# Mozart's Late Symphonies vs. Sibelius's Symphonic Cycle



## neoshredder (Nov 7, 2011)

Tough choice for me. Love both. Going with Sibelius by a hair.


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## TwoFlutesOneTrumpet (Aug 31, 2011)

Very tough choice for me as well. The Sibelius symphonies are probably my 2nd favorite set after Beethoven's (yes, over Mahler's and Brahms' at this time). But there is something magical about the late Mozart symphonies too (we're talking 35-41, right? but even 38-41 will do for this discussion) that I find needing to go back to regularly. 

Sibelius for me too but it wasn't easy.


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## neoshredder (Nov 7, 2011)

I didn't specify. Pick your top 7 of the last 10 I guess.


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## starthrower (Dec 11, 2010)

I'll go with Nielsen.


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## Strange Magic (Sep 14, 2015)

Tough to choose. Mozart's Final Four would make the reputation as a symphonist of any composer, but I voted the two composers equal. But Brahms....now that's another story.


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## Art Rock (Nov 28, 2009)

After Mahler, Sibelius, Shostakovich, Bruckner and Brahms are my favourite symphonists. Even against Mozart's collected 41+ symphonies, I'd pick Sibelius.


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## Heck148 (Oct 27, 2016)

Can't chose, and wouldn't dream of choosing one over the other...both great, both wonderful contributions to symphonic repertoire. 
All great to perform, to listen to, to study.


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## Manxfeeder (Oct 19, 2010)

I'd say equally great. Mozart was great for his time and Sibelius was great for his.


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## sbmonty (Jan 11, 2014)

Both are wonderful, I do listen to Sibelius more often, by quite a margin.


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## Haydn man (Jan 25, 2014)

Sibelius is great but Mozart is sublime 
No contest


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## hpowders (Dec 23, 2013)

Going with Mozart by a comb.


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## Bettina (Sep 29, 2016)

Mozart. I enjoy the way that he played with expectations (such as tricking the listener into thinking that a cadence is coming, and then backing off). Mozart was such a tease and I love it!


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## jdec (Mar 23, 2013)

Mozart. 

Haydn's vs. Sibelius's? then Sibelius's.


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## hpowders (Dec 23, 2013)

Not so fast!! Haydn vs. Sibelius? EVEN LESS for Sibelius.


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## jdec (Mar 23, 2013)

Well, I like a dozen or so of Haydn's late symphonies, but I like Sibelius's even more (especially the 2nd, 4th, 5th, 6th and 7th), and I definitely consider Mozart's late symphonies superior to Haydn's. But that's me .


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## Pugg (Aug 8, 2014)

Haydn man said:


> Sibelius is great but Mozart is sublime
> No contest


I second this wise words.


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## Pugg (Aug 8, 2014)

jdec said:


> Mozart.
> 
> Haydn's vs. Sibelius's? then Sibelius's.


The are bot great in their own way.


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## Retrograde Inversion (Nov 27, 2016)

What's with all these increasingly random "vs." polls? What next, Josquin "vs." Poulenc? Buxtehude "vs." Villa-Lobos? Offenbach "vs." Tippett? 

How can we make any useful comparison between such disparate styles and musical personalities, between people who lived in quite different times and places? 

These kinds of threads seem rather pointless to me.

Also: Callas. 100%. EVERY TIME


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## Pugg (Aug 8, 2014)

Retrograde Inversion said:


> What's with all these increasingly random "vs." polls? What next, Josquin "vs." Poulenc? Buxtehude "vs." Villa-Lobos? Offenbach "vs." Tippett?
> 
> How can we make any useful comparison between such disparate styles and musical personalities, between people who lived in quite different times and places?
> 
> ...


That's called one track mind .


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## mmsbls (Mar 6, 2011)

Retrograde Inversion said:


> What's with all these increasingly random "vs." polls? What next, Josquin "vs." Poulenc? Buxtehude "vs." Villa-Lobos? Offenbach "vs." Tippett?
> 
> How can we make any useful comparison between such disparate styles and musical personalities, between people who lived in quite different times and places?
> 
> ...


I think there can be confusion between polls that ask which is greater/better and polls that ask which do you prefer. Determining the greatness of works or composers is extraordinarily difficult in part because there's no clear definition of great. But determining which work or composer one prefers can be relatively straightforward.

I generally assume these polls are asking which we prefer. Usually for me that is rather easy. For example, without much thought I would answer your hypothetical questions above with Josquin, Villa-Lobos, and Tippett. Preferences can be easily determined (at least for some people) for things that have much less in common than composers' works. I would choose basketball over carrots, geometry over bowling, and reading over traveling. Some choices might be more difficult, but not because the choices are not closely related.

Perhaps these polls seem pointless to you, but for those who have little difficulty in choosing favorites, they are often fun and can be interesting.


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## jdec (Mar 23, 2013)

Pugg said:


> The are bot great in their own way.


Agree.

........


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## neoshredder (Nov 7, 2011)

Retrograde Inversion said:


> What's with all these increasingly random "vs." polls? What next, Josquin "vs." Poulenc? Buxtehude "vs." Villa-Lobos? Offenbach "vs." Tippett?
> 
> How can we make any useful comparison between such disparate styles and musical personalities, between people who lived in quite different times and places?
> 
> ...


Both are very accessible works. Strong melodies and moody. The length of Mozart's late Symphonies are also similar in length to Sibelius. So yeah there was a method to my madness. Lol


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## silentio (Nov 10, 2014)

mmsbls said:


> I think there can be confusion between polls that ask which is greater/better and polls that ask which do you prefer. Determining the greatness of works or composers is extraordinarily difficult in part because there's no clear definition of great. But determining which work or composer one prefers can be relatively straightforward.
> 
> I generally assume these polls are asking which we prefer. Usually for me that is rather easy. For example, without much thought I would answer your hypothetical questions above with Josquin, Villa-Lobos, and Tippett. Preferences can be easily determined (at least for some people) for things that have much less in common than composers' works. I would choose basketball over carrots, geometry over bowling, and reading over traveling. Some choices might be more difficult, but not because the choices are not closely related.
> 
> Perhaps these polls seem pointless to you, but for those who have little difficulty in choosing favorites, they are often fun and can be interesting.


Josquin, Josquin, Josquin. I pick Josquin over anyone.


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## EdwardBast (Nov 25, 2013)

mmsbls said:


> I generally assume these polls are asking which we prefer.


I generally do too - unless, as in this case, the word great appears in the poll choices.


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## mmsbls (Mar 6, 2011)

EdwardBast said:


> I generally do too - unless, as in this case, the word great appears in the poll choices.


Good point. I didn't see that answer. I guess I still prefer to give my preferences rather than try to deal with the question of greatness.


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## neoshredder (Nov 7, 2011)

Mozart with a monster comeback. I thought Sibelius would win early on.


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## Pugg (Aug 8, 2014)

neoshredder said:


> Mozart with a monster comeback. I thought Sibelius would win early on.


Do not count your chickens yet......


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## PlaySalieri (Jun 3, 2012)

I read somewhere once that in a century from now - the great symphonists of the 19th will be largely forgotten - and Mozart's last great symphonies will still be there.

Eternal works for all times.


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## Border Collie (Mar 9, 2016)

Mozart's symphonies are not, of his major orchestral work, my favourites. He is one of the true greats of music, no question. But if I had to choose a pack of 7 symphonies to accompany me to a desert island it would be Sibelius. Beethoven as an alternative.

Now, Piano Concertos, that would be Mozart. Against anyone and everyone.


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## jim prideaux (May 30, 2013)

Sibelius.......I understand how great Mozart's symphonies are but there is something about Sibelius' 7 symphonies that ensures they will always have a central place in my life long experience of music....


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## satoru (May 29, 2014)

I interpreted "vs" as personal liking, so I picked Sibelius here. Depends on how the "vs" is defined, the answer could be different. Mozart's late symphonies are great, no question about that. Just I like Sibelius better (especially later ones) for their tone, color, etc, which Mozart was limited by the time. Nice to see many other Sibelius lovers lurking around


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## PeterF (Apr 17, 2014)

For me this is very easy. Though I very much like the Sibelius symphonies, I love Mozart's late symphonies. So Mozart is my definite first choice.


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## chalkpie (Oct 5, 2011)

Sibelius for the WIN!


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## hpowders (Dec 23, 2013)

Mozart and Sibelius couldn't have been more different or incomparable.


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## pcnog11 (Nov 14, 2016)

Again, they are apples and oranges. Hard to compare. Mozart got my vote.


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## TwoFlutesOneTrumpet (Aug 31, 2011)

pcnog11 said:


> Again, they are apples and oranges. Hard to compare. Mozart got my vote.


Why are apples and oranges hard to compare? They are both fruit! Which fruit do you like better? See, easy


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## Pugg (Aug 8, 2014)

chalkpie said:


> Sibelius for the WIN!


Nope, same amount of votes, so we add the people's vote Mozart wins.


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## TwoFlutesOneTrumpet (Aug 31, 2011)

We need a tie breaker. Additional pieces to consider:

Sibelius symphonies + violin concerto 

vs

Mozart late symphonies + piano concerto #20


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## Pugg (Aug 8, 2014)

TwoFlutesOneTrumpet said:


> We need a tie breaker. Additional pieces to consider:
> 
> Sibelius symphonies + violin concerto
> 
> ...


I suggest you make a new poll.


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## gouts (Jan 19, 2017)

Mozart all the way. I love the way his musical style really matured in those late symphonies (39th is my favourite by the way)


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## Vaneyes (May 11, 2010)

Depends on the day.


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## TwoFlutesOneTrumpet (Aug 31, 2011)

Pugg said:


> I suggest you make a new poll.


You do it. You're closer


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## Pugg (Aug 8, 2014)

TwoFlutesOneTrumpet said:


> You do it. You're closer


No need to, Mozart's leading again.


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## TwoFlutesOneTrumpet (Aug 31, 2011)

Pugg said:


> No need to, Mozart's leading again.


Votes are favorable because it's Mozart's birthday today.


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