# The many varieties of Bach's Cello Suites



## Earthling

I am obsessed with Bach's _Cello Suites_. Of all of his works, I love the _Cello Suites _more than anything.

I've currently got five recordings (Casals, Ma-1997, Starker-1997, Ter Linden, Wang and a viola transcription by Patricia McCarty) and I intend to get more in the future (Wispelwey, Isserlis and Bylsma at the top of my to-get list). I find each interpretation has its own unique aspect which I can appreciate. I probably listen to Wang's & Ter Linden's the most right now, but I like all of them.

I'm not so interested in which is the "best" recording, but rather what is special or unique about each one. The Cello Suites seem to handle many interpretations, like looking through a prism from different angles.

_What recordings do you have of the cello suites? What is it that a particular cellist brings to his interpretation that you enjoy? _

Of course, the recordings all began with *Casals*, so I guess its best to start there. Its not my favourite recording, but it is a must in my collection nevertheless, and I still bring it out every now and then. He gives the suites a rather strong "romantic" feel, but it works (laying the vibrato on thick, plenty of rubato). You almost forget Bach was a _baroque _composer.










I've only heard this remastered version of it-- I'm not sure if there are any other remastered recordings or how they compare, but its surprisingly good for being recording in the late 1930s!

A funny story: Several years ago, I had checked out Starker's 1997 recording form a local library, but I only heard half of it originally, and I never heard the fifth suite. Some time later, I bought Casals recording and I put it on for the first time, but fell asleep in the afternoon as it played. I woke up in the middle of the sarabande, hearing all this strange chromaticism-- and hearing it out of context, only half awake, I was so confused-- was this some sort of modern atonal music I was hearing that got put on the disc by mistake? I couldn't believe it was Bach at first. I was so disoriented and I had to play the sarabande again to make sure I wasn't imagining things (and then I could hear what was happening harmonically). It was a very strange experience I'll never forget LOL


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## Nix

I have (and listen to constantly) the Isserlis recordings. I'm young and haven't heard that many interpretations, but I like his the most. His sound is a little rough and very raw (he seems to really dig into the string) but also very smooth when it needs to be. Again, I don't have much to compare it to, but I'd say he's a little more romantically inclined.


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## Earthling

This seems to be my current favourite recording of the _Cello Suites _performed by *Jian Wang*. It seems to me that he really _gets _the rhythms-- though the playing is far from being merely _metronomic_. But the rhythms are not lost in too much rubato. The _Cello Suites _were, after all, modeled on dances, and Wang doesn't forget this.

Little vibrato, uncanny intonation. Not a thick or heavy handed interpretation, but rather light and graceful.


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## Guest

I really enjoy Rostropovich's and Fournier's recordings of the Cello Suites. Fournier currently holds the edge.


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## Ukko

Except for the 1st piece in each suite, they are all dances. Heinrich Schiff plays them as dances. JSB smiles when he hears them. Me too.


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## StlukesguildOhio

I lean toward the Fournier version myself, although I quite like janos Starker's muscular, dark interpretation, and certain Yo Yo Ma's first recording is quite serviceable, and Casals and Rostropovitch are almost necessities, are they not?


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## joen_cph

One of those I like is Morten Zeuthen´s recording. And there´s a bonus: the Flute Solo Partita played for solo cello, which seems to work very well; he argues that it _might_ originally have been thought of as a cello work. Zeuthen has a wonderful tone and his rhythms are good and captivating, his slow movements likewise very gripping ... He´s rather on the Romantic side in his playing style, making the music grander than some tend to. Wonderful sound in the recording, in spite of budget re-releases going down to 4 Euros ...


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## Wumbo

I only have Bylsma's and Du Pre's, but I have to agree it's one of my favourite compositions. I greatly prefer Bylsma's over Du Pre's, because it is much slower and really lets you hear the groaning vibrations of the cello. I have a friend who says it's too slow in general for the piece, but I don't agree  I would call the emotions delivered by Bylsma's recording to be much more calming and distinguished/mature.


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## Conor71

Hilltroll72 said:


> Except for the 1st piece in each suite, they are all dances. Heinrich Schiff plays them as dances. JSB smiles when he hears them. Me too.


Yes, this interpretation sounds appealing (as does Earthling's Suites by Wang!) - have this one wishlisted now on Amazon .


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## haydnguy

I had put the Fournier in the shopping cart last night. (Didn't hit buy yet). After reading this thread and the reviews of the Fournier, it appears that it is rather on the slow side so I've decided on the Wang. That sound like a bit truer to the spirit of the music. (Just guessing because they didn't have it where you could sample the Fournier.


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## StlukesguildOhio

http://www.amazon.com/Bach-Suiten-Violoncello-Johann-Sebastian/dp/B000001GRZ/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=music&qid=1279557925&sr=1-1

http://www.amazon.com/Bach-J-S-The-Cello-Suites/dp/B0015REX32/ref=dm_cd_album_lnk?ie=UTF8&qid=1279557925&sr=1-2


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## Guest

The take home message is - get more than one. For me, I have been quite satisfied between the Fournier and Rostropovich recordings. Different takes by both. Rostropovich definitely tends to take it a bit brisker, but Fournier does have a way with these.


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## Earthling

DrMike said:


> The take home message is - get more than one. For me, I have been quite satisfied between the Fournier and Rostropovich recordings. Different takes by both. Rostropovich definitely tends to take it a bit brisker, but Fournier does have a way with these.


I think this is one of the really maddening -- and _thrilling_-- things about the suites -- interpretations can be so varying that you can't just stick with one recording.

Next payday I 've got Byslma cued up. Fournier and Rostropovich have long been on my list as well... (my goal is to one day have at least 15 or so different recordings!)

Jaap Ter Linden's recording is taken at a surprisingly slow pace. Its a more contemplative take on the suites but my main complaint is that there is too much reverb in the recording (sounds like there's more reverb than there is cello!).


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## Guest

Earthling said:


> I think this is one of the really maddening -- and _thrilling_-- things about the suites -- interpretations can be so varying that you can't just stick with one recording.
> 
> Next payday I 've got Byslma cued up. Fournier and Rostropovich have long been on my list as well... (my goal is to one day have at least 15 or so different recordings!)
> 
> Jaap Ter Linden's recording is taken at a surprisingly slow pace. Its a more contemplative take on the suites but my main complaint is that there is too much reverb in the recording (sounds like there's more reverb than there is cello!).


I've read really good things about Thedeen's recording for BIS, as well as Wispelwey's recording for Channel Classics. I sampled Wispelwey on iTunes, and the place where it was recorded has very much the feel of a very resonating room - much different, closed in feel than my Fournier recording. The Thedeen one has been calling to me for a while.


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## Ukko

*Thedeen*



DrMike said:


> I've read really good things about Thedeen's recording for BIS, as well as Wispelwey's recording for Channel Classics. I sampled Wispelwey on iTunes, and the place where it was recorded has very much the feel of a very resonating room - much different, closed in feel than my Fournier recording. The Thedeen one has been calling to me for a while.


The Thedeen is good; excellent recorded sound, close but not too close, and only moderately reverent. I know from other recordings that he has a sense of humor, so a little reverence here is acceptable.


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## misterjones

Variety is the key, I think. I used to have many versions, but some sort of sounded the same. I ended up keeping only the ones that seemed interesting and different. For example, Wispelwey's aggressive attack and Gendron's casual (lyrical? melodic?) style fit different moods. Regarding Casals, check out the Opus Kura version. Some swear by it, though it certainly has more hiss. (It's hard to get, too.) I'm not entirely convinced there isn't some artificial bass enhancement. I like the EMI version - it seems to sound more like a nicely remastered old recording should sound - but I suppose I should give the Opus Kura another listen.


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## World Violist

Now that I'm getting interested in Bach's cello suites, I think I'll get Jian Wang's recording. I've listened to the sound clips from Amazon and it seems to be my kind of recording: relatively broad tempi, presenting the pieces as they are without trying to make them larger than life, with wonderful phrasing and musicality. Nothing is excessive nor too spare.


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## SteveTern

I'm surprised that nobody has mentioned Ralph Kirshbaum's recording for Virgin Classics.
The tone he extracts is warm without being cloying, and the tempos just right - flowing, not hesitating - sprightly when needed, without being rushed.
To my ears, Rostropovich tends to lose the plot at times and his tone can be harsh (heresy?).
Try Kirshbaum.


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## Guest

Has anyone heard Gavriel Lipkin? I like his set quite a bit. He's very passionate, and the sound is beautiful--it's a multi-channel SACD.


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## Taneyev

Favorites: first Starker, Fournier, Tortelier and Gendron. Have them also on viola and violin.


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## Vaneyes

Kontrapunctus said:


> Has anyone heard Gavriel Lipkin? I like his set quite a bit. He's very passionate, and the sound is beautiful--it's a multi-channel SACD.


Lots of positives with this recording--good tone, good acoustic, good style. That's half the battle. In the other half...Gavriel's playing perked my ears when carefree, but pinned them back when trying to be technically correct. He needs to come back to these, speeding it up, and letting it fly.


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## Guest

Vaneyes said:


> Lots of positives with this recording--good tone, good acoustic, good style. That's half the battle. In the other half...Gavriel's playing perked my ears when carefree, but pinned them back when trying to be technically correct. He needs to come back to these, speeding it up, and letting it fly.


Is there some particular reason that you are attacking only my suggestions? (This recording and my Hammerklavier pick.) You don't even offer any of your own.


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## Ukko

Kontrapunctus said:


> Is there some particular reason that you are attacking only my suggestions? (This recording and my Hammerklavier pick.) You don't even offer any of your own.


Tut-tut. I think _Vaneyes_ has simply not generated the enthusiasm required to initiate a sub-thread. Please do not regard this to be _another_ attack.

If the performances recommended so far have not exhausted your (the collective 'your', not just thine,_ Kontrapunctus_) spirit of adventure, I offer (if you can find it) consideration of the recordings by Paolo Beschi, the first three suites of which I have on the Winter & Winter label. This is _baroque cello_ to a fare thee well, impossible to confuse with the 'modern' configuration. I find it difficult to listen to, but a correspondent has rated it as sublime. The recordings are from 1996.


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## userfume

Jean Guihen Queyras


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## Beth Troy

Has anybody heard the new recording by acoustic guitarist Steven Hancoff: From Tragedy to Transcendence: The Six Suites for Cello Solo for Acoustic Guitar? It is amazing! I don't think there is anything else out there like it. Blue Wolf Reviews wrote: "Hancoff must have often wondered if the ghost of Bach was not sitting on his shoulder inspiring him." And there are lots of other critical responses just as good. If you love the suites -- or the guitar, or music -- "You owe it to yourself to also enjoy deeply these guitar transcriptions sublimely delivered by Steven Hancoff," as another reviewer put it.


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## Eramirez156

The one recording I go back to time and again is the *Daniil Shafran*. It is an old school interpretation. I also like the Truls Mork.









The Suites lend themselves to myriad of interpretations, each with their value. _Vive la différence. _


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## Casebearer

I've not been listening to Baroque music that much since I was a young adult and first came into contact with classical music -learning to play the 'very sexy' recorder myself, ha ha (and failing at that). 

Most Baroque music is merely enjoyable but not interesting to my brain if you know what I mean. Often I find it hard to hear the music through the style of the period but when listening to Bach it's the opposite. I forget it's Baroque. Bach transcends his style period like no one else (excuse me for the cliché). 

The Cello Suites (and his Organ Works) do this for me even more than other Bach' works. Maybe because there's no orchestra with other instruments to distract you from the core of the music? 

Well, I'm already beside the point I want to make. I'm listening to Paul Torteliers performance of the suites right now (on vinyl). My only reference is Pieter Wispelwey's second interpretation of the Suites in 1998 that also impressed me a lot with their purity. So I can't really compare very well but Torteliers interpretation is also really worthwhile to listen to. I suppose it holds the middle ground so to say.


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## Pugg

Pieter Wispelwey for me, recorded it several times and still always something to add :tiphat:
For the purist Anner Bijlsma:tiphat:


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## Heliogabo

My first suites were by Antonio Janigro, but I first heard the ones by Casals, which I own too, with Fournier, Tortelier and (partially) Yo Yo Ma. In recent times my favorite is the Tortelier set (EMI/ Warner).


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## chesapeake bay

These have always been a favorite of mine as well, a more recent recording by Sebastian Klinger is my new favorite


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## qanik

agree with this choice of Casals,his discovering the suites in an antique store in Barcelona and introducing them to the world somehow gives him something extra, if only one could get the Casals in the recording quality of the Rostropovich, and his recording near the end of his life fits in with my stage in life and somehow speaks to me, but my guilty pleasure is the double bass recording of the entire transposed cello suites by Paolo Pandolfo, his music you can almost taste and the richness of the double bass contrasts so much with the smoothness of the cello and I never can figure which instrunent I prefer, I guess it depends on the environmental mood you're in


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## Judith

Only one musician can perform these for me!

Steven Isserlis

Beautiful, rich, and textured sound!

Heaven!


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## Oldhoosierdude

I tested out quite a few different artists before purchasing Gendon, Founier, and Rost... But a bunch of others tempted me. I don't think I heard a bad rendition. I could easily go for them all. Now qanik has to go and mention Pandolfo,whom I haven't heard.


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## Pugg

userfume said:


> Jean Guihen Queyras


This set I want to buy, have it on loan from a friend, stunning.


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## Oldhoosierdude

Oldhoosierdude said:


> I tested out quite a few different artists before purchasing Gendon, Founier, and Rost... But a bunch of others tempted me. I don't think I heard a bad rendition. I could easily go for them all. Now qanik has to go and mention Pandolfo,whom I haven't heard.


Update. I have listened to most of the Pandolfo version. I forgot that one. I listened over either spotify or Amazon prime. I remember the musician with the instrument I hadn't heard of. It was well played but sounded like he was in another room. Didn't care for it for that reason.


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## Oldhoosierdude

Heard first three parts of suite 1. Not a cello, sorry purists, but well played a nice , rich sound. It wont take the place of your favorite, but worth a listen and tempting price used.








I have room for another cd.


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## Zeram1

Has anyone purchased the remastered Fournier version just released on vinyl this year? I ask, for I've read that it may not be that much better than the original release.


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## Pugg

Zeram1 said:


> Has anyone purchased the remastered Fournier version just released on vinyl this year? I ask, for I've read that it may not be that much better than the original release.


They must have something done right, otherwise not a very commercial move.


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## AlexS

Two recordings I particularly like at present are Richard Tunnicliffe and David Watkin, both on baroque cellos but with very different sounds. Many recordings draw me in, despite differences of speed, style, emphasis and so on. There are very few I've heard which don't work for me, but two I don't like are Rocco Filippini - overblown, somehow -, and Anne Gastinel, whose overuse of rubato irritates me.


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## Vasistha

For me, nearly every version I've heard brings something interesting and unique, and I wouldn't want to pare down what I have. I am looking to add a digital version of the Starker, and noticed on Presto that the two are the Mercury & Sony. Can't tell much from listening online to snippets, but I know they are different sessions and also sound different (the Mercury sounding more distant and slightly less present, the Sony with higher output and sounding more present and maybe even brighter but still quite rich and resonant in the lower octaves. I wonder, Taneyev if you have explored both of these two versions, and if so, what you found. Or, perhaps you only have one of these two. The Mercury is the most common, as everyone seems to go for the 35mm Living Presence, both because it has street credit for its reputation, and possibly because people feel that session is the most technically perfect. I looked for a comparison of the two online, and nothing came up in a Google search. I am surprised that's true. Would have thought there should have been a comparison. Maybe there's such a comparison on this Forum, but I am a new member and this is only my second posting here. Anyway, since you are fan of the Starker version, I thought I'd ask where you stand on the Starker versions. Thanks in advance.


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## Merl

Vasistha said:


> For me, nearly every version I've heard brings something interesting and unique, and I wouldn't want to pare down what I have. I am looking to add a digital version of the Starker, and noticed on Presto that the two are the Mercury & Sony. Can't tell much from listening online to snippets, but I know they are different sessions and also sound different (the Mercury sounding more distant and slightly less present, the Sony with higher output and sounding more present and maybe even brighter but still quite rich and resonant in the lower octaves. I wonder, Taneyev if you have explored both of these two versions, and if so, what you found. Or, perhaps you only have one of these two. The Mercury is the most common, as everyone seems to go for the 35mm Living Presence, both because it has street credit for its reputation, and possibly because people feel that session is the most technically perfect. I looked for a comparison of the two online, and nothing came up in a Google search. I am surprised that's true. Would have thought there should have been a comparison. Maybe there's such a comparison on this Forum, but I am a new member and this is only my second posting here. Anyway, since you are fan of the Starker version, I thought I'd ask where you stand on the Starker versions. Thanks in advance.


This is my favourite Starker set. I love it. Probably one of my favourites.


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## Itullian

Merl said:


> This is my favourite Starker set. I love it. Probably one of my favourites.
> 
> View attachment 118829


Thanks mate! I ordered it


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## Merl

Itullian said:


> Thanks mate! I ordered it


You're worse tham me, Itullian. :lol:


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## wkasimer

Merl said:


> This is my favourite Starker set. I love it. Probably one of my favourites.
> 
> View attachment 118829


Although I don't really like any of Starker's Bach recordings very much, I think that this is the best of his four recordings. I've never understood the almost universal adoration of his Mercury recording. There are, I think, several dozen recordings that are preferable.


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## premont

wkasimer said:


> Although I don't really like any of Starker's Bach recordings very much, I think that this is the best of his four recordings. I've never understood the almost universal adoration of his Mercury recording. There are, I think, several dozen recordings that are preferable.


So you know the recording he made for Sefel in 1984? It is difficult to get hold of, and I have never heard it. Is it worth seeking out, when one has got all his other Bach recordings?

BTW I agree, that there are several dozens of recordings preferable to Starker's.


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## wkasimer

premont said:


> So you know the recording he made for Sefel in 1984? It is difficult to get hold of, and I have never heard it. Is it worth seeking out, when one has got all his other Bach recordings?


I like it a bit better than the Mercury - Starker sounds more involved on the Sefel recording, where the Mercury always makes me think that he's giving a lesson rather than making music. If you have the RCA recording, I don't think that the Sefel adds much to your knowledge of Bach, or of Starker, whose style was pretty consistent through the various recordings. It's actually hard for me to understand why Starker felt the need to record these works so many times, when his interpretation didn't change very much (as opposed to, for example Wispelwey and Ma, whose later recordings represent a marked change from earlier efforts).


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## Merl

Each Ma set sounds completely different. His latest is definitely my favourite. I like the first one but I never play the 2nd set.


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## hoodjem

DrMike said:


> I really enjoy Rostropovich's and Fournier's recordings of the Cello Suites. Fournier currently holds the edge.


I too love these pieces. I own Ma (CBS 1), Rostropovich, Starker (RCA), Fournier, Harnoncourt (MHS LP), Janigro, Bruns, Baumann, Schiff, and Kniazev.

Rostropovich is too Romantic and idiosyncratic, IMHO.

Fournier is one of if not the best, certainly the most patrician.
Janigro is great but the sonics are not that good.
Janos Starker (RCA) presents a thoughtful 'old man's view'-- slower, more stately and more contemplative.
Pieter Bruns presents a wonderful 'young man's view'--faster, sprightlier and more energetic.


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## premont

Merl said:


> Each Ma set sounds completely different. His latest is definitely my favourite. I like the first one but I never play the 2nd set.


I have never heard the second set. Of the two others I prefer the first set. It is simple and unmannered. The third is IMO too contrived.


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## SanAntone

*bach | cello suites | zachary carrettín*

View attachment 156356


*On viola
*


> A specialist in multiple period instruments, Carrettín decided his 18th-century viola had the most detail to offer, "the finest brush," as he said. He used all wound gut strings, rather than his normal two wound and two pure-gut setup, to "maintain the identity of each string while also offering a blend when desired."


*The Violin Channel*



> "There is an inherent freedom in these works, inviting a musician to explore phrasing, choosing different 'pivot' moments for the shaping to and from harmonic changes. The inner voices of the counterpoint disappear and reappear but continue in the mind as a continuous musical line. The notation leaves much room for a changing interpretation throughout a musician's life, (I favor Anna Magdalena Bach's manuscript as there is no extant autograph manuscript by J.S. Bach himself.)
> 
> "I chose the title, 'Metamorphosis,' reflecting on how I've changed in the quarter-century. I've played the suites, sonatas, and partitas, and these have continued to change in my mind as living artworks, paintings in sound.


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