# What would you say are the top best black opera singers of the recording era?



## Baritenor (Dec 13, 2015)

What would you say the top 5 (or more if you want) are?


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## DavidA (Dec 14, 2012)

Price
Verett
Norman
Bumbry
Battle


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## Baritenor (Dec 13, 2015)

DavidA said:


> Price
> Verett
> Norman
> Bumbry
> Battle


Is that from best to worst?


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## Bonetan (Dec 22, 2016)

1. Dylan
2. Dylan
3. Dylan
4. Dylan
5. Dylan

Lol, I just want to see if anyone on TC will get the reference :lol:


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## Tsaraslondon (Nov 7, 2013)

Black singers are still shamefully under-represented in the world of opera, though Marian Anderson, the first African-American artist to appear at the Met, didn't appear there until 1955.

There have been some wonderful singers since then of course, though I see nobody has yet mentioned any of the men - George Shirley, Willard White, Simon Estes, William Warfield, Bruce Hubbard anyone?

Personal favourites of mine would be Shirley Verrett and Barbara Hendricks.


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## Itullian (Aug 27, 2011)

^^^^^^Barbara Hendricks for me too.


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## howlingfantods (Jul 27, 2015)

Arroyo, Maria Ewing, Eric Owens, Reri Grist

Kinda feels weird to rank or compare just because this cohort of singers share an ancestry. That said, I'd take Arroyo and Verrett as the tops in this group.

edited to add--my list above at the top of my post are just notable good singers that hadn't been mentioned yet in this thread, not my top picks. My personal sentiment has Arroyo and Verrett ahead in this cohort, but many of the others mentioned in this thread are very fine singers.


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## Seattleoperafan (Mar 24, 2013)

I never knew Maria Ewing was black. There was a time in the 20th century when many of the most talented opera stars were African American singers. These women were real stars!!!!!!!!! To have made it big they had to be super talented to overcome the prejudice. I think it was because there used to be good school music programs in schools . I think a lot of black students are just not being exposed to opera the way they once were.
Now the only big name black singer I can think of is Larry Brownlee. The first person in this thread to make a list did a great job. I think it is fair to say that in her prime Price was the greatest Verdi soprano of her generation, though Gwynneth Jones might have given her a run for the money if she stayed in Verdi instead of the heavy German roles. Price likely was the most successful moneymaker from her recordings as she had many.


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## Baritenor (Dec 13, 2015)

Seattleoperafan said:


> I never knew Maria Ewing was black. There was a time in the 20th century when many of the most talented opera stars were African American singers. These women were real stars!!!!!!!!! To have made it big they had to be super talented to overcome the prejudice. I think it was because there used to be good school music programs in schools . I think a lot of black students are just not being exposed to opera the way they once were.
> Now the only big name black singer I can think of is Larry Brownlee. The first person in this thread to make a list did a great job. I think it is fair to say that in her prime Price was the greatest Verdi soprano of her generation, though Gwynneth Jones might have given her a run for the money if she stayed in Verdi instead of the heavy German roles. Price likely was the most successful moneymaker from her recordings as she had many.


I've never understood why Price gets more recognition than Verrett who is my favorite soprano and who I think has better musicianship and technique. She also has equally beautiful voice (and in a similar way for that matter).

(I've heard it said that Verrett's foreys in the soprano fach were a mixed bag but that's bull....she was just as amazing in soprano roles as she was in mezzo ones)


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## Don Fatale (Aug 31, 2009)

Oh, there are separate categories for different races are there?


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## howlingfantods (Jul 27, 2015)

Baritenor said:


> I've never understood why Price gets more recognition than Verrett who is my favorite soprano and who I think has better musicianship and technique. She also has equally beautiful voice (and in a similar way for that matter).
> 
> (I've heard it said that Verrett's foreys in the soprano fach were a mixed bag but that's bull....she was just as amazing in soprano roles as she was in mezzo ones)


Price had a much larger recorded legacy. Verrett left RCA over their unwillingness to record her in Carmen so soon after they'd released a Carmen with Price, and I believe she never got another exclusive record contract. Very unfortunate, particularly since Verrett was right--I would rather have had a Verrett Carmen than the Price one we got.

Although I am more fond of Verrett than Price, I disagree with you in this respect--I prefer Verrett's mezzo work since I think the best part of her voice was her sexy, growly chest voice, which you hear much less of in Verrett's soprano roles.


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## Tsaraslondon (Nov 7, 2013)

Baritenor said:


> I've never understood why Price gets more recognition than Verrett who is my favorite soprano and who I think has better musicianship and technique. She also has equally beautiful voice (and in a similar way for that matter).
> 
> (I've heard it said that Verrett's foreys in the soprano fach were a mixed bag but that's bull....she was just as amazing in soprano roles as she was in mezzo ones)


I agree with paragraph 1, but not with paragraph 2. Like Howlingfantods I preferred her as a mezzo. In his memoirs (which were edited after his death by his wife) Walter Legge, who knew a thing or two about singers, was appalled to hear she was moving into soprano repertoire. He thought she was the greatest mezzo before the public at the time and that moving into soprano territory would alter her unique timbre.

I also agree that it is a great shame that she never got to record Carmen, or indeed Amneris and Azucena.


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## Baritenor (Dec 13, 2015)

howlingfantods said:


> Price had a much larger recorded legacy. Verrett left RCA over their unwillingness to record her in Carmen so soon after they'd released a Carmen with Price, and I believe she never got another exclusive record contract. Very unfortunate, particularly since Verrett was right--I would rather have had a Verrett Carmen than the Price one we got.
> 
> Although I am more fond of Verrett than Price, I disagree with you in this respect--I prefer Verrett's mezzo work since I think the best part of her voice was her sexy, growly chest voice, which you hear much less of in Verrett's soprano roles.


You PREFER her mezzo work but do you agree that she did an equally good job as a soprano in terms of technique?


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## Sloe (May 9, 2014)

I like Grace Bumbry.


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## Rogerx (Apr 27, 2018)

Price, Bumbry, Verret, Grist and Lawrence Brownlee.


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## howlingfantods (Jul 27, 2015)

Baritenor said:


> You PREFER her mezzo work but do you agree that she did an equally good job as a soprano in terms of technique?


Her technique is excellent in whatever rep. But the best part of her voice is her bottom, and you don't hear it much in soprano rep.






That's a nice, well-sung Vissi d'arte, but nothing super special. There's probably a dozen sopranos whose Vissi d'arte's I'd rather hear. Her high notes are secure and ring out, but they're not especially pretty.














But these are spectacular. Listen to that resonant chest voice. Wonderful. I can think of few who can match her and no one who exceeds her in this rep.


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## Seattleoperafan (Mar 24, 2013)

GregMitchell said:


> I agree with paragraph 1, but not with paragraph 2. Like Howlingfantods I preferred her as a mezzo. In his memoirs (which were edited after his death by his wife) Walter Legge, who knew a thing or two about singers, was appalled to hear she was moving into soprano repertoire. He thought she was the greatest mezzo before the public at the time and that moving into soprano territory would alter her unique timbre.
> 
> I also agree that it is a great shame that she never got to record Carmen, or indeed Amneris and Azucena.


Here is my take on Verrett: I do think the lack of recordings in a recording era hurt her. I am mostly familiar from Met matinee recordings when I listened to Sirius FM. I thought her Norma and her Tosca were really wonderful BUT the mezzo part of her voice was very unique sounding, whereas her techniquely wonderful soprano singing was less distinctive sounding for some reason and for me that is the reason I enjoy her mezzo singing . I get really caught up in her distinctive sounding mezzo recordings. If you asked me whether I would rather hear her Arsace or Horne, it would be hard but I would pick Verrett's.


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## Woodduck (Mar 17, 2014)

For combined voice, musicianship, and dramatic power, Shirley Verrett stands out, and not only among black singers. For sheer vocal beauty, the young Leontyne Price would probably top my list of women, with an honorable mention to the young Jessye Norman (both developed qualities later on that made me like them less).

Among men, the little I've heard of George Shirley suggests a first-rate lyric tenor. I see on YouTube that he recorded Ferrando in _Cosi_ and some Haydn in the operas under Dorati. Seems like he had a good career.


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## Granate (Jun 25, 2016)

For what I know:

1. J. Norman
2. G. Bumbry
3. S. Verrett
4. S. Estes
5. L. Price

6. R. Grist
7. W. White
8. K. Battle


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## nina foresti (Mar 11, 2014)

Price/Verrett/Brownlee/Owens


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## BalalaikaBoy (Sep 25, 2014)

edit: you know, I think Reri Grist actually beats out Marian Anderson by a tiny margin. a gorgeous and under-appreciated voice. silvery-velvet timbre with consistently superb vocal line. 

in order

5) Paul Robeson (politics aside...)
4) Marian Anderson
3) Reri Grist
2) Martina Arroyo
1) Shirley Verrett

honorable mention 
Leontyne Price (wonderful in some rep, somewhat muddy sounding in others)
Willard White
Grace Bumbry 


others I can admit were technically brilliant but not for me.


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## Woodduck (Mar 17, 2014)

BalalaikaBoy said:


> edit: you know, I think Reri Grist actually beats out Marian Anderson by a tiny margin. a gorgeous and under-appreciated voice. silvery-velvet timbre with consistently superb vocal line.
> 
> in order
> 
> ...


Robeson refused to sing opera because he felt it wasn't relevant to his culture. An early exponent of "identity politics"?


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## BalalaikaBoy (Sep 25, 2014)

Woodduck said:


> Robeson refused to sing opera because he felt it wasn't relevant to his culture. An early exponent of "identity politics"?


I didn't know that. Mostly I was referring to him being a literal communist -_-

that's alright though, we can swap him out for Willard White for 5th place


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## Sonata (Aug 7, 2010)

Rogerx said:


> Price, Bumbry, Verret, Grist and* Lawrence Brownlee*.





nina foresti said:


> Price/Verrett/Brownlee/Owens


So glad to see that mention!! Brownlee has a beautiful voice!

Price
Brownlee
Battle 
Verret
Norman


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## Reichstag aus LICHT (Oct 25, 2010)

Derek Lee Ragin. One of the best countertenors in my book, with a stunning technique.


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## LaContessa (Jun 5, 2018)

Shirley Verrett
Grace Bumbry
Martina Arroyo
Reri Grist
Barbara Hendricks
Kathleen Battle


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## Bellinilover (Jul 24, 2013)

George Shirley is probably one of my favorite tenors, just based on his _Cosi fan tutte_ from 1967 (he didn't record all that much, unfortunately).

Grace Bumbry would be right up there with Jennifer Larmore, etc. on a list of my favorite mezzo-sopranos.

Leontyne Price

Leona Mitchell

Lawrence Brownlee


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## peeknocker (Feb 14, 2012)

I find the idea of formulating a list of singers (let alone that of any profession) on the basis of a wholly irrelevant and immutable characteristic such as race to be distasteful, but since such is the question presented I would offer the late Mattiwilda Dobbs as a particularly fine coloratura who is worthy of mention.


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## Bellinilover (Jul 24, 2013)

Here's Leona Mitchell as Liu in TURANDOT:


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## Bonetan (Dec 22, 2016)

peeknocker said:


> I find the idea of formulating a list of singers (let alone that of any profession) on the basis of a wholly irrelevant and immutable characteristic such as race to be distasteful, but since such is the question presented I would offer the late Mattiwilda Dobbs as a particularly fine coloratura who is worthy of mention.


I have to admit that I don't like this topic either, but I'm always compelled to click on it. FYI I'm a black opera singer...


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## Rogerx (Apr 27, 2018)

Bellinilover said:


> Here's Leona Mitchell as Liu in TURANDOT:


I've seen her live in Brussels doing Leonora ( Trovatore) I was speechless, went a few days later again.


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## howlingfantods (Jul 27, 2015)

Bonetan said:


> I have to admit that I don't like this topic either, but I'm always compelled to click on it. FYI I'm a black opera singer...


The weird thing to me is to create a ranked list order based on ancestry, but I like having a thread celebrating these artists, and I don't blame baritenor for framing it in the way he/she did to prompt responses. I do think it's odd and amusing when otherwise dissimilar black singers are compared to each other, though.


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## BalalaikaBoy (Sep 25, 2014)

Bonetan said:


> I have to admit that I don't like this topic either, but I'm always compelled to click on it. FYI I'm a black opera singer...


I see can see how this would get a bit annoying. Like, everywhere you go people put on these vacuous heirs of solidarity. "oh! well here are some of my favorite black actors, playwrights, musicians, etc". In particular with opera, it's meant to share basic feelings of the human experience.


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## Bellinilover (Jul 24, 2013)

I forgot to mention Kenneth Tarver.


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## BalalaikaBoy (Sep 25, 2014)

howlingfantods said:


> The weird thing to me is to create a ranked list order based on ancestry, but I like having a thread celebrating these artists, and I don't blame baritenor for framing it in the way he/she did to prompt responses. *I do think it's odd and amusing when otherwise dissimilar black singers are compared to each other, though*.


Like when people compare Kathleen Battle and Leontyne Price. wtf....Their voices could not be more dissimilar either in terms of repertoire, range, timbre of style of singing.


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