# Adventure music like Sibelius' Symphony #4



## Fracta (Apr 15, 2015)

Hi All,

I am trying to get in touch with a community with an appreciation for classical music.

I want to get more music like the above noted symphony.

I love it for its adventure/desolate landscape/progressive nature, and I hope to find more music like this.

Is there anything anyone can recommend?

I have listened to Pendreki, and it is similar in some respects, but doesn't quite have enough adventure in it.

Thanks!


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## Richannes Wrahms (Jan 6, 2014)

Sibelius' Symphony No. 4 is strongly influenced by *Wagner*'s operas, specially the second act of *Parsifal* and Tristan und Isolde.

Another *Sibelius* piece in simmilar lines is *Tapiola*.

*Schoenberg* might interest you, try his _Transfigured Night_, _Chamber Symphony No. 1_ and *Five Pieces for Orchestra*.

Then there's *Bartók*'s *Music for Strings, Percussion and Celesta* and _Concerto for Orchestra_, also perhaps his opera _Bluebeard's Castle_ and the ballet _The Miraculous Mandarin_ (this one if you really like dissonance).

*Ligeti's* Requiem and *Chamber Concerto* might fit the bill, they are certainly dark.

In closer times you have *Birtwistle*'s myth-based operas like _The Minotaur _ and some of his other works like *The Triumph of Time*.


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## brotagonist (Jul 11, 2013)

That's a great list, RW! I was thinking of Ligeti's Lontano and Ramifications, but the stipulation that it must exhibit a _subjective_ sense of "adventure" threw me off.


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## maestro267 (Jul 25, 2009)

Sorry, but I can't take seriously anyone who says the borefest that is Sibelius 4 is more adventurous than Penderecki.


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## Becca (Feb 5, 2015)

Try Ralph Vaughan Williams symphonies 6 & 7. The composer had done music for the film _Scott of the Antarctic_ and he then used some of the material in creating the symphony


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## Becca (Feb 5, 2015)

maestro267 said:


> Sorry, but I can't take seriously anyone who says the borefest that is Sibelius 4 is more adventurous than Penderecki.


Let's not forget that it is all a matter of personal opinion with emphasis on the word 'personal'. There is no requirement for us to like the same thing.


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## Woodduck (Mar 17, 2014)

maestro267 said:


> Sorry, but I can't take seriously anyone who says the borefest that is Sibelius 4 is more adventurous than Penderecki.


Here is a new member, posting for the very first time, and he is promptly informed by a member of six years' experience that his musical tastes are so wrong that he cannot be taken seriously.

I would like to welcome new member Fracta to the forum and reassure him that he will find friendly and helpful people here. :tiphat:


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## SONNET CLV (May 31, 2014)

The Sibelius 4th remains dear to my heart, and to my sense of adventure, too. It is probably the Sibelius symphony I access more than any of the others, though I might lay claim to "liking" the Second more. Perhaps, Fracta, you might survey the entire line of Sibelius symphonies and orchestral works as you undertake this great adventure of "classical music".

Personally, I've found much pleasure in Scandinavian music, especially symphonies, many of which are dark and stark and, well, Scandinavian "winter" like. Upon reading your post I thought immediately of the oeuvre of Allan Pettersson, a Swedish composer whose sixteen (or seventeen?) symphonies provide much in the way of adventure in, I will venture, a Sibelius Fourth kind of way.

The Danish composer Carl Nielsen has much to offer in his symphonies, too. Nielsen's Fourth, subtitled "The Inextinguishable" ranks as my favorite, and I would think it may please a fan of Sibelius's Fourth. But many prefer the Nielsen Fifth, a worthy contender, certainly.

I find the three symphonies of Swedish composer Karl-Birger Blomdahl as fitting the definition of adventurous works. Perhaps here you'll want to start with Number Two. But don't overlook One. And ... the third, subtitled "Facetter" remains one of the 20th century's great works, albeit a rather lesser known masterpiece than many others.

Adventure is it we're after? Why not try the symphonies of Einojuhani Rautavaara, a Finnish composer, perhaps the greatest Finnish composer after Sibelius. I'm quite fond of Rautavaara's Symphony No. 5 which presents one of the most unforgettable openings in all of music, perhaps rivaling that opening of Nielsen's Fourth for sheer drama. (I hear the Rautavaara Fifth's opening as the wash of the sea tide undulating against the rocky shoreline.) If the Fifth meets your needs, try a survey of the other Ruatavaara symphonies. Much there to please. Much adventure, too. (Start with Number 1, move to 2, and then 3. If you happen to like what you hear, especially in Number 3, you'll want to move to Bruckner's Seventh Symphony, and then his Fourth. Bruckner's 7th inspired the Rautavaara Third; the Bruckner 7th remains my favorite of the twelve or so Bruckner symphonies and is a work of great adventures.)

Of course, once you get to Bruckner, the adventure takes on tentacles that will reach forward and backward and to every side ... and you'll be hooked.

Welcome to the Forum, Fracta. We'll be pleased to learn what you thought of our various recommendations, and we all have plenty more where these came from. Way will lead to way. If you find you are liking a certain kind of piece (as you indicated with the Sibelius Fourth), many here can suggest similar sound-world works. And will.

But the adventure continues outside of the familiar, too. One of the great gifts of classical music is its wide range. After all, you have centuries (a millennium, really) of music to explore, and there is so much of excitement to be had. A composer whose sound you might reject early on (I still recall as a teenage not being especially enamoured of Bach!) may grow on you with experience, and soon you'll find your sound-world has expanded ten-fold over what it once was. (I now own at least two sets of "The Complete Bach works" and several sets of the "Complete Cantatas" ... and innumerable versions of the Brandenburg Concerti. Ah! Bach! I love the guy!)

Welcome to the club. Madness surely awaits. But what a grand madness it is.


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## Blancrocher (Jul 6, 2013)

There's nothing quite like Sibelius' 4th--it's pure magic. However, I'd recommend the 5th as equally adventurous though with a much sunnier disposition. For darker-hued works with a similarly exploratory feel, you might try Bruckner's 8th Symphony, Alban Berg's Violin Concerto, Lutoslawski's Cello Concerto, and William Walton's Cello Concerto. If these or other works appeal, let us know and we'll recommend more--_much_ more :lol:!


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## manyene (Feb 7, 2015)

Fracta,

In tackling the Sibelius 4th as your opener you have selected the most difficult, rugged, universal and enigmatic of all his symphonies: you are right, it is an adventure in which you examine yourself as well as the world around you. It is very different from the 1st, with its procedures copied from Tchaikovsky, or ultimately triumphant 2nd Symphony.

You have had lots of suggestions from others: Nielsen, and Rautavaara are obvious continuations, but I would add to this - other works by Scandinavian composers such as Atterberg, and Melartin, who both write the traditional classical symphony and have plenty to say. Good listening, there are vast oceans to explore out there!


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## hpowders (Dec 23, 2013)

Blancrocher said:


> There's nothing quite like Sibelius' 4th--it's pure magic. However, I'd recommend the 5th as equally adventurous though with a much sunnier disposition. For darker-hued works with a similarly exploratory feel, you might try Bruckner's 8th Symphony, Alban Berg's Violin Concerto, Lutoslawski's Cello Concerto, and William Walton's Cello Concerto. If these or other works appeal, let us know and we'll recommend more--_much_ more :lol:!


If I ever have a daughter, I will name her "Celeste" out of tribute to the Sibelius 4th.

Sounds better than "Inextinguishabelle".


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## Fracta (Apr 15, 2015)

Thank you for your suggestions! I have listened to Tapiola, I like it, but it's not long enough. It is the closest to Symphony 4 that I have found though.

I will start going through all of this tomorrow!

Thank you again!


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## Fracta (Apr 15, 2015)

brotagonist said:


> Ligeti's Lontano and Ramifications


Thank you for your suggestions, I will give them a listen!


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## Fracta (Apr 15, 2015)

maestro267 said:


> borefest


I'm sorry but I can't disagree more. Every time I listen to this symphony I enjoy it _more_. Personal taste, sure.


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## Fracta (Apr 15, 2015)

Any music made to suit the Antarctic is likely something I would enjoy. That is exactly the landscape I want to be pictured. Quiet, dead, silent, alien, and inhospitable.


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## Fracta (Apr 15, 2015)

Thank you Woodduck, I'm really impressed by the answers I have received! First thing though, I'm going to turn on email notifications, I thought no one had replied to me.


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## Art Rock (Nov 28, 2009)

You might want to explore Bax as well (symphonies, especially 2,3,6, and symphonic poems such as November woods).


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## Fracta (Apr 15, 2015)

Hi SONNET CLV,

Thank you for your most expansive reply, so many suggestions to look through!

It sounds like you get what I am after, anything that depicts a Scandinavian winter I'm sure I will enjoy.

Time to start getting through all of this..


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## Fracta (Apr 15, 2015)

Thanks Blancrocher, 

Yes, definitely after the darker side. It's so satisfying to listen to. I love deep strings as well. I'll listen to all you recommend, thank you!


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## Fracta (Apr 15, 2015)

Thanks manyene, it seems Scandinavia has some quality that produces composes with that particular flavour. 

Sibelius 4 subtly grew on me until I realised I was thoroughly enjoying it, and then it got better.

I'll take a look at your other suggestions,

Thanks!


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## Fracta (Apr 15, 2015)

Inextinguishabelle... That's an awesome name! 

When I have a daughter....


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## Fracta (Apr 15, 2015)

Thanks Art Rock,

I will give them a listen to as well. Wow, so much to go through!


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## Andolink (Oct 29, 2012)

Definitely try *Ernst Toch*'s _Symphonies No. 4_ and _6_. And *Arnold Bax*'s _Symphony No. 2_ is dark and exploratory. Even more adventurous is *Poul Ruders*' _Symphony No. 2_.


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## Marschallin Blair (Jan 23, 2014)

Deleted. Duplicate post.


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## Marschallin Blair (Jan 23, 2014)

> Woodduck: Here is a new member, posting for the very first time, and he is promptly informed by a member of six years' experience that his musical tastes are so wrong that he cannot be taken seriously.
> 
> I would like to welcome new member Fracta to the forum and reassure him that he will find friendly and helpful people here.


I double and treble that motion of cheerful buoyancy. _;D_. . .

But as far as anything sounding like the Sibelius _Fourth_ goes, 'I've' certainly never heard anything that sounds like it.

Not unlike the Hanging Gardens of Babylon or the Elgin Marbles, its just a _sui generis_ magnificence unto itself- especially the two Karajan performances.

I wish I could find other pieces of music that honestly approximate its austere Finnish awe and mystery- but I've never come across them, myself.


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## Guest (May 7, 2015)

Fracta said:


> Any music made to suit the Antarctic is likely something I would enjoy.


If Alaska is chilly enough, you may like some John Luther Adams!


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## Xaltotun (Sep 3, 2010)

Yeah, you should hear Karajan's Sibelius 4. It's a great pleasure to search for different interpretations of your favourite works! Also, try Oramo's and Segerstam's S4. I don't know much music that sounds like it or has a similar soul. Maybe his 7th symphony?

Personally, I rarely associate S4 with nature, I always get a vision of a man in a dark room, staring at his face in the mirror. I think of personal tragedies and philosophical matters. I think of a man with enough willpower and faith to find meaning, but enough honesty and intelligence to be critical and destructive. It's a darkness of a _refreshing_ kind, a _cleansing_ kind, pure, cruel, and welcome.


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## Marschallin Blair (Jan 23, 2014)

Xaltotun said:


> Yeah, you should hear Karajan's Sibelius 4. It's a great pleasure to search for different interpretations of your favourite works! Also, try Oramo's and Segerstam's S4. I don't know much music that sounds like it or has a similar soul. Maybe his 7th symphony?
> 
> Personally, I rarely associate S4 with nature, I always get a vision of a man in a dark room, staring at his face in the mirror. I think of personal tragedies and philosophical matters. I think of a man with enough willpower and faith to find meaning, but enough honesty and intelligence to be critical and destructive. It's a darkness of a _refreshing_ kind, a _cleansing_ kind, pure, cruel, and welcome.


With Sibelius' _Fourth_ its funny how different we all are.

I synaesthtically experience aurora borealises, Finnish flora and fauna, and fjords with approaching fog.


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## Xaltotun (Sep 3, 2010)

Heh! I guess that Finnish nature isn't mysterious enough for me, for obvious reasons. To me, it's _home._ I'm not originally from Helsinki, but from the countryside...


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