# Multiple meter in pre-20-century music



## AmateurComposer (Sep 13, 2009)

Is anybody here familiar with Brahms Trio Op. 101? It caught my attention, in the Dictionary of Musical Themes by Barlow and Morgenstern, because of the double meter in its third movement. Furthermore, both themes in this movement have double meter but it applies differently in each of them. Since I do not have the score, I cannot judge for the entire movement, but from the lines in the dictionary, it seems that in the first theme the meter pattern is A B B A B B while in the second theme the meter pattern is A B A B, where A represents the first meter and B the second.

Are there other cases of multiple meters in pre-20-century music? If there are, is there any pattern of the manner in which they are applied? Is it completely random at the will of the composer? I wonder.


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## Klavierspieler (Jul 16, 2011)

IMSLP Score of Brahms' Piano Trio Op. 101
See page 20.


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## jalex (Aug 21, 2011)

Essentially it's just another way of writing the first theme in 7/4 and the second in 15/8. The second movement of Tchaikovsky's 6th (in 5/4) could be written in alternating bars 2/4 and 3/4. You'll find lots more examples of this under any prime number (except obviously two and three) on Wikipedia's list of pieces in unusual time signatures, although they won't be notated as in the Brahms.


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## AmateurComposer (Sep 13, 2009)

Thank you, both Klavierspieler and Jalex, very much. 

Jalex, I am aware of Tschaikovksy's 5/4 and other odd single meters. My question is about the Brahms' double meter notation and the inconsistency in its application. I was wondering if other pre-20-century composers used this notation. From your response I get the impression that this Brahms notation is unique.


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## jalex (Aug 21, 2011)

AmateurComposer said:


> Thank you, both Klavierspieler and Jalex, very much.
> 
> Jalex, I am aware of Tschaikovksy's 5/4 and other odd single meters. My question is about the Brahms' double meter notation and the inconsistency in its application. I was wondering if other pre-20-century composers used this notation. From your response I get the impression that this Brahms notation is unique.


Ah, I thought you were looking for the effect rather than the notation. I don't know of any pre-C20 works notated in this way, but then I haven't looked at how many works are notated. Possibly there are others.


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