# Nicknames of works



## brianvds (May 1, 2013)

Many famous works have nicknames, such as "pastoral symphony" or "Symphony of a thousand" etc. Many of these were not given by the composer, and some can be very misleading. 

So here is a thread to post your favourite nicknames, or pet peeve ones, or to invent some yourself. Perhaps this thread title belongs in the "Stupid thread titles" thread, but let's see what happens. 

I once saw a recording of Beethoven's symphony number 5, in which it was subtitled "Fate." I have never seen that nickname anywhere else. Presumably it comes from the story that Beethoven referred to the opening motive with the phrase "Thus fate knocks on the door." I'm not sure how authentic that story even is, though the name is kind of apt. But it seems not to have caught on. 

Any other examples?


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## Fugue Meister (Jul 5, 2014)

I don't particularly have a favorite (I tend to enjoy calling out the work by key unless it doest have one in which case I fall back on numbers) I detest the label "Moonlight" for Beethoven's Op. 27 No. 2 in c#... and I really don't know why I like the phrase but I don't feel it at all applies to the c# sonata, if I had to pick a favorite I guess I'd say "Hammerklavier sonata" Op. 106 in Bb, even though Beethoven really wrote the nickname himself on the title page and as "Grand sonata for the fortepiano" "fortepiano is "Hammerklavier". (He also gave the same title to the preceding sonata op. 101 in A, somehow it only refers to Op. 106 these days, but hey whatever right).


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## elgar's ghost (Aug 8, 2010)

I normally get a slow burn every time hear Mozart's piano concerto no. 21 being referred to as the 'Elvira Madigan' thanks to THAT film- I believe the cover of one or two recordings of it have descended to this as well.


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## Winterreisender (Jul 13, 2013)

Most people refer to Chopin's Prelude #15 as the "Raindrop." Apparently this nickname was invented by Hans von Bülow, who incidentally assigned nicknames to all of Chopin's preludes, such as "Suffocation," "The Polish Dancer," "Suicide" and "Heartfelt Happiness." 

Apparently Alfred Cortot also came up with a series of nicknames for the preludes. He seems to have gone a little more over the top with his titles, e.g. "Sensational memories float like perfume through my mind" and "The snow falls, the wind screams, and the storm rages; yet in my sad heart, the tempest is the worst to behold." 

Luckily these nicknames haven't really caught on.


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## TresPicos (Mar 21, 2009)

Winterreisender said:


> Most people refer to Chopin's Prelude #15 as the "Raindrop." Apparently this nickname was invented by Hans von Bülow, who incidentally assigned nicknames to all of Chopin's preludes, such as "Suffocation," "The Polish Dancer," "Suicide" and "Heartfelt Happiness."


Many years ago, I heard someone on the radio presenting one of the other preludes as "the one _Chopin himself_ called the Raindrop Prelude". It was either #4 or #6. But I've never heard that mentioned anywhere else. All three fit the description well, I think.


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## mikey (Nov 26, 2013)

I've always thought Rach Pag had a nice ring to it.

Wow, never knew half of these...props for _originality_ for 'the chord' but serious props for originality for 'a pleasure boat'
The Names for the Chopin Preludes:
1.C major - Agitato (Reunion)
2.A minor - Lento (Presentiment of Death)
3.G major - Vivace (Thou Art So Like a Flower)
4.E minor - Largo (Suffocation)
5.D major - Molto allegro (Uncertainty)
6.B minor - Lento assai (Tolling Bells)
7.A major - Andantino (The Polish Dancer)
8.F-sharp minor - Molto agitato (Desperation)
9.E major - Largo (Vision)
10.C-sharp minor - Molto allegro (The Night Moth)
11.B major - Vivace (The Dragonfly)
12.G-sharp minor - Presto (The Duel)
13.F-sharp major - Lento (Loss)
14.E-flat minor - Allegro (Fear)
15.D-flat major - Sostenuto (Raindrop)
16.B-flat minor - Presto con fuoco (Hades)
17.A-flat major - Allegretto (A Scene on the Place do Notre-Dame de Paris)
18.F minor - Molto allegro (Suicide)
19.E-flat major - Vivace (Heartfelt Happiness)
20.C minor - Largo â€" C minor (Funeral March) (also called The Chord) 
21.B-flat major - Cantabile (Sunday)
22.G minor - Molto agitato (Impatience)
23.F major - Moderato â€" F major (A Pleasure Boat)
24.D minor - Allegro appassionato (The Storm)


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## Weston (Jul 11, 2008)

I know nicknames can impart intent where the composer had none, and that may be bad, but look -- W. A. Haydel's Concerto Grosso in Q flat minor for kazoo, strings and basso continuo, Op. 13, No. 9 doesn't exactly roll off the tongue or remind me of the piece in any way. I know Beethoven's sonatas and quartets by their themes, not by their opus numbers. The fact that there are only 9 symphonies is the only reason I can recall them by their numbers. With Haydn I have more trouble. Named or nicknamed pieces are a big help to me.

However I too dislike the Moonlight" nickname of the Beethoven's sonata no. (whatever it is - 14? quasi una fantasia). I would have called it "Brooding."

Favorite real nicknames?
Beethoven: Piano Sonata No. 26 in Eb, Op. 81a "Les Adieux"
Beethoven: String Quartet No. 11 in F minor, Op. 95 "Serioso"
Haydn: Symphony No. 73 in D, "La chasse," H. 1/73 (I wouldn't have understood the charming ending without this nickname.)
Haydn: Symphony No, 94 in G “Surprise” 
Mahler: Symphony No. 1 in D “Titan” (that's a bit different, isn't it?)
Mozart: String Quartet No. 19 in C "Dissonant," K 465 (Tells us what to expect, even though I scarcely hear any dissonance.)
Nielsen: Symphony No. 4, Op. 29 "The Inextinguishable" (Makes me want to listen somehow.)

Nicknames I would give? Mahler: Symphony No. 3 "Interminable."


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## PetrB (Feb 28, 2012)

I feel -- about any and all of the subtitles not actually given by the composer -- the same way I feel about those mnemonic verbal phrases people have made to attach to various themes and tunes.

I.e. the less they are mentioned, the less people are reminded of them _other than to be reminded they are false, have nothing to do with the piece or the composers' announced intentions of the piece,_ the better off everyone is.

Best if they are never mentioned again, to fade into an obscurity of eventual total oblivion from the consciousness of all mankind.

So there


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## Skilmarilion (Apr 6, 2013)

The most bizarre of them all is the "Emperor" nickname which accompanies Beethoven's 5th concerto -- one would have thought that would've been the very last possible nickname that he might possibly have approved.


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## Cosmos (Jun 28, 2013)

I've always disliked calling it the "moonlight" sonata. That nickname was given by one of Beethoven's biographers who claimed he wrote the sonata inspired by the moonlight over Lake Zurich. I don't like the name, because it doesn't fully encapsulate the overall character of the work. I think "night" would have been more suitable.

I also don't care for calling a sonata a "funeral sonata" just because there's a funeral march in it (Beethoven's 12, Chopin's 2). If it's only one fourth of the work, don't say the entire work is "funeral"-like

My favorite nicknames? Mahler's "Resurrection" Symphony, Medtner's "Night Wind" sonata, Schubert's "Great" Symphony, and Beethoven's "Pastorale"


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## brianvds (May 1, 2013)

Cosmos said:


> I've always disliked calling it the "moonlight" sonata. That nickname was given by one of Beethoven's biographers who claimed he wrote the sonata inspired by the moonlight over Lake Zurich. I don't like the name, because it doesn't fully encapsulate the overall character of the work. I think "night" would have been more suitable.


I would assume that the moniker "Moonlight" refers only to the first movement, for which it is apt enough, but as you point out, that kind of ignores the other two movements. And B. really should have made the first movement more difficult to play, so that all the armies of YouTube amateurs would be forced to play either the whole thing, or none of it. I say this even though I am one of said amateurs, but in my defense, I would never torture YT viewers with any of my renditions of anything.


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## Il_Penseroso (Nov 20, 2010)

Personally I don't care about nicknames, unless it is indicated by the composer in order to make the listener understand his/her purpose, e.g. Beethoven's HammerKlavier Sonata or Shostakovich's Leningrad Symphony (and yes, even in such cases, nicknames might sound spoiling rather than useful e.g. Richard Strauss Symphonia Domestica according to Romain Rolland).


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## Brad (Mar 27, 2014)

Does anyone know who nicknamed Chopin's etudes? Some are quite bland ("octaves", "thirds", "sixths"), while some are very interesting ("Revolutionary", "Ocean", "Winter wind").


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## Mahlerian (Nov 27, 2012)

The "Symphony of a Thousand" nickname was a concert promoter. Mahler despised the title, and it's afflicted the work, which certainly does not deserve it, for a century.

Titan was Mahler's title for the early version of the First Symphony, but this was removed by the time of the first publication and the time when the work reached its final form. In my opinion, it would be helpful if we only used the name to refer to the earlier version.

Resurrection and Tragic are not necessarily Mahler's own names, but they're not particularly offensive and relate to the content of the works.

Song of the Night isn't heard all that often as a title for the Seventh, but it does relate to the fact that the music has two "Nachtmusik" movements and also a finale that the composer compared to the break of daylight.

Thankfully there don't seem to be any other titles applied to the other symphonies.


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## GreenMamba (Oct 14, 2012)

Elgars Ghost beat me to the punch in criticizing "Elvira Madigan." I'm just glad that trend didn't continue, nick naming works after movies in which they are used.

I generally don't care for nicknames, although I suppose Saint Saens' "Organ" Symphony is quite on the nose. Also, I don't always recall the exact number of, say, Haydn's "Fifths" string quartet.


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## Weston (Jul 11, 2008)

I forgot to mention Peter Schickele's Symphony, "Unbegun," which only incorporates movements 3 and 4.


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## EdwardBast (Nov 25, 2013)

brianvds said:


> I once saw a recording of Beethoven's symphony number 5, in which it was subtitled "Fate." I have never seen that nickname anywhere else. Presumably it comes from the story that Beethoven referred to the opening motive with the phrase "Thus fate knocks on the door." I'm not sure how authentic that story even is, though the name is kind of apt. But it seems not to have caught on.


Beethoven's personal secretary, Anton Schindler, claims that Beethoven said "Thus Fate raps on the door" in reference to the opening motive. Schindler is not considered a particularly reliable source. Adolf Bernhard Marx popularized this by incorporating it into a comprehensive interpretation of the symphony in his Beethoven Leben und Schaffen. Neither of these guys ever thought it would be used as a nickname.


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## PetrB (Feb 28, 2012)

EdwardBast said:


> Beethoven's personal secretary, Anton Schindler, claims that Beethoven said "Thus Fate raps on the door" in reference to the opening motive. Schindler is not considered a particularly reliable source. Adolf Bernhard Marx popularized this by incorporating it into a comprehensive interpretation of the symphony in his Beethoven Leben und Schaffen. Neither of these guys ever thought it would be used as a nickname.


_I_ blame them, nonetheless!


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## KenOC (Mar 7, 2011)

EdwardBast said:


> Schindler is not considered a particularly reliable source.


That, sir, is speaking with some delicacy! BTW just finished Laurel Fay, I think on your recommendation. Is that right? A wonderful book, thanks.


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## KenOC (Mar 7, 2011)

BTW, does anybody know why Haydn's String Quartet Op. 55/2 is nicknamed "The Razor"?

Bach has his organ prelude and fugue called "The Wedge", but that's easy to figure out.


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## EdwardBast (Nov 25, 2013)

PetrB said:


> _I_ blame them, nonetheless!


If this particular quotation of Beethoven were accurate, and if Schindler were reliable enough for us to take it seriously, then it would be of considerable interest. Marx's interpretation is quite insightful in some ways.


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## EdwardBast (Nov 25, 2013)

KenOC said:


> That, sir, is speaking with some delicacy! BTW just finished Laurel Fay, I think on your recommendation. Is that right? A wonderful book, thanks.


The biography of Shostakovich? It is reliable and thorough.


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## Radames (Feb 27, 2013)

Weston said:


> Nicknames I would give? Mahler: Symphony No. 3 "Interminable."


I call it the kitchen sink symphony. But not in a derogatory way. he just put everything in it!


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## HaydnBearstheClock (Jul 6, 2013)

KenOC said:


> BTW, does anybody know why Haydn's String Quartet Op. 55/2 is nicknamed "The Razor"?
> 
> Bach has his organ prelude and fugue called "The Wedge", but that's easy to figure out.


Basically, the anecdote is as follows: Haydn needed a razor for shaving but didn't have one, so he asked Tost to give him one, promising to write him an excellent quartet in return. And so the end result was this terrific quartet, one of Haydn's finest, imo.

Speaking of Haydn and nicknamed musical pieces, he must have more than anyone? - off the top of my head:
Symphony No. 26 in D minor - Lamentatione
Symphony No. 49 in F minor - La Passione
Symphony No. 44 in E minor - Mourning
Symphony No. 96 in D Major - Miracle
Symphony No. 100 in G Major - Military
Symphony No. 45 in F-Sharp minor - Farewell
Symphony No. 48 in C Major - Maria Theresia
Symphony No. 104 in D Major - London
Symphony No. 46 in A Major - Tempora Mutantur
the list goes on and on. 
Same with the quartets - a lot of them are nicknamed - in Op. 33 alone: 'How do you do?', 'The Joke', 'The Bird'.


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## Radames (Feb 27, 2013)

Can we call Dvorak's 7th the Old World Symphony?


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## PetrB (Feb 28, 2012)

~ "Pure _and_ Simple" ~

Nicknames or sub-headed titles of pieces not named by the composer are corruption.

~ "Simple _and_ Pure" ~​
_*If*_ you can manage to remember and say, "Cappuccino," "Cafe Macchiato," "Cafe Latte," "Espresso," "Grande, Venti & Trenta," _speak no other Italian, and_ can figure out what change you have coming to you when you pay for any of those, _*then*_ you can also manage to remember and say, "Sonata Number 14 in C-sharp minor," or "Sonata quasi una fantasia, Opus 27, Number 2."


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## SeptimalTritone (Jul 7, 2014)

A thousand likes Peter! Pure and simple!!!


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## Manxfeeder (Oct 19, 2010)

Bruckner's symphonies have some strange nicknames.
No. 0: Nullte
No. 1: The Saucy Maid. 
No. 2: The Symphony with Pauses
No. 3:  Wagner
No. 4: Romantic
No. 5: The Church of Faith. (What, as opposed to a church of no faith?) Also Tragic and Pizzicato
No. 6: The Philosophical
No. 7: The Lyric
No. 8: The Apocalyptic
No. 9: To God, the Beloved


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## Manxfeeder (Oct 19, 2010)

Hovhaness' symphonies have a lot of nicknames, none as silly sounding as Walla Walla, Land of Many Waters. Well, maybe Loon Lake.


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## KenOC (Mar 7, 2011)

HaydnBearstheClock said:


> Basically, the anecdote is as follows: Haydn needed a razor for shaving but didn't have one, so he asked Tost to give him one, promising to write him an excellent quartet in return. And so the end result was this terrific quartet, one of Haydn's finest, imo.


Thanks for that!


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## brianvds (May 1, 2013)

GreenMamba said:


> Elgars Ghost beat me to the punch in criticizing "Elvira Madigan." I'm just glad that trend didn't continue, nick naming works after movies in which they are used.


Indeed! Imagine listening to Mozart's "Amadeus" symphony, or Beethoven's "Dead Poets Society" piano concerto. We could make up a whole thread of silly subtitles on that theme.


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## PetrB (Feb 28, 2012)

Weston said:


> Nicknames I would give? Mahler: Symphony No. 3 "Interminable."





Radames said:


> I call it the kitchen sink symphony. But not in a derogatory way. he just put everything in it!


Mahler had thought of dedicating his 10th symphony to Sigmund Freud; 
he was going to call it _The Kitchen Shrink Symphony._


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## Guest (Jul 28, 2014)

I've always given my own subtitles to the second movement of Schnittke's 1st symphony. "A baroque ensemble is rudely interrupted by modernist charlatans"


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## Couac Addict (Oct 16, 2013)

I think there's a lesson to be learned here. All young composers would be wise to give their work a nickname and prevent others renaming it _Mr. T fights Godzilla_ or whatever.


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## Guest (Jul 28, 2014)

Couac Addict said:


> I think there's a lesson to be learned here. All young composers would be wise to give their work a nickname and *prevent others renaming it Mr. T fights Godzilla* or whatever.


Well-reasoned, sir. However, as the geniuses before you have failed to grasp such a concept, *I would like to hereby subtitle Bach's Mass (the one in B minor): "Mr. T Fights Godzilla".* Always good to have a nickname around, especially when there's all these songs with the same name!


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## PetrB (Feb 28, 2012)

Couac Addict said:


> I think there's a lesson to be learned here. All young composers would be wise to give their work a nickname and prevent others renaming it _Mr. T fights Godzilla_ or whatever.


_If you do not name it, someone else will!_


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## DeepR (Apr 13, 2012)

Does anyone know if Adolph von Henselt's Etudes Op. 2 and Op. 5 were given nicknames by other people than the composer, similar to Chopin's?
They are a bit obscure but I enjoy his etudes a lot. Too bad about the awful nicknames. Examples: 
"Op. 2 No. 1 - Orage, tu ne saurais m'abbatre!" (Storm, you will not fell me!)
"Op. 2 No. 8 - Tu m'attires, m'entraînes, m'engloutis!" (You attract me, overpower me, engulf me!)
Surely this was done by some publisher?


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## HaydnBearstheClock (Jul 6, 2013)

KenOC said:


> Thanks for that!


I verified the information - it was the English publisher Bland who was involved, not Johann Tost. Haydn apparently wanted fine English razors from him, which he then got and created the quartet. But there are many anecdotes about Haydn, it's not known if it's actually true. Haydn later gave Johann Tost the right to sell the quartets in Paris and Vienna, whence comes the nickname of the Op. 55 quartets, 'Tost'.


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## CyrilWashbrook (Feb 6, 2013)

Manxfeeder said:


> Bruckner's symphonies have some strange nicknames.


A few of them are rather suspect though, in that nobody refers to them by those names and/or the composer never referred to them in that manner either. For instance, until now I'd never heard the fifth referred to as "the church of faith" and it doesn't appear to come from Bruckner himself.

While on the subject of Bruckner, what annoys me is when the third movement of the ninth - sometimes even the whole work - is given the appellation "Farewell to Life". It is clear beyond doubt that Bruckner used this term to refer only to a specific passage from bar 29 onwards.


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## Manxfeeder (Oct 19, 2010)

CyrilWashbrook said:


> A few of them are rather suspect though, in that nobody refers to them by those names and/or the composer never referred to them in that manner either. For instance, until now I'd never heard the fifth referred to as "the church of faith" and it doesn't appear to come from Bruckner himself.


Yeah, I didn't mean to imply Bruckner came up with these; it's just curious how that all of his symphonies (except 00) ended up with nicknames, sometimes two or three. That doesn't seem to be the case with his contemporaries; they'll have a couple with names but not all of them.


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## Orfeo (Nov 14, 2013)

Shostakovich's Eighth Symphony "Stalingrad."


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## hpowders (Dec 23, 2013)

Bruckner, Symphonies #'s 1-9, "Die nie endenden Einsen".


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## Couac Addict (Oct 16, 2013)

arcaneholocaust said:


> Well-reasoned, sir. However, as the geniuses before you have failed to grasp such a concept, *I would like to hereby subtitle Bach's Mass (the one in B minor): "Mr. T Fights Godzilla".* Always good to have a nickname around, especially when there's all these songs with the same name!


I think it's what he would've wanted.


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## HaydnBearstheClock (Jul 6, 2013)

HaydnBearstheClock said:


> Basically, the anecdote is as follows: Haydn needed a razor for shaving but didn't have one, so he asked Tost to give him one, promising to write him an excellent quartet in return. And so the end result was this terrific quartet, one of Haydn's finest, imo.
> 
> Speaking of Haydn and nicknamed musical pieces, he must have more than anyone? - off the top of my head:
> Symphony No. 26 in D minor - Lamentatione
> ...


Not symphony No. 46 - it was 64 in A Major, 'Tempora Mutantur'.


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## HaydnBearstheClock (Jul 6, 2013)

Couac Addict said:


> I think it's what he would've wanted.


I wonder how Bach would react if he actually witnessed Mr. T fighting Godzilla - just imagine his face ...


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## Couac Addict (Oct 16, 2013)

HaydnBearstheClock said:


> I wonder how Bach would react if he actually witnessed Mr. T fighting Godzilla - just imagine his face ...


My guess is that his wigmaker would have a new project.


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## DeepR (Apr 13, 2012)

But Chuck Norris would win that fight. Yes, without participating.


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## brianvds (May 1, 2013)

DeepR said:


> But Chuck Norris would win that fight. Yes, without participating.


And then Riaan Cruywagen would have to go break it up and discipline the miscreants...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Riaan_Cruywagen


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