# Save me from myself



## Polednice

and my inability to learn from my mistakes.

Polednice has very few friends. Polednice finds it hard to make friends and doesn't really want that many. Polednice finds socialising extremely unpleasant, and is really just a symptom or two short from having Asperger's. Still, Polednice sometimes pushes himself to socialise.

So, Polednice is in London. Polednice was supposed to just be staying with one close friend. Said friend did not tell Polednice that there would be a house party tonight. Polednice is hiding on his own in said friend's room with said friend's laptop, because he would rather display and be judged for his strangenesses and inabilities than suffer the stress and discomfort of navigating noise and music and chatter of too, too many people.

This is why I talk to you folks about a lot of random stuff a lot of the time. Because whenever I venture out into the world of having real friends in the real world, something unexpected and unpredictable happens that tells me I should not leave my shell and that I would rather be an avatar online than a social human being.

You may not understand my mentality - most people don't. But don't be most people and don't judge me for it. I have a social 'disability' and it's very hard and upsetting to live with. People often assume I'm cold, judgemental and have a superiority complex, but really I'm just pathetic and scared.


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## moody

That was always obvious but nobody is condemning you, maybe you have more friends than you think.


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## Kopachris

I would be your friend if we weren't thousands of miles apart. I know that feel you're feeling all too well.


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## Yoshi

I had a similar situation today. My mother was visiting a few family members and I decided to stay in the car because I really didn't feel like socializing, it usualy makes me very anxious and awkward. So yeah I stood in the car listening to classical music like a weirdo till she returned. To be honest most of my family is used to my personality already, they don't question anymore if I want to be alone most of the time. 

Hmm yeah I don't know how I can help you because I'm almost the same lol. And yes I'm judged a lot but I really don't care anymore. I feel like my bestfriend and my boyfriend are the only people I need. I guess if extroverted people are understood and accepted, introverted people should too. Just my opinion. But if it bothers you being like this, there are ways to get better social skills by doing a little practise.


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## Ukko

For many years, extending into decades, I could only tolerate parties by getting drunk as soon as possible, and socializing as little as possible. I aged out of the problem; maybe you will too.


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## Crudblud

You're not alone.

No, really, there's a serial killer in your friend's closet! NO, DON'T OPEN THAT DOOR!

But seriously; I'm about as socially inept as they come, I know it sucks when there are lots of people you don't know and don't particularly want to know hanging around in your general vicinity.


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## aleazk

but Poled... we are all like you here!!


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## ComposerOfAvantGarde

I thought Polednice left???


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## Crudblud

He did, but now he is communicating with us from the place he went when he left.


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## ComposerOfAvantGarde

Crudblud said:


> He did, but now he is communicating with us from the place he went when he left.


Why couldn't he _not_ communicate with us on this website? It would be a lot less confusing for me then.


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## Oskaar

I will not say that I KNOW your situation, but I can understand it maybe, struggeling with many things myselfe. But you have one of the clearest voices in here, and by clear, I men that you lay your personality behind it when you post. That is a very good capacity, and I am sure you can be successfull with that in social life to, if you only dare. But daring is hard.


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## sospiro

Be strong Poley. Even though you are just words on a screen, your strength of character & personality brighten my life.


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## Polednice

Thanks for your sweet words of kindness and encouragement guys!!  This is precisely why I value our little community so much, even though we often argue about many things! And this is exactly what I would point to in order to disprove any fool who said that you can't find true friendship on an internet forum. It's not the most conventional kind, but, to me, it is the most enriching and reassuring. 

I've made it through the evening and can sleep now. Tomorrow: home!


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## ComposerOfAvantGarde

Polednice said:


> Thanks for your sweet words of kindness and encouragement guys!!  This is precisely why I value our little community so much, even though we often argue about many things! And this is exactly what I would point to in order to disprove any fool who said that you can't find true friendship on an internet forum. It's not the most conventional kind, but, to me, it is the most enriching and reassuring.
> 
> I've made it through the evening and can sleep now. Tomorrow: home!


Does that mean you're going to leave again?


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## Fsharpmajor

Polednice said:


> Thanks for your sweet words of kindness and encouragement guys!!  This is precisely why I value our little community so much, even though we often argue about many things! And this is exactly what I would point to in order to disprove any fool who said that you can't find true friendship on an internet forum. It's not the most conventional kind, but, to me, it is the most enriching and reassuring.
> 
> I've made it through the evening and can sleep now. Tomorrow: home!


Not so fast! To begin with, how can you know for sure that we are real?


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## Crudblud

INCOMING TRANSMISSION

"Doctor Brahms, these are the results of the 'simulated digital social experience' tests on one CODENAME Polednice"

"Franz, are you sure this is a secure line?"

"Oh ****... turn it off, Ludwig! Turn it off!"

TRANSMISSION TERMINATED


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## Philip

i'm happy we're only internet friends, this way i don't have to see your bad english teeth


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## moody

Crudblud said:


> He did, but now he is communicating with us from the place he went when he left.


What is it Heaven or the other place?


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## Crudblud

moody said:


> What is it Heaven or the other place?


London, sort of like the other place only you can buy stuff and get terribly confused by their public transportation systems.


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## ComposerOfAvantGarde

Crudblud said:


> London, sort of like the other place only you can buy stuff and get terribly confused by their public transportation systems.


What is the public transportation system like then?


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## moody

Crudblud said:


> London, sort of like the other place only you can buy stuff and get terribly confused by their public transportation systems.


 Watch it, I'm a Londoner mush !


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## moody

Probably when he finds out there's a new Rachmaninoff thread


ComposerOfAvantGarde said:


> Does that mean you're going to leave again?


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## moody

ComposerOfAvantGarde said:


> What is the public transportation system like then?


I thought I'd done this it is very good, big red buses, the underground (Tube) system which is huge, overground trains as well and of course the famous London taxis.


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## Huilunsoittaja

@Polednice

More like you haven't actually met anyone who _should_ be your friend yet...

I must admit it's extremely painful to read your posts. I am really sad for you. It's people like you that I write my short stories about actually. Because those kinds of men I'm really attracted to, the ones the sit out of the crowd, and lurk in corners. But I wouldn't just leave them in the corner. They're the ones I see, and think, "Woah, he probably has a lot to say if someone were to open him up."

I hope you meet someone who could do that for you.


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## clavichorder

It sounds like you are being exposed to too much all at once for the time being, and you are suffering from hard self criticism for feeling like you are falling short faced with this tough situation to boot. I will say that you should do away with the worst of your self criticism if you can, and a little help from us on that is certainly appropriate(since its hard just to "do away with"), in saying that there is nothing wrong with introverted tendencies, and that we(I relate as well) relate. But perhaps we don't want this place to be too comfortable either, I think Polednice, that you will have to keep trying and that one day you will be better equipped to handle social situations, the time will come. You may even be like me in that you secretly yearn for some safe social interaction(I did yearn, but now I get enough of it). That's my whole long term goal oriented mode of speaking, I don't really know what else to offer.

Once again, I don't really know that what I'm trying to say will be understood as I got caught up in nuance. I want to be a little challenging to you, but I don't know how appropriate it is to do so. Socializing can be good. I think you are right to recognize that you are scared. But that is no cause for shame, not being hard on yourself is tough to do; simply recognizing you are scared without the self hate might help you if you want to overcome some of the painful social difficulty. It won't change who you are fundamentally to socially open up either, so you needn't be worried about sacrificing integrity at being a more social being.


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## violadude

Don't worry Polednice, I feel the same way. Most people are extremely boring anyway, you aren't missing much. 

Socializing is over-rated.


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## Ukko

Huilunsoittaja said:


> @Polednice
> 
> More like you haven't actually met anyone who _should_ be your friend yet...
> 
> I must admit it's extremely painful to read your posts. I am really sad for you. It's people like you that I write my short stories about actually. Because those kinds of men I'm really attracted to, the ones the sit out of the crowd, and lurk in corners. But I wouldn't just leave them in the corner. They're the ones I see, and think, "Woah, he probably has a lot to say if someone were to open him up."
> 
> I hope you meet someone who could do that for you.


"open him up"?


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## starthrower

Poley, you gotta get away from the computer and get some fresh air. I agree with Violadude that most people are boring and socializing is no great fun. Get out and go to some chamber music concerts. I'm going to do the same starting next weekend.


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## Kopachris

Hilltroll72 said:


> Huilunsoittaja said:
> 
> 
> 
> @Polednice
> 
> More like you haven't actually met anyone who _should_ be your friend yet...
> 
> I must admit it's extremely painful to read your posts. I am really sad for you. It's people like you that I write my short stories about actually. Because those kinds of men I'm really attracted to, the ones the sit out of the crowd, and lurk in corners. But I wouldn't just leave them in the corner. They're the ones I see, and think, "Woah, he probably has a lot to say if someone were to open him up."
> 
> I hope you meet someone who could do that for you.
> 
> 
> 
> "open him up"?
Click to expand...

Now I'm thinking about cupcakes.... And the works of Xiang Yu.


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## Polednice

Those who have said it are right to point out that I'm probably not _completely_ inept and that it just takes meeting the right people. As it happens, looking back on my last few years, it seems that my general trend is to find a new friend _very_ occasionally, but for them to become extremely close friends. I don't deal at all well with 'acquaintances' or 'friends' you can only exchange pleasantries with.

For me, we can either talk about life, the universe, and everything, or we don't talk at all. Thankfully, I have perhaps 3 or 4 friends like this (though it took months to develop the friendship in each instance because it takes months for me to open up). They are the only people I see except for tutors and doctors etc., and I don't mind that. But socialising is so often about big groups rather than one-to-ones that I sometimes find myself in horrible situations like this weekend.



starthrower said:


> Poley, you gotta get away from the computer and get some fresh air. I agree with Violadude that most people are boring and socializing is no great fun. Get out and go to some chamber music concerts. I'm going to do the same starting next weekend.


What's the computer got to do with it?


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## Couchie

Polednice said:


> You may not understand my mentality - most people don't. But don't be most people and don't judge me for it. I have a social 'disability' and it's very hard and upsetting to live with. People often assume I'm cold, judgemental and have a superiority complex, but really I'm just pathetic and scared.


You're not actually as weird as you think you are, there is a reason alcohol has been at the centre of adult socialization in most cultures for pretty much all of human history and it isn't because it tastes good. The only way to improve at anything is to practice. University is excellent at presenting awkward social situations on a weekly basis, embrace them! You MUST give people a greater benefit of doubt... surely you see the irony of "People often assume I'm cold, judgemental and have a superiority complex".


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## Polednice

Couchie said:


> You're not actually as weird as you think you are, there is a reason alcohol has been at the centre of adult socialization in most cultures for pretty much all of human history and it isn't because it tastes good. The only way to improve at anything is to practice. University is excellent at presenting awkward social situations on a weekly basis, embrace them! You MUST give people a greater benefit of doubt... surely you see the irony of "People often assume I'm cold, judgemental and have a superiority complex".


I have no respect for people who use alcohol as a social lubricant because, if it's true that it serves that purpose so widely, then society would be so much better if people openly acknowledged their idiosyncrasies and incapabilities and anxieties instead of trying to cover them up in this ridiculous game of social-cues-hide-and-seek.

Anyway, I don't want to embrace awkward social situations. I avoid them and I'm happy doing that because, even when I get through one without feeling terrible, I don't get anything from it. I'd rather sit in my room and read. And I'm not wrong about how people judge me.

----------

Sorry, I just want to go on a little rant for a second. You see, I've thought about this even when I'm in a good frame of mind because my partner has Asperger's and finds all this even more difficult than me and gets very upset about it. But why? Because the world is so ****ing inconsiderate. Everyone is expected to play by this arbitrary unwritten rules of social niceties and platitudes and stepping on egg-shells at every ****ing turn. He, and others like him, shouldn't be led in the way they are to feeling that there is something wrong with them. They're just different, and society doesn't tolerate this difference.

For example, I was talking to someone today and they told me about a flat-mate they used to have who they named "Crazy Jess". Why? Because she was socially awkward. Because when Crazy Jess brought friends to the house, the person I was talking to (let's call her Agnes) would be very friendly and talk to them all and not get too much in the way but still socialise; but, when Agnes brought people to the house, Crazy Jess would be quiet and stay away or seem awkward. So Agnes was annoyed with Crazy Jess for her social inability because it made Agnes feel 'guilty'.

WELL **** YOU, AGNES. Jess doesn't have to play your ****ing ridiculous social games, and maybe she doesn't want you flaunting your social skills whenever she has friends at the house. This is what I'm talking about - people don't see social awkwardness and accept a simple social difference, something to be respected or at least tolerated, they see an annoying deficiency, _something they believe the person can change but is unwilling to_. WHEN IT CAN'T BE CHANGED, IT'S ****ING HARD AND SHOULDN'T HAVE TO BE CHANGED.

I don't know where I'm going with this. I'm just so ****ing sick of humans. I want to make a city inside a bubble called Aspieland where only people with properly diagnosed social anxiety disorders are allowed entry. **** the rest of you!


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## Ukko

As Jim Carey would say... "Well all right then."


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## violadude

I can relate with you actually. Maybe I don't get anxiety around big groups like you do, but like I said, I just think it's boring. I talk to people at school and I am friendly, but a choice between hanging out with people outside of the school or staying at home by myself on the computer, I will definitely pick the computer.

"people don't see social awkwardness and accept a simple social difference, something to be respected or at least tolerated, they see an annoying deficiency, something they believe the person can change but is unwilling to. WHEN IT CAN'T BE CHANGED, IT'S ****ING HARD AND SHOULDN'T HAVE TO BE CHANGED."

This is the part I can really relate to. My dad and my sister are constantly hounding me to be more social and to make more friends and to be more outgoing blah blah blah so I can get "the college experience" (which apparently is more important than a college *degree* ). But they just don't realize that I don't care to hang out with large groups of people and I'm fine with entertaining myself most of the time.


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## Lisztian

All I can say is that I hear you loud and clear. I actually suffer from Social Anxiety Disorder myself and have for a few years now. I think that at the end of the day it's not about what you struggle with, it's about accepting what you struggle with and then working on it, while looking at the good sides. For one, it gives you much more time to do other things - which from your posts seems to have served you very well. You are one of my favourite posters for a variety of reasons and seemingly a very learned and intelligent man who has a great sense of humour despite struggling in the real world socially. Also when you are deprived of something you really appreciate what you do have in that area, whenever you happen to get it. So it's about accepting and embracing your situation, working on it and just going at your own, individual, unique pace. Others can think what they want in the end, but all that matters is that you keep your own life rolling and do your best.


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## Couchie

Polednice said:


> I have no respect for people who use alcohol as a social lubricant because, if it's true that it serves that purpose so widely, then society would be so much better if people openly acknowledged their idiosyncrasies and incapabilities and anxieties instead of trying to cover them up in this ridiculous game of social-cues-hide-and-seek.


We can go on all day about how the world "should be". In reality we have to make the best of how it is, whether that's by drinking alcohol or locking yourself in the room. I wouldn't judge drinkers right after demanding to not be judged for your own coping methods.



Polednice said:


> Anyway, I don't want to embrace awkward social situations. I avoid them and I'm happy doing that because, even when I get through one without feeling terrible, I don't get anything from it. I'd rather sit in my room and read. And I'm not wrong about how people judge me.


Then why did make this thread and label yourself "pathetic and scared"? Sounds to me like you're not content with the situation.


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## Philip

Couchie said:


> You're not actually as weird as you think you are, there is a reason alcohol has been at the centre of adult socialization in most cultures for pretty much all of human history and it isn't because it tastes good. The only way to improve at anything is to practice. University is excellent at presenting awkward social situations on a weekly basis, embrace them! You MUST give people a greater benefit of doubt... surely you see the irony of "People often assume I'm cold, judgemental and have a superiority complex".


this. nothing wrong with a good stout in the winter to loosen you up.


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## Vaneyes




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## Lukecash12

Polednice said:


> and my inability to learn from my mistakes.
> 
> Polednice has very few friends. Polednice finds it hard to make friends and doesn't really want that many. Polednice finds socialising extremely unpleasant, and is really just a symptom or two short from having Asperger's. Still, Polednice sometimes pushes himself to socialise.
> 
> So, Polednice is in London. Polednice was supposed to just be staying with one close friend. Said friend did not tell Polednice that there would be a house party tonight. Polednice is hiding on his own in said friend's room with said friend's laptop, because he would rather display and be judged for his strangenesses and inabilities than suffer the stress and discomfort of navigating noise and music and chatter of too, too many people.
> 
> This is why I talk to you folks about a lot of random stuff a lot of the time. Because whenever I venture out into the world of having real friends in the real world, something unexpected and unpredictable happens that tells me I should not leave my shell and that I would rather be an avatar online than a social human being.
> 
> You may not understand my mentality - most people don't. But don't be most people and don't judge me for it. I have a social 'disability' and it's very hard and upsetting to live with. People often assume I'm cold, judgemental and have a superiority complex, but really I'm just pathetic and scared.


You really think you have a disability? I don't know about that, but I do think you can have some of the life skills you want anyways. My Papa (Portugal's name for granddad) had pretty severe autism and he managed to be considered a sociable guy, so there's definitely hope for you.

So, if you would, please tell me how it is that you think you are disabled? If a PM would be better, shoot me one.


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## Polednice

Couchie said:


> We can go on all day about how the world "should be". In reality we have to make the best of how it is, whether that's by drinking alcohol or locking yourself in the room. I wouldn't judge drinkers right after demanding to not be judged for your own coping methods.


Some coping mechanisms retain more integrity than others.



Couchie said:


> Then why did make this thread and label yourself "pathetic and scared"? Sounds to me like you're not content with the situation.


I'm obviously conflicted and I don't deny it. I want to live in a world I can't live in, and, because I can't, therefore crave skills that I can't develop that I wouldn't need in the first place if I was in the world I wanted.



Lukecash12 said:


> You really think you have a disability? I don't know about that, but I do think you can have some of the life skills you want anyways. My Papa (Portugal's name for granddad) had pretty severe autism and he managed to be considered a sociable guy, so there's definitely hope for you.
> 
> So, if you would, please tell me how it is that you think you are disabled? If a PM would be better, shoot me one.


These kinds of things exist on a spectrum, and not all people can have a diagnostic label (PDD-NOS is an example). But I think it's reasonable to say that if something significantly affects your quality of life, then it is a disability of some sort or another.


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## lou

Polednice said:


> I don't know where I'm going with this. I'm just so ****ing sick of humans. I want to make a city inside a bubble called Aspieland where only people with properly diagnosed social anxiety disorders are allowed entry. **** the rest of you!


What if we threw a party for all of us with social anxiety disorder and no one came? Or would they? If only we had transporters, like on Star Trek. It would be fun to see what happened!


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## Polednice

lou said:


> What if we threw a party for all of us with social anxiety disorder and no one came? Or would they? If only we had transporters, like on Star Trek. It would be fun to see what happened!


People would come, but there would be no music, no loud noises, no talking over each other, no unpredictabilities, and everyone would have a bloody good time.


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## Lukecash12

> These kinds of things exist on a spectrum, and not all people can have a diagnostic label (PDD-NOS is an example). But I think it's reasonable to say that if something significantly affects your quality of life, then it is a disability of some sort or another.


That definition makes a bit of sense, but when it's put to the test I don't think it would be a tenable definition because of all of the issues of personality, culture, and upbringing that can then be lumped under disabilities. So, I would assert that disabilities are conditions with symptoms, symptoms that hinder and disable people from doing one or more important activities, just as it is defined by most any psychologist I've known or studied the work of.

The distinction here-

Possibly: If you just don't like being around a lot of people, because they annoy you and there's too much going on at once, guess what? You may be perfectly sane and normal in thinking and feeling that way. It's not as if all people were made to be busybodies and socialites. That you just don't like that environment simply means a thing or two about your personality, and possibly your background.

Or: If you feel actually stunted in these situations, in that you can't participate in social interactions like other people, and you get butterflies, speak in monotone, feel your heart rate go up, and often find yourself confused by people and misreading them, then you may very well have a social disorder.

I make these points to you in order to really assess where you are at, because disorders aren't fun at all and they literally require life changes or even therapy in order for you to be happy. If you have issues of boundaries, upbringing, personality, etc., those can be dealt with more easily, however irritating they may be. I don't mean to trivialize you, but there is a marked difference between a grown man having nausea and panic attacks from needles, and a gal who really just doesn't like needles. One person is humiliated, confused, and feels stunted in comparison to others his age, completely unable to be the rational person he normally is, while the other person simply finds needles unpleasant, using her rational mind to tolerate their presence and just get it over with.

Considering that you went into a room and confined yourself away from everyone else, I wouldn't be surprised if you get symptoms. However, that hasn't been established.


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## Polednice

Lukecash12 said:


> Or: If you feel actually stunted in these situations, in that you can't participate in social interactions like other people, and you get butterflies, speak in monotone, feel your heart rate go up, and often find yourself confused by people and misreading them, then you may very well have a social disorder.


That is me, and more besides, which is why I have spent years on anti-depressants and have counselling every week. So I hope you don't think I was trivialising what it means to have a disability or a disorder because I do know from first hand experience how debilitating and frustrating and horrible and upsetting it can be to have one. It's just that my problems fall under the vague categories of 'depression' and 'social anxiety' rather than any more precise disorders.


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## Lukecash12

Polednice said:


> That is me, and more besides, which is why I have spent years on anti-depressants and have counselling every week. So I hope you don't think I was trivialising what it means to have a disability or a disorder because I do know from first hand experience how debilitating and frustrating and horrible and upsetting it can be to have one. It's just that my problems fall under the vague categories of 'depression' and 'social anxiety' rather than any more precise disorders.


Then it appears to me that you've not been given a proper diagnosis, if you are taking antidepressants. It irks me that the professionals today will give people antidepressants often without any good attempt at diagnosis. All that the medications ever did was chip away at my mother's pride and put a bandaid on the problem, instead of giving her the assistance she needed, for just one of many examples.

To be frank: You're a particularly morbid person, and you've been dealing with morbid health issues. As a friend/acquaintance of about two years (?), I think it's time you looked into some sort of diagnosis. It's a shame that someone who has undergone as much treatment as you, might be taking medication you don't have to take. That stuff will wear on your digestive tract, and just patch up a problem you can very well come to terms with better if you knew what the issue was better.


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## Polednice

Lukecash12 said:


> Then it appears to me that you've not been given a proper diagnosis, if you are taking antidepressants. It irks me that the professionals today will give people antidepressants often without any good attempt at diagnosis. All that the medications ever did was chip away at my mother's pride and put a bandaid on the problem, instead of giving her the assistance she needed, for just one of many examples.
> 
> To be frank: You're a particularly morbid person, and you've been dealing with morbid health issues. As a friend/acquaintance of about two years (?), I think it's time you looked into some sort of diagnosis. It's a shame that someone who has undergone as much treatment as you, might be taking medication you don't have to take. That stuff will wear on your digestive tract, and just patch up a problem you can very well come to terms with better if you knew what the issue was better.


Hmm, I suppose I haven't given enough thought to looking at the issue from this perspective. I'll give it a try with help from your PMs.


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## TrazomGangflow

If you don't want friends then that is fine. But if you want them I'm sure you could get them. You have a good sense of humor, at least when talking about classical music. I'm sure you could transfer that into everyday life.


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## Couchie

Polednice said:


> Some coping mechanisms retain more integrity than others.


Meh, it's a matter of brain chemistry. Some people have the chemicals to be naturally outgoing. Some need a little help to bring them up to speed. Appealing to moral "integrity" is unscientific and makes you sound like a ******* Republican.



Polednice said:


> I'm obviously conflicted and I don't deny it. I want to live in a world I can't live in, and, because I can't, therefore crave skills that I can't develop that I wouldn't need in the first place if I was in the world I wanted.


This is the only world you're going to get. You CAN develop these skills, but only by putting yourself out there and practicing. If you are unwilling to do so then you need to stop complaining.


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## Guest

For many people, these types of problems mellow with age. Not sure why though.

Eat healthy food, take long walks, make sure you sleep enough, try to keep "screen time" to a reasonable minimum, avoid substance abuse (although it sounds like you're okay here), and try keep your focus on positive thoughts - these all sound like platitudes, but they are important and will help improve your quality of life. Beyond that, just create your own reality and enjoy it. Nothing is ever as bad (or as good) as it seems.


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## ComposerOfAvantGarde

BPS said:


> For many people, these types of problems mellow with age. Not sure why though.
> 
> Eat healthy food, take long walks, make sure you sleep enough, try to keep "screen time" to a reasonable minimum, avoid substance abuse (although it sounds like you're okay here), and try keep your focus on positive thoughts - these all sound like platitudes, but they are important and will help improve your quality of life. Beyond that, just create your own reality and enjoy it. Nothing is ever as bad (or as good) as it seems.


I do none of those things you listed. Other than eat healthy food.


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## aleazk

> For many people, these types of problems mellow with age. Not sure why though.
> 
> Eat healthy food, take long walks, make sure you sleep enough, try to keep "screen time" to a reasonable minimum, *avoid substance abuse* (although it sounds like you're okay here), and try keep your focus on positive thoughts - these all sound like platitudes, but they are important and will help improve your quality of life. Beyond that, just create your own reality and enjoy it. Nothing is ever as bad (or as good) as it seems.





ComposerOfAvantGarde said:


> *I do none of those things you listed*. Other than eat healthy food.


mmmmm, interesting, now I understand your style of composition


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## ComposerOfAvantGarde

aleazk said:


> mmmmm, interesting, now I understand your style of composition


There _are_ substances that I abuse, just not the ones people might immediately think of.


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## Guest

Maybe puppies?



Edit: Uh-oh. Past my bedtime. All traces of wit are gone.


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## Couchie

ComposerOfAvantGarde said:


> There _are_ substances that I abuse, just not the ones people might immediately think of.


Uranium-235?


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## Crudblud

What he does is get out his special vial of liquidised hair and sprinkle it on his breakfast cereal.


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## ComposerOfAvantGarde

Couchie said:


> Uranium-235?


Yes and also Plutonium-239.


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## Sid James

Polednice said:


> ...Polednice is hiding on his own in said friend's room with said friend's laptop, because he would rather display and be judged for his strangenesses and inabilities than suffer the stress and discomfort of navigating noise and music and chatter of too, too many people...





> ...
> You may not understand my mentality - most people don't. But don't be most people and don't judge me for it. I have a social 'disability' and it's very hard and upsetting to live with. People often assume I'm cold, judgemental and have a superiority complex, but really I'm just pathetic and scared.


People judge eachother, even unconsciously. I've been guilty of judging and been judged. Sometimes I only stop judging a person once I get to know him/her. Maybe for that I have to take a kind of risk, but if I don't, I will remain in the same position.

Some people are not comfortable with diversity. Maybe it's their loss, if they want to revolve around the same circles and only mix with the "in crowd" or whatever. But you'd be surprised, most people have insecurities of some kind, it's just that some people don't show it, cover it up, etc.

Bottom line for me is that I try not to worry what people think about me. I've been there done that. Probably still do that to a degree. But now I just do and say what I want, within normal bounds, of course. Politeness and manners is the most important thing to me. I don't like to be rude but I am direct, I speak my mind. If I want to change a conversation I think is boring, I just say openly, but courteously, let's talk about something else. Or move it on by other means, but just be natural.

For me, it's important to be myself. If certain people judge that, it's their business, they own that judgement. I don't worry what I say, people who have a life forget what you say anyway. It's the people who remember what I said like 5 years ago, and inevitably use it against me, they're the ones who are hard to work on, bring into the zone of being natural and normal. I have succeeded with some of these difficult situations. But it takes time. I mean I don't even remember what I said to someone here yesterday most of the time. I get my memory of what I said to different people mixed up.

So just relax. Most people aren't out to get you. & you can deal with, or learn to deal with, those few who are difficult or hostile, etc. It's basic psychology. But I prefer not to play mind games, just be natural, be myself. If a few people can't accept that, well as I said it's their business, their judgement, they own it like I own my own...


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## Polednice

Couchie said:


> This is the only world you're going to get. You CAN develop these skills, but only by putting yourself out there and practicing. If you are unwilling to do so then you need to stop complaining.


Oh **** off. You're just like the rest of them.


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## Couchie

Polednice said:


> Oh **** off. You're just like the rest of them.


Sorry, but daydreaming about how you would like the world to be is not going to make that world materialize. So that is a dead-end. You then have 2 choices, either try and develop these social skills, and I don't know how do that without just putting yourself out there and forcing yourself to socialize; you can't learn to play a piano without playing a piano. If you refuse to do that, then you need to learn to not give a **** when people judge you. People judge all the time, yourself included. Complaining about it won't change anything. I don't see why you made a thread entitled "Save me from myself" then tell people to **** off when they try to offer you more than just sympathy.


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## Philip

adopt a kitten and purchase a bicycle


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## clavichorder

Polednice, I think there is truth to Couchie's message that would be well not be written off, concerning practicing socializing, that's essentially the point of his message. (Before you write me off, read on to get the whole of my message, its not always apparent even to me, but something has been achieved I assure you)But also, some of the older members have given their two cents about how some of these things you deal with fade with age. And believe me, I went through the whole aspergers deal, and if anything, make your crutch what it probably is mostly: severe social anxiety. You may very well have some aspergers traits, I might, but there are some pretty social people with the disorder actually, who aren't necessarily sufferers of extreme social anxiety. I know the disorder is a very personal thing, and it can be helpful at times to lean on it when in need, but don't make it a situation of permanence, you'll never be satisfied with it anyway. Lively and fun socializing can happen among the interesting crowds of people who disdained the word "socialize" back in high school as something for more obnoxious of "the social types." 

I hope I am not hurting you with this challenge. I am cautious because I know what its like to be looking for real sympathy and comforting meaning, only to find a challenge, it really throws one off, and my former best friend disdained me for being tough on him when he had problems similar to yours: and ultimately resented resented me. My only hope is that i present the idea of socializing in a new light. I believe that people like you and him, have a lot to offer, but are extremely clever at finding ways to hide in mazes of abstraction that are unhelpful in the long run. I have the problem myself to an extent.


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## clavichorder

Right now, if I have a self to be saved from, its the part of me that dreads school work. Its only fair if I advise you on your social difficulty Polednice, that I somehow stave off my own unconscious trickery that prevents me from doing any work. That's my personal thing... No kidding.


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## Polednice

Couchie said:


> Sorry, but daydreaming about how you would like the world to be is not going to make that world materialize. So that is a dead-end. You then have 2 choices, either try and develop these social skills, and I don't know how do that without just putting yourself out there and forcing yourself to socialize; you can't learn to play a piano without playing a piano. If you refuse to do that, then you need to learn to not give a **** when people judge you. People judge all the time, yourself included. Complaining about it won't change anything. I don't see why you made a thread entitled "Save me from myself" then tell people to **** off when they try to offer you more than just sympathy.


You are one of the many people whose empathy does not extend to understanding the abilities and inabilities of people like me - just like I can't understand how those who function better than me manage it. Others like you at least accept human diversity and accept that certain difficult or impossible obstacles exist for some people, which can't and shouldn't be overcome by alcohol or some other idiotic pathway to achieving an arbitrarily preferred brain state, and so make considerate compromises and tolerate certain kinds of awkwardness. You, however, trot out the most tiresome, pointless, short-sighted, idiotic piece of advice, which is to practice. Shall I practice my way out of depression as well? I'll just tell myself to be happy, right, and that'll work for sure? No, scrap that. I've got a better idea. I'll practice my way out of having these tumours in my body. You know, I'll just think that they're not there and eventually I'll cure myself.

This is what I'm sick of. People just don't get that some psychological traits in some people are _not_ changeable through practice and will-power. They can become manageable, but they _don't_ change. So that's why I get angry, and that's why I tell people to **** off. Because, yes, I'm conflicted, and I've contradicted myself in this thread, and I still don't know what to think or what to do with myself, and I think I've probably over-reacted to you and to others at other times, but I've spent half of my life so far being made to feel like an inadequate piece of **** because I can't play by the rules of the social game, and I utterly, whole-heartedly, unreservedly resent anyone who has the gall to tell me that I only need to practice and think and behave differently as though I've so far been lazy or stupid.

I'm not just some vain, insecure teenager worried about what other people think. Most of the time, I really don't give a **** what people think, but that doesn't stop me feeling anxious and nauseous when faced by social situations. It's not that I care what some crowd of morons thinks of me, it's that there is too much going on, too much to process, too much to think about and analyse, and it stresses the **** out of me. You can say, "well you just need to learn not care about that stuff", well, **** that, that is how my brain works and I can't help it, and I just wish people would acknowledge it and expect no more of me.


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## Polednice

clavichorder said:


> I hope I am not hurting you with this challenge. I am cautious because I know what its like to be looking for real sympathy and comforting meaning, only to find a challenge, it really throws one off, and my former best friend disdained me for being tough on him when he had problems similar to yours: and ultimately resented resented me. My only hope is that i present the idea of socializing in a new light. I believe that people like you and him, have a lot to offer, but are extremely clever at finding ways to hide in mazes of abstraction that are unhelpful in the long run. I have the problem myself to an extent.


Challenge is fine, and I know a great deal of managing difficulties like this is challenging oneself. Which I do. Which I did last year and which I did last week and which I did this weekend. And about 90% of social interactions, for me, are very negative experiences. Of course, that means 10% are good - wonderful, even - and so I shouldn't do anything that would close those opportunities to me. But the 90% is so heart-breaking and upsetting, and people are so inconsiderate of my difficulties - _and_ sometimes when I feel like I'm pushing myself to find the 10% I only end up in the 90% - that it doesn't always seem worth the hardship.


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## clavichorder

^^^^Ughh, this hurts to read. Nothing confuses one and tears away at you like self conflict. The better part of me wishes I could piece it together for you(whatever the solution may be) without having an agenda of my own and pushing any wrong buttons. My only wish to you right now is that you find some relief. As much as I am capable, I feel for you.


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## Polednice

As it is an important thing to recognise one's own fallibility and mistakes, I just want to apologise if I've come across as a bit of a prick in this thread. Looking back over the past couple of pages, I know I was disproportionately upset by Couchie's replies, probably because I read them through the haze of tiredness and a headache this morning, but this is obviously a very sensitive topic that I have nowhere near worked out myself. My main point, however, about innate social capabilities that cannot and should not be changed, and cannot and should not be hidden, remains. We often talk about how everyone has their insecurities - well how about we all stop hiding the bloody things, playing complicated games of smoke and mirrors that people like me just can't ****ing follow!

/caaaalm


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## violadude

My advice is to simply try and not meet people in large social situations like a party. It seems to me like that 90% comes from those kind of situations, but if you can stick with a small group of close friends that you meet in small venues or in small ways (one on one,like you like it) and derive that 10% experience from those people, I'd say there is nothing wrong with that.

Again, socializing = over-rated.


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## clavichorder

Edit, not helpful.


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## clavichorder

violadude said:


> My advice is to simply try and not meet people in large social situations like a party. It seems to me like that 90% comes from those kind of situations, but if you can stick with a small group of close friends that you meet in small venues or in small ways (one on one,like you like it) and derive that 10% experience from those people, I'd say there is nothing wrong with that.
> 
> Again, socializing = over-rated.


Smart, I think.


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## Chrythes

violadude said:


> My advice is to simply try and not meet people in large social situations like a party. It seems to me like that 90% comes from those kind of situations, but if you can stick with a small group of close friends that you meet in small venues or in small ways (one on one,like you like it) and derive that 10% experience from those people, I'd say there is nothing wrong with that.
> 
> Again, socializing = over-rated.


This is what I've been started doing before leaving my country. I just became sick of spending too much time with people that I don't care about, so I just narrowed my social experience to a small number of friends that I feel the most comfortable with.
It did affect the time I was spending with them, as when they go out they usually meet with other people that I wouldn't usually meet with, but It's manageable - at least for me, there's always at least one person that I could spend the time with, without having to confront socially unpleasant situations.


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## Couchie

Polednice said:


> You are one of the many people whose empathy does not extend to understanding the abilities and inabilities of people like me - just like I can't understand how those who function better than me manage it. Others like you at least accept human diversity and accept that certain difficult or impossible obstacles exist for some people, which can't and shouldn't be overcome by alcohol or some other idiotic pathway to achieving an arbitrarily preferred brain state, and so make considerate compromises and tolerate certain kinds of awkwardness. You, however, trot out the most tiresome, pointless, short-sighted, idiotic piece of advice, which is to practice. Shall I practice my way out of depression as well? I'll just tell myself to be happy, right, and that'll work for sure? No, scrap that. I've got a better idea. I'll practice my way out of having these tumours in my body. You know, I'll just think that they're not there and eventually I'll cure myself.
> 
> This is what I'm sick of. People just don't get that some psychological traits in some people are _not_ changeable through practice and will-power. They can become manageable, but they _don't_ change. So that's why I get angry, and that's why I tell people to **** off. Because, yes, I'm conflicted, and I've contradicted myself in this thread, and I still don't know what to think or what to do with myself, and I think I've probably over-reacted to you and to others at other times, but I've spent half of my life so far being made to feel like an inadequate piece of **** because I can't play by the rules of the social game, and I utterly, whole-heartedly, unreservedly resent anyone who has the gall to tell me that I only need to practice and think and behave differently as though I've so far been lazy or stupid.
> 
> I'm not just some vain, insecure teenager worried about what other people think. Most of the time, I really don't give a **** what people think, but that doesn't stop me feeling anxious and nauseous when faced by social situations. It's not that I care what some crowd of morons thinks of me, it's that there is too much going on, too much to process, too much to think about and analyse, and it stresses the **** out of me. You can say, "well you just need to learn not care about that stuff", well, **** that, that is how my brain works and I can't help it, and I just wish people would acknowledge it and expect no more of me.


The idea that nothing can be done about social anxiety runs counter to the experiences of myself and many others. Yes, "practice", support groups and forcing yourself to go to social events is absolute hell but it has proven effective for many people. I appreciate that it is a spectrum and everyone is different. The picture you painted is that you haven't done a lot of practicing but resort to locking yourself in your room. If that is not the case, I fully apologize. Also you have obviously have my sympathy for the tumors and depression, I'm not suggesting practicing is the cure to everything.


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## myaskovsky2002

Polednice said:


> and my inability to learn from my mistakes.
> 
> Polednice has very few friends. Polednice finds it hard to make friends and doesn't really want that many. Polednice finds socialising extremely unpleasant, and is really just a symptom or two short from having Asperger's. Still, Polednice sometimes pushes himself to socialise.
> 
> So, Polednice is in London. Polednice was supposed to just be staying with one close friend. Said friend did not tell Polednice that there would be a house party tonight. Polednice is hiding on his own in said friend's room with said friend's laptop, because he would rather display and be judged for his strangenesses and inabilities than suffer the stress and discomfort of navigating noise and music and chatter of too, too many people.
> 
> This is why I talk to you folks about a lot of random stuff a lot of the time. Because whenever I venture out into the world of having real friends in the real world, something unexpected and unpredictable happens that tells me I should not leave my shell and that I would rather be an avatar online than a social human being.
> 
> You may not understand my mentality - most people don't. But don't be most people and don't judge me for it. I have a social 'disability' and it's very hard and upsetting to live with. People often assume I'm cold, judgemental and have a superiority complex, but really I'm just pathetic and scared.


Like you I had a superiority complex....After analizing coldly I have discovered that this is not a complex. I am just "superior" to many people. LOL
I have a few friends...I never show them I feel "superior"...But I think that what it makes me different is that I'm extremely curious and I love to learn new stuff...I know I am very ignorant and I have to learn all my life...less "superior" people think they already now everything and they have nothing to learn...

As Socrates said;

If you know you know you are wise (I don't know many people like that, do you?)
if you know you don't know you're cautious (as I am)
if you don't know you don't know you're stupid.

I love Socrates.

Sincerely,

Martin


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## Polednice

Couchie said:


> The idea that nothing can be done about social anxiety runs counter to the experiences of myself and many others. Yes, "practice", support groups and forcing yourself to go to social events is absolute hell but it has proven effective for many people. I appreciate that it is a spectrum and everyone is different. The picture you painted is that you haven't done a lot of practicing but resort to locking yourself in your room. If that is not the case, I fully apologize. Also you have obviously have my sympathy for the tumors and depression, I'm not suggesting practicing is the cure to everything.


I gave a false impression of myself then. I locked myself away this weekend, but I have spent many upsetting hours pushing myself to get better at this stuff over the past few years. I fully accept that improvements can be made because I _have_ improved - a _lot_ - but there are ceilings in these matters, and mine just happens to be lower than I'd have liked.


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## Couchie

Polednice said:


> I gave a false impression of myself then. I locked myself away this weekend, but I have spent many upsetting hours pushing myself to get better at this stuff over the past few years. I fully accept that improvements can be made because I _have_ improved - a _lot_ - but there are ceilings in these matters, and mine just happens to be lower than I'd have liked.


So I should have been much more sympathetic from the start. It just I wanted to give you something _actionable_ you know and not just an expression of sympathy. Sorry I was an *** and useless.


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## Ukko

Couchie said:


> So I should have been much more sympathetic from the start. It just I wanted to give you something _actionable_ you know and not just an expression of sympathy. Sorry I was an *** and useless.


I have this theory that it does _Poley_ good to get pissed off once in a while.


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## Polednice

Couchie said:


> So I should have been much more sympathetic from the start. It just I wanted to give you something _actionable_ you know and not just an expression of sympathy. Sorry I was an *** and useless.


I know, and it would have been helpful if it wasn't based on a false image I gave. Sorry for being an *** too. *big hugs*


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## Vaneyes

Things are getting a wee bit morose, classical soldiers. Maybe it's time to bring out Patton for another pep talk.


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## Fsharpmajor

Polednice said:


> I know, and it would have been helpful if it wasn't based on a false image I gave. Sorry for being an *** too. *big hugs*


I suppose disputes between Brahmsians and Wagnerians will always be with us, but in the future, can you two please confine your mudslinging and implied use of the "F word" to the Classical Music Discussion forum, where it belongs?


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## mstar

I'm gonna cry, Polednice, I'm gonna cry! You're not even not his forum anymore. ADIEU!!!


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## brianvds

Bit late to jump into this thread now. But if it makes the OP feel any better, all my best friends are online ones too, and I find "real" people boring and tiresome and stressful. I'm sure if I met my online friends in real life I'd also try my best to avoid them.


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