# The thee Bs



## DrMuller (May 26, 2014)

Why are Bach, Beethoven and Brahms referred to as the three Bs? What do they have in common? Well obviously their names start with a B and they are German composers but is there another reason for this naming? I find this interesting because my top 3 composers are Bach, Beethoven and Brahms so I want to know if that means something special or if it's just a coincidence in my case. I know Brahms was very fond of Beethoven but i have no idea what Brahms and Beethoven thought of Bach. Can anyone help me out? Is this naming just a silly thing connected to the simple fact that their names starts with a B.


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## Weston (Jul 11, 2008)

They're just the three most well known composers whose names begin with "B." You couldn't include Mozart or you'd have the three BMs.


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## Fugue Meister (Jul 5, 2014)

The B thing holds for sure. However I think the main reason that became a saying is because they represent the greatest composers (to the person in the late 1800's who came up with it) in each era. Bach in the Baroque, Beethoven in the classical, and Brahms in the Romantic. I suppose we in the 21st century could re-christen the saying the 4 B's and add Bartok to the list. I'm game if you are.


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## SONNET CLV (May 31, 2014)

Fugue Meister said:


> The B thing holds for sure. However I think the main reason that became a saying is because they represent the greatest composers (to the person in the late 1800's who came up with it) in each era. Bach in the Baroque, Beethoven in the classical, and Brahms in the Romantic. I suppose we in the 21st century could re-christen the saying the 4 B's and add Bartok to the list. I'm game if you are.


Be careful about that fourth "B". Pierre Boulez might have some objection about the Bartok thing, and you know, that as a 20 year old, he led a riot of students "to protest the neo-classical works of Stravinsky." Who can say what the 89 year old fellow might be capable of! If I were you, I'd hide out at a Tchaikovsky concert. He'll never find you there.


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## Mahlerian (Nov 27, 2012)

SONNET CLV said:


> Pierre Boulez might have some objection about the Bartok thing,












Really?


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## Guest (Jul 15, 2014)

If I recall correctly, the three B's were initially Bach, Beethoven, and Berlioz...then someone came along who liked Brahms better.


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## hpowders (Dec 23, 2013)

Agree that Bartok should be admitted to the fold.


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## KenOC (Mar 7, 2011)

arcaneholocaust said:


> If I recall correctly, the three B's were initially Bach, Beethoven, and Berlioz...then someone came along who liked Brahms better.


It was conductor and critic Hans von Bülow who ejected Hector and substituted Johannes. Wagner wanted Bruckner instead, but that didn't work out (for better or worse).

Said Hans, "I believe in Bach, the Father, Beethoven, the Son, and Brahms, the Holy Ghost of music."


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## SONNET CLV (May 31, 2014)

Mahlerian said:


> Really?


Of course, I'm referring to a supposed arrogance on the part of the composer who must certainly champion himself as the "B" of the 20th (and 21st) century rather than someone else, even one of Bartok's standing. Sure, Boulez conducted much of Bartok's music, but note the cover picture on those recordings is always of Boulez. Self-aggrandizement? Perhaps. In the end, I'll take Bartok over Boulez any day.


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## dgee (Sep 26, 2013)

SONNET CLV said:


> Of course, I'm referring to a supposed arrogance on the part of the composer who must certainly champion himself as the "B" of the 20th (and 21st) century rather than someone else, even one of Bartok's standing. Sure, Boulez conducted much of Bartok's music, but note the cover picture on those recordings is always of Boulez. Self-aggrandizement? Perhaps. In the end, I'll take Bartok over Boulez any day.


DG's decision I would think. And to think, they never put Bernstein or HvK on album covers!! ;-)


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## Guest (Jul 15, 2014)

^ Yes indeed! Karajan must think quite poorly of Beethoven!


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## brianvds (May 1, 2013)

I think another reason for the three Bs is that there is a certain continuity in their music. Beethoven revered Bach, and Brahms revered both the two previous Bs, and saw himself as continuing their tradition.


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## Couac Addict (Oct 16, 2013)

Originally, it was Biber, Buxtehude & Bach. However the supergroup disbanded due to artistic differences and each pursued solo careers.


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## Guest (Jul 15, 2014)

A composer named Peter Cornelius, who was a huge Berlioz fan, first referred to his trinity of music as Bach, Beethoven, and Berlioz.

As Ken has pointed out, Hans von Bülow substituted Brahms for Berlioz for his trinity, despite also being, or having been, a Berlioz proponent.

Odd that that thing caught on like it did.

So much so that hardly anyone (Ken and I have been doing our best) knows how the thing got started. Or how it was altered. Or even its itness.


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## SONNET CLV (May 31, 2014)

Couac Addict said:


> Originally, it was Biber, Buxtehude & Bach. However the supergroup disbanded due to artistic differences and each pursued solo careers.


I thought originally it was Bumpo, Burpo, and Bup, the three cavemen who invented clapping, vocalization, and the drum (by smacking his head against a hollow tree whenever he threw a tantrum after hearing clapping and belching from his two noisy friends).


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## senza sordino (Oct 20, 2013)

Benjamin Britten's mother had very high hopes for her son. She has been quoted as saying that one day her son will be the third B. He'd be my fifth or sixth B, not including his first name.


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## Vesteralen (Jul 14, 2011)

By the end of the 14th century, there were only two B's: von Bingen and de Bologna (Sounds like a good name for a music drama)


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