# 30-day Opera Challenge - Round 2



## mamascarlatti (Sep 23, 2009)

rgz said:


> Many thanks to Natalie, this was really fun and interesting and I'm sad that it's over. Maybe we could cobble together some questions for another month's worth?
> 
> - Most underrated opera
> - Most overrated opera
> ...


"*I've got a little list, I've got a little list" 
*

TC THIRTY DAY OPERA CHALLENGE, ROUND TWO

1.	Best chorus
2.	Best operatic candidate for a Darwin award
3.	Favourite duet 
4.	Favourite post-1920 opera
5.	Opera which you would have liked to see in the original production
6.	Opera you recommend for a newbie
7.	Wagnerphile or Wagnerphobe?
8.	Opera whose libretto you enjoyed reading.
9.	Favourite Bel Canto opera
10.	One DVD and/or CD to avoid
11.	Favourite fiction book about or involving opera
12.	Opera that you watch/listen to when you need cheering up
13.	An opera blog/site you frequently visit
14.	HIP - important to you or not?
15.	Favourite opera conductor.
16.	Favourite ensemble aria.
17.	Do you tend to prefer singers from the past or the present?
18.	Last time you cried at the opera.
19.	What voice type are you?
20.	Favourite Regie production (if any)
21.	Do you enjoy operettas?
22.	Best opera (singing) actor
23.	Watching or listening? Why?
24.	Favourite "traditional" production (if any)
25.	Favourite One-act opera
26.	Best opera (singing) actress
27.	High notes - essential or irrelevant?
28.	Your most often consulted reference book about opera?
29.	Opera character your mother would warn you away from marrying.
30.	Three qualities essential for an opera singer.


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## FragendeFrau (May 30, 2011)

That's a terrific list! I may participate more, even based on my limited experience of opera...


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## Almaviva (Aug 13, 2010)

Great, Nat. Do we start now, or after midnight? (It's still the 30th day of the previous challenge).
I'd change question 21, though. You make operettas sound like they are in equal grounds with musicals, and I do see a big difference. Operettas belong to the umbrella of classical music, but musicals don't. While the latter are definitely not my thing, I do enjoy several operettas. One can't place something as excellent as Die Fledermaus or Orphée aux Enfers or La Grande-Duchesse de Gérolstein on the same boat with musicals.


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## mamascarlatti (Sep 23, 2009)

Almaviva said:


> Great, Nat. Do we start now, or after midnight? (It's still the 30th day of the previous challenge).


Day one of round 2 is roughly 24 hours after your last post.



> I'd change question 21, though. You make operettas sound like they are in equal grounds with musicals, and I do see a big difference. Operettas belong to the umbrella of classical music, but musicals don't. While the latter are definitely not my thing, I do enjoy several operettas. One can't place something as excellent as Die Fledermaus or Orphée aux Enfers or La Grande-Duchesse de Gérolstein on the same boat with musicals.


Done


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## World Violist (May 31, 2007)

Yay round 2!!! 

Best chorus: The choral leading into "When I am laid in earth" from Dido and Aeneas. It's gorgeous, what can I say?


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## mamascarlatti (Sep 23, 2009)

Alma, could you put the questions from round two into the original post, or move to a new thread, to make it easier for people to find then as they move through the challenge?


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## rgz (Mar 6, 2010)

Best chorus is probably Peter Grimes, if we're talking about a full opera


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## Aksel (Dec 3, 2010)

FragendeFrau said:


> Aksel, you were there! I envy you!! although I have the DVD, so...


Technically, I wasn't, actually, but ah well. I was at the premiere, but there was not a chance in anywhere to get tickets to see the actual production inside. We (myself, my brother and our parents) had arrived in Munich the day before, and I saw that the opening performance of Münchner Opernfestwoche (or something like that) was taking place that day. We had walked past the Staatsoper earlier that day and heard that the performance would be projected outside. So I managed to drag my father with me to the pebbly outsides of the Bavarian state opera, and we sat there (on our sandals) the whole six or so hours (with two _very_ liberal 45 minute intermissions, I should add). I was rather proud of my dad afterwards, because he doesn't really listen to opera and just a week or so earlier, we had seen Aida at the Wiener Staatsoper, and so you would think he'd had enough for one holiday.


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## Aramis (Mar 1, 2009)

Best chorus? First thing that comes to my mind is welcome that people of Brabant pay to Lohengrin. Especially it's culmination. And then the scene after he defeats von Telramund and they praise him. One of most powerful pieces that Wagner wrote.


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## TxllxT (Mar 2, 2011)

*Tc thirty day opera challenge, round two, one: Best chorus*

The best Chorus I know is the last part of Khovanshchina. But all Mussorgsky's operas let the chorus represent all the Russian people from all ages, from the faraway past backward until the present. This magnification is grand and never fails to swallow me up completely.


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## BalloinMaschera (Apr 4, 2011)

yay; more fun!

TC THIRTY DAY OPERA CHALLENGE, ROUND TWO

1. Best chorus- 
Hunters chorus from Freischutz 
or the Guests Entry chorus from Tannhauser ... 
OR the Dutch/Norwegian crews double-chorus from The Flying Dutchman

Apologies; I couldn't just pick *one*!


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## Operafocus (Jul 17, 2011)

*Default Tc thirty day opera challenge, round two, one: Best chorus *

Pilgrims Chorus, Tannhauser!


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## Almaviva (Aug 13, 2010)

It may sound conventional but it needs to be Va Pensiero (Nabucco)


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## waldvogel (Jul 10, 2011)

Regina Coeli and the chorus outside the church that follows it in Cavalerria Rusticana.


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## BalloinMaschera (Apr 4, 2011)

thanks to Alma, for creating a separate thread for round 2


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## Almaviva (Aug 13, 2010)

BalloinMaschera said:


> thanks to Alma, for creating a separate thread for round 2


 You're welcome. What Natalie asks of me, Natalie gets.


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## amfortas (Jun 15, 2011)

mamascarlatti said:


> 30.	Three qualities essential for an opera singer.


This one will be too easy for Alma. He'll only have to give any real thought to the third one.

(Oh wait. It said "qualities," not "assets.")


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## schigolch (Jun 26, 2011)




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## amfortas (Jun 15, 2011)

The "Wach auf" chorus from Act III of Die Meistersinger. The entire city, gathered for the St. John's Day festival, welcomes the arrival of the beloved cobbler-poet Hans Sachs with a soaring chorale (in words written by the actual, historical Sachs). Just an incredibly moving spontaneous tribute by a community for one of their own.


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## Almaviva (Aug 13, 2010)

amfortas said:


> This one will be too easy for Alma. He'll only have to give any real thought to the third one.
> 
> (Oh wait. It said "qualities," not "assets.")


 No need for any real thinking. "Killer legs" can be 3rd and 4th.
I guess after 5th placed "pretty face" I might even consider those other 6th and 7th placed less important qualities called "beautiful voice" and "correct vocal technique." As long as 1st through 5th are good, who cares?

(Kidding, lest Ballo kills me)


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## sospiro (Apr 3, 2010)

*1. Best chorus*

So many to choose from ... but today I'll go with the blacksmiths


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## MAuer (Feb 6, 2011)

*Round 2, Day 1: Best chorus*

I also like the Huntsmen's Chorus from _Der Freischütz_.


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## FragendeFrau (May 30, 2011)

Yes, thanks for the separate thread and I'm sorry I got off the rails a bit...

I will have to agree with Va Pensiero!


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## Operafocus (Jul 17, 2011)

The Covent Garden version, this year. Being there was just... it's the build-up that does it for me. Then 50 strong men giving it their all.


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## amfortas (Jun 15, 2011)

Operafocus said:


> 50 strong men giving it their all.


I think I rented that movie!


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## Operafocus (Jul 17, 2011)

amfortas said:


> I think I rented that movie!


lmao. :lol:


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## mamascarlatti (Sep 23, 2009)

Sorry, after living in Italy I've just got to go for "Va Pensiero".


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## Almaviva (Aug 13, 2010)

mamascarlatti said:


> Sorry, after living in Italy I've just got to go for "Va Pensiero".


 Time to insert this striking, moving version that had me in tears.


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## FragendeFrau (May 30, 2011)

Here's an example of Va Pensiero in contemporary Italy: During a performance of Nabucco everything came to a halt after Va Pensiero, Muti gave a speech about how arts funding had been cut (or something like that) then led the audience in singing the whole thing again (must have been planned--what about the slips of paper falling down). Still, a moving moment.


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## FragendeFrau (May 30, 2011)

Great minds think alike!

(you can delete mine)


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## Almaviva (Aug 13, 2010)

FragendeFrau said:


> Great minds think alike!
> 
> (you can delete mine)


 That's fine, you explained it more than I did.


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## StlukesguildOhio (Dec 25, 2006)

As a choral music fanatic I must say that the best choruses probably aren't from opera (gasp!) but rather from liturgical music: Bach, Handel, Monteverdi, Faure, Brahms, Schubert, etc... Nevertheless, opera has more than its share of lovely choruses.

Almost the first chorus I thought of was that from the closing Rameau's _Les indes galantes_. I especially love Minkowsky's muscular take on it... beside which Magali Léger is absolutely stunning:






But then there's the unique "humming chorus" from _Madame Butterfly_... here in a video that gives the music a disturbing edge:






Ultimately, however, I have to go with *Wagner's Pilgrim's Chorus*:






This, to me, is one of the most stirring moments in any opera... in any work of music... as the chorus grows in intensity in tandem with the strings... I am left speechless...


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## BalloinMaschera (Apr 4, 2011)

Day 2- Candidate for Darwin Award- G&S The Mikado- and yes, I know it ain't an opera, per se...


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## mamascarlatti (Sep 23, 2009)

To clarify: the Darwin awards are given to those unfortunate individuals who remove themselves from the gene pool by acts of crass stupidity. So we are looking for operatic characters who do just that.

My nomination goes to Ernani. Why did he promise to kill himself when he heard the horn? Who was forcing him to? What an idiot.


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## TxllxT (Mar 2, 2011)

*2. Best operatic candidate for a Darwin award*

Male: Wotan, being such a dumbo & dodo & no-brainer. When it comes to intellectual capacities the _Ring des Nibelungen_ puts forward: the Rhinemaidens as the vanity-summit of vanities, the gods as greedy nitwits, the giants as blockbuster Walhalla-builders who at least keep their eye on the real prize  Freya) ( - they remain throughout sympathic to me - ) and the dwarfs Alberich & Loge as the cleverish powerbrokers. The Darwin award may also go to those who are able to spend so many hours in their company :devil:
Female: The Queen of the Night. I hate soap-series for unbelievably changing all of a sudden the characters on stage in order to let the show drag on. The _Zauberflöte_ is a soap-opera _par excellence_.


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## mamascarlatti (Sep 23, 2009)

TxllxT said:


> Male: Wotan, being such a dumbo & dodo & no-brainer. When it comes to intellectual capacities the _Ring des Nibelungen_ puts forward: the Rhinemaidens as the vanity-summit of vanities, the gods as greedy nitwits, the giants as blockbuster Walhalla-builders who at least keep their eye on the real prize  Freya) ( - they remain throughout sympathic to me - ) and the dwarfs Alberich & Loge as the cleverish powerbrokers. The Darwin award may also go to those who are able to spend so many hours in their company :devil:


Take your point but Wotan certainly managed to spread his genes around in a big way before disappearing from the picture:lol:!


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## BalloinMaschera (Apr 4, 2011)

ah ok... now i get it- thanks for clarifying- let me rethink... hmmmm....


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## HarpsichordConcerto (Jan 1, 2010)

mamascarlatti said:


> 2.	Best operatic candidate for a Darwin Award


Brünnhilde from Wagner's _Ring_ cycle. Heroine at times? Or plain stupid?


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## World Violist (May 31, 2007)

Jaufre Rudel from "L'amour de loin." Not only could he have virtually any woman in his home village, but he spurns them all for a woman he doesn't even know the slightest thing about except that someone is _telling_ him she's pretty, then goes after her and upon meeting her dies of exhaustion. It's textbook Darwin Award: nice sentiment, genetically just plain stupid.

(I still like the opera though)


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## FragendeFrau (May 30, 2011)

ooh, isn't this the basis for many opera plots? but I will go with:

Carmen--why did she stay to meet Don Jose? She could have gone on into the bullring to cheer for Escamillo.

But then we wouldn't have an opera, of course. :lol:


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## Aksel (Dec 3, 2010)

Day 1:

The different choruses from Meistersinger, from the opening chorale to the final praise of Hans Sachs. Pure wonderful (yes, I am using wonderful as a noun, thankyouverymuch).


Day 2:

Magda from La Rondine (the suicide version). I adore the opera (the first two acts, at least), but 3rd act Magda severely annoys me. I don't get why Ruggero would be the man to kill yourself over. It is to be mentioned, though, that this choice is possibly also because I have a severe dislike for Roberto Alagna.


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## Almaviva (Aug 13, 2010)

Folks, you're missing the true spirit of the Darwin award. The point is to remove undesirable genetic material (that is, genes that code for stupidity) from the genetic pool. There is no better such example than Il Trovatore. If a mother is stupid enough to try and kill her enemy's baby but she ends up - oops - tossing her own baby into the bonfire, it's the perfect relief for Darwin since that baby won't grow up to perpetuate his mother's stupidity genes.


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## FragendeFrau (May 30, 2011)

I have to admit Il Trovatore was also on my list. I must see this opera! Having read (and laughed over) the synopsis many times...


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## amfortas (Jun 15, 2011)

A joint entry: Tosca and Cavaradossi.

Sure, you can trust Scarpia, why not? He's an honest, upstanding guy. Sure, it will be just a *fake* execution. "_Come Palmieri_"--just like Palmieri! All you have to do is stand there, let them shoot you with *blanks,* play dead for a minute, then scurry away to freedom!

What could possibly go wrong?


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## sospiro (Apr 3, 2010)

Attila.

Fighting woman is captured & given to you as a prize. You admire her courage so much you ask her what she'd like as a reward. She asks for her sword and _you give her yours_??


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## FragendeFrau (May 30, 2011)

amfortas said:


> A joint entry: Tosca and Cavaradossi.
> 
> Sure, you can trust Scarpia, why not? He's an honest, upstanding guy. Sure, it will be just a *fake* execution. "Come Palmieri"--just like Palmieri! All you have to do is stand there, let them shoot you with *blanks,* play dead for a minute, then scurry away to freedom!
> 
> What could possibly go wrong?


I have heard that in some recent productions, Kaufmann plays Cavaradossi as realizing about halfway through the big scene with Tosca that it ain't gonna happen and he's gonna die. Very effective. I hope to see this interpretation some day.


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## waldvogel (Jul 10, 2011)

Dr. Bartolo in The Barber of Seville...

Let's see, you're an old guy who thinks that he has a right to marry Rosina. The only obstacles in your way are the fact that Rosina hates you, that she's in love with the richest and most powerful man in town, whose best friend is the smartest man in town. But I'm sure it will all work out for the good doctor, right?


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## Chi_townPhilly (Apr 21, 2007)

*Day 1: Favorite chorus*-

Man, there are just SO MANY by Wagner. Asking me to pick my favorite among these is like asking me to pick my favorite Wagner opera. Of course, any of the ones already mentioned is worthy. However (to be a little original), I'd like to put in a word for the much-maligned ending chorus from _Die Meistersinger_. I understand that it'll be impossible for lots people to keep from viewing this through a geopolitical prism. Still, I think there are three important points-
1. If any non-German composer had composed something about "honor[ing] our (fill in nationality here) masters," it would almost certainly be less cause for offense.
2. It IS musically outstanding- and (most importantly)
3. It merits understanding as a statement by Wagner, best known as a revolutionary firebrand of the Arts, in support of what can be learned from the great Artist(e)s of the past.

*Day 2- The Darwin award is hereby presented to...*
Eh- how about _Judith_ from "Duke Bluebeard's Castle?"
"You don't really want to see everything?!" "Yes, I do!" "The next to last stop is sorrow- do you still want to go on?!" "Yes, I do!! Give it to me! Give it to me now!!"

"Okay then, die."

Well earned, well earned.:devil:


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## MAuer (Feb 6, 2011)

*Day 2: Best operatic candidate for a Darwin Award *

Rodolfo in _Luisa Miller_. He'll teach that (supposedly) faithless girlfriend of his a thing or two! He'll not only force her to drink the poisoned beverage, but will drink it HIMSELF! Yessir, that will show her, and that father of his, too. Uh, wait a minute; you mean she wasn't unfaithful after all?


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## sospiro (Apr 3, 2010)

FragendeFrau said:


> I have to admit Il Trovatore was also on my list. I must see this opera! Having read (and laughed over) the synopsis many times...


If you can't see it live then this DVD is highly recommended by both Natalie & I. Alma absolutely raves over it (ignore him if he says not - he loves it really & is embarrassed to admit it)


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## Almaviva (Aug 13, 2010)

sospiro said:


> Alma absolutely raves over it (ignore him if he says not - he loves it really & is embarrassed to admit it)


I think I need bigger wet fish.
Hear, hear, folks - in these pictures, you see Annie swimming, and Almaviva about to swallow her whole.



















Let's see how well she can watch this dreadful Trovatore DVD from inside the whale shark's belly.:devil:


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## FragendeFrau (May 30, 2011)

sospiro said:


> If you can't see it live then this DVD is highly recommended by both Natalie & I. Alma absolutely raves over it (ignore him if he says not - he loves it really & is embarrassed to admit it)


Looks good! and since it's from the BBC I may be able to stream it from our university's music library. Thanks for the rec!


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## sospiro (Apr 3, 2010)

Almaviva said:


> I think I need bigger wet fish.
> Hear, hear, folks - in these pictures, you see Annie swimming, and Almaviva about to swallow her whole.
> 
> Let's see how well she can watch this dreadful Trovatore DVD from inside the whale shark's belly.:devil:


See what I mean FF?

"The (gentleman) doth protest too much, methinks"


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## Almaviva (Aug 13, 2010)

FragendeFrau said:


> *Looks good! *


 Famous last words.
Don't tell me later I didn't warn you.
Good buy, FF. It was good having you here while it lasted.
Please don't pick a painful suicide method after you watch this DVD; get at least a fast and painless method; you don't deserve to die painfully just because you upheld Annie's misguided advice over my well-intentioned one.


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## mamascarlatti (Sep 23, 2009)

Almaviva said:


> I think I need bigger wet fish.
> Hear, hear, folks - in these pictures, you see Annie swimming, and Almaviva about to swallow her whole.
> 
> 
> ...


Sorry sweety you are first going to have to shrink Annie to the size of a plankton before taking a mouthful of her, or she'll get stuck in your gills and YOU will die.


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## Almaviva (Aug 13, 2010)

mamascarlatti said:


> Sorry sweety you are first going to have to shrink Annie to the size of a plankton before taking a mouthful of her, or she'll get stuck in your gills and YOU will die.


 I know that, Nat (couldn't resist the pictures given the wet fish running joke), but I got a special shrinking ray that will get me through this obstacle.:devil: I got it from a Hollywood auction. Apparently the thing was used in some movie before.










Besides, Annie is petite, if the ray doesn't work I think I can still manage to swallow her.


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## sabrina (Apr 26, 2011)

I don't really understand how this challenge works. But for the best chorus I chose right now, Rachmaninov's Aleko, first gypsies chorus "Kak vol'nost, vesel nas nocleg".










The Darwin award goes to Papageno from die Zauberflote (Simon Keenlyside)










And for the duets I love the Vendetta duet from Rigoletto


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## sabrina (Apr 26, 2011)

I just found this duet from Lucia di Lamermoor:


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## World Violist (May 31, 2007)

I feel like I ought to listen to Pelleas et Melisande before answering what my favorite duet is...


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## mamascarlatti (Sep 23, 2009)

sabrina said:


> I don't really understand how this challenge works.


We post an answer on thirty consecutive days.

We are now on day two, best candidate for a Darwin award (see link in original post and here for a fuller explanation), but I don't think Papageno qualifies because he doesn't do anything stupid enough to remove himself from the gene pool - on the contrary I think he and Papagena are planning to create a whole tribe of baby Papageni!

Ernani, on the other hand, gratuitously commits suicide, Alzucena throws her own baby into the fire, Attila gives his sworn enemy his own sword, Carmen stays and faces Don Jose instead of calling in the brawny boy friend to help, Cavaradossi goes along with the whole "blank bullets" farce, and we can probably go on a whole lot more.


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## sabrina (Apr 26, 2011)

I completely misunderstood the Darwin award. For me, it had a positive connotation, and a creative outcome. That's why I chose Papageno.


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## mamascarlatti (Sep 23, 2009)

sabrina said:


> I completely misunderstood the Darwin award. For my it had a positive connotation, and a creative outcome. That's why I chose Papageno.


Well, no one could doubt that Papageno's babies would be so super-cute they'd have some kind of advantage!


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## schigolch (Jun 26, 2011)

Favourite duet:


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## BalloinMaschera (Apr 4, 2011)

Chi_townPhilly said:


> *Day 2- The Darwin award is hereby presented to...
> Eh- how about Judith from "Duke Bluebeard's Castle?"
> "You don't really want to see everything?!" "Yes, I do!" "The next to last stop is sorrow- do you still want to go on?!" "Yes, I do!! Give it to me! Give it to me now!!"
> 
> ...


*

Day 2- I have to agree 

Day 3- If the second half of Act I Walkuere can qualify as a Duet (once Hunding exits), then I'd have to go with that...otherwise, the Bedchamber Duet from Lohengrin or the endless T&I duet.*


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## Couchie (Dec 9, 2010)

Normally I'd go with the Liebesnacht, but I just got a new Ring, and well, nothing else exists right now.


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## mamascarlatti (Sep 23, 2009)

Favourite duets:

Two baroque beauties


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## TxllxT (Mar 2, 2011)

*3. Favourite duet*

Prokofiev: Semyon Kotko

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0018O4T6I/ref=dm_mu_dp_trk24

Can't get enough of it!


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## HarpsichordConcerto (Jan 1, 2010)

mamascarlatti said:


> 3.	Favourite duet


I really don't know what my favourite duet is. But I was listening to these recently, amongst the innumerable masterpieces that he wrote.

Handel, from _Muzio Scevola - Ma come amar_. Note that _Muzio_ was a three act opera with music by three composers, each writing one act; Handel wrote the music to Act Three. It was a relatively common novelty those days when an opera company had several leading in-house composers, and people wanted each composer to write an act's music. In this case, it was England's first professional opera company, The Royal Academy of Music, where Handel was appointed Master of the Orchestra.






Handel, from _Sosarme - Per le porte tormento_


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## Aksel (Dec 3, 2010)

Day 3:
Why do you make this so hard, Nat? It's impossible to pick just one.

Totally agree with HC. _Per le porte del tormento _is a thing of wonder:





Also, the love duet from Tristan is amazing. 





And Zauberflöte is just rife with lovely duets, like this one (and that other one):


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## waldvogel (Jul 10, 2011)

There's so much optimism in it, yet the despair comes through too. I'll pick the French version "Dieu, tu semas dans nos ames" from Don Carlos.


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## sospiro (Apr 3, 2010)

Death of Rodrigo. There are so many versions but I like this one.


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## MAuer (Feb 6, 2011)

*Day 3: Favorite duet*

This is really a tough call because there are so many gorgeous ones. But another YouTube video from the Hvorostovsky/Kaufmann concert has really sold me on "Au fond du temple saint" from _The Pearl Fishers_.


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## rgz (Mar 6, 2010)

*3. Favourite duet *
Ack, too many to list! Both Adina - Dulcamara duets in l'Elisir, Via Resti Servita from Nozze, Mon Regiment from La Fille du Regiment, so many more. If I must answer, though, then probably this one:


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## Almaviva (Aug 13, 2010)

I'm afraid again that I'll be too conventional, but I really love _Au fond du temple saint. _When we get to the part - Oui, c'est elle! C'est la déesse - I completely melt and start swinging with the music like a wave.

*ZURGA
C'était le soir!
Dans l'air par la brise attiédi,
Les brahmines au front inondé de lumière,
Appelaient lentement la foule à la prière!

NADIR
**Au fond du temple saint
Paré de fleurs et d'or,
Une femme apparaît!
ZURGA
Une femme apparaît!
**NADIR**
Je crois la voir encore!
ZURGA
Je crois la voir encore!

NADIR
La foule prosternée
La regarde, etonnée,
Et murmure tous bas:
Voyez, c'est la déesse!
Qui dans l'ombre se dresse
Et vers nous tend les bras!

ZURGA
Son voile se soulève!
Ô vision! ô rêve!
La foule est à genoux!

ZURGA & NADIR 
Oui, c'est elle!
C'est la déesse 
plus charmante et plus belle!
Oui, c'est elle!
C'est la déesse 
qui descend parmi nous!
Son voile se soulève et la foule est à genoux!

NADIR
Mais à travers la foule
Elle s'ouvre un passage!

ZURGA
Son long voile déjà
Nous cache son visage!

NADIR
Mon regard, hélas!
La cherche en vain!

ZURGA
Elle fuit!

NADIR
Elle fuit!
Mais dans mon âme soudain
Quelle étrange ardeur s'allume!

ZURGA
Quel feu nouveau me consume!

NADIR
Ta main repousse ma main!

ZURGA
Ta main repousse ma main!

NADIR
De nos cœurs l'amour s'empare
Et nous change en ennemis!

ZURGA
Non, que rien ne nous sépare!

NADIR
Non, rien!

ZURGA
Que rien ne nous sépare!

NADIR
Non, rien!

ZURGA
Jurons de rester amis!
NADIR
Jurons de rester amis!
ZURGA
Jurons de rester amis!

ZURGA & NADIR
Oh oui, jurons de rester amis!
Oui, c'est elle! C'est la déesse!
En ce jour qui vient nous unir,
Et fidèle à ma promesse,
Comme un frère je veux te chérir!
C'est elle, c'est la déesse
Qui vient en ce jour nous unir!
Oui, partageons le même sort,
Soyons unis jusqu'à la mort!*


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## amfortas (Jun 15, 2011)

I can't come up with *the* favorite duet, so I'll settle for *a* favorite.

Last night I took my son to see the Met HD rebroadcast of Don Carlo, which only reconfirmed my love for this work. There are so many tremendous moments, but I'll single out a favorite of mine that never seems to get quite the love it deserves: the final scene between Carlo and Elisabetta. Verdi gives the lovers such dignified restraint while never losing sight of their underlying passion. In particular, the "Ma lassu ci vedremo" duet (beginning of the second clip below) is just so perfect and moving in its utter chaste simplicity.

The clips are from the same excellent Nicholas Hytner production I saw last night, though here in its earlier Royal Opera House run--Poplavskaya teaming up with Villazon rather than Alagna.


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## Almaviva (Aug 13, 2010)

I know I've voted already and I do confirm my vote, but taking a hint from amfortas' choice of a recent experience, I must say that I was very impressed with the duet between Gertrudes and Hamlet in Thomas' opera.


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## rgz (Mar 6, 2010)

*4. Favourite post-1920 opera*
Shostakovich - The Nose


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## schigolch (Jun 26, 2011)

So many...

For today, I'll settle with _Saint François d'Assise_, just because it's the last post-1920 opera that I've watched at the theater, and was thrilled about it.


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## Almaviva (Aug 13, 2010)

Some of my favorites: Peter Grimes, Porgy and Bess, Lady Macbeth of Mtsensk District, The Nose, L'Amour de Loin, The Minotaur, Oedipe, Moses und Aron, Dialogue des Carmélites, The Ghosts of Versailles, The Death of Klinghoffer, Doctor Atomic, Die Gezeichneten, Król Roger, Doktor Faust, Lulu, Wozzeck, Cardillac, L'Enfant et les Sortilèges, Betrothal in a Monastery, War and Peace, The Rape of Lucretia, Death in Venice, A Village Romeo and Juliet, The Love for Three Oranges, Arabella, Daphne, and I'd have included Die Tote Stadt but it missed the deadline by a hair, with its premiere in December of 1920.

The list above is already a selection of favorites, so, it's hard to cut down from it.

Let me see which ones I *really* cherish:

Peter Grimes
Porgy and Bess
Lady Macbeth of Mtsensk District
L'Amour de Loin
The Minotaur
Moses und Aron
The Death of Klinghoffer
Die Gezeichneten
Doktor Faust
Lulu
Wozzeck
L'Enfant et les Sortilèges

Cutting further down from these:

Peter Grimes
Porgy and Bess
Lady Macbeth of Mtsensk District
Moses und Aron
The Death of Klinghoffer
Doktor Faust
Lulu
Wozzeck
L'Enfant et les Sortilèges

It's becoming tougher. Let's make some painful cuts:

Peter Grimes
Porgy and Bess
Lady Macbeth of Mtsensk District
The Death of Klinghoffer
Doktor Faust
Lulu

Got to top six. Now, top three

Peter Grimes
Porgy and Bess
Lady Macbeth of Mtsensk District

Top two

Peter Grimes
Lady Macbeth of Mtsensk District

Now it's practically impossible to say which one.
They are pretty much equally good.
But it's called a "challenge" so my task is to take the challenge and produce the sole result.

Everything else being equal in terms of quality, I'll have to go with Peter Grimes, because of the beautiful intermezzi that do tip the balance in its favor.


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## TxllxT (Mar 2, 2011)

*4. Favourite post-1920 opera*

When it comes to my personal favourite, Prokofiev is the name of the composer and Semyon Kotko the name of the opera (_primus inter pares_ among Betrothal in a Monastery, Love for 3 Oranges, War & Peace, Story of a Real Man). When it comes to greatness, impressiveness, an opera that really deserves respect as such, I have to mention Francis Poulenc's Dialogues des Carmélites.


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## mamascarlatti (Sep 23, 2009)

So as not to be boring, I won't say Billy Budd again. I'll go for "The Death of Klinghoffer instead". Almost unbearably moving,


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## BalloinMaschera (Apr 4, 2011)

Favourite post-1920 opera- Lulu


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## FragendeFrau (May 30, 2011)

post-1920 opera: Peter Grimes (I've only seen three, and it's the only one I liked. And I REALLY like it!)

I can't really do duets because of lack of exposure; does Wotan/Brünnhilde at the end of Walküre count as a duet? If so, that's my pick.


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## World Violist (May 31, 2007)

3: Favorite duet: Tristan und Isolde...
4: Favorite post-1920 opera: Saint Francois d'Assise.


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## MAuer (Feb 6, 2011)

*Day 4: Favorite post-1920 opera*

Carlisle Floyd's _Susannah_. Here is a link to a YouTube clip of the great Sam Ramey singing the role of the Rev. Olin Blitch:




(I can't get the "insert video" icon to work properly to save my soul, no pun intended.) 

I remember parts of "_Porgy and Bess_" from a televised production back in the '70s, and liked it --I'm familiar with some of its music ("Summertime," "I've Got Plenty of Nothin'," "It 'Ain't Necessarily So," etc.). The local opera company here has "P&B" among the scheduled productions for the 2012 season, so I'm going to take a look at our TC Recommended Videos for the top 100 operas and then make the folks at Amazon happy . . .


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## mamascarlatti (Sep 23, 2009)

MAuer said:


> I remember parts of "_Porgy and Bess_" from a televised production back in the '70s, and liked it --I'm familiar with some of its music ("Summertime," "I've Got Plenty of Nothin'," "It 'Ain't Necessarily So," etc.). The local opera company here has "P&B" among the scheduled productions for the 2012 season, so I'm going to take a look at our TC Recommended Videos for the top 100 operas and then make the folks at Amazon happy . . .


The Porgy and Bess film with Willard White is really wonderful...


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## mamascarlatti (Sep 23, 2009)

FragendeFrau said:


> post-1920 opera: Peter Grimes (I've only seen three, and it's the only one I liked. And I REALLY like it!)


I think you'd like Billy Budd.


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## amfortas (Jun 15, 2011)

Almaviva said:


> Some of my favorites: Peter Grimes, Porgy and Bess, Lady Macbeth of Mtsensk District, The Nose, L'Amour de Loin, The Minotaur, Oedipe, Moses und Aron, Dialogue des Carmélites, The Ghosts of Versailles, The Death of Klinghoffer, Doctor Atomic, Die Gezeichneten, Król Roger, Doktor Faust, Lulu, Wozzeck, Cardillac, L'Enfant et les Sortilèges, Betrothal in a Monastery, War and Peace, The Rape of Lucretia, Death in Venice, A Village Romeo and Juliet, The Love for Three Oranges, Arabella, Daphne, and I'd have included Die Tote Stadt but it missed the deadline by a hair, with its premiere in December of 1920.
> 
> The list above is already a selection of favorites, so, it's hard to cut down from it.
> 
> ...


Yeah. What he said.


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## ooopera (Jul 27, 2011)

I'll join you if I can, even it's already a fourth day. 

Choosing my favourite opera since 1920 it's almost impossible (have same problems as Almaviva). It should be at least after 1945 
.... let it be Saint Francois d'Assise because I saw it few days ago in Munich.


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## HarpsichordConcerto (Jan 1, 2010)

mamascarlatti said:


> 4.	Favourite post-1920 opera


Difficult to say. I would prefer to answer this by choosing a composer or two whose operas seemed to click well, namely Britten and Alban Berg. I enjoy this era of opera, but like almost all opera, I think that is to do with the composer and his/her music rather than era per se.


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## Sieglinde (Oct 25, 2009)

I'll _so_ put this all in one post. I love filling these things but i'd forget some days if i streched it out.

1. Best chorus - Gira la cote 
2. Best operatic candidate for a Darwin award - Sooo many... maybe Ernani? Giving his horn to his biggest enemy and saying "just blow it and I'll die"? Really? How stupid is this man?
3. Favourite duet - King Philip vs. Grand Inquisitor
4. Favourite post-1920 opera - Billy Budd
5. Opera which you would have liked to see in the original production - Aida
6. Opera you recommend for a newbie - Tosca
7. Wagnerphile or Wagnerphobe? Wagnerphile.
8. Opera whose libretto you enjoyed reading. - Peter Grimes. It actually makes sense.
9. Favourite Bel Canto opera - Lucia
10. One DVD and/or CD to avoid - Losey's Don Giovanni. It's the most boring **** I've ever seen.
11. Favourite fiction book about or involving opera - Pratchett's Maskerade
12. Opera that you watch/listen to when you need cheering up - Zauberflöte
13. An opera blog/site you frequently visit - Barihunks 
14. HIP - important to you or not? What's HIP?
15. Favourite opera conductor. - Furtwängler
16. Favourite ensemble aria. - whut? You mean minor character aria? Or chorus? Or massive multiplayer ensemble right before the pause?
17. Do you tend to prefer singers from the past or the present? Past, mainly.
18. Last time you cried at the opera. - Parsifal, 2009.
19. What voice type are you? - Dramatic soprano
20. Favourite Regie production (if any) - Copenhagen Ring
21. Do you enjoy operettas? - Hate them with a passion.
22. Best opera (singing) actor - like what? Actual actor who sings opera, or singer who's a great actor? In the latter case, Gobbi. I have no idea if any actor sings opera.
23. Watching or listening? Why? - Watching. With subtitles. I prefer seeing my stuff too.
24. Favourite "traditional" production (if any) - Metropolitan Billy Budd. The ONLY version with 100% accurate costumes and hairdos. And badass set. 
25. Favourite One-act opera - Cavalleria
26. Best opera (singing) actress - see above. Clarify.
27. High notes - essential or irrelevant? - Whatev. I get orgasm from low F and below... don't care much for high notes.
28. Your most often consulted reference book about opera? - Tons of random library books...
29. Opera character your mother would warn you away from marrying. - Hagen 
30. Three qualities essential for an opera singer. - Voice. Looks. Acting ability.


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## waldvogel (Jul 10, 2011)

I think I'll divide it up into early, mid-period, and late operas.

(1920-1950) Lady Macbeth of Mzensk
(1950-1980) Death in Venice
(1980-2011) Nixon in China is the best of the three operas that I've heard from this period. We're seeing L'amour de loin this fall...


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## amfortas (Jun 15, 2011)

Sieglinde said:


> 27. High notes - essential or irrelevant? - Whatev. I get orgasm from low F and below... don't care much for high notes.


*cough* *cough* (deep voice) . . . Well hel - LOOOOOOW there . . .


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## Almaviva (Aug 13, 2010)

Original production: The Ring, obviously, there at Bayreuth, hopefully I'd sit just next to Tchaikovsky who was in attendance.


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## sospiro (Apr 3, 2010)

*Opera which you would have liked to see in the original production*

Rigoletto

After all the problems with censorship it must have been an anxious time for Verdi.

And to see if the audience really did leave whistling _La donna è mobile_ after hearing it for the first time. Takes me ages to 'learn' a tune.


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## Operafocus (Jul 17, 2011)

sospiro said:


> *Opera which you would have liked to see in the original production*
> 
> Rigoletto
> 
> ...


And also if the tenor actually only got to hear it (and learn it!) on the day of the performance so that others wouldn't know it/whistle it before the opening night...!


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## mamascarlatti (Sep 23, 2009)

Giulio Cesare, to hear Cuzzoni and Senesino in the title roles. And get dressed up of course. Though I might have been irritated by all the chatting and coming and going.


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## schigolch (Jun 26, 2011)

_Guglielmo Ratcliff_, at La Scala, in 1895.


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## TxllxT (Mar 2, 2011)

*5. Opera which you would have liked to see in the original production*

Well, of course: Nabucco! To be among the first who sing along with the Hebrew slaves and to see the impact on the Italian society....


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## MAuer (Feb 6, 2011)

*Day 5: Opera which you would have liked to see in the original production*

I'd also like to have seen the "_Ring_" operas. It would have been interesting to hear what sorts of voices Wagner had in his original cast (compared to what we think of today as "Wagnerian" voices), and fun to watch the Victorian version of special effects.


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## World Violist (May 31, 2007)

I'd probably be most interested in seeing the original production of Britten's _Curlew River,_ if only because they put such effort into every aspect of staging and movements the people on stage would make, etc. It would be fascinating to see.


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## FragendeFrau (May 30, 2011)

MAuer said:


> *Day 5: Opera which you would have liked to see in the original production*
> 
> I'd also like to have seen the "_Ring_" operas. It would have been interesting to hear what sorts of voices Wagner had in his original cast (compared to what we think of today as "Wagnerian" voices), and fun to watch the Victorian version of special effects.


I can't think of anything out of my limited experience so I will have to steal this from you as my answer!


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## amfortas (Jun 15, 2011)

Originally I probably would have gone with the Ring as well. But after reading Alex Ross's _The Rest is Noise_, I'm going to cheat a little bit and go with the *second* production of Strauss's _Salome_. The opera premiered in Dresden in 1906; five months later it was performed in the provincial Austrian city of Graz. By then word had spread about this scandalous, dissonant, major new work, so that among the many luminaries in attendance, besides Strauss himself, were Gustav and Alma Mahler, Giacomo Puccini, Arnold Schoenberg, Alexander von Zemlinsky, Alban Berg, the widow of Johann Strauss, and (just possibly) Adolf Hitler. Talk about hobnobbing with the hoi polloi!


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## FragendeFrau (May 30, 2011)

Wow, that is pretty amazing!


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## Aksel (Dec 3, 2010)

I agree with the Ring cycle. To have seen the original sets, heard the original singers, sitting in the same room as most of musical Europe of the middle late 19th century.


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## waldvogel (Jul 10, 2011)

Opera that I'd love to have seen at its premiere:

Well, a LOT of us would have liked to be in Bayreuth for the premiere of the Ring. That's a small house, and it's getting pretty crowded now. So instead, get me to La Scala on February 5, 1887, and let me sit in anticipation with the rest of the audience for the first opera written by Giuseppe Verdi after a 16 year "retirement". It's time for Otello.


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## amfortas (Jun 15, 2011)

Aksel said:


> I agree with the Ring cycle. To have seen the original sets, heard the original singers, sitting in the same room as most of musical Europe of the middle late 19th century.


Although not all of the stage effects went quite as planned. The story is that the dragon's neck was mistakenly sent, not to Bayreuth, but to Beirut, so that Wagner had to do without. The original "no-neck monster"!


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## Almaviva (Aug 13, 2010)

ooopera said:


> I'll join you if I can, even it's already a fourth day.
> 
> Choosing my favourite opera since 1920 it's almost impossible (have same problems as Almaviva). It should be at least after 1945
> .... let it be Saint Francois d'Assise because I saw it few days ago in Munich.


Of course you can join anytime, and even catch-up by posting your answers to the older questions. There is also Round 1, and do feel welcome to go back there and post your answers to those 30 questions as well, if you wish.


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## Almaviva (Aug 13, 2010)

waldvogel said:


> Opera that I'd love to have seen at its premiere:
> 
> Well, a LOT of us would have liked to be in Bayreuth for the premiere of the Ring. That's a small house, and it's getting pretty crowded now. So instead, get me to La Scala on February 5, 1887, and let me sit in anticipation with the rest of the audience for the first opera written by Giuseppe Verdi after a 16 year "retirement". It's time for Otello.


 That's a good one. I'd have loved to have been among those who carried him back to his apartment after the performance while shouting _Viva il Maestro!_


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## Aksel (Dec 3, 2010)

amfortas said:


> Although not all of the stage effects went quite as planned. The story is that the dragon's neck was mistakenly sent, not to Bayreuth, but to Beirut, so that Wagner had to do without. The original "no-neck monster"!


I've heard that as well. My brother's 8th grade English textbook actually had an article about it.


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## amfortas (Jun 15, 2011)

Aksel said:


> I've heard that as well. My brother's 8th grade English textbook actually had an article about it.


That's about my level of knowledge.


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## ooopera (Jul 27, 2011)

waldvogel said:


> Well, a LOT of us would have liked to be in Bayreuth for the premiere of the Ring. That's a small house, and it's getting pretty crowded now.


There should be another empty seat for me ...


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## Aksel (Dec 3, 2010)

waldvogel said:


> Opera that I'd love to have seen at its premiere:
> 
> Well, a LOT of us would have liked to be in Bayreuth for the premiere of the Ring. That's a small house, and it's getting pretty crowded now.


It's no matter. I can sit on Grieg's lap.


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## waldvogel (Jul 10, 2011)

Aksel said:


> It's no matter. I can sit on Grieg's lap.


I don't think I'd want to sit on Tchaikovsky's lap...


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## Aksel (Dec 3, 2010)

waldvogel said:


> I don't think I'd want to sit on Tchaikovsky's lap...


Nah. He'd probably freak out and go hide in his room or something. And write in his journal. But if you did sit in his lap and he did freak out, you'd get his seat. And besides, he didn't really like the music anyway.


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## HarpsichordConcerto (Jan 1, 2010)

mamascarlatti said:


> 5. Opera which you would have liked to see in the original production


Just about any of the early operas, pre-Baroque, Baroque or Classical! I'll have to randomly pick one out of a hat or something. Later operas, I guess Wagner's _Ring_ for its significance. Frankly, it's all a dream.


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## World Violist (May 31, 2007)

6. Opera I'd recommend for a newbie? Seriously? I don't have one. Were I forced to pick one it would be Curlew River...provided the person I was recommending to was a God-forsaken crazy person who was already listening to weird concert music at the time, and who for whatever reason didn't like Italian opera. Basically, if the person was me.

Um...were I absolutely forced--bound, gagged, undergoing Chinese water torture (a lot worse than a gun to one's head, I'm sure)--I might go ahead and say Boris Godunov. It's accessible, has an involving plot, believable characters, and does not last 4 hours (which is the ONLY reason I didn't spring for Tristan).


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## mamascarlatti (Sep 23, 2009)

HarpsichordConcerto said:


> Just about any of the early operas, pre-Baroque, Baroque or Classical! I'll have to randomly pick one out of a hat or something. Later operas, I guess Wagner's _Ring_ for its significance. Frankly, it's all a dream.


Dust out your best wig and cravat and come with me to Giulio Cesare. We can let the riff-raff squabble over their Ring seats.


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## sospiro (Apr 3, 2010)

*6. Opera you recommend for a newbie*

Depends on whether the recommendation is for a DVD or a visit to the theatre.

For a DVD I'd suggest Don Giovanni.

For a first live experience I'd suggest something without a complex story and which has some tunes the newbie probably knows already like Carmen or La Traviata. The opera should be in its original language so make sure the theatre has sur-titles.


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## Operafocus (Jul 17, 2011)

*6. Opera you recommend for a newbie*

Tosca. Because it's easy to follow, has some amazing arias and doesn't last five hours. :lol:


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## Almaviva (Aug 13, 2010)

For a newbie: Le Nozze di Figaro.


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## schigolch (Jun 26, 2011)

In my experience, a given individual can get hooked with any given opera. That will depend a lot on his musical background, his literary tastes, if he is already a keen theatergoer...

But if we think on the average new person, my recommendation will be for short operas (around two hours will be fine), with a credible plot, and accessible music. 

Let's say Traviata, Carmen, Bohème,...


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## TxllxT (Mar 2, 2011)

*6. Opera you recommend for a newbie*

I've seen quite some Madame Butterflies. Exotic setting, a story full of human longing, touch and tragedy. I myself needed the _verismo_ atmosphere when I was a newbie. Fairy tale plots, where all remains possible, twisted & unbelievable I wouldn't advise.


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## FragendeFrau (May 30, 2011)

I myself as a newbie was hooked by a television broadcast of The Flying Dutchman.

But I have had great success with the Carmen DVD from the Royal Opera House. However, all my friends were musical folks anyway, they just weren't particularly interested in opera. And I can't say I've convinced anyone who doesn't like or know opera at all to become a fan.

Listening to Tristan and Isolde from Bayreuth on the radio last week reminded me how much opera is an 'acquired taste' like so many of the finer things in life  that you don't always like the first few tastes of. Despite having sung in an amateur chorus for 20 years (which definitely gives me more perspective/interest in singing than I did when I first became interested in opera) and loving the Ring cycle, I found Tristan and Isolde...as an opera...somewhat boring. :devil: AND I found the voices of the singers unappealing, even thought I was in complete AWE of what they were doing. I have a problem with big voices that have big vibrato.

So that is something that will take a few more "tastes" before it becomes a favorite!

And it may be that a newbie could be hooked after watching a few operas of different styles. I absolutely loved Nozze after my first listen yesterday and can't wait to see a DVD. (or try that Met streaming thing...:lol


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## MAuer (Feb 6, 2011)

*Day 6: Opera you recommend for a newbie*

I would also recommend _Carmen_, whether live in the theater, on DVD (ROH version, of course), or audio (several fine versions to choose from). It isn't very long, as operas go (no five or six hours), and our newbie would probably recognize quite a bit of the music.


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## FragendeFrau (May 30, 2011)

Yes I think the music recognition factor in Carmen is a big plus. And of course, watching a DVD has the plus of subtitles, which is huge. Finally, more of my friends have studied French at some time in the past than have studied Italian or German, and it's always nice when you understand some of the singing and the dialogue (in Carmen).


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## Almaviva (Aug 13, 2010)

I almost said Carmen. It was *my* first one. But I ended up settling for Le Nozze because of its lively plot, catchy tunes (who wouldn't find Porgi Amor, Voi che sapete, Non più andrai, and Sull'aria interesting?), and great orchestration. But as a matter of fact when I've been faced with this problem in real life I used La Traviata to some good results. Oh wait, I have used Le Nozze with *children* of a friend of mine and they loved it. I guess all three would do. Madama Butterfly on the other hand I find too melodramatic and lachrymose, I think that some newbies might be turned off by it. 

The duration is a problem, even for a 2-hour opera - remember that if we want to successfully jump start the love for opera, we're supposed to let the newbie be hungry for more instead of bored and waiting for it to end already. This is why I didn't propose something like Il Barbiere because while its first half is spectacular, its second half drags on a bit and could get the newbie to be a bit restless. We've not been thinking of shorter alternatives which can also be a very good appealing introduction, such as Gianni Schicchi, and L'Heure Espagnole. 

Longer ones that could also work include La Pietra del Paragone, Rita, L'Equivoco Stravagante, L'Elisir d'Amore, La Cenerentola, L'Italiana in Algeri, Don Pasquale, Mignon, Les Contes d'Hoffmann, The Bartered Bride, La Fille du Regiment. You've noticed that I'm deliberately picking light, uplifting, funny plots. For the younger viewer I might think of L'Enfant et les Sortilèges, or Hansel und Gretel (La Cenerentola would also do).

It would be good to find out what genre of movies the newbie favors. If someone likes drama better than comedy, then I'd go with something like Cavalleria Rusticana (I've mentioned Carmen already). La Bohème of course could also work in this context. Manon and Rusalka migth do as well, although it would be a longer shot. Porgy and Bess might work.

For the seasoned classical music fan who nevertheless hasn't been exposed to opera, we might get a little more adventurous and pick something like Die Meistersinger, The Flying Dutchman, or Norma.

Another avenue might be an operetta first, as a step up, especially for people who love musicals. The Merry Widow or Die Fledermaus would do.


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## FragendeFrau (May 30, 2011)

I like your idea of operetta as a step into it. I also found with my "Carmen" experiment, since it was a dvd, I made it a party and we stopped at the intervals for food and drink (not that I didn't have us drinking sangria right from the start!) Creates a jovial atmosphere!

The other great thing about a DVD and having other friends come over is that, frankly, you can stop the video and answer questions, and the friends can be sociable, and nobody feels like they have to follow any 'opera rules' as at a live performance. Of course everyone agreed that a live performance would be a very special treat, I'm the only one crazy enough to have gotten Met tickets!


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## waldvogel (Jul 10, 2011)

Well, the first opera that I saw was The Rake's Progress... I loved it. But I already loved classical music, so one obstacle was already eliminated.

For a newbie, especially a young one, how about the traditional combination of Cavalleria Rusticana and Pagliacci? It would give you a lot to chat about at intermission, and the ability to compare the two operas afterwards.


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## amfortas (Jun 15, 2011)

I can never predict what other people will like, so I figure I may as well share with them something *I* love. I've shown several opera newbies the Chereau _Walkure_, and they've gotten caught up in the romance and excitement of the story. Same with my son and the recent Met HD broadcast. Wagner doesn't have to be a daunting experience, even for a newbie.

But then again, this is a fanatic speaking. After all, I'm the guy who stayed up late one night reading the subtitles of _Parsifal_ so my three-year-old daughter could follow the story about the "evil wizard."


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## Aksel (Dec 3, 2010)

Die Zauberflöte could actually be a good introduction. Lots of fun moments, especially in the first act.


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## mamascarlatti (Sep 23, 2009)

Almaviva said:


> Les Contes d'Hoffmann, ......light, uplifting, funny .


Alma, seriously? This guy falls in love with three women and one's a doll, one dies and one steals from him while mocking him, so that despairing he turns back to his muse?

I think this could turn people off - at my first encounter I remember thinking how different it was from all the other Hoffmann works I had seen, and being freaked out by the weirdness of the story. And I was USED to opera plots.

I'll stick to Carmen or Traviata, although in real life I'd take into account someone's exisiting musical tastes and sophistication first.


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## sospiro (Apr 3, 2010)

amfortas said:


> But then again, this is a fanatic speaking. After all, I'm the guy who stayed up late one night reading the subtitles of _Parsifal_ so my three-year-old daughter could follow the story about the "evil wizard."


:lol:

Thanks - makes me feel (almost) normal. You're talking to someone who got up at 03:00 to listen to _Don Quichotte_ live from Seattle Opera.


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## amfortas (Jun 15, 2011)

mamascarlatti said:


> Alma, seriously? This guy falls in love with three women and one's a doll, one dies and one steals from him while mocking him, so that despairing he turns back to his muse?
> 
> I think this could turn people off - at my first encounter I remember thinking how different it was from all the other Hoffmann works I had seen, and being freaked out by the weirdness of the story. And I was USED to opera plots.
> 
> I'll stick to Carmen or Traviata, although in real life I'd take into account someone's exisiting musical tastes and sophistication first.


But in fairness to Alma, Carmen and Traviata aren't exactly "light, uplifting, and funny" either--certainly not their endings. If people are going to develop a taste for opera at all, they're going to have to accept a certain amount of darkness and tragedy. And come on, who among us couldn't use a little more of that in our lives?


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## mamascarlatti (Sep 23, 2009)

amfortas said:


> But in fairness to Alma, Carmen and Traviata aren't exactly "light, uplifting, and funny" either--certainly not their endings. If people are going to develop a taste for opera at all, they're going to have to accept a certain amount of darkness and tragedy. And come on, who among us couldn't use a little more of that in our lives?


I agree, I was just saying that Hoffmann is rather different in tone from the other jolly romps that Alma quoted.


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## FragendeFrau (May 30, 2011)

Thanks for the warning--you say there's a doll in Les Contes d'Hoffmann? *shivers* I don't like dolls, clowns, puppets, or mimes (but that's a whole nother thing). I may have to give that one a miss!


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## mamascarlatti (Sep 23, 2009)

The doll in one act only (the Olympia one) and of course is played by a human being. So you could watch or listen to all the other acts safely, although you would be missing the famous virtuoso aria "Les Oiseaux dans la Charmille".

Of course you presumably avoid Pagliacci if you don't like clowns, and for mimes some DVD versions of Love for Three Oranges as the source material is commedia dell'arte and some productions use this in their DVDs (eg the one with the lovely Charles Workman). The Ritorno D'Ulisse in Patria with Marijana Mijanovic and the Met Madama Butterfly with Patricia Racette both use puppets in the productions.


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## Almaviva (Aug 13, 2010)

Yes, Nat, Les Contes d'Hoffmann slipped in behind my back when I was quoting uplifting plots. But still, I think it might work, because it's such a gem! It's a sci-fi opera! The Olympia story is great, and there are some very funny renditions of the Doll song; the first part has the Kleinzach aria, and then later you get the melodious Barcarolle, and it's varied and interesting all the way. I think it's great fun for a newbie. Maybe not light and uplifting, but then, Carmen or La Bohème or La Traviata aren't, and people are quoting them as good choices. I sustain that Les Contes d'Hoffmann is a very good choice for a newbie.


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## ooopera (Jul 27, 2011)

I vote for almost everything ... but explained with enthusiasm and passion!


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## Almaviva (Aug 13, 2010)

Day 7 - Wagnerphile of course.
The Ring is and is likely to remain my favorite operatic work, and after Les Troyens, next comes Tristan und Isolde. So of my top 3 preferred operatic works (taking the Ring as one), numbers 1 and 3 are Wagner's. Then, the others aren't that high in my preference but are pretty high too - Die Meistersinger is such a gem! Lohengrin is my next favorite, and then Tannhäuser which I think is great and a bit under-rated. Paradoxically I'm not that fond of Parsifal when compared to the other Wagners, although I recognize that it contains some of the most sublime music ever written, but I don't really like its libretto, unlike all the other Wagners whose libretti I always find interesting. Der Fliegende Holländer and Rienzi are good but are in a more "regular" status in my appreciation (meaning good works but not especially better than those of many other composers). His "youthful mistakes" as he puts it, I've never seen/heard. I'd like to, though, just to complete my exposure, although I know I can't expect much from them.

It is hard for me to decide whether Wagner is my number 1 preferred opera composer, because I consider Mozart, Verdi, and Handel to be just as good. I'd say it's a 4-way tie for first place, and Berlioz rounds up my top five, although I realize that everybody looks at me with funny faces when I include Berlioz among the five greatest opera composers of all times - but for me, he is: small production of four operas, but all four outstanding. Anyway, I digress. So, definitely yes, I'd say someone who places Wagner as at least one of the four "number one" composers, and places two of his works in his personal 1st and 3rd ranking spots, is a Wagnerphile. But I haven't joined a Wagner Society yet, but I'm planning to (in order to see if I can score some Bayreuth tickets, eventually).


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## schigolch (Jun 26, 2011)

Day 7 - Neither.

There are some Wagner operas I like a lot (Tristan, Lohengrin) and others that I'm pretty indifferent to (Ring, Meistersinger), with the rest coming in between.


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## TxllxT (Mar 2, 2011)

*7. Wagnerphile or Wagnerphobe?*

Yes, I do like Otto Wagner's academical Secession architecture very much:









As to Richard, you know, that musician: great composer who however wanted to do everything 'all by myself'. I admire it more when a librettist and a composer *together* produce a work of marvel (for example: Mozart & Da Ponte). Wagner's idea of a _Gesamtkunstwerk_ was carried out in a monomanic manner. That is not _gesamt_.


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## World Violist (May 31, 2007)

Wagnerphile or Wagnerphobe...I'd have to say neither as well. I love Tristan und Isolde, but I just can't appreciate a staging of the Ring cycle because of all the blatant fakery Wagner forces staging directors to engage in (to be perfectly honest, Wagner seems to be working _against_ the opera house and anticipating film in it).

Also, I've never quite gotten into _Die Meistersinger,_ even though I acknowledge the overture as incredible. The plot and structure and all that never really grabbed me much.

It's kind of strange that there's a mentality about Wagner that "you either love or hate him, but you can't ignore him" as though there was such thing as an ultimatum between "love/hate" and "ignore." Those are just the most popular options!


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## BalloinMaschera (Apr 4, 2011)

5. Opera which you would have liked to seen in the original production - Die Zauberfloete- Not my favorite opera- but it would mean having Mozart in the pit and Schikanaeder as Papageno, and Mozart's sister in law, Jospeha, as QoTN

6. Opera you recommend for a newbie - Nozze di Figaro 

7. Wagnerphile or Wagnerphobe? Phile


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## waldvogel (Jul 10, 2011)

I'm a Wagnerphile, not to the point of worship, but I consider him the greatest operatic composer, with all due respect to Verdi.

Wagner is the only composer that will get me to travel to a city that I'd otherwise never visit just to see one of his operas. So thanks to Wagner, I've gotten to visit Toulouse (Tannhauser, Paris version) and Mannheim (Parsifal, Meistersinger).


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## Aksel (Dec 3, 2010)

waldvogel said:


> I'm a Wagnerphile, not to the point of worship, but I consider him the greatest operatic composer, with all due respect to Verdi.


+1. And with all respect to Händel as well.


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## amfortas (Jun 15, 2011)

Staunch Wagnerphile. 

Wagner was my first and still greatest opera love. My ten favorite operas (yes, I can name them, though in no particular order, and don't ask me to come up with 11 through 20) consist of four Wagners, two Verdis, two Mozarts, a Strauss, and a Tchaikovsky. 

Die Walkure is my favorite opera period, followed (among Wagner's works) by Parsifal, Tristan, Meistersinger, and Siegfried. After that the order is a little sketchy, but I find plenty to enjoy in the other works as well.

For me, the lifelong challenge has been, not learning to love Wagner, but learning to appreciate the wide range of other operatic periods and styles--something I'm still working on.


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## sospiro (Apr 3, 2010)

7. Wagnerphile or Wagnerphobe?

Phobe I'm afraid


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## waldvogel (Jul 10, 2011)

Aksel said:


> +1. And with all respect to Händel as well.


Oh, I forgot about Handel. I meant to mention him in the list of great operatic composers, after, of course, Wagner, Verdi, Strauss, Puccini, Mozart, Mussorgsky, Tchaikovsky, Janacek, Dvorak, Britten, Purcell, Rameau, Bizet, Berlioz, Massenet, Debussy, Ravel, Donizetti, Bellini, Mascagni, Leoncavallo, Rossini, Prokofiev, Shostakovich, Borodin, Barber, Gershwin, Chausson, Schreker, Berg, Offenbach, Meyerbeer, Gounod, Korngold, and Weill.

I know that Bach, Brahms, Mahler, and Bruckner didn't write operas, but I bet they would have been good if they had written one. I've never heard any of Schubert's or Haydn's operas, but that's my own fault, I'm sure.

Anyway, Handel's operas do compare quite favourably to Vivaldi's...


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## amfortas (Jun 15, 2011)

waldvogel said:


> Oh, I forgot about Handel. I meant to mention him in the list of great operatic composers, after, of course, Wagner, Verdi, Strauss, Puccini, Mozart, Mussorgsky, Tchaikovsky, Janacek, Dvorak, Britten, Purcell, Rameau, Bizet, Berlioz, Massenet, Debussy, Ravel, Donizetti, Bellini, Mascagni, Leoncavallo, Rossini, Prokofiev, Shostakovich, Borodin, Barber, Gershwin, Chausson, Schreker, Berg, Offenbach, Meyerbeer, Gounod, Korngold, and Weill.


Surprised you didn't throw in Garaudé, Sablières, and Wallek-Walewski as well.


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## MAuer (Feb 6, 2011)

*Day 7: Wagnerphile or Wagnerphobe?*

Neither. I enjoy Wagner's operas (or at least parts of them), but they're not among my favorites.


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## ooopera (Jul 27, 2011)

Almaviva said:


> But I haven't joined a Wagner Society yet, but I'm planning to (in order to see if I can score some Bayreuth tickets, eventually).


Day 7 - Wagnerphile!  I already did that "joining thing" ... and now waiting for the tickets ... someday.


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## mamascarlatti (Sep 23, 2009)

I'm a born again phile, having been a phobe throughout most of my operatic life. One year I was ready to give away my only Wagner recording because it was way too boring (the Bohm Tristan), 18 months later I have 4 ring cycle DVDs, 2 CD recordings and countless other stuff, and am planning like Alma to join the local Wagner Society so I can go to the Melbourne Ring with someone. 

I'm a little apprehensive about the Society, as I am not an unreserved admirer of the man, and I'm worried the other members might brook no dissention. I also like a hell of a lot of other composers and am hoping to encounter some general opera fans. You guys got any experience of Wagner societies? oooperafocus?


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## sospiro (Apr 3, 2010)

mamascarlatti said:


> I'm a born again phile, having been a phobe throughout most of my operatic life.


There's hope for me yet then


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## HarpsichordConcerto (Jan 1, 2010)

mamascarlatti said:


> 7.	Wagnerphile or Wagnerphobe?


I can recognise Wagner's importance and genius with operas but I'm not the biggest Wagner fan on the planet, enjoying his operas every now and then. My favourite is _Parsifal_.


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## Almaviva (Aug 13, 2010)

I forgot to mention that I have Wagner's picture on my refrigerator door, and a poster of Das Rheingold in my office. So yes, there's a bit of worshiping here. In my defense, I must say that I have Verdi's picture there as well.

@waldvogel - go figure, people are really so different. I hear you, and of course you have a right to your opinion and to your tastes, but for me, every single opera by Handel that I've seen, I found to be completely fascinating, and my only regret about his operas is that I only know 12 of them - in the _latu sensu _- some are rather oratorios (I'm working on it, I'll get to know more). Yes, they're repetitive, long, and formulaic, but oh so beautiful! I'm in bliss, nirvana, and paradise rolled into one when I'm listening to/watching an opera by Handel.

So for me it is completely puzzling that someone who obviously has a lot of exposure and appreciation for opera may say what you just said. Again, different strokes for different folks. More power to you if you don't like Handel, it's just that I can barely understand how this can be possible. I mean, I can understand it in a cognitive level, but not in an emotional level. In my opinion, the man didn't know how to put two ugly notes together. For me, everything he wrote is sublime.

Oh, and by the way, don't waste your time with operas by Haydn. Unlike his other works, his operas are definitely not that good.

OK, now, some Haydn fan will tell me the same thing I've told you.:lol:


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## mamascarlatti (Sep 23, 2009)

Almaviva said:


> @waldvogel - go figure, people are really so different. I hear you, and of course you have a right to your opinion and to your tastes, but for me, every single opera by Handel that I've seen, I found to be completely fascinating, and my only regret about his operas is that I only know 12 of them - in the _latu sensu _- some are rather oratorios (I'm working on it, I'll get to know more). Yes, they're repetitive, long, and formulaic, but oh so beautiful! I'm in bliss, nirvana, and paradise rolled into one when I'm listening to/watching an opera by Handel.
> 
> So for me it is completely puzzling that someone who obviously has a lot of exposure and appreciation for opera may say what you just said. Again, different strokes for different folks. More power to you if you don't like Handel, it's just that I can barely understand how this can be possible. I mean, I can understand it in a cognitive level, but not in an emotional level. In my opinion, the man didn't know how to put two ugly notes together. For me, everything he wrote is sublime.
> 
> ...


What he said, but perhaps more succinctly.


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## schigolch (Jun 26, 2011)

8. Opera whose libretto you enjoyed reading.

NEITHER 

to and fro in shadow from inner to outer shadow 

from impenetrable self to impenetrable unself by way of neither 

as between two lit refuges whose doors once neared gently close, once away turned from gently part again 

beckoned back and forth and turned away 

heedless of the way, intent on the one gleam or the other 

unheard footfalls only sound 

till at last halt for good, absent for good from self and other 

then no sound 

then gently light unfading on that unheeded neither 

unspeakable home


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## BalloinMaschera (Apr 4, 2011)

8. Opera whose libretto you enjoyed reading.- I can honestly say that I have never read a libretto, for the sake of the words alone. I think parts of _Der Rosenkavalier _could qualify as literature in its own right, but I have never read a libretto like I might read a play.


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## Aksel (Dec 3, 2010)

*8. Opera whose libretto you enjoyed reading.*

The Wagner poems are rather fantastic, and what I've read of the Ring in Norwegian translation (by Eve-Marie Lund) has been fantastic.
I also love Falstaff's libretto.


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## Couchie (Dec 9, 2010)

*Day 7: Wagnerphile or Wagnerphobe?*

Wagnerphile. Nothing else compares. I listen to Wagner, I humour other composers.


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## mamascarlatti (Sep 23, 2009)

The only libretto I've ever read cover to cover without the music was Dialogues des carmélites.


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## Operafocus (Jul 17, 2011)

*Day 7: Wagnerphile or Wagnerphobe?*

Wagnerphobe :lol:


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## TxllxT (Mar 2, 2011)

*8. Opera whose libretto you enjoyed reading.*

Eugene Onegin, Don Giovanni................


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## ooopera (Jul 27, 2011)

mamascarlatti said:


> I'm a little apprehensive about the Society, as I am not an unreserved admirer of the man, and I'm worried the other members might brook no dissention. I also like a hell of a lot of other composers and am hoping to encounter some general opera fans. You guys got any experience of Wagner societies? oooperafocus?


Yes, exactly that's the way it is. Mostly general opera fans. Maybe because in my country it's the only opera society. So, let it be Wagner Now, seriously, society is planning trips to opera houses near and we are NOT visiting only Wagner operas. But it's true that when there's longer trip it's allwalys related to Wagner. Also our magazine consist mostly of Wagner articles but I think there's some part (not sure-maybe 20%) of other opera things.

I think that you can join without problems and meet people who love opera overall.


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## waldvogel (Jul 10, 2011)

An opera libretto that I've enjoyed reading on its own... this is going to make for a very short list. 
In the original language, I suppose Carmen.
In translation, The Marriage of Figaro.


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## waldvogel (Jul 10, 2011)

As regards to my dislike of Handel operas, all I can compare it to is the situation that arose a few years ago at lunchtime, on January 25th, which all Scots and very few other people recognize as Robbie Burns' Day. A Scottish friend came to the lunch table, sat with another couple of Scottish friends, and proceeded to open up a container holding a cooked sheep's stomach. Yes, with part of the esophagus and duodenum still visible, and covered in a network of blue veins. To top it off, they recited a poem, then cut into this monstrosity, upon which a disgusting odour of onions and fortissimo LIVER emerged. The liver and onions were all mixed in with enough oatmeal (!) to turn the entire stomach contents into something that looked like, well, stomach contents. 

Then then actually ATE this thing, and enjoyed it. It was the most disgusting thing that I've ever seen a human being eat, with the exception of National Geographic videos. I can imagine eating something like this after, say, a week of starvation with little hope of rescue in the immediate future. But the concept of enjoying a haggis... how could you?

Yet I like and respect the three people who ate it.


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## Almaviva (Aug 13, 2010)

Les Troyens which I read in its entirety before the first time I ever listened to it. Dialogue des Carmellites is another libretto that has literary value on its own.


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## Almaviva (Aug 13, 2010)

waldvogel said:


> As regards to my dislike of Handel operas, all I can compare it to is the situation that arose a few years ago at lunchtime, on January 25th, which all Scots and very few other people recognize as Robbie Burns' Day. A Scottish friend came to the lunch table, sat with another couple of Scottish friends, and proceeded to open up a container holding a cooked sheep's stomach. Yes, with part of the esophagus and duodenum still visible, and covered in a network of blue veins. To top it off, they recited a poem, then cut into this monstrosity, upon which a disgusting odour of onions and fortissimo LIVER emerged. The liver and onions were all mixed in with enough oatmeal (!) to turn the entire stomach contents into something that looked like, well, stomach contents.
> 
> Then then actually ATE this thing, and enjoyed it. It was the most disgusting thing that I've ever seen a human being eat, with the exception of National Geographic videos. I can imagine eating something like this after, say, a week of starvation with little hope of rescue in the immediate future. But the concept of enjoying a haggis... how could you?
> 
> Yet I like and respect the three people who ate it.


Wow, this bad, huh? Poor Handel...


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## sospiro (Apr 3, 2010)

8. Opera whose libretto you enjoyed reading

_Simon Boccanegra_

The words mean so much to me


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## MAuer (Feb 6, 2011)

*Day 8: Opera whose libretto you enjoyed reading*

I read librettos only when I'm familiarizing myself with an opera I previously haven't heard, so I can't really say that I've read any libretto just for the pleasure of it. However, I think I probably liked those to Wagner's "_Ring_" operas best.


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## AnaMendoza (Jul 29, 2011)

*Day 8: Opera whose libretto you enjoyed reading*

_Pelleas et Melisande_

In fact, I read it out loud to my mother, and was sobbing uncontrollably as I got to: "It's the little one's turn, now."

Okay, I'm assuming that we didn't have to take the word 'enjoyed' literally.


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## World Violist (May 31, 2007)

The only libretto I've read apart from actually listening to the opera was that of Wagner's Ring, so I'm afraid I'll have to go for that one by default. It is fascinating to read, anyway, so I don't feel _that_ bad about it.


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## amfortas (Jun 15, 2011)

I don't typically read librettos. Some of them have a great deal of interest in their own right, and certainly *could* be read as literature, but I'd much rather listen to words and music together. Reading just the libretto, too much is missing--it's like reading every other word of Shakespeare.

That said, I do recall writing a lengthy undergraduate paper on Wagner's _Siegfried_ in relation to the "hero" myths variously described by Otto Rank, Joseph Campbell, and Northrop Frye. It was fun doing a close reading of the libretto in that instance, though I also discussed some of the pertinent musical motifs as well.


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## mamascarlatti (Sep 23, 2009)

Almaviva said:


> Wow, this bad, huh? Poor Handel...


Yes that's the first time I've heard Handel compared to a haggis. It's a striking image:lol:.


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## sospiro (Apr 3, 2010)

waldvogel said:


> As regards to my dislike of Handel operas, all I can compare it to is the situation that arose a few years ago at lunchtime, on January 25th, which all Scots and very few other people recognize as Robbie Burns' Day. A Scottish friend came to the lunch table, sat with another couple of Scottish friends, and proceeded to open up a container holding a cooked sheep's stomach. Yes, with part of the oesophagus and duodenum still visible, and covered in a network of blue veins. To top it off, they recited a poem, then cut into this monstrosity, upon which a disgusting odour of onions and fortissimo LIVER emerged. The liver and onions were all mixed in with enough oatmeal (!) to turn the entire stomach contents into something that looked like, well, stomach contents.
> 
> Then then actually ATE this thing, and enjoyed it. It was the most disgusting thing that I've ever seen a human being eat, with the exception of National Geographic videos. I can imagine eating something like this after, say, a week of starvation with little hope of rescue in the immediate future. But the concept of enjoying a haggis... how could you?
> 
> Yet I like and respect the three people who ate it.


I love haggis & the tatties & neeps which go with it. Not sure how it can be compared with Handel though.


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## amfortas (Jun 15, 2011)

sospiro said:


> I love haggis & the tatties & neeps which go with it. Not sure how it can be compared with Handel though.


Maybe because they both make you cry, "Hallelujah!"

Or not . . .


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## waldvogel (Jul 10, 2011)

amfortas said:


> Maybe because they both make you cry, "Hallelujah!"
> 
> Or not . . .


More like "He was despised."


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## Almaviva (Aug 13, 2010)

AnaMendoza said:


> *Day 8: Opera whose libretto you enjoyed reading*
> 
> _Pelleas et Melisande_
> 
> ...


This is arguably the best last phrase of an opera libretto.
The one about Mother Russia in Boris Godunov (not the R-K version) is a close second.
I also love the last phrase of Les Troyens. Carthage is over... now Rome.


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## schigolch (Jun 26, 2011)

9.	Favourite Bel Canto opera

I love _Norma_ so much.... I've got over 100 different versions, and rarely I pass a full week whithout listening to one of them.


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## BalloinMaschera (Apr 4, 2011)

9. Favourite Bel Canto opera
Donizetti's Maria Stuarda (with a soprano Maria)


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## mamascarlatti (Sep 23, 2009)

Donizetti La Fille du regiment


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## TxllxT (Mar 2, 2011)

*9. Favourite Bel Canto opera*

Probably not entirely 'correct' but my favourite Bel Canto opera is Vivaldi's _Juditha Triumphans_. Nice long & smooth arias, a little ruffle-recitative and then again: nice soul to soul singing.


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## Aksel (Dec 3, 2010)

Favourite bel canto opera:
Rossini's La Cenerentola. I mean, how can you resist something like this:


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## waldvogel (Jul 10, 2011)

I really enjoyed Maria Stuarda when the Canadian Opera Company put it on last year. Same thing with La Cenerentola, which had a quirky humourous production that really fit the opera.


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## amfortas (Jun 15, 2011)

*9. Favourite Bel Canto opera*

I suppose I could go with Donizetti's _L'elisir d'amore_. But honestly, there's no bel canto opera I've ever taken to my heart the way I love works by Wagner, Verdi, Mozart, and Strauss. Maybe that will change some day, and I'll "get" bel canto more completely.


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## Almaviva (Aug 13, 2010)

I assume we're talking the Italian Bel Canto period in the first half of the 19th century, mostly represented by Bellini, Rossini, and Donizetti, because Bel Canto can also apply to a singing technique / style that is much older than this, starting with the Baroque and making extensive use of castrati. Some authors sustain that once the castrati were gone, we can't talk about Bel Canto any longer, which applies more to the female registers. Tenors took over the male roles, destroying one of the premises of Bel Canto. But then, that period of Italian opera got known for its strong melodic content and use of ornamentations, and got known as the Bel Canto era, which is actually a much more common use of the expression.

We once had a - cough, cough - slightly deranged Italian member here (he's been banned ever since) who was so adamant about this point that he would fight with members who didn't endorse his views on this, to the point of producing a string of colorful... choice words (not coloratura, LOL, thus the banning). Anyway, in spite of his unusual tactics to express his views, he did convince me to read a book called The History of Bel Canto, and I do grant his perspective some validity.

In any case, the common use of the expression is the one that applies to the composers above, so be it.

While Donizetti was the king of melody and particularly his opera seriae (Maria Stuarda, Roberto Devereux, Anna Bolena, Lucia di Lammermoor, La Favorita, Linda di Chamounix, etc) are very rich in melodious arias sung in the Bel Canto style, and while Rossini's comedies and opera seriae are also full of beautiful melodies with rich coloratura, I'll go with the often under-rated Bellini.

His career was a lot shorter due to illness, and I'm sure he would have given us many more masterpieces, had he survived longer. Still, what he did give us is outstanding in terms of beautiful melody, so I'll go with _Norma_ as the ultimate representative of this style.


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## schigolch (Jun 26, 2011)

Mental illness?

He died of acute inflammation of the intestine, young indeed, but assuredly with a very sound mind.


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## FragendeFrau (May 30, 2011)

Opera libretto: I have only read one, Andrew Porter's translation of the Ring Cycle, so I guess that has to be it.

Bel canto: I've never seen a bel canto opera, however you define it, so I will recuse myself from this. I have noticed the extreme love of bel canto/stuff like Handel--which I guess is not bel canto--both here and on parterre box, so I guess that comes with experience. I'm still working on seeing all the 'obvious' 19th-early 20thC operas, which I love the most anyway.

But I will be seeing Rodelinda in December so--a first!


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## schigolch (Jun 26, 2011)

Well, some of the "bel canto" operas (understood at italian opera being composed during roughly the first half of the 19th century) are indeed in the 'obvious' list.


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## MAuer (Feb 6, 2011)

*Day 9: Favorite Bel Canto opera*

Donizetti's _Lucia di Lammermor_.


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## sospiro (Apr 3, 2010)

*Day 9: Favourite Bel Canto opera*

_Lucia di Lammermoor_ was the first opera I fell in love with & I didn't know then what 'Bel Canto' meant so it's got to be Lucia.


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## ooopera (Jul 27, 2011)

amfortas said:


> *9. Favourite Bel Canto opera*
> 
> I suppose I could go with Donizetti's _L'elisir d'amore_. But honestly, there's no bel canto opera I've ever taken to my heart the way I love works by Wagner, Verdi, Mozart, and Strauss. Maybe that will change some day, and I'll "get" bel canto more completely.


*Day 8: Opera whose libretto you enjoyed reading*

I haven't read any. But I'm reading a lot the literature on which librettos incurred. Dumas: La dame aux Camélias, Goethe: Werther, Dostoyevsky: The House of the Dead etc.

*Day 9: *
I couldn't agree more with Amfortas


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## amfortas (Jun 15, 2011)

ooopera said:


> I couldn't agree more with Amfortas


Most people find that to be true on a regular basis.


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## World Violist (May 31, 2007)

Day 9: Don Pasquale once again (is that officially considered "Bel Canto?").


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## Watercarrier (Aug 3, 2011)

_I Puritani_ by Bellini for the ravishing tunes, and the fact you can get as much pleasure from listening it as watching it as it's all rather static. I love the Italian versions of English names, and Bellini's idea of Plymouth, but mainly, it's the wonderful music.


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## Aksel (Dec 3, 2010)

World Violist said:


> Day 9: Don Pasquale once again (is that officially considered "Bel Canto?").


It's Donizetti, so I don't see why not.


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## Aksel (Dec 3, 2010)

Watercarrier said:


> _I Puritani_ by Bellini for the ravishing tunes, and the fact you can get as much pleasure from listening it as watching it as it's all rather static. I love the Italian versions of English names, and Bellini's idea of Plymouth, but mainly, it's the wonderful music.


Yay! Another member! On the opera forum! Welcome!


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## Almaviva (Aug 13, 2010)

schigolch said:


> Mental illness?
> 
> He died of acute inflammation of the intestine, young indeed, but assuredly with a very sound mind.


 Oops, I stand corrected, it was Donizetti who had neurosyphilis and bipolar disorder (I mixed them up), you're right, Bellini died of peritonitis.


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## HarpsichordConcerto (Jan 1, 2010)

mamascarlatti said:


> 9.	Favourite Bel Canto opera


Assume usage of the term refers to Romantic period operas, which of course does not mean to say no earlier operas from the Baroque and Classical periods did not apply the _bel canto_ model of singing. Hard to pick. Probably something by Rossini.


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## sospiro (Apr 3, 2010)

Watercarrier said:


> _I Puritani_ by Bellini for the ravishing tunes, and the fact you can get as much pleasure from listening it as watching it as it's all rather static. I love the Italian versions of English names, and Bellini's idea of Plymouth, but mainly, it's the wonderful music.


Welcome to the forum Watercarrier! Great first post.


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## schigolch (Jun 26, 2011)

One CD to avoid

Wish I would have avoided this one.


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## BalloinMaschera (Apr 4, 2011)

10. One DVD and/or CD to avoid
EMI Tannhauser / Catalogue Number 0724359973395


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## sospiro (Apr 3, 2010)

10. One DVD and/or CD to avoid










What could I _not_ love about this CD? I adore this opera, ditto Mehta, Milnes & Domingo, so why *the one to avoid*?

:scold: It's because of the ***** recording! It crackles and hisses and at times fades out almost completely. What a shameful waste of such talent.


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## Aramis (Mar 1, 2009)

10. One DVD and/or CD to avoid


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## MAuer (Feb 6, 2011)

Day 10: One DVD or CD to avoid

The video of _Tannhäuser_ from the Zürich Opera. Fortunately, I was warned by other members of this forum before I made the mistake of purchasing this DVD myself. Even though the performance includes Peter Seiffert in the title role and my adored Jonas K. as Walther von der Vogelweide, word is that the video itself is horrible. And we see Seiffert's face while the Jonas is singing . . .


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## World Violist (May 31, 2007)

The CD/DVD to avoid is the one with a bunch of Amazon 1-star reviews because there aren't any discs in the box.


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## TxllxT (Mar 2, 2011)

*10. One DVD and/or CD to avoid*










From Rostropovich as conductor I will make one exception: Lady Macbeth of the Mtsensk; the rest is crap. Other crappy conductors who never happened to convince me are Seiji Osawa, Zubin Mehta, Daniel Barenboim. When they have recorded something, be sure that someone else did that work much better...


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## amfortas (Jun 15, 2011)

TxllxT said:


> Other crappy conductors who never happened to convince me are Seiji Osawa, Zubin Mehta, Daniel Barenboim. When they have recorded something, be sure that someone else did that work much better...


Interesting choices. Osawa I can understand. Mehta to some extent as well (though he's made some reference opera recordings over the years: the Sutherland/Pavarotti/Caballé _Turandot_, and that "crackle and hiss" _Trovatore_ referenced in a post above).

But Barenboim? He's widely regarded as one of the top Wagner conductors of this era, and can be heard, for example, doing some pretty impressive work in *three* different _Tristan_ DVDs (including the Heiner Muller Bayreuth production, my personal favorite).

But as they say, _de indigestibus non disputandum est_.

Or something like that.


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## amfortas (Jun 15, 2011)

*10. One DVD and/or CD to avoid*

The Stuttgart _Siegfried_.










This may be the _Siegfried_ of someone's dreams . . . but not mine.

Actually, if I dreamed *this*, I'd wake up in a cold sweat:


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## mamascarlatti (Sep 23, 2009)

amfortas said:


> But Barenboim? He's widely regarded as one of the top Wagner conductors of this era, and can be heard, for example, doing some pretty impressive work in *three* different _Tristan_ DVDs (including the Heiner Muller Bayreuth production, my personal favorite).


My favourite Ring on DVD, because of the conducting.


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## mamascarlatti (Sep 23, 2009)

MAuer said:


> Day 10: One DVD or CD to avoid
> 
> The video of _Tannhäuser_ from the Zürich Opera. Fortunately, I was warned by other members of this forum before I made the mistake of purchasing this DVD myself. Even though the performance includes Peter Seiffert in the title role and my adored Jonas K. as Walther von der Vogelweide, word is that the video itself is horrible. And we see Seiffert's face while the Jonas is singing . . .


I was going to nominate that, but you have, so I'll go for this nauseatingly self-indulgent, offensive and silly production, despite the stellar singing of David Daniels and the rest of the cast. To be seen with a blindfold AND your eyes tightly shut.


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## amfortas (Jun 15, 2011)

mamascarlatti said:


> . . . nauseatingly self-indulgent offensive and silly . . . To be seen with a blindfold AND your eyes tightly shut . . .


Funny, I remember hearing much the same words from my ex-wife on our wedding night.


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## amfortas (Jun 15, 2011)

Note to self: nothing draws "likes" like bashing the ex-wife!


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## FragendeFrau (May 30, 2011)

I saw it more as your self-deprecating sense of humor, o wounded one!


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## ooopera (Jul 27, 2011)

I changed my mind ten times ... I don't know. It seems that I haven't seen enough DVDs. Or maybe I'm buying just the good ones?


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## Aksel (Dec 3, 2010)

ooopera said:


> Because of the production ...


You'll need to go to the actual image in order to use the IMG tags. I haven't seen it, though, but I thought the production looked fab. And besides, Cecilia's in it.


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## ooopera (Jul 27, 2011)

Aksel said:


> You'll need to go to the actual image in order to use the IMG tags. I haven't seen it, though, but I thought the production looked fab. And besides, Cecilia's in it.


Thanks. I know, I loved Cecilia ... I just didn't get the production. It's all in me.


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## Aksel (Dec 3, 2010)

And speaking of non-recommended DVDs:

This production of Hänsel und Gretel is rather awful. The singing is very good, especially the two children, but the production is really weird. It tries to warn against the dangers of modern capitalism or something. A seriously strange production.


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## mamascarlatti (Sep 23, 2009)

amfortas said:


> *10. One DVD and/or CD to avoid*
> 
> The Stuttgart _Siegfried_.
> 
> ...












What's with all the sheet-tugging between Siegfried and Brünnhilde:lol:. And how did that tenor manage to make the forging song such a snoozefest?


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## HarpsichordConcerto (Jan 1, 2010)

mamascarlatti said:


> 10.	One DVD and/or CD to avoid


The standout batch of productions in my collection that was an eyesore when viewed and thus to avoid were several from the Mozart M22 Salzburg series. But as the price for the whole set is now reduced to a very reasonable price, it might well be reasonable to get the whole set, but _avoid individual_ purchase of some. The rarely performed works are of value just for the sake of getting a relatively recent recording of those works, if you're a big Mozart fan, although stage productions were often trash. As for the establised repertoire,the worst one was _Die Entführung aus dem Serail_.


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## World Violist (May 31, 2007)

Gah, I don't know any fiction books about opera...


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## mamascarlatti (Sep 23, 2009)

Day 11: 

Terry Pratchett's Maskerade. I love Agnes Nitt. 

Also Butterfly's Child.


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## rgz (Mar 6, 2010)

Day 11: Well, it's not about opera per se, but a significant fraction of _The Count of Monte Cristo_ takes place during visits to the opera and it gives you a great feel of what it must have been like to attend French opera houses in the mid 19th century.


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## BalloinMaschera (Apr 4, 2011)

11. Favourite fiction book about or involving opera

ALW aside, Leroux's Phantom of the Opera/ Le Fantôme de l'Opéra is a terrific read.


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## sospiro (Apr 3, 2010)

11. Favourite fiction book about or involving opera

Phantom of the Opera by Gaston Leroux

I love its journalistic style & the prologue: _In which the author of this singular work informs the reader how he acquired the certainty that the Opera Ghost really existed._


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## Almaviva (Aug 13, 2010)

DVD to avoid - of course, Il Trovatore with Dmitri, right, Annie?
Fiction - Butterfly's child


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## TxllxT (Mar 2, 2011)

*11. Favourite fiction book about or involving opera*

*Enten-Eller * (Danish title of _Either/Or_) 1843 by Victor Eremita (Pseudonym of Søren Kierkegaard). This book deals with Don Giovanni, Love and Aesthetics throughout.


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## sospiro (Apr 3, 2010)

Almaviva said:


> DVD to avoid - of course, Il Trovatore with Dmitri, right, Annie?


:kiss:

You just wait my boy ...



Almaviva said:


> Fiction - Butterfly's child


Really? What a shame, I'd seen some good reviews.


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## amfortas (Jun 15, 2011)

*11. Favourite fiction book about or involving opera*

Not a full-length book, but a classic novella: Honoré de Balzac's "Sarrasine" (1830). In the mid-eighteenth century, a young Parisian, visiting Rome for the first time, goes to the opera and falls in love with a beautiful soprano--only to discover, too late, the shocking practices of Italian opera!


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## MAuer (Feb 6, 2011)

*Day 11: Favorite fiction book about or involving opera*

I'm afraid my favorite opera-related fiction isn't on the same literary level as those of other posters. Thanks to my sister, I've gotten hooked on Beverle Graves Myers' Tito Amato mysteries, which are set in 18th century Venice and feature a character (said Signor Amato) who is a castrato and primo uomo of the city's Teatro San Marco. I'm also a fan of Donna Leon, who begins all of her Guido Brunetti mysteries (set in contemporary Venice) with a quote from one of Mozart's operas.


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## amfortas (Jun 15, 2011)

MAuer said:


> *Day 11: Favorite fiction book about or involving opera*
> 
> I'm afraid my favorite opera-related fiction isn't on the same literary level as those of other posters. Thanks to my sister, I've gotten hooked on Beverle Graves Myers' Tito Amato mysteries, which are set in 18th century Venice and feature a character (said Signor Amato) who is a castrato and primo uomo of the city's Teatro San Marco. I'm also a fan of Donna Leon, who begins all of her Guido Brunetti mysteries (set in contemporary Venice) with a quote from one of Mozart's operas.


Nothing wrong with Donna Leon--I enjoyed her _Death at La Fenice_.


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## mamascarlatti (Sep 23, 2009)

MAuer said:


> *Day 11: Favorite fiction book about or involving opera*
> 
> I'm afraid my favorite opera-related fiction isn't on the same literary level as those of other posters.


Mary, I voted Terry Pratchett's Maskerade, not exactly high literature but brilliant anyway



> I've gotten hooked on Beverle Graves Myers' Tito Amato mysteries, which are set in 18th century Venice and feature a character (said Signor Amato) who is a castrato and primo uomo of the city's Teatro San Marco. I'm also a fan of Donna Leon, who begins all of her Guido Brunetti mysteries (set in contemporary Venice) with a quote from one of Mozart's operas.


I like Donna Leon too. I'll tryout Myers now if the books are good!


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## waldvogel (Jul 10, 2011)

My favourite book involving opera (well, peripherally) would be Dangerous Liaisons.

Colin Dexter's Inspector Morse was a Wagnerphile, and operas - Die Zauberflote and Die Walkure at least, feature in several of his novels.


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## Almaviva (Aug 13, 2010)

sospiro said:


> Really? What a shame, I'd seen some good reviews.


What do you mean? I'm not talking about a book to avoid, I'm talking about a book I like. It's another day, favorite fiction involving opera.


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## amfortas (Jun 15, 2011)

​


sospiro said:


> Really? What a shame, I'd seen some good reviews.





Almaviva said:


> What do you mean? I'm not talking about a book to avoid, I'm talking about a book I like.


Maybe she means that if Alma likes it, it must be avoided at all costs--in spite of the good reviews!


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## Almaviva (Aug 13, 2010)

amfortas said:


> ​
> Maybe she means that if Alma likes it, it must be avoided at all costs--in spite of the good reviews!


Stop it, agent of evil! In spite of our fights around the issue of Dmitri's Trovatore, Annie is a good friend of mine!


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## amfortas (Jun 15, 2011)

Almaviva said:


> Stop it, agent of evil! In spite of our fights around the issue of Dmitri's Trovatore, Annie is a good friend of mine!


I know, and it was wicked of me to suggest otherwise. I am ashamed of myself, and will now go hide.


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## Almaviva (Aug 13, 2010)

amfortas said:


> I know, and it was wicked of me to suggest otherwise. I am ashamed of myself, and will now go hide.


 Hide??? Just hide??? Suicide is more like it!


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## amfortas (Jun 15, 2011)

Almaviva said:


> Hide??? Just hide??? Suicide is more like it!


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## TxllxT (Mar 2, 2011)

*12. Opera that you watch/listen to when you need cheering up*

Really, do I need cheering up?  :tiphat: From time to time I need a strong _catharsis_, a mindburning clean-up. This makes me turn to the roots of opera (/oratoria): Monteverdi, Purcell, continuing with Vivaldi & Handel. So called cheerful operas like _La Bohème_ with its abundant student jollity or even worse: operettas quickly make me fed up: *fake* !


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## schigolch (Jun 26, 2011)

_La Bohème_, a cheerful opera?. Well, I'd rather prefer not to know what's a sad opera for you. 

For myself, when I need cheering up I always look for new operas, for the joy of discovery, good or bad.


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## TxllxT (Mar 2, 2011)

schigolch said:


> _La Bohème_, a cheerful opera?. Well, I'd rather prefer not to know what's a sad opera for you.
> 
> For myself, when I need cheering up I always look for new operas, for the joy of discovery, good or bad.


I see poor Mimi as part of a twisted Charles Dickens setup, because of which the audience can turn a blind eye to the real world Mimis, feel better & identify themselves more with the gay drinking fun of the students... Outraging


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## MAuer (Feb 6, 2011)

*Day 12: Opera that you watch/listen to when you need cheering up*

Probably Mozart's _Die Zauberflöte_, or one of my numerous _Fidelio_ recordings.


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## World Violist (May 31, 2007)

Darn, these questions are getting harder for me. I don't listen to opera when I need cheering up, I watch stand-up comedy.

If pressed for an answer I'd probably say that I go for the overture to Meistersinger. But the finale of Mahler 7 is better.:devil:


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## waldvogel (Jul 10, 2011)

To cheer me up, and to revel in some really beautiful music, it's hard to beat Cosi Fan Tutte.


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## Operafocus (Jul 17, 2011)

*Day 12. Opera that you watch/listen to when you need cheering up *

As I function so that I sometimes need a good cry before cheering up properly, my choice would be... something I consider absolutely beautiful, which is just about anything by Giuseppe Giacomini or one particular version of "You'll never walk alone" by Mario Lanza (on Spotify it's the version that was used on some World Cup CD!). But the Pilgrims' Chorus from Tannhauser would work too


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## sospiro (Apr 3, 2010)

*Day 12: Opera that you watch/listen to when you need cheering up*

My brain is weirdly wired.

When I'm sad I prefer to listen to something which matches my mood, like the death of Posa. I can't bear to listen to something cheerful - I want to scream "Stop being so bloddy _happy_" I usually feel better after a good cry.


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## amfortas (Jun 15, 2011)

It's really hard to answer this one. If I'm feeling down, I'm not as likely to listen to an opera--I don't feel I'd be receptive enough.

Still, whether or not I'm sad to begin with, many operas do leave me feeling a lot *better* afterwards. They can be as affirming as _Die Zauberflöte_ or as tragic as _Otello_. Either way, I feel uplifted to have experienced such greatness.


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## mamascarlatti (Sep 23, 2009)

When I need cheering up I'm migrate to something familiar and beautiful, a favourite DVD. It can be cheerful like La Fille du Regiment or tragic like the "live" Tosca.


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## Aksel (Dec 3, 2010)

Day 11: Maskerade. Such a brilliant book. Although, the opera bit in the beginning of _The Rich Man_, the first book of the Forsythe Saga by John Galsworthy is rather charming, however short.

Day 12: Fille du régiment is wonderful, although I feel all sorts of happy inside after the first act of La rondine.


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## Almaviva (Aug 13, 2010)

Day 12: A new opera for me; any. There's little that makes me as happy (musically speaking) as watching (I prefer visual media) an opera that I don't know yet, as long as it is a good quality one.


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## HarpsichordConcerto (Jan 1, 2010)

mamascarlatti said:


> 12.	Opera that you watch/listen to when you need cheering up


Almost any but a Handel or a Mozart definitely would work!


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## World Violist (May 31, 2007)

I'm jumping the gun because I've got coffee in my system and I have to keep moving.

13.	An opera blog/site you frequently visit

Talk Classical's opera board...yeah, that's all I got.


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## Operafocus (Jul 17, 2011)

*13. An opera blog/site you frequently visit*

This one. And my own operablog


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## mamascarlatti (Sep 23, 2009)

Operafocus said:


> *13. An opera blog/site you frequently visit*
> 
> This one. And my own operablog


Found it. Looks fun!


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## TxllxT (Mar 2, 2011)

*13. An opera blog/site you frequently visit*

:tiphat::angel: This one :angel::tiphat:


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## Operafocus (Jul 17, 2011)

mamascarlatti said:


> Found it. Looks fun!


It's not updated a lot, cause I do it in between work, but it will be updated quite regularly once the new opera season starts in September - but also next week when I'm off to see Pagliacci/Cav. Rust.


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## sospiro (Apr 3, 2010)

13. An opera blog/site you frequently visit

 TC of course 

Opera bloggers Commandopera David Karlin Andrew Richards

Have also been following the blog of Susan Eichhorn-Young a voice coach who recently had an awful accident


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## Almaviva (Aug 13, 2010)

This one. I have a number of others, and blogs, all bookmarked but I don't visit them very often because this one is a handful.


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## MAuer (Feb 6, 2011)

*Day 13: An opera blog/site you frequently visit*

Jonas Kaufmann's unofficial web site, of course!
http://www.jkaufmann.info/


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## waldvogel (Jul 10, 2011)

Aside from this one, I like OperaStuff. It's a primitive website, but it does link to most of the opera companies of the world. If you're traveling and wonder what's on in Dusseldorf in November, it's exactly what you need.

http://www.operastuff.com/


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## amfortas (Jun 15, 2011)

Like the rest of you, I spend far more time here at TC than is healthy for me.

Sometimes, though, I'll make use of the reference site Opera Glass, with their comprehensive directories of operas and composers.

For opera current events and intelligent reviews, I enjoy Likely Impossibilities, I Hear Voices, and Poison Ivy's Wall of Text.

For discussion of the current European opera scene, there's nothing better than Opera Cake, while for a focus mostly on New York, there's An Unamplified Voice.


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## mamascarlatti (Sep 23, 2009)

I visit Opera Chic and Intermezzo everyday. I prefer the latter as OC is a bit fixated on fashion for me. I also enjoy the wittiness and obsessive bitching at Parterre Box, although the negativity about singers does gets oppressive.

But my favourite is tenor Andrew Richards' blog Opera Rocks, as he give such honest and unflinching insight into the creative process.


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## schigolch (Jun 26, 2011)

TC and Opera News are the only english sites I visit frequently.


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## mamascarlatti (Sep 23, 2009)

schigolch said:


> TC and Opera News are the only english sites I visit frequently.


Do you have some good Spanish (or French or Italian) suggestions?


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## schigolch (Jun 26, 2011)

I like those sites:

http://www.todoperaweb.com.ar/
http://www.proopera.org.mx/
http://www.operaclick.com/forum/index.php
http://ilcorrieredellagrisi.blogspot.com/
http://www.forumopera.com/


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## Almaviva (Aug 13, 2010)

I'll jump the gun a bit because I don't think I'll be awake until midnight.

HIP performances - important for me or not?

Of course they are. The period instruments have a more delicate sound that doesn't smother the singers of this repertoire, who tend to have a lighter voice. Lately we've been blessed with many HIP orchestras, and I love it!


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## World Violist (May 31, 2007)

Yep, I'm somewhat a HIPster. I'd better be, I'll be studying old instruments next year by my own choice!

So yes, HIP is important to me, but only as long as the people employing it make good music with it. Scholasticism for its own sake does not impress me.


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## schigolch (Jun 26, 2011)

They are ok.


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## mamascarlatti (Sep 23, 2009)

Almaviva said:


> HIP performances - important for me or not?
> 
> Of course they are. The period instruments have a more delicate sound that doesn't smother the singers of this repertoire, who tend to have a lighter voice. Lately we've been blessed with many HIP orchestras, and I love it!


Alma said it for me.


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## TxllxT (Mar 2, 2011)

14. HIP – important to you or not?

I'm not familiar with this slang; when it refers to period instruments (Gardiner, Christie, Minkowski) I find it important.


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## BalloinMaschera (Apr 4, 2011)

12. Opera that you watch/listen to when you need cheering up - Nozze di Figaro, Fledermaus, Die Lustigen Weiber v Windsor, or Don Carlo- that said, I don't often need cheering up...

13. An opera blog/site you frequently visit - there are so many... 

14. HIP – important to you or not?- what is HIP?


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## schigolch (Jun 26, 2011)

HIP stands for Historically Informed Performance, and is usually referring to period instruments and style of singing, though perhaps a little bit of "stage HIP" will be much welcomed too...


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## waldvogel (Jul 10, 2011)

If "HIP" represents one end of the operatic performance practice, and "regie" represents the other, then plant me firmly in the "HIP" corner. I find it wonderfully refreshing to go to Il Trovatore and have it set in 16th century Spain, rather than in Stalin's USSR.


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## Almaviva (Aug 13, 2010)

waldvogel said:


> If "HIP" represents one end of the operatic performance practice, and "regie" represents the other, then plant me firmly in the "HIP" corner. I find it wonderfully refreshing to go to Il Trovatore and have it set in 16th century Spain, rather than in Stalin's USSR.


HIP usually refers more to the orchestra than the staging, though. William Christie for example has an HIP orchestra (Les Arts Florissants) and often does very modern staging.


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## amfortas (Jun 15, 2011)

Historically Informed Performance? Isn't every performance informed, in one way or another, both by the history of the work itself and the current historical circumstances of its presentation? 

If we're talking about using the specific type of instruments employed at the time the opera was first produced, then I'm all for it. But it hasn't been that big a deal to me, since the operas I care about most are already performed on "period" instruments (i.e., your typical symphony orchestra) that are fairly close to what the composer would have had in mind.


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## MAuer (Feb 6, 2011)

*Day 14: HIP - important to you or not?*

I'm afraid I don't have a very strong preference here one way or the other.


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## waldvogel (Jul 10, 2011)

Almaviva said:


> HIP usually refers more to the orchestra than the staging, though. William Christie for example has an HIP orchestra (Les Arts Florissants) and often does very modern staging.


I've only seen three operas done by an original instruments ensemble - Don Giovanni and Le Nozze di Figaro done by Tafelmusik in Toronto, and Les Indes Galantes (with traditional but spectacular Baroque staging) done by William Christie in Paris. I must say that I was impressed by all three of them very much. But I'm not fanatical about this to the point of getting upset at a performance of Die Zauberflote because the horns and trumpets have, quel horreur, valves!


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## Almaviva (Aug 13, 2010)

waldvogel said:


> But I'm not fanatical about this to the point of getting upset at a performance of Die Zauberflote because the horns and trumpets have, quel horreur, valves!


Sure, but the question wasn't whether or not HIPs are essential/obligatory, but rather, important. While many orchestras play old music with modern instruments just fine, I do think that these historically informed performances on period instruments are important (and very beautiful).


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## HarpsichordConcerto (Jan 1, 2010)

mamascarlatti said:


> 14.	HIP - important to you or not?


Yes, important to me. It is almost always the case now that an early opera released on CD/visual medium is performed by HIP performers (singers and orchestra) often to a consistent high standard that we would expect. Even orchestras that use modern instruments are often HIP with regard to orchestral pitch, tempi, vibrato, playing techniques etc. with regards to early repertoire.


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## World Violist (May 31, 2007)

Favorite opera conductor...um...Pierre Boulez?


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## schigolch (Jun 26, 2011)

Tullio Serafin.


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## TxllxT (Mar 2, 2011)

*15. Favourite opera conductor.*

Valery Gergiev, when he has his day.... Just to watch his hand shaping & guiding the music


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## mamascarlatti (Sep 23, 2009)

William Christie - I love his smile, his enthusiasm, his rapport with singers, and his willingness to have an onestage party:


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## BalloinMaschera (Apr 4, 2011)

14. Don't care either way HIPor not, really depends on the quality of execution

15. Favourite opera conductor.
This is a toughy... I suppose v Karajan , Claudio Abbado (when at his best), Thomas Schippers, and Wilhelm Furtwängler make my list... these days, I like Fabio Luisi, in particular and Mark Wigglesworth.


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## Almaviva (Aug 13, 2010)

William Christie, no doubt


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## Il_Penseroso (Nov 20, 2010)

Missed the first round and a half of the second ...

*15. Favourite opera conductor*.

Tullio Serafin (Really the best I think)

and also Vassily Nebolsin (He conducted the first recording of a couple of russian opears and did all of them great.)


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## amfortas (Jun 15, 2011)

*15. Favourite opera conductor.*

Of those still active: Daniel Barenboim, Christian Thielemann, Antonio Pappano.

Of those no longer performing: Claudio Abbado, Georg Solti, Giuseppe Sinopoli, Carlos Kleiber.


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## Il_Penseroso (Nov 20, 2010)

amfortas said:


> *15. Favourite opera conductor.*
> 
> Of those still active: Daniel Barenboim, Christian Thielemann, Antonio Pappano.
> 
> Of those no longer performing: Claudio Abbado, Georg Solti, *Giuseppe Sinopoli*, Carlos Kleiber.


Oh, yes, Sinopoli was very good, It was so soon for him to pass away.


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## MAuer (Feb 6, 2011)

*Day 15: Favorite opera conductor*

Currently active: Tony Pappano
No longer performing: Karl Böhm


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## sospiro (Apr 3, 2010)

*15. Favourite opera conductor*

From the past: Lamberto Gardelli

The series of early Verdi operas he recorded with Philips are my favourites.

Currently: I was very impressed by young Dan Ettinger who conducted Rigoletto last November but it has to be Antonio Pappano.


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## waldvogel (Jul 10, 2011)

In recordings, Karl Böhm was the best, in my opinion. 

For a conductor that I've seen live, I've been very impressed with Donald Runnicles.

And for all us Canadians who miss him terribly, Richard Bradshaw will forever be our favourite.


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## ooopera (Jul 27, 2011)

12. Opera that you watch/listen to when you need cheering up
Maybe just some arias.
13. An opera blog/site you frequently visit
Intermezzo, OperaChic, Likely Impossibilities, Classical Iconoclast ...
14. HIP – important to you or not?
It could be fun
15. Favourite opera conductor.
Carlos Kleiber, Christian Thielemann


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## ooopera (Jul 27, 2011)

I forgot to add Kent Nagano!


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## amfortas (Jun 15, 2011)

ooopera said:


> 15. Favourite opera conductor.
> Carlos Kleiber, Christian Thielemann





ooopera said:


> I forgot to add Kent Nagano!


Hmmm . . . I'm with you much more on Kleiber and Thielemann than on Nagano (but that's OK . . . a lot of people will take me to task for liking Solti).


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## mamascarlatti (Sep 23, 2009)

See, I go on smiles rather than quality of conducting. Smiley conductors:

Yannick Nézet-Séguin










Marco Armiliato










When they come on and smile at the orchestra I feel in safe hands.


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## ooopera (Jul 27, 2011)

amfortas said:


> Hmmm . . . I'm with you much more on Kleiber and Thielemann than on Nagano (but that's OK . . . a lot of people will take me to task for liking Solti).


I really like Nagano's work with some "newer" operas, like Three Sisters, Saint Francois d'Asisse ... And I admit he's one of rare big conductors which I have seen live. So far


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## amfortas (Jun 15, 2011)

mamascarlatti said:


> See, I go on smiles rather than quality of conducting. . . . When they come on and smile at the orchestra I feel in safe hands.


Bet you LOVE Wilhelm Furtwängler, then: Mr. Happy!


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## Almaviva (Aug 13, 2010)

I replied from the standpoint of living conductors (picked Christie)
If I had to pick just one from the dead ones, I think I'd pick Carlos Kleiber - the man who could make an orchestra perform clearly better than even that orchestra's highest standards


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## sospiro (Apr 3, 2010)

mamascarlatti said:


> See, I go on smiles rather than quality of conducting. Smiley conductors:
> 
> Yannick Nézet-Séguin
> 
> ...


 I like!





I loved Dan Ettinger's autograph


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## mamascarlatti (Sep 23, 2009)

sospiro said:


> I loved Dan Ettinger's autograph


Very cute and cheerful


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## Almaviva (Aug 13, 2010)

Day 16 - I'll be very conventional and pick _Bella figlia dell'amore_, since I'm back to a Verdi phase after our last remarks about the nice qualities of the man in addition to the composer. I really like the way the voices enter one by one and behave like instruments in an orchestra. Then the orchestra itself quiets down and the voices continue to do the orchestration. Pure genius!






Of course Lucia's sextet and the final trio in Der Rosenkavalier are strong competition.


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## World Violist (May 31, 2007)

Grr, I have no favorite ensemble arias...


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## rgz (Mar 6, 2010)

Day 16: Favorite Ensemble Aria

I'd have to go with the first quintet from Ariadne auf Naxos, Die Dame Gibt Mit Trubem Sinn, which occurs right before Grossmachtige Prinzessin. I seem to be in a definite minority in my admiration for this piece, as there is a single example on YT of very questionable quality.


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## BalloinMaschera (Apr 4, 2011)

16. Favourite ensemble aria.
Die Meistersinger von Nurnberg - Act III Quintet


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## TxllxT (Mar 2, 2011)

*Day 16: Favorite Ensemble Aria*

I like the big clash between Il Commendatore and Don Giovanni with Leporello crouching about in the background.


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## schigolch (Jun 26, 2011)




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## Il_Penseroso (Nov 20, 2010)

Favorite Ensemble Aria :

Inaffia l'ugola ! trinca, tranca ! Jago, Cassio, Roderigo and Chorus (Otello, Act I, Verdi)


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## amfortas (Jun 15, 2011)

*Day 16: Favorite Ensemble Aria*

Not very original, I know, but I do love the final _Rosenkavalier_ trio. The clip below is from the first production I ever saw (rather than heard), the 1982 Met broadcast with Kiri Te Kanawa, Tatiana Troyanos, and Judith Blegen. That "In Gottes Namen" at the end gets me every time. (Sorry the sound quality isn't better.)


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## sospiro (Apr 3, 2010)

The Lucia sextet especially in my favourite (ducks incoming wet fish ) DVD


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## MAuer (Feb 6, 2011)

*Day 16: Favorite Ensemble Aria *

I'm not going to win any prizes for originality with my choice, either: the quartet "Mir ist so wunderbar" from the first act of _Fidelio_.


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## waldvogel (Jul 10, 2011)

Nobody's mentioned this one - the end of Falstaff, and Verdi's last written music. A fugue, no less...

Tutto nel mondo è burla...


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## mamascarlatti (Sep 23, 2009)

"Soave sia il vento" too.


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## ooopera (Jul 27, 2011)

I'm not sure. But if I have to pick one, I'm also voting for Soave. 
Sorry for so boring answer. But here's another link:


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## Almaviva (Aug 13, 2010)

You know, guys, many here including me prefaced these choices by lamenting our lack of originality.
But you know, these famous trios, quartets, quintets and sextets that we've picked are famous for a reason: because they're all darn good!
We shouldn't be ashamed of picking these masterpieces just because everybody thinks of them when ensembles are mentioned.
By the way, if I had thought of it, I could have picked Soave Sia Il Vento instead of Bella Figlia del Amore. But they're all outstanding.


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## sospiro (Apr 3, 2010)

Almaviva said:


> By the way, if I had thought of it, I could have picked Soave Sia Il Vento instead of Bella Figlia del Amore ...


It's just that you're in the Verdi-Zone at the moment - enjoy the ride.


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## schigolch (Jun 26, 2011)

*Do you tend to prefer singers from the past or the present?*

To me the date of birth of a singer is not really relevant, I tend to focus on the singing itself.

Of course, for some singers there is more material than for others, some I've been able to listen in live performance, some not... All this can influence my opinion, for good or for bad.

In terms of numbers, there are more singers for the past that I like, but this is logical given the different timeframes here. There are now more than one century of operatic recordings, versus three decades of live singing (in my case), and even a good part of those "live singers" I've heard are already retired.


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## Almaviva (Aug 13, 2010)

For the statistical reasons mentioned by schigolch, the critical mass of great singers is higher in the past than in the present, which doesn't mean I don't enjoy a certain Russian girl.


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## BalloinMaschera (Apr 4, 2011)

17. Do you tend to prefer singers from the past or the present? Past.


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## TxllxT (Mar 2, 2011)

*17. Do you tend to prefer singers from the past or the present?*

Baroque: singers from the present
19th century onwards: singers from the past


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## mamascarlatti (Sep 23, 2009)

My first great period of opera exposure was in the eighties, and I was pretty familiar with those singing then. But then I had a long hiatus and have only been exloring again for a couple of years, and usually through the medium of DVD, so I like the current generation. Added to that, I don't like the timbre of old recordings so tend to avoid them.


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## HarpsichordConcerto (Jan 1, 2010)

mamascarlatti said:


> 17.	Do you tend to prefer singers from the past or the present?


A tricky and tough question. Answering carefully, on the whole, I would tend to prefer the present mainly because when it comes to HIP, advances in our understanding of ancient music practices have come a long way, and performances sound a lot more convincing now than an older recording. But for Romantic and later repertoire, I can't seem to pick one or the other.


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## waldvogel (Jul 10, 2011)

I tend to prefer the past, but once you go beyond 1950 or so, the quality of the recordings tend to degenerate to the point where I'm more annoyed by the hiss and distortion than pleased by the singer. So Caruso is out and Björling is on the edge for me.


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## World Violist (May 31, 2007)

My favorite singers are largely from the present, much unlike instrumentalists. There seems to be much more variety among singers today. Previously there seemed to be two big "ways" of singing opera: German (Wagner) and Italian, with a few "fringe" schools. Now there is a vast number of equally valid ways to sing, from medieval to modern and everything in between and outside. I don't have to deal with wide vibrato and singing that prioritizes on technique, and there are more and greater personalities in singing (where "personalities" means more than just loud (Flagstad) and louder (Nilsson)).

In short, I prefer today's singers because there is more thought in singing while still not crossing over into cautiousness.


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## amfortas (Jun 15, 2011)

I'll go with "present," if I can cheat a little and include singers from the 80's onwards (Domingo, Pavarotti, Freni, Stratas, Scotto, etc.) who may not be singing now but were the present generation back when I was listening to them 

I have great respect for singers of the more distant past, and just as much for those who listen to them, collect their recordings, and help preserve their memories. But I'm always interested in new productions and new possibilities for opera, which necessarily forefronts the current generation of singers.


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## TxllxT (Mar 2, 2011)

World Violist said:


> My favorite singers are largely from the present, much unlike instrumentalists. There seems to be much more variety among singers today. Previously there seemed to be two big "ways" of singing opera: German (Wagner) and Italian, with a few "fringe" schools. Now there is a vast number of equally valid ways to sing, from medieval to modern and everything in between and outside. I don't have to deal with wide vibrato and singing that prioritizes on technique, and there are more and greater personalities in singing (where "personalities" means more than just loud (Flagstad) and louder (Nilsson)).
> 
> In short, I prefer today's singers because there is more thought in singing while still not crossing over into cautiousness.


I do not agree with the reduction of Flagstad's and Nilsson's personality to "loud" and "louder". Probably we hear differently.


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## MAuer (Feb 6, 2011)

*Day 18: Do you tend to prefer singers from the past or the present?*

I like both, though, to be honest, "past" for me means the '50s, '60s, and '70s (I think a few singers who were active during the '80s are still performing). For me, discovering new voices is part of what makes opera enjoyable.


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## sospiro (Apr 3, 2010)

*Do you tend to prefer singers from the past or the present?*

I can't really choose and not sure how I'd define 'past'. I love the studio recordings from the 1970s and 1980s so love the singers who were in their prime then.

But on DVD I prefer today's singers' interpretation of their roles instead of the old P&B.


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## ooopera (Jul 27, 2011)

Do you tend to prefer singers from the past or the present?

Present. I love new interpretations and productions.


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## Il_Penseroso (Nov 20, 2010)

17. Do you tend to prefer singers from the past or the present ?

For me the answer is clear, Past, before 70s ... Never mind the quality of recordings, I prefer always the quality of singing ...


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## rgz (Mar 6, 2010)

17.	Do you tend to prefer singers from the past or the present?

For several reasons, among them my fairly recently developed interest in opera, and my preference for high quality acting (more prevalent in the modern era due to increased emphasis on acting and for the sheer amount of opera vids compared to previous eras), I prefer modern singers.


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## schigolch (Jun 26, 2011)

18.	Last time you cried at the opera.

I don't cry easily. Well, I hardly cry. But to get some watery eyes, the last time was at a live performance of _Dialogues des Carmelites_, in 2006.


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## mamascarlatti (Sep 23, 2009)

I cry like a baby, frequently.

I cried about 10 seconds ago as Sant'Alessio's mother mourned her lost son:


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## TxllxT (Mar 2, 2011)

*18. Last time you cried at the opera.*

I remember being touched deeply by listening for the first time to Jessye Norman's Dido (on CD). _Live_? No


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## BalloinMaschera (Apr 4, 2011)

18. Last time you cried at the opera.

I never have.


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## waldvogel (Jul 10, 2011)

I have to stifle tears every time I see _Otello_.

Um, obviously not the one by Rossini with the happy ending.


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## ooopera (Jul 27, 2011)

I also don't cry easily. But I had watery eyes at MET Broadcast of Die Walkure.


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## amfortas (Jun 15, 2011)

I got teary a couple of nights ago watching this wonderful DVD again:










I know it has received much praise here already, but if anyone still hasn't seen it--please do!


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## sospiro (Apr 3, 2010)

*Last time you cried at the opera.*

Never live except for wiping away a few tears at how much it's cost me.

DVDs nearly always.


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## Almaviva (Aug 13, 2010)

The death scene in Pelleas et Melisande got me somewhat close to it but it still didn't happen. I've never cried while watching opera.


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## MAuer (Feb 6, 2011)

*Day 18: Last time you cried at the opera*

I'm another who's never cried at the opera.


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## amfortas (Jun 15, 2011)

Almaviva said:


> The death scene in Pelleas et Melisande got me somewhat close to it but it still didn't happen. I've never cried while watching opera.





MAuer said:


> I'm another who's never cried at the opera.


Hmmmm . . . all these macho guys. I'm not buying it.

Come on, admit it. When poor little dying Mimi finally gets that muff to keep her hands warm, you cry like leeetle gorrrrls . . .


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## Il_Penseroso (Nov 20, 2010)

Day 18: Last time you cried at the opera

It happens sometimes while listening to music itself, but never while watching opera.


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## Aramis (Mar 1, 2009)

Day 18: Last time you cried at the opera

I think it was on live performance of La Boheme something like two months ago. And I left after first act. No, second. After the scene in restaurant anyway. Long time no crying since then, but more because I focused on other genres and didn't listen to much of opera until recently.


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## rgz (Mar 6, 2010)

Day 18: Last time you cried at the opera

Never have at a live opera, but listening to certain arias does it every time, especially Ah Non Credea Mirarti


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## rgz (Mar 6, 2010)

*19.What voice type are you?*

Going by the Wikipedia fach page and the roles listed, I guess I'd be a Lyric Bass-Baritone


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## schigolch (Jun 26, 2011)

Baritone..


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## mamascarlatti (Sep 23, 2009)

Permanently flat mezzo


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## Il_Penseroso (Nov 20, 2010)

Bass ... If I had a chance to improve my voice, I could do Russian operas very good ...


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## Aramis (Mar 1, 2009)

19. What voice type are you?

I am not a voice type.


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## TxllxT (Mar 2, 2011)

Bass, member of a male choir, but I do not have a trained voice. After a rehearsal you sometimes have the feeling of being a well-tuned bell with deep internal resonance


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## World Violist (May 31, 2007)

Last time I cried at the opera? I've never been to the opera, but I've cried while listening to some. Tristan und Isolde stands out, obviously. And L'amour de loin.

Voice type? Baritone. Yes, I'm a villain. Unless I'm French, then I'm not so much a villain.


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## FragendeFrau (May 30, 2011)

I've gotten a little behind on this. Here are the ones I can answer:

*13. An opera blog/site you frequently visit*

In addition to this one, I have these bookmarked: 
Likely Impossibilities (she has just moved back to the US from Vienna so I will miss her reviews of European productions)

Parterre Box (Their chats during opera streams can be amazing--or not, depending on who is chatting. There are some very knowledgeable folks there)

Intermezzo (based in the UK so I get my ROH and London-based fix.)

Opera Obsession (based in NYC, and not just opera reviews. Lucy's blog was the one that led me to all the others, and I found her via a google search for *cough* Jonas Kaufmann, shortly after seeing _Die Walküre_ at the cinema)

Opera Cake (I check this one irregularly, but it has amazing coverage of European opera--and there is just SO MUCH of it! A real fan of Regie but not quite as good an "explainer" as La Cieca on Parterre Box)

And of course, I check this every day: unofficial Jonas Kaufmann website
 thanks to the kind advice of folks right here.

I will do the rest in a follow-up post as this is getting so long it may disappear!

ETA: I wanted to add that the writing at Likely Impossibilities, Intermezzo, and Opera Obsession is outstanding and that's one of the reasons why I go back to their blogs even if I will never have a chance to see the performances they review.

Also, I follow a LOT more opera-related people/institutions on Twitter and that is where I find I'm getting a lot of news from and links.


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## FragendeFrau (May 30, 2011)

To continue:

*14. HIP - important to you or not?* No

*15. Favourite opera conductor.* I don't have a lot to choose from so for now I will say Antonio Pappano

*16. Favourite ensemble aria.* Not sure if this counts, but I absolutely adore the entire Act 2 Scene 2 of _La Traviata_ (after the silly dancers leave) but to limit it to the finale, here's the inimitable Sir Denis Forman's description:

"Germont has a sweet sad plaint (Can this be my boy?), Alfredo quite fed up with himself (What a **** I am), the chorus hushed, shocked, embarrassed (Poor Violetta: my God how awful), Germont in a second coming (The girl's a brick), the Baron (I'll get you yet Alfredo), Violetta (If only he knew how I love him)."

I love the chorus part in this scene and also the incredible confrontation with Alfredo and Violetta. I just love the whole thing!!

*17. Do you tend to prefer singers from the past or the present?* This one's easy: present

*18. Last time you cried at the opera.* Have not. Yet.

*19. What voice type are you?* I sing plain old vanilla soprano in our choral society but for the last few years have been losing my voice whether from age or allergies I don't know. This will probably be my last year (and 20th year, I can hardly believe it myself) to sing with them.


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## MAuer (Feb 6, 2011)

*Day 19: What voice type are you?*

Eons ago, I sang alto in the high school and church choirs. Now I'm probably a tenor!


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## Almaviva (Aug 13, 2010)

My voice has the baritone range, but it doesn't mean I can actually sing like one.


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## amfortas (Jun 15, 2011)

*19. What voice type are you?*

Baritone, with a pretty good range verging into tenor and bass territories. Developed mostly from theatre training, though I've had singing lessons on and off (mostly off) over the years.

Now I'll tell you how listening to opera has hurt me.

A few years back I auditioned for my first musical, an expensive, full-orchestra local production of _Man of La Mancha_. Much to my surprise, I got the lead, Don Quixote, mostly because of my acting abilities. When rehearsals began, people told me I was singing the part in too "operatic" a manner, and tried to encourage me to tone it down--but to me that just felt like crooning.

The whole experience was a lot of fun, and after the premiere, one reviewer compared my acting to Olivier's--but said that as a singer, I was no Jim Nabors! Still my favorite review ever.

Then a few months later I played Pilate in _Jesus Christ Superstar_ for the same company. People from the previous show who came to see me asked if I'd had voice lessons, my singing was so improved. I told them, no, it's just the role was written to feel more like normal speaking. Apparently, I'm a better singer when I don't try to sing!


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## waldvogel (Jul 10, 2011)

I'm a barely bearable baritone...


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## rgz (Mar 6, 2010)

amfortas said:


> *19. What voice type are you?*
> 
> Baritone, with a pretty good range verging into tenor and bass territories. Developed mostly from theatre training, though I've had singing lessons on and off (mostly off) over the years.
> 
> ...


Interesting. Did you sing Pilate transposed down, or do you have the range to hit the rather high tessitura of the role?

Of course, I'm just going by the movie soundtrack -- for all I know, they transposed the role up in the movie and it's normally a baritone role


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## ooopera (Jul 27, 2011)

mezzo wheezing ... or something


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## Almaviva (Aug 13, 2010)

amfortas said:


> *19. What voice type are you?*
> 
> Baritone, with a pretty good range verging into tenor and bass territories. Developed mostly from theatre training, though I've had singing lessons on and off (mostly off) over the years.
> 
> ...


Next you need to try your hand at being a comedian, because you're a hell of a funny guy!
(before anybody misunderstands me, it's meant as a compliment)


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## amfortas (Jun 15, 2011)

Almaviva said:


> Next you need to try your hand at being a comedian, because you're a hell of a funny guy!
> (before anybody misunderstands me, it's meant as a compliment)


I choose to misunderstand you! En garde!


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## sospiro (Apr 3, 2010)

amfortas said:


> I choose to misunderstand you! En garde!


amfortas this is the fight scene to get Alma really riled


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## Almaviva (Aug 13, 2010)

I refuse to click on the above abominable video.


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## FragendeFrau (May 30, 2011)

Just finished watching the Zurich _Tosca_ again. Let me just say that if I _were_ going to cry at the opera, it would definitely be during "E lucevan le stelle". (I teared up)

I can see where some have issues with this production, but for me, having Cavaradossi draw on the wall is a heartbreaker right from the get-go, and the music has already got me going before he even begins to sing.

It's interesting how certain things in productions press my buttons--I worked for 10 years in London at an arts center, with lots of artists (hence my avatar), so it was just so RIGHT for me when he takes out the chalk and draws on the wall... *sniff*

OK, back to the most recent challenge question...


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## Almaviva (Aug 13, 2010)

Well, I've just remembered of something that tears me up - not to the point of crying but I do get a little emotional - it's Verdi's Va Pensiero.


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## schigolch (Jun 26, 2011)

*20.	Favourite Regie production (if any)*

This staging of "Dialogues des Carmelites" by Robert Carsen.


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## TxllxT (Mar 2, 2011)

*20. Favourite Regie production (if any)*

Well, I'm not so involved in watching as I am in listening to operas, but I did see the Boulez/Chereau Ring with Wotan being _bourgeois_ and all the other gods being petty bourgeois.  I don't know, but perhaps it was this production that initiated the expansion of Opera-on-DVD/Bluray.
In Amsterdam I remember seeing Monteverdi's Poppea in the Regie of Pierre Audi: marvellous!


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## mamascarlatti (Sep 23, 2009)

An oldie but a goodie: Jonathan Miller's Mafia Rigoletto at ENO

In my collection: The Copenhagen Ring


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## sospiro (Apr 3, 2010)

L'elisir d'amore from Munich which I saw.

Didn't think I'd like it but I did. Joseph Calleja sang _Una furtiva lagrima_ from half way up a telegraph pole.


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## MAuer (Feb 6, 2011)

*Day 20: Favorite Regie production (if any)*

I'm not usually a Regietheater fan, but I have a certain fondness for the Baden Baden _Tannhäuser_ conducted by Philippe Jordan. This has mainly to do with the singing of Mesdames Nylund and Meier and Stephen Milling (Landgraf), but I get a hoot out of the costumes. The whole thing reminds me of some cheap 1960's Hollywood sci-fi "outer space" film.


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## waldvogel (Jul 10, 2011)

I have seen a few really horrible Regie productions, and I would love to rant about them. But there have also been a few that I really liked, including a production of Cosi Fan Tutte at the Berlin Staatsoper Unterdenlinden in 2008.

This version was set in the 1970's - lots of bright orange furniture and disco-inspired costumes. The protagonists were airline pilots and flight attendants. The costumes, which were already over the top, got even goofier when Guglielmo and Ferrando disguised themselves as "Albanians". It worked, it stayed funny - something lost to most Regie productions of comedies - and it was generally appreciated by the audience as a fresh take on an opera that can cause some difficulties in conventional productions.


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## rgz (Mar 6, 2010)

I don't know precisely what defines Regie so I don't know if this counts, but the Louis Erlo Tales of Hoffmann is really something. I'd wager that 90% here would hate it -- it sets the entire opera in a mental institution and has the slowest performance of Les Oiseaux, by far, that you'll ever hear -- but it really, really worked for me.


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## Almaviva (Aug 13, 2010)

I like a lot the Benvenuto Cellini below, complete with Star Wars robots and helicopters. It all sounds ridiculous but strangely enough, it works (or at least, it does for me, I guess the killer legs of the leading soprano helped my appreciation).










This trailer gives a fair idea of what to expect. But I'm telling you, do get it, it is very interesting (not to forget that Benvenuto Cellini is a darn good opera):


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## FragendeFrau (May 30, 2011)

Well, the only two regie productions I've seen are the Munich _Lohengrin_ and the Munich Bieito _Fidelio_ (unless you include the Zurich _Tosca_ as regie). I love them all but I was most impressed and moved by the Munich _Fidelio_. There are several reasons it worked so well for me: I liked the "PTSD Florestan" and the "labyrinth/everyone is a prisoner of something" concept; the streaming broadcast had NO subtitles; there was no program, so I had no idea what Bieito's Konzept was, nor could I read the poetry that was inserted for some of the dialogue. Since I had no libretto, and cast aside the synopsis early on as it didn't seem to relate to what I was seeing--I came to it with completely fresh eyes!

The terrific acting by all the cast (this apparently is a hallmark of those artists who can make it through a regie production!) and the gorgeous music just came together for me in an incredible way.

Here is the beginning of Act 2. It's a playlist so it will play the only bits I've been able to find on the tubes.


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## amfortas (Jun 15, 2011)

Since I'm still getting caught up on the current opera scene after having drifted away for a while, I'll go with some "classic" regie . . . the Patrice Chereau _Walküre_, the Harry Kupfer _Fliegende Holländer_, and of course the Heiner Müller _Tristan_:


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## TxllxT (Mar 2, 2011)

*21. Do you enjoy operettas?*

I need to be in a mood for that. For example when we're planning to visit Vienna & Austria again. The Merry Widow with John Eliot Gardiner is a gem. But quite quickly I'm getting a full stomach.


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## mamascarlatti (Sep 23, 2009)

Operetta: only Offenbach and zarzuelas. I get rather bored with German operetta.


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## schigolch (Jun 26, 2011)

Not very much. Of course, I have been also exposed to many Zarzuelas, but don't like a lot, either (at least the Romantic, and 20th century Zarzuelas, I do have more interest for Baroque Zarzuelas).


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## mamascarlatti (Sep 23, 2009)

schigolch said:


> Not very much. Of course, I have been also exposed to many Zarzuelas, but don't like a lot, either (at least the Romantic, and 20th century Zarzuelas, *I do have more interest for Baroque Zarzuelas*).


I love this CD - lots of gems:


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## Aksel (Dec 3, 2010)

Hi, everyone! Have you missed me? I've missed you, although a week or so almost without Internets has been rather great.

13. An opera blog/site you frequently visit

Mostly here, Parterre, and Opera Chic but I do visit Opera Cake and Intermezzo from time to time. The comments on Parterre makes me giggle. Or groan. Loudly.

14. HIP - important to you or not?

Definitely a HIPster. The sound of a HIP orchestra playing things like Händel or Mozart is much more interesting than a modern orchestra doing the same. Especially when it comes to the wind instruments. Baroque trombones are sexy.

15. Favourite opera conductor.

Current: Pappano
Past: Solti or Karajan

16. Favourite ensemble aria.

Just about anything from Falstaff. Since the final fugue has been posted, I nominate the 2nd scene of the 1st act:






Also, the 2nd act sextet of La Cenerentola:






17. Do you tend to prefer singers from the past or the present?

I prefer present singers, although I do own many recordings with past recordings. I think it mostly depends on the opera. And the singer(s) for that matter. But generally I prefer modern (or at least somewhat modern) singers for bel canto and older opera.

18. Last time you cried at the opera.

I haven't actually cried at the opera, although I did get rather choked up at the end of the Aïda I saw at Wiener Staatsoper a few years back. I did however cry just a little at the end of the 1994 Gheorghiu Traviata.

19. What voice type are you?

I like to think of myself as a budding Spieltenor, but I prefer being a countertenor.

20. Favourite Regie production (if any)

The 2009 Munich Lohengrin.

21. Do you enjoy operettas?

Yes! I love Offenbach and Strauss. I haven't quite gotten into Lehar yet, but I hope to correct that soon (I rented the Bo Skovhus Count of Luxemburg, and I didn't really care much for the music. Or it may just have been Bo Skovhus. I don't really care much for that man).


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## mamascarlatti (Sep 23, 2009)

Aksel said:


> Yes! I love Offenbach and Strauss. I haven't quite gotten into Lehar yet, but I hope to correct that soon (I rented the Bo Skovhus Count of Luxemburg, and I didn't really care much for the music. *Or it may just have been Bo Skovhus*. I don't really care much for that man).


Yes it was. Definitely.


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## schigolch (Jun 26, 2011)

*@mamascarlatti*

Then, perhaps you will like also this, though maybe you have already try:










_Acis y Galatea_ is complete in youtube, with Marta Almajano (perhaps the more appreciated singer for this type of Zarzuela now in Spain) leading the ensemble;






Apart from Spain, there is also a big tradition of Zarzuela (mainly 19th and 20th century, but also some Baroque) in some American countries, especially Cuba, Mexico, Peru and Argentina.


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## Il_Penseroso (Nov 20, 2010)

Do you enjoy operettas ?

Yes, I do ... especially Viennese Operettas ...


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## ooopera (Jul 27, 2011)

20. Favourite Regie production (if any)
Lohengrin (Bayerische Staatsoper, 2009)

21. Do you enjoy operettas?
No. But I do like "Dein ist mein ganzes Herz".


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## waldvogel (Jul 10, 2011)

Do I like operettas? First of all, define the genre. Is it confined to the German-language works written in the late 1800's, early 1900's featuring spoken dialogue and happy endings? Can I include Offenbach, Gilbert and Sullivan, Zarazuelas, Victor Herbert, or Rodgers and Hammerstein? Because I like stuff from all of those genres, and it's a fine point that places _The Merry Widow_ in one category and _South Pacific_ in another.

I wish we had a theatre tradition like the Volksoper in Vienna, which shows a mix of Broadway shows, operettas, and operas that don't have huge demands of orchestral forces. I've seen _Der Freischutz_ there, as well as Kander and Ebb's _Cabaret_.

In its narrowest sense _Die Fledermaus_ is a little masterpiece - with much better music than a lot of the traditional operas that are in the repertoire. _The Merry Widow_ is almost as good. Unfortunately, I don't think I've heard any other operettas in their entirety.


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## Aksel (Dec 3, 2010)

waldvogel said:


> In its narrowest sense _Die Fledermaus_ is a little masterpiece - with much better music than a lot of the traditional operas that are in the repertoire. _The Merry Widow_ is almost as good. Unfortunately, I don't think I've heard any other operettas in their entirety.


Offenbach's operettas, at least the ones I've heard, are little gems. Although, I'm not quite sure about Orphée yet, but I think that was because I saw a German production from the 70's. Loads of campy fun (including wooden skirts), but I wasn't completely convinced.


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## rgz (Mar 6, 2010)

Aksel said:


> Offenbach's operettas, at least the ones I've heard, are little gems. Although, I'm not quite sure about Orphée yet, but I think that was because I saw a German production from the 70's. Loads of campy fun (including wooden skirts), but I wasn't completely convinced.


You absolutely must watch the Natalie Dessay Orphee. It is literally (and I mean _literally_) impossible not to love.


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## Aksel (Dec 3, 2010)

rgz said:


> You absolutely must watch the Natalie Dessay Orphee. It is literally (and I mean _literally_) impossible not to love.


From what I've seen of it, I do think you're right. The 1st act duet was hi-larious.


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## sospiro (Apr 3, 2010)

Aksel said:


> Hi, everyone! Have you missed me? I've missed you, although a week or so almost without Internets has been rather great.


I've missed you! Where have you been?



Aksel said:


> 16. Favourite ensemble aria.
> 
> Just about anything from Falstaff. Since the final fugue has been posted, I nominate the 2nd scene of the 1st act:


I'm obsessed with Falstaff at the moment.

Going to see it next year (May), wanna come?


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## MAuer (Feb 6, 2011)

*Day 21: Do you enjoy operettas?*

I rather like Johann Strauss II's _Die Fledermaus _and _Zigeunerbaron_ (I have a video of the late '70s made-for-TV production with Jerusalem as Barinkay), and Lehar's _Das Land des L_ächelns and _Die lustige Witwe_.


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## amfortas (Jun 15, 2011)

Welcome back, Aksel!

I've never gotten much into operettas. This despite the fact that I lived for five years in Wooster, Ohio, home of the Ohio Light Opera, which does nothing but.

One more horizon I need to broaden. Oh, world enough and time!


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## TxllxT (Mar 2, 2011)

*22. Best opera (singing) actor*

At present? Following all the TC excitement it must be either Jonas or Dmitri... Dmitri I know. We sometimes see him _live _ on Russia 1 with an _estrada_ of patriotic songs:  all those old women crying


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## schigolch (Jun 26, 2011)

I guess by the brackets that singing comes second.

In this case, Tito Gobbi.


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## BalloinMaschera (Apr 4, 2011)

19. What voice type are you? Sop
20. Favourite Regie production (if any)...not sure i have a fav, but i have always gravitated toward P Chereau's Ring
21. Do you enjoy operettas? not many, beyond Fledermaus and perhaps Merry Widow
22. Best opera (singing) actor Tit Gobbi


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## rgz (Mar 6, 2010)

21. Do you enjoy operettas?
Yes!

22. Best opera (singing) actor?
Simon Keenleyside

Honorable mention to Rolando Villazon, who was hilarious in L'elisir d'Amore. Plus he can juggle!


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## Il_Penseroso (Nov 20, 2010)

22. Best opera (singing) actor 

Can't choose anyone as the best ...


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## amfortas (Jun 15, 2011)

schigolch said:


> I think there is another question coming about the best singing actress....


Edit: Oops, my bad. I'm so used to "actor" as the generic term for both males and females, I didn't even notice the "actress" question coming up in a few days' time. Thank you for setting me straight, schigolch.


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## MAuer (Feb 6, 2011)

*Day 22: Best opera (singing) actor*

Talk about indulging biases . . . Jonas Kaufmann, of course!


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## schigolch (Jun 26, 2011)

amfortas said:


> *22. Best opera (singing) actor*
> 
> No one's mentioned Callas?


I think there is another question coming about the best singing actress....


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## sospiro (Apr 3, 2010)

22. Best opera (singing) actor

Simon Keenlyside - the adorable Papageno


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## FragendeFrau (May 30, 2011)

MAuer said:


> *Day 22: Best opera (singing) actor*
> 
> Talk about indulging biases . . . Jonas Kaufmann, of course!


This counts for me as well, although to be fair with my limited experience I'm not choosing from a huge pool of possibilities.


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## mamascarlatti (Sep 23, 2009)

Jonas Kaufmann or Simon Keenlyside. Though I have a soft spot for Luis Lima as Don Carlo and Don Jose.


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## amfortas (Jun 15, 2011)

Now that I've understood the question and excluded females from consideration (duh!), I'm having a hard time making a selection. Honestly, I can't come up with a male opera singer who has the acting depth and range of a certain French coloratura. 

But I will give a nod to the "opera singer I would most like to have a beer with," my old drinking buddy Bryn Terfel--because of his strong stage presence, intelligent choices, and, in his recent Met Wotan, heartbreaking vulnerability.


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## sospiro (Apr 3, 2010)

amfortas said:


> Now that I've understood the question and excluded females from consideration (duh!), I'm having a hard time making a selection. Honestly, I can't come up with a male opera singer who has the acting depth and range of a certain French coloratura.
> 
> But I will give a nod to the "opera singer I would most like to have a beer with," *my old drinking buddy Bryn Terfel*--because of his strong stage presence, intelligent choices, and, in his recent Met Wotan, heartbreaking vulnerability.


Cool

I must admit his Scarpia but very good but he's just not Simon


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## ooopera (Jul 27, 2011)

Jonas Kaufmann, Thomas Hampson and Bryn Terfel.


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## Almaviva (Aug 13, 2010)

Operettas - it depends. I like a few Viennese operettas and I love Offenbach, and a few other zebras here and there, but I don't care much for many others (e.g. Gilbert & Sullivan - I kind of like their best ones but I'm definitely not in love with them). At the user who questioned the scope of the question, I think we're all thinking operettas in the broad sense here. Because in the strict sense we can't even call Offenbach's works Operettas; he classified them in many different ways.

Best opera (singing) actor - I like Bryn Terfel's acting a lot, and also Simon Keenlyside's. Jonas Kaufmann who has been mentioned several times above impresses me more for his singing than for his acting.


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## schigolch (Jun 26, 2011)

*Watching or listening? Why?*

In order of preference:

1.- Watch a live production in the theater
2.- Watch a live production in other media: TV, cinema, Internet,..
3.- Watch a DVD
4.- Listen to a CD or other media

All this, of course, assuming the cast and the conductor/orchestra are the same. Because they are the top priority for me.


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## BalloinMaschera (Apr 4, 2011)

23. Watching or listening? Why?
Listening- I love listening in the dark, as I feel more connected to the music- and then...well, there's nothing to see


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## BalloinMaschera (Apr 4, 2011)

@ mamascarlatti....*22. Best opera (singing) actor*...did you male singer with the best *vocal *acting skills?...or male opera singer with the best acting skills (in the traditional theatrical sense) ?

If it's the former, I'm sticking to Tito Gobbi.


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## mamascarlatti (Sep 23, 2009)

BalloinMaschera said:


> @ mamascarlatti....*22. Best opera (singing) actor*...did you male singer with the best *vocal *acting skills?...or male opera singer with the best acting skills (in the traditional theatrical sense) ?
> 
> If it's the former, I'm sticking to Tito Gobbi.


Best opera singer who can also act his socks off on stage, physically as well as vocally.


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## TxllxT (Mar 2, 2011)

*23. Watching or listening? Why?*

Listening. I'm not easily satisfied with what is presented to my eyes, nor do I want to get satisfaction from certain 'assets' that one singer has and another one may be lacking... So a DVD I mostly appreciate for its educational value of getting to know the libretto. After that I like to immerse into the opera itself without those gimmicks.


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## Aksel (Dec 3, 2010)

sospiro said:


> I've missed you! Where have you been?


I've been away playing Rachmaninoff 2nd Piano Concerto and Sibelius 2nd Symphony. Loads of fun!



> I'm obsessed with Falstaff at the moment.
> 
> Going to see it next year (May), wanna come?


Mayhaps? 
Aren't they premiering a new production (I presume you're seeing it at the ROH?)? Because I hated, hated, HATED, the last one.


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## Aksel (Dec 3, 2010)

BalloinMaschera said:


> 19. What voice type are you? Sop
> 20. Favourite Regie production (if any)...not sure i have a fav, but i have always gravitated toward P Chereau's Ring
> 21. Do you enjoy operettas? not many, beyond Fledermaus and perhaps Merry Widow
> 22. Best opera (singing) actor *Tit* Gobbi


*snicker*

____________________

22. Best opera (singing) actor

Male: Jonas Kaufmann
Female: Maria Callas

23. Watching or listening? Why?

Watching. Opera is first and foremost a visual artform, and I believe it should be experienced as such. Although I have nothing against listening either.


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## Il_Penseroso (Nov 20, 2010)

23. Watching or listening? 

Listening.

Why?

Simply because there'e no opera house or even a real concert hall where I live ... I'm just happy to see some opera productions on VHS or DVD ...


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## sospiro (Apr 3, 2010)

Aksel said:


> I've been away playing Rachmaninoff 2nd Piano Concerto and Sibelius 2nd Symphony. Loads of fun!


Cooool!! Any recordings you'd care to share?



Aksel said:


> Mayhaps?
> Aren't they premiering a new production (I presume you're seeing it at the ROH?)? Because I hated, hated, HATED, the last one.


Yes ROH & yes a new production. According to the programme co-produced with La Scala & Canadian Opera Company.

 You Know Who is singing Pistola


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## Aksel (Dec 3, 2010)

sospiro said:


> Cooool!! Any recordings you'd care to share?


I don't, but even if I did, I don't think I would have shared them anyway. The brass section, me included, made such complete arses of ourselves that I don't think even I will listen to the recording (if it exists, mind you).



> Yes ROH & yes a new production. According to the programme co-produced with La Scala & Canadian Opera Company.
> 
> You Know Who is singing Pistola


No, but judging from the winky-face, I'm guessing it's Il Cioccolatissimo. And Ambroglio Maestri is singing Falstaff, which should be lots of fun as well.


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## sospiro (Apr 3, 2010)

Aksel said:


> I don't, but even if I did, I don't think I would have shared them anyway. The brass section, me included, made such complete arses of ourselves that I don't think even I will listen to the recording (if it exists, mind you).


You're being too modest. Bet it's really good!



Aksel said:


> No, but judging from the winky-face, I'm guessing it's Il Cioccolatissimo. And Ambroglio Maestri is singing Falstaff, which should be lots of fun as well.


No not John Relyea, but my Lovely Lukas. His first proper role at ROH after completing his two years on the Jette Parker Young Artists Programme

This was taken after Macbeth.


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## Aksel (Dec 3, 2010)

sospiro said:


> No not John Relyea, but my Lovely Lukas. This is was taken after Macbeth.


Well, he ought to be good as well. Do you know who's singing Bardolph?


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## sospiro (Apr 3, 2010)

Aksel said:


> Well, he ought to be good as well. Do you know who's singing Bardolph?


No, sorry Bardolph isn't listed in the programme. Pistola isn't either but I got that information from elsewhere.


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## MAuer (Feb 6, 2011)

*Day 23: Watching or listening? Why?*

My first choice would be watching a performance at the opera house. Otherwise, my preference for video versus audio recordings varies. Generally, I like the videos -- but there are times when I simply enjoy listening to the music and imagining my own staging of the opera.


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## Aksel (Dec 3, 2010)

sospiro said:


> No, sorry Bardolph isn't listed in the programme. Pistola isn't either but I got that information from elsewhere.


Ok. I actually like Bardolph more than Pistol, but that's just me. I have a thing for character tenors. That is also why I like the right honorable Dr. Cajus, I think. That, and the fact that he reminds me of a lemming.


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## amfortas (Jun 15, 2011)

*Day 23: Watching or listening? Why?*

I prefer watching *and* listening (I've tried watching opera DVDs with the sound turned off, but somehow it's just not the same).


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## FragendeFrau (May 30, 2011)

Day 23: Watching or listening? Why?

Prefer seeing it live, but that's not really an option where I am now (spoiled by my earlier life in the big city). Second choice, DVDs. But I have, much to my surprise, been enjoying listening to my CD of _Fidelio_ and also to a recording of the live broadcast of _La Traviata_ from ROH. So really I like both watching and listening.


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## sospiro (Apr 3, 2010)

Aksel said:


> Ok. I actually like Bardolph more than Pistol, but that's just me. I have a thing for character tenors. That is also why I like the right honorable Dr. Cajus, I think. That, and the fact that he reminds me of a lemming.


A lemming??! :lol:

(back on topic)

*Day 23: Watching or listening? Why?*

Apples & oranges.

Listening: on the hoof or travelling
Watching: at home


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## Aksel (Dec 3, 2010)

sospiro said:


> A lemming??! :lol:


Bah! Screw the topic to the sticking place!

But yes. A lemming. He's always so mad, and he sounds like he's about to explode anytime.


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## mamascarlatti (Sep 23, 2009)

I usually privilege watching because I'm often interested in the theatrical take on an opera, and I enjoy physical as well as vocal acting. I certainly do NOT regard that as gimmicks - opera was written to be performed in a theatre, not listened to on an audio system, and that's the ideal place to see it. Unfortunately like others my live opportunities are rare, so it's sometimes the cinema and usually a DVD.

But when I'm walking, or driving, or cooking, or ironing, I do a lot of listening. Rather than my scattergun approach in watching I choose an unfamiliar opera and listen carefully a few times (If I like it) to get to know it better.


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## waldvogel (Jul 10, 2011)

I love the live experience of seeing opera - I got my season tickets yesterday and it felt lovely just looking at those little pieces of cardboard. 

DVD's are a good second option, particularly for operas that get performed here about as often as lasting peace treaties get signed in the Middle East - I'm sure they'll be doing Parsifal any year now, lol. 

I don't listen to my opera CD's as often as I should - but I do listen to MP3's in the car and when taking a walk.


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## rgz (Mar 6, 2010)

schigolch said:


> *Watching or listening? Why?*
> 
> In order of preference:
> 
> ...


Perfectly said


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## mamascarlatti (Sep 23, 2009)

waldvogel said:


> I love the live experience of seeing opera - *I got my season tickets yesterday *and it felt lovely just looking at those little pieces of cardboard.


So what's on the menu, waldvogel?


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## ooopera (Jul 27, 2011)

rgz said:


> Perfectly said


Yes, indeed!


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## Almaviva (Aug 13, 2010)

Watching.
Opera is a theatrical art, and only listening to it is like eating a sandwich with no fillings. Or maybe more accurately, eating the fillings without the bun.


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## schigolch (Jun 26, 2011)

*Favourite "traditional" production (if any)*

Aida, Franco Zeffirelli


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## mamascarlatti (Sep 23, 2009)

Cosi fan tutte from Glyndebourne:










Runner up:

Billy Budd, Glyndebourne


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## rgz (Mar 6, 2010)

I was considering answering the Laurent Pelly _Orphee aux Enfers_ but I think the question as to whether it's a traditional production is unanswerable. What exactly would a traditional production of an Offenbach operetta that's a greek myth farce look like?

So I'll dodge the question and answer: either the Zefirelli Traviata or the 1990 Met Ring.


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## TxllxT (Mar 2, 2011)

24. Favourite “traditional” production (if any)
....................


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## Aksel (Dec 3, 2010)

24. Favourite “traditional” production (if any)

The McVicar Magic Flute at the ROH is uh-mazing. I also want to add his recent Meistersinger, but that's really sugar-free Regie light.

Oh, and the Cappuccio production of Falstaff at the Teatro Verdi a decade ago. Such an amazing production.


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## BalloinMaschera (Apr 4, 2011)

24. Favourite “traditional” production (if any)

Jean-Pierre Ponnelle's MET Mozart Nozze (because it is one of my fondest childhood operatic memories)


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## sospiro (Apr 3, 2010)

Aksel said:


> Well, he ought to be good as well. Do you know who's singing Bardolph?





Aksel said:


> Ok. I actually like Bardolph more than Pistol, but that's just me. I have a thing for character tenors. That is also why I like the right honorable Dr. Cajus, I think. That, and the fact that he reminds me of a lemming.


*Update*

Daniele Gatti, Conductor
Robert Carsen, Director
Orchestra of the Royal Opera House, Covent Garden

Ambrogio Maestri: Sir John Falstaff
Dalibor Jenis: Ford
Joel Prieto: Fenton
Carlo Bosi: Dr Caius
Alasdair Elliott: Bardolph
Lukas Jakobski: Pistol
Ana Maria Martinez: Alice Ford
Kai Rüütel: Meg Page
Amanda Forsythe: Nanetta
Marie-Nicole Lemieux: Mistress Quickly

*24. Favourite "traditional" production (if any)*

ROH _Simon Boccanegra_ with Domingo in the title role


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## MAuer (Feb 6, 2011)

*Day 24: Favorite "traditional" production (if any)*

Okay, so I'm getting boring . . . of course, it's the 2004 Harnoncourt _Fidelio_:


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## sospiro (Apr 3, 2010)

MAuer said:


> *Day 24: Favorite "traditional" production (if any)*
> 
> Okay, so I'm getting boring . . . of course, it's the 2004 Harnoncourt _Fidelio_:


No you're not. Your _Fidelio_ obsession is no worse than my _Boccanegra_ obsession.


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## Almaviva (Aug 13, 2010)

I guess this can be considered traditional although it's a filmed version:










A close runner-up would be the Glyndebourne Così mentioned by Nat.


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## HarpsichordConcerto (Jan 1, 2010)

mamascarlatti said:


> 24.	Favourite "traditional" production (if any)


One of the finest, as far as HIP inspired stage production is concerned.


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## mamascarlatti (Sep 23, 2009)

HarpsichordConcerto said:


> One of the finest, as far as HIP inspired stage production is concerned.


HC, have you seen this?










Same director, William Christie at the helm, very beautiful and moving. It would be my third choice.


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## HarpsichordConcerto (Jan 1, 2010)

mamascarlatti said:


> HC, have you seen this?
> 
> Same director, William Christie at the helm, very beautiful and moving. It would be my third choice.


No, I don't have it. I shall need to fix that real soon ... thanks!


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## Il_Penseroso (Nov 20, 2010)

Day 24: Favorite "traditional" production (if any)

Il barbiere di Siviglia, Glyndebourne Festival Opera, 1987


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## schigolch (Jun 26, 2011)

*25.	Favourite One-act opera*

Quite a few.

Today, I'd say _Violanta_, by Erich Wolfgang Korngold









_Maria Jeritza as_ Violanta​
This is an early opera from the wunderkind Korngold. It was premiered in 1916, with a librettto by writer Hans Müller, based on a Renaissance drama. From a purely technical point of view, there are good melodies, an incredible mastery of harmony and a lustful orchestration, all coming from a child not yet eighteen.

True, there are echoes of Tristan, of Strauss, of Zemlinsky's (also one of Korngold's teachers) _Eine florentinische Tragödie_... But incorporated and within the framework of the astonishing own voice of the young prodigy.


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## TxllxT (Mar 2, 2011)

*25. Favourite One-act opera*


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## BalloinMaschera (Apr 4, 2011)

25. Favourite One-act opera
Bartók- Duke Bluebeard's Castle


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## sospiro (Apr 3, 2010)

*25. Favourite one-act opera*

Bluebeard's Castle

I don't know many one-act operas but I love this one so much I think it will always be my favourite


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## Almaviva (Aug 13, 2010)

HarpsichordConcerto said:


> No, I don't have it. I shall need to fix that real soon ... thanks!


 I endorse it as well, it's good!


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## Almaviva (Aug 13, 2010)

One-act operas: I love many, and like the concept. Some of my favorites, L'enfant et les sortilèges, Il Tabarro, L'Heure Espagnole, Gianni Schicchi, Rossini's early farces (I've seen four of them and loved them all), Bluebeard's Castle, La Serva Padrona, and although it's not one act but it feels this way because it is so short, Le Rossignol. But I have to be conventional here and pick Cavalleria Rusticana, because it is a member of a superior league, in my opinion. There is no way to avoid it in the name of picking something out of the beaten path, because its sheer quality is hard to ignore when we consider one-act operas.


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## mamascarlatti (Sep 23, 2009)

Il Viaggio a Reims is technically a one act opera, although it's quite long.


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## Il_Penseroso (Nov 20, 2010)

25. Favourite one-act opera

Cavalleria rusticana, no doubt ...


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## FragendeFrau (May 30, 2011)

MAuer said:


> *Day 24: Favorite "traditional" production (if any)*
> 
> Okay, so I'm getting boring . . . of course, it's the 2004 Harnoncourt _Fidelio_:


OK, I'm going to have to buy this! Now! Unfortunately the "jacket" looks like a blank CD. Was this a traditional production? I thought some were surprised that (just like the Bieito!) Florestan and Leonora don't sing O Namenlose Freude clutching each other, but rather standing apart...

[ETA: ugh, now that I've pulled the trigger and ordered, they say it's going to be September at the earliest...think I will cancel and order from a used vendor]

I guess for my favorite traditional production I would have to say "Carmen" ROH since that's the only one I own...


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## waldvogel (Jul 10, 2011)

My favorite (really long) one-act opera is Das Rheingold. It does approach the bladder limit for a one-act opera, though.

My favorite conventional-length one-act opera is Cavalleria Rusticana. It has more great music than most full-length operas.


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## amfortas (Jun 15, 2011)

*Day 24: Favorite "traditional" production (if any)*

This one was hard (which is why I'm a day late with it). At this point, I'm not entirely sure what counts as "traditional" anymore (for instance, often today you'll see period costumes in front of abbreviated, abstracted, or nonexistent sets).

But with that caveat, I'll go with the 1993 Met _Parsifal_--certainly far more traditional than the only other version I had seen up to that point, the wildly unconventional 1982 Hans-Jürgen Syberberg film. The Met production, by the director/designer team of Otto Schenk and Gunther Schneider-Siemssen (the same people who brought you the traditional Met Ring cycle), is dismissed by many today as too blandly literal. But it is attractive to look at, and it made realize that this ponderous, slow-moving opera didn't *have* to be accoutered with all kinds of off-the-wall visual paraphernalia for me to enjoy it.


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## amfortas (Jun 15, 2011)

*25. Favourite one-act opera*

This is entrapment, I tell you, nothing but entrapment! You're forcing me (once again) to cop to my "guilty pleasure" opera!

OK, fine then . . . you asked for it . . .

Puccini. _Il Trittico_. _Suor Angelica_.

I know, I know. I try to resist, really I do. But it's no use. I can hold out for a little while, but by the time the little nun gets to join her baby boy in heaven, I'm reduced to a puddle of tears. Totally devastated.

There, I admitted it. I'm a big *******!

Happy now???


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## sospiro (Apr 3, 2010)

amfortas said:


> *25. Favourite one-act opera*
> 
> This is entrapment, I tell you, nothing but entrapment! You're forcing me (once again) to cop to my "guilty pleasure" opera!
> 
> ...




Is there a PT'SA'D support group?


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## amfortas (Jun 15, 2011)

sospiro said:


> Is there a PT'SA'D support group?


I've been in one for years. The first step is to acknowledge that I'm powerless over my addiction.

Sometimes, late at night, when I'm all alone, I feel the nearly uncontrollable urge to watch the old Renata Scotto Met performance. But I call my sponsor, let him know how tempted I am, and slowly, slowly, he talks me down.

By the end of the call, the dawn is poking through my window. I'm tired, exhausted, a nervous wreck. But I've won the battle, stayed on the wagon. I've made it through another day.


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## MAuer (Feb 6, 2011)

FragendeFrau said:


> OK, I'm going to have to buy this! Now! Unfortunately the "jacket" looks like a blank CD. Was this a traditional production? I thought some were surprised that (just like the Bieito!) Florestan and Leonora don't sing O Namenlose Freude clutching each other, but rather standing apart...
> 
> [ETA: ugh, now that I've pulled the trigger and ordered, they say it's going to be September at the earliest...think I will cancel and order from a used vendor]
> 
> I guess for my favorite traditional production I would have to say "Carmen" ROH since that's the only one I own...


I think the Harnoncourt _Fidelio_ would fit the description of a traditional production, although -- thanks, in part, to Harnoncourt's exceedingly slow tempo -- Leonore and Florestan are only standing side-by-side toward the end of "O namenlose Freude" and don't embrace until it's finished. But this production includes generally period-appropriate (early 19th century) costuming, and there are no staging gimmicks. The whole rescue of Florestan is not treated as some sort of hallucination/wishful thinking on the part of Leonore, Pizarro isn't confined to a wheelchair, Don Fernando doesn't show up decked out like The Joker and proceed to shoot Florestan, etc., etc.
For what it's worth, I prefer this video to the new Abbado CD. I like Nylund's voice much better than Stemme's (though that's just personal taste), and der Jonas doesn't indulge in what the _Gramophone_ critic refers to as the "vocal discolorations" that -- for me -- compromise his Lucerne performance a little.

Oh, yeah, before I forget . . .

*Day 25: Favorite One-act opera*

Probably _Gianni Schicci_, although _I Pagliacci _has to be a close second.


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## sospiro (Apr 3, 2010)

amfortas said:


> I've been in one for years. The first step is to acknowledge that I'm powerless over my addiction.
> 
> Sometimes, late at night, when I'm all alone, I feel the nearly uncontrollable urge to watch the old Renata Scotto Met performance. But I call my sponsor, let him know how tempted I am, and slowly, slowly, he talks me down.
> 
> By the end of the call, the dawn is poking through my window. I'm tired, exhausted, a nervous wreck. But I've won the battle, stayed on the wagon. I've made it through another day.












Oh you poor man, my heart really does go out to you & it sounds like you're fighting a lonely battle.

I find these help with my own 'little problem', the blue ones are particularly efficacious.


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## FragendeFrau (May 30, 2011)

MAuer said:


> For what it's worth, I prefer this video to the new Abbado CD. I like Nylund's voice much better than Stemme's (though that's just personal taste), and der Jonas doesn't indulge in what the _Gramophone_ critic refers to as the "vocal discolorations" that -- for me -- compromise his Lucerne performance a little.


You are not the first person that I've read this from. I can't tell yet--I have only listened to the Lucerne CD in my car, but noticed immediately that the sound levels seem strange--there are pp (ppp?) sections in the overture(?) that are inaudible, then of course JK's renowned "Gott" which honestly, *I* couldn't hear the 'G' either or anything at all until several seconds in; and quite a bit of the whispered dialogue that follows was also inaudible. I realize it was a live performance but I found it very oddly recorded. It could be just the sound system in my car; I haven't had time yet to listen at home.


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## Aksel (Dec 3, 2010)

Favourite one-act opera:

Rheingold


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## Almaviva (Aug 13, 2010)

amfortas said:


> *25. Favourite one-act opera*
> 
> This is entrapment, I tell you, nothing but entrapment! You're forcing me (once again) to cop to my "guilty pleasure" opera!
> 
> ...


 Go figure. I've rarely seen an opera that I disliked as much as Suor Angelica.


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## ooopera (Jul 27, 2011)

Favourite one-act opera:

Elektra


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## mamascarlatti (Sep 23, 2009)

Almaviva said:


> Go figure. I've rarely seen an opera that I disliked as much as Suor Angelica.


Yup, not really dislike, but more meh...


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## waldvogel (Jul 10, 2011)

Almaviva said:


> Go figure. I've rarely seen an opera that I disliked as much as Suor Angelica.


Il Trittico - two masterpieces sandwiched around a dud.


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## amfortas (Jun 15, 2011)

Almaviva said:


> Go figure. I've rarely seen an opera that I disliked as much as Suor Angelica.





mamascarlatti said:


> Yup, not really dislike, but more meh...





waldvogel said:


> Il Trittico - two masterpieces sandwiched around a dud.


What did I tell you? See, they come out of the woodwork . . .


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## Almaviva (Aug 13, 2010)

amfortas said:


> What did I tell you? See, they come out of the woodwork . . .


 Yes, amfortas, look out. The wolves are coming. You're doomed, mate, I tell you, doomed!:devil:


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## sospiro (Apr 3, 2010)

amfortas said:


> What did I tell you? See, they come out of the woodwork . . .


You may find some comfort reading this thread


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## schigolch (Jun 26, 2011)

*Best opera (singing) actress*

In my view the best singing actresses from which we have recordings, are:


Claudia Muzio

Magda Olivero

Maria Callas

I will go today with Magda Olivero, that is now 101 years old:


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## rgz (Mar 6, 2010)

I'm just going to go by those active today, and say Natalie Dessay. Honorable mention to Diana Damrau.


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## mamascarlatti (Sep 23, 2009)

At the moment I'm greatly admiring of Eva Maria Westbroek and Nina Stemme.


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## TxllxT (Mar 2, 2011)

*26. Best opera (singing) actress*

Maria Callas. Best opera actress legs..........................see Alma's answer


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## MAuer (Feb 6, 2011)

*Day 26: Best opera (singing) actress*

This is a bit of a tough call, as we seem to have quite a few sopranos/mezzos today who are terrific actresses as well as marvelous singers -- Natalie Dessay, Joyce di Donato, Anna Netrebko, Karita Mattila, Agnes Baltsa . . . hard to narrow it down to just one.


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## Almaviva (Aug 13, 2010)

MAuer said:


> *Day 26: Best opera (singing) actress*
> 
> This is a bit of a tough call, as we seem to have quite a few sopranos/mezzos today who are terrific actresses as well as marvelous singers -- Natalie Dessay, Joyce di Donato, Anna Netrebko, Karita Mattila, Agnes Baltsa . . . hard to narrow it down to just one.


 No, it's not hard to narrow it down to just one. The one and only Anna Netrebko La Bellissima!!!


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## FragendeFrau (May 30, 2011)

Simon Callow (the British actor) has voted in this thread, and he says "Natalie Dessay and Jonas Kaufmann"

(from the _Guardian_'s supplement on enjoying opera)

I was 15 when I saw my first: _Il Trittico_, Puccini's great triple bill of one-act operas, at the Royal Opera House. I paid 12s/6d for my ticket in the slips and was overwhelmed - not just by the dramatic power of the music, the richness of the orchestral playing, the beauty of the singing and the spectacular impact of the production, all of which I had expected - but by the greatness of the acting, which I had not. The leading singer was Tito Gobbi, in two out of the three pieces. His piercing pain and comic bravura were as fine as any acted performance in any medium I've ever seen. Today Jonas Kaufmann and Natalie Dessay and Thomas Allen are every bit his equal.


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## amfortas (Jun 15, 2011)

*26. Best opera (singing) actress*

Oh goodie! Now that we're talking about *female* actors (aka "actresses"), I can repost this . . .

I have to indulge my bias and go with Natalie Dessay. Not only is she the current queen of tragic mad scenes (Ophelia, Lucia), but she's a brilliant, adorable comedienne in the best Lucille Ball tradition--as this clip from _La Fille du Regiment _ amply demonstrates.


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## Almaviva (Aug 13, 2010)

amfortas said:


> *26. Best opera (singing) actress*
> 
> Oh goodie! Now that we're talking about *female* actors (aka "actresses"), I can repost this . . .
> 
> I have to indulge my bias and go with Natalie Dessay. Not only is she the current queen of tragic mad scenes (Ophelia, Lucia), but she's a brilliant, adorable comedienne in the best Lucille Ball tradition--as this clip from _La Fille du Regiment _ amply demonstrates.


No match for the Russian girl.


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## amfortas (Jun 15, 2011)

Almaviva said:


> No match for the Russian girl.


Oh, it's on now!










You got a clip to back that up? I've shown you mine. Now you show me yours.


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## Almaviva (Aug 13, 2010)

amfortas said:


> Oh, it's on now!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 Anna wouldn't lower herself to some lousy YouTube clips.
I present her body (!) of works on DVD and blu-ray, available from the best sites and stores, and rest my case.


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## schigolch (Jun 26, 2011)

*High notes - essential or irrelevant?*

If it's written by the composer, it shoud be tried (unless we have a problem in some notes for one particular singer, and we can balance our options), so I guess the question refers to high notes incorporated into the score by tradition.

Got nothing against them, but not particularly in favor, either. Should I conduct one performance, will go case by case with the singers and took the decision together.


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## TxllxT (Mar 2, 2011)

*27. High notes - essential or irrelevant?*

I guess the reintroduction of the HIP pitch, which is lower than those of the modern instruments, is a blessing for the singers. So, high notes, how high? The modern pitch is devastating. Essential is not to be out of tune of to falsify the tone to 'as if' it was high.


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## schigolch (Jun 26, 2011)

What's an 'old' pitch?. 

We have physical evidence of A3 being tuned at 453 Hz, at La Scala, of all places, in the first decades of the 19th century. So then Giuditta Pasta, for instance, had to sing higher pitches than today!.

Reality is that each theater in the 19th century, had slightly (sometimes, not that slightly) different tunings. And some of those tunings were lower the "standard" modern tune (let's this be 440 or 442), but some were higher. In the baroque era, there is also evidence of A3 from 392 to 460, including some from Italy in the 18th century at precisely 440. So using 415 today in most Baroque HIP music, it's just a kind of 'compromise', rather a way to try to sound 'appropriately Baroque' in the 21st century, than to get a real sound of the 18th, that was different, in different places, not uniform.


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## TxllxT (Mar 2, 2011)

schigolch said:


> What's an 'old' pitch?.
> 
> We have physical evidence of A3 being tuned at 453 Hz, at La Scala, of all places, in the first decades of the 19th century. So then Giuditta Pasta, for instance, had to sing higher pitches than today!.
> 
> Reality is that each theater in the 19th century, had slightly (sometimes, not that slightly) different tunings. And some of those tunings were lower the "standard" modern tune (let's this be 440 or 442), but some were higher. In the baroque era, there is also evidence of A3 from 392 to 460, including some from Italy in the 18th century at precisely 440. So using 415 today in most Baroque HIP music, it's just a kind of 'compromise', rather a way to try to sound 'appropriately Baroque' in the 21st century, than to get a real sound of the 18th, that was different, in different places, not uniform.


OK not uniform, but fine for the gut strings & human voice.


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## Almaviva (Aug 13, 2010)

Day 27 - I'm not sure if I agree with the question. It would be equivalent to asking, low notes, essential or irrelevant? Middle notes, essential or irrelevant? The notes are what they are, and the variation between low-middle-high is what makes the melody, so of course they are all relevant, and beautiful when well composed and well sung. But being less picky and assuming that a singer is embellishing the vocal writing with high notes or a composer is writing high notes in excess to achieve a certain effect, could they be over-the-top, pun not intended? I guess, but still, it all depends on the quality of the singing. Everything in operatic singing that is well done is beautiful, in my opinion.


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## MAuer (Feb 6, 2011)

*Day 27: High notes - essential or irrelevant?*

I took this question to mean whether or not we think it's important for singers -- sopranos and tenors, at any rate -- to have those big, crowd-pleasing "money notes." (Think _Nessun Dorma_.) I don't feel it's absolutely necessary . . . though I must confess that I get a certain guilty thrill when I hear a singer deliver a clear, ringing high note at the conclusion of an aria.


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## Operafocus (Jul 17, 2011)

*Day 27: High notes - essential or irrelevant?*

If I'm being blunt, I personally think that a singer who can't deliver the essential high notes are kinda irrelevant. I've heard so many bad attempts at high notes by mediocre singers, and it really does **** me off Like the tenor who was up against Maria Guleghina last year, who cracked on all his top notes - in all the performances. How is someone like that relevant in an opera house?


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## mamascarlatti (Sep 23, 2009)

MAuer said:


> *Day 27: High notes - essential or irrelevant?*
> 
> I took this question to mean whether or not we think it's important for singers -- sopranos and tenors, at any rate -- to have those big, crowd-pleasing "money notes." (Think _Nessun Dorma_.) I don't feel it's absolutely necessary . . . though I must confess that I get a certain guilty thrill when I hear a singer deliver a clear, ringing high note at the conclusion of an aria.


That is what I meant - I've seen discussions which bitch about the fact that x singer had to transpose something down a semitone or so in order to sing the aria, or disussing a high note completely isolated from the rest of the aria which might have been executed very well. I prefer to take the whole performance into consideration.

And anyway I'm a low note fancier. When Sam Ramey laughs evilly 'ha ha ha" as Mefistofeles, that's when my heart races.


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## amfortas (Jun 15, 2011)

*Day 27: High notes - essential or irrelevant?*

I guess I saw the question a little differently--not how we feel about singers interpolating high notes or reaching them in performance, but how much importance we place on vocal highwire displays in general.

From that perspective, I would say that, while I can certainly enjoy a thrilling high note, it's not something I obsess over. I suppose if I did, I might have a somewhat different list of favorite composers--Wagner, so far as I know, wrote only one tenor high C in his entire body of work.


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## FragendeFrau (May 30, 2011)

amfortas said:


> *Day 27: High notes - essential or irrelevant?*
> 
> I guess I saw the question a little differently--not how we feel about singers interpolating high notes or reaching them in performance, but how much importance we place on vocal highwire displays in general.
> 
> From that perspective, I would say that, while I can certainly enjoy a thrilling high note, it's not something I obsess over. I suppose if I did, I might have a somewhat different list of favorite composers--*Wagner, so far as I know, wrote only one tenor high C in his entire body of work.*


He just decided there were other ways to make their lives miserable, from what I've heard from tenor friends!

And I agree with your understanding of the question: I'm not especially a fan of displays; also, my knowledge is so limited that I wouldn't know if one were left out!


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## Almaviva (Aug 13, 2010)

mamascarlatti said:


> That is what I meant - I've seen discussions which bitch about the fact that x singer had to transpose something down a semitone or so in order to sing the aria, or disussing a high note completely isolated from the rest of the aria which might have been executed very well. I prefer to take the whole performance into consideration.
> 
> And anyway I'm a low note fancier. When Sam Ramey laughs evilly 'ha ha ha" as Mefistofeles, that's when my heart races.


Oh, OK, I was pretty dense, I got the gist of the question completely wrong.
In this case, no, not essential, a singer *can* be very good without reaching those high notes, but then, he/she must pick well the roles or the public will be disappointed.


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## schigolch (Jun 26, 2011)

*28. Your most often consulted reference book about opera?*


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## Aramis (Mar 1, 2009)

28. Your most often consulted reference book about opera?

http://pl.wikipedia.org/wiki


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## TxllxT (Mar 2, 2011)

*28. Your most often consulted reference book about opera?*

Groot Opera Boek by Leo Riemens


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## HarpsichordConcerto (Jan 1, 2010)

mamascarlatti said:


> 28.	Your most often consulted reference book about opera?


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## BalloinMaschera (Apr 4, 2011)

26. Best opera (singing) actress - Maria Callas
27. High notes – essential or irrelevant?- if you mean interpolated notes... it depends on their quality and dramatic relevance... generally though, they are not a bad bonus, for a singer to have in his/her arsenal


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## sospiro (Apr 3, 2010)

28. Your most often consulted reference book about opera?










But I use Aramis' choice as well


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## amfortas (Jun 15, 2011)

Hmmm . . . I have a lot of books in storage right now, so my choices are limited. But I like having this one around:


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## MAuer (Feb 6, 2011)

*Day 28: Your most often consulted reference book about opera*

I don't think Jonas Kaufmann's bio would exactly constitute a reference book about opera  . . . so, for me, it would either be the Grove dictionary or the web.


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## Almaviva (Aug 13, 2010)

1. A History of Bel Canto - Rodolfo Celletti
2. A Song of Life and Death - The meaning of opera - Peter Conrad
3. After Aida, or Verdi's Messiah - play - John Mitchell
4. Fortissimo - backstage at the opera with sacred monsters and young singers - William Murray
5. Histoire de l'Opéra - René Leibovitz (in French)
6. Living Opera - Joshua Jampol (interviews with singers, conductors, directors)
7. Opera and Ideas - From Mozart to Strauss - Paul Robinson
8. Opera and its symbols - the unity of words, music, and staging - Robert Donington
9. Opera, Sex, and Other Vital Matters - Paul Robinson
10. Ring Resounding - John Culshaw
11. The Billboard Illustrated Encyclopedia of Opera (guide, coffee-table book)
12. The rough guide to opera - Matthew Boyden (guide)
13. The toughest show on earth - my rise and reign at the Metropolitan Opera - Joseph Volpe
14. The Tristan Chord: Wagner and Philosophy - Bryan Magee
15. The Wagner Operas - Ernest Newman
16. Rackham's Color Illustrations for Wagner's Ring - Arthur Rackham
17. The Gilded Stage - A Social History of Opera - Daniel Snowman
18. Butterfly's Child - novel - Angela Davis-Gardner
19. The New Kobbé's Opera Book -The Earl of Harewood - Antony Peattie (guide)
20. Famous Italian Opera Arias - A Dual Language Book - Ellen H. Bleiler
21. Grove Book of Operas - Stanley Sadie, Laura Macy (guide)
22. Opera: Composers. Works. Performers. (Ullmann) - Andras Batta (guide, coffee-table book)
23. In Grand Style - The Glory of the Metropolitan Opera - Nancy Ellison(coffee-table book)

My budding opera library is listed above, in no order.
Which ones I consult most? I think the Grove, the Kobbé, and the Boyden, but I should explore more the Ullmann which I bought recently and has been sitting around, almost unopened.


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## schigolch (Jun 26, 2011)

*29. Opera character your mother would warn you away from marrying*.

I guess Lucrezia Borgia. To marry her was definitely into the health hazard category.


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## TxllxT (Mar 2, 2011)

*29. Opera character your mother would warn you away from marrying.*

Donna Elvira, Carmen, Fricka, Queen of the Night


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## Aramis (Mar 1, 2009)

29. Opera character your mother would warn you away from marrying

Siegfried


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## mamascarlatti (Sep 23, 2009)

*29. Opera character your mother would warn you away from marrying.*

Lohengrin (control freak), Ernani (terminally stupid), Don José (clingy), Eugene Onegin (superiority complex), Pinkerton (skeletons in closet + surprise stepchild), Hermann (addictive personality), Wotan (roving eye), Hercules (comes back from business trips with floozies in tow), Don Giovanni (ha! try getting him to the altar), Manrico (interfering mother in law) and the list goes on....


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## waldvogel (Jul 10, 2011)

Katerina, from _Lady Macbeth of Mzensk_, assuming that I'm looking for a wife.

If I were looking for a husband, it's hard to pick worse than a hot-tempered, jealous and powerful man who likes nothing more than flattery and takes bad advice from his assistant. Stay away from Otello!


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## amfortas (Jun 15, 2011)

mamascarlatti said:


> *29. Opera character your mother would warn you away from marrying.*
> 
> Lohengrin (control freak), Ernani (terminally stupid), Don José (clingy), Eugene Onegin (superiority complex), Pinkerton (skeletons in closet + surprise stepchild), Hermann (addictive personality), Wotan (roving eye), Hercules (comes back from business trips with floozies in tow), Don Giovanni (ha! try getting him to the altar), Manrico (interfering mother in law) and the list goes on....


Maybe it would be simpler to ask, is there an opera character your mother *wouldn't* warn you away from marrying?


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## amfortas (Jun 15, 2011)

*29. Opera character your mother would warn you away from marrying.*

Probably Lulu. Real bad choice for a wife.

Though I did date her for a year and a half.


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## Operafocus (Jul 17, 2011)

*29. Opera character your mother would warn you away from marrying.*

Canio/Pagliaccio, probably. An alcoholic, aggressive clown who would - let's face it - end up killing me off :lol:


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## sospiro (Apr 3, 2010)

Sparafucile

Although he did have principles


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## Almaviva (Aug 13, 2010)

amfortas said:


> *29. Opera character your mother would warn you away from marrying.*
> 
> Probably Lulu. Real bad choice for a wife.
> 
> Though I did date her for a year and a half.


Well, Lulu is so obvious that *I* wouldn't want to marry her so she wouldn't make it to the "mother" stage.
I guess Norina would be the one.


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## amfortas (Jun 15, 2011)

Almaviva said:


> Well, Lulu is so obvious that *I* wouldn't want to marry her so she wouldn't make it to the "mother" stage.


In retrospect, my "Lulu" was so obvious she shouldn't have made it to the dating stage!

But, you know . . . "love is blind" . . .


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## MAuer (Feb 6, 2011)

*Day 29: Opera character your mother would warn you away from marrying*

Since I'm not likely to be hobnobbing with the aristocracy (which leaves out the Duke of Mantua, Don Carlo, Titus Vespasianus, Count di Luna, Baron Scarpia, and assorted other troubled characters), my mother definitely would have warned me about the Rev. Olin Blitch in Carlisle Floyd's _Susannah_. She would have spotted his hypocrisy from the start.


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## Aramis (Mar 1, 2009)

How about another question: 30. Opera character whose mother would warn him/her away from marrying you.


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## AnaMendoza (Jul 29, 2011)

waldvogel said:


> .........
> 
> If I were looking for a husband, it's hard to pick worse than a hot-tempered, jealous and powerful man who likes nothing more than flattery and takes bad advice from his assistant. Stay away from Otello!


My dad wouldn't have liked the idea of my marrying him, either....


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## schigolch (Jun 26, 2011)

*30. Three qualities essential for an opera singer*

Project the voice
Manage the passage between different zones of the tessitura to keep homogeinity
Phrase well, sing legato.


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## BalloinMaschera (Apr 4, 2011)

28. Your most often consulted reference book about opera?
Musicians since 1900 - Performers in Concert and Opera- by David Ewen 1977; while it obviously covers nobody or anything past 1977, I find myself going back to this reference book quite a lot.

29. Opera character your mother would warn you away from marrying.
Countess Geschwitz from Lulu


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## TxllxT (Mar 2, 2011)

*30. Three qualities essential for an opera singer.*

Intriguing voice, stage character, diligence in preparation


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## Aramis (Mar 1, 2009)

30. Three qualities essential for an opera singer.

whimsicality, cruelty, ability put a curb into the mouth of horse with crooked teeth


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## Almaviva (Aug 13, 2010)

Three qualities essential for an opera singer
1. Have a face like Anna Netrebko's
2. Have the left-sized, cough cough, asset, look like Anna's left girl
3. Have the right-sized, cough cough, asset, look like Anna's right girl


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## waldvogel (Jul 10, 2011)

to paraphrase the old real estate maxim:

The three things essential for any great opera singer are:

1. A good voice
2. A good voice
3. A good voice

You can have a face like Medusa, a body like a circus freak, a personality like Stalin's, and stage presence like a mannequin - but if you've really got the pipes, there will be a career out there for you. There might be a lot of Vaseline on the lens when they took your photo for the DVD...


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## Almaviva (Aug 13, 2010)

waldvogel said:


> to paraphrase the old real estate maxim:
> 
> The three things essential for any great opera singer are:
> 
> ...


I'm not sure if this remains true. It's not what the singers themselves say. I've read interviews with young overweight singers saying that they need more time in the gym than in the studio if they ever have any chance of landing a good role.


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## Aramis (Mar 1, 2009)

Almaviva said:


> I'm not sure if this remains true. It's not what the singers themselves say. I've read interviews with young overweight singers saying that they need more time in the gym than in the studio if they ever have any chance of landing a good role.


That's curious because we just got new director of our new opera house who claims that he is disappointed that all singers he found here are young and good looking and that he wants to employ some fat geezers like him in nearest future.


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## amfortas (Jun 15, 2011)

Aramis said:


> How about another question: 30. Opera character whose mother would warn him/her away from marrying you.





Aramis said:


> 30. Three qualities essential for an opera singer.
> 
> whimsicality, cruelty, ability put a curb into the mouth of horse with crooked teeth





Aramis said:


> That's curious because we just got new director of our new opera house who claims that he is disappointed that all singers he found here are young and good looking and that he wants to employ some fat geezers like him in nearest future.


Damn, I've missed you, Aramis! Where have you been the past couple of days?


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## amfortas (Jun 15, 2011)

*30. Three qualities essential for an opera singer.*

Nowadays I would say:

1. Singing ability
2. Acting ability
3. Reasonably good looks

With number 4 being that horsey teethy thing.


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## BalloinMaschera (Apr 4, 2011)

30. Three qualities essential for an opera singer.

a) Dedication/Patience/Good Memory
b) Naturally gifted; both musically and in terms of vocal quality/uniqueness 
c) Supportive family and/or friends


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## Aramis (Mar 1, 2009)

amfortas said:


> Damn, I've missed you, Aramis! Where have you been the past couple of days?


I'm sorry to say that I were nowhere far and I've posted actively in recent week, perhaps not in opera section, but I did. At least I think so. I'm loosing sense of time. I may be wrong but I must be strong. Wherever I was, anyway, I got an idea for an opera from there. It shall be based on this:

Before his lion-court
Impatient for the sport,
King Francis sat one day;
The peers of his realm sat around,
And in balcony high from the ground
Sat the ladies in beauteous array.
And when with his finger he beckoned,
The gate opened wide in a second
And in, with deliberate tread,
Enters a lion dread,
And looks around
Yet utters no sound;
Then long he yawns
And shakes his mane,
And, stretching each limb,
Down lies he again.

Again signs the king,--
The next gate open flies,
And, lo! with a wild spring,
A tiger out hies.
When the lion he sees, loudly roars he about,
And a terrible circle his tail traces out.
Protruding his tongue, past the lion he walks,
And, snarling with rage, round him warily stalks
Then, growling anew,
On one side lies down too.

Again signs the king,--
And two gates open fly,
And, lo! with one spring,
Two leopards out hie.
On the tiger they rush, for the fight nothing loth,
But he with his paws seizes hold of them both
And the lion, with roaring, gets up, - then all's still,
The fierce beasts stalk around, madly thirsting to kill.

From the balcony raised high above
A fair hand lets fall down a glove
Into the lists, where 'tis seen
The lion and tiger between.

To the knight, Sir Delorges, in tone of jest,
Then speaks young Cunigund fair;
"Sir Knight, if the love that thou feel'st in thy breast
Is as warm as thou'rt wont at each moment to swear,
Pick up, I pray thee, the glove that lies there!"

And the knight, in a moment, with dauntless tread,
Jumps into the lists, nor seeks to linger,
And, from out the midst of those monsters dread,
Picks up the glove with a daring finger.

And the knights and ladies of high degree
With wonder and horror the action see,
While he quietly brings in his hand the glove,
The praise of his courage each mouth employs;
Meanwhile, with a tender look of love,
The promise to him of coming joys,
Fair Cunigund welcomes him back to his place.
But he threw the glove point-blank in her face:
"Lady, no thanks from thee I'll receive!"
And that selfsame hour he took his leave.

It's fantastic material, just imagine what magnificent finale could it made - the potential of this scene is limitless. I already have 28378397524 ideas for scenography, extended plot and I even had a tune in mind but I forgot it, but I think it was Tchaikovsky's anyway so I'll get new ones.


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## MAuer (Feb 6, 2011)

*Day 30: Three qualities essential for an opera singer*

- Beautiful voice
- High degree of technical skill/musicality
- Acting ability


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## amfortas (Jun 15, 2011)

Aramis said:


> It's fantastic material, just imagine what magnificent finale could it made - the potential of this scene is limitless. I already have 28378397524 ideas for scenography, extended plot and I even had a tune in mind but I forgot it, but I think it was Tchaikovsky's anyway so I'll get new ones.


Cool! Will the lion, tiger, and leopards get to sing as well? I could see a nice aria, duet, ensemble progression.


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## Aramis (Mar 1, 2009)

amfortas said:


> Cool! Will the lion, tiger, and leopards get to sing as well? I could see a nice aria, duet, ensemble progression.


I thought of writing short aria for the tiger with following lyrics:

Roar... ra-o-rar!
Raooo-a-a-aaa-r... ra,
roa... roa... roar...
r..rr... rrr.... r...
... r!

But they told me that tiger tenors were not employed so far and it's hard to get one these days so I gave up the idea.

Basically the scenography will be based upon the enclosure of circular pit (arena) interior of which will be unseen by audience (in fact there will be no real interior HO HO HO) surrounded by the choir and solists. So there will be no need to show any of these animals.


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## mamascarlatti (Sep 23, 2009)

Ispiration
Perspiration
Perspiration


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## ooopera (Jul 27, 2011)

28. Your most often consulted reference book about opera?
Recently it is Musiktheater im 20. Jahrhundert (http://openlibrary.org/books/OL3636223M/Musiktheater_im_20._Jahrhundert)

29. Opera character your mother would warn you away from marrying.
Bluebeard. But the list can be really long

30. Three qualities essential for an opera singer.
1. everything in connection with the voice
2. acting ability/stage presence
3. good manager (or be clever enough to choose perfect roles at the right time)


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## sospiro (Apr 3, 2010)

30. Three qualities essential for an opera singer.

Can sing
Can act
Looks like the role


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## amfortas (Jun 15, 2011)

amfortas said:


> 30. Three qualities essential for an opera singer.
> 
> 1. Singing ability
> 2. Acting ability
> 3. Reasonably good looks





sospiro said:


> 30. Three qualities essential for an opera singer.
> 
> Can sing
> Can act
> Looks like the role


Wow! Great minds *do* think alike!


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## Aksel (Dec 3, 2010)

30.

- Awareness of style
- A good, individual voice with great technique
- Acting abilities FFS!

Ooh look, accidental alliteration.


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## HarpsichordConcerto (Jan 1, 2010)

mamascarlatti said:


> 30.	Three qualities essential for an opera singer.


Technique with taste.
Understanding of the sung language as good as a local singer, and without accent.
A naturally gifted voice that simply swooooooons all listeners!


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## ooopera (Jul 27, 2011)

Round 3???


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## mamascarlatti (Sep 23, 2009)

.


ooopera said:


> Round 3???


Go for it. You just need to think of 30 new questions.


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## MAuer (Feb 6, 2011)

HarpsichordConcerto said:


> Technique with taste.
> Understanding of the sung language as good as a local singer, and without accent.
> A naturally gifted voice that simply swooooooons all listeners!


In other words, Jonas Kaufmann!


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## Operafocus (Jul 17, 2011)

MAuer said:


> In other words, Jonas Kaufmann!


Or Mario Lanza


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## amfortas (Jun 15, 2011)

So, has anyone formally volunteered to come up with another set of 30 questions? If not, I'll be happy to take a stab at it. Or two or more of us could collaborate on the next list.


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## sospiro (Apr 3, 2010)

amfortas said:


> So, has anyone formally volunteered to come up with another set of 30 questions? If not, I'll be happy to take a stab at it. Or two or more of us could collaborate on the next list.


Not sure I can think of any more questions so I'm happy for you to have a go, thank you. :tiphat:


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## Operafocus (Jul 17, 2011)

Maybe put in a few easy ones for the next round as well?  At times I felt a bit like an opera virgin throughout the last round, as I had absolutely no f-ing clue what the question was :lol:


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## amfortas (Jun 15, 2011)

Operafocus said:


> Maybe put in a few easy ones for the next round as well?  At times I felt a bit like an opera virgin throughout the last round, as I had absolutely no f-ing clue what the question was :lol:


I'll do my best. Trouble is, I've already come up with a list of question, and *I* don't understand most of them!


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## Operafocus (Jul 17, 2011)

amfortas said:


> I'll do my best. Trouble is, I've already come up with a list of question, and *I* don't understand most of them!


It would just be nice to get a question where you don't need a master's degree in classical music to even get past the question :lol:


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## sospiro (Apr 3, 2010)

amfortas said:


> I'll do my best. Trouble is, I've already come up with a list of question, and *I* don't understand most of them!


I lied. I can think of lots but as they're questions involving certain singers, an egg whisk and wet celery, I'd get banned pdq.

:angel:


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## amfortas (Jun 15, 2011)

sospiro said:


> I lied. I can think of lots but as they're questions involving certain singers, an egg whisk and wet celery, I'd get banned pdq.
> 
> :angel:


Oh great. Now I have to get rid of #23!

By the way, not to give too much away, but I think you guys may find that a certain new thread has just popped up!


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