# Do You Own A Car(s)?



## ArtMusic

I am curious whether my fellow members here own a car(s)?

What are your views of cars in general?

Thank you for your thoughts.


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## Pugg

Yes, I / we do, actually two as my partner is working on Schiphol Airport using the "family" car every day.
I myself have Peugot 306 .


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## joen_cph

Cars are unnecessary in my city & for my needs, they are very expensive, parking space is extremely costly and difficult to find, they pollute the city in many ways and cause trouble, so a comparatively slightly provocative "who cares" from here.


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## ldiat

i own one car. when my wife worked we had 2. she doesnt drive anymore, so just one. always have owned never leased.


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## Dr Johnson

I like cars.


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## SarahNorthman

I do not have a car at the present. I walk, bike, and take public transportation. Everyone says that it is so "European" of me. Psh, just like a lazy New Mexican to say something like that. I will take it as a compliment regardless.


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## Ingélou

Yes, I do. We have one.
I have always been aware of the pollution that cars cause, and when I was a teenager, I said that I'd delay getting one until I was 30, and that is in fact what happened. 

But I can't deny that it's wonderfully life-enhancing to be able to go to concerts and dances and music lessons without waiting and worrying - and in Norfolk, there wouldn't necessarily be a bus anyway. 

I hope that I will have the sense & resolution to give up driving when/if I live to be 80+, as I know of terrible accidents that have occurred when drivers were 'past it'. I dread causing harm to anyone when behind the wheel.


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## ArtMusic

Dr Johnson said:


> I like cars.


Which ones? Just curious.


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## ArtMusic

Ingélou said:


> Yes, I do. We have one.
> I have always been aware of the pollution that cars cause, and when I was a teenager, I said that I'd delay getting one until I was 30, and that is in fact what happened.
> 
> But I can't deny that it's wonderfully life-enhancing to be able to go to concerts and dances and music lessons without waiting and worrying - and in Norfolk, there wouldn't necessarily be a bus anyway.
> 
> I hope that I will have the sense & resolution to give up driving when/if I live to be 80+, as I know of terrible accidents that have occurred when drivers were 'past it'. I dread causing harm to anyone when behind the wheel.


Yes it's the convenient factor when you are going somewhere that depends on time for public transport.


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## Dr Johnson

ArtMusic said:


> Which ones? Just curious.


You don't want a list, do you?

:lol:


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## SiegendesLicht

Never had one and do not intend to if I can avoid it.


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## Kjetil Heggelund

Yes, a Mazda 3 from 2007. It is grey and on it's way to Sweden in a day


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## TxllxT

Our fifth in a row  and probably the last one


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## Dr Johnson

ArtMusic said:


> Which ones? Just curious.


To give a less facetious answer to your question:

I currently own a 14 yr old Audi A3 which is economical to run, great to drive (when conditions allow) and very reliable.

Before that I had an Audi A4 which was great to drive etc and very, very reliable.

I sometimes think that, if I had taken a bit more thought about careers when I was young, I should have become a motoring journalist and thus had the experience of driving lots of different cars without the expense and worry of owning them.


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## Art Rock

I have no special interest in cars, but we have one for convenience sake. A trip to my brother's place is 45 min by car, 1 h 45 min by public transport.


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## Harmonie

I like to joke that I chose to have instruments instead. However, in reality I can't drive for medical reasons. I'm sad, I would love to have that independence, and it will be awkward if I ever find a partner. 

I probably would have had a Honda Accord or Civic. My family has had good experience with that brand.


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## Barbebleu

Two cars. My wife has a Mini One, I have a Vauxhall Astra. Really for convenience sake. We both do a lot of different things so we both need the convenience of a car, babysitting duties, children's hearings, lawn green bowling commitments etc. Always busy, busy, busy. So much for lazy retirement!!


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## Dr Johnson




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## znapschatz

We own two cars, both Volvos. Although I'll drive anything, my wife is partial to the marque, so I defer to her preference. One is a 23 year old 850 sedan, the other a recently purchased 2012 S60 that replaced an increasingly unreliable 1991 740. I am a photographer and she is a singer and performer of children's programs. We need them because our occupations both require us to travel with too much equipment (lighting, sound) to hand carry and occasionally for considerable distances. Our local public transportation systems are inadequate, so we are sort of dependent on private means. We are both getting on in years, so these could be the last cars we own.


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## SixFootScowl

These reside at my house
My 2001 Ford Ranger 2.3L 5-speed.
Son's 2001 Chevy S-10 2.2L 5-speed.
Wife's 1999 Plymouth Voyager van 2.4L 3-speed automatic
Daughter's 1997 Ford Escort wagon 2.0L automatic

Pretty much have to have a car to get around here, but I do like cars too.


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## SiegendesLicht

My fiance used to have a Toyota. After he moved to Hamburg he sold it and went on a three months' long trip to New Zealand.


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## TurnaboutVox

I had to give up driving 25 years ago due to illness. We lived in Glasgow at the time which has reasonably good public transport. People generally gave me lifts when I worked at a hospital out in the remote countryside for 6 months, but I also evolved my present system of using public transport and my legs, and taxis where time was of the essence or no public transport option was available (increasingly in austerity Britain).

I reckon this costs us less than a second car would (I travel all over the north of England and to London and Scotland for work and family purposes).

We jointly own, and Mrs. Vox drives, a petrol engined 2011 VW Golf which is a cousin to Dr Johnson's Audi A3. It too is very reliable. 

Which reminds me, Dr. J., that we first encountered each other over a disagreement about diesel engines last year! :tiphat:


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## Guest

Being an American who does not live in a major population center, I need a car. My family has two, one for me, one for my wife. I enjoy having a car, and we travel quite a bit with it.


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## Dr Johnson

TurnaboutVox said:


> I had to give up driving 25 years ago due to illness. We lived in Glasgow at the time which has reasonably good public transport. People generally gave me lifts when I worked at a hospital out in the remote countryside for 6 months, but I also evolved my present system of using public transport and my legs, and taxis where time was of the essence or no public transport option was available (increasingly in austerity Britain).
> 
> I reckon this costs us less than a second car would (I travel all over the north of England and to London and Scotland for work and family purposes).
> 
> We jointly own, and Mrs. Vox drives, a petrol engined 2011 VW Golf which is a cousin to Dr Johnson's Audi A3. It too is very reliable.
> 
> *Which reminds me, Dr. J., that we first encountered each other over a disagreement about diesel engines last year! *:tiphat:


I remember it well! :lol:

Thinking of the rather fraught question of types of fuel etc I have just remembered that I saw one of *these* in Cambridge a couple of weeks ago. Looks very smart.










It will be interesting to see how the electric car develops.


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## Manxfeeder

I live 20 minutes north of Nashville, and buses don't run up here, so I need a car. I drive a 1997 Toyota Camry with 230,000 miles on it, but the car stereo is fabulous. My wife drives a Mercedes. We found an inexpensive used one and fixed it up. 

Maybe the carbon emission thing makes me a bad person. But hey, every time our president steps into Air Force One he puts out more carbon in one trip than I do in an entire year. I guess we're both in the same club.


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## senza sordino

I don't own a car. I used to own a car. I stopped driving to work 12 years ago, and started taking public transport. Transit is not too bad here, if you live in the urban area. While I took public transit to work I still owned the car, but it got old and neglected sitting in the garage doing nothing. It needed maintenance, or I needed to buy a new car - and why do that just to sit in the garage? So 7 years ago I scrapped the car, and by then the car was 18 years old with one owner - me. We have a program here to scrap a car and get in return two years of transit tickets. 

I have been without a car for seven years and six months. I take transit everywhere. Recently I moved close enough to either walk or ride my bicycle to work. My groceries are delivered. I don't need to own a car.

Last Christmas I signed up for a car sharing program. I've used it a few times since, and it made my move a lot easier, especially buying new furniture and plants for my new place. 

I don't intend on owning a car ever again.


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## Figleaf

I've never had a car. I've considered it from time to time, but always delayed learning to drive because of the cost. When I was 17, a car was a great status symbol even if it was some 1970s rust bucket - but for most people the choice was between spending all your free time on driving lessons and McJobs to pay for the driving lessons, or focusing on A levels and university, where you wouldn't need a car in any case. With my usual instinct for backing the three legged horse, I chose the academic route and put off car ownership until the day when I had a career and disposable income. The career never materialised and my income peaked at a level where I could probably just about afford to run a car but didn't see the point of spending every single penny on it. So that's where I am: I'd like to pretend it was some high minded environmentalist principle, but really it's because cars are a money draining status symbol, and if you have to even think about the cost, you should know already that you probably can't afford it. If I manage to move to France, I would like to get a cargo bike of the kind they make in Denmark, or failing that a solidly made German bike, or maybe a vintage bike which is heavy but indestructible. French drivers may be reckless but they tend to be respectful towards cyclists and pedestrians, and the roads are fairly empty. Here in congested Britain I wouldn't dream of cycling on the roads, and my opinions on the subject of pavement cyclists are unprintable!


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## Figleaf

Dr Johnson said:


> To give a less facetious answer to your question:
> 
> I currently own a 14 yr old Audi A3 which is economical to run, great to drive (when conditions allow) and very reliable.
> 
> Before that I had an Audi A4 which was great to drive etc and very, very reliable.
> *
> I sometimes think that, if I had taken a bit more thought about careers when I was young, I should have become a motoring journalist *and thus had the experience of driving lots of different cars without the expense and worry of owning them.


It's a shame you never did. Top Gear needs you! :tiphat:


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## Dr Johnson

Figleaf said:


> It's a shame you never did. Top Gear needs you! :tiphat:


That's very flattering, Figleaf, but I'm not sure that I could stand working with Chris Evans.


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## Strange Magic

I currently own a Subaru Forester, 2004--my 6th Subaru. Subaru has established itself in a secure niche, specializing in 4-wheel drive vehicles of very high quality at affordable prices, and their customer base is very loyal. They make it a point, though, to almost always have a model available that almost nobody will buy--often these vehicles are quite innovative, or at least different--but within 2 or 3 years they are gone from the U.S. market anyway. I remember the Brat, the Justy, the SVX, the Baja, the GF, to name a few of the short-lived experiments. Two rules always for me when selecting a car: it must be white, and it must have a manual transmission. I enjoy driving on twisty roads, o'er hill and dale, and as I drive, I think of Toad--he so loved driving too.


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## Dr Johnson

Strange Magic said:


> I currently own a Subaru Forester, 2004--my 6th Subaru. Subaru has established itself in a secure niche, specializing in 4-wheel drive vehicles of very high quality at affordable prices, and their customer base is very loyal. They make it a point, though, to almost always have a model available that almost nobody will buy--often these vehicles are quite innovative, or at least different--but within 2 or 3 years they are gone from the U.S. market anyway. I remember the Brat, the Justy, the SRS, the Baja, the GF, to name a few of the short-lived experiments. Two rules always for me when selecting a car: it must be white, and it must have a manual transmission. *I enjoy driving on twisty roads, o'er hill and dale, and as I drive, I think of Toad--he so loved driving too.*


:tiphat: .


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## GreenMamba

I have one car, a Chevy Cruze. I tend to run them into the ground but this one is young yet. 

As with Strange Magic, I must have manual transmission.


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## Figleaf

Dr Johnson said:


> That's very flattering, Figleaf, but I'm not sure that I could stand working with Chris Evans.


I should have made it clear that this hypothetical scenario involved yourself and possibly Matt Leblanc, but certainly not Chris Evans!


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## Dr Johnson

Figleaf said:


> I should have made it clear that this hypothetical scenario involved yourself and possibly Matt Leblanc, but *certainly not Chris Evans!*


Phew! That's alright then.

It's just a matter of waiting for the call ...


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## Bulldog

My wife and I have two cars - hers is a Subaru, mine a manual transmission Mazda. I suppose there might be some big cities in the U.S. where a car is not necessary, but there are no such places in New Mexico. I've been in European cities where the public transportation is so good that one can live without a car such as Basel/Switzerland where my son resides.

Almost forgot to mention that fast driving is a blast!


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## sospiro

Have never had a car and don't intend getting one.

Like Figleaf, I'd like to say it was for the environment but it isn't - it's because of the cost. I walk as much as possible and I'm lucky to live within walking distance of town and only get the bus if there's lightning about. I buy my bulky/heavy shopping online and get it delivered. I use bus or train for longer distances and get a taxi if necessary.

I would ride a bike but until the attitude of the British motorist changes towards cyclists then I won't bother. It is becoming the norm for councils to designate pavements as part of cycle routes and it's proving a nightmare. I know in Germany the pavements are divided into cycle and pedestrian lanes but it's a free for all here and is very dangerous. One of the (many) reasons I love The Netherlands is the country's attitude towards cycling and I read about the _Stop de Kindermoord_ project with envy.

http://www.aviewfromthecyclepath.com/2011/01/stop-child-murder.html


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## elgar's ghost

Never really been interested in cars or motorcycles and have been even less interested in learning how to drive/ride them. This has probably limited my travel options and career opportunities over the last thirty-odd years but on the plus side I have saved myself a fair amount of money along the line which has at least allowed me to pay off my mortgage quicker than I might have done otherwise.


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## znapschatz

Strange Magic said:


> I currently own a Subaru Forester, 2004--my 6th Subaru. Subaru has established itself in a secure niche, specializing in 4-wheel drive vehicles of very high quality at affordable prices, and their customer base is very loyal. They make it a point, though, to almost always have a model available that almost nobody will buy--often these vehicles are quite innovative, or at least different--but within 2 or 3 years they are gone from the U.S. market anyway. I remember the Brat, the Justy, the SVX, the Baja, the GF, to name a few of the short-lived experiments. Two rules always for me when selecting a car: it must be white, and it must have a manual transmission. *I enjoy driving on twisty roads, o'er hill and dale, and as I drive, I think of Toad--he so loved driving too.*


Oh, didn't he, though! But he jumped from one fad to another so often that by now he might have gone into flying machines because the story is so timeless. Dear thing. Enthusiasm is such a positive emotion that it is sometimes worth the consequences.


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## SixFootScowl

I like older vehicles and long for my old 1977 F100, which was a 3-speed column shift, manual steering, no power brakes, crank windows, manual locks, no AC (though I might like the AC these days), and a simple radio with knob dials and push buttons--no touch screen thankfully! Here it is (that's my sister driving) and the sun roof was added probably because I did not have AC:


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## Figleaf

elgars ghost said:


> Never really been interested in cars or motorcycles and have been even less interested in learning how to drive/ride them. This has probably limited my travel options and career opportunities over the last thirty-odd years but on the plus side I have saved myself a fair amount of money along the line which has at least allowed me to pay off my mortgage quicker than I might have done otherwise.


Me too! Well, I never earned enough to qualify for a mortgage, but I did cobble together enough funds to buy a house for the price of a cheap new car - and since I don't think the kids would be especially chuffed to live in a car, that was probably the right choice.


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## TxllxT

Figleaf said:


> Me too! Well, I never earned enough to qualify for a mortgage, but I did cobble together enough funds to buy a house for the price of a cheap new car - and since I don't think the kids would be especially chuffed to live in a car, that was probably the right choice.


Our last Xantia was imported from Belgium for 3000 Euro (with 100.000km officially guaranteed on the counter), and all the Xantias we had before this one costed around 5000 Euro. For that price one cannot buy even a lone garage in Holland.


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## Huilunsoittaja

I'd like to not buy a car, and use bike, uber, walking, and public transit as much as I can as a musician. But I know the day is coming when I'll need one. I just need more money first....


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## Sloe

TxllxT said:


> Our last Xantia was imported from Belgium for 3000 Euro (with 100.000km officially guaranteed on the counter), and all the Xantias we had before this one costed around 5000 Euro. For that price one cannot buy even a lone garage in Holland.


I think Figleaf meant the down payment.
And houses usually don´t loose value like a car.


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## Manxfeeder

Huilunsoittaja said:


> I'd like to not buy a car, and use bike, uber, walking, and public transit as much as I can as a musician.


That's the benefit of playing the flute. I've suffered from flute envy more than once as I lugged my saxophone onto the college bus. It was a challenge not to hit people, and it was hard to sit comfortably with the case between my knees and trying not to poke the person next to me. And that was just with an alto sax. With my baritone, forget it.


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## Strange Magic

No matter how old (within reason) your car is, be assured that the average car today is infinitely better than cars were in the 1940s, 50s, 60s, 70s. It took the shock of the Japanese auto industry's absorption of American-invented ideas of assembly-line quality control--which American car makers entirely ignored--to finally jolt the beginnings of massive, cumulative improvement in U.S. cars. A mechanic I know said that, back then, when a new American model came onto the market, quality control consisted in fixing the endless bugs in the new model, and then slowly working the repairs into the manufacturing cycle, rather than striving to build the car right from the get-go. Classic examples of GM idiocy: the 4-6-8 engine, which was supposed to shut down cylinders when not needed, and the attempt to convert gasoline engines into diesels during an early diesel craze here.

Tires are way, way better now also. And car AC. Wouldn't dream of owning a car without AC. Now, if I could get everybody else off the roads, Toad and I would be in ecstasy.


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## Gordontrek

2001 Chevrolet Silverado. Thing is about to hit 170,000 miles, but still drives like a Cadillac and has never had a major problem. As far as I'm concerned, it's only gone through about half its lifespan!
Nevertheless I'm saving up for a Malibu. My Silverado is a wonderful vehicle but it's a gas guzzler. I need something (as long as it's Chevy!) that is better on gas and gets around a cramped college campus a little better.


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## SixFootScowl

Gordontrek said:


> 2001 Chevrolet Silverado. Thing is about to hit 170,000 miles, but still drives like a Cadillac and has never had a major problem. As far as I'm concerned, it's only gone through about half its lifespan!
> Nevertheless I'm saving up for a Malibu. My Silverado is a wonderful vehicle but it's a gas guzzler. I need something (as long as it's Chevy!) that is better on gas and gets around a cramped college campus a little better.


A Malibu? Can you get it with a manual transmission? How about a Dart? That can be had with manual transmission.


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## ArtMusic

Dr Johnson said:


> You don't want a list, do you?
> 
> :lol:


Like we always do here at TalkClassical, list only your top favorites.


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## EdwardBast

The nearest grocery store is four miles (and 500 feet elevation) away and there is no public transportation where I am, so a car is a necessity. I have one — actually two, but I'm trying to get rid of one. Hondas both.


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## GreenMamba

Strange Magic said:


> No matter how old (within reason) your car is, be assured that the average car today is infinitely better than cars were in the 1940s, 50s, 60s, 70s.


It drives me crazy when people pine for the cars of yesteryear. Sure, many models looked great, but I sure as check wouldn't want to drive one on a daily basis.


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## Guest

2016 Honda Accord V6 Touring Edition.


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## Krummhorn

Mine is a 2004 VW Jetta GLS Turbo (gas), 5 speed manual. Bought new off the showroom floor. 

Wife has 2006 Honda Cr-V, auto trans. Bought used in 2008.


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## Figleaf

Sloe said:


> I think Figleaf meant the down payment.
> And houses usually don´t loose value like a car.


No, the house (in France) cost thirteen thousand and five pounds sterling in December last year: that's the entire purchase price including fees and taxes, though of course the sterling-euro exchange rate was better then than now. Last week I got a refund from the notaire that came to just over two hundred pounds, thus taking the cost well below thirteen thousand pounds. I know it's vulgar to talk about how much your house cost, but I feel I have to mention it because there are so many people like me who have small savings but don't earn enough to get a mortgage, and thus wrongly assume they are priced out: they just need to think creatively and be prepared for a radical relocation. (We will see in the coming months whether UK citizens will legally be allowed to continue to live on the Continent in the light of recent political events; my timing may well have been unfortunate.) Anyway, I don't know what sort of car you can get for 13 grand - a pretty good used one perhaps, or a modest one that's new - but I do think car culture is unfortunate in that so many young and impecunious people seem to think that getting a car is a rite of passage which is necessary to become a proper adult, and that this focus on such an expensive mode of transport holds them back financially and keeps them in the rent trap for longer than they would otherwise be. Of course, the cost and desirability of car travel as well as the need to buy rather than rent a house does very much depend on the situation in the country you happen to be living in - mine is a British perspective and things might well be different elsewhere.


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## SixFootScowl

GreenMamba said:


> It drives me crazy when people pine for the cars of yesteryear. Sure, many models looked great, but I sure as check wouldn't want to drive one on a daily basis.


Yes but then the new, more reliable and low maintenance cars took all the fun and adventure out of driving. 

I want the best of both worlds. Give me a nice simple 60s car but retrofitted with electronic ignition and fuel injection. But I'll keep the crank windows and manual locks.


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## SixFootScowl

Krummhorn said:


> Mine is a 2004 VW Jetta GLS Turbo (gas), *5 speed manual*. Bought new off the showroom floor.


I *like* it! My kind of car.


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## Strange Magic

D


Florestan said:


> Yes but then the new, more reliable and low maintenance cars took all the fun and adventure out of driving. .


Not so, IMO. The fun of driving, for me, is a combination of a great country road combined with at least a 4-speed manual transmission and the full ability to use that transmission to the max. I have long observed that, on average, drivers brake (show brake lights) ten times more often than I. By maintaining a prudent distance behind the car ahead, by observing closely what the car ahead of the car ahead of you is doing, and by judiciously using the transmission to control both acceleration and braking (engine braking), one becomes fully integrated with the road/traffic/car interface, and soars along, rarely needing to brake. The manual transmission is the key. My wife has a 1.5 liter Scion xA--a puny, feeble car that would be essentially a motorized baby carriage with an automatic transmission. But with its 4-speed manual, it's actually a great driving road car, with remarkable torque. I'll quit driving when they no longer make manual transmissions.


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## SixFootScowl

Strange Magic said:


> D
> 
> Not so, IMO. The fun of driving, for me, is a combination of a great country road combined with at least a 4-speed manual transmission and the full ability to use that transmission to the max. I have long observed that, on average, drivers brake (show brake lights) ten times more often than I. By maintaining a prudent distance behind the car ahead, by observing closely what the car ahead of the car ahead of you is doing, and by judiciously using the transmission to control both acceleration and braking (engine braking), one becomes fully integrated with the road/traffic/car interface, and soars along, rarely needing to brake. The manual transmission is the key. My wife has a 1.5 liter Scion xA--a puny, feeble car that would be essentially a motorized baby carriage with an automatic transmission. But with its 4-speed manual, it's actually a great driving road car, with remarkable torque. I'll quit driving when they no longer make manual transmissions.


I can go along with most of that. Unfortunately, manual transmissions are pretty rare in the USA these days. One problem with manual transmissions in modern cars is the computer makes it rev hang to prevent extra pollutants from dumping to the atmosphere from a sudden drop in rpm. That, I am told, makes driving the manual kind of awkward. But other countries may not have that anti pollution requirement.

The other problem is most affordable new cars today with manual transmissions are front wheel drive. I have always had rear wheel drive. In winter, when the streets are snowy, I sometimes will goose the throttle a little on a turn to bring the rear end around. Just a fun sort of thing to do. Well when my wife got the Voyager mini van it is front drive and the first time I took a corner in the snow, I goosed it. It was then I realized the habit would not do in a front drive vehicle. When you do that on a turn in the snow, instead of bringing the rear end around, it makes it quit turning and go straight for the curb.


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## JosefinaHW

Dr Johnson said:


> To give a less facetious answer to your question:
> 
> I currently own a 14 yr old Audi A3 which is economical to run, great to drive (when conditions allow) and very reliable.
> 
> Before that I had an Audi A4 which was great to drive etc and very, very reliable.
> 
> I sometimes think that, if I had taken a bit more thought about careers when I was young, I should have become a motoring journalist and thus had the experience of driving lots of different cars without the expense and worry of owning them.


Great Taste, Dr. Johnson! I've never bought a new car and never plan to do it, unless it's the only way I'll get a manual transmission. All German cars until now  My first car was a VW bug--$.99 for a gas filter!! :lol: That car ran like a tank despite having bicycle-wide-sized tires! I was the only one going up the hills in the snow. Also, always have driven manual transmissions until now  (we really need a "smiley" that is wailing in agony!).

After the VW, I had all used Audi's: I LOVED those cars--not the parts and labor bills ($50 for wind shield wipers 16 years ago!), but fortunately I never had many problems. I was so disappointed when they redesigned them to look like all other cars (I'm terrible with model numbers). Last Audi came over from Germany: had a Blaupunkt stereo system. It was ordered by the Parts Manager at my dealership and he was getting a divorce and had to streamline.

There was a period of several years that I physically was not able to drive and having moved to the "country" at the end of this period I was going crazy--my sister believed me when I said it was time to start driving again and she let me drive her car, taking pretty fast steps from easy to most difficult conditions. The most difficult thing was how attached I had become to wildlife, I was so afraid I was going to hit a groundhog, opossum, etc..! It took awhile for me to come up to the speed limit because of that.

Then a friend that my father had met out here died and he had willed me his car--this was totally out of the blue!: a Chevy Malibu that was maxed out with all the best options because he loved to drive, too--performance tires, fantastic stereo system, powerful engine. I never knew why he didn't select a manual transmission.

Believe it or not it is a really fun car to drive. I'm also driving my father's car because he is too weak to drive and he wants me to take my mother around in his car to keep it running, etc.. Both cars have CD players not the system that can access my music on the cloud and from my phone, etc., so there is this constant dashing between the two vehicles to find the disc I want to listen to, my one pair of prescription sunglasses, etc.... I suppose I said too much, sorry, I really wanted to share this story for some reason.  Thank you.

I close with as soon as I think the Malibu has lived the best of its life I've definitely decided to go back to a manual transmission, what make and model? I have no idea--don't like the design of the Audis anymore. [


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## JosefinaHW

Harmonie said:


> I like to joke that I chose to have instruments instead. However, in reality I can't drive for medical reasons. I'm sad, I would love to have that independence, and it will be awkward if I ever find a partner.
> 
> I probably would have had a Honda Accord or Civic. My family has had good experience with that brand.


:Harmonie: Let's hope they find a way to design a car that will accommodate your special needs. It's starting to seem that some cars will be driving themselves were soon.


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## JosefinaHW

znapschatz said:


> We own two cars, both Volvos. Although I'll drive anything, my wife is partial to the marque, so I defer to her preference. One is a 23 year old 850 sedan, the other a recently purchased 2012 S60 that replaced an increasingly unreliable 1991 740. I am a photographer and she is a singer and performer of children's programs. We need them because our occupations both require us to travel with too much equipment (lighting, sound) to hand carry and occasionally for considerable distances. Our local public transportation systems are inadequate, so we are sort of dependent on private means. We are both getting on in years, so these could be the last cars we own.


:znapschatz: That just reminded me I do like the design of both the old and new Volvos.... a future possibility. (I hope your wife is much improved, by the way.)


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## JosefinaHW

TurnaboutVox said:


> We jointly own, and Mrs. Vox drives, a petrol engined 2011 VW Golf which is a cousin to Dr Johnson's Audi A3. It too is very reliable. Which reminds me, Dr. J., that we first encountered each other over a disagreement about diesel engines last year! :tiphat:


Did you meet in person over there? or did you meet on here discussing diesel engines? LOL That's cute.


----------



## Sloe

Figleaf said:


> No, the house (in France) cost thirteen thousand and five pounds sterling in December last year: that's the entire purchase price including fees and taxes, though of course the sterling-euro exchange rate was better then than now. Last week I got a refund from the notaire that came to just over two hundred pounds, thus taking the cost well below thirteen thousand pounds. I know it's vulgar to talk about how much your house cost, but I feel I have to mention it because there are so many people like me who have small savings but don't earn enough to get a mortgage, and thus wrongly assume they are priced out: they just need to think creatively and be prepared for a radical relocation. (We will see in the coming months whether UK citizens will legally be allowed to continue to live on the Continent in the light of recent political events; my timing may well have been unfortunate.) Anyway, I don't know what sort of car you can get for 13 grand - a pretty good used one perhaps, or a modest one that's new - but I do think car culture is unfortunate in that so many young and impecunious people seem to think that getting a car is a rite of passage which is necessary to become a proper adult, and that this focus on such an expensive mode of transport holds them back financially and keeps them in the rent trap for longer than they would otherwise be. Of course, the cost and desirability of car travel as well as the need to buy rather than rent a house does very much depend on the situation in the country you happen to be living in - mine is a British perspective and things might well be different elsewhere.


Congratulation.
You can get 2 Dacia Sandero for that price:

https://www.dacia.co.uk/vehicles/sandero/


----------



## JosefinaHW

Strange Magic said:


> I currently own a Subaru Forester, 2004--my 6th Subaru. Subaru has established itself in a secure niche, specializing in 4-wheel drive vehicles of very high quality at affordable prices, and their customer base is very loyal. They make it a point, though, to almost always have a model available that almost nobody will buy--often these vehicles are quite innovative, or at least different--but within 2 or 3 years they are gone from the U.S. market anyway. I remember the Brat, the Justy, the SVX, the Baja, the GF, to name a few of the short-lived experiments. Two rules always for me when selecting a car: it must be white, and it must have a manual transmission. I enjoy driving on twisty roads, o'er hill and dale, and as I drive, I think of Toad--he so loved driving too.


My dad's car is a Subaru Forester, too; I think 2011 or 2012--not sure. It was his first foreign car: I nearly passed out when I heard he wasn't getting another Chevy or Ford. Yes, the curvy roads--so many fun curvy roads where I live... I am so tempted to start the hunt for another car when I drive the curvy roads.


----------



## Dr Johnson

JosefinaHW said:


> Did you meet in person over there? or did you meet on here discussing diesel engines? LOL That's cute.


I drove into Mr and Mrs Vox on a roundabout in Eccles. After exchanging insurance details he persuaded me to join TC.

He's been regretting it ever since.

:lol:


----------



## JosefinaHW

GreenMamba said:


> I have one car, a Chevy Cruze. I tend to run them into the ground but this one is young yet.
> 
> As with Strange Magic, I must have manual transmission.


I take the Malibu for service and inspection at the dealership, too and the one guy always offers me the keys to a black Chevy Cruze (black is my preferred car color) with a manual transmission. He LOVES telling me that the transmission is made in Germany.  Thus far, I have been able to resist the temptation.


----------



## JosefinaHW

Florestan said:


> I like older vehicles and long for my old 1977 F100, which was a 3-speed column shift, manual steering, no power brakes, crank windows, manual locks, no AC (though I might like the AC these days), and a simple radio with knob dials and push buttons--no touch screen thankfully! Here it is (that's my sister driving) and the sun roof was added probably because I did not have AC:


More good memories.... all the Audi"s had power-assist steering: that was so much fun. Fortunately the Malibu is a heavy car and the steering wheel has a pretty tight feel. I wonder if cars still come with the power-assist option?


----------



## JosefinaHW

Kontrapunctus said:


> 2016 Honda Accord V6 Touring Edition.


My sister adores her Honda Accord! Says she'll drive it until it dies. I don't know what year it is but it has 175,000 and has only needed the standard wear-and-tear parts.


----------



## JosefinaHW

Strange Magic said:


> D
> 
> Not so, IMO. The fun of driving, for me, is a combination of a great country road combined with at least a 4-speed manual transmission and the full ability to use that transmission to the max. I have long observed that, on average, drivers brake (show brake lights) ten times more often than I. By maintaining a prudent distance behind the car ahead, by observing closely what the car ahead of the car ahead of you is doing, and by judiciously using the transmission to control both acceleration and braking (engine braking), one becomes fully integrated with the road/traffic/car interface, and soars along, rarely needing to brake. The manual transmission is the key. My wife has a 1.5 liter Scion xA--a puny, feeble car that would be essentially a motorized baby carriage with an automatic transmission. But with its 4-speed manual, it's actually a great driving road car, with remarkable torque. I'll quit driving when they no longer make manual transmissions.


You people are really tempting me now.... Yes, the FUN of moving along up to the next car without breaking.... I think of that every time I cross this one bridge over the river out here..... Discipline and restraint.


----------



## JosefinaHW

:ArtMusik: What a fun thread! Thank you.  Now back to the _Soprano Assoluto_: I was in the middle of a film about Maria Callas when I needed a bit of a break.


----------



## TurnaboutVox

Dr Johnson said:


> *I drove into Mr and Mrs Vox on a roundabout* in Eccles. After exchanging insurance details he persuaded me to join TC.
> 
> He's been regretting it ever since.
> 
> :lol:


It just wasn't the right time to try to sell us a diesel-powered lawnmower, Dr. J.


----------



## Strange Magic

P


Florestan said:


> The other problem is most affordable new cars today with manual transmissions are front wheel drive. I have always had rear wheel drive.


When I say that cars are infinitely better now, one of the key reasons has been the massive switch to front wheel drive (and, in the case of Subaru, to all-wheel drive). Front wheel drive revolutionized driving in snowy conditions, rendering chains and snow tires obsolete. I live near the top of a steeply inclined road. Years ago, I looked out my 2nd story window onto a morning wintry snowscape right out of Doctor Zhivago, and watched first a Mercedes ($$$) and then a BMW (alleged World's Greatest Driving Machine) labor with glacial slowness up the hill, one rear wheel spinning wildly, just barely creeping along. A little later came a battered old Datsun F-10, front wheel drive of course, roaring up the hill like it was a June day. A definitive demonstration of the superiority of FWD (but I already was a believer).


----------



## znapschatz

JosefinaHW said:


> :znapschatz: That just reminded me I do like the design of both the old and new Volvos.... a future possibility. (I hope your wife is much improved, by the way.)


Thank you for your good wishes. She is much improved, but while the crisis is past, my wife is still in the hospital with an unstable cardio vascular condition (serious, but not a heart attack.) Almost daily we are informed that she can come home next day, then there is a recurrence. It has been more than a week since she was admitted, but at least she is out of the ICU. I visit daily, and she does seem to be getting stronger. Her care, however, has been excellent. In gratitude, she wants me to bring a gift package to the staff attending her. Cookies? Fruit? Beer? I can't decide.


----------



## znapschatz

Strange Magic said:


> P
> 
> When I say that cars are infinitely better now, one of the key reasons has been the massive switch to front wheel drive (and, in the case of Subaru, to all-wheel drive). Front wheel drive revolutionized driving in snowy conditions, rendering chains and snow tires obsolete. I live near the top of a steeply inclined road. Years ago, I looked out my 2nd story window onto a morning wintry snowscape right out of Doctor Zhivago, and watched first a Mercedes ($$$) and then a BMW (alleged World's Greatest Driving Machine) labor with glacial slowness up the hill, one rear wheel spinning wildly, just barely creeping along. A little later came a battered old Datsun F-10, front wheel drive of course, roaring up the hill like it was a June day. A definitive demonstration of the superiority of FWD (but I already was a believer).


How well I remember those days of spinning wheels in the snow and slush of my native Cleveland. My father owned a Studebaker Lark, a compact car with a V8 engine, a poorly designed machine with too much weight in front and not enough in the rear. I once tried to drive it down a street with rather steep snow covered hill, and the rear wheels lost adhesion. The car spun out and went around and around, finally coming to a stop with the front facing the direction I had started from. By the best of luck, the street was deserted because everyone else had the good sense to steer clear of it under those weather conditions (as a teenager, I then had more nerve than sense.) I slowly nursed the car back up the hill and got back home safely. I don't even remember what was so important for me to have been out that evening . It was a learning experience, to say the least.


----------



## znapschatz

JosefinaHW said:


> My dad's car is a Subaru Forester, too; I think 2011 or 2012--not sure. _It was his first foreign car: I nearly passed out when I heard he wasn't getting another Chevy or Ford. _ Yes, the curvy roads--so many fun curvy roads where I live... I am so tempted to start the hunt for another car when I drive the curvy roads.


Yeah, my dad was like that. But I don't generalize. I've had good and bad domestic and foreign made cars, but the absolute worst was the only new car I ever owned. It was a 1963 Ford Fairlane, purchased after discharge from the army with my ill-gotten poker winnings (I'm a decent, not great poker player, but knew better than draw to an inside straight.) It was one thing after another; wheel bearings, generator, flywheel (twice!), water pump, and on and on. And on. In the end, I got philosophical about it, considering the experience as Karmic. But it didn't cause me to avoid Fords or other US made cars, some of which were decently reliable. Probably the most trouble free car I ever owned was a 1982 Ford Escort, bought used with 80,000 miles on it. The model had a spotty reputation, but in the 5 years I had it, ran trouble free, and when it died, did so all at once instead of nickel and dining me to death.
Good old car. I still kind of miss it.


----------



## SixFootScowl

Strange Magic said:


> P
> 
> When I say that cars are infinitely better now, one of the key reasons has been the massive switch to front wheel drive (and, in the case of Subaru, to all-wheel drive). Front wheel drive revolutionized driving in snowy conditions, rendering chains and snow tires obsolete. I live near the top of a steeply inclined road. Years ago, I looked out my 2nd story window onto a morning wintry snowscape right out of Doctor Zhivago, and watched first a Mercedes ($$$) and then a BMW (alleged World's Greatest Driving Machine) labor with glacial slowness up the hill, one rear wheel spinning wildly, just barely creeping along. A little later came a battered old Datsun F-10, front wheel drive of course, roaring up the hill like it was a June day. A definitive demonstration of the superiority of FWD (but I already was a believer).


True, the front drive has more traction for taking off because of the weight over the drive wheels. But also they get weird when the traction is lost because it also takes out steering. I live in a flat area and have seen plenty of front drives spinning tires in the snow. So for all purpose it is perhaps best, but for sportier applications, rear drive is preferred (Mustang for example). If I lived in a hilly area with a lot of snow I would probably opt for all wheel drive.


----------



## Dr Johnson

TurnaboutVox said:


> It just wasn't the right time to try to sell us a diesel-powered lawnmower, Dr. J.


I know. It was a bit pushy, all things considered.


----------



## Ingélou

Our very first car was a yellow Vauxhall Cavalier, which we called Rupert after Prince Rupert of the Rhine, the famous Cavalier general. But because of the colour, people always thought we'd named the car after Rupert Bear's trousers.


----------



## Dr Johnson

Florestan said:


> True, the front drive has more traction for taking off because of the weight over the drive wheels. But also they get weird when the traction is lost because it also takes out steering. I live in a flat area and have seen plenty of front drives spinning tires in the snow. So for all purpose it is perhaps best, but for sportier applications, rear drive is preferred (Mustang for example). If I lived in a hilly area with a lot of snow I would probably opt for all wheel drive.


I prefer FWD. If we have any snow in the UK everything grinds to a halt anyway, irrespective of where the drive wheels are.

Many years ago I used to have a *MkII Ford Capri* (British members will understand if I say I owned it in a sort of quasi-ironic way ). That was RWD. Great fun in a straight line but it could be very tricky if you took a corner in the wrong way. Not that that characteristic was exclusively due to the RWD.

40 years ago I got a lift from Somerset to London in an *Austin 7* that belonged to a friend of my father's. On the M3 he just set the cruise control and we chugged along at 30mph. An interesting experience but not for every day.


----------



## Strange Magic

znapschatz said:


> Probably the most trouble free car I ever owned was a 1982 Ford Escort, bought used with 80,000 miles on it. The model had a spotty reputation, but in the 5 years I had it, ran trouble free, and when it died, did so all at once instead of nickel and dining me to death.
> Good old car. I still kind of miss it.


Ahhh, the Ford Escort. I bought a 1992 Escort, new, and got 307,000 miles of fine driving out of it, on the original clutch. 1992 was the first year that Ford massively incorporated Mazda parts, design, and technology into the revamped Escort (Ford then owned 25% of Mazda), and the results were a dramatic improvement in the Escort's 'til-then dubious reputation--though you seemed to have gotten lucky.


----------



## Dr Johnson

Look what I have just found:

http://www.greatescapecars.co.uk/cars-cobrahirecars.asp

Oh dear, oh dear :lol:


----------



## Strange Magic

Just imagine what J.M.W. Turner would have done with the subject of Toad behind the wheel of a powerful motorcar!


----------



## JosefinaHW

znapschatz said:


> I visit daily, and she does seem to be getting stronger. Her care, however, has been excellent. In gratitude, she wants me to bring a gift package to the staff attending her. Cookies? Fruit? Beer? I can't decide.


I am VERY glad to hear she is stronger! I thought about the gift package and talked to my sister about it--she's an elementary school teacher who is the school's "gift and card buyer"--we think a collection of individual snack packs, so that people can put it in their pocket and take it on the run with them: mix of semi-healthy and sweets: Cheez-its, Mini-Pretzels, Snack-pack size cookies, etc.. Just go down the snack-pack aisle of the supermarket.

We disagree on what kind of container to put all the snacks in: my sister says a medium/large gift bag in the card/wrapping paper aisle (and suggests to you to get a card for you and your wife to sign).

I say look for some kind of clear/transparent salad/chip bowl in the seasonal aisle, so that the people can easily see the stuff, so we'll let you decide that one. (Definitely no alcohol--but a good thought)


----------



## JosefinaHW

TurnaboutVox said:


> It just wasn't the right time to try to sell us a diesel-powered lawnmower, Dr. J.


Dr. Johnson: Wait a minute!! You *HIT* Mr. and Mrs. Vox's car and *THEN* you tried to sell them a lawnmower on top of that?!?!!!! 
I was going to send you a friend request, hmmmm........


----------



## znapschatz

JosefinaHW said:


> I am VERY glad to hear she is stronger! I thought about the gift package and talked to my sister about it--she's an elementary school teacher who is the school's "gift and card buyer"--we think a collection of individual snack packs, so that people can put it in their pocket and take it on the run with them: mix of semi-healthy and sweets: Cheez-its, Mini-Pretzels, Snack-pack size cookies, etc.. Just go down the snack-pack aisle of the supermarket.
> 
> We disagree on what kind of container to put all the snacks in: my sister says a medium/large gift bag in the card/wrapping paper aisle (and suggests to you to get a card for you and your wife to sign).
> 
> I say look for some kind of clear/transparent salad/chip bowl in the seasonal aisle, so that the people can easily see the stuff, so we'll let you decide that one. (Definitely no alcohol--but a good thought)


Oh, joy! Looks like she is well enough to come home tomorrow (cross fingers, there were dashed hopes earlier.) I answered your pm earlier about your suggestions, none of which had occurred to me but upon which I will act. Fortunately, my sweetheart has a strong constitution inherited from her father, an athlete who was also a bass baritone and voice coach. His roles included Varlam, Dr. Miracle (Tales of Hoffman), Sarastro, others that don't come to mind right now, and lots of uncredited work both on and off screen in movies of the 1930s and 40s. Those included *Gunga Din* (British soldier,) *Golden Earrings* (beefcake quartet behind Mervin LeRoy in title song,) *The Wizard of Oz* (Yo Ee Oh, Yo Ho,) *The Great Dictator* (Storm Trooper,) *Pennies from Heaven* (Russian trio backing Danny Kaye), *Two Girls From Boston* (innkeeper in stupid opera with Lauritz Melchior,) *The Brothers Karamatsov* (Russian priest at funeral,) and a bunch more. The only closeup of him was in the Bob Hope film *The Lemon Drop Kid*, where he had a scene as a cab driver during the Silver Bells Christmas song obbligato ("I wish this was a sleigh," one day's waiting around and 3 seconds on screen.) In olden times before VCR, I used to stay up late when one of his films was on TV to snap pics of him when he appeared. I

I seem to be off topic, so better tie this off. But I am a most happy fellow at the moment. Thanks again. :kiss:


----------



## Dr Johnson

JosefinaHW said:


> Dr. Johnson: Wait a minute!! You *HIT* Mr. and Mrs. Vox's car and *THEN* you tried to sell them a lawnmower on top of that?!?!!!!
> I was going to send you a friend request, hmmmm........


I always believe in striking when the opportunity is hot.

BTW, now that you have sent me a friend request, do you want to buy a lawnmower?


----------



## JosefinaHW

dr johnson said:


> i always believe in striking when the opportunity is hot.
> 
> Btw, now that you have sent me a friend request, do you want to buy a lawnmower?


lmao!!!!! ...................


----------



## znapschatz

Strange Magic said:


> Ahhh, the Ford Escort. I bought a 1992 Escort, new, and got 307,000 miles of fine driving out of it, on the original clutch. 1992 was the first year that Ford massively incorporated Mazda parts, design, and technology into the revamped Escort (Ford then owned 25% of Mazda), and the results were a dramatic improvement in the Escort's 'til-then dubious reputation--though you seemed to have gotten lucky.


Although not sure of this, I believe the transmission on my Escort was a Japanese make. Even earlier than 1992, Ford may have been already using Mazda components. But you are right, I did get lucky on this one.


----------



## Xaltotun

I don't own a car, I don't have a driver's license and I've never actually driven a car for a single metre. I've gone through life completely ignoring cars. That is, until my son started to get excited about cars. Then, to retain what's left of my father's authority I had to study cars a little bit. I started to be able to tell them apart. I borrowed some car books from the library, and one of them caught my interest. It was a book written by an art historian, and it dealt about cars solely as art objects - as moving sculptures. Now THAT spoke to me. So right now I'm strangely perplexed and enchanted by cars, but only as art objects. They are beautiful, and while they have their own problems, they sort of sidestep many of the very serious problems that modern art faces. They are in a way what's left of classicism in sculpture today. Of course they're very commercial etc. But they are also very interesting, even from a purely formalist point of view.


----------



## JosefinaHW

znapschatz said:


> Oh, joy! Looks like she is well enough to come home tomorrow (cross fingers, there were dashed hopes earlier.) I answered your pm earlier about your suggestions, none of which had occurred to me but upon which I will act. Fortunately, my sweetheart has a strong constitution inherited from her father, an athlete who was also a bass baritone and voice coach. His roles included Varlam, Dr. Miracle (Tales of Hoffman), Sarastro, others that don't come to mind right now, and lots of uncredited work both on and off screen in movies of the 1930s and 40s. Those included *Gunga Din* (British soldier,) *Golden Earrings* (beefcake quartet behind Mervin LeRoy in title song,) *The Wizard of Oz* (Yo Ee Oh, Yo Ho,) *The Great Dictator* (Storm Trooper,) *Pennies from Heaven* (Russian trio backing Danny Kaye), *Two Girls From Boston* (innkeeper in stupid opera with Lauritz Melchior,) *The Brothers Karamatsov* (Russian priest at funeral,) and a bunch more. The only closeup of him was in the Bob Hope film *The Lemon Drop Kid*, where he had a scene as a cab driver during the Silver Bells Christmas song obbligato ("I wish this was a sleigh," one day's waiting around and 3 seconds on screen.) In olden times before VCR, I used to stay up late when one of his films was on TV to snap pics of him when he appeared. I
> 
> I seem to be off topic, so better tie this off. But I am a most happy fellow at the moment. Thanks again. :kiss:


It is so touching, heart-warming, and just all around-wonderful to hear someone still call their spouse "sweetheart"! 

Little by little I will check out the film scenes--it will be fun.

Absolutely, fingers and toes have been crossed and I am awaiting the good news.


----------



## aleazk

Does this one count?


----------



## znapschatz

JosefinaHW said:


> It is so touching, heart-warming, and just all around-wonderful to hear someone still call their spouse "sweetheart"!
> 
> Little by little I will check out the film scenes--it will be fun.
> 
> Absolutely, fingers and toes have been crossed and I am awaiting the good news.


Well, she is home at last and I can exhale. There will be a period of convalescence, and then we can have fun again. Thanks for your suggestion, it was a big hit with the medicos, and, as predicted by your sister, the bags disappeared into their pockets. I guess being an elementary school teacher is good preparation for knowing how to massage the medical professionals. Give her my thanks, please.:tiphat:


----------



## JosefinaHW

znapschatz said:


> Well, she is home at last and I can exhale. There will be a period of convalescence, and then we can have fun again. :tiphat:


Wonderful news! I just told my sister and she is thrilled that it all worked out well. She just loves to brighten people's day and has a marvelous way of thinking up "little" gifts that do just that. We both send hugs and kisses to you and your wife.


----------



## Tristan

I do. I have a 2010 Audi A6. It was my dad's car that he ended up giving me after I got my license. I don't plan on owning too many other cars, though I wouldn't mind a Tesla for myself


----------



## JosefinaHW

Tristan said:


> I do. I have a 2010 Audi A6. It was my dad's car that he ended up giving me after I got my license. I don't plan on owning too many other cars, though I wouldn't mind a Tesla for myself


:Tristan: Does that Audi have power-assist steering?


----------



## znapschatz

JosefinaHW said:


> Little by little I will check out the film scenes--it will be fun.


If you do, I suggest starting with *The Lemon Drop Kid*. Since its the only closeup in all his film work, you would get a good look at him to recognize his face in other movies. The scene is a big production number of the featured song, *Silver Bells*. It takes place on New York, actually shot in a Los Angeles studio, with Bob Hope, Marilyn Maxwell and company parading down the 5th Avenue singing. After the first (or second?) stanza, there is an obbligato, with first a flower lady - "A holiday bouquet," followed by a closeup of a driver sitting behind the wheel of a cab with his arm out the window - "I wish this was a sleigh." That's Leslie's dad. Peek quick, because the shot lasts 3 seconds. It was a paycheck in a tough business. Some of the movies, like Wizard of Oz, has only his bass baritone voice, but in a famous bit of business as henchmen of the Wicked Witch of the East march along, singing -"Yo E Yo, Yo Ho." Have fun :wave:.


----------



## Xaltotun

Tristan said:


> I do. I have a 2010 Audi A6. It was my dad's car that he ended up giving me after I got my license. I don't plan on owning too many other cars, though I wouldn't mind a Tesla for myself


Seems that the Teslas are all the rage around where I live! You see them more and more on the streets.


----------



## znapschatz

Xaltotun said:


> Seems that the Teslas are all the rage around where I live! You see them more and more on the streets.


So far, in my city I have seen only one Tesla, that in a tony neighborhood. It looked like a nice ride. The fanciest cars in my part of town tend to be senior citizen Volvos, where it is said they go to spend their retirement years.


----------



## znapschatz

znapschatz said:


> If you do, I suggest starting with *The Lemon Drop Kid*. .......-"Yo E Yo, Yo Ho."


Apologies for the sloppy post  . I really ought to proof read before sending, or not stay up so late to pound them out.


----------



## JosefinaHW

:znapschatz: I have a screenshot of Mrs. Z's dad in "The Lemon Drop Kid"; may I post it somewhere here on TC? If so, in which thread would you like me to post it?--he is sitting in a car, so we aren't miles off OP topic.


----------



## znapschatz

JosefinaHW said:


> :znapschatz: I have a screenshot of Mrs. Z's dad in "The Lemon Drop Kid"; may I post it somewhere here on TC? If so, in which thread would you like me to post it?--he is sitting in a car, so we aren't miles off OP topic.


By all means! I'd love to see it. Your choice where to post it. Is it okay to put it in more than one thread? Let me know where to find it and I will post a brief bio.


----------



## JosefinaHW

znapschatz said:


> By all means! I'd love to see it. Your choice where to post it. Is it okay to put it in more than one thread? Let me know where to find it and I will post a brief bio.


:Znapschatz: I am going to post the image in three different threads:

1. This one (I know ArtMusic is a generous and understanding person, so I think he'll allow us the indulgence)

2. What was the last film you saw http://www.talkclassical.com/11511-what-last-film-you-350.html?highlight=Christmas+carols

3. What are your favorite Christmas carols--"Silver Bells" is one of my favorite carols. http://www.talkclassical.com/3998-favourite-christmas-carols-3.html?highlight=Christmas+carol

I'll let you do the explaining.....


----------



## JosefinaHW

_Silver Bells_ from _The Lemon Drop Kid

_


----------



## ArtMusic

Tristan said:


> I do. I have a 2010 Audi A6. It was my dad's car that he ended up giving me after I got my license. I don't plan on owning too many other cars, though I wouldn't mind a Tesla for myself


Lucky you! Nice car!


----------



## znapschatz

JosefinaHW said:


> _Silver Bells_ from _The Lemon Drop Kid
> 
> _


This is my father in law, Lee Wintner, a bass baritone who did a lot of movie work in the 1940s and '50s. Here he is in a scene from *The Lemon Drop Kid*, a Bob Hope movie featuring the song, *Silver Bells*, during the big production number of the song, taking place on New York's 5th Ave., actually a Los Angeles movie studio. It was a day's work of sitting around and a 3 second take. His line: "I wish this was a sleigh," delivered in a New York accent. He never got a movie credit, but was in several classic films both on screen and off as a voice, probably best known in *The Wizard of Oz* sequence with the evil palace guards marching toward the lair of the Evil Witch of the East.

Movies was for the paycheck. In "real life," he sang opera, his roles including Sarastro, Dr. Miracle (Tales of Hoffman,) Varlam, several others I can't recall at the moment, was a highly regarded voice teacher and on a first name basis with the likes of Lauritz Melchior and Jerome Hines (Jerry, but nobody was informal with Melchior.) He was a featured performer at Hollywood Bowl concerts and performed at the Santa Monica Civic opera. The only recording of his that we know of was one of children's songs, but his recitals were wonderful. The first time I heard his *Winterreise* it drove me to my knees. Literally.

Arriving in Los Angeles in the late 1930s, Lee's first job was as a boxing coach at the YMCA, but somewhere along the line he got interested in music, studied with Hugo Streilitzer, and went in that direction. At the time, he was one of few voice teachers who accepted African American students. An athlete at the University of Alabama, which he attended on a football scholarship, Lee witnessed the aftermath of a lynching. It affected him profoundly and he dedicated himself to fighting against racism for the rest of his life. 
He was strong as a bull, dying at age 93 a few days after teaching his last group of students. I honor his memory.


----------



## isorhythm

Like a majority of New Yorkers, I do not own a car.

I would like to avoid ever owning a car.


----------



## Jos

We own two cars. I like cars, driving them and when I was younger tinkering with them.
After a few years of "sensible" and very boring vehicles (think Volvo estate) we decided to bring the fun back in driving without breaking the bank. Our cars are always at least 10 years old.
Currently the workhorse for hauling children, dogs and stuff is an Audi A6 quattro, equipped with a very capable 3ltr V6.

To celebrate our arrival at middle-age, my lovely and me bought a BMW Z3. It was that or complex stuff like adultery, drugs or watercolour painting. We opted for the car.
Just got back from a 5 day trip to Lago Iseo to the "floating piers" by Christo. Amazing artwork but a big part of the fun were the mountains we needed to cross to get there. No motorways ofcourse.
The Z3 is made for the Alps. Vroaaap


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## znapschatz

Jos said:


> We own two cars. I like cars, driving them and when I was younger tinkering with them.
> After a few years of "sensible" and very boring vehicles (think Volvo estate) we decided to bring the fun back in driving without breaking the bank. Our cars are always at least 10 years old.....


Until last fall, the same was true for us. We had two Volvos, one 22 and the other 25 years old. I had no problem keeping them running, but parts were getting scarce, especially trim items. The wakeup call was when I had to replace a faulty climate control module. An Ebay search found one in Canada, the only one available in North America (easy fix, the only tool required was a quarter,) so we sold the older and got a 2012 model S60. We are getting on in age, so it is possible that it will be the last car we own. Actually, I'll drive anything, but my wife is stuck on Volvos, mostly for the safety factor. Years ago I ran into a deer on a freeway, totaling the car and the deer, but I didn't even get a stiff neck out of it. That cemented the deal for her.


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## Jos

That is true, Snapschatz. They are very safe, and when our three children were babies or very little safety and reliability were a concern. And the size of those 7 and 940's ! You could transport half the household and still find a spot for the dog.
Roadholding of those old rearwheeldrive ovlovs was, erm, interesting. A bit like freestyle wrestling. V70's were a bit better, but also tedious suburban statussymbols. At least around here they are. (And imho, ofcourse)


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## znapschatz

Jos said:


> That is true, Snapschatz. They are very safe, and when our three children were babies or very little safety and reliability were a concern. And the size of those 7 and 940's ! You could transport half the household and still find a spot for the dog.
> Roadholding of those old rearwheeldrive ovlovs was, erm, interesting. A bit like freestyle wrestling. V70's were a bit better, but also tedious suburban statussymbols. At least around here they are. (And imho, ofcourse)


The one we sold off was a 740, and you are right about the room in it for everything and the dog. OTOH, it handled very well, I thought, except in snow or ice, an issue with any rear wheel drive auto, although compensated for by a tighter turning circle. But cars, like people, get older, and there is a time to say goodbye. We sold it to a friend who is a car rebuild hobbyist. He intends to spiffy it from the ground up. All power to him, but I just prefer to move on.


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## cwarchc

Unfortunately, due to work, I need to use a car
Until recently I used bangernomics.
The art of buying a cheap car, running it until it died.
Then go out and buy another cheapie.
Then my work relocated, 25 miles away with no public transport.
My oldies, fell by the wayside.
They couldn't handle the mileage
I'm now the driver of a new Jeep, financed on a lease
This works out to be the best option for me, at the moment.












Then go out and


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## Guest

ArtMusic said:


> I am curious whether my fellow members here own a car(s)?


Why ?


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## Badinerie

Nyet! If I cant have one of these, then I dont want anything!

[I


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## SixFootScowl

Yesterday my exhaust pipe broke and the muffler and pipe were hanging down pointing forward and dragging the ground. This was while driving in Detroit. I managed to fix it with a flattened beverage can found at the side of the road and four heater hose clamps put together into two larger clamps. It was enough to get me home. Today, for $21 in pipe sections and clamps I fixed it. These are the joys of owning a vehicle. Mine has always been a pickup truck (Ford Ranger at this time) which makes such side-of-the-road repairs a lot easier when you don't have to struggle with how to access the undercarriage as there is plenty of room to get under it.


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## JosefinaHW

Florestan said:


> Yesterday my exhaust pipe broke and the muffler and pipe were hanging down pointing forward and dragging the ground. This was while driving in Detroit. I managed to fix it with a flattened beverage can found at the side of the road and four heater hose clamps put together into two larger clamps. It was enough to get me home. Today, for $21 in pipe sections and clamps I fixed it. These are the joys of owning a vehicle. Mine has always been a pickup truck (Ford Ranger at this time) which makes such side-of-the-road repairs a lot easier when you don't have to struggle with how to access the undercarriage as there is plenty of room to get under it.


That is the joy of YANKEE INGENUITY!!!


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## Dim7

Something to keep in mind:


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## Wood

Travelling by car is like working in an office. It is warm, secure & convenient but fundamentally involves life-wasting sterility. I don't agree with them & feel that their use should be kept to a minimum.


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## znapschatz

Wood said:


> Travelling by car is like working in an office. It is warm, secure & convenient but fundamentally involves life-wasting sterility. I don't agree with them & feel that their use should be kept to a minimum.


Would that were possible, but not always with life styles that involve traveling long distances or even short ones in an environment where public transportation is spotty or worse. In most of the US, that is the case, and by design, not happenstance. In a California court back in the 1960s, General Motors and Standard Oil were found guilty of perpetrating a scheme by which bus and streetcar facilities were deliberately sabotaged nationwide to make private transportation more of a necessity. The plot was successful. As a youngster, and although hardly aware of the underlying causes, I was witness to this transfer as our city's quiet and efficient electric busses were replaced by gasoline powered ones, eventually fewer in number under more restricted routes. It was all a matter of economics, which is to say, greed for profits. US culture was shaped by this.


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## znapschatz

Badinerie said:


> Nyet! If I cant have one of these, then I dont want anything!
> 
> [I


These kind of limit your travel from starting to finishing lines, and left turns only. But suppose you only want a trip to the market for a quart of milk? I don't even think they sell that at a race track, or do they?


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## joen_cph

An old 3-wheeled, rather crisp car seen on my recent UK trip.

First driving rule is probably:"Exercise Extreme Caution".


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## JosefinaHW

: Dr. Johnson:
:Florestan: This message is posted with both of you in mind. I had my car inspected today and instead of handing me the keys to a black Cruze my favorite sales guy saw me taking one of many versions of the following:










Now he has heard me say a thousand and one times that this car is just too flashy for me and if I were going to buy a new car it would be black. He opens the driver's door and I made the mistake of getting into the car.










Well, I'm a believer! LOL I still managed to leave the dealership having only spent $75. :lol:


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## starthrower

Owning a car where I live is necessary. It's also a losing battle. Due to the harsh winters, the roads must be salted regularly, and this destroys motor vehicles. I have decided my next car will be leased. I no longer want to deal with expensive repairs.


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## Pugg

Going to get a brand new one today.


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## JosefinaHW

Pugg said:


> Going to get a brand new one today.


CONGRATULATIONS!!! Details, Details, please.


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## Pugg

JosefinaHW said:


> CONGRATULATIONS!!! Details, Details, please.


Peugeot 2008 Connect, I want a dark blue one.


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## Dr Johnson

Since this thread started I have become the owner of a second car.

Decadence indeed.


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## Wood

znapschatz said:


> Would that were possible, but not always with life styles that involve traveling long distances or even short ones in an environment where public transportation is spotty or worse. In most of the US, that is the case, and by design, not happenstance. In a California court back in the 1960s, General Motors and Standard Oil were found guilty of perpetrating a scheme by which bus and streetcar facilities were deliberately sabotaged nationwide to make private transportation more of a necessity. The plot was successful. As a youngster, and although hardly aware of the underlying causes, I was witness to this transfer as our city's quiet and efficient electric busses were replaced by gasoline powered ones, eventually fewer in number under more restricted routes. It was all a matter of economics, which is to say, greed for profits. US culture was shaped by this.


Yes, that sounds familiar. Reduction in car use needs stick and carrot methods. Congestion charges and other environmental taxes on the one hand, and a huge investment in state owned public transport on the other.

Unfortunately, in this neo-liberal world, there is a greater likelihood that pigs will fly.


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## Wood

starthrower said:


> Owning a car where I live is necessary. It's also a losing battle. Due to the harsh winters, the roads must be salted regularly, and this destroys motor vehicles. I have decided my next car will be leased. I no longer want to deal with expensive repairs.


Same here. A fews years back I bought a new car. It lasted 7 years and 42,000 miles before the bodywork rotted away. It has become a nice feature in my garden though, and a source of nearly new spares for one of my current cars which is the same model.


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## Wood

Dr Johnson said:


> Since this thread started I have become the owner of a second car.
> 
> Decadence indeed.


Indeed.

In five minutes I'll just be dropping off my number two car for an MOT. I'm hoping that my bodged bumper repairs will satisfy the tester.


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## Dr Johnson

The other day, when negotiating the Beckton roundabout for the umpteenth time, coming from the north on the A406 and attempting to get into the correct lane so as to exit on the w/bound A13, I thought that I would like to buy myself an old Land Rover or similar and have a load of bull bars welded on to it, possible also a cowcatcher on the front, to discourage other motorists from carving me up.


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## Guest

Dr Johnson said:


> I thought that I would like to buy myself an old Land Rover or similar and have a load of bull bars welded on to it, possible also a cowcatcher on the front, to discourage other motorists from carving me up.


Instead, you reassured yourself that the blue lights on top of your stripey estate would have the same effect.


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## Dr Johnson

Wood said:


> Indeed.
> 
> In five minutes I'll just be dropping off my number two car for an MOT. *I'm hoping that my bodged bumper repairs will satisfy the tester.*


Good luck! .


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## majlis

Traffic in Buenos Aires is similar to NY in a working day at 11.AM. And I went totally histerical. I've never drive any vehicule, but if I could, I'll never aventure to a street in BA: It makes me absolutely mad. That's why I don't had, don't have and never will own a car.


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## Wood

Dr Johnson said:


> Good luck!  .


Thanks. The bumper repair held up. It had just a couple of minor fails, a brake pipe and a couple of exhaust screws missing. Not bad for a 15 year old car.


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## mstar

Dim7 said:


> Something to keep in mind:


Or just resign yourself to that misfortune and hope Wagner's not playing on the radio that day.


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## Dr Johnson

JosefinaHW said:


> : Dr. Johnson:
> :Florestan: This message is posted with both of you in mind. I had my car inspected today and instead of handing me the keys to a black Cruze my favorite sales guy saw me taking one of many versions of the following:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Now he has heard me say a thousand and one times that this car is just too flashy for me and if I were going to buy a new car it would be black. He opens the driver's door and I made the mistake of getting into the car.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Well, I'm a believer! LOL I still managed to leave the dealership having only spent $75. :lol:


What was the $75 for? Being allowed to sit in the car? :lol:


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## JosefinaHW

Dr Johnson said:


> What was the $75 for? Being allowed to sit in the car? :lol:


'to play with all the buttons (and I drooled on the upholstery). Blush

Got my car inspected and routine maintenance.


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## EddieRUKiddingVarese

Two cars Hillman Hunter as per pic on this site and Holden Captiva 3ltr v6 SUV


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## MoonlightSonata

I'm too young to drive, so there's not much point having a car at this point.


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## SixFootScowl

JosefinaHW said:


> : Dr. Johnson:
> :Florestan: This message is posted with both of you in mind. I had my car inspected today and instead of handing me the keys to a black Cruze my favorite sales guy saw me taking one of many versions of the following:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Now he has heard me say a thousand and one times that this car is just too flashy for me and if I were going to buy a new car it would be black. He opens the driver's door and I made the mistake of getting into the car.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Well, I'm a believer! LOL I still managed to leave the dealership having only spent $75. :lol:


Just now saw this post but the images are gone.


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## KenOC

Where I live, a car is a necessity. Since I retired, we have just one, unlike in previous years. Our car is ten years old and running like new with over 150,000 miles. When I was growing up, if somebody's car made it to 100,000 miles there was a neighborhood party!


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## EddieRUKiddingVarese

Was it this one








like this one better


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## SixFootScowl

EddieRUKiddingVarese said:


> Was it this one
> View attachment 88680
> 
> 
> like this one better
> View attachment 88681


Wow! From one extreme to another. Given the choice and assuming both are running, I would go for the old beater. :lol:


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## Pugg

MoonlightSonata said:


> I'm too young to drive, so there's not much point having a car at this point.


You could start saving already.


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## Merl

EddieRUKiddingVarese said:


> Two cars Hillman Hunter........


I have fond memories of my dad's Hillman Hunter. He is less complimentary about it. In response to the OP I own just one car - a SEAT.


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## SixFootScowl

Pugg said:


> You could start saving already.


And start looking for /working on that dream hot rod so it will be ready to drive when you are.


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## JosefinaHW

I hope this was worth waiting for, Florestan. I think the wheels are amazing!

http://postimage.org/

http://postimage.org/

http://postimage.org/


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## SixFootScowl

JosefinaHW said:


> I hope this was worth waiting for, Florestan. I think the wheels are amazing!


It is certainly a very nice sports car, though I am old school and would have something like a 1970 Corvette or other late 60s car. The wheels are very nice, but I must confess that as far as wheels go, I am very basic. I bought these wheels for $100 used so I could have some nice old fashioned wheels and in the process stepped down from a 225 mm width tire to a 205 mm width as I felt that the Rangers were equipped with too fat of tires to entice the fickle consumes who are agog at big fat tires. The narrower tires work great.










Original wider tire on left:


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## Wood

Merl said:


> I have fond memories of my dad's Hillman Hunter. He is less complimentary about it. In response to the OP I own just one car - a SEAT.


Tehran is Hillman Hunter heaven.


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## EddieRUKiddingVarese

Wood said:


> Tehran is Hillman Hunter heaven.


Very cool, took my out on the Bay to Birdswood car run on the weekend, the little wagon (estate) ran very well. Good to see there are lots of spares around........

*Up to 1,000 classic and vintage cars have made their way from the coast to the Adelaide Hills for the annual Bay to Birdwood Run

*


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## Bradius

I have three. 
The SLK is my favorite.


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## ArtMusic

What a nice car.


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## Flamme

We used to, but we sold it.


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## Larkenfield

I live in the community small enough that a car isn't required. Loving it.


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## georgedelorean

I have one, and need it to realistically get around with how spread out Salt Lake is. It's my fifth that I've ever owned. 

First ever: 1985 Buck Century LTD with 2BC and 170 CID engine
Second: 1993 Ford Escort LX station wagon with Ford SEFI and 115 CID engine
Third: 2007 Ford Focus ZX4 SES with CPCI and 122 CID engine
Fourth: 1997 Ford Taurus GL with MFI and 183 CID engine
Current: 1992 Ford Escort GT coupe with MFI and 109 CID engine


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## ArtMusic

Interesting list in that your current car is not actually the newest; your third car was (2007 Ford Focus).


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## SixFootScowl

Since 1975:

1964 Dodge Dart inline slant six - about 6 months
1971 Ford 5.0 V8 - about 1 year
1963 Chevy Biscayne inline six and 3-speed column shift manual - about 6 months
1977 Ford F100 4.9 inline six and 3-speed column shift manual - 7 years
1984 Ford F150 4.9 inline six and 4-speed OD floor shift manual - 15 years
1995 Ford F150 4.9 inline six and 5-speed OD floor shift manual - 12 years
2001 Ford Ranger 2.3L DOHC, 16 valve, inline four and 5-speed OD floor shift manual - 6 years and still driving it.

Edit: Also has a 500 cc 1979 Suzuki motorcycle for a few years, bought new.


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## Art Rock

1980 - 1984 Toyota Corolla
1984 - 1988 Suzuki Swift
1988 - 1992 Suzuki Swift (2)
1992 - 1998 Maxda MX3
1998 - 1999 Maxda MX3 (2)
1999 - 2002 no car (Singapore)
2002 - 2011 Renault Scenic
2011 - 201? Opel Corsa

The MX3 was beautiful, the Scenic practical, the Corsa is economical.


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## Pugg

I am on the car hunt, new Peugot perhaps.


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## georgedelorean

It is interesting, isn't it, ArtMusic? When I bought that back in late 2006, I was working a good job with good pay. The plant closed, at which point I got another job immediately, and was laid off from it within two months. Sold it to the dealer, put the difference on a card, and paid that off. Luckily I had a good job lined up, and had it paid off in eighteen months. In the end though, it boosted my credit score immensely from paying off such a big debt, and I also have a paid auto on my report. So, I'm pretty good there.


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