# Recommendations



## beetzart (Dec 30, 2009)

Apologies if this has been done before. I was wondering what piece of Western Art Music you would prescribe for someone who is not initiated in the delights of Beethoven or JS Bach. Just a gentle nudge to see if it gets them hooked (converted?). 

I remember my music teacher at school who told me that when he was in the army another soldier, who was musically inert, would mock him for liking WAM. That was until my teacher introduced him to Mahler's 1st symphony, especially the last movement. The naysayer was thus hooked and purportedly played the symphony continuously. 

I think Maher's 1st along with the 1st movement of the 2nd is a good place to start. But most things by Tchaikovsky are probably the best option, even if it has to be the 1812 Overture!


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## Guest (Jun 10, 2014)

beetzart said:


> I think Maher's 1st along with the 1st movement of the 2nd is a good place to start.


I agree with the former, but I find that Bill Maher's 2nd symphony was a bit pompous.


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## Weston (Jul 11, 2008)

I think it depends on the age of person you are trying to brainwash - I mean indoctrinate. Younger people might enjoy the big crashing orchestral works, like Mahler's symphonies or Fanfare for Common Man or Les Preludes. Those longer in the tooth might get hooked on the complexity of a Bach fugue. 

I've learned not to try nudging people too much. I just indifferently go about my business of listening to what I enjoy and often others will follow my lead out of curiosity. We come across much cooler that way.


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## Headphone Hermit (Jan 8, 2014)

1st movement of Beethoven's 5th 

Even the dullest of dullards can hear the variation in the theme if you point it out to them. If they like it, you can even ask them to count how many times it gets repeated when they lliste to it again (and then quickly hit Google to find a credible answer)


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## beetzart (Dec 30, 2009)

Weston said:


> I think it depends on the age of person you are trying to brainwash - I mean indoctrinate. Younger people might enjoy the big crashing orchestral works, like Mahler's symphonies or Fanfare for Common Man or Les Preludes. Those longer in the tooth might get hooked on the complexity of a Bach fugue.
> 
> I've learned not to try nudging people too much. I just indifferently go about my business of listening to what I enjoy and often others will follow my lead out of curiosity. We come across much cooler that way.


I wasn't suggesting to brainwash people, but just to see if they may enjoy something they have never taken an interest in before. If they don't like it then fair enough, there is plenty of music I don't like. I would hate to think liking classical was akin to some religious worship. Although I do worship some of the immortals.


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## science (Oct 14, 2010)

The way to do it is to start with contemporary works. If they liked romantic symphonies, they'd already be listening to them. But they've never heard _Black Angels_ or _Music for 18 Musicians_ or Stockhausen's _Stimmung_ or Rzewski's variations on _El pueblo unido jamas sera vencido!_ or Ligeti's _Lux aeterna_ - they've probably never even heard anything like those works. Works like that are hooks.

If the youthful seems to be the kind who'd fear something hardcore like that, start with Piazzolla or Golijov instead. The point is, something novel, something that'll surprise and interest them.


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## Headphone Hermit (Jan 8, 2014)

Black angels? 

"The Black Angels are a psychedelic rock band from Austin, Texas" - forgive my ignorance (it IS genuine here), but is that what you mean?


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## science (Oct 14, 2010)

Headphone Hermit said:


> Black angels?
> 
> "The Black Angels are a psychedelic rock band from Austin, Texas" - forgive my ignorance (it IS genuine here), but is that what you mean?


I'm sorry!

I meant Crumb's _Black Angels_. It is an amazing work if you can handle some in your face modernism. Please give it a try! The most famous recording of it is by the Kronos Quartet, but there are about half a dozen other recordings floating around and I'll bet none of them are going to disappoint someone new to the work.


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## Declined (Apr 8, 2014)

Beethoven's 5th Symphony. The first movement starts it off ominously. Throughout the other three movements, the symphony progressives from being ominous to being triumphant. It is, in a sense, autobiographical of Beethoven's life.


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## GreenMamba (Oct 14, 2012)

It would be nice to know more about the listener. The OP mentions Tchaikovsky, but that would have been a terrible choice for the cooler-than-thou music fans from my college days (myself included). People who scorned mainstream pop/rock didn't seem to like Tchaikovsky either (or didn't want to like him). 

Science has a point. I also think something like Janacek's Sinfonietta has great appeal.


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## Guest (Jun 10, 2014)

It's going to vary with the person, but it helps to know their general musical background. Classical era is rarely the way to go, because it isn't remotely related to any kind of non-classical genre of the 20th century. 

Examples:
I already liked some ambient piano albums or some sad folk or pop songs... I was READY to hear Chopin's Nocturnes
I loved dark and ominous music, thanks to my death/black metal background... I was READY to hear Ligeti's Requiem
My friend loved Tangerine Dream, Autechre, etc... He was READY to hear Stockhausen's Kontakte
I loved the scenery in Lord Of The Rings and the accompanying soundtrack... I was READY to hear Smetana's Ma Vlast

Not always things you would typically suggest...but you have to be relatable. 

(If you weren't sure, all four examples did actually happen  )


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## PetrB (Feb 28, 2012)

beetzart said:


> I remember my music teacher at school told me when he was in the army another soldier, who was musically inert, would mock him for liking WAM. That was until my teacher introduced him to Mahler's 1st symphony, especially the last movement. The naysayer was thus hooked and purportedly played the symphony continuously.


There is no readily guessing or second-guessing what might or might not catalyze an interest in classical music in those who presently have none.

Your teacher, while in the army, was in a situation where 'the subject' was in a forced circumstance where propinquity was unavoidable, the soldier unable to escape regular contact with his cell-mate, uh, I mean bunk-house mate. This unnatural situation allowed your teacher to repeatedly assault his fellow soldier with this, that and the other piece of classical music until something finally 'took.' Odds were just as good the whole endeavor could have been a complete failure, with the soldier / victim ending up not having liked any of it


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## Weston (Jul 11, 2008)

beetzart said:


> I wasn't suggesting to brainwash people, but just to see if they may enjoy something they have never taken an interest in before. If they don't like it then fair enough, there is plenty of music I don't like. I would hate to think liking classical was akin to some religious worship. Although I do worship some of the immortals.


Sorry, beetzart. That was completely a joke, meant to poke fun at human nature, not at your question. We all want to convert people to our way of thinking and to the things we enjoy.


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## hpowders (Dec 23, 2013)

Copland's Appalachian Spring.


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## beetzart (Dec 30, 2009)

PetrB said:


> There is no readily guessing or second-guessing what might or might not catalyze an interest in classical music in those who presently have none.
> 
> Your teacher, while in the army, was in a situation where 'the subject' was in a forced circumstance where propinquity was unavoidable, the soldier unable to escape regular contact with his cell-mate, uh, I mean bunk-house mate. This unnatural situation allowed your teacher to repeatedly assault his fellow soldier with this, that and the other piece of classical music until something finally 'took.' Odds were just as good the whole endeavor could have been a complete failure, with the soldier / victim ending up not having liked any of it


Blimey, PetrB, he didn't mention that there was a third party present. Well done for remembering something so mundane and tiresome.


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