# All things symphonic/tone poems



## Avey (Mar 5, 2013)

Your *favorites*, *opinions *on the poems, *random anecdotes* about these stand-alone gems, etc.

I'll start with a work that speaks for itself: *Scriabin's* _Poem of Ecstasy_ is fantastically...ecstatic. With the bells and all at the end, that fall off only to give way to the true crescendo -- truly epic. I find this definitive of the form.


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## Blake (Nov 6, 2013)

Bax - All of them. He just takes you away to this mystical place.


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## DeepR (Apr 13, 2012)

Avey said:


> Your *favorites*, *opinions *on the poems, *random anecdotes* about these stand-alone gems, etc.
> 
> I'll start with a work that speaks for itself: *Scriabin's* _Poem of Ecstasy_ is fantastically...ecstatic. With the bells and all at the end, that fall off only to give way to the true crescendo -- truly epic. I find this definitive of the form.


Agreed and Prometheus is just as good and in ways similar. It also exists of little themes that are simple on itself but form a complex whole as the piece develops. There's also a long build up, a climax and then the big bang at the end. Prometheus is perhaps less ecstatic, but even more electrifying. 
Some think the ending is out of place, or strangely sudden, but I disagree. It may appear like that at first, but if you listen more you'll see the ending isn't so strange after all. The last notes/chords climbing up to that final chord are hinted at earlier in the piece. 
The piano part is complex and detailed, but perhaps the individual notes are less important here. The piano part is kind of a "special fx" part to give it (along with other instruments) its intense, shimmering, fiery quality.

I also love Rachmaninoff's Isle of the Dead with its ever growing intensity. When I listen to it I envision myself sitting in that little boat while getting closer and closer to the Isle of the Dead to face my destiny.


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## Art Rock (Nov 28, 2009)

As much as I enjoy the Sibelius symphonies, I think his symphonic poem Tapiola is his absolute masterpiece.


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## EdwardBast (Nov 25, 2013)

Sea Interludes from Peter Grimes - Not program music technically speaking, but they are so in every important sense when excerpted.

Debussy Nocturnes for Orchestra

Among the ones mentioned above, _Isle of the Dead_ and _Tapiola_.


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## Aramis (Mar 1, 2009)

Symphonic poems? Here, have some:





















ENJOY


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## Weston (Jul 11, 2008)

I have trouble with a lot of tone poems. I think I must need something more akin to abstract music, and tone poems are very programmatic. Still there are a lot of stunning examples. My favorite is probably *Franz Liszt's Les Preludes*. That brass!

My first experience with tone poems is not with one of my favorite composers, but I explored a lot of *Richard Strauss* after the movie 2001: a space odyssey came out. After the opening onslaught of Zarathustra and its disappointing (at the time) follow through, I bought more Strauss works with my saved allowance trying to find something close to Zarathustra's potential. That is how I grew to love *Death and Transfiguration* and also *Till Eulenspiegels lustige Streiche (Op. 28) .* Though the latter sounds like cartoon music to me, I still love it I suppose through familiarity and nostalgia.


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## Couac Addict (Oct 16, 2013)

Borodin - Steppes of Central Asia. The cor anglais depicting the oriental caravan...a Russian escort. Borodin magic.
...and of course, Holst's The Planets is famous for a reason.

A few that often aren't bundled into _tone poem_ lists but really are when you listen.
Dvorak's 8th. The adagio with its birds and country surrounds ticks all the right boxes.
Gershwin - An American in Paris. You know you're in the city when those car horns sound off.
Elgar - In the South. An overture but a tone poem in disguise. A jaunt through the Italian countryside. Very Staruss-sounding in parts, with a nod to Berlioz as well.


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## KenOC (Mar 7, 2011)

Couac Addict said:


> Borodin - Steppes of Central Asia. The cor anglais depicting the oriental caravan...a Russian escort. Borodin magic.


Tchaikovsky wrote in a letter, "[Borodin] also possesses talent, a very great talent, which however has come to nothing... He has less taste than Cui, and his technique is so poor that he cannot write a bar without assistance."

So where did that "assistance" come from? Certainly his work is impressive...


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## Vasks (Dec 9, 2013)

Couac Addict said:


> Elgar - In the South. An overture but a tone poem in disguise


Being an overture fanatic/collector I can attest to the fact that a number of longer overtures by various composers are tone poems in disguise


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## hillisg (Dec 1, 2013)

Strauss' Death and Transfiguration is a favorite of mine.


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## Cosmos (Jun 28, 2013)

Strauss: Alpine Symphony. I feel like I'm watching a movie!
Rachmaninov: Isle of the Dead, one of the greatest Russian Late Romantic works IMO
Britten: Four Sea Interludes, oh the beauty!


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## Avey (Mar 5, 2013)

Vasks said:


> Being an overture fanatic/collector I can attest to the fact that a number of longer overtures by various composers are tone poems in disguise


I've always wondered about this -- aren't tone/symphonic poems any stand-alone orchestral piece? I mean, as I understand it, Liszt sort of championed this label, so without his consent, I won't deface the form. But, regardless, I don't know the distinctions between tone poems and overtures, preludes, or other such forms.

Anyone have thoughts?


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## senza sordino (Oct 20, 2013)

Vesuvius said:


> Bax - All of them. He just takes you away to this mystical place.


Do you have a list of titles? Any particular recordings?

I'm really only just scratching the surface of the world of tone poems. I've listened to Sibelius En Saga a few times and really enjoyed it, plenty of energy, especially in the strings.


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## GioCar (Oct 30, 2013)

Ottorino Respighi - the Roman trilogy, with a preference for Fontane di Roma and Pini di Roma.
IMO they are among the best orchestrated pieces.


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## Couac Addict (Oct 16, 2013)

KenOC said:


> Tchaikovsky wrote in a letter, "[Borodin] also possesses talent, a very great talent, which however has come to nothing... He has less taste than Cui, and his technique is so poor that he cannot write a bar without assistance."
> 
> So where did that "assistance" come from? Certainly his work is impressive...


_
Hey, Balakirev! Wanna make a few roubles?_


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## Couac Addict (Oct 16, 2013)

Avey said:


> I've always wondered about this -- aren't tone/symphonic poems any stand-alone orchestral piece? I mean, as I understand it, Liszt sort of championed this label, so without his consent, I won't deface the form. But, regardless, I don't know the distinctions between tone poems and overtures, preludes, or other such forms.
> 
> Anyone have thoughts?


Tone poems are just programme symphonies (eg. Beethoven's 6th) but with only one movement. The key ingredient is that the composer is trying to create a scene/mood...some kind of mental imagery through the music (birds twittering etc). This is in contrast to a stand-alone piece where the notes were chosen, simply because it sounds cool.
Programme symphonies had become trendy so the shorter tone poem grew popular.

Overtures are a stand-alone piece that precedes an opera's first act. They embody music from the entire opera so it's kind of a sneak preview of what's to come (eg. Flying Dutchman). There is a break between the overture an the start of the first act.

Preludes are an extension of the first act. They set the scene for whatever happens when the curtain goes up. In Die Walkure, the prelude is the storm. So you get this stormy music...curtain goes up...stormy music still going....here come Siegmund - seeking shelter.

To make things more confusing - along came the concert overture. A stand-alone piece with a theme (1812 Overture). They were just glorified tone poems.

...not helping is the fact that everyone kept bending the rules (they weren't exactly concrete to start with). Mozart had overtures that didn't incorporate themes from the entire opera. Wagner stuffed themes from his opera into the prelude.

I guess no one was listening to Handel because his overtures had several movements.

_It's anarchy, I tells ya!_


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## Aramis (Mar 1, 2009)

Couac Addict said:


> Tone poems are just programme symphonies (eg. Beethoven's 6th) but with only one movement.


Uhm, nope. There are multi-movement symphonic poems



> Preludes are an extension of the first act


There are preludes before middle/last acts as well



> There is a break between the overture an the start of the first act.


The overture to Don Giovanni doesn't resolve and leads into Leporello's opening number. Just an example.



> To make things more confusing - along came the concert overture. A stand-alone piece with a theme (1812 Overture). They were just glorified tone poems.


There are concert overtures without any "theme", other than musical one. Also, there IS a major difference between concert overture resolving around extra-musical subject and symphonic poem - the first keeps the classical form and the connection with subject is restricted to general character of the work, while form of symphonic poem is entirely subordinate to the "plot".


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## techniquest (Aug 3, 2012)

I don't know whether this counts as a 'symphonic poem' of sorts or not, but it is certainly one of my very favourite stand-alone pieces of orchestral music. I know there are a lot of people who dismiss Hovhaness as bland and samey, but I really think this piece is inspired and makes for beautiful listening. Go on, allow yourself 16 minutes to see if you get anything from it.


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## Piwikiwi (Apr 1, 2011)

Art Rock said:


> As much as I enjoy the Sibelius symphonies, I think his symphonic poem Tapiola is his absolute masterpiece.


Don't forget oceanides


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## maestro267 (Jul 25, 2009)

I ordered a disc yesterday with Aus Italien and Macbeth, that will complete my collection of Richard Strauss' tone poems. Quite amazed that the only 2 I don't yet have were available on a single disc together, at a very decent price.

I'm already planning a complete traversal of them on the day of his 150th birthday next year.


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## Couac Addict (Oct 16, 2013)

Aramis said:


> Uhm, nope. There are multi-movement symphonic poems
> 
> There are preludes before middle/last acts as well
> 
> ...


It was only meant as rough guide. I can't list every single overture etc.
I notice that you didn't quote the caveat at the end of the post. :lol:


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