# Brandenburg Concerti



## Notung (Jun 12, 2013)

Does anyone know how much improvisation there should or should not be in any given concerto?

I have the Alessandrini, and was wondering how much he improvised.


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## Marisol (May 25, 2013)

I assume you mean for the harpsichord player only and not the whole orchestra.

Nobody really knows. Personally I do not like too much 'tinkering' during the continuo parts. For instance Ton Koopman does that all the time.

Alessandrini? I looked at this video of the first part of the 5th and I did not notice any extensive improvisation. What I did notice is how relaxed he and the orchestra played!






And sometimes we are lucky and there is an alternative version, for instance listen to this recording by Hogwood and the AAM using an alternative version:






Notice the differences?


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## Notung (Jun 12, 2013)

I think I'm hearing the harpsichord more pronounced in the latter. Hearing notes that I didn't here with Alessandrini.


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## Notung (Jun 12, 2013)

Is this "alternate version" another version of the piece by Bach? Or are the differences and alterations done by Hogwood?


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## Notung (Jun 12, 2013)

Thanks a lot! Big help in better understanding these pieces.


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## Marisol (May 25, 2013)

Notung said:


> Is this "alternate version" another version of the piece by Bach? Or are the differences and alterations done by Hogwood?


It is an older survived version by Bach.

Here is a demonstration of Koopman's excessive (at least in my opinion) tinkering:

Move the timer to 1:01:37 for the start of the 5th and listen to the harpsichord in the continuo parts:


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## Marisol (May 25, 2013)

Now as a contrast listen to this rendition by one of the pioneers of HIP. Technically certainly not perfect but notice how much the music 'breathes' and 'talks', it has a kind of majestic feeling:





And now a more 'modern' interpretation of HIP, fast and rhythmic:





And this is before HIP:





The vibrato here is killing me.


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## pluhagr (Jan 2, 2012)

The amount of rubato and tinkering is very interesting to me when considering Baraque music. One of the things that is interesting is that we have no clue how the music was actually performed. I do think that there are different ways of approaching baroque music. There can be the historically informed performance where there is research done to find out how the music would have been played. Then there is music performed in the style of a different musical movement. One example would be Bach being played a la Chopin. While to me it is horrible to hear Bach played in the manner of Chopin many do enjoy this. And this is what makes music so interesting the fact that the performer and conductor has an interpretive license. 
I would personally look to Glenn Gould as I believe he has the mos authentic sound when playing Bach.


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## Marisol (May 25, 2013)

pluhagr said:


> I would personally look to Glenn Gould as I believe he has the mos authentic sound when playing Bach.


I enjoy Gould's solo interpretations of Bach's keyboard music but this piece of ... awfulness ... I find just too painful to listen to.


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## pluhagr (Jan 2, 2012)

Marisol said:


> I enjoy Gould's solo interpretations of Bach's keyboard music but this piece of ... awfulness ... I find just too painful to listen to.


I agree. The recording is awful. Sorry about that.


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