# Worst Tosca Ever



## nina foresti (Mar 11, 2014)

Proceed at your own risk.


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## Pugg (Aug 8, 2014)

And people paying for seeing this......


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## Woodduck (Mar 17, 2014)

Who can resist a come-on like that?

I'll get back to you...


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## Becca (Feb 5, 2015)

nina foresti said:


> Proceed at your own risk.


Worst how? Singing? Staging? Orchestra? All of the above?

For what it is worth, the Scarpia was a very last minute substitute for Evgeny Nikitin.


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## Woodduck (Mar 17, 2014)

I'm sure there have been worse Toscas than this. The stripped down, gray, computer-age setting isn't much to look at, but it's no uglier than a lot of regietheater productions, and it doesn't get in the way of the characters projecting their relationships, which is all this opera is about anyway. It falls to the performers to fulfill that requirement, and these do pretty well, even if the direction is sometimes odd and gets in their way (why don't the lovers touch more?). In the midst of this postmodern regie-ism, "Vissi d'arte," strongly sung by Opolais, seemed a strange and therefore surprisingly moving intrusion from a more romantic era, and I could even agree with Callas and others who feel that it doesn't really belong where it is and merely interrupts the action. 

Aside from this moment, I was generally unmoved by the production, as was much of the audience, to judge by their faces during the final ovation. But then, it takes a very special performance for this opera to impress me as more than a piece of cunningly crafted melodrama. So far, I've seen only one such performance - Covent Garden, 1964, with Callas and Gobbi - and unfortunately we have only the second act of that.


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## nina foresti (Mar 11, 2014)

Becca said:


> Worst how? Singing? Staging? Orchestra? All of the above?
> 
> For what it is worth, the Scarpia was a very last minute substitute for Evgeny Nikitin.


Well no wonder he was so ineffectual. (Loved those glasses though). 
And to answer your question: Yep. ALL of the above. (in my humble opinion, of course)
And just look at those quizzical faces in the audience. There tells the tale.


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## DarkAngel (Aug 11, 2010)

nina foresti said:


> Proceed at your own risk.


Bad, very bad insensitive production with no advancement of the emotional themes of the opera using modern settings or technology. This production represents a familiar pattern of forcing the mindless sheep in the audience swallow anything they are presented by the "superior" reggie elite minds, notice scarpia is now the opera director himself to further mock the current production and audience, laughable death scence of Tosca complete with champagne toasts by scarpia/director.....

Strange obsession with Karl Lagerfeld look alikes...........


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## interestedin (Jan 10, 2016)

DarkAngel said:


> Bad, very bad insensitive production with no advancement of the emotional themes of the opera using modern settings or technology. Typical reggie pattern of *forcing the mindless sheep in the audience* swallow anything they are presented by the "superior" reggie elite minds, notice scarpia is now the opera director himself to further mock the current production and audience.....


As far as I know attending the performance was as voluntary as with every other Tosca production.


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## SixFootScowl (Oct 17, 2011)

I always check out the stabbing scene and the jumping off the parapet wall scene. So after she stabs him she comes around and gives him a second jab in the back. There was no parapet wall. Looks like Spoletta was holding a high voltage cattle prod type device that Tosca grabbed and jolted herself in the forehead then dropped senseless or whatever to the ground. No parapet wall. No, this is not a Tosca that will be on my play list.


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## howlingfantods (Jul 27, 2015)

"Worst ever" with Opolais singing the title role, and Rattle in the pit with the BPO? I think you haven't heard some of the recordings I've heard.


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## howlingfantods (Jul 27, 2015)

Finished listening to it, although I only paid attention to the visuals intermittently. Nothing special one way or the other. Opolais is a charming but not particularly affecting singer--she often reminds me of Anna Moffo in this respect. I believe this is pretty fresh repertoire for Rattle, and you can tell he's seeing how he can try to freshen up a warhorse like this, with some unusual tempi and attention here and there. 

Alvarez was a perfectly competent Cavaradossi, and he pulled off a decent E Lucevan le Stelle. Vratogna was probably the least successful of the main trio, but I've heard worse--he's just a little anonymous and lacks the personality for a Scarpia. Some of the mechanics were probably unsuccessful--the video collage at the end seemed intended to be thematically significant but mostly seemed pretty random, and the stage business with the cattle gun was probably confusing visually to anyone in the theater without the benefit of close ups.

I'd probably rate this higher than the last time I saw Tosca live actually, which was with Gheorghiu at the SF opera a few years back. Although I suppose as a trad production, people around here might've liked it more, but the cast particularly Gheorghiu seemed to be sleepwalking through the production, and the blocking and stage direction was probably worse than here.


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## Becca (Feb 5, 2015)

This was part of the Baden-Baden Easter Festival where the Berlin Philharmonic is in residence and they put on one newly staged opera each year with about 4 performances. The Scarpia was a replacement after the 3rd performance when the baritone had to withdraw due to illness. Last year's production was Tristan which is the staging seen at the Met earlier this season.


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## Woodduck (Mar 17, 2014)

Becca said:


> This was part of the Baden-Baden Easter Festival where the Berlin Philharmonic is in residence and they put on one newly staged opera each year with about 4 performances. The Scarpia was a replacement after the 3rd performance when the baritone had to withdraw due to illness. Last year's production was Tristan which is the staging seen at the Met earlier this season.


So they like gray sets at Baden-Baden, hm?

I think "regie gray" should be the in color for this year's spring fashions, just in time for everyone to buy it and wear it to Bayreuth.


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## amfortas (Jun 15, 2011)

Stark and modernized, not to my taste, but nothing all that outrageous, at least in current regie terms. I'm sure there have been plenty of worse _Tosca_s, if I had any inclination to look for them.


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## Pugg (Aug 8, 2014)

I don't want to see it ever again.


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## Sloe (May 9, 2014)

At least it is recognizable. I have said this before Tosca is an opera that it is difficult to make Regie so it will be unrecognised. The Ring is probably easier to recognise you only need an eye patch on Wotan then you can do whatever you want.


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## Woodduck (Mar 17, 2014)

Sloe said:


> At least it is recognizable. I have said this before Tosca is an opera that it is difficult to make Regie so it will be unrecognised. The Ring is probably easier to recognise you only need an eye patch on Wotan then you can do whatever you want.


Who knew directing was so easy, huh?


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## Pugg (Aug 8, 2014)

The Robert Carsen staging looks classic compare to this rubbish.


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## perempe (Feb 27, 2014)

off:
nice channel


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## Pugg (Aug 8, 2014)

perempe said:


> off:
> nice channel


Do we have to guess


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## Sloe (May 9, 2014)

They could really just have made a concertant performance.


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## Sloe (May 9, 2014)

I really like Opolais.
Maybe not so much here.


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## Woodduck (Mar 17, 2014)

Sloe said:


> I really like Opolais.
> Maybe not so much here.


She overacts, uses the same distraught gestures over and over, has no sense of pacing, needs to calm down. Partly the director's fault. Callas thought Tosca a boring woman, but knew how to make her interesting. Most singers just strike prima donna poses. Opolais, left rudderless by a lack of direction, tries too hard. Hopefully she'll find a better production somewhere (good luck nowadays).


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## nina foresti (Mar 11, 2014)

Woodduck said:


> She overacts, uses the same distraught gestures over and over, has no sense of pacing, needs to calm down. Partly the director's fault. Callas thought Tosca a boring woman, but knew how to make her interesting. Most singers just strike prima donna poses. Opolais, left rudderless by a lack of direction, tries too hard. Hopefully she'll find a better production somewhere (good luck nowadays).


Ditto! (must I type it 5 times to comply with the 15 letter rule(silly!).


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## Woodduck (Mar 17, 2014)

nina foresti said:


> Ditto! (must I type it 5 times to comply with the 15 letter rule(silly!).


The magic solution to the 15-character rule is to type in a line of periods and color them white (use the "A" in the row of options). They'll look like this: ....................

Silly is right.


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## Loge (Oct 30, 2014)

Not quite as bad as Montserrat Caballe's last performance as Tosca. I have seen more convincing sets at school plays. And I can't remember Tosca exiting stage left?


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## Pugg (Aug 8, 2014)

Loge said:


> Not quite as bad as Montserrat Caballe's last performance as Tosca. I have seen more convincing sets at school plays. And I can't remember Tosca exiting stage left?


And yet fascinating watching.


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## nina foresti (Mar 11, 2014)

Woodduck said:


> The magic solution to the 15-character rule is to type in a line of periods and color them white (use the "A" in the row of options). They'll look like this: ....................
> 
> Silly is right.


Let me try this:
............................
oops. Try again.

.......................


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## nina foresti (Mar 11, 2014)

nina foresti said:


> Let me try this:
> ............................
> oops. Try again.
> 
> .......................


Bless you miluv. It actually worked. You've saved me!! Yessssssss!


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## Woodduck (Mar 17, 2014)

Loge said:


> Not quite as bad as Montserrat Caballe's last performance as Tosca. I have seen more convincing sets at school plays. And I can't remember Tosca exiting stage left?


Beyond a certain age and weight, you avoid jumping off parapets. She probably just ran out in front of a speeding horsecart.


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## Rys (Nov 26, 2016)

I didn't watch it, but gosh! I thought that channel shut down a long time ago due to copyright problems. The owner must have remade it.


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## dnitzer (May 1, 2017)

It's one thing to tweak with time and place and update things, and another to stage a completely different story. I'm not sure what that was, but it wasn't Tosca. At the very end I thought Cio-Cio San had stepped in for Tosca. Is it only opera and ballet that get subjected to this kind of treatment? Theater directors don't change the spoken word when they direct a play, at least not to such an extent that it becomes a different play. Conductors don't promote a performance of Beethoven's 7th, and then swap out movements from a Haydn symphony. But opera and ballet directors seem to be given carte blanche, composer and librettist be damned. Why?

I'm still waiting to see a Don Giovanni in which he and Commendatore float heavenward, all rapture and eternal bliss.


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## Reichstag aus LICHT (Oct 25, 2010)

I've been listening to it today, minus the visuals, and I must say that I enjoyed it immensely.


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## Sloe (May 9, 2014)

dnitzer said:


> It's one thing to tweak with time and place and update things, and another to stage a completely different story. I'm not sure what that was, but it wasn't Tosca. At the very end I thought Cio-Cio San had stepped in for Tosca. Is it only opera and ballet that get subjected to this kind of treatment? Theater directors don't change the spoken word when they direct a play, at least not to such an extent that it becomes a different play. Conductors don't promote a performance of Beethoven's 7th, and then swap out movements from a Haydn symphony. But opera and ballet directors seem to be given carte blanche, composer and librettist be damned. Why?
> 
> I'm still waiting to see a Don Giovanni in which he and Commendatore float heavenward, all rapture and eternal bliss.


If they are going to change the way the characters die they can at least do it in a way that enhances the effect. That rod worked extremely bad.


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## mountmccabe (May 1, 2013)

dnitzer said:


> It's one thing to tweak with time and place and update things, and another to stage a completely different story. I'm not sure what that was, but it wasn't Tosca. At the very end I thought Cio-Cio San had stepped in for Tosca.


What did I miss? Like, really, I watched this, bracing for all kinds of weirdness and it never happened. This was quite literal and quite recognizable. Tosca killed herself with a different method and it's a different work? In what world?


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## mountmccabe (May 1, 2013)

But yes, other art forms do get reworked and modified. It may be less, but this is in large part because there is comparatively less interested in the past, in works now in the public domain. The vast majority of plays and musicals seen now (at least in the USA) are post-World War 2, many are much newer. There are also far fewer DVD and CDs of musicals (and plays) so there's less to compete with. You can do a local production of _The Drowsy Chaperone_ that looks much like the one that played Broadway and most people won't have any idea what you borrowed and what you changed. And people won't say, I could just watch that at home with a better cast.

For pre-public domain works, it's (in the USA at least) mostly Shakespeare and opera. And it's much more difficult to make changes to things where you have to get rights cleared, but it happens. Phyllidia Lloyd's trilogy of Shakespeare plays with all-female casts set in a women's prison (some plays in the public domain are still popular). _Sweeney Todd_ by John Doyle, as seen in London in 2004 and Broadway in 2005 that presented the work as happening in a traumatized Tobias' mind, and was re-orchestrated for 10 instruments, played by the singers. There were significant changes in Sam Mendes' production of _Cabaret_, first seen in London in 1993 (the production was brought to Broadway in 1998 and again in 2014). And talk of different interpretations of characters in Broadway-style theater reminds me a lot of talk of different interpretations in opera.


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## Sloe (May 9, 2014)

mountmccabe said:


> What did I miss? Like, really, I watched this, bracing for all kinds of weirdness and it never happened. This was quite literal and quite recognizable. Tosca killed herself with a different method and it's a different work? In what world?


The problem is that it just looks stupid.
In the horrible looking Torino version of Madama Butterfly. Cio-Cio San shots herself in the head, falls abruptly to the floor and Pinkerton rushes over the stage and takes Dolore with him. I find that ending much more effective and moving than the usual ending. But Tosca killing herself with some I guess electric rod looks just stupid.


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## dnitzer (May 1, 2017)

Sloe said:


> But Tosca killing herself with some I guess electric rod looks just stupid.


Is that what that thing was? I wasn't sure if she was doing her own lobotomy, or trying to knock herself unconscious or what. She didn't appear to be trapped in a corner with only one way out. Certainly someone could have grabbed that thing out of her hand in time. It didn't make sense.

Look again (if you can stand to) at the Te Deum. Where are they? Why is the chorus dressed alike, genderless, in black suits, glasses, wearing something round and shiny in their lapels? What happened to the sense of Scarpia's blasphemy or perversion at this moment? It's been diluted and neutered; we've already seen earlier examples of blasphemy and perversion in the form of child molestation, in whatever this location is supposed to be, so Scarpia's cry of "Tosca, mi fai dimenticare Iddio" seems trite and loses the intended effect. If there is no indication of "Iddio" anywhere in sight, how blasphemous can it be? What was the director trying to say here, and does it work? Did it communicate whatever he intended? It just looks random and stupid and if he was trying to say something "new" or he thought he was communicating a deeper insight, I would have to say he failed.


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## Sloe (May 9, 2014)

dnitzer said:


> Is that what that thing was? I wasn't sure if she was doing her own lobotomy, or trying to knock herself unconscious or what. She didn't appear to be trapped in a corner with only one way out. Certainly someone could have grabbed that thing out of her hand in time. It didn't make sense.


I think it is a captive bolt pistol. The weapon Javier Bardem uses to kill people in No Country for Old Men.

Never used for executions and modern day Italy don´t have death penalty anyway.


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## VladaNS (May 24, 2017)

That ending just does not work for me.
Also Tosca for me seems really awkward when staged in modern times.
For some other operas it may work...


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## Pugg (Aug 8, 2014)

VladaNS said:


> That ending just does not work for me.
> Also Tosca for me seems really awkward when staged in modern times.
> For some other operas it may work...


All operas staged in nowadays should be forbidden .


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## huntsman (Jan 28, 2013)

Worst Tosca?

I'm no expert, but I was totally disappointed yesterday by the performance I attended in Pretoria, South Africa. Poor acting, in-audible singing (though a few off-key bellows by Cavaradossi were painfully clear!), uninspired costumes and smoke (mist?) that kept drifting in and out for no apparent reason made the 250km trip less than worthwhile...

First time I have seen a curtain-call at the end of the first act...thought I'd fallen asleep and missed the show for a moment!  What gives with that??


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## Pugg (Aug 8, 2014)

huntsman said:


> Worst Tosca?
> 
> I'm no expert, but I was totally disappointed yesterday by the performance I attended in Pretoria, South Africa. Poor acting, in-audible singing (though a few off-key bellows by Cavaradossi were painfully clear!), uninspired costumes and smoke (mist?) that kept drifting in and out for no apparent reason made the 250km trip less than worthwhile...
> 
> First time I have seen a curtain-call at the end of the first act...thought I'd fallen asleep and missed the show for a moment!  What gives with that??


250 km for a opera, I do hope you stayed overnight somewhere.


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## huntsman (Jan 28, 2013)

Pugg said:


> 250 km for a opera, I do hope you stayed overnight somewhere.


Heh heh - It was R125km in each direction, so really just around the corner here...unless the destination is disappointing, in which case the trip home is really long!


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## Sloe (May 9, 2014)

nina foresti said:


> Proceed at your own risk.


You thought that was bad watch this totally ugly and unrecognisable production of Tosca:


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## Barelytenor (Nov 19, 2011)

Woodduck said:


> Beyond a certain age and weight, you avoid jumping off parapets. She probably just ran out in front of a speeding horsecart.


And she doesn't bend down to check on Mario, either. You know she'd never get back up.

Kind regards, :tiphat:

George


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## Taplow (Aug 13, 2017)

Becca said:


> For what it is worth, the Scarpia was a very last minute substitute for Evgeny Nikitin.


Last-minute substitutions can be the death of a show. I had the misfortune to attend a performance of Lucia di Lammermoor recently with Diana Damrau in the title role. All should have been well, except that my Enrico had fallen ill and had to be replaced at the last minute by Ambrogio Maestri. Great singer, did one of the hands down best Falstaff's I've seen ... but hugely miscast as Enrico, and stiff as a board in a part he had obviously not had the chance to rehearse. Quite ruined an evening at the opera.


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## Don Fatale (Aug 31, 2009)

Sloe said:


> You thought that was bad watch this totally ugly and unrecognisable production of Tosca:


(Changed the link to the start of Recondita Armonia, so that the midgets and break-dancers can be enjoyed!)
I had the misfortune to see this in Oslo in August. Had I known how bad it was, I wouldn't have gone. Truly dire and an embarrassment to the opera world and particularly to Den Norsk Opera. In fact it almost made me be ashamed of being an opera fan.

I'm astonished that anyone would think it worthy of committing to film, but that's the philistines who've hijacked opera for you.


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## nina foresti (Mar 11, 2014)

Shame on moi!
Boy did I ever go off the deep end on this one. "Worst Tosca ever?" Did I really say that? What was I drinking that day?
Okay, I didn't love it but the singing was certainly decent. They all did an able job. I just guess I got carried away with the stinky staging and silly things like bopping oneself on the head to kill oneself. 
But frankly, I've seen worse Toscas than this one so I humbly apologize.


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## Sloe (May 9, 2014)

nina foresti said:


> Shame on moi!
> Boy did I ever go off the deep end on this one. "Worst Tosca ever?" Did I really say that? What was I drinking that day?
> Okay, I didn't love it but the singing was certainly decent. They all did an able job. I just guess I got carried away with the stinky staging and silly things like bopping oneself on the head to kill oneself.
> But frankly, I've seen worse Toscas than this one so I humbly apologize.


It didn't have Calixto Beito as director.


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## nina foresti (Mar 11, 2014)

Sloe said:


> It didn't have Calixto Beito as director.


You said a mouthful. The most hubristic, woman-hater, egotistical, talentless "dreck"tor in the business.


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## Sloe (May 9, 2014)

nina foresti said:


> You said a mouthful. The most hubristic, woman-hater, egotistical, talentless "dreck"tor in the business.


I take that as you don't want to see breakwater during Recondita armonia.


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## Sloe (May 9, 2014)

Pugg said:


> All operas staged in nowadays should be forbidden .


Except for operas that really takes place nowadays.


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## Pugg (Aug 8, 2014)

Sloe said:


> Except for operas that really takes place nowadays.


On this I agree totally.


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## Sloe (May 9, 2014)

Don Fatale said:


> (Changed the link to the start of Recondita Armonia, so that the midgets and break-dancers can be enjoyed!)
> I had the misfortune to see this in Oslo in August. Had I known how bad it was, I wouldn't have gone. Truly dire and an embarrassment to the opera world and particularly to Den Norsk Opera. In fact it almost made me be ashamed of being an opera fan.
> 
> I'm astonished that anyone would think it worthy of committing to film, but that's the philistines who've hijacked opera for you.


In its defence I think that Tosca was more enjoyable than Opolais.


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## DavidA (Dec 14, 2012)

I can never quite see this strange obsession to update. Tosca is set in a particular place at a particular time. Once we get rid of that it starts to lose its point. The staging was pretty awful. When I go to opera I want a bit of romance in the set. Mind you, I have seen worse. The last Carmen ENO put on was simply dreadful apart from a very good performance of Carmen. Just made you wish to have seen it as Bizet intended and not in a car-wreck of a production. Mind you, in most regietheatre you don't have to go very far to find awful productions. The last Tristan from the Met was simply dreadful. At the end the 'dead' Tristan is seen sitting next to Isolde. The lights went on at the wrong moment so the audience saw the corpse walk across and sit down! :lol:


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## Woodduck (Mar 17, 2014)

DavidA said:


> I can never quite see this strange obsession to update. Tosca is set in a particular place at a particular time. Once we get rid of that it starts to lose its point. The staging was pretty awful. When I go to opera I want a bit of romance in the set. Mind you, I have seen worse. The last Carmen ENO put on was simply dreadful apart from a very good performance of Carmen. Just made you wish to have seen it as Bizet intended and not in a car-wreck of a production. Mind you, in most regietheatre you don't have to go very far to find awful productions. *The last Tristan from the Met was simply dreadful. At the end the 'dead' Tristan is seen sitting next to Isolde. The lights went on at the wrong moment so the audience saw the corpse walk across and sit down!* :lol:


Doesn't Isolde also slit her wrist in this production? It seems rather awkward for Tristan to revive and cozy up to her while she's bleeding to death. Perhaps he could grab the knife, stab himself, and die for a second time? They'd need a lot of fake blood, but I'm sure they could borrow some from the Met's current production of _Parsifal._


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