# Brandenburg Concerto 5



## juliante (Jun 7, 2013)

I am loving this piece of music! Can anyone tell me how clever the first movement is? I am not musical... it strikes me he uses lots of devices and that this is why it feels so engaging... but does he do it better than most? Or am I barking up the wrong tree? Either way, the harpsichord solo is epic and fantastic.. reminds me of an extended heavy metal axe solo.. in good way!


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## Captainnumber36 (Jan 19, 2017)

juliante said:


> I am loving this piece of music! Can anyone tell me how clever the first movement is? I am not musical... it strikes me he uses lots of devices and that this is why it feels so engaging... but does he do it better than most? Or am I barking up the wrong tree? Either way, the harpsichord solo is epic and fantastic.. reminds me of an extended heavy metal axe solo.. in good way!


I'm glad you found something you love so much! I wouldn't be bothered trying to decide if he does such a general idea better than others, but perhaps try to break it down to a more distinct aspect to compare how he stands against others in that specific area.

For example, counterpoint is a very distinct concept that has a specific definition that you can compare how he fares to others that utilize counterpoint.

Find concepts you are interested in to compare to others like in the example above.

I agree, though, I love _all_ of the Brandenburg Concertos


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## larold (Jul 20, 2017)

What you love about the Brandenburg concerto 5 is probably Bach's inventiveness linked to what it is -- a "triple" concerto for keyboard, flute and violin, meaning the three instruments play off each other and against the chamber orchestra supporting them or, as they say, the ripieno. The concerto format was not yet well established when Bach wrote the Brandenburgs and the idea of a Beethoven or Brahms violin concerto, with its length, duration, and ideas, was scores of years away.

It is J.S. Bach's inventiveness that makes this music memorable and fun. Bach was one of the greatest musicians in history who could play all the instruments and sing all the parts so he knew the range of every instrument he wrote about. When you get to the middle of the first movement note how the lead instrument, the flute, actually shows the other solo instruments where to go and what to play. Then he puffs along making little birdlike sounds as the play their parts. Then later listen to the mammoth solo for keyboard that goes all over the place, kind of like an absent-minded professor developing a new idea.

There is no musical genius is history greater than Sebastian Bach. He could do anything with music and instruments and his fifth Brandenburg concerto is one of his very, very, very greatest creations, clearly the gem among the six Brandenburgs which are, in my opinion, the greatest connected set of concertos ever written. It is credit to your intuition and interest that you can see the greatness in this music not knowing a nickel's worth about its construction, the author, or anything else. Good for you and keep listening.

FYI .. Bach wrote another "triple" concerto for a woodwind instrument, violin and keyboard but it has none of the joie de vivre of the fifth Brandenburg. Beethoven wrote a triple concerto for violin, cello and piano which I love but most people disparage. A more modern composer, Hans Werne Henze, also wrote one. There aren't many triples in the repertory and none that quite match the cheerfulness and wit of Bach's fifth Brandenburg.


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## Azol (Jan 25, 2015)

I am sooo with you, that first part with harpsichord solo is mindblowing to say the least. Love it!


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## Manxfeeder (Oct 19, 2010)

One mark of a great composer is economy of means, or doing a lot with a little. The second movement an example of that, using a few ideas masterfully. Note how most of it has the soloists, just three voices, playing the same thing but coming in at different times. And the last movement is just one theme treated contrapuntally.


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## Mandryka (Feb 22, 2013)

I once read an analysis of the first movement in social terms. The harpsichord, who is normally one of the “low class” instruments, certainly not an instrument dignified enough to take a solo, eventually takes over, like a working class revolution. Apparently these ideas are not foreign to Bach’s brand of religion, though the egality may be more relevant to life in heaven than life on earth, as it were. God’s kingdom, not Caesar’s. 

Anyway, this may be just my imagination, but in the recording with Gustav Leonhardt, at the very start you can hear him play continuo, and it’s like he’s on edge, seething, waiting to explode with pent up tension. And of course, he finally does explode in the “cadenza.”


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## ldiat (Jan 27, 2016)

larold said:


> What you love about the Brandenburg concerto 5 is probably Bach's inventiveness linked to what it is -- a "triple" concerto for keyboard, flute and violin, meaning the three instruments play off each other and against the chamber orchestra supporting them or, as they say, the ripieno. The concerto format was not yet well established when Bach wrote the Brandenburgs and the idea of a Beethoven or Brahms violin concerto, with its length, duration, and ideas, was scores of years away.
> 
> It is J.S. Bach's inventiveness that makes this music memorable and fun. Bach was one of the greatest musicians in history who could play all the instruments and sing all the parts so he knew the range of every instrument he wrote about. When you get to the middle of the first movement note how the lead instrument, the flute, actually shows the other solo instruments where to go and what to play. Then he puffs along making little birdlike sounds as the play their parts. Then later listen to the mammoth solo for keyboard that goes all over the place, kind of like an absent-minded professor developing a new idea.
> 
> ...


i always wondered about that keyboard solo. its great just never could put in words like you did! nice!


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## ldiat (Jan 27, 2016)

Bach wrote another "triple" concerto for a woodwind instrument,

Name?? please


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## KenOC (Mar 7, 2011)

ldiat said:


> Bach wrote another "triple" concerto for a woodwind instrument,
> 
> Name?? please


"The Triple Concerto, BWV 1044, is a concerto in A minor for [flauto] traverso, violin, harpsichord, and string orchestra by Johann Sebastian Bach. He based the composition on his Prelude and Fugue BWV 894 for harpsichord and on the middle movement of his Organ Sonata BWV 527, or on earlier lost models for these compositions."

A superb piece.


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## premont (May 7, 2015)

ldiat said:


> Bach wrote another "triple" concerto for a woodwind instrument,
> 
> Name?? please


Some of Bach's concertos for three harpsichords and strings (BWV 1063 and 1064) exist in modern arrangements for wind soloists. Helmut Winschermann has recorded his own arrangements.


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## Manxfeeder (Oct 19, 2010)

Mandryka said:


> I once read an analysis of the first movement in social terms.


An interesting book along those lines is The Social and Religious Designs of J.S. Bach's Brandenburg Concertos by Michael Marissen.


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## ldiat (Jan 27, 2016)

KenOC said:


> "The Triple Concerto, BWV 1044, is a concerto in A minor for [flauto] traverso, violin, harpsichord, and string orchestra by Johann Sebastian Bach. He based the composition on his Prelude and Fugue BWV 894 for harpsichord and on the middle movement of his Organ Sonata BWV 527, or on earlier lost models for these compositions."
> 
> A superb piece.


thanks you very much!


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## Enthusiast (Mar 5, 2016)

larold said:


> FYI .. Bach wrote another "triple" concerto for a woodwind instrument, violin and keyboard but it has none of the joie de vivre of the fifth Brandenburg. Beethoven wrote a triple concerto for violin, cello and piano which I love but most people disparage. A more modern composer, Hans Werne Henze, also wrote one. There aren't many triples in the repertory and none that quite match the cheerfulness and wit of Bach's fifth Brandenburg.


There is also the Tippett Triple (all strings: violin, viola and cello). A lovely work but not (of course) the equal of the Bach.


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## janxharris (May 24, 2010)

juliante said:


> I am loving this piece of music! Can anyone tell me how clever the first movement is? I am not musical... it strikes me he uses lots of devices and that this is why it feels so engaging... but does he do it better than most? Or am I barking up the wrong tree? Either way, the harpsichord solo is epic and fantastic.. reminds me of an extended heavy metal axe solo.. in good way!


So exuberant and infectious. I love this too.


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## larold (Jul 20, 2017)

_The Triple Concerto, BWV 1044, is a concerto in A minor for [flauto] traverso, violin, harpsichord, and string orchestra. A superb piece. _

It is often linked on recordings to a double concerto for violin, oboe and strings BWV 1060, another rewrite.


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