# Body Language and Facial Expression of a Soloist



## ormandy

In another thread, various posts expressed divergent opinions re contemporary violin soloists. Most comments focused on sound, but I think that there is another factor at work.

Hilary Hahn is technically superb and has produced breathtaking performances, but has an impassive facial expression and little body movement while playing. She is regal in her demeanor. Only at the conclusion of a piece do the corners of her lips turn ever so slightly upward.

Julia Fischer is just as superb of a technician and has also produced breathtaking performances, but her stage affect is much more dynamic. Her body sways and she conveys emotion via her facial expression while playing.

I love Hahn's playing but relate even more so to Fischer. Of course, there are limits to which a soloist can take this. In my estimation, Lang Lang is too much over the top.

Leaving articulation, bowing, and fingering aside, how much does body language and facial expression while playing affect your perception of a soloist? Offer examples if you wish.

ormandy


----------



## arpeggio

We have addressed this issue in other threads.

For example check out:

http://www.talkclassical.com/38954-conductors-acting-too-much.html#post906851

http://www.talkclassical.com/27538-how-do-we-judge.html


----------



## Ingélou

This thread is specifically about violin soloists, however.

I like to think that demeanour doesn't affect my response all that much - but I am probably mistaken, being human. We all respond to body language, not always at a conscious level.

If a violinist is making faces or reacting in an affected way, it *would* put me off.
A smile, or a slight movement to the music, will probably add warmth to my response, provided that it doesn't seem artificial. (I used to use a Sarah Chang YT video to help me learn 'Air on a G string'; the way she reacts when she nearly runs out of bow - a wry smile - certainly helped me think about how to play that opening note!) 
A deadpan attitude helps me to think that the violinist is serious about what s/he is doing.


----------



## Steatopygous

Ingélou said:


> This thread is specifically about violin soloists, however.
> 
> I like to think that demeanour doesn't affect my response all that much - but I am probably mistaken, being human. We all respond to body language, not always at a conscious level.
> 
> If a violinist is making faces or reacting in an affected way, it *would* put me off.
> A smile, or a slight movement to the music, will probably warmth to my response, provided that it doesn't seem artificial. (I used to use a Sarah Chang YT video to help me learn 'Air on a G string'; the way she reacts when she nearly runs out of bow - a wry smile - certainly helped me think about how to play that opening note!)
> A deadpan attitude helps me to think that the violinist is serious about what s/he is doing.


Sarah Chang is a fascinating example. Very fine player. I aw her at a rehearsal, very high heels, legs kicking and stamping, and I know it distracted some of the musicians. In the concert she wore a long dress, but still did lots of flamenco stamps.


----------



## Don Fatale

This comes to mind. Leila Josefowitz gets some criticism for it, but I wouldn't want to change a thing. (It helps that she looks gorgeous here.)


----------



## Triplets

Watching Nadia Solerno Sonnenberg gives me vertigo


----------



## arpeggio

Ingélou said:


> This thread is specifically about violin soloists, however.


My contributions to those two threads were about violinists.


----------



## Ingélou

arpeggio said:


> My contributions to those two threads were about violinists.


So why not post your opinions here too? It would save readers from searching through the other more general threads specifically to locate your contributions & you might even have something new to add.

No man jumps into the same river twice, so even if someone posts exactly the same topic, one's experience of reading it is always a little different.


----------



## breakup

When I listen to music, it's the music I'm interested in, if I want to watch someone dance, I'll watch "Dancing With the Stars". If a performer is moving too much, I'll leave the sound on and go to another window where I don't need to watch the performer. That way I can have some nice background music for Spider Solitaire.


----------



## Taggart

Most of my listening is on CD so body language is not a major issue. Plus we listen mostly to Baroque where it's all affect.

Heifetz was once quoted as saying that to play the violin, you need "the nerves of a bullfighter, the vitality of a night-club hostess, and the concentration of a Buddhist monk." He is noted for his impassiveness.

"Conventional" technique might mean that you are not that expressive from far away, moving just the necessary and trying to avoid too extreme faces. That doesn't mean the performer doesn't have any emotion (think David Oistrakh).

Then there are the theatrical and extrovert personalities such s Vengerov and Lang Lang.


----------



## Manxfeeder

Triplets said:


> Watching Nadia Solerno Sonnenberg gives me vertigo


I knew she'd come up eventually.

I'm not particularly concerned with gesticulations, but in a live performance, it would be nice to have them like like they're actually alive.

Once I saw the Eroica Trio, and they all had a different persona they were presenting. The violinist, I think, was associated with fire, and I do remember her energetic, almost Riddler-like stance, in contrast to the elegance of the pianist and the dreamlike posture of the cellist. It made for a more compelling visual effect.


----------



## arpeggio

Ingélou said:


> So why not post your opinions here too? It would save readers from searching through the other more general threads specifically to locate your contributions & you might even have something new to add.
> 
> No man jumps into the same river twice, so even if someone posts exactly the same topic, one's experience of reading it is always a little different.


One. I do not see the difference between what a violinist does with what a pianist or conductor or whatever does. It is all the same. There may be other contributions in those threads that one may find interesting.

Second. I hate being redundant.


----------



## Ingélou

arpeggio said:


> One. I do not see the difference between what a violinist does with what a pianist or conductor or whatever does. It is all the same. There may be other contributions in those threads that one may find interesting.
> 
> Second. I hate being redundant.


Fine.

In my opinion there's a lot of difference between a violinist and a pianist and conductor, and there's a difference in response to their behaviour, and there's a difference in the experience of the various members of Talk Classical; also a difference between the posters on site now, and on site when those other threads were posted; also a difference between the general and the particular - this thread is asking for people to give examples of violinists whose behaviour they find appealing or offputting.

I prefer to answer a question posed by a thread, rather than imply to the OP that his or her thread is unnecessary, before the thread has even got going. 
As I fiddle and take an interest in All Things Violin, I think it's a fab thread & am looking forward to reading more answers.

And posting three times on a thread without answering the OP kinda seems a bit 'redundant' to me, actually.

But I can accept that you think differently from me. 
:tiphat: Live long & prosper.


----------



## Ingélou

To return to topic: in this link, Andrew Manze & Rachel Podger both move their bodies in time with the music, and express vigour and enthusiasm in their movements and smiles; also expressing awareness of each other, as it's the Bach Double. 





This sort of animation I do find attractive, and not distracting.

I'm looking forward to seeing Rachel Podger play in Norwich Cathedral this September.


----------



## arpeggio

Ingélou said:


> I prefer to answer a question posed by a thread, rather than imply to the OP that his or her thread is unnecessary, before the thread has even got going.


I apologize for giving the impression that the thread is unnecessary. I was just trying to provide some additional material that the OP might find helpful.


----------



## Ingélou

arpeggio said:


> I apologize for giving the impression that the thread is unnecessary. I was just trying to provide some additional material that the OP might find helpful.


That's great! Nice of you to say.

When I pointed out that the threads were similar but not the same, I wasn't trying to get at you, but just wanted to assure the OP that I thought his/her thread was a good idea - as were the other threads that you mentioned, of course.

Peace be with you!


----------



## ptr

I once heard the Finnish pianist Ollie Mustonen play the famous Grieg Piano Concerto at the concert hall in Gothenburg, but his facial expressions and arm mannerisms completely spoiled the experience for me, actually killed the work for me, every time I hear the Grieg Concerto ever since I see Mustonen in front of my inner eye and make my ears throw up slightly... 

/ptr


----------



## Steatopygous

ptr said:


> I once heard the Finnish pianist Ollie Mustonen play the famous Grieg Piano Concerto at the concert hall in Gothenburg, but his facial expressions and arm mannerisms completely spoiled the experience for me, actually killed the work for me, every time I hear the Grieg Concerto ever since I see Mustonen in front of my inner eye and make my ears throw up slightly...
> 
> /ptr


Good way to get the wax out.


----------



## nightscape

ormandy said:


> In my estimation, Lang Lang is too much over the top.


That's an understatement. 

For me the whole performance comes together when music and body form one expressive instrument. Each piece and each performer is different and they communicate differently. Sometimes the message comes across, sometimes not, to varying degrees of success.

The one thing I can't stand, however, is seemingly intentional manipulation through overacting.


----------



## bharbeke

The soloist's actions should complement the music as much as possible. That said, whatever they need to do to produce the best-sounding performance should be done.

I like Perlman's style of performance, where he is obviously thinking about and connecting to the music with his expressions and body language, but any physical pyrotechnics are limited to the rapid movements that some sections of the piece require.


----------



## EdwardBast

Triplets said:


> Watching Nadia Solerno Sonnenberg gives me vertigo


I get the same effect just listening.


----------



## Marsilius

In public performances Jascha Heifetz cultivated an aloof, patrician persona and critics often used to describe his playing as "cold" or "detached". If, however, you listen to his recorded performances, they are full of real emotion. It's a good example of how a performer's physical appearance can create an impression that subliminally influences how those watching feel about what they are hearing.


----------



## ormandy

In watching the violinist Arabella Steinbacher, I noticed that she plays with her eyes closed during much of the performance. Is this a common practice? Might this handicap a performer (no eye contact with the conductor, not seeing where the bow is vis-a-vis the bridge, etc.)? Or does it denote a complete command of the instrument?

ormandy

P.S. Her performance of the Beethoven violin concerto on You Tube is stunning (as is she personally).


----------



## Ingélou

ormandy said:


> In watching the violinist Arabella Steinbacher, I noticed that she plays with her eyes closed during much of the performance. Is this a common practice? Might this handicap a performer (no eye contact with the conductor, not seeing where the bow is vis-a-vis the bridge, etc.)? Or does it denote a complete command of the instrument?
> 
> ormandy
> 
> P.S. Her performance of the Beethoven violin concerto on You Tube is stunning (as is she personally).


I often play with my eyes closed, and so did one of my violin teachers. And I've read about other fiddlers/ violinists liking to do it too. It helps a player to concentrate on the sound and for an amateur like me, helps the intonation therefore - for a professional soloist, it probably also helps the dynamics. Obviously for orchestral violinists there'd be a huge hazard, so they are less likely to do it.


----------

