# Recommendations - WTC on piano



## bwv543

I am looking for a good WTC piano set to complement the ones I have. Currently I have the Gould set, which I don't care for, and the Richter set, which I really enjoy. I'd be looking for something similar to Richter - not afraid to use pedal or romanticize it a bit, but maybe with a little more tempo restraint on numbers like Book I G major and Book II E minor, where the temptation to fly through like a virtuoso is strong.


----------



## SanAntone

Guided by your preferences:

Maria Tipo
Alexandra Papastefanou
Dina Ugorskaja
Wilhelm Kempff
Jill Crossland
Piotr Anderszewski
Craig Sheppard
Peter Hill
Vladimir Ashkenazy
Till Fellner
Cédric Pescia
Ewa Poblocka
Ivo Janssen

My favorite is *András Schiff* on EMI - but he doesn't use the sustain pedal nor does he Romanticize the music. But it is a magical performance.


----------



## bwv543

SanAntone said:


> Guided by your preferences:
> 
> Maria Tipo
> Alexandra Papastefanou
> Dina Ugorskaja
> Wilhelm Kempff
> Jill Crossland
> Piotr Anderszewski
> Craig Sheppard
> Peter Hill
> Vladimir Ashkenazy
> Till Fellner
> Cédric Pescia
> Ewa Poblocka
> Ivo Janssen
> 
> My favorite is *András Schiff* on EMI - but he doesn't use the sustain pedal nor does he Romanticize the music. But it is a magical performance.


Thank you! You know, I love Schiff's recording of the English Suites, so thank you for including that in the list. I sometimes forget there is a middle ground between Richter and Gould, occupied by the likes of Hewitt and Schiff. I am also very fond of that middle ground.


----------



## wkasimer

Tatyana Nikolayeva.


----------



## lextune

Richter is tough to beat.

Schiff, who I love in general, quite literally does not use the pedal. At all. So that in itself, is interesting, but not entirely successful in my opinion.

Roger Woodward and Konstantin Lifschitz are two somewhat lesser know pianists who both made powerful, and quite wonderful WTC recordings.


----------



## Rogerx

My very favorite on this moment is: Daniel-Ben Pienaar (piano)



> Gramophone Magazine March 2014
> 
> Pienaar plays with the basic pulse, allowing little expansions and contractions...[He] particularly enjoys the more relentless of the fugues...Pienaar's WTC is impressive and full of lively ideas.


----------



## joen_cph

*Samuil Feinberg* is definitely worth hearing.






If only allowed one, I'd take that. The sound is not of modern quality, however, if that's a concern. Obviously, CDs or Digital Files are better than the scratchy LP sound transfer in the excerpt above.


----------



## Animal the Drummer

Edwin Fischer on Naxos. This too is a historical recording and there are numerous good versions out there but this one makes the music sing and dance (where appropriate) more than any other I know.


----------



## Kreisler jr

Sheppard is much less romantic than Richter, but certainly a good straightforward "modern" interpretation.
A bit more Russian but also less "romantic" and in superb sound is Koroliov/TACET.

BTW several in the list in #2 didn't record the WTC (Tipo) or not all of it (Kempff).


----------



## Bulldog

A lot of great sets already recommended. I would add Rosalyn Tureck (DG and BBC Classics).


----------



## Josquin13

Early in his career, Valery Afanassiev won the Leipzig Bach competition, & I don't think that was a fluke. If you're looking for more tempo restraint in the WTC than Richter, Afanassiev tends to be slower (as he has very large hands) & I like how he plays this music. His approach is more spacious, & he lets the music breathe, & I feel like he has a close connection to the scores & loves playing Bach. I also prefer him to Richter in the WTC because the Denon digital sound is a lot better than the mediocre to poor sound engineering that Richter received from Eurodisc/Melodiya, or the not so great RCA remaster.

Book 1,


















Book 2,


















In addition, Tatiana Nikolayeva is one of my two or three favorite Bach pianists (generally, the earlier her recordings the better), and I would strongly recommend her WTC (even more so than Afanassiev's, though she may not be quite as tempo restrained, nor is she as well recorded, either),






Edward Aldwell is also very interesting & more spacious and tempo restrained in the WTC; however, he was a student of Schenkerian musical analysis, like Wilhelm Furtwangler, and as with Furtwngler's conducting, there are shifts in tempo within Aldwell's WTC that not everyone likes. (However, it's deliberate.) So, you should definitely sample his recordings first:

Book 1: 



Book 2: 




Peter Hill is good, too, and well recorded. So is Evelyne Crochet, however, her tempi are probably faster & more vigorous than what you're looking for, at times. For example, she takes the opening Prelude of Book 1 rather quickly: 



. I prefer what Richter, Afanassiev, Aldwell, & Asperen do here. But otherwise, it's an excellent set.

Mieczyslaw Horszowski's WTC is similarly worthwhile for Vanguard Classics, but again you might find his tempi on the brisk side: 



.

While among historical mono recordings, I think you'll find Samuel Feinberg's WTC to be more spaciously played than Edwin Fischer's, though both sets are legendary. You might also want to look into Rosalyn Tureck's early mono WTC set on DG: 



 , as well as her later live BBC 'Legends' recordings: 



. Though I prefer Feinberg in the WTC myself, among mono era recordings:

Book 1: 



Book 2: 




Hope that helps.


----------



## jegreenwood

joen_cph said:


> *Samuil Feinberg* is definitely worth hearing.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> If only allowed one, I'd take that. The sound is not of modern quality, however, if that's a concern. Obviously, CDs or Digital Files are better than the scratchy LP sound transfer in the excerpt above.


A unique and compelling performance.


----------



## wkasimer

Josquin13 writes:



> In addition, Tatiana Nikolayeva is one of my two or three favorite Bach pianists (generally, the earlier her recordings the better), and I would strongly recommend her WTC...


Nikolayeva recorded the WTC twice, first 1972-73, and then in 1984. I can't choose between them, but I don't have to....


----------



## Malx

I'd suggest Peter Hill and Evelyn Crochet of those I know well.

Edit - having read through the thread I note Josquin beat me to my recommendations - I can understand his comments regarding Crochet but if you have access to sampling the recording it is worthy of consideration.


----------



## Josquin13

One recent WTC set that I forgot to mention in my post above are the two books from the Italian pianist, Pietro de Maria. His approach to Bach can be similar to that of his teacher, Maria Tipo, which means it can be quite romantic at times, & maybe a bit heavy on the pedal. It's not my own favorite approach to Bach on the piano, but de Maria plays very well, and it might be what you're looking for...?

Book 1: 



Book 2: it's no longer on YT, but here's a review: http://www.musicweb-international.com/classrev/2016/Jan/Bach_WTC2_4812361.htm

P.S. I should point out that I've not heard Schiff's second WTC on ECM, which is why I didn't mention it previously...


----------



## Allegro Con Brio

A little-known name that hasn't been mentioned is Jill Crossland (on the Signum label). Some days hers is my favorite WTC, and I think she meets the OP's criteria to a T. Judicious and creative use of the sustain pedal, fresh and imaginative tempi, crystalline contrapuntal voicing, and truthful recording. I generally like the WTC to be played pretty "straight" with minimal embellishment á la Aimard and Pollini (both of whom, if I am not mistaken, have only recorded Book I) though the insightful interpretations of Fischer and Richter also have a special place in my heart.


----------



## bwv543

I've been really enjoying the recommendations in this thread - it's been a mini-_tour de WTC_ for me the last few days, limited somewhat by what's available on YouTube. Jill Crossland was nice, but didn't grab me on first hearing. I listened to 7 or 8 numbers from WTC I & II. Maria Tipo and Ivo Janssen really stuck out to me but I couldn't find WTC recordings, so I listened to some partitas (Tipo) and the G minor Toccata (Janssen). I will keep digging and perusing the names you all have suggested and maybe branch out beyond YT. Thanks so much!


----------



## Mandryka

bwv543 said:


> I've been really enjoying the recommendations in this thread - it's been a mini-_tour de WTC_ for me the last few days, limited somewhat by what's available on YouTube. Jill Crossland was nice, but didn't grab me on first hearing. I listened to 7 or 8 numbers from WTC I & II. Maria Tipo and Ivo Janssen really stuck out to me but I couldn't find WTC recordings, so I listened to some partitas (Tipo) and the G minor Toccata (Janssen). I will keep digging and perusing the names you all have suggested and maybe branch out beyond YT. Thanks so much!


I think Janssen's WTC is pretty good. The way he embellishes the music - ornamentation and rubato.


----------



## bwv543

Last night, and this morning, I've been listening to the Feinberg WTC set and I'm hooked... what a magical tone! Of the ones I've listened to, this is the closest to Richter in spirit and conception. I'm still not wild about some of the virtuosic tempi on some of the numbers, but my goodness: overall, what gorgeous playing. I see that Nikolayeva was his student so I may put her next on the list to listen to.


----------



## Mandryka

bwv543 said:


> Last night, and this morning, I've been listening to the Feinberg WTC set and I'm hooked... what a magical tone! Of the ones I've listened to, this is the closest to Richter in spirit and conception. I'm still not wild about some of the virtuosic tempi on some of the numbers, but my goodness: overall, what gorgeous playing. I see that Nikolayeva was his student so I may put her next on the list to listen to.


Too rushed for me. But yes, the tone is ravishing and he completely "inhabits" the music. I wonder if you'll like Arthur Loesser.


----------



## bwv543

Mandryka said:


> Too rushed for me. But yes, the tone is ravishing and he completely "inhabits" the music. I wonder if you'll like Arthur Loesser.


Agreed - some of them are just too fast. A shame too, because with that golden tone some of them could be transformed by a broader tempo.


----------



## Josquin13

Like Aldwell, Feinberg was another student of Schenkarian musical analysis. Which definitely plays a part in both mens' WTC, tempo-wise.

bwv543 writes, "Maria Tipo and Ivo Janssen really stuck out to me but I couldn't find WTC recordings, so I listened to some partitas (Tipo) and the G minor Toccata (Janssen)."

Tipo never recorded the WTC, to my knowledge. But as I wrote in my previous post, her pupil Pietro de Maria has recorded both books for Decca, and his approach to Bach isn't dissimilar to hers.

Here's a link to Janssen's WTC on You Tube--for me, he's at his best in the quieter pieces, & the pieces that require a lot of technique: 




I own all of Janssen's Bach survey on VOID in a box set, and one of the recordings that has most impressed me over the years is his Goldberg Variations: 



. I'd rank his Goldbergs among the very best that I've heard played on a piano, alongside Nikolayeva's several versions (prior to her late Hyperion Goldbergs, where she wasn't at her best due to health reasons), Gould 1981, Konstantin Lifschitz's first recording for Denon, & Edward Aldwell's Biddulph recording. Janssen's WTC is good, too, but it has never quite grabbed me like his Goldbergs.

In addition, Janssen is excellent in The Art of the Fugue: 



, though he has some competition here, especially from Hans Petermandl. I recall, years ago, one critic at Fanfare surveyed many recordings of The Art of the Fugue, and concluded that Janssen's was one of the two best piano versions in the catalogue, next to Aldwell's incomplete recording. (Even so, I slightly prefer Petermandl.) I also like Janssen's 6 English Suites & prefer them to Schiff's award winning recording on Decca: 



. His 6 Partitas are good too, but here I prefer Virginia Black, Jean Louis Steuerman, & Vladimir Feltsman. In the 6 French Suites, again he's very good, but I prefer Andrea Bacchetti, Edward Aldwell, Ingrid Haebler, and Caspar Frantz. But you have to tip your hat to Janssen for taking on the monumental task of recording all of Bach's keyboard works, as his survey is more complete than Schiff or Gould's.


----------



## wkasimer

bwv543 said:


> Maria Tipo and Ivo Janssen really stuck out to me but I couldn't find WTC recordings,


I don't believe that Tipo has recorded either book of the WTC, but I'd love to be proved wrong. Janssen's recording is hard to find; I have it a big box containing all of Janssen's Bach recordings.


----------



## 59540

> tempo restraint


That would call for another vote for Rosalyn Tureck.


----------



## SanAntone

wkasimer said:


> I don't believe that Tipo has recorded either book of the WTC, but I'd love to be proved wrong. Janssen's recording is hard to find; I have it a big box containing all of Janssen's Bach recordings.


I suggested her name but was thinking of her recording of the Goldberg Variations, and some other Bach works including a number of other preludes and fugues.

Her playing definitely fit the kind of interpretation that was asked for in the OP which is why I included her name.


----------



## bwv543

Josquin13 said:


> Like Aldwell, Feinberg was another student of Schenkarian musical analysis. Which definitely plays a part in both mens' WTC, tempo-wise.


Can you elaborate how that influenced their choice of tempi?


----------



## Josquin13

bwv543 said:


> Can you elaborate how that influenced their choice of tempi?


I've never studied Schenkerian analysis, so I'm not the person to explain it, & I can't, since I don't understand it from any technical standpoint. (I'm not a musicologist.) However, I have listened intently to a number of different musicians who are proponents of Schenker's theories, & I believe I can hear certain similarities between their interpretative approaches, which is why I mentioned it in regards to Aldwell & Feinberg. Essentially--if I were to make a fool's attempt to try to explain it--the proponents of Schenkerian analysis seem to believe that there is more to the music than following any strict counterpoint, but instead focus on certain key melodic lines in order to bring out a greater sense of human emotion and feeling and therefore melodic fluency within the music. They additionally accentuate certain harmonies, or pick out more meaningful harmonic relationships to emphasize. Therefore, there is a freer (& arguably more imaginative) usage of the laws of strict counterpoint. (This emphasis on a greater melodic fluency is something that Glenn Gould seems to have been more drawn to on his second recording of the Goldberg Variations, such as in the way he plays the opening aria, for instance; although I don't know if Gould was familiar with Schenker's theories. But his 1981 playing of the aria does have a more melodic, singing quality than his 1955 recording of the aria. As an aside, I should add that Gould more or less disowned his earlier Bach recordings in an interview with Tim Page in the early 1980s, as the "sins of my youth".) In other words, Schenker's proponents don't think that Bach's keyboard music or any music should sound like lifeless exercises, but rather be connected to human emotions & feelings & states of mind or psychology, if you will. Does that make any sense?

If not, Aldwell co-wrote one of the most highly regarded textbooks on the subject of harmony, entitled, "Harmony and Voice Leading". Which should explain his distinctive approach to Bach & music a lot better than I can.

In addition, given that Tatiana Nikolayeva studied with Feinberg, the influence of Schenker's theories on Nikolayeva will likely be heard in her Bach playing, too.

Another proponent of Schenkerian analysis is the conductor Wilhelm Furtwangler, who studied Schenker's theories for 15 years, & I believe his pulling around of the tempi or rhythms--i.e., his slowing the music down & then speeding it back up for expressive purposes--is likely connected to Schenker, simply because I hear the pianists taking these kinds of liberties, too--at times (though maybe not to the same extreme that Furtwangler did).

The late American pianist Elizabeth Rich was another proponent of Schenker's theories, & her set of the complete Mozart Piano Sonatas is well worth hearing, since her approach to Mozart is very different & less strict, rhythmically, from that of Alicia de Larrocha, Miezyslaw Horszowski, or Ingrid Haebler (i.e., other pianists that are highly regarded for their Mozart). Personally, I suspect that Schenker's ideas go way back, or don't entirely originate with him, even if he made certain modifications to previous ways of thinking about music. In other words, I wouldn't be at all surprised if Mozart, were he around today, might prefer the way that Rich plays his Piano Sonatas versus the more metronomically strict playing of De Larrocha & Horszowski; although of course, I can't prove it. (Nor would I want to be without all four pianists' wonderful Mozart recordings in my collection.)

Here are some examples of Rich's Mozart playing from her complete survey:

Vol. 1: 



Vol. 2: 



etc. 
(the rest is on You Tube, if interested)

Suffice it to say, if you listen enough to the recordings of Rich, Aldwell, and Feinberg, I think you'll begin to hear certain common distinctions between their playing & interpretative approaches, from that of other pianists. In the end, I expect it's something that you have to hear for yourself.

But perhaps someone else here can step in and explain Schenkerian musical analysis in relation to these pianists better than I have...?

By the way, the composer Anton Bruckner also studied directly with Schenker, which may help to partly explain why Furtwangler was such a great Bruckner conductor.


----------



## RogerWaters

People bag Barenboim's version because it isn't 'historically correct', but I haven't heard a version which better makes Bach's music sound as though it was _intended_ for the possibilities of the piano. Barenboim's c-sharp minor fugue is nothing short of amazing.

My overall favourite, though, is Nikolayeva. Her dry tone and considered phrasing bring out the different voices amazingly.

Schiff is too sheen, and it all moulds into one amorphous mass for me after a while.


----------



## Mandryka

RogerWaters said:


> People bag Barenboim's version because it isn't 'historically correct', but I haven't heard a version which better makes Bach's music sound as though it was _intended_ for the possibilities of the piano. Barenboim's c-sharp minor fugue is nothing short of amazing.
> 
> My overall favourite, though, is Nikolayeva. Her dry tone and considered phrasing bring out the different voices amazingly.
> 
> Schiff is too sheen, and it all moulds into one amorphous mass for me after a while.


Yes Barenboim is a good example of someone ready to use all the effects of a modern piano in an interpretation of a score which comes from before the modern piano.


----------



## bwv543

Josquin13 said:


> I've never studied Schenkerian analysis, so I'm not the person to explain it, & I can't, since I don't understand it from any technical standpoint. (I'm not a musicologist.)
> 
> *SNIP*
> 
> But perhaps someone else here can step in and explain Schenkerian musical analysis in relation to these pianists better than I have...?
> 
> By the way, the composer Anton Bruckner also studied directly with Schenker, which may help to partly explain why Furtwangler was such a great Bruckner conductor.


Schenkerian analysis is a sort of "unified field theory" way of analyzing music. I'm not an expert on it, though, and I've never considered the kind of concrete application of it in the way described here... I've always thought of it as just another tool in the arsenal of understanding and never as a determinative framework for interpretive choices. Fascinating... if anyone knows of a treatise on applying Schenkerian principles to performance, I'd love to know.

Bruckner did not study with Schenker, whose dates are 1868 - 1935, but rather with Simon Sechter. In fact, Schenker was a student of AB and did not come away with a positive impression.


----------



## joen_cph

I find Feinberg particularly good in Book II.


----------



## Josquin13

bwv543 writes, "if anyone knows of a treatise on applying Schenkerian principles to performance, I'd love to know."

Have you read Aldwell's book, which I mentioned above?--"Harmony and Voice Leading" I'd imagine that he & his fellow author, Allen Cadwallader--who is another proponent, lecturer, & writer on Schenkerian analysis, incorporate their extensive knowledge of Schenker's theories into the book. (Carl Schachter is another co-author.) But I'm not certain about that.

Here's a biographical blurb on Cadwallader, & what he's written, which may lead to what you're asking for,

"Allen Cadwallader is Professor of Music Theory at Oberlin Conservatory of Music, where he teaches counterpoint, tonal harmony, and Schenkerian analysis. He is editor of TRENDS IN SCHENKERIAN RESEARCH, ESSAYS FROM THE THIRD INTERNATIONAL SCHENKER SYMPOSIUM, ESSAYS FROM THE FOURTH INTERNATIONAL SCHENKER SYMPOSIUM, VOL. 1, and coauthor of ANALYSIS OF TONAL MUSIC: A SCHENKERIAN APPROACH (Oxford University Press). He has published articles on Schenkerian theory in JOURNAL OF MUSIC THEORY, MUSIC ANALYSIS, and MUSIC THEORY SPECTRUM, and has given lectures and workshops on Schenker's work in England, France, Germany, and the United States."

So yes, I'd say the following Oxford University Press book does look promising, in regards to your question, but it's not inexpensive (as usual)--perhaps you can find it in a music library: https://www.amazon.com/Analysis-Ton...iversity+Press)&qid=1638841809&s=books&sr=1-2

But, have you listened to Aldwell's WTC? It's quite different, and more subtle & nuanced and soft-spoken than Janssen's... not as bold or loudly played. I prefer it. Though as noted, my top favorite in this music is Nikolayeva (& then Afanassiev, Feinberg, Aldwell, Hill, Richter, Crochet, Tureck BBC, Janssen, Horszowski, etc.)

By the way, I'm surprised that no one has mentioned Friedrich Gulda's WTC, which usually comes up on these threads...

(As for myself, I'm just waiting for Pascal Dubreuil or Christian Rieger to record the WTC on the harpsichord, speaking of favorites in Bach. Although there are other harpsichordists that I like too, of course, in the WTC, such as Bob van Asperen, Leon Berben, & Pieter-Jan Belder--to name just three...)

bwv543 writes, "Bruckner did not study with Schenker, whose dates are 1868 - 1935, but rather with Simon Sechter. In fact, Schenker was a student of AB and did not come away with a positive impression."

Ugh. I knew that. Sorry, I misremembered. Sometimes it's hard to write my lengthy posts late at night, as I often do, & not make silly errors. Yes, Schenker studied counterpoint with Bruckner, & not the other way around. What was I thinking. (& now I can't even fix my mistake!) But in regards to his view of Bruckner, Schenker seems to have been of two minds about his teacher; although curiously he didn't see these two views as a contradiction. On the one hand, he speaks about Bruckner's music in the most exalted terms, writing,

"I have always evaluated Bruckner's themes more highly than all invention of all other composers (that of a Brahms, Dvořák , and Wolf excepted, of course), and so it remains still today. The gap from Bruckner to the others is so great that they don't even deserve to be mentioned alongside of him. And what I am yet more thankful for is Bruckner's genuine, typical good composition, in which he stands sky high above all, all of today! Compared with him, the real tone craftsmen, the composers of today ‒ not a single one excepted! ‒ simply no longer appear as musicians. He wrote in our musical language of which, however, the Hummel-composers know nothing genuinely and well; the others babble some kind of "Matabele-jargon," which could need another eight-to-ten centuries of evolution before it can finally serve as a language of art, at the same time, however, to reach the stage where our musical language has been for some time."

But, in the same letter, Schenker then adds to the contrary,

"Nevertheless I still cannot call Bruckner a master, let alone see in him an advancement in any regard whatsoever. The reasons are of a purely technical nature and will find their place extensively in the third volume. Here I can therefore sketch them only fleetingly and provisionally for you.

What would you say if for us Beethoven were contained, for example, only in the grandiose openings of the Ninth, Fifth, of the "Leonore" and "Egmont" Overtures, and in so many other equally dramatic passages in the middle of the Third, the Fifth, of the last piano sonatas and string quartets, but we otherwise were to miss in him the other, unfathomable world of the charming, of the playful, the engaging, of the purely pianistic, the purely violinistic, purely orchestral, and the like? Does it not make you suspicious that Bruckner's invention resides always only in pathos, in ecstasy, or ‒ in the Ländler? If we do not know from the outset how properly to assess what damage such a gift of invention must do to the symphony in particular, we are in good faith certainly inclined, at first, to assess the invention as higher the more dramatically, the more ecstatically it manifests itself. We think the more grandiose the thematic material, all the more heavenly and rich, apparently, also the source from which it flows. And yet all of that is a fallacy.

Although I gladly conceded above that isolated moments in Bruckner are grand and sublime, I am nonetheless not guilty of any contradiction if, despite all of that, I assert that Bruckner possessed only a very minimal powers of invention. For Bruckner lacked namely that specific compositional talent which in literature we call the specific literary talent, that fluent disposition as has always been the first condition with all masters, and up to the end of the world will always remain so for all creative beings."

If anyone's interested, here's a link to the letter that I'm drawing these quotes from: https://schenkerdocumentsonline.org/documents/correspondence/OJ-5-15_2-3.html, which is posted on a website that also serves as a valuable resource for all of Schenker's correspondences about Bruckner, etc.: https://schenkerdocumentsonline.org/profiles/person/entity-000104.html.


----------



## Josquin13

I have one more note to add concerning Heinrich Schenker: I had previously read that Furtwangler studied with Schenker between 1920-35, but while Furtwangler & Schenker had a (complicated) teacher-disciple friendship between 1919-1935, & Furtwangler worked with Schenker on the repertory that he conducted, & read all of his books & writings, & was very influenced by Schenker's ideas on music & other subjects--but particularly his thoughts on Beethoven's Nine Symphonies, Furtwangler was never officially one of Schenker's 'pupils'. The following article sets the record straight: https://schenkerdocumentsonline.org/profiles/person/entity-000268.html.


----------



## Oldhoosierdude

No one has said Jeno Jando? The only WTC I have. I've heard others and stuck with this one.


----------



## joen_cph

Jando is usually solid. 

The only exception I've heard are the Schubert impromptus/naxos - apparently it was an uninspired day at the office for him.


----------



## bwv543

Thank you for the recommendation Josquin - I will look into that book at the earliest possible opportunity.

So far, in addition to Crossland, I've listened to the Feinberg and Tureck sets all the way through. I really enjoyed Tureck and her choice of tempi. I've also listened to the Aldwell and Nikolayeva sets, not in their entirety, but maybe 15 or so of the 48 for each set... Josquin, you were right about Aldwell - it's a wonderful set and I really enjoyed it! I also listened to Gieseking's Book II... it was good but didn't wow me.

I saw you mentioned Crochet in passing - I was intrigued by a link to her WTC I in the YouTube sidebar so I've started on that as of last night and - wow! Although I'm hesitant to list favorites, preferring instead to give each one a listen and then come back in subsequent weeks and months, it's possible that this has made the most positive first impression of any of the sets so far. I see also that she was a noted Faure pianist, so besides being on this Bach kick, I need to check those out as well. Such is the life of a music lover... you check 2 recordings of the list to have them replaced with 5 more!

After working my way through Crochet I'll try Gulda or Kempff next. Hey, this is a lot of fun - thank you guys for all these recommendations!


----------



## Animal the Drummer

I didn't like Gulda - altogether too clipped and peremptory in too many of the pieces for my liking. Kempff is another matter and I love his Bach. Given that he got his start as an organist that may not be surprising.


----------



## Kreisler jr

Gulda is not as eccentric as Gould but mostly in the objective camp, with mostly fast tempi and a bit percussive and very directly recorded (produced by Jazz label, despite appearing later on Philips).


----------



## joen_cph

*Joao Carlos Martins* is another lively piano eccentric, but maybe difficult to find.

Book I


----------



## Josquin13

bwv543 said:


> Thank you for the recommendation Josquin - I will look into that book at the earliest possible opportunity.
> 
> So far, in addition to Crossland, I've listened to the Feinberg and Tureck sets all the way through. I really enjoyed Tureck and her choice of tempi. I've also listened to the Aldwell and Nikolayeva sets, not in their entirety, but maybe 15 or so of the 48 for each set... Josquin, you were right about Aldwell - it's a wonderful set and I really enjoyed it! I also listened to Gieseking's Book II... it was good but didn't wow me.
> 
> I saw you mentioned Crochet in passing - I was intrigued by a link to her WTC I in the YouTube sidebar so I've started on that as of last night and - wow! Although I'm hesitant to list favorites, preferring instead to give each one a listen and then come back in subsequent weeks and months, it's possible that this has made the most positive first impression of any of the sets so far. I see also that she was a noted Faure pianist, so besides being on this Bach kick, I need to check those out as well. Such is the life of a music lover... you check 2 recordings of the list to have them replaced with 5 more!
> 
> After working my way through Crochet I'll try Gulda or Kempff next. Hey, this is a lot of fun - thank you guys for all these recommendations!


I hope if you read the book that you'll post some of your thoughts about it here, & especially in regards to Feinberg, Nikolayeva, & Aldwell's Bach interpretations, & how they may be influenced by Schenker's theories.

I'm pleased to hear that you enjoyed Aldwell's Bach playing (his French Suites & Goldbergs are excellent, too). Yes, I mentioned that Evelyne Crochet's WTC was another favorite of mine, but I didn't think you'd like it because her tempi can be on the brisk side. Yet I know that both Trevor Pinnock & Alfred Brendel were complimentary of her WTC. Pinnock even wrote Crochet a letter thanking her, & so did Brendel (but they are friends). Her Book 2 is likewise on YT: 



.

Crochet & Brendel recorded one of my three or four favorite versions of Schubert's Fantasy in F minor for Four Hands, Op. 940, many years ago for Vox: 



. & yes, her older recordings of the complete solo piano music of Faure for Vox are very good, too: 



 (though it's hard to beat Germaine Thyssens-Valentin in Faure: 



, as well as Magda Tagliaferro, Jean-Philippe Collard, & several other pianists). Crochet also recorded an LP of Satie's solo piano music for the Philips label that included some world premieres at the time (before there were many Satie recordings in the catalogue).

By the way, Crochet's CDs are available for sale on her website, if you can't find them elsewhere at a reasonable price: http://evelynecrochet.com/index.html.

I agree that in order to sort out your favorites, you have to go away and come back to them. Speaking for myself, sometimes my first impression is overly positive, & vice versa, occasionally it can take me several listens before I begin to appreciate a recording more enthusiastically.

P.S. Speaking of which, have you sampled Afanassiev's WTC? or did you not like his Bach playing? Granted, he's not for everyone, but if you've not heard Afanassiev's WTC yet, don't let his sometimes unusual or individualistic recordings of other repertory keep you away. His WTC is very good, in my estimation. Besides, no one wins the Leipzig Bach competition without being able to play this music well.


----------



## Mimi38

Talking about historical recordings, is there a recording of WTC by Wilhelm Kempff?
I really enjoy his Goldberg variations.


----------



## joen_cph

Mimi38 said:


> Talking about historical recordings, is there a recording of WTC by Wilhelm Kempff?
> I really enjoy his Goldberg variations.


Only excerpts, equal to an LP, a DG stereo:
https://www.discogs.com/release/146...-Kempff-Das-Wohltemperierte-Klavier-I-Auswahl


----------



## wkasimer

joen_cph said:


> *Joao Carlos Martins* is another lively piano eccentric, but maybe difficult to find.
> 
> Book I


Martins actually recorded the WTC twice. The first one was issued by Connoisseur Society and is fairly mainstream, compared to the later, more individual interpretation on Labor Records.


----------



## bwv543

Josquin13 said:


> I hope if you read the book that you'll post some of your thoughts about it here, & especially in regards to Feinberg, Nikolayeva, & Aldwell's Bach interpretations, & how they may be influenced by Schenker's theories.
> 
> I'm pleased to hear that you enjoyed Aldwell's Bach playing (his French Suites & Goldbergs are excellent, too). Yes, I mentioned that Evelyne Crochet's WTC was another favorite of mine, but I didn't think you'd like it because her tempi can be on the brisk side. Yet I know that both Trevor Pinnock & Alfred Brendel were complimentary of her WTC. Pinnock even wrote Crochet a letter thanking her, & so did Brendel (but they are friends). Her Book 2 is likewise on YT:
> 
> 
> 
> .
> 
> Crochet & Brendel recorded one of my three or four favorite versions of Schubert's Fantasy in F minor for Four Hands, Op. 940, many years ago for Vox:
> 
> 
> 
> . & yes, her older recordings of the complete solo piano music of Faure for Vox are very good, too:
> 
> 
> 
> (though it's hard to beat Germaine Thyssens-Valentin in Faure:
> 
> 
> 
> , as well as Magda Tagliaferro, Jean-Philippe Collard, & several other pianists). Crochet also recorded an LP of Satie's solo piano music for the Philips label that included some world premieres at the time (before there were many Satie recordings in the catalogue).
> 
> By the way, Crochet's CDs are available for sale on her website, if you can't find them elsewhere at a reasonable price: http://evelynecrochet.com/index.html.
> 
> I agree that in order to sort out your favorites, you have to go away and come back to them. Speaking for myself, sometimes my first impression is overly positive, & vice versa, occasionally it can take me several listens before I begin to appreciate a recording more enthusiastically.
> 
> P.S. Speaking of which, have you sampled Afanassiev's WTC? or did you not like his Bach playing? Granted, he's not for everyone, but if you've not heard Afanassiev's WTC yet, don't let his sometimes unusual or individualistic recordings of other repertory keep you away. His WTC is very good, in my estimation. Besides, no one wins the Leipzig Bach competition without being able to play this music well.


It may be a while before I am able to read the book - life gives me very little time for reading these days - but I have it on my shortlist. Thankfully I have a job where, depending on which projects I'm assigned to, I can often "hole up" with headphones and get a lot of listening done while I work.

Since the last post, I've listened to recordings by Gulda, Fischer, Kempff (what I could find), Schiff, and Afanassiev. (I'm still working my way through the last-named of those as we speak.) I was somewhat surprised to find that I really liked Gulda's interpretations despite the fact that his take is a slightly more eccentric one. Fischer - I did not care for as much. Kempff I really enjoyed. Schiff was something very different and although I doubt it would ever be my favorite recording, I appreciate the "tastefulness" of his approach: he is usually very moderate in his tempo, touch, dynamics, etc. I like his silvery tone and admire how much legato he can get without any pedal. I am also enjoying the Afanassiev but have only listened to five or six numbers so far.

I was interested by your comment about Crochet's playing being on the fast side. I didn't listen to all 48 p&fs from her set - maybe about 20 or 25 - and I recall being generally pleased with her tempi. Could you highlight an example or two?

In my OP I mentioned disliking overly fast tempi on certain numbers. Here is a notable example of what I am talking about. I have this recording in my iTunes and I took the rare step of rating it 1 star and creating a rule for my playlists to exclude all 1-starred recordings just so I didn't ever have to listen to this again. Apologies to Gould fans on here; I'm not a Gould hater by any means and I really enjoy some of his Bach playing. But that link highlights an extreme example of a tendency for players to approach some of the WTC numbers too virtuosically - the two G majors, the E minor fugue from Bk I, the two C minor preludes, as some examples. Although Richter is nothing like Gould in most respects he does share this tendency to go too fast on some of these numbers. Feinberg does this as well, and so does Fischer. On other numbers, I may not be bothered by a brisk tempo if it seems to fall within the bounds of "good taste" - which is totally subjective on my end, of course.

At any rate, in closing, I'll just acknowledge once more that my perusal of these sets has been very superficial - listening to nearly a dozen WTC sets in a handful of weeks is bound to preclude any profound insights on my part. But I am enjoying this sampling of the variety of recordings out there. I don't know who I'll listen to next after Afanassiev but I am planning to listen to at least 5 or 6 more sets before "wrapping up" this _tour de WTC_. After that - then I'll try to figure out a way to take a slightly closer look. If any of you veteran listeners have tips on how to do that, I'm open, though I suspect it simply involves time and repetition. I don't as readily grasp the subtle nuances of piano playing (one reason my listening has always been more heavily skewed towards orchestral works and pipe organ music), but I know I'm capable of growth in that area.


----------



## Kreisler jr

I am surprised that you liked Gulda at all. While he is not as excentric as Gould his tempi are often fast (I seem to recall both the c minor prelude and the e minor fugue from bk. 1 as very fast), the general attitude a bit "cold" and the very (direct) sound an acquired taste.... I like parts of it a lot but it was my first complete recording of the music and I got to know many pieces by this recording.

Did you have a chance to try Koroliov? He seemed to me closest to a modern, unexcentric version of the "Russian school" and more on the slow side as well.


----------



## bwv543

Kreisler jr said:


> I am surprised that you liked Gulda at all. While he is not as excentric as Gould his tempi are often fast (I seem to recall both the c minor prelude and the e minor fugue from bk. 1 as very fast), the general attitude a bit "cold" and the very (direct) sound an acquired taste.... I like parts of it a lot but it was my first complete recording of the music and I got to know many pieces by this recording.
> 
> Did you have a chance to try Koroliov? He seemed to me closest to a modern, unexcentric version of the "Russian school" and more on the slow side as well.


Yes, you and me both! I did not expect to like Gulda but I did. Of course I also like Gould quite a bit, some of the time.

I have not tried Koroliov. Maybe I will do that next, after Afanassiev.


----------



## lnjng

I usually rely on Schiff for a solid recording. His use of no pedal appeals to me when Bach is concerned.


----------



## Varick

I have three recordings of the WTC. Gould, Fischer, & Richter. The Gould & Fischer recordings are just outstanding (I love Gould for Bach and make no apologies for it). Richter's is very good, but sometimes I get frustrated with Richter. His technique and approach to music is exemplary, but too often I find his playing a bit too analytical. I enjoy the fact that his playing is never sentimental which is why I really enjoy a lot of his late Classical and Romantic era performances, but sometimes his Bach and early classical pieces fall just a bit short with me.

I know in many musical circles criticism of Richter is verboten, but I've never been afraid of going against the grain. Again, don't get me wrong, Richter is absolutely one of the greatest piano masters of all time.

I have the Schiff on my list to buy. I have listened to it before and I thought it superb. I am a big fan of his approach to Bach.

V


----------

