# Erda Bonus Round



## The Conte (May 31, 2015)

I have two Erdas we didn't get to hear in the Erda contest a few weeks back. Which do you think sang it better and why?

Ruth Siewert





Maria von Ilosvay





Both are from 1953.

N.


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## ALT (Mar 1, 2021)

Siewert is about perfect. The video for von Ilosvay is “not available” in my browser, unfortunately. Both are new names to me, by the way.


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## Shaughnessy (Dec 31, 2020)

Maria von Ilosvay is showing as "Video Unavailable" in the US - This one is available but if it's not the one that you wish to showcase, I'll pull it.


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## The Conte (May 31, 2015)

Shaughnessy said:


> Maria von Ilosvay is showing as "Video Unavailable" in the US - This one is available but if it's not the one that you wish to showcase, I'll pull it.


The one I posted was with Keilberth, but they are from the same year and the Krauss is in better sound, I'm happy with the Krauss as a replacement.

N.


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## Woodduck (Mar 17, 2014)

Both of these singers were prominent at postwar Bayreuth. Von Ilosvay hasn't the contralto depth I want, and Krauss's fast tempo further militates against the serene gravity Erda should project. Siewert's version is better in both respects, really first-rate.


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## The Conte (May 31, 2015)

I've now added the poll at the top of the thread!

N.


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## MAS (Apr 15, 2015)

Siewert is spectacular_! _


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## OffPitchNeb (Jun 6, 2016)

I enjoy Siewert and von Ilosvay equally, but it was Furtwangler who made me pick the former.


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## The Conte (May 31, 2015)

It's remarkable to think that 1953 gave us three great recordings of the Ring (with the Keilberth being my favourite) and the 50s Bayreuth recordings preserve a legacy that certainly haven't been equalled since. We may prefer the likes of Melchior, Flagstad, Leider and Lawrence in the main roles, but overall there's no competition for the Bayreuth recordings IMO. The only drawback is the sound. Therefore I wanted to see how TCers felt about these two Erdas.

Siewert is wonderful. The rich, contralto voice is perfect for Erda. I also like the way Furtwaengler's slow tempo and attitude allow the music to grow organically. Siewert doesn't do much with the words and music, allowing it to speak for itself. This results in her coming across as a force of nature.Perfect for the earth goddess.

I like Ilosvay too and find it hard to choose between the two. Ilosvay sounds more womanly to my ear and her enunciation of the text means the words flow out as if she is speaking. However, I prefer Siewert's otherworldliness.

Siewert wins!

N.


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## ColdGenius (9 mo ago)

I think both singers are first class. Again the ratio of transcendence and sexuality of Erda is discussed. Maria von Ilosvay is here like Christa Ludwig was in her contest, more womanly. But for me she is also no less otherworldly, not diminishing the excellence of Ruth Siewert's work.


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## Woodduck (Mar 17, 2014)

ColdGenius said:


> Again the ratio of transcendence and sexuality of Erda is discussed.


What's sexual about Erda?


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## ColdGenius (9 mo ago)

Woodduck said:


> What's sexual about Erda?


Her affair with Wotan is several times mentioned in Der Ring. When she leaves in Rheingold Wotan is trying to follow her. As in Schmitt's "The Libertine": She is a real woman, she's left, but you keep on thinking about her!" In Walküre Wotan and Frika and Brunhilde discuss it. In Siegfried he reminds about their liaison again. In Götterdämmerung Brunhilde remembers them as her parents, without any association to presumed love affair. But it's a part where Wotan doesn't appear and just hasn't a possibility to tell about his adventure. And don't underestimate Erda. She's a respectful chtonic divinity and sex is an equal part of her entity among others or even a basic way of interaction with others, like in Greek Geo.


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## Woodduck (Mar 17, 2014)

ColdGenius said:


> Her affair with Wotan is several times mentioned in Der Ring. When she leaves in Rheingold Wotan is trying to follow her. As in Schmitt's "The Libertine": She is a real woman, she's left, but you keep on thinking about her!" In Walküre Wotan and Frika and Brunhilde discuss it. In Siegfried he reminds about their liaison again. In Götterdämmerung Brunhilde remembers them as her parents, without any association to presumed love affair. But it's a part where Wotan doesn't appear and just hasn't a possibility to tell about his adventure. And don't underestimate Erda. She's a respectful chtonic divinity and sex is an equal part of her entity among others or even a basic way of interaction with others, like in Greek Geo.


Hmmm....... I wonder what Wagner would say about this. I know only that there isn't a hint of sexuality in Erda's music or words. Menopause, I suppose...


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## ColdGenius (9 mo ago)

[QUOTE="Woodduck] Menopause, I suppose... 
[/QUOTE]
... That was followed by hyperovulation.


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## Woodduck (Mar 17, 2014)

ColdGenius said:


> [QUOTE="Woodduck] Menopause, I suppose...
> ... That was followed by hyperovulation.


Your intimate knowledge of the woman is making me uncomfortable.


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