# Sounds like Beethoven but isn't



## MaxManLA (Mar 25, 2016)

I'm looking for suggestions of composers whose work sounds very much like Beethoven, preferably orchestral and symphonic works by composers who were either contemporaries of Beethoven or who came after Beethoven in the Romantic Era. Feel free to name specific pieces as well! Many thanks for any and all suggestions.


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## StlukesguildOhio (Dec 25, 2006)

Well... the obvious suggestions are Schubert's 8th & 9th symphonies and Brahms' 1st. You might want to look into Hummel's piano concertos as well as the symphonic works of Dvorak and Bruckner.


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## tortkis (Jul 13, 2013)

How about Wilms?

Johann Wilhelm Wilms (1772-1847): Symphony No.7 in C minor - 3. Scherzo - Trio


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## Huilunsoittaja (Apr 6, 2010)

tortkis said:


> How about Wilms?
> 
> Johann Wilhelm Wilms (1772-1847): Symphony No.7 in C minor - 3. Scherzo - Trio


Yes definitely that :lol: I feel sad for the exact contemporaries of Beethoven. They were so overshadowed that it was unnatural. It _really _doesn't mean a thing to say you're not as famous as Beethoven. 

Luigi Cherubini

John Field maybe a very mild-mannered Beethoven....


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## KenOC (Mar 7, 2011)

I'd try Ferdinand Ries, a student of Beethoven. Even Beethoven said he sounded too much like Beethoven!

Hummel, as mentioned, is a good bet -- his piano concertos and his chamber music.


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## Gouldanian (Nov 19, 2015)

Nothing sounds quite like Beethoven in my opinion. His music is very distinctive. Just like Bach's. (Not that I'm comparing the two...)


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## Pugg (Aug 8, 2014)

KenOC said:


> I'd try Ferdinand Reiss, a student of Beethoven. Even Beethoven said he sounded too much like Beethoven!
> 
> Hummel, as mentioned, is a good bet -- his piano concertos and his chamber music.


I second this :tiphat:


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## Bruckner Anton (Mar 10, 2016)

Although there are many followers and admirers of Beethoven, it is quite hard to find works that are very identical to Beethoven's own (also Beethoven's own compositional style varied greatly through his life), because post-Beethoven era is a period that composers emphasize their own unique style and taste. Of course, later composers are able to imitate Beethoven's way of harmonic progression or motivic development without much difficulty, but it is almost meaningless to do so, because the mission of later composers is to make musical composition goes steps further.
If you just need some pieces that sound similar to Beethovens on hearing, Ferdinand Ries mentioned in the above post is a good example. Also there are some minor/less-known ones, like this for example:


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## joen_cph (Jan 17, 2010)

-> *Kuhlau*: Piano Concerto. Definitely. 




a more gracious and better-sounding recording


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## KenOC (Mar 7, 2011)

Be warned: Beethoven's glory is not in the way his music "sounds". While I am generally a fan of the later classical style, Beethoven's virtue isn't in his style but in the concentrated, almost frightening intelligence that infuses his music. That can't be imitated.


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## kanishknishar (Aug 10, 2015)

MaxManLA said:


> I'm looking for suggestions of composers whose work sounds very much like Beethoven, preferably orchestral and symphonic works by composers who were either contemporaries of Beethoven or who came after Beethoven in the Romantic Era. Feel free to name specific pieces as well! Many thanks for any and all suggestions.


Sorry to break it to you, Mr. Max, but that's not going to happen. One of Beethoven's charms lay in his individuality. The best you can do is get his Complete Works on DG.


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## DaveM (Jun 29, 2015)

MaxManLA said:


> I'm looking for suggestions of composers whose work sounds very much like Beethoven, preferably orchestral and symphonic works by composers who were either contemporaries of Beethoven or who came after Beethoven in the Romantic Era. Feel free to name specific pieces as well! Many thanks for any and all suggestions.


You might find this interesting:
http://www.talkclassical.com/41496-challenge-being-contemporary-beethoven.html?highlight=wolfl


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## ArtMusic (Jan 5, 2013)

Try Ferdinand Ries a student of Beethoven. Definitely sounds like Louis.


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## hpowders (Dec 23, 2013)

Another vote here for the Hummel Piano Concertos. Some are actually quite fine and enjoyable!


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## Stavrogin (Apr 20, 2014)

Ferdinand Ries was my first thought.
But all the composers mentioned here are appopriate answers.


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## Weston (Jul 11, 2008)

I third or fourth the Ferdinand Ries suggestion.

If you want to go a little more toward the romantic, Anton Rubinstein is like a romantic Beethoven, but sadly without the focus. I think he wanted to *be* Beethoven and even tried to look like him. I'll post links if needed when I get home today.


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## gardibolt (May 22, 2015)

Ries is a very good bet, and he's a much underrated composer. Susan Kagan has done a lot of work championing Ries and helping to bring him out of obscurity. Beethoven's favorite contemporary composer other than himself was Luigi Cherubini, and he has many Beethoven-like moments (check the overture to Medea, which sounds very much like Ludwig himself). Leopold Kozeluch penned a number of compositions that were once thought to be by Beethoven; if you are able to fool the experts like that, you should be in the running.


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## HaydnBearstheClock (Jul 6, 2013)

MaxManLA said:


> I'm looking for suggestions of composers whose work sounds very much like Beethoven, preferably orchestral and symphonic works by composers who were either contemporaries of Beethoven or who came after Beethoven in the Romantic Era. Feel free to name specific pieces as well! Many thanks for any and all suggestions.


Schubert's compositions are often like that - however, he definitely has his own style.


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## Delicious Manager (Jul 16, 2008)

I would suggest (with apologies for any duplications):

Luigi Cherubini
Charles Gounod (his two symphonies are VERY Beethovenian)
Antonín Rejcha (Anton Reicha)
Ferdinand Ries (please note spelling)
Jan Václav Voříšek (perhaps more like Schubert)
Johann Wilhelm Wilms


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## hpowders (Dec 23, 2013)

"You think I care about your damn instruments!!!!

Sounds like Beethoven....but it was Arturo Toscanini.


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## jpar3 (Mar 9, 2016)

MaxManLA said:


> I'm looking for suggestions of composers whose work sounds very much like Beethoven, preferably orchestral and symphonic works by composers who were either contemporaries of Beethoven or who came after Beethoven in the Romantic Era. Feel free to name specific pieces as well! Many thanks for any and all suggestions.


Haydn, Mendelsson, Dvorak


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## Truckload (Feb 15, 2012)

Bruckner Anton said:


> Although there are many followers and admirers of Beethoven, it is quite hard to find works that are very identical to Beethoven's own (also Beethoven's own compositional style varied greatly through his life), because post-Beethoven era is a period that composers emphasize their own unique style and taste. Of course, later composers are able to imitate Beethoven's way of harmonic progression or motivic development without much difficulty, but it is almost meaningless to do so, because the mission of later composers is to make musical composition goes steps further.
> If you just need some pieces that sound similar to Beethovens on hearing, Ferdinand Ries mentioned in the above post is a good example. Also there are some minor/less-known ones, like this for example:
> View attachment 82856
> View attachment 82857


Very interesting composer. Thanks for sharing this. Very interesting thread.


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## StlukesguildOhio (Dec 25, 2006)

Beethoven's glory is not in the way his music "sounds".

Huh?


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## violadude (May 2, 2011)

StlukesguildOhio said:


> Beethoven's glory is not in the way his music "sounds".
> 
> Huh?


Of course. I love good Thai cooking, but not the way it tastes (or smells or feels in my mouth).


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## hpowders (Dec 23, 2013)

Wow! That conductor has the most imprecise beat I've ever seen!!!

Sounds like Beethoven?

Nope. Fritz Reiner!


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## Alfacharger (Dec 6, 2013)

The 4 late reconsrtucted symphonies of Clementi sound like early Beethoven on steroids, (or late Haydn).

Another composition that sounds like Beethoven is Salieri's "Twenty six variations on La Folia de Spagna". I guess Beethoven's lessons with Salieri paid off.


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## musicrom (Dec 29, 2013)

I'd recommend the symphonies of Ries and Czerny if you're looking for something similar to Beethoven. I can't say much about the rest of their works, but the first time I heard their symphonies, I immediately thought of Beethoven. Not surprising, considering both were students of his.


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## MaxManLA (Mar 25, 2016)

Thanks StlukesguildOhio! Brahms' 1st is one of my all-time favorites, and I've just recently begun to appreciate Schubert (so I'll check out his 8th and 9th asap). Both are excellent suggestions...thanks again!


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## MaxManLA (Mar 25, 2016)

Thanks tortkis! Wilms is actually one of the reasons I became interested in composers who were obviously influenced by Beethoven. I first encountered him about a year ago and upon listening to a few of his symphonies I immediately noticed the strong similarity to Beethoven. I enjoy him all the more because, more than any other composer I've yet discovered, his work shows the steady progression from the late Baroque style to the early Romantic Era style. Thanks again!


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## MaxManLA (Mar 25, 2016)

Thanks Huilunsoittaja! I just finished sampling Field's nocturnes which were so beautiful they actually brought tears to my eyes! Lovely, sublime, haunting! Thanks again!


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## Alydon (May 16, 2012)

MaxManLA said:


> I'm looking for suggestions of composers whose work sounds very much like Beethoven, preferably orchestral and symphonic works by composers who were either contemporaries of Beethoven or who came after Beethoven in the Romantic Era. Feel free to name specific pieces as well! Many thanks for any and all suggestions.


I know you have mentioned orchestral or symphonic works, but I have over the years had great satisfaction from three composers who wrote primarily for the piano and were more or less Beethoven's contemporaries: Muzio Clementi, 1752-1832, Jan Ladislav Dussek, 1760-1812, and John Field, 1782-1837. I couldn't honestly say these composer's 'sound' like Beethoven, as of course else nobody does, but now with such easy access to music it is worth investigating these composers, and I can assure you there are some real gems there; Clementi's piano sonata op 50 no.3 Didone abbandonata, and any of Field's piano concertos will not disappoint.


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## DaveM (Jun 29, 2015)

Overall, while I think Ferdinand Ries' music is worth investigating, I don't find too much of a 'Beethoven sound' there. What never ceases to amaze me is how completely Beethoven carved out something entirely new and uniquely different from his contemporaries to the point that IMO, it was simply almost impossible to copy him. Not to mention that even if one tried to (copy him) in any given time period, it would have been too late, because Beethoven would have moved on to something almost entirely new.

I credit Hummel and Field for composing music unique to them without bowing to a Beethoven influence. On the other hand, I find Ries to be all over the map. In some of his Piano Concertos, he might start off with something like Beethoven, but then takes off into rather extreme romantic-period piano embellishment (think Liszt). Which again, reminds me how controlled Beethoven was in his innovation: There was just enough to amaze without making too much of a good thing.


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## MaxManLA (Mar 25, 2016)

Thanks for the link, DaveM! That's an excellent piece on Beethoven's cvontemporaries and thanks to it I listened to Joseph Wolfl's Symphony in G-minor. It's an excellent work and exactly the type of Beethoven-similar music I'm interested in. Very, very glad to have found this composer and this symphony, and very grateful to you for the link!


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## DaveM (Jun 29, 2015)

MaxManLA said:


> Thanks for the link, DaveM! That's an excellent piece on Beethoven's cvontemporaries and thanks to it I listened to Joseph Wolfl's Symphony in G-minor. It's an excellent work and exactly the type of Beethoven-similar music I'm interested in. Very, very glad to have found this composer and this symphony, and very grateful to you for the link!


Thanks for the reply. It makes the effort of posting those links worthwhile. Wolfl was far more than an average talent. I wish more of his piano works were recorded.


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## MaxManLA (Mar 25, 2016)

Thank you Weston! I first heard Rubinstein's music about a year ago and like him very much. Your suggestion made me go back and listen to some of his works again and yes, now I can hear the Beethoven influence. Very good suggestion. Thanks again!


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## MaxManLA (Mar 25, 2016)

Thanks Delicious Manager! Yes, Gounod! I'd forgotten him and upon seeing his name in your post instantly remembered that he and Wilms were the two composers whose symphonies, to me, sounded so much like Beethoven that it sparked my interest on this subject. I just listened to Gounod's Symphony No. 2 again, which is very, very Beethoven-like. Reicha has a wonderful playfulness to his music which to me seems influenced by both Beethoven and Mozart. Delightful! That's as far down the list of your suggestions as I got today. Judging by what I've heard so far, I'm looking forward to checking out the remainder of your list tomorrow and will post another reply then. Many thanks!


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## MaxManLA (Mar 25, 2016)

Thanks for the link, Alfacharger! Salieri is so much better than his post-Amadeus reputation makes out. Rare is the composer who could be judged favorably when pitted against the likers of Mozart! I enjoy Salieri very much. As for Clementi, I can't thank you enough for introducing me to this composer! What a find! His Symphony No. 4 in D-major is magnificent! I look forward to enjoying much more of his work. Thanks again!


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## arpeggio (Oct 4, 2012)

With all of the posts I am surprised that no one has mentioned Franz Danzi. 

I think he composed about six symphonies. Most of the word he is remembered for are his woodwind quintets and his wind concertos.


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## Nereffid (Feb 6, 2013)

One particular work that I think might appeal is the 4th symphony of Napoléon Henri Reber.

I know it from a very fine album performed by Le Cercle de l'Harmonie.


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## MaxManLA (Mar 25, 2016)

Thank you, Alydon! I listened to several pieces by Dussek. I particularly liked the very charming Sonatine Op. 20, some exceptionally beautiful harp sonatas as well as some wonderful duets for harp and piano, and a few of his excellent piano concertos. I love his soft, gentle style which nevertheless grabs one's attention from the start and holds one's interest with some truly delightful surprises in the melodies, tempos, etc. Clementi and Field I just discovered in the last few days thanks to other suggestions posted in the forum. Clementi is fantastic! As for Field, I still haven't quite recovered from the impact of hearing a few of his Nocturnes for the first time. I don't think I've ever heard anything more beautiful in my life. Thank you for your suggestions...very much appreciated!


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## regenmusic (Oct 23, 2014)

Domenico Cimarosa - 32 Piano Sonatas


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## Enthusiast (Mar 5, 2016)

There has been no second coming. But the one composer who sometimes make me thing of Beethoven is Berlioz. Obviously to style is very different and, genius though he was, Berlioz was no Beethoven but to me there is something about Berlioz's music that is a little beethovian in a way that no other composer's music is. I'll have to think about why I feel this.


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## gellio (Nov 7, 2013)

Schubert! Schubert! Schubert! If you like Beethoven you will like Schubert. Ive been a 20 year Beethoven fan, and am just now diving deeply into Schubert. I haven't been this excited with all the discoveries since, well Beethoven.


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## hammeredklavier (Feb 18, 2018)

""My string writing is indeed very traditional," muses Richter. "I listen to a lot of Purcell. And if there's a model for the big string piece on The Blue Notebooks, which is 'On The Nature Of Daylight', it's late Beethoven. I'm looking for that incredible intensity and clarity, using the minimum amount of notes possible."


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## Merl (Jul 28, 2016)

Cherubini quartets from the 3rd onwards.


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## neoshredder (Nov 7, 2011)

Schumann’s Symphonies do sound a lot like Beethoven.


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## Gold Member (Aug 23, 2021)

I believe this actually resembles Beethoven a bit; just listen more to the melody and structure evolving for a minute, not the orchestration.






What got me saying that is, this melody was vaguely stuck in my head, the shape of it, and I thought "This is a really classic melody, a superb melody and vertical structure, but I forget where it's from. It's got more a chance of being Beethoven than it does the likely candidates Tchaikovsky or Rimsky, because this melody has this more _momentous, _developmental quality I don't get from them, I just know the orchestration was more modern. Hmm... ah"

I know this comparison is a big leap of generations, but it's not that off.


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## bagpipers (Jun 29, 2013)

They often call Fernando Sor the Beethoven of guitar music.I never thought Sor was all that great but some like him.


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## Kreisler jr (Apr 21, 2021)

Classical guitar is not really compatible with Beethoven's style, too soft and mild. Amplified and distorted electrical guitar maybe...


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## Aurelian (Sep 9, 2011)

The third movement of Mozart's 38th Symphony to me _foreshadows_ Beethoven.


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## bagpipers (Jun 29, 2013)

Kreisler jr said:


> Classical guitar is not really compatible with Beethoven's style, too soft and mild. Amplified and distorted electrical guitar maybe...


People call him the Beethoven of the guitar,I did not start this custom,I would not have put Sor together with Beethoven persionally.Re-read my post in my words.


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## larold (Jul 20, 2017)

The only music I've known that reminded me of Beethoven, other than some of Mendelssohn's, was the score to the film Vanity Fair.






Vanity Fair (Original Motion Picture Soundtrack) by Mychael Danna on Amazon Music - Amazon.com


Check out Vanity Fair (Original Motion Picture Soundtrack) by Mychael Danna on Amazon Music. Stream ad-free or purchase CD's and MP3s now on Amazon.com.



www.amazon.com


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## pianozach (May 21, 2018)

If you like Beethoven so much, I'd recommend exploring the lesser known works in his catalog. So. Much. Music. Chances are that you haven't heard even half of them.

722 works. Only 172 of Beethoven's works have opus numbers.



https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_compositions_by_Ludwig_van_Beethoven


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## Montarsolo (5 mo ago)

I once heard 25 years ago a piece of symphony by an (unknown) composer who composed in the Beethoven style. The owner of a CD store let me listen to it. It wa a new cd. Unfortunately I have no idea who the composer was. No Schubert or Brahms. It was really a kind of Beethoven imitation. I'm going to take a look at this topic. maybe I'll come across that recording.

I remember this because the owner put the music on and asked what it was. I replied: Beethoven's 10th. He thought that was a wonderful answer, because it was indeed a Beethoven imitation. Still wonder what it was. No Field of Hummel or Ries because I already knew those names back then.


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## neoshredder (Nov 7, 2011)

pianozach said:


> If you like Beethoven so much, I'd recommend exploring the lesser known works in his catalog. So. Much. Music. Chances are that you haven't heard even half of them.
> 
> 722 works. Only 172 of Beethoven's works have opus numbers.
> 
> ...


Not all Beethoven works are of equal quality. I would rather listen to the top works of Schubert, Mendelssohn, Schumann, Brahms, and Dvorak over lesser works of Beethoven.


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## pianozach (May 21, 2018)

neoshredder said:


> Not all Beethoven works are of equal quality. I would rather listen to the top works of Schubert, Mendelssohn, Schumann, Brahms, and Dvorak over lesser works of Beethoven.


That's fine too. Nothing wrong with that either. It was a suggestion for someone that loves *Beethoven's* music. However, the musical character of *Schubert, Mendelssohn, Schumann*, and especially *Brahms*, are all decidedly _different_ from *Beethoven*. Only *Dvorak* seems to have that *Beethoven-y *thing going on.

I like *Schubert* and *Schumann's* piano works, although *Schubert* certainly can be long winded. I used to have one of his Sonatas (well, used to), the one in Bb, in my repertoire, and the first movement alone is, like, 20 minutes long. And I'm not really fond of *Schubert's Leider*. 

*Brahms*, to me at least, is not much like *Beethoven* at all, compositionally (although there are a lot of orchestration things that are). Beethoven, for one, is far more dramatic than Brahms. Brahms weaves music in a complex manner, while Beethoven is balls-to-the-wall sometimes. There are plenty of other differences, but I'll let you peruse a very very very lengthy discussion right here on this site: 

The Difference Between Beethoven and Brahms 

Honestly, if you love *Beethoven*, you might *not* find more of what you're looking for in *Brahms*' catalog; I suppose it depends on what aspects of Beethoven's music you love.

For *Beethoven*, there's almost no _poor_ quality works in his Middle Period (starting around 1805, or about the time of his *Symphony No. 3*) and later, with a few exceptions (such as *Wellington's Victory*).


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## geralmar (Feb 15, 2013)

Montarsolo said:


> I once heard 25 years ago a piece of symphony by an (unknown) composer who composed in the Beethoven style. The owner of a CD store let me listen to it. It wa a new cd. Unfortunately I have no idea who the composer was. No Schubert or Brahms. It was really a kind of Beethoven imitation. I'm going to take a look at this topic. maybe I'll come across that recording.
> 
> I remember this because the owner put the music on and asked what it was. I replied: Beethoven's 10th. He thought that was a wonderful answer, because it was indeed a Beethoven imitation. Still wonder what it was. No Field of Hummel or Ries because I already knew those names back then.




Friedrich Witt's 14th Symphony (1792) was in 1911 misattributed as Beethoven's 10th Symphony, and nicknamed "Jena", the city in which it was discovered.



1943


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## neoshredder (Nov 7, 2011)

pianozach said:


> That's fine too. Nothing wrong with that either. It was a suggestion for someone that loves *Beethoven's* music. However, the musical character of *Schubert, Mendelssohn, Schumann*, and especially *Brahms*, are all decidedly _different_ from *Beethoven*. Only *Dvorak* seems to have that *Beethoven-y *thing going on.
> 
> I like *Schubert* and *Schumann's* piano works, although *Schubert* certainly can be long winded. I used to have one of his Sonatas (well, used to), the one in Bb, in my repertoire, and the first movement alone is, like, 20 minutes long. And I'm not really fond of *Schubert's Leider*.
> 
> ...


Every Composer wants to be thought of as unique. In some ways, those 5 I mentioned are. But it’s not like they are complete opposites. They built on what Beethoven created. Imo, it wasn’t until Stravinsky until something totally different was created. And Stravinsky had a mixed reaction for being so daring. I consider the Romantic Era one great dedication to Beethoven.


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## Kreisler jr (Apr 21, 2021)

The "Jena Symphony" doesn't sound much like Beethoven. It sounds like a piece very closely modelled after Haydn's late symphonies (especially #97). Of course the young Beethoven could have written such a piece but even pieces where he leaned heavily on examples from others (more often Mozart than Haydn), like the piano+winds quintet sound more like Beethoven to me than that symphony by Witt. Nevertheless, it is a piece worth hearing (there is a good BBC recording with Bamert).
I agree that if one wants music that "sounds like Beethoven", lesser known Beethoven is usually a better bet than anyone else, after this probably Ries. Hummel, I think, sounds more like an alternative post-Mozart music than Beethoven, a way Beethoven might have composed if he had not been such an original and stubborn individual.
Not quite like Beethoven but closer are the two piano concertos by C. M. v. Weber. They are obviously inspired by Beethoven's 1st and 5th (IIRC they copy the rather uncommon keys of the slow movements) but more early romantic virtuoso than "symphonic" concertos.


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## RICK RIEKERT (Oct 9, 2017)

Op. Unknown


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