# Essential Listening for Every American of American Music?



## 20centrfuge (Apr 13, 2007)

I was thinking the other day about American music and thinking about all of the Americans out there who probably couldn't even name more than 1 or 2 American composers. Then I thought, "which works of American music should every American know?" 

You could think of this in terms of a being a good citizen, culturally, or of simply being more culturally aware.

Anyway, what do you think? 

Also, as a tangent (for anyone that is a citizen of another country besides the USA), what do you think every citizen of YOUR country should know from YOUR country?


Personally, I think a shorter list is more ideal than a really long list, but I'll leave that up to you individually.


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## Jacck (Dec 24, 2017)

concerning Czech music, I think most Czechs know Dvořák a Smetana a Janáček. Martinů and Fibich and Suk are less known.

concerning American music, there are a few works I really like and consider to be the best of the American music. So if I were asked to recommend to a newcomer some American classical music to listen to, these are the works I would recommend

Gershwin - Rhapsody in Blue
Gershwin - Porgy and Bess
Barber - Violin Concerto
Barber - Vanessa
Barber - Adagio for Strings
Barber - Piano sonata
Bernstein - Mass
Herrman - Symphony
Ives - piano sonatas and symphonies
Still - Symphony No.1 in A flat major "Afro-American"
Dawson - Negro Folk Symphony
Copland - Quiet City
Reich - New York Counterpoint 
Reich - Octet
Carter - String Quartet 1
Hovhaness - Mount St. Helen symphony
Hanson - symphony 2
Beach - Symphony
Beach - Piano Concerto

there is more, but I will stop to keep the list short


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## 20centrfuge (Apr 13, 2007)

TIER 1: THE ABSOLUTE FUNDAMENTALS
Bernstein: West Side Story
Copland: Appalachian Spring
Copland: Fanfare for the Common Man
Barber: Adagio for Strings
Gershwin: Rhapsody in Blue
Gershwin: An American in Paris
Sousa: Stars and Stripes Forever
Sousa: Washington Post March
Ungar: Ashokan Farewell
Joplin: The Entertainer
Joplin: Maple Leaf Rag


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## Art Rock (Nov 28, 2009)

I doubt that the (wo)man in the street here in the Netherlands can come up with the name of even one Dutch composer - not that there's anything wrong with that.

Even casual classical music listeners would struggle to think of more than (if at all) Sweelinck and Louis Andriessen.

Personally I would recommend Zweers, van Gilse, Diepenbrock, Henk Andriessen, Vermeulen, Bosmans and Pijper.


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## CnC Bartok (Jun 5, 2017)

When I was much much younger, one of the first American pieces on the list of essential American works was Grofe's Grand Canyon Suite. Personally I don't think much of it! And the "first" great American composer was Edward MacDowell.

I suspect things have moved on since, so I would have thought the typical American should be aware of a handful of pieces by the likes of Copland and Barber, whilst not being embarrassed by the accessibility of George Gershwin. Maybe they could be aware of the more cutting-edge later composers like Babbitt, or Ives, like their music or not, a sense of pride in their qualities and reputation would not go amiss!

Onwards, I'd love to recommend some of those boring academic symphonies that got themselves overlooked for being too traditional. I love what I have heard of Piston, David Diamond, Paul Creston, Ned Rorem and the like, and as just music, their works are very fine indeed!


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## 20centrfuge (Apr 13, 2007)

TIER 2: A BROADER GRASP
Adams: Short Ride in a Fast Machine
Barber: Violin Concerto
Corigliano: Symphony 1 "Aids"
Crumb: Black Angels
Gershwin: Porgy and Bess
Glass: Koyaanisqatsi
Hanson: Symphony 2
Harris: Symphony 3
Ives: Symphony 4
Reich: Different Trains
Schumann: Symphony 3


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## Bulldog (Nov 21, 2013)

Robert Pickett said:


> Onwards, I'd love to recommend some of those boring academic symphonies that got themselves overlooked for being too traditional. I love what I have heard of Piston, David Diamond, Paul Creation, Ned Rorem and the like, and as just music, their works are very fine indeed!


Paul Creston is real good, but he's not "creation" good.


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## Jacck (Dec 24, 2017)

Robert Pickett said:


> And the "first" great American composer was Edward MacDowell.


John Knowles Paine was the first great American composer, I believe. Listen to his symphony 1. I think it is great.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Knowles_Paine


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## CnC Bartok (Jun 5, 2017)

I hate autocorrect!!!!!


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## Bulldog (Nov 21, 2013)

Many great works have been noted. I'd like to cite one more - Copland's Symphony no. 3.


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## mbhaub (Dec 2, 2016)

20centrfuge said:


> TIER 1: THE ABSOLUTE FUNDAMENTALS
> Bernstein: West Side Story
> Copland: Appalachian Spring
> Copland: Fanfare for the Common Man
> ...


This is probably about as good a list as anyone could make. The Ungar might be a bit of a stretch. I would add:

Willson: The Music Man
Rodgers: Oklahoma!, The Sound of Music, South Pacific
Anderson: Sleigh Ride (and maybe a couple of others)
Grofe: Grand Canyon Suite


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## Jacck (Dec 24, 2017)

I've spent some time now listening to Grofé and Coleridge-Taylor and Copland and Beach. This is some very fine music ! It is distinctly different from the German, English, French, Russian music and has an unique American charm and poetry. 
Personally I am not a big fan of minimalism, which became the dominant American trend is music in the latter half of the 20th century, but this American romantic music is beautiful.

EDIT: Coleridge-Tayler was in fact English, but he sounds more American than English to me


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## Taggart (Feb 14, 2013)

Billings - leading into the whole shape note / Sacred Harp stuff - especially David's Lamentation
 proper roots music.


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## Art Rock (Nov 28, 2009)

Curious that the composer most Americans would answer has not been mentioned yet in the thread: John Williams.

Also, Philip Glass apparently is sufficiently well-known to get a mention in the Simpsons TV series.


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## Olias (Nov 18, 2010)

He wasn't American, but I think Dvorak's residency in the United States and his "American-ish" compositions composed there qualify as something of which Americans should be aware. Obviously this would include the New World Symphony, the American String Quartet, and the Op 97 Quintet.


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## Bluecrab (Jun 24, 2014)

Jacck said:


> I've spent some time now listening to Grofé and Coleridge-Taylor...
> 
> EDIT: Coleridge-Tayler was in fact English, but he sounds more American than English to me


If you're referring to Coleridge-Taylor Perkinson, he was American. He was named after the British poet Samuel Coleridge-Taylor.


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## Jacck (Dec 24, 2017)

Bluecrab said:


> If you're referring to Coleridge-Taylor Perkinson, he was American. He was named after the British poet Samuel Coleridge-Taylor.


I meant the poet. He composed some wonderful music too


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## Manxfeeder (Oct 19, 2010)

Jacck said:


> John Knowles Paine was the first great American composer, I believe. Listen to his symphony 1. I think it is great.
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Knowles_Paine


His Mass in D is also worth hearing. If he would have called it "Mass for the Civil War" it would have been a hit.


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## Manxfeeder (Oct 19, 2010)

Taggart said:


> Billings - leading into the whole shape note / Sacred Harp stuff - especially David's Lamentation
> proper roots music.


Good point. I think it all starts with Billings.


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## mbhaub (Dec 2, 2016)

Uhhh.. the English poet was Samuel Taylor Coleridge.

The English composer was Samuel Coleridge-Taylor.


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## starthrower (Dec 11, 2010)

Duke Ellington-Sophisticated Lady; Prelude To A Kiss
Miles Davis/Gil Evans- Sketches Of Spain
William Schuman-Symphonies 4, 7
Bernstein-Jeremiah, Age Of Anxiety, Serenade
Zappa-Peaches En Regalia
Ives-The Unanswered Question
Mingus-Pithecanthopus Erectus
Monk-Round Midnight
Bill Evans-Waltz For Debby
George Russell-Chromatic Universe
Gershwin-Piano Concerto
Fats Waller-Numb Fumblin'
Dave Brubeck-Strange Meadowlark, The Real Ambassadors
Chick Corea-Spain
W.C. Handy-The St Louis Blues


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## SONNET CLV (May 31, 2014)

Essential American music must be, in some sense, essentially American. A lot of my favorite American music could have been composed by a European, African, or Asian, among others. At least it exhibits rather universal musical tendencies. My favorite symphony, the "Romantic" (No. 2) by Howard Hanson does not strike me as essentially American; it rather shares essential "romantic" tendencies and could be Nordic in nature. (Indeed, Hanson's First Symphony is subtitled "Nordic".) Not that there is anything wrong with a universal flavor in music. But essential _American _music? Hmm....

I believe we cannot overlook George Gershwin (_Rhapsody in Blue_, _Porgy and Bess_) and Charles Ives (the Second, Third, and Fourth Symphonies, the "Holidays" Symphony, the quartets, the Piano Sonata). Aaron Copland has contributed much to the "American sound": _Appalachian Spring_, the Third Symphony. Roy Harris's Third Symphony has long struck me as perhaps "the great American symphony" (with Copland's Third and Ives' Second or Fourth among the small list of competitors); to my ears it could only have been composed by an American with native aspirations. The music of George Crumb seems to fit in no box but the one marked "essentially American", for there is quite nothing else like it, and America is a place for uniqueness. And, William Schuman.

Of course, Leonard Bernstein is often strongly American in his music. _West Side Story _could only be from the U.S., though his symphonies and some of the other serious orchestral music is less convincingly "American" and could well have been composed by an Israeli, for instance. It seems the jazz inflections lend to the distinct American flavor. And therein lies an essence of American music which forces inclusion of composers such as Scott Joplin, Duke Ellington, Professor Longhair and Thelonious Monk as "essential", for these folks could not have sprung up with their particular sound in any other culture. Which means what I'm suggesting is that American jazz remains essential listening to Americans concerned about their musical cultural heritage.

Of course, there is also an indigenous aspect that should not be overlooked. Native American flute music, for example, is quite unlike that of any other culture and deserves hearing. Often this music is incorporated into "classical" and "jazz" foundations, adding a dose of Americanism to the soundings. (Consider the music of the jazz ensemble Oregon.) I think Ned Rorem and Jake Heggie and John Corigliano, among contemporary American composers of "serious" music, provide us with an essential American sound in their incorporations of American classical, jazz, and pop music traditions.

Too, the minimalism of Steve Reich and Philip Glass seem somehow essentially American. And though it does not count among my favorite of musics, minimalism should well be experienced by anyone interested in tapping into the American core sound, though that sound has now become international.

So … happy exploring the American essence. Meanwhile, I will turn my attentions to some of the music of David Diamond, whose symphonies and ballets exude an essential American sound I would not want to be without.

P.S. -- Let's not forget John Philip Sousa. Is any music more "American" than his?

P.P.S. -- American film composers are quite responsible for essentially American sounding music. My vote would go to Elmer Bernstein for scores such as "Magnificent Seven" and "To Kill a Mockingbird," both of which are indispensable listening for the American experience.


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## Jacck (Dec 24, 2017)

I don't know why I forgot her, but *Florence Price* is like quintessential American music to me. Her symphony No 1 is not only very beautiful, but seems to contain many American folk melodies, in the same sense that Dvořák seems to contain a lot of Czech folklore.


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## Colin M (May 31, 2018)

I would agree/argue that Ives Symphony No. 4 owns some of the hallowed ground of American greatest composition. "Orchestras within orchestras" overlay incredible melodies threatening to come off the rails at any moment. An exhilarating and terrifying 30 minutes of magic.

And let us hear some love for Barber's Tone Poem Knoxville 1915. As American as it comes. Great thread by the way.


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## Colin M (May 31, 2018)

I hate roller coasters by the way... Except for this one.


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## Bluecrab (Jun 24, 2014)

Jacck said:


> I don't know why I forgot her, but *Florence Price* is like quintessential American music to me.


Yes, she's certainly a historic figure in American classical music. Another African American composer who IMO is really under-recognized is George Walker. He composed some fine contemporary music and was an outstanding concert pianist.


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## Bulldog (Nov 21, 2013)

Colin M said:


> And let us hear some love for Barber's Tone Poem Knoxville 1915. As American as it comes. Great thread by the way.


Yes, Knoxville 1915 and the Adagio are my favorite Barber works with his piano concerto not far behind.


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## larold (Jul 20, 2017)

America being home to Hollywood it seems strange no one thinks of film music as essentially American.

*Jerry Goldsmith* produced notable scores for "Papillon", "Alien" and "Planet of the Apes" (1971). Many of his scores use serial technique.

*Bernard Herrmann* conceived memorable scores for "Psycho" and other Hitchcock films and has several notable recordings on London where he conducted his own scores.

In the romantic film era *Miklos Rozsa *wrote scores for "King of Kings", "Ben-Hur", "El Cid" (loosely translates to The Christ) and other Biblical epics as well as mysteries like "The Red House" and "Spellbound". He also wrote strictly classical music including a violin concerto and sinfonia concertante recorded by Naxos.

*Walter Piston* shared time between serialism and tonalism. I enjoy his 2nd and 4th symphonies. There's a wonderful album of Ormandy conducting his 4th symphony mated to *Roy Harris's *7th and *William Schuman's *6th.

Michael Tilson Thomas produced a recording for DG with Schuman's Violin Concerto and Piston's 2nd Symphony.

*Charles Ives* should be heard by anyone curious about American music. His 2nd and 3rd symphonies are approachable and his 4th is not. He also wrote serially in Three Places In New England, the Concord piano sonata and elsewhere.

*Virgil Thomson* is a powerful American voice and author of Symphony On a Hymn Tune, Louisiana Story, and suites from the films "The River" and "The Plow That Broke The Plains".

Another composer in the mid-century band of American brothers similar to Piston, Harris and Schuman is *Vincent Persichetti*. *David Diamond* came along later but is equally important.


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## mbhaub (Dec 2, 2016)

This is getting nuts. The original question was "...which works of American music should *every* American know?" Price? Walker? Barber? Seriously? Kids today don't even know the old once-common folk songs and you want them to know Knoxville 1915? I'd be happy if they could sing Oh Susanna, Red River Valley, Oh Columbia the Gem of the Ocean or God Bless America.


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## Jacck (Dec 24, 2017)

larold said:


> America being home to Hollywood it seems strange no one thinks of film music as essentially American..


film music is not essentially American, film music is universal, but given that Hollywood is the wold's largest producer, the film composers tend to concentrate there. I am probably the biggest Goldmith fan on this web, I own dozens of his film scores, and he is for me simply the best American composer of the 20th century. But I did not want to bring it in, since film music is viewed as part of the pop culture and not as part of classical music. But in my opinion, some very fine music has been composed for film, a random example that I listened to recently
The Red Violin Chaconne - Corigliano


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## Bulldog (Nov 21, 2013)

mbhaub said:


> This is getting nuts. The original question was "...which works of American music should *every* American know?" Price? Walker? Barber? Seriously? Kids today don't even know the old once-common folk songs and you want them to know Knoxville 1915? I'd be happy if they could sing Oh Susanna, Red River Valley, Oh Columbia the Gem of the Ocean or God Bless America.


I never heard of "Oh Columbia" but I can play Knoxville 1915 in my head.

The original question had little validity for there is no music that everyone should know - individual preference rules.


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## mbhaub (Dec 2, 2016)

But it is valid - there used to be, and should be, a shared common cultural heritage among people. There was a great book some 20 years ago about cultural literacy that people in a modern, complex society and what they need to know to function. Without those basic cultural sign posts you're lost. For example, take "Oh Columbia the Gem of the Ocean". If you listen to Ive's 2nd symphony you've heard it - he uses it many times. But if you don't know the song (and many others) their place in his symphony and the meaning behind their use, completely eludes you. When I was a kid in the 50s we all had singing in our elementary classrooms. We knew those old songs that our own grandfathers knew. It gave society more cohesion, something that is horribly lacking today. Those folksongs and common songs we all sang were one of society's glues. About the only two left are the inane Happy Birthday and The Star Spangled Banner, although many people don't know the correct words to the latter. Heck, I've been to enough baseball and basketball games to know that. Of the many things wrong with public (and some private) schools today is the elimination of music so we can push STEM and sports. (It so happens I still have my Songs for Singing that I used in 4th grade! We learned to read music - everyone did. I feel sorry for my grandkids in their fancy-schmanzy school today; they never sing in class...only students who want to take chorus - starting in 7th grade - will do that.)


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## millionrainbows (Jun 23, 2012)

For me, it's Aaron Copland: Fanfare for the Common Man, and Ives: Holidays Symphony.


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## KenOC (Mar 7, 2011)

mbhaub said:


> ...We knew those old songs that our own grandfathers knew. It gave society more cohesion, something that is horribly lacking today. Those folksongs and common songs we all sang were one of society's glues.


​
John Philip Sousa would agree with you, and even assign a cause: "These talking machines are going to ruin the artistic development of music in this country. When I was a boy... in front of every house in the summer evenings, you would find young people together singing the songs of the day or old songs. Today you hear these infernal machines going night and day. We will not have a vocal cord left. The vocal cord will be eliminated by a process of evolution, as was the tail of man when he came from the ape."


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## Larkenfield (Jun 5, 2017)

EI think a far better question is: what American music of cultural significance should all students be exposed to in school. You have to start somewhere and I'd start with Louis Armstrong and then expand out into the classics. I consider classical music as having roots in Europe and not the US. American music was born on this soil and deals with American issues, such as slavery, the West, and in the sense of democracy that can be heard in the music of Charles lives. But even Charles Ives combined the American popular and church-music traditions of his youth with European art music. Most students (and their parents) are not likely getting the exposure at home.

Standards in American schools seem very low now... and teachers continue to be nickeled and dimes on salaries. American history and culture... Some students who should know better, think that the US fought on the side of Germany during WW2-that is, if they've heard of the War at all. I think that's not what happened in Europe, to say the least.

IMO, again, the widest possible exposure to American music that all should hear should start by coming through schools with some kind of a unified perspective nationally in certain cultural areas. But of course, no one wants to pay for such exposure in this country because funding for the arts is still too controversial.

The last US president we've had who had a major perspective on the arts was JFK, and that's like going back to the Stone Age. It's no wonder that so many Americans look to Europe for something that doesn't always have a price tag on it though Europeans have their own problems too.

President Kennedy's tribute to poet Robert Frost and the arts... I've long considered it inspirational:


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## Bulldog (Nov 21, 2013)

mbhaub said:


> But it is valid - there used to be, and should be, a shared common cultural heritage among people.


I believe the level of sharing takes place on a natural basis. What about diversity - that's a big thing these days.


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## Colin M (May 31, 2018)

mbhaub said:


> This is getting nuts. The original question was "...which works of American music should *every* American know?" Price? Walker? Barber? Seriously? Kids today don't even know the old once-common folk songs and you want them to know Knoxville 1915? I'd be happy if they could sing Oh Susanna, Red River Valley, Oh Columbia the Gem of the Ocean or God Bless America.


 Sorry I missed the memo... I wrongly assumed this was related to classical music... Not folk music nor Americana nor jazz nor rock and roll. My mistake. Then definitely they should be aware of White Rabbit by Grace Slick and the Great Society...


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## Bluecrab (Jun 24, 2014)

mbhaub said:


> This is getting nuts. The original question was "...which works of American music should *every* American know?" Price? Walker? Barber? Seriously?


Yes, seriously. The fact that you disagree with those opinions does not render them any less valid. And be advised that I (and, I suspect, quite a few others) disagree with some of _your_ opinions.


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## larold (Jul 20, 2017)

_Columbia the Gem of the Ocean_

FYI to uninitiated this is a song from the Civil War era and is a popular tune you've heard many times. Others of its ilk include The Red, White and Blue, Free America!, Washington Post March, You're A Grand Old Flag and Yankee Doodle Dandy.


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## SONNET CLV (May 31, 2014)

20centrfuge said:


> I was thinking the other day about American music and thinking about all of the Americans out there who probably couldn't even name more than 1 or 2 American composers. Then I thought, "which works of American music should every American know?"


True, in essence the original question proves rather vague. The post progresses from "couldn't even name more than 1 or 2 American composers" to "which works...." Works of music, of course, differ from composers. Off hand, I don't know who composed "Over the river and through the woods to grandmother's house we go," but I know the song, and a good many folks my age do as well. On the other hand, there are Americans who cannot correctly sing our national anthem "The Star-Spangled Banner". And some of these are singers hired to do so! Too, are we talking "informed Americans", "well-educated Americans", or "dumb-*** Americans"? And … we haven't even discussed the possibility of what music deaf Americans might have to know.

Sometimes we think too much, perhaps.


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## Taggart (Feb 14, 2013)

OK What music should every American know? Simple stuff - basic folk songs. Two basic sources - Springsteen's Seeger Sessions and Ken Burns Civil War Music. The only duplication between the two is Jacob's Ladder. That gives you Dixie, Bonnie Blue Flag, Battle Hymn of the Republic, Yankee Doodle, John Henry and many more classic American standards.

Another source would be Guthrie's Library of Congress recordings for some more modern stuff.


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## starthrower (Dec 11, 2010)

I learned a lot of traditional songs as well as old country and blues listening to acoustic guitarists like Harvey Reid, Geoff Muldaur, Martin Simpson, Doc Watson, Norman Blake, Rory Block, Rev Gary Davis, among others. Mike Bloomfield knew a ton of old songs as well. And the Blue Grass bands too.


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## Red Terror (Dec 10, 2018)

The "Super Freak" himself: *Rick James*


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## jegreenwood (Dec 25, 2015)

Just get this album. . .


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## 20centrfuge (Apr 13, 2007)

I would love it if somehow American folksongs became canonized and officially became part of the American cultural awareness. I'm worried that we will lose our connection with them over time. As has been mentioned before, if primary schools don't keep these songs going, they are likely to be forgotten.


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## larold (Jul 20, 2017)

If you want o hear and/or perform American folk songs go to church or join a local theater troupe or music society. I am part of all and have plenty of opportunity to sing that stuff. Those are the places where the traditions are retained, not schools.


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## GregGoodale (Dec 29, 2014)

So pleased you included the Unger piece. Simple, so American.


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## GregGoodale (Dec 29, 2014)

I think Hanson 2 is definitely Tier 1


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## GregGoodale (Dec 29, 2014)

As you point out on your PPS there is so much wonderful film music that is s quintessentially American. I love Bernstein’s True Grit as well as the the,e to the Cowboys.


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## sstucky (Apr 4, 2020)

W. Schuman 3, R. Harris 3, Mennin 3, Copland 3, Gershwin Rhapsody, Paris, Porgy; the Southern Harmony, West SideStory, Piston oeuvre, Barber symphonies, Essays, Piano Concerto.


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## BrahmsWasAGreatMelodist (Jan 13, 2019)

20centrfuge said:


> I was thinking the other day about American music and thinking about all of the Americans out there who probably couldn't even name more than 1 or 2 American composers. Then I thought, "which works of American music should every American know?"
> 
> You could think of this in terms of a being a good citizen, culturally, or of simply being more culturally aware.


Then I don't think there is any "essential" American CLASSICAL music. The canon of "essential" American music probably consists of the folk songs that others have noted before, jazz, country, blues, funk, a bit of pop/rock, and maybe a touch of R&B, soul, and hip-hop. American classical music is simply not as culturally relevant in America as the aforementioned genres.


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## GregGoodale (Dec 29, 2014)

I’m with you here. Terrific E. Bernstein soundtracks, proud American music


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## Allegro Con Brio (Jan 3, 2020)

The answer is Charles Ives. I think this is close as you can get to a six-minute encapsulation of America; it moves me to tears in the same way that Sibelius's Finlandia and the finale of Smetana's Ma Vlast do - nothing to do with patriotism, but with the conviction and poetry of composers' depictions of their homeland.


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## Fabulin (Jun 10, 2019)

If every American knew even a single major work of Ives, the world would have been a better place.

If you asked me about New Yorkers specifically, I would certainly mention this piece:


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## 20centrfuge (Apr 13, 2007)

Congratulations Fabulin on your 1000th post - featuring Taxi Driver. But I wish it would have been the mohawk photo:


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## SanAntone (May 10, 2020)

Composers for which any sampling of their music would be a good representation of American music:

Ives
Copland
Bernstein
Gershwin
Ellington
Feldman
Cage

I'd also say that listening to blues, jazz, country, gospel would also be necessary to get the full flavor of American music.

I left off the academic composers since I don't think their style is especially American.


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