# Error in orchestration?



## David Phillips (Jun 26, 2017)

Emmanuel Chabrier, who composed the brilliantly orchestrated Espana, begins his Suite Pastorale with three long notes on the triangle played _piano_. An odd way to start a piece you might think, and the composer wasn't to know that a hundred years hence most of his fans would be listening to his music at home where, unless the volume is turned up high, it's hard to tell that the piece has actually begun.
Jean Martinon solves the problem in his 1948 recording by having the triangle played _mezzo-forte_.


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## mbhaub (Dec 2, 2016)

Well, this happens a lot - especially in the old days before digital recording. Back then microphones weren't as sensitive, and really quiet playing was often swallowed up by the surface noise or tape hiss. The dynamic range of LPs was much narrower than the cd. So it was common to turn volume up either with a knob or a instrumental dynamic level so it would record. In a good hall, that p in a triangle part would be clearly audible. Chabrier was one of the most meticulous and detailed composers and orchestrators who ever lived - this is no mistake.


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## Larkenfield (Jun 5, 2017)

I question whether it’s an error in orchestration. According to the score, the triangle not only begins the piece but also reoccurs in other parts of the Suite. The dynamics of this particular recording sounds about right to me because the triangle is marked piano (p) in the beginning and the entrance of the pizzicato in the strings is marked pianissimo (pp). That sounds like what Martinon did in the recording because the strings sound quieter than the triangle if one listens carefully. In other words, the triangle was actually playing piano (p), was slightly louder, in relationship to the strings (pp), as marked in Chabrier’s score, deliberately so, it seems, and those dynamic markings were being followed accurately and faithfully by Martinon.


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## David Phillips (Jun 26, 2017)

mbhaub said:


> Well, this happens a lot - especially in the old days before digital recording. Back then microphones weren't as sensitive, and really quiet playing was often swallowed up by the surface noise or tape hiss. The dynamic range of LPs was much narrower than the cd. So it was common to turn volume up either with a knob or a instrumental dynamic level so it would record. In a good hall, that p in a triangle part would be clearly audible. Chabrier was one of the most meticulous and detailed composers and orchestrators who ever lived - this is no mistake.


There's no problem with a live performance, you can see the conductor cue the triangle player, you can watch the guy play his three notes. It is different at home with no visual clues. I must have a dozen recordings of the Suite Pastorale and in most of them the triangle is inaudible. I sit there with ears cocked waiting for those three tings, and then the strings come in!


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## mbhaub (Dec 2, 2016)

Could it be a combination of your ears, the recordings, the playback equipment? I know that as I'm getting older I don't hear high pitches as well as I used too. Even for things like timpani I don't hear all the overtones like I used too. That's a good thing sometimes.


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## David Phillips (Jun 26, 2017)

mbhaub said:


> Could it be a combination of your ears, the recordings, the playback equipment? I know that as I'm getting older I don't hear high pitches as well as I used too. Even for things like timpani I don't hear all the overtones like I used too. That's a good thing sometimes.


I bought Ansermet's recording of Suite Pastorale 40 years ago and I couldn't hear the triangle there either! I still think beginning this lovely piece with a solo triangle was a creative mistake - like starting a great symphony with a swanee whistle. In a talk he gave on radio in 1957, RVW made an interesting point about the beginning of Elgar's Symphony No.1:

'In the introduction to Elgar's First Symphony, the melody is given to fairly heavy woodwind and violas. The violoncellos and double basses play the bass _detache_, while the inner harmony is left to two soft muted horns. Well, I think if a student had brought this score into any composition teacher, he'd have put the blue pencil through it and said, "This will not be heard." And to my mind, when I look at it still, it looks all wrong, but it sounds all right. Here indeed we have a mystery and a miracle.'


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