# Which is your favorite or 'best' recording of Tchaikovsky Symphony 6 "Pathetique"?



## meaned

*Which is your favorite or 'best' recording of Tchaikovsky Symphony 6 "Pathetique"?*

What Tchaikovsky Symphony No. 6 recording have you heard that most moved you? I think this piece should hold you securely, without losing you once, at least through the first movement whole. That is when you take a breath and reflect, or realize 'oh, nice ensemble playing in the trio' or something, but it should keep you completely immersed otherwise.

I've long been searching for my favorite, ideal performance. So far, I have collected a large array of contenders, and from that list it is Evgeny Mravinsky who has made it into the tops most often. He has been recorded many times, and each has its special merit. His molding of this work changed significantly as decades passed. I recently came across a top fave from him: the most ferocious and beautifully paced March 30 1971 Soviet broadcast version.

I almost always give a new recording of the Pathetique the minimal decency of at least one complete playing. Then I have to go hunt around for my favorite set-piece and its breakdown, which is the big silent tapering off, followed by the shocking re-start which usually comes around the first movement's 9th or tenth minute. But how to single out a part of such a perennially fascinating and consistently rewarding composition?

So, please write which version you have, or if several, which is your favorite and maybe why? which moment do you wait for?

Anyway here is the ridiculous collection I've amassed in the search for 'the one':
_Tchaikovsky Symphony No.6_

Claudio Abbado, Simon Bolivar Venezuelan Youth Symphonic 2010 broadcast
Ernest Ansermet, Orchestre de la Suisse Romande 1956 Decca
Sergiu Celibidache, West German Radio Symphony Orchestra broadcast
Vladimir Delman, RAI Symphony Orchestra 1990
Wilhelm Furtwangler, Berlin Philharmonic Orchestra 1938
Daniele Gatti, Royal Philharmonic Orchestra
George Gerogescu, Romanian Radio & TV Orchestra 1950's LP
Valery Gergiev, Vienna Philharmonic Orchestra 2008 inhouse
Carlo Maria Giulini, Philharmonia Orchestra 1959 Decca
Carlo Maria Giulini, Philharmonia Orchestra 1961 BBC Legends
Mariss Jansons, Bavarian Radio Symphony Orchestra 2004 broadcast
Paavo Jarvi, Cincinnati Symphony Orchestra 2008 Telarc
Erich Klieber, Köln Radio Symphony Orchestra 1955
Zoltan Koczis, Hungarian National Philharmonic Orchestra 2010 broadcast
Serge Koussevitzky, Boston Symphony Orchestra 1946
Andrew Litton, Netherlands Radio Symphony Orchestra 2011 broadcast
Igor Markevitch, London Symphony Orchestra 1962 Decca
Igor Markevitch, National Orchestra of France 1958 broadcast
Jean Martinon, Vienna Philharmonic Orchestra 1958 Decca
Willem Mengelberg, Amsterdam Concertgebouw 1941
Willem Mengelberg, Amsterdam Concertgebouw 1937 Telefunken
Dmitry Mitropoulos, New York Philharmonic 1956 CBS
Pierre Monteux, Boston Symphony Orchestra 1955
Evgeny Mravinsky, Leningrad Philharmonic Orchestra 1949 USSR studio
Evgeny Mravinsky, Leningrad Philharmonic Orchestra 1960 UK
Evgeny Mravinsky, Leningrad Philharmonic Orchestra 1971 March 30 USSR broadcast *
Evgeny Mravinsky, Leningrad Philharmonic Orchestra 1975 Japan
Evgeny Mravinsky, Leningrad Philharmonic Orchestra 1982 USSR
Evgeny Mravinsky, Leningrad Philharmonic Orchestra 1982 USSR
Gennady Rozhdestvensky, London Philharmonic 2005 LPO label
Kurt Sanderling, Berlin Radio Symphony Orchestra 1979
Leonard Slatkin, France Radio Philharmonic Orchestra 2008 broadcast
Georg Solti, Chicago Symphony Orchestra 1978 Proms broadcast
Leopold Stokowski, London Symphony Orchestra 1973 broadcast
Evgeny Svetlanov, USSR Symphony Orchestra 1967
George Szell, Cleveland Orchestra 1969 Blossom Fest broadcast
Vaclav Talich, Czech Philharmonic Orchestra 1955 Supraphon
Klaus Tennstedt, Philadelphia Orchestra 1982 broadcast
Arturo Toscanini, NBC Symphony Orchestra 1938 Oct 29 broadcast
Arturo Toscanini, Philadelphia Orchestra 1942

\nota bene: these have been the ones I have kept, while many have, after considered listening, been sent to the delete bin.


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## joen_cph

Impressive list ! My favourite has always been the *Mravinsky stereo DG *& I find it quite sufficient;

I´ve had a couple more, but currently only these

CD - Mengelberg,CtGeb/gram 41-98 cd1ab78780
cd - Mengelberg,CtGeb/membran 4cd mono 44-05 222339-354
LP - Mengelberg,CtGeb/ telef mono 1940 th 97002
cd - Ormandy,PhiladO/tim 36-00 205237-303
LP - Mravinsky,LenPO/dg 61-xx 2727 012
LP - Matacic,CzPO/sup 68-83 1110 0485

I´m not so sure about the datings of the various Mengelbergs.

However, if I should spot the *late DG with Bernstein* at an attractive price I´d get that, due to its highly unusual, extremely slow finale etc.

Any other on your list you´d refer to as unusual/interesting in particular ?

*EDIT*: I remember *Matacic* as particularly good in the march, but it´s been a while since I heard it.


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## Ukko

David Oistrakh/Moscow orchestra (one of the biggies); 1967 celebration of the revolution. There is some tape saturation in the loud parts, but an over-the-top performance, with highly distinctive 'Russian brass sound'.


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## meaned

joen, I've not had the pleasure of the Matacic! Got to get to that one. Also, about



joen_cph said:


> ... the *late DG with Bernstein*
> 
> Any other on your list you´d refer to as unusual/interesting in particular ?
> 
> *EDIT*: I remember *Matacic* as particularly good in the march, but it´s been a while since I heard it.


I don't know that I can support Lenny's way with Tchaikovsky too much. I keep feeling like there are garish neon signs fuming and blasting every so often: "Cry *NOW* !!! _*FEEL THISSSSS!!!!*_ " and so on. it distracts me. Tchaikovsky compositions certainly can stand some schmaltz, need it in choice places, but I prefer other conductors' way with this aspect.

I just went back to some of the outliers and interesting perfs, among them I love, love the synergy between Concertgebouw and Mengelberg. In all instances. I enjoy following the head-shaking beauty and 'vibe' that they achieve in tempi fluctuations, organic buildups and other sadly underused [perceived] anachronisms. _Portamento_!

A dark horse solid library choice is the LPO under Rozhdestvensky, on the orchestra's own label. Great, satisfying performance.

Gatti's studio efforts with the Royal PO are unimpeachable. up there as equals with, or modern recorded versions of, Mravinsky's take on the symphony. That applies to Gatti's 4th and 5th too. especially the 4th, with a truly 'vodka-soaked finale'

And the Toscanini Philadelphia is always a special listen. This is since it is accompanied with the story that the maestro finished conducting it in tears, according to the liner notes reporting of Arturo's letter to his wife. apparently Toscanini never really liked the piece, then suddenly had an epiphany with it.
..

Hilltroll, I think I missed out on that one, it was on russia revelation? also a new one for the 'gotta get it someday' list. thanks!


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## bigshot

There are two schools of thought on Tchaikovsky, and it goes all the way back to the 1940s... One school of thought is that it is music that should be performed like any other music, with the focus on presenting it straight and proper. The other camp sees Tchaikovsky's music as a springboard for emotional expression. They're often accused of "lilly painting" and "taffy pulling" with the tempi. Personally, I am in the latter camp and prefer a highly evocative performance style. I really like Bernstein and Stokowski- Bernstein for the big sweeping emotions, and Stoki for the small beautiful details.


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## mitchflorida

Here's the answer to your question. The sound quality is amazing for a performance from the mid-50s. To me, this is "ear candy".


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## Klas Runo

\nota bene: these have been the ones I have kept, while many have, after considered listening, been sent to the delete bin.[/QUOTE]

What about Ferenc Fricsay's 1960 (1959?) stereo recording with the Berlin RSO on DG?


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## Pugg

Klas Runo said:


> \nota bene: these have been the ones I have kept, while many have, after considered listening, been sent to the delete bin.


What about Ferenc Fricsay's 1960 (1959?) stereo recording with the Berlin RSO on DG?[/QUOTE]

Welcome to Talk Classical Klas Runo , nice first post, is that your first choice?


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## Animal the Drummer

Klas Runo said:


> What about Ferenc Fricsay's 1960 (1959?) stereo recording with the Berlin RSO on DG?


I prefer his earlier mono recording with the Berlin Philharmonic, but both are very fine indeed.


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## Merl

Wow, tough question. So may really good ones, and recently I've been playing symphonies 1-3 far more, but before that I was really caught up in Pletnev's (DG) account and Dorati's from his LSO cycle.


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## Klas Runo

Pugg said:


> What about Ferenc Fricsay's 1960 (1959?) stereo recording with the Berlin RSO on DG?


Welcome to Talk Classical Klas Runo , nice first post, is that your first choice?[/QUOTE]

Thank you! Yes that has to be my first choice but I really haven't heard a lot of recordings.


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## realdealblues

Animal the Drummer said:


> I prefer his earlier mono recording with the Berlin Philharmonic, but both are very fine indeed.


I've easily got 75 recordings of Tchaikovsky's 6th and Ferenc Fricsay's MONO recording from 1953 with the Berlin Philharmonic is still the one that gives me the biggest chill! I like his later Stereo Recording but I would gladly trade it in a heartbeat to have that 1953 recording in modern Stereo Sound.


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## Pugg

I think I will stick with Muti.


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## JACE

My preferred Tchaikovsky Sixth is Ormandy/Philadelphia O (CBS/Sony).

Next would be either Fricsay/BPO (Heliodor) or Mravinsky/Leningrad PO (DG).


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## Vaneyes

Muti w. Philharmonia (EMI). Honorable mentions--HvK (EMI), Dutoit (Decca), Pappano (EMI). :tiphat:


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## chesapeake bay

I haven't listened to the 6th in a while but the three I had enjoyed in the past are the Martinon, Vienna Philharmonic which you have on your list as well as Bohm with the London Symphony and Ashley with the London Festival orchestra.


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## premont

Animal the Drummer said:


> I prefer his earlier mono recording with the Berlin Philharmonic, but both are very fine indeed.


I have only heard the mono, but I have also heard Fricsay conduct the work at a concert in Copenhagen (together with Bartok's Concerto for orchestra), and that was memorable, even if I was/am no Tchaikovsky'an at all.

Also I would mention Klemperer's recording, which is interesting, because it makes the music more cosmopolitan - a bit in the same way as Bernsteins Espansiva.


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## hpowders

Toscanini/Philadelphia Orchestra. Devastating.


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## Heck148

Reiner/ChicagoSO
my favorite...."best"

also very strong

Mravinsky LenPO
Mitropoulos/NYPO/


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## DavidA

Karajan / BPO(his EMI was Record Review's choice)

Mravinsky / Leningrad PO

Pletnev's first recording

All terrific


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## Antiquarian

My first 'Pathétique' was the Maazel/Vienna Philharmonic (1964) recording. It was my only recording of it for a long time ( vinyl of course), so my impression is that the 6th should sound like that one.

Others:
Neeme Järvi / Gothenburg Symphony Orchestra (BIS SACD-1348)

Ormandy / Philadelphia Orchestra (Sony)

Rozhdestvensky / USSR State Radio and Television Symphony Orchestra ( on a cheapo Ydang Classics CD)

I would just get the whole Järvi set on SACD. It has the symphonies, and loads of other great stuff.


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## Brahmsian Colors

joen_cph said:


> Impressive list ! My favourite has always been the *Mravinsky stereo DG *& I find it quite sufficient;


The sound of the recording is not the greatest, but I too am still most impressed with the stereo DG Mravinsky/Leningrad.


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## Pugg

I am leaning towards , Symphony No. 6 in B minor, Op. 74 'Pathétique' London Symphony Orchestra, Antal Dorati.
Muti still my favourite .


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## Brahmsianhorn

meaned said:


> What Tchaikovsky Symphony No. 6 recording have you heard that most moved you? I think this piece should hold you securely, without losing you once, at least through the first movement whole. That is when you take a breath and reflect, or realize 'oh, nice ensemble playing in the trio' or something, but it should keep you completely immersed otherwise.
> 
> I've long been searching for my favorite, ideal performance. So far, I have collected a large array of contenders, and from that list it is Evgeny Mravinsky who has made it into the tops most often. He has been recorded many times, and each has its special merit. His molding of this work changed significantly as decades passed. I recently came across a top fave from him: the most ferocious and beautifully paced March 30 1971 Soviet broadcast version.
> 
> I almost always give a new recording of the Pathetique the minimal decency of at least one complete playing. Then I have to go hunt around for my favorite set-piece and its breakdown, which is the big silent tapering off, followed by the shocking re-start which usually comes around the first movement's 9th or tenth minute. But how to single out a part of such a perennially fascinating and consistently rewarding composition?
> 
> So, please write which version you have, or if several, which is your favorite and maybe why? which moment do you wait for?
> 
> Anyway here is the ridiculous collection I've amassed in the search for 'the one':
> _Tchaikovsky Symphony No.6_
> 
> Claudio Abbado, Simon Bolivar Venezuelan Youth Symphonic 2010 broadcast
> Ernest Ansermet, Orchestre de la Suisse Romande 1956 Decca
> Sergiu Celibidache, West German Radio Symphony Orchestra broadcast
> Vladimir Delman, RAI Symphony Orchestra 1990
> Wilhelm Furtwangler, Berlin Philharmonic Orchestra 1938
> Daniele Gatti, Royal Philharmonic Orchestra
> George Gerogescu, Romanian Radio & TV Orchestra 1950's LP
> Valery Gergiev, Vienna Philharmonic Orchestra 2008 inhouse
> Carlo Maria Giulini, Philharmonia Orchestra 1959 Decca
> Carlo Maria Giulini, Philharmonia Orchestra 1961 BBC Legends
> Mariss Jansons, Bavarian Radio Symphony Orchestra 2004 broadcast
> Paavo Jarvi, Cincinnati Symphony Orchestra 2008 Telarc
> Erich Klieber, Köln Radio Symphony Orchestra 1955
> Zoltan Koczis, Hungarian National Philharmonic Orchestra 2010 broadcast
> Serge Koussevitzky, Boston Symphony Orchestra 1946
> Andrew Litton, Netherlands Radio Symphony Orchestra 2011 broadcast
> Igor Markevitch, London Symphony Orchestra 1962 Decca
> Igor Markevitch, National Orchestra of France 1958 broadcast
> Jean Martinon, Vienna Philharmonic Orchestra 1958 Decca
> Willem Mengelberg, Amsterdam Concertgebouw 1941
> Willem Mengelberg, Amsterdam Concertgebouw 1937 Telefunken
> Dmitry Mitropoulos, New York Philharmonic 1956 CBS
> Pierre Monteux, Boston Symphony Orchestra 1955
> Evgeny Mravinsky, Leningrad Philharmonic Orchestra 1949 USSR studio
> Evgeny Mravinsky, Leningrad Philharmonic Orchestra 1960 UK
> Evgeny Mravinsky, Leningrad Philharmonic Orchestra 1971 March 30 USSR broadcast *
> Evgeny Mravinsky, Leningrad Philharmonic Orchestra 1975 Japan
> Evgeny Mravinsky, Leningrad Philharmonic Orchestra 1982 USSR
> Evgeny Mravinsky, Leningrad Philharmonic Orchestra 1982 USSR
> Gennady Rozhdestvensky, London Philharmonic 2005 LPO label
> Kurt Sanderling, Berlin Radio Symphony Orchestra 1979
> Leonard Slatkin, France Radio Philharmonic Orchestra 2008 broadcast
> Georg Solti, Chicago Symphony Orchestra 1978 Proms broadcast
> Leopold Stokowski, London Symphony Orchestra 1973 broadcast
> Evgeny Svetlanov, USSR Symphony Orchestra 1967
> George Szell, Cleveland Orchestra 1969 Blossom Fest broadcast
> Vaclav Talich, Czech Philharmonic Orchestra 1955 Supraphon
> Klaus Tennstedt, Philadelphia Orchestra 1982 broadcast
> Arturo Toscanini, NBC Symphony Orchestra 1938 Oct 29 broadcast
> Arturo Toscanini, Philadelphia Orchestra 1942
> 
> \nota bene: these have been the ones I have kept, while many have, after considered listening, been sent to the delete bin.


I don't see here my absolute favorite, which is the SECOND Furtwangler recorded in 1951 in Cairo, available in various DG incarnations as well as on Archipel. His 1938 recording has a mysterious beauty and is well-recorded in studio, but for me the 1951 performance really captures the excitement and inspiration of the moment, as well as having a more full and present orchestral sound.


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## Brahmsianhorn

These are what I would consider the three essential sets of the last three Tchaikovsky symphonies. The Furtwangler set includes the 1951 recording I mentioned in my last post.


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## AfterHours

Though it's too recent to have attained "classic" status (yet), if I had to pick just one I'd probably choose Daniele Gatti's (slightly) over Mravinsky/LPO (DG), Bernstein/NYP (DG) and Muti. I think all of these are virtual equals in terms of "Performance Quality" though the tie breaker is the superb, vivid sound quality of Gatti's.


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## AfterHours

realdealblues said:


> I've easily got 75 recordings of Tchaikovsky's 6th and Ferenc Fricsay's MONO recording from 1953 with the Berlin Philharmonic is still the one that gives me the biggest chill! I like his later Stereo Recording but I would gladly trade it in a heartbeat to have that 1953 recording in modern Stereo Sound.


Wow, that's a lot of recordings leading me believe that, as usual, I should take your recommendation at least as seriously as any other!


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## realdealblues

AfterHours said:


> Wow, that's a lot of recordings leading me believe that, as usual, I should take your recommendation at least as seriously as any other!


Thanks. I have a ridiculous collection. Been trying to catalog it all for years. Certain composers and works I have multitudes of recordings of (such as this one). Symphonies, Orchestral Works, Piano & Violin Concertos and Solo Piano Works are my main focus. I'm no good for modern works for the most part. There are certain chamber works I'm knowledgeable of (Brahms, Beethoven, Mozart, Schubert, etc.) but many others I am not. Symphonies have always been my primary focus though.

Anyway, there's something about that old Fricsay recording that just makes the hair on the back of my neck stand up. I have many favorites Bernstein, Mravinsky, Muti, Fricsay, Monteux, Munch, Reiner, Gatti...they are all up at the top for me.


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## Animal the Drummer

One version which hasn't been getting a lot of love here, but which I like very much, is Paul Kletzki's with the Philharmonia, a very fine reading indeed though perhaps missing just the last touch of dark despair which Fricsay finds in the music.


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## Brahmsianhorn

One more I must mention. I am not a big Toscanini fan. I find most of his performances to be too rigid. But his 1941 Carnegie Hall Pathetique really hit it out of the park, one of the most electric performances you will ever here. It is from the same concert at the Piano Concerto with Horowitz, so very much worth seeking out.


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## Manxfeeder

I'm a little late for the party, but I'll cast another vote for Rozhdestvensky on Yedang. I was indifferent to Tchaikovsky until I heard his recording of the 6th.


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## DarkAngel

https://www.pristineclassical.com/collections/artist-yevgeny-mravinsky/products/pasc396

The Mravinsky hat trick remains a reference but the DG recording is closely miked and brightly lit, for those concerned with best sound Andrew Rose of Pristine XR applies his skills to further refine and illuminate sound......still brightly lit but now more nuance and fine detail is heard, check long sample at website.

From Fanfare Mag review:



> Since I've had the original mastered-for-CD Deutsche Grammophon set in my collection for years, it was easy to compare it to Rose's restoration effort to hear how much of a difference, if any, actually exists between them. First, I will say that I think I know what Rose means when he describes the sound of the original source recordings as "boxy." It's a bit dead, as in having little or no air or atmosphere around it, and there's little front-to-back dimensional depth. I would also agree that frequency-response-wise, the high end is a bit constricted or attenuated.
> 
> These two deficiencies have indeed been compensated for, quite remarkably so, I'd have to say, in Rose's refurbishment. There's real openness now and a sense of space in the hall and around the instruments, and the violins now soar upward into the stratosphere as if relieved of the gravity that was previously holding them captive. The one aspect on which I'm not sure Rose has improved much, if any, is the bass response. Maybe it's just a function of our individual hearing, but my Deutsche Grammophon CDs reproduce the low bass firmly and with satisfying impact. I honestly can't say I hear a significant difference in the low-register department, which, to my ear, was never really deficient to begin with.


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## Konsgaard

Currentzis'. I'd place it next to the Mravinsky, but still I think I prefer Currentzis in the end. I think it deserves all the awards and accolades it got.


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## Rmathuln

My faves

Mravinsky/DG stereo
Silvestri/Philharmonia
Monteux/BSO Living Stereo SACD
Furtwangler/Cairo
Giulini/Philharmonia
Abbado/VPO


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## Oldhoosierdude

Or


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## Merl

For an impressive modern recording try this one.


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## Itullian

Bernstein, DGG................


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## AfterHours

Evgeny Mravinsky - Leningrad Philharmonic Orchestra (1961) https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/51jSLwItstL.jpg ... as previously mentioned, may never be surpassed, imo...

Bernstein/DG probably just below that ... then the recent Corentzis rendition, which is not just an amazing performance, but possibly the most well-recorded Classical work I've ever heard in terms of checking all boxes of sound quality.

What separates Mravinsky's apart is how devotedly idiomatic it is to Tchaikovsky himself. Particularly in its most ferocious passages, it is on the verge of emotional (and technical) recklessness but just holds itself together. It sounds both highly technical, brilliantly composed, fully rendered _and_ emotionally spontaneous, almost haphazard (arms flailing, self-destructive and impulsive, achingly heart-on-sleeve, grief-ridden, violent outcries, frustrated, borderline suicidal...) at the same time. The tension between form and emotion is incredible.


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## DavidA

Karajan's 1970s EMI recording with the BPO is quite special


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## DarkAngel

realdealblues said:


> Thanks. I have a ridiculous collection. Been trying to catalog it all for years. Certain composers and works I have multitudes of recordings of (such as this one). Symphonies, Orchestral Works, Piano & Violin Concertos and Solo Piano Works are my main focus. I'm no good for modern works for the most part. There are certain chamber works I'm knowledgeable of (Brahms, Beethoven, Mozart, Schubert, etc.) but many others I am not. Symphonies have always been my primary focus though.
> 
> *Anyway, there's something about that old Fricsay recording that just makes the hair on the back of my neck stand up.* I have many favorites Bernstein, Mravinsky, Muti, Fricsay, Monteux, Munch, Reiner, Gatti...they are all up at the top for me.












This is available on Tidal streaming and includes 53 Pathetique, hard to find in CD form but Presto UK has download available.

I have the stereo 59 Ficsay 6th below which is very good but that 53 mono performance is really electrifying comparable to Mravinsky in intensity!


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## DarkAngel

AfterHours said:


> Evgeny Mravinsky - Leningrad Philharmonic Orchestra (1961) https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/51jSLwItstL.jpg ... as previously mentioned, may never be surpassed, imo...
> 
> Bernstein/DG probably just below that ... then the recent Corentzis rendition, which is not just an amazing performance, but possibly the most well-recorded Classical work I've ever heard in terms of checking all boxes of sound quality.
> 
> *What separates Mravinsky's apart is how devotedly idiomatic it is to Tchaikovsky himself. Particularly in its most ferocious passages, it is on the verge of emotional (and technical) recklessness but just holds itself together. It sounds both highly technical, brilliantly composed, fully rendered and emotionally spontaneous, almost haphazard (arms flailing, self-destructive and impulsive, achingly heart-on-sleeve, grief-ridden, violent outcries, frustrated, borderline suicidal...) at the same time. The tension between form and emotion is incredible*.


Well said AH, the 2nd movement sad waltz of a broken heart like two lovers who will soon depart forever, the 3rd movement last act of glorious defiance and brief moments of false hope only to be crushed in utter defeat, despair and hopelessness of 4th movement........it is quite a final testament of this troubled soul


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