# Great Conductors of the 20th Century (EMI CD series)



## JAS (Mar 6, 2013)

Here is a useful overview of the series: http://www.classicalnotes.net/columns/emiconductors.html

I am currently playing the Toscanini volume. The sound is much better than I expected, somewhat muted in terms of dynamics and a bit muddy, but overall remarkable given the age of the recordings. (I assume that someone involved with the remastering really knew what he or she was doing.)

Have others dipped into this series? (If it has already been discussed here on TC, I was not able to find the thread.)


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## Heck148 (Oct 27, 2016)

JAS said:


> Have others dipped into this series? (If it has already been discussed here on TC, I was not able to find the thread.)


Yes, this is a fine series, in my view - I have the Reiner, Monteux and Stokowski volumes. some real gems in the collection - hard to find items that have been re-issued.


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## JAS (Mar 6, 2013)

Particularly from watching the two-part DVD documentary on The Art of Conducting ("Great Conductors of the Past" and "Legendary Conductors of a Golden Era"), I have been very much interested in understanding more of what a conductor actually does. (I would not dream of pretending that I could fill their slippers, but I am interested into their role and the means by which they achieve it. I don't have the musicality to do more than attempt an imitation and merely for the sake of looking closely at what they are doing, or at least appear to be doing.) I vividly remember the conductor of my high school band, who spent most of his efforts frantically trying to keep us playing in something like the same tempo. (We were truly terrible, and he broke a lot of batons in frustration. At one point, I even made him a box of baton-like sticks just to give him something else to break.) 

Obviously, these conductors are working with musicians who actually know what they are doing, and are playing at a completely different level, which presumably alters the focus of the conductor. Actually watching the conductors in performance, they seem to be much less keeping the time (although there is, of course, some of that), but more shaping of the nuances of the performance, and in cuing dramatic moments. Much of their work is presumably done in rehearsal, although Thomas Beecham was very critical of conductors presuming to instruct the musicians on how to play a piece that "they already knew ten times better than he does." (This is the quote as I remember it, and may be slightly imperfect, although I am pretty sure that it is quite close.) Of course, Beecham was also sometimes criticized as being an amateur, so perhaps his views are not usual. 

Although these CDs offer no visual clues, I thought they would be interesting as representative selections of interpretive choices made by the various conductors. I am not sure how well they might actually fulfill such an expectation.


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## JAS (Mar 6, 2013)

A minor, but somewhat related article I stumbled across online: http://www.smh.com.au/entertainment...o-breaking-the-baton-code-20120503-1y1ku.html


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## Heck148 (Oct 27, 2016)

JAS said:


> A minor, but somewhat related article I stumbled across online: http://www.smh.com.au/entertainment...o-breaking-the-baton-code-20120503-1y1ku.html


Pretty good practical advice, and explanation overall.
a few interesting quotes on the subject:

The best conducting technique is that which achieves the maximum musical result with the minimum effort. The only general rule is to infuse all gestures with precision, clarity, and vitality. - Fritz Reiner

Reiner on Leonard Bernstein, 1944: "Wait until you see that kid conduct tonight._ Mit einem Schmiss _[with fiery verve]! Watch out for him. He's going to make a real career."

Leonard Bernstein on Reiner, 1989: "He was a genius, apart from all other conductors I've ever known. He was tyrannical, he was cruel, he was bitter, he was ruthless in his treatment of us if we didn't know what was happening. His standards were incredibly high, and I bless him for it."


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## Vaneyes (May 11, 2010)

JAS said:


> Here is a useful overview of the series: http://www.classicalnotes.net/columns/emiconductors.html
> 
> I am currently playing the Toscanini volume. The sound is much better than I expected, somewhat muted in terms of dynamics and a bit muddy, but overall remarkable given the age of the recordings. (I assume that someone involved with the remastering really knew what he or she was doing.)
> 
> Have others dipped into this series? (If it has already been discussed here on TC, I was not able to find the thread.)


Twas an interesting idea, this series, compiling pieces (some previously unreleased) from various labels. This rare cooperation was appreciated.

I gleaned a few, but only Sir "Glorious" John Barbirolli remains. Primarily for the 1956 "Enigma" with Halle O. Mahler 2 with Stuttgart should've been avoided. A haphazard account, near the end of Maestro's life. 









Related:

http://www.musicweb-international.com/classrev/2002/Apr02/Mahler2_Barbirolli.htm


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## Becca (Feb 5, 2015)

While it is true that the Barbirolli Mahler 2nd has a number of flaws in the performance (which don't really bother me0, it is still an excellent interpretation and one worth discovering. I rate it almost as good as the Klemperer/Philharmonia and certainly higher than the well-regarded Rattle/CBSO.


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## Marsilius (Jun 13, 2015)

For me, a particularly eye-opening release in this series was the one devoted to Artur Rodziński. It contains the most exciting account of the _William Tell_ overture's climax that I've ever heard (it's reputed to have been the recording used for the credits of TV's _The Lone Ranger_). See here for more details: https://www.classicstoday.com/review/review-9953/

The _Great conductors of the 20th century_ release devoted to the much-underrated Ataúlfo Argenta was also very enjoyable.


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## Brahmsian Colors (Sep 16, 2016)

Since I already had a number of the same individual pieces/performances by conductors that would later appear on discs from this series, I didn't have the need to purchase a stable full of them. However, of those I did acquire, four contained performances that deserved to be kept. These were Weingartner, Walter, Mitropoulos and Bohm.


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## JAS (Mar 6, 2013)

I must admit that I have never even heard of Artur Rodziński, or quite a few of the other conductors in the series. (I don't mean that as necessarily any reflection on them.)


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## JAS (Mar 6, 2013)

And having just received the Omnibus DVD set of Bernstein's presentations, there is one on What Does the Conductor Do? that is pretty good, even if it is necessarily just a small window into the subject. (At least Bernstein was willing to address it with technical detail and not just superficial aphorisms.) I can see that even just beating time is more difficult than it appears.


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## Heck148 (Oct 27, 2016)

JAS said:


> And having just received the Omnibus DVD set of Bernstein's presentations, there is one on What Does the Conductor Do? that is pretty good, even if it is necessarily just a small window into the subject. (At least Bernstein was willing to address it with technical detail and not just superficial aphorisms.) I can see that even just beating time is more difficult than it appears.


If you can - find the video of Bernstein, and Ozawa teaching conducting students at Tanglewood....wonderful stuff....the contrast is amazing!!
Also - there is a video of Bernstein conducting his studi version of "West Side Story" with Te Kanawa and Carreras - wonderful video - it shows Lenny at work in the studio. very interesting...amazing talent...


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## JAS (Mar 6, 2013)

In watching some of the DVD performances, especially of Karajan (and not with an audience present), one wonders how much of what Karajan is doing is actually conducting or even affecting the playing of the musicians. Sometimes he seems to be so caught up in his own experience that one wonders if he remembers what he is doing. The results are usually amazing, however he might achieve them.


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## JAS (Mar 6, 2013)

Heck148 said:


> If you can - find the video of Bernstein, and Ozawa teaching conducting students at Tanglewood....wonderful stuff....the contrast is amazing!!
> Also - there is a video of Bernstein conducting his studio version of "West Side Story" with Te Kanawa and Carreras - wonderful video - it shows Lenny at work in the studio. very interesting...amazing talent...


I am assuming that the one DVD is The Making of West Side Story. I am not having much luck finding a video of Bernstein and/or Ozawa teaching conducting students at Tanglewood. There are a few snippets of video on some of the Bernstein documentaries that show him trying desperately to get a student conductor to make a dramatic gesture. Mostly, the student is so overwhelmed by the fact that he is being instructed, personally, by Leonard Bernstein, that he can hardly do anything. (It isn't Bernstein's fault, but who can blame the student?) Eventually, he gets the student to make something approximating the gesture, but mostly because he is imitating Bernstein showing him what to do and not because he really feels it himself.


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## Manxfeeder (Oct 19, 2010)

The Karel Ancerl set is outstanding as well as Furtwangler. Beecham is very good, though the sound is dated, being from the '40s. 

I just got Erich Kleiber yesterday. The performances are good, but I don't know if they show the conductor's greatness. Still, I wouldn't pass it up if it were selling for $2 in a used CD store like mine was.


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## CnC Bartok (Jun 5, 2017)

The link at the top is a bit unpleasant about André Cluytens, who really does deserve to be in this collection.

As to Karel Ancerl, yup! A superb conductor, and a great man to boot!


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## Josquin13 (Nov 7, 2017)

It's a very good, representative list. While I don't know which conductors they had planned to include in their subsequent 21+ volumes, in my opinion, the following absent names should be appear on any list of great conductors of the 20th century: Sir Adrian Boult, Hans Knappertsbusch, Istvan Kertesz, Eugen Jochum, Wolfgang Sawallisch, Gennady Rozhdestvensky, Antal Dorati, Leonard Bernstein, and Paavo Berglund. Also, what about Igor Stravinsky? or Benjamin Britten?

Does anyone think that Kirill Kondrashin, Sir Charles Groves, Vaclav Neumann, Lovro von Matacic, Yevgeny Svetlanov, or Jean Martinon deserved to be in the series, too? or Sir Georg Solti? or Karl Richter? or Yehudi Menuhin? or Sir Reginald Goodall?

My own personal list would include a number of 'unsung' conductors, who I bet they weren't considering for the series, but I rate highly: Manuel Rosenthal, Jean Fournet, Hans Rosbaud, Jascha Horenstein, Constantin Silvestri, Lamberto Gardelli, and Ernst Bour.

There's also the next generation of later 20th century conductors to consider as well: such as Claudio Abbado, Bernard Haitink, Charles Dutoit, Sir Colin Davis, Pierre Boulez, Klaus Tennstedt, Kurt Masur, Herbert Blomstedt, Neeme Järvi, Eliahu Inbal, Andre Previn, Michael Gielen, Stanislaw Skrowaczewski, Sir Charles Mackerras, Riccardo Muti, Vernon Handley, etc.. (My own personal list would include Peter Schreier for his wonderful Bach & Mozart choral recordings, Serge Baudo for his conducting of the French repertoire, and Sir Neville Marriner for his Handel, Bach, & Mozart.)

Then, there's the generation or two after them to consider--basically, those currently working today (in addition to the conductors that remain active from the previous generation): Riccardo Chailly, Leif Segerstam, Sakari Oramo, Esa-Pekka Salonen, Sir Simon Rattle, Jukka-Pekka Saraste, Andris Nelsons, John Nelson, Harmut Haenchen, Hans Graf, Oliver Knussen (who sadly passed away this week), the late Richard Hickox, Michael Tilson Thomas, Yuri Temirkanov, Maris Jansons, Semyon Bychov, Jaap van Zweden, Yannick Nézet Séguin, etc.

Nor should the best of the period conductors be forgotten either, such as John Eliot Gardiner, Nikolaus Harnoncourt, Paul McCreesh, Ton Koopman, Christopher Hogwood, William Christie, Gustav Leonhardt, Frans Bruggen, Trevor Pinnock, Philippe Herreweghe, Andrew Parrott, Rene Jacobs, John Butt, Joshua Rifkin, Marc Minkowski, Jos van Immerseel, Alfredo Bernardini, Ottavio Dantone, Eric Milnes, Vincent Dumestre, Giovanni Antonini, Philippe Pierlot, etc.

I wonder what there choices would have been?...


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## Larkenfield (Jun 5, 2017)

Bernstein and Ozawa at Tanglewood.


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