# Round 1: Baritone. Wie Todesahnung Dämmrung.Hans Reinmar, Gerhard Husch, A. van Rooy



## Seattleoperafan (Mar 24, 2013)

Notes below are important


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## Seattleoperafan (Mar 24, 2013)

Hopefully this time my research into baritones pays off and you like at least one of these singers . I am starting off with singers who will likely be unknown to many of you so here is an introduction. All of these were active in the first half of the 20th century and were exclusively European in their careers.
In the more than forty years of his career, Hans Reinmar was probably the most versatile and multi* facetted baritone of his time. 
Gerhard Husch was one of the most important German singers of modern times. A lyric baritone, he specialized in Lieder but also sang, to a lesser extent, German and Italian opera
Anton van Rooy was a Dutch bass-baritone. He had a voice of enormous proportions and is most remembered for his association with the music dramas of Richard Wagner, especially the Ring Cycle, The Mastersingers of Nuremberg and Parsifal.
The second round will have more well known singers. To me this music is very Bel Canto in sound.


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## Woodduck (Mar 17, 2014)

This was a delight. I can't help pointing out that all three of these singers, leading artists of their day, offer a fine demonstration of authentic "Wagnerian style," as opposed to whatever was being argued for under that designation in a discussion we were having here several days ago (something about making a slight crescendo on each note, if I'm remembering right). Wagner asked his singers for "Italian" legato singing - it was evidently something distinct from what provincial German singers were apt to give him - and he certainly gets it here. The very fast vibrato of Anton van Rooy takes some getting used to, but as he proceeds he rolls out a musical line like a great cellist. Van Rooy was a bass-baritone noted for his Wotan and his Sachs. This recording is from 1908. Hans Reinmar, too, took on the big bass-baritone parts - there's an excellent "Wotan's farewell" on YouTube - while Gerhard Husch stuck to more lyric repertoire, including Mozart and lieder. 

Husch is probably the most natural pick for Wolfram, but all three of them show themselves fully equal to this magical nocturne, which requires the same senstive phrasing as does any Chopin piece by that name. I'm not going to fuss over details of execution here; I'll leave that fun to others. There were other baritones capable of turning in equally beautiful performances, including my own possible favorite, Joseph Schwarz. Of these three I'm going to pick Husch, who just seems made for the role.


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## Seattleoperafan (Mar 24, 2013)

Woodduck said:


> This was a delight. I can't help pointing out that all three of these singers, leading artists of their day, offer a fine demonstration of authentic "Wagnerian style," as opposed to whatever was being argued for under that designation in a discussion we were having here several days ago (something about making a slight crescendo on each note, if I'm remembering right). Wagner asked his singers for "Italian" legato singing - it was evidently something distinct from what provincial German singers were apt to give him - and he certainly gets it here. The very fast vibrato of Anton van Rooy takes some getting used to, but as he proceeds he rolls out a musical line like a great cellist. Van Rooy was a bass-baritone noted for his Wotan and his Sachs. This recording is from 1908. Hans Reinmar, too, took on the big bass-baritone parts - there's an excellent "Wotan's farewell" on YouTube - while Gerhard Husch stuck to more lyric repertoire, including Mozart and lieder.
> 
> Husch is probably the most natural pick for Wolfram, but all three of them show themselves fully equal to this magical nocturne, which requires the same senstive phrasing as does any Chopin piece by that name. I'm not going to fuss over details of execution here; I'll leave that fun to others. There were other baritones capable of turning in equally beautiful performances, including my own possible favorite, Joseph Schwarz. Of these three I'm going to pick Husch, who just seems made for the role.


This makes my day!!!! I also liked Husch the best, but I was fascinated with Anton's gorgeous voice. I have a good variety for next round with some gorgeous voices. Joseph Schwartz never showed up in any of my baritone searches on Youtube.


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## Woodduck (Mar 17, 2014)

Seattleoperafan said:


> This makes my day!!!! I also liked Husch the best, but I was fascinated with Anton's gorgeous voice. I have a good variety for next round with some gorgeous voices. Joseph Schwartz never showed up in any of my baritone searches on Youtube.


Maybe because he spelled it "Schwarz"? "Schwarzkopf" lacks a "t" as well. _Schwarz_ is German for "black." We call her Betty Blackhead in these parts.


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## Seattleoperafan (Mar 24, 2013)

Woodduck said:


> Maybe because he spelled it "Schwarz"? "Schwarzkopf" lacks a "t" as well. Schwarz is German for "black." We call her Betty Blackhead in these parts.


 I created a contest around him for later. Opera names are one of my biggest pitfalls LOL.


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## vivalagentenuova (Jun 11, 2019)

An interesting group. All were good. The combination of the vibrato and the old recording made it hard for me to fully enjoy van Rooy, although it was a good performance. Husch is a great singer who is the old school version of a "Lieder singer", namely, a sensitive artist with a full scale operatic voice who can bring real power when needed. My favorite here for sure, however, is Reinmar, whose performance was remarkably intimate in its effect, especially for an singer with such a huge voice. Legato, rubato, tone, all were superb.


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## Seattleoperafan (Mar 24, 2013)

vivalagentenuova said:


> An interesting group. All were good. The combination of the vibrato and the old recording made it hard for me to fully enjoy van Rooy, although it was a good performance. Husch is a great singer who is the old school version of a "Lieder singer", namely, a sensitive artist with a full scale operatic voice who can bring real power when needed. My favorite here for sure, however, is Reinmar, whose performance was remarkably intimate in its effect, especially for an singer with such a huge voice. Legato, rubato, tone, all were superb.


So nice to hear from you. Reinmar's performance is first rate!


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## Parsifal98 (Apr 29, 2020)

I voted for Hüsch and now, listening again, I would rather vote for Reinmar *sigh*. The latter being one of my favourite singers, I was suprised at first to be instead leaning towards the former. But it is no problem, for the two renditions really struck a chord with me, and I think my vote would change again after a third listening. Both give such sensitive renditions, with instruments that enable them to make any sounds that they desire, all of this whilst maintaining a beautiful (well-schooled voices are always, in my opinion, beautiful and I believe the two things are linked), vibrant tone. They succeed in creating the hushed atmosphere that the aria need without resorting to histrionics or a whispered tone which can only be the result of a constricted throat. As for Van Rooy, the vibrato is rather distracting, but it remains a great performance nonetheless.


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## Bonetan (Dec 22, 2016)

I've sung this many many times and the Reinmar version is the one I listen to if I need inspiration, so naturally my vote is his. I wish he had recorded more, much more. He has become my favorite helden baritone because the freedom with which he sings is uncommon in the rep. This is the way. Thank you to those of you who exposed me to him. You know who you are.

This aria is every baritones introduction to Wagner, so it's lost some of its luster for me. But when a real Wagnerian baritone with control of his instrument, like Reimnar, gets his hands on it, it can be sensational.


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## Tsaraslondon (Nov 7, 2013)

Three beautiful renditions and I find it hard to separate them, so I'll just go for the voice I preferred and the one who, as Woodduck said, seemed a better fit for the role of Wolfram. So Hüsch for me.


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## wkasimer (Jun 5, 2017)

Although I think that Reinmar's version shows more tonal and dynamic variety, Hüsch was the superior vocalist and the one whose Wolfram I imprinted on many years ago. I remember the first time I heard him - singing "Wohl wusst ich hier" in an Electrola LP set called "Sänger auf dem Grünen Hügel" - and was stunned by his singing. Since then, I think that I've bought virtually every recording I could find.

Glad Schwarz will be included in the next round - one of the greatest baritones of the 20th century. What a shame that he died so young, before he was able to record electrically.

I wouldn't mind a round that includes some modern Wolframs - there have been some fine ones, if none quite on the level of Hüsch, like Mattei, Gerhaher, Andreas Schmidt, Hampson, and of course, Fischer-Dieskau (I'm not a big fan of the latter's Wagner in general, but Wolfram was one of his best roles).


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## Parsifal98 (Apr 29, 2020)

Alexander Kipnis could also be considered for a future round. His version is really good.


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## nina foresti (Mar 11, 2014)

Not being on familiar ground and not knowing how the aria is supposed to be presented, I can but only choose the voice that seemed the most involved in the words, and it is fairly clear to my ear that Reinmar takes the cake.


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## Seattleoperafan (Mar 24, 2013)

wkasimer said:


> Although I think that Reinmar's version shows more tonal and dynamic variety, Hüsch was the superior vocalist and the one whose Wolfram I imprinted on many years ago. I remember the first time I heard him - singing "Wohl wusst ich hier" in an Electrola LP set called "Sänger auf dem Grünen Hügel" - and was stunned by his singing. Since then, I think that I've bought virtually every recording I could find.
> 
> Glad Schwarz will be included in the next round - one of the greatest baritones of the 20th century. What a shame that he died so young, before he was able to record electrically.
> 
> I wouldn't mind a round that includes some modern Wolframs - there have been some fine ones, if none quite on the level of Hüsch, like Mattei, Gerhaher, Andreas Schmidt, Hampson, and of course, Fischer-Dieskau (I'm not a big fan of the latter's Wagner in general, but Wolfram was one of his best roles).


I didn't have room for Schwarz in this aria's contest, but I put him a later contest. He never poppped up for me to consider him before. I do have more modern choices next time, but none of yours, alas. If it is a bomb I will do one with your suggestions LOL. At least now I know I can sometimes get Wagner men right. I somehow thought Hampson's voice was of course gorgeous but not quite big enough for Wagner, but I don't know Tannhauser like you do. I know Lohengrin but not Tannhauser as an opera.I think I did better on these than the last bass contest as this is more like Bel Canto singing and I know better what is called for rather than the more specialized Wagner style needed for the last aria which is beyond my ken.


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## Seattleoperafan (Mar 24, 2013)

Parsifal98 said:


> Alexander Kipnis could also be considered for a future round. His version is really good.


Mr Parsifal, I am Il Stupido, but I have him in a number of contests but as a bass :-O I don't always know how this work with bass/baritones LOL. They are sort of like bisexuals... sometimes a bit confusing.:lol: I know with women Verrett could sing soprano, but I think lost some of the beautiful richness of her lower voice found in her mezzo roles when she did so.


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## Parsifal98 (Apr 29, 2020)

Seattleoperafan said:


> Mr Parsifal, I am Il Stupido, but I have him in a number of contests but as a bass :-O I don't always know how this work with bass/baritones LOL. They are sort of like bisexuals... sometimes a bit confusing.:lol: I know with women Verrett could sing soprano, but I think lost some of the beautiful richness of her lower voice found in her mezzo roles when she did so.


You are far from stupid for Alexander Kipnis is indeed a bass. I had forgotten the contest was about baritones, and not about the aria itself, which is why I proposed his name. Quite confusing indeed!


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## Seattleoperafan (Mar 24, 2013)

Parsifal98 said:


> You are far from stupid for Alexander Kipnis is indeed a bass. I had forgotten the contest was about baritones, and not about the aria itself, which is why I proposed his name. Quite confusing indeed!


No, it gets confusing. A singer in the next round sounds like a bass but he does a great job so I included him. I just don't understand this bass/ baritone fach LOL I would have included Kipnis possibly if he had shown up in my search for artists who sing arias, but Youtube is not omniscient LOL.


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## Parsifal98 (Apr 29, 2020)

Seattleoperafan said:


> No, it gets confusing. A singer in the next round sounds like a bass but he does a great job so I included him. I just don't understand this bass/ baritone fach LOL I would have included Kipnis possibly if he had shown up in my search for artists who sing arias, but Youtube is not omniscient LOL.


Here is a video of Kipnis if you want to add him to a future round of the tournament. The title of the video will serve you as a reminder!


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## ScottK (Dec 23, 2021)

Way tough!! I could easily pick any of the three. Listened to Reinmar first and that beautiful warm voice in this lush song with his sensitive but never cloying moments, awesome. Van Rooy...wasn't he like the first Tristan??? and if I were asked out of the blue I'd guess that seriously. Without the advantage of timbre I didn't think he could compete. But, I thought his impact was accomplished in a large way with his use of the words. So hard to describe why someones performance can be distinctive because of the handling of the words when they are not exaggerating! And that is, of course, required!! Somehow he made the use of the text completely distinct along with some use of rhytmic freedom. Husch had the most imposing sound but subtly (again) was able to incorporate the necessary sensitivity in his slightly more austere production. And his voice is beautiful.I really have no desire to choose one so I think I wont. Great choices SOF!


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## Seattleoperafan (Mar 24, 2013)

ScottK said:


> Way tough!! I could easily pick any of the three. Listened to Reinmar first and that beautiful warm voice in this lush song with his sensitive but never cloying moments, awesome. Van Rooy...wasn't he like the first Tristan??? and if I were asked out of the blue I'd guess that seriously. Without the advantage of timbre I didn't think he could compete. But, I thought his impact was accomplished in a large way with his use of the words. So hard to describe why someones performance can be distinctive because of the handling of the words when they are not exaggerating! And that is, of course, required!! Somehow he made the use of the text completely distinct along with some use of rhytmic freedom. Husch had the most imposing sound but subtly (again) was able to incorporate the necessary sensitivity in his slightly more austere production. And his voice is beautiful.I really have no desire to choose one so I think I wont. Great choices SOF!


Bless you.,,,,,,,,,,,,


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