# Signore, ascolta! Pick your favorite Liù!



## Azol (Jan 25, 2015)

I think this could be fun for opera fans, so here's my game:

I've selected 8 different performances of the famous aria by 8 different sopranos. I've adjusted the volume level, frequency range and whatnot of all the recordings to bring them more in line with each other so you can listen with no preconceptions. Of course some voices you might easily recognize but that's okay.

You may vote for any number of recordings that you enjoy the most.
You can also send me PMs with your guesses (not necessary).

I'll post the results in several days depending on voting activity so take your time with the tracks.

track #1
track #2
track #3
track #4
track #5
track #6
track #7
track #8


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## nina foresti (Mar 11, 2014)

Impossible for this old dame to figure out how to just click one track and listen without having to go through a whole rigamarole.

Wish there were an easier way for unsavvy tech people.


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## The Conte (May 31, 2015)

nina foresti said:


> Impossible for this old dame to figure out how to just click one track and listen without having to go through a whole rigamarole.
> 
> Wish there were an easier way for unsavvy tech people.


SNAP! There must be an easier way to organise these.

N.


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## Azol (Jan 25, 2015)

I replaced the links - hopefully Dropbox is more user-friendly and allows to play each file without the need to download them first.


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## nina foresti (Mar 11, 2014)

It's working -I don't know how but I discovered #5 is Callas and they won't accept it
aand #7 is not acceptable. I am now going to 8.

Once it was fixed by Azol the whole thing became easy and I was able to hear 5 and 7.
Thanks Azol


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## Seattleoperafan (Mar 24, 2013)

Darn it. I had a big contest planned around this. I may still do it down the road.


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## MAS (Apr 15, 2015)

Having decided to play, I listened to all tracks, and found them all worthy of attention. 

Dear Katia, Leontyne, Montserrat, Maria, etc. are all in there (not necessarily in that order), but the one that I found most affecting is no.3 the slow tempo beautifully sustained by the soprano. 

But I voted for more than one!


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## nina foresti (Mar 11, 2014)

No trouble once I got the hang of it. And I even heard Callas which was obvious!!
And Olivero which was also obvious (and over the top)
I think the one that grabbed me the most was #3 with a bit of tremolo. 
#8 sounded like Scotto.
#1 and #2 were also good.
Fun fun fun! I love this stuff.
Thanks for taking the time.


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## The Conte (May 31, 2015)

nina foresti said:


> No trouble once I got the hang of it. And I even heard Callas which was obvious!!
> And Olivero which was also obvious (and over the top)
> I think the one that grabbed me the most was #3 with a bit of tremolo.
> #8 sounded like Scotto.
> ...


SPOILER ALERT! Perhaps send a PM to Azol with your guesses of who is who.

N.


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## The Conte (May 31, 2015)

1) I generally like this one, she's very stylish and it's very beautiful singing. Somewhat dull though. (I really can't tell who it is.)

2) This is much more interesting than number one and the voice is more luscious if not quite as even on the high notes. I prefer this over number one and the conducting is more touching. (I could guess the country this singer is from, but not the singer.)

3) This beats both one and two as the soprano is more connected to the aria. The tempo is very slow, too slow. (Again, I don't know who the singer is.)

4) This voice has a bleat to it that isn't particularly attractive, but the phrasing is effective and touching. The singer isn't as 'in the mood' as number three and so three is the winner so far. (I think I recognise this one.)

5) This one is different from all the others and doesn't sound quite right for the role (it's not a typical Puccini voice). It's nicely done, but I still prefer number three despite the slow speed of the conducting ruining the mood of the piece. (I am absolutely certain I know who this is.)

6) Oh, this one's good. This is the best so far, the phrasing is so loose and natural. Like number three it's too slow, but it's still the best yet. (I would attempt a guess at this one.)

7) No, I don't like this one, but the bad sound might be influencing me somewhat. However, I had a feeling I knew who it was and so found the same recording on YouTube, but in slightly better sound. It actually turns out to be pretty good. (I know who this is.)

8) This one is good too, it's a toss up between this and number 6 and number 7. (I don't know who it is.)

Before doing this listening comparison I would have said number 7 was my favourite. However, I prefer 6 and 8.

I've listened to 6 and 8 again a few times and number 6 is the winner for me by a hairsbreadth, but since we can vote for more than one, I am going with 6 and 8 and I can't wait to find out who they all are.

N.


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## Tsaraslondon (Nov 7, 2013)

I recognised Olivero and Callas straight away. I think I also recognised Moffo, Scotto, Caballé and maybe Te Kanawa.

No 4 was the only one to do a proper _mesa di voce_ on the last note, as Puccini requests, but I didn't care for her rapid vibrato. I enjoyed allf of them, but my favourites were probably no 5 and no 8.


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## nina foresti (Mar 11, 2014)

Okay. Here are my picks: 
#1(?) Moffo
#2 (?) Scotto (liked the least of all)
#3 (?) By far the one that touched me like no other. I don't know who it was but my guess is Zeani or Moffo.
#4 Olivero
#5 Callas
#6 (?) Freni
#7 (?) Caballe
#8 (?) Tebaldi
I too liked #7 and thought of Freni??
Of course we all know who #4 & #5 are!! (duh!)
I thought #8 might have been Tebaldi.
How bad did I do?

More more!!!

I didn't know you could vote for more than one. Sort of takes the oomph out of it for the winner as some will just vote for Callas ... because.


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## nina foresti (Mar 11, 2014)

To The Conte:
Why? I don't know the real answers except for those 2 obvious ones.
I'd actually like to see who everybody voted for before getting the real answers.


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## nina foresti (Mar 11, 2014)

MAS said:


> Having decided to play, I listened to all tracks, and found them all worthy of attention.
> 
> Dear Katia, Leontyne, Montserrat, Maria, etc. are all in there (not necessarily in that order), but the one that I found most affecting is no.3 the slow tempo beautifully sustained by the soprano.
> 
> But I voted for more than one!


I am dying to know who 3 is


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## Woodduck (Mar 17, 2014)

It's fun not knowing who the singers are in advance. I recognize all but #1, #6 and #8 (although I have a strong suspicion about #8). Random remarks:


1. Lovely and simple, less intense than most but satisfying, with a beautiful high pianissimo.

2. Tone tending toward its present excessive darkness and heaviness, and vibrato toward its present wobble.

3. Very detailed and dramatic, slow, a trifle overdone as is her tendency, but touching.

4. Unmistakable tremulous vibrato, satisfactory interpretation until the melodramatic crackup at the end (a trademark, it seems).

5. Predictably fine interpretation, but not really a voice for this role. Can't float a pianissimo.

6. Feels right to me, on the slow side but very expressive and idiomatic. Last note with a bit of strain, but forgivable.

7. Past her prime, unable to sustain consistent tone and dynamics to shape her phrases, which sound self-indulgent and awkward. The only really poor rendition here. Her contribution to a complete recording of a few years earlier is better, but still not one of the best.

8. Rather similar to #6, hard to choose between them. I think one of them will be my favorite of the lot, but I'll call it a tie and choose both.


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## Tsaraslondon (Nov 7, 2013)

I've listened to them all again and have adjusted my guesses on the various sopranos. Absolutely sure about nos 4 and 5, though, which no doubt means they have the most distinctive voices. I suppose it also means that reactions to the two voices are also more definite. I don't like 4, but I do like 5. I mentioned in my post that Puccini asks for a _mesa di voice_ on the last note, that is starting piano, swelling the note, then a final diminuendo, and 4 is the only singer to really do this. Stylistically she's bang on, but I find it hard to get past that fluttery vibrato. (She sounds a bit like Katherine Grayson!) Most sopranos sing the note piano or do a pianissimo on it. In her famous performane on the Mehta recording (not included here), Caballé floats the most amazing pianissimo, but she's so pleased with the effect that she holds the note long past the point Puccini has asked her to leave it. :devil:

The soprano who manages the effect (almost) perfectly is Schwarzkopf on the Callas recording. I can add her version as it's not amongst those above.






I say almost because there is a tiny flicker of unsteadiness as she does the diminuendo, but it is closer to what Puccini wrote than anyone else I've heard. I've heard people say that Schwarzkopf sounds more like the Princess Werdenberg than a poor little slave girl, but I've always enjoyed her Liu and think that it has been severely underrated.


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## Woodduck (Mar 17, 2014)

Tsaraslondon said:


> I've listened to them all again and have adjusted my guesses on the various sopranos. Absolutely sure about nos 4 and 5, though, which no doubt means they have the most distinctive voices. I suppose it also means that reactions to the two voices are also more definite. I don't like 4, but I do like 5. I mentioned in my post that Puccini asks for a _mesa di voice_ on the last note, that is starting piano, swelling the note, then a final diminuendo, and 4 is the only singer to really do this. Stylistically she's bang on, but I find it hard to get past that fluttery vibrato. (She sounds a bit like Katherine Grayson!) Most sopranos sing the note piano or do a pianissimo on it. In her famous performane on the Mehta recording (not included here), Caballé floats the most amazing pianissimo, but she's so pleased with the effect that she holds the note long past the point Puccini has asked he to leave it. :devil:
> 
> The soprano who manages the effect (almost) perfectly is Schwarzkopf on the Callas recording. I can add her version as it's not amongst those above.
> 
> ...


I agree. I think her slender voice suits the character better than some heavier voices do. She and Callas make for some unusual casting, worth hearing even if the recording isn't our first choice for the opera.


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## nina foresti (Mar 11, 2014)

I sure wouldn't mind seeing a poll where everyone votes for their one favorite only and not 2 or 3. Seems counter-productive to me.
I never realized when I voted that I was supposed to pick several. What's the fun in that? How do we know which one has really gotten the most votes that way?


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## Tsaraslondon (Nov 7, 2013)

nina foresti said:


> I sure wouldn't mind seeing a poll where everyone votes for their one favorite only and not 2 or 3. Seems counter-productive to me.
> I never realized when I voted that I was supposed to pick several. What's the fun in that? How do we know which one has really gotten the most votes that way?


I thought the fun was in the guessing. I've checked with Azol and I got seven out of eight, which isn't bad, though I'm suprised I missed the one I did.


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## nina foresti (Mar 11, 2014)

Tsaraslondon said:


> I thought the fun was in the guessing. I've checked with Azol and I got seven out of eight, which isn't bad, though I'm suprised I missed the one I did.


I agree that the fun is in the guessing but that hasn't really anything to do with choosing the #1 best in your opinion to see how many people voted for the best one and who it was.
Just sayin'


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## Azol (Jan 25, 2015)

This was meant as more relaxed kind of game, giving every contestant a chance to get a vote. You can vote for any number of singers that make you happy - only one or maybe all of them if you feel really generous!


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## nina foresti (Mar 11, 2014)

Azol said:


> This was meant as more relaxed kind of game, giving every contestant a chance to get a vote. You can vote for any number of singers that make you happy - only one or maybe all of them if you feel really generous!


Got it. Thanks for taking the time for another fun guessing game. Keep 'em coming.


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## The Conte (May 31, 2015)

nina foresti said:


> I sure wouldn't mind seeing a poll where everyone votes for their one favorite only and not 2 or 3. Seems counter-productive to me.
> I never realized when I voted that I was supposed to pick several. What's the fun in that? How do we know which one has really gotten the most votes that way?


I agree. However, Seatleoperafan is planning a contest along the same lines, so we may be able to see who is the overall winner then.


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## nina foresti (Mar 11, 2014)

The Conte said:


> I agree. However, Seatleoperafan is planning a contest along the same lines, so we may be able to see who is the overall winner then.


Oh how neat. Keeps me young.:lol:


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## Azol (Jan 25, 2015)

Since most of our usual participants have already voted (and have took pretty good guesses at who's who in this puzzle), it's time for final reveal:

1 - Ricciarelli
2 - Netrebko
3 - Fleming
4 - Olivero
5 - Callas
6 - Freni
7 - Caballe
8 - Scotto

Some additional notes from myself:
I agree that Callas has wrong voice type for this particular part, but goddamn her take alone brings tears to my eyes. Her characterization (if not the technical execution) is immaculate, as usual.
I'm very glad Scotto's rendition pleased most listeners (currently leading with 7 votes), she is another amazing singing actress but - similarly to Callas - not without problems developed pretty early in her career.
My mistake in choosing the wrong version with Caballe, I'm sure she would have fared better... sorry, Montsy fans!
Fleming is (as expected) super-elaborate but somehow it doesn't detract from enjoying her exquisite lines.
Netrebko is the only soprano here I just cannot listen to, no matter how hard I try. Doesn't work. I'm allergic 

Was fun little game, thanks for taking time to participate, it's been great pleasure reading your reactions and comments!


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## Azol (Jan 25, 2015)

Seattleoperafan said:


> Darn it. I had a big contest planned around this. I may still do it down the road.


You are welcome to set up more games in this mode if you'd like to!
My advice would be to pick short and effective pieces (not going to listen to eight Immolation scenes, sorry!), to cut them all down to size precisely, to normalize the perceived volume level and frequency range across all recordings so the remaining differences in recording quality are negligible.


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## Tsaraslondon (Nov 7, 2013)

Azol said:


> Since most of our usual participants have already voted (and have took pretty good guesses at who's who in this puzzle), it's time for final reveal:
> 
> 1 - Ricciarelli
> 2 - Netrebko
> ...


Freni was the only one I didn't guess correctly and I'm rather surprised I didn't recognise her, though I suppose it's not a particularly individual voice.

I feel the same as you about Netrebko. Hers was the only version I actively didn't like and, though I appreciated Olivero's artistry, the vibrato as recorded here really was too intrusive.

I agree with you about Callas. As usual, her interpretation was spot on and she and Scotto were my favourites.

I should probably have voted for Ricciarelli and Freni too. I liked both their versions.


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## nina foresti (Mar 11, 2014)

Well I got Scotto at #8 and a question mark on Freni for #6 and #4 and #5 were obvious. But the shocker for me was Fleming at #3, my favorite. I never thought she could do a simple song without relying on any scoops or swoops. It was awesome! Brava Renee! 
Thanks again for this neat little game. Sure put me in my place!


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## The Conte (May 31, 2015)

I got 4 and 5 and recognised a slav voice for number 2 and suspected that 3 was someone I didn't like, possibly Fleming. Whilst I wasn't sure which one was Freni, Caballe or Scotto, had I been asked who was my favourite in the aria I would have said Freni and Scotto and then I voted for 6 and 8, so my instincts are the same blind as when I know who the sopranos are.

N.


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## Woodduck (Mar 17, 2014)

I missed guessing Ricciarelli and Freni, though their names occurred to me as possibilities as I listened. It may be that because their voices aren't as strongly individual as the rest, and because I haven't listened to either of them sing anything for years, I don't have a strong mental imprint of their sound (and actually, I may not have heard Ricciarelli more than two or three times altogether). But they both give natural, idiomatic performances; they're fine Italian sopranos comfortable in the tradition, something hard to define but somehow audible, especially when heard alongside some of the others.


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## MAS (Apr 15, 2015)

Ricciarelli was the first I guessed (she was no.1!), I was an early fan, remembering her first LP. 
The obvious ones that everyone knew, 4 & 5, of course. I was shocked that my first choice was Fleming, whom I usually detest, but she sang it impeccably. Guessed Scotto’s screech, but did not absolutely know Netrebko or Freni, two generic voices. But I did get the “late career” Caballe.


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## Tsaraslondon (Nov 7, 2013)

MAS said:


> Ricciarelli was the first I guessed (she was no.1!), I was an early fan, remembering her first LP.
> The obvious ones that everyone knew, 4 & 5, of course. I was shocked that my first choice was Fleming, whom I usually detest, but she sang it impeccably. Guessed Scotto's screech, but did not absolutely know Netrebko or Freni, two generic voices. But I did get the "late career" Caballe.


Funnily enough Scotto's "screeching" seems to have won the day. I and 6 others are obviously a bit partial to a bit of screeching :devil:


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## Tsaraslondon (Nov 7, 2013)

Woodduck said:


> I agree. I think her slender voice suits the character better than some heavier voices do. She and Callas make for some unusual casting, worth hearing even if the recording isn't our first choice for the opera.


Another favourite Liu of mine is Barbara Hendricks, whom I actually heard sing the role at a concert performance of the opera some years ago. Sylvia Sass was Turandot and Franco Bonisolli Calaf, but Hendricks stole the show that night. She also does a lovely _mesa di voce_ on the Karajan recording which unfortunately suffers from having another Liu in the title role.


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## Woodduck (Mar 17, 2014)

Tsaraslondon said:


> the Karajan recording which unfortunately suffers from having another Liu in the title role.


Good one.  ............

What other well-known sopranos assayed both Liu and Turandot? I can think of Caballe. Anyone else?


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## Woodduck (Mar 17, 2014)

MAS said:


> Ricciarelli was the first I guessed (she was no.1!), I was an early fan, remembering her first LP.
> The obvious ones that everyone knew, 4 & 5, of course. I was shocked that my first choice was Fleming, whom I usually detest, but she sang it impeccably. Guessed Scotto's screech, but did not absolutely know Netrebko or Freni, two generic voices. But I did get the "late career" Caballe.


I liked Fleming in this too. Intelligent artist that she is, I suspect she understood the need for simplicity in portraying Liu. Of course "simplicity" in Fleming terms still gives us plenty of nuance. Her cerebral hyperactivity is incurable, bless her heart (and brain).


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## Tsaraslondon (Nov 7, 2013)

Woodduck said:


> Good one.  ............
> 
> What other well-known sopranos assayed both Liu and Turandot? I can think of Caballe. Anyone else?


Has Netrebko sung both roles?


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## MAS (Apr 15, 2015)

Deleted deleted deleted


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## MAS (Apr 15, 2015)

Woodduck said:


> Good one.  ............
> 
> What other well-known sopranos assayed both Liu and Turandot? I can think of Caballe. Anyone else?


Ricciarelli has sung both, but I think *Turandot* herself only on record.


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## MAS (Apr 15, 2015)

Tsaraslondon said:


> Has Netrebko sung both roles?


I don't think she's sung Liu on stage, but I'm not sure.


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## Woodduck (Mar 17, 2014)

Tsaraslondon said:


> Has Netrebko sung both roles?


I don't know. Not recently, I'd say. I didn't follow her early career.


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## Revitalized Classics (Oct 31, 2018)

Woodduck said:


> Good one.  ............
> 
> What other well-known sopranos assayed both Liu and Turandot? I can think of Caballe. Anyone else?


Just for recordings-
Callas was Turandot live and Liu in the studio for arias
Tebaldi recorded Liu complete in the studio twice and Turandot's aria.
Leontyne Price sang Liu on stage and Turandot's aria in the studio
Angela Gheorghiu sang Liu on stage and Turandot's aria in the studio.

Leona Mitchell was Liu to Caballe's Turandot at San Francisco and Paris but also sang the title role: I think there are recordings about.


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## Seattleoperafan (Mar 24, 2013)

Revitalized Classics said:


> Just for recordings-
> Callas was Turandot live and Liu in the studio for arias
> Tebaldi recorded Liu complete in the studio twice and Turandot's aria.
> Leontyne Price sang Liu on stage and Turandot's aria in the studio
> ...


It is theoretically possible that Christine Goerke sang Liu when she was young and a lyric soprano. Today she may be the reigning Turandot.


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## OffPitchNeb (Jun 6, 2016)

Seattleoperafan said:


> It is theoretically possible that Christine Goerke sang Liu when she was young and a lyric soprano. Today she may be the reigning Turandot.







Sorry, I don't see anything reigning about her Turandot, at least from this clip. This role, like Brunnhilde and Isolde, should be locked in a secret place until we have some proper dramatic sopranos.


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## Seattleoperafan (Mar 24, 2013)

OffPitchNeb said:


> Sorry, I don't see anything reigning about her Turandot, at least from this clip. This role, like Brunnhilde and Isolde, should be locked in a secret place until we have some proper dramatic sopranos.


Many people say Goerke's voice is enormous in size and she handles high C's easily, so at least she can sing it. I saw her in Norma 20 years ago before the voice grew so big, but even so her D6 was enormous - sort of like you think Sutherland's must have been. I thought she looked good in the part at the Met video but I can't speak for live. She also has a strong lower register and Turandot has several passages down low. I think I would rather have seen Nilsson, Marton or Dimitrova in the role, but dramatic sopranos are few and far between today.


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## MAS (Apr 15, 2015)

Revitalized Classics said:


> Just for recordings-
> Callas was Turandot live and Liu in the studio for arias
> Tebaldi recorded Liu complete in the studio twice and Turandot's aria.
> Leontyne Price sang Liu on stage and Turandot's aria in the studio
> ...


There's a video of her singing _In questa reggia _, but it's not recommended.


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## ScottK (Dec 23, 2021)

Most of my observations were not about preference just about different. But it was wonderful to listen without knowing names.

Thought I heard Caballe twice ( I don't think you did that, but I heard that  ) Callas and Tebaldi. Favorite may be #3 with that shimmery voice, slow and immersed in the words. The long high note pulls me out but otherwise I thought she was great.
They all were great!


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## Azol (Jan 25, 2015)

I confirmed with Seattleoperafan and I'm going to post a couple more similar "blind" polls in the future - not too frequently, mind you, so we might have other fun and educating stuff going on in-between. Once again, thanks for your participation!


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## ScottK (Dec 23, 2021)

Azol said:


> Since most of our usual participants have already voted (and have took pretty good guesses at who's who in this puzzle), it's time for final reveal:
> 
> 1 - Ricciarelli
> 2 - Netrebko
> ...


Great discoveries. Ricciarelli was one of my TWO Caballes...heard her once and don't remember anything like that so its probably just a "me this time" thing. Certainly glad that Montserrat was ONE of my Caballe's...oh the humiliation! if she wasn't! My Tebaldi was the other singer I often liken to Tebaldi, Freni...beautiful, idiomatic, but not TO ME, that recognizable. Have never heard Olivero that I'm aware of....those vibrato's are usually fine for me but here the voice is so exposed...and what was that ending? never in a million years would have thought of Fleming in this material...loved it! And finally I'm so glad to see Scotto shining in this company. Go Renata!


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## betterthanfine (Oct 17, 2017)

MAS said:


> Ricciarelli has sung both, but I think *Turandot* herself only on record.


I did a quick search on Amazon: she's the Liu to Eva Marton's Turandot on the Maazel recording.



ScottK said:


> Thought I heard Caballe twice ( I don't think you did that, but I heard that  )-


I was convinced #1 was Caballe, but then when I heard #7 I was very confused!

Brava Renée, whom I instantly recognised. I'm glad a few people who normally detest her were struck by her singing here. I voted for #3 and #8. Wasn't sure if that one was either Moffo or Scotto.

I disliked #2, although I'm surprised to learn it was Netrebko! She's grown more vulgar over the years... Olivero was also not to my taste, I can't stand that fast vibrato.


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