# Recommend me some modern recordings of these works



## Chordalrock

Harpsichord: Bach WTC, keyboard concerto in d minor
Harpsichord or piano: Bach keyboard partitas
Bach partita in d minor for violin
Mozart Don Giovanni
Mozart piano sonatas
Beethoven piano concerto number four
Beethoven symphony number nine
Schumann Fantasy in C & Kreisleriana
Chopin nocturnes
Brahms fourth symphony
Wagner Parsifal

Yes, I did just get spotify premium. That is all.


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## Alypius

Chordalrock said:


> Harpsichord: Bach WTC ...
> Beethoven piano concerto number four
> Beethoven symphony number nine
> Schumann Fantasy in C & Kreisleriana
> Chopin nocturnes
> Brahms fourth symphony...
> 
> Yes, I did just get spotify premium. That is all.


By "modern recordings," I presume you mean "recent" ones. These are the most recent that I know and can recommend strongly.

*Bach's WTC*, I would strongly recommend Christophe Rousset's _Well-Tempered Clavier, Book II_ (2 CDs) (Aparte, 2014) - A superb new performance. In the liner notes, he explains why he started his cycle with Book II.










*Beethoven Piano Concerto #4*: Paul Lewis (piano), with Jiří Bĕlohlávek and BBC Symphony, _Beethoven: Piano Concertos_ (Harmonia mundi, 2010).










I have Steven Lubin's performance on fortepiano of these due to arrive soon. I'll report on them when they do.

*Chopin Nocturnes*: Nelson Freire, _Chopin: The Nocturnes_ (Decca, 2010):


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## Alypius

Continuing:

*Beethoven Symphony 9*. Osmo Vänskä / Minnesota Orchestra, _Beethoven: Symphony 9_ (BIS, 2009)










Simply a great performance, and BIS's recording quality is superb. This has been boxed up as part of the complete cycle by Vänskä and the Minnesota. One of the finest recent cycles.

*Schumann Fantasy in C*: Leif Ove Andsnes, _Schumann: Klaviersonate 1 / Fantasie C-dur_ (EMI, 2005) (though I believe it was originally released in the late 1990s.










*Brahms: Symphony 4*: Riccardo Chailly and Gerwandhaus Orchester released the complete cycle of Brahms' Symphonies in 2013, and these were named just the other day Gramophone Magazine's "Best Orchestral Performance" for 2013/14:


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## Guest

Harpsichord: Bach WTC, keyboard concerto in d minor
Harpsichord or piano: Bach keyboard partitas 
*Murray Perahia*
Bach partita in d minor for violin
Mozart Don Giovanni
*Rene Jacobs on Harmonia Mundi*
Mozart piano sonatas
*Ronald Brautigam on BIS on the fortepiano*
Beethoven piano concerto number four
*Yevgeny Sudbin and Osmo Vanska on BIS*
Beethoven symphony number nine
*Osmo Vanska on BIS*
Schumann Fantasy in C & Kreisleriana
Chopin nocturnes
Brahms fourth symphony
Wagner Parsifal


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## Chordalrock

Thanks! I'll listen to these and see if I find any of them stunning. I'm very conservative with the like button so I'll like your messages if I do.

By 'modern recording', I guess anything since the early 1990s would do.


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## SimonNZ

(just deleted my post - I had recommendations for all works, but they were all from well before 1990)


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## Chordalrock

The reason I'm asking for newer stuff is that I'm pretty much familiar with the artists, if not always the recordings, of the earlier eras, and when I'm not, they're easy to hear about. The last thirty years though is more unknown to me, the newer the more so.


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## Alypius

Chordalrock said:


> Harpsichord: Bach ... keyboard concerto in d minor.


I held off recommending a performance of this because there is some confusion about whether what has come down to us as _Keyboard Concerto in D minor_, BWV 1052, is in fact a harpsichord concerto or actually a violin concerto. I needed to reread my notes on this. The argument that it is a violin concerto lurking underneath the keyboard version is made by one of the finest early music groups working today, the Akademie für Alte Musik Berlin on their release, _J.S. Bach: Violin Concerto BWV 1052 / Double Concertos_ (Harmonia mundi, 2007). Here the discussion in the liner notes:



> "The Concerto in D minor BWV 1052 has come down to us only as a harpsichord concerto, but the figuration in the solo part reveals that this is obviously a transcription of a violin concerto that has since disappeared. It is not easy to place this extraordinary work convincingly in historical terms, and indeed in the past doubts were frequently expressed as to its authenticity--quite certainly wrongly, for as far as we are aware no composer except Bach practised so concentrated and at the same time so expressive a concerto style in the first half of the eighteenth cnetury. With unsurpassed technical mastery, the piece develops musical concepts which are partly applicable to Bach's other violin concertos: a dense contrapuntal texture, motivic working of the accompaniment, an almost unrelievedly sombre character, and a high degree of instrumental virtuosity which is nonetheless invariably subordinated to the work's conception. The intensity of musical expression suggests that the concerto was written for a specific occasion, which, however, can no longer be identified. Its existence can be traced back as far as the late 1720s, when Bach used all three movements in church cantatas."--Midori Seller


Whatever you think of the violin vs. harpsichord argument, try this. It's a great performance -- and not only of this great work.










As for a more traditional harpsichord version of it, there are many fine performances since 1990s. Bob van Asperan has a good one (but I don't care much for the sound quality); I have not heard Christophe Rousset's one from the late 1990s on Oiseau-Lyre. The one I recommend is a recent, award-winning one by Matthew Halls and the Retrospect Ensemble: _Johann Sebastian Bach: Harpsichord Concertos_ (Linn, 2012). This won the BBC Music Magazine's "Disc of the Month" for December 2012 and 5 (of possible 5) star rating. Review:



> "The choice of one-to-a-part strings, while not confirmed by hard contemporary evidence, would avoid crowding out the coffee-drinking clientele. But such lean forces also create transparent textures, balancing perfectly with the harpsichord...Halls's sparkling articulation, even at quite moderate tempos, generates enormous exuberance"


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## Alypius

Chordalrock said:


> Harpsichord or piano: Bach keyboard partitas.


On piano, I agree with DrMike's recommendation of Murray Perahia. However, keep an eye out for the forthcoming performance by Igor Levit, which is due out in a few days. His debut release was of Beethoven's late piano sonatas and he wowed critics -- displaying a maturity of expression far beyond his years. So this second release, Bach's Partitas, is something to be on the lookout for:










I prefer these on harpsichord. I have not heard the recent performance by Ton Koopman (Challenge Classics, 2012), which got good reviews -- and he is generally superb. The performance I enjoy is by Peter Watchorn, _Clavier-Ubung I / Six Partitas, BWV 825-830_ (Musica Omnia, 2013). There is an older performance (on Spotify) by Christophe Rousset on Decca.


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## Chordalrock

Thanks! 

I wasn't aware of the history behind BWV 1052. Interesting.

Listening to the Rousset WTC, I was reminded of a dilemma in finding good Bach keyboard recordings: the harpsichordists always phrase heavy-handedly by using changes in tempo or rhythm, while the pianists keep the rhythm steady but use dynamics to bring out phrases in a manner that shouldn't be done because it's impossible on the harpsichord.

Rousset isn't by any means the worst offender: his rubato is subtle, but it's there and I'm not sure I like it. It would certainly be interesting to hear, for a change, a performance on the harpsichord that is almost as steady as the piano performances and doesn't assume you need to be hand-held through the piece by "revealing its structure" via rubato - but of course something that doesn't sound like a computer is playing it.


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## Alypius

I sense that your taste and mine don't match. You probably want to ignore the rest of my recommendations.


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## Chordalrock

Um, what? I have thanked you for your contributions twice now, and I was and am interested in checking them out. I do not think I am also duty bound to perceive all of this music the way you do, or that I'm not allowed to express my sincere ideas about them.


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## Bulldog

Chordalrock said:


> Thanks!
> 
> I wasn't aware of the history behind BWV 1052. Interesting.
> 
> Listening to the Rousset WTC, I was reminded of a dilemma in finding good Bach keyboard recordings: the harpsichordists always phrase heavy-handedly by using changes in tempo or rhythm, while the pianists keep the rhythm steady but use dynamics to bring out phrases in a manner that shouldn't be done because it's impossible on the harpsichord.
> 
> Rousset isn't by any means the worst offender: his rubato is subtle, but it's there and I'm not sure I like it. It would certainly be interesting to hear, for a change, a performance on the harpsichord that is almost as steady as the piano performances and doesn't assume you need to be hand-held through the piece by "revealing its structure" via rubato - but of course something that doesn't sound like a computer is playing it.


You paint a picture of harpsichordists loving rubato and pianists staying away from it. I've been listening to Bach solo keyboard music for dozens of years (harpsichord and piano), and your premise isn't correct. Of course, there's nothing wrong about not caring for rubato; in my earlier years of listening, I didn't appreciate it. Over time, I have developed a strong affection for devices such as hesitations and staggering of musical lines. Their use can enhance musical expression, and I see rubato as risk-taking that has the potential to deliver a distinctive performance.

Having said the above, I also like a nice flowing rhythm that's excellently presented by an artist like Edward Aldwell. Overall, it's good to have an array of interpretations of Bach's music.


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## Chordalrock

Bulldog said:


> You paint a picture of harpsichordists loving rubato and pianists staying away from it. I've been listening to Bach solo keyboard music for dozens of years (harpsichord and piano), and your premise isn't correct.


Can you think of a harpsichordist who doesn't though, specifically for WTC? You mentioned Aldwell, but he plays it on the piano.

Also, I didn't mean that pianists avoid rubato entirely, but for harpsichordists it seems to be a constant thing while pianists use it more as a special effect rather than the primary means of phrasing.

I'm not hating on rubato as such (I like Cortot for example), I'm just interested in hearing a cembalo recording of the WTC in particular that doesn't have it as a regular feature.


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## hpowders

Alypius said:


> On piano, I agree with DrMike's recommendation of Murray Perahia. However, keep an eye out for the forthcoming performance by Igor Levit, which is due out in a few days. His debut release was of Beethoven's late piano sonatas and he wowed critics -- displaying a maturity of expression far beyond his years. So this second release, Bach's Partitas, is something to be on the lookout for:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I prefer these on harpsichord. I have not heard the recent performance by Ton Koopman (Challenge Classics, 2012), which got good reviews -- and he is generally superb. The performance I enjoy is by Peter Watchorn, _Clavier-Ubung I / Six Partitas, BWV 825-830_ (Musica Omnia, 2013). There is an older performance (on Spotify) by Christophe Rousset on Decca.


Trevor Pinnock is very fine in the Partitas and is my "number one".


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## Chordalrock

BTW, I once learned that authentic rubato is about manipulating rhythm while keeping the tempo steady. This is what Cortot does generally speaking, while pianists these days manipulate tempo rather than rhythm. I wonder which would be the historically correct approach - if either - for Bach's solo harpsichord works.


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## Bulldog

Chordalrock said:


> Can you think of a harpsichordist who doesn't though, specifically for WTC? You mentioned Aldwell, but he plays it on the piano.


Off the top of my head, no problem. Luc Beausejour's BK. 1 on Naxos and Keith Jarrett's BK. 2 on ECM.


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## OperaGeek

*Wagner: Parsifal*

You may want to try out one of these (or indeed all three ) - they are all post-1990, good and available on Spotify:





















Levine - Thielemann - Gergiev

Personally, if I had to choose, I'd go for the Levine, but this view is by no means universally shared.


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## Chordalrock

Bulldog said:


> Off the top of my head, no problem. Luc Beausejour's BK. 1 on Naxos and Keith Jarrett's BK. 2 on ECM.


Cool. Can't find the Jarrett on spotify but the Luc B sounds pretty good. Uses some slow downs to highlight structure in the C major prelude but generally a steady tempo.


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## Chordalrock

OperaGeek said:


> *Wagner: Parsifal*
> 
> You may want to try out one of these (or indeed all three ) - they are all post-1990, good and available on Spotify:
> 
> View attachment 50115
> View attachment 50116
> View attachment 50118
> 
> 
> Levine - Thielemann - Gergiev
> 
> Personally, if I had to choose, I'd go for the Levine, but this view is by no means universally shared.


Not bad. Domingo is a good tenor obviously.

I think I still prefer Goodall's Parsifal to Levine's.


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