# Sibelius vs Beethoven: String Quartets



## Captainnumber36 (Jan 19, 2017)

I have a CD with a couple of Sibelius String Quartets and the complete cycle of Beethoven's Quartets. I find Sibelius' Quartets, at least the ones I've heard, to be reminiscent of the rather chaotic and dark nature of the late Beethoven String Quartets.

Anyone with more experience with these pieces want to chime in on their thoughts? Is my assertion completely ridiculous, or is there some truth in this comparison, in your opinion?

(I don't want to make a poll, I'd rather have a discussion. If a poll is made, too much of the discussion will be based on who is winning and each fanboy defending their favorite).

:tiphat:


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## Tchaikov6 (Mar 30, 2016)

Beethoven easily, sorry.


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## ST4 (Oct 27, 2016)

Sibelius doesn't have many quartets though....but Beethoven's last 6 quartets are masterpieces....sooo....


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## Captainnumber36 (Jan 19, 2017)

But, does anyone hear similarities between Sibelius' SQ and Beethoven's Late SQ?

The point of this thread is more so to compare/contrast rather than pick a winner.


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## Captainnumber36 (Jan 19, 2017)

I really love my Sibelius SQ CD, and it reminds me of Beethoven's dark and ferocious yet elegant style in his late SQ.

That's all I'm trying to say, and was wondering if others with more experience could enlighten me with the theory of why these sound similar to my ears.


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## Tchaikov6 (Mar 30, 2016)

Captainnumber36 said:


> But, does anyone hear similarities between Sibelius' SQ and Beethoven's Late SQ?
> 
> The point of this thread is more so to compare/contrast rather than pick a winner.


Well don't title the thread Sibelius *vs. * Beethoven, then. :lol:


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## Captainnumber36 (Jan 19, 2017)

Tchaikov6 said:


> Well don't title the thread Sibelius *vs. * Beethoven, then. :lol:


Fair enough, I should've titled it Compare/Contrast: Sibelius & Beethoven SQ


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## Captainnumber36 (Jan 19, 2017)

To be fair though, I did make it quite clear in the OP if you read the entire thing.


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## Tchaikov6 (Mar 30, 2016)

Captainnumber36 said:


> To be fair though, I did make it quite clear in the OP if you read the entire thing.


Well, I pretty much skimmed the OP, sorry. Rereading it, I've never really compared Beethoven and Sibelius closely, but I think if you compare two things enough, you can find a similarity in them. Such as Arensky's second piano trio and Tchaikovsky's piano trios, Bach's Magnificat and Mozart's Requiem, Brahms's second symphony and Mahler's 1rst symphony.... any two pieces can be compared.


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## Captainnumber36 (Jan 19, 2017)

Tchaikov6 said:


> Well, I pretty much skimmed the OP, sorry. Rereading it, I've never really compared Beethoven and Sibelius closely, but I think if you compare two things enough, you can find a similarity in them. Such as Arensky's second piano trio and Tchaikovsky's piano trios, Bach's Magnificat and Mozart's Requiem, Brahms's second symphony and Mahler's 1rst symphony.... any two pieces can be compared.


True, but I feel what is being compared/contrasted here has a closer connection than say something like Chopin's Nocturnes vs Mozart's Symphony #41.


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## Tchaikov6 (Mar 30, 2016)

Captainnumber36 said:


> True, but I feel what is being compared/contrasted here has a closer connection than say something like Chopin's Nocturnes vs Mozart's Symphony #41.


I'll listen to the pieces and see if they have a closer similarity.


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## KenOC (Mar 7, 2011)

Captainnumber36 said:


> Fair enough, I should've titled it Compare/Contrast: Sibelius & Beethoven SQ


I don't mind the thread title at all. If it came down to a match between the Bonn Bruiser and the Flashy Finn, I suspect Ludwig would take it on the cards, though maybe by a split decision. In any event, on points, not a walkover for either composer.


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## Bulldog (Nov 21, 2013)

Captainnumber36 said:


> To be fair though, I did make it quite clear in the OP if you read the entire thing.


Three paragraphs - that's a bit much to take in at one sitting.


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## Pugg (Aug 8, 2014)

I like the Beethoven more, they are great and always will be whilst the Sibelius I hardly even touch.


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## Bettina (Sep 29, 2016)

To be honest, I've actually never heard Sibelius's string quartets. I don't particularly enjoy his symphonies, so I've simply never been motivated enough to try out his string quartets. Shame on me!  If I ever do get around to hearing them, I'll let you know if I hear any similarities with Beethoven. In general, though, the two composers don't strike me as having much in common.


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## Melvin (Mar 25, 2011)

I did not know Sibelius wrote more than one string quartet! For some reason "_Voces intimae_" was the only one I'd ever heard of. They'd be fun to hear, it always bummed me out when the tops orchestral composers would not deliver the goods in chamber! (Mahler & Bruckner, looking your way)


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## silentio (Nov 10, 2014)

Just the _cavatina_ from Beethoven's quartet no.13 or the_ Heiliger Dankgesang_ from No.15 would dwarf Sibelius' quartets.


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## Tallisman (May 7, 2017)

While I haven't listened to Sibelius' quartets a great deal, I can see that there would be a similar starkness to both of them: Beethoven from his deafness, Sibelius from his Finnishness.


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## chill782002 (Jan 12, 2017)

I suppose there are similarities between Sibelius' quartets and Beethoven's later ones but that's only to be expected given the huge influence they had on later composers. However, as much as I like Sibelius, I regard his gifts as being more in the realm of orchestral composition and can't compare his quartets to Beethoven's in terms of quality.


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## hpowders (Dec 23, 2013)

I've never heard any Sibelius String Quartet, but if they were terrific works, by word of mouth, I would have listened to them by now, because of all the positive publicity.


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## Triplets (Sep 4, 2014)

I can't say that I agree with the OP, but I am glad that he enjoys the Music. Sibelius Chamber Music deserves to be better known


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## hpowders (Dec 23, 2013)

silentio said:


> Just the _cavatina_ from Beethoven's quartet no.13 or the_ Heiliger Dankgesang_ from No.15 would dwarf Sibelius' quartets.


Sibelius for me was a "problem composer". His works for me, violin concerto excepted, were "unfocused"; not sure of where they were going, emotionally.

With Beethoven, no such haziness.


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## Johnnie Burgess (Aug 30, 2015)

I enjoy this one by Sibelius: String Quartet in D-Minor op. 56, Voces Intimae


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## hpowders (Dec 23, 2013)

silentio said:


> Just the _cavatina_ from Beethoven's quartet no.13 or the_ Heiliger Dankgesang_ from No.15 would dwarf Sibelius' quartets.


You ain't kidding!!!


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## MarkW (Feb 16, 2015)

I had always thought Sibelius only wrote one -- which someone pointed to after I had been extolling Nielsen's. Listened to it and still liked Nielsen's better.


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## Captainnumber36 (Jan 19, 2017)

This is the tracklisiting for the Sibelius CD I have:

1. Moderato-Allegro Appassionato, for string quartet in C sharp minor, JS 131
2. Allegro, for string quartet in E minor, JS 28
3. Work(s): Allegretto in A major, JS 17 and Più lento in F major, JS 149
4. Allegro, for string quartet in F minor, JS 14
5. Allegretto, for string quartet in B flat major
6. Fuga for Martin Wegelius, for string quartet, JS 85
7. String Quartet in A minor, JS 183: 1. Andante - Allegro
8. String Quartet in A minor, JS 183: 2. Adagio ma non tanto
9. String Quartet in A minor, JS 183: 3. Vivace
10. String Quartet in A minor, JS 183: 4. Allegro

https://www.amazon.com/String-Quart...=8-1&keywords=tempera+string+quartet+sibelius


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## brianvds (May 1, 2013)

I am not familiar with Sibelius' string quartets. Are they among his early work? I should really go explore them; Sibelius wrote much more than symphonies and tone poems. And these can perhaps to some extent be compared with Beethoven's pastoral symphony, in a distant, indirect sort of way, in that they also evoke nature's beauty and awesome power. 

I once had a CD with works for solo piano by Sibelius, and while they were by no means major masterpieces, they were all hugely listenable. Borrowed the CD to someone; never got it back. Presumably I'm not the only one who liked the music. 

In summary, it occurs to me that Sibelius' influences are actually not too clear to me. His music stand fairly unique, and I don't know to which extent he was even familiar with Beethoven's work.


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