# Haydn's Op. 77 mystery



## KenOC (Mar 7, 2011)

Prince Lobkowitz commissioned six quartets from Haydn and Beethoven at about the same time. Beethoven delivered with his six Op. 18 quartets in 1801, but Haydn wrote only two in his Op. 77, delivered in 1802. Why? Did he hear Beethoven's quartets and decide to bow out? Ideas?


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## Andolink (Oct 29, 2012)

I seem to remember reading somewhere (probably liner notes) that he just didn't have the "chops" left for the task at that stage of his life. That he was more or less burnt out. I think the two quartets he did write and the stand alone movement of the unfinished one show clear signs that that was the case. They sound like a composer unfortunately running low on ideas.


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## ArtMusic (Jan 5, 2013)

Haydn was getting rather old (died 1809) and he had a very long life for someone of the 18th century. His oratorio The Seasons was premiered a year before in 1801.


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## hpowders (Dec 23, 2013)

He should have quit with "The Creation". "The Seasons" is disappointing, in comparison.


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## HaydnBearstheClock (Jul 6, 2013)

hpowders said:


> He should have quit with "The Creation". "The Seasons" is disappointing, in comparison.


I disagree, I think The Seasons has some awesome music in it. Maybe not quite as good as The Creation, but it still has some of Haydn's best musical ideas imo.


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## HaydnBearstheClock (Jul 6, 2013)

KenOC said:


> Prince Lobkowitz commissioned six quartets from Haydn and Beethoven at about the same time. Beethoven delivered with his six Op. 18 quartets in 1801, but Haydn wrote only two in his Op. 77, delivered in 1802. Why? Did he hear Beethoven's quartets and decide to bow out? Ideas?


Haydn was too old at this point to continue writing and lacked the strength to finish the set. It had nothing to do with Beethoven imo. In addition, I don't think Haydn was ever 'daunted' by other composers in this genre, since he continued writing well after Mozart's greatest quartet works were written.


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## hpowders (Dec 23, 2013)

HaydnBearstheClock said:


> I disagree, I think The Seasons has some awesome music in it. Maybe not quite as good as The Creation, but it still has some of Haydn's best musical ideas imo.


After loving The Creation, I ran out and bought "The Seasons". Didn't find the same level of inspiration.


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## jurianbai (Nov 23, 2008)

True there were speculation that Haydn got bow out after Beethoven's string quartet circulated in the area, but the mainstrean 'theory' is Haydn just got too old. Haydn exhausted after finishing his The Season. The book "String Quartet of Haydn" by Floyd and Margareth Grave have bit of details on this accounts. Haydn seems to dragging too long after finishing The Season and two Op.77 string quartet. Several reports contradicted each other, one said Haydn will finished the job, the other said the project was abandoned. The last confirmation on this is Haydn own letter:



> The composer himself had confessed as much in a painfully sad letter that accompanied the score to The Creation, sent to Breitkopf & Härtel more than two years earlier, in which he complained of weakened memory, nervous exhaustion, and consequent
> bouts of deep depression.


 - "String Quartet of Haydn" by Floyd and Margareth Grave

Just for reminder, Haydn did finished two movements for the third string quartet, Op. 103 I.Andante grazioso and II.Menuet ma non troppo presto

A good book to read:









http://amzn.to/WMR6Ui


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## ArtMusic (Jan 5, 2013)

Haydn also wrote _The Seasons_ almost literally killed him during composition. Give them man a break. By 1802, he had written over 100 symphines, dozens of string quartets, dozens of masses and operas, innumerable other concertos, chamber and solo music etc. etc. OK, so he wrote two SQ instead of maybe six of the op.77. Fact is, his musical career was coming to an end, and it finished up around the first couple of years of the early 1800's.


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## KenOC (Mar 7, 2011)

ArtMusic said:


> Give them man a break. By 1802, he had written over 100 symphines, dozens of string quartets, dozens of masses and operas, innumerable other concertos, chamber and solo music etc. etc.


Yeah, but what's he done for me lately? And I suppose he'll be wanting a pension or something.


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## Novelette (Dec 12, 2012)

hpowders said:


> After loving The Creation, I ran out and bought "The Seasons". Didn't find the same level of inspiration.


Understandably weaker music given what a poor libretto the work has! The final chorus is marvelous though. In the 19th century, the final chorus was performed far more often than a whole act, let alone the full work. Quite typical in an era wherein single arias or single acts would be carved from oratorios or operas for performance.


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## HaydnBearstheClock (Jul 6, 2013)

Novelette said:


> Understandably weaker music given what a poor libretto the work has! The final chorus is marvelous though. In the 19th century, the final chorus was performed far more often than a whole act, let alone the full work. Quite typical in an era wherein single arias or single acts would be carved from oratorios or operas for performance.


The introduction to Winter is excellent too, so is the Overture. The Sunrise, 'Sie steiget auf', is awesome, I think it even surpasses that in the Creation. There are many excellent parts in the oratorio imo.


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## hpowders (Dec 23, 2013)

I would stick my neck out (not really too far) and claim "The Creation" to be Haydn's greatest work.


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## Couac Addict (Oct 16, 2013)

Perhaps Haydn was on an hourly rate


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## HaydnBearstheClock (Jul 6, 2013)

hpowders said:


> I would stick my neck out (not really too far) and claim "The Creation" to be Haydn's greatest work.


It's probably true - however, Haydn has a whole lot more amazing music - the London symphonies alone are, on their own, as much of an achievement imo.


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## hpowders (Dec 23, 2013)

Yes, but the "Creation" seems to be his most inspired work.


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## Alydon (May 16, 2012)

Following other answers it seems Haydn was only able to complete the two Op77 rather than the six intended quartets. I think there may have been other reasons than lack of creativity as certainly the opening movement of Op77 in G major is as sprightly and inventive as any of Haydn's other quartets and the remainder of the Op 77 are very at the same level as the Op76. It is well documented that Haydn wasn't short of money at this time and possible just didn't want the effort of composing four more quartets and apart from that his reputation in this genre was complete.


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## mikey (Nov 26, 2013)

Some info here but apparently a mystery.
Also says "In summary, this "late" work of Haydn's shows absolutely no diminution of craft, creativity or energy."
http://www.earsense.org/blog/?p=350


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