# Honorary doctorates - what do you think?...



## Sid James (Feb 7, 2009)

I just noticed in the news that pop singer *Kylie Minogue* got an honorary doctorate from a UK university.

It was basically for her role in promoting the fight against breast cancer, of which she is a survivor.

Article on ABC online HERE.

Usually these things are awarded to support some cause or other, & it's usually high profile people who get them (but probably not always, but at least one former Australian Prime Minister was awarded one here, Paul Keating, for something to do with his work regarding Asia-Australia relations).

What do you think, are honorary doctorates good, bad or neither? Please vote in the poll and tell us what you think about this issue, I'd like to know your thoughts.

Is it like prizes for the boys (and girls) from the big end of town or does the way it raises the profile of certain issues a good thing? Who in your neck of the woods has been awarded these doctorate to those who aren't really PHD's in the usual sense of the word? ...


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## itywltmt (May 29, 2011)

I voted "no".

Not because I don't believe that some causes and-or people aren't deserving but rather because their proliferation has watered down their significance. 

Or, maybe, because it's become a convenient way to book a speaker for a convocation!


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## Polednice (Sep 13, 2009)

Well, it was only Anglia Ruskin that gave it to her.

If it was a more high profile university, I think it can still lend some significance - but, in those cases, they would only be awarded to people who had genuinely furthered the field (as should be the case).


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## kv466 (May 18, 2011)

While there are a couple of things I would have liked to have given Kylie...

...a doctorate is not one of them! :angel:


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## graaf (Dec 12, 2009)

As the news said: _Kylie Minogue has been awarded an honorary doctorate in health sciences for her work in promoting breast cancer awareness._

Cancer awareness is a great thing, but "an honorary doctorate in health sciences" seems a bit misplaced. I'd say that a medal or similar awars is more appripriate in the case like this - something she easily deserves. An "honorary doctorate" is, in my opinion, more for someone who made significant progress or contribution in a certain field, without having much formal education. For example, when an author, who had modest education but wrote great literature, is given "honorary doctorate" in English (or other) Literature, that I an understand - he/she did made a contribution to a field (like Heinrich Schliemann did in archeology), and I can even see people like that lecturing. I can't see Kylie lecturing on a subject of "health sciences", but then again, I don't know her good enough anyway.


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## Krummhorn (Feb 18, 2007)

graaf said:


> . . . An "honorary doctorate" is, in my opinion, more for someone who made significant progress or contribution in a certain field, without having much formal education. For example, when an author, who had modest education but wrote great literature, is given "honorary doctorate" in English (or other) Literature, that I an understand - he/she did made a contribution to a field . . .


Well stated, graaf.


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## Polednice (Sep 13, 2009)

graaf said:


> As the news said: _Kylie Minogue has been awarded an honorary doctorate in health sciences for her work in promoting breast cancer awareness._
> 
> Cancer awareness is a great thing, but "an honorary doctorate in health sciences" seems a bit misplaced. I'd say that a medal or similar awars is more appripriate in the case like this - something she easily deserves. An "honorary doctorate" is, in my opinion, more for someone who made significant progress or contribution in a certain field, without having much formal education. For example, when an author, who had modest education but wrote great literature, is given "honorary doctorate" in English (or other) Literature, that I an understand - he/she did made a contribution to a field (like Heinrich Schliemann did in archeology), and I can even see people like that lecturing. I can't see Kylie lecturing on a subject of "health sciences", but then again, I don't know her good enough anyway.


Similarly, I think people who do hold formal education in the field already can be awarded honorary doctorates from institutions around the world just to signify any international impact their work has achieved.


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## Guest (Oct 12, 2011)

So many honors and awards have become empty anymore. I'm not too worried that anybody is going to mistake Kylie Minogue for an actual medical professional, nor am I worried she will take this honorary doctorate and seek to use it to imply her expertise in the field.

I don't really think it cheapens actual doctorates.


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## itywltmt (May 29, 2011)

DrMike said:


> So many honors and awards have become empty anymore. I'm not too worried that anybody is going to mistake Kylie Minogue for an actual medical professional, nor am I worried she will take this honorary doctorate and seek to use it to imply her expertise in the field.
> 
> I don't really think it cheapens actual doctorates.


I think institutions could be more creative... When my Son had his convocation at a 2-year (junior) college, they granted "honorary diplomas" to a handful of _honoris causa_ types. Of course, the instiutution doesn't give degrees or doctorates, so that's the best they could do...

All this to say that there could be another honour bestowed onto celebrities who are gettiung these distinctions due to theur celebrity alone, and NOT for having contributed in the field (sorry, Kylie!). I believe both Montreal major universities (U of M and McGill) have granted Kent Nagano honorary doctorates in music - but it can be argued it is in recognition to his distinguished career as a musician and NOT as a celebrity (hair splitting, not sure...)


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## myaskovsky2002 (Oct 3, 2010)

Krummhorn said:


> Well stated, graaf.


I voted yes...because I'd love to have one...The reason...maybe because I have a charming smile. LOL

Martin


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## GoneBaroque (Jun 16, 2011)

They create publicity for the particular Institute of "Higher Learning". Enough said.


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## Vaneyes (May 11, 2010)

Indifferent. Harmless fun at the expense of a few.


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## Stasou (Apr 23, 2011)

I wouldn't say it's a bad thing, but it doesn't actually do anything good. I guess you could say it's bad in the sense that it's unnecessary, but I voted indifferent.


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## Almaviva (Aug 13, 2010)

I think they only make sense in case of real contributions.


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## Lukecash12 (Sep 21, 2009)

Not all doctorates are made equal. And a lot of doctorates sound just plain stupid. Philosophy, theology, engineering, business, law, physics, etc. are doctorates that are a serious accomplishment as an honorary.


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## Sid James (Feb 7, 2009)

Interesting thoughts here, thanks guys. 

RE the mention of Maestro Nagano, a number of musicians have been given HD's over the decades. It's a sign of respect & other things, like in the Oscars you have that annual "lifetime achievement" award. I voted "yes" based on these examples, eg. to give respect for contribution to a certain area, or things like promoting worthy causes as a role model, etc. (eg. as with Kylie). 

But what I don't like is if they're based on furthering some political agenda, eg. biased. Elena Ceausescu, the wife of the former Romanian dictator Nicolai Ceausescu, was given a number of HD's (not only at home but abroad, one in Manila). The late Zairean/Congolese dictator Mobutu Sese Seko also got a couple of them, one from Seoul. I think this kind of thing is not good, but I think it's an exception to the norm, it's like a relic of Cold War politics...


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## Lukecash12 (Sep 21, 2009)

Sid James said:


> Interesting thoughts here, thanks guys.
> 
> RE the mention of Maestro Nagano, a number of musicians have been given HD's over the decades. It's a sign of respect & other things, like in the Oscars you have that annual "lifetime achievement" award. I voted "yes" based on these examples, eg. to give respect for contribution to a certain area, or things like promoting worthy causes as a role model, etc. (eg. as with Kylie).
> 
> But what I don't like is if they're based on furthering some political agenda, eg. biased. Elena Ceausescu, the wife of the former Romanian dictator Nicolai Ceausescu, was given a number of HD's (not only at home but abroad, one in Manila). The late Zairean/Congolese dictator Mobutu Sese Seko also got a couple of them, one from Seoul. I think this kind of thing is not good, but I think it's an exception to the norm, it's like a relic of Cold War politics...


It's definitely a travesty that someone is literally given a *Doctorate* (yes, capital D for emphasis) for just being some sort of a successful person. That level of degree used to be the paragon of intellectual achievement. For proper Doctoral studies, you are often required to conduct and write peer reviewed studies and articles, sometimes as much as twelve if you expect to take up a post right after receiving your doctorate. Honestly, I think they should put to use the old magister degree (magister came between master and doctor).


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## Polednice (Sep 13, 2009)

I suppose the question would be just like asking: "Do you think degrees are a good thing?" or "Do you think PhDs are a good thing?"

It depends where they come from. You can get one from Harvard; you can pay for one from the internet. As with this, you can get an HD from some well-respected, centuries-old institution, or you can get one from ******* Anglia Ruskin!


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## Huilunsoittaja (Apr 6, 2010)

So you don't think he should have gotten to wear that gown? :'(

:tiphat:


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## Couchie (Dec 9, 2010)

itywltmt said:


> I voted "no".
> 
> Not because I don't believe that some causes and-or people aren't deserving but rather because their proliferation has watered down their significance.
> 
> Or, maybe, because it's become a convenient way to book a speaker for a convocation!


I agree. Pretty much a means by which an institution can "collect" an accomplished famous person and link their name with them without actually having to achieve the much more arduous task of attracting and nourishing top talent, and being involved with _producing_ an accomplished famous person through the legitimate degree-granting channels.


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## Lukecash12 (Sep 21, 2009)

Couchie said:


> I agree. Pretty much a means by which an institution can "collect" an accomplished famous person and link their name with them without actually having to achieve the much more arduous task of attracting and nourishing top talent, and being involved with _producing_ an accomplished famous person through the legitimate degree-granting channels.


A question, why not just have doctorates be professional and academy related? That is it's proper setting, after all. What use does some random douchebag have who hasn't spent whole years of his/her life in the library, time applying one's self to a field that espouses intellectual achievement, in receiving an award for being a supposed intellectual?

Edit: To clarify, I had meant that doctorates should be functional. They were/are used to further a scholar's career, and it doesn't make sense that they aren't universally used that way.


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## Sid James (Feb 7, 2009)

Maybe other prizes that are linked to a university but more specific, and not named Honorary Doctorates or whatever, but just called prizes. One of them over in our neck of the woods is the Sydney Peace Prize which is awarded annually to those who have contributed in some way to global peace, justice, humanitarianism, etc...


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## EddieRUKiddingVarese (Jan 8, 2013)

I prefer honorary Nurses....


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## Roger Knox (Jul 19, 2017)

EddieRUKiddingVarese said:


> I prefer honorary Nurses....


How about honourary Donor$$$ -- they give in bitcoin.


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