# Brahms: Piano Quintet op. 34



## BrahmsWasAGreatMelodist (Jan 13, 2019)

Brahms' Piano Quintet, op. 34 is currently on the eighth tier of the Talk Classical community's favorite and most highly recommended works, making it the highest rated piano quintet and tied for the third highest rated quintet with Mozart's clarinet quintet in A.

Kelly Dean Hansen has great listening guides on this piece in both its quintet (op. 34) and two piano (op. 34b) forms. She notes (as others have) that while Brahms liked the content of the quintet, he was not satisfied with the instrumentation, which led him to rearrange the work for two pianos, and no one really knows if that was meant to be the final form or just an intermediate step towards an orchestral arrangement.

What do you guys think about this work? Do you have any reservations about it?

Personally I love the piece every bit as much as the next Brahmsian, but I am a bit divided on it. On one hand, it is an epic work, an epic exploration of rich sonorities and masterful manipulation of content, but on the other hand, I can see where the criticisms (including Brahms' own) regarding the piece (especially its instrumentation) come from. It does seem a bit "big for its britches" at times, so to speak... but I suppose that is part of the beauty of it. Still, I do not think it is fair to say this work is Brahms' "best" chamber work (a title that would probably be designated to this piece almost as often as the clarinet quintet), as the 3 piano trios, the 1st and 3rd piano quartets, the clarinet trio, the clarinet quintet, the 3 violin sonatas, the 2 cello sonatas, the 2 clarinet sonatas (and their viola arrangements), and the second string quintet are all just as good if not better (IMO). Furthermore, I think that the Schumann piano quintet is probably the best example of the form.

However, the third movement of this piece (especially the trio!) remains one of my favorite moments in all of music. Simply stunning.

Edit: I accidentally posted this thread in the "Non-Classical" discussion. I think it counts as classical, so mods, please remove that thread.


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## Mifek (Jul 28, 2018)

IMO, this is not only Brahm's best chamber work, but also the best piece of chamber music ever. I probably like some individual movements from other chamber works a little bit more than any individual movement from this piano quintet (some movements from works by Schubert, Shostakovich, Dvorak, Tchaikovsky and Grieg immediately come to my mind), but as a complete chamber work there is nothing better than this piano quintet.


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## MarkW (Feb 16, 2015)

I don't doubt that it is masterfully composed, but for whatever reason I have never warmed to it. I have enjoyed it in performance, but virtuually never play recordings of it at home.


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## Littlephrase (Nov 28, 2018)

Like you pointed out, so much of Brahms’ chamber output is solid gold. The Piano Quintet is no exception. There are many perfectly valid reasons for placing it at the summit of, not only Brahms, but chamber music as a whole. However, there are just so many other Brahms chamber works I like equally; namely, the clarinet quintet, the second string quintet, and the violin sonatas. Just to name a few.


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## ccar (Mar 3, 2017)

There are at least 3 wonderful recordings of the F minor quintet with Richter at the piano. Two with the Borodin (studio and live, both 1958) and another with the Tatrai in Budapest (also 1958 live). For me the Budapest recital is the most unexpected, giving a sense of old school intimacy and music "discovery" I may miss with the Borodin.


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## BrahmsWasAGreatMelodist (Jan 13, 2019)

Oh yeah, forgot to say, what are your favorite recordings? Sorry I'm not science.


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## Mandryka (Feb 22, 2013)

BrahmsWasAGreatMelodist said:


> Oh yeah, forgot to say, what are your favorite recordings? Sorry I'm not science.


wdolwsahfcikwsafgcewsikfewskfb


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## joen_cph (Jan 17, 2010)

I've liked it a lot, but I tend to listen more to his piano quartets nowadays. 
Haven't really collected it, but accumulated these through the years:

CD Bocchese,Zordanazzo,soli/mond mus 1997 3cd mfcn10074
LP Pollini,Ital4/dg 1980 2531 197

_historical recordings:_
cd Rudolf Serkin,Busch2,Doktor,Andreasson/membran 1938-05 222369
lp Harold Bauer,Flonzaly4/rca 2lp mono 1925-xx 2lp vcm-7103
LP Sviatoslav Richter,Borodin4/melodiya mono ca. 1955-60 05576-77
LP Wladyslaw Szpilman,Gimpel,Warsz5/mms ca. 1965 "st" sms2466 (soloist known from the movie "_The Pianist_")

_Version for 2 pianos, op.34b:_
cd Zilberstein,Argerich/emi 6cd 50999 0940442


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## Mandryka (Feb 22, 2013)

joen_cph said:


> I've liked it a lot, but I tend to listen mor eto the piano quartets these days.
> I've accumulated these through the years:
> 
> CD Bocchese,Zordanazzo,soli/mond mus 97 3cd mfcn10074
> ...


Get the Ranki/Bartok quartet! I just put it on for the first time in years and it's fabulous.


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## joen_cph (Jan 17, 2010)

Though the Pollini was praised a lot when it came, and was my first one, I'm not sure my more recent recordings are totally satisfying, so I'll have a look around ...


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## Mifek (Jul 28, 2018)

Favorite recordings:

Pollini and Quartetto Italiano
Rubinstein and the Guarneri quartet


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## EdwardBast (Nov 25, 2013)

I think it's wonderful. As a critic of Brahms's work, Brahms was a hack. The dolt thought the C minor piano quartet was of little value, so I wouldn't trust his opinion on the quintet either.


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## wkasimer (Jun 5, 2017)

joen_cph said:


> cd Rudolf Serkin,Busch2,Doktor,Andreasson/membran 1938-05 222369


It took me a very long time to appreciate Brahms and for many years, this was the only work I liked, and this was virtually the only Brahms recording I owned.


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## BrahmsWasAGreatMelodist (Jan 13, 2019)

EdwardBast said:


> I think it's wonderful. As a critic of Brahms's work, Brahms was a hack. The dolt thought the C minor piano quartet was of little value, so I wouldn't trust his opinion on the quintet either.


Yeah, a lot of composers tend to be overly critical of some of their largest-scale or most significant works. I suppose it's only natural. However, I think Brahms's criticism of his own music is at least occasionally insightful, even if he scrutinizes it with unreasonable and often totally unfair standards.


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## Brahmsianhorn (Feb 17, 2017)

I like the classic Serkin/Busch version, but I must admit that this set has a very special place in my heart for the committed music-making:


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## Mandryka (Feb 22, 2013)

joen_cph said:


> _Version for 2 pianos, op.34b:_
> cd Zilberstein,Argerich/emi 6cd 50999 0940442


Argerich recorded it with Zilberstein and with Rabinovitch, I remember listening to them both about 15 years ago and preferring the Rabinovitch, I don't know why.

I haven't explored other recordings of it, I've never heard it in concert. Did Kontarsky Bros record it? Gilels/Zak or Emil and Elizaveta Gilels? Kocsis/Ranki? The Lhevinne siblings? I think there's one with Afanassiev and someone.


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## science (Oct 14, 2010)

BrahmsWasAGreatMelodist said:


> Brahms' Piano Quintet, op. 34 is currently on the eighth tier of the Talk Classical community's favorite and most highly recommended works, making it the highest rated piano quintet and tied for the third highest rated quintet with Mozart's clarinet quintet in A.
> 
> Kelly Dean Hansen has great listening guides on this piece in both its quintet (op. 34) and two piano (op. 34b) forms. She notes (as others have) that while Brahms liked the content of the quintet, he was not satisfied with the instrumentation, which led him to rearrange the work for two pianos, and no one really knows if that was meant to be the final form or just an intermediate step towards an orchestral arrangement.
> 
> ...


Hey, well done!

Also, wikipedia has a good page about this work!


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## science (Oct 14, 2010)

BrahmsWasAGreatMelodist said:


> Brahms' Piano Quintet, op. 34 is currently on the eighth tier of the Talk Classical community's favorite and most highly recommended works, making it the highest rated piano quintet and tied for the third highest rated quintet with Mozart's clarinet quintet in A.
> 
> Kelly Dean Hansen has great listening guides on this piece in both its quintet (op. 34) and two piano (op. 34b) forms. She notes (as others have) that while Brahms liked the content of the quintet, he was not satisfied with the instrumentation, which led him to rearrange the work for two pianos, and no one really knows if that was meant to be the final form or just an intermediate step towards an orchestral arrangement.
> 
> ...


I don't think I'm the kind of person that should be evaluating works of music, but ... I don't have any reservations about it!

There are a few Brahms chamber works that I like more, especially the "firsts" - the first piano trio, the first cello sonata, and the first violin sonata, and maybe I like the second cello sonata, clarinet quintet, and horn trio more too. But nothing else. And I definitely like it more than Schumann's.


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## Phil loves classical (Feb 8, 2017)

Brilliant work. One of my favourite Brahms' works.


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## BrahmsWasAGreatMelodist (Jan 13, 2019)

The first piano trio is incredible (I mean the 1889 version, but the 1854 version is still pretty great). It is nothing short of one of my favorite pieces of music of all time. I really wish Brahms had revised his third piano sonata later in his life (he considered doing so); it would've been cool to see what he could've done with that piece.


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## DavidA (Dec 14, 2012)

Thanks for this thread. I've just sorted out a performance of this I own and I'm listening to it at the moment with enjoyment . One of the great recordings of this work by the great Leon Fleischer and the Julliard Quartet.


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## Guest (Feb 16, 2019)

brahms' chamber music is heaven; the piano quintet ranks slightly below the clarinet quintet in my preferences; the musicality and the german "gemütlichkeit" transpires in these works; the string quartets are great as well; despite the fact that brahms has no major cycle in chamber music, the quality of his output is exceptional and he is one of the great masters in the genre; i recommend the takacs quartet for all of brahms' chamber music; they play the piano quintet with stephen hough


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