# Solti's reputation



## fugueforthought (Nov 28, 2013)

I was under the impression (even from years ago) that Sir Georg Solti was a huge name in the conducting world, that his reputation was one of success and genius. Even before I spend tons of money on a classical music collection and downloaded scores and became fascinated with the history and culture of classical music, it was a name I associated with the Chicago symphony. So when I went to look into box sets of the symphonies of Mahler, Bruckner, and Brahms (not at the same time), I bought Solti's Mahler set (as a novice, thinking any performance was as good as another). 
Come to find out, years later, after hearing people like Boulez and Bernstein and Sanderling and Chailly, etc., it seems Solti's reputation with Mahler is.... mediocre.
I'm just using Mahler as an example, and while a quick look at Amazon may show it has four stars or something, I don't quite take that as an unbiased appraisal. In all of my research and looking into definitive recordings of Mahler symphonies, only the seventh (and perhaps the eighth; I can't remember) were noted by a few people as being standout recordings. Solti was my go-to for a first listen of a Mahler piece, a rather neutral recording (something less emotionally flooded than perhaps a Bernstein rendition), but I do prefer Solti over, say, Ozawa's traversal.
Anyway, is it just some misunderstanding I had that Solti was one of the greatest conductors of the previous century? Because it seems much of his work (that I've looked for) is somewhat panned, or at least not considered definitive or special. I've read reviews of people panning his Bruckner cycle, etc. Just a thought. Does he have a repertoire (opera? Wagner?) where he really shines? Thanks.


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## DiesIraeCX (Jul 21, 2014)

Let me say this to begin with, if *YOU* enjoy Solti's recordings of your favorite composers, that's all that matters. Secondly, Solti is generally considered one the great conductors of the 20th century. But ultimately, it's what you like that matters. If your favorite conductor is some unknown Mongolian guy named Genghis Furtajan, then so be it. It is what it is, regardless of his reputation.

Also, let me add that I've heard Solti's name come up when discussing a wide range of composers. I've heard people swear by his Beethoven, Brahms, Mahler, Bruckner, Wagner, etc. etc.


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## fugueforthought (Nov 28, 2013)

DiesIraeVIX said:


> Let me say this to begin with, if *YOU* enjoy Solti's recordings of your favorite composers, that's all that matters.


Well said. It's true that all of this is highly subjective. I suppose what I was worried about is getting too used to a 'poor' (or perhaps more objectively, 'inaccurate'?) rendition of a symphony and being unable to appreciate or not enjoying a truer, more accurate performance. But yes, I am in no position to criticize Solti's recordings in any way. I can't pinpoint specific faults in his work. I still listen to them. I adore Yoel Levi's recording of Mahler's second with the Atlanta Symphony. For me, that's the one, but I get your point. It just seems that his name seems to be absent from (if not panned in) many discussions of the 'definitive' recordings. Then again, Bernstein seems also to be hailed in many of the same discussions, while I tend not to care for his tendency to "over-gild the lily" in his interpretations. To each his own. Again, just using Mahler's works as an example. I think I actually also have Solti's Beethoven, and haven't listened to any of his Brahms yet. Thanks again.


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## Celloissimo (Mar 29, 2013)

I really dig any of Solti's interpretations of Wagner. Other than that, I'm not really that familiar with his output.


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## fugueforthought (Nov 28, 2013)

Celloissimo said:


> I really dig any of Solti's interpretations of Wagner.


Wagner is a nut I have yet to crack. Well, opera in general, I suppose. The only Wagner cycle I have Karajan's with the Berlin Philharmonic, and... I've only listened to _Das Rheingold_ thus far. It's just... a lot of music, so much so that I cannot even begin to appreciate it to the point of differentiating and comparing different traversals. It is beautiful music, for sure, but one seventeen-hour set is enough for now. I also hear great things about Barenboim's Wagner, among others.


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## Celloissimo (Mar 29, 2013)

In my opinion, Furtwangler reigns supreme when it comes to Wagner. James Levine conducting the original Met Ring with Hildegard Behrens is also timeless.


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## StlukesguildOhio (Dec 25, 2006)

I must agree with the comments made by DiesIrae. Favorite conductors are as much an issue of personal taste as favorite composers. I would add that all conductors have a limited range or oeuvre in which they are at their finest. I wouldn't turn to Solti or Karajan for Handel, Bach, or Monteverdi.

Having said that, I find that there are more than a few recordings by Solti I would not be without...







He looks like more than an average composer by far.


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## Celloissimo (Mar 29, 2013)

By classical music standards, the Carmen is a pretty risqué album cover.


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## StlukesguildOhio (Dec 25, 2006)

Furtwangler's _Tristan und Isolde_ is essential, but there are a number of recordings of the the _Ring_ that I would choose before Furtwangler... including Solti and the "Four K's": Hans Knappertsbusch, Clemens Krauss, Joseph Keilberth, and Herbert von Karajan.


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## Morimur (Jan 23, 2014)

DiesIraeVIX said:


> If your favorite conductor is some unknown Mongolian guy named Genghis Furtajan, then so be it. It is what it is, regardless of his reputation.


Genghis Furtajan? Don't ever mention that name in my presence! He's an @$$H0L€ and a terrible, horrible conductor!


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## StlukesguildOhio (Dec 25, 2006)

By classical music standards, the Carmen is a pretty risqué album cover.

Opera d'oro is known for their Surreal and Risqué covers of live opera recordings:


__
Sensitive content, not recommended for those under 18
Show Content


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## DiesIraeCX (Jul 21, 2014)

Celloissimo said:


> By classical music standards, the Carmen is a pretty risqué album cover.


I'll have to confiscate that album cover for my... um, archives, yes.


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## musicrom (Dec 29, 2013)

I listened to Solti's version of Mahler's 5th today, and it was a bit underwhelming. I'm not sure that it was necessarily his fault; the instruments just all sounded weird in the recording. As for his reputation, I couldn't say much because I hadn't heard of him prior (but I haven't heard of most conductors so that doesn't say much at all).


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## Giordano (Aug 10, 2014)

Solti is one of the greats, IMO. 
Among the music that I (still) listen to, 
I really like his Beethoven's 9th (1972 & 1986), 
and Mozart's Die Zauberflöte (1991).


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## hpowders (Dec 23, 2013)

My favorite Solti performance is of a work I usually avoid, Schubert's 9th Symphony with the Vienna Philharmonic.

Solti almost has me convinced!


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## Lukecash12 (Sep 21, 2009)

fugueforthought said:


> Well said. It's true that all of this is highly subjective. I suppose what I was worried about is getting too used to a 'poor' (or perhaps more objectively, 'inaccurate'?) rendition of a symphony and being unable to appreciate or not enjoying a truer, more accurate performance. But yes, I am in no position to criticize Solti's recordings in any way. I can't pinpoint specific faults in his work. I still listen to them. I adore Yoel Levi's recording of Mahler's second with the Atlanta Symphony. For me, that's the one, but I get your point. It just seems that his name seems to be absent from (if not panned in) many discussions of the 'definitive' recordings. Then again, Bernstein seems also to be hailed in many of the same discussions, while I tend not to care for his tendency to "over-gild the lily" in his interpretations. To each his own. Again, just using Mahler's works as an example. I think I actually also have Solti's Beethoven, and haven't listened to any of his Brahms yet. Thanks again.


I think this is just because of the nature of the beast with music critics. They tend to be very opinionated, obviously that's why they are music critics, and not only that but they can have a narrow view of what constitutes "good", "emotional", "original", or "accurate". This can be quite clear when the same music critic derides the efforts of one conductor and praises another, when both of them are excellent conductors. It's been my experience so far that because of this I'm not so interested in music critics any more, they all seem to think they know literally everything about music, and are very insular and arrogant (no offense to any music critics here, this isn't the case across the board). In the end many of them are ideologues no better than Boulez or Stravinsky.


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## Blake (Nov 6, 2013)

Lukecash12 said:


> I think this is just because of the nature of the beast with music critics. They tend to be very opinionated, obviously that's why they are music critics, and not only that but they can have a narrow view of what constitutes "good", "emotional", "original", or "accurate". This can be quite clear when the same music critic derides the efforts of one conductor and praises another, when both of them are excellent conductors. It's been my experience so far that because of this I'm not so interested in music critics any more, they all seem to think they know literally everything about music, and are very insular and arrogant (no offense to any music critics here, this isn't the case across the board). *In the end many of them are ideologues no better than Boulez or Stravinsky.*


I'd assumed that Boulez and Stravinsky have earned a spot much higher than that of a simple ideologue or critic. They have walked just as much as they've talked.


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## aleazk (Sep 30, 2011)

Lukecash12 said:


> In the end many of them are ideologues no better than Boulez or Stravinsky.


Nonsense, "bro"...


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## Haydn man (Jan 25, 2014)

hpowders said:


> My favorite Solti performance is of a work I usually avoid, Schubert's 9th Symphony with the Vienna Philharmonic.
> 
> Solti almost has me convinced!


I will second that, as this is a favourite of mine.
I think Solti was always an interesting conductor but perhaps not an inspired one. He always seemed to get good but not great reviews but I have enjoyed several of the works already mentioned
All down to taste in the end


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## Blake (Nov 6, 2013)

His Brahms is exceptional.


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## Couchie (Dec 9, 2010)

He has the most consistent Wagner. The only one not worth your time is the Tristan.


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## GGluek (Dec 11, 2011)

Solti’s reputation is as a great but flawed conductor, some of which have worn well, some not. He was an electrifying podium presence who had a way of drawing full-throated playing out of a virtuoso orchestra while still leaving room for the music to breathe when needed. When he stomped on the gas – to use an automotive analogy from his era – as in the faster Enigma variations, it was like being in a Shelby Cobra, or perhaps riding a Harley. (Karajan’s BPO at the time was like being in a Porsche, or on a BMW road bike.)
Before he came to the U.S. his reputation rested primarily on recordings for Decca – some very good Bartok , good Schumann, and a couple of okay Mahlers with the LSO, a landmark Ring cycle and an extraordinarily good Der Rosenkavalier with Vienna. When he came to Chicago, the match was thought to be a good one because of the CSO’s rep as a virtuoso ensemble with arguably the best wind sections (definitely the best brass) in the U.S. He did not disappoint. 
His first CSO recordings were Mahler – which sonically blew everybody out of the water at the time. If you compare that first Mahler Fifth, where the brass pop right out of the frame, with a more measured later recording with the same forces, you can hear a certain mellowing. His Mahler was up and down, his R. Strauss generally superb, his Wagner good (with an incredible assist from Decca’s engineers). He still spent a lot of time in England, and brought out a number of recordings of Elgar (Enigma was a specialty, the Symphonies don’t travel well to my side of the Atlantic). Beethoven was okay (but the engineers were disappointed that LvB doesn’t lend itself to sonic spectacular) and his Ninth was weighty and Germanic but saved by extraordinary singing by the CSO Chorus. He stayed in the background and let Ashkenazy take the lead in the piano concerti – which are characteristically crystalline, note-perfect, and unmannered.
Instructive are two recordings of the Verdi Requiem – his and Giulini’s, both with the CSO made about 6 months apart. Both are excellent, but diametrically opposed interpretively. He had a serious side. I heard them in Carter’s Variations for Orchestra – a difficult and frankly, not very likeable work on first hearing. But most of the audience was surprised at the end to find that they had heard a real piece of music.
He should be not discounted, but heard and judged by your own standards.

Cheers --


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## OperaGeek (Aug 15, 2014)

As previous posters have pointed out, it's ultimately a matter of personal taste. Solti made many recordings with some of the best orchestras in the world (mostly the Vienna Philharmonic or Chicago Symphony), often very well recorded, so there is certainly listening pleasure to be had from his work.

While I have not heard that many of his recordings of orchestral works, I know most of his opera recordings quite well. Some are excellent, such as his "Le nozze di Figaro", his second "Die Zauberflöte" and his "Tannhäuser". If you like opera, these recordings are basically essential listening. 

In other opera recordings, he can be very (too) aggressive. His "Rigoletto", for instance, is a violent attack on the senses and very disappointing, despite a superb cast. His Wagner and Strauss have been much praised, and should indeed be sampled, but personally, the "Tannhäuser" and possibly his "Arabella" and "Die Frau ohne Schatten" apart, I don't think any of his Wagner or Strauss recordings are first choices for the respective operas. Solti is simply too consistently loud and aggressive. While the results are certainly spectacular, they can also be rather overbearing, even tiring. The important climaxes too often lose their effect because everything leading up to them is so aggressive and loud. Other conductors are better at sustaining tension and building up to the great moments.

Some love Solti's approach, though, and you should not dismiss Solti without trying him out.


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## SimonNZ (Jul 12, 2012)

Love Solti's Magic Flute.

Not my most played recording of it, but along with its other merits it probably makes the best case for, and the best use of, keeping all the chatty bits.


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## Guest (Aug 16, 2014)

I was living in Chicago in the 80s when I began my love affair with classical music, and had the fortune of seeing Solti conduct the CSO on a couple of occasions. I felt at the time that he was the bee's knees. Several of my earliest classical CD purchases featured Solti either with the CSO or the Weiner Philharmonic, including:

View attachment 48818

Debussy: Le Mer; Nocturns; Prelude to an Afternoon of a Fawn

View attachment 48819

Tchaikovsky: 1812 Overture; Romeo and Juliet; Nutcracker Suite

View attachment 48820

Wagner: Exerpts from The Ring

View attachment 48821

Richard Strauss: Also Spoke Zarathustra; Till Eulenspiegel; Dance of the Seven Veils

I still listen to all four of these and love them. IMO Solti is still a giant.


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## jdcbr (Jul 21, 2014)

I think that Solti and von Karajan are too "over" to be the darling of current critics and too recent to be sentimental favorites. They were both over-exposed by recording everything under the sun, sort of like Ormandy just before them. I think familiarity has bred some contempt that will be reversed as time passes. Back in the 70s and 80s when Solti, von Karajan and Haitink were THE conductors on their respective labels, you would be hard pressed to find a "best" list that didn't rank them above Reiner or Szell or Walter. So the barrel will turn for Solti, too. Now, he's so last century...


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## hpowders (Dec 23, 2013)

Besides the great performance of the Schubert 9th, Solti also has one of the greatest Mahler 8th's ever recorded.


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## Haydn man (Jan 25, 2014)

jdcbr said:


> I think that Solti and von Karajan are too "over" to be the darling of current critics and too recent to be sentimental favorites. They were both over-exposed by recording everything under the sun, sort of like Ormandy just before them. I think familiarity has bred some contempt that will be reversed as time passes. Back in the 70s and 80s when Solti, von Karajan and Haitink were THE conductors on their respective labels, you would be hard pressed to find a "best" list that didn't rank them above Reiner or Szell or Walter. So the barrel will turn for Solti, too. Now, he's so last century...


I agree with the idea 'not dead long enough' and that opinion will change with time.
Having seen him conduct I must also agree that he had great presence on the podium and there was no doubt he was a master of his craft. Just seemed a bit too aggressive at times with the music, but his Elgar symphony 1 was a very early LP of mine and was sensational. It was a Penguin Rosette if I remember correctly


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## DavidA (Dec 14, 2012)

I bought Solti's a Rigoletto as the first opera recording I bought as a lad. I played it and played it because it was so exciting. Recently I have obtained the recording on CD and am somewhat put off by Solti's brash and hectic way with the music. If it's excitement you are after go for Solti. That's one reason his Ring was so acclaimed - it was an exciting ride. 
One problem with some of the earlier stuff is that he had never actually performed it before he recorded it - eg the ill fated Tristan whereas (eg) Karajan had been conducting opera at Achenes and Ulm from the beginning. 
When it came to directing an opera house or orchestra there wax no-one like Solti. He had a saying: If you like hard work I am your best friend; if you don't I am your worst enemy!


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## ribonucleic (Aug 20, 2014)

Today's critical consensus on Sir Georg seems to be that, while he was skilled at getting big vibrant sounds out of an orchestra, he isn't someone you would go to for interpretive depth.

As noted by others, taste is cyclical. He's all but certain to be "reappraised" at some point.


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## Lukecash12 (Sep 21, 2009)

Vesuvius said:


> I'd assumed that Boulez and Stravinsky have earned a spot much higher than that of a simple ideologue or critic. They have walked just as much as they've talked.


Of course they've walked the walk. That doesn't mean they weren't ideologues.


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## Blake (Nov 6, 2013)

Lukecash12 said:


> Of course they've walked the walk. That doesn't mean they weren't ideologues.


Surely. But I was a bit surprised that you left out the 'walking' part, as it's pretty relevant to actually speaking with some power behind it.


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## Lukecash12 (Sep 21, 2009)

Vesuvius said:


> Surely. But I was a bit surprised that you left out the 'walking' part, as it's pretty relevant to actually speaking with some power behind it.


Not really relevant for me. I could care less what credentials a music critic has, if he/she is just spewing ideological material I'm going to roll my eyes regardless. We can have all the intelligence, all the accomplishments and impressive points on our cirriculum vitae in the world and that doesn't mean we aren't capable of intellectually vacuous statements.


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## hpowders (Dec 23, 2013)

One wonders how anyone in the orchestra could follow Solti. He was one of the most awkward conductors I have ever seen.


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## GraemeG (Jun 30, 2009)

I heard him a few times live. The CSO came here to Sydney in 1988 and he conducted a very good Brahms 4 and Mahler 9. A couple of years later I heard him conduct Elektra at Covent Garden, which was a raise-the-hair-on-your-neck experience.

His Decca/CSO Bruckner 6 is under-rated I think; he paces it much better than others who rush the finale too much.

I have a few CDs of his; he's pretty reliable.
cheers,
GG


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## Blake (Nov 6, 2013)

Lukecash12 said:


> Not really relevant for me. I could care less what credentials a music critic has, if he/she is just spewing ideological material I'm going to roll my eyes regardless. *We can have all the intelligence, all the accomplishments and impressive points on our cirriculum vitae in the world and that doesn't mean we aren't capable of intellectually vacuous statements.*


I found this to be agreeable. But experience certainly helps to make statements that are not so vacuous. Everything starts off as an ideology. And hopefully the ideas we give attention to are from those with both intelligence and experience.


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## SONNET CLV (May 31, 2014)

I listened to this LP tonight:









Authentic Bartok? Perhaps. Certainly not bad coming from the guy who in 1938 (to quote Solti himself) "turned pages for him at the first public performance of his Sonata for Two Pianos and Percussion, which he played with his wife."

Of the Concerto, Solti remarks: "When preparing ... for the recording, I was determined that the tempi should be exactly as Bartok wrote and this led me to some extraordinary discoveries, chief of which was in the second movement of the _Concerto for Orchestra_. The printed score gives crochet equals 74, which is extremely slow, but I thought that I must follow what it says.

When we rehearsed I could see that the musicians didn't like it at all and in the break the side drum player (who starts the movement with a solo) came to me and said "Maestro, my part is marked crochet equals 94," which I thought must be a mistake, since none of the other parts have a tempo marking.

The only way to check was to locate the manuscript and through the courtesy of the Library of Congress in Washington, we obtained a copy of the relevant page, which not only clearly showed crochet equals 94, but a tempo marking of _Allegro scherzando _(the printed score gives '_Allegretto scherzando'_).

Furthermore, Bartok headed it '_Presentando le coppie' _(Presentation of the pairs) not '_Giuocco delle coppie' _(Game of the pairs). I was most excited by this, because it becomes a quite different piece.

The programme of the first performance in Boston clearly has the movement marked '_Allegro scherzando' _and the keeper of the Bartok archives was able to give us further conclusive evidence that the faster tempo must be correct.

I have no doubt that thousands of performances, including my own up until now, have been given at the wrong speed!"

Notes from http://mankabros.com/blogs/emily/2013/03/20/bela-bartok-concerto-for-orchestra/


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## Andreas (Apr 27, 2012)

SONNET CLV said:


> Of the Concerto, Solti remarks: "When preparing ... for the recording, I was determined that the tempi should be exactly as Bartok wrote and this led me to some extraordinary discoveries, chief of which was in the second movement of the _Concerto for Orchestra_. The printed score gives crochet equals 74, which is extremely slow, but I thought that I must follow what it says.
> 
> When we rehearsed I could see that the musicians didn't like it at all and in the break the side drum player (who starts the movement with a solo) came to me and said "Maestro, my part is marked crochet equals 94," which I thought must be a mistake, since none of the other parts have a tempo marking.
> 
> ...


This is great. However, one could also read it as proof that it's best for performers to go with their own intuition rather than to slavishly obey the Written Letter, as mistakes (or manipulations) are apparently quite common, whereas a good musician's intuition, though not infallible of course, may provide a fairly reliable compass.


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## joen_cph (Jan 17, 2010)

I like his Bartok and and his Mozart´s operas, and I plan to dig more into his earliest recordings; that´s about it. At times, there´a lack of "singing" and architecture/pointing to highlights in some of his recordings.

Haven´t heard his Haydn, where the at times rustic character might be suitabe for his style/"Hungarian" temperament.


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## Lukecash12 (Sep 21, 2009)

Andreas said:


> This is great. However, one could also read it as proof that it's best for performers to go with their own intuition rather than to slavishly obey the Written Letter, as mistakes (or manipulations) are apparently quite common, whereas a good musician's intuition, though not infallible of course, may provide a fairly reliable compass.


Meh, different conductors can have different goals. I can listen to Yudina or Gieseking play some Bach and listen to an HIP performance the next second, it's all wonderful.


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## HaydnBearstheClock (Jul 6, 2013)

Celloissimo said:


> By classical music standards, the Carmen is a pretty risqué album cover.


Yep, pretty sexy. But that was the point with Carmen, I guess.


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## hpowders (Dec 23, 2013)

HaydnBearstheClock said:


> Yep, pretty sexy. But that was the point with Carmen, I guess.


I would change my name to Don José, just to be able to discuss the meaning of life with the lass.


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## Lukecash12 (Sep 21, 2009)

hpowders said:


> I would change my name to Don José, just to be able to discuss the meaning of life with the lass.


Yeah, if I was with that lass discussing the meaning of life would probably be the last thing I'd do. But seriously, if she were a gold digger I wouldn't care, with eyes like that and a voice like that I'd buy a ring more expensive than my truck.


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## hpowders (Dec 23, 2013)

Lukecash12 said:


> Yeah, if I was with that lass discussing the meaning of life would probably be the last thing I'd do. But seriously, if she were a gold digger I wouldn't care, with eyes like that and a voice like that I'd buy a ring more expensive than my truck.


Yeah, but then she'd leave you, corporal. That ain't no bull!


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## Lukecash12 (Sep 21, 2009)

hpowders said:


> Yeah, but then she'd leave you, corporal. That ain't no bull!


Well no dur, that's the point of gold digging. Still a sweet deal if you ask me. Grandpa's gotta get his freak on too :devil:


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## poconoron (Oct 26, 2011)

I have enjoyed Solti's recordings of several Mozart operas including Don Giovanni and Magic Flute.

Solti said this abut Mozart:

_Mozart makes you believe in God because it cannot be by chance that such a phenomenon arrives into this world and leaves such an unbounded number of unparalleled masterpieces. _


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## gellio (Nov 7, 2013)

fugueforthought said:


> Wagner is a nut I have yet to crack. Well, opera in general, I suppose. The only Wagner cycle I have Karajan's with the Berlin Philharmonic, and... I've only listened to _Das Rheingold_ thus far. It's just... a lot of music, so much so that I cannot even begin to appreciate it to the point of differentiating and comparing different traversals. It is beautiful music, for sure, but one seventeen-hour set is enough for now. I also hear great things about Barenboim's Wagner, among others.


Keep listening the ring is fantastic. It tool me years to appreciate but now I can't get enough.


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## gellio (Nov 7, 2013)

I absolutely love Solti. My favorite Wagner conductor. There are many to love, but I love Solti's energy and passion.


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## Heck148 (Oct 27, 2016)

fugueforthought said:


> I was under the impression (even from years ago) that Sir Georg Solti was a huge name in the conducting world, that his reputation was one of success and genius


that is accurate. He was great, first-rate, one of the giants.


> it seems Solti's reputation with Mahler is.... mediocre.


rubbish...he's one of the greatest Mahlerians....His live Mahler 5 performed by Chicago in Carnegie Hall, 3/70, is the single greatest concert I've ever heard...incredible


> Solti was my go-to for a first listen of a Mahler piece


good choice....stick to your guns 



> Anyway, is it just some misunderstanding I had that Solti was one of the greatest conductors of the previous century?


No, your understanding is totally correct - Solti was a great conductor.



> I've read reviews of people panning his Bruckner cycle, etc.


His Bruckner cycle is outstanding - top drawer all the way - 
esp 3,6,7,8 [both CSO and VPO],9


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## Pugg (Aug 8, 2014)

Heck148 said:


> that is accurate. He was great, first-rate, one of the giants.
> 
> rubbish...he's one of the greatest Mahlerians....His live Mahler 5 performed by Chicago in Carnegie Hall, 3/70, is the single greatest concert I've ever heard...incredible
> 
> ...


You a strong Solti advocate, like that .:tiphat:


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## starthrower (Dec 11, 2010)

I'm waiting for his Ring cycle to show up in my mailbox! I like his Brahms symphonies, and his Dvorak 9th w/ the CSO is an old favorite. When I saw that Solti/Debussy cover on the other page I did a double take! Solti and French music don't seem to go together. Maybe he should have tried his hand at some Varese? Solti conducting Ameriques could blow the roof off of a concert hall.


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## Heck148 (Oct 27, 2016)

starthrower said:


> I'm waiting for his Ring cycle to show up in my mailbox! I like his Brahms symphonies, and his Dvorak 9th w/ the CSO is an old favorite. When I saw that Solti/Debussy cover on the other page I did a double take! Solti and French music don't seem to go together. Maybe he should have tried his hand at some Varese? Solti conducting Ameriques could blow the roof off of a concert hall.


Solti was great with big orchestra spectaculars, and complex scores....He came late to Shostakovich, but was very successful...I would have loved to hear him lead some Prokofieff Syms - like #3, #5, #6...

Surprisingly, tho - Solti was most excellent with Haydn, Mozart, Mendelssohn.... Very clear, muscular, gutsy, but not heavy or bloated sounding...


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## hpowders (Dec 23, 2013)

I never took to Solti, with two exceptions:

His complete Wagner Ring and his Schubert Symphony No. 9 with the VPO, almost convincing me that the latter is great music.

I find his Mahler 8 completely over-rated and prefer Boulez in that music.


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## superhorn (Mar 23, 2010)

Solti tends to divide music critics and has for decades . People tend either to love or hate his conducting . I am a definite Solti fan . I've never found his conducting "brash " . insensitive,", "too loud " (well, maybe sometimes ) , "superficial" etc .
Solti could also show his warm and lyrical side , although he never overdid it and over sentimentalized the music as some conductors have . Nor were his tempi particularly fast . Urgent, yes, rushed, no . 
Other renowned conductors, such as Toscanini and Carlos Kleiber, have used much faster tempi .
Solti had a fantastic sense of orchestral color , unsurpassed IMHO . His Wagner is technicolor, ditto his Richard Strauss , operatic and the orchestral works . 
His set of the Brahms symphonies with the CSO contradicts all the cliches about him . Rich, warm, expansive, flexible .
There are far fewer duds among his recordings than there are by many other great conductors who recorded prolifically . Some people complained about all the Grammy awards he received all the time, but they were richly deserved !


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## Heck148 (Oct 27, 2016)

"Solti had a fantastic sense of orchestral color , unsurpassed IMHO . His Wagner is technicolor, ditto his Richard Strauss , operatic and the orchestral works . "
True - and like Toscanini, and Reiner, Solti had a superb sense of drama - the ebb and flow, rise and fall of action - of course, that is vital, and apparent in Wagner and Bruckner....and certainly in opera....actually, all music as well.

Donald Peck, [long-time CSO Flute I] in his autobiography remarks about how unmatched both Reiner and Solti were with identifying, and presenting, the drama of the music - not just the individual works on a program, but the entire program as a whole....they were unerring at clearly getting the point across....
I heard Solti/CSO live many times - the greatest concerts I've ever heard....really overwhelming.


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## Pugg (Aug 8, 2014)

Heck148 said:


> "Solti had a fantastic sense of orchestral color , unsurpassed IMHO . His Wagner is technicolor, ditto his Richard Strauss , operatic and the orchestral works . "
> True - and like Toscanini, and Reiner, Solti had a superb sense of drama - the ebb and flow, rise and fall of action - of course, that is vital, and apparent in Wagner and Bruckner....and certainly in opera....actually, all music as well.
> 
> Donald Peck, [long-time CSO Flute I] in his autobiography remarks about how unmatched both Reiner and Solti were with identifying, and presenting, the drama of the music - not just the individual works on a program, but the entire program as a whole....they were unerring at clearly getting the point across....
> I heard Solti/CSO live many times - the greatest concerts I've ever heard....really overwhelming.


First class analyses .


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## sbmonty (Jan 11, 2014)

After reading this thread on Solti, I wanted to hear his Bolero


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## Bruckner Anton (Mar 10, 2016)

He should be a big figure especially in the UK and US. But I rarely enjoyed his recordings except his Wagner and Hungarian composers. To be honest, I never find his most Mozart, Bruckner and Mahler recordings great.


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## pcnog11 (Nov 14, 2016)

I think Solti had a very different philosophy in conducting than most of the other conductor. Certainly, he is one of the best. Certain repertoire seemed to appeal to him than others. I would not go to him when I listen to Mozart or early classical, baroque is not his forte as well. Those works in the late romantic period may be his best. Also, I think CSO and Solti had a bonding that made Solti to be his personal best.


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## Guest (Jan 20, 2017)

I like him very much and that's all that matters to me.


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## Barbebleu (May 17, 2015)

Heard his Mahler 1 on the radio this morning. It was his 60's Decca recording with the LPO and it was brilliant. He was BBC radio 3 artist of the week. I love his Mahler and Wagner and the rest of his output isn't too shabby either. IMO one of the great conductors of the twentieth century.


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## Pugg (Aug 8, 2014)

Barbebleu said:


> Heard his Mahler 1 on the radio this morning. It was his 60's Decca recording with the LPO and it was brilliant. He was BBC radio 3 artist of the week. I love his Mahler and Wagner and the rest of his output isn't too shabby either. IMO one of the great conductors of the twentieth century.


I do think you are right, but then again we can't force yours or mine tats upon others, just like they can't do that towards us.


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## GodotsArrived (Jan 12, 2017)

I "learned" music under Solti. What I mean to say is that I went to university in Chicago and saw my very first orchestral concert (St Matthew Passion) in my freshman year, falling in love in the process. Back in those days the cheap (or student) seats in Orchestra Hall were the front two or three rows of the stalls, half "beneath" the high stage, and after that SMP I attended pretty much every week for four years. Solti literally became my guide through the repertoire. There are can few on this board or anywhere else who can claim to have as intimate a knowledge of Solti's sock collection as I do, given where I sat.

During those years, the triumvirate at Bernstein, Karajan, and Solti pretty much towered over the conducting world. I was lucky enough to see all three, Lenny and Solti many, many times and Karajan just once (a Bruckner 8 seared into the memory). For me, Solti was very much a kapellmeister in the European tradition; a fantastic orchestra-builder (the ROH and CSO orchestras are in my opinion his real legacy, not his recordings) and an unfussy conductor (a sharp contrast to Lenny.) By and large his faithfullness to the score renders his recordings, even when not "the greatest" somewhat timeless. When you listen to Solti's Mahler, for instance, you hear Mahler. When you listen to Lenny's Mahler, chances are you hear Lenny. A matter of taste. I think of Solti as a musican's musician.


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