# Compositions inspired by Nature, Cosmos and the Mystical



## Lucashio (Mar 11, 2016)

Greetings,

I am interested in compositions that is trying to convey the composers inspiration from nature, the celestial bodies and the mystical realm, an example can be Gustav Holst - The planets. A composition so vibrantly conveying the very presence and quality of the planets themselves that one can almost feel them as if they are passing by. Another example is offcourse Ludwig Van Beethovens Moonlight Sonata where the stillness of the full moon, her glow and the slight sense of melancholia it brings is conveyed uninterruptedly.

I would love to hear your lists, make them long, I hope this can be a long thread to benefit for more people with similar musical thirst, good luck
:tiphat:


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## Fugue Meister (Jul 5, 2014)

Actually the name "Moonlight" came from Beethoven's publisher and the piece is not based on any imagery... Beethoven called it his piano sonata no. 14 in c#... A better example from Beethoven is his 6th symphony which is inspired and is supposed to represent nature.


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## Fugue Meister (Jul 5, 2014)

Vivaldi and his four seasons is another..


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## Harold in Columbia (Jan 10, 2016)

One of the perhaps less obvious mystical cases - Stravinsky's _Symphonies of Wind Instruments_ (1920), 



.


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## Cosmos (Jun 28, 2013)

Here's a great work that I discovered recently that also fits in with your theme:

Langgaard - Music of the Spheres





While not so much about space, Scriabin was a composer who wrote with mysticism in mind
Piano Sonata 5: 



Piano Sonata 8: 



Symphony 3, "The Divine Poem": 



***Poem of Ecstasy: 




***The poem of ecstasy is one of my top favorite orchestral works, and I cannot recommend it enough :tiphat:


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## Bayreuth (Jan 20, 2015)

Mahler's 3rd, Messiaen's Turangalila Symphony, Symphony no. 2 by Hovhaness and (especially) Richard Strauss Ein Alpensinfonie


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## clavichorder (May 2, 2011)

Okay, I heard one live just the other day for the first time that for me, takes the cake in mystical, and even spooky or haunted. Debussy's Symphonic Fragments from the Martyr Saint Sebastian. Wonderful piece, I typically think of Debussy as a composer who depicts things in nature, was not aware of his ample facility as evidenced in this piece, for evoking the supernatural and deeply mysterious. My hair stood on end several times, it was entrancing.


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## GreenMamba (Oct 14, 2012)

Saariaho's Orion is inspired by both Orion the Hunter and the constellation.






Wendy Mae Chambers' Symphony on the Universe has movements named Big Bang, Organism, Cosmos and Evolution.


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## Guest (Mar 18, 2016)

Stockhausen is easily the No. 1 composer for this topic.


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## Harold in Columbia (Jan 10, 2016)

clavichorder said:


> ...I typically think of Debussy as a composer who depicts things in nature, was not aware of his ample facility as evidenced in this piece, for evoking the supernatural and deeply mysterious.


This is why the "Impressionist" label - as opposed to Debussy's preference of "Symbolist" - is so pernicious (as well as being simply anachronistic).


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## arpeggio (Oct 4, 2012)

*Bax*

I acknowledge that many find a correlation between nature and music. Generally speaking I am not one of them. There must be a missing link in my DNA.

However there is one interesting exception. The symphonies of Arnold Bax. Over the past few years my wife and I have had the opportunity to travel out west and experience many of the breathtaking vistas. We found that listening to Bax while driving has enhanced these experiences.

To many this probably does not make sense. Like some of us find beauty in listening to Schoenberg or whistling Carter while taking a shower. So here I am, a goofy American, interacting to Bax while driving through the Painted Desert. Go figure.

I can be a cold hearted fish and this is probably the only contribution I can make to this discussion.


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## Becca (Feb 5, 2015)

Holst's The Planets would be a somewhat ambiguous selection as the idea behind it related specifically to astrology (although I can see how that can be considered a form of mysticism.)


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## Weston (Jul 11, 2008)

Bayreuth said:


> Mahler's 3rd, Messiaen's Turangalila Symphony, Symphony no. 2 by Hovhaness and (especially) Richard Strauss Ein Alpensinfonie


Hovhaness was my choice also. Quite a number of his symphonies are subtitled something about mountains or a mountain - Mt. St. Helens, Mystic Mountain, To the Green Mountain, Return of the Son of Mystic Mountain, etc., and the music itself sounds mystical somehow.


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## clavichorder (May 2, 2011)

Harold in Columbia said:


> This is why the "Impressionist" label - as opposed to Debussy's preference of "Symbolist" - is so pernicious (as well as being simply anachronistic).


Agreed. He definitely wrote pieces that are essentially the definition of musical impressionism, but it really short changes his art to simply refer to him as "an Impressionist" as opposed to simply, a great composer. Late Debussy in general really gets ethereal and inimitably subtle, and a piece about a dead saint and weird painting, isn't exactly evocative of nature or oriental things.


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## hpowders (Dec 23, 2013)

Mystical? César Franck's Symphony in d Minor.


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## Richard8655 (Feb 19, 2016)

Can't get much more cosmic or mystical than Ives' "The Unanswered Question".


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## clavichorder (May 2, 2011)

Richard8655 said:


> Can't get much more cosmic or mystical than Ives' "The Unanswered Question".


Ives has become more and more interesting to me ever since I developed a liking for Emerson and some aspects of the transcendental movement. I really liked what little Melville, I read(Bartleby the Scrivenor) and I can feel Ives' art emanating from these best of the American ideas, not so related to classic patriotism.


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## Richard8655 (Feb 19, 2016)

clavichorder said:


> Ives has become more and more interesting to me ever since I developed a liking for Emerson and some aspects of the transcendental movement. I really liked what little Melville, I read(Bartleby the Scrivenor) and I can feel Ives' art emanating from these best of the American ideas, not so related to classic patriotism.


Agree for sure. Ives stands out as very unique in American composers to me. I didn't realize the connection with the transcendental movement, and you've got me intrigued now to explore his works more.


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## Blancrocher (Jul 6, 2013)

clavichorder said:


> Ives has become more and more interesting to me ever since I developed a liking for Emerson and some aspects of the transcendental movement. I really liked what little Melville, I read(Bartleby the Scrivenor) and I can feel Ives' art emanating from these best of the American ideas, not so related to classic patriotism.


If you haven't read it, you may be interested in Ives' "Essays Before a Sonata," which is available for free online.


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## clavichorder (May 2, 2011)

Richard8655 said:


> Agree for sure. Ives stands out as very unique in American composers to me. I didn't realize the connection with the transcendental movement, and you've got me intrigued now to explore his works more.


Well I am not sure how connected he was, if at all, but the Concord Sonata certainly enshrines the big names of the movement in it's movements.


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## Harold in Columbia (Jan 10, 2016)

clavichorder said:


> Agreed. He definitely wrote pieces that are essentially the definition of musical impressionism, but it really short changes his art to simply refer to him as "an Impressionist" as opposed to simply, a great composer. Late Debussy in general really gets ethereal and inimitably subtle, and a piece about a dead saint and weird painting, isn't exactly evocative of nature or oriental things.


If anything is the definition of musical impressionism, I would say it's Bizet's _Carmen_ (particularly things like the choruses of bored soldiers and cigarette factory workers on break). And it has the advantage of originating in the same decade as Impressionist painting, and being by a composer who was the same age as the first generation of Impressionist painters (Debussy was 20 years younger).

It's not just late Debussy that's ethereal and subtle. He's already supremely both in _Pelleas and Melisande_, his big beak (an almost verbatim setting of maybe the quintessential Symbolist play, and having nothing whatsoever to do with Impressionism).

The title of the first movement of _The Sea_ - "From Dawn To Noon on the Sea" - does suggest Monet. But as in all of mature Debussy, the self-consciously mysterious quality of the music seems to me antithetical to Impressionism (Manet is disorienting, but not exactly mysterious, and anyway, maybe not exactly an Impressionist either). (And it's maybe significant that the picture on the cover of the first edition of _The Sea_ was some Japonisme ripped out of Hokusai - again, more suggestive of Symbolism than Impressionism.)


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## Harold in Columbia (Jan 10, 2016)

Harold in Columbia said:


> If anything is the definition of musical impressionism, I would say it's Bizet's _Carmen_ (particularly things like the choruses of bored soldiers and cigarette factory workers on break). And it has the advantage of originating in the same decade as Impressionist painting, and being by a composer who was the same age as the first generation of Impressionist painters (Debussy was 20 years younger).


Though, of course, proto-verismo sex and murder isn't exactly Impressionist territory.

Hmmm, maybe the closest thing to an important "Impressionist" composer is Lalo? Or maybe Grieg, even though he wasn't working anywhere near Paris?


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## Woodduck (Mar 17, 2014)

Harold in Columbia said:


> If anything is the definition of musical impressionism, I would say it's Bizet's _Carmen_ (particularly things like the choruses of bored soldiers and cigarette factory workers on break). And it has the advantage of originating in the same decade as Impressionist painting, and being by a composer who was the same age as the first generation of Impressionist painters (Debussy was 20 years younger).
> 
> It's not just late Debussy that's ethereal and subtle. He's already supremely both in _Pelleas and Melisande_, his big beak (an almost verbatim setting of maybe the quintessential Symbolist play, and having nothing whatsoever to do with Impressionism).
> 
> The title of the first movement of _The Sea_ - "From Dawn To Noon on the Sea" - does suggest Monet. But as in all of mature Debussy, the self-consciously mysterious quality of the music seems to me antithetical to Impressionism (Manet is disorienting, but not exactly mysterious, and anyway, maybe not exactly an Impressionist either). (And it's maybe significant that the picture on the cover of the first edition of _The Sea_ was some Japonisme ripped out of Hokusai - again, more suggestive of Symbolism than Impressionism.)


Bizet's soldiers and factory workers are Impressionist, but Debussy's sea picture is "antithetical" to it?

How do you define Impressionism?


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## Harold in Columbia (Jan 10, 2016)

Correctly.

Impressionist: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:...of_the_Boating_Party_-_Google_Art_Project.jpg

Not Impressionist: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Khnopff-verlorene-stad.jpg

*Edit* - I originally had this instead of Khnopff standing for Symbolism, which wasn't quite right: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:..._a_yellow_Background_-_Google_Art_Project.jpg


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## violadude (May 2, 2011)

When you think about it, all music is inspired by nature, actually.


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## Woodduck (Mar 17, 2014)

Harold in Columbia said:


> Correctly.
> 
> Impressionist: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:...of_the_Boating_Party_-_Google_Art_Project.jpg
> 
> Not Impressionist: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:..._a_yellow_Background_-_Google_Art_Project.jpg


I asked how you defined impressionism _in music._ We're talking about music, not painting. It was a good question. If you don't want to answer it, don't make a mockery of it by posting irrelevancies. Just be honest and say you don't want to answer.


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## Xaltotun (Sep 3, 2010)

Sibelius symphonies 3-7: Nature - check. Cosmos - check. Mystical - check.


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## Harold in Columbia (Jan 10, 2016)

Woodduck said:


> I asked how you defined impressionism _in music._ We're talking about music, not painting.


In the first of my posts to which you replied, I already said Impressionism in music - if there is such a thing - is not Debussy, and is maybe to some extent Bizet, Lalo, and/or Grieg.


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## Becca (Feb 5, 2015)

Harold in Columbia said:


> In the first of my posts to which you replied, I already said Impressionism in music - if there is such a thing - is not Debussy, and is maybe to some extent Bizet, Lalo, and/or Grieg.


Woodduck asked you to define impressionism and you gave examples. Examples can support a definition but they are not a definition.


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## Harold in Columbia (Jan 10, 2016)

Woodduck didn't complain that I replied with examples, he complained that the examples were paintings.


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## Xaltotun (Sep 3, 2010)

Harold in Columbia said:


> In the first of my posts to which you replied, I already said Impressionism in music - if there is such a thing - is not Debussy, and is maybe to some extent Bizet, Lalo, and/or Grieg.


I like how you seem to connect Impressionism with Realism - because that's where it grew up from, in painting that is. In many ways, Impressionism can be seen a more philosophical and less socially aware form of Realism. But if we distance Impressionism from Symbolism - and we should - we can also see that there is a middle ground (again, in painting; this is all an analogue), namely Pointillism and related post-Impressionist movements. Thus, perhaps a particularly "Realist-Impressionist" piece by Debussy (_La Mer?_) could be seen as occupying that middle ground, a "Pointillist" corner of music where we are looking at reality, but that reality not only bends (like in Impressionism) but also breaks to its core components (like in Pointillism) that suggest a hidden layer of reality behind experience (like Symbolism).


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## Becca (Feb 5, 2015)

> Quote Originally Posted by Woodduck
> I asked how you defined impressionism in music. We're talking about music, not painting.


And I am reiterating his question, how do you define impressionism in music? Why do you say that Bizet etc., are and Debussy is not?


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## Harold in Columbia (Jan 10, 2016)

Xaltotun said:


> But if we distance Impressionism from Symbolism - and we should - we can also see that there is a middle ground (again, in painting; this is all an analogue), namely Pointillism and related post-Impressionist movements. Thus, perhaps a particularly "Realist-Impressionist" piece by Debussy (_La Mer?_) could be seen as occupying that middle ground, a "Pointillist" corner of music where we are looking at reality, but that reality not only bends (like in Impressionism) but also breaks to its core components (like in Pointillism) that suggest a hidden layer of reality behind experience (like Symbolism).


This all seems magnificently right.


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## Woodduck (Mar 17, 2014)

Harold in Columbia said:


> Woodduck didn't complain that I replied with examples, he complained that the examples were paintings.


I merely pointed out that using paintings in response to a request for a definition of music was irrelevant. When someone asks for a definition of Impressionism in music, they are not asking for examples, of paintings or anything else. You know that.

No definition of "Impressionism" exists which everyone would agree on, under which everyone would place the same works of art or music, or which would justify a precise parallelism between painting and music. Your claim to have "the correct definition" is unsupported and, I think, not supportable. That's why I wanted to know _your_ definition, and how you derive from it your claim that Bizet's _Carmen_ is Impressionist and Debussy's _La Mer_ is "antithetical" to it. You must realize that most people would not agree with these examples. I don't - but then I don't make grand and provocative claims to having some "correct" definition of the term.

Would you care to make a direct response to my (and now our) inquiry?


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## clavichorder (May 2, 2011)

I liked Xaltotun's placement of La Mer along these lines. The thing that started this was because I claimed that The Martyrdom of Sebastian Symphonic Fragments(whatever I call it not in French) seemed to me so much beyond my perception of impressionism, which is basically that it is colorful and dreamy impressions of natural things or people being "natural" or whatnot.(as an aside, I percieve Images for piano solo or La Cathedral Ingloutie as quintessential impressionism, with La Mer sort of being the ultimate realization, and this is only based on probably both gut impression and prejudice) Not saying it is superior to impressionism, but the piece struck me as being eminently suitable for this thread and I seriously was wowed, distinct from the Debussy I am most familiar with. Curiousl, even though it is 19th century I believe, I also hear much mysticism in Prelude to the Afternoon of Faun. Debussy apparently was a clever guy and could both "tone paint"nature and myths/the more esoteric, and even combine the two when he wanted.


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## Harold in Columbia (Jan 10, 2016)

Out of curiosity, how well do you know _Pelleas and Melisande_?


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## clavichorder (May 2, 2011)

Harold in Columbia said:


> Out of curiosity, how well do you know _Pelleas and Melisande_?


Very poorly. I sampled a long time ago in a time when I was going through a bombast phase, and it didn't sink on. Thanks for the recommendation. Unfortunately I am only in possession of a smart phone and am on a short vacation within my time abroad without headphones. I will give it a listen when I return in a few days.


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## DeepR (Apr 13, 2012)

Just two minutes of Scriabin should be enough to show who is the master of the mystical and cosmic domain. So far out there. That ending gives me the chills each and every time I listen to it.


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## MarkW (Feb 16, 2015)

Janacek's opera "The Cunning Little Vixen."


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## Lucashio (Mar 11, 2016)

Hooray, this thread is flowing like a river!


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## Lucashio (Mar 11, 2016)

I absolutely intuitively agree with Clavicorder earlier in the thread in regard to Debussy and his ability to depict natural mysticism. To me Debussy depicts nature and in particular oceans because of his "floaty" somewhat unconventional ways of composing his music 

PS: I am trying to reply to a reply about Debussy earlier in the thread but to me this message just keeps on coming at the bottom of the thread?? I thought a reply to a reply in a forum would put the reply (to the reply) just beneath the reply.


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## Becca (Feb 5, 2015)

Nope, not here. Strictly chronological order.


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## Weston (Jul 11, 2008)

Reply With Quote is about as close as we get to embedded replies -- which you've probably figured out by now.


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## hpowders (Dec 23, 2013)

Of course the greatest musical description of the "cosmos" is the theme music from the old Star Trek TV program with William Shatner.


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## elgar's ghost (Aug 8, 2010)




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## Lucashio (Mar 11, 2016)

Thanks a lot for all the great suggestions from everybody, let me add that by mystical I in no way mean dark, obscure, complicated, eerie or creepy, I address more the sense of mystical union, compassion and love for all beings and the transcendental nature (the ability to sense beyond the human standpoint, to enter into nature and take its shape and so on) as well as the aspect of transformation, if anybody knows composers who elaborate on these points, my heart surely delight even more


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## Richard8655 (Feb 19, 2016)

"Also Sprach Zarathustra" always seemed to convey this sense to me. Probably the relationship with the movie "2001" contributed to that. But the entire work as well, not just the opening few bars.

This was indeed a good thread subject. In addition to "mystical" as you've described it, "spiritual" might also be applicable as the human perspective of how we perceive and relate to the cosmos. A problem to me is how in everyday life we've physically separated ourselves from nature, especially with technology and modern conveniences. I'm not sure modern western man knows how to relate to the natural world anymore except to consume it and make it expendable. Hopefully music like this might help make this connection again at least on a psychological and spiritual level.


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## tortkis (Jul 13, 2013)

John Luther Adams composes works deeply rooted in nature. He is an environmentalist, living in Alaska. _"My music has always been profoundly influenced by the natural world and a strong sense of place. Through sustained listening to the subtle resonances of the northern soundscape, I hope to explore the territory of sonic geography-that region between place and culture...between environment and imagination"_ (requotation from wikipedia article)


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## Woodduck (Mar 17, 2014)

hpowders said:


> Of course the greatest musical description of the "cosmos" is the theme music from the old Star Trek TV program with William Shatner.


H, you've always been willing to boldly go where no man has, understandably, gone before.


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## clavichorder (May 2, 2011)

With the updated refined meaning on mysticism, I would suggest Sibelius Symphony 7.


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## Cosmos (Jun 28, 2013)

And I would suggest Bruckner's 9th


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## chesapeake bay (Aug 3, 2015)

Here are a few on the more Tranquil nature side of things.
Florida suite for Orchestra - Delius
Seven Years in Tibet - John Williams
Pavane op 50 - Faure
In The Steppes of Central Asia - Borodin
Im Sommerwind - Webern


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## Strange Magic (Sep 14, 2015)

arpeggio said:


> So here I am, a goofy American, interacting to Bax while driving through the Painted Desert.


As a fellow goofy American, I enjoy (to this day) the depiction of the Painted Desert as musically painted by the oft-derided Ferde Grofé in the oft-derided Grand Canyon Suite. I grew up listening to the Suite, and when I finally got to Desert and Canyon, I thought that Grofé had done a pretty good job capturing much of the atmospherics of both.


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## Becca (Feb 5, 2015)

Sibelius' Tapiola (assuming that it has not previously been mentioned)

Josef Suk (unofficial) trilogy of 
- Asrael Symphony
- A Summer's Tale
- Ripening


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## Lucashio (Mar 11, 2016)

Reply to Richard8655. Well, when I see the enthusiasm around this topic, it looks like there is ample hope for the modern mystical human being, maybe classical music is the way to bridge the gap we have so naively dug into our mother earth/selves if not so, we (humanity) have surely had a jolly good time on our way into oblivion. about this thread there is only one thing to say: "Thaaaaar she blows!"

:tiphat:


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## Lucashio (Mar 11, 2016)

By Stockhausen, do you mean Karlheinz, Simon or Markus?


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## millionrainbows (Jun 23, 2012)

Resphigi's Gli Ucelli (The Birds).

Speaking of birds, Messiaen used birdsong-constructs all all through his music. His Catalogue of Birds is the most obvious example.

Beethoven's 6th "Pastoral" is a good one.


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## TxllxT (Mar 2, 2011)

Mysticism for me means: deep, deep bass pedals that really go into the body.


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## Pat Fairlea (Dec 9, 2015)

Becca said:


> Sibelius' Tapiola (assuming that it has not previously been mentioned)
> 
> Josef Suk (unofficial) trilogy of
> - Asrael Symphony
> ...


I'll buy that. To my hearing, Sibelius is genuinely transcendent, evoking a sense of engagement with a natural world that has no need of and is disinterested in human responses to it. That's quite different to composers who look at the natural world then try to tell us how it made them feel. 
And Suk's Ripening is strange and wonderful.


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## hpowders (Dec 23, 2013)

Of course there's Debussy's La Mer, though play it for 10 musical virgins in a room, absolutely NONE of them would identify the sea as the principal star of this composition.


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## Selby (Nov 17, 2012)

Xenakis.

http://www.theguardian.com/music/tomserviceblog/2013/apr/23/contemporary-music-guide-xenakis


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## DeepR (Apr 13, 2012)

Then there is a lot of ambient music with a cosmic theme to it. It's my favorite kind of music to take a step back, drift off and experience unity with nature, the cosmos, past, present and future.


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## Woodduck (Mar 17, 2014)

DeepR said:


> Then there is a lot of ambient music with a cosmic theme to it. It's my favorite kind of music to take a step back, drift off and experience unity with nature, the cosmos, past, present and future.


This brings to mind the "space music" of Jon Serrie. A trip to elsewhere if ever there was one.

"And the Stars Go With You."


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## Lucashio (Mar 11, 2016)

hpowders said:


> Of course there's Debussy's La Mer, though play it for 10 musical virgins in a room, absolutely NONE of them would identify the sea as the principal star of this composition.


I must be an exception to this rule. I identified the sea as the essence of this composition in 1.2 seconds, but having that said, few are able to trace the root of an expression as I am, I am just born like that, an ability beyond music. When I hear certain pieces of music I can almost tell exactly which image inspired the composer of a certain time, not only that, say if Vivaldi was roaming around on the Piazza San Marco in Venice at the time when he got the inspiration for the four season, I can even tell what breakfast the people on the piazza had that day, how it smells and that the fact that they sold discounted pasteries due to a flooding incident causing the flour to be wet that morning.


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## kartikeys (Mar 16, 2013)

Someone must have mentioned already
Beethoven's sixth symphony - pastorale.


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## Lucashio (Mar 11, 2016)

Selby said:


> Xenakis.
> 
> http://www.theguardian.com/music/tomserviceblog/2013/apr/23/contemporary-music-guide-xenakis


Oooh, forks against porcelain sounds harmonious in comparison, in fact I will go and listen to a 3 hour recording of that to recover from this suggestion, still thank you very much!!

:angel:


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