# Do I draw your ire?



## Couchie (Dec 9, 2010)

Just a bit of a poll, wondering if the Wagner bit is getting a bit too much.


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## regressivetransphobe (May 16, 2011)

I don't care, but this forum (any, for that matter) could do with way less in-jokes/memes. It's kinda lazy.


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## Couchie (Dec 9, 2010)

regressivetransphobe said:


> I don't care, but this forum (any, for that matter) could do with way less in-jokes/memes. It's kinda lazy.


This to me?
This, regressivetransphobe, to me?
Whither has humour fled
now that regressivetransphobe has betrayed it?


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## clavichorder (May 2, 2011)

It depends more on you: if you are tired of being a certain kind of character, and want to reinvent yourself, you should do it. Are you looking for a new obsession potentially, or to at least move on from Wagner worship? It was tough for me to not worship Medtner like I was one of his disciples or something, but I realized that I wanted to hear more variety. Still love Medtner, but I'm far more realistic about it.


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## Couchie (Dec 9, 2010)

clavichorder said:


> It depends more on you: if you are tired of being a certain kind of character, and want to reinvent yourself, you should do it. Are you looking for a new obsession potentially, or to at least move on from Wagner worship? It was tough for me to not worship Medtner like I was one of his disciples or something, but I realized that I wanted to hear more variety. Still love Medtner, but I'm far more realistic about it.


Move _on_? I can say that I've tried. 

Yet banished, Wagner avenged himself;
with my sins;
he took counsel
what darkening Night showed me
I had to surrender
to the regal power
of the Wagner-star,
to live alone,
gleaming there
in barren splendour. How could I bear it?
How can I endure it now?


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## clavichorder (May 2, 2011)

Only Couchie knows what is best of Couchie.


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## emiellucifuge (May 26, 2009)

Oh its a joke is it?


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## Guest (Mar 6, 2012)

Is it your desire to draw our ire?
Is it what you require?
Of drawing ire do you ever tire?
Or does it you continually inspire?
Will my rhymes draw your fire?
I hope it's not so dire.

Anyway, I'm done now, so buh byer.


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## Kopachris (May 31, 2010)

I've always had to try very hard to not worship Tchaikovsky as Couchie does Wagner and Polednice Brahms. Should I stop holding myself back?

Because Tchaikovsky's last three symphonies are the best ever written by anyone, hands-down.


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## SiegendesLicht (Mar 4, 2012)

You rather draw my admiration, Couchie. I think I should be more restrained in my own Wagner worship though. Two Couchies on the same forum would be a bit too much.


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## Mesa (Mar 2, 2012)

I have an appreciation for his musical ability that is only equalled by my disdain of his personality.

Also, Vivaldi: Music's gone nowhere but downhill since him, let's be fair


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## emiellucifuge (May 26, 2009)

Mesa said:


> I have an appreciation for his musical ability that is only equalled by my disdain of his personality.


I dont understand the whole thing about Wagner's personality. Im going to start a thread on it soon.


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## SiegendesLicht (Mar 4, 2012)

And I admire his personality. A bit arrogant at times, maybe, but wasn't he one of those few people who have a right to feel their own greatness because they are great indeed. And, if he was too humble, who knows, maybe he would have never undertaken anything as large-scale as The Ring. That would have been a real loss for humanity. And to be honest, I don't see why the arrogance of someone who lived in the 1800s should bother us in the twenty-first century. We don't have to deal with him every day!


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## Polednice (Sep 13, 2009)

I could never be ireful at that sweet green face.


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## lou (Sep 7, 2011)

On the contrary, your obsession has caused me to delve into Wagner.

I'm still trying to fully appreciate him though. 

Plus, as Polednice states, how could anyone be upset with your adorable green face?


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## eorrific (May 14, 2011)

Hojotoho dir Couchie. (That probably makes no grammatical sense?)


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## Ukko (Jun 4, 2010)

Your Wagnerphilia is disgusting. That green thing is disgusting.

Carry on as you are, _Couchie_; it's all relative you see, and compared to the political scene you are (barely) tolerable.

[trying to dampen the enthusiasm. That green thing looks like it might pop if it swells up much.]

:devil:


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## Couchie (Dec 9, 2010)

some guy said:


> Is it your desire to draw our ire?
> Is it what you require?
> Of drawing ire do you ever tire?
> Or does it you continually inspire?
> ...


_My_ desire?
Oh, foolish maid!
Do you not know the Love Spirit,
not know her magic's power?
The Queen
of boldest courage,
Regent of the
world's course?
My posts are
but subject to her,
she weaves them out of bliss and sorrow,
transmuting my clean intentions into impassioned wrath.

A scholar's work,
upon which I audaciously embark,
the Love Spirit
wrests it from my power.
She takes the green monster's fingers
under her sway and
takes her work
into her own hands.
However she performed it,
however she completes it,
wherever she may choose for me,
wherever she may lead me,
I am subject to her.
Now let me display my obedience! *Herr Wagner! Meisterkomponist der Komponisten!*


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## kv466 (May 18, 2011)

Hey, if you can take my nearly-non-stop rant over Glenn and Earl,...I can take Wagner.


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## mmsbls (Mar 6, 2011)

Even if your maniacal obsession with Wagner bothered me (which it doesn't), I would still eagerly peruse your posts for the ample wit and humor. Your synopsis of _Tristan and Isolde_ in a recent post, though perhaps a bit lengthy, was hilarious, and I shared it with several friends. That post alone was worth a month's visit to TC. Keep up the good work.


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## sospiro (Apr 3, 2010)

:scold: YESSSSSS!! :scold:

But I luv you really :kiss:


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## Guest (Mar 6, 2012)

Couchie,

I give you doggerel, and you give me poetry? How dare you be better than I?!!:lol:

:tiphat:


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## violadude (May 2, 2011)

I would have said it nicer than"Yes, shut the **** up, Couchie" but it's the only option you gave me.


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## emiellucifuge (May 26, 2009)

mmsbls said:


> Even if your maniacal obsession with Wagner bothered me (which it doesn't), I would still eagerly peruse your posts for the ample wit and humor. Your synopsis of _Tristan and Isolde_ in a recent post, though perhaps a bit lengthy, was hilarious, and I shared it with several friends. That post alone was worth a month's visit to TC. Keep up the good work.


ooh which post?


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## tdc (Jan 17, 2011)

I think I would vote somewhere in between...I agree there is ample wit and humor in your posts, and the good outweighs the bad in a lot of cases but to be honest I find the constant Wagner worship a little off putting. I think I actually appreciate Wagner slightly less than I did before as a result of this. I can't help it! I associate Wagner with those posts now and it slightly irks me.


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## mmsbls (Mar 6, 2011)

emiellucifuge said:


> ooh which post?


The post is here. Since, as we all know, nothing really happens in T&I, Couchie embellished the plot a bit.


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## Couchie (Dec 9, 2010)

tdc said:


> I think I would vote somewhere in between...I agree there is ample wit and humor in your posts, and the good outweighs the bad in a lot of cases but to be honest I find the constant Wagner worship a little off putting. I think I actually appreciate Wagner slightly less than I did before as a result of this. I can't help it! I associate Wagner with those posts now and it slightly irks me.


That's unfortunate. Maybe I'll lay off for a bit and you can go back to associating Wagner with the Nazis?


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## Sid James (Feb 7, 2009)

I voted "yes..." with the caveat that if the thread is about or related in some way to Wagner, then go for it, talk all you want about him. But if it's not, esp. nowhere related (except inside your head), then better for you to say nothing. Esp. in terms of that thread recently, the newbie asking for new-age type music and you recommending_ The Flying Dutchman_. I mean I like a lot of things, eg. just now was listening to French organ music, but why would I recommend that if it's not relevant at all?...


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## Couchie (Dec 9, 2010)

Sid James said:


> I voted "yes..." with the caveat that if the thread is about or related in some way to Wagner, then go for it, talk all you want about him. But if it's not, esp. nowhere related (except inside your head), then better for you to say nothing. Esp. in terms of that thread recently, the newbie asking for new-age type music and you recommending_ The Flying Dutchman_. I mean I like a lot of things, eg. just now was listening to French organ music, but why would I recommend that if it's not relevant at all?...


A bit of a double standard you've got there Sid... in at least 95% of cases when you bring up Wagner it's in a thread not about Wagner... I suppose you make exceptions when it's _anti_-Wagner.


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## StlukesguildOhio (Dec 25, 2006)

Surely there can be no such thing as "enough Wagner." Is such a phrase not as much of an oxymoron as "too much Bach?" 

Seriously, how could you possibly reinvent yourself in any manner at all approaching the originality of the Silver helmeted, Wagnerian green worm of the Götterdämmerung? We already have the Brahmsian vampire pig; the Beethoven fanboys; Mayakovsky, champion of Russian opera; at least several Handelians; an untold number of Mozartians, Schubertians, and Mahlerians (whose name sounds perilously close to a disease); and God knows how many raging Modernists with hidden political agendas... to say nothing of the the Church of the True Believers in the One and the Only Johann Sebastian Bach (yours truly, included). What role could possibly live up your current incarnation? An alcoholic enamored of Xenakis? A Stravinskian who writes only in doggerel? A manic-depressive Schoenbergian? Or perhaps you might reinvent yourself as a rather unstable young woman with a "bad boy" fixation, sexually attracted to Gesualdo.:lol:


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## Sid James (Feb 7, 2009)

Couchie said:


> A bit of a double standard you've got there Sid... in at least 95% of cases when you bring up Wagner it's in a thread not about Wagner... I suppose you make exceptions when it's _anti_-Wagner.


Fair enough.

I'm not as near as hard on Wagner here as I am in real life, though. On this forum I don't "push" any composer. I just talk about his works or the history. I don't shy away from talking of whatever I like, don't like or am middling with. I listen to Wagner maybe once a year, but it's more than some people I know who don't listen to anything like that (eg. heavy). I also listen to vocal (eg. masses, artsong) and a smattering of opera, esp. by composers whose instrumental works I really like. I try to be flexible but there's a limit to everything.

But I like the eclecticism of talkclassical, I like how we all have different tastes that often surprisingly overlap. I just don't like ideology and dogma, whatever it is, from hard core conservative to hard core progressive...


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## tdc (Jan 17, 2011)

Couchie said:


> That's unfortunate. Maybe I'll lay off for a bit *and you can go back to associating Wagner with the Nazis? *


I've never done that, but I'm no longer in between in my voting - you've pushed me over the edge!


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## Sid James (Feb 7, 2009)

^^Yeah, tdc, "don't mention the war":lol:...or the elephant in the room...


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## brianwalker (Dec 9, 2011)

No Couchie. 

I draw their ire.


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## ComposerOfAvantGarde (Dec 2, 2011)

Couchie is not going overboard with the Wagner talk
...
But *Ligeti* is better.


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## Lenfer (Aug 15, 2011)

For the most part I really dislike perhaps even hate most *Wagner* but I am quite fond of *Couchie*.


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## ComposerOfAvantGarde (Dec 2, 2011)

Lenfer said:


> For the most part I really dislike perhaps even hate most *Wagner* but I am quite fond of *Couchie*.


 _How could you say that?!?!?_


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## Lenfer (Aug 15, 2011)

ComposerOfAvantGarde said:


> _How could you say that?!?!?_


Well he's green and it's not easy being green. 

As for *Wagner* the schoolmaster who was in charge of our music department at school had a serious *Wagner* fetish so I've always been a bit put off by *Wagner*. *Tristan und Isolde* I have seen several times and liked but I can't get by with most of his other work. Perhaps it's because I know it's *Wagner* maybe I am negatively bias?


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## Lenfer (Aug 15, 2011)

Sid James said:


> ^^Yeah, tdc, "don't mention the war":lol:...or the elephant in the room...


The *BBC* with advertisements?  I wonder if this means all the *British* folk can get their TV license fee back?


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## ComposerOfAvantGarde (Dec 2, 2011)

Lenfer said:


> Well he's green and it's not easy being green.
> 
> As for *Wagner* the schoolmaster who was in charge of our music department at school had a serious *Wagner* fetish so I've always been a bit put off by *Wagner*. *Tristan und Isolde* I have seen several times and liked but I can't get by with most of his other work. Perhaps it's because I know it's *Wagner* maybe I am negatively bias?


A serious Wagner fetish is a _good_ thing. A serious *Ligeti* fetish is a _better_ thing.


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## Sid James (Feb 7, 2009)

^^I can think of better real fetishes than either of them, but I won't mention that since you're under 18...


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## ComposerOfAvantGarde (Dec 2, 2011)

Sid James said:


> ^^I can think of better real fetishes than either of them, but I won't mention that since you're under 18...


Wrong. I am 54


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## Klavierspieler (Jul 16, 2011)

ComposerOfAvantGarde said:


> Wrong. I am 54


I am Elgar.


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## ComposerOfAvantGarde (Dec 2, 2011)

Klavierspieler said:


> I am Elgar.


I thought he died in 1934.


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## Couchie (Dec 9, 2010)

Please keep senseless derailing chitchat for the Mahler and Sibelius threads.


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## Polednice (Sep 13, 2009)

Couchie said:


> Please keep senseless derailing chitchat for the Mahler and Sibelius threads.


Does senselessness count as derailing for a thread that is fundamentally senseless to begin with?


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## Dodecaplex (Oct 14, 2011)

*Thread Hacked by the Soul of Jean Sibelius*

Where is soul from which Mahler's grievance poured into soul of sorrowful composer with name Sibelius? Ach! When torches vanish and smoke fly away when wind is dispersed into autumn leaves, how could amazing ancient hero so magnificent and so great walk for thousand years and have his thought and feeling dispersed with soul of Sibelius? Why would soul not exist forever? And y u no good at copying Simara style? Why matery existence? Why same thing not happen with soul of Jean Sibelius?


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## Couchie (Dec 9, 2010)

Polednice said:


> Does senselessness count as derailing for a thread that is fundamentally senseless to begin with?


Senseless? Senseless Polednotsonice! I bared my soul in this, opened my heart for criticism. Senseless?


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## Polednice (Sep 13, 2009)

Couchie said:


> Senseless? Senseless Polednotsonice! I bared my soul in this, opened my heart for criticism. Senseless?


I meant the proposed Mahler and Sibelius threads.  Wagner may be my nemesis, but that makes Mahler and Sibelius even more pitifully insignificant.


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## Couchie (Dec 9, 2010)

Polednice said:


> I meant the proposed Mahler and Sibelius threads.  Wagner may be my nemesis, but that makes Mahler and Sibelius even more pitifully insignificant.


I love you.


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## science (Oct 14, 2010)

I've been looking at this thread title for days, and days, and days, seemingly months and years, and I've resisted and resisted and resisted - 

- 

- 

- and I can resist no longer. 

Couchie, you draw my ire all you want, just as long as you don't post any of your drawings because I haven't showed it to most of the people here. And make sure my ire's at least as impressive in your drawing as it is in real life.


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