# Things I Wonder ...



## guythegreg (Jun 15, 2012)

So do you have an opera obsession right now? One opera you're listening to day and night?

Or are you going from one to the next, like a butterfly in a garden?


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## sospiro (Apr 3, 2010)

guythegreg said:


> So do you have an opera obsession right now? One opera you're listening to day and night?
> 
> Or are you going from one to the next, like a butterfly in a garden?


:tiphat:

What a great idea for a thread!

I tend to listen obsessively & play the same one over & over & over again. I'm lucky that I can walk to work & back; it takes 40 minutes so that's 80 minutes listening five days a week. On Saturday mornings I watch a DVD while I do the ironing.

My current obsession is _L'amour des trois oranges_. I'm listening to this one:










and watching this










and have this on order










What about you _Greg_ - are you an obsessive or a butterfly?


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## myaskovsky2002 (Oct 3, 2010)

sospiro said:


> :tiphat:
> 
> What a great idea for a thread!
> 
> ...


This opera is so cute! But I was lucky, a French guy got me a DVD with this opera in RUSSIAN !!!!

Martin


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## sospiro (Apr 3, 2010)

myaskovsky2002 said:


> This opera is so cute! But I was lucky, a French guy got me a DVD with this opera in RUSSIAN !!!!
> 
> Martin




I forgot - I have a Russian version! It's part of a box set from Festival d'Aix-en-Provence. I don't watch it much but I do like the production.


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## guythegreg (Jun 15, 2012)

sospiro said:


> :tiphat:
> 
> I tend to listen obsessively & play the same one over & over & over again. I'm lucky that I can walk to work & back; it takes 40 minutes so that's 80 minutes listening five days a week. On Saturday mornings I watch a DVD while I do the ironing.
> 
> ...


Oh, I am definitely an obsessive - I get one opera in my head I can't get it out until a new one replaces it. Come chiodo scaccia chiodo, eh? Probably I didn't spell that right lol. I definitely should seek out that one, though, I went to a production lo these many years ago at Indiana University and all I remember is the music!


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## Dakota (Jun 30, 2012)

Yeah, often my favorite is what I saw most recently but I exercise my general obsession by streaming Operavore from WQXR all day in my office. Most of my co-workers don't react TOO negatively. :lol:


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## ComposerOfAvantGarde (Dec 2, 2011)

I have listened to Tristan und Isolde every day for the past few weeks. I think I'm just getting over it now. Will move on to *Ligeti's* Le Grand Macabre next.


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## MaestroViolinist (May 22, 2012)

ComposerOfAvantGarde said:


> I have listened to Tristan und Isolde every day for the past few weeks. I think I'm just getting over it now. Will move on to *Ligeti's* Le Grand Macabre next.


You're _finally_ getting over Tristan und Isolde? Took awhile.  :lol:


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## ComposerOfAvantGarde (Dec 2, 2011)

MaestroViolinist said:


> You're _finally_ getting over Tristan und Isolde? Took awhile.  :lol:


It took Couchie a year. I think I'll be listening to Le Grand Macabre ever day for longer than that though.


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## mamascarlatti (Sep 23, 2009)

I'm a butterfly, but i tend to stick to a period or compser for a while and listen to everything I can find by them. At the moment it's Handel (again!), before that Vivaldi but constrained by limited funds. I"m planning to up my collection when I have recovered financially from my trip to England.


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## guythegreg (Jun 15, 2012)

ComposerOfAvantGarde said:


> I have listened to Tristan und Isolde every day for the past few weeks. I think I'm just getting over it now. Will move on to *Ligeti's* Le Grand Macabre next.


Yay! Another obsessive!


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## ComposerOfAvantGarde (Dec 2, 2011)

guythegreg said:


> Yay! Another obsessive!


I've listened to it every day to the past week.


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## guythegreg (Jun 15, 2012)

mamascarlatti said:


> I'm a butterfly, but i tend to stick to a period or compser for a while and listen to everything I can find by them. At the moment it's Handel (again!), before that Vivaldi but constrained by limited funds. I"m planning to up my collection when I have recovered financially from my trip to England.


We had Rodelinda at the Met last fall. I was really impressed! I wasn't expecting much, but it was ... very operatic. I kind of missed the duets and the trios and sextets you get in later operas, but it was a very enjoyable experience.

Never tried a Vivaldi opera, but he's SUCH a good composer ... hard to imagine he wouldn't do a good job!


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## Dakota (Jun 30, 2012)

This might not be considered strictly opera but one of my big obsessions is Berlioz' La Mort de Cleopatre, I love that piece so much and tend to play it over and over and over. A few years ago I started trying to collect versions of it by everyone who sang it, have four so far: Veronique Gens, Jessye Norman, Janet Baker and Jennie Tourel (new to me). Looks like it is also recorded by Susan Graham, Violeta Urmana and maybe others; guess I need to get busy this weekend.


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## Couchie (Dec 9, 2010)

ComposerOfAvantGarde said:


> It took Couchie a year. I think I'll be listening to Le Grand Macabre ever day for longer than that though.


LOL I'm still not over it, started watching _Les Troyens _like a good boy the other night but was compelled to take it out and put in Barenboim _Tristan _and then watched the whole thing yet again.


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## joen_cph (Jan 17, 2010)

As regards opera, I am more of a butterfly (and as such certainly didn´t cause any hurricanes to happen), but buying the "Boris Godunov" with Melik Pasheev/George London the other day, I plan to compare it a bit with the collection´s other versions - Ermler/Nesterenko and Semkow/Christoff. It seems that Melik Pasheev/London is a bit fast, almost classicist, and that Nesterenko will remain a favourite ...


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## WolfAlphaX (May 7, 2012)

WHAT? Why didn't anyone tell me COAG was finally over Tristian and Isolde? I'm going to celebrate with some Rhachmaninoff piano concertos. Who's with me?


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## guythegreg (Jun 15, 2012)

joen_cph said:


> As regards opera, I am more of a butterfly (and as such certainly didn´t cause any hurricanes to happen), but buying the "Boris Godunov" with Melik Pasheev/George London the other day, I plan to compare it a bit with the collection´s other versions - Ermler/Nesterenko and Semkow/Christoff. It seems that Melik Pasheev/London is a bit fast, almost classicist, and that Nesterenko will remain a favourite ...


So, like mamascarlatti, you're concentrating in an area. I see. (nods thoughtfully). But ... how do you know you didn't cause a hurricane on the other side of the earth?

I have a copy of Boris Godunov but I don't listen to it. I don't get into Russian opera too much. I think it has a lot to do with the librettos, they don't seem built for singing, somehow. I get that with French too, sometimes ... it just seems like the words are out of touch with the music. Good idea for a thread ...


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## guythegreg (Jun 15, 2012)

WolfAlphaX said:


> WHAT? Why didn't anyone tell me COAG was finally over Tristian and Isolde? I'm going to celebrate with some Rhachmaninoff piano concertos. Who's with me?


False alarm, he's back into it ... hold thy horses ...


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## MAuer (Feb 6, 2011)

Aside from a long-term, incurable addication to _Fidelio_, I'm otherwise something of a butterfly. I like to listen to different operas, or sometimes to different recordings of the same opera (right now, it's _Idomeneo_).


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## guythegreg (Jun 15, 2012)

MAuer said:


> Aside from a long-term, incurable addication to _Fidelio_, I'm otherwise something of a butterfly. I like to listen to different operas, or sometimes to different recordings of the same opera (right now, it's _Idomeneo_).


I like Fidelio. I only have two, though, and I only listen to one, the Levine/Mattila version. I just love watching the maestro through the overture! And then the grand quartet, in the first act ... incomparable! Of course, if I had more versions, I'd probably think it was comparable ... lol


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## sospiro (Apr 3, 2010)

guythegreg said:


> I have a copy of Boris Godunov but I don't listen to it. I don't get into Russian opera too much. I think it has a lot to do with the librettos, they don't seem built for singing, somehow.


Boris is tricky, I agree, but try watching a DVD & once you can match the music with the story it flows better.

Only a suggestion, this forum has a reputation for bankrupting its members.


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## guythegreg (Jun 15, 2012)

Actually, my only copy IS a DVD ... the really expensive 2-DVD set with Christopher Lloyd as Boris! I get the story, I just ... I dunno. I love the fool, and I love the way the whole opera plays into the Russian self-conception as having good reasons to get weepy and drunk ... I can't help thinking though that the music could be a lot better. (Martin throws big rocks ...)


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## sospiro (Apr 3, 2010)

guythegreg said:


> Actually, my only copy IS a DVD ... the really expensive 2-DVD set with Christopher Lloyd as Boris! I get the story, I just ... I dunno. I love the fool, and I love the way the whole opera plays into the Russian self-conception as having good reasons to get weepy and drunk ... I can't help thinking though that the music could be a lot better.


Thank goodness we don't all like the same thing! Sorry don't mean to nag, I just love Boris, but then I love deep dark Russian voices 



guythegreg said:


> (Martin throws big rocks ...)


Just throw an old _La traviata_ back.


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## joen_cph (Jan 17, 2010)

guythegreg said:


> So, like mamascarlatti, you're concentrating in an area. I see. (nods thoughtfully). But ... how do you know you didn't cause a hurricane on the other side of the earth?


The opera world doesn´t seem to take any notice of my views anyway; Italian opera is thriving without me. But I can pick and choose from a vast, unaffected selection out there, which is good.



> I have a copy of Boris Godunov but I don't listen to it. I don't get into Russian opera too much. I think it has a lot to do with the librettos, they don't seem built for singing, somehow. I get that with French too, sometimes ... it just seems like the words are out of touch with the music. Good idea for a thread ...


Experts would have to be consulted .... but the musical ongoings and melodies in Russian operas are often inspired from Russian folk songs, so they must necessarily have a folksy vocal background, like those of Janacek, Dvorak and Janacek ? And Tchaikovsky wrote almost "Italian" arias, it seems to me ...


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## guythegreg (Jun 15, 2012)

Ooh! good one!


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## guythegreg (Jun 15, 2012)

joen_cph said:


> Experts would have to be consulted .... but the musical ongoings and melodies in Russian operas are often inspired from Russian folk songs, so they must necessarily have a folksy vocal background, like those of Janacek, Dvorak and Janacek ? And Tchaikovsky wrote almost "Italian" arias, it seems to me ...


That's interesting! You know, in Traviata, Giorgio Germont's arias seem extremely "country" to me, as though by their actual cadences Verdi was trying to portray Giorgio as a hick from the sticks. Have you heard Traviata?


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## ComposerOfAvantGarde (Dec 2, 2011)

WolfAlphaX said:


> WHAT? Why didn't anyone tell me COAG was finally over Tristian and Isolde? I'm going to celebrate with some Rhachmaninoff piano concertos. Who's with me?


Oh no, not you again.


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## WolfAlphaX (May 7, 2012)

Oh yes me again


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## joen_cph (Jan 17, 2010)

guythegreg said:


> That's interesting! You know, in Traviata, Giorgio Germont's arias seem extremely "country" to me, as though by their actual cadences Verdi was trying to portray Giorgio as a hick from the sticks. Have you heard Traviata?


I do have the Kleiber DG, actually own quite a lot of Italian ones, being a completist and since LP versions are so cheap here, but only remember a few bits. At their best however they do have some "verismo" quality of fight for social progress plus that of general Italian pastoralism, with a touch of "The Godfather" melodrama  - Will give it a check ...


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## Couchie (Dec 9, 2010)

WolfAlphaX said:


> WHAT? Why didn't anyone tell me COAG was finally over Tristian and Isolde? I'm going to celebrate with some Rhachmaninoff piano concertos. Who's with me?


You don't get over _Tristan und Isolde_, it gets over _you_. Unless.... it finds you worthy, at which you may stop listening to the music and simply _breathe it_, as it caresses your bosom, anticipates your senses, touches you where you need to be touched, lifts you beyond the void of everyday life into an eternity of bliss.


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## myaskovsky2002 (Oct 3, 2010)

sospiro said:


> I forgot - I have a Russian version! It's part of a box set from Festival d'Aix-en-Provence. I don't watch it much but I do like the production.


Please tell me where did you get this marvelous DVD. I didn't know that in Aix-in-Provence they sung in Russian, that's awesome!

Martin


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## sospiro (Apr 3, 2010)

myaskovsky2002 said:


> Please tell me where did you get this marvelous DVD. I didn't know that in Aix-in-Provence they sung in Russian, that's awesome!
> 
> Martin


Amazon.uk

They sing in the original language & chose to sing this in Russian.


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## myaskovsky2002 (Oct 3, 2010)

sospiro said:


> Amazon.uk
> 
> They sing in the original language & chose to sing this in Russian.


Well, I found it on amazon.com too finally, but it was very expensive. Probably is the same version I have and about other operas, I have them, except Britten's that I am less interested.

Thank you anyways

Martin


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## Hesoos (Jun 9, 2012)

Many years ago I listened always the same operas, Rigoletto, Nabucco, Macbeth, Aida, Attila, Traviata, Trovatore... I learnd from heart the arias and resitatives from Macbeth, I just was a crazy Verdi lover. I was capable to listen for many weeks only the Verdi's Macbeth and sing at the same time. Then I tried with Mozart, Rossini and Wagner. With Mozart I started the same way, for weeks I just listened to Don Giovanni or Così fan tutte. 

These days I'm a perfect butterfly, today I listened to some tracks from L'Orfeo and Giulio Cesare. In this week I've seen on DVD Don Carlo and Simon Boccanegra and listened on cd Tristan und Isolde and Lohengrin. Sometimes when I watch on dvd an opera, then I select the best arias or scenes and I listened to these on cd.


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## powerbooks (Jun 30, 2012)

Hesoos, just comment on your signature:


1813 - 2013 Verdi and Wagner 200 years 

You might have to add:

1913 - 2013 Benjamin Britten 100 years 

Quite a busy and competing year to come!


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## ComposerOfAvantGarde (Dec 2, 2011)

There's no such thing as Verdi *and* Wagner.


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## powerbooks (Jun 30, 2012)

ComposerOfAvantGarde said:


> There's no such thing as Verdi *and* Wagner.


There is a (not so good) book about it:

http://www.amazon.com/Verdi-Wagner-Two-Worlds-Centuries/dp/050051593X


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## ComposerOfAvantGarde (Dec 2, 2011)

powerbooks said:


> There is a (not so good) book about it:
> 
> http://www.amazon.com/Verdi-Wagner-Two-Worlds-Centuries/dp/050051593X
> 
> View attachment 6151


Haha I borrowed that from the library yesterday. I'm not sure if I'll read it though. I'm much more interested in the book about the history of socialism I that borrowed as well.


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## powerbooks (Jun 30, 2012)

ComposerOfAvantGarde said:


> Haha I borrowed that from the library yesterday. I'm not sure if I'll read it though. I'm much more interested in the book about the history of socialism I that borrowed as well.


You should read it and write a review for us here. I am not a good fast reader!


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## ComposerOfAvantGarde (Dec 2, 2011)

powerbooks said:


> You should read it and write a review for us here. I am not a good fast reader!


Well I think it does seem to be a very concise book about how socialism began and evolved throughout history. Has a good deal written on communism.

Geez do I have to write a review of a book about Verdi and/or Wagner? How about an essay on Maoism?


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## mamascarlatti (Sep 23, 2009)

ComposerOfAvantGarde said:


> There's no such thing as Verdi *and* Wagner.


There is for me.

AND Handel and Mozart and Monteverdi and Massenet and Prokofiev and Rossini and Britten and Birtwistle and Vivaldi and Donizetti and Tchaikovsky and Berlioz and SO ON.


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## Hesoos (Jun 9, 2012)

powerbooks said:


> Hesoos, just comment on your signature:
> 
> 1813 - 2013 Verdi and Wagner 200 years
> 
> ...


I like Verdi and Wagner. (More Verdi than Wagner, anyway)
When I want to listen to music, I ask myself: Today Verdi or Wagner?
Verdi and or or Wagner, depends on the sentence... :lol:

When I made up my signature I just was thinking on show my taste on opera. I didn't mention Britten because i'm not interested on Britten.
(I listened to Britten only once, The A Midsummer Night's Dream, was a bit boring for me, I only liked a fairy chorus in the begining of the opera if I remember. I mean, I don't like much Britten, but in the future I can try another opera.)


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## mamascarlatti (Sep 23, 2009)

Hesoos said:


> I like Verdi and Wagner. (More Verdi than Wagner, anyway)
> When I want to listen to music, I ask myself: Today Verdi or Wagner?
> Verdi and or or Wagner, depends on the sentence... :lol:
> 
> ...


I just came to Britten recently, but now the Turn of the Screw, Billy Budd, Peter Grimes and Albert Herring are among my favourite operas. As well as great music, Britten has some of the most interesting libretti in opera - comes from pillaging Henry James, Herman Melville, George Crabbe, and Guy de Maupassant for his plots.

Try this.










If you don't like the music much you can still enjoy the production as a film.


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## guythegreg (Jun 15, 2012)

Hesoos said:


> Many years ago I listened always the same operas, Rigoletto, Nabucco, Macbeth, Aida, Attila, Traviata, Trovatore... I learnd from heart the arias and resitatives from Macbeth, I just was a crazy Verdi lover. I was capable to listen for many weeks only the Verdi's Macbeth and sing at the same time. Then I tried with Mozart, Rossini and Wagner. With Mozart I started the same way, for weeks I just listened to Don Giovanni or Così fan tutte.
> 
> These days I'm a perfect butterfly, today I listened to some tracks from L'Orfeo and Giulio Cesare. In this week I've seen on DVD Don Carlo and Simon Boccanegra and listened on cd Tristan und Isolde and Lohengrin. Sometimes when I watch on dvd an opera, then I select the best arias or scenes and I listened to these on cd.


you loved MACBETH???!?!?!?! omg now i have to know why. I've probably bored everyone to death with my complaints about access, but really, I can't imagine anyone loving Macbeth. But please tell me why, and, as with Trovatore, you'll give me access!!


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## guythegreg (Jun 15, 2012)

ComposerOfAvantGarde said:


> Well I think it does seem to be a very concise book about how socialism began and evolved throughout history. Has a good deal written on communism.
> 
> Geez do I have to write a review of a book about Verdi and/or Wagner? How about an essay on Maoism?


How bout an essay on Maoism as viewed through the lens of Nixon in China? lol


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## sospiro (Apr 3, 2010)

guythegreg said:


> ... I can't imagine anyone loving Macbeth ...


 

My Macbeth Experience


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## powerbooks (Jun 30, 2012)

ComposerOfAvantGarde said:


> Well I think it does seem to be a very concise book about how socialism began and evolved throughout history. Has a good deal written on communism.
> 
> Geez do I have to write a review of a book about Verdi and/or Wagner? How about an essay on Maoism?


Don't feel pressured maestro. Just remember we all like to hear your opinion!


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## guythegreg (Jun 15, 2012)

sospiro said:


> My Macbeth Experience


Sorry! I only bring these things up in the hopes someone will tell me something that will get me closer ...


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## sospiro (Apr 3, 2010)

*added youtube*



guythegreg said:


> Sorry! I only bring these things up in the hopes someone will tell me something that will get me closer ...


Please don't apologise! There wouldn't be any opera if we all like the same thing.

I can't explain why I like it so much, wish I could.


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## Hesoos (Jun 9, 2012)

guythegreg said:


> you loved MACBETH???!?!?!?! omg now i have to know why. I've probably bored everyone to death with my complaints about access, but really, I can't imagine anyone loving Macbeth. But please tell me why, and, as with Trovatore, you'll give me access!!


It's a bit difficult to explain...a terror story with a beautiful music. The music is inseparable from the plot, terror music. the arias are wonderful, but the resitatives are at the same level, in the resitatives the orchestra dialogues with the characters about murders and ghosts, and describes lightings, the darkness, the heart. That music makes me imagine ghosts, witches... The Lady Macbeth's high notes go to the world of dead....Before Rigoletto that was the most beloved own work for Verdi, sure for the public perhaps that opera was too dark.

That's my favorite scene. In the video begins at the minute 3.50 Lady Macbeth waits for her husband that he kills the king, she describes the horror from the night, then Macbeth returns and explain how all went with the duetto "o fatal mia donna"


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## Hesoos (Jun 9, 2012)

Another of the highlights of this opera, better perhaps than the last, the Banquo ghost's scene, at the minute 1.00 of the video:
Just a wonderful terror music!!


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## Aksel (Dec 3, 2010)

guythegreg said:


> you loved MACBETH???!?!?!?! omg now i have to know why. I've probably bored everyone to death with my complaints about access, but really, I can't imagine anyone loving Macbeth. But please tell me why, and, as with Trovatore, you'll give me access!!


Macbeth is AWESOME! I agree there are some rather horrible moments (most of the witches' music, for instance, and the ballet is just weird), but Lady M's arias are SO GOOD! How can one not love a cabaletta like Or tutti sorgete?


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## guythegreg (Jun 15, 2012)

Hesoos said:


> It's a bit difficult to explain...a terror story with a beautiful music. The music is inseparable from the plot, terror music. the arias are wonderful, but the resitatives are at the same level, in the resitatives the orchestra dialogues with the characters about murders and ghosts, and describes lightings, the darkness, the heart. That music makes me imagine ghosts, witches... The Lady Macbeth's high notes go to the world of dead....Before Rigoletto that was the most beloved own work for Verdi, sure for the public perhaps that opera was too dark.
> 
> That's my favorite scene. In the video begins at the minute 3.50 Lady Macbeth waits for her husband that he kills the king, she describes the horror from the night, then Macbeth returns and explain how all went with the duetto "o fatal mia donna"


OMG Hesoos that was WONDERFUL!! geez, you guys are costing me money. I'm going to have to get this DVD now. lol Shirley Verrett's grins, as she comforts Macbeth, are just priceless. "But look at the bright side!" she's saying. And Piero Cappuccilli was one of the real greats, wasn't he? I'll never forget his "Orrenda orrenda pace! LA PACE DE SEPULCHRE!!!" from Don Carlos ...


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## Hesoos (Jun 9, 2012)

I have only 2 cd's from Macbeth:

That was my first, and I didn't know then , but it's the first version without ballet. The final is a little different. Is a live version and the sound is not so great but is the version that sounds more scary. Carlo Cossutta and Christa Ludwig sounds nice. Perhaps the best is the conducting, Carl Böhm.









That's my other cd, with Cappuccili and Verrett. I usually listen to it, Verrett is the best Lady Macbeth ever.









There are recordings with Callas as Lady Macbeth, sounds great, but Verrett is better for me.

My VHS was with Renato Bruson, and Zampieri. Bruson is for me the best Verdi's king (best Nabucco and best Macbeth). I can't anymore watch this because I don't have anymore VHS lector, I need to buy it on dvd.









I have 2 more videos in dvd, but they are not nice...one with Hampson and Marrocu, and the other with bad singers (no in the image)


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## Hesoos (Jun 9, 2012)

I need to buy this!!!! The movie version with Nucci and the wonderful Verrett:

http://www.amazon.com/Verdi-Macbeth-Leo-Nucci/dp/B000UVLJK4/ref=sr_1_2?s=music&ie=UTF8&qid=1342111091&sr=1-2&keywords=macbeth+dvd+1987



















Verrett in the sleepwalking scene is fantastic, the high notes travels to another world, is like a ghost singing...


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## Hesoos (Jun 9, 2012)

guythegreg said:


> OMG Hesoos that was WONDERFUL!! geez, you guys are costing me money. I'm going to have to get this DVD now. lol Shirley Verrett's grins, as she comforts Macbeth, are just priceless. "But look at the bright side!" she's saying. And Piero Cappuccilli was one of the real greats, wasn't he? I'll never forget his "Orrenda orrenda pace! LA PACE DE SEPULCHRE!!!" from Don Carlos ...


I'm so glad if you would like Macbeth, Guythegreg!!! Verrett is the best Macbeth for sure (better than Callas), Cappuccilli is great yes, but I like more Bruson. Thanks for asking about Macbeth!!


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## Aksel (Dec 3, 2010)

The Muti one with Fiorenza Cossotto! Cossotto sounds completely insane right from the get-go. The first iteration of 'Vieni t'affretta' turns me cold in my very core. Also, the high notes are to die for. In a kind of perverse 'ohmygodisshegonnacrack?' way.


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## sospiro (Apr 3, 2010)

Hesoos said:


> I'm so glad if you would like Macbeth, Guythegreg!!! Verrett is the best Macbeth for sure (better than Callas), Cappuccilli is great yes, but I like more Bruson. Thanks for asking about Macbeth!!


Well there we must disagree 

Greg - this is the best CD & is complete with the ballet which is beautiful music. Milnes & Raimondi are incomparable.










and this is the best DVD, the subject of my 'Experience' aka obsession


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## Hesoos (Jun 9, 2012)

Aksel said:


> The Muti one with Fiorenza Cossotto! Cossotto sounds completely insane right from the get-go. The first iteration of 'Vieni t'affretta' turns me cold in my very core. Also, the high notes are to die for. In a kind of perverse 'ohmygodisshegonnacrack?' way.


Hey!!! Awsome!!! You are right!!! After listening this video with Cossotto I agree with you Aksel and Sospiro. Years ago I listened some radio programs about Macbeth, Callas and Verrett, and I decided that Verrett was the best...Is there any Macbeth dvd with Cossotto, is this you tube video from some dvd?


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## Aksel (Dec 3, 2010)

Hesoos said:


> Hey!!! Awsome!!! You are right!!! After listening this video with Cossotto I agree with you Aksel and Sospiro. Years ago I listened some radio programs about Macbeth, Callas and Verrett, and I decided that Verrett was the best...Is there any Macbeth dvd with Cossotto, is this you tube video from some dvd?


No. It's from a broadcast RAI, the Italian public television network did in the 70's or 80's where they got the singers (or in certain cases actors) to lip-sync over their own recordings. There is a Turandot with Nilsson and Corelli that was done the same way. Don't think there are commercial tapes of it, although there are probably pirates aplenty.

But the recording is quite sensational. As is the Met live (I think) recording with Leonie Rysanek as Lady M and Leonard Warren as the Thane himself. Erich Leinsdorf is in the pit. And the witches are particularly hammy.


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## Hesoos (Jun 9, 2012)

Aksel said:


> No. It's from a broadcast RAI, the Italian public television network did in the 70's or 80's where they got the singers (or in certain cases actors) to lip-sync over their own recordings. There is a Turandot with Nilsson and Corelli that was done the same way. Don't think there are commercial tapes of it, although there are probably pirates aplenty.
> 
> But the recording is quite sensational. As is the Met live (I think) recording with Leonie Rysanek as Lady M and Leonard Warren as the Thane himself. Erich Leinsdorf is in the pit. And the witches are particularly hammy.


What a shame!  I'm looking for a good Macbeth dvd and I thinked, after listening your video, that one with Cossotto would be the best. Perhaps I keep the idea of buying the film version 1987 with Verrett...


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## sospiro (Apr 3, 2010)

Hesoos said:


> What a shame!  I'm looking for a good Macbeth dvd and I thinked, after listening your video, that one with Cossotto would be the best. Perhaps I keep the idea of buying the film version 1987 with Verrett...


No, no, no!! 

You *must* get the Keenlyside. Liudmyla Monastyrska, who was a late replacement for Micaela Carosi in _Aida_, is jaw-droppingly exciting. Review


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## Aksel (Dec 3, 2010)

Hesoos said:


> What a shame!  I'm looking for a good Macbeth dvd and I thinked, after listening your video, that one with Cossotto would be the best. Perhaps I keep the idea of buying the film version 1987 with Verrett...


As far as Macbeth DVD's go, I've only seen a few (not the new ROH one, regrettably), but I can recommend the 2008 Met one with Lucic and Guleghina. Although it is not as well-sung as other versions, it's a striking production, and Maria Guleghina makes a very memorable Lady Macbeth, although her voice is sort of shot to hell and beyond, wobble and all. Dramatically, she is most excellent. Also, you know, she sings Or tutti sorgete whilst rolling around on the floor, which is, you know, seriously impressive. It all works in the end. Also, the witches are totally fab.
As one would expect, there is no video of the performance on the Youtubes.

But here is something else from the same production:


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## sospiro (Apr 3, 2010)

Aksel said:


> As far as Macbeth DVD's go, I've only seen a few (not the new ROH one, regrettably), but I can recommend the 2008 Met one with Lucic and Guleghina. Although it is not as well-sung as other versions, it's a striking production, and Maria Guleghina makes a very memorable Lady Macbeth, although her voice is sort of shot to hell and beyond, wobble and all. Dramatically, she is most excellent. Also, you know, she sings Or tutti sorgete whilst rolling around on the floor, which is, you know, seriously impressive. It all works in the end. Also, the witches are totally fab.
> As one would expect, there is no video of the performance on the Youtubes.
> 
> But here is something else from the same production:


Love John Relyea's Banco in this. Much better than Raymond Aceto's in *my* Macbeth.


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## guythegreg (Jun 15, 2012)

Note to self: must do VERY MUCH LISTENING tomorrow am lol


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## mamascarlatti (Sep 23, 2009)

Hesoos said:


> What a shame!  I'm looking for a good Macbeth dvd and I thinked, after listening your video, that one with Cossotto would be the best. Perhaps I keep the idea of buying the film version 1987 with Verrett...


Here is my review of the Verrett/Nucci one


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## Aksel (Dec 3, 2010)

And here is my review of the 2008 Met production.


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## guythegreg (Jun 15, 2012)

> There's masculine, there's virile & then there's Samuel Ramey stripped to his navel and singing like a God.


Boy (sospiro) you hit that one right on the head!


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## guythegreg (Jun 15, 2012)

Well, after a morning spent listening to all these videos, in an orgy of MACBETH LOVE, I have to say: I was wrong. Macbeth is great. I must go buy two DVD productions and two CD productions (since obviously I can't be without Verrett or Cossotto, and I must have both Cappuccilli and Keenlyside!

I don't understand it though. I went to an HD rebroadcast of the Lucic/Guleghina production, and didn't hear ANY of that music. In addition to which I didn't see any of her great acting. How is that possible? Rhetorical question, please don't answer.)

You guys are great.


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## Aksel (Dec 3, 2010)

I guess being a Guleghina fan takes a certain kind of crazy ...


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## sospiro (Apr 3, 2010)

guythegreg said:


> Well, after a morning spent listening to all these videos, in an orgy of MACBETH LOVE, I have to say: I was wrong. Macbeth is great. I must go buy two DVD productions and two CD productions (since obviously I can't be without Verrett or Cossotto, and I must have both Cappuccilli and Keenlyside!
> 
> I don't understand it though. I went to an HD rebroadcast of the Lucic/Guleghina production, and didn't hear ANY of that music. In addition to which I didn't see any of her great acting. How is that possible? Rhetorical question, please don't answer.)


It's unusual to release a DVD of the same production but with a different cast but that's what they did with the Phyllida Lloyd. Simon's is the best of course. 










This is the same production from 2005 but with Carlos Álvarez as Macbeth, Maria Guleghina as Lady Macbeth & Roberto Scandiuzzi as Banco.












guythegreg said:


> You guys are great.


You may want to review your opinion when your credit card bill comes in


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## guythegreg (Jun 15, 2012)

Aksel said:


> I guess being a Guleghina fan takes a certain kind of crazy ...


I actually loved Guleghina in her Pique Dame ... her performance and her duet with ... I forget the name of the contralto ... Borodina? just gorgeous, though


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## Hesoos (Jun 9, 2012)

mamascarlatti said:


> I just came to Britten recently, but now the Turn of the Screw, Billy Budd, Peter Grimes and Albert Herring are among my favourite operas. As well as great music, Britten has some of the most interesting libretti in opera - comes from pillaging Henry James, Herman Melville, George Crabbe, and Guy de Maupassant for his plots.
> 
> Try this.
> 
> ...


I borrowed from my library the only version that there is in there, the Opera Australia one with Hannan, Haggart, Austin and Dixon. Your recomandation seems to be better but is too risky spend money if you are unsure. Today I saw this opera.
This opera is so original and the libretto is great, but the music... I'm confused... some parts are nice (Act1, scene 6 the lesson "malo, malo", Act2 scenes 2, 3, 6 the bells, miss Jessel, and the Piano). The duet or scene when the ghost of Miss Jessel is in the desk arguing with the governess is wonderful and scary.
I'm confused about the music because it sounds so new or strange to me (I'm stuck in the Romantic operas) but I think somehow I liked it. There are very few instruments in the orchestra. My first experience with the A midsummer night's dream was boring (I listened to it with the libretto, without dvd). I think I want to try a little more Britten, I'd borrow the Peter Grimes. Perhaps I buy then my own dvds.
Thanks a lot for the recommendation! It was worth it!

Anyone could explain the mean of the title "The turn of the screw"? English is not my mother tongue, is it some kind of expression?


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## guythegreg (Jun 15, 2012)

Hesoos said:


> Anyone could explain the mean of the title "The turn of the screw"? English is not my mother tongue, is it some kind of expression?


"turn of the screw" refers to how much worse the horror is when it's children that are the source, I think ... "as the screw turns" on your psyche, so to speak ...


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## Hesoos (Jun 9, 2012)

Talking of Macbeth again... 
Anyone knows the Macbeth dvd with Paskalis and Barstow?

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Verdi-Macbeth-DVD-Kostos-Paskalis/dp/B0007ORDNG/ref=pd_cp_d_h__2

EO]This version has fantastic costumes and settings. Anyway, I think that the Pappano version is worth it (thanks Sospiro), but the production is a bit poor... I saw only the duet from Pappano version on Youtube, I am wrong?


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## Hesoos (Jun 9, 2012)

guythegreg said:


> "turn of the screw" refers to how much worse the horror is when it's children that are the source, I think ... "as the screw turns" on your psyche, so to speak ...


Thanks a lot Guythegreg !!!
Sure the title describes very well what kind of story is in it.


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## sospiro (Apr 3, 2010)

Hesoos said:


> Talking of Macbeth again...
> Anyone knows the Macbeth dvd with Paskalis and Barstow?
> 
> http://www.amazon.co.uk/Verdi-Macbeth-DVD-Kostos-Paskalis/dp/B0007ORDNG/ref=pd_cp_d_h__2
> ...


I don't know this version, sorry.



Hesoos said:


> Anyway, I think that the Pappano version is worth it (thanks Sospiro), but the production is a bit poor... I saw only the duet from Pappano version on Youtube, I am wrong?


I apologise but I'm hopelessly biased towards the Pappano/Keenlyside version & I can't find anything wrong with it at all.  I had a wonderful few weeks going to all sorts of Macbeth stuff & it was such a magical time for me that I'm looking at it through rose-tinted spectacles.

It could be absolute rubbish for all I know.


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## mamascarlatti (Sep 23, 2009)

Hesoos said:


> I'm confused about the music because it sounds so new or strange to me (I'm stuck in the Romantic operas) but I think somehow I liked it. There are very few instruments in the orchestra. My first experience with the A midsummer night's dream was boring (I listened to it with the libretto, without dvd). I think I want to try a little more Britten, I'd borrow the Peter Grimes. Perhaps I buy then my own dvds.
> Thanks a lot for the recommendation! It was worth it!


I think you are right about the music, that is how I felt when I first heard it, but now that I have listened much more to Britten I love it.

You can see Peter Grimes in its entirety on YouTube before you make a decision. I liked this production so much I went out and bought the DVD. Here is the first part.


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## mamascarlatti (Sep 23, 2009)

sospiro said:


> I apologise but I'm hopelessly biased towards the Pappano/Keenlyside version & I can't find anything wrong with it at all.  I had a wonderful few weeks going to all sorts of Macbeth stuff & it was such a magical time for me that I'm looking at it through rose-tinted spectacles.
> 
> It could be absolute rubbish for all I know.


I think experiencing it live makes a huge difference to one's appreciation of a particular production.

Not to mention that I somehow get a feeling that you might have a slight penchant for Mr Keenlyside.


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## sospiro (Apr 3, 2010)

mamascarlatti said:


> I think experiencing it live makes a huge difference to one's appreciation of a particular production.


True. If the McVicar _Troyens_ DVD is awful, I would still think it was fabulous.



mamascarlatti said:


> Not to mention that I somehow get a feeling that you might have a slight penchant for Mr Keenlyside.


Slight?? :lol:


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## guythegreg (Jun 15, 2012)

sospiro said:


> I had a wonderful few weeks going to all sorts of Macbeth stuff & it was such a magical time for me that I'm looking at it through rose-tinted spectacles.
> 
> It could be absolute rubbish for all I know.


Not rubbish. I picked up the Keenlyside version on Saturday - along with Nucci/Verrett and Cappuccilli/Verrett - and watched the Keenlyside Saturday night and it was GREAT. If I'd been in London I would have gone to EVERY PERFORMANCE!!

I would say that Monastyrska is awfully YOUNG for Lady Macbeth. But she didn't overact nearly as much as she might have, and her singing, I thought, was very good. But the production, the show, it all just hung together and supported the concept so well, I was really delighted. What's odd is how different the Nucci/Verrett version is - I watched that one Sunday night - and they both hang together equally well and support the same concept of the show, maybe there's really no end to the number of wonderful different productions of a show you can have and think are wonderful.

But anyway, good job Annie!!


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## sospiro (Apr 3, 2010)

guythegreg said:


> Not rubbish. I picked up the Keenlyside version on Saturday - along with Nucci/Verrett and Cappuccilli/Verrett - and watched the Keenlyside Saturday night and it was GREAT. If I'd been in London I would have gone to EVERY PERFORMANCE!!


I'm so pleased you liked it. Everyone has such different tastes & I'm usually reluctant to recommend anything.

Live opera is _so_ addictive! I read a lovely interview with tenor Giuseppe Filianoti in which he said



> I live with the knowledge that what I do is something intangible and at the same time indescribable. Opera is like the sound that the singer makes; as soon as it appears, it vanishes into the air. So the pleasure of singing brings with it the longing for the next time when you will be able express yourself in song.


I find that statement so poetic & it describes perfectly how I feel as a fan. Each time I come out of the opera house, there's the longing to hear it again.



guythegreg said:


> I would say that Monastyrska is awfully YOUNG for Lady Macbeth. But she didn't overact nearly as much as she might have, and her singing, I thought, was very good. But the production, the show, it all just hung together and supported the concept so well, I was really delighted. What's odd is how different the Nucci/Verrett version is - I watched that one Sunday night - and they both hang together equally well and support the same concept of the show, maybe there's really no end to the number of wonderful different productions of a show you can have and think are wonderful.
> 
> But anyway, good job Annie!!


I think I might get the Nucci/Verrett version just to compare.


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