# Give me your advice! And tell me why.



## Oskaar (Mar 17, 2011)

I am quite new to classical music. But I have learned to love a lot of it! I am searching threads and posts to be inspired. But I strugle with navigating some times. I am very eclectic...But so far I have explored mostly music from romantism to 1950.

I will be very glad for advices in any epoque, any style!


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## Manxfeeder (Oct 19, 2010)

I think you're pretty well grasping what you're hearing. 

A very, very short and incomplete but general description is, from 300 to 1600, classical music was concerned with melody; from 1600 to 1900, it was concerned with harmony; and from 1900 on, it was concerned with sound. So from pre-1600, listen to how the melodies interact; from around 1600 to 1900, listen to how the bass line progresses. 

Also notice how at the end of these eras, music anticipates the next phase; the closer to 1600 Renaissance music is, the more tonal it gets; the closer to the 20th Century harmony-driven music is, the less tonal it gets.


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## Manxfeeder (Oct 19, 2010)

Here's something new for you: fauxbourdon. Guilliame Dufay basically began the Renaissance style, and one characteristic of it was the use of the third note of the scale to add a sweet sound. 

Listen on Spotify to Pomerium's version of Ave Maria Stella. It starts with the first section in plainchant, all voices in unison. In the next section, the choir sings the same chant but with one part four notes below the melody and one part six notes below the melody - basically, a first-inversion chord (the bottom part is a false bass, or fauxbourdon). By making the bottom line of the melody the third note of the chord, the parts can move together in parallel motion without dissonance. 

Composers have used this technique since then, especially Vaughan-Williams with his chord streams. It has a sweet, serene sound.


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## Oskaar (Mar 17, 2011)

Thankyou Manxs, I will try it out, and try to recogn what you mention.


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## Oskaar (Mar 17, 2011)

I did not find Pomerium. This is without composer, maybe this is it?






I think I understand what you meen. Beautiful piece!


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## Oskaar (Mar 17, 2011)

I think I found it!


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## Sid James (Feb 7, 2009)

I would advise to get your hands on some good books about classical music. The A-Z of composers kinds of books are good, eg. giving you a spread of mainstream composers from ancient times to contemporary. I am not a fan of lists but these, if well written, are not just lists but offer biographies of the composers as well as describing some of their works, their relevance in the general scheme of things, their impacts & connections with other composers and the wider world, etc. You don't have to stick to mainstream though, already you've gone beyond that with guys like Antheil and Enescu who aren't as mainstream as some, but still important in their own ways. Just use what you read as a springboard to other things, etc.

I can PM you later or come back in next few days to give you a list of books I have, I recently got a very good one, but I don't have the title. Maybe it's a good idea to get one in your native language, just go into a bookstore or look online? Even for guys like me who've been listening to classical on and off for all my life, I still get a lot out of books even aimed at beginners. I see myself as not an expert in anything, very much an "eclectic" like your good self, Oskaar...


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## Oskaar (Mar 17, 2011)

Thanks for the advice, Sid! But I am strugelling with concentration problems, an reading is not easy for me. But one day I might be bether, and then perhaps I will go to the library and dig into the material.


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## Manxfeeder (Oct 19, 2010)

oskaar said:


> I think I found it!


That's the one. In fact, the whole Musical Book of Hours CD is a textbook of Renaissance composers. If you want to learn about this period, that's an excellent place to start, and it's well-sung.


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## Oskaar (Mar 17, 2011)

I will slowly get there!


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## Oskaar (Mar 17, 2011)

I have bookmarked this cd


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## Manxfeeder (Oct 19, 2010)

Do you know sonata form (also called sonata-allegro form)? Symphonies and sonatas use this form in the first movements and sometimes in the last movement. The easiest illustration is the first movement of Mozart's Eine Kleine Nachtmusik.

(This is timed to Jordi Savall's Serenate Notturne/Eine Kleine Nachtumusik on Spotify.)

Sonata form is like a novel which introduces a man, he travels to meet a woman, then they travel together and get in different situations, and finally they arrive home together.

Eine Kleine Nachtmusik starts out with *Theme A* (in G), which, in typical sonata form, is an energetic, masculine-sounding theme. Notice how it outlines the home chord (G) and the dominant chord (D) of the key it's in.

At .30, is a *bridge/transition* of rising scales that play faster and lands on a new key. Then there is a brief pause, letting you know you've traveled to a new key.

At .46, *Theme B* comes in (key of D). It's femine-sounding, lyrical, more relaxed, like it's sighing. The second half of the theme is a skipping-sounding closing theme, which closes off this section.

Both themes (called *the exposition*) repeat so you'll get the themes in your head.

At 3:09, the *development section* begins. The closing-skipping theme from the second half of the B theme moves through different keys, as if traveling from home. Finally, you hear a sustained pitch (pedal point), and it reaches the dominant key (D), which drops into:

at 3:42, the *recapitulation* of the A theme in the home key (g). This time, though, there is no key change in the bridge (so it's called a *false bridge*); at 4:24 the B theme returns in the same key.

At 5:07 is a *coda* (or tail), a brief melodic motif to end the piece.

Unusual for sonata form, the development and ending sections are repeated, but that's because the piece is so short.

Of course, composers don't rigidly follow this pattern, but this gives a general idea of how to follow this particular form.


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## Manxfeeder (Oct 19, 2010)

oskaar said:


> I have bookmarked this cd


If you have any questions as you get into it, I'll try to answer them. The liner notes don't explain why they include these particular pieces, but they do point out different aspects of the Renaissance.

Like the inclusion of "Venit ad Petrum . . . caput" - why is that there? Because composers wrote settings called Missa Caput, and no one knew why until some guy figured out it was taken from the melody over the word "caput."


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