# Why do women tend to be less interested in more complex music compared to men?



## KendrickThaibs (Aug 28, 2021)

In the Jazz, prog rock, experimental and classical music concerts that I have been to, the majority of the audience are men and only a few women. Why does this happen? In daily conversations I have found that women tend to be more susceptible to listening to pop or more mainstream music that mostly speaks of love and stuff like that. Women also tend to fall more easily into worshiping young pop stars who have music that is very easy to digest but because they are physically attractive, they are adored. Is this something cultural? Obviously I know there are exceptions but it is always somewhat disconcerting to be in a concert where for every 20 men, there is only one woman. The same doesn't happen when you go to a pop, reggaeton or rap concert.


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## mossyembankment (Jul 28, 2020)

I don't even know where to begin, this question has so many false premises embedded in it.

Regardless, I think you should consider the possibility that when a gender disparity exists in the first place, they tend to be self-perpetuating. In other words, if a prog rock concert audience is 90% men, it's not going to be a welcoming (or even appealing) environment for women, which means that it's going to stay that way. This principle is a lot more applicable to what you're describing than any inherent differences.


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## Livly_Station (Jan 8, 2014)

mossyembankment said:


> I don't even know where to begin, this question has so many false premises embedded in it.
> 
> Regardless, I think you should consider the possibility that when a gender disparity exists in the first place, they tend to be self-perpetuating. In other words, if a prog rock concert audience is 90% men, it's not going to be a welcoming (or even appealing) environment for women, which means that it's going to stay that way. This principle is a lot more applicable to what you're describing than any inherent differences.


Perfectly said.


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## Forster (Apr 22, 2021)

KendrickThaibs said:


> In the Jazz, prog rock, experimental and classical music concerts that I have been to, the majority of the audience are men and only a few women. [etc]


Why do some new posters drop by, post problematic questions and never engage with the responses?

Classical music fans who haven't been able to get into Jazz: What's been the reason?

(also launched by KendrickThaibs)


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## Kreisler jr (Apr 21, 2021)

I think the largest difference is not that women are less interested in what are minority interests also in men, but that women are less interested in cranking up a hobby to nerdy obsession.

I don't know about niches in more recent music but in classical music it seems quite clear that women are roughly equally interested in the music as performers (both on amateur and professional level) and audience but they are far less interested in collecting CDs/records (this gender difference holds for all collecting, be it butterflies or stamps) or debate on the internet. So as soon as one looks not at concert attendance but at CD buying or internet spaces, one will find overrepresentation of males.

There is one more point, namely that women tend to be more socially conformist than men (for all kinds of bio/sociological/historical reasons but the very fact seems well established). So if a pursuit/hobby tends to alienate one from a peer crowd, women are less likely to pursue it to that extent. 
And the young starlets of pop culture are often designed and marketed to appeal mostly to teenager girls. It's as little surprising that many fall for them as teenage boys fall for video games or other stuff directly marketed towards them. But I wouldn't expect this to be relevant for people past their mid-20s.


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## Wilhelm Theophilus (Aug 8, 2020)

mossyembankment said:


> I don't even know where to begin, this question has so many false premises embedded in it.
> 
> Regardless, I think you should consider the possibility that when a gender disparity exists in the first place, they tend to be self-perpetuating. In other words, if a prog rock concert audience is 90% men, it's not going to be a welcoming (or even appealing) environment for women, which means that it's going to stay that way. This principle is a lot more applicable to what you're describing than any inherent differences.


What about classical concerts, are they not a welcoming or appealing environment for women?


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## mossyembankment (Jul 28, 2020)

Wilhelm Theophilus said:


> What about classical concerts, are they not a welcoming or appealing environment for women?


I don't know if it's true that there is a big gender imbalance in classical audiences, I'm not aware of it if there is.


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## Kreisler jr (Apr 21, 2021)

I don't think there is a pronounced gender difference in concert/opera attendance. 
I have often been told that in amateur choirs/vocal groups men are in "higher demand" than women because fewer men are interested in singing. 
I am not so sure about instrumental music but I would not be surprised about a female majority in amateur classical instrumental ensembles. 

Despite a long time of exclusion/restrictions for women in professional orchestras I think they have gained so much ground in the last decades to be around parity today.

The gender difference mainly applies to collecting, comparing, nerdy debate and criticism, not to playing the music and probably not to listening either.


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## mossyembankment (Jul 28, 2020)

Frankly I think this thread should be allowed to die. It feels like trolling and there isn't much if any substance in it that's worth discussing.


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## Wilhelm Theophilus (Aug 8, 2020)

mossyembankment said:


> Frankly I think this thread should be allowed to die. It feels like trolling and there isn't much if any substance in it that's worth discussing.


How would it be trolling?


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## Dan Ante (May 4, 2016)

KendrickThaibs said:


> In the Jazz, prog rock, experimental and classical music concerts that I have been to, the majority of the audience are men and only a few women. Why does this happen? In daily conversations I have found that women tend to be more susceptible to listening to pop or more mainstream music that mostly speaks of love and stuff like that. Women also tend to fall more easily into worshiping young pop stars who have music that is very easy to digest but because they are physically attractive, they are adored. Is this something cultural? Obviously I know there are exceptions but it is always somewhat disconcerting to be in a concert where for every 20 men, there is only one woman. The same doesn't happen when you go to a pop, reggaeton or rap concert.


*All I can say is you and I move in different circles mate. *


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## Pat Fairlea (Dec 9, 2015)

I don't want to be part of a Twitter-style pile-on, but must say that the OP's experience and mine do not coincide. 

Though KreislerJr's comment about men being more likely to have a nerdy obsession certainly does! Let me tell you about the snail and slug species native to the British Isles..... :lol:


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## Aries (Nov 29, 2012)

Men and women are different, so you should expect such differences between the sexes. Women are the ones who give birth to children, suckle them and end up having much more to do with them. This gave a preference to practical capabilities for woman in the evolution compared the to more theoretical men.


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## larold (Jul 20, 2017)

_There is one more point, namely that women tend to be more socially conformist than men (for all kinds of bio/sociological/historical reasons but the very fact seems well established). So if a pursuit/hobby tends to alienate one from a peer crowd, women are less likely to pursue it to that extent._

On the right track though I think I'd state this another way.

Research consistently shows if you let a group of kindergartners out to do their own thing(s) the boys go off on their own and the girls form groups. This holds true throughout life as a guide to the sexes.

Chatting on internet classical music groups and collecting CDs and recordings tend to be individual, not group, pursuits. Those are things that are more likely going to interest men.

Playing in orchestras and/or singing in choirs is a group activity, perhaps the reason women are more well-represented there.

If record collecting was a group activity, such as a book or card or cooking club, I think you may see more women involved.


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## wkasimer (Jun 5, 2017)

KendrickThaibs said:


> In the Jazz, prog rock, experimental and classical music concerts that I have been to, the majority of the audience are men and only a few women.


Absolutely not true in Boston, at least in the classical scene (I'm not nearly as familiar with the other genres you mention).


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## Enthusiast (Mar 5, 2016)

Aries said:


> Men and women are different, so you should expect such differences between the sexes. Women are the ones who give birth to children, suckle them and end up having much more to do with them. This gave a preference to practical capabilities for woman in the evolution compared the to more theoretical men.


I also heard that men come from Mars and women from Venus. Seems unlikely to me, though.


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## Kreisler jr (Apr 21, 2021)

Enthusiast said:


> I also heard that men come from Mars and women from Venus. Seems unlikely to me, though.


They should not react as similarly to earth's atmosphere and gravity as the seem to, if this was true...


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## Kreisler jr (Apr 21, 2021)

Pat Fairlea said:


> Though KreislerJr's comment about men being more likely to have a nerdy obsession certainly does! Let me tell you about the snail and slug species native to the British Isles..... :lol:


Are you using slugs to outdo Gussie Fink-Nottle with his newts?


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## Becca (Feb 5, 2015)

Aries said:


> Men and women are different, so you should expect such differences between the sexes. Women are the ones who give birth to children, suckle them and end up having much more to do with them. This gave a preference to practical capabilities for woman in the evolution compared the to more theoretical men.


Are you saying that while the women were taking care of the children, the men were sitting around considering theoretical problems? If so, who were out hunting for the evening's dinner? The third gender? if this sounds sarcastic then you are correct, but then that's what the idea deserves.


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## Aries (Nov 29, 2012)

Becca said:


> Are you saying that while the women were taking care of the children, the men were sitting around considering theoretical problems? If so, who were out hunting for the evening's dinner?


The men were hunting and that is a technical task. Theorethical thinking about hunting strategies/weapons etc. was beneficial. Taking care of children is a more social task. Its more about connecting with humans.



Becca said:


> if this sounds sarcastic then you are correct, but then that's what the idea deserves.


You should reconsider that.


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## Becca (Feb 5, 2015)

Aries said:


> The men were hunting and that is a technical task. Theorethical thinking about hunting strategies/weapons etc. was beneficial. Taking care of children is a more social task. Its more about connecting with humans.
> 
> You should reconsider that.


Perhaps ... after I stop laughing.


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## Forster (Apr 22, 2021)

Aries said:


> Men and women are different


Yes



Aries said:


> so you should expect such differences between the sexes.


Yes, but that's just a repetition of what you've just said.



Aries said:


> Women are the ones who give birth to children


Yes



Aries said:


> suckle them


Yes, but men can and do bottle feed their children too.



Aries said:


> and end up having much more to do with them.


Often, yes, but not inevitably so. Men are just as capable of rearing children as women, though family circumstances can be so variable, it would be difficult to generalise for all families, all cultures.



Aries said:


> This gave a preference to practical capabilities for woman in the evolution compared the to more theoretical men.


How this follows from your preceding points, I don't know. And how this relates to the OP's assumption that women tend to be less interested in complex music I'm not sure either.

Surely, while the women were at home nattering and suckling, they had time to listen to complex music while the men were out hunting woolly mammoth...

er...something not quite right here...


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## Aries (Nov 29, 2012)

Forster said:


> Yes, but that's just a repetition of what you've just said.


No, I used overall differences to made a conclusion about specific differences.



Forster said:


> Yes, but men can and do bottle feed their children too.


There was no bottle during the most time of the human evolution. There was also no cattle breeding.



Forster said:


> Men are just as capable of rearing children as women


There is no reason to believe this regarding capability averages.



Forster said:


> How this follows from your preceding points, I don't know. And how this relates to the OP's assumption that women tend to be less interested in complex music I'm not sure either.


I assume the terms "practical" and "theoretical" are just confusing here.

Lets make it more concrete: Complex music is attractive to people with disposition for technical thinking in contrast to social, interpersonal thinking. The former was more beneficial for the hunting men in the evolution, the ladder was more beneficial for the child raising women in the evolution.


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## Knorf (Jan 16, 2020)

Aries said:


> Men and women are different, so you should expect such differences between the sexes. Women are the ones who give birth to children, suckle them and end up having much more to do with them. This gave a preference to practical capabilities for woman in the evolution compared the to more theoretical men.


You should be ashamed of yourself for writing this sexist drivel.


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## Aries (Nov 29, 2012)

Knorf said:


> You should be ashamed yourself for writing this sexist drivel.


Lol, sexist. I can't take that seriously.


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## Knorf (Jan 16, 2020)

Aries said:


> Lol, sexist. I can't take that seriously.


Quelle surprise.


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## Enthusiast (Mar 5, 2016)

> Lol, sexist. I can't take that seriously.


^ Interesting. Why? You don't think sexism exists? Or that it matters? Or is it that you just like to enjoy your masculine "privilege" and laugh at those who cannot?

Note to mods: time to move this thread to the political area.


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## Knorf (Jan 16, 2020)

Enthusiast said:


> Note to mods: time to move this thread to the political area.


Or just close it. The premise of the OP is invalid, and I see no reason why TC should encourage flagrant sexism.


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## Art Rock (Nov 28, 2009)

Closing sounds far more appealing, given that the connection with music is getting less and less clear.

*Closed (at least for now).*


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