# Everything Chopin



## Polednice (Sep 13, 2009)

I don't know if anyone else here reads the BBC Music Magazine, but, with it being Chopin's 200th anniversary year, they did a special article on him this month!

Seeing as in another thread I was moaning about the man and then pointed out that _no one_ talks about him on here, I thought it was about time that you all let out your repressed admiration of hatred of the composer!

First and foremost, _why_ does nobody mention him? Do you just not like his music? Is it a drawback that his oeuvre is so focused on one instrument?

I think that latter question is poignant for me; I find that I much prefer listening to chamber/orchestral/choral music as opposed to piano solo - I have to be in a very specific mood to listen to piano music. So, when I said that I don't like him, what I really meant was that I don't like _listening_ to him; I certainly enjoy _playing_ his music - so it might be especially interesting to hear the views of non-pianists.


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## Aramis (Mar 1, 2009)

> First and foremost, why does nobody mention him?


Don't complain, we're busy with talking about Mahler.



Tapkaara said:


> and about Sibelius


Yes indeed.

If you don't like solo piano you can try his cello sonata. I guess you already know piano concertos. They are not very symphonic, orchestra is just addition to piano parts but it still sounds diffrent than solo piano works. If you dislike 1st piano concerto then I can't help you, you're just not kind of person that will enjoy Chopin.


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## Air (Jul 19, 2008)

Polednice said:


> _no one_ talks about him on here


Not _quite_ true. Many of us have mentioned Chopin and would be more than happy to discuss his works. However, you must admit, there isn't much chance to bring up his name in many of the recently prominent topics: "religion", "orchestration", and such.



Aramis said:


> Don't complain, we're busy with talking about Mahler.


No need to be so condescending, Aramis. If someone likes Sibelius or Mahler more than Chopin, that's their preference, which is totally all-right. What's not all-right is when you mock someone else because of their tastes in music. Now, if someone had actually come on to the Chopin thread to say "what about Mahler?", then I may be inclined to agree with you...

So, shall the discussion begin?


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## Guest (Jan 20, 2010)

I, for one, love Chopin's music. My favorites include his Polonaises, his Etudes (esp. his Op. 10, No. 3), and his Sonata in B flat minor.

I'm not always in the mood for solo piano, but often I enjoy it greatly. That is when I make a playlist of Chopin, Beethoven, Schubert, and Rachmaninoff.


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## Aramis (Mar 1, 2009)

Air said:


> No need to be so condescending, Aramis. If someone likes Sibelius or Mahler more than Chopin, that's their preference, which is totally all-right. What's not all-right is when you mock someone else because of their tastes in music. Now, if someone had actually come on to the Chopin thread to say "what about Mahler?", then I may be inclined to agree with you...


Lighten up, I'm not attacking anyone.


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## Polednice (Sep 13, 2009)

Aramis said:


> Lighten up, I'm not attacking anyone.


It's all right, I took it as a joke anyway  Now let's just stick to Chopin! Is anybody familiar with orchestrations of his works? On the free CD with the magazine, it features Stravinsky's orchestration of Nocturne Op. 32 No. 2, as well as Glazunov's _Chopiniana_. I haven't listened to them yet though.


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## Air (Jul 19, 2008)

Aramis said:


> Lighten up, I'm not attacking anyone.


I don't see your need to "quote" other members, then.


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## Polednice (Sep 13, 2009)

Over on the 'Richter' thread, Argus mentioned an organist's little shoes, which made me think of something... This is one of the most frightening tributes to Chopin I have ever seen in my life


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## Lukecash12 (Sep 21, 2009)

Polednice said:


> I don't know if anyone else here reads the BBC Music Magazine, but, with it being Chopin's 200th anniversary year, they did a special article on him this month!
> 
> Seeing as in another thread I was moaning about the man and then pointed out that _no one_ talks about him on here, I thought it was about time that you all let out your repressed admiration of hatred of the composer!
> 
> ...


It's probably the same as what I said for Rach's third. It doesn't seem tasteful to beat a dead horse. Most likely all of us have been versed in his stuff by the time we get to being enough of an enthusiast of classical music to visit such a thread as this. There really isn't much to discuss, besides maybe someone who did some great new performances of Chopin.

I mean, we've heard all of the recordings of Cutner, Cziffra, Ashkenazy, Horowitz, Richter, Michaelangeli, Rubinstein, Pachmann, Cortot, Sofronitzky, etc. He's just so damned popular that we would only be going through the motions if we discussed him.


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## Argus (Oct 16, 2009)

Polednice said:


> Over on the 'Richter' thread, Argus mentioned an organist's little shoes, which made me think of something... This is one of the most frightening tributes to Chopin I have ever seen in my life


His feet are frightening.

His left hand is used more for keeping him stable than playing the instrument.

As for the shoes. The heels on those bad boys are awesome. Plus they're white. They must be custom made. His overall look reminded me of John McLaughlin during his Mahavishnu Orchestra years.

That interprataion was different, I but I enjoyed it.


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## bplary (Sep 13, 2009)

I'm a great admirer of Chopin, being a pianist myself. He was a master of the instrument, creating works of symphonic quality on the piano.


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## MisquotedTeabag (Jan 24, 2010)

When I want to listen to Chopin, I listen to Liszt. O.O


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## Romantic Geek (Dec 25, 2009)

Let's be realistic, Chopin was a composer for the piano. Much of his other works for much else isn't really worth discussing. His orchestration is shaky at best.

His piano works are unlike any others though in the Romantic period. Maybe people will talk about Liszt, but I find him to be more of an imitator of Chopin, too flashy for the simplicity of Chopin's piano music.


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## Aramis (Mar 1, 2009)

Romantic Geek said:


> Let's be realistic, Chopin was a composer for the piano.


For chamber ensables.

You can say that his orchestration isn't very good, but don't divide his music only to solo piano and piano with orchestra. Cello sonata and songs are really well composed.


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## bplary (Sep 13, 2009)

MisquotedTeabag said:


> When I want to listen to Chopin, I listen to Liszt. O.O


 In some ways Liszt was just as fantastic a composer for the instrument as Chopin, his pieces are filled with dazzling virtuosity which isn't always true about Chopin's works. But those who say Liszt are shallow are incorrect, some of his works are incredibly beautiful and complex, the Sonata in b minor for example can stand up to anything Chopin wrote in terms of beauty and complexity, not to mention difficulty.


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## Polednice (Sep 13, 2009)

But does virtuosity and technical difficulty really count for anything? I think that kind of showmanship can detract from the music (which I think is true with some of Liszt's music), even though that needn't _necessarily_ be the case.


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## bplary (Sep 13, 2009)

I agree that in some of Liszt's works the virtuosity can be a little overbearing, but it still can put a smile on my face (especially being a pianist myself) to hear such fireworks now and then.


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## TresPicos (Mar 21, 2009)

Polednice said:


> But does virtuosity and technical difficulty really count for anything? I think that kind of showmanship can detract from the music (which I think is true with some of Liszt's music), even though that needn't _necessarily_ be the case.


To me, Liszt is Chopin without a heart. Virtuosity run amuch.


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## Aramis (Mar 1, 2009)

> But does virtuosity and technical difficulty really count for anything?


Yes. Most people say that Liszt, Paganini and other famous instrumentalists are boring because they have builded their music on virtuosity. Can't you understand that it can be... enjoyable? It's just another element of music that some people like and some don't.


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## bplary (Sep 13, 2009)

Exactly Aramis, virtuosity has always been a part of music and always will be. The astonishing technique required to play some of these pieces sometimes can provide as much entertainment as the music itself.


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## Polednice (Sep 13, 2009)

Well, I suppose it's enjoyable if you're into that kind of thing... next you'll be telling me you frequent freak shows  - just don't forget about the actual music!


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## Air (Jul 19, 2008)

Franz Liszt said:


> Virtuosity is not an outgrowth, but an indispensable element of music.


Virtuosity is a melodic language. It was the way many composers such as Liszt and Prokofiev (sometimes referred to as 'The Russian Liszt') spoke. It was their way of expressing themselves musically, whether for good or for bad.

When Liszt was not playing for his ladies (the Piano Sonata being the most 'well-known' example), he did not need to sacrifice the music for pure bravura. Virtuosity for the sake of virtuosity is very different from virtuosity itself. The former is an abuse of the virtuosic language. Surely Prokofiev's War Sonatas and Liszt's Piano Sonata are not 'vapid and empty' (Hah, quote by Chopin regarding Liszt!) works?


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## bplary (Sep 13, 2009)

Air said:


> he did not need to sacrifice the music for pure bravura


 This is perfect, the bravura is what makes Liszt...Liszt! It's a special touch in his music which you can sense throughout his Transcendental Etudes and the Hungarian Rhapsodies in particular.


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## Romantic Geek (Dec 25, 2009)

Aramis said:


> For chamber ensables.
> 
> You can say that his orchestration isn't very good, but don't divide his music only to solo piano and piano with orchestra. Cello sonata and songs are really well composed.


It's a matter of opinion. I don't care for much other than his piano works (and not even much of the piano concertos).


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## Rogerx (Apr 27, 2018)

*Frédéric François Chopin 1 March 1810 - 17 October 1849*



Frédéric François Chopin 1 March 1810 - 17 October 1849)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frédéric_Chopin


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## Mandryka (Feb 22, 2013)

I shall take the opportunity to listen more carefully to the 1979 recording of Pletnev playing the third sonata released by Melodyia last year.


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