# Pavarotti's Best



## guythegreg (Jun 15, 2012)

I just realized recently, that while I have a number of recordings with Domingo as the tenor that I treasure at least partly for his singing, I can't say I have a single one with Pavarotti that I treasure for the same reason. That seems kind of odd. He's universally acknowledged to be one of the great tenors, and he wasn't a Wagnerian - how can I have missed hearing a great performance by him? Please suggest a recording of his that you treasure for his singing. Thanks.


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## sospiro (Apr 3, 2010)

I prefer Pavarotti's voice to Domingo's so I like all of the above but this is one I play over and over & never tire of.


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## mamascarlatti (Sep 23, 2009)

I am not at all keen on Pavarotti's voice (or persona) but I can acknowledge that he was a fine Duke of Mantova.


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## Bardamu (Dec 12, 2011)

He is my ideal Fritz ( and Freni is my ideal Suzel).
Don't love him much though.


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## Barelytenor (Nov 19, 2011)

I love his Rodolfo opposite Mirella Freni although I listen more to the Bjoerling-de los Angeles _Boheme_ than to the other. That's my all-time favorite. Curious that Cavaradossi is not in the poll, I probably would have voted for that one if it had been there.

Best Regards, :tiphat:

George


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## AndyS (Dec 2, 2011)

mamascarlatti said:


> I am not at all keen on Pavarotti's voice (or persona) but I can acknowledge that he was a fine Duke of Mantova.


I have to agree. His was a 'beautiful' voice but it does very little for me... Except his Duke, which was wonderful. Probably because there wasn't much depth to the role


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## Pamina (Sep 5, 2012)

His bright tone and the "smile" in his voice made him good for the comic roles, like Nemorino and Tonio. But he also has that romantic sweetness, like a big cuddly teddy bear and the Italian technique and high notes to do both of those roles justice. His Puccini guys like Cavaradossi and Rodolfo were warm and charming as well and in Verdi I liked him best as the Duke of Mantua (a cad, but a lovable one) and Riccardo in Ballo.


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## mamascarlatti (Sep 23, 2009)

Pamina said:


> ... the Duke of Mantua (a cad, but a lovable one)


Got to disagree with this. Just because he is cheerful doesn't make him loveable. I think he's a psychopath, destroying lives and marriages in pursuit of his selfish sexual gratification.


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## Flamme (Dec 30, 2012)

Wow...What a description...


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## sospiro (Apr 3, 2010)

mamascarlatti said:


> Got to disagree with this. Just because he is cheerful doesn't make him loveable. I think he's a psychopath, destroying lives and marriages in pursuit of his selfish sexual gratification.


I thought at first you were referring to Pavarotti & I thought it was a tad harsh ...


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## Il_Penseroso (Nov 20, 2010)

In addition, he acted also very good as Manrico in 1988 MET production of Il Travatore.


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## mamascarlatti (Sep 23, 2009)

sospiro said:


> I thought at first you were referring to Pavarotti & I thought it was a tad harsh ...


:lol:Yes I can think of a few unflattering things to say but that would be going too far!!


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## MattExcell (Jun 15, 2011)

I also prefer him to Domingo, at least from a purely recorded point of view. Clearly with his frame, he would always struggle to be a believable actor for some roles.

He's pretty much universally agreed to be the best Nemorino on record, but I think the role he was best suited to from an acting and singing point of view would have to be Rodolfo.

To many of my age he will always be the guy who gave us the introduction to Calaf with his Nessun Dorma, but whilst I still love his version of the aria above all others I prefer Corelli overall in the role.

As a more out there choice, I'd give him the edge in a toss-up with Gedda as best Arturo.


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## Arsakes (Feb 20, 2012)

I don't have any music album by him, just his best. So I can say:

La Donna è mobile


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## guythegreg (Jun 15, 2012)

sospiro said:


> I prefer Pavarotti's voice to Domingo's so I like all of the above but this is one I play over and over & never tire of.


wow - I had no idea you were a Rigoletto fan! I will have to check this one out, no doubt.


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## guythegreg (Jun 15, 2012)

Barelytenor said:


> I love his Rodolfo opposite Mirella Freni although I listen more to the Bjoerling-de los Angeles _Boheme_ than to the other. That's my all-time favorite. Curious that Cavaradossi is not in the poll, I probably would have voted for that one if it had been there.
> 
> Best Regards, :tiphat:
> 
> George


Hey, George! I have to admit, Puccini's music has never been his strong suit, to me. As with Wagner, it's his skills as a dramatist that attract me. But I'll give Pavarotti's Boheme a try and we'll see. Thanks.


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## guythegreg (Jun 15, 2012)

Pamina said:


> His bright tone and the "smile" in his voice made him good for the comic roles, like Nemorino and Tonio. But he also has that romantic sweetness, like a big cuddly teddy bear and the Italian technique and high notes to do both of those roles justice. His Puccini guys like Cavaradossi and Rodolfo were warm and charming as well and in Verdi I liked him best as the Duke of Mantua (a cad, but a lovable one) and Riccardo in Ballo.


I have to admit, I never thought of the Duke of Mantua as a lovable cad, even in Pavarotti's interpretation ... but I did ask your opinion, so now I've got it!


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## guythegreg (Jun 15, 2012)

Il_Penseroso said:


> In addition, he acted also very good as Manrico in 1988 MET production of Il Travatore.


Good one! I will have to seek that out now.


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## guythegreg (Jun 15, 2012)

MattExcell said:


> I also prefer him to Domingo, at least from a purely recorded point of view. Clearly with his frame, he would always struggle to be a believable actor for some roles.
> 
> He's pretty much universally agreed to be the best Nemorino on record, but I think the role he was best suited to from an acting and singing point of view would have to be Rodolfo.
> 
> ...


Well - I too have heard that he's a wonderful Nemorino; but I would note that none of our posters suggested a good recording of his in that role. I have a recording of his as Nemorino, it's the DVD with Kathleen Battle as Adina; and she outshines him so badly that it's really astonishing. I was really hoping someone would suggest a wonderful recording of his as Nemorino, but there may not be one.


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## sospiro (Apr 3, 2010)

guythegreg said:


> wow - I had no idea you were a Rigoletto fan! I will have to check this one out, no doubt.


Verdi is my favourite composer & this is in my Verdi top ten


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## MattExcell (Jun 15, 2011)

guythegreg said:


> Well - I too have heard that he's a wonderful Nemorino; but I would note that none of our posters suggested a good recording of his in that role. I have a recording of his as Nemorino, it's the DVD with Kathleen Battle as Adina; and she outshines him so badly that it's really astonishing. I was really hoping someone would suggest a wonderful recording of his as Nemorino, but there may not be one.


Interesting... I don't have the recording with Battle, but on the official CD recommendations thread, it was felt that Battle let down this recording, rather than Pav.

I find that it's usually best to stick to the Bonynge/Sutherland/Pavarotti trifecta, particularly with Bel Canto. I have this and love it:








Or you could try the epic Puritani recording for his Arturo which is phenomenal:


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## guythegreg (Jun 15, 2012)

MattExcell said:


> Interesting... I don't have the recording with Battle, but on the official CD recommendations thread, it was felt that Battle let down this recording, rather than Pav.


Well, if you only LISTEN, it's clear she's not singing the role as well as, say, Ileana Cotrubas. On DVD though, I just thought she sparkled and he lumbered. And there's nothing in just listening, as I've done, that I can recall about his performance.

I do have that Puritani and I do enjoy it a great deal - there was a period when I played it daily, or even twice a day. But not for Pavarotti's performance, rather for Sutherland's. Maybe I'm just not a tenor appreciator! Although I do have Domingo recordings that I treasure for his contribution, and Carreras for his, and Vickers for his. I dunno. Maybe I'm crazy. But I'll look for that pavarotti/sutherland Elisir and see what I think. Thanks.


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## sospiro (Apr 3, 2010)

guythegreg said:


> I do have that Puritani and I do enjoy it a great deal - there was a period when I played it daily, or even twice a day.


Thanks Greg!! Your post reminded me I've had this on my wish list for ages, just been waiting for a good used copy to come up for sale & have just got one for £10.00 ($16 ish).

Can't wait to hear it!!


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## bigshot (Nov 22, 2011)

Neapolitan songs


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## Itullian (Aug 27, 2011)

not a Pav fan, but his Duke is pretty good.


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## guythegreg (Jun 15, 2012)

sospiro said:


> Thanks Greg!! Your post reminded me I've had this on my wish list for ages, just been waiting for a good used copy to come up for sale & have just got one for £10.00 ($16 ish).
> 
> Can't wait to hear it!!


and I can't wait for YOU to hear it! It is pretty frantabulous. Sutherland at her best, and all around her sing very well too.


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## sospiro (Apr 3, 2010)

guythegreg said:


> and I can't wait for YOU to hear it! It is pretty frantabulous. Sutherland at her best, and all around her sing very well too.


Really looking forward to it. I love the opera & have this version which I listen to over & over.


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## Pamina (Sep 5, 2012)

mamascarlatti said:


> Got to disagree with this. Just because he is cheerful doesn't make him loveable. I think he's a psychopath, destroying lives and marriages in pursuit of his selfish sexual gratification.


True, the character is not a really nice guy, but Pavarotti never seemed to accentuate the Duke's dark side. He played him more like a guy who doesn't take his responsibilities or women's hearts very seriously. And his Parmi veder le lagrime was sincere enough. I think Pavarotti took a nicer, lighter approach to a lot of his characters.


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## Vaneyes (May 11, 2010)

I like "Tutto", a 2CD collection of arias covering most of his career. :tiphat:


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## Hesoos (Jun 9, 2012)

Duke of Mantua, Rodolfo, Arturo...

...and for me the best Pavarotti's role: Radames !
Someone could think that perhaps Radamés is too hard for Pavarotti, but Pavarotti's voice makes more victim and fragile the character than for example Domingo which I like a lot.


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## guythegreg (Jun 15, 2012)

Hesoos said:


> Duke of Mantua, Rodolfo, Arturo...
> 
> ...and for me the best Pavarotti's role: Radames !
> Someone could think that perhaps Radamés is too hard for Pavarotti, but Pavarotti's voice makes more victim and fragile the character than for example Domingo which I like a lot.


Oh no! And I didn't even have Radames in the poll. Sorry ...


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## sospiro (Apr 3, 2010)

sospiro said:


> Thanks Greg!! Your post reminded me I've had this on my wish list for ages, just been waiting for a good used copy to come up for sale & have just got one for £10.00 ($16 ish).
> 
> Can't wait to hear it!!





guythegreg said:


> and I can't wait for YOU to hear it! It is pretty frantabulous. Sutherland at her best, and all around her sing very well too.


Right. It's here, on the PC & now on the Walkman. Will listen on the way to work tomorrow.


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## guythegreg (Jun 15, 2012)

sospiro said:


> Right. It's here, on the PC & now on the Walkman. Will listen on the way to work tomorrow.


I'm holding my breath RIGHT NOW...


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## sospiro (Apr 3, 2010)

guythegreg said:


> I'm holding my breath RIGHT NOW...


Absolutely love it, love it, love it. It will be played _lots_.


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## DavidA (Dec 14, 2012)

Pav singing Rudolfo opposite Freni with Karajan and the BPO stretching the tempi. The tiny hand has never been lovelier. Better to hear him rather than see him as he never really looked the part of a starving poet!

Another great one is the Butterfly duet with the same conductor and soprano.


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## guythegreg (Jun 15, 2012)

sospiro said:


> Absolutely love it, love it, love it. It will be played _lots_.


WHEW!!! :lol: I'm going to look for that Caballe version, myself, sounds like I may have been missing something there. Thanks for the recommendation!


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## sospiro (Apr 3, 2010)

guythegreg said:


> WHEW!!! :lol:


 Check out Facebook



guythegreg said:


> I'm going to look for that Caballe version, myself, sounds like I may have been missing something there. Thanks for the recommendation!


A couple of day's ago I would have said there isn't another recording to equal it but now I've heard your favourite, I think I like yours better.


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## guythegreg (Jun 15, 2012)

Well, we'll see. I love Kraus and I'm not sure why - but one of his Faust DVDs was just phenomenal, I seem to recall. I'm sorry, I'm no Faust expert, but there's a key tenor aria and as soon as Kraus began singing it the air became kind of electric - it was as though you and the audience could all tell that something historic was happening (even though the recording was made years ago lol). And the way he crafted his way through the song, I don't know any other way to describe it, it was as though he was creating it new. At the end the response was such that he took a bow right on the spot.


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## sospiro (Apr 3, 2010)

guythegreg said:


> Well, we'll see. I love Kraus and I'm not sure why - but one of his Faust DVDs was just phenomenal, I seem to recall. I'm sorry, I'm no Faust expert, but there's a key tenor aria and as soon as Kraus began singing it the air became kind of electric - it was as though you and the audience could all tell that something historic was happening (even though the recording was made years ago lol). And the way he crafted his way through the song, I don't know any other way to describe it, it was as though he was creating it new. At the end the response was such that he took a bow right on the spot.


Is this the aria?

Salut! demeure chaste et pure


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## guythegreg (Jun 15, 2012)

lol i'll have to bring my headphones next time I come ... even then I may not remember it. I'll try, though.


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## DavidA (Dec 14, 2012)

In the Butterfly duet the way he sings one wonders who could resist


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## guythegreg (Jun 15, 2012)

sospiro said:


> Is this the aria?
> 
> Salut! demeure chaste et pure


WOW. Just ... wow. I think it is, and if it ain't it's pretty friggin' amazing. THANK you.


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## realdealblues (Mar 3, 2010)

My opera is very limited. I honestly don't venture very far from the opera's of Mozart and Wagner.

But, the version of "La Boheme" that has been mentioned with Karajan and Freni is the only recording of that work I need and over the years it has become one of my favorite listens. I still have no idea what the opera is about. I've never taken the time to see a DVD, or read the complete synopsis, or read the dialogue along with the recording. For me it stands on it's own.


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## sospiro (Apr 3, 2010)

realdealblues said:


> My opera is very limited. I honestly don't venture very far from the opera's of Mozart and Wagner.
> 
> But, the version of "La Boheme" that has been mentioned with Karajan and Freni is the only recording of that work I need and over the years it has become one of my favorite listens. I still have no idea what the opera is about. I've never taken the time to see a DVD, or read the complete synopsis, or read the dialogue along with the recording. For me it stands on it's own.


Great story. There is no 'right' way or 'wrong' way to enjoy opera.


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## Bellinilover (Jul 24, 2013)

The Duke of Mantua, Decca/Bonynge recording. For me Pavarotti IS the Duke. His gloriously effortless sound alone is enough to characterize him as an amoral yet charming egoist. I couldn't imagine "Questa o quella," "Parmi veder le lagrime" and (especially!) its cabaletta, or "La donna e mobile" being sung better. Maybe I could imagine them being sung as well, but not better.


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