# Why do Soloists Play from Memory?



## haziz (Sep 15, 2017)

In concertante works and many solo works the soloist usually plays from memory. Nobody expects the orchestra and conductor to do the same!

Why?

Tradition? Pride? Showing off? Unsure that they will find a “page turner” at the next venue?!

What is the rationale for this?

When did this tradition start and why does it continue? Surely their repertoire would be much bigger if they are allowed to sneak a peak at a music stand, which I think would be a good thing for most concerned.

Also how long does it take for a soloist to memorize a 30-40 minute concerto?

Thanks.


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## mbhaub (Dec 2, 2016)

Playing from memory lets you have a freedom to improvise and add expression. It's that simple. When you're eyes are glued to the music that's what you're thinking about. There are a lot of conductors who work without a score for the same reason - it ties you down. It's amazing to me how some people can memorize so much music, such as pianists who will do all 32 Beethoven sonatas from memory over a period of a week or so. To be sure, there are some soloists who do use printed music (or iPads nowadays) especially on difficult contemporary works, or music they might play so rarely that its not worth the time to commit the brain cells to save it.

In fact, many conductors DO memorize the music - it allows that freedom of interpretation that can be great. Personally, when I conduct I like to be able to make eye contact with the players; and that's hard to do when your eyes are in the score. Even some big time maestros use a score, though and that's ok. There are orchestras where the players are expected to memorize the music. The Aurora orchestra in Los Angeles did the Shostakovich 5th, playing standing up, and from memory - and no conductor!


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## marlow (11 mo ago)

There is no real virtue in playing without the music as my music teacher used to tell me. Just telling people how clever you are really. It is how you are playing that matters. I have read that the first person to play without music was Clara Schumann who did it to show as a woman she was as good as any man. I don’t know whether the story is true or whether anyone can verify it. To me it is incredible that someone like Richter could remember around 70 concerts in his heyday or Karajan or Toscanini knew scores off by heart. In Toscanini’s case it was necessity as he was very short sighted and would not wear glasses. Klemperer in his book on conducting, however, urged all young conductors to use a score. ‘A good friend’ he said. Typically he reckoned that conducting without a score was just playing to the gallery. Which of course it is unless you are gifted with a phenomenal memory.


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## brahms4 (May 8, 2017)

I`ve heard that it was Franz Liszt who started the playing without a score.As far as conducting without a score,I love the quip by Otto Klemperer in regards to Toscanini:"What,I`m supposed to conduct without a score because that Italian is myopic!"


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## Kreisler jr (Apr 21, 2021)

Richter played with sheet music in his later years but I don't know when he changed to this. And it seems fairly common to play with music in chamber music.


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## marlow (11 mo ago)

Kreisler jr said:


> Richter played with sheet music in his later years but I don't know when he changed to this. And it seems fairly common to play with music in chamber music.


Apparently he had a hearing problem which caused him to confuse the pitch at which he was hearing the music. Hence the music. He also played in a darkened hall.


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## Animal the Drummer (Nov 14, 2015)

I wouldn't mind betting it's often a matter of simple personal preference. I'm an amateur pianist but have reached a reasonable standard, have taken part in a number of concerts over the years and invariably play from memory so that I can concentrate on what my hands will have to do. If I've worked on a piece hard enough to bring it up to concert standard it'll be securely in my memory, and in those circs.the score would be little more than a distraction. Different strokes for different folks.


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## Mandryka (Feb 22, 2013)

Why do ensemble players, string quartets for example, rarely play from memory?


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## marlow (11 mo ago)

I attended a concert in which Clifford Curzon played a Mozart concerto. He used the music. Apparently he suffered from nerves and having the music in front of him helped him relax.

More recently Angela Hewitt played Bach’s WTC Book 2 and used an iPad with a foot control.


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## EdwardBast (Nov 25, 2013)

Animal the Drummer said:


> I wouldn't mind betting it's often a matter of simple personal preference. I'm an amateur pianist but have reached a reasonable standard, have taken part in a number of concerts over the years and invariably play from memory so that I can concentrate on what my hands will have to do. If I've worked on a piece hard enough to bring it up to concert standard it'll be securely in my memory, and in those circs.the score would be little more than a distraction. Different strokes for different folks.


Yes, me too (mostly). The memorization is automatic and always well in hand before I've technically mastered anything. At any given time I have a couple of hours of music memorized. It's hard to imagine it being otherwise.

Orchestral players, however, have so much music to perform (three pieces a week would be pretty standard for professionals during the season) so of course it makes sense for them to rely on or reference the music as they play.


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## Kreisler jr (Apr 21, 2021)

The Smetana Quartet played from memory for some time but they had a comparably limited repertoire for this reason (I think they never played the last three Mozart quartets or the great Dvorak G major which is a pity) and later on used sheet music.


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## marlow (11 mo ago)

Fascinating to read Walter Legge on how Karajan absorbed a score. Apparently he would borrow one and return it unmarked and all completely absorbed just by studying it. Quite phenomenal. But not unusual among musicians? Glenn Gould could do the same.


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## mbhaub (Dec 2, 2016)

Come to think of it, I have played entire shows from memory...The Music Man. I got hired to play in the orchestra and I can tell you from experience, after six or so rehearsals and then a run of seven weeks, five nights a week, matinees on Sat, that music was so in my head that I didn't count rests, or even look at the part after a while. It's been 45 years and I wouldn't be surprised if I could play it right now from memory. And I realize that classical music is different from pop music, but you never see a pop group using music - the whole show is memorized (except the backup orchestra if there is one).


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## Mandryka (Feb 22, 2013)

Kreisler jr said:


> The Smetana Quartet played from memory for some time but they had a comparably limited repertoire for this reason (I think they never played the last three Mozart quartets or the great Dvorak G major which is a pity) and later on used sheet music.


Yes, and recently the Chiara Quartet released Bartok and Brahms "by heart" - they play from memory and they play standing I believe.


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## marlow (11 mo ago)

Mandryka said:


> Yes, and recently the Chiara Quartet released Bartok and Brahms "by heart" - they play from memory and they play standing I believe.


Great! But I enjoyed the Amadeus sitting and playing from music!


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## marlow (11 mo ago)

On a slightly different note, I am also in awe of the incredible sight reading skills of some musicians!


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## verandai (Dec 10, 2021)

Especially for pianists it can be quite distracting to play from a score in a concert, because you would have to turn pages quite a lot. Of course you can organize someone who turns the page for you, but that would distract me even more and imho creates a strange atmosphere.

Playing without a score creates a feeling of freedom, of course it removes a feeling of security on the other hand (in form of memory backups). I prefer playing without a score, but I also don't have a big concert repertoire.


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## Luchesi (Mar 15, 2013)

marlow said:


> There is no real virtue in playing without the music as my music teacher used to tell me. Just telling people how clever you are really. It is how you are playing that matters. I have read that the first person to play without music was Clara Schumann who did it to show as a woman she was as good as any man. I don't know whether the story is true or whether anyone can verify it. To me it is incredible that someone like Richter could remember around 70 concerts in his heyday or Karajan or Toscanini knew scores off by heart. In Toscanini's case it was necessity as he was very short sighted and would not wear glasses. Klemperer in his book on conducting, however, urged all young conductors to use a score. 'A good friend' he said. Typically he reckoned that conducting without a score was just playing to the gallery. Which of course it is unless you are gifted with a phenomenal memory.


It might have been that Richter couldn't forget a piece after he had worked on it, because he said in an interview, that he was cursed with a powerful memory. 
He remembered the names and faces of all the people coming backstage who he had ever been introduced to, and he didn't really want to remember all that. How would it be? 
He said in an interview that he would take scores onto the stage because during preparation and trying different conceptions he annotated his own graduations in the dynamic markings and slurs etc for different interpretations, not because he didn't remember the notes.


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## Brahmsianhorn (Feb 17, 2017)

It is not about showing off. It is about knowing the music so well that it sounds more spontaneous and "alive."

I connect much more to the audience when I don't have a score in front of me.


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## SONNET CLV (May 31, 2014)

*Why do Soloists Play from Memory?*

It's possible that they are simply very forgetful about remembering to bring their music scores with them to the concert hall!


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## Luchesi (Mar 15, 2013)

Brahmsianhorn said:


> It is not about showing off. It is about knowing the music so well that it sounds more spontaneous and "alive."
> 
> I connect much more to the audience when I don't have a score in front of me.


Funny, it's the opposite with me. I connect with our audiences more comfortably if I have the music to glance at, just for the feeling of sharing what's in the score with them, and the whole process of expressing/communicating it.


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## pianozach (May 21, 2018)

verandai said:


> Especially for pianists it can be quite distracting to play from a score in a concert, because you would have to turn pages quite a lot. Of course you can organize someone who turns the page for you, but that would distract me even more and imho creates a strange atmosphere.
> 
> Playing without a score creates a feeling of freedom, of course it removes a feeling of security on the other hand (in form of memory backups). I prefer playing without a score, but I also don't have a big concert repertoire.


I've played professionally for almost 50 years, and rarely have I intentionally committed works to memory. I've also only used a page turner rarely, like, almost never. The page turns are quick and furious, and sometimes a bit noisy. I think an iPad would be great, but they are far too pricey for a large one.

As for memory, I've accompanied *The Pirates of Penzance* so many times that I actually fell asleep during a "pick-up" rehearsal DURING the _*Act I Finale*_ - WHILE I WAS PLAYING. I awoke because the music stopped. It stopped on the last chord. I looked around warily to see if I'd f***ed up, and no one batted an eye, because I had continued to play from memory while I had nodded off.


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## Rogerx (Apr 27, 2018)

> Why?
> 
> Tradition? Pride? Showing off? Unsure that they will find a "page turner" at the next venue?!


A bit of all, some artist are really good playing from memory. A conductor without score is even more spectacular.


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## arpeggio (Oct 4, 2012)

One of my favorite baroque groups is Red Priest.

The perform all of their music for memory.


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## amfortas (Jun 15, 2011)

Rogerx said:


> A bit of all, some artist are really good playing from memory. A conductor without score is even more spectacular.


I dunno'. Even if I didn't know a piece that well, I could probably go up on the podium without a score and wave my arms around.

Not saying the results would be any GOOD . . .


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## Mandryka (Feb 22, 2013)

marlow said:


> Great! But I enjoyed the Amadeus sitting and playing from music!


Yes it's hard for me to say whether it's a gimmick - I mean, it feels like a gimmick but I've never played in a string quartet.


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## Heck148 (Oct 27, 2016)

Rogerx said:


> ....A conductor without score is even more spectacular.


A conductor who knows exactly what he/she needs to hear at every instant, with or without score, is spectacular, or at least, very , very good....


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## SanAntone (May 10, 2020)

haziz said:


> In concertante works and many solo works the soloist usually plays from memory. Nobody expects the orchestra and conductor to do the same!
> 
> Why?


The soloist will have played the concerto many more times than the orchestra members. The soloist has worked on learning the work for weeks, or months, and possibly years. Orchestra members will rehearse the work for a week prior to the concert, and it will be just one of dozens of works they will perform each season, which are not repeated possibly for years. Also in order for the orchestra to truly perform as a unified ensemble they should literally be reading from the same page.

Muscle memory is something instrumentalists develop from practicing countless hours: scales, arpeggios, and other technical exercises as well as specific works. When a pianist (or any instrumentalist) performs the ideal is to know the work so well that the music appears to be spontaneous.

Playing from memory is certainly not a stunt to serve a performer's ego.


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## Mandryka (Feb 22, 2013)

SanAntone said:


> The soloist will have played the concerto many more times than the orchestra members. The soloist has worked on learning the work for weeks, or months, and possibly years. Orchestra members will rehearse the work for a week prior to the concert, and it will be just one of dozens of works they will perform each season, which are not repeated possibly for years. Also in order for the orchestra to truly perform as a unified ensemble they should literally be reading from the same page.
> 
> Muscle memory is something instrumentalists develop from practicing countless hours: scales, arpeggios, and other technical exercises as well as specific works. When a pianist (or any instrumentalist) performs the ideal is to know the work so well that the music appears to be spontaneous.
> 
> Playing from memory is certainly not a stunt to serve a performer's ego.


Are you suggesting that:

1. Playing with the score is less conducive to spontaneous sounding performances than playing from memory?

and/or that

2. Playing from memory is more conducive to spontaneous sounding performances than playing from memory?


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## pianozach (May 21, 2018)

Mandryka said:


> Are you suggesting that:
> 
> 1. Playing with the score is less conducive to spontaneous sounding performances than playing from memory?
> 
> ...


I don't know about either of those, but playing from memory is better from an audience POV. We tend to hear with our eyes. For example, *MTV* (when it first debuted).


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## EdwardBast (Nov 25, 2013)

Mandryka said:


> Are you suggesting that:
> 
> 1. Playing with the score is less conducive to spontaneous sounding performances than playing from memory?
> 
> ...


Presuming that the last word of your post should be "score," I would say both are undoubtedly true.


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## Mandryka (Feb 22, 2013)

EdwardBast said:


> Presuming that the last word of your post should be "score," I would say both are undoubtedly true.


The reason it caught my interest is that it looks like an empirical claim, and I'm not totally sure whether it's born out by the evidence. I just think it's really hard to say.

I saw Aimard play Stockhausen with a score and it sounded very spontaneous; I saw Pletnev play Scarlatti without one (I think!) and it didn't sound spontaneous.

I don't want to draw any conclusions, it just doesn't feel obvious to me.


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## amfortas (Jun 15, 2011)

Mandryka said:


> The reason it caught my interest is that it looks like an empirical claim, and I'm not totally sure whether it's born out by the evidence. I just think it's really hard to say.
> 
> I saw Aimard play Stockhausen with a score and it sounded very spontaneous; I saw Pletnev play Scarlatti without one (I think!) and it didn't sound spontaneous.
> 
> I don't want to draw any conclusions, it just doesn't feel obvious to me.


I'm not sure how well the analogy holds up, but back in my acting days, once I was "off book"--that is, had fully committed my part to memory, so that I didn't have to struggle for my next line--it gave me a greater freedom to interact spontaneously with the other performers around me.


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## DaveM (Jun 29, 2015)

In my experience, amateur pianists tend to not play classical works well from sight reading. There will be slight hesitations and a rather generic interpretation because they are concentrating on reading the score. I’ve always memorized works I play and then concentrate on things like touch, pedaling and interpretation.

Of course, there are very talented amateurs and, of course, professionals where they can read the score and play at a high level at the same time.


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## EdwardBast (Nov 25, 2013)

Mandryka said:


> The reason it caught my interest is that it looks like an empirical claim, and *I'm not totally sure whether it's born out by the evidence.* I just think it's really hard to say.
> 
> I saw Aimard play Stockhausen with a score and it sounded very spontaneous; I saw Pletnev play Scarlatti without one (I think!) and it didn't sound spontaneous.
> 
> I don't want to draw any conclusions, it just doesn't feel obvious to me.


The evidence is that virtually all virtuosos perform concertos from memory. It's not for show. So …


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## Luchesi (Mar 15, 2013)

Mandryka said:


> The reason it caught my interest is that it looks like an empirical claim, and I'm not totally sure whether it's born out by the evidence. I just think it's really hard to say.
> 
> I saw Aimard play Stockhausen with a score and it sounded very spontaneous; I saw Pletnev play Scarlatti without one (I think!) and it didn't sound spontaneous.
> 
> I don't want to draw any conclusions, it just doesn't feel obvious to me.


Well, there's different levels of using/checking a score. It can just be there to glance at, to instantly remind me at a glance of the whole concept of that section, what's before and what's to come. I can see how it would be distracting to see a soloist glued to every measure of the score, like a young student at his first recital. Because sight-reading is more like scanning whole sentences and paragraphs, otherwise, if not, stick to memorizing for a performance. Please everyone instead of no one.


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## amfortas (Jun 15, 2011)

EdwardBast said:


> The evidence is that virtually all virtuosos perform concertos from memory. It's not for show. So …


And a good thing, too. I mean, imagine a violin soloist, in the usual standing position, before a ridiculously raised music stand, trying to turn pages with a bow in one hand and a fiddle in the other.

Then again, they said Paganini could do it.


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## Luchesi (Mar 15, 2013)

marlow said:


> On a slightly different note, I am also in awe of the incredible sight reading skills of some musicians!


It becomes easier than reading Shakespeare sonnets. It's like having another written language, it becomes effortless/second nature, and one that's helped you to express indescribable thoughts and allusions for many decades. It's part of you.


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## Luchesi (Mar 15, 2013)

amfortas said:


> And a good thing, too. I mean, imagine a violin soloist, in the usual standing position, before a ridiculously raised music stand, trying to turn pages with a bow in one hand and a fiddle in the other.
> 
> Then again, they said Paganini could do it.


A friend and I had gone inside his house after a game of touch in the yard. His father was watching a piano concerto on TV. He didn't believe that any human brain could memorize all those notes etc.. He asserted that there must be a "television trick" to it.
My friend knew I was going to say "What? You believe what?" so he quickly escorted me outside. He said I shouldn't start arguing about this with his dad. He knew from experience. We were only 10 or 11.


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## amfortas (Jun 15, 2011)

Luchesi said:


> A friend and I had gone inside his house after a game of touch in the yard. His father was watching a piano concerto on TV. He didn't believe that any human brain could memorize all those notes etc.. He asserted that there must be a "television trick" to it.
> My friend knew I was going to say "What? You believe what?" so he quickly escorted me outside. He said I shouldn't start arguing about this with his dad. He knew from experience. We were only 10 or 11.


It's like the question an actor always gets after a performance from people who don't see much live theatre: "How do you remember all those words?"

All you can do is smile and say, "Thank you."


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## Luchesi (Mar 15, 2013)

amfortas said:


> It's like the question an actor always gets after a performance from people who don't see much live theatre: "How do you remember all those words?"
> 
> All you can do is smile and say, "Thank you."


I'm impressed with you guys. Don't you have somebody helping with lines from off stage left? But even so, that's tricky for the flow I imagine.. And most of the audience is hanging on every word and gesture you make.
OTOH, I can fake some things to 'blend' some mistakes until they're no longer glaring. I guess you can too, but musicians are very experienced at smoothing over finger faults, false starts and small lapses.


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## amfortas (Jun 15, 2011)

Luchesi said:


> I'm impressed with you guys. Don't you have somebody helping with lines from off stage left?


_" . . . or not to be!" _



Luchesi said:


> But even so, that's tricky for the flow I imagine.. And most of the audience is hanging on every word and gesture you make.
> OTOH, I can fake some things to 'blend' some mistakes until they're no longer glaring. I guess you can too, but musicians are very experienced at smoothing over finger faults, false starts and small lapses.


Actors who "go dry" usually rely on other actors onstage to help them out: "So, Horatio, I suppose you came here to tell me you saw the ghost of my father last night? Right?"

I'm not sure if there's any musical parallel.


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## marlow (11 mo ago)

amfortas said:


> And a good thing, too. I mean, imagine a violin soloist, in the usual standing position, before a ridiculously raised music stand, trying to turn pages with a bow in one hand and a fiddle in the other.
> 
> Then again, they said Paganini could do it.


And Clement who apparently played the first performance of the Beethoven from sight!


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## marlow (11 mo ago)

amfortas said:


> It's like the question an actor always gets after a performance from people who don't see much live theatre: "How do you remember all those words?"
> 
> All you can do is smile and say, "Thank you."


I have rarely acted as such but I have directed performances and I think I pretty well knew everyone's part off by heart by the first curtain. When teaching young people about public speaking I tell them you've either got to have notes in your head or on the paper in front of you. The one thing you mustn't do is to give the impression you're reading it. The notes are there just as a guidance. The great speechmakers make it appear spontaneous even if it isn't.


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## Mandryka (Feb 22, 2013)

EdwardBast said:


> The evidence is that virtually all virtuosos perform concertos from memory. It's not for show. So …


Well Stephen Hough would agree with you -- this is quite interesting, the transcript, worth reading

https://bulletproofmusician.com/ste...s-memorizing-music-really-all-that-important/


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## progmatist (Apr 3, 2021)

A soloist typically has nobody there to turn pages for them. The concertmaster by contrast has the principal associate concertmaster seated right next to them to turn pages.


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## progmatist (Apr 3, 2021)

On the flip side of the coin, I once watched a jazz recital on BYU-TV. A white Mormon kid was playing a difficult "improvised" piano solo, while sight reading the score.


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## Luchesi (Mar 15, 2013)

amfortas said:


> _" . . . or not to be!" _
> 
> Actors who "go dry" usually rely on other actors onstage to help them out: "So, Horatio, I suppose you came here to tell me you saw the ghost of my father last night? Right?"
> 
> I'm not sure if there's any musical parallel.


Heh, I don't know how my fellow musicians could signal me with helping to recall notes, like that. We would all need to know facial codes, like actors have.


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