# CDs or LPs in a World of Lossless Streaming



## Esclarmonde

For some time, I have been considering giving away my CD or LP opera collection.

I have held on to both collections – perhaps for nostalgia reasons – and perhaps for the “warmth” I hear in the recordings when playing LPs.

There is some substantial overlap between operas in each collection.

I have a confession, though – 90% of my listening is now via Apple Music. The quality is generally fabulous – and the service is about to go lossless.

So I will keep Apple Music – but I would be happy with some extra shelf space around here.

Would you keep both collections?

Or sell one?

Or sell both?

I am interested in your thoughts.


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## Art Rock

First off, I would never switch all-in to a lossless streaming provider. There is no guarantee that they will still be in business in a few years, or maybe they will raise the price considerably. Secondly, unless there are rarities in your collection, I think you will not get much for your CD's and LP's. If you are not running into storage problems, why not keep them?


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## Mandryka

Esclarmonde said:


> For some time, I have been considering giving away my CD or LP opera collection.
> 
> I have held on to both collections - perhaps for nostalgia reasons - and perhaps for the "warmth" I hear in the recordings when playing LPs.
> 
> There is some substantial overlap between operas in each collection.
> 
> I have a confession, though - 90% of my listening is now via Apple Music. The quality is generally fabulous - and the service is about to go lossless.
> 
> So I will keep Apple Music - but I would be happy with some extra shelf space around here.
> 
> Would you keep both collections?
> 
> Or sell one?
> 
> Or sell both?
> 
> I am interested in your thoughts.


Dump them for land fill, they have no market value, any warmth you hear from your LPs is distortion.


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## jegreenwood

Art Rock said:


> First off, I would never switch all-in to a lossless streaming provider. There is no guarantee that they will still be in business in a few years, or maybe they will raise the price considerably. Secondly, unless there are rarities in your collection, I think you will not get much for your CD's and LP's. If you are not running into storage problems, why not keep them?


Or a favorite recording may be deleted from the provider's site. If space is an issue, why not rip the CDs at least? I don't know the size of your collection, but multi-terabyte hard drives are cheap. I recently picked up a 5 TB SSD drive for about $100. Of course, you shouldn't sell your collection then, but as of others have said, there is not a great market for them.

https://www.bestbuy.com/site/wd-eas...able-hard-drive-black/6406512.p?skuId=6406512


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## haydnguy

I would like to ask you how you rip your CD's to external storage in a reasonable amount of time. Thx.


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## fbjim

Mandryka said:


> Dump them for land fill, they have no market value, any warmth you hear from your LPs is distortion.


LPs have some value for hobbyists, the labels have sold them for some time as premium products. You could probably sell bulk to a collector/hobbyist for a bit.


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## starthrower

I refuse to subscribe to streaming services owned by giant tech companies. And I rarely buy from Amazon. I don't want to live in a world where there are no record stores or many other local retailers. I want to maintain a certain amount of diversity in the retail market. I can no longer enjoy the golf course in my home neighborhood because they sold it to Amazon and now I have to look at a giant warehouse and deal with 24/7 truck traffic. And I never run into any of my old acquaintances shopping online. That only happened at the local record and audio shops.


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## Red Terror

starthrower said:


> I refuse to subscribe to streaming services owned by giant tech companies. And I rarely buy from Amazon. I don't want to live in a world where there are no record stores or many other local retailers. I want to maintain a certain amount of diversity in the retail market. I can no longer enjoy the golf course in my home neighborhood because they sold it to Amazon and now I have to look at a giant warehouse and deal with 24/7 truck traffic. And I never run into any of my old acquaintances shopping online. That only happened at the local record and audio shops.


Many bemoan the social supremacy of corporate hegemony without stopping to think that consumerism is the enabling force behind the grotesque proportions of these capitalist entities. The mass craving for convenience is such that we willingly sell ourselves into slavery for short-term comfort.


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## jegreenwood

haydnguy said:


> I would like to ask you how you rip your CD's to external storage in a reasonable amount of time. Thx.


I ripped about 4000, and it did take a while. Best done during the baseball season. And get a quality CD Drive. It can cut ripping time by half or even more with fewer errors.

Now, ripping 450 SACDs with a PlayStation 3 - that took some real time.


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## SixFootScowl

Art Rock said:


> First off, I would never switch all-in to a lossless streaming provider. There is no guarantee that they will still be in business in a few years, or maybe they will raise the price considerably. Secondly, unless there are rarities in your collection, I think you will not get much for your CD's and LP's. If you are not running into storage problems, why not keep them?


Exactly, a bird in the hand is worth two or two hundred in cyberspace.


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## Art Rock

jegreenwood said:


> I ripped about 4000, and it did take a while. Best done during the baseball season. And get a quality CD Drive. It can cut ripping time by half or even more with fewer errors.


Also, don't forget to backup the ripped files on a second hard disk. I know you still have the original CD's (otherwise your ripped files become illegal), but you do NOT want to go through the whole ripping exercise again if the external hard disk crashes.


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## jegreenwood

Art Rock said:


> Also, don't forget to backup the ripped files on a second hard disk. I know you still have the original CD's (otherwise your ripped files become illegal), but you do NOT want to go through the whole ripping exercise again if the external hard disk crashes.


The drive I bought was to replace a backup that failed. I have three copies, plus two copies of the ISO files of my SACDs should I ever find room for a surround system.


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## Mark Dee

I have vinyl, CD's and mp3's. I enjoy them all at different times in different circumstances. If you have space, keep them all!


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## joen_cph

Some good advise especially in #2. 

I kept the old media & only stick to them now. I've tried ripping quite a lot of my CDs, but if you're starting from zero, having a large collection, it can be very time-consuming, and it became too much time in my case.

At the end, give it all some thought, wait for a while, and then choose with your heart.


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## SixFootScowl

I once backed up some music to a cloud drive service then forgot the super secure password, so had to abandone it. I have other backups, including one hard drive I keep a the office. Since I have not been in the office since mid March of 2020 that hard drive is way behind on backup storage. I have two others though, plus my computer drive, and the disks.


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## 89Koechel

Mandryka - ("... no market value ...") - I hope you're kidding. Boy, those old RCA LPs (shaded dogs, etc.) with Reiner, Monteux and others are still some of the BEST-engineered recordings of all time. Also, there were valuable LPs (jazz, blues and classical) that have no counterparts, on CD, the cloud, or anywhere else. Geez, I even keep valuable cassettes, and eliminate the tape hiss (via software). Even Princeton Record Exchange might be interested in LPs, but only of a narrow category; I've sold some to them, before.


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## 89Koechel

Esclarmonde - BTW, I've been DUBBING LPs (and rare CDs, or even rare cassettes) onto blank CDs for a number of years. Can you do that? I have two old PCs, both with "line in" inputs, and they work very well. If you have a pre-amp that you can patch-into a computer/PC, and use inexpensive software (such as DartPro, or others) you can dub any of your LPs/CDs, and THEN let them go, if you want.


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## Esclarmonde

Art Rock said:


> First off, I would never switch all-in to a lossless streaming provider. There is no guarantee that they will still be in business in a few years, or maybe they will raise the price considerably. Secondly, unless there are rarities in your collection, I think you will not get much for your CD's and LP's. If you are not running into storage problems, why not keep them?


My thanks to the forum for your thoughts.

I realise now that I had not thought through the possibilities of (a) substantial price hikes by streaming providers, or (b) the removal of favourite albums from their service.

And I do miss browsing our local record store, which is long gone…

My inclination now is to emphasise listening to physical media. Let's see how I go - I have become a lazy listener.


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## Bigbang

Since the subject is about storage I would be interested in what containers members have bought (specific names/dimensions) to store cds (case with cd). CD racks and all are getting in the way and boxes are hard to stack. I have some idea of what to buy but thought it might be well to ask this question. 

For me not worth the trouble to engage the new technology or burn cds excessively but play them as needed.


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## starthrower

Since I ran out of room for storage racks I've been buying clear plastic bins from Walmart. They have locking tops and hold about 60 CDs each that you can stand on end to see the titles. They are the perfect size for handling because 60 CDs is not too heavy to lift and they can be stacked 5 or 6 high. But it's getting a little crazy because I've already filled over 20 of these. My wife doesn't appreciate the warehouse look that is taking over our little house! Here's a link that shows these totes.
https://www.globalindustrial.com/p/...ral)&adlclid=597b4426854e1a5fe1c4249e715d2d08 The dimensions on the totes I use are 16.5 x 12.5 x 6.5. Great for easy, dust free storage and easy access to the titles you want to retrieve.


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## Bigbang

Thanks, will check out this as well. Price can vary but if I can get good quality for less best way to go.


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## starthrower

They're 4 dollars at Walmart. If you get the size I specified the CDs fit just right.


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## SixFootScowl

I bought a lot of *these* from my local ACE Hardware. I recall they were about 4-5 dollars each and sometimes on sale. Each bin holds about 30 standard single-disk jewel cases. You can also put in larger jewel cases even if they are in a cardboard slipcase. They stack nicely and you can view the titles on either side.


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## apricissimus

When I buy a house (hopefully soon!) and have a place to put them, I may buy some of these:

http://www.can-am.ca/CD-storage-DVD-storage.htm

They're pricey, but I've grown tired of the visual clutter of spines-out CDs. And I think they'll be more efficient with space.

I'd be interested in hearing if anyone uses these, or something similar.


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## starthrower

Very pricey. The cost of media storage has gone up 40-50 percent. But those pullout drawers are nice.


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## progmatist

I choose option C: Hi-Res downloads. I get the more open, transparent sound of a record with none of the surface noise. Most modern vinyl records are sourced from Hi-Res digital anyway.



Art Rock said:


> Also, don't forget to backup the ripped files on a second hard disk. I know you still have the original CD's (otherwise your ripped files become illegal), but you do NOT want to go through the whole ripping exercise again if the external hard disk crashes.


I have a rotating backup scheme in which I have 1 external drive with all my ripped and downloaded music at home. Another in my filing cabinet at work. The 2 drives constantly rotate as I perform new backups. If my house burns down, I still have all my music at work. If worse comes to worse, an external hard drive will easily fit in the smallest available safe deposit box. Try doing that with hundreds of CDs and thousands of vinyl records, as I have in my collection.


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## Bigbang

starthrower said:


> They're 4 dollars at Walmart. If you get the size I specified the CDs fit just right.


I found on walmart app one smaller for a buck but only in limited supplies...will try to hunt down the one you have. Was at a local walmart...looked like a pandemic buying spree...bare shelves


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## starthrower

I went to two Walmarts today. The first one had no totes but I found three at another store. Supplies have been scarce since the pandemic started.


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## Mathias Broucek

People have mentioned already the risk of non-availability (Melodiya vanished briefly a few months ago). Another risk is exclusively - e.g. if Warner or Universal launches its own platform (as with Disney for video streaming) . But the most serious risk is outage. Several major tech firms lost service for a few hours yesterday...


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## Rmathuln

jegreenwood said:


> Or a favorite recording may be deleted from the provider's site. If space is an issue, why not rip the CDs at least? I don't know the size of your collection, but multi-terabyte hard drives are cheap. I recently picked up a 5 TB SSD drive for about $100. Of course, you shouldn't sell your collection then, but as of others have said, there is not a great market for them.
> 
> https://www.bestbuy.com/site/wd-eas...able-hard-drive-black/6406512.p?skuId=6406512


Not SSD. The link is not a Solid State drive.
And a 5 TB SSD will cost you in the 1,000s minimum.


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## julide

Imagine not keeping your lps...or give them over to people who have not enough lps..............


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## amfortas

I still go with CDs, and good old-fashioned shelves for storage. Over time, I've purchased and assembled five of these--good capacity for the price. The one drawback, as reviewers point out, is that the shelves tend to sag when full. But I solved that problem during assembly by driving three thin, evenly spaced nails into each shelf through the back of the unit. The shelves are no longer adjustable, but they hold up under the weight.


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## jegreenwood

Rmathuln said:


> Not SSD. The link is not a Solid State drive.
> And a 5 TB SSD will cost you in the 1,000s minimum.


My bad. It was displayed in the store with SSD drives. And I cannot hear/feel any vibration.


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## Bwv 1080

I find IDAGIO far better than the non-classical apps - it has a searchable composer-performer-work structure (and knows the difference between the composer John Williams and the guitarist) A good number of recordings have the inserts. It does lossless - although lossless is really means CD quality for most recording in these libraries. To store the lossless audio from the service, I just record everything to cassette tape.


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## Oldhoosierdude

Esclarmonde said:


> For some time, I have been considering giving away my CD or LP opera collection.
> 
> I have held on to both collections - perhaps for nostalgia reasons - and perhaps for the "warmth" I hear in the recordings when playing LPs.
> 
> There is some substantial overlap between operas in each collection.
> 
> I have a confession, though - 90% of my listening is now via Apple Music. The quality is generally fabulous - and the service is about to go lossless.
> 
> So I will keep Apple Music - but I would be happy with some extra shelf space around here.
> 
> Would you keep both collections?
> 
> Or sell one?
> 
> Or sell both?
> 
> I am interested in your thoughts.


We went the small house, minimalist living way. Meaning, most of the books and CD'S, LPs, along with the other excess had to go.

Sold what I could through eBay at bargain prices. Had a yard sale. And donated everything else. Clothes, furniture, whatever was excess.

For music, I ripped a lot to a portable hard drive, uploaded it in duplicate to a cloud drive. For streaming I use my Amazon prime account but download any purchases and save them to my back ups. If I do buy a CD I burn it and use it in my cars player. And of course I would never just get rid of it and keep the ripped copy. Who does that? Isn't it illegal? Of course We all always honor these laws.


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## progmatist

Oldhoosierdude said:


> We went the small house, minimalist living way. Meaning, most of the books and CD'S, LPs, along with the other excess had to go.
> 
> Sold what I could through eBay at bargain prices. Had a yard sale. And donated everything else. Clothes, furniture, whatever was excess.
> 
> For music, I ripped a lot to a portable hard drive, uploaded it in duplicate to a cloud drive. For streaming I use my Amazon prime account but download any purchases and save them to my back ups. If I do buy a CD I burn it and use it in my cars player. *And of course I would never just get rid of it and keep the ripped copy. Who does that? Isn't it illegal? Of course We all always honor these laws.*


That's why record stores stopped giving cash refunds for CDs ages ago.


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## Pmartel63

I'll always buy CD's
Just recently bought a new Denon CD player hooked to a Marantz 1070 with BeyerDynmacs DT100's
The sound is stunning 
I pefer my physical media over streaming any day
As for lp's I wish I had my collection from my younger days as would be transferring them to the computer and that includes 78's that I had
Eventually my goal is to set up a music server of some kind for background llistening whether cloud or NAS 
CD playback has come al long way and rediscovering just how good tey sound


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