# Round Three: Ma se m'è forza perderti. Tucker and Carreras



## Seattleoperafan (Mar 24, 2013)

Un ballo in maschera, Act III: "Ma se m'è forza perderti" · Richard Tucker · Giuseppe Verdi Richard Tucker: The Opera Recital Album Collection




Jose Carreras, tenor. Recorded 1976. With Roberto Benzi conducting Royal Philharmonic Orchestra.


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## nina foresti (Mar 11, 2014)

Both wonderful voices with the most beautiful sound belonging to "the other guy" Carerras (IMO), but the bell sound that emits from Tucker's throat cannot be denied as he gives an impassioned rendering without the usual cries and sobs.
I do admit I cut my teeth on Tucker with his incomparable "la speranza" note in "Che gelida manina", so maybe there is that too!


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## ScottK (Dec 23, 2021)

I like Carreras the better. Tucker's voice on record sounds great to me but I wouldn't go so far as to say beautiful. But more importantly, he sings everything at the same color, later in the aria adding some of his lurchy phrases for "expression"! The one time I heard him live though, a late career Boccanegra, the sound was a treat. Carreras sound is more beautiful to me and, even though I'd take more, I do hear some variety of color in his singing. Tucker's voice sounds stronger but I think Carreras voice is ample sized for this role. Hard to believe the Zeffirelli Boheme was only five years later. He didn't sound like this then!


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## MAS (Apr 15, 2015)

While I was impressed with Tucker’s voice - those unstrained _acuti, _the voice ringing and free, and having seen Carreras in the role onstage, I would pick him for the character he projects. He is also much handsomer with a more phonogenic voice.


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## Op.123 (Mar 25, 2013)

Tucker. Wonderful voice, well used. Carreras's inoffensive but rather flat sound has never interested me.


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## Tsaraslondon (Nov 7, 2013)

Tucker has a splendid voice but, as ScottK pointed out, it's all one colour. I don't hear any real engagement with the text, though his musical manners are a bit better here than they often were. Aspirates and sobs are not so much in evidence.

Carreras is in early, gorgeously lyrical voice here and he is much more in character. I've always been a bit of a fan of Carreras at least up until the early 1980s and I prefer not only the sound of his voice here, but his engagement with the character and his caressing of the musical line.


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## Seattleoperafan (Mar 24, 2013)

I predicted it would be all over the map for these two fine singers. Very different in style. I don't like later Carreras but his voice was so beautiful here.


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## Tsaraslondon (Nov 7, 2013)

Seattleoperafan said:


> I predicted it would be all over the map for these two fine singers. Very different in style. I don't like later Carreras but his voice was so beautiful here.


This is from his first recital disc, which I had on LP. He was so good looking as well, which probably swayed my opinion of him, but I also loved his voice back then. I saw him three times on stage, the first time as a superb Don José to Baltsa's equally wonderful Carmen, and then again as Andréa Chénier and then later in *Fedora *with Freni, who was really past her best by then. Unfortunately I missed his Stiffelio, which was one of his best roles. The producer Elijah Moshinsky really loved working with him. He said he was quite a shy man really and not really into all the hype that went into The Three Tenors. He was much more interested in what he called "the serious work." I have a soft spot for him and really like his Don Carlo for Karajan in which he captures brilliantly both the character's instability and his desperation.


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## Seattleoperafan (Mar 24, 2013)

Tsaraslondon said:


> This is from his first recital disc, which I had on LP. He was so good looking as well, which probably swayed my opinion of him, but I also loved his voice back then. I saw him three times on stage, the first time as a superb Don José to Baltsa's equally wonderful Carmen, and then again as Andréa Chénier and then later in *Fedora *with Freni, who was really past her best by then. Unfortunately I missed his Stiffelio, which was one of his best roles. The producer Elijah Moshinsky really loved working with him. He said he was quite a shy man really and not really into all the hype that went into The Three Tenors. He was much more interested in what he called "the serious work." I have a soft spot for him and really like his Don Carlo for Karajan in which he captures brilliantly both the character's instability and his desperation.


When he was young he closely resembled a guy I had a serious crush on. He was so handsome and dreamy back then.


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## BBSVK (10 mo ago)

I really enjoyed this round. No need to look at the libretto, I know it after the two previous rounds. The interpretation is once again similar to the way I know the aria, and if it deviates, it feels legitimate. I needed to hear them twice, and finally decided on Tucker. It is late and he makes me feel more awake. Carreras is kind of softer. But I am content with both of them, really, they are both very good.


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## BBSVK (10 mo ago)

nina foresti said:


> I do admit I cut my teeth on Tucker with his incomparable "la speranza" note in "Che gelida manina", so maybe there is that too!


What does this mean ? Would you explain to the non-native speaker ?


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## ScottK (Dec 23, 2021)

It was a shame that voice got away from him so fast. My great recollection from the night I went to hear him in the Zeffirelli Boheme was that at the very beginning of the show he stepped out onto the roof of their flat looking at the sky while Marcello was singing his opening bit and he looked so leading man - forget it John you would have been done right there - and even though the night ended up proving how badly things had gone for his voice, when he sang the little arietta he opens up with, as soon as he opens his mouth you just said man that’s the real deal!


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## Seattleoperafan (Mar 24, 2013)

BBSVK said:


> What does this mean ? Would you explain to the non-native speaker ?


"Cut my teeth" means like grew in your baby teeth on them. He was a very early influence on her.


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## nina foresti (Mar 11, 2014)

BBSVK said:


> What does this mean ? Would you explain to the non-native speaker ?


Sorry. I should have been more explicit. I started my love affair on opera with the voice of Richard Tucker singing "Che gelida manina" from_ La Boheme._ And by the time he got to that high note near the end ("La speranza") I was hooked on opera.


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## BBSVK (10 mo ago)

Seattleoperafan said:


> "Cut my teeth" means like grew in your baby teeth on them. He was a very early influence on her.


Thanx ! This is what I cut my teeth on:


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## ScottK (Dec 23, 2021)

BBSVK said:


> Thanx ! This is what I cut my teeth on:


Known the name forever but this may be the first time I’ve heard him. He’s got some voice!


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## Woodduck (Mar 17, 2014)

Tucker is really terrific in this. Sharp in declamation, taut of line, everything finely judged and encompassed without strain - a great piece of Verdi singing.

Carreras, with a more soft-grained, less distinctive timbre, is not as sharp in articulation but brings more pathos to the cavatina than Tucker. Is this a good thing? For me he sounds a bit lachrymose, even wimpy. Tucker makes me sit up and commands my attention and admiration. Carreras is merely pleasant, and I can leave him as easily as take him.


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## The Conte (May 31, 2015)

Carreras was known for this role so he is definitely in with a chance. However, Tucker is a tenor I remember that I like whenever I listen to him. He is very good in the recit. The Italian is perfect and I find him a more adept Verdian than Bergonzi. Tucker may be the best we've heard so far. He brings plenty of welly to the role whilst not oversinging a la Corelli. However, I find him to disappoint somewhat in the aria. His vocal acting is good, but I don't here the resigned sadness I want here rather than dramatic despair. Great conducting though.

There's everything to play (or should that be sing?) for. Carreras is much softer of tone than Tucker and I can't imagine him as King or Govenor of anything. I once heard a live recording of Ballo with him and Caballe that was meant to be very good, but it didn't do much for me (this is one of my least favourite of Verdi's mature works though). In the aria itself Carreras sounds more resigned than Tucker, but with less strength of feeling. I hadn't heard of Benzi and now I know why.

It's Tucker.

N.


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## PaulFranz (May 7, 2019)

I learned this piece listening to Björling finish it with a high C in a live recording. Unfortunately, these two don't compare favorably. Like many, I find Tucker's recorded voice ugly, but at least it's big and doesn't sound fundamentally lacking. I hear a fundamental lack in Carreras--it's too light, not centered enough. So I vote for Tucker, the more accomplished singer, whose legacy will be being the longest principal tenor in Met history, while Carreras's legacy will be...well we all know.

Incidentally, I do quite enjoy Tucker's Jewish stuff. As far as I'm aware, I have it all.


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