# Favorite Mozart/Haydn symphonies?



## Kopachris

Mozart and Haydn are both very popular composers who wrote a large collection of symphonies at around the same time. Of Mozart's, my favorite is No. 25 in G minor for its very strong opening motif and excellent use of a minor key to contrast most of his other works. 

Of Haydn's, my favorite is No. 60 in C major, mostly because I listen to it all the time while reading; to me, it sounds majestic and stately, which fits perfectly with a few of the characters in a book series I'm reading. I haven't listened to many of his others, though, so I might eventually find one I like better.  I just now found out that the violins have to retune in the finale of Hadyn's 60th--I always just thought that was part of the music.


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## Air

Mozart - either 38 or 39. The finale of the Jupiter is my favorite movement but the rest of the work doesn't do quite as much for me.

Haydn - still have to work my wall through all 107 of these. It's kind of like my life's goal that I can never ever get to.


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## mmsbls

I consider Mozart's 40th and 41st two of the greatest symphonies ever written. It's hard to choose between them. His 38th would be just a bit behind them.

I probably like Haydn's 104 the most with 101 just behind. There are many Haydn symphonies I have not heard so I think it's much more likely I would possibly change this assessment than my feeling for Mozart.


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## pjang23

Haydn's Symphony No.44 "Trauer"


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## Sid James

*Haydn* is one of my favourite composers, I esp. like his symphonies with nicknames eg. La Passione, the Drumroll (very innovative to bring back the initial drumroll at the end, this wasn't done much in those days), The Clock, Surprise, Lamentatione, etc. Of the un-named ones I esp. like #88 & the rest of the "London" symphonies sets. I haven't listened to all 100+ though!

As for *Mozart*, I haven't heard much of his symphonies, even as much as Haydn's. I think I like Mozart's choral & chamber things more. I too like the two G minor symphonies (25,40), the # 41 (of course!) but my memory of the rest is sketchy at best. The Haffner one rings a bell with me too, I remember it as being a delight! More often than not, I "bump into" his symphonies in concerts, but I think I've only got two of them (incl. #41) on disc...


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## itywltmt

My votes go to:
Mozart - *Symphony no. 36 (Linz)*, written and orchestrated in 4 days, it represents the finest example (IMO) of a "classical" symphony, and augurs well for the more "forward-looking" set (38 to 41). Honourable mention goes to no. 38 (Prague). See my recent blog posting on these symphonies.

Haydn - Some will argue that Haydn produced so many symphonies that he had to have used a "cookie cutter" approach. I agree that probably a third of his output could be viewed as "pedestrian" (though, I wish I were _that _pedestrian), a few stabnd out in my mind. My favourite is an early symphony, *Symphony No. 22 (The Philosopher)*. It is "all Haydn", and stands up very well against the "Paris" and "London" symphonies. Hounourable mention to Symphony no. 96 (the Miracle), my favourite "London" symphony.


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## Weston

I enjoy the later Haydn symphonies, especially No. 100 "Military." I just happen to listen to it more than the few others I have and it seems very Beethoven-like to me. Or rather Beethoven was very like Haydn, moreso than like Mozart.

For Mozart I enjoy the No. 39 especially for the 3rd movement. it's lively, cheerful and graceful all at once.


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## Polednice

I unfortunately don't know enough about Haydn to comment on his symphonies, but I look forward to using this thread as a way to approach them instead of just starting at #1!

As for Mozart, well, the 40th holds a special place - as I'm sure it does for many - purely because the first movement is one of the earliest classical pieces that I can remember hearing. However, my favourite by a significant margin is the 38th, _Prague_, mostly because of the relentless joy of the first movement (excepting the slow opening - though this structure always reminds me of Beethoven's 4th).


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## Ukko

*38 & 87*

Mozart: Symphony No. 38 in D major, K. 504 ("Prague"). Mozart was 'big' in Prague, and this symphony is excellent 'payment for considerations'.

Haydn: I can't make a strong preference among the 'London' symphonies, I enjoy all of them. I am particularly fond of Symphony No. 87 in A, perhaps the _least_ popular of the 'Paris' symphonies, as performed by _Collegium Aureum_. The music for small choirs and solo instruments charms me.


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## Il_Penseroso

Haydn : Symphonies Nos. 85 (La Reine) , 88 in G (The Letter V, a real masterwork with that beauty of rustic atmosphere) , 92 (Oxford) , 100 (Military) and 103 (Drumroll)

Mozart : Symphonies Nos. 35 (Haffner) , 40 and 41 (Jupiter) 

and I like Haydn's Symphonies more than Mozart's ...


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## haydnfan

If I had to choose just one for both it would be Mozart's 38th and Haydn's 82nd. Though I will recognize that their greatest symphonies are probably the 41st and the 92nd respectively.


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## eorrific

Has there been a conductor who extensively recorded Haydn's symphonies, if not all?


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## tahnak

MOZART G MINOR FORTIETH and HAYDN D MAJOR ONE HUNDRED AND FOURTH -THE LONDON


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## haydnfan

eorrific said:


> Has there been a conductor who extensively recorded Haydn's symphonies, if not all?


Russell Davies has recorded all of them, Dorati as well, and Adam Fischer. Hogwood has recorded most of them (available in 10 separate volumes). Fey has recorded most of them and will eventually be complete (available as well in many separate volumes).










































There are many conductors that do the London ones, many that do the Paris, several that have done the Storm and Stress... and the rest have only a few conductors each.

Significant mini-cycles are Harnoncourt, Weil, Bruggen, Pinnock and Bernstein. It is too bad the Bruggen is oop because it is an excellent PI set of all of the significant symphonies:


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## kv466

I'm with Kopa on both of those...also very much of a fan of kv201 and I can listen to Haydn symphonies all day long


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## eorrific

Well, thank you for the information, haydfan.
I didn't even know that there ARE complete Haydn symphonies boxsets in existence. 
:tiphat:


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## haydnfan

Your welcome! Hope you enjoy some Haydn symphonies in the future.


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## World Violist

I haven't heard all of Haydn's symphonies, and I don't consider it a priority as of yet (my priority right now is listening to all 200 or so of Bach's cantatas!), but so far my favorite is No. 88. It's such an irresistibly charming work.

We all know my history with Mozart's symphonies, but I'm willing to give them a shot since I'm sure I've become "better suited" to them over recent months (for want of a better term). I listened to Bruno Walter's recording of No. 40 about a year ago and liked it a bit, though I'm not sure if that was because of the conductor, the orchestra, the sound, or the fact that it actually ends in the minor key. It's a pleasant enough symphony, so that's my sorta de facto favorite amongst the Mozart symphonies.


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## tdc

My favorite Mozart symphony is #38 (I had no idea it was so popular here that is awesome). In truth Ive not listened to much Haydn (considering how vast his oeuvre is). The only two Haydn symphonies I own are #82 and #94. Out of these two I prefer #82. I've heard one of the movements from symphony #45 as well and that also sounded quite good.

(I do plan to pick up more Haydn symphonies soon, but I'd like to explore his string quartets and piano sonatas first)


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## samurai

@ haydnfan, Now I'm really impressed; a *37* *cd box set! *
I guessit's not too much of a stretch then to infer--as if your username wasn't enough of a clue--that Haydn is your absolute favorite composer. :tiphat:


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## Ravellian

Haydn - No. 88. It's a deliciously vivacious piece.

Mozart - No. 40. That first theme is probably his catchiest theme..


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## Vesteralen

Mozart - 39th

Haydn - 102nd (just slightly edging out 96)


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## Sid James

I forgot to mention* Haydn's* _Symphony #99_ - there's a great fugue (or fugue-ish?) thing at the end. I like his sense of optimism & joy the most, it shines through a lot of what he wrote...


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## HarpsichordConcerto

I quite like Mozart's #29. Or at east this interpretation of it.


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## haydnfan

samurai said:


> @ haydnfan, Now I'm really impressed; a *37* *cd box set! *
> I guessit's not too much of a stretch then to infer--as if your username wasn't enough of a clue--that Haydn is your absolute favorite composer. :tiphat:


Well yeah Haydn and Bach are my favorite composers... but I haven't listened to all of those complete sets, just the Fischer. I've heard many of the incomplete sets though. My favorite in print one is the Weil, which deliver awesome performances of the Storm and Stress and the Paris symphonies and some of the chunnel:










Now the complete sets that I do go really crazy on are the string quartets. 3 complete sets and 2 almost complete set plus several individual recordings of each SQ = obsession.:lol:


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## Bill H.

Most of the choices cited here are among my favorites too. I will also mention an early Mozart, K. 134 (#21) which is a lovely work differentiated by the use of flutes rather than oboes in the winds. No. 31 (Paris) is a jaunty 3 movement example, bettered only by the Prague (#38), which because of its composition date, has echoes of both Figaro and the Don in it. Any Mozart symphony featuring clarinets (39, 40 etc.) are going to have a special sound world, as that was his favorite woodwind instrument. 

As for Haydn, I will suggest something that has not been done in this thread as yet--try out as many of his "festive" symphonies as you can find written in C major. This includes 38, 41, 48, 56, 60, 63, 82, 90 and others (but not #97, though it is festive too). They are distinguished by their use of high (alto) horn parts--assuming you can find players who can handle the notes! A very exciting type of sound, especially when grouped with trumpets and tympani in the same pieces. I would speculate the main reason why #97 does not have the high horn parts is that the London orchestras could not play that type of instrument, whereas the ones in Austria and France could.


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## Kopachris

Thanks, Bill. I think I'll have to try those. Haydn and Mozart's symphonies can get a little repetitive sometimes, so it'll be refreshing to have some of theirs that are different from the others.


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## Olias

For Haydn, I always end up going back to numbers 88 and 100. For Mozart numbers 36 and 40. I love this video of Bernstein conducting the Haydn 88 Finale (and doing an encore with his facial expressions).


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## clavichorder

Many of his middle period symphonies recorded by Adam Fischer and the Austro Hungarian orchestra are brilliant. The ones that really stand out to me from this period are symphony 45(farewell) in f sharp minor, and symphony 51 in b flat. 47(the palindrome) and 48 in c major, as well as 43(Mercury) are also favorites. I have a special soft spot for 51 excepting its slow movement, which I can appreciate but do not get a warm feeling when listening to it, unlike the slow movement of 45. 48 and 47 are worth it for their compelling horn parts. 46 is a nice piece otherwise typical of his middle period save for its unusual key signature of B major.


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## clavichorder

Of the middle period symphonies, I've lately delved into 40 in F Major, 41 in C Major(very nice use of winds in this symphony), and 53 in D major(I really like this one especially). They are all SOLID, even brilliant. They tell stories in their own right. I'm starting to think that its very difficult to recommend one Haydn symphony from this period over another, they all have their merits. Once you accept the limited harmonic language and realize the brilliancy of the orchestration and development of themes in each, any Haydn symphony can be enjoyed on an emotional level that offers great pleasure to the listener. I even compared Haydn's symphonies after listening to them to some solid ones by Dittersdorf, Boccherini, and Michael Haydn, and there are things that these composers are very competent at, but Haydn is clearly the superior symphonist in his middle period through and through, his works are that well integrated. The only composers of the time that have an edge on him in any respect are Mozart and CPE Bach in particular, Mozart for his melodic pallette and rival abilities in thematic development and CPE Bach for his brave modulations, though he is probably inferior in thematic integration.


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## Conor71

For Mozart I really enjoy Symphonies 25, 40 & 41 but all of them are pretty good I think 
I only own a few of Haydn's London Symphonies and haven't listened to them very often so cant really pick out favourites here - I'm much more interested in Haydn's String Quartets!.


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## BoggyB

I've been through all of Haydn's symphonies now and have identified six favourites, namely *24* (i-ii), *34* (i), *54* (i), *89* (i-ii), *101* (i-ii), & *103* (i-ii). The Sturm und Drang, Paris, and London-part-one symphonies didn't work for me, whereas the London-part-two ones did. And I'm proud to be a poster boy for those earlier ones!

I'd need to listen to Mozart's again before passing "official" judgement, but from memory I'll say 25, 29, 40, & 41.


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## BoukeB

Haydn: currently in a period where I'm listening to new symphonies. Favourites are many London (esp 104 but all of them have their charm), 82, 89, 92 and I'm really fond of 88. Anybody like the finale as much as me? What a genius.

Mozart: 35 (second movement), 36 (really created in 4 days?), 38 (parts of first movement played at my wedding), 39 (am I the only one that finds the 2nd movement lovely and softening?),40,41. Also 34, 25 and 29.


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## Pugg

Lots of Mozart and Hayden fans on this forum


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## BoggyB

BoukeB said:


> Haydn: currently in a period where I'm listening to new symphonies. Favourites are many London (esp 104 but all of them have their charm), 82, 89, 92 and I'm really fond of 88. Anybody like the finale as much as me? What a genius.


Nice to see someone else appreciating 89!



itywltmt said:


> Haydn - Some will argue that Haydn produced so many symphonies that he had to have used a "cookie cutter" approach. I agree that probably a third of his output could be viewed as "pedestrian" (though, I wish I were _that _pedestrian), a few stabnd out in my mind. My favourite is an early symphony, *Symphony No. 22 (The Philosopher)*. It is "all Haydn", and stands up very well against the "Paris" and "London" symphonies. Hounourable mention to Symphony no. 96 (the Miracle), my favourite "London" symphony.


I'm still making my mind up about 22 (largely in relation to the first movement). I can sort of see why it's called the philosopher now.

Regarding Mozart, I've come to opine that he was more of a concerto man than a symphonist.


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## Bevo

Well by far my favorite by Mozart is No. 41. That finale is just so brilliant! After that my favorite is No. 38 and then probably No. 39. As far as Haydn goes, there's so many!! Some of my favorite are No. 101, 100, 97, 94, 84, 73, 82, 44, 104, and 85 (in no particular order). When the opening Allegro is played a little faster than usual I also enjoy 103 quite a bit. But there are so many to choose with him, it's hard to single out just a few.


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## Bettina

Mozart: 25, 31, 38, 40, 41

Haydn: 6, 7, 8, 45, 99, 103


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## hpowders

Haydn 82-87 Paris Symphonies. All of them.

Haydn Symphony 88.

Haydn 93-104. London Symphonies. All of them.

Mozart Symphonies 29, 31 and 38.


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## hpowders

Bettina said:


> Mozart: 25, 31, 38, 40, 41
> 
> Haydn: 6, 7, 8, 45, 99, 103


A drumroll for your great choices!


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## Bettina

hpowders said:


> A drumroll for your great choices!


Thank you for supporting my choices...I would hate to say Farewell to any of these great symphonies.


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## hpowders

Bettina said:


> Thank you for supporting my choices...I would hate to say Farewell to any of these great symphonies.


Your tour director is telling you to say Farewell to Prague.

Yes. That's accurate. I just double-czeched


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## Tchaikov6

hpowders said:


> Your tour director is telling you to say Farewell to Prague.


But that you're going on a Surprise trip to Paris.

And my favorites:
Mozart: Jupiter
Haydn: Miracle


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## Rhinotop

Haydn: 22, 39, 45, 48, 49, 76, 82, 88, 93-104. The best: 101
Mozart: 25, 29, 31, 36, 38-41. The best: 39


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## Haydn man

hpowders said:


> Haydn 82-87 Paris Symphonies. All of them.
> 
> Haydn Symphony 88.
> 
> Haydn 93-104. London Symphonies. All of them.
> 
> Mozart Symphonies 29, 31 and 38.


Hard to argue with these choices
If you want to explore Haydn then these would be a great starting point and then throw in the Sturmg und Drang for good measure


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## hpowders

Haydn man said:


> Hard to argue with these choices
> If you want to explore Haydn then these would be a great starting point and then throw in the Sturmg und Drang for good measure


So much listening pleasure!!


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## Pugg

Rhinotop said:


> Haydn: 22, 39, 45, 48, 49, 76, 82, 88, 93-104. The best: 101
> Mozart: 25, 29, 31, 36, 38-41. The best: 39


 Very good advice /choice.


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## Animal the Drummer

Mozart: as a whole symphony, no.39; favourite movement - the uniquely brilliant and delightful finale of the "Jupiter".

Haydn: a couple of lesser-known nominations from me, no.87 in A major from the "Paris" group and no.97 in C major from their "London" counterparts. Not a value judgment, I just find these particularly euphonious and attractive.


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## Brahmsian Colors

Haydn: 44,45,49,55,88,95 through 104
Mozart: 25,35,36,38,39,41


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## Bettina

Bettina said:


> Mozart: 25, 31, 38, 40, 41
> 
> Haydn: 6, 7, 8, 45, 99, 103


Update: now my favorite Haydn symphony is no. 101, The Clock.


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## hpowders

Bettina said:


> Update: now my favorite Haydn symphony is no. 101, The Clock.


Funny you should mention that. I was just winding my bedroom clock!

Quite often, I do my indoor exercises to the second movement's metronomic ticking. I have slow and relatively swift performances of that movement, so I can set the "metronome" to the intensity of the workout.

Glad you really enjoy Haydn's Clock!


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## Pugg

Animal the Drummer said:


> Mozart: as a whole symphony, no.39; favourite movement - the uniquely brilliant and delightful finale of the "Jupiter".
> 
> Haydn: a couple of lesser-known nominations from me, no.87 in A major from the "Paris" group and no.97 in C major from their "London" counterparts. Not a value judgement , I just find these particularly euphonious and attractive.


People should use that phrase more often.


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## hpowders

Bettina said:


> Update: now my favorite Haydn symphony is no. 101, The Clock.


I just played The Clock. Glorious!


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## PlaySalieri

Listen to the 2nd mvt of Mozart no 24 - 24 seems to be ignored - it is brief but a delight particularly 2nd mvt which I think used to be used for a radio 4 program some time ago.


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## Animal the Drummer

There are some gems in those early symphonies. Another is the slow movement of no.27.


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