# Symphonies and symphonic poems with choir



## DeepR (Apr 13, 2012)

Since the use of choirs in symphonies and symphonic poems has (IMO) led to some of the greatest and most epic moments in music, I would like to know all works of this kind that make use of (multiple) voices.
I don't think there are that many? Can we make a complete list? Would be nice if it's more or less chronological.

Wikipedia mentions Beethoven was the first _major_ composer to do it. So does it really start with Beethoven 9 or were there other (minor) composers before him?


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## DeepR (Apr 13, 2012)

Lol, nevermind.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_choral_symphonies


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## DrKilroy (Sep 29, 2012)

Choir is also used in RVW's Sinfonia Antartica, though of course to much lesser extend than in the great Sea Symphony. 

Best regards, Dr


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## Andreas (Apr 27, 2012)

Although they're not symphonies, I'd add Holst's Planets and Debussy's Nocturnes. Both feature a female chorus in the final movement.


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## Art Rock (Nov 28, 2009)

Myaskovsky's sixth symphony is not listed.


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## Ravndal (Jun 8, 2012)

sibelius - kullervo


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## drpraetorus (Aug 9, 2012)

Scriabins very strange "Prometheus" uses a wordless choir and a solo piano. The ending is not so much a finale as a half cadence that he never followed up on.


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## joen_cph (Jan 17, 2010)

Langgaard´s 14th isn´t on the list either, or Ivanovs´ 4th, "Atlantis", for example. Not even Pettersson´s 12th, one of his most approachable and full of content - which is scandalous.


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## DeepR (Apr 13, 2012)

drpraetorus said:


> Scriabins very strange "Prometheus" uses a wordless choir and a solo piano. The ending is not so much a finale as a half cadence that he never followed up on.


Prometheus isnt that strange anymore when you've listened to it as much as i have (i was obsessed with it and went to a live performance as well).


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## DeepR (Apr 13, 2012)

Thanks for the additions all.


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## Lisztian (Oct 10, 2011)

Berlioz' _Grande symphonie funèbre et triomphale_.


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## PetrB (Feb 28, 2012)

The chorus in Scriabin's "Prometheus" is a tacked-on afterthought, singing only a few bars in the final cadence of the entire work: the work can be performed without it, as per the composer's direction in the score -- the chorus part is marked _'ad libitum'_.

I would add the _Stravinsky 'Symphony of Psalms',_ (it may technically be 'a choral work' but it is a symphony  with its highly integrated use of the chorus, its fantastic inverted double fugue middle movement, and its remarkably lovely final movement, so 'static' that it induces in many a listener the feeling of a spiritual trance.

Too, though a ballet, _Ravel's "Daphnis et Chloe"_ uses a wordless chorus as yet another section of the orchestra (i.e. treats the chorus instrumentally) to great affect. The chorus is so well integrated that sometimes you forget there is a chorus, while other times it is brought to the foreground, and at least once the chorus 'solos.' The orchestral forces are very large to begin with, and it is one of Ravel's true masterworks.
One of the 'archival' great recorded performances here, available on budget CD, Charles Munch, Boston Symphony




Here is the link to a more current (1999) fine live performance ~ Bernard Haitink; Concertgebouw Orkest





Another honorable mention, at least, ought to go to Gustav Holst; the female chorus introduced in 'The Planets' suite, (Neptune). The chorus only enters well after that section has begun, they sing pianissimo, and in a live hall, were out of sight and offstage. Their entry then, even on a recording, is nearly subliminal; the ending, too, is the chorus alone, fading to nothing. Highly dramatic, very effective, even today when the Planets is rather hackneyed and overexposed.

Stepping out of the 'Symphony' mold, there are some very exciting Symphonic Choral works, not all religious, or cantatas or oratorio.

A few American pieces from the second half of the 20th century are:
John Adams ~ Harmonium, for large orchestra and chorus.













And Steve Reich ~ Desert Music


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## Il_Penseroso (Nov 20, 2010)

Lisztian said:


> Berlioz' _Grande symphonie funèbre et triomphale_.


Oh my dear, I'm sure you ain't forget our favortie Liszt's Faust and Dante Symphonies. 

How can I ever get away from the final male chorus in Faust:

Alles Vergängliche 
ist nur ein Gleichnis;

das Unzulängliche, 
hier wird's Ereignis;

das Unbeschreibliche, 
hier ist es getan:

das Ewigweibliche 
zieht uns hinan.


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## Art Rock (Nov 28, 2009)

The Liszt symphonies are in the wikipedia link (post 2).


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## Il_Penseroso (Nov 20, 2010)

Art Rock said:


> The Liszt symphonies are in the wikipedia link (post 2).


Ok, thanks...


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## Vaneyes (May 11, 2010)

DeepR said:


> Lol, nevermind.
> 
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_choral_symphonies


Time-saver. I see Jimmy Wales is appealing again. Someone kindly give the man $2m.


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## DeepR (Apr 13, 2012)

PetrB said:


> The chorus in Scriabin's "Prometheus" is a tacked-on afterthought, singing only a few bars in the final cadence of the entire work: the work can be performed without it, as per the composer's direction in the score -- the chorus part is marked _'ad libitum'_.


Not just during the final few bars. The choir also sings for about a minute, just before and during the massive climax, where some of the "micro melodies" that were used throughout the piece fall into place. In fact, the most important moment of the piece. 
I'm glad the performance I went to used a choir, because it wouldn't be the same without it. An incredibly powerful experience I will never forget.
I haven't heard a performance where the choir wasn't used. Some conductors seem to rush through the choral part however, which is a shame.


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## PetrB (Feb 28, 2012)

The now cliche prototype of 'Epic' choral symphony is Mahler's Eighth.


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## Lisztian (Oct 10, 2011)

Il_Penseroso said:


> Oh my dear, I'm sure you ain't forget our favortie Liszt's Faust and Dante Symphonies.
> 
> How can I ever get away from the final male chorus in Faust:


Never! It's just that it was already listed on the wikipedia page. The Berlioz, a work I like, was not. But yes, both the Faust and Dante are favourites! For a while I wasn't that keen on the Faust, found it overlong and discursive. Not anymore, though. I think it's a masterpiece, and I agree with Leslie Howard who calls it one of the pinnacles of Liszt's achievement, along with the Piano Sonata and the oratorio Christus (I would also add the Annees de Pelerinage and the 'Gran' Mass).


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## Xaltotun (Sep 3, 2010)

Lisztian said:


> Berlioz' _Grande symphonie funèbre et triomphale_.


This is one ROUSING piece. Perhaps dead people aren't emotionally affected by it, but I'll suspect everyone else is!


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## DeepR (Apr 13, 2012)

I am going to Mahler 2 in two months, can't wait. 
I wish Scriabin's first would be performed somewhere, sometime, outside Russia, and not so far from where I live.


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## PetrB (Feb 28, 2012)

Symphonic, if not 'a symphony,' is Messiaen's _Trois petites liturgies de la présence divine_ for orchestra, female chorus, piano and Ondes Martinot.


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## Mahlerian (Nov 27, 2012)

Trois petites liturgies was the first piece by Messiaen that I heard. I have since listened to just about everything he wrote, and found my tastes expanded greatly because of it. I was also fortunate to get the chance to hear it live a few years ago.


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