# Which Beethoven Piano Sonatas?



## KenOC

Quite a legacy here. Choose from 15 of his most popular. Which two or three are your especial favorites?


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## clavichorder

From the ones on the list, Das Lebewohl, Waldstein, and Pathetique. Four others I really like are no. 7, no. 24, no. 13, and no. 3. I don't know them all equally well though.


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## Mahlerian

I voted for Hammerklavier and the two in C minor. If you don't know the 32nd, clavichorder, I recommend it wholeheartedly.


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## Ravndal

i voted no 8, 17 and 21. But i really miss no 7 on the list.


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## Tristan

My personal favorite is #24 in F-sharp major "A Therese".


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## clavichorder

Mahlerian said:


> I voted for Hammerklavier and the two in C minor. If you don't know the 32nd, clavichorder, I recommend it wholeheartedly.


I do know the 32nd. I am not as fond of the variations as some are, but thanks for the recommendation. I'm generally a middle Beethoven fan at heart, though the thrill of exploding classicism in early Beethoven is fascinating to me as well. It has been a while since I've listened to 32 though, and I haven't heard Perahia or Gilels, who are both available on youtube.

Edit: I was being a fool in my youtube searching. I typed in Beethoven 32 Variations, intending to find that strange final section to sonata 32 and came across 32 variations in C minor, which seemed like a really thrilling piece. I'm less a fan of the exalted finale of the 32nd sonata, which I can't find Gilels playing.


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## kv466

The favorite I most often go back to is on the list (no.18) my other e-flat favorite is, sadly, not. The 13.


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## KenOC

clavichorder said:


> Edit: I was being a fool in my youtube searching. I typed in Beethoven 32 Variations, intending to find that strange final section to sonata 32 and came across 32 variations in C minor, which seemed like a really thrilling piece. I'm less a fan of the exalted finale of the 32nd sonata, which I can't find Gilels playing.


The C-minor variations (WoO 80) is an excellent piece. Although Beethoven didn't think it worth an opus number, it was popular from the beginning -- so much so that he once expressed some irritation when he heard it from the street. "That nonsense by me? Oh Beethoven, what an *** you were!"

Re Gilels, he died while recording his cycle, so several sonatas are missing, including the Op. 111. I don't believe there is any recording at all of Gilels playing this sonata.


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## clavichorder

I find Das Lebewohl really impressive and powerful. It seems stylistically still a part of the middle period. We have a member here, also my friend, who is completely obsessed with it and she hasn't mentioned it in a while.


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## tdc

I like all of Beethoven's Piano Sonatas but for as long as I can remember my favorite has been Piano Sonata number 1. It is the most classical sounding of his sonatas I think, maybe not as complex as later Beethoven but it comes across as a perfect sounding composition to me.


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## clavichorder

Though I did not vote for it, I recall really liking 28 in A major. I think it is late period, but there was something really nice about it. I don't know it well enough though.


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## KenOC

clavichorder said:


> Though I did not vote for it, I recall really liking 28 in A major. I think it is late period, but there was something really nice about it. I don't know it well enough though.


#28 is a bit of an odd duck, kind of straddling the line between Beethoven's middle and last periods. Its first movement is a relaxed and lyrical exercise in avoiding resolution, and its last is thorny and quite fugal. This is one of the only non-named sonatas that Horowitz recorded, and he did a good job. I can't see that Gould recorded it, but if he did I'm sure the results were...uh...interesting.


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## Novelette

Difficult choice.

I adore Sonata #30 in E, especially the third movement which I love to play. Still, 32, Waldstein, and Hammerklavier take the cake.


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## realdealblues

tdc said:


> I like all of Beethoven's Piano Sonatas but for as long as I can remember my favorite has been Piano Sonata number 1. It is the most classical sounding of his sonatas I think, maybe not as complex as later Beethoven but it comes across as a perfect sounding composition to me.


Sonata #1 is in my top 5 for that exact reason.


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## Vaneyes

KenOC said:


> #28....I can't see that Gould recorded it, but if he did I'm sure the results were...uh...interesting.


Only the first three movements exist (rec.1952). Available via CBC CD, and YT.

Re LvB's Piano Sonatas, the first movement of Op. 101 was GG's favorite, and thought not much of the remaining movements related to it.


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## ArtMusic

Moonlight, Appassionata, Hammerklavier

Iwent to Bonn before and I visted Beethoven Haus and saw his piano. I felt very special seeing it all there.


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## Novelette

The early Beethoven works are difficult for me to listen to. And I cannot explain why.

I adore Haydn and the "sterile", dare I say so, Classical form. But for some reason, I can hardly stomach most of Beethoven's works of the 1790's. =\


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## Weston

I chose the Opp. 109 and 110 and the Pathetique. I meant for one of them to be the late sonata that has the long loooong fugue section in the final movement. That one is a debilitating piece, and by that I mean I can scarcely do anything after listening to it except dream about some impossible distant future utopia when humanity is beautiful and ingenious and eternally fascinating and everyone sits around listening to each others' siren songs. Or something like that. Is that the Op. 110 or the 111? That's what I meant to include. I don't think it's the very last one.

Oh heck. I like them all.


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## KenOC

It's the 110...  C'mon, put it on, listen to it.


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## neoshredder

If only we could replace PS's 2, 12, 15, 18, 28, with 1, 3, 7, 13, 24 and do the poll again.


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## KenOC

neoshredder said:


> If only we could replace PS's 2, 12, 15, 18, 28, with 1, 3, 7, 13, 24 and do the poll again.


Well, of course we (you) can.


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## neoshredder

KenOC said:


> Well, of course we (you) can.


Alright I'll get right to it.


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## KenOC

BTW I see that all the highest-scoring sonatas in this poll, except one, have nicknames. The power of marketing?


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## Turangalîla

I thought that Op. 81a's nickname was _Les adieux_...? Das Lebewohl is the name of the first movement I think.

Anyhow, I voted for Opp. 109 and 111, but Opp. 2 no. 3 and 31 no. 1 are my real favourites. (I can't see why you excluded the former and yet included Op. 2 no. 2!)


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## KenOC

CarterJohnsonPiano said:


> I thought that Op. 81a's nickname was _Les adieux_...? Das Lebewohl is the name of the first movement I think.


The sonata was published as _Les Adieux_. Beethoven had intended to entire sonata to be named _Das Lebewohl _and was a bit peeved over the mix-up. The "a" in the "81a" is due to yet another mix-up, this one between publishers -- Op. 81b is a sextet from 1795, remaindered by Ludwig the way Amazon does MP3 compilations!


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## Turangalîla

KenOC said:


> The sonata was published as _Les Adieux_. Beethoven had intended to entire sonata to be named _Das Lebewohl _and was a bit peeved over the mix-up. The "a" in the "81a" is due to yet another mix-up, this one between publishers -- Op. 81b is a sextet from 1795, remaindered by Ludwig the way Amazon does MP3 compilations!


Oh okay, it looks like you're more knowledgeable than me about it...thanks for the info!:tiphat:


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## KenOC

Beethoven was on a German-language kick about this time, lasting through his "Hammerklavier" sonata Op. 106. He used German tempo and expression markings in his sonatas, though not exclusively, up to but not including the Op. 106.


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## Schumann

Piano Sonata #7 In D, Op. 10/3 & Piano Sonata #11 In B Flat, Op. 22 are one of my favorites as well especially their second movements!


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## TurnaboutVox

I know this cycle better than any other musical works having discovered them at a tender age and having kept on listening.

I voted for Op. 101 because it has always been my favourite (I do see it as a fully fledged late period work, though, KenOC, a bit like the 'cello sonatas of Op. 102 but not the final violin duo sonata Op. 96) and Op. 109 and 111 for their ethereal beauty and brooding introspection respectively.

Other favourites are Op. 7, Op. 10/3, Op. 22, 26 & 28; all three of the Op 31 set and Op. 81a


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## Forte

I chose Op. 106, 109, and 111. It's really quite difficult to make a decision though, I'd much rather have all the others on that list exist than only these three if I had to pick.


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## Couac Addict

Hammerklavier. If only because it offers the opportunity to watch pianists torture themselves.
Whatever happened to short minor-key adagios? I guess Ludwig skipped class during _Sonata 101_


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## Itullian

Les Adieux, Pastoral, Appassionata


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## clavichorder

I've been listening to op 2 no. 2 lately, and have been really enjoying the feel of that piece. Its very eccentric.


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## Ukko

Michelangeli recorded at least two wonderful performances of Op.2/3, one in Italy in the early 1940s, one in Argentina in 1949.


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## Vaneyes

Ukko said:


> Michelangeli recorded at least two wonderful performances of Op.2/3, one in Italy in the early 1940s, one in Argentina in 1949.


ABM discography...

http://www.andrewfwilson.co.uk/abm1.htm#beethoven


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## LancsMan

Well I've got to go for Op. 101, 109 and 111, particularly the last movement. I respect Op 106 rather than loving it. I also have a soft spot for Op. 54 and Op. 78 - both quite modest works but very subtle to my untrained ear.


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## Lord Lance

My favorite is by far, Hammerklavier. Its thunderous start and complex structure all make for a masterpiece. Second, Waldstein, because of its mesmerizing melody and third, Moonlight, cliched choice but still one of my favorite compositions of all time.


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## chrisco97

*At the moment, my three favourites are:*

*Moonlight* - I do not care how overplayed or how obvious this is for a favourite, I love this sonata. The first movement is so hauntingly beautiful and I LOVE the final movement. One of my goals as a pianist is to know how to play this movement one day.

*Waldstein* - I love how fun this sonata is. Has always been a favourite of mine.

*No. 32* - Breathtakingly beautiful. One of the few solo piano pieces that send chills all over. One of my favourite Beethoven pieces.

Another favourite at the moment is the *Pathetique*, but I left it out of my vote to stay with the two or three choice limit given by the OP.


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## jani

Pathetique,Appasionata and Moonlight.

Pathetique is demonstration of his rebelious spirit, the first chord of the sonata already gives me shivers.
Also when the tempo changes faster after the intro i get the feeling that " i am coming and no one is gonna stop me".
It also sounds very majastetic.

Moonlight, the first movement creates a magical atmosphere with its use of pedals and arpeggios, on the second movement we hear some joy but with sad undertone. In the third movement i get the feeling that its a struggle of him leaving something behind on his life and continue on and at the end he accepts that he has to do it.

Appasionata sounds like a big struggle for me, specially the third movement.


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## DebussyDoesDallas

The final trilogy all the way, any day.

Also voted for Pastoral (Especially love Gould here) and Pathetique (everybody _except_ Gould)


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## guy

Problem: You didn't include my 2nd favourite sonata.


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## Rachmanijohn

Op.109 is one of the most spiritually beautiful pieces he ever wrote. I also voted for _Appassionata_ because I love the drama and it's the first sonata I ever performed. Sentimental value, if you will.


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## csacks

Pathetique, Moonlight and Appassionata for me. I must declare myself a victim of marketing, but those are my favorites, what can I do. I promise that I have done a effort with the last group, but I still can not get them. Possible some guided audition might help.
Arrau (I am chilean, sorry about the bias), Brendel and Serkin are my favorites.
I have just bought Barenboim´s cycle and I am enjoying it very much.


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## Bas

The Tempest sonata, the last three sonatas and if I have to choose my favourite one it is no. 32 (but really all of them are good music.)


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## julianoq

I voted on sonatas 21, 23 and 29 a few months ago. At this moment, my three favorites are the 30, 31 and 32. Oh well.

Anyway, if I need to choose only one it is the No. 30 op 109, it is by far my favorite. The variations in the third movement never fails to amaze me.


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## lupinix

hammerklavier


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## HaydnBearstheClock

I think 'Das Lebewohl' is my favourite so far - very lyrical, with nice contrasts and a wonderful finale.


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## BillT

Op. 109, especially the Variations movement. But so many are so wonderful!


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## hpowders

My favorites are the Opus 2, A Major, Opus 101 A Major, Opus 106 B Flat Major and Opus 111, C minor.


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## violadude

Tristan said:


> My personal favorite is #24 in F-sharp major "A Therese".


You're in good company. That was Beethoven's favorite.


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## Skilmarilion

hpowders said:


> My favorites are the Opus 2, A Major, Opus 101 A Major, Opus 106 B Flat Major and Opus 111, C minor.


Am I the only one who doesn't know the sonatas by opus number, lol?

I'm keen on 1, 17, 23 and the late sonatas, among many others -- but 21 still steals the show for me.


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## hpowders

Skilmarilion said:


> Am I the only one who doesn't know the sonatas by opus number, lol?
> 
> I'm keen on 1, 17, 23 and the late sonatas, among many others -- but 21 still steals the show for me.


Yeah, but I don't know my license plate number.


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## Peter Gibaloff

You got them all 

Opus 13: No. 8 in C minor 'Pathétique' (1798)

Opus 26: No. 12 in A-flat major 'Funeral March' (1801)

Opus 27 #2: No. 14 in C-sharp minor 'Moonlight' (1801)


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## EdwardBast

Skilmarilion said:


> Am I the only one who doesn't know the sonatas by opus number, lol?
> 
> I'm keen on 1, 17, 23 and the late sonatas, among many others -- but 21 still steals the show for me.


I know this is way late, however: Yes, you are the only one  If you want people to know immediately what your are talking about, use the opus number and or nickname. Virtually no one knows them by number.


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## wolfango

From 29 to 32, in my opinion the best music for piano.


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## DiesIraeCX

wolfango said:


> From 29 to 32, in my opinion the best music for piano.


Include #28 and I agree completely!


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## hpowders

Number 2 in A Major is seriously underrated. It is one of my favorite Beethoven keyboard sonatas and of course I prefer it performed on a replica of a Broadwood fortepiano.


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## Skilmarilion

EdwardBast said:


> I know this is way late, however: Yes, you are the only one  If you want people to know immediately what your are talking about, use the opus number and or nickname. Virtually no one knows them by number.


I guess I've just never understood why works can sometimes be referred to only using opus (or equivalent) numbers. To me it's quite irrelevant where a work positions in a composers entire oeuvre. Besides, with most other composers this isn't the case -- it seems like Mozart piano concertos and Beethoven sonatas / quartets get this treatment the most.


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## tortkis

I also don't remember the opus number of every sonata  but I can understand its merit: an opus number is always unique. Sequential numbers sometimes change. (For instance, Schubert's symphony No. 7/8.)

I voted for No. 30, Opus 109 (my favorite) & No. 32, Opus 111. I love Opus 2 No.1, too. The opening is magical.


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## Triplets

hpowders said:


> Number 2 in A Major is seriously underrated. It is one of my favorite Beethoven keyboard sonatas and of course I prefer it performed on a replica of a Broadwood fortepiano.


 I just ordered Annie Fischer's complete cycle. She plays the hell out of that piece on a good old inauthentic Bosendorfer. It should be required listening for all fortepianists. After hearing that, they will ask their parents to buy them a real Piano when they grow up!:devil:


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## Albert7

Hammerklavier and late piano sonatas are my favorites.


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## Dave Whitmore

I'm working my way through his sonatas now. I've just finished listening to number 5. So far his 1st sonata is my favourite. It's going to be hard to pick a fave after working through all of them. There's a LOT of great music here!


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## hpowders

Dave Whitmore said:


> I'm working my way through his sonatas now. I've just finished listening to number 5. So far his 1st sonata is my favourite. It's going to be hard to pick a fave after working through all of them. There's a LOT of great music here!


Listen to all 32, one at a time. So many humorous touches. The guy was such an incredible genius.

All 32 are terrific!


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## Skilmarilion

Dave Whitmore said:


> I'm working my way through his sonatas now. I've just finished listening to number 5.


The finale of #5 is good fun. :tiphat:


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## Blancrocher

When I want to hear Sviatoslav Richter try to break something, I often listen to #3 or #23.


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## Dave Whitmore

hpowders said:


> Listen to all 32, one at a time. So many humorous touches. The guy was such an incredible genius.
> 
> All 32 are terrific!


That's what I plan to do. I'm really into piano music right now.


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## Blancrocher

Dave Whitmore said:


> That's what I plan to do. I'm really into piano music right now.


Don't forget Beethoven's other piano music as well, by the way. Some enjoy the Diabelli Variations as much as anything he wrote. I'm also extremely fond of his 32 Variations in C minor, Bagatelles, and the seldom-mentioned but extraordinary Fantasy in G minor. There are other gems here and there--just follow the great pianists where they lead!

Gould in the 32 Variations: 




Serkin in the Fantasy:


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## KenOC

Blancrocher said:


> Don't forget Beethoven's other piano music as well, by the way. Some enjoy the Diabelli Variations as much as anything he wrote. I'm also extremely fond of his 32 Variations in C minor...


Lots of people don't know the 32 Variations, maybe because Beethoven evidently didn't think they were worth an opus number. Even though they were very popular, he spoke slightingly of them. Walking with a friend on a Vienna street, he heard them being played in a nearby home: "Did I write that? Oh Beethoven, what an *** you were!"

Or so it's said. Formally, they're Beethoven's only chaconne. This was noted at the time. From a contemporary and very favorable review: "In this work, B. follows the oldest and particularly German manner of writing variations more than the manner prevalent today. Handel wrote variations in this manner..."


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## Mandryka

KenOC said:


> Lots of people don't know the 32 Variations, maybe because Beethoven evidently didn't think they were worth an opus number. Even though they were very popular, he spoke slightingly of them. Walking with a friend on a Vienna street, he heard them being played in a nearby home: "Did I write that? Oh Beethoven, what an *** you were!"
> 
> Or so it's said. Formally, they're Beethoven's only chaconne. This was noted at the time. From a contemporary and very favorable review: "In this work, B. follows the oldest and particularly German manner of writing variations more than the manner prevalent today. Handel wrote variations in this manner..."


It's interesting that the reviewer picks Handel when there are a whole bunch of other composers who wrote chaconnes, German ones. I wonder why.

What was the review a review of -- a performance or a publication?


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## Steve Wright

*Results?*

So, did you come to a winner? Or is the poll still open.
I'd be very interested to see results as I am just beginning my Sonata journey and would love a few recommendations. Only know (and love) Waldstein so far.
Thanks!

Steve


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## hpowders

I love all 32 and play the Annie Fischer cycle complete at least twice a year.


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## trazom

I would've voted for #7, 9, and 11 if they were available, so i voted for #12, 26, and ...oh I forgot the last one I voted for. I'm a bit surprised at the lack of enthusiasm for The Hunt, and Les Adieux.


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## 20centrfuge

kv466 said:


> The favorite I most often go back to is on the list (no.18) my other e-flat favorite is, sadly, not. The 13.


I'm glad I'm not the only one. No 18 is fantastic!


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## martrepuS

Pathetique and Waldstein


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## dwindladwayne

Op. 111, the less sonata of all sonatas.


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## MoonlightSonata

The temptation here is to say "I voted for Beethoven".


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## solkorset

KenOC said:


> Quite a legacy here. Choose from 15 of his most popular. Which two or three are your especial favorites?


I refuse to answer because you left out my favourite sonata: No. 27 in E minor, Op. 90.


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## DavidA

Why do we have to choose? I've got them all on disc several times over!


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## isorhythm

If I'm allowed three, I choose opp 101, 109 and 110.


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## Abraham Lincoln

I choose the Pathetique. Disgusting Touhou fan, I am.


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## Laraine

KenOC said:


> I can't see that Gould recorded it, but if he did I'm sure the results were...uh...interesting.


I'm sorry, but your diplomacy set me laughing. I've never heard Gould's Beethoven but I once heard him playing a Mozart sonata. I can't remember which sonata it was but I found it excruciating. Some weeks later a listener asked Concert to play the same sonata (because she was studying it for her exams) and she specifically asked them not to play Gould's performance. And now I'm off to see just how interesting Gould's Beethoven is. ;-)


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## KenOC

Gould's Beethoven -- well, it generally puts me off my feed. Oddly enough, he absolutely nails one work, one movement -- the slow movement of the Hammerklavier. You coulda knocked me over with a cassowary. (I think his Op. 28 isn't bad either.)


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## Mandryka

Laraine said:


> I'm sorry, but your diplomacy set me laughing. I've never heard Gould's Beethoven but I once heard him playing a Mozart sonata. I can't remember which sonata it was but I found it excruciating. Some weeks later a listener asked Concert to play the same sonata (because she was studying it for her exams) and she specifically asked them not to play Gould's performance. And now I'm off to see just how interesting Gould's Beethoven is. ;-)


I think you will enjoy the humour in op 2 and op 10 - I'm very keen on what he does with the early music. Some late music too - especially the last bagatelles.


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## DiesIraeCX

My top five happen to be the final five sonatas: Ops. 101, 106, 109, 110, and 111 (not in that order)


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## Manxfeeder

Only three? Opus 106, 111, and 8. There's something spiritual I get from those three.


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## Scififan

I voted for _The Tempest_ particularly as played by Kempff in his Fifties mono set.


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## TurnaboutVox

isorhythm said:


> If I'm allowed three, I choose opp 101, 109 and 110.


Correct apart from your typo - it's "111", not "110"


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## Ukko

solkorset said:


> I refuse to answer because you left out my favourite sonata: No. 27 in E minor, Op. 90.


If one wishes to spend some time with all of the 'late' sonatas by listening to them in numerical order, one should begin with Op. 90, which is 'the beginning of the end'.

This even if your mind works like mine (for your sake I hope not), where Op. 106 arrives at the ultimate conclusion - and the last three are glorious afterthoughts.


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## TurnaboutVox

Ukko said:


> If one wishes to spend some time with all of the 'late' sonatas by listening to them in numerical order, one should begin with Op. 90, which is 'the beginning of the end'.
> 
> This even if your mind works like mine (for your sake I hope not), where Op. 106 arrives at the ultimate conclusion - and the last three are glorious afterthoughts.


My take is that Op. 106 is a giant musical experiment, and Op. 109, 110 and 111 are the refined end-products of the master's research, Ukko!

Op. 101, I don't know: is it truly a product of Beethoven's final period or a result of the increasingly lyrical direction he was taking prior to that (Op. 90, the Op. 96 violin duo sonata and the Op. 97 piano trio for three good examples) or a fusion of both? It is lovely, and my favourite of all Beethoven's works.


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## chesapeake bay

TurnaboutVox said:


> Op. 101, I don't know: is it truly a product of Beethoven's final period or a result of the increasingly lyrical direction he was taking prior to that (Op. 90, the Op. 96 violin duo sonata and the Op. 97 piano trio for three good examples) or a fusion of both? It is lovely, and my favourite of all Beethoven's works.


I haven't listened to op. 101 in a while, and in listening again, I think I would agree on all counts, it is lovely, lyrical and the beginning of the end


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## Ukko

TurnaboutVox said:


> My take is that Op. 106 is a giant musical experiment, and Op. 109, 110 and 111 are the refined end-products of the master's research, Ukko!
> 
> Op. 101, I don't know: is it truly a product of Beethoven's final period or a result of the increasingly lyrical direction he was taking prior to that (Op. 90, the Op. 96 violin duo sonata and the Op. 97 piano trio for three good examples) or a fusion of both? It is lovely, and my favourite of all Beethoven's works.


It seems to support my delusion (that I have some idea about what Beethoven was doing) if I separate the solo piano sonatas from the rest of his output. What he did with the other forces become other trains on different tracks. So... Op. 90 is significantly different from the piano sonatas that precede it, not so different from those that come after it - until 'the elephant in the room', Op. 106.

I agree with your take that Op. 106 is 'a giant music experiment', but I think the work contains the 'end product' of the experiment; he got where he was trying to go. The last three sonatas are expressions of that _apotheosis_ (possibly mangling the meaning of that word).


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## EdwardBast

Ukko said:


> It seems to support my delusion (that I have some idea about what Beethoven was doing) if I separate the solo piano sonatas from the rest of his output. What he did with the other forces become other trains on different tracks. So... Op. 90 is significantly different from the piano sonatas that precede it, not so different from those that come after it - until 'the elephant in the room', Op. 106.
> 
> I agree with your take that Op. 106 is 'a giant music experiment', but I think the work contains the 'end product' of the experiment; he got where he was trying to go. The last three sonatas are expressions of that _apotheosis_ (possibly mangling the meaning of that word).


I share your delusion. I always thought the piano sonatas were the purest channel for the composer's voice and that they were always on a different track and always ahead of his works for other forces. So we get something like the _Largo e mesto_ in Op. 10 no. 3, chronologically an early work but from another world entirely. And then Op. 31 no. 2 as the first fully middle period work(?). Op. 90 sounds "late" to me as well.


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## Ukko

EdwardBast said:


> I share your delusion. I always thought the piano sonatas were the purest channel for the composer's voice and that they were always on a different track and always ahead of his works for other forces. So we get something like the _Largo e mesto_ in Op. 10 no. 3, chronologically an early work but from another world entirely. And then Op. 31 no. 2 as the first fully middle period work(?). Op. 90 sounds "late" to me as well.


Well, at least I am not alone . Now I will stretch credibility further and suggest that the 9th Symphony leads to another expression of the apotheosis that occurred in Op. 106 in the last bars of the slow movement and the finale. It took awhile for Beethoven to create for the expanded forces.


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## sam93

My favourites are both C minor Sonatas and the Appassionata. An honourable mention to Moonlight though.


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## arnerich

I think op 101 is his most underrated and would probably be any other composer's greatest sonata. But my vote goes for op 109.


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## Pugg

I voted : Opus 28: No. 15 in D major 'Pastoral' /Opus 31 #3: No. 18 in E-flat major 'The Hunt' 
Opus 53: No. 21 in C major 'Waldstein' .


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## KenOC

arnerich said:


> I think op 101 is his most underrated and would probably be any other composer's greatest sonata. But my vote goes for op 109.


Beethoven spoke of the Op. 101 with some amusement. In a letter to the publisher Steiner, he proposed calling the work "The Difficult-to-play Sonata" and added: "For what is difficult is also beautiful, good, great, etc. Hence everyone will realize that this is the most lavish praise that can be given, since what is difficult makes one sweat."


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## arnerich

KenOC said:


> Beethoven spoke of the Op. 101 with some amusement. In a letter to the publisher Steiner, he proposed calling the work "The Difficult-to-play Sonata" and added: "For what is difficult is also beautiful, good, great, etc. Hence everyone will realize that this is the most lavish praise that can be given, since what is difficult makes one sweat."


Correct me if I'm wrong but I think I read this was the ONLY sonata ever to be performed publicly during Beethoven's life and it was by an amateur pianist/banker...

This piece of info is on wikipedia's article about op 101 but the source is "Joseph Braunstein, Liner notes to the Michael Ponti recording of Clara Schumann's Piano Concerto in A minor, Op. 7" which seems strange... Can anyone shed light on this?


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## KenOC

arnerich said:


> Correct me if I'm wrong but I think I read this was the ONLY sonata ever to be performed publicly during Beethoven's life and it was by an amateur pianist/banker...


 An interesting question -- Beethoven's sonatas were performed in private salons and similar informal settings, but the idea of a public recital was barely thought of before the 1830s. I seem to remember reading the same of the Op. 101, and also that the Hammerklavier was performed publically by Czerny, though I don't have the source at hand. Did he sell tickets? Were there early-day scalpers? IMWTK!


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## isorhythm

I wouldn't have singled out Op. 101 as difficult to play compared to the other late sonatas, I wonder why he thought so? I mean it's difficult enough but it's not the Hammerklavier.


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## KenOC

isorhythm said:


> I wouldn't have singled out Op. 101 as difficult to play compared to the other late sonatas, I wonder why he thought so? I mean it's difficult enough but it's not the Hammerklavier.


I'm not sure, but the "difficult to play" remark may have had to do with a running joke. Supposedly a critic had remarked that the Symphony No. 7, from four years earlier and also in A major, was difficult to play. So it could have been just some back and forth joking about that connection.

Also, most of Beethoven's piano sonatas were thought difficult to play, which is often commented on in reviews of the time. They were sold as sheet music, and the buying audience were not professional pianists but home-bred amateurs. Anybody who has tried to play these sonatas, almost any of them, will have a lot of respect for the Viennese amateurs!


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## Pat Fairlea

arnerich said:


> I think op 101 is his most underrated and would probably be any other composer's greatest sonata. But my vote goes for op 109.


I completely agree with you regarding Op101 (currently playing in background, courtesy of Mr Brendel). It's a remarkably taut, coherent piece that runs the gamut of human emotion without once straying into maudlin or obvious. The Adagio 3rd movement is simply beautiful then the 1st movement 1st subject comes back as a bridge into a final Allegro that seems firmly rooted in the Classical tradition until it takes the theme for a walk in fascinating and innovative ways. Great stuff.

I would put in a word of support for Op110 as well, especially the outer movements.


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## chromatic owl

Where are the 'Tempest' fans? Also, I'm missing the fourth sonata.


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## hpowders

In real time, I still love the Sonata No. 22 in F Major, Opus 54; Beethoven at his wacky, quirky best, ESPECIALLY as performed by Sviatoslav Richter as the filler to his recording with Charles Munch/BSO of the Beethoven First Piano Concerto.


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## Tchaikov6

I voted for Waldstein, Appassionata, and Hammerklavier. Not just my three favorite Beethoven sonatas, but among my top 10 solo piano works as well.


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## EdwardBast

hpowders said:


> In real time, I still love the Sonata No. 22 in F Major, Opus 54; Beethoven at his wacky, quirky best, ESPECIALLY as performed by Sviatoslav Richter as the filler to his recording with Charles Munch/BSO of the Beethoven First Piano Concerto.


Yes, Op. 54 is wonderful! That and the ones on either side, "Waldstein" and "Appassionata," are my favorite run of three.


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## Brahmsian Colors

None of my favorites are listed here: Nos. 24 ("A Therese"), 13 and 20.


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## Jacred

Ahhh, so hard to choose! We need a poll for most painful polls. 

I went with the "Appassionata," Opus 109, and the "Pathétique." Could have put anything from the "Hammerklavier" onwards though.


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## Bettina

Jacred said:


> *Ahhh, so hard to choose!* We need a poll for most painful polls.
> 
> I went with the "Appassionata," Opus 109, and the "Pathétique." Could have put anything from the "Hammerklavier" onwards though.


That's exactly why I haven't voted in this poll - it's too hard to choose. For this particular poll, I plead the fifth (da-da-da-DUM!!) :lol:


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## hpowders

Every year I seem to play the Beethoven 32 at least twice, and truthfully, my favorite sonata is whichever one is being featured on my CD player at that particular moment. There isn't a clinker in the bunch. Annie Fischer is usually my tour guide.


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## hpowders

Bettina said:


> That's exactly why I haven't voted in this poll - it's too hard to choose. For this particular poll, I plead the fifth (*da-da-da-DUM!!)* :lol:


Yes. The opening fanfare of Mahler's Fifth Symphony.


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## hpowders

EdwardBast said:


> Yes, Op. 54 is wonderful! That and the ones on either side, "Waldstein" and "Appassionata," are my favorite run of three.


To compose Op. 54, Beethoven had to be high on something! What a wacky sonata!


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## Bettina

hpowders said:


> To compose Op. 54, Beethoven had to be high on something! What a wacky sonata!


He was probably high on his beloved 60 beans of coffee!


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## hpowders

Bettina said:


> He was probably high on his beloved 60 beans of coffee!


I would think the 60 beans made a pot for the entire day....not for one cup.


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## Pugg

Bettina said:


> That's exactly why I haven't voted in this poll - it's too hard to choose. For this particular poll, I plead the fifth (da-da-da-DUM!!) :lol:


I am still waiting for this poll Betinna....


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## AfterHours

hpowders said:


> Yes. The opening fanfare of Mahler's Fifth Symphony.


Yes! Tell her hp! :lol:


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## AfterHours

4 selections would've been far more manageable.

Given only 3, I chose:
(1) 32nd
(2) 23rd
(3) 30th

I had to go punch myself in the face for leaving the 29th out of my selections. Yes I know what you're thinking: not enough punishment.

It went a lot like this:


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## ibrahim

The last three have been an obsession of mine these past few years. But I can't really declare a favorite! (I did vote though!)

Regarding the opus 101, the fugal development section of the finale is peak Beethoven. It reminds me of the fugato section of the 1st movement of the 9th.


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## Pugg

ibrahim said:


> The last three have been an obsession of mine these past few years. But I can't really declare a favorite! (I did vote though!)
> 
> Regarding the opus 101, the fugal development section of the finale is peak Beethoven. It reminds me of the fugato section of the 1st movement of the 9th.


Emil Gilels is a master at the piano, wonderful technique.


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## ToneDeaf&Senile

I felt it "safe" to pick the final sonata and the Hammerklavier. Beyond that it depends on which sonatas I am must hooked on at any given moment. For instance, I've lately listened to Pollini's recording of No.11 Op.22 (which can be heard at YouTube) over and over again, and it's not even in the poll! Brautigam (the set I own) does fine by it too. (YouTube also houses Brautigam's performance of the finale movement of the Hammerklavier, which is well worth checking out.)


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## arapinho1

I chose 8, 14, 21 and 23. I don't know others that well. That will have to change


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## SanAntone

I voted for the opp. 13-81 sonatas (although the ones listed would not my exact choices). The late works have never appealed to me. IMO, Beethoven became insufferable late in his career. I know many people will consider that opinion mauvais goût - but I am well beyond caring what others think of my opinions.


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## golfer72

Id have to say the last three are my favorite three


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## mollig

The last three, Appassionata, Waldstein, in category A.
Moonlight, Sturm not too far behind.

Never cared much for the Adieux, and Hammerklavier is too monumental for my tastes.


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## Waehnen

These are the best piano sonatas I know:

*Opus 28: No. 15 in D major 'Pastoral' (1801)
Opus 53: No. 21 in C major 'Waldstein' (1803)
Opus 101: No. 28 in A major (1816)
Opus 109: No. 30 in E major (1820)*

I kinda like major key sonatas, minor key Sturm und Drang is not my thing, I suppose.

After these comes some late Schubert and 1 Liszt Sonata.


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## caters

My top 3 favorites would be Pathetique, Appassionata, and Waldstein, in that order. But I love every single sonata that Beethoven wrote, all 32 are great and I plan on orchestrating them starting with the first sonata.


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