# Does anyone prefer Verdi's "early" operas?



## Bellinilover (Jul 24, 2013)

When it comes to Giuseppe Verdi, is there anyone here who has a distinct preference for his "early" operas over his "late" ones? I'm defining as "early Verdi" anything from _Nabucco_ to _Luisa Miller_, and "late" (or "later") as anything from, say, _La forza del destino_ thru _Falstaff_. I guess I'm taking it for granted that most people who love Verdi more or less love at least his most popular "middle" works (_Rigoletto, Il Trovatore, La Traviata, Un ballo in maschera_).

Lately I'm finding that, as much as I love _Don Carlo_ and _Otello_--not to mention _Rigoletto_--I can tire of them, whereas I never tire of the music in Verdi's early operas. My favorites of these are _Ernani, Macbeth_, and _Luisa Miller_. I also enjoy _Attila_ a lot.

So, who agrees with me, and is there anybody here whose all-time favorite Verdi opera is an early (i.e., pre-_Rigoletto_) opera? Does anyone not like Verdi's "later" (and presumably more mature) works at all?


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## LouisMasterMusic (Aug 28, 2013)

Bellinilover said:


> When it comes to Giuseppe Verdi, is there anyone here who has a distinct preference for his "early" operas over his "late" ones? I'm defining as "early Verdi" anything from _Nabucco_ to _Luisa Miller_, and "late" (or "later") as anything from, say, _La forza del destino_ thru _Falstaff_. I guess I'm taking it for granted that most people who love Verdi more or less love at least his most popular "middle" works (_Rigoletto, Il Trovatore, La Traviata, Un ballo in maschera_).
> 
> Lately I'm finding that, as much as I love _Don Carlo_ and _Otello_--not to mention _Rigoletto_--I can tire of them, whereas I never tire of the music in Verdi's early operas. My favorites of these are _Ernani, Macbeth_, and _Luisa Miller_. I also enjoy _Attila_ a lot.
> 
> So, who agrees with me, and is there anybody here whose all-time favorite Verdi opera is an early (i.e., pre-_Rigoletto_) opera? Does anyone not like Verdi's "later" (and presumably more mature) works at all?


My favourite Verdi operas are Nabucco (early) and La Traviata (middle). I'm undertaking a listening focus on all the operas (and the Requiem hopefully!) to see what I do and don't enjoy. Check out my thread using this link.

Listening Focus: Verdi


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## Sonata (Aug 7, 2010)

No, I don't prefer the early ones, but I do like many of the early ones a great deal. I told my husband the other day, I don't think I am able to dislike Verdi's music, I love just about all of it  I watched Un Giorno Di Regno the other day and I really enjoyed it!


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## BalalaikaBoy (Sep 25, 2014)

absolutely. Attila, Macbeth and Nabucco are three of my favorites. Verdi's earlier soprano roles are so much more interesting imo.


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## Bellinilover (Jul 24, 2013)

Sonata said:


> No, I don't prefer the early ones, but I do like many of the early ones a great deal. I told my husband the other day, I don't think I am able to dislike Verdi's music, I love just about all of it  I watched Un Giorno Di Regno the other day and I really enjoyed it!


Interesting! I've never seen/heard _Un Giorno di Regno_, but always assumed it was bad.


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## Bellinilover (Jul 24, 2013)

BalalaikaBoy said:


> absolutely. Attila, Macbeth and Nabucco are three of my favorites. Verdi's earlier soprano roles are so much more interesting imo.


Yeah, I seem to remember that, in the thread about "top favorite Verdi operas," you had _Attila_ as number one. Certainly the first time I'd ever seen that!

I like all the music in_ Attila_, but my favorite has got to be the duet between Ezio and Attila -- one of my favorite male/male duets ever.


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## silentio (Nov 10, 2014)

I think the early Verdi works still have that "bel canto flair", thus it requires the principals, especially the soprano to have great coloratura to pull it off convincingly.

That is true even for something in the transitional period like _La Forza del Destino_. While I have heard it done pretty OK by the sopranos labeled "spinto" (Tebaldi and Price, the 1953 Firenze of Tebaldi with Mitropoulos is especially gorgeous), not until I heard the much underappreciated Callas studio that I realized Leonora should be better handled by someone with good coloratura skills. For example, this expressive aria from Act I, _"Me pellegrina ed orfana"_ has florid passages that were so rarely executed as accurate as in here:






This too is good early Verdi bel canto that is rarely done up to the standard by others (Verrett herself is a supreme bel canto singer):






Later Verdi has much more in the orchestra that could cover the weakness of the singer. For example, while I am not saying that Elisabeth in Don Carlo and Desdemona in Otello are easy parts, the orchestra has done so much that I have heard horrid, wobble screamers sing them but still quite enjoyable. The same can't be said for Leonora in Trovatore, Lady Macbeth, Luisa Miller, etc.


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## Sonata (Aug 7, 2010)

Actually, I think you had a good point there why though that Verdi's early operas have so much appeal to some listeners. Because they are Bel Canto. Some of Verdi's early ones bear some resemblence to Donizetti operas, and Donizetti really appeals to me too! So it works well.

Montserrat Caballe singing Giovanna D'arco is a treat.


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## davidglasgow (Aug 19, 2017)

It's maybe worth listing the operas in order of composition to see what this comparison entails (I've left out the various revisions which rather complicate things since _Macbeth _and _Simon Boccanegra_, among others, are performed as hybrids of "early" and "late" Verdi)

1842-1849
Nabucco
I Lombardi
Ernani
I Due Foscari
Giovanna d'Arco
Alzira
Attila
Macbeth
I Masnadieri
Il Corsaro
La battaglia di Legnano
Luisa Miller

1850-1859
Stiffelio
Rigoletto
Il Trovatore
La Traviata
I Vespri Siciliani
Simon Boccanegra
Un Ballo in Maschera

1862-1893
La Forza del Destino
Don Carlos
Aida
Otello
Falstaff

There is a great deal of excellent music among Verdi's early operas like you say, but I think it is possible to overstate the case: I'm not necessarily convinced they are all forgotten masterpieces. The standouts for me are _Nabucco_, _Ernani _and (including later revisions) the superb _Macbeth_.

To put our enthusiasm for the early works in perspective, however, I think it is perhaps worthwhile to imagine how Verdi's posthumous reputation might be different if he had died young like Bellini: the equivalent of Verdi passing aged 33 sometime after the premiere of _I Masnadieri_.

I don't think on the strength of those operas alone that Verdi would still enjoy his sui generis reputation among Italian composers. As much as I enjoy the other early operas, I generally find them less memorable than the later works: my favourite Verdi operas are _Rigoletto_, _La Traviata_ and especially _Otello_.

_I Due Foscari_ was impressive at Covent Garden with Placido Domingo but it felt like a vehicle which had been revived just for him, and it did not hang together the same way that, say, _Simon Boccanegra_ can with its dramatic set-pieces. Admittedly, that later opera has its own problems notwithstanding. If Jacopo Foscari is not the most rounded character, I can't say Gabriele Adorno is Verdi's most profound creation either...

The early/mid/late demarcation of Verdi is a bit problematic for me because there are genius moments early in his career, there are operas from his 'best' years which I'm not terribly interested in, such as _Stiffelio _or _I Vespri Siciliani_, and I admittedly prefer the old-fashioned stand-and-deliver moments of _Aida _to Verdi's experiments in _Falstaff_.


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## Woodduck (Mar 17, 2014)

Perhaps even more than with Bellini and Donizetti, the singers have to be "golden age standard" if I'm to want to hear early Verdi. _Ernani,_ one of the best (despite the risible plot), is shot through with great melody, but as heard at the Met recently it did nothing for me. Try the recordings made by Battistini of the baritone arias. How many operas have this much good stuff for the baritone?

_Nabucco_ is fine, but not without a terrific Abigaille. _Macbeth_ is even better, especially with the later revisions, but Callas has more or less spoiled me. There are several of the early operas I've never heard.


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## Annied (Apr 27, 2017)

It was mainly through the 1970s Philips recordings of the earlier Verdi operas that I got into opera in the first place, so they'll always be dear to me.


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## schigolch (Jun 26, 2011)

I'd say very early Verdi, ("Oberto" and "Un giorno di regno") are pretty indifferent stuff, and if they were written by Marrone, no one would care about them today. Starting from "Nabucco" a different, and new operatic voice is starting to be heard. Of course, there are ups and downs, but some operas, and some characters, are really wonderful.

My personal favorites are "I due Foscari" and "Luisa Miller".

Having said that, of course the great Verdi begins with "Rigoletto".


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## SixFootScowl (Oct 17, 2011)

Looks like I lean more toward early and middle Verdi. These are in my collection (broken out according to the three lists davidglasgow provided above):

Oberto
Battaglia di Legnano
Jerusalem (I Lombardi)

Aroldo (Stiffello)
Trovatore
Boccanegra

Aida


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## BalalaikaBoy (Sep 25, 2014)

Bellinilover said:


> Yeah, I seem to remember that, in the thread about "top favorite Verdi operas," you had _Attila_ as number one. Certainly the first time I'd ever seen that!
> 
> I like all the music in_ Attila_, but my favorite has got to be the duet between Ezio and Attila -- one of my favorite male/male duets ever.


two of the greatest arias for bass, two of the greatest arias for soprano**, one of the greatest arias for baritone, a stellar bass/baritone duet and a quartet which is, to my ears, almost as pleasing at the one from Rigoletto. imo, the only reason this opera is not more popular is because it takes three bloody good singers who are usually not around at the same time.

**and so contrasting! one of them is soft, lyrical, lots of long, pulling legato lines. the other is dramatic, glorious, a fireworks display of some of the most difficult coloratura in the Italian rep while still requiring a heavy voice


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## BalalaikaBoy (Sep 25, 2014)

Woodduck said:


> Perhaps even more than with Bellini and Donizetti, the singers have to be "golden age standard" if I'm to want to hear early Verdi. _Ernani,_ one of the best (despite the risible plot), is shot through with great melody, but as heard at the Met recently it did nothing for me. Try the recordings made by Battistini of the baritone arias. How many operas have this much good stuff for the baritone?
> 
> _Nabucco_ is fine, but not without a terrific Abigaille. _Macbeth_ is even better, especially with the later revisions, but Callas has more or less spoiled me. There are several of the early operas I've never heard.


^this. exactly this. early Verdi is right up there with Wagner is terms of waiting for the right singers to come around and more or less avoiding the rest because it has to reach a phenomenal standard to even be worth it.


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## Tsaraslondon (Nov 7, 2013)

In response to the OP, I would just point out that scholars usually talk of early, middle period and late Verdi, *Rigoletto* forming the bridge between early and middle period, just as *Aida* forms the bridge between middle and late.

As someone who loves Verdi (along with Berlioz, one of my favourite composers), the early works will always be dear to me for carrying within them the seeds of his genius. However, I would have to admit that many of them are formulaic; probably as a result of his having to satisfy various opera managements in order to make money out of his craft. As for many Italian opera composers, opera was a commercial business and he had to satisfy both managements and the public, which could in turn exert a stranglehold on his creativity. Some of the early operas (*Alzira*, for instance) were rattled off in great haste, and this tends to show in the level of inspiration. When it takes a dip, it can usually be explained by looking at the circumstances of the work's composition.

Of the pre *Rigoletto* operas, *La Battaglia di Legnano*, I think, is severely underrated. *Stiffelio* too, though it has undergone something of a reassessment in recent years. Of the others, *Nabucco* is a must as an opera in which Verdi's own voice is truly heard for the first time; the revised *Macbeth*, once derided, is now treated with a great deal of respect and performed quite regularly. *Luisa Miller* has justifiably always held a foothold on the repertoire, as has the slightly more bombastic *Ernani*, if only because it bursts with great tunes and offers great vocal opportunities for the singers. There are plenty of other wonderful moments in every single one of the other early operas too, but I'm not sure any of them satisfy _as a whole_ quite as much as those I've mentioned.

By the time Verdi wrote *Rigoletto*, he was quite famous, more financially stable, more able to dictate terms to opera managements, and take more time over each new project, and none of his operas from *Rigoletto* onwards is without merit. Maybe I should really say from *Stiffelio* onwards. It is interesting to note, however, that his relationship with the Paris Opéra was always fraught with problems, and how those problems have a more detrimental effect on *Les Vêpres Siciliennes* than they do on the later *Don Carlos*, by which time he had become more assertive. Even then, he vowed never to write for the Paris Opéra again, though he was not averse to writing ballet music for *Otello* when they wanted to mount the opera there.

Looking at Verdi's two Shakespearean tragedies and his two comedies, I might regret the loss of some fantastic music in having to choose *Otello* over *Macbeth*. However I would have no hesitation choosing *Falstaff*, a work teeming with sparkling invention, over the youthful and derivative *Un Giorno di Regno*, charmingly tuneful though that work is.


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## Tsaraslondon (Nov 7, 2013)

silentio said:


> I think the early Verdi works still have that "bel canto flair", thus it requires the principals, especially the soprano to have great coloratura to pull it off convincingly.
> 
> That is true even for something in the transitional period like _La Forza del Destino_. While I have heard it done pretty OK by the sopranos labeled "spinto" (Tebaldi and Price, the 1953 Firenze of Tebaldi with Mitropoulos is especially gorgeous), not until I heard the much underappreciated Callas studio that I realized Leonora should be better handled by someone with good coloratura skills. For example, this expressive aria from Act I, _"Me pellegrina ed orfana"_ has florid passages that were so rarely executed as accurate as in here:


How very perceptive of you, and how few people ever notice that central singers such as Tebaldi and Price do not render this aria with anything like the degree of accuracy that Callas does. But then, I suppose you would need to be able to read music and follow the score in order to understand this.

Amelia in *Un Ballo in Maschera* is also a transitional role, and requires a command of trills, easy coloratura, and a whole compliment of vocal niceties that are usually glossed over or ignored, as does the role of Leonora in *Il Trovatore*. Verdi's roots in _bel canto_ are always in evidence, even as late as *Aida*. Think of Aida's _Vedi, di morte d'angelo_ in the final duet.


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## Tuoksu (Sep 3, 2015)

As Riccardo Muti said  here _"Il primo Verdi è sacro. Ogni nota è pensata scientificamente."_ 
I wouldn't say I particularly prefer early Verdi over middle/late Verdi but my all time favorite Opera by anyone is Macbeth. It reflects everything I love about the early Operas. As the previous posters pointed out, it takes an excellent and exceptionally-gifted singer to pull off this kind of Soprano roles. True dramatic voices have to sing fiendishly difficult fioriture, which makes it the only repertoire really calling for "drammatico d'agilità" as opposed to Dramatic Coloratura. This also makes these operas much less forgiving and harder to enjoy in most cases (i.e whenever it's not Maria Callas singing them) than say Trovatore or Traviata, which can be interpreted decently by Spinto or even Lyric Sopranos.


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## DavidA (Dec 14, 2012)

I love Macbeth but then Verdi revised it. I can't understand anyone performing it in the original form as the revised work is one of great genius. Can't say I go in for anything before Macbeth although Nabucco is fun. But Verdi really found himself with Rigoletto and the rest is history


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## silentio (Nov 10, 2014)

GregMitchell said:


> How very perceptive of you, and how few people ever notice that central singers such as Tebaldi and Price do not render this aria with anything like the degree of accuracy that Callas does. But then, I suppose you would need to be able to read music and follow the score to understand this.
> 
> Amelia in *Un Ballo in Maschera* is also a transitional role, and requires a command of trills, easy coloratura, and a whole compliment of vocal niceties that are usually glossed over or ignored, as does the role of Leonora in *Il Trovatore*. Verdi's roots in _bel canto_ are always in evidence, even as late as *Aida*. Think of Aida's _Vedi, di more d'angelo_ in the final duet.


While I can read music and play instrument, I have never followed opera scores. But you can tell from the recording that she is almost always more accurate than others. Here is another extreme example with incredibly intriguing vocal lines.





.

Compared with the above, this is only the approximation (starting at 2:05)


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## Tsaraslondon (Nov 7, 2013)

silentio said:


> While I can read music and play instrument, I have never followed opera scores. But you can tell from the recording that she is almost always more accurate than others. Here is another extreme example with incredibly intriguing vocal lines.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


It's not just the notes, but the expression marks. Grace Bumbry once stated that, if you musically notated what Callas sang, you would invariably come up with an exact copy of what the composer wrote.


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## BalalaikaBoy (Sep 25, 2014)

only sopranos I can think of who could consistently do justice to early Verdi are Callas, Verrett and Dimitrova. his work for bass is also pretty challenging, although he seems to go a bit easier on tenors (at least in the sense that you don't need to wait 20 years for a good one to come along. it's by no means easy music). other prominent Verdians like Price were wonderful in later Verdi rep, but didn't have the agility necessary to specialize in the first half of his work


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## Bellinilover (Jul 24, 2013)

DavidA said:


> I love Macbeth but then Verdi revised it. I can't understand anyone performing it in the original form as the revised work is one of great genius. Can't say I go in for anything before Macbeth although Nabucco is fun. But Verdi really found himself with Rigoletto and the rest is history


Is Macbeth's aria "Mal per me" (in the final scene) a part of the early version or the revised one?


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## Sonata (Aug 7, 2010)

I didn't realize Macbeth had revisions. Which popular recordings sre the original and which are revised?


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## Tuoksu (Sep 3, 2015)

Sonata said:


> I didn't realize Macbeth had revisions. Which popular recordings sre the original and which are revised?





Bellinilover said:


> Is Macbeth's aria "Mal per me" (in the final scene) a part of the early version or the revised one?


The biggest differences between the original 1847 version and the 1865 Paris revision are:

"La luce langue" wasn't in the original version. Instead there was a more early-Verdi-like dramatic coloratura cabaletta "trionfai", which is very interesting and fun from a singer's perspective but still, "la Luce Langue" is a better choice musically and dramatically here in my opinion.





Patria Opressa wasn't in the original either. Instead, there was a different chorus à la "va pensiero".
Act III ends with a duet with Lady Macbeth ("ora di morte e di vendetta") in the 1865 revision, instead of the aria Verdi wrote for Macbeth in the original.
A Ballet was added to act III
The finale is different:instead of the big "vittoria" chorus it ends with a Macbeth aria "mal per me"

Overall, the revision is indeed a great improvement in my opinion, but even so, Macbeth was already Verdi's best (and favorite) work up to that point when he wrote it and he was so proud of it. The original opera is great. The revised one is perfect.


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## Seattleoperafan (Mar 24, 2013)

I like soprano arias from the early taxing operas a whole lot. Santo di patria and those big arias from Nabucco. The operas themselves I am not overly familiar with. Stiffelio was fairly early an I think it has splendid music.


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## Tsaraslondon (Nov 7, 2013)

Seattleoperafan said:


> I like soprano arias from the early taxing operas a whole lot. Santo di patria and those big arias from Nabucco. The operas themselves I am not overly familiar with. Stiffelio was fairly early an I think it has splendid music.


*Stiffelio* was written just before *Rigoletto* so not that early really. *La Battaglia di Legnano* is also from around the same time, and also has some splendid music.


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## Sonata (Aug 7, 2010)

GregMitchell said:


> *Stiffelio* was written just before *Rigoletto* so not that early really. *La Battaglia di Legnano* is also from around the same time, and also has some splendid music.


Verdi himself was rather fond of both Stiffelio and La Battaglia, I've read


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## SanyiKocka (May 6, 2020)

For those early ones, I would say I like Ernani, Nabucco and La battaglia most. I don't include Macbeth because now the version performed is mostly the revised one, though some will add Mal per me. 
Ernani and Nabucco are already popular, but La Battaglia is also not considered "rarely performed". 1961 La Scala live which was performed for the centenary of Italy's unification is unsurpassable.


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## Dick Johnson (Apr 14, 2020)

*Attila!*

Although I agree with the general critical consensus that "mature" Verdi was at a more consistently higher level, I enjoy operas from all stages of Verdi's career. 
Of the 13 prior to Luisa Miller (to use Bellinilover's criteria at the top of the thread), I listen to Macbeth the most, followed by Attila, Ernani, and Nabucco - in that order.
Really glad to see Attila getting some traction with posters on this thread. That's the one that never seems to attract as much attention as it deserves. Some great moments such as "Allor che I forti corrono" and "Spirti Fermate". Listening to "Trado per gli anni" always makes me burst with patriotic Italian pride - despite my not having any Italian background whatsoever.
I particularly enjoy the Cheryl Studer/Samuel Ramey recording.


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## Autumn Leaves (Jan 3, 2014)

Dick Johnson said:


> Although I agree with the general critical consensus that "mature" Verdi was at a more consistently higher level, I enjoy operas from all stages of Verdi's career.
> Of the 13 prior to Luisa Miller (to use Bellinilover's criteria at the top of the thread), I listen to Macbeth the most, followed by Attila, Ernani, and Nabucco - in that order.
> Really glad to see Attila getting some traction with posters on this thread. That's the one that never seems to attract as much attention as it deserves. Some great moments such as "Allor che I forti corrono" and "Spirti Fermate". Listening to "Trado per gli anni" always makes me burst with patriotic Italian pride - despite my not having any Italian background whatsoever.
> I particularly enjoy the Cheryl Studer/Samuel Ramey recording.
> ...


Giorgio Zancanaro is simply amazing here as Ezio (I'm always sad that one of my favorite baritone characters doesn't have more stage time…). I don't like Ramey, though, no idea why - his voice is beautiful, I can hear it, it just doesn't resonate with me, as a friend of mine puts it.

My favorite _Attila_ recording is the 2010 one with Ildar Abdrazakov:


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## ThaNotoriousNIC (Jun 29, 2020)

Have been peaking at this topic for a little while now. While I am in the busy time of my work, one of the pleasures I have had has been a dive into Verdi operas; in particular, his earlier operas. For years, the extent of my Verdi listening was more or less Rigoletto, Il Trovatore, and Aida. I journeyed into some mid period operas such as La Traviata, Simon Boccanegra, and Don Carlo along with listening to Falstaff, but besides Don Carlo the other two haven't clicked for me yet. Was going to continue listening to my usual rotation until I stumbled on a broadcast of Verdi's Attila back in January. It did not hit immediately but after a few days I realized that I really enjoyed the music in the opera, which led me to listen to some more early Verdi. So far I have listened to the following:

1) Attila
2) Nabucco
3) Macbeth (revised version)
4) Il Corsaro

I have also listened to Un Ballo in Maschera, La Forza Del Destino, Othello for the first time, of which La Forza Del Destino my be my new favorite Verdi opera. Out of all of the early Verdi I have listened to this year, I believe that my favorite has been Macbeth. Just a wonderful listen. One thing I really like about some of the earlier Verdi operas are the baritone/bass roles as well as the bel canto influence. I really hope that I can see some of these operas in person one day when operas houses reopen.

If anyone has any recommendations for early Verdi, I am happy to give all of them a shot. Here are my favorites from what I have listened to so far:

1) Macbeth, Act II: Studia Il Passo, O Mio Figlio






2) Nabucco, Act II: Vieni, O Levita






3) Attila, Act I Spirti, Fermate


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## Seattleoperafan (Mar 24, 2013)

I agree that one must have really top notch singers for early Verdi. Macbeth, Nabucco and Attila can be spectacular with stellar casts. I like individual arias, such as the amazing cabelleta showstopper from Il Duo Foscari that can blow you away with a great soprano. Gianna D'Arco has some great arias sung by Tebaldi and Caballe. Joan Sutherland's big aria from Attila might be her most spectacular and one of the greatest single performances of any aria. I am not expert like many of you on this subject, but my sense is later Verdi operas move better as far as the stories are rendered to music and are more dramatic, whereas the early ones have more difficult and showy music.


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## ThaNotoriousNIC (Jun 29, 2020)

Will definitely give I Due Foscari and Giovanna d'Arco a listen. 

I agree with your general opinion on early vs. late Verdi. I haven't had the pleasure of seeing any of them live before and I really don't know much about the libretti; my impressions largely come from my listening experience on Spotify. Generally speaking, I think the early ones have more traditional operatic structures with flashy arias that catch my ear as I listen to them. In contrast, I was having a particularly harder time listening through Othello and Falstaff because I think the music plays more to the story and drama on stage (in a sense, I feel like I am missing something).

I guess that is one of the issues of listening to opera online and in particular when you are working.


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## Seattleoperafan (Mar 24, 2013)

ThaNotoriousNIC said:


> Will definitely give I Due Foscari and Giovanna d'Arco a listen.
> 
> I agree with your general opinion on early vs. late Verdi. I haven't had the pleasure of seeing any of them live before and I really don't know much about the libretti; my impressions largely come from my listening experience on Spotify. Generally speaking, I think the early ones have more traditional operatic structures with flashy arias that catch my ear as I listen to them. In contrast, I was having a particularly harder time listening through Othello and Falstaff because I think the music plays more to the story and drama on stage (in a sense, I feel like I am missing something).
> 
> I guess that is one of the issues of listening to opera online and in particular when you are working.






 Tamara Wilson tears up the stage with Il Duo Foscari with a tremendous high D6's. I think she is one of the most sensational singers today by a long shot. Very exciting as is the music itself.


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## ThaNotoriousNIC (Jun 29, 2020)

I have officially finished listening to all Verdi operas and have definitely found some gems of choruses and arias from the early works. Macbeth holds out as my favorite of the early Verdi operas and I am still a big fan of Nabucco and Attila. Out of the remaining early Verdi operas, the ones that I liked the most were as follows:

1) I Lombardi 
2) I Due Foscari
3) I Masnadieri 
4) La Battaglia di Legnano

Musically, I found that there were a lot of similarities amongst the early operas in structure and in musical ideas. For instance, I feel that many of the early Verdi ensemble parts/choruses all tend to end in a similar fashion through cadence. Given that some of the operas were sometimes created months apart of each other, Verdi borrowing ideas from one opera and using it in another makes sense. I feel that out of the early Verdi operas, Macbeth and Nabucco deviate the most from a set formula. 

After listening to all of his operas, I find that I appreciate the middle and later works more so than before now that I know how he began his operatic career. Listening to Othello or Falstaff is now more interesting to me as I can now appreciate how much different the music in those operas are from say I Due Foscari or from the middle period, La Traviata. By no means do I want to imply that the later works are superior; I listen to the early works more than those later operas and thoroughly enjoy them. I also imagine that the early Verdi operas bring forth the gradual transition out of the bel canto era of operas by Rossini, Donizetti, and Bellini. Hearing each subsequent Verdi opera in sequence is like a journey from one style of opera to another. 

I am very happy to have gone on this quest to listen to early Verdi operas and I now have a new found respect and appreciation for Verdi. Wagner is still my favorite opera composer, but Verdi continues to close the gap with every listen.


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## moonlitknight (Mar 16, 2021)

I'm delighted someone else ranks I Lombardi as highly as I do. It is easily one of my favorite Verdi operas and, to me anyway, much better and more beautiful than Ernani. I like Ernani. I love i Lombardi. There are no Verdi operas I dislike, but the two in the lowest rank are Ernani and Alzira. And mind you, I don't dislike them but they place low. Ernani at the bottom by the way. Alzira is worth the price of admission for the first three pieces in Act 1 alone. After that it's less inspiring. A lot better work than it's been credit for by the way. One more thing, the early comedy Un Giorno Di Regno was NOT the failure people always say it was. Verdi considered it a 'failure' but really wasn't being honest about it. It was not well received in Milan, but was a great success everywhere else. Verdi was a prickly and overly sensitive person and if it wasn't a success when and where he wanted it to be, it wasn't a success period—as far as he was concerned. But it's just not true.


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## SixFootScowl (Oct 17, 2011)

SixFootScowl said:


> Looks like I lean more toward early and middle Verdi. These are in my collection (broken out according to the three lists davidglasgow provided above):
> 
> Oberto
> Battaglia di Legnano
> ...


Oh wow, my favorite, Traviata, wasn't even in my list back then (2018). In fact, it is the only Verdi Opera I listen to anymore, well maybe occasionally Aroldo.


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## Asser (Sep 24, 2021)

*Asser*



Woodduck said:


> Perhaps even more than with Bellini and Donizetti, the singers have to be "golden age standard" if I'm to want to hear early Verdi. _Ernani,_ one of the best (despite the risible plot), is shot through with great melody, but as heard at the Met recently it did nothing for me. Try the recordings made by Battistini of the baritone arias. How many operas have this much good stuff for the baritone?
> 
> _Nabucco_ is fine, but not without a terrific Abigaille. _Macbeth_ is even better, especially with the later revisions, but Callas has more or less spoiled me. There are several of the early operas I've never heard.


You are absolutely right. Battistini is superb in oh dei verd'anni miei or vieni meco, so are Stracciari.and Ruffo in suoni la tromba . If we still had bel canto singers around I think that early Verdi operas would be as popular as the later ones.


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## Asser (Sep 24, 2021)

Woodduck said:


> Perhaps even more than with Bellini and Donizetti, the singers have to be "golden age standard" if I'm to want to hear early Verdi. _Ernani,_ one of the best (despite the risible plot), is shot through with great melody, but as heard at the Met recently it did nothing for me. Try the recordings made by Battistini of the baritone arias. How many operas have this much good stuff for the baritone?
> 
> _Nabucco_ is fine, but not without a terrific Abigaille. _Macbeth_ is even better, especially with the later revisions, but Callas has more or less spoiled me. There are several of the early operas I've never heard.


Absolutely right. Just listen to Battistini's Vieni meco or his Oh dei verd'anni miei , or Stracciari (or Ruffo) in Suoni la tromba . If there were bel canto singers around today I'm sure early Verdi operas would be as popular as his later ones. Its a bit like without top notch violinists Paganini's work would have been forgotten!


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## mparta (Sep 29, 2020)

Seattleoperafan said:


> I agree that one must have really top notch singers for early Verdi. Macbeth, Nabucco and Attila can be spectacular with stellar casts. I like individual arias, such as the amazing cabelleta showstopper from Il Duo Foscari that can blow you away with a great soprano. Gianna D'Arco has some great arias sung by Tebaldi and Caballe. Joan Sutherland's big aria from Attila might be her most spectacular and one of the greatest single performances of any aria. I am not expert like many of you on this subject, but my sense is later Verdi operas move better as far as the stories are rendered to music and are more dramatic, whereas the early ones have more difficult and showy music.


Any house that had that performance by Sutherland would sell out Attila every night.

But that doesn't happen.

The beauty of the voice is astounding. Much less the evenness, control, whatever, but the beauty of the voice:clap:


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## Tsaraslondon (Nov 7, 2013)

I often wish the early Verdi revival was further advanced when Callas was emerging on the scene. We have her Abigaille and her Lady Macbeth (*Macbeth* still a rarity back then, remember) is _hors concours_, but I'd love to have heard her sing Odabella, Griselda or Giovanna d'Arco, to name but three that need a dramatic soprano with a florid technique.


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## SanAntone (May 10, 2020)

My traversal of Verdi's operas in chronological order in an ongoing project, but already producing rewards. The early operas have some really wonderful music and often preview the later works, and it did not take him long to write a true masterpieces in _Nabucco_ and _Macbeth_.

I think it is a mistake to only listen to/watch Verdi's later masterworks.


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## moonlitknight (Mar 16, 2021)

This is over three years since your question, but for what it's worth, I love Verdi's early operas as much, and in some cases more than his later ones. They're raw and still brilliant. They are not beginners works as some seem to imply. Verdi was always Verdi and simply grew more refined as he composed more operas. The four you mention I totally love. I'm also particularly fond of Giovanna d'Arco and I Lombardi. You want to listen to the radio broadcast recording of Alfredo Simonetto's Giovanna from 1951 and the 1969 live I Lombardi with Pavarotti and Scotto conducted by Gavazzeni. Alzira is a far better opera than many armchair pundits say as well. There aren't many choices available without a bit of effort. The Gardelli studio set from 1983 is outstanding.


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## moonlitknight (Mar 16, 2021)

Un Giorno is far from bad. That's an erroneous and tragic view that continues, most likely from people who haven't even listened to it. The best version is the 1951 Alfredo Simonetto radio broadcast. The only other option is Gardelli's later recording—also excellent. Wonderful opera. It was not a failure even when it was first performed. It didn't go over so well in Milan but it was spectacular success all over the rest of Italy.


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## Tsaraslondon (Nov 7, 2013)

moonlitknight said:


> Un Giorno is far from bad. That's an erroneous and tragic view that continues, most likely from people who haven't even listened to it. The best version is the 1951 Alfredo Simonetto radio broadcast. The only other option is Gardelli's later recording-also excellent. Wonderful opera. It was not a failure even when it was first performed. It didn't go over so well in Milan but it was spectacular success all over the rest of Italy.


I prefer the Simonetto to the Gardelli. The Gardelli is very well sung and played, but it doesn't have the infectious high spirits of the earlier recording.

I've reviewed them both on my blog http://tsaraslondon.com/2017/04/18/verdis-un-giorno-di-regno-2-recordings/


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## MAS (Apr 15, 2015)

*Macbeth*, *Nabucco*, *Attila* have wild music for soprano that I love!


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## SanAntone (May 10, 2020)

There is no Verdi opera I do not enjoy, and he only had two works that qualify as "early" by _Nabucco_ he already knew what he was doing. He got better with each opera, but they are all of a high level.


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## starthrower (Dec 11, 2010)

Concerning Attila recordings, how does Muti's conducting and singers compare to Gardelli? Or should I just get both?

The last Muti Verdi opera I bought on EMI was Aida and I don't like the sound at all. It's very harsh and bright so I'm leaning towards the Gardelli on Philips even if the Muti performance sounds a bit more passionate.


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## The Conte (May 31, 2015)

I have both, but my preference would be for the Muti, it's one of his best recordings and I find the sound just fine.

The cast is very good and Studer is a better Odabella than Deutekom, who is too light of voice. Ramey and Raimondi are both superb and I have a slight preference for Bergonzi and Milnes over Muti's singers in the same roles. Overall, Muti's excellent conducting wins the day.

N.


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## starthrower (Dec 11, 2010)

I went with the Muti. If I don't like the sound I can try the Philips recording.


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## The Conte (May 31, 2015)

I can't believe that I haven't commented on this topic yet. Whilst I can't say that I _prefer_ early Verdi over late Verdi, I'm definitely a fan.

My favourites among the pre Rigoletto works are:

1) Nabucco - as others have remarked this is different enough from operas written before it that it can be hailed as being truly Verdian (although you can hear the seeds of his style in his first work, Oberto).
2) I Lombardi - (the introduction to the opera is a masterpiece, as is the 'violin concerto' and associated trio).
3) Ernani
4) Attila
5) Macbeth - This is now part of the standard rep, what greater proof of its worth could anyone want?
6) Stiffelio - This too has been reevaluated, even if it isn't quite on a par with Macbeth.

The others all have great parts and I like them all (save for Alzira, that I consider his one turkey), but these rank higher for me than the others.

N.


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## PlaySalieri (Jun 3, 2012)

I have only really heard Atilla in live performance and while it was very lively and I enjoyed it - it was nothing like the joy of hearing Traviata Trovatore or Otello for the first time.


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## starthrower (Dec 11, 2010)

I'm on a huge Verdi binge so I've been referring to this thread quite a bit. I ordered about a half a dozen cheap used copies of the early operas. Mostly by Gardelli on Philips with the exception of Luisa Miller, and Nabucco. I already have Macbeth by Abaddo. I'm still looking for cheap copies of I Masnadieri, and Stiffelio. Hopefully I won't tire of these too quickly. But my love for opera is increasing each year so I remain positive.

Nabucco
I Lombardi
I Due Foscari
Attila
La battaglia di Legnano
Luisa Miller


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## Tsaraslondon (Nov 7, 2013)

starthrower said:


> I'm on a huge Verdi binge so I've been referring to this thread quite a bit. I ordered about a half a dozen cheap used copies of the early operas. Mostly by Gardelli on Philips with the exception of Luisa Miller, and Nabucco. I already have Macbeth by Abaddo. I'm still looking for cheap copies of I Masnadieri, and Stiffelio. Hopefully I won't tire of these too quickly. But my love for opera is increasing each year so I remain positive.
> 
> Nabucco
> I Lombardi
> ...


Gardelli and Philips did us a great service back in the 1970s as most of Verdi's early operas had never before been recorded. Of those not on Philips, *Oberto* and *Alzira* ended up on the Orfeo label for some reason. Philips didn't record *Giovanna d'Arco* either, presumably because Caballé had already recorded it for EMI with Domingo and Milnes under Levine. There were also already recommendable recordings of *Ernani* and *Luisa Miller* available, which is presumably why they were never recorded by Gardelli. He also recorded *Macbeth* for Decca, but Souliotis is a pretty disastrous Lady and Fischer-Dieskau hardly ideal casting as Macbeth. The best singing comes from Pavarotti as MacDuff and Ghiaurov as Banquo.


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## starthrower (Dec 11, 2010)

I'm listening to Muti's Macbeth at the moment on a CD I borrowed from the library. I'm enjoying this one but I want to go back and revisit the Abaddo as well as listen to some others. I also snapped up a copy of Il Corsaro on Philips.


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## Tsaraslondon (Nov 7, 2013)

starthrower said:


> I'm listening to Muti's Macbeth at the moment on a CD I borrowed from the library. I'm enjoying this one but I want to go back and revisit the Abaddo as well as listen to some others. I also snapped up a copy of Il Corsaro on Philips.


The Muti and Abbado sets of *Macbeth* came out at roughly the same time. Listeners tended to come down in favour of one or the other, though both are very fine. I'm rather in the Abbado camp. I think it's a much more interesting performance and Verrett is the best Lady I've heard after Callas.


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## starthrower (Dec 11, 2010)

Can I get some opinions on your favorite Nabucco recordings in good sound? I'm listening to this one quite a bit lately. I have just one CD which the Sinopoli, and I'm watching performances on YT.


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## Tsaraslondon (Nov 7, 2013)

starthrower said:


> Can I get some opinions on your favorite Nabucco recordings in good sound? I'm listening to this one quite a bit lately. I have just one CD which the Sinopoli, and I'm watching performances on YT.


Gardelli is a must. Gobbi as Nabucco and Souliotis in her first recording is stupendous. Not long after this she ran into vocal trouble, but she is fabuous here.










Other than that, if you can cope with the absolutely horrendous sound, Callas's Abigaille has to be heard to be believed.


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## JanacekTheGreat (Feb 26, 2021)

For me, the singers would make it or break it for earlier Verdi, even up to La Forza. In Aida, Don Carlo, Simon Boccanegra, Otello, and Falstaff, the orchestra carries and "covers" a lot for the singers, so unless the singing is excruciatingly bad or there are some serious miscasting, it will be more likely than not that the performance is enjoyable.

The same can't be said for Nabucco, Macbeth, Luisa Miller, Stiffelio, etc.

For example, I can somewhat tolerate Rysanek as Desdemona in the EMI Otello, but could never put up with Netrebko and Domingo in Macbeth.


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## amfortas (Jun 15, 2011)

JanacekTheGreat said:


> For me, the singers would make it or break it for earlier Verdi, even up to La Forza. In Aida, Don Carlo, Simon Boccanegra, Otello, and Falstaff, the orchestra carries and "covers" a lot for the singers, so unless the singing is excruciatingly bad or there are some serious miscasting, it will be more likely than not that the performance is enjoyable.
> 
> The same can't be said for Nabucco, Macbeth, Luisa Miller, Stiffelio, etc.


Interesting. I've always found the singers to be extremely important, at a make-or-break level, in all of Verdi's operas, late ones included. But oh well.


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## Tsaraslondon (Nov 7, 2013)

amfortas said:


> Interesting. I've always found the singers to be extremely important, at a make-or-break level, in all of Verdi's operas, late ones included. But oh well.


I'd agree with that. For example, I have six different recordings of *Aida*, including the most recent, the Pappano studio, which is orchestrally and sonically splendid. However it is the one I pull down least often from the shelf, because the singing, save for Kaufmann's Radames, is nowhere near as good as that on my other sets.


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## The Conte (May 31, 2015)

amfortas said:


> Interesting. I've always found the singers to be extremely important, at a make-or-break level, in all of Verdi's operas, late ones included. But oh well.


I'd allow an exception for Falstaff, which can be very enjoyable with a competent cast as long as the conductor knows what he is about.

N.


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## Tsaraslondon (Nov 7, 2013)

The Conte said:


> I'd allow an exception for Falstaff, which can be very enjoyable with a competent cast as long as the conductor knows what he is about.
> 
> N.


True, but the best recordings (Karajan I, for instance) also have a superb cast.


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