# Classical music with the original manuscripts - megathread.



## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

I don't know about anyone else, but not only as a collecter or music manuscripts, to hear and see music written in the hand of the composer himself, brings me much closer to him, and so I choose to create what I feel is a long overdue thread, dedicated to audio / video of a composers work coupled with the original manuscripts.

Anyone can feel free to contribute to this thread, I certainly will be uploading alot here so we can all enjoy not only music, but the actual literal music itself written on paper.

To start! With my most recent saved video/manuscript and heavenly performance of Mahlers unfinished Adagio of his 10th symphony. With orchestration of movements 2-5 by Cooke.


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

Andre Campra - Messe de Requiem in D Mol.


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

Mozart's Rondo for Piano.


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

Beethoven's COMPLETE 6th Pastoral Symphony:


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

Bach's Sanctus in D Major - a standalone work.


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## gardibolt (May 22, 2015)

What a great idea! I like the concept too, though I'm not skilled enough to create these---which is a shame since I have a metric ton of copies of Beethoven manuscripts lying around.


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

A beautiful Aria by Herr Bach:


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

Bach's Magnificat! Glorious!


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

Bach's Prelude & Fuga in G Major:


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

First movement of Bach's cantata, Nun Komm, der Heiden Heiland. (Copyist)


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

Bach's Partia No.2 for Violin, includes the famous Chaconne;


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

Brahm's Prelude and Fugue in A Minor:


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

Likewise, his Prelude & Fugue in G Minor:


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## JAS (Mar 6, 2013)

I love seeing these manuscripts, although I could never afford to own one. They seem like such an intimate glimpse into the composer as a person. (Beethoven's scores appear to be very hard to read.)

Can we be sure in each of these cases that the handwriting isn't that of a copyist?


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

JAS said:


> I love seeing these manuscripts, although I could never afford to own one. They seem like such an intimate glimpse into the composer as a person. (Beethoven's scores appear to be very hard to read.)
> 
> Can we be sure in each of these cases that the handwriting isn't that of a copyist?


You can be 90-95% sure, I analyse manuscripts and composers handwriting quite often (atleast the famous ones) and I can tell a original to a copyist, most of these are originals, I have only uploaded 1 copyist score so far.


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## Sandra (Mar 5, 2017)

It really is incredible to see these original manuscripts. Bach seems to have a clear handwritting, which apparently isn't the case of beethoven.. thanks for sharing !


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## gardibolt (May 22, 2015)

Beethoven's handwriting runs the gamut. I have some things (parts for a performance) in his hand that are easily legible and downright gorgeous, so he was capable of it when he needed to be.

For sketches and materials for his own use, no, they're sometimes close to indecipherable. But no one was intended to make them out except him.


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

The opening movement of Bach's St.Matthew Passion, one of the PINNACLES of western music and art!:


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## hpowders (Dec 23, 2013)

JamieHoldham said:


> The opening movement of Bach's St.Matthew Passion, one of the PINNACLES of western music and art!:


Wow! I'm trembling! Incredible. Thanks!


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## hpowders (Dec 23, 2013)

JamieHoldham said:


> The opening movement of Bach's St.Matthew Passion, one of the PINNACLES of western music and art!:


Way back when, a museum in NYC had an exhibit of Mozart's manuscripts. The second movement to Piano Concerto 21; the Horn Concertos, with annoying little jokes in German, gently poking fun at the horn player these works were dedicated to.

It was like I found the Holy Grail. I wanted to just stand there forever, gazing through those glass cases, at peace with Mozart's own manuscripts.


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

A sonata by Buxtehude for Cello and Organ continuo, probally a copyist score though as Buxtehude used mostly Organ tablature rather than traditional western music notation - interesting none the less.


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

Schoenberg; not much else to say really, not my cup of tea but will share for those that like pure dissonance and almost random structure


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## Chronochromie (May 17, 2014)

JamieHoldham said:


> Schoenberg; not much else to say really, not my cup of tea but will share for those that like pure dissonance and almost random structure


A shame Mahlerian isn't here anymore to jump in and explain the structure of the work.


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## Pugg (Aug 8, 2014)

It's a joy to see your post's Jamie, thanks.


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

Bruckner's Aequale 1 & 2 for 3 Trombones.


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

Brucker Sinfonie No.0


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

Bruckner Sinfonie No.1


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

Bruckner Sinfonie No.2


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

Bruckner Sinfonie No.3


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

Bruckner Sinfonie No.4


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

Bruckner Sinfonie No.5


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

Bruckner Sinfonie No.6


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

Bruckner Sinfonie No.7


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

Bruckner Sinfonie No.8


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

The final of Bruckners Symphony's - the great 9th.


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## JAS (Mar 6, 2013)

I just wanted to say thank you again for posting these.


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

JAS said:


> I just wanted to say thank you again for posting these.


No problem, good to know other people enjoy seeing the orignal manuscripts as I do


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## JAS (Mar 6, 2013)

JamieHoldham said:


> No problem, good to know other people enjoy seeing the orignal manuscripts as I do


And you look so familiar . . .

Just out of curiosity, where are all of these manuscripts from?


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

JAS said:


> And you look so familiar . . .
> 
> Just out of curiosity, where are all of these manuscripts from?


Various librarys & museums, often left stored in composer's past homes if they are still standing with any instruments & other personal things of the composer.


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## JAS (Mar 6, 2013)

It really makes me wish my grasp of notation was better. I presume that the section of music we are hearing roughly corresponds to the page shown?


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

JAS said:


> It really makes me wish my grasp of notation was better. I presume that the section of music we are hearing roughly corresponds to the page shown?


Roughly, most of the pages are in sync correctly.


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

The finale of a act from Mozart's Opera, Don Giovanni, brilliante.


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

The Christmas Oratorio by Bach - a 2 and a half hour work of stupendous complexity and genius that only Bach could fathom.


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

Bach's BWV 105.


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

Bach's Partia for Solo Flute in A Minor.


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

Beethoven, Sonata in E Minor, my personal favourite Piano piece by Beethoven


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

A Concerto by Telemann for Violin and 3 horns:


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

Bach and the grand Passcalgia and Fuga in C Minor, although by a copyist it's interesting none the less, if not for the terrific performance.


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

Bach again, with the Choral Prelude for Organ - "Schmücke dich, o liebe Seele".


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

One of Bach's most famous pieces, the heavenly Jesus Bleibet Mein Freude!:


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## Pugg (Aug 8, 2014)

Good to see you being busy, do you compose pieces nowadays also?


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

Pugg said:


> Good to see you being busy, do you compose pieces nowadays also?


I do still compose, albeit not as reguarly because of my errornous sleeping patterns & new nousy neighbours which distrurb my sleep almost every day, my most recent project is a relatively large work for a large orchestra simply titled "Adagio".

I can't spoil much more than that since I am still developing ideas for it


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

Bach and a movement from his St.John Passion, partially copyed by Bach's Assistant Bammler, with corrections in the master Bach's hand:


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

Another movement from Bach's St.John Passion:


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

And another:


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

And one last one:


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

Also the 1st movement to Bach's St John Passion, this time it is entirely written by Bach from sometime around 1724-late 1730s:


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

Bach's Sonata No.1 for Solo Violin:


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

Bach's beautiful Cello Suite no.1  (Copyist: his 2nd wife Anna Bach)


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## Picander (May 8, 2013)

JamieHoldham said:


> The opening movement of Bach's St.Matthew Passion, one of the PINNACLES of western music and art!:


I have the book with the facsimile:









This book is, by far, the most expensive I've never bought, but I don't regret the expense.


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

Also Bach's Partia No.1 for Violin which I forgot to upload:


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

Now for a very special video, which isn't the traditonal upload like the rest I have done, but it does include original manuscript fragments by Bach, and its extremely interesting & defines Bach as probally one of the most intellegent composers of all time.

His 14 canons, mathmatically brillant and something I doubt any other composer could do to the extent Bach does:


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

Picander said:


> I have the book with the facsimile:
> This book is, by far, the most expensive I've never bought, but I don't regret the expense.


Thats really cool, something too expensive for me to buy but would really be a interesting item to have, lucky you


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

Bach again (my favourite composer as you can tell) with his Harpischord Concerto No.1, a piece he composed late in his life, showing his contrapuntal mastery in the height of his musical powers.

Movement 1.


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

Movement 2:


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

Movement 3:


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

Mozart's Piano Sonata No.10 on Pianoforte, a real nice treat on top of the original manuscript:


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

Mozart's Overture to Don Giovanni: a chilling piece...


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

My final upload for today, and one of the best, the final movement to Bach's St. Matthew Passion, a extremely divine and celestial piece:

Also something I want everyone to take note of, over this MASSIVE work of giant complexity, what do you see? You don't... no errors in what I presume is not just a copy by Bach, but the original manuscript and the first composition from his genius to paper... just food for the thought.






Also the 68th post for the 68th movement of this work... :devil:


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## Picander (May 8, 2013)

JamieHoldham said:


> My final upload for today, and one of the best, the final movement to Bach's St. Matthew Passion, a extremely divine and celestial piece:
> 
> Also something I want everyone to take note of, over this MASSIVE work of giant complexity, what do you see? You don't... no errors in what I presume is not just a copy by Bach, but the original manuscript and the first composition from his genius to paper... just food for the thought.
> 
> ...


This manuscript is not the compositional score of the Passion. It's a score that Bach wrote in 1736, if the notes in the book with the facsimile are correct.

Bach was aware of the importance of this work, and possibly wanted to bequeath to posterity so magnificent manuscript of the Passion.


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## JosefinaHW (Nov 21, 2015)

gardibolt said:


> What a great idea! I like the concept too, though I'm not skilled enough to create these---which is a shame since I have a metric ton of copies of Beethoven manuscripts lying around.


Where did you find the originals to copy, Gardibolt?


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## JosefinaHW (Nov 21, 2015)

Picander said:


> This manuscript is not the compositional score of the Passion. It's a score that Bach wrote in 1736, if the notes in the book with the facsimile are correct.
> 
> Bach was aware of the importance of this work, and possibly wanted to bequeath to posterity so magnificent manuscript of the Passion.


Picander, have you studied at length the discussions between Bach and Picander re/ the final or intermediary texts of the passions and cantatas--I know Picander's texts were not used in all of the extent cantatas?


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

Now it's time for some Vivaldi! His Concerto in C Major for many instruments, of which unless anyone can correct me otherwise is written in the hand of the man himself:


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

Vivaldi's La Olimpiade music drama part 1:


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

Vivaldi's music drama part 2:


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

Part 3:


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

Part 4:


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

Part 5:


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

Part 6:


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

Part 7:


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

Part 8:


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

Finale:


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

And last post for today, Vivaldi's Concerto for 2 Cellos, a wonderful work as always with Vivaldi;


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## arnerich (Aug 19, 2016)

I made this video of Bach's Crucifixus from the mass in b minor.


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

arnerich said:


> I made this video of Bach's Crucifixus from the mass in b minor.


Awsome job, great video of a great work.


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

One more post before I go to bed, Mozart's divine Ave Verum Corpus with manuscript..


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

A beautiful Bach chorale performed by Elliot Gardiner:


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

A movement from Don Giovanni:


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

And another:


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

Anoter:


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

The first scene of Don Giovanni:


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

One more movement from Don Giovanni and my personal favourite, the scene of the duet between 2 characer's I cannot remember, but all I know is that this piece resonates with me more than the rest of the Opera.


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

Schubert's Piano & Cello Sonata in A Minor -


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

Carlos de Seixas and his Toccata 1a:


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

Mendelssohn and his Piano Concerto in A Minor, of which he wrote at just the age of 13, very impressive.


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## Pugg (Aug 8, 2014)

JamieHoldham said:


> One more movement from Don Giovanni and my personal favourite, the scene of the duet between 2 characer's I cannot remember, but all I know is that this piece resonates with me more than the rest of the Opera.


This is a duet between Don Giovanni (baritone) and Zerlina (soprano)


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

Bruckner's Overture in G mol:


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

Bruckner's March and 3 pieces for Orchestra:


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

A special one here, Mozart's Requiem in full with Susmayer completion:


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

Bach's Well Tempered Clavier Prelude and Fuga 1:


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

2:


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

3:


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

4:


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

5:


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

6:


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

I am sad to say this will probally be my last upload here for a long time, as I have exhausted and uploaded all the videos w/ manuscripts that I have saved on my Youtube playlist, I left this final upload as the best for the last, the first movement to Bach's Mass in B Minor, the Kyrie.

At this point I just hope this thread doesn't get buried and forgotten, that people come here to hear and SEE the music, as well as maybe uploading more videos. Anyhow sorry I have nothing more really to add to this thread, but I hope everyone enjoyed it while it lasted.

Herr Bach:






_~ Soli Deo Gloria ~_


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## Francis Poulenc (Nov 6, 2016)

JamieHoldham said:


> A special one here, Mozart's Requiem in full with Susmayer completion:


That's incredible.


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

Actually found another video, of Mozart and his Violin Sonata in G Major, enjoy everyone:


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## Jacred (Jan 14, 2017)

The coolest thread I've seen.


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

Jacred said:


> The coolest thread I've seen.


Why thank you :tiphat:


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

Vivaldi's Concerto for Flute, played on Recorder:


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

Not a typical video, but does include a fragment of a manuscript by Johann Sebastian Bach, the "Crab" Canon.

Mathmatically perfecto! Don't know how Bach does it


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

Being eager to revive this thread I have put lots of posts into I will add this, a short fragment of some Medevial music for Treble Violin:


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

Bach Cello Suite No.2:


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

Bach Cello Suite No.3:


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

Bach Cello Suite No.4:


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

Bach Cello Suite No.5:


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

Bach's final Cello Suite No.6:


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

Another piece of Medieval music for solo Vielle:


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## bioluminescentsquid (Jul 22, 2016)

Wanted to drop this here:


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

bioluminescentsquid said:


> Wanted to drop this here:


Very nice piece of music & post


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

3rd movement of Beethoven's Sonata in E Major:


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

Bruckner's Mass No.1:


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

Bruckner's Mass No.2:


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## Pugg (Aug 8, 2014)

JamieHoldham said:


> Bruckner's Mass No.1:





JamieHoldham said:


> Bruckner's Mass No.2:


You are on fire I see Jamie, good work!


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

Terra Tremuit: a Roman chant that is over 1400 years old:


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

Kyrie for two voices, another mediveal piece of music:


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

Found another scrolling manuscript w/ music, this time a motet by the composer going by the name of Joesph de Boismortier, very similar to Bach, but not as perfect!


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

Back again with Antonio Salieri and his Piano Concerto in C, written in his own handwriting:


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## Bettina (Sep 29, 2016)

I'm glad that you revived this thread. I'm enjoying these videos - it's fascinating to see how the composers notated their musical ideas: the handwriting, spacing, ink blots (especially in the case of Beethoven)...this is a nice peek inside the workshop!


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

Antonio Saleri - Variations on La Folia for orchestra:


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

Antonio Saleri - Piano Concerto in Bb Major, my last contribution to this thread and the forum. By this Saturday, maybe Sunday you'll never hear from me again, refer to the Area 51 thread if you haven't seen it yet.

My only wish if you can call it that, is people continue to find these types of videos and contribute to this thread, dont let it die, but if there really isn't any interest then so be it.


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## Portamento (Dec 8, 2016)

Röntgen, Julius - Piano Concerto No. 6 in E minor (1929)






_"Röntgen is memorable throughout; his music has staying power. This originality clearly separates Röntgen from a host of second-tier romantics."_

*CHAMBER MUSIC:* https://www.amazon.com/Right-Through-Bone-Chamber-Röntgen/dp/B000W1V4AM
*CELLO SONATAS:* http://www.prestoclassical.co.uk/w/224711/Julius-Röntgen-Cello-Sonata-No-13-in-C-sharp-minor
*STRING TRIOS:* http://www.prestoclassical.co.uk/r/Champs+Hill+Records/CHRCD122
*PIANO TRIOS:* http://www.prestoclassical.co.uk/w/212129/Julius-Röntgen-Piano-Trio-No-9-in-F-minor
*SYMPHONIES:* https://www.amazon.com/Röntgen-Symp...rd_wg=GUt9t&psc=1&refRID=JYB0HABHVGEQFKJ60G9D
*SYMPHONY #11, "BITONAL SYMPHONY":* http://www.prestoclassical.co.uk/w/201383/Julius-Röntgen-Bitonal-Symphony​*CELLO CONCERTOS:* https://www.amazon.com/Röntgen-Comp...rd_wg=1DhdK&psc=1&refRID=N9833WJZWD8R2DSKC0BB
*PIANO CONCERTOS:* https://www.amazon.com/Röntgen-Pian...764072&sr=1-1&keywords=rontgen+piano+concerto
*VIOLIN CONCERTOS:* https://www.amazon.com/Röntgen-Viol...sr=1-1-spell&keywords=rontgen+violin+concrtos


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## Bettina (Sep 29, 2016)

This is an inspiring thread - it's exciting to see the actual handwriting of the composers and to think about the creative process while listening. I'd be sad to see this thread sink into obscurity. I hope that all of us (including you, Jamie!) decide to keep it going. Here's a manuscript video for Chopin's Ballade No. 2.


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

Liszt: Annee de Pelerinnage


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

Liszt's great Sonata in B Minor; part 1:


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

Part 2:


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

Finally, part 3:


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

A very short Piano piece by Wagner, written in his own hand, surprisingly composed near the end of his life, apparently:


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

Eric Satie - Gymnopedies


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

*(accidental repost of a manuscript already posted, )*


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

Chopin - Prelude No.15 "Raindrop":


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

Chopin - Etude in E Major:


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

Chopin - the manuscript of the VERY famous Polonaise No.6, and my personal favourite composition of Chopin:


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

Chopin - Nocturne in B Major:


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## JamieHoldham (May 13, 2016)

Chopin - Piano Sonata No.2:


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## lextune (Nov 25, 2016)

I wish I knew how to make one of these videos. I have copies of several of Beethoven's Piano Sonatas in manuscript. The most remarkable to me being Op.110.

It is very interesting to see his struggles in the 3rd mvmt. The Adagio/Fugue.


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