# Did Beethoven write any opera(s)?



## Clouds Weep Snowflakes (Feb 24, 2019)

Even though he is one of my favorite composers, I've never heard about any opera by Beethoven...Am I wrong? I actually hope I am, as if he did write operas they would be splendid! Mozart wrote some (I'm getting "The Magic Flute" till the end of the month on CD) and they are good, and Wagner was inspired by Beethoven, so you get the point...


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## Sloe (May 9, 2014)

He wrote one opera Fidelio which is one of the most popular operas.


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## Clouds Weep Snowflakes (Feb 24, 2019)

Sloe said:


> He wrote one opera Fidelio which is one of the most popular operas.


Any more details? How good is it in your opinion(s)?


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## Sloe (May 9, 2014)

Clouds Weep Snowflakes said:


> Any more details? How good is it in your opinion(s)?


It is a rather easy opera to find out to listen to:

https://www.youtube.com/results?sp=EgIYAg%3D%3D&search_query=fidelio

It sounds like Beethoven so if you like Beethoven you like Fidelio.


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## Art Rock (Nov 28, 2009)

If you like the way Beethoven writes for voices (Sym 9 , Missa Solemnis), you'll like Fidelio. If you don't (like me), you won't.


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## DavidA (Dec 14, 2012)

Not really a great opera as such but a great work which can move you deeply


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## Don Fatale (Aug 31, 2009)

Fidelio is wonderful in many respects, and frustrating in a few, particularly if you don't care for spoken sections. It seems to lose a little focus later in the work.

On the plus side:
There is a selection of 5 different overtures to enjoy, whether at the opera or as concert pieces. Hopefully a live opera will feature two of them. Anything that mentions Leonore is actually Fidelio.
The first four numbers are back-to-back stunning melodies, which perfectly set up the scene and characters.
The prisoners' chorus can be overwhelming in live performance in a good production.
The basic story is one of the greatest, inspiring and moving in all of opera.

I've thought for a long time that this opera could have a prequel, concerning Florestan ended up in prison and Leonore's subsequent transformation into Fidelio. What an amazing two night opera that would be!


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## DavidA (Dec 14, 2012)

Yes if you are new to it pick a recording that has the original dialogue, even if it's truncated. Barenboim conducted a concert performance at the Proms some years ago where some PC nuttering had inserted some daft 'meaningful' commentary. The Abaddo gas the dialogue altered too but is not worth hearing apart from Kaufmann. The best version is Karajan's high octane one with Vickers and Denersch. I know some pick Klemperer but this is meant to be a drAma!


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## SixFootScowl (Oct 17, 2011)

I have seen all the commercial videos of Fidelio and this one remains my favorite (and this has English subtitles). Don't let the spoken parts deter you, they are short. Another good thing about this video is that whoever posted it has removed the 15-minute Leonore overture from between the last two parts (it never belonged there the way Beethoven wrote it but was inserted for a scene change).


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## SixFootScowl (Oct 17, 2011)

Don Fatale said:


> I've thought for a long time that this opera could have a prequel, concerning Florestan ended up in prison and Leonore's subsequent transformation into Fidelio. What an amazing two night opera that would be!


 Awesome idea! ...


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## Itullian (Aug 27, 2011)

It's a masterpiece, buy it.


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## SixFootScowl (Oct 17, 2011)

Itullian said:


> It's a masterpiece, buy it.


Like, like, like, like, ... like!


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## Becca (Feb 5, 2015)

Don Fatale said:


> I've thought for a long time that this opera could have a prequel, concerning Florestan ended up in prison and Leonore's subsequent transformation into Fidelio. What an amazing two night opera that would be!


And that prequel would, of course, require a prequel to it, and that one would need a brief preliminary. Then they can perform each of the Leonora overtures, one per prequel.


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## Woodduck (Mar 17, 2014)

Becca said:


> And that prequel would, of course, require a prequel to it, and that one would need a brief preliminary. Then they can perform each of the Leonora overtures, one per prequel.


Who knew that Rocca's aria about "Das Gold" might end up referring to "Das Rheingold"?


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## Clouds Weep Snowflakes (Feb 24, 2019)

Art Rock said:


> If you like the way Beethoven writes for voices (Sym 9 , Missa Solemnis), you'll like Fidelio. If you don't (like me), you won't.


Actually, Beethoven's 9th symphony is one of my favorite pieces of music of all time, so I'll try to get it; thank you everyone!


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## Sloe (May 9, 2014)

Woodduck said:


> Who knew that Rocca's aria about "Das Gold" might end up referring to "Das Rheingold"?


Who is Rocca. Or is there an opera about Steve Irwin I have not heard about?


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## Woodduck (Mar 17, 2014)

Sloe said:


> Who is Rocca. Or is there an opera about Steve Irwin I have not heard about?


It's a typo.

You know that.


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## Sloe (May 9, 2014)

Woodduck said:


> It's a typo.
> 
> You know that.


I understood. But I wanted to have some fun.


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## Woodduck (Mar 17, 2014)

Sloe said:


> I understood. But I wanted to have some fun.


Fair enough. But we should probably tell the uninitiated that "Rocca" is really "Rocco."

Sounds like a mafioso, doesn't it?

Who's Steve Irwin?


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## SixFootScowl (Oct 17, 2011)

Becca said:


> And that prequel would, of course, require a prequel to it, and that one would need a brief preliminary. Then they can perform each of the Leonora overtures, one per prequel.





Woodduck said:


> Who knew that Rocca's aria about "Das Gold" might end up referring to "Das Rheingold"?


Yes! Withg three prequels, we would have a cycle of four operas, much like the Ring, but since Fidelio, the fourth opera in the series is the last, it appears we would have 1, 2, 2, and 2 discs total, or half the length of the Ring. This could be good since length is one thing that deters the less brave from diving into the Ring.

OTOH, we could do a reversal of the Ring and have 4, 4, 4, and 2 CDs for the series. Then it would rival the Ring!


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## Reichstag aus LICHT (Oct 25, 2010)

Woodduck said:


> Who knew that Rocca's aria about "Das Gold" might end up referring to "Das Rheingold"?


Especially when sung by Gottlob "Hagen" Frick


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## Meyerbeer Smith (Mar 25, 2016)

Fritz Kobus said:


> Like, like, like, like, ... like!


Weren't you called Florestan at one point?


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## Meyerbeer Smith (Mar 25, 2016)

Sloe said:


> Who is Rocca. Or is there an opera about Steve Irwin I have not heard about?


No, you're thinking about crocca.


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## SixFootScowl (Oct 17, 2011)

Dr. Shatterhand said:


> Weren't you called Florestan at one point?


Yes. And my son is Rocco, but does not hang out here anymore.

We did it after discovering the Bernstein Fidelio DVD, which was the first opera video for both of us.


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## Sloe (May 9, 2014)

Dr. Shatterhand said:


> No, you're thinking about crocca.


My association was with ray which in Swedish is called rocka.


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## SixFootScowl (Oct 17, 2011)

I guess one could say Beethoven wrote two operas: They even have different names: Leonore (1805) and Fidelio (1814).


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## gellio (Nov 7, 2013)

SixFootScowl said:


> I guess one could say Beethoven wrote two operas: They even have different names: Leonore (1805) and Fidelio (1814).


I would argue that, too, and I would argue that _Leonore_ (1805) is the better, and I think Rene Jacobs great recording shows why.


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## SixFootScowl (Oct 17, 2011)

gellio said:


> I would argue that, too, and I would argue that _Leonore_ (1805) is the better, and I think Rene Jacobs great recording shows why.


Sometimes it seems the first attempt is the best. I feel that way with Tannhauser (Dresden over Paris version), and with Boris Godunov (1869 over 1872).


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## gellio (Nov 7, 2013)

SixFootScowl said:


> Sometimes it seems the first attempt is the best. I feel that way with Tannhauser (Dresden over Paris version), and with Boris Godunov (1869 over 1872).


Exactly. The perfect storm happened that lead to Leonore's failure. I love both Fidelio and Leonore, but since I got the Jacobs recording of Leonore that's all I really listen to anymore. It's the best.


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