# Beethoven String quartett op.130 (Cavatine) - set for orchestra



## gprengel (Dec 21, 2015)

As I have set Beethoven's last 3 piano sonatas for orchestra, I tried to do the same with some of his late string quartetts. Here the famous Cavatina from stringquartett in Bb op. 130 which become now in a sense a new symphonic Beethovenian Adagio  :

http://www.gerdprengel.de/Beeth-op130-Cavatine-orch.mp3
http://www.gerdprengel.de/Beeth_op130_cavatine_orch.pdf

I don't know about you, but I think it just sounds wonderful... 
Beethoven said he could not think of this movement without shedding a tear...

Gerd


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## ibrahim (Apr 29, 2017)

Well this work has been often set for orchestra. By professional musicians and famous conductors.


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## hpowders (Dec 23, 2013)

Why destroy the intention of a deliberately intimate piece written for four instruments, by transcribing it for a large ensemble?

You know what? If Beethoven wanted a transcription of the Cavatina for full orchestra, he would have written one.

I mean come on now. He was no dummy!

Beethoven's music certainly doesn't need this kind of "help".


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## Bettina (Sep 29, 2016)

hpowders said:


> Why destroy the intention of a deliberately intimate piece written for four instruments, by transcribing it for a large ensemble?
> 
> You know what? If Beethoven wanted a transcription of the Cavatina for full orchestra, he would have written one.
> 
> ...


I don't think gprengel sees it as an improvement, but just as another way of experiencing the piece. I don't know if Beethoven would have minded too much. He often authorized transcriptions of his works (and he made some transcriptions himself). I'll be sure to ask him if I ever manage to get my hands on a time machine!


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## gprengel (Dec 21, 2015)

to my knowledge it has been arranged only for string orchestra, but I love it with the colours of woodwinds


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## hpowders (Dec 23, 2013)

Bettina said:


> I don't think gprengel sees it as an improvement, but just as another way of experiencing the piece. I don't know if Beethoven would have minded too much. He often authorized transcriptions of his works (and he made some transcriptions himself). I'll be sure to ask him if I ever manage to get my hands on a time machine!


Beethoven would side with me, a TC Premium Member....especially when he sees how many sets of his complete Cavatina-less, full orchestra interpretations of his symphonies I've got.


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## Manxfeeder (Oct 19, 2010)

Bettina said:


> I don't think gprengel sees it as an improvement, but just as another way of experiencing the piece.


That's how I see it as well. And as a fan of orchestral color, I think it is lovely. It would sound even better with a live ensemble.


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## KenOC (Mar 7, 2011)

Bettina said:


> I don't know if Beethoven would have minded too much. He often authorized transcriptions of his works (and he made some transcriptions himself).


Early on Beethoven wrote his publisher claiming that the greater composers ("such as myself" he didn't need to add) were the only ones who could properly arrange their own works. However, he did authorize arrangements by others and did a lot of them himself as well, usually with excellent results.

The last work of his own he arranged was the piano four-hand version of the Grosse Fuge. He had let the publisher give it to somebody else to arrange, but he didn't like the results and redid it himself at a very small charge.


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## hpowders (Dec 23, 2013)

I would place all these orchestral transcriptions of the Cavatina in the same category as spray painting a wall with meaningless garbage.

Just because one's name may have been Leonard Bernstein doesn't mean an orchestral transcription of an imtimate piece for string quartet wasn't misguided.

If Beethoven saw a viable alternative for orchestra, he would have written a transcription himself.

Any orchestral transcription of the Cavatina is doomed to tamper with the intimate mood, and I thusly must consider to be musical graffiti. Misguided, in my opinion.


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## Bettina (Sep 29, 2016)

hpowders said:


> I would place all these orchestral transcriptions of the Cavatina in the same category as spray painting a wall with meaningless garbage.
> 
> Just because one's name may have been Leonard Bernstein doesn't mean an orchestral transcription of an imtimate piece for string quartet wasn't misguided.
> 
> ...


I definitely share your love of the Cavatina and its intimate mood. But I'm not as strongly opposed to transcriptions as you are. Perhaps I've been corrupted by too much Liszt, but I actually enjoy some transcriptions (including this one).


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## hpowders (Dec 23, 2013)

Bettina said:


> I definitely share your love of the Cavatina and its intimate mood. But I'm not as strongly opposed to transcriptions as you are. Perhaps I've been corrupted by too much Liszt, but I actually enjoy some transcriptions (including this one).


I am speaking soul-ly for myself.


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## DaveM (Jun 29, 2015)

hpowders said:


> I am speaking soul-ly for myself.


Well, not really. You're saying that there's no need for it to exist at all..for anybody.


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## Pugg (Aug 8, 2014)

> I don't know about you, but I think it just sounds wonderful...
> Beethoven said he could not think of this movement without shedding a tear...
> 
> Gerd


The tear part is a bit to far for me but indeed sounds wonderful.


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## gprengel (Dec 21, 2015)

Pugg said:


> The tear part is a bit to far for me but indeed sounds wonderful.


Well, for those who liked my orchestration, you may like also the short movements 2 and 4 of this gorgeous string quartett:

http://www.gerdprengel.de/Beeth-op130-2-orch.mp3

http://www.gerdprengel.de/Beeth-op130-4-orch.mp3
http://www.gerdprengel.de/Beeth-op130-4-orch.pdf

Gerd


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## DaveM (Jun 29, 2015)

I finally found some time to listen to your transcription of the op130's Cavatina, one of the greatest string quartet movements up there in the rarified atmosphere with Grosse Fugue (and a few others) although the two evoke very different emotions. I was very moved by your transcription because it struck me as an expression of someone who loves the work and was treating it with great care.

My guess is that you are getting better at this very quickly and wonder what you might accomplish with this work a year from now. Orchestrating is not for the faint of heart and you are showing a real talent/aptitude for it.

Incidentally, regarding the premise that Beethoven would have written an orchestral transcription for the Cavatina if he had thought it appropriate: Beethoven would have written one if someone paid him enough to do it. In fact, the op 130 #13 quartet was one of the 3 late quartets (along with 12 & 15) that were commissioned by Nikolai Galitizine and which Beethoven, in spite of bad health, desperately worked to complete because of financial need.


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## DaveM (Jun 29, 2015)

Hmm, this sounds familiar. I guess the Cavatina transcription was created some time ago.


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## eugeneonagain (May 14, 2017)

It's not a string quartet movement of Beethoven's I particularly like, but I salute anyone who takes on the task of arranging it for small orchestra. It's not an easy task to expand a piece for a larger ensemble whilst retaining the essence of the original.

Mr hpowders, why are you so forcefully rubbishing gprengel's efforts?


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## mathisdermaler (Mar 29, 2017)

Good, now transcribe the Grosse Fuge for four recorders.


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