# Your perfect piece



## violadude (May 2, 2011)

Imagine you are reviewing a piece of music and you must give that piece a score of 1-1-10/10. In your opinion, what qualities must the piece have for you to give it a 10/10. 

Note, this is not a question of what must a piece have for you to enjoy it. I imagine anyone could enjoy a 9/10 piece just as much as a 10/10 piece. But what is that extra something(s) that you look for to give it a perfect score. 


Also, just for fun, conversely what would a 0/10 piece sound like to you?


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## Aramis (Mar 1, 2009)

It would have to be one of such works which move you so much that after it's finished you still can't think about anything else that this music and what it represents to you. You stand up, hear no more music, perhaps even go to do some other things yet you're still under spell of the work. Later in night you go to bed and fall asleep with what you have heard in your mind. 10/10 is for more than enjoyment - it's for music that offers profound experience and evokes lasting thoughts and feelings.



> Also, just for fun, conversely what would a 0/10 piece sound like to you?


Ever heard Brahms op. 118? :tiphat:


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## Weston (Jul 11, 2008)

It would have to elicit a transcendent, orgasmic, or religious experience. I can think of only a handful of pieces that achieve that for me.

Beethoven: Symphony No. 9
Vaughan-Williams: Tallis Fantasia
Yes: Awaken


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## violadude (May 2, 2011)

Aramis said:


> It would have to be one of such works which move you so much that after it's finished you still can't think about anything else that this music and what it represents to you. You stand up, hear no more music, perhaps even go to do some other things yet you're still under spell of the work. Later in night you go to bed and fall asleep with what you have heard in your mind. 10/10 is for more than enjoyment - it's for music that offers profound experience and evokes lasting thoughts and feelings.
> 
> Ever heard Brahms op. 118? :tiphat:


What about the 118 piano pieces of Brahms would make you rate them a 0?


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## Huilunsoittaja (Apr 6, 2010)

For me... it needs to 1) have very obvious contrast (tempo, dissonance, you name it) 2) some sort of groove 3) Usually Romantic era or 20th Cent. 4) A really _really_ good idea, not just melody, but everything combined

What makes a good idea? That, my friends, I cannot explain. It's only something I feel.

Yes. What makes a piece of music a 10/10 is if I have a very strong emotional response to it, either crying, laughing, awe, or all of the above. Prokofiev's ballet Cinderella in its entirety, that's an "all of the above" piece for me, a brilliant 10/10.


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## Manxfeeder (Oct 19, 2010)

violadude said:


> I But what is that extra something(s) that you look for to give it a perfect score.


I look for pieces that provide, as Eliot said, the "unattended moment . . . that you are the music while the music lasts."

Beethoven's Opus 111 affects me that way. The first movement sums up his youth - sonata form, tension, fighting; the last movement, his old age - variations, acceptance, the whole piece resolving into C major, compressed into a trill, "The still point," quoting Eliot again, and dying away. I don't want to hear anything for a while after that.

Less spiritual but still serene is Satie's Gymnopedie No. 1: One line over a static background, like the figures on a Grecian vase, a melody which doesn't go anywhere; it just is, and as such, it could go on endlessly.


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## Art Rock (Nov 28, 2009)

10/10: the few pieces (maybe 50-100 in total in classical music) that I can listen to again and again and again, no matter how familiar they are. They range form Bach's cello suites and St Matthew Passion to Stravinsky's Sacre and Gorecki's 3d symphony. But also pop/rock music like Pink Floyd's Shine on you crazy diamond, or Genesis' Firth of Fifth.

0/10: in classical music, no. Rap would score here.

In my blog I rate pieces I discuss in the following categories, which probably would corrspond to the numbers in brackets:

Hord concours (10)
Essential (9)
Important (8)
Good to have (6/7)
Not required (5)
Avoid (0-4)


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## tdc (Jan 17, 2011)

Aramis said:


> It would have to be one of such works which move you so much that after it's finished you still can't think about anything else that this music and what it represents to you. You stand up, hear no more music, perhaps even go to do some other things yet you're still under spell of the work. Later in night you go to bed and fall asleep with what you have heard in your mind. 10/10 is for more than enjoyment - it's for music that offers profound experience and evokes lasting thoughts and feelings.


I would agree with the above, it also has to have this:



Art Rock said:


> I can listen to again and again and again, no matter how familiar they are


Finally the piece has to offer something completely distinctive and original about it. To get a ten out of ten I have to feel the composer is at least partially stepping on virgin territory with whatever work it is. If it gives me that exciting feeling of 'woah this is great, but I don't fully understand it' on first listen, then continues to grow on me continually even after many listens. With all these attributes it might get a ten out of ten.

I honestly can't think of too many works I would give a zero out of ten to. Maybe a really bad commercialized jingle or something. If an artist has put any effort at all into something, I'd likely give it at least a 1. I really can't think of anything I've heard in the classical repertoire I'd rate at zero.


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## World Violist (May 31, 2007)

Yeah, a 10/10 piece would be one of those that make me unable to listen to anything else for a long time afterward, as well as all the usual junk about structure, etc. The only piece that really qualifies a 10/10 for me is the Bach St. Matthew Passion. There would be other 10/10's if I had never heard the St. Matthew, but it's so good it puts everything else down a point.

As for a 0/10...that would have to be one God-awful piece of crap right there...


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## Guest (Jul 7, 2011)

My favorite music goes up to 11. It's one better !!


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## Sofronitsky (Jun 12, 2011)

10/10 





0/10


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## clavichorder (May 2, 2011)

Aramis said:


> Ever heard Brahms op. 118? :tiphat:


Polednice, I could see your date with Aramis getting ugly...


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## Polednice (Sep 13, 2009)

Aramis said:


> Ever heard Brahms op. 118? :tiphat:


I make myself such an easy target! GRR!

To the question at hand: if I could answer properly, I would be composing it and trying to make money out of it. I don't think it's helpful to fanny around with a thousand metaphors about how art can affect you either - it's obvious that a 10/10 piece will be something that (in a gazillion other possible purple prose phrases) "makes you feel great".

More specifically, as I was talking about on another thread recently, the most important thing to me is a sense of narrative - i.e., this involves plentiful exposition, conflict, tension, resolution, and a denouement worthy of _Poirot_.

For a particular narrative to be more than 7, it's just also going to have to excel at providing the best of the best in terms of thematic material. In other words, the story is going to need to be based on an astonishing melody with rhythmic catchiness and harmonic interest.

These may well be things that most composers try to capture most of the time. So what are the ethereal qualities I have missed from my description? In short, I've got no f**king idea.


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## jdavid (Oct 4, 2011)

10/10 works _for me_ are those wherein the entire composition seems to be moving toward a single point where all the foregoing finds resolution - this is not an original thought but when I read it several works suddenly came to mind, especially the 2nd movement 'andante sostenuto' of Schubert's posthumous Piano Sonata Op. 108 in Bb. The 2nd movement is in C# minor, moves to A major and Bb after which the theme comes back in the original key, then out of nowhere a sudden, quiet C major chord makes the tiresome word 'magical' mean something. It is a wonderful moment.

A 0/10 would either be a genius work and a very poor performance, or a very poor work, which through the talents and determination of the performer(s) is transformed andbecomes the proverbial 'silk purse made from a sow's ear'.



violadude said:


> Imagine you are reviewing a piece of music and you must give that piece a score of 1-1-10/10. In your opinion, what qualities must the piece have for you to give it a 10/10.
> 
> Note, this is not a question of what must a piece have for you to enjoy it. I imagine anyone could enjoy a 9/10 piece just as much as a 10/10 piece. But what is that extra something(s) that you look for to give it a perfect score.
> 
> Also, just for fun, conversely what would a 0/10 piece sound like to you?


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## maxshrek (Sep 14, 2011)

Well I can type many pieces.
- Schubert, Impromptus D 890 n. 4
- Mozart, Batti Batti o bel Masetto.
- Mozart, Via resti servita, madama brillante
- Beethoven, op. 95, surely the most perfect piece of chamber music ever.
- Bach, Contrapunctus I, IV.
- Bach, Variations 13, 15, 18, 21 and Aria.


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## Olias (Nov 18, 2010)

"If I have an orgasm, its good music." - Bernstein


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## Nix (Feb 20, 2010)

Solid structure, interesting and engaging material throughout, expressive, moving, and says something in a way that is both profound and creative. Something that does more then just 'give the chills' but actually makes me feel what the composer felt. 

Some pieces that I think are borderline perfect:

Bach: Cello Suite #6
Mozart: Piano Concerto #20
Beethoven: Symphony #5
Schubert: Cello Quintet
Janacek: String Quartet #2


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## Fsharpmajor (Dec 14, 2008)

It needs to be just awesome, man. Like, totally symphonic.

Beethoven, Symphony No. 9
Bruckner, Symphony No. 8
Shostakovich, Symphonies 4 and 7
Mahler, Symphonies 8 and 9
Britten, _Sinfonia da Requiem_
Strauss, _Also sprach Zarathustra_, _Death and Transfiguration_, _An Alpine Symphony_
Wagner, _Prelude_ and _Entry of the Gods into Valhalla_ from _Das Rheingold_
Holst, _The Planets_
Bax, _Tintagel_
Sibelius, Symphony No. 7
Rimsky-Korsakov, _Sheherazade_


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## rarevinyllibrary (Aug 9, 2013)

the "Chesterfield " Symphony by A.BOURUKOV


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## science (Oct 14, 2010)

For me, Takemitsu's _From Me Flows What You Call Time_ is it. Ironically, given the title, the time just disappears when I listen to it - I'm absolutely entranced when I hear it. When it's over I find it hard to believe it's already over. I think what draws me in so much is the infinite timbral novelty of it. The endless shades of color fascinate me. There is a rhythmic mystery to it as well, which probably also plays a part in the effect it has on me. Anything with a more regular beat (or, perhaps, a more transparent structure) would probably preserve the sense of time for me.

I really don't know how long I could listen to a work like this without getting bored. If only Takemitsu had done something like it on a Feldman-esque scale! I'd love to try it.

The only work I remember having a comparable effect on me is Debussy's _Prélude à l'après-midi d'un faune_, but much less so than FMFWYCT.


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## Schumann (Aug 12, 2013)

*My most perfect solo piano pieces ever written*

_These solo piano/keyboard pieces I consider perfect to me:_

Bach: Harpsichord Suite In A Minor, BWV 818A - Sarabande
Bach: Goldberg Variations, BWV 988 - Aria
Bach: Harpsichord Partita #4 In D, BWV 828 - Allemande
Bach: Fantasia & Fugue In A Minor, BWV 904 - Fugue
Bach: English Suite #3 In G Minor, BWV 808 - Sarabande
Bach: The Art Of Fugue, BWV 1080 - Contrapunctus 11, A 4
Schumann: Waldszenen, Op. 82 - 9. Abschied
Schumann: Davidsbündlertänze, Op. 6 - 14. Zart Und Singend
Schumann: Album Für Die Jugend, Op. 68 - 32. Scheherazade
Schubert: Impromptu In G Flat, Op. 90, D 899/3
Schubert: Piano Sonata #3 In E, D 459, "Fünf Klavierstücke" - 1. Allegro Moderato
Beethoven: Piano Sonata #7 In D, Op. 10/3 - 2. Largo E Mesto
Beethoven: Piano Sonata #8 In C Minor, Op. 13, "Pathétique" - 2. Adagio Cantabile
Beethoven: Piano Sonata #14 In C Sharp Minor, Op. 27/2, "Moonlight" - 1. Adagio Sostenuto
Chopin: Andante Spianato & Grande Polonaise Brillante In E Flat, Op. 22
Chopin: Etude #3 In E, Op. 10/3, CT 16, "Tristesse"
Chopin: Etude #12 In C Minor, Op. 10/12, CT 25, "Revolutionary"
Chopin: Nocturne #2 In E Flat, Op. 9/2, CT 109
Chopin: Nocturne #10 In A Flat, Op. 32/2, CT 117
Brahms: 3 Intermezzi, Op. 117 - 1. Andante Moderato
Brahms: 6 Piano Pieces, Op. 118 - 2. Intermezzo In A
Grieg: Suite "From Holberg's Time" - 4. Air
Liszt: Liebesträume, "3 Notturnos Für Das Pianoforte", S 541 - #3 O Lieb, So Lang Du Lieben Kannst!
Liszt: Hungarian Rhapsody #2 In C Sharp Minor, S 244/2
Liszt: Harmonies Poétiques & Religieuses, S 173 - #3 Bénédiction De Dieu Dans La Solitude
Liszt: Mephisto Waltz #1, "Der Tanz In Der Dorfschenke", S 514
Mozart: Piano Sonata #9 In D, K 311 - 2. Andante Con Espressione
Rachmaninov: Moments Musicaux, Op. 16 - 4. Presto
Rachmaninov: Suite #1 In D Minor - 2. Lento
Scriabin: Étude #5 In C Sharp Minor, Op. 42
Scriabin: Piano Sonata #1 In F Minor, Op. 6 - 1. Allegro Con Fuocoso
Debussy: Suite Bergamasque, L 75 - 3. Clair De Lune


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## starry (Jun 2, 2009)

I'm not sure if anything can be completely perfect (composers are human beings not Gods), and certainly I wouldn't expect anything to rate 0/10. There has to be some kind of musicality even if it's only fleeting. Maybe rating music as 10/10 reflects that it counts among the top works within a composer's own oeuvre, and so isn't really meant to indicate complete perfection.


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## Feathers (Feb 18, 2013)

For me, a 10/10 piece should be stunning to listen to and also be able to withstand repeated listening. 

I would give around 2/10 to pieces that I thoroughly dislike. The pieces I would 0/10 would have to be really empty, and by empty I don't mean quiet, slow, or simple. By empty I mean having little musical content within an exaggeratedly fancy shell.


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## Cosmos (Jun 28, 2013)

Weston said:


> It would have to elicit a transcendent, orgasmic, or religious experience. I can think of only a handful of pieces that achieve that for me.


I have to say this is probably my criteria as well. In that case, the pieces I would say are "perfect" are:
Chopin's Ballade No. 1
Mahler's Das Lied von der Erde
Tallis' Spem in alium
Rachmaninov's Vespers (all night vigil)
Medtner's Piano Concerto No. 2
Beethoven's Symphony No. 6
and Busoni's Fantasia nach J.S.Bach

P.S. I forgot to add Contrapunctus XIV from Bach's The Art of Fugue


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## hpowders (Dec 23, 2013)

I have 48 perfect pieces:

Any of the 48 preludes and fugues of J.S. Bach's Well-Tempered Clavier. All masterpieces. All perfect.

Composing virtuosity at its finest!


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## MoonlightSonata (Mar 29, 2014)

Well, if it sounds like one of these it's on the right track to 10/10:
Beethoven - Symphonies 5 & 9, "Emperor" Concerto second movement, "Moonlight" and "Pathetique" sonatas
Mozart - Symphony 40, flute and harp concerto
Bach - WTC, Mass in B Minor
Saint-Saens - Danse Macabre, Carnaval des Animaux
RVW - Fantasia on Greensleeves
Prokofiev - Lieutenant Kijé
Schnittke - Viola Concerto, Concerto Grosso
Stravinsky - Rite of Spring
Schubert - Erl King

I don't think I would give anything 0/10. I don't have the heart.


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## Dim7 (Apr 24, 2009)

MoonlightSonata said:


> I don't think I would give anything 0/10. I don't have the heart.


How about............................................................................................................................................................


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## Cosmos (Jun 28, 2013)

I'm adding:
Ravel - Left Hand Piano Concerto
Scriabin - Sonata 5
Poulenc - Organ Concerto


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