# learning music for first time for old people!



## Hamidreza

For a 37 years old man who doesn't have any experience in playing musical instruments before, is it possible to start learning something new for first time?!


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## pianississimo

old? 
I started at 44 and I'm learning. I was a total beginner.
Go for it!

What do you want to learn to play?


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## Ingélou

Hamidreza said:


> For a 37 years old man who doesn't have any experience in playing musical instruments before, is it possible to start learning something new for first time?!


Yes, it is possible. It depends on commitment as well as talent, and on setting realistic goals for yourself. 
Obviously you are not likely to become a world-class performer but there is no reason why you shouldn't be able to play an instrument sufficiently well to give pleasure to yourself and others.
I returned to the violin after 45 years and am enjoying myself tremendously. My husband returned to the piano, similarly. 
Good luck with your plans.

Oh, and by the way - thirty-seven *old*? Pah!


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## Taggart

Ingélou said:


> Oh, and by the way - thirty-seven *old*? Pah!


Probably a typo - meant 73.

Quite agree. You may not make concert standard but good amateur, and above all - have a whale of a time.


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## Guest

37??!!! Get out.


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## MoonlightSonata

I wouldn't say 37 is old...
Well, as long as you're not planning to become a world-famous virtuoso, you should be fine.


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## bghill

There is no age too old to enjoy learning to play music.


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## Potiphera

If one is middle aged and takes up piano lessons on the understanding that he has missed the boat on becoming a concert pianist, then is it worth it to take the grades and exams, even if it is just for the pleasure of playing?


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## Taggart

Potiphera said:


> If one is middle aged and takes up piano lessons on the understanding that he has missed the boat on becoming a concert pianist, then is it worth it to take the grades and exams, even if it is just for the pleasure of playing?


It's a question of learning the techniques and becoming acquainted with the repertoire. You will note that on most of the beginning piano threads, the suggestion is that you acquire a teacher. A teacher will help you learn the techniques and one way is to attempt the grades, scales and suitable studies. The grades also give you a target to aim for.

It also depends what you want to play - classics, popular music, jazz, folk, whatever. Most teachers take children through the basic grade exams so you need to find somebody who can help you do what you want to. I want to play (mostly) Baroque (and earlier) so the grades suit me.


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## Weston

I would add not only is it possible, research is showing that it is good for you. Good for healthy brain plasticity.


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## Potiphera

Thank you Taggart. I do have a tutor at present, and I have been considering starting grades, I should think at my age I will probably only do up to grade 3. I think you are right about achieving targets, it will seem a long slog though but I am sure beneficial in that it will enrich my understanding of music and music theory, makes it more interesting really. 
I'm happy to learn both classical and some popular and maybe play Christmas carols . In particular, I would love to be able to play 'Farewell to Stromness'. But I think that is a grade 3 piece. 

You mentioned basic grade exams. Would that be like basic up to grade 3? Which grades are considered intermediate?


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## ptr

It is never to late to learn how to play instruments or sing! Some instruments will be more difficult to master, but challenges is fun ain't they!

/ptr


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## Potiphera

Thank you Weston, I think we must have posted at the same time.


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## Potiphera

ptr said:


> It is never to late to learn how to play instruments or sing! Some instruments will be more difficult to master, but challenges is fun ain't they!
> 
> /ptr


Most definitely, challenges are fun. Though I would rather play an instrument than sing , as my singing is lousy. 

When I look at the thread, ' What are you working on right now', you all seem so advanced!


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## Taggart

Potiphera said:


> You mentioned basic grade exams. Would that be like basic up to grade 3? Which grades are considered intermediate?


Umm ... I meant basic as in the standard exams and no frills.

ABRSM grades 1 to 3 are classified as Elementary
Grades 4-5 are Intermediate
Grades 6-8 are Advanced.

The 5 baroque books go from easy through moderately easy to intermediate then moderately difficult and finally difficult!

Certainly grade 3 shouldn't be a problem if you are motivated.


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## pianississimo

I discussed grades with my teacher on the first day. I said I'd like to do some so I could have an idea of what level I'd achieved and also it adds motivation.
I remember looking at the grade 1 pieces and thinking how hard they looked! Now (a mere 4 years later!) it looks like baby music!

My teacher told me that very few people fail grade 1. I thought I was terrible but I got a merit. They expect you to be able to play the 3 very short pieces through more or less and be able to play a couple of one handed scales.
The sight reading is one line of music in which the left and right hands never play at the same time.
The aural part of the exam is clapping along to the examiner playing a very easy rhythmic piece.
If you listen to a lot of music, learn to sight read the pieces slowly and practice scales you can pass grade 1!

2012-2014 ABRSM had  this  at grade 3
It's so exciting playing even very simple Chopin! Worth the work involved in getting up to that grade!


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## pianississimo

Ingélou said:


> I returned to the violin after 45 years and am enjoying myself tremendously. My husband returned to the piano, similarly.
> Good luck with your plans.
> :


Nice that you've got your own accompanist!


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## Potiphera

Thank you very much pianississimo, that is most encouraging. 
Many thanks for the link to the Chopin piece, hope it's ok to print it off.


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## Hamidreza

thanks for your comments.Now the question is for an adult which is the suitable instrument for learning? I did a search on internet and found that piano is the most recommended instrument but I think it is good for children who want to make a good base for their playing not for adults! Maybe Wind instruments such as flute or clarinet can be good suggestion!


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## Potiphera

If I were a lot younger like yourself Hamid, my first choice would have been a string instrument violin or cello, but now that I'm older I love the piano too, I think you need to have a passion for a certain instrument that speaks to your soul while playing. Piano or violin does that for me.


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## ptr

I say, choose an instrument that You feel would be fun to learn, on which You can play music that You enjoy!

/ptr


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## pianississimo

I am biased. I love playing piano, but learning has made me realise that if I didn't really love it then the endless hours of practice would soon become a chore. If you don't really love a particular instrument then you'r more likely to tire of it soon.


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## Ingélou

Potiphera said:


> If I were a lot younger like yourself Hamid, my first choice would have been a string instrument violin or cello, but now that I'm older I love the piano too, I think you need to have a passion for a certain instrument that speaks to your soul while playing. Piano or violin does that for me.


If you love both the piano and the violin, then it makes sense to choose the piano, as it's easier to strike the notes, but also gives you the complete grounding in harmony and music theory that the violin doesn't.

I started the piano six months ago, but I have had to stop the lessons now, as I have lots going on in my life and couldn't give it the time that I wanted to - I like to 'do my best' in anything I take up.
I wrote a blog giving an account of my struggles with the piano: http://www.talkclassical.com/blogs/ing-lou/

For the same reason I cancelled my plans to do violin grade 4, though I think I would have got on with it okay - I got a distinction in my grade 3. But I don't really want to play romantic or modern classical pieces on my violin, or pieces in difficult keys. What I want is *to be a fiddler*! 

I think you could take as many exams as you want, if you are willing to put in the practice and hard work, up to grade 8, considering that your age is *only 37*! Taggart is hoping to take grade 7 this year.
See how you go.

So I am left with the fiddle, which I absolutely adore - the hardship for me is when I _*can't*_ practise because of illness or absence, and I always take my fiddle on holiday with me when I can. Taggart feels the same about the piano, and takes a portable keyboard on holiday too, so that we can have a daily practice in our self-catering cottage!

Age is irrelevant. I took this quotation from my violin forum, by a member called Peter Charles:
*"You should play the violin for one reason only - and that is because you love doing it.
Forget all about grades, getting to a certain level. Just do it, and find a way that is easy and free of tension, and you will be on cloud nine.
I play because tomorrow I may die, and today I can try and make music. It does not matter what you play, but how you play it. Do it for love of yourself and your own self respect."*


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## pianississimo

Ingélou said:


> *"You should play the violin for one reason only - and that is because you love doing it.
> Forget all about grades, getting to a certain level. Just do it, and find a way that is easy and free of tension, and you will be on cloud nine.
> I play because tomorrow I may die, and today I can try and make music. It does not matter what you play, but how you play it. Do it for love of yourself and your own self respect."*


exactly!! 
Music is a place to live, not a hill to climb


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## dpwave

I'm a guitar player, and near retirement age. I have an intermediate to advanced knowledge of harmony and counterpoint, and had two classes in orchestration from Berklee. Now I see the need to learn piano. But I only want to use piano as a composing tool, not for performance.

Since I understand harmony, and know where the notes are on the piano, the only things I see (for myself) to learn is to play with both hands while reading, and practicing scales and harmonized scale chords in Major, Harmonic, and Melodic minor in the various key and time signatures. So some absolute beginner guide book will not do for me, that would turn me away from it.

Suggestions?


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## pianississimo

For scales you could get the ABRSM The Manual of Scales, Broken Chords and Arpeggios book which has all the scales and arpeggios for major and harmonic minor keys with fingering so you should be able to work out how to do that. There are a ton of how to play scales type videos on you tube which will tell you all about hand position and things.
It's worth pointing out that good scale playing is about more than putting the right finger on the right key!

There are thousands of free beginner type exercises you can download which help you with the tricky business of finger independence. I found an old book called *The Foundations of pianoforte technique by Geoffrey Tankard*
http://www.amazon.co.uk/Geoffrey-Tankard-Foundations-Pianoforte-Technique/dp/B004XPGYXU

I bought this one at Oxfam but it's popular with teachers so still available all over the place.

Would you consider finding a teacher? It might be worth it for getting to grips with technique.


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## Taggart

The Tankard is an excellent book for technique but has almost no harmony theory.

You want to use the piano to compose so you probably want a keyboard which can record. You'll want something with a sustain pedal. This will allow you to move smoothly between chords.

You play guitar and know harmony so presumably you know the basic chord progressions, inversions, 7ths and modulations. You will need to translate that to the piano given that the right hand will usually be playing the melody and the left the harmony.

One starting place is a good hymn book in solid four part harmony. If you play either jazz or folk look for basic melody + notated chords - you probably have this sort of thing anyway. Try working the left hand to see the easiest way to get the progressions working. Look at adding harmony notes to the right hand.

Look at playing a walking bass (jazz and baroque) to get that to work smoothly, you need to know your scales well and be confident playing them.

Thing is, you'll probably need some technique lessons for scales and to manage chord progressions also to cope with something like an alberti bass or where you want to introduce passing notes in your chord progressions.

Try picking out a simple melody you know and adding chords to suit. You should know the chords from guitar, it's just a matter of moving on to a keyboard.

Enjoy.


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## dpwave

Thanks guys. I'll look into the Tankard book.

What I'm interested in is 'using' the piano to compose for orchestra. I really need an expression pedal or breath controller more than a sustain pedal. It would be nice to have right/left hand independence for melody and harmony, so I see the need to develop that somewhat, but only for the purpose of inputting a kind of reduction into Pro Tools or Finale.

I also need a good book on modulation in the Classical style, because I'm mostly familiar with basic modulation on pivot chords in Pop and Jazz chromatic substitution.


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## ColColt

A little late to the party here but I tried learning to play the tenor sax and found I had just waited too long to start, apparently. My biggest hurdle was reading music. It looked like Hebrew and still does. I couldn't correlate where the notes were on the staff to where my fingers should be on the sax keys. I'd look at a note and didn't know if I was looking at A or Db. I gave up.


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## Lukecash12

Hamidreza said:


> For a 37 years old man who doesn't have any experience in playing musical instruments before, is it possible to start learning something new for first time?!


It's not just possible to start learning, it's possible to give yourself something to love for the rest of your years. You've no time to lose adding in a new and fulfilling part to your life! The way I figure it, you've got decades left to learn. What *can't* you accomplish with that much time?


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## Lukecash12

Taggart said:


> Umm ... I meant basic as in the standard exams and no frills.
> 
> ABRSM grades 1 to 3 are classified as Elementary
> Grades 4-5 are Intermediate
> Grades 6-8 are Advanced.
> 
> The 5 baroque books go from easy through moderately easy to intermediate then moderately difficult and finally difficult!
> 
> Certainly grade 3 shouldn't be a problem if you are motivated.


I don't see why anyone should have any trouble reaching grade 5 if they never doubt themselves. Learning an instrument isn't a goal. Music is a lifestyle choice and a great one at that.


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## Guest

So starting at 55 is not utterly utterly hopeless then?


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## Stavrogin

I am 37 and I would love to learn music.
I just don't have the time - family, work and all.
So my plan is to become outrageously rich so I can live off rents, don't need to work any more, and have enough time to take private lessons.

I think I'd choose the piano, so I can also play and sing Tom Waits songs.


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## pianississimo

I'm studying for grade 6 now and can play my pieces through.
It'd be a valid question to ask why I put myself through the stress and expense of exams at the age of 48. I will never be a professional but I never wanted to be either.
Ask yourself what you want to be able to do. For me it was to be able to sit at the piano at the end of a busy working day and play some music that I like. To be able to pick up a piece of sheet music and work through it, even play it a bit. Most of all though it was to be able to listen to other people play and have a better understanding of how it works. How the technical and artistic elements of performance combine to make the music that I love to hear. 
I didn't know how hard that was going to be, I didn't know how rewarding it was going to be either.
Whether you're 18 or 80 you should give it a try. Giving some time to music study will teach you things about music that you can't get through just listening. Also it's FUN!


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## Potiphera

That's a wonderful achievement pianississimo, these grades aren't easy as they go on. 

Thanks everyone for support on this forum, you gave me the courage to bravely go forth and start my exams. 
I passed my Grade 1. ABRSM Piano exam. It sure gives me more confidence to carry on now to Grade 2. I thought about skipping to Grade 3, but no, I really need to go through grade 2 , first . I have a lot to learn still.


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## Jake

Hamidreza.

The answer is yes.


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## Aarontastic

As long as you aren't expecting yourself to play like Liszt, I think you will be very pleased with the amount of progress you can make. Nobody is ever too old to start picking up an instrument; just keep in mind that the level you are able to attain completely depends on practice, practice, practice.


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## hreichgott

I hope Hamidreza will check in and say how he is getting on


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## DVMasdar

Hamidreza said:


> For a 37 years old man who doesn't have any experience in playing musical instruments before, is it possible to start learning something new for first time?!


Hi There.
Everything always have first step, so just do practice. Do everything we love it's never to be late.


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