# Grumpy composers



## aleazk (Sep 30, 2011)

who is the most grumpy of the famous composers?

is Bach?










is Beethoven?










is Brahms?










(hilarious situation: there is some innocent kids playing this piece in a piano






... but then it comes Brahms!!, and says: grrr, grr, get out of here kids, the piano it's not a toy, grr, grr. the kids then flee in terror. Brahms sits in the piano, of course with the attitude he has in the photograph, and starts to play this piece






... man, that's grumpy...)

is Chopin?










is Wagner?










is Alkan?


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## aleazk (Sep 30, 2011)

is Dvorak?










is Schönberg?










is Stravinsky?










is Ravel?










is Shostakovich?










is other?

of course, the big prize is for either Beethoven or Brahms.


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## An Die Freude (Apr 23, 2011)

Saint-Saens.


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## elgar's ghost (Aug 8, 2010)

Re: DSCH - if I thought I could invoke Stalin's displeasure at any second I don't think I'd be too chipper either (assuming the picture was taken after the 'muddle instead of music' Pravda condemnation and before the death of Uncle Joe). Just his luck that when the pressure was largely off from the late 50s onwards it coincided with the onset of his first real health problems. A 'better' picture shows a careworn face resting in one hand - it features on an album cover but can't recall which. An acquaintance suggested the caption 'Shosters shares a joke with the commissars'. If I can find it I'll post it.


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## Sid James (Feb 7, 2009)

Grumblebum is the terminology I use. More quirky.

I think it's a tie between Beethoven & Brahms, they could both be REALLY unpleasant. The former quite paranoid and control freakish (eg. with his nephew) & a horrible temper, the latter with a very caustic acidic tongue which he could lash out at people any minute unexpectedly. The thing with Brahms was expect the unexpected, as far as I know.

But I like these two guys as well in a way as what you saw was what you got, basically. They didn't dress flashily or throw huge parties. They were not socialites, they were anti-social more likely. & it shows in their music, it's very human and kind of down to earth in many ways.

As for the rest, I don't think they're that grumpy compared to the two above.

But Stravinsky did have a quick mind and his tongue could be lashing as well. Eg. calling _Carmina Burana_ "neo-neanderthal!" Saint-Saens was mainly grumpy when he got into contact with music he didn't like, eg. the _Rite of Spring _where he kind of spat the dummy, but apparently he tolerated _Salome_ to some degree, at least it had some lush bits that went down more easily with him than it's "atonal" or "dissonant" moments...


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## Polednice (Sep 13, 2009)

Brahms wasn't grumpy!!!! You just don't get his sense of humour!


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## Manok (Aug 29, 2011)

Chopin was just homesick, so we can cut him some slack too I suppose.


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## Sid James (Feb 7, 2009)

Polednice said:


> Brahms wasn't grumpy!!!! You just don't get his sense of humour!


Well that thing with Hans Rott was the worse of his caustic, critical tongue. Some say he drove Rott to suicide with his criticism. But I don't agree basically as to do suicide you have to be a very troubled individual. It's a psychological disorder in the first place, irrespective of what tips you over the edge in a way.

But of course Brahms also had a caring and human side, eg. being much like the rock of the Schumann family, during Robert's bouts of illness and also after his death, a great support for Clara. I don't think this was just infatuation but deeper love than that, he really did a lot to help the Schumann family across his whole life. & there were other things too. I like how he was down to earth and dressed simply. He wasn't one for extravagance. Like his music, it was "what you see is what you get" type of thing...


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## TrazomGangflow (Sep 9, 2011)

aleazk said:


> is Chopin?


Why do we have to bring poor Chopin into this?


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## elgar's ghost (Aug 8, 2010)

Wikipedia describes Jean-Philippe Rameau as '...secretive, solitary...brusque...quick to anger...' - even if only half-true surely he must be in the running.


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## mleghorn (May 18, 2011)

I wouldn't characterize Beethoven or Brahms as grumpy, not that I knew them personally. Beethoven's humor is loaded with humor. I read that he'd sometime bust out laughing for no apparent reason, as if he was enjoying some sort of inside joke.


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## mleghorn (May 18, 2011)

I read in Wagner's autobiography (My Life) that Liszt had a very short temper, and frequently had tantrums.


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## ComposerOfAvantGarde (Dec 2, 2011)

I voted for Brahms. I'm a little surprised that Beethoven has got more votes. Beethoven's a nice guy really, jsut a little misunderstood.


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## violadude (May 2, 2011)

Other....I'm the grumpiest composer ever. Don't get on my bad side! :devil:


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## aleazk (Sep 30, 2011)

ComposerOfAvantGarde said:


> I voted for Brahms. I'm a little surprised that Beethoven has got more votes. Beethoven's a nice guy really, jsut a little misunderstood.


see the post by sid james, he has a case against ludwig!



> I think it's a tie between Beethoven & Brahms, they could both be REALLY unpleasant. The former quite paranoid and control freakish (eg. with his nephew) & a horrible temper


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## GraemeG (Jun 30, 2009)

Rachmaninov.
Once described by someone as "six feet of Russian gloom and doom".
GG


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## Huilunsoittaja (Apr 6, 2010)

GraemeG said:


> Rachmaninov.
> Once described by someone as "six feet of Russian gloom and doom".
> GG


That was this guy who said so:









But you guys all missed the man who I think has the greatest scowl. I think I would be a little scared to see him scowl like that in person (speaking of guy in middle):









:tiphat:


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## clavichorder (May 2, 2011)

GraemeG said:


> Rachmaninov.
> Once described by someone as "six feet of Russian gloom and doom".
> GG


Many accounts of Rachmaninoff are that he was a very warm hearted person. He did go through a period of depression though.


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## Sid James (Feb 7, 2009)

Yeah, & Maestro Glazunov conducting Rachmaninov's debut symphony sent the younger man into a great depression! But Rach didn't hold grudges against the older guy, he knew he had issues of his own, eg. alcohol...


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## Huilunsoittaja (Apr 6, 2010)

Sid James said:


> Yeah, & Maestro Glazunov conducting Rachmaninov's debut symphony sent the younger man into a great depression! But Rach didn't hold grudges against the older guy, he knew he had issues of his own, eg. alcohol...


Ugh! Always blaming _him!_ It wasn't a sabotage attempt, Glazunov actually approved of the symphony.

But you're right, they remained friends long after. Perhaps a true reconciliation even.


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## Chris (Jun 1, 2010)

ComposerOfAvantGarde said:


> I voted for Brahms. I'm a little surprised that Beethoven has got more votes. Beethoven's a nice guy really, jsut a little misunderstood.


Beethoven is This Week's Composer on Radio 3. In this afternoon's programme it was revealed that he would throw eggs at his housekeeper if he considered they were not fresh. A little misunderstood? Ha!


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## itywltmt (May 29, 2011)

With Beethoven it wasn't that he was grumpy as much as it was about the caffeine:

__
https://flic.kr/p/74157401


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## ComposerOfAvantGarde (Dec 2, 2011)

Chris said:


> Beethoven is This Week's Composer on Radio 3. In this afternoon's programme it was revealed that he would throw eggs at his housekeeper if he considered they were not fresh. A little misunderstood? Ha!


Well, yes. "A little misunderstood" is what I would say to that anyway! :lol:


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## Sid James (Feb 7, 2009)

I remember in the film _Immortal Beloved_, Beethoven (played by Gary Oldman) accuses his housekeeper of wanting to poison him and fires her on the spot.

He went through a lot of housekeepers, and also a lot of "houses" - moved house about 30 times in all during his life in Vienna, which was most of his life...


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## EddieRUKiddingVarese (Jan 8, 2013)

the first one ...............


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