# Dvorak or Tchaikovsky?



## Superflumina (Jun 19, 2020)

Saw the Brahms vs Dvorak thread and thought this would be an interesting one too.
Which composer do you prefer and why?


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## Bulldog (Nov 21, 2013)

Dvorak by a wide margin - Tchaikovsky is too syrupy for my tastes.


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## Chilham (Jun 18, 2020)

Bulldog said:


> Dvorak by a wide margin - Tchaikovsky is too syrupy for my tastes.


I have a sweet-tooth.


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## Art Rock (Nov 28, 2009)

Whenever I do a composer ranking (according to personal taste), Dvorak ends up in the top ten, and Tchaikovsky in the 20-30 range (which is still pretty good). In the for me most important categories (symphonies, concertos, other symphonic works, chamber music), Dvorak has a small edge over Tchaikovsky, except in chamber music - where the edge is immense.


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## Kreisler jr (Apr 21, 2021)

I prefer Dvorak, mostly because I prefer chamber music and while Tchaikovsky's chamber works might be slightly underrated, Dvorak is clearly superior here. And I am not too fond of the flashiness and overly emotional character of some Tchaikovsky pieces; I can listen to them in small doses but I remember that about 10 years ago I wanted to compare recordings of his 4th or 5th symphony and had to stop because I couldn't bear it twice in one afternoon. Whereas Dvorak almost always seems "fresh", even in his lesser pieces, like a walk through a natural landscape instead of a refined art gallery.
(Dvorak published more mediocre earlyish works, though, but PIT also has his share (Marche slave...) and one should judge by their best, not their weaker pieces. I'd also concede that with the exception of the cello concerto and a few chamber works Dvorak didn't compose pieces as superior in their genre as PIT's ballets or 6th symphony or violin concerto.)


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## neoshredder (Nov 7, 2011)

Tchaikovsky. He created the Nutcracker. My favorite Orchestral Work. Also Symphony 6 is amazing as well! I also prefer his Violin Concerto over Dvorak. But I’ll admit Dvorak clearly better in String Quartets.


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## Scherzi Cat (8 mo ago)

It’s Tchaikovsky for me. His symphonies and concertos have a slight edge over Dvorak. Dvorak wins in chamber music. But what pushes Tchaikovsky over the top is ballets and the single movement orchestral works like Romeo and Juliet, 1812, etc. Both composers are in my top 10, but Tchaikovsky is a little bit higher.


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## Barbebleu (May 17, 2015)

What Bulldog said!


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## Georgieva (7 mo ago)

Tchaikovsky for me too!


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## Enthusiast (Mar 5, 2016)

I can't separate them in terms of merit. I don't think one is better than the other.


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## Merl (Jul 28, 2016)

Kreisler jr said:


> I prefer Dvorak, mostly because I prefer chamber music and while Tchaikovsky's chamber works might be slightly underrated, Dvorak is clearly superior here. And I am not too fond of the flashiness and overly emotional character of some Tchaikovsky pieces; I can listen to them in small doses but I remember that about 10 years ago I wanted to compare recordings of his 4th or 5th symphony and had to stop because I couldn't bear it twice in one afternoon. Whereas Dvorak almost always seems "fresh", even in his lesser pieces, like a walk through a natural landscape instead of a refined art gallery.
> (Dvorak published more mediocre earlyish works, though, but PIT also has his share (Marche slave...) and one should judge by their best, not their weaker pieces. I'd also concede that with the exception of the cello concerto and a few chamber works Dvorak didn't compose pieces as superior in their genre as PIT's ballets or 6th symphony or violin concerto.)


Excellent post Kreisler and I wholeheartedly agree. Like you, I feel Tchaikovsky's chamber works are very underrated (I love his quartets) but many of Dvorak's chamber works are sublime (except the boring 3rd quartet that seems to go on for about a month). For the symphonies I much prefer Dvorak and the 3rd symphony onwards are pieces I play with far more regularity than Tchaikovsky. Dvorak had a way cooler beard too.


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## EdwardBast (Nov 25, 2013)

I don't have a strong preference. Tchaikvosky was primarily an opera composer. Doesn't seem anyone notices or cares about that.


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## ORigel (May 7, 2020)

Dvorak by a good margin. I prefer his symphonies, cello concerto, and chamber music over Tchaikovsky's works in the genres.


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## hammeredklavier (Feb 18, 2018)

EdwardBast said:


> Tchaikvosky was primarily an opera composer. Doesn't seem anyone notices or cares about that.


What are you intrigued about his opera compared to Dvorak's?


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## EdwardBast (Nov 25, 2013)

hammeredklavier said:


> What are you intrigued about his opera compared to Dvorak's?


Who said I was?


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## mbhaub (Dec 2, 2016)

Tchaikovsky no question - and I really like Dvorak. But the Russian was one of those rare composers who wrote undeniable masterpieces in virtually ever genre he attempted. His operas, except for Pique Dame and Eugen Onegin, are sadly neglected and there still hasn't been a systematic survey of them all. Dvorak's operas are in the same boat. Maybe it has to do with the languages.

I've often thought of packing up all the Tchaikovsky works - the symphonies, concertos, operas, ballets, chamber music, piano music, suites, tone poems...everything - along with the headphone set up and taking them to a secluded cabin in Montana or Wyoming and spend a glorious month listening to it all. Ennis, Montana....what an idea!


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## Xisten267 (Sep 2, 2018)

Tchaikovsky. In my opinion his music is more profound, and I think that the expression of strong emotions in his works is very artistic. I much prefer him over Dvorák in terms of symphonies and ballets, and I prefer his Violin Concerto and Piano Concerto #3 over any by the czech, although I prefer Dvorák for chamber music.



Kreisler jr said:


> And I am not too fond of the flashiness and overly emotional character of some Tchaikovsky pieces; I can listen to them in small doses but I remember that about 10 years ago I wanted to compare recordings of his 4th or 5th symphony and had to stop because I couldn't bear it twice in one afternoon.


I don't think that deep and very expressive works should be listened in a row, by Tchaikovsky or by any other composer. Emotional music needs to be appreciated when one is in the mood for it, and in small doses, otherwise it can exhaust the listener.


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## larold (Jul 20, 2017)

In my survey Tchaikovsky came in tied for No. 4 with Haydn both one point behind Brahms in third place quite a distance behind the Big Three. I find even after 50 years listening to them his Symphony No. 4 and 1812 Overture excite me. I can't say that for much else from the top 100.

In my survey Dvorak came in No. 13 after Richard Strauss and tied with Prokofiev. Between them were Handel, Schubert, Schumann, Wagner and Verdi. I was surprised how highly the latter three scored -- but not Tchaikovsky. He's with the very greatest; Dvorak is at the next level.


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## starthrower (Dec 11, 2010)

I'm not a huge fan of either but I'd have to go with Tchaikovsky. As for Dvorak, I like symphonies 8 & 9 but not much else.


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## Waehnen (Oct 31, 2021)

Tchaikovsky for me -- even if the music is so expressive, colourful, strong, emotional and beatiful that I am not always able to listen to it or to properly receive it.

Although I need to "protect" myself from too much Tchaikovsky, I am very grateful that we have these magnificent works. When I was experiencing more troubled times in my life around 20 years ago, the Pathétique along with Sibelius´s 4th and some Beethoven seemed the only consolation. There is some true pain in the Pathétique.

Just the other day my Random Play gave me The Piano Trio. I was amazed at the overwhelming quality and beauty. You know, there are great piano trios. Then there is the Tchaikovsky Piano Trio. It is on a league of it´s own. Not necessarily better than all else, but on a league of it´s own. Just like most Tchaikovsky masterpieces. What a genius!

Dvorak I enjoy. I am able to listen to Dvorak anytime. But when I want something really extraordinary and overwhelming, it is Tchaikovsky time.


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## adrien (Sep 12, 2016)

I wouldn't want to try to separate them. They are both giants who have both written masterpieces. How can you compare the Dvorak cello concerto against the Tchaikovsky violin concerto?

I only slightly prefer Dvorak symphonies overall, but the Tchaik 5th is amazing, as is his 6th. Some Tchaik choral work (e.g. hymn to the Cherubims) is sublimely beautiful. They are about equal on string orchestra stuff IMO. 

But I think Tchaikovsky reaches a higher level of beauty and emotional engagement overall. Oh yeah the ballet music, and the R&J FO.

Probably have to give this one to Pete.


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## Highwayman (Jul 16, 2018)

I`m a chamber guy so I`d choose Dvořák regardless of the other factors anyway but the thing is I prefer him over P.I.T in almost every other department as well. The only exception is probably Solo Piano. Even though I feel Dvořák did not care for the instrument very much and his output is very "modest" in terms of quality, P.I.T does not win there by a significant margin anyway.


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## MusicInTheAir (Apr 21, 2007)

Superflumina said:


> Saw the Brahms vs Dvorak thread and thought this would be an interesting one too.
> Which composer do you prefer and why?


I like Tchaikovsky a lot more than I once did. However, I still prefer Dvorak. Both are great composers. I think Dvorak's personality as personified in his music has more appeal to me. There's a humble, rustic down to earth quality to it that I find more enjoyable.


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## Gold Member (Aug 23, 2021)

Although, Dvořák more rustic than Tchaikovsky? That's debatable.


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## ORigel (May 7, 2020)

starthrower said:


> I'm not a huge fan of either but I'd have to go with Tchaikovsky. As for Dvorak, I like symphonies 8 & 9 but not much else.


Have you listened to Dvorak's String Quartet no. 13? It might be his finest chamber work.


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## haziz (Sep 15, 2017)

Ouch! I simply adore the music of both composers! Almost too close to call. If forced I would say Tchaikovsky by a hair, but it is extremely close. 

Tchaikovsky is my favorite composer. Period.
Dvorak is number three in my pantheon with Beethoven sandwiched between them in second place.

I am glad to be able to enjoy the great music of both composers!


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## jegreenwood (Dec 25, 2015)

Dvorak by a considerable margin. I’m at best a modest fan of Tchaikovsky. Too much heart on the sleeve. Dvorak, for me (a Brahms lover), has a better sense of structure combined with a wonderful gift for melody. And there’s no comparison when it comes to chamber music.


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