# Focusing while Listening to Classical Music



## Captainnumber36 (Jan 19, 2017)

Do you feel you get much more enjoyment from Classical music when you focus on it rather than having it on in the background? I do. I think it helps you appreciate all the nuance that is going on.


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## Enthusiast (Mar 5, 2016)

Not sure. I'm not so good at focusing my mind by will. The music might do it or it might not. I do quite often find myself being drawn into music as it unfolds but I'm not good at intending or planning this. It can be quite inconvenient sometimes!

I also think that some forms of focusing on music is actually counter-productive and does not enhance the experience. This is when listening "critically". I think critical understanding needs to be a reflection about an experience but I find it can be quite difficult to turn off my inner critic, especially when listening to a new performance of a familiar work. 

And I do think there is a lot to say for having music loud but in the background, as if someone else in the house was listening to it. This is good especially with music that is new to me (new composer) as it allows the ideas to get under my skin.


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## MusicSybarite (Aug 17, 2017)

For me it's absolutely vital because I want to fall in love with the piece, to appreciate its details. If I get distracted, I miss many ideas that develop throughout the work. Not always it's possible, but I try.


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## Simon Moon (Oct 10, 2013)

I do not listen to _any_ music in the background. I only listen to music, when I am able to give it my attention.

Music is way to important to me to listen while doing another activity.

Not to mention, that I listen almost exclusively post mid 20th century and later classical, which tends not to lend itself to background music.


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## Bulldog (Nov 21, 2013)

Never in the background at home. In my car, it has to be background; otherwise I'd be crashing all over the place.


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## Captainnumber36 (Jan 19, 2017)

Enthusiast said:


> Not sure. I'm not so good at focusing my mind by will. The music might do it or it might not. I do quite often find myself being drawn into music as it unfolds but I'm not good at intending or planning this. It can be quite inconvenient sometimes!
> 
> I also think that some forms of focusing on music is actually counter-productive and does not enhance the experience. This is when listening "critically". I think critical understanding needs to be a reflection about an experience but I find it can be quite difficult to turn off my inner critic, especially when listening to a new performance of a familiar work.
> 
> And I do think there is a lot to say for having music loud but in the background, as if someone else in the house was listening to it. This is good especially with music that is new to me (new composer) as it allows the ideas to get under my skin.


If by focusing I simply mean following intensely, how do you counter?


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## DeepR (Apr 13, 2012)

If it's new music you can't listen to it in the background. If it's very familiar music, you can listen to it more or less in the background and still get a sense of enjoyment from the music, or whatever it is you get from it.


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## Dan Ante (May 4, 2016)

I never have classical on while driving there is just too mush tyre noise plus it can be a distraction, I am used to having some sort of music on in the background and it just passes me by most of the time, so to really enjoy classical music I have to *listen* and be doing nothing else, this does not apply to jazz which I am used to having a background of talking etc.


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## Capeditiea (Feb 23, 2018)

it depends on various factors... but both are likely.


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## Mandryka (Feb 22, 2013)

Captainnumber36 said:


> Do you feel you get much more enjoyment from Classical music when you focus on it rather than having it on in the background? I do. I think it helps you appreciate all the nuance that is going on.


You have to know what to focus on - where the patterns are; where the voices are in the textures, how they interact.

And in my experience having it on in the background has helped me develop this acuity.

(I'm going through this at the moment with some guitar music by Angelo Michele Bartolotti, as interpreted by Lex Eisenhardt. The music is complicated, and at first it wasn't easy for me to focus, but I had an intuition that something interesting was going on. And so I've just been letting it play in the background, without making much of an effort to listen attentively. And gradually it's making more sense, I can follow the polyphony etc.

The sensation is that the music has put me (finally) in the right state of mind to appreciate it.)


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## Strange Magic (Sep 14, 2015)

When I listen to music, that's all I'm doing.


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## Michael Diemer (Nov 12, 2017)

If Scheherazade is on in the car, there's a good chance I'll get lost. I hear the ship creaking in the waves; the sails unfolding, and I am off to the nethermost parts of the globe. No question of focusing here; the music just grabs me and won't let go.

I find that if I "try" to focus, I get impatient and lose the mood. For me, music is a form of meditation. Some of my most pleasant experiences have been letting the music put me in that state between waking and sleeping, where almost anything I hear acquires a magical veneer. When I come out of it, I say, Wow, I never realized how wonderful that piece was before.


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## Richard8655 (Feb 19, 2016)

I agree with the above. You can listen to CM in concentrated, razor sharp focus. Or in a meditative, ethereal state of mind. Both equally valid (and enjoyable) in my opinion.


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## DBLee (Jan 8, 2018)

I certainly derive more enjoyment and appreciation from music when I am able to devote my attention to it and appreciate the development of themes, the contrast of dynamics, the interplay of the different sections, etc. Unfortunately, time constraints dictate that most of my listening is done while I am doing something else.


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## Pugg (Aug 8, 2014)

Some people can two things at once, called multi tasking. I am one for sure as new daylight comes everyday.


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## jenspen (Apr 25, 2015)

Strange Magic said:


> When I listen to music, that's all I'm doing.


These days I give as much attention as I'm capable of to the music I'm listening to. This limits my listening times of course but it intensifies my enjoyment and understanding.

Once I used to ('overhear' would be the word I guess) a lot of music. I spoiled some of it for myself by doing that - I became familiar with the tunes and the highs and so got bored with many large, demanding works without ever having got to know them properly.


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## jenspen (Apr 25, 2015)

Pugg said:


> Some people can two things at once, called multi tasking. I am sure as new daylight everyday one of them.


But Pugg, research shows that they are kidding themselves. We think we can use our brains efficiently when attempting to do more than one thing at a time but we are actually swapping our attention between the various activities and performing all of them less well and more slowly than if we'd done them serially. Sad!


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## MarkW (Feb 16, 2015)

I am practically incapable of "just" listening without doing something else (often reading) because of the induced boredom of not being either active or at least doing something with my eyes (I hate being read to also). But for some reason my ability to compartmentalize auditory information processing allows me to be very aware of the qualities of whatever I'm hearing. Have no idea how I do it.


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## Capeditiea (Feb 23, 2018)

Aye, if i am listening while doing something else, i end up shifting focus back and forth... often i wonder how i ended up in the third movement so fast, 

most of the time i end up, listening to my favourite composers alone for the first time at the very least. But end up listening to them in the background. 
A great example would be Brahms' First Symphony, the first three movements i listen to with minute activity, but the fourth movement is a bit long winded and i end up doing something else. during the middle. 
Where for mahler's tenth, i end up stopping what ever i am doing just to listen to it. 
Also like yesterday, Rachmaninov's four Piano Concertos (i think of them as one big one since they all have a similar melody with the piano.) But they are all good, yet i end up listening to them all as background music while i end up listening intently to No. 2 and a few various parts of the other three. 

but for most others, i end up listening to them in the background for the first time, then revisiting them for informative purposes (if a piece i am working on calls for it.) 

I think Sorabji is the perfect example for this all, Opus Clavensemblisticum is long. (perfect for background music, also has various parts to captivate you for sporatic breaks of doing what ever you are doing. It is cleverly put together... i have a suspicion that he may have known that folk would be more busy doing other things... and that music would be recorded more often someday.) 

In my opinion, no matter the music, it is always more enjoyable the more attention you give to it.


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## Enthusiast (Mar 5, 2016)

Captainnumber36 said:


> If by focusing I simply mean following intensely, how do you counter?


I'm not good at concentrating by will. The music has to do it for me: to draw me in. This happens quite often but also fails to happen quite often! When it doesn't happen I may stop and try something else or I may let it run in the background. But I don't find having music in the background to be "listening time wasted" as quite a bit gets through and this is especially useful for new music. Something happens subconsciously that prepares me. Often I might find phrases or progressions from something heard in this background way going round in my head later. Then I know I will want to listen to the piece "properly".

I don't say it is right. It is just how I am. But I do see a lot of different senses in which we can focus on a piece of music (which may be what you are thinking of?): we can just sit there listening and thinking about (or not) what we are hearing or we can listen while reading a book (which is really music in the background) or we can follow the music from the score (I can't but those who can read music can - but isn't it "music in the background when we they that?) or we can listen intently but with our minds wandering to issues going on in our lives. And so on.

For me enjoying music involves getting inside it (or it getting inside me) and I personally feel that concentrating can sometimes stop this from happening in a meaningfully experiential way.


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## Enthusiast (Mar 5, 2016)

MarkW said:


> I am practically incapable of "just" listening without doing something else (often reading) because of the induced boredom of not being either active or at least doing something with my eyes (I hate being read to also). But for some reason my ability to compartmentalize auditory information processing allows me to be very aware of the qualities of whatever I'm hearing. Have no idea how I do it.


Yes. That is close to my experience also.


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## Enthusiast (Mar 5, 2016)

jenspen said:


> But Pugg, research shows that they are kidding themselves. We think we can use our brains efficiently when attempting to do more than one thing at a time but we are actually swapping our attention between the various activities and performing all of them less well and more slowly than if we'd done them serially. Sad!


I would like to know what research that is. I'm not sure I entirely trust it. After all, we know that a large part of our mental life is unconscious (or subconscious) and that what comes to the surface is a construction - often a rationalisation - created so that we can, where needed, make conscious decisions. These unconscious processes must be running genuinely in parallel (and not, like a computer, by jumping from strand to strand and only seeming to do all simultaneously). It is only when consciousness is involved that we need a unified focus. So, I would have thought that multitasking is fairly normal in activities that we are very practiced in.

You may drive from A to B and do so thinking about something totally different (perhaps listening to music!). You may not even remember the journey when you get there. But that does not mean you were not safely "focused" on your driving. If something happens that might require conscious intervention you immediately give it that attention. I often talk with my wife while driving but sometimes I need to say - hang on a minute, I need to concentrate on this.


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## jenspen (Apr 25, 2015)

Enthusiast said:


> I would like to know what research that is. I'm not sure I entirely trust it. After all, we know that a large part of our mental life is unconscious (or subconscious) and that what comes to the surface is a construction - often a rationalisation - created so that we can, where needed, make conscious decisions. These unconscious processes must be running genuinely in parallel (and not, like a computer, by jumping from strand to strand and only seeming to do all simultaneously). It is only when consciousness is involved that we need a unified focus. So, I would have thought that multitasking is fairly normal in activities that we are very practiced in.


As far as I can remember:

Daniel Dennett says pretty much exactly what you wrote (or he has said, I'm just taking an amateurish interest in the subject and it's been a while since I read him. I'm not sure that he is still active).

Daniel Kahnemann (an economist? Noble Prize winner) makes a distinction between thinking fast and thinking slow and I took away the idea that only very simple tasks could be completed while multitasking - as you suggest, driving on an empty road while listening to music.

But the neuroscientist whose book seems to be the most recent (and which is also the book that is still fresh in my mind) is Daniel J. Levitin, who calls multitasking a myth. I have also heard a podcast or two on the subject lately but I cannot attribute them - in an ABC (Australia) broadcast and, I think, a Sam Harris podcast.

Neuroscience seems to be a rapidly developing subject and I'm trying to keep up because I want my ageing brain to stay as brisk and healthy as possible. Also, it's fascinating!


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## Enthusiast (Mar 5, 2016)

jenspen said:


> As far as I can remember:
> 
> Daniel Dennett says pretty much exactly what you wrote (or he has said, I'm just taking an amateurish interest in the subject and it's been a while since I read him. I'm not sure that he is still active).
> 
> ...


Thank you. Interesting. I will have to look into Levitin. As for Kahnemann - a psychologist rather than a neuroscientist (as you note) and therefore focused on mind rather than brain - his fast thinking includes quite a lot of complex tasks that are familiar to us. He sees that fast thinking leads to mistakes (biases) which is interesting in the context of listening to music. Does the way I often listen to even new music lead me to hear something that is not there and to miss what is there as a result of some biases I have? My experience is almost the opposite - that by not focusing I allow in new (to me) understanding rather than filtering it through a more critical process. Hmm. I'll need to go back to Kahnemann to see how he handles that sort of thing.


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## Enthusiast (Mar 5, 2016)

I wonder if others have a similar experience to mine in this:

When I was a kid I would often listen to music - the latest piece I was getting to know - while reading a book. Some pieces now inevitably invoke a memory of the book I was reading when I first got to know the piece. So, Scheherazade (Rimsky-Korsakov's rather than Ravel's) always brings my experience of reading The Kraken Wakes by John Wyndham when I was 13 (the churning sea in the music seems particularly appropriate as the book is most set on boats). And Mahler 5 - my first encounter with Mahler (I was 16) - always makes me think of The Time Machine by HG Wells. In the latter case it also brings up the memory and feel of the day in question (the Time Machine is very short) - lying on my front in our living room on an unseasonably hot April day! Longer books often involved more than one piece of music so I have less memory of what I was reading at the time of reading them.


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## FossilHominid (Feb 24, 2018)

Mandryka said:


> You have to know what to focus on - where the patterns are; where the voices are in the textures, how they interact.
> 
> And in my experience having it on in the background has helped me develop this acuity.


I agree. It's counterintuitive, but really active listening, especially the first few times, doesn't get me far. It's in the repetition, in the random moments when I'm not necessarily paying attention, that things start to click.


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## MarkW (Feb 16, 2015)

Enthusiast said:


> I wonder if others have a similar experience to mine in this:
> 
> When I was a kid I would often listen to music - the latest piece I was getting to know - while reading a book. Some pieces now inevitably invoke a memory of the book I was reading when I first got to know the piece. So, Scheherazade (Rimsky-Korsakov's rather than Ravel's) always brings my experience of reading The Kraken Wakes by John Wyndham when I was 13 (the churning sea in the music seems particularly appropriate as the book is most set on boats). And Mahler 5 - my first encounter with Mahler (I was 16) - always makes me think of The Time Machine by HG Wells. In the latter case it also brings up the memory and feel of the day in question (the Time Machine is very short) - lying on my front in our living room on an unseasonably hot April day! Longer books often involved more than one piece of music so I have less memory of what I was reading at the time of reading them.


My experience is simiilar. Swan Lake often brings to mind the Dr. Doolittle bookis, Rodeo a youth sci-fi novel about Phobos!


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## Totenfeier (Mar 11, 2016)

Now that I'm actually thinking about it - I see a strange, possibly inexplicable pattern to my listening. Baroque and classical - with the exception of Bach - are _generally_ background for me. From Beethoven on, I find I am _compelled_ to focus intently for maximum enjoyment. Hm. Perhaps I have a semi-subconscious ability to register and process the more formal, mathematical, regular structures of pre-Romanticism in the background, but the unexpectedness of romantic and modern music requires an alertness? I dunno.


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## Simon Moon (Oct 10, 2013)

Pugg said:


> Some people can two things at once, called multi tasking. I am one for sure as new daylight comes everyday.


It's not a question of multitasking. It is whether I _ want_ to multitask, while listening to music.

And for me, that is a resounding no.

Not to mention, multitasking to Ligeti, Carter, Berg, Lundberg, Berio, Tower, Schwantner, etc, is not the easiest thing to do. :tiphat:


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## Enthusiast (Mar 5, 2016)

Totenfeier said:


> Now that I'm actually thinking about it - I see a strange, possibly inexplicable pattern to my listening. Baroque and classical - with the exception of Bach - are _generally_ background for me. From Beethoven on, I find I am _compelled_ to focus intently for maximum enjoyment. Hm. Perhaps I have a semi-subconscious ability to register and process the more formal, mathematical, regular structures of pre-Romanticism in the background, but the unexpectedness of romantic and modern music requires an alertness? I dunno.


Interesting - your instinct more or less maps onto the way audiences were expected to behave as our present day concert etiquette evolved. I believe our expectation of a completely quiet audience dates back to Wagner in the 1880s but this was a sort of culmination of a growing tendency of expecting audiences to listen carefully. But I am not that sure that I would treat, say, the Jupiter any differently to the Eroica.


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## Bill Cooke (May 20, 2017)

The only time I listen to CM while doing another activity is when I'm driving. For some reason I am able to listen in the car with enough attentiveness for it be a pleasurable experience. At work, I do not listen to any music. Whenever I try, I end up not hearing any of it. 

At home, an hour or two every day is devoted entirely to music. I do not do any other tasks at this time, because I want to fully appreciate the music.


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## Sonata (Aug 7, 2010)

It depends on the type of classical I am listening to. If it's an opera or a Bruckner symphony, absolutely I need to have focus. Actually Bruckner is my perfect driving classical, it actually kind of helps keep me alert and focused on both the road and the music at the same time if that makes sense. If I just sit and listen while doing nothing else, I might be prone to dozing off. (not because of the music, it's just my nature). Going for a good walk while listening is also a good option for me.

However, listening to Haydn, Boccherini, or some lively French Baroque really does not require extensive focus for me. Same for some (but not all) solo piano music. Having it on as background music can still help enhance whatever else I'm doing at the time.


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## Sonata (Aug 7, 2010)

Enthusiast said:


> I wonder if others have a similar experience to mine in this:
> 
> When I was a kid I would often listen to music - the latest piece I was getting to know - while reading a book. Some pieces now inevitably invoke a memory of the book I was reading when I first got to know the piece. So, Scheherazade (Rimsky-Korsakov's rather than Ravel's) always brings my experience of reading The Kraken Wakes by John Wyndham when I was 13 (the churning sea in the music seems particularly appropriate as the book is most set on boats). And Mahler 5 - my first encounter with Mahler (I was 16) - always makes me think of The Time Machine by HG Wells. In the latter case it also brings up the memory and feel of the day in question (the Time Machine is very short) - lying on my front in our living room on an unseasonably hot April day! Longer books often involved more than one piece of music so I have less memory of what I was reading at the time of reading them.


I didn't listen to classical music when I was young, but I've had this same experience with other music. It's a very cool sensation.


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## Merl (Jul 28, 2016)

Depends on how well I know the piece sometimes My listring time is limited. I listen to most of my music in the car, before and after school and whilst I'm ironing etc in the spare room.


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## mbhaub (Dec 2, 2016)

Classical Music, or Concert Music, is meant to be listened to. It demands our attention if we are to get the most out of it. But some people have trouble keeping focused. They pick up a book, watch TV with CC on, do puzzles - whatever. And they miss the music. Others close their eyes to absorb the music without distraction - and promptly fall asleep. What to do? Conduct! Yes, stand up, get a real baton, close the drapes, lock the door (lest someone think you're nuts) and flail away. You're probably doing it wrong, but that's not the point. Getting your whole body involved makes a huge difference in getting in touch with the music. Years ago some outfit sold a home-conductors kit to help people get started. And it's great aerobic exercise, too. You get to conduct the world's great orchestras and don't have to deal with union rules, either. Start simple: Haydn symphonies, and learn the basic beat patterns. Air conducting! Why not? There are plenty of fake air-guitarists.


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## Enthusiast (Mar 5, 2016)

I was thinking about this some more. Most (but not all) seem to prefer listening with concentration but there is a range of approaches taken. Many may feel that no-one can listen properly if they _don't concentrate (a position I feel is deeply wrong!). What I was wondering, though, is whether those who prefer listening with concentration do not find their minds wandering? And, if so, what do they do about it. Presumably a wandering mind can end up far from the music being listened to.

And this takes me to wonder what concentrating on music involves. Does it involve "interrogating" the music, discerning structure and/or seeking to follow what the composer is doing in technical (musical) terms? Or does it engage the imagination - such as developing images or some sort of narrative meaning from the music? And, finally, do "concentrators" feel strong emotions from the music they are concentrating on?_


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## Kevin Pearson (Aug 14, 2009)

I don't listen to classical while driving the car nor when working. I prefer to sit and concentrate on what I am listening to. For me it provides the greatest enjoyment and, in my opinion, gives the music the respect it deserves. I honestly don't know how anyone can listen to classical while driving. Especially if the music is slow and tedious. I prefer something like rock or gospel in the background while doing such tasks. Everyone is different though and I certainly wouldn't press on anyone my way of listening. The important thing is that you listen and enjoy it no matter how that is done.


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## Richard8655 (Feb 19, 2016)

I might be a little different as far as always needing to focus or fixate on classical music. I enjoy both serious concentration of the music as well as causal enjoyment as it plays in the background.

My analogy is like to fine architecture. I can admire and analyze a particular style or structure, but also enjoy just being within its confines and realm. This way it can benefit both left and right sides of the brain... analytic and mood/emotion.


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## Joe B (Aug 10, 2017)

Kevin Pearson said:


> ...Everyone is different though and I certainly wouldn't press on anyone my way of listening. *The important thing is that you listen and enjoy it no matter how that is done.*


aaaaa:tiphat:aaaaa:clap:aaaaa:cheers:


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## Roger Knox (Jul 19, 2017)

It's true that there's no one answer. Trained musicians may listen more _cognitively_, picking up analytically what's going on in the music. Untrained listeners may be equally attentive but respond more _affectively_, i.e. to mood and with emotion. Music in the background may be composed to be smooth, no arresting events or heavy emotions. Or it may be that listeners just turn the music down, or select (or have selected for them) "smooth" music.


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