# Most Stormy/Outright Violent Symphony



## njk345

By stormy or violent, I don't necessarily mean that it has to be so in its entirety. I'm just looking for works with specific sections or overarching themes that are especially dark and menacing in nature - something good to listen to when you're pissed off!

Off the top of my head, as an avid Shostakovich listener, I'm naturally inclined to name some of his usual suspects - the 10th (2nd movement especially), the 8th (eg. those nasty, dissonant bits in the 1st movement), the 7th (at the culmination of the invasion section in the first movement), all throughout his 4th symphony, and his 11th (the literal massacre depicted at the end of mov. 2).


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## dgee

I can't think of a symphony that is stormy and violent throughout - there's always a measure of contrast. However, Prokofiev 3 has excellent violent outbursts and plenty of tension and menace all the way


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## Stirling

I agree with this. are there any other nominations?


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## Weston

I nominate Julius Röntgen. He's often more explosive than stormy, but that's a similar mood.

Julius Röntgen - Symphony No. 3

(And no, I suppose it's not explosive throughout.)


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## Cosmos

Another Prokofiev: Symphony 2. The first movement is a wild ride! 

I feel that Stravinsky's Symphony in 3 movements has its violent sections

Vaughan Williams Symphony 4: not explosive throughout, but definitely peppered in


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## dsphipps100

Cosmos said:


> Vaughan Williams Symphony 4: not explosive throughout, but definitely peppered in


I was just about to mention this one.


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## Dim7

Rued Langgaard - Symphony No. 1


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## joen_cph

Nielsen´s symphonies, especially 4+5, weren´t mentioned. Neither Bax (1st Symphony), Langgaard´s 10th (Stupel recording), Myaskovsky´s early symphies, Scriabins 2+3, or Leifs´ Saga Symphony, for example.

Pettersson´s 9th is violent throughout, his 10th and 11th could also be characterized like that. As for the 9th, there´s a marked difference between the rushed CPO recording and the IMO much better Comissiona recording, which softens the work a lot and calms down for the slow ending, prolonged. These symphonies aren´t for Pettersson beginners however - nos. 7 and 8 are.


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## Dim7

joen_cph said:


> Scriabins 2+3


Scriabin's 3rd Symphony isn't really violent at all. Neither is 2nd from what I remember (though I only know the third movement well).


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## joen_cph

It´s true that tempi in the 3rd are rarely very fast. But the 1st Movement is appropriately entitled "struggles". 
The effects can partly depend on the chosen recordings - Fedoseyev or historical Golovanov for example are dramatic. Muti and Inbal have a somewhat more subdued approach, for example.


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## jcofer

Jón Leifs' "Sguhetju" ("Saga Heros"), popularly known as the "Saga Symphony". Leifs was an Icelandic composer, trapped in Germany during WWII with his Jewish wife and daughters. The five movements describe five Icelandic saga heros. In addition to a full symphony orchestra, instrumentation includes stones, hammers, anvils, wooden mallets and iron, wood and leather shields!


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## Bayreuth

Although very common, I think that the first movement of Mahler's 2nd contains some of the most magnificent violent outbreaks you can find anywhere. Bruckner's 9th has its moments, too.


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## Weston

jcofer said:


> Jón Leifs' "Sguhetju" ("Saga Heros"), popularly known as the "Saga Symphony". Leifs was an Icelandic composer, trapped in Germany during WWII with his Jewish wife and daughters. The five movements describe five Icelandic saga heros. In addition to a full symphony orchestra, instrumentation includes stones, hammers, anvils, wooden mallets and iron, wood and leather shields!


I have a Leifs symphony in my wish list, but now I don't remember which. The samples sounded spectacular.


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## DeepR

joen_cph said:


> It´s true that tempi in the 3rd are rarely very fast. But the 1st Movement is appropriately entitled "struggles".
> The effects can partly depend on the chosen recordings - Fedoseyev or historical Golovanov for example are dramatic. Muti and Inbal have a somewhat more subdued approach, for example.


Especially in Ashkenazy's version (which is my favorite and a little lighter and faster than most, or perhaps I should say: less over the top), you can hear the first movement actually has a wonderfully playful, airy vibe to it, with some grandiose outbursts in between. There are moments of friction for sure, but as a whole I wouldn't call it a stormy or violent piece myself. I find it more uplifting than menacing.


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## Reichstag aus LICHT

Mahler's Sixth takes some beating... literally.


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## Reichstag aus LICHT

Bayreuth said:


> Bruckner's 9th has its moments, too.


Particularly the scherzo. I often wonder whether Holst based "Mars" on it.


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## TwoPhotons

Schnittke - Symphony No.1
R. Strauss - the storm section in An Alpine Symphony (ignoring the fact it's not a proper "symphony")


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## HaydnBearstheClock

njk345 said:


> By stormy or violent, I don't necessarily mean that it has to be so in its entirety. I'm just looking for works with specific sections or overarching themes that are especially dark and menacing in nature - something good to listen to when you're pissed off!
> 
> Off the top of my head, as an avid Shostakovich listener, I'm naturally inclined to name some of his usual suspects - the 10th (2nd movement especially), the 8th (eg. those nasty, dissonant bits in the 1st movement), the 7th (at the culmination of the invasion section in the first movement), all throughout his 4th symphony, and his 11th (the literal massacre depicted at the end of mov. 2).


The Sturm und Drang symphonies - Mozart's 25th, Michael Haydn's 29th or Joseph Haydn's 44th/49th/52nd.


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## Alfacharger

Robert Simpson's Fifth Symphony has some violent moments.

Although not a symphony, Carl Ruggles' Sun-Treader can be a handful to some.


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## Dim7

HaydnBearstheClock said:


> The Sturm und Drang symphonies - Mozart's 25th, Michael Haydn's 29th or Joseph Haydn's 44th/49th/52nd.


By Classical era standards maybe... not really by today's standards IMHO.


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## Huilunsoittaja

Vaughan-Williams Symphony no. 4 is quite belligerent at times. I second Prokofiev's symphony no. 2. That one is a nightmare in a steel factory. Shostakovich was very good at depicting violence and terror in general, the storm of battle more than storm of nature perhaps.


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## Orfeo

I was beginning to mention operas and tone poems before I re-read the title of this thread. 
That said, I'll go with these:


*Gavrill Popov*: Symphony no. I.
*Shostakovich*: Symphony no. IV.
*Bax*: Symphony no. II.
*Atterberg*: Symphony no. III "West Coast Pictures" (second movement).
*Lyatoshynsky*: Symphonies I-III.
*Kabalevsky*: Symphonies I & III.
*Anton Rubinstein*: Symphony no. IV "Dramatic."
*Liszt*: Dante Symphony (part one).
*Rachmaninoff*: Symphony no. I
*Tchaikovsky*: Manfred (outer movements).
*Glazunov*: Symphonies nos. II (first movement) & VI (outer movements).
*Janis Ivanovs*: Symphonies nos. IV "Atlantis", XV, XVI, XVII.
*Adolfs Skulte*: Symphony no. V.


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## HaydnBearstheClock

Dim7 said:


> By Classical era standards maybe... not really by today's standards IMHO.


It was my view of things. I also forgot to add F. J. Haydn's symphony 26, 39 and the 1st and 4th movements of Symphony 45. These classical symphonies generally end with dramatic final movements in minor keys, something which is often absent from later Romantic symphonies (which often choose a pattern similar to the one in Beethoven's 5th, with an explosive final movement in a major key).

Additional stormy symphonies: Mozart's 40th in G minor; Mendelssohn - Symphony No. 3 in A minor, 'Scottish'; Beethoven - Symphony No. 5 in C minor, Symphony No. 9 in D minor; Schubert - Symphony No. 4 in C minor, 'Tragic', Symphony No. 8 in B minor, 'Unfinished'; Brahms - Symphony No. 1 in C minor, Symphony No. 4 in E minor; Dvorak - Symphony No. 7 in D minor.


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## Pat Fairlea

Cosmos said:


> Vaughan Williams Symphony 4: not explosive throughout, but definitely peppered in


Oh yes. Especially so in recording with RVW conducting. He takes some of the most jagged passages at one helluva pace. Quite contrary to the stereotypical image of him.


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## maestro267

The first two movements of Walton's 1st Symphony are quite violent and stormy. Music of rage and anger. In fact, the scherzo (II) is marked _Presto, con malizia_ (with malice).


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## Dim7

HaydnBearstheClock said:


> These classical symphonies generally end with dramatic final movements in minor keys, something which is often absent from later Romantic symphonies (which often choose a pattern similar to the one in Beethoven's 5th, with an explosive final movement in a major key).


Also many classical era minor key sonata allegro movements have the "depressing" pattern of the originally major key second subject group turning to minor key in the recapitulation (Mozat G minor String Quintet 1st movement for example). Kind of ironic given that the Romantics were supposed to be the angstier ones....


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## Ukko

Nielsen's 5th symphony expresses violence without being violent.


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## Gordontrek

Tchaikovsky's 6th- second half of the first movement. Emotional thunderstorm culminating in a desperate climax.


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## Cosmos

Pat Fairlea said:


> Oh yes. Especially so in recording with RVW conducting. He takes some of the most jagged passages at one helluva pace. Quite contrary to the stereotypical image of him.


Yeah, I remember the first time I decided to go through his symphonies, after hearing just the first, second, third, and fifth before, the fourth felt like I was on another planet of awesome


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## Pugg

Gordontrek said:


> Tchaikovsky's 6th- second half of the first movement. Emotional thunderstorm culminating in a desperate climax.


This, and Mahler six :tiphat:


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## helenora

Pugg said:


> This, and Mahler six :tiphat:


absolutely! the first symphony Mahler's 6 that came to mind when I've read this topic's title.


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## Azol

Hasn't been mentioned yet - Alan Hovhaness - Symphony 50 'Mount St.Helens', last movement is very raw, brutal and violent (starts several minutes into it)


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## techniquest

Lots of people have mentioned Vaughan Williams' 4th, but I'd like to nominate his 6th: the first three movements are especially turbulent, while the finale is the epitome of desolation.


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## SONNET CLV

Believe it or not, but there's a fellow named Beethoven who conjures up quite a storm in his Sixth Symphony. Especially as Bernstein conducts it with the Boston Symphony Orchestra.






Take a listen about 31 minutes in. But batten down the windows first. You don't want to get wet or blown away!


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## Enthusiast

Stormy in a bleak frozen way: Sibelius 4.


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## hpowders

The first movement of the Shostakovich 4 fills the bill and is one of the greatest symphonic movements ever composed.

Absolutely magnificent from the great opening march theme through the whirlwind fugato.


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## techniquest

On a slightly different tack, you might want to explore the opening part of Gorecki's 2nd Symphony "Copernican".


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## Delicious Manager

Being an incurable pedant, I just wanted to point out that one should never refer to Icelanders by the their patronimic (we might see it as a surname) only. There are no surnames as such in Icelandic; one takes the first name of your father and adds "-sson" or '-dóttir" to that. So, Harald Jónsson might have a son, Tryggvi and a daughter Lisa. The son would take the name "Tryggvi Haraldsson" and the daughter "Lisa Haraldsdóttir". One, therefore, needs to refer to Icelandic people by the their full name or their first name, but never only by their patroninimic. "Leifs" is a contraction of "Leifsson", by the way.


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## Guest

John Corigliano's Symphony No.1 has some extremely violent and cataclysmic sections.


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## Pat Fairlea

Enthusiast said:


> Stormy in a bleak frozen way: Sibelius 4.


Oh, you have touched a nerve there. As a Sibelius 'fan' (sorry) from teenage, I quickly got my head around the symphonies, apart from the 4th. That took _years_ to sink in. Then I hit middle-age and repeated bouts of depression and the bleak emptiness of that symphony made perfect sense. It's not one in which to wallow if you are feeling 'down', but few other pieces of music capture a sense of detachment from the joys and compensations of life or give such an impression of a vast, bleak world out there that simply doesn't give a damn. I wouldn't call it 'stormy' at all - Sibelius' 5th and 2nd do that - but it is total immersion darkness in modal form.


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## TwoPhotons

Andrew Norman's "Play". Very violent stuff!


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## elgar's ghost

Robert Simpson's Symphony no.9, which I am listening to at the moment. Stormy, agitated, restless, explosive - these and similar adjectives encapsulate the spirit of this work.


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## Foghunter

Pettersson's 13th and any of the Giya Kancheli symphonies.


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## geralmar

Beethoven Symphony #9, first two movements
Borodin Symphony #2, first movement
Mahler Symphony #1, last movement


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