# Rarely Played Pieces



## Nate Miller (Oct 24, 2016)

I had a music history professor who told me once that "if there is a piece that is rarely played, often there is a very good reason why"

I do play a couple of pieces that don't seem to be played very often. I sometimes wonder if my old professor was right about them, though

What are your thoughts on playing pieces that are rarely played?

do you like to program pieces that are rarely played, knowing the chances of anyone out there being familiar with them are pretty slim?

do you program them in between other more familiar works? do you ever end a program with them?

or do you never program that sort of stuff at all?


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## Genoveva (Nov 9, 2010)

I would say that about 99% of the classical music I listen to is "rarely played" material, if by that you mean the kind of popular stuff they play on radio stations like Classic FM in the the UK. Even the BBC's daytime classical music programmes seem increasingly to play the more popular material, probably to compete with the likes of CFM.

I don't have to look far to find many interesting alternatives, including some pretty obscure classical music, in my collection. It's all on a hard drive with some 700 composers represented. There is practically every main work by all the top 50 composers plus tons of material by the others. 

If I discover a gap in the collection of music I like I'll buy it. To take just one recent example, right now I've been playing through a CD featuring a work by composer Samuel Coleridge-Taylor called "Song of Hiawatha". It is only very rarely performed these days but there was a time when it was a concert classic. Sir Malcolm Sargant often included in Proms concerts before 1939, and is a beautiful work. 

I don't know how other classical obsessed members might respond but would guess that they too often wander off the well-trodden path of the standard repertoire. If for no other reason, it's far more interesting to listen to new material than say Beethoven's Symphony No X, or Mozart's Piano concerto No Y for the umpteenth time in the same week, as some folk reputedly do. Variety is the spice of life.


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## Strange Magic (Sep 14, 2015)

Thank goodness for CDs. If not for recordings, we'd be down to a tiny fraction of what's out there. In part, it's a consequence of the astonishing output of classical music _sensu lato_ that's been composed in the last 2 centuries.


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## hpowders (Dec 23, 2013)

The Ives Concord Piano Sonata is rarely played, with no fault to Ives.

This is a magnificent work, epic in scope, as fine as any piano sonata Beethoven wrote.

It is neglected out of ignorance.

Professors are professors for a reason. Those that can, do. Those that can't, teach.


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## Nate Miller (Oct 24, 2016)

Genoveva said:


> I would say that about 99% of the classical music I listen to is "rarely played" material, if by that you mean the kind of popular stuff they play on radio stations like Classic FM in the the UK. .


no, by "rarely played" I mean its rarely played

I don't mean "rarely played on the radio" I mean rarely, if ever, performed

for example, I play classical guitar, and Mauro Giuliani is a fairly popular composer, but his Grand Rondo op 109 doesn't get played very often. I played the piece in college and didn't find a recording of it until this year. 30 years looking for a recording is the sort of "rarely played" that I mean. Everybody does his sonata op15 and the Grand Overture op.61 and the Grand Sonata op 150...but the Grand Rondo? not very often is the best information I can find

and my question is more along the lines of programming this sort of stuff. Listening is great, but do you put the time into one of these things to go perform it?


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## R3PL4Y (Jan 21, 2016)

If there is a good reason that a piece is not often performed, that reason does not necessarily have to be that it is bad music.


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## DaveM (Jun 29, 2015)

hpowders said:


> The Ives Concord Piano Sonata is rarely played, with no fault to Ives.
> 
> This is a magnificent work, epic in scope, as fine as any piano sonata Beethoven wrote.


Apples and oranges. Totally different eras and form/structure of classical piano music.


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## Pugg (Aug 8, 2014)

DaveM said:


> Apples and oranges. Totally different eras and form/structure of classical piano music.


Amen to this....................................


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## Pat Fairlea (Dec 9, 2015)

hpowders said:


> Professors are professors for a reason. Those that can, do. Those that can't, teach.


Ahem! Speaking as a retired Professor (though not of music), teaching IS doing. And the best teaching is encouraging and enabling others to find out just what they can do. Which isn't a bad way to earn a crust.

Regarding neglected music, it isn't necessarily 'bad', whatever that means. Chaminade's little pieces for piano, for example, get little attention these days, but among them are some quite accomplished and enjoyable examples of 19th century salon music. In the dense undergrowth of English 20th century music, Elizabeth Maconchy's works lurk out of sight and hearing for no obvious reason.


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## Animal the Drummer (Nov 14, 2015)

Genoveva said:


> I would say that about 99% of the classical music I listen to is "rarely played" material, if by that you mean the kind of popular stuff they play on radio stations like Classic FM in the the UK. Even the BBC's daytime classical music programmes seem increasingly to play the more popular material, probably to compete with the likes of CFM.
> 
> I don't have to look far to find many interesting alternatives, including some pretty obscure classical music, in my collection. It's all on a hard drive with some 700 composers represented. There is practically every main work by all the top 50 composers plus tons of material by the others.
> 
> ...


I enjoy departing from the beaten track as well, but I respectfully disagree with the "far more interesting" bit. To you it clearly is, to some it equally clearly isn't. I get a lot out of either approach at different times.


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## hpowders (Dec 23, 2013)

The Schuman symphonies #4,6,7,8,9 and 10 are terrific works, among the greatest of American symphonies, and have been scandalously neglected, not because of the lack of craftsmanship of their creator. They are long overdue for a major orchestra recording. I mean, how many more Beethoven 9 symphonies do we need?


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## Nate Miller (Oct 24, 2016)

R3PL4Y said:


> If there is a good reason that a piece is not often performed, that reason does not necessarily have to be that it is bad music.


this is exactly what I tell myself every time I pull out the Grand Rondo and put it on the music stand


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## Nate Miller (Oct 24, 2016)

Pat Fairlea said:


> Regarding neglected music, it isn't necessarily 'bad', whatever that means. Chaminade's little pieces for piano, for example, get little attention these days, but among them are some quite accomplished and enjoyable examples of 19th century salon music. In the dense undergrowth of English 20th century music, Elizabeth Maconchy's works lurk out of sight and hearing for no obvious reason.


there are pieces that come and go, too. I remember in music school, all the cool kids were playing John Duarte's Sonatina Lyrica...now I can't find a recording of it to save my life

one thing I will say about playing a rarely performed piece....it is sort of comforting to know that nobody out there knows what it is supposed to sound like! :lol:


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## hpowders (Dec 23, 2013)

The Franz Schmidt Fourth Symphony is a very fine work which begins and ends with the most haunting trumpet solo.

It really should be played more often!


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## EdwardBast (Nov 25, 2013)

hpowders said:


> Professors are professors for a reason. Those that can, do. Those that can't, teach.


This is egregious nonsense. Beethoven taught. Haydn taught. Tchaikovsky, Myaskovsky, Shostakovich, Rimsky-Korsakoff, Schoenberg, and many more of the best composers of this era were professors of music. The performance faculties of most of the best music schools and conservatories are made up of professional orchestral players and soloists. Professors of musicology who transcribe, authenticate, edit and publish editions of early music have specialized skills that allow you to hear whole repertoires that might have been lost without what they do - and teach.


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## hpowders (Dec 23, 2013)

Peter Mennin's Seventh Symphony, arguably, is the greatest symphony written by an American.

Yet where the heck is it on concert programs?


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## Pugg (Aug 8, 2014)

A Grand, Grand Overture (Malcolm Arnold)
Vacuum players: Jane Glover, Christopher Laing, Bill Oddie, Donald Swann.
Now this I would like to see.


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## hpowders (Dec 23, 2013)

The Franck Symphony in D minor was a staple on concert programs of the 1940's-1960's with terrific performances by Pierre Monteux and Charles Munch in the catalog.

Shockingly out of favor. A terrific symphony!


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## Pat Fairlea (Dec 9, 2015)

Pugg said:


> A Grand, Grand Overture (Malcolm Arnold)
> Vacuum players: Jane Glover, Christopher Laing, Bill Oddie, Donald Swann.
> Now this I would like to see.


Many years ago, I saw this Overture performed live, with the composer conducting. The vacuum cleaner and floor polisher players kept straight, serious faces throughout. Nobody else did!


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## R3PL4Y (Jan 21, 2016)

hpowders said:


> The Schuman symphonies #4,6,7,8,9 and 10 are terrific works, among the greatest of American symphonies, and have been scandalously neglected, not because of the lack of craftsmanship of their creator. They are long overdue for a major orchestra recording. I mean, how many more Beethoven 9 symphonies do we need?


Yes! Schuman is one of my favorite composers, and I always find it sad how little the symphonies besides 3 and 5 are performed.


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## Pugg (Aug 8, 2014)

Pat Fairlea said:


> Many years ago, I saw this Overture performed live, with the composer conducting. The vacuum cleaner and floor polisher players kept straight, serious faces throughout. Nobody else did!


I would like to have seen that, someone told me they did it once on Last Night, do you know this by accident?


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## Templeton (Dec 20, 2014)

hpowders said:


> The Franz Schmidt Fourth Symphony is a very fine work which begins and ends with the most haunting trumpet solo.
> 
> It really should be played more often!


As should Schmidt's Second Symphony, as well as his contemporary, Joseph Marx's 'Eine Herbstsymphonie'.

This is an excellent thread, with some very interesting suggestions that I will be following up, so thanks for all of the contributions so far.


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## Pat Fairlea (Dec 9, 2015)

Pugg said:


> I would like to have seen that, someone told me they did it once on Last Night, do you know this by accident?


The Grand Grand Overture was performed at the Last Night of the Proms a couple of years ago. The performance I was remembering was at the Albert Hall on 15th December 1976 (Mrs Pat's birthday, fortuitously), with the title "Hear, Hear Hoffnung!". It was a recreation of the great Hoffnung Music Festivals, including some of the original performers. It was highly memorable, not least to hear one of Leopold Mozart's Horn Concerti played on a length of garden hose. And of course, the bulky force of nature that was Malcolm Arnold in his prime conducting orchestra, vacuum cleaners and riflemen through his Overture.


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## Gordontrek (Jun 22, 2012)

Gershwin's Lullaby for strings is a mostly neglected work that I find exceptionally beautiful if not a bit repetitive. Gershwin in general, in my opinion, deserves a little more attention in the concert hall.


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