# SS 23.02.19 - Atterberg #3



## realdealblues

A continuation of the Saturday Symphonies Tradition:

Welcome to another weekend of symphonic listening! 
_*
*For your listening pleasure this weekend:*

Kurt Atterberg **(1887 - 1974)*

Symphony No. 3 in D major, "Vastkustbilder aka West Coast Pictures", Op. 10__
1. __Soldis - Sun Smoke: Lento__
2. __Storm: Con fuoco__
3. __Summer Night: Adagio - Molto vivace__

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Post what recording you are going to listen to giving details of Orchestra / Conductor / Chorus / Soloists etc - Enjoy!_


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## realdealblues

Another weekend is upon us and another symphony is up for your listening enjoyment. This week it's Swiss composer Kurt Atterberg. I haven't heard a lot of Atterberg but I seem to recall enjoying this one quite a bit so I'm looking forward to giving it a spin. I'll post a link via YouTube which will also be the recording I'll be listening too on CD.





Ari Rasilainen/NDR Radiophilharmonie


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## D Smith

I'll listen to Jarvi/Gothenburg here. This will be a new one for me.


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## CnC Bartok

Enjoyable stuff. I'll give Rasilainen a spin as well. An excellent set of all the Atterberg Symphonies.


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## Haydn man

D Smith said:


> I'll listen to Jarvi/Gothenburg here. This will be a new one for me.


This one for me too


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## Mika

D Smith said:


> I'll listen to Jarvi/Gothenburg here. This will be a new one for me.


Will listen this one also


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## Sloe

realdealblues said:


> Another weekend is upon us and another symphony is up for your listening enjoyment. This week it's Swiss composer Kurt Atterberg. I haven't heard a lot of Atterberg but I seem to recall enjoying this one quite a bit so I'm looking forward to giving it a spin. I'll post a link via YouTube which will also be the recording I'll be listening too on CD.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ari Rasilainen/NDR Radiophilharmonie


Swiss composer really! Here is a clue. Switzerland have no coast and certainly not a west coast.


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## Malx

If time permits I'll search whats available on Spotify.
I will confess to never having heard anything by Atterberg.


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## mbhaub

Malx said:


> If time permits I'll search whats available on Spotify.
> I will confess to never having heard anything by Atterberg.


Wonderful composer. This 3rd Symphony has one of the most tremendous climaxes is the entire repertoire. I've been luck enough to play it - extraordinary. Being new to Atterberg you simply must try the 6th Symphony. A totally enjoyable masterpiece and why it isn't standard repertoire is one of those confounding mysteries.


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## KenOC

New to me also. I'll listen to Rasilainen.









​


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## cougarjuno

This Atterberg symphony is one which came up every now and then in various CT posts and games, and this made me listen to his works much more frequently. Extremely enjoyable piece. Same Rasilainen recording on CPO coupled with Symphony 6.


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## KenOC

I like to read up a bit on significant works that are new to me before listening to them. I have no program notes for this symphony and there's no Wiki article for it. But this was on-line and I want to share it.



> Here is Atterberg's summary of the Symphony #3 "West Coast Pictures":
> 
> THE FIRST MOVEMENT (in lied form) strives to recreate the mood at the seaside on a calm sunshine-saturated day when the heat haze over the surface of the water makes it impossible to judge distance, and when the sea swells are rolling, in spite of complete calm.
> 
> THE SECOND MOVEMENT, `Storm', is arranged in `symmetrical sonata form (i.e. the first theme, second theme, developmental phase, second theme, first theme, and coda passage). The first motif, development, and coda strive to represent impressions of the violent power of a storm among the islands of the outer archipelago. The second theme endeavors to capture the feeling of seeing the calm placid water in a fjord, while the rumble from the open water of a distant black and threatening sea is hardly heard.
> 
> THE THIRD MOVEMENT. In the tranquility of evening, when only the swells move the surface of the sea, the eye is enraptured by the fabulous display of colours in the endless view over sea and land; the colours fade towards midnight, the calmness becomes even more complete until at last the night winds slowly begin to blow. The colours in the north-east become stronger, the wind becomes brisker, the sun rises majestically over the mountains, first in cold nuances, then warmer and warmer.


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## Malx

KenOC said:


> I like to read up a bit on significant works that are new to me before listening to them. I have no program notes for this symphony and there's no Wiki article for it. But this was on-line and I want to share it.


I haven't read the information included in your post Ken - I adopt the opposite stance to you in that I prefer my first impressions of a work to not be influenced by knowing what the composer or others suggest I should be hearing.
I will read the notes afterwards and may listen again.
Just my preference.


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## kyjo

Atterberg is one of my very favorite composers and the Third Symphony is probably his masterwork. A tremendously vivid and powerful piece of nature-painting. The final movement, which is the crux of the symphony, is an overwhelmingly ecstatic portrayal of the Northern Lights (Aurora Borealis). The Rasilainen recording on CPO is the only one I know, and it seems well nigh definitive to me.


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## KenOC

Malx said:


> I haven't read the information included in your post Ken - I adopt the opposite stance to you in that I prefer my first impressions of a work to not be influenced by knowing what the composer or others suggest I should be hearing...


Now I feel guilty, like I've posted a spoiler...


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## Merl

KenOC said:


> New to me also. I'll listen to Rasilainen.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ​


I like Atterberg's symphonies quite a lot and I'll be listening to this one too. After that I'll be listening to that other famous Swiss conductor, Beethoven. Sorry I couldn't resist that one, RDB. Lol.


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## Enthusiast

This is timely for me so I'm in. With this one:


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## Malx

I found some time (!) and I also gave this one a listen:

View attachment 113478


Umm - my first listen to anything by Atterberg. 
It was pleasant enough but it didn't really grab my attention. One observation - I thought it sounded like three tone poems each depicting a differing seascape as much as a Symphony.

Edit: I kept listening to the disc on Spotify and enjoyed the 6th Symphony that followed a great deal more, still not outstanding but a more coherent Symphony.

Edit 2: looks like the one I listened to has been on the shelf too long and the cover has faded.


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## CnC Bartok

Malx said:


> Edit 2: looks like the one I listened to has been on the shelf too long and the cover has faded.


This cannot be true. This implies quite clearly that you get sunshine in Scotland.......:devil:


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## Malx

CnC Bartok said:


> This cannot be true. This implies quite clearly that you get sunshine in Scotland.......:devil:


CnC - I fear you have missed the point, we get so much sunshine it even fades covers on Spotify


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## MusicSybarite

It was time to recommend this monumental piece of music! Without fear of being wrong, it's one of the fullest masterpieces from Scandinavia, with a great sense of nature/landscape depiction as nothing else. Majestic is a word that is short to describe this riveting work!


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## DLOinQUEENS

The opening theme is so warm and inviting - a really tranquil beginning. The early development is appropriately and quite beautifully paced - I find it drawing you into the piece in an effortless, understated way - not drawing attention to itself. The restatement of the opening theme, again, is beyond beautiful and tranquil - it gave me chills the second time around.

The slightly bombastic development with the main theme returning suddenly and ending abruptly was a strange ending - I felt the theme was good enough to be further developed and expanded upon. I regard this opening movement as an opportunity lost - a magnificent opening theme, restated once, and abandoned. I would have been happily lost in this movement for 15 minutes at its early pace and tone.

I am not fond of the bombast of the second movement’s opening - it feels forced and inappropriately positioned directly behind the opening theme’s inherent tranquility and beauty. It does develop nicely, with a strong and quite robust and enjoyable theme stated by the brass. The transition of the piece into to an interplay between various instruments is wonderfully done and really intellectually pleasing. The rapid increase in pace and ferocity feels more natural and meaningful than the opening. The percussion, brass, and strings are really driving an impressive, powerful theme - very enjoyable. Another splendid transition to a dreamy, deeply satisfying understated theme, appropriately placed. Wow - the way this picks up pace and ferocity again is absolutely incredible. I got chills again in the new theme stated by the brass with percussion driving it - around the 8:30 mark. That is one glorious, heroic melody. Amazing. The way it develops and comes back again is seriously invigorating and uplifting - I will be blasting this for my neighbors soon, haha. The climax, with the slowly dying theme following shortly thereafter is perfectly placed, giving time to reflect on the entire movement’s volatile and explosive nature. A truly remarkable composition - thoroughly enjoyable and ripe for multiple visits.

Another beautiful opening theme to the last movement - very much similar to the first - it feels pensive and intoxicatingly dark and philosophical, in a natural way. A splendid, inviting opening. The horns are haunting and hypnotic. The theme stated by the strings is crushing - major chills on that one (this a true masterpiece). The slow, dreamy interplay leading into another strong and heroic short theme, then back into another dream state, is truly hypnotic and engrossing. Another beautiful and poignant melody trailing off into a fractured, wandering sound - the interplay in this symphony is really magnificent. Each instrument seems to perfectly compliment the other without calling attention to itself. Another very loud and bombastic heroic theme, not particularly memorable, but well fitted to the piece. The melodies following in the finale, and the orchestration throughout, are incredible and so naturally uplifting - this truly feels important and awe-inspiring - a very appropriately paced, strongly stated, and enjoyably drawn out ending with a majestic and heavenly final statement of peace and tranquility, as we began.

An absolute masterpiece - I will return to this piece many times!


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## Larkenfield

realdealblues said:


> Another weekend is upon us and another symphony is up for your listening enjoyment. This week it's Swiss composer Kurt Atterberg. I haven't heard a lot of Atterberg but I seem to recall enjoying this one quite a bit so I'm looking forward to giving it a spin. I'll post a link via YouTube which will also be the recording I'll be listening too on CD.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ari Rasilainen/NDR Radiophilharmonie


Oops. You probably means Swedish composer rather than Swiss? Talented musician. I like his symphonies very much.


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## Haydn man

A new work for me and I echo the general positive comments
An evocative work with much feeling and adds yet another composer who requires more exploring


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## MrMeatScience

I'll add my voice to the chorus of praise here. The outer movements in particular have been lingering in my mind -- so atmospheric and affecting. Probably my favorite Atterberg I've heard so far, though admittedly that only includes a couple of his other symphonies.


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## leonsm

It's great to see Atterberg in SS, he has an amazing symphonic output (check no. 2, 5, 6, 7 and 8), he's a master tone maker. 

The 3rd is my favorite in his output, a very colored, vivid, melodius symphony, with a bombastic and memorable ending.


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## realdealblues

Larkenfield said:


> Oops. You probably means Swedish composer rather than Swiss? Talented musician. I like his symphonies very much.


Yes, I typed Swiss when I meant to type Swedish...glad a few got a good laugh out of that :tiphat: 
My only excuse is that I was wanting a cup of Swiss miss or because I literally sleep 3-4 hours a day and by Friday afternoon when I posted it I was half asleep, so my apologies for mixing up one of the three Sw countries. At least I didn't put Swaziland...


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## Merl

realdealblues said:


> .........At least I didn't put Swaziland...


Dont be silly RDB. Thats where Tchaikovsky was from. :lol:


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## Malx

KenOC said:


> Now I feel guilty, like I've posted a spoiler...


Not a problem Ken - as I said I didn't read the comments. Just my perverse way of approaching things.
Although to be fair it is hard to listen to something without some impression of what it may sound like but I do attempt to minimise the influences.


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## kyjo

DLOinQUEENS said:


> The opening theme is so warm and inviting - a really tranquil beginning. The early development is appropriately and quite beautifully paced - I find it drawing you into the piece in an effortless, understated way - not drawing attention to itself. The restatement of the opening theme, again, is beyond beautiful and tranquil - it gave me chills the second time around.
> 
> The slightly bombastic development with the main theme returning suddenly and ending abruptly was a strange ending - I felt the theme was good enough to be further developed and expanded upon. I regard this opening movement as an opportunity lost - a magnificent opening theme, restated once, and abandoned. I would have been happily lost in this movement for 15 minutes at its early pace and tone.
> 
> I am not fond of the bombast of the second movement's opening - it feels forced and inappropriately positioned directly behind the opening theme's inherent tranquility and beauty. It does develop nicely, with a strong and quite robust and enjoyable theme stated by the brass. The transition of the piece into to an interplay between various instruments is wonderfully done and really intellectually pleasing. The rapid increase in pace and ferocity feels more natural and meaningful than the opening. The percussion, brass, and strings are really driving an impressive, powerful theme - very enjoyable. Another splendid transition to a dreamy, deeply satisfying understated theme, appropriately placed. Wow - the way this picks up pace and ferocity again is absolutely incredible. I got chills again in the new theme stated by the brass with percussion driving it - around the 8:30 mark. That is one glorious, heroic melody. Amazing. The way it develops and comes back again is seriously invigorating and uplifting - I will be blasting this for my neighbors soon, haha. The climax, with the slowly dying theme following shortly thereafter is perfectly placed, giving time to reflect on the entire movement's volatile and explosive nature. A truly remarkable composition - thoroughly enjoyable and ripe for multiple visits.
> 
> Another beautiful opening theme to the last movement - very much similar to the first - it feels pensive and intoxicatingly dark and philosophical, in a natural way. A splendid, inviting opening. The horns are haunting and hypnotic. The theme stated by the strings is crushing - major chills on that one (this a true masterpiece). The slow, dreamy interplay leading into another strong and heroic short theme, then back into another dream state, is truly hypnotic and engrossing. Another beautiful and poignant melody trailing off into a fractured, wandering sound - the interplay in this symphony is really magnificent. Each instrument seems to perfectly compliment the other without calling attention to itself. Another very loud and bombastic heroic theme, not particularly memorable, but well fitted to the piece. The melodies following in the finale, and the orchestration throughout, are incredible and so naturally uplifting - this truly feels important and awe-inspiring - a very appropriately paced, strongly stated, and enjoyably drawn out ending with a majestic and heavenly final statement of peace and tranquility, as we began.
> 
> An absolute masterpiece - I will return to this piece many times!


A superb analysis!


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## KenOC

I'll agree with that. My only objection is...must we have all those cymbals? Got a bit of a headache.


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## Enthusiast

Is it really such an _interesting _work? Wasn't all that bombast (without the composer having worked to get us there with a sense of consummation and fulfillment) a bit much? And doesn't it worry anyone that the aesthetic was _so _backward-looking? Strauss and Elgar - both true conservatives at the time Atterberg's 3rd was written - were writing with a lot more genuine originality and distinctiveness than Atterberg appears to have been. I ask these things because I am not so familiar with Atterberg's music and would like to understand what it is that the advocates are arguing for.


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## MusicSybarite

kyjo said:


> A superb analysis!


I agree. He/she understands the quality of the work! What DLOinQUEENS says about the 1st movement is true and I feel the same:

"_The slightly bombastic development with the main theme returning suddenly and ending abruptly was a strange ending - I felt the theme was good enough to be further developed and expanded upon. I regard this opening movement as an opportunity lost - a magnificent opening theme, restated once, and abandoned._"


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## MusicSybarite

Enthusiast said:


> Is it really such an _interesting _work? Wasn't all that bombast (without the composer having worked to get us there with a sense of consummation and fulfillment) a bit much? And doesn't it worry anyone that the aesthetic was _so _backward-looking? Strauss and Elgar - both true conservatives at the time Atterberg's 3rd was written - were writing with a lot more genuine originality and distinctiveness than Atterberg appears to have been. I ask these things because I am not so familiar with Atterberg's music and would like to understand what it is that the advocates are arguing for.


This work is not an example of originality or something to break any scheme in music, or to make it revolutionary. For me, it's more about magnificence, true sense of beauty, greatness, majesty, sentiments, impressions, well-crafted music overall. I think it's perfectly valid on its nature and shape. It will cloy some, but I guess it's normal. In addition, the way Atterberg uses the orchestra is not less than spellbinding.

Not all the works have to be advanced or show much originality to enjoy them or qualify them like masterpieces, it will depend on each person as he/she feels it.


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## kyjo

MusicSybarite said:


> This work is not an example of originality or something to break any scheme in music, or to make it revolutionary. For me, it's more about magnificence, true sense of beauty, greatness, majesty, sentiments, impressions, well-crafted music overall. I think it's perfectly valid on its nature and shape. It will cloy some, but I guess it's normal. In addition, the way Atterberg uses the orchestra is not less than spellbinding.
> 
> Not all the works have to be advanced or show much originality to enjoy them or qualify them like masterpieces, it will depend on each person as he/she feels it.


Totally agree. Enthusiast once again seems to be unable to come to terms with the fact that some people enjoy the music of 20th century composers who weren't at the cutting edge of their time.


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## Enthusiast

MusicSybarite said:


> This work is not an example of originality or something to break any scheme in music, or to make it revolutionary. For me, it's more about magnificence, true sense of beauty, greatness, majesty, sentiments, impressions, well-crafted music overall. I think it's perfectly valid on its nature and shape. It will cloy some, but I guess it's normal. In addition, the way Atterberg uses the orchestra is not less than spellbinding.
> 
> Not all the works have to be advanced or show much originality to enjoy them or qualify them like masterpieces, it will depend on each person as he/she feels it.


Thanks. Yes, that makes sense.


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## Enthusiast

kyjo said:


> Totally agree. Enthusiast once again seems to be unable to come to terms with the fact that some people enjoy the music of 20th century composers who weren't at the cutting edge of their time.


That was uncalled for, kyjo. My comparative examples were Strauss and Elgar, composers I love but hardly "cutting edge for their time". I do like quite a lot of contemporary music that is quite avant garde but why do you think that makes me not like other great classical music? And why "once again"? I came to the avant garde that I do like via the greats of the past and via composers like Strauss, Elgar, Sibelius and others.

My question - that is what it was!! - felt in the spirit of the Saturday Symphony tradition and was legitimate. The fear with music that is very conservative is that, even if very well made, it might be mere pastiche. One listening of a piece by a new composer was not enough on its own for me to dismiss that possibility - particularly with a work that is not without bombast - so I sought guidance. If the work had been a piece by Carter or Boulez then someone who didn't get it but was open to trying might have asked questions similarly and I (and others) would have tried to help. I did not dismiss it as rubbish with a closed mind as some people do with music that they don't like on first hearing. And, in fact, it is my experience that if I like a piece strongly on first hearing I will probably get bored with it quickly.

Please tell me what I did wrong in asking my question ... or point to my other posts that have led you to suspect I always reject conservative composers.


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## sharkeysnight

I've given this a couple of listens over the past few days. I think the third movement is the strongest, and could probably stand by itself in a mixed evening at the symphony, but as a whole piece I'm not sure if it's worth it sitting through the first two movements. There are some nice melodic thoughts throughout but I felt like there was a lot of difficulty in the various pieces cohering, and too often it seemed like the orchestra was being broken up into three or four big pieces that would all move in unison. Not a big fan of the use of the triangle, either. Not music to my suiting, overall. I'll be keeping the third movement in mind, though, it's beautiful.


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