# Another question for the Schoenberg-averse or -indifferent



## isorhythm (Jan 2, 2015)

What do you think of _Verklärte Nacht_?

I ask because I am curious whether it is the atonality that drives some people away from Schoenberg, or the Teutonic heaviness.


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## Dim7 (Apr 24, 2009)

Though I like the original string sextet version as well, the string orchestra version might prove more popular.

I think it's quite obvious that the "Teutonic heaviness" is rarely the thing that drives people away from Schoenberg, given the relative popularity of Wagner, Bruckner, Mahler etc. As for aton.... lack of traditional keys, well for sure it does make his music less accessible for the average classical musc listener, but I think at least equally important factors are the leaping melody lines, irregular phrase lengths, contrapuntal density, lack of literal repetition (the near constant development and variation) and the dissonance.


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## Mahlerian (Nov 27, 2012)

A wonderful piece, and the work of a composer whose personality was already very fully formed. The melodies and their treatment are pure Schoenberg.


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## isorhythm (Jan 2, 2015)

Yes, I guess I meant that more than Teutonic heaviness - in particular, his obsession with motivic development is very much present, with a huge amount of the musical material being derived from the descending scale figure at the beginning. I think it's beautiful, but there are no catchy tunes here.


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## Sloe (May 9, 2014)

Sorry I have listened to it for 11 minuts and now I don´t want to hear more.
I think it is a bit boring to listen to. I liked his piano concerto in the other thread better.


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## Dim7 (Apr 24, 2009)

Sloe said:


> Sorry I have listened to it for 11 minuts and now I don´t want to hear more.
> I think it is a bit boring to listen to. I liked his piano concerto in the other thread better.


The "atonal" piano concerto is certainly more tuneful! But I like both of them.


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## Sloe (May 9, 2014)

Dim7 said:


> The "atonal" piano concerto is certainly more tuneful! But I like both of them.


I continued with the orchestral version you linked to and I must say it is more pleasant to listen to. I really don´t care if music is atonal or not rhe only thing that is important for me is that it sounds good.


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## ComposerOfAvantGarde (Dec 2, 2011)

I'm not a great fan. Most Schoenberg just doesn't float my boat. Give me Webern!


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## Celloman (Sep 30, 2006)

isorhythm said:


> I think it's beautiful, but there are no catchy tunes here.


Of course, we all know that in order for a piece of music to qualify as "great", it *must* have a catchy tune. 

No, I think that _Verklarte Nacht_ is a great introduction to the person who hasn't heard anything by Schoenberg. It's a good stepping-stone to much of his later work.


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## Illuminatedtoiletpaper (Apr 12, 2012)

The orchestration is lush, the harmony is very sad and moving, and there are some quite operatic moments. Oh, and the counterpoint is spot on... It's a thrilling recording.


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