# The Stoic History of Indian Classical Music



## Lukecash12 (Sep 21, 2009)

And awaaay we go!



> The Indus Valley Civilization
> 
> Little is known of the musical culture of the Indus Valley civilization of the 3rd and 2nd millennia BC. Some musical instruments, such as the arched or bow-shaped harp and several varieties of drums, have been identified from the small terracotta figures and from the pictographs on the seals that were probably used by merchants. Further, the famous bronze statuette of a dancing girl, probably representing a class of temple dancers, clearly indicates the presence of music.
> 
> Evidence of Rudra-worship during this period has also been found. Rudra was later to become popular as Shiva- the supreme deity of dance, drama and music.


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## Lukecash12 (Sep 21, 2009)

And the saga continues:



> Vedic Literature
> 
> The Indus Valley civilization died with the arrival of the Aryans, who descended into India from the northwest in the first half of the 2nd millennium BC. An important aspect of Aryan religious life was the bard-priest who composed hymns, in praise of the gods, to be sung or chanted at sacrifices. This tradition was continued in the Aryans' new home in northern India until a sizable body of oral religious poetry had been composed.
> 
> ...


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## Lukecash12 (Sep 21, 2009)

And now we soldier on into the next era:



> Ramayana and music
> 
> The first Indian epic, Ramayana, was composed by the sage Valmiki. It was written in shloka form. The word shloka refers to a particular kind of metrical composition known for its brevity, easy tempo and lilting rhyme.
> 
> ...


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## Lukecash12 (Sep 21, 2009)

Continuing into section four:



> Harivamsha, Chhalikya and Hallisaka
> 
> Harivamsha is a volume of 16,374 shlokas appended to the great epic Mahabharata between 200 BC and 500 AD to complete the epic. Harivamsha is important because it describes two forms that may have inspired many composite genres in Indian cultural expression - the Chhalikya, a genre of songs in the ancient Gandharva mode of music making, and the Hallisaka dance.
> 
> ...


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## Lukecash12 (Sep 21, 2009)

Section five, the booming Gupta period:



> The Gupta period
> 
> The period of the Gupta kings shone in literary excellence. It is often described as the Golden Age of culture, arts and learning in ancient India. Kalidasa, who was in the court of Vikramditya (380-413 AD), epitomises the artistic accomplishments of the Gupta period. He was a lyrical poet and a writer of epics and plays. The poem 'Meghadoot', the epic 'Raghuvamsha' and the play 'Shakuntala' are some of his creative masterpieces that adorn the Indian literary tradition. The numerous references to music and dance in Kalidasa's works show the importance accorded to music in man's life during his period.
> 
> ...


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## Lukecash12 (Sep 21, 2009)

Section six, the birth of Raga:



> The Deshi in music
> 
> Brihaddeshi (The Great Treatise on the Regional), by Matanga was the first work to describe music in the period after Bharata, before the advent of Islam began to influence music. Matanga probably hailed from south India. Brihaddeshi is the first major and available text to describe the raga, which has been the central concept in Indian art music for centuries. It also introduced the sargam, or notation in the names of notes. In Matanga's discussion of musical scales and micro-tonal intervals he clarifies what Bharata had said in the Natyashastra.
> 
> ...


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## Lukecash12 (Sep 21, 2009)

Section 7, and the stories of Amir Khusro, Raja Mansingh, and Tansen:



> The Delhi Sultanate : Amir Khusro
> 
> In 1262, when he was nine years old, Amir Khusro began to compose poetry. He composed almost half a million verses in Persian, Turkish, Arabic, Braj Bhasha, Hindawi and Khadi Boli. He is supposed to have enriched or invented qawali, qasida, qalbana, naqsh and many others forms of music. Varying degrees of secularity permeated these musical forms. The zeelaph and sarparda ragas are also associated with Amir.
> 
> ...


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## Lukecash12 (Sep 21, 2009)

And finally, section 8; we have now reached the modern era:



> The Modern Period
> 
> Music in India, and especially art music, went through a metamorphosis for four centuries from the sixteenth, to result in the Hindustani music of today. This modern period saw an increasing number of musicological works in Persian, Urdu, Hindi and other regional languages, instead of Sanskrit. All these tell us the story of how Hindustani Art Music, as we know it today, evolved and took shape.
> 
> ...


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## Lukecash12 (Sep 21, 2009)

All quotes taken from the ITC Sangeet Research Society: http://www.itcsra.org/sra_hcm/sra_hcm_index.asp

I hope that at least one of you has enjoyed this excellent historical summary as much as I have.


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## Lukecash12 (Sep 21, 2009)

No one has any thoughts on the matter?


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## Lukecash12 (Sep 21, 2009)

So no one has any interest whatsoever in the history of Indian Music?


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## World Violist (May 31, 2007)

I shall reply!

I like it. The history of Indian music has always held much interest in me, and I'm very fascinated by this thread.

I'll need to read it a bit more... I more or less just responded because you asked for one, I didn't read it particularly in-depth. Don't have the time right now.

Thanks for the thread though!


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## Argus (Oct 16, 2009)

Lukecash12 said:


> So no one has any interest whatsoever in the history of Indian Music?


I have a semi-related question. I have started playing long raga style improvisations by looping a short melodic phrase and then using this as a foundation to solo over. As I understand it, having little knowledge in the inner workings of Indian classical music, each raga has a mode that defines it and also microtonal inflections that characterise it. I know that one is based on our harmonic minor scale with it's augmented interval between the 6th and 7th degrees. Could you enlighten me as to some other modes/scales that are used frequently in raga's and also how quarter tones and such are utilised?

I know that's not really a question to do with the history of the music but I thought this was an appropriate thread to ask it.


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## starry (Jun 2, 2009)

If from 1700 is modern that suggests it has developed much in recent centuries.


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## World Violist (May 31, 2007)

Argus said:


> I have a semi-related question. I have started playing long raga style improvisations by looping a short melodic phrase and then using this as a foundation to solo over. As I understand it, having little knowledge in the inner workings of Indian classical music, each raga has a mode that defines it and also microtonal inflections that characterise it. I know that one is based on our harmonic minor scale with it's augmented interval between the 6th and 7th degrees. Could you enlighten me as to some other modes/scales that are used frequently in raga's and also how quarter tones and such are utilised?
> 
> I know that's not really a question to do with the history of the music but I thought this was an appropriate thread to ask it.


I think the Phrygian mode is quite common in Indian music... I forget what the raga is called, but it is based in Phrygian.


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## jurianbai (Nov 23, 2008)

I always interested in exotic music. I heard Indian music once in a while. In more detail topic later I will need to ask about Indian music influence to other region, that is the SE Asian. But later ... now on topic please.


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## deeppurpled (Oct 13, 2010)

*Strange experience with Indian Classical Music*

Im a student of Hindustani music(Indian classical music). The process of exploring new ragas(scale system) introduced me to a raaga called Malkauns. I had read about it that it is a mid-night Raaga and it attracts evil spirits. I did not believe these this until I experienced it myself. It may sound a bit strange and crazy just like I did not believe this the first time until I experienced it again. Well It was not a scary experience but a thrilling one. I still have that recording clip with me. Something very mysterious is associated with this pentatonic Raaga and It can be only experienced in person. I can leave you with this beautiful piece in malkauns by Ravi Shankar.
Enjoy!
Mohit Kumar
http://www.deeppurpled.blogspot.com/


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## Lukecash12 (Sep 21, 2009)

> I have a semi-related question. I have started playing long raga style improvisations by looping a short melodic phrase and then using this as a foundation to solo over. As I understand it, having little knowledge in the inner workings of Indian classical music, each raga has a mode that defines it and also microtonal inflections that characterise it. I know that one is based on our harmonic minor scale with it's augmented interval between the 6th and 7th degrees. Could you enlighten me as to some other modes/scales that are used frequently in raga's and also how quarter tones and such are utilised?
> 
> I know that's not really a question to do with the history of the music but I thought this was an appropriate thread to ask it.


It certainly is an appropriate thread. Herein is all of the material you might need to familiarize yourself with Hindustani music theory (at least when it comes to Ragas), which you won't find difficult to comprehend considering the similarities it has to Western music theory:

http://chandrakantha.com/articles/indian_music/swar.html

http://chandrakantha.com/articles/indian_music/saptak_scale.html

http://chandrakantha.com/articles/scales.html

http://chandrakantha.com/articles/indian_music/that.html

http://chandrakantha.com/articles/indian_music/jati.html

http://chandrakantha.com/articles/indian_music/arohi_avarohi.html

http://chandrakantha.com/articles/indian_music/vadi_samvadi.html

http://chandrakantha.com/articles/indian_music/pakad.html

http://chandrakantha.com/articles/indian_music/samay.html

http://chandrakantha.com/articles/indian_music/raga_ragini.html

http://chandrakantha.com/articles/indian_music/saptak_register.html

http://chandrakantha.com/articles/indian_music/lippi.html

http://chandrakantha.com/articles/indian_music/avartan.html

http://chandrakantha.com/articles/indian_music/bol_percussion.html

http://chandrakantha.com/articles/indian_music/khali.html

http://chandrakantha.com/articles/indian_music/laya.html

http://chandrakantha.com/articles/indian_music/matra.html

http://chandrakantha.com/articles/indian_music/sam.html

http://chandrakantha.com/articles/indian_music/tali.html

http://chandrakantha.com/articles/indian_music/theka.html

http://chandrakantha.com/articles/indian_music/vibhag.html


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## Lukecash12 (Sep 21, 2009)

Actually deeppurpled, I would consider Pandit Nikhil Banerjee and Bade Gulam Ali Khan's performance of Raga Malkauns to be a better demonstration of this demon attracting that you have referred to, because it is full of rhythmic drive and there is an aggressive emphasis in the middle of each sitar phrase. Overall, Banerjee's wild and varied ornamentation, and divide between refrain notes and aggressive emphasis in the middle, seems more well suited to Malkauns.

I would say, however, that Pandit Ravi Shankar is the go-to sitarist for Rag Bihag.


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## Ralfy (Jul 19, 2010)

Thanks for sharing that! I'd like to include this link:

http://www.medieval.org/music/world.html

with recommendations on how to buy recorded works.


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## Argus (Oct 16, 2009)

Lukecash12 said:


> It certainly is an appropriate thread. Herein is all of the material you might need to familiarize yourself with Hindustani music theory (at least when it comes to Ragas), which you won't find difficult to comprehend considering the similarities it has to Western music theory:
> 
> http://chandrakantha.com/articles/indian_music/swar.html
> 
> ...


Thanks for the informative, if delayed reply. I'm already pretty familiar with both Hindustani and Carnatic music now, and did use that Chandrakantha site for some knowledge early on.

I tend to use the Carnatic Melakarta and Janya ragams derived from them but prefer Hindustani instrumentation and form. The hardest part is not staying in the raag and defining the vadi/samvadi, but touching upon the shruti outside the mode using gamaka/alankar. I mostly use a synthesizer to imitate traditional instruments and although it has a pitch bend wheel it can't recreate subtle nuances like andolan and I can't sing dhrupad or khyal to save my life.

Some ragas are easier to play in and maintain the rasa than others I find. The ragas of the ten Hindustani thaats (Bhairav especially) are all pretty simple and some audava ragas like Hamsadhvani are just beatiful, but some I find very hard to retain the tonic/vadi/samvadi and prevent from drifting into related ragas with a different shadjam.

The non-standard spelling of terms confuses things as well. When I play a piece in a raga I'm not sure the name of I search for the sargam in this list, and some of the names seem like rough translations from Sanskrit.

My next main learning focus is the taal as I mostly use Teental or just play by ear. I've listened to Indian percussionists sing the rhythms using those syllables they use and it seems quite difficult to master. But to be honest, I am not interested in conforming exactly to all the traditions, like a good Western musician that I am, I'll pick'n'mix the bits that I like from various musical cultures and assimilate them into my style.

Also, Lukecash what do you think of L Shankar and his work with Shakti?


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## Lukecash12 (Sep 21, 2009)

Would you be specific as to who L Shankar is? I've got a good idea, of course, but I'm not sure.


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## Argus (Oct 16, 2009)

Lukecash12 said:


> Would you be specific as to who L Shankar is? I've got a good idea, of course, but I'm not sure.


The bloke who played with Shakti, not the female vocalist Lakshmi Shankar. He plays a ten-string double violin and worked with a lot of pop and rock acts. Some of his stuff I find hit and miss but his playing is excellent.


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## chee_zee (Aug 16, 2010)

best thread ever. to any other people wondering about how to play Indian stuff, Karnatic or Hindustani, I recommend the book by M. Narmadha called "Indian Music and Sancaras in Ragas', it's over 500 pages and fills in the gaps left by websites devoted to indian music theory, very helpful in performance practice. In the summer I'm gonna make some backing tracks if anyone is interested, anything from simple 10, 15 minute kriti compositions to full hour long RTPs, using East West Ra. It wouldn't be too much of a lie to say that I probably like Indian classical more than European, thanks to the fact that there is both a compositional and improvisational element to it rather than just one or the other.

Ra has tabla and baya, sarangi, esraj, bansuri, and sitar, along with the tamboura. For me I standardly use the tabla/baya, the sarangi (esraj players are hard to come by) or just a violin, and of course tamboura, and then you play whatever instrument as the principal voice (I play guitar). the esraj, bansuri, and sitar can take the place of the sarangi/violin as the accompaniment voice, but esraj players are hard to come by, sarangi/violin is still more common than the bansuri or sitar as accompaniment so those two would just be when you want a different timbre to accompany you.


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## Lukecash12 (Sep 21, 2009)

Argus said:


> The bloke who played with Shakti, not the female vocalist Lakshmi Shankar. He plays a ten-string double violin and worked with a lot of pop and rock acts. Some of his stuff I find hit and miss but his playing is excellent.


Ya, I guess I'm not familiar with him, then. If it's someone in ICM who's gone into pop at all, I probably don't know him/her, because I tend to study sitarists from 1-2 generations back and study the different gharanas/schools.

Lakshmi is actually very similar to one of my favorite indian vocalists:






http://www.youtube.com/playlist?p=50D244CC4454C9D7

Pandit Omkarnath Thakur happens to be a fairly close predecessor in Lakshmi's gharana.


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## Argus (Oct 16, 2009)

Best jugalbandi ever. Flute, saxophone (or sexophone as the title reads) and morsing (jews harp), plus mridangam and tabla.






Never heard the saxaphone in Carnatic music before. It fits excellently. It sounds like its got some echo/delay put on it as well, but that could just be the acoustics.

I love the weird little Indian instruments like the morsing, jaltarang and the kanjira. They just add so much character to the raga.


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## chee_zee (Aug 16, 2010)

never seen sax in Karnatak? I recommend signing up at saneethapriya.org, you can sign up for the site and the mailing list, gives you access to an incredible amount of video and audio of concerts, you can sort by instrument, artist, tradition, etc.


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## Lukecash12 (Sep 21, 2009)

I'm bringing this thread back into view, because I'd like to see if the people here want me to make a properly cited article out of it.


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## chee_zee (Aug 16, 2010)

that'd be great for site ripping, please do.


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