# Your Favorite Unusual Pairings?



## Lenfer

I enjoy recordings with a eclectic mix of composers together on the one recording that I wouldn't normally put together. What are your favorite unusual pairings and who do you think has the best repertoire?

I apologise if this is a boring post trying to get some musical discussion going. That "dinosaurs" and non-dinosaurs alike may appreciate.

:tiphat:​


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## BurningDesire

Well I've made some mixes for friends that include Beethoven and Cage :3 both of whom I love and consider favorites, and personal musical heroes as a composer myself. I think I more consistently love Beethoven's repertoire, because I'm not a huge fan of many of Cage's strictly chance stuff, nor the happenings (I do like some of the chance pieces though). I mostly love Cage for his more personal works, the ones that are written down and you can hear his taste coming through, and his ideas about sound in general (along with the same from Varese) are very inspiring. Don't quite agree with this one though:

"Beethoven was wrong!" - John Cage

"Your opinion is WRONG Mr. Cage" - me :3


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## Art Rock

View attachment 6581


Love both works, stunning combination of baroque and contemporary.


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## Lenfer

bump


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## Sid James

Good thread. I'll be back but I'll put a thread I made before -

http://www.talkclassical.com/14381-interesting-couplings-cd-you.html


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## Lenfer

Sid James said:


> Good thread. I'll be back but I'll put a thread I made before -
> 
> http://www.talkclassical.com/14381-interesting-couplings-cd-you.html


Thanks your thread didn't show up in search but we all know how good the *TC* search is. I look forward to your post oh and I like this...








Will have to check it out I have another good recording.


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## Sid James

Okay I will start with one of my best buys of last year, an album that freshly came out then. *Pianist Francesco Tristano's bachCage album*.

An earlier 'review' of mine on it here:
http://www.talkclassical.com/1005-current-listening-679.html#post193877
& another one here:
http://www.talkclassical.com/1005-current-listening-688.html#post198785


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## Vaneyes

I'm conservative on this issue. I haven't owned many "period-gapped" recs. IIRC, the one Art Rock mentioned, is the only one I currently have in my collection. Mutter tried to make a case for, by saying there was "profound spiritual affinity" with Gubaidulina and Bach. There may be, but they don't belong on the same rec.

The Gielen Mahler series has examples of odd pairings. I don't even care for mixing one composer's genre on a rec.


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## Sid James

^^Funny re the Gubaidulina & Bach violin concertos coupling. I played it to a friend of mine, who's more into music of Romantic era and Modern period up to about 1945. He's okay with other things but that's his focus. Anyway, he really liked the Gubaidulina on the cd (well he liked both that and the Bach, actually). While me, more into post 1945 things, I liked the Bach far more than the Gubaidulina. It may be because its so different from her chamber things I've got on Naxos cd (eg. 'Seven Words') which are more pared down, obviously for smaller forces, & chamber tends to be my favourite of all instrumental music. But its interesting and I'll have to relisten to that cd again as my opinion might have easily changed (its been about 2 years).


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## neoshredder

Vivaldi and Ligeti are quite different except for the i at the end of their name.


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## Sid James

Cellist Pieter Wispelwey's album putting Walton's_ Cello Concerto _(written for Piatigorsky in the 1950's - a superb combination of neo-romanticism and serial techniques) with works for solo cello by Bloch, Britten and Ligeti. The concerto was recorded live in Sydney with the Sydney Symphony Orch. under Jeffrey Tate and the others where done in Europe. On the ONYX label. Good stuff.


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## Andreas

Sid James said:


> Good thread. I'll be back but I'll put a thread I made before -
> 
> http://www.talkclassical.com/14381-interesting-couplings-cd-you.html


I've posted my thoughts on the recent Schoenberg/Bruckner recording there, the works being orchestral pieces.


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## Head_case

It's a fascinating thread Lenfer. For me, I'm usually one of those dinosaurs struggling thinking 'who on earth would buy such a wacky programming!'

But the great thing is..at least it's consistent.....violin concerto matched with violin concerto, or cellist playing different eras of concertos. 

What really does my head in, is having a piano trio paired with a string quartet instead of a string quartet paired with another string quartet. It's really too much.


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## Crudblud

Art Rock said:


> View attachment 6581
> 
> 
> Love both works, stunning combination of baroque and contemporary.


I remember thinking the Bach was really out of place there, but I have a fondness for the record because it got me in to Gubaidulina's work after a disappointing experience with her Stimmen Verstummen symphony.


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## Manxfeeder

It's interesting how many pairings there are with Bach, especially since this is one of my favorite pairings: Bach with Nancarrow.


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## Sid James

This was one of my gateways into* Schoenberg's *music. *Hilary Hahn's *passionate and on-fire performance of his_ *Violin Concerto*_, paired with* Sibelius' *more popular/standard rep concerto. Ms.Hahn has done a number of these kinds of old-new pairings, her recent one with Tchaikovsky and Jennifer Higdon concertos looks to be just as good - but I haven't got it yet. Hahn played the Schoenberg to packed houses in Europe. I think this is the kind of no-nonsense advocacy of new/newer music I like and connect with, it just reaches out to the audience, its about the music not pushing any 'agenda' or ideology.


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## Lenfer

Manxfeeder said:


> It's interesting how many pairings there are with Bach, especially since this is one of my favorite pairings: Bach with Nancarrow.
> 
> View attachment 6702


I think it may because many people think of *Bach* in a certain way these pairings reveal that Bach is more than what you think. Both the Bach/Cage and the Bach/Nancarrow look really interesting thank you both. 








At the very end of the CD there is *BWV 864-869: Prelude in C Major BWV 846*. Instantly regonizable but I had to go back and check because I just didn't expect it on this disc. It starts of with *Corigliano*, then *Beethoven*, *Pärt* and finally *Bach*. I'm not sure if *Bach* is a hidden or bonus track but the whole album had a very somber feel.


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## Sid James

Lenfer said:


> I think it may because many people think of *Bach* in a certain way these pairings reveal that Bach is more than what you think. ...


Well my opinion is, based on anecdotal experience of talking to people into classical (to whatever extent) is that Bach is the most universally admired (or near to) composer around. So it makes sense in a commercial way to pair him with something more 'adventurous.' & I think, of course, all these composers learnt something - whether big or small - from Bach's music.



> ...
> Both the Bach/Cage and the Bach/Nancarrow look really interesting thank you both.
> 
> ....


Well the Bach/Cage got me deeper into both composers. As for Manxfeeder's recommendation, it looks good for me in the future to buy, I don't have any of COnlon Nancarrow's music on cd. It looks to be a good start with his things, and I love BAch's art of fugue (have only got in on ancient vinyl, so there you go, time for an upgrade there).


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## millionrainbows

That Helene Grimaud is a good one. It's the first time I ever heard the "Choral Fantasy," which is like a mini-Ninth.

This combination seems to work, for me, anyway:


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## Morgante

Bach and Bartok.


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## Lenfer

Morgante said:


> Bach and Bartok.


Any particular recording?


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## Lenfer

Manxfeeder said:


> It's interesting how many pairings there are with Bach, especially since this is one of my favorite pairings: Bach with Nancarrow.
> 
> View attachment 6702


CD arrived this morning, good stuff thanks *Manx*.


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## Lenfer

On the hunt again so I'm bumping this do forgive me. :devil:


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## Olias

Hilary Hahn paired the Beethoven VC and Bernstein's Violin Serenade a while back. They actually worked rather well together.


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## StlukesguildOhio

Gidon Kremer has made any number of interesting "pairings":

Vivaldi and Piazzolla-










Arvo Pärt, Philip Glass, and Vladimir Martynov:










Viktor Kissine and Tchaikovsky:










Beyond Kremer I quite liked this disc of Glass and John Cage:










*****


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## StlukesguildOhio

Dawn Upshaw is also continually provocative with her choices. I can't count the number of works/composers she has introduced me to:

Here she combines Samuel Barber, John Harbison, Igor Stravinsky, and Gian Carlo Menotti:










Gabriel Faure, Claude Debussy, Olivier Messiaen, and Osvaldo Golijov:










Aaron Copland, Kurt Weill, Samuel Barber, Carlisle Floyd, Leonard Bernstein, John Adams, and Tania Leon:










Manuel de Falla, Maurice Ravel, Igor Stravinsky,Maurice Delage, Earl Kim:










Claudio Monteverdi, G.F. Handel, Henry Purcell, John Dowland, Peter warlock, Ruth Crawford Seeger, Heitor Villa-Lobos, Joseph Schwantner, and george Crumb:


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## Lenfer

StlukesguildOhio said:


> Gidon Kremer has made any number of interesting "pairings":
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> Vivaldi and Piazzolla-
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> Arvo Pärt, Philip Glass, and Vladimir Martynov:
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> Viktor Kissine and Tchaikovsky:
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> Beyond Kremer I quite liked this disc of Glass and John Cage:
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> *****


Great picks, shows you have good taste *cough* (I own all of these).


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## Sid James

I think I've told this to L'enfer elsewhere, but was just listening to it recently, so I put it here. Talking of Bach and Bartok, works for solo violin by both are on this recording (incl. Bach's moving _Chaconne_). Also a rare work in which Stravinsky let his mask slip, the _Elegie for solo viola_, here played on violin (composed after he lost his first wife, a child and his mother in a short space of time). & also works by Hindemith and Prokofiev. The violinist is the late Ruggiero Ricci. A great 2 cd set which lovers of chamber & solo instrumental music will most likely love.


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## violadude

StlukesguildOhio said:


> Manuel de Falla, Maurice Ravel, Igor Stravinsky,Maurice Delage, Earl Kim:


Hey look! It's Art Rock!


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## Lenfer

I can't say this is a favorite of mine I haven't heard it yet but I'm hoping it's good. It's nice to see *Elgar* paired with something different for a change.


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## kskdn

Well, I haven't made a classical mixtape before, but I do have a way of slipping some classical pieces into all of my mixes. I've actually got a project with 11 friends where, once per month, one of us makes a mixtape and mails it to 11 others on a list, so once per month I get a new sampling of music. Anyways, my approach is always to try and make the mix flow from one track to the next. Pieces I've used in the past include Elliott Carter's _Saeta_ (Arrow), from the solo timpani pieces (iii/viii), the first and last movements of Janacek's sinfonietta, Barrios' op8 no3 Waltz, lots of beethoven, and even an excerpt of Dvorak's Cello Conerto. Sometimes you get a neat pairing with a simple pop tune, for instance : 
Janacek Sinfonietta mvt 1 into 
Typhoon - The Honest Truth. or 
Dovekins - Walks So High into Beethoven's op 109 Piano Sonata.

I wonder if there's a mixtape that counld be made connecting a Bach Harpsichord Concerto at the beginning to Georgy Ligeti's _Hungarian Rock_.


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## Blue Hour

Bach: English Suite # 6, Beethoven: Piano Sonata # 31 & Webern: Variations ~ Piotr Anderszewski​


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## Selby

Sid James said:


> This was one of my gateways into* Schoenberg's *music. *Hilary Hahn's *passionate and on-fire performance of his_ *Violin Concerto*_, paired with* Sibelius' *more popular/standard rep concerto. Ms.Hahn has done a number of these kinds of old-new pairings, her recent one with Tchaikovsky and Jennifer Higdon concertos looks to be just as good - but I haven't got it yet. Hahn played the Schoenberg to packed houses in Europe. I think this is the kind of no-nonsense advocacy of new/newer music I like and connect with, it just reaches out to the audience, its about the music not pushing any 'agenda' or ideology.


Wonderful album.

I believe we owe Ms. Hahn a great thank-you for this gem.


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## Selby

Although hardly groundbreaking, I have found that I enjoy making mixes that pair Bach with Chopin.


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## Sid James

Mitchell said:


> Wonderful album.
> 
> I believe we owe Ms. Hahn a great thank-you for this gem.


Yes, and I know she moved from Sony label to DGG because she said she wanted a label that she could work with more. I'd kind of bet that DGG took a bit of a risk releasing the Schoenberg/Sibelius concertos album. Many people still balk at Schoenberg. But it sold well and created a bit of a buzz, I remember. Judging from postings on current listening thread here on TC, it pops up quite often there, so I think judging from that people have embraced it. So its worth taking a bit of a risk - God knows we've had the Sibelius concerto coupled with all and sundry warhorse type things (eg. I got Nigel Kennedy playing it with the Tchaikovsky) but Schoenberg? Well it actually worked and its one of my fav cd's!


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## Vaneyes

Sid James said:


> Yes, and I know she moved from Sony label to DGG because she said she wanted a label that she could work with more. I'd kind of bet that DGG took a bit of a risk releasing the Schoenberg/Sibelius concertos album. *Many people still balk at Schoenberg. *But it sold well and created a bit of a buzz, I remember. Judging from postings on current listening thread here on TC, it pops up quite often there, so I think judging from that people have embraced it. So its worth taking a bit of a risk - God knows we've had the Sibelius concerto coupled with all and sundry warhorse type things (eg. I got Nigel Kennedy playing it with the Tchaikovsky) but Schoenberg? Well it actually worked and its one of my fav cd's!


Over the past few days, a whole lotta *balkin'* goin' on!


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## Selby

Sid James said:


> Yes, and I know she moved from Sony label to DGG because she said she wanted a label that she could work with more. I'd kind of bet that DGG took a bit of a risk releasing the Schoenberg/Sibelius concertos album. Many people still balk at Schoenberg. But it sold well and created a bit of a buzz, I remember. Judging from postings on current listening thread here on TC, it pops up quite often there, so I think judging from that people have embraced it. So its worth taking a bit of a risk - God knows we've had the Sibelius concerto coupled with all and sundry warhorse type things (eg. I got Nigel Kennedy playing it with the Tchaikovsky) but Schoenberg? Well it actually worked and its one of my fav cd's!


I also think very highly of her recent recording of Ives' 4 sonatas for violin and piano with Valentina Lisitsa.


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## nightscape

I'm currently listening to the Higdon Violin Concerto, which was premiered on CD with the Tchaikovsky violin concerto. That's a rather odd pairing.










EDIT: I didn't see the earlier post about this until after I submitted my own post (I commented from page 1). Regardless, I'll leave it here.


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## Turangalîla

I purchased this CD a few weeks ago and I thought the pairing was very odd, but he explains it in the notes and it is actually a very deep connection...










(Edit: In between the first two books of Ligeti Etudes he sandwiches the Beethoven Op. 111 Sonata...)


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## Garlic

That Ligeti/Beethoven is fantastic, a masterpiece even. Also very fond of the Schoenberg/Sibelius and Elgar/Carter.

This one is a very interesting listen:


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## Turangalîla

Garlic said:


> That Ligeti/Beethoven is fantastic, a masterpiece even.


It is great, isn't it? What prevented me from giving it the status of "masterpiece" was the Aimard recording of the Etudes, which I heard first (I would consider it a "colossal masterpiece"). Nothing can surpass it so I suppose I will never be fully content with any other interpretation...


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## Guest

Bach's Violin Concerto BWV 1041/1042 and Gubaidulina's 'In Tempus Praesens' (Violin Concerto No.2).


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## Bas

Wrong topic, excuse me.


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