# Descendants of famous composers



## Aramis

Did you ever try to find out if and when the line of your favourite composers ancestors broke up? 

Tracking sons and daughters of contemporary composers wouldn't be too fascinating so I suggest we focus on composers born before 1900. 

Some things that I've learned so far:

Mahler's daughter had two daughters which could be possibly still alive (born 4 August 1930 and 1 August 1943), but I can't find any informations about what happened to them and if they assured continuity of the sacred tree. 

Mozart's line broke up after death of his sons. 

Glenn Gould was, in quite thin way, descendant of Grieg.


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## emiellucifuge

The renowned violinist Josef Suk (II) is a direct descendant of Antonin Dvorak


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## handlebar

Here is a list of the Mahler family tree:

http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~prohel/names/misc/mahler.html

Still does not answer if the girls are still living but makes for interesting reading.

Jim


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## Sid James

The recent television series *Classical Destinations* interviewed the granddaughter of Sibelius (series 1) and grandson of Rachmaninov (series 2). The latter still lives in the house the composer built on Lake Lucerne, Switzerland.


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## Air

I am pretty well-acquainted with Scriabin's nephew (or is it grand-nephew? I have to ask next time we meet). He's accompanied me in quite a few piano concerti, and is an absolutely splendid pianist. Probably the best accompanist I know personally...


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## Lukecash12

Air said:


> I am pretty well-acquainted with Scriabin's nephew (or is it grand-nephew? I have to ask next time we meet). He's accompanied me in quite a few piano concerti, and is an absolutely splendid pianist. Probably the best accompanist I know personally...


I believe Scriabin has grandchildren of his son in law (my favorite pianist, of course) who are alive and well today.


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## alfine

Gabriel Prokofiev, DJ, is grandson or Serge and runs a club night called NONCLASSICAL in East London and is a composer in his own right...

http://www.myspace.com/nonclassicalmusic


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## ScipioAfricanus

you guys fail to touch on Wagner's great grand daughters and great grand son. These folks have Liszt's blood running through their veins.


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## Aramis

> you guys fail to touch on Wagner's great grand daughters and great grand son. These folks have Liszt's blood running through their veins.


I want to reach them and cut their vains, put Liszt's and Wagner's blood in a golden cup and build a hidden castle somehwere, then wear a silver armor and silver sword and became guardian knight of this new Grail, I shall stand in the gate and fight and slay everyone attempting to get my treasure until a composer will come and he will stand before me and he will play his music and it will be as great as Liszt and Wagner combined and then I will fall and throw my sword in highest delight and he will came into the castle and seize the Grail, the trumpets and horn will blow so loud that the whole world will hear it and I shall wake and see his glory and the light will shine on us from the heavens and the world will known that he is a musical messiah so I shall give him my blessing and go to heaven to seize my reward from Wagner and Liszt themselfs and our joy will be endless.


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## alfine

Aramis said:


> I want to reach them and cut their vains, put Liszt's and Wagner's blood in a golden cup and build a hidden castle somehwere, then wear a silver armor and silver sword and became guardian knight of this new Grail, I shall stand in the gate and fight and slay everyone attempting to get my treasure until a composer will come and he will stand before me and he will play his music and it will be as great as Liszt and Wagner combined and then I will fall and throw my sword in highest delight and he will came into the castle and seize the Grail, the trumpets and horn will blow so loud that the whole world will hear it and I shall wake and see his glory and the light will shine on us from the heavens and the world will known that he is a musical messiah so I shall give him my blessing and go to heaven to seize my reward from Wagner and Liszt themselfs and our joy will be endless.


mmm. yes I think I have seen that opera...


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## handlebar

Air said:


> I am pretty well-acquainted with Scriabin's nephew (or is it grand-nephew? I have to ask next time we meet). He's accompanied me in quite a few piano concerti, and is an absolutely splendid pianist. Probably the best accompanist I know personally...


Unless he is a very old man I would expect grand-nephew.

Jim


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## World Violist

I had suspicions that I could be related to Benjamin Britten in some way shape or form (my last name's Britton, and you know how immigration officers were about spelling; could be related to one of Britten's older relatives...). My hopes are somewhat dashed, but I still think it would be awesome to become a conductor and have a CD called "Britton conducts Britten"...

Or maybe I'm just odd.


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## ScipioAfricanus

what about Robert and Clara Schumann. They had about 8 children totally. A couple of them had tragic lives but I know they had 2 daughters and at least 1 son that had children. Some of his descendants are supposed to be in the US.


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## Sid James

Bartok had a son, Peter, who worked as an architect in Hungary. Kodaly also had a child from his second marriage who is probably still alive...


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## SalieriIsInnocent

I remember hearing from somewhere that Karajan had a famous composer in his blood line. I am not sure who it is. He always looked like Beethoven (but that is not possible).

It was a romantic composer. It might have been word of mouth.


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## emiellucifuge

World Violist said:


> I had suspicions that I could be related to Benjamin Britten in some way shape or form (my last name's Britton, and you know how immigration officers were about spelling; could be related to one of Britten's older relatives...). My hopes are somewhat dashed, but I still think it would be awesome to become a conductor and have a CD called "Britton conducts Britten"...
> 
> Or maybe I'm just odd.


Well living Englad for many years I knew many people with that surname.

Most surnames in germanic europe were simply the fathers name with suffix son or daughter. For example in Iceland an example of a surname is Johnsson, (johns son) or Jonsdottir (johns daughter).

When Napoleon built his empire he told his subjects that they needed surnames, and so (also here in the netherlands) people chose their surnames based on their occupation, appearance or location.

Outside Napoleon influences I think surnames from latin european countries (i.e france) had the same basis.

Given these circumstances it seems highly unlikely that two Brittons/Brittens/Britons/Britains are related as the name was most likely chosen due to location.

Sorry to ruin your dreams, it would still be a cool album title!


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## toucan

ScipioAfricanus said:


> you guys fail to touch on Wagner's great grand daughters and great grand son. These folks have Liszt's blood running through their veins.


And jewish blood on their conscience.

Cecilia Sarkosy, the previous wife of the current president of France, is a descendant of Albeniz.

The American writer Gore Vidal is a descendant of the Provencal troubadour, Peire Vidal
(1175-1210)

HK Gruber, composer of a fine trumpet concerto titled Aerial, is a descendant of Franz Xaver Gruber, author of the christmas carol, Stille Nacht (Silent Night)

But then, Franz Xaver Gruber is not a famous composer. I guess that puts me off topic.


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## elgar's ghost

Some direct bloodlines died out immediately due to the composers remaining bachelors and/or without issue - Brahms, Bruckner, Berlioz, Beethoven... 

Taking into account the size of the clan surely there have to be a few Bachs left somewhere?


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## Air

elgars ghost said:


> Some direct bloodlines died out immediately due to the composers remaining bachelors and/or without issue - Brahms, Bruckner, Berlioz, Beethoven...


Berlioz had one son who died without leaving any known offspring. I've always liked to think that Beethoven and Brahms had illegitimate children - for the latter it may have been possible through prostitution.


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## Huilunsoittaja

My mother's family in Finland is close friends with a family descended from Sibelius, of his oldest daughter I believe.


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## Nix

Air said:


> Berlioz had one son who died without leaving any known offspring. I've always liked to think that Beethoven and Brahms had illegitimate children - for the latter it may have been possible through prostitution.


Possible with the former too, I think (unless Maynard Solomon was lying to me again).


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## Air

Nix said:


> Possible with the former too, I think (unless Maynard Solomon was lying to me again).


And if you believe _Immortal Beloved_.


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## Meaghan

There are photographs of I think all Mahler's descendants in Gilbert Kaplan's _The Mahler Album_ (which also contains every known photo of Mahler. Whatever one thinks of Kaplan's conducting habit, this book is a valuable contribution). I'm fairly certain Mahler has living descendants in America.


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## Nicola

toucan said:


> HK Gruber, composer of a fine trumpet concerto titled Aerial, is a descendant of Franz Xaver Gruber, author of the christmas carol, Stille Nacht (Silent Night)
> 
> But then, Franz Xaver Gruber is not a famous composer. I guess that puts me off topic.


More on Franz Gruber here: http://www.talkclassical.com/3869-franz-gruber.html

Those were the days, when "Christi" used to post here. One of the biggest send-ups in the history of T-C.


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## elgar's ghost

Air said:


> Berlioz had one son who died without leaving any known offspring.
> 
> Yep - absolutely right, my mistake. I also overlooked the prostitute angle with other composers so maybe there are some 'Schuberts' about?


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## superhorn

I don't believe Mahler had any direct descendents.He had two daughters by his wife Alma,the elder of whom died tragically at the age of about five,and the surviving one was briefly married to the well-known Austrian composer Ernst krenek,but I don't believe she ever had any children.
A niece of Mahler was a talented violinist who tragically died in a Nazi concentration camp.


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## Art Rock

emiellucifuge said:


> The renowned violinist Josef Suk (II) is a direct descendant of Antonin Dvorak


... via Josef Suk (I), a great composer as well (Asrael symphony for instance).


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## SonataSonataSonata

Air said:


> Berlioz had one son who died without leaving any known offspring. I've always liked to think that Beethoven and Brahms had illegitimate children - for the latter it may have been possible through prostitution.


Even though Beethoven hated his sister in law, I have read _somewhere _that suspects that his nephew Karl was actually his son and that's why he was so protective of him. I like to believe that. It's fun and unconventional of what _we think we know_ about Beethoven.


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## Meaghan

superhorn said:


> I don't believe Mahler had any direct descendents.He had two daughters by his wife Alma,the elder of whom died tragically at the age of about five,and the surviving one was briefly married to the well-known Austrian composer Ernst krenek,but I don't believe she ever had any children.
> A niece of Mahler was a talented violinist who tragically died in a Nazi concentration camp.


Krenek was the second of Anna Mahler's five husbands. She had two daughters, Alma and Marina.


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## HarpsichordConcerto

Aramis said:


> Did you ever try to find out if and when the line of your favourite composers ancestors broke up?


Here's one.

*Heinrich Ignaz Franz von Biber *(1644 - 1704), baroque composer and violinst, and his great, great, great, great, great, great grandson, *Justin*.

The family resemblance is so obvious after all these years. :tiphat:


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## Air

SonataSonataSonata said:


> Even though Beethoven hated his sister in law, I have read _somewhere _that suspects that his nephew Karl was actually his son and that's why he was so protective of him. I like to believe that. It's fun and unconventional of what _we think we know_ about Beethoven.


I hope you didn't get that from _Immortal Beloved_ though. It's a good piece, but the historical basis of the film is extremely weak and/or nonexistant.


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## lipkinasl

*Dvorak descendants active musician*



Art Rock said:


> ... via Josef Suk (I), a great composer as well (Asrael symphony for instance).


Yes true granddaughter of Suk I is a violinist in the Mahler Chamber Orchestra.
(reliable source: their conductor Daniel Harding)


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## Delicious Manager

Art Rock said:


> ... via Josef Suk (I), a great composer as well (Asrael symphony for instance).


Josef Suk, composer of the _Asrael Symphony_ was Dvořák's son-in-law, having married his eldest daughter Otilie in 1901. Josef Suk the violinist is the previous Josef Suk's grandson and is, therefore, Dvořák's great-grandson.


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## kv466

Well, the distant relative of Edvard was my two cents...shame he didn't record the beloved piano concerto


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## jaimsilva

the Shostakovich family


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## Fsharpmajor

Aram Khachaturian seems to have a descendant with musical talent, presumably his son:

*http://www.russianarts.org/rno/photos.cfm?Photos=Guest&Code=712*

My brother and I have a theory, based on circumstantial evidence, that we are related to Erik Satie. We don't have the family tree information to prove it, though.


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## Delicious Manager

Fsharpmajor said:


> Aram Khachaturian seems to have a descendant with musical talent, presumably his son:
> 
> *http://www.russianarts.org/rno/photos.cfm?Photos=Guest&Code=712*
> 
> My brother and I have a theory, based on circumstantial evidence, that we are related to Erik Satie. We don't have the family tree information to prove it, though.


They are two completely different families. the surname isn't even spelt the same:

Aram KHACHAT*U*RIAN 
Sergei KHACHATRIAN no middle 'u'

The page spells Sergei Khachatrian's name wrongly.

Sorry, this is wrong.


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## Fsharpmajor

Delicious Manager said:


> They are two completely different families. the surname isn't even spelt the same:
> 
> Aram KHACHAT*U*RIAN
> Sergei KHACHATRIAN no middle 'u'
> 
> The page spells Sergei Khachatrian's name wrongly.
> 
> Sorry, this is wrong.


My apologies, I heard Sergei Khachatrian mentioned on the radio and googled him; when I found that I jumped to conclusions.


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## Meaghan

My piano teacher's piano teacher studied composition with Darius Milhaud. That makes him my great-grandteacher.


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## violadude

Meaghan said:


> My piano teacher's piano teacher studied composition with Darius Milhaud. That makes him my great-grandteacher.


Along those same lines, my current composition teacher in college studied composition with Milhaud as well. She also studied with Messiaen.

My viola teachers name is Joyce Remee, her viola teacher was Max Arnoff, who studied Violin and Viola with Carl Flesch, who's violin teacher was Joseph Joachim who was one of Brahm's good friends. Thats quite a student genealogy right thar!


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## solkorset

Sid James said:


> The recent television series *Classical Destinations* interviewed the granddaughter of Sibelius (series 1) and grandson of Rachmaninov (series 2). The latter still lives in the house the composer built on Lake Lucerne, Switzerland.


Lake Luzern? Funny, that's where Wagner lived as a political refugee from Germany in his revolutionary youth.


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## solkorset

ScipioAfricanus said:


> you guys fail to touch on Wagner's great grand daughters and great grand son. These folks have Liszt's blood running through their veins.


Yes, Wagner left plenty of offspring. I spoke to Wolfgang Wagner in Bayreuth in 1992. But I don't know of any famous musicians among them. The opera singer Sieglinde Wagner was NOT related to him. Strange.


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## solkorset

Aramis said:


> I want to reach them and cut their vains, put Liszt's and Wagner's blood in a golden cup and build a hidden castle somehwere, then wear a silver armor and silver sword and became guardian knight of this new Grail, I shall stand in the gate and fight and slay everyone attempting to get my treasure until a composer will come and he will stand before me and he will play his music and it will be as great as Liszt and Wagner combined and then I will fall and throw my sword in highest delight and he will came into the castle and seize the Grail, the trumpets and horn will blow so loud that the whole world will hear it and I shall wake and see his glory and the light will shine on us from the heavens and the world will known that he is a musical messiah so I shall give him my blessing and go to heaven to seize my reward from Wagner and Liszt themselfs and our joy will be endless.


And you are polish? I thought the polish still hated the germans and everything german. But maybe you are a german living in Poland? Or maybe you are being ironic? Or maybe the love of music unites people and dissolves national hostilities and grievances.


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## solkorset

World Violist said:


> I had suspicions that I could be related to Benjamin Britten in some way shape or form (my last name's Britton, and you know how immigration officers were about spelling; could be related to one of Britten's older relatives...). My hopes are somewhat dashed, but I still think it would be awesome to become a conductor and have a CD called "Britton conducts Britten"...
> 
> Or maybe I'm just odd.


Or maybe you're just a stupid briton. Hahaha...


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## solkorset

elgars ghost said:


> Some direct bloodlines died out immediately due to the composers remaining bachelors and/or without issue - Brahms, Bruckner, Berlioz, Beethoven...
> 
> Taking into account the size of the clan surely there have to be a few Bachs left somewhere?


Yes, it's sad that all those great composers didn't pass their genius on to posterity. Schubert and Chopin are other examples. Chopin proposed to a girl but was turned down because of his consumption (I mean tuberculosis) which eventually killed him. They must have been lonely and unhappy men. But we only care for their music and have no compassion with them. They live forever through their fame, though. Chopin is still the most cherished grave at Pere Lachaise in Paris.


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## solkorset

Air said:


> And if you believe _Immortal Beloved_.


I suppose you're referring to the 1994 Hollywood film. But there is also a german film from 1951 by the famous director Veit Harlan: Unsterbliche Geliebte.


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## Alydon

I came across the decendant of a famous composer by pure chance when in my former job as a funiture salesman I sold a large number of items to a very old lady who happened to live a mile or so from me. When I asked for her name, she replied, 'Mrs Clementi.' I immediatly mentioned the fact that there was a famous piano composer/manufacturer of the same name who I had always admired, being an amateur pianist myself. The lady told me that Muzio Clementi had been her great, x 6 or so grandfather which came as an amazing suprise. The funny thing was she didn't really have any interest in her great decendant's music or life, but seemed genuinely touched that someone actually knew who he was.


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## Xaltotun

Aramis said:


> I want to reach them and cut their vains, put Liszt's and Wagner's blood in a golden cup and build a hidden castle somehwere, then wear a silver armor and silver sword and became guardian knight of this new Grail, I shall stand in the gate and fight and slay everyone attempting to get my treasure until a composer will come and he will stand before me and he will play his music and it will be as great as Liszt and Wagner combined and then I will fall and throw my sword in highest delight and he will came into the castle and seize the Grail, the trumpets and horn will blow so loud that the whole world will hear it and I shall wake and see his glory and the light will shine on us from the heavens and the world will known that he is a musical messiah so I shall give him my blessing and go to heaven to seize my reward from Wagner and Liszt themselfs and our joy will be endless.


This one is actually one of the best posts ever on this site, I always read it with a mixture of awe and amusement. Aramis was a genius.


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## Bone

Xaltotun said:


> This one is actually one of the best posts ever on this site, I always read it with a mixture of awe and amusement. Aramis was a genius.


I was thinking the exact same thing. Is Aramis no longer a member?


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## KenOC

Ever wonder what happened to the Beethoven family? Ludwig of course had no children, and the only male carrying on the Beethoven name was nephew Karl, who was allowed to join the army after attempting suicide.

"Karl van Beethoven left the army in 1832, marrying Caroline Naske in the same year. They had four daughters and a son, whom they named Ludwig [and who] emigrated to America, where he worked for the Michigan Central Railroad Company of Detroit." Karl died in 1858. The American Ludwig van Beethoven had no children.


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## EddieRUKiddingVarese

Alfred Cortot was a relative of Edgard Varese's. Unfortunately, he supported the German occupation of France during the Second World War..... not something that went down well later..... and was banned from performing publicly for a year- got off easy I guess.


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## PetrB

ScipioAfricanus said:


> you guys fail to touch on Wagner's great grand daughters and great grand son. These folks have Liszt's blood running through their veins.


...and by many reports, are about as charismatic and interesting as a cash register.


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## PetrB

Meaghan said:


> My piano teacher's piano teacher studied composition with Darius Milhaud. That makes him my great-grandteacher.


and you have 'cousins' -- Steve Reich, Burt Bacharach, and others!


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## StevenOBrien

KenOC said:


> Ever wonder what happened to the Beethoven family? Ludwig of course had no children, and the only male carrying on the Beethoven name was nephew Karl, who was allowed to join the army after attempting suicide.
> 
> "Karl van Beethoven left the army in 1832, marrying Caroline Naske in the same year. They had four daughters and a son, whom they named Ludwig [and who] emigrated to America, where he worked for the Michigan Central Railroad Company of Detroit." Karl died in 1858. The American Ludwig van Beethoven had no children.


There's actually a rumor that Beethoven apparently had an illegitimate daughter with Josephine Brunswick named Minona. She bears a striking resemblance to him and was also quite musical, publishing two small piano pieces in her lifetime:

















This is COMPLETE speculation, mind you, but it's fun to imagine that Beethoven's blood was passed on, I suppose.


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## brianvds

emiellucifuge said:


> When Napoleon built his empire he told his subjects that they needed surnames, and so (also here in the netherlands) people chose their surnames based on their occupation, appearance or location.


Looking at Dutch surnames, I suspect many of them made a joke out of the whole thing. 



elgars ghost said:


> Some direct bloodlines died out immediately due to the composers remaining bachelors and/or without issue - Brahms, Bruckner, Berlioz, Beethoven...


As others have noted, many of these composers, in their younger days, spread their seed far and wide, and it would not surprise me at all if they had many living descendants. Alas for me, my family came to South Africa around 1700, so I don't think I have any of that illustrious blood flowing in my veins.


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## hello

alfine said:


> Gabriel Prokofiev, DJ, is grandson or Serge and runs a club night called NONCLASSICAL in East London and is a composer in his own right...
> 
> http://www.myspace.com/nonclassicalmusic


Huh, I assumed G. Prokofiev's name was a coincidence.
Anybody else here a fan of his Concerto for Turntables?


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## Minona

1. About the Beethoven daughter pictures... all I know is that they are not the same women! Noses can grow with age -the pulp at the tip, but you don't grow a larger nasal bridge with age! That's bone. The younger women looks like Beethoven, but so do plenty other German and Hungarian women actually.

2. I've always been amazed at the Bach family, that Bach's many sons didn't make damn sure they continued the line after establishing so many generations. You think they'd have spat a new Bach every year or so. This illustrates how pointless this whole topic. Genius, even if it's genetic, is something that occurs rarely, and there doesn't seem to be any way to really predict it, certainly not by family trees. J.S. Bach sticks out like a sore thumb in 50 generations of otherwise competant and creative musicians. W.Mozart came out of nowhere (and no one _that_ special).

3. "And jewish blood on their conscience." Similarly, you can't put Wagner's racism on his descendents any more than you can put it on his ancestors. We're all individuals!

4. Those wishing to be related to someone great/famous: to me that's just wanting reflected glory rather than carving your own path in life. And even if documents 'prove' you are related to some great, how do you know your great-great grandma didn't have a 'role in the hay' with some nameless farmhand?

5. I think it's personality that makes genius, after all Albrechsberger knew as much (if not more) about composition as Haydn, but he was no creative genius. Will power, to concentrate and focus, to dismiss pointless activities, sacrifice relationships perhaps, and foremost taste and insight, I'd say that's what makes genius.

6. We're all closely related anyway. Danish researchers think all blue-eyed people share common ancestor. Many people you meet, and the composers named above, are probably related to Genghis Khan or Charlemagne, or both. It's inevitable given the number of people around back then, and the number of people in recent times.


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## ahammel

Minona said:


> Those wishing to be related to someone great/famous: to me that's just wanting reflected glory rather than carving your own path in life. And even if documents 'prove' you are related to some great, how do you know your great-great grandma didn't have a 'role in the hay' with some nameless farmhand?


Yeesh, it's just a bit of fun. Did you get your degree in grumpiness from Killjoy University?


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## Minona

Actually I think it's funny! Perhaps I don't make it obvious enough with smileys, etc.

All these family tree programmes on tv, celebrities taking it all seriously, but no one really knows what their ancestors got up to!


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## EddieRUKiddingVarese

Many these family trees will help explain everything, and i do mean everything!


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## brianvds

Minona said:


> 4. Those wishing to be related to someone great/famous: to me that's just wanting reflected glory rather than carving your own path in life. And even if documents 'prove' you are related to some great, how do you know your great-great grandma didn't have a 'role in the hay' with some nameless farmhand?


Genetic tests can nowadays establish it beyond much doubt, but you are exactly right. Suppose Beethoven very much wanted to be related to someone famous. Would it really be necessary!? Almost all of these great composers came out of nowhere and made their own path in life without needing a famous name, and today all the famous names of their own day are forgotten while we still remember them.



> 6. We're all closely related anyway. Danish researchers think all blue-eyed people share common ancestor. Many people you meet, and the composers named above, are probably related to Genghis Khan or Charlemagne, or both. It's inevitable given the number of people around back then, and the number of people in recent times.


And ultimately, we are all Africans.


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## schuberkovich




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## Minona

"Genetic tests can nowadays establish it beyond much doubt"

Well it's difficult and expensive to process genetic material from great-great grandparents, and most of the tv shows don't offer this kind of proof. 

Incidentally, I really criticised the 'reflected glory' position because it's the same principle to blaming descendents of nazi monsters and the like. If most of us are related to Ghenghis Khan, that says enough. In any case, surely we've all got rapists and murderers in our family history ...somewhere down the line?


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## brianvds

Minona said:


> "Genetic tests can nowadays establish it beyond much doubt"
> 
> Well it's difficult and expensive to process genetic material from great-great grandparents, and most of the tv shows don't offer this kind of proof.


I think it can be done using samples from known living relatives, but I suppose it depends on the specific case.



> Incidentally, I really criticised the 'reflected glory' position because it's the same principle to blaming descendents of nazi monsters and the like. If most of us are related to Ghenghis Khan, that says enough. In any case, surely we've all got rapists and murderers in our family history ...somewhere down the line?


Well, I'm pretty sure I have at the very least had slave owners among my ancestors, who came to South Africa around 1700, where every man and his dog owned slaves. Further back, I am descended from Germanic people, who were infamous for their barbarism and cruelty.

Now if only I could have a few genes of Bach, that would redeem me at least a little bit.


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## ahammel

brianvds said:


> I think it can be done using samples from known living relatives, but I suppose it depends on the specific case.


Probably not after five or six generations. You could use DNA fingerprinting to determine that you have _a_ recent common ancestor with Bob Mozart , but not _who_ it was.

It might work if you have lots of samples from different known Mozart ancestors.


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## EddieRUKiddingVarese

Aramis said:


> I want to reach them and cut their vains, put Liszt's and Wagner's blood in a golden cup and build a hidden castle somehwere, then wear a silver armor and silver sword and became guardian knight of this new Grail, I shall stand in the gate and fight and slay everyone attempting to get my treasure until a composer will come and he will stand before me and he will play his music and it will be as great as Liszt and Wagner combined and then I will fall and throw my sword in highest delight and he will came into the castle and seize the Grail, the trumpets and horn will blow so loud that the whole world will hear it and I shall wake and see his glory and the light will shine on us from the heavens and the world will known that he is a musical messiah so I shall give him my blessing and go to heaven to seize my reward from Wagner and Liszt themselfs and our joy will be endless.


Should sell this idea to Monty Python and they might even make a movie about it ........................


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## MastaHanky

The great-granddaughter of Russian composer Reinhold Gliere is a soprano living in the NYC area.

Jennifer Gliere


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## badRomance

Minona said:


> Actually I think it's funny! Perhaps I don't make it obvious enough with smileys, etc.
> 
> All these family tree programmes on tv, celebrities taking it all seriously, but no one really knows what their ancestors got up to!


I haven't seen these tv shows (are they European?), but I think family trees are fun and interesting. Even pseudo-family trees are interesting like Math Genealogy which traces math doctorates to their ancestral advisors. But to think greatness comes from one's blood is silly as I think greatness comes from external circumstances and one's own actions.


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## Garlic

I'm a related to Johann Pachelbel. Distantly, but by blood. Shame I don't like his canon much.


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## Garlic

schuberkovich said:


>


haha they look so Schoenbergian

Hahn lovely as always


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## isridgewell

I know Samuel Colerdige Taylor has a grandson and great-grandchildren. 

Coleridge Taylor married a lady from Croydon in Surrey where he lived and had a daughter called Avril.

I interviewed his grandson sometime ago and he said finds himself in quite an interesting position; Colerdige-Taylor's grandson is white but is extremely proud of his grandfather's black heritage and works hard to promote the the music young black composers.


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