# What composers said about themselves



## KenOC (Mar 7, 2011)

Always interesting to hear composers speak of their own efforts. Here's Haydn:

"I was never a quick writer, but composed with great care and effort."

Didn't seem to harm his productivity... :lol:


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## Woodduck (Mar 17, 2014)

KenOC said:


> Always interesting to hear composers speak of their own efforts. Here's Haydn:
> 
> "I was never a quick writer, but composed with great care and effort."
> 
> Didn't seem to harm his productivity... :lol:


Apparently you were quick only if you turned out 500 concertos. 104 symphonies and 68 string quartets just didn't cut it.


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## KenOC (Mar 7, 2011)

“Nevertheless the passions, whether violent or not, should never be so expressed as to reach the point of causing disgust; and music, even in situations of the greatest horror, should never be painful to the ear but should flatter and charm it, and thereby always remain music.” –Mozart


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## Judith (Nov 11, 2015)

What did Schumann say about himself through his delirium? Think he knew he was ill??


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## Art Rock (Nov 28, 2009)

I may not be a first-rate composer, but I am a first-class second-rate composer (Richard Strauss).


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## tdc (Jan 17, 2011)

"Great music must always come from the heart. Music that is made only with technique and intellect is not worth the paper it is written on."

"I am not a modern composer in the strictest sense of the word, because my music is an evolution, not a revolution. While I have always been receptive to new ideas in music, I have never tried to throw the laws of harmony and composition into the discard. On the contrary, I have always drawn inspiration generously from the masters. I have never stopped studying Mozart. To the greatest extent possible my music is built upon the traditions of the past and grows out of them."

"Sincerity is of no value unless one's conscience helps to make it apparent. This conscience compels us to turn ourselves into good craftsmen. My objective, therefore, is technical perfection. I can strive unceasingly to this end, since I am certain of never being able to attain it. The important thing is to get nearer to it all the time."

Maurice Ravel


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## CypressWillow (Apr 2, 2013)

Gershwin was an admirer of Stravinsky. When they met, Gershwin is said to have asked Stravinsky for lessons. Stravinsky reportedly asked Gershwin how much money he (Gershwin) had earned in the previous year. When Gershwin told him, Stravinsky purportedly said, "Then I should take lessons with you!" :lol:


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## elgar's ghost (Aug 8, 2010)

_'I am not like other people - I have finer nerves. I must have beauty, radiance and light. The world owes me what I need! I can't live the miserable life of an organist like your Master Bach! Is it such an outrageous demand to say that I deserve the little bit of luxury that I can bear? I, who can give pleasure to thousands?'_

Dick Cartwright


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## SixFootScowl (Oct 17, 2011)

My favorite from Ludwig van Beethoven:



> "Prince, what you are, you are by accident of birth; what I am, I am through my own efforts. There have been thousands of princes and will be thousands more; there is only one Beethoven!"*


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## Agamemnon (May 1, 2017)

tdc said:


> "Great music must always come from the heart. Music that is made only with technique and intellect is not worth the paper it is written on."
> 
> Maurice Ravel


I think this mirrors my quote of Debussy which generated so much fuss. LOL.


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## Guest (Sep 22, 2017)

Florestan said:


> My favorite from Ludwig van Beethoven:


There is much truth in this quote but not entirely.Sure there is one Beethoven but it is not only effort wich made him great,much talent is involved and that was just a gift of nature.
The statement he made is a bit 
proud-hearted


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## brianvds (May 1, 2013)

KenOC said:


> "Nevertheless the passions, whether violent or not, should never be so expressed as to reach the point of causing disgust; and music, even in situations of the greatest horror, should never be painful to the ear but should flatter and charm it, and thereby always remain music." -Mozart


Why do I get this feeling Mozart would not have liked Beethoven's music all that much?


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## KenOC (Mar 7, 2011)

“It is not hard to compose, but what is fabulously hard is to leave the superfluous notes under the table.” --Brahms

There are those who say that Brahms wasn't really very good at that. I seem to remember Hermann Hesse had him wearing his "too many notes" as heavy iron chains that he had to drag around for eternity.


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## Dedalus (Jun 27, 2014)

Traverso said:


> There is much truth in this quote but not entirely.Sure there is one Beethoven but it is not only effort wich made him great,much talent is involved and that was just a gift of nature.
> The statement he made is a bit
> proud-hearted


While there is something to be said for natural ability given by your genes I think most of what makes a person is hard work, dedication, practice, and perhaps a bit of single mindedness that makes a person great. Nobody becomes great on raw talent alone


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## Gordontrek (Jun 22, 2012)

CypressWillow said:


> Gershwin was an admirer of Stravinsky. When they met, Gershwin is said to have asked Stravinsky for lessons. Stravinsky reportedly asked Gershwin how much money he (Gershwin) had earned in the previous year. When Gershwin told him, Stravinsky purportedly said, "Then I should take lessons with you!" :lol:


I also believe he asked Ravel for lessons, and received the famous reply "I would only make you a bad Ravel, and you're already such a wonderful Gershwin."
With all this praise from the heavyweights I'm sure Gershwin had no self-esteem issues!


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## bz3 (Oct 15, 2015)

Good thread.



KenOC said:


> "It is not hard to compose, but what is fabulously hard is to leave the superfluous notes under the table." --Brahms
> 
> There are those who say that Brahms wasn't really very good at that. I seem to remember Hermann Hesse had him wearing his "too many notes" as heavy iron chains that he had to drag around for eternity.


Nothing against Hesse but I totally disagree. _Maybe_ early Brahms but anything mid-career or later I would put second to only Beethoven in terms of concise use of material. In fact when they splurged (Missa Solemnis, Brahms Violin Concerto and maybe the 2nd Piano Concerto) it was all the more effective because of how spare their aesthetic had become.


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## Guest (Sep 23, 2017)

Dedalus said:


> While there is something to be said for natural ability given by your genes I think most of what makes a person is hard work, dedication, practice, and perhaps a bit of single mindedness that makes a person great. Nobody becomes great on raw talent alone


Very true,but without talent you can work hard as hard as you can without any result.


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## Mal (Jan 1, 2016)

KenOC said:


> Always interesting to hear composers speak of their own efforts. Here's Haydn:
> 
> "I was never a quick writer, but composed with great care and effort."
> 
> Didn't seem to harm his productivity... :lol:


Never mind the quality feel the boredom, in quotes and works. (OK that's a bit unfair... but some truth in it... especially on the quotes side. Did he ever say anything interesting?)


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## isorhythm (Jan 2, 2015)

"I was obliged to be industrious. Whoever is equally industrious will succeed equally well."

-J.S. Bach


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## cimirro (Sep 6, 2016)

"I am fat"
A.Cimirro
:lol:


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## Pat Fairlea (Dec 9, 2015)

isorhythm said:


> "I was obliged to be industrious. Whoever is equally industrious will succeed equally well."
> 
> -J.S. Bach


Was he referring to his musical output or his abundant offspring?


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## Bettina (Sep 29, 2016)

cimirro said:


> "I am fat"
> A.Cimirro
> :lol:


Based on your website pictures, you don't look fat in my opinion. But even if you've put on some weight recently, you're in good company with Rossini and Brahms!


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## Gaspard de la Nuit (Oct 20, 2014)

"I was not made like other people" - Wagner

Sometimes I think that....so many want to be unique or special.....but if you truly are so different from others, you are likely to be alone.


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## laurie (Jan 12, 2017)

" Music is, for me, like a beautiful mosaic which God has put together. He takes all the pieces in his hand, throws them into the world, & we have to recreate the picture from the pieces".
~ Jean Sibelius

And he also said this ...

" If I could express the same thing with words as with music, I would, of course, use a verbal expression. 
Music is something autonomous and much richer. Music begins where the possibilities of language end. 
That is why I write music".


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## cimirro (Sep 6, 2016)

Bettina said:


> Based on your website pictures, you don't look fat in my opinion. But even if you've put on some weight recently, you're in good company with Rossini and Brahms!


Ha-Haaaaaa! naughty girl!
So it was you looking at my pictures on my website!!!! I knew it, I knew it...

(no, I'm the same... only some months older now)


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## KenOC (Mar 7, 2011)

“Straight-away the ideas flow in upon me, directly from God, and not only do I see distinct themes in my mind's eye, but they are clothed in the right forms, harmonies, and orchestration.” --Brahms


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## KenOC (Mar 7, 2011)

"The withering away of illusions is a long and dreary process, like a toothache. But you can pull out a tooth. Illusions, dead, continue to rot within us. And stink. And you can't escape them. I carry all of mine around with me." -Shostakovich (quoted in _Testimony_)

This guy must have been fun at parties.


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## tdc (Jan 17, 2011)

KenOC said:


> "Straight-away the ideas flow in upon me, directly from God, and not only do I see distinct themes in my mind's eye, but they are clothed in the right forms, harmonies, and orchestration." --Brahms


Interesting, I have not come across this quote before. Perhaps this puts to rest the idea Dvorak put forth that Brahms believes in nothing!


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## hpowders (Dec 23, 2013)

cimirro said:


> "I am fat"
> A.Cimirro
> :lol:


U B Sharp.


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## SixFootScowl (Oct 17, 2011)

Wow, there seems to be some contradiction between these two (my bold), but perhaps it all works out in greater context.



> Ever since I began to compose, I have remained true to my starting principle: not to write a page because no matter what public, or what pretty girl wanted it to be thus or thus; *but to write solely as I myself thought best, and as it gave me pleasure*.


 Felix Mendelssohn



> And do you agree with me, that the first condition of an artist should be to bear respect toward what is great, and to bow to it and acknowledge it *and not attempt to extinguish great flames for the sake of making his own rushlight burn more brightly*?


Felix Mendelssohn


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## cimirro (Sep 6, 2016)

hpowders said:


> U B Sharp.


well, A(m) f(l)at + B sharp...
three more notes and we have a theme for a new piece!


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## Woodduck (Mar 17, 2014)

Gaspard de la Nuit said:


> "I was not made like other people" - Wagner
> 
> Sometimes I think that....so many want to be unique or special.....but if you truly are so different from others, you are likely to be alone.


Wagner was extraverted, gregarious, and loquacious. He was probably alone only when composing or writing. It's nevertheless obvious that he was not made like other people.


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## lextune (Nov 25, 2016)

"I want to be the brightest light, the greatest, and only sun. I want to illuminate the universe with my light. I want to swallow all and include all in my individuality. I want to give to the world pleasure. I want to seize the world as I would a woman. 
I create the world by the play of my mood, my smile, my sigh, my caress, anger, hope, doubt. And with this caprice, this passing wish, I create all history as I create the future. All is my wish, my dream, and I am aware of all of this." -Scriabin, 1904


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## brianvds (May 1, 2013)

KenOC said:


> "Straight-away the ideas flow in upon me, directly from God, and not only do I see distinct themes in my mind's eye, but they are clothed in the right forms, harmonies, and orchestration." --Brahms


And here I thought Brahms wasn't particularly religious...


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## ArtMusic (Jan 5, 2013)

Handel said of his own music: "Purcell would have composed greater music than this" (referring to Handel's own music), or some words to that effect.


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## laurie (Jan 12, 2017)

lextune said:


> "I want to be the brightest light, the greatest, and only sun. I want to illuminate the universe with my light. I want to swallow all and include all in my individuality. I want to give to the world pleasure. I want to seize the world as I would a woman.
> I create the world by the play of my mood, my smile, my sigh, my caress, anger, hope, doubt. And with this caprice, this passing wish, I create all history as I create the future. All is my wish, my dream, and I am aware of all of this." -Scriabin, 1904


Wow, Scriabin certainly didn't suffer from any low self esteem issues!


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## R3PL4Y (Jan 21, 2016)

KenOC said:


> "The withering away of illusions is a long and dreary process, like a toothache. But you can pull out a tooth. Illusions, dead, continue to rot within us. And stink. And you can't escape them. I carry all of mine around with me." -Shostakovich (quoted in _Testimony_)
> 
> This guy must have been fun at parties.


I am very skeptical of anything that comes out of that book. There has been a great deal of criticism and doubt cast upon the accuracy of many of the statements in it, and many of the claims that the author makes are completely unsubstantiated aside from his own alleged conversations with Shostakovich.


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## Woodduck (Mar 17, 2014)

brianvds said:


> And here I thought Brahms wasn't particularly religious...


He wasn't. God is a useful metaphor.


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## tdc (Jan 17, 2011)

Woodduck said:


> He wasn't. God is a useful metaphor.


Even if used metaphorically it still seems to be suggestive that he believed in _something_ of a spiritual nature.


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## DeepR (Apr 13, 2012)

laurie said:


> Wow, Scriabin certainly didn't suffer from any low self esteem issues!


The more I read about him and especially by him, the more confused I get. How could such a seemingly silly man be such a great artist? (let's not forget he was also a great pianist) 
I'm no expert, but perhaps deep down inside he was actually a very insecure little man, with low self esteem. So to compensate, he had to believe in his own fantasies and convince himself he was special and great. Maybe that's the only way he could function as an artist. And so his narcissistic artistic persona with messiah complex and delusions of grandeur was created. But I could be wrong. He could've been seriously delusional. Either way, it didn't stop him from being a great composer.


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## Pat Fairlea (Dec 9, 2015)

One more from Sibelius:

"Whereas most other modern composers are engaged in manufacturing cocktails of every hue and description, I offer the public cold spring water"

Supposedly said about his own 6th symphony, of which he also said:

"It always puts me in mind of the smell of the first snow of winter"

And that, I think, is the most peculiar and accurate thing ever said about a symphony!


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## Omicron9 (Oct 13, 2016)

Gaspard de la Nuit said:


> "I was not made like other people" - Wagner
> 
> Sometimes I think that....so many want to be unique or special.....but if you truly are so different from others, you are likely to be alone.


Well-said, Gaspard.


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## Omicron9 (Oct 13, 2016)

"Good composers borrow. Great composers steal." -- Stravinsky


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## Marinera (May 13, 2016)

Omicron9 said:


> "Good composers borrow. Great composers steal." -- Stravinsky


Picasso said the same only about painting. Interesting who 'borrowed' this from whom, or is this the case of great minds thinking alike, I wonder.


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## cimirro (Sep 6, 2016)

Marinera said:


> Picasso said the same only about painting. Interesting who 'borrowed' this from whom, or is this the case of great minds thinking alike, I wonder.


Actually it seems it was said by "Banksy" now...


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## Rambler (Oct 20, 2017)

Just arrived today in the post:
*Shostakovich Symphony 10* Royal Liverpool Philharmonic conducted by Vasily Peternko on Naxos

*Wagner Lohengrin* conducted by Semton Bychkov on WDR Profil

Two composers I have mixed feeling about. I'm a bigger fan of the Shostakovich string quartets than I am of the symphonies. This disc is performed by an orchestra and conductor I have heard numerous times at the concert hall, so I thought I should give it a try.

As to the Wagner, I'm always happy to invest hours in listening to The Ring. I have found the earlier operas no where near as compelling. But it's several years ago that I last listened to one - so I'll give Lohengrin a hearing and see if I fall for it!


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## Woodduck (Mar 17, 2014)

Rambler said:


> View attachment 98619
> 
> View attachment 98620
> 
> ...


I think you may not have noticed what thread you were posting in.


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## Rambler (Oct 20, 2017)

Woodduck said:


> I think you may not have noticed what thread you were posting in.


Yes, this was supposed to have gone in latest purchases!! Don't know how I managed to be so incompetent!!!


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## Enthusiast (Mar 5, 2016)

brianvds said:


> Why do I get this feeling Mozart would not have liked Beethoven's music all that much?


I wonder. I suspect he would have found much to admire. I can remember a TV programme that showed among other things Haydn listening to the Eroica with both reservation and respect (I have no idea how true or likely that dramatisation was). I do find it stimulating to think of how great composers might respond to music that came after them.


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## RICK RIEKERT (Oct 9, 2017)

The work I've done is the work I know, and the work I do is the work I don't know. I don't know what I'm doing.
~Philip Glass

To render my works properly requires a combination of extreme precision and irresistible verve, a regulated vehemence, a dreamy tenderness, and an almost morbid melancholy.
~Hector Berlioz.


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## regenmusic (Oct 23, 2014)

Quote Originally Posted by brianvds View Post
And here I thought Brahms wasn't particularly religious... 


Woodduck said:


> He wasn't. God is a useful metaphor.


You and others keep spouting these lies about Brahms and probably others you revisionists accuse of being atheists:

"In my study, I can lay my hands on my Bible in the dark."
Johannes Brahms, who has a whole chapter in "Spiritual Lives of the Great Composers." He was a student of Luther's works.

"I will now tell you and our young friend how about my method of communicating with the Infinite, for all truly inspired ideas come from God. Beethhoven, who was my ideal, was well aware of this."
Johannes Brahms

People should get that book or interlibrary loan it because it tells the true story of Elgar, Vaughn Williams, Chopin, and others people try to accuse of atheism.


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## Becca (Feb 5, 2015)

regenmusic said:


> People should get that book or interlibrary loan it because it tells the true story of Elgar, *Vaughn Williams*, Chopin, and others people try to accuse of atheism.


Why does the fact that someone put it in a book make it the 'true story'? I suggest that you read Ursula Vaughan Williams' 1988 biography of her late husband: "_He was an atheist during his later years at Charterhouse and at Cambridge, though he later drifted into a cheerful agnosticism: he was never a professing Christian._" I suspect that she knew her husband better than whoever wrote the book you mentioned.


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## KenOC (Mar 7, 2011)

regenmusic said:


> People should get that book or interlibrary loan it because it tells the true story...


I usually find that the "true story" is the one I most want to believe.


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