# Name that Symphony!



## GraemeG

Over on the ‘Yay Bruckner’ thread I was pouring scorn on spurious naming of Bruckner symphonies: specifically the ‘Lyric’, ‘Apocalypse’, and ‘Divine’ names appended to the 7th, 8th & 9th symphonies respectively. It got me to thinking – if people can just append any name they want to an established masterpiece, and qualify it with the phrase ‘sometimes known as’, when almost no-one ever uses the name (at least no-one who knows anything about the subject) – why don’t we have a go at giving names to all those works without them? We live in a trivial, soundbite age; everything needs a catch, a hook, a memorable twist.
So with tongue firmly in cheek, let’s see what we can do about spreading some more names about. Use historical precedent, endless known facts/trivia about the piece, frequently-quoted anecdotes, etc. Avoid duplicating names.
I’ll start with more Bruckner. There are other ridiculous names:
Symphony No 6 in A ‘Philosopher’ – I’ve actually read this as a semi-serious claim, too
Symphony No 5 in B flat ‘Flying Buttress’ - I’d have gone ‘Gothic’, except Havergal Brian has already officially nabbed that.

Beethoven’s clearly got some gaps. Let’s try:
Symphony No 1 in C ‘Preliminary’
Symphony No 4 in B flat ‘Goddess’ – “a Greek Goddess between two Norse giants” – how many times have I read that?
Symphony No 5 in c minor ‘Churchill’ – I’d have called it ‘Victory’ but for the confusion with the Wellington opus.
Symphony No 7 in A ‘Apotheosis of the Dance’ – thanks, Wagner. I thought four words might be too much, but Dvorak got away from ‘From the New World’, so it stands.
Symphony No 8 in F ‘Throwback’

Tschaikovsky’s got most bases covered, with ‘Winter Dreams’, ‘Little Russian’, ‘Polish’, ‘Pathetique’, ‘Manfred’. There are just these two left:
Symphony no 5 in e minor ‘Fate’
Symphony No 4 in f minor ‘Vulgar’

Mendelssohn only left one out, here it is;
Symphony No 1 in c minor ‘Forgotton’

Brahms was quite remiss. Fancy writing pure music in the Romantic age. We can fix that:
Symphony No 1 in c minor ‘Tenth’ - let's make it official, then.
Symphony No 2 in D ‘Bucolic’
Symphony No 3 in F ‘Pudding’
Symphony No 4 in e minor ‘Bipolar’

Sibelius is another slacker. Gotta keep up with modern ways. Try these:
Symphony No 2 ‘Provincial’ – Virgil Thomson’s memorable critique is thus commemorated
Symphony No 4 in a minor ‘Suicidal’
Symphony No 7 in C ‘Cold Water’ – yada, yada, other composers are offering exotic cocktails, I offer…
Symphony No 8 ‘Destroyed’

Hey, and what about Mahler?
Symphony No 3 in d minor ‘Endless’
Symphony No 4 in G ‘Stoned’
Symphony no 5 in c sharp minor ‘Hysterical’


And a few others could use some help:
Schumann: Symphony No 4 in d minor ‘Turgid’
Franck: Symphony in d minor ‘Prolix’
Elgar: Symphony No 1 in A flat ‘Yorkshire Pudding’
Rachmaninoff: Symphony no 2 in e minor ‘Schmaltz’

There must be more. Tell us your best names. And stand by for these names to show up on an iTunes website soon…
cheers,
Graeme


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## Polednice

Interesting! But while I'll think some up in the coming hours, I must first give way to my urge to comment on some of yours 



GraemeG said:


> Beethoven
> ...
> Symphony No 5 in C minor 'Churchill' - I'd have called it 'Victory' but for the confusion with the Wellington opus.


If that's a reference to Winston, I'd personally avoid it because of just how anachronistic it is - it doesn't feel genuine given that Beethoven wasn't alive during the 20th century, but he would have been fully aware of the concept of Victory 



GraemeG said:


> Tschaikovsky's got most bases covered, with 'Winter Dreams', 'Little Russian', 'Polish', 'Pathetique', 'Manfred'. There are just these two left:
> Symphony no 5 in e minor 'Fate'
> Symphony No 4 in f minor 'Vulgar'


These ones pained me most! I really hope that you meant to label 4 as 'Fate' and 5 as 'Vulgar'! 4, after all, is the Beethoven-5 inspired symphony which itself was 'fate knocking at the door', while 5 is the crude (but nonetheless fun and stirring!) symphony that is frequently described as simple and over the top.



GraemeG said:


> Mendelssohn only left one out, here it is;
> Symphony No 1 in c minor 'Forgotton'


Just considering this and a few others that you named, are these titles an attempt to label our response to the works? 'Preliminary', 'Throwback' and 'Forgotten' seem to undermine the works of the composers. A label, in my opinion, should always demonstrate a feeling evoked by the piece, rather than how an audience responds on a critical level.



GraemeG said:


> Brahms was quite remiss. Fancy writing pure music in the Romantic age. We can fix that:
> Symphony No 1 in c minor 'Tenth' - let's make it official, then.
> Symphony No 2 in D 'Bucolic'
> ...
> Symphony No 4 in e minor 'Bipolar'


1: 'Beethoven's Tenth' just for clarity 
2: This is already frequently referred to as the 'Pastoral' I believe (as is Dvorak's 6th).

As for 4, that's potentially offensive...


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## Jules141

My suggestions are a bit more personal (and weird) and speak of what the symphonies mean to me. Here's some of Prokofiev's

Symphony No.5 - "Disaster"
Symphony No.6 - "Orange"
Symphony No.7 - "The City at Night"

and my most subjective suggestion:

Symphony No.2 - "The WTF Symphony"

Elgar's:

Symphony No.1 - "Noble"
Symphony No.2 - "Proud"
(Unfinished) Symphony No.3 - "The Ship at Sea" (I can think of nothing but waves for that opening)


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## Argus

Haydn Symphony No 17 - 'Raggamuffin'

Mozart Symphony No 12 - 'Bungalow'

Robert Simpson Symphony No 11 - 'Brutus'

Einojuhani Rautavaara Symphony No 5 - 'Minx'

Alan Hovhaness Symphony No 26 - 'Dromedary'

Villa Lobos Symphony No 7 - 'Nanook'


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## Aramis

Rachmaninoff No. 2 "Андрей Болконский" or "Война и Мир"
Brahms No. 1 "The Original One" 
Schubert No. 5 "The Shower"
Saint-Saëns No. 3 "The Overrated"


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## andruini

Bruckner 2 "Yes! It's finally ov---oh, come on!!"


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## emiellucifuge

I have no idea what Schmaltz means, but I think the cliché term 'Romantic' perfectly suits the Rachmaninov 2nd


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## Weston

I'm so into this thread. I have raged against forgettable names like "Concerto for transverse flute, prepared rubber band, viola dalla biforcazione, and continuo in Q minor, Op. 117, No. 12, VW-1186" for decades!

Having said that, I'm hard pressed to come up with names at the moment.

Beethoven's 5th - this should probably be "Fate," not "Victory."

Beethoven's 8th - "Ubiquitous" It appears on almost every CD I have of other Beethoven symphonies because it is short and makes good filler.

Brahms 4th "Farewell" That opening theme seems to be saying "Farewell -- farewell --farewell -- farewell, etc." 

Shostakovich No. 11 is already called "The Year 1905," but I think of it as "Cosmos."

Copland No. 3 "Fanfare" Well that was obvious I guess.


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## PostMinimalist

I often imagine the old great composers still writing away from beyond the grave, so here's a few of the latest works from behind the pearly gates:

Haydn symphony No 2443 - the 'Giant Pink Porcupine'.
Mahler symphony No 53 - the 'Utterly Humungulorious' (six and a half days duration)
Tchaikovsky symphony No 13 - the 'Really, Really, Really Unlucky'
Vaughan-Williams symphony No 73 - 'A South West Chelmsford Symphony'
Lutoslawsky Symphony No 87 - the 'Undertandable (almost)'
Neilsen symphony No 999 - the 'Get The Fire Extingusher Now!!!!!'
Beethoven symphony No 254 - 'Van Halen Eat That!!'

There are of course many more.
FC


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## Fsharpmajor

Shostakovich named some of his, but here are my names for some he didn't:

*Shostakovich Symphony No. 2 "Commie Propaganda"
Shostakovich Symphony No. 4 "The Great Terror"
Shostakovich Symphony No. 9 "Stalin Hit the Roof"
Shostakovich Symphony No. 10 "Yippee! He's Dead!"
Shostakovich Symphony No. 14 "This is Supposed to Be a Symphony? You Must Be Joking"
*
I also think that Messaien's Turangalila-Symphonie should be renamed:

*Messaien Symphony No. 1 "What the Hell Is that Thing?"*

And then there's:

*Nielsen Symphony No. 5 "Keith Moon"*


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## Dim7

The nickname "This is Supposed to Be a Symphony? You Must Be Joking" fits Messiaen's Turangalila symphony as well.....


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## andruini

Fsharpmajor said:


> *Nielsen Symphony No. 5 "Keith Moon"*


Ha! That one's great!


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## islandersbob

PostMinimalist said:


> I often imagine the old great composers still writing away from beyond the grave, so here's a few of the latest works from behind the pearly gates:
> 
> Haydn symphony No 2443 - the 'Giant Pink Porcupine'.
> Mahler symphony No 53 - the 'Utterly Humungulorious' (six and a half days duration)
> Tchaikovsky symphony No 13 - the 'Really, Really, Really Unlucky'
> Vaughan-Williams symphony No 73 - 'A South West Chelmsford Symphony'
> Lutoslawsky Symphony No 87 - the 'Undertandable (almost)'
> Neilsen symphony No 999 - the 'Get The Fire Extingusher Now!!!!!'
> Beethoven symphony No 254 - 'Van Halen Eat That!!'
> 
> There are of course many more.
> FC


Here's a list of some that I'm sure Mahler would be willing to undertake....I think he'd be the only composer to have a chance of successfully pulling these off!

'Matthew'
'Mark'
'Luke'
'John'


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## kmisho

Fsharpmajor said:


> Shostakovich named some of his, but here are my names for some he didn't:
> 
> Shostakovich Symphony No. 2 "Commie Propaganda"
> Shostakovich Symphony No. 4 "The Great Terror"
> Shostakovich Symphony No. 9 "Stalin Hit the Roof"
> Shostakovich Symphony No. 10 "Yippee! He's Dead!"
> Shostakovich Symphony No. 14 "This is Supposed to Be a Symphony? You Must Be Joking"


More Shostakovich

5th - "Please Don't Kill Me"
7th - "Intoxicated Ravel"
11th - "Movie Gig"


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## kmisho

Samuel Barber:

Violin Concerto - "Take That"
Cello Concerto - "And That"
Piano Sonata - "Choke On It"
Symphony - "Had Enough?"
Piano Concerto - "Say Uncle"


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## emiellucifuge

Prokofiev 5 - Victory
Prokofiev 6 - War
Prokofiev 7 - Childhood


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## danae

Mozart's 40th: "He he, no one does it like I do it"

Beethoven's 3rd: "I DID IT!!!!!"

Brahms's 1st: "Oh my God, I don't know if I can do it. Can I do it? How can I ever do it when HE did what he did? Can I ever match him? I don't know what to do! I have to do it, I have to do it... I ... have... to... how ...will I..., oh my God..."

Shostakovitch's 15th: "Oops! I did it again!"


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## Aramis

Tchaikovsky No. 3 "Russian farting"


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## GraemeG

kmisho said:


> More Shostakovich
> 
> 5th - "Please Don't Kill Me"
> 7th - "Intoxicated Ravel"
> 11th - "Movie Gig"


Actually, I was thinking more along the lines of:
Symphony No 5 "Irony"
Symphony No 9 "Get Stuffed"

Graeme


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## maestro267

Vaughan Williams Symphony No. 3 ('Cowpat')

Haydn Symphony No. 90 ('Can I Clap Yet? Nope...Now? Nope... Now? Nope...')


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## Guest

To insert a note of seriousness, I don't necessarily think these are inventions of our current times, so much as what we have the early Romantics to thank for (sorry for ending the sentence on a preposition!).

People like Schumann liked to convey emotions and feelings not only in their music, but in their titles. I think that was when we really started seeing a shift from "Symphony No. X in F Major" and "Sonata for Piano and Garbage Can Lid in A Minor." 

Is it bad that names get attached to things over time? Other than the composer gave them? I don't know. My friends call me Mike, even though my parents gave me the name Michael (and she still uses Michael). Is that bad? 

Now, I have a really hard time sometimes remembering specific numeric designations for all the various works that I listen to. If someone were to come up to me and ask, "What do you think of Beethoven's 5th Trio for Piano and Strings in D Major?" I am going to remain silent, trying to remember which one that is. They might then remark, "You know, his Opus 70, No. 1 Piano Trio?" Still I will scratch my head. But if they ask, "What do you think of Beethoven's 'Ghost' Piano Trio?" I will know just which one they are talking about.

Maybe it is amateurish for those of us that don't have eidetic memories, but it helps us remember one piece from another. Personally, I think Bruckner would rather that people remember his "Romantic" symphony than to not even know he existed.


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## Il Seraglio

Great, great thread

Bruckner - Symphony No. 9 _Duke Nukem Forever_
Mahler - Symphony No. 9 _Kill Yourself_


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## tahnak

I think you are taking this too far. My apologies for appending titles to Bruckner's Seventh, Eighth and Ninth and disturbing your peace. Henceforth, I shall refer to the symphonies without their titles. What you have done here is childish. However, Have a good year on the forum.


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## Argus

tahnak said:


> I think you are taking this too far. My apologies for appending titles to Bruckner's Seventh, Eighth and Ninth and disturbing your peace. Henceforth, I shall refer to the symphonies without their titles. What you have done here is childish. However, Have a good year on the forum.


I know you are but what am I?


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## kmisho

maestro267 said:


> Haydn Symphony No. 90 ('Can I Clap Yet? Nope...Now? Nope... Now? Nope...')


I'm more familiar with Beethoven's "Can I Clap Yet? Nope...Now? Nope... Now? Nope...", AKA the 7th Symphony.


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## tahnak

DrMike said:


> Maybe it is amateurish for those of us that don't have eidetic memories, but it helps us remember one piece from another. Personally, I think Bruckner would rather that people remember his "Romantic" symphony than to not even know he existed.


Well said!


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## tahnak

Il Seraglio said:


> Great, great thread
> 
> Bruckner - Symphony No. 9 _Duke Nukem Forever_
> Mahler - Symphony No. 9 _Kill Yourself_


This is blasphemy


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## Aramis

Beethoven's Symphony No. 7 "a lot of yaks dancing about"


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## kmisho

Aramis said:


> Beethoven's Symphony No. 7 "a lot of yaks dancing about"


Thomas Beecham said that about the 7th right?

Along the same lines:
Tchaikovsky Violin Concerto "Redolent of Vodka"


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## GraemeG

tahnak said:


> I think you are taking this too far. My apologies for appending titles to Bruckner's Seventh, Eighth and Ninth and disturbing your peace. Henceforth, I shall refer to the symphonies without their titles. What you have done here is childish. However, Have a good year on the forum.


Oh, come on.  I did say 'with tongue firmly in cheek' at the start. I still can't find any reputable sources for the names for Bruckner 7-9. The apocalyptic 8th got referred by Wikipedia back to a 1950s Oxford Companion - I have that book at home and looked it up. It just appeared in there with no further references or information. Seeing as how Britain in the 1950s was pretty much a hotbed of Brucknerian ignorance, I wouldn't give it much credence. Bet it doesn't appear in a current edition!
Anyway, this thread is a chance to put any names you like to symphonies. Go for it!
cheers,
Graeme


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## Il Seraglio

tahnak said:


> This is blasphemy


You've got the wrong idea, I love Mahler's ninth, but it is very downbeat.

I sincerely apologise if it seemed snide at all.


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## Falstaft

This is a hilarious thread. My contribution:

Haydn 45: The Gimmick
Saint-Saens 3: Babe The Cyclical Pig
Bruckner 8: The Engorged
Vaughan Williams 4: The Heavy Artillery
Vaughan Williams 5: The Hallowed
Vaughan Williams 6: The Shell-Shocked
Penderecki 2: The Extremely Depressing Christmas


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## JAKE WYB

GraemeG said:


> Symphony No 7 in C 'Cold Water' - yada, yada, other composers are offering exotic cocktails, I offer…


It was *Sibelius 6th *that was Pure cold spring water


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## Huilunsoittaja

GraemeG said:


> Tschaikovsky's got most bases covered, with 'Winter Dreams', 'Little Russian', 'Polish', 'Pathetique', 'Manfred'. There are just these two left:
> Symphony no 5 in e minor 'Fate'
> Symphony No 4 in f minor 'Vulgar'


I thought it was the 4th that was called the "Fate" symphony (negative connotation to destiny), which is opposed to the 5th which is the "Providence" symphony (positive connotation to destiny).


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## Serge

Brahms - No. 1 "In HIS Shoes"
Beethoven - No. 3 "Revolutionary, but That Little French Dude Can Forget It!"


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## starry

DrMike said:


> To insert a note of seriousness, I don't necessarily think these are inventions of our current times, so much as what we have the early Romantics to thank for (sorry for ending the sentence on a preposition!).


Nicknames for pieces didn't start with the Romantics. It's seen with classical period pieces sometimes and even baroque (like Vivaldi).


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