# Composing Orchestral in DAW



## ShadowRaz

Hey

Haven't really discussed with people about composing orchestral/classical music from inside a DAW. My personal decision has been FL Studio with my productions and so far i have only made Orchestral Dubstep or Electro House but i am starting to lean forward into making only orchestral since it has a certain amount of epic feeling in it and/or is rather more beautiful than some of the party music nowadays for my opinion. 

Are there any other folks composing their pieces with virtual instruments? May i ask what DAW you are using? And what instruments and plugins are being used?

How about music you listen to for inspiration? Have you had any teachers or just browsed through internet in search of lessons about using a DAW and for finding good virtual instruments to use like me?


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## Truckload

I would have responded sooner, but I just saw your post (Dec 20). There are lots of people writing orchestral music within a DAW and many using a notation program like Sibelius or Finale. Some will compose in a notation program then do a mockup performance in a DAW. Probably the most popular DAW's are Pro Tools, Cubase, Logic and Reason. Check out this forum:

http://vi-control.net/portal/

Halfway down the page on the left are many examples of excellent orchestral compositions written and performed within a DAW.


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## Weston

Though I don't have the time or skill, I think FL Studio will do it given really good samples. I think people underestimate its capabilities, but it's the sample packs that could run into some money. It's all a matter of how realistic you want it to sound. As a listener I don't have a huge problem with a bit less realism if you're only going for a demo or mock up.


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## ShadowRaz

Hey awesome stuff thanks for the link, those folks have some serious skills on composing within a DAW, have to practice myself too, missing some serious plugins i would need for my productions for example more of good enough electric guitars and brass ensemble would not hurt one bit, and those kinetic metal sounds that usually bring some content into orchestral tracks and lot's of other stuff too but got to try to make something with what i have until the day i got better stuff


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## ShadowRaz

Yeah have to practice my composition build too first before i can seriously think about realism on all the virtual instruments i have and use


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## Guest

What on earth is "Orchestral Dubstep" and do I want to know?


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## ShadowRaz

You wanting to even know depends slightly on your music taste of course, but i guess you can pretty much deduce what kind of an music it is if you ever heard any dubstep, as in combination of epic (movie style) orchestral or almost classical music but with a twist of making an slowish kick snare dubstep/drumstep beat and making some growls or other distorted basses to bring a "heavier" feeling for the track, here is my latest example of such productions:

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https://soundcloud.com/shadowraz%2Fwalking-in-the-air-from-the-snowman
What do you think?


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## techniquest

Interesting take on a familiar tune. Why did you use a different chord to the original where it changes at 'sky' in the second line?

A few years ago I used an old version of FL Studio (FL6) along with Edirol Orchestral vst to do an arrangement of the theme to 'Brendon Chase' by James Galway. It's too slow and, were I to do it again, I'd change a few things, but I'm reasonably happy with this different use of a DAW to make music.


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https://soundcloud.com/techniquest%2Fbrendon-chase

You might want to listen to my 'Paragon Aquarium' too (the other track I have on Soundcloud); it's a far more electronic sound and uses a lot more instruments, but essentially it's a rather free re-write of 'Aquarium' by Saint-Saens.


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## PavolBrezina

ShadowRaz said:


> Hey
> 
> Are there any other folks composing their pieces with virtual instruments? May i ask what DAW you are using? And what instruments and plugins are being used?


I am composing purely with virtual instruments. You can check my classical composition on my website www.pavolbrezina.com and also on my Youtube channel where I have some remakes also with visualisation of DAW. I am using Cakewalk Sonar DAW along with Vienna Symphonic Instruments Library


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## PavolBrezina

I am composing using virtual instruments, you can check my latest production here 

And here is second movement of Piano concerto in G from Ravel that I made by virtual instruments

Maurice Ravel / Piano Concerto In G (II. Adagio Assai)


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## ShadowRaz

techniquest: Honestly i suck at notes and especially reading sheets so i used a MIDI file on the piano in that, i tried to play it all on my MIDI keyboard at first and clicking them to piano roll as i went along but then i lost all patience again (as usual) and went ahead and downloaded the mid file from somewhere was it youtube? arpeggios goes as such: F4, F5, A#5, D6, D6+F6, A#5, F5, F4 in it so it's not correct? sounds almost good to my ear.. "lead" a.k.a singing the long note 'sky' is A#6+F7

But yeah so far i have managed to create what i do by only trying to listen the tone i am playing as in does it fit to the composition so it wouldn't sound too much off the key, i don't know exactly why i don't have the patience to properly learn to read sheets and try to memorize them so i could kind of read other compositions from sheets and try to learn to produce better

And by the way Brendon Chase was really cool man, too bad you gave up on producing with 2 tracks especially if those are your first works and with such outdated software

PavolBrezina: Dude, gotta hand it to you, that's freaking awesome stuff, i barely can believe those are made by virtual instruments, may i ask what plugins you are using? is it that Vienna Mir Pro 24? just checking out this https://www.vsl.co.at/en libraries
My productions have included only stuff from Native instruments such as Actions Strings, Emotive Strings, Action Strikes, Session Horns, Symphonic Choirs and newest addition Brass Solo, on this i'm just testing out composing orchestral stuff:

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https://soundcloud.com/shadowraz%2Fclassical-orchestral-music

I am constantly struggling between do i want to make only Orchestral/Classical which does bring me some relaxing emotions but is more frustrating time consuming to compose sometimes or full on Brutal Dubstep that is more exciting/heavier so to speak at least for my young side of soul, which brings me to the conclusion of trying to mush them together as one style, there are some other producers out there doing the same from which most noticeable would be Instrumental Core perhaps but still haven't heard of too many of such, i really should just try out to make some compositions of both separately and together more so i could go somewhere with my musician dreams


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## Mahlerian

ShadowRaz said:


> techniquest: Honestly i suck at notes and especially reading sheets so i used a MIDI file on the piano in that, i tried to play it all on my MIDI keyboard at first and clicking them to piano roll as i went along but then i lost all patience again (as usual) and went ahead and downloaded the mid file from somewhere was it youtube? arpeggios goes as such: F4, F5, A#5, D6, D6+F6, A#5, F5, F4 in it so it's not correct? sounds almost good to my ear.. "lead" a.k.a singing the long note 'sky' is A#6+F7


It's a B-flat major chord in second inversion, which is only mildly dissonant (depending on the idiom of the music). Respell the A#s as Bbs and you're fine.


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## PavolBrezina

ShadowRaz said:


> PavolBrezina: Dude, gotta hand it to you, that's freaking awesome stuff, i barely can believe those are made by virtual instruments, may i ask what plugins you are using? is it that Vienna Mir Pro 24? just checking out this https://www.vsl.co.at/en libraries
> My productions have included only stuff from Native instruments such as Actions Strings, Emotive Strings, Action Strikes, Session Horns, Symphonic Choirs and newest addition Brass Solo, on this i'm just testing out composing orchestral stuff:
> 
> __
> https://soundcloud.com/shadowraz%2Fclassical-orchestral-music


Thank you, yes it is done all with VSL libraries


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## ShadowRaz

Ok so went ahead and made another Orchestral Dubstep, but this time composed the Intro of the song entirely orchestral without designing any basses on it (only designed the effect on Massive for it), kept a cool 110bpm rhythm and then towards the end lowered it for the last note hit which made kind of an cool "tadaa" moment at least for my opinion and then just upped the tempo for a faster Dubstep/Drumstep style, have any opinions on the intro? what about the rest of the song?

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https://soundcloud.com/shadowraz%2Fshadowraz-the-dawn


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## ShadowRaz

Ok, working on another orchestral intro composition, this time trying to focus on the piano, not just strings and brass, and also trying to make it long, emotional and melodic.
I shall not rush this even though i already kind of got excited over it, i don't know why i don't compose more orchestral music and more often since i get freaking goosebumps when i truly start producing and am not just goofing around with them virtual instruments. Well i am rather pissed off because i can't have good enough of equipment nor libraries such as the Vienna Symphonic libraries, but i think i can manage to try to create something worth producing with what i have now


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## ShadowRaz

Ok made an separate orchestral test composition (not the one i was talking about in my last message)

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https://soundcloud.com/shadowraz%2Forchestral-madness-stuff
Anyone have any opinions? or advice?


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## ShadowRaz

Hey people, i would really appreciate some opinions on this shortish orchestral tune composed by me:

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https://soundcloud.com/shadowraz%2Frandom-orchestral-tune

Also, any of you know places that would maybe need something of that kind music or something similar?


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## techniquest

Interesting little pieces; very gladiatorial in style. What software are you using for your percussion and choral sounds?


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## ShadowRaz

Thank you, gonna try to fine tune that, make it longer with composing more chord modulations and then add it as the intro to my first EP, which i'm adding to Bandcamp.

Percussion: Orchestral hits made with Action Strikes from Native Instruments
Choral: EastWest Symphonic Choirs opened in Kontakt 5 as an separate "OH" full church choir 
Haven't ever gotten wordbuilder to work sadly with that so can't build words so it's much more Ram saving to open it in Kontakt than with the actual plugin EastWest provides

Also few of my recent composition clips in youtube:


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