# improvising out of key ? Amin over Dmin/Emin etc..



## johnfkingmatrix

i have only A MINOR/C MAJ patterns memorized on my guitar, and i just cue up corresponding backing tracks and solo over it (c maj d dorian e phrygian ETC) and it sounds good and i understand the concept/ sound of modes now, but... then i noticed if i solo Amin over.. Emin it sounds OK too... same with Amin over Dmin ... i assumed it was because it was a closely related key and there are only 1 note differences.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Closely_related_key

i found this chart and i see what im doing is like.. maybe playing the mediant/subdominant etc? 
is there a "sound" of soloing Amin over Dmin called "the mediant" (the same way there is a sound of any given mode) or am i just being lazy and soloing with a closely related scale ?

i notice it doesnt sound wrong, but it doesnt exactly have a distinct sound like the modes do. it seems kind of crucial to know the root (tonic?) note of the actual backing track.. like if im doing Amin pattern over Emin .. knowing that i periodically should fall back on the E in a climactic moment rather than on the A seems important.

So what's going on here, and is there more to look into with this (such as when i discovered modes), or should i just figure out which notes i need to change to be in key and stop being lazy lol

thanks for all of your answers, in advance.


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## Phil loves classical

Not exactly sure what you're asking, but I would say forget the scale degrees, and just go with the chords of closely related keys. It'll work out on its own when you're improvising.


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## johnfkingmatrix

hey,
im saying that (as far as i know) when im selecting notes to play over any given key, the notes that i choose should be from that key. Like if i have a chord progression in the key of C, i just look at the C scale and can use any of those notes in my improv/compositions. It would go to reason that if i choose like F# scale to improv over C it isn't going to work because there are going to be tons of dissonant notes, since they are very distantly related keys

I realize that in the key of C i am not limited to purely the (diatonic?) notes of the C scale, but can also select from corresponding harmonic minor /exotic scales/base it upon the exact chord that is going on at that moment Etc. But my question deals purely with the actual diatonic scales, and how they would work over an entire chord progression that is technically a different key- as it seems that the entire F and G scales both work OK over C, presumably because they are closely related. 

My question is: is this a thing that is intentionally done for a specific sound (soloing in the key of F over a chord progression that is in the key of C , for instance) or is it just improving with a scale thats "close enough" and the one "sour note" (Bb in this case) likely won't clash too often, causing me to mistakenly assume its working out well.

I guess in this case the only "sound" of doing this would be a FLAT 7 here ? aka mixolydian mode.. maybe i answered my own question lol 

but then again the backing will have a regular 7, so now i have a 1 2 3 4 5 6 b7 7 
aka bebop scale.. so thats whats happening when i do this?


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## Phil loves classical

Forgot about this thread. I think I know what you're getting at. I see more than one possible answer. In common practice, if you play F major chords with C major triads with the left hand as a chord progression, you can play just about whatever you want with notes in those 2 scales (with B natural or Bb) for whatever melody you have in mind and it would work out, whether your tonic is C or F, or Am or Dm (if you raise the 7th note). You could go even further like G or Bb or their relative minors in your chord progression (a Bb chord is called a borrowed chord in the key of C, since there is no Bb in C), but the notes in your right hand would need to adjust accordingly to the scale or a closely related key. 

You can even have your right hand play a melody in G and left hand play a melody in say F for a bitonal effect, but you're getting out of common practice harmony. Forget about other modes with the circle of fifths, you're talking just Major and Minor keys.

A lot depends on your harmonization, the notes you pick on the strong beat, your tonic and counterpoint and stuff, but the concept of the circle of fifths is to show the relation between keys.


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## tdc

Some performers like to focus on matching up certain scales over chords, some performers choose to focus more on melodic material and the expansion of it. There are different approaches to improvisation. A lot depends on how chromaticism is used, how things are phrased and how one uses passing notes. All 12 notes of the chromatic scale can be seen to have some kind of use in any given key. Ted Greene opened up a lecture about improvisation that way once, that a person shouldn't think of any notes as being outside of any key.


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## MAXSWAGGER

When it sounds good go ahead and figure out why.

Don't try to figure out why something should sound good.


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