# Are you afraid of Luigi Nono?



## myaskovsky2002 (Oct 3, 2010)

I am a bit, I guess. I liked some simple stuff by him...but his minimalist approcah sometimes is hard for me....What about you? Do you have any suggestions about how can I do to better in order to "swallow" his music?

Martin


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## StlukesguildOhio (Dec 25, 2006)

Are you afraid of Luigi Nono?

No... no.


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## starry (Jun 2, 2009)

myaskovsky2002 said:


> Do you have any suggestions about how can I do to better in order to "swallow" his music?


People ask this here in threads about Mozart, Nono or other composers. But ultimately it's just a matter of listening to the music. I don't think there is any secret key people can get on a forum. It's just between you and the music. If you are tuned into that modernist sound by just concentrating alot on that kind of music for a time then some of it may well click. If not try again a few years later. Yeh it can take effort, that's how art can be. I think this will be my standard response on this kind of topic now.


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## Sid James (Feb 7, 2009)

I haven't heard any of his music in recent memory. I have read about him, though. He certainly is a composer I want to get around to hearing at some stage. I agree with starry. Many things like Schoenberg or Boulez "click" for me after going away and thinking about their music way after the initial listening. Sometimes repeated listening helps, but sometimes you need to space out your listening, because this music can be quite intense. But honestly, there are some pieces like Boulez' _Sur Incises_ (for 3 each of pianos, harps and percussionists) that I think I'll probably never "get" fully. With this kind of highly complex music, I just try to let myself go & just go along for the ride. I've been listening to Berg's _Lyric Suite_ for string quartet on and off for 15 years, and haven't even gotten close to deciphering it, thematically or otherwise. But by the same token, sometimes another work by the same composer can "click" more or less immediately - eg. for me, Berg's string quartet op. 3. That's why it's a good idea to listen as widely to a composer's output as possible, from all genres and stylistic periods...


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## starry (Jun 2, 2009)

And you don't have to like everything by Nono. There will probably be some things you like (find interesting at least) and some you don't like, same with me. Music doesn't have to be like an exam where you have to like everything in a list someone has written in a book, you just take what you need. But try hard enough to find out what you can like by just listening alot for a period.


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## World Violist (May 31, 2007)

I'm not terribly familiar with Nono, but I'm not afraid of him any more than I am of Stockhausen or Boulez or Berio... and I actually rather like them all in some way.

So no, I'm not afraid of Nono in the least.


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## emiellucifuge (May 26, 2009)

Just bought the CD with Como una ola... 
Pollini and Abbado.

Havent listened yet though...


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## HarpsichordConcerto (Jan 1, 2010)

Many comments so far but none seem to suggest they have listened to many pieces by the composer, except perhaps member myaskovsky2002, the OP.

I sampled some. This is a fairly lengthy piece, called _Caminantes ... Ayacucho_ (1986/87), scored for mezzo-soprano, flute, small and large choir, organ, three orchestral groups and live electronics.

This piece by Nono is a _no-no_ for me. I ran out of patience early on but endeavoured through the minimalistic, near random noise/sound. Not quite sure what Nono was trying to achieve. It sounded like it lacked continuity. Turn up your volume, but not too loud as there are loud smashing noises "at random", and be patient. So, I could not swallow this - the emptiness would make my stomach bloat.

Part 1 out of 4 (the other parts follow at YouTube).


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## Aramis (Mar 1, 2009)

Nono? Am I afraid of him? No, not at all... but just to be sure I locked all my doors, installed alarm system and always have Magnum 44 under my pillow.


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## toucan (Sep 27, 2010)

Perhaps this will help? I found Nono, once you penetrate him, most resembles the "easiest" or most popular representative among the post-war avant-garde composer, Gyorgy Ligeti (especially his choral music) - just like Berio most resembles Boulez. Within this group of individuals who broadly speaking took similar or parallel direction, you do find these affinities.


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## myaskovsky2002 (Oct 3, 2010)

```
Nono? Am I afraid of him? No, not at all... but just to be sure I locked all my doors, installed alarm system and always have Magnum 44 under my pillow.
```
This is so funny....about the second email (Toucan), I have no problems with Berio nor Ligeti...

Best.

Martin


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## Serge (Mar 25, 2010)

Never heard of him. What did he write, another silent piece?


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## Manxfeeder (Oct 19, 2010)

I don't know about afraid; maybe timorous. The post-1950 composers, especially the Darmstead-era ones, have their own language, and to take on a new composer requires some degree of commitment to learn this language. I'm limited in my free time, so if I hear of a new composer, I have to be sure the end result it will be worth the effort, at least for me in particular. 

I'm not planning on getting into Nono's music unless someone around here who has taken the time to digest his style can give me some introduction that sparks some interest.


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## starry (Jun 2, 2009)

Manxfeeder said:


> I don't know about afraid; maybe timorous. The post-1950 composers, especially the Darmstead-era ones, have their own language, and to take on a new composer requires some degree of commitment to learn this language. I'm limited in my free time, so if I hear of a new composer, I have to be sure the end result it will be worth the effort, at least for me in particular.
> 
> I'm not planning on getting into Nono's music unless someone around here who has taken the time to digest his style can give me some introduction that sparks some interest.


 Well everyone has limitations in their free time in some way. I'm busy at present looking through popular music albums from 2010. But a couple of years ago I did look through some of this stuff and it isn't all difficult if you are open to it. As I said before though not every piece is equally good necessarily and part of the fun is picking out what you like. But if you need a big introduction to be interested in listening then you probably shouldn't look at it right now. My interest goes in spurts and that drives me to look through loads of stuff when I am interested.


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## Edward Elgar (Mar 22, 2006)

Just listen to this.






It's a string quartet, but no more than two things are going on at the same time. It's the way he combines different string techniques to create "hyper-instruments" which is astounding.

Just listen to the third suspended note. That's the Arditti Quartet playing one note, but all using different parts of the string and bow pressures.


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## myaskovsky2002 (Oct 3, 2010)

*Well*

Edward, this music is fascinating, I would say...What is the title....

Sincerely,

Seasoned

Martin


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## HarpsichordConcerto (Jan 1, 2010)

Edward Elgar said:


> Just listen to this.
> 
> It's a string quartet, but no more than two things are going on at the same time. It's the way he combines different string techniques to create "hyper-instruments" which is astounding.
> 
> Just listen to the third suspended note. That's the Arditti Quartet playing one note, but all using different parts of the string and bow pressures.


I think I can agree with you that it is a very interesting technique in producing sounds and notes. It might even be quite fascinating to see it produced in real life.

That's about its best feature though because I don't think it is music.


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## myaskovsky2002 (Oct 3, 2010)

*I am not so demanding...*


```
That's about its best feature though because I don't think it is music.
```
I am not so demanding, it IS music for me....LOL

Martin


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## Sid James (Feb 7, 2009)

That clip Edward Elgar posted of Nono (the string quartet work) reminded me of Gubaidulina. Quite spooky stuff, and a bit surreal as well. Kind of like hearing a minute of a Schoenberg, Berg or Webern quartet being extended to ten minutes. Nono takes an idea that other composers might have mentioned in passing and extends it into a whole work in itself. It makes a microcosm into a macrocosm. I like the delicacy of the textures and the very emphatic ending.

Interesting stuff & thanks a lot for posting it, Edward. I would also like to listen to the clip HC posted when I get the time later...


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## myaskovsky2002 (Oct 3, 2010)

*Andre*

I think Andre is right...Luigi Nono is convinced he's original but he's not...He makes longer some sounds others explore and quit...That's maybe the reason some people think that this is not music...but it is, you have to be patient...and listen to it deeply...

Martin


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## Sid James (Feb 7, 2009)

I was just thinking out aloud in my original reactions to Nono's music. It shouldn't be taken as derogatory to Nono in any way. I see nothing wrong with extending out basic ideas as Nono seems to have done in that string quartet work. Composers have really been doing this for yonks, especially in the string quartet genre. Just listen to any of Beethoven's late quartets, for example. He did similar things...


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## Manxfeeder (Oct 19, 2010)

The quartet clip reminds me of color-field painters: it's not so much linear music as it is sounds, like color-field painters aren't concerned with images but with paint itself.

Any thoughts on Il Canto Sospeso? I've been listening to some YouTube clips; it reminds me of Anton Webern.


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## Huilunsoittaja (Apr 6, 2010)

All I know is he thought of the idea of the "spider crawl" in dodecophony, where there is contrary motion chromaticism: ex. C,B, #C, bB, D, A, bE, bA, E, G, F, #F


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## myaskovsky2002 (Oct 3, 2010)

*I am not a musician*

I cannot tell you.

I am sad. I can't have an avatar.

Martin


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## starry (Jun 2, 2009)

The first video is certainly quite slow developing. The first forte at around 5 min left me unmoved, it seemed a bit of a boring idea after the tension which had been set up. But then it returns by 7 min and is more developed, more expressive.

The string quartet piece starts off rather fragmented but has a very good performance and does hold my interest. It's from my favourite period in modern classical music too from the later 70s and first half of the 80s which I see as the final maturing of the modernist style. It's not so much the technique that interests me as the effect and how it is used. Originality just for the sake of it is overrated by audiences in all kinds of music imo. Very little music (if any) is completely original in style.


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## myaskovsky2002 (Oct 3, 2010)

Well.....
Some of his music is ok...

Other is like this:






Prometeo....Should we burn the score? LOL

Martin, smiling


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## emiellucifuge (May 26, 2009)

This is so far the work ive found most interesting:


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## myaskovsky2002 (Oct 3, 2010)

I like this work...Como una ola de fuerza y luz....(in Spanish by the way).

Martin


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