# Composers of the month December 2014 Schubert and Ablinger



## Haydn man (Jan 25, 2014)

Here we are with the first nominations for composers of the month
Thanks to SeptimalTritone as he was the first to suggest 2 names so we shall start with them.
I hope this thread gives the opportunity to explore in more depth 2 composers for a few weeks, notable works, favourite recordings, likes and dislikes.
Schubert is well known, but when I stopped to consider it is only his symphonies and last string quartets that I known well.
Ablinger is a mystery to me.

Let's see where we go from here


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## Haydn man (Jan 25, 2014)

To make a start here are 3 Schubert recordings I would not want to be without.
I think Solti delivers a fine performance of the 9th without the too much of the fieryness he could tend toward
The Unfinished I believe was a Rosette disc back in the day
The Takacs recording and performance are stunning and great cover art to boot.


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## JACE (Jul 18, 2014)

*Peter Ablinger *

Some basic info:

- Wikipedia entry: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peter_Ablinger

- Internet site: http://ablinger.mur.at/


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## GioCar (Oct 30, 2013)

the latest Winterreise with Goerne (his third) with Eschenbach at the piano.

Simply outstanding.


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## JACE (Jul 18, 2014)

Some of my favorite Schubert recordings:









Lieder / Janet Baker with Geoffrey Parsons and Gerald Moore (EMI)









Symphonies Nos. 8 & 9 / Szell, Cleveland Orchestra (Sony)









Last Four String Quartets / Quartetto Italiano (Philips)


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## Marschallin Blair (Jan 23, 2014)

JACE said:


> Some of my favorite Schubert recordings:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


'Like' for the others and ""love"" for the Baker/Moore Schubert Lieder.


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## BartokPizz (Oct 26, 2014)

Haydn man said:


> The Takacs recording and performance are stunning and great cover art to boot.


It is a good recording (although the Takacs Quartet plows through some of the quieter moments in the D Minor) but I actually find the cover art kitsch in the extreme!


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## scratchgolf (Nov 15, 2013)

Marschallin Blair said:


> 'Like' for the others and ""love"" for the Baker/Moore Schubert Lieder.


I find the Quartet Italiano to be a bit slow and at times choppy during SQ14. Believe it or not, I've never heard Szell do a Schubert Symphony. It's on my to do list.

I'll go with


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## StlukesguildOhio (Dec 25, 2006)

Absolutely essential!


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## Guest (Dec 16, 2014)

My first Ablinger piece was _Two Strings and Noise,_ which I heard somewhere live. Oslo or Wrocław or Vilnius maybe.

I could look it up, but that would mean a whole personality change from lazy to industrious.

Anyway, here's the full score: http://ablinger.mur.at/scores/2str+n.pdf

And I can assure you, it's a real stunner live.

Otherwise, I was interested in seconding ST's idea because I know so little about Ablinger. The one CD of his I had at one time was extremely boring, even for me. So I thought this would be a good way for me to get over myself and get back into listening to some music. His website is a real treat, I can say that. Makes me want to hear everything, actually.

I don't remember what my first Schubert piece was. It was probably something like _Ave Marie,_ which is ubiquitous. I recommend the Brodsky Quartet for no. 14, a CD that also comes with the Crumb that quotes it. Great idea for an album, and really fine performances of each very different piece. I think I liked it so much I actually did an Amazon review. I would second the Takacs recommendation, too, though.

That said, I can think of no quartets of the nineteenth century that I like better than no. 15. Wow. That is one sweet piece of work. Back when I was still composing, I did a string quartet which quotes the Schubert (and a large chunk of Beethoven's fifth symphony, the last bit of the first movement and the first couple of bars of the second). But that was then, and now is now.


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## scratchgolf (Nov 15, 2013)

some guy said:


> That said, I can think of no quartets of the nineteenth century that I like better than no. 15. Wow. That is one sweet piece of work. Back when I was still composing, I did a string quartet which quotes the Schubert (and a large chunk of Beethoven's fifth symphony, the last bit of the first movement and the first couple of bars of the second). But that was then, and now is now.


I'd like to hear that. Is this possible?


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## StlukesguildOhio (Dec 25, 2006)

Three more essential Schubert discs.


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## scratchgolf (Nov 15, 2013)

Some great symphony offerings.

My favorite Symphony 5








An essential 9 (without repeats)








A great lesser known cycle (HIP)








and for a stunning Symphony 8


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## D Smith (Sep 13, 2014)

This is a great idea. Thanks, Haydn Man for starting it. I'll try to listen to as much Schubert as I can the rest of the month. Tonight I have on Barbara Bonney's CD of Schubert Lieder, highly recommended if you haven't heard it.


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## Bulldog (Nov 21, 2013)

I love Schubert's chamber works, lieder and piano sonatas (especially D 894); I'm not a big fan of his symphonies. Ranki and Brendel are my go-to pianists for the solo works.

Concerning Ablinger, never heard of him so I went to NML and spent a couple of hours listening to Quadraturen IV and Voices and Piano. I hardly ever listen to music of this type, so I'm trying to get used to it. Not so hard with Q IV, but I'm finding the Voices and Piano music very irritating. I read that the V and P music is really over 6 hours long; six hours of this stuff and I might go on a killing spree. I doubt any serial killer has ever said "Blame it on Ablinger".


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## hpowders (Dec 23, 2013)

Haydn man said:


> View attachment 58806
> View attachment 58807
> View attachment 58811
> 
> ...


Yes. I'm not a Schubert fanatic but the one Schubert CD I will listen to without hesitation is the overwhelming, magnificent performance of the Schubert Ninth Symphony with Sir Georg Solti leading the Vienna Philharmonic. I've never heard a better performance of this symphony. Just terrific!!


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## trazom (Apr 13, 2009)

some of the first Schubert CDs I ever bought:



























I also recommend reading this older thread. It's very well written with lots of good information and contributions by this board's previous generation of Schubert fans:

http://www.talkclassical.com/1211-franz-schubert-composer-week.html


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## GioCar (Oct 30, 2013)




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## Chronochromie (May 17, 2014)

Piano Sonatas: 







Impromptus, Klavierstucke and Moments musicaux:







Lieder:


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## Chronochromie (May 17, 2014)

Die Schone Mullerin:







Winterreise:


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## Chronochromie (May 17, 2014)

More Piano stuff: 













Symphonies:



















The Marriner set has *all* of the symphonies, some completed or orchestrated by Newbould.


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## scratchgolf (Nov 15, 2013)

hpowders said:


> Yes. I'm not a Schubert fanatic but the one Schubert CD I will listen to without hesitation is the overwhelming, magnificent performance of the Schubert Ninth Symphony with Sir Georg Solti leading the Vienna Philharmonic. I've never heard a better performance of this symphony. Just terrific!!


It's awesome that you've had a change of heart on this one. What a difference a year makes. Welcome to the unofficial Schubert Fan Club!!!



hpowders said:


> The worst torture I can imagine is being strapped to a chair and being forced to listen to Schubert's "Great" C Major symphony.......


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## Haydn man (Jan 25, 2014)

I have just found this on Spotify
Tracks 7 -16 are Voices and Piano by Ablinger
This really is different, each is a monologue by a differnt individual some names I recognise eg Nina Simone. There is a piano accompaniment with each but only when the person is speaking so the music follows the rhythms of the speech.
Not sure what to make of it and would value other people's observations


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## Chronochromie (May 17, 2014)

String Quartets:













String Quintet







Arpeggione Sonata


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## scratchgolf (Nov 15, 2013)

Der Leiermann said:


> String Quartets:
> View attachment 58843
> View attachment 58844
> 
> ...


I have the Berg. How are the Hagen and Melos?


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## Chronochromie (May 17, 2014)

And finally...Piano Trios:













Piano Quintet:


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## Chronochromie (May 17, 2014)

scratchgolf said:


> I have the Berg. How are the Hagen and Melos?


The Melos is more for completionists, it's good but the tempos are somewhat on the slow side. Their Death and the Maiden lacks urgency, but the 15th quartet is excellent.
The Hagen/Schiff String Quintet is great, although I don't have much to compare it to, having heard only that one and the Alban Berg/Schiff which is also very good.


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## SimonNZ (Jul 12, 2012)

Haydn man said:


> View attachment 58842
> 
> I have just found this on Spotify
> Tracks 7 -16 are Voices and Piano by Ablinger
> ...


I havent heard the Mark Knoop, but the Wergo disc of Nicholas Hodges performing nineteen selections from the ongoing Voices And Piano is, imo, essential listening. The mimicry and ornamentation of the speech patterns is here handled so effectively, its easy to believe speech patterns and rhythms dictates thought, or vice versa (though I'm not sure that was Ablinger's intention), there also seems to be elements of criticism and/or mockery in the simultaneous transcriptions. The exception to all this is the one for Morton Feldman - but I'll let you hear it before I speculate further on that.

Currently available for consideration here:


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## scratchgolf (Nov 15, 2013)

Thanks. I find the exact same with Quartet Italiano. A overly slow and dull 14 with a great 15. ABQ's Quintet is great. In the same league with Rostropovich for sure.


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## SimonNZ (Jul 12, 2012)

The big, three-volume, expanded edition of Graham Johnson's Schubert lieder notes into encyclopedic form has finally been published by Yale, and I've got it waiting for me at work - so chances are most of my Schubert listening over the next month will be in conjunction with leafing through that.


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## ComposerOfAvantGarde (Dec 2, 2011)

The first Schubert I ever bought was a record of Karl Munchinger conducting the 4th and 5th symphonies. I don't have much Schubert apart from that and maybe about 6 or 7 CDs, but I do like Schubert very much. 

I have never heard anything by Ablinger so I look forward to hearing new music!


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## Albert7 (Nov 16, 2014)

For Schubert, I really am enjoying some lieder as sung by Ian Bostridge and some piano works as played by Maria Joao Pires.

I really dream of owning the complete lieder box set (21 discs) as sung by Fischer-Dieskau released by DG.


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## SimonNZ (Jul 12, 2012)

albertfallickwang said:


> I really dream of owning the *complete lieder box set* (21 discs) as sung by Fischer-Dieskau released by DG.
> 
> View attachment 58851


Complete for male voice - 37 discs in the Hyperion edition.


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## Albert7 (Nov 16, 2014)

SimonNZ said:


> Complete for male voice - 37 discs in the Hyperion edition.


I would assume in that case Schubert composed some non-lieder for male voice(s)? Either that or the DG version is incomplete?


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## StlukesguildOhio (Dec 25, 2006)

Still more essentials of Schubert recordings.


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## SimonNZ (Jul 12, 2012)

albertfallickwang said:


> I would assume in that case Schubert composed some non-lieder for male voice(s)? Either that or the DG version is incomplete?


More to do with the protagonist of the song being a woman, or reasons like that - even if they would other wise have been happy transcribing (as most all recordings do, willy-nilly - strange how that's seldom an issue in lieder)


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## SeptimalTritone (Jul 7, 2014)

Thanks koopa Haydn!!!

I made a thread on Peter Ablinger earlier actually.

http://www.talkclassical.com/35036-peter-ablinger-1959-a.html

There are 6 pieces I listed there, and there are a few others one can youtube search. I highly highly recommend Points and Views, composed this very year.


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## JACE (Jul 18, 2014)

scratchgolf said:


> Thanks. I find the exact same with Quartet Italiano. A overly slow and dull 14 with a great 15. ABQ's Quintet is great. In the same league with Rostropovich for sure.


Funny. My opinion w/ regards to the the Schubert's SQ14 is precisely the _opposite_ of yours. I have both the Alban Berg Quartett and the Quartetto Italiano in this repertoire -- and I much prefer the Quartetto Italiano. 

The ABQ sounds harsh to me compared to the Quartetto Italiano's song-like lyricism.


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## JACE (Jul 18, 2014)

albertfallickwang said:


> For Schubert, I really am enjoying some lieder as sung by Ian Bostridge and *some piano works as played by Maria Joao Pires*.


Yes, Pires' Impromptus are lovely!


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## BartokPizz (Oct 26, 2014)

JACE said:


> Funny. My opinion w/ regards to the the Schubert's SQ14 is precisely the _opposite_ of yours. I have both the Alban Berg Quartett and the Quartetto Italiano in this repertoire -- and I much prefer the Quartetto Italiano.
> 
> The ABQ sounds harsh to me compared to the Quartetto Italiano's song-like lyricism.


I agree the Italiano are excellent in 14, and in 15 they are phenomenal. I think they are stronger in Schubert than Beethoven, while in Beethoven I prefer the ABQ's intensity to the Italiano's beauty, poise, and depth of feeling.


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## JACE (Jul 18, 2014)

SeptimalTritone said:


> Thanks koopa Haydn!!!
> 
> I made a thread on Peter Ablinger earlier actually.
> 
> ...


I wonder: Why make the Ablinger thread separate? I like the idea of a single thread containing BOTH composers of the month, with constant pinging back and forth between both of them. That way, we all get more exposure to people's thoughts about these artists -- whether we're more drawn to the contemporary composer or the past master.

Also, it bucks the trend of specialization that I think hampers music in general -- not just classical. I like the idea of it all jumbled up -- ALL music.

Just my point of view, of course!


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## Albert7 (Nov 16, 2014)

I will dig up a guitar piece by Ablinger... very cool stuff.






Of course, I think that most people didn't realize that Schubert composed for guitars.


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## SimonNZ (Jul 12, 2012)

Jace: I think you'll find ST made that thread before the Composer Of The Month thing was mentioned. (and it may still prove useful once this month has passed)


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## Albert7 (Nov 16, 2014)

albertfallickwang said:


> I will dig up a guitar piece by Ablinger... very cool stuff.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Here is a Schubert piece involving a guitar:


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## Haydn man (Jan 25, 2014)

SeptimalTritone said:


> Thanks koopa Haydn!!!
> 
> I made a thread on Peter Ablinger earlier actually.
> 
> ...


I followed your link, read about then listened to Quadraturen V 
Now I think I might be getting what is going on. If I am following this correctly he is taking something familiar be that music, speaking or just everyday noises and than using a computer programme to turn this into a whole new sonic experience with a structure which is close to the original but not such that is recognisable as the original.
What at first might appear to be noise is in fact quite clearly not!

Interesting, I love Schubert but so far I have listened only to Ablinger


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## BartokPizz (Oct 26, 2014)

I'll be putting these favorite Schubert CDs on my iPod:


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## BartokPizz (Oct 26, 2014)

And these as well


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## HaydnBearstheClock (Jul 6, 2013)

BartokPizz said:


> It is a good recording (although the Takacs Quartet plows through some of the quieter moments in the D Minor) but I actually find the cover art kitsch in the extreme!


The girl on that cover is hot.


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## Skilmarilion (Apr 6, 2013)

some guy said:


> That said, I can think of no quartets of the nineteenth century that I like better than no. 15. Wow. That is one sweet piece of work.


Yeah, that first movement alone is gold. The way he never fully commits to either the major or minor, how he weaves those rich themes in and out of one another, the way he uses tremolo to ornament tender moments yet using it also to create those passages of persistent violence ... "Wow" indeed. 

I really like this set of the late quartets and that sublime quintet, by the _Emerson_.









That aside, I can't help but wonder that such threads will end up pretty biased towards the "big boy" whilst neglecting Ablinger et al. I guess in the case of the latter, any detailed recognition here would be better than nothing.


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## regenmusic (Oct 23, 2014)

I'm not getting much out of Ablinger, but I generally don't get much 
out of composers who are, imo, primarily conceptual artists. There is
enough "concept" in creating new music (like Stravinsky said about
how 12 notes will never be exhausted). I was thinking that William
Bolcom would be an interesting next choice for composer of the month
who are modern. Not all modern composers create only difficult music
(for more conservative classical ears). Bolcom seems to cover all the ground.


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## Haydn man (Jan 25, 2014)

Been listening to this today intermittently
Particularly impressed by the playing in the Impromptus
Will listen to the Wanderer later


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## Albert7 (Nov 16, 2014)

I went to the SLC public library this morning to look for CD's of Ablinger's work. Apparently he is just too obscure so I am relegated to YouTube clips here .

On the other hand, Schubert's stuff is way easier to locate.


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## Haydn man (Jan 25, 2014)

albertfallickwang said:


> I went to the SLC public library this morning to look for CD's of Ablinger's work. Apparently he is just too obscure so I am relegated to YouTube clips here .
> 
> On the other hand, Schubert's stuff is way easier to locate.


In case you had not seen this. If you look at post #37 on this thread you will see a link to a page set up by SeptimalTritone for Ablinger. This has helpful YouTube links


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## ComposerOfAvantGarde (Dec 2, 2011)

I posted this in the current listening thread. 



ComposerOfAvantGarde said:


> *Composer of the month listening....*
> Ablinger! A composer I've not heard the music of until now. I'm enjoying this! Klangforum Wien are one of the best new music orchestras around and are performing three of his works on this disc which I'm listening to on Spotify:
> 
> 
> ...


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## Haydn man (Jan 25, 2014)

I am warming up this evening with some more Brendel,this time the piano sonatas. I really like the music, the performance and the recording and it's on the list to buy
Followed by







I started to get some understanding of what Ablinger is trying to achieve listening to Piano and Voices and then the Quadraturen V yesterday. Let us see what today brings


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## SeptimalTritone (Jul 7, 2014)

Listen to the 2 minute piece below, first without looking at the video, and then again with looking at the video.


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## Albert7 (Nov 16, 2014)

This Ablinger track is the oddest one I heard so far on Youtube:


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## Haydn man (Jan 25, 2014)

SeptimalTritone said:


> Listen to the 2 minute piece below, first without looking at the video, and then again with looking at the video.


It is interesting to listen with and without the words. I presume the music is being computer generated again or someone's on a lot of amphetamine 
I am intrigued by what I have heard so far with the experimentation of words and sound. The problem for me is I can't yet let this music wash over me like I can with Schubert for example. I have to concentrate hard on Ablinger because my brain does not recognise the patterns and flow (which I assume are there) as yet.
Listened to Schubert Impromptus with Brendel and this just takes me to another place. I want modern music to do the same so I guess 'keep an open mind' should be my motto


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## Albert7 (Nov 16, 2014)

Haydn man said:


> It is interesting to listen with and without the words. I presume the music is being computer generated again or someone's on a lot of amphetamine
> I am intrigued by what I have heard so far with the experimentation of words and sound. The problem for me is I can't yet let this music wash over me like I can with Schubert for example. I have to concentrate hard on Ablinger because my brain does not recognise the patterns and flow (which I assume are there) as yet.
> Listened to Schubert Impromptus with Brendel and this just takes me to another place. I want modern music to do the same so I guess 'keep an open mind' should be my motto


I agree with you there... Ironically listening to Morton Feldman's String Quartet 2 was easier than any of the very radical work of Ablinger.

Still no complaints on my end.


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## Guest (Dec 20, 2014)

SeptimalTritone said:


> Listen to the 2 minute piece below, first without looking at the video, and then again with looking at the video.


My first thought? Colin Nancarrow. My second thought, someone's been listening to Nancarrow. (The actual music goes in a way that Nancarrow would never have chosen.)

And of course, since I had seen the opening screen and read the title, I was anticipating what would happen when I watched the video. But it was quite different from what I expected. And then I thought, why would I have expected something that I know Peter Ablinger would never have chosen?:lol:

And then I was just embarrassed.

Anyway, fun times!!


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## Albert7 (Nov 16, 2014)

Woot just found a copy of the DG recording of Winterreise as sung by Fischer-Dieskau in my stepdad's collection. I haven't heard it before so I look forward to adding this to my listening rotation.


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## elgar's ghost (Aug 8, 2010)

Has anyone any thoughts, positive or otherwise, on Joachim's orchestration of the Grand Duo Sonata D812? I like the original for two pianos but I wondered if the orchestrated version is also worth investigating (I had my eye on the Abbado/CEO recording).

Thanks in advance for any replies.


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## Haydn man (Jan 25, 2014)

albertfallickwang said:


> Woot just found a copy of the DG recording of Winterreise as sung by Fischer-Dieskau in my stepdad's collection. I haven't heard it before so I look forward to adding this to my listening rotation.


The Schubert song cycles are on the list for the coming week, I shall look at reviews and search Spotify.


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## KenOC (Mar 7, 2011)

elgars ghost said:


> Has anyone any thoughts, positive or otherwise, on Joachim's orchestration of the Grand Duo Sonata D812? I like the original for two pianos but I wondered if the orchestrated version is also worth investigating (I had my eye on the Abbado/CEO recording).
> 
> Thanks in advance for any replies.


I have the Abbado and the symphonic version is surprisingly good. Well, the finale less so, but that's not Joachim's fault. Anyway, it's worth having.


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## AndyTownend (Dec 15, 2014)

Hi all, new to the forum. 
How would I know if this has been mentioned in the forum already, Moments Musicaux, 4 pieces for piano, all interesting, really great. I'm going to carry on reading all your comments. Thanks


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## Mandryka (Feb 22, 2013)

I dipped into some things by Ablinger on spotify. Danish Border, Voice and Piano and 33-127. 

Voice and Piano made me smile because this thread associates Ablinger with Schubert. I thought it was a fun idea which was unimaginatively executed, maybe the idea goes nowhere and leads to nothing, I don't know. I hope I'm wrong, by the way, and that someone will point out something I've missed. 

Danish Border was the most traditional of the three recordings, you hear echoes of mainstream composers like Ferrari, Holliger, Lachenmann, Hespos. So this is music I felt very comfortable with. I thought that what Ablinger does is beautiful, just beautiful. If I have one negative thing to say, it's that maybe each piece goes on slightly too long, wears out its welcome. That could be just me, my mood now. So I don't want it necessarily to be seen as a criticism of the music.

With 33-127 I'm seriously out of my comfort zone, I can bearly hear this as music. I need to take a tablet to recover and I'll steal myself to listen again to it tomorrow.


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## Mandryka (Feb 22, 2013)

Re Schubert, I've been really impressed by the Winterreise with Elsaker and Beghin. I will go as far as to say that this is the best piano playing in Winterreise I have heard - with the possible exception of Richter with Schreier.

And because this is a Schubert thread let me post what is probably my favourite thing by him, for those who don't know it. Nachthelle


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## Haydn man (Jan 25, 2014)

AndyTownend said:


> Hi all, new to the forum.
> How would I know if this has been mentioned in the forum already, Moments Musicaux, 4 pieces for piano, all interesting, really great. I'm going to carry on reading all your comments. Thanks


Welcome to TC hope you enjoy yourself here
I don't think the Moments Musicaux have been mentioned before, but if they have it doesn't matter.
I came across them on this disc, having not heard them before they were a real find


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## AndyTownend (Dec 15, 2014)

Great, thanks for making me feel welcome.
I'm a guitar player by the way, that's where my interests lie. I've been recommended Lob der Tranen, as an easy entry into playing one of Schuberts songs, so that is on my to do list. Thanks for recommending Alfred Brendel, I've heard some of his playing. Who else is good?


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## Haydn man (Jan 25, 2014)

If you look back to the earlier pages on this thread there are several recommendations that have been made for Schubert Piano works.
I wouldn't consider myself an expert on the Schubert's Piano works but what I have heard by both Brendel and Periaha have been mighty good.
This is the first Composer of the Month thread, featuring one classic and one contemporary composer. If you look in the main menu you will see there is a Composer Guestbook where there is a separate much longer running thread for many composers. That is a great place to look for much more info and recommendations


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## AndyTownend (Dec 15, 2014)

Radio 3: 1pm each day this week, what are the chances?

_Founded by Hermann Prey in 1976, the Schubertiade is one of the most important and distinguished Schubert festivals in the world, presenting about 80 events each summer in the Austrian hill towns of Schwarzenberg and Hohenems.

In this first programme of highlights from concerts given this year in the Angelika Kauffmann Hall in Schwarzenberg, baritone Gerald Finley and pianist Julius Drake perform Schubert's posthumously published collection of late songs, Schwanengesang_.


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## Albert7 (Nov 16, 2014)

Just wanted to share with you guys from Schubert's Winterreise so lyrical and wonderful!


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## Haydn man (Jan 25, 2014)

It is clear that Schubert was highly regarded for his song cycles and to my shame I am not familiar with them. Listening to singing always leaves me a bit confused between, is it the voice or is it the words that I should follow?
I am working my way through this set and there is a real beauty to the voice with the piano accompaniment.
This continues my Schubert education


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## Albert7 (Nov 16, 2014)

Found this gem that I may do a spin of later tomorrow:


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## Bulldog (Nov 21, 2013)

I've spent about 20 hours listening to Ablinger's music and have reached a conclusion. The man's music is not for me; the more I listen to it, the more irritating it becomes. Even though I'm retired, I still feel that 20 Ablinger hours are 20 too many.


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## Guest (Dec 23, 2014)

What do the rest of us think about Voice And Piano? On first sample, it seemed like it would be a tedious thing - a good concept (perhaps akin to Finnissy's transcriptions but for spoken language rather than sung) but seemingly little more. 

However, I don't particularly feel that KAIROS is known for releasing clunkers, so I'd like to give it a real try after getting around to some of his other music.


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## Albert7 (Nov 16, 2014)

I'm actually curious... can anyone here relate Ablinger to Schubert to see if there is any connection? That would be challenging to me.


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## SeptimalTritone (Jul 7, 2014)

albertfallickwang said:


> I'm actually curious... can anyone here relate Ablinger to Schubert to see if there is any connection? That would be challenging to me.


Ablinger said that "Voices and Piano" was like his song cycle... but that's about it.

I came up with those two names for one classic composer and one living composer on a whim, and everybody seemed to go along with it. I was really happy about that.

I think I chose Schubert because I was enjoying the B flat piano sonata and I wanted to playfully spite hpowders, and I chose Ablinger because I was blown away by Points and Views, and enjoyed his other stuff like Voices and Piano, Quadraturen, and a few others. Not much of a connection.


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## SeptimalTritone (Jul 7, 2014)

This just came in tonight. I'm a happy man.


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## Albert7 (Nov 16, 2014)

SeptimalTritone said:


> This just came in tonight. I'm a happy man.
> 
> View attachment 59268


Nice... I need to dig this up from iTunes if possible.


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## Mandryka (Feb 22, 2013)

arcaneholocaust said:


> What do the rest of us think about Voice And Piano? On first sample, it seemed like it would be a tedious thing - a good concept (perhaps akin to Finnissy's transcriptions but for spoken language rather than sung) but seemingly little more.
> 
> However, I don't particularly feel that KAIROS is known for releasing clunkers, so I'd like to give it a real try after getting around to some of his other music.


I thought it was tedious. I enjoyed hearing Points and Views. What did you think of 33-127? What Finnissy are you thinking of?


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## Guest (Dec 23, 2014)

Mandryka said:


> I thought it was tedious. I enjoyed hearing Points and Views. What did you think of 33-127? What Finnissy are you thinking of?


His Verdi Transcriptions (and maybe the Gershwin Arrangements?) are sort of focused on transcribing nuances of the voice...But of course, transcribing Verdi rather than speech.


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## Haydn man (Jan 25, 2014)

SeptimalTritone said:


> This just came in tonight. I'm a happy man.
> 
> View attachment 59268


If you had told me 2 weeks ago I would be listening to this and trying to understand it, then I would not have believed you. But I suppose that sums up my feelings about about TC and why I thought the new and old composer suggestions for this thread was good. I want to try new stuff and this sure fits the bill.
Do I like Ablinger? Not sure is the 'sitting on the fence' answer I may be verging on Bulldogs answer from earlier but am going to try him again before the month end


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## Albert7 (Nov 16, 2014)

Haydn man said:


> If you had told me 2 weeks ago I would be listening to this and trying to understand it, then I would not have believed you. But I suppose that sums up my feelings about about TC and why I thought the new and old composer suggestions for this thread was good. I want to try new stuff and this sure fits the bill.
> Do I like Ablinger? Not sure is the 'sitting on the fence' answer I may be verging on Bulldogs answer from earlier but am going to try him again before the month end


I am warming up slowly to Ablinger the more I listen to him. I probably should not go for just snippet but chunks of his work. I think that he is definitely at the forefront of the avant garde that's for sure.

Like Webern, very abstruse to grasp such musical concepts intersecting with technology.


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## Haydn man (Jan 25, 2014)

This morning I shall be giving these a go, having a final crack at Ablinger before the month end
I would like to hear my other comments from those who, like me are new to contemporary work such as this


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## Albert7 (Nov 16, 2014)

Just saw this:









Had to add that of my iTunes wishlist for sure.


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## Albert7 (Nov 16, 2014)

I need to keep this thread alive because we only have a few days left to talk about these guys... who's next month?


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## Chronochromie (May 17, 2014)

albertfallickwang said:


> I need to keep this thread alive because we only have a few days left to talk about these guys... who's next month?


Maybe we should consider changing this to composer of the week...


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## SimonNZ (Jul 12, 2012)

albertfallickwang said:


> I need to keep this thread alive because we only have a few days left to talk about these guys... who's next month?


We haven't had 30-ish days of these guys yet.

Also we really haven't done terribly much more than display some pretty cover images for Schubert.


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## Chronochromie (May 17, 2014)

SimonNZ said:


> We haven't had 30-ish days of these guys yet.
> 
> Also we really haven't done terribly much more than display some pretty cover images for Schubert.


Mea culpa. This thread shouldn't be Current Listening-like, but actually talk about the composers, and an opportunity for those used to Schubert hear some Ablinger and vice versa. Maybe in the next one?


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## Kibbles Croquettes (Dec 2, 2014)

arcaneholocaust said:


> What do the rest of us think about Voice And Piano? On first sample, it seemed like it would be a tedious thing - a good concept (perhaps akin to Finnissy's transcriptions but for spoken language rather than sung) but seemingly little more.
> 
> However, I don't particularly feel that KAIROS is known for releasing clunkers, so I'd like to give it a real try after getting around to some of his other music.


I came here to post this video, in which the same principle is used, but actually it wasn't as off-topic as I afraid since it turned out to be by Ablinger too!


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## Haydn man (Jan 25, 2014)

Der Leiermann said:


> Mea culpa. This thread shouldn't be Current Listening-like, but actually talk about the composers, and an opportunity for those used to Schubert hear some Ablinger and vice versa. Maybe in the next one?


I agree and hoped that's what this thread would become. I have tried to post my thoughts and struggles with Ablinger and have certainly enjoyed the effort. I planned to write a little summary post of what I thought I had achieved with my efforts with both composers, which might inspire people in future months.
Although we have not had a full month with these 2 composers I planned to start a new thread on January 1st with the next 2 names from the original list, and thought we could treat this month as a test run.
Certainly people have posted listening suggestions but more discussion would be my good. Those who know more about contemporary composers could champion the new guy over the classic warhorse
Thanks to all who have kept this going


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## Chronochromie (May 17, 2014)

Haydn man said:


> I agree and hoped that's what this thread would become. I have tried to post my thoughts and struggles with Ablinger and have certainly enjoyed the effort. I planned to write a little summary post of what I thought I had achieved with my efforts with both composers, which might inspire people in future months.
> Although we have not had a full month with these 2 composers I planned to start a new thread on January 1st with the next 2 names from the original list, and thought we could treat this month as a test run.
> Certainly people have posted listening suggestions but more discussion would be my good. Those who know more about contemporary composers could champion the new guy over the classic warhorse
> Thanks to all who have kept this going


We have a list? Who are the next 2 composers?


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## Haydn man (Jan 25, 2014)

albertfallickwang said:


> I need to keep this thread alive because we only have a few days left to talk about these guys... who's next month?


The next 2 on the list are Bartock and Francisco Lopez and I plan to start the new thread on Janusry 1st


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## Guest (Dec 29, 2014)

Wow. Bartok* and Lopez. Two of my very favorite composers.

Sweet!!

(As someone who started his journey into the twentieth century with Bartok, it's very amusing--and gratifying--to see a context in which he is the "old" composer. 'Course, that's partly just me living, on and on and on....)

*I hope you were misspelling Bartok, anyway, and not Bantock. The latter's possible, I suppose.


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## Haydn man (Jan 25, 2014)

some guy said:


> Wow. Bartok* and Lopez. Two of my very favorite composers.
> 
> Sweet!!
> 
> ...


A thousand apologies it is Bartok of course
Long work day etc, etc
PS some guy I shall be looking to you for some recommendations in January


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## SeptimalTritone (Jul 7, 2014)

I have enjoyed this thread a lot.

It encouraged me to actually buy some music in order to have a good grasp of Ablinger.

When it comes to Francisco Lopez, I think that once I get sufficiently familiar with the stuff posted on youtube, I'm going to go buy a CD or two as well.


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## ComposerOfAvantGarde (Dec 2, 2011)

Looking forward to next month!!!!  going to be exciting.


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## MagneticGhost (Apr 7, 2013)

I've not been about much to contribute here. I've still to get around to listening to any Ablinger.
On the other hand - I did dip heavily into my Schubert lieder box before Christmas and I also arranged a chronological playlist of the same and listened to a few early works. 
I have to say - the quality of these early lieder is incredible. 
So my mission into the new year and beyond is to listen to all these Lieder in this order. I may even make an exclusive thread just for this purpose and then other like minded Schuby fiends can join me. 

So 48 hours to listen to some Albinger.........


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## MagneticGhost (Apr 7, 2013)

Ablinger: Voices and Piano

Interesting - I am barely scratching the surface. Is this in some way similar to what Reich was doing with Different Trains. An exploration of an idea but taken in a different direction with different results. 
Reich created a masterpiece. I can't comment on this having only listened to half an hour of a projected 6 hour cycle.

Edit: Actually - the more I listen to this the more I am getting something out of it. I thought it was just piano mimicing voice. But I wasn't listening properly as there are moments when it is an accompaniment. I particularly loved the Morton Feldman section. It is enjoyable just to hear the snippets of historical figures speaking as much as the musical content. 
I want to buy this on CD now


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## Haydn man (Jan 25, 2014)

Thought I would post a summary of what I have got from this month
Firstly Schubert
I have explored his works much more than before but so far can only say I have scratched the surface given the relatively short time period. Highlights so far have been the following 
View attachment 59967
View attachment 59968
View attachment 59969

I think of these 3 the Brendel disc is just outstanding in terms of technique and feeling he brings from the performance. Harnoncourt brings freshness to the symphonies but I still prefer other versions for 8 and 9
The song cycle has taken more time to enjoy, but has repaid repeated listening.
Secondly Ablinger
Well this is a whole new 'kettle of fish' 
I tried several of the works I could find via Spotify and I have documented thoughts about them in posts above. It takes my brain a bit of time to start to register some of this as music, and I can't say I understood some of it.

Voices and Piano I am beginning to enjoy, it repays a few goes 
33-127 sorry but this one looses me as I can't hear it as music
Quadraturen V I liked this one best the interplay and linking of sound and music.

I hope others have got something from this past few weeks, because I certainly have. I think combining 2 composers has worked and gives the opportunity to try to spot links and connections if they exist
Tomorrow I will start a new thread and look forward to what happens
Thanks everyone who has made a contribution so far, and to everyone else I would say, come on and join the fun


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## Haydn man (Jan 25, 2014)

I decided that at the end if each month I would purchase something by each composer that had particularly grabbed me, and my choices this month are






for Ablinger







for Schubert


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## SeptimalTritone (Jul 7, 2014)

Haydn man: you've got to hear Points and Views. It's my favorite work by Ablinger.


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## Guest (Dec 31, 2014)

I have to say, this has been a hoot.

Kudos, Haydn man, and all the rest.

See y'all on the flip side.


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## Albert7 (Nov 16, 2014)

Just found the complete lieder on DG box set by D. Fischer Diskeau at the public library. Too bad I didn't know that they had it last month .


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