# Who pulled the utter best missa l'homme armée :Dufay, Josquin, Ockeghem?



## deprofundis (Apr 25, 2014)

I have it all on naxos, i would have to say i favor old school ''déboire'' of early renaissance polyphony of Dufay over the two other, Ockeghem is the one i like the less' Josquin is interresting, music of Josquin has a special soul to it.

But i favor Ockeghem other missa and his chanson over Josquin...
What about you guys hmm???


:tiphat:


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## GreenMamba (Oct 14, 2012)

Josquin actually has two of them: sexit toni and super voces musicales. The latter might be my favorite. But really, it's hard to compare among the best of them.

Busnois, de la Rue and Palestrina also have good ones. Carissimi's is interesting because it is from the Baroque era. Arnold Rosner wrote one in 1971.


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## Mandryka (Feb 22, 2013)

How strange that secular song should serve as the basis for religious music, in an age where everything was symbolic. Has anyone read anything about this?


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## Pugg (Aug 8, 2014)

Mandryka said:


> How strange that secular song should serve as the basis for religious music, in an age where everything was symbolic. Has anyone read anything about this?


Not really did you?


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## Johnnie Burgess (Aug 30, 2015)

Mandryka said:


> How strange that secular song should serve as the basis for religious music, in an age where everything was symbolic. Has anyone read anything about this?


Martin Luther used beer hall tunes to right hymns.


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## Mandryka (Feb 22, 2013)

Johnnie Burgess said:


> Martin Luther used beer hall tunes to right hymns.


So was it a Lutheran thing? God is everywhere, even in the beer hall.


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## Johnnie Burgess (Aug 30, 2015)

Mandryka said:


> So was it a Lutheran thing? God is everywhere, even in the beer hall.


Or popular enough that people knew them. So the hymn would be easy to learn.


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## Mandryka (Feb 22, 2013)

Popular or not, I think it's interesting that a song like this

_The armed man should be feared.
Everywhere it has been proclaimed
That each man shall arm himself
With a coat of iron mail.
The armed man should be feared.
_
Should serve as the basis for a setting of this

_Lamb of God,
Who takest away the sins of the world,
have mercy upon us.
Lamb of God.
Grant us peace.
_


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## Johnnie Burgess (Aug 30, 2015)

Mandryka said:


> Popular or not, I think it's interesting that a song like this
> 
> _The armed man should be feared.
> Everywhere it has been proclaimed
> ...


It was written in times of war.


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## Pugg (Aug 8, 2014)

Mandryka said:


> So was it a Lutheran thing? God is everywhere, even in the beer hall.


This could be a possibility, nor sure though.


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## chesapeake bay (Aug 3, 2015)

Johnnie Burgess said:


> Martin Luther used beer hall tunes to right hymns.


I wonder who wrote the left hymns? or maybe they were just wrong


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## Pugg (Aug 8, 2014)

chesapeake bay said:


> I wonder who wrote the left hymns? or maybe they were just wrong


Most reasonable option.


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## GreenMamba (Oct 14, 2012)

Mandryka said:


> So was it a Lutheran thing? God is everywhere, even in the beer hall.


It began long before Lutherans existed.


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## Mandryka (Feb 22, 2013)

My point about Luther was silly, I wasn't thinking. 

So what's the earliest religious music we have that's based on a popular secular song?


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## Johnnie Burgess (Aug 30, 2015)

Mandryka said:


> My point about Luther was silly, I wasn't thinking.
> 
> So what's the earliest religious music we have that's based on a popular secular song?


St. Clement of Alexandria before 200 AD used secular songs of his time to make religious music.


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