# Duplication



## Chris (Jun 1, 2010)

Today I was listening to a Poulenc CD I bought last week. The first work was the Concerto for Two Pianos in D minor. Shortly into the first movement the music became familiar. It was the same as the composer's own sextet for piano and wind, the only difference being the instrumentation. Now.....I have no objection to a composer quoting his own work, but this was a major cut and paste job. I also have no objection to a composer transcribing his own work for other instruments (e.g. creating piano versions of orchestral pieces) because that is above board. This re-use felt rather underhand. As it happens I do not have a CD of the Poulenc sextet, but if I had, I think I would have felt short changed on listening to this latest CD. A little like my ISP charging me twice for the same month's broadband usage.

How do others feel about this sort of duplication? More tolerant? And can anyone name other examples of compositional recycling?


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## Delicious Manager (Jul 16, 2008)

It has happened since time immemorial. Poulenc was particularly fond of quoting himself and various little phrases (and sometimes more) can be heard shared between two or more works. I don't have a problem with it at all. In days gone by, when composers were considered little more than talented servants required to churn-out vast quantities of music to a strict timetable, this kind of self-borrowing was essential to be able to fulfill their obligations. Vivaldi, Bach and Handel all did it regularly, Mozart wrote an entire cantata, _Davidde penitente_, based on the existing parts of the C minor Mass, while later composers such as Rossini and Charles Ives were not adverse to a bit of musical recycling.


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## emiellucifuge (May 26, 2009)

The third movement of Berio's Sinfonia is built entirely on quotations.


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## tdc (Jan 17, 2011)

Ive also noticed movements from J.S. Bach's Mass in B minor showing up in his cantatas, as well as a couple 'cut and paste' jobs as you've termed it in Joaquin Rodrigo concertos. I think as mentioned it happens all over the board, certainly much better than cut and paste jobs ripped off from other artists! (Which Im sure probably has happened a time or two as well!).


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## Pieck (Jan 12, 2011)

Concerto for 4 harpsichords\ violins. Bach barely wrote something of his own in this concerto. (taken from Vivaldi)


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## Almaviva (Aug 13, 2010)

Rossini used to recycle a lot of his own music in order to churn out more operas faster and make more money. Probably the best know example is _Le Comte Ory_, which extensively borrows material from _Il Viaggio a Reims _to the point that it is almost the same music, with a totally different plot.


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## Sid James (Feb 7, 2009)

I was listening to the radio where a current rock musician was talking of a similar kind of thing - when musicians unconsciously "copy" another artist's ideas or phrases. He said it's only when he listens to fresh playbacks of his own recordings that he realises that he has done this. I think the issue here is the compositional process. Prolific composers like Poulenc, or Milhaud, Martinu or Hovhaness probably didn't like to revise, they just composed a piece & that was basically it. So if they inadvertendly "quoted" themselves, it must have fell under the radar. I never get a sense of this happening with more fastidious composers like Berg, Durufle, Kodaly or Varese. Each of their (few) works are worlds unto themselves, they were not able to "duplicate" another work because of the way in which they worked. That's what it all boils down to, I think...


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