# Cello Concertos



## LouisMasterMusic

Hi,

The cello is my favourite string instrument, and I have many concertos for it on CD. Here they are:

Dvorak with Janos Starker and Gregor Piatigorsky

Elgar with Maria Kliegel and Li-Wei (don't know If I have any other recordings)

Saint-Saens 1, Schumann and Lalo with Janos Starker

Walton with Gregor Piatigorsky (on the same CD as the Dvorak)

Herbert 2 with Georges Miquelle

After having listened to the Dvorak with Janos Starker (which also has Bruch's Kol Nidrei and Tchaikovsky's Rocco Variations on the same CD), in which order is it best to go next, and why?

I'd appreciate some guidance in this matter.

Louis Solomons

(.P.S. I'm going to listen to the Dvorak (with the Bruch and Tchaikovsky) now).


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## Guest

LouisMasterMusic said:


> Hi,
> 
> The cello is my favourite string instrument, and I have many concertos for it on CD. Here they are:
> 
> Dvorak with Janos Starker and Gregor Piatigorsky
> 
> Elgar with Maria Kliegel and Li-Wei (don't know If I have any other recordings)
> 
> Saint-Saens 1, Schumann and Lalo with Janos Starker
> 
> Walton with Gregor Piatigorsky (on the same CD as the Dvorak)
> 
> Herbert 2 with Georges Miquelle
> 
> After having listened to the Dvorak with Janos Starker (which also has Bruch's Kol Nidrei and Tchaikovsky's Rocco Variations on the same CD), in which order is it best to go next, and why?
> 
> I'd appreciate some guidance in this matter.
> 
> Louis Solomons
> 
> (.P.S. I'm going to listen to the Dvorak (with the Bruch and Tchaikovsky) now).


For Dvorak, I prefer Rostropovich with Karajan.

But you are missing Elgar! There are some recordings that I like better, but I would start with du Pre/Barbirolli, an iconic recording.


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## Guest

Sorry, just noticed you did have Elgar listed.


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## DaDirkNL

Where is Shostakovich?


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## Ingélou

What about Boccherini?


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## Weston

Elgar and Shostakovich 1 are likely my favorites.


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## Ukko

If you wish the music of the cello to diffuse throughout your being and suffuse your spirit, you must diversify. Haydn and Boccherini, Kodaly and Lutoslawski, and beyond in both directions, the 'run of the river' must inform your enthusiasm.

Otherwise you are merely a dilettante.


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## Art Rock

Moeran, Finzi and Bax for starters.


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## Ukko

To strengthen your foundation for Violoncello Appreciation, I suggest spending some time with the sounds of the Viola da Gamba. Without that foundation, Classical period music played on a 'modern' cello can saturate your tolerance for the saccharine.


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## Vaneyes

Vivaldi - Maisky/Orpheus CO (DG)
CPE Bach - Suzuki/Bach Collegium Japan (BIS)
Schumann - Rostropovich/Bernstein (EMI)
Tchaikovsky (Rococo Variations) - Wallfisch/Simon (Chandos)
Dvorak - Fournier/Szell (DG)
Lalo - Chang/Pappano (EMI)
Saint-Saens (1 & 2) - Isserlis/MTT/Escenbach (RCA)
Barber - Ma/Zinman (Sony)
Britten - Ma/Zinman (Sony)
Carter - Sherry/Knussen (Bridge)
Delius - Wallfisch/Mackerras (EMI)
Dutilleux - Rostropovich/Baudo (EMI)
Elgar - DuPre/Barbirolli (EMI)
Ginastera (1 & 2) - Kosower/Zagrosek (Naxos)
Kabalevsky (1 & 2) - Tarasova/Dudarova (Regis)
Khachaturian - Tarasova/Dudarova (Regis)
Ligeti - Perenyi/Eotvos (Sony)
Lutoslawski - Rostropovich/Lutoslawski (EMI)
Martin - Kates/Mester (First Edition)
Moeran - Johnston/Falletta (Naxos)
Myaskovsky - Rodin/Krimets (Arte Nova)
Penderecki (1 & 2) - Noras/Penderecki (Elatus)
Prokofiev (Symphony-Concerto) - Chang/Pappano (EMI)
Rawsthorne - Baillie/Lloyd-Jones (Naxos)
Schnittke (No.1) - Gutman/Rozhdestvensky (Regis)
Schnittke (No. 2) - Rostropovich/Ozawa (Sony)
Schoenberg - Sherry/Craft (Naxos)
Shostakovich (1 & 2) - Schiff/M. Shostakovich (Philips)
Walton - Harrell/Rattle (EMI)


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## PetrB

The only piece I can think of not already mentioned, which I think should be added:
William Schuman; 'cello concerto _Song of Orpheus._


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## violadude

Two cello concertos that haven't been mentioned by Ahmed Saygun and Einojuhani Rautavarra.


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## csacks

I would add both Brahms´s double concerto (violin and cello), and Beethoven´s Triple.
And what about chamber music?. That will be a loooooong list, but if you like cello, there is a lot to enjoy there.


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## Ukko

csacks said:


> I would add both Brahms´s double concerto (violin and cello), and Beethoven´s Triple.
> And what about chamber music?. That will be a loooooong list, but if you like cello, there is a lot to enjoy there.


Beethoven's Triple Concerto listens like an exercise in Instrument Appreciation for children. Every bit that one instrument gets, the other two repeat in order - without significant modification. There is at least one soloist too many for effective entertainment. My daydreamed explanation for the work's existence is that Beethoven was working out some problem - and decided that the resultant doodling was salable. This supposition preserves my respect for Beethoven as a composer.

Sorry _csacks_, you must have pushed a button.


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## LouisMasterMusic

csacks said:


> And what about chamber music? there is a lot to enjoy there.


 I'm more interested in cello concertos or pieces for orchestra which involve solo cello (like Bruch's Kol Nidrei) rather than chamber music. Sorry if I wasted your time.


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## LouisMasterMusic

Vaneyes said:


> Elgar - DuPre/Barbirolli (EMI)
> Shostakovich (1 & 2) - Schiff/M. Shostakovich (Philips)
> )


 Hello,
Thank you for this list.
I have only bought the above two pieces at the moment. The list is too long to buy all at once. Thank you for avoiding Karajan and Barenboim.

In which order should I listen to them; Elgar first and then the Shostakovich, ior vice versa? Additionally, should my recording of the Dvorak and Walton concertos with Piatagorsky be listened to before these other concertos? Please can you give me a full order, and why you think it is important that they be listened to in this order.


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## revdrdave

In the interest of expanding your cello concerto horizons, and because it is one of the most hauntingly beautiful of all cello concerti, the concerto by Rodion Shchedrin...


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## LouisMasterMusic

revdrdave said:


> In the interest of expanding your cello concerto horizons, and because it is one of the most hauntingly beautiful of all cello concerti, the concerto by Rodion Shchedrin...
> 
> View attachment 35852


Thanks, but at the moment I'll start with the Elgar played by Jacqueline Du-Pre and both Shostakovich cooncertos played by Heinrich Schiff, as recommended by someone else


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## Guest

For me, I prefer Shostakovich's 1st Cello Concerto in its premiere recording, with Rostropovich wielding his bow. I believe he was accompanied by Eugene Ormandy with the Philadelphia Orchestra.


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## csacks

Ukko said:


> Beethoven's Triple Concerto listens like an exercise in Instrument Appreciation for children. Every bit that one instrument gets, the other two repeat in order - without significant modification. There is at least one soloist too many for effective entertainment. My daydreamed explanation for the work's existence is that Beethoven was working out some problem - and decided that the resultant doodling was salable. This supposition preserves my respect for Beethoven as a composer.
> 
> Sorry _csacks_, you must have pushed a button.


No problem, this is intended to interchange opinions. To me, it is nice to listen, and that is enough. If that means that I enjoy music for children, no problem, it is the "problem" of being young


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## csacks

LouisMasterMusic said:


> I'm more interested in cello concertos or pieces for orchestra which involve solo cello (like Bruch's Kol Nidrei) rather than chamber music. Sorry if I wasted your time.


No problem LouisMasterMusic, you own like 1 minute. It is not that bad


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## danielsshao

Even as a cellist myself, I have to say that Vaneye's list is nigh-exhaustive. Why don't you try to broaden your cello horizons a little though (so to speak) and listen to some of the great sonatas that have been composed for the cello? I'd recommend both of Brahms', the Rachmaninov, the Schnittke, and the Schubert transcribed Arpeggione for a start: hopefully that gives you a little variety.


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## moody

Strangely I see no mention of Robert Schumann's concerto.


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## perempe

i saw Cello Concerto No.1, Op.33 (Saint-Saëns) yesterday. Perényi Miklós played the chello, and Lionel Bringuier was the conductor. the concert was one of the best musical experiences of the season. (i usually go to operas, it might be my 1st concert.)








the program:
Dances of Galánta (Kodály)
Cello Concerto No.1, Op.33 (Saint-Saëns)
Daphnis et Chloé (Ravel)


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## hpowders

Haydn Cello Concerto in C remains my favorite for this instrument.


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## atmplayspiano

What about Vivaldi's cello concerti? I don't know much about them, but I recently listened to a nice concerto in A minor.


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## maestro267

Elgar's is probably my favourite, followed by Walton and Shostakovich's 2nd. I'm also getting into Penderecki's 2nd.

There's a ton that I want to get, including Schnittke's, Lutoslawski's and Dutilleux's.


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## ComposerOfAvantGarde

I have to make mention of the cello concerto by Kaila (born 1978) which I experienced for the first time last week. Marvellous.


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## Guest

Don't forget Saariaho's Notes On Light


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## Selby

Art Rock said:


> Moeran, Finzi and Bax for starters.


Exactly.

Hovhaness or Rautavaara if you want something a little lighter.

Dobrinka Tabakova wrote a stunning one if you are willing to try something new.

http://www.amazon.com/Tabakova-Stri...7921243&sr=8-1&keywords=tabakova+string+paths


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## LudwigKaramazov

Faure's cello works are great pieces, and this CD is enjoyable all the way through:

http://www.amazon.com/Complete-Works-Cello-Steve-Isserlis/dp/B000003FTT


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## DavidA

Dvorak with Rostropovich / Karajan or Fournier / Szell (or Casals / Szell)
Elgar with Du Pre / Barbirolli
Shostokovich 1 with Rostropovich is unbeatable
Britten Cello Symphony with Slava (again)
Schumann with du Pre
Of course there is also Strauss' Don Quixote in which Fournier (with HvK) gets the cello to talk best.


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## Vaneyes

DavidA said:


> Dvorak with Rostropovich / Karajan or Fournier / Szell (or Casals / Szell)
> Elgar with Du Pre / Barbirolli
> Shostokovich 1 with Rostropovich is unbeatable
> Britten Cello Symphony with Slava (again)
> Schumann with du Pre
> Of course there is also Strauss' Don Quixote in which Fournier (with HvK) gets the cello to talk best.


du Pre's rehearsal DQ is fun. Nice Schumann/DQ coupling with Slava/LB/HvK. And we can't forget H. Schiff w. M. Shostakovich.







:tiphat:








View attachment 40192


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## Vaneyes

danielsshao said:


> Even as a cellist myself, I have to say that Vaneye's list is nigh-exhaustive. Why don't you try to broaden your cello horizons a little though (so to speak) and *listen to some of the great sonatas that have been composed for the cello*? I'd recommend both of Brahms', the Rachmaninov, the Schnittke, and the Schubert transcribed Arpeggione for a start: hopefully that gives you a little variety.


Excellent idea. They don't even have to be the considered greats. So many pleasant surprises from the unsungs. Don't mean to hijack the thread. Anyone can PM me for suggestions.


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## Blake

Schnittke - 1 & 2.


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## Vaneyes

LouisMasterMusic said:


> Hello,
> Thank you for this list.
> I have only bought the above two pieces at the moment. The list is too long to buy all at once. Thank you for avoiding Karajan and Barenboim.
> 
> In which order should I listen to them; Elgar first and then the Shostakovich, ior vice versa? Additionally, should my recording of the Dvorak and Walton concertos with Piatagorsky be listened to before these other concertos? Please can you give me a full order, and why you think it is important that they be listened to in this order.


You're most welcome.

I wasn't avoiding HvK, as much as not remembering R. Strauss and Don Quixote. A glaring omission, that I've since made up for.

Re Barenboim, it's tragic there's substandard recorded sound for du Pre and Barenboim's Lalo.

Re order, none is necessary, but I did list them roughly in chronological order. You may find that you want to adjust further, when you get to atonal. Some like a clear separation for distinct listening periods or days. Personally, it doesn't matter to me. I bounce back and forth all the time.

Happy listening.


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## cjvinthechair

On the back of the excellent 'modern' concerti by Kaila, Saariaho, Shchedrin & Tabakova mentioned earlier, can I make mention of those by Unsuk Chin, Robert Simpson, Peteris Vasks...and from slightly further back Reinhold Gliere & Lars-Eric Larsson.


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## Animato

Did anyone mention the extraordinary beautiful Cello-Concerto by Jacques Offenbach ? It is amazing ! Please listen to it.


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## LouisMasterMusic

moody said:


> Strangely I see no mention of Robert Schumann's concerto.


I haven't listened to it yet, but I know now that I have it on a CD with Janos Starker playing the Lalo and the Saint-Saens's 1 alongside.


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## Svelte Silhouette

Dvorak and Elgar make a perfect pair oft perfectly paired


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## SONNET CLV

It may not rank with Elgar's, Dvorak's, or other "top ranked" concertos for cello, but T*he Cello Concerto in A minor, Op 40, by Gerald Finzi *sits at the top of the list of my favorite cello concertos. Give it a listen.


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## changeup

Not exactly a Cello Concerto, but I really love Brahms' Double Concerto.
Rostropovich / Oistrakh / Szell / Cleveland Orchestra


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## LouisMasterMusic

DaDirkNL said:


> Where is Shostakovich?


Which recording is best? Heinrich Schiff on Philips, or Maria Kliegel on Naxos?


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## hpowders

Haven't heard the Kliegel, though Schiff is very fine.


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## Albert7

Ironically I do prefer the Elgar Cello Concerto as played by Alisa Weilerstein over that of du Pre which is probably pretty controversial.

Du Pre is passionate but Weilerstein takes a more nuanced and measured approach which befits its personality.


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## starthrower

Ginatera concertos by Mark Kosower


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## LouisMasterMusic

[QUOTE








View attachment 40192
[/QUOTE]

How do you insert images into a post in TallkClassical? I've been trying to copy and paste them from websites, but that doesn't work. (That's not my picture by the way; its one from Vaneyes).


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## CyrilWashbrook

LouisMasterMusic said:


> How do you insert images into a post in TallkClassical? I've been trying to copy and paste them from websites, but that doesn't work. (That's not my picture by the way; its one from Vaneyes).


Save the image that you want onto your computer. Then attach it using the image dialog, which is accessible through this icon:


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## LouisMasterMusic

CyrilWashbrook said:


> Save the image that you want onto your computer. Then attach it using the image dialog, which is accessible through this icon:


I've just saved it, but I don't know where to find the icon?


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## Art Rock

Quick reply box (under the thread), third symbol from the right.


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## ptr

Look at the quick reply field at the bottom of each thread, above the box for writing there is a row of icons, third from the right!

In the advanced mode reply, its situated in the middle row fifth from the right..

/ptr


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## LouisMasterMusic

Thank you very much.


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## elgar's ghost

Hindemith wrote two (three if the 'Kammermusik #3' is included) from opposite ends of his career - well worth looking into.


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## aajj

I love the 1st Shostakovich. Favorite recording is with Mischa Maisky/Siberski/Saarbrucken Radio Symphony Orchestra. I won't say it is superior to Rostropovich but I love the ferocious yet controlled playing by Maisky. 

I also enjoy those by Walton, Lutoslawski. Boccherini, the Cello "Symphony" by Britten and C.P.E. Bach's in A Minor. It's been brought up previously, so I will also include the Brahms "double."


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## Nope

Elgar NOT played by Jaqucline du Pre? My god you really need to listen to her recording! its truely amazing


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## Celloman

:angel:...........................................


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## hpowders

Enough with du Pre already.

My favorite Elgar Cello Concerto is with the great Heinrich Schiff.


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## Oliver

Shostakovich 2.


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## hapiper

Well thanks to this thread I just ordered a CD with both Elgar and Saint-Saens on it. I have never heard either one of them before. In fact thinking back on it I think the only one I HAVE heard is Dvorak and I really like the cello, so this should be fun. I still have the Dvorak on it's way as well, so I am going to have all 3 arriving at about the same time.


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## Lord Lance

hpowders said:


> Enough with du Pre already.
> 
> My favorite Elgar Cello Concerto is with the great Heinrich Schiff.


Do you think that du Pre got her revered status mainly because she died early? Honestly, I see a lot of action in her but none of the skill and intensity that age and wisdom can bring. Overrated in my opinion.


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## elgar's ghost

Lord Lance said:


> Do you think that du Pre got her revered status mainly because she died early? Honestly, I see a lot of action in her but none of the skill and intensity that age and wisdom can bring. Overrated in my opinion.


The sales of Jacqueline du Pré's Elgar with Barbirolli on EMI were quite freakishly high in classical terms (as would those of Gorecki's 3rd on Nonesuch be decades later) - had she lived to be 90 it's unlikely anything else of hers would have sold so well even if she had managed to play even better.

Jacqueline du Pré's cruel illness and early death were indeed tragic but I like to think most classical listeners who have heard her work are too analytical and discerning to let anything like that cloud their judgement as to how good (or not) they think she was for her age, or could have been had her career developed further.


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## Albert7

Shostabear's cello concertos are pure genius. My top fav five things Shostabear ever composed. Sol's recording is a landmark here.


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## Lord Lance

Albert7 said:


> Shostabear's cello concertos are pure genius. My top fav five things Shostabear ever composed. Sol's recording is a landmark here.


Thank you, Albert.


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## Albert7

Lord Lance said:


> Thank you, Albert.


I didn't know whether you are being sarcastic or really wanting to hear the recording that I recommended here.


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## Lord Lance

Albert7 said:


> I didn't know whether you are being sarcastic or really wanting to hear the recording that I recommended here.


You called Shostakovich "Shostabear". Hence, thank you.


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## hapiper

I downloaded Du Pre doing Dvorak's Cello Concerto. I have nothing to compare it to (yet) but it was very good. Then I was reading a short Bio on her and Oh MAN!! She certainly didn't have an uneventful life and that's an understatement. Sounded like a good candidate for a new reality show on TV. Mahler had an interesting life but nothing even close to this.


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## Albert7

hapiper said:


> I downloaded Du Pre doing Dvorak's Cello Concerto. I have nothing to compare it to (yet) but it was very good. Then I was reading a short Bio on her and Oh MAN!! She certainly didn't have an uneventful life and that's an understatement. Sounded like a good candidate for a new reality show on TV. Mahler had an interesting life but nothing even close to this.


I recommend the complete EMI recordings of Jacqueline du Pre... a great budget box set.


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## hapiper

I just got my recording of Dvorak and Saint-Saens Cello concerto's on EMI with Rostropovich and LPO and I must say I absolutely LOVE this recording. The recording quality could be just a little bit better but the performance is the best I have ever heard. I was thinking as I was listening to the Saint-Saens concerto, this is the only thing I have from this composer, but based on this I need to get more. Very short for a concerto but very enjoyable just the same. The whole concerto is shorter than one movement of most others. Can anyone offer a suggestion for something else by Saint-Saens that I might like?


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## ColColt

I just joined the forum and considering learning the cello myself, I was drawn to this thread. I ran through most of the posts but didn't find Truls Mork listed. I saw a YouTube video of him and thought he was rather good. In fact, I liked it so well, I found a CD of it and bought it.


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## CyrilWashbrook

ColColt said:


> I just joined the forum and considering learning the cello myself, I was drawn to this thread. I ran through most of the posts but didn't find Truls Mork listed. I saw a YouTube video of him and thought he was rather good. In fact, I liked it so well, I found a CD of it and bought it.


Yes, he plays it well. The concert in that video, incidentally, was his comeback performance after an illness that put him out of action for more than a year. Quite a way to return.



hapiper said:


> I just got my recording of Dvorak and Saint-Saens Cello concerto's on EMI with Rostropovich and LPO and I must say I absolutely LOVE this recording. The recording quality could be just a little bit better but the performance is the best I have ever heard. I was thinking as I was listening to the Saint-Saens concerto, this is the only thing I have from this composer, but based on this I need to get more. Very short for a concerto but very enjoyable just the same. The whole concerto is shorter than one movement of most others. Can anyone offer a suggestion for something else by Saint-Saens that I might like?


There's much to recommend. How about The Carnival of the Animals (including The Swan, which you have almost certainly heard whether you knew it or not) or his third symphony?


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## hapiper

My cd arrived today with cello concerto's by Elgar and Saint-Saens on it. I have to admit I am not a big fan of either one. Could be the cellist (Julian Lloyd Webber) as I have never heard of him but both performances were pretty pedestrian to my ears.


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## changeup

Albert7 said:


> I recommend the complete EMI recordings of Jacqueline du Pre... a great budget box set.


I have it but it does not have Dvorak in it. Weird.


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## Kathrin

Thanks for your interest in the cello! I totally agree 

Being a cellist myself, one of my favourite concerts is Schumann's concerto - lovely to listen to (and wonderful to play).


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## changeup

hapiper said:


> I just got my recording of Dvorak and Saint-Saens Cello concerto's on EMI with Rostropovich and LPO and I must say I absolutely LOVE this recording. The recording quality could be just a little bit better but the performance is the best I have ever heard. I was thinking as I was listening to the Saint-Saens concerto, this is the only thing I have from this composer, but based on this I need to get more. Very short for a concerto but very enjoyable just the same. The whole concerto is shorter than one movement of most others. Can anyone offer a suggestion for something else by Saint-Saens that I might like?


Saint-Saens:

Symphony No. 3 "Organ"
Piano Concerto No. 2
Piano Concerto No. 4
Piano Concerto No. 5 "Egyptian"
Violin Concerto No. 3
Introduction and Rondo Capriccioso
Havanaise
Danse Macabre

Of course the Cello Concerto. I am not a big fan of the Carnival of Animals, but Le Cygne is absolutely touching.


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## dzc4627

have heard the first schnittke cello concerto and i highly recommend it... the recording of alexander ivashkin is the best one i'd say. a very emotional work for a very emotional instrument


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## fjf

"From his deathbed, Brahms continued to praise Dvořák’s Cello Concerto: “Why on earth didn’t I know one could write a cello concerto like this? If I’d only known, I’d have written one long ago!”"


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## SONNET CLV

Just posted about a new cello concerto disc in another thread. Thought it appropriate to mention here for those of you who (like me) are cello concerto fans. This latest addition in the Hyperion catalog of THE ROMANTIC CELLO CONCERTO is a stunner! Well worth hearing.

Here's the post:

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Finally got round to listening to my latest acquisition in Hyperion's ongoing THE ROMANTIC CELLO CONCERTO series -- Volume 6 featuring the two concertos of Henry Vieuxtemps (No. 1 in A minor Op.46; No. 2 in B minor Op.50) and two works for cello and orchestra by Vieuxtemps's student Eugène Ysaÿe (Méditation in B minor 'Poème' Op 16; Sérénade in A major Op 22).









Both Vieuxtemps concertos are relatively late works, composed in the final decade of his life and contemporaneous with the Violin Concertos 6, 7, and the unfinished 8. (Vieuxtemps died in 1881, aged 61.) They exude maturity and depth of expression. I was pleasantly surprised, especially at the quality of the A minor Concerto which wow-ed me from start to finish. Both concertos were splendid listens, and though the B minor may be the more substantial work of the two, I don't always prefer the substantial to something that is immediate, dynamic, fiery, albeit less substantial. Or it may have been that I was so impressed by the First Concerto that my attention waned while listening to the Second. Still, both of these are "finds" and if you like Romantic era melody and classical structure in your music, these fill the bill nicely. Great additions to both the Hyperion catalog and my own record shelves.

By the way, the two shorter Ysaÿe pieces were equally pleasing, alone worth the price of this CD. They too are of the lyrical Romantic world, though one might hear shades of Richard Strauss and the late Romantics in these works composed both circa 1910.

If you haven't yet plunged into the Hyperion Romantic Cello Concerto series, there is no finer disc in the collection thus far to begin with than this volume, no. 6, which follows some very fine works including the cello concertos of Camille Saint-Saëns (Vol. 5) and that of Robert Schumann (Vol. 2). These works by Vieuxtemps and Ysaÿe will likely be unfamiliar to even those who know the Saint-Saëns and Schumann works well, and probably even to those greatly familiar with Vieuxtemps' violin concertos.

Music well worth giving a listen to. I can't wait to revisit this disc, soon. In fact, I've just pressed play on my SONY CD deck remote, cueing up track 4 for a second listen to that Second Concerto. Bye now.


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## Arsakes

Dvorak owns Brahms almost in every field and genre! Maybe except Choral works and Piano Concerto.


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## Lord Lance

Ukko said:


> Beethoven's Triple Concerto listens like an exercise in Instrument Appreciation for children. Every bit that one instrument gets, the other two repeat in order - without significant modification. There is at least one soloist too many for effective entertainment. My daydreamed explanation for the work's existence is that Beethoven was working out some problem - and decided that the resultant doodling was salable. This supposition preserves my respect for Beethoven as a composer.
> 
> Sorry _csacks_, you must have pushed a button.


Quite honestly, the work has seemed to me [A musically retarded person with no idea of anything intricate except a rudimentary understanding of the sonata form and well-to-do understanding of tempi.] a jumble of confusion. Sometime it feels like an orchestral work, sometimes a solo, double concerto, sometimes sonata for violin or violin and cello and sometimes just three soloists jamming in the garage.


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## Lord Lance

Arsakes said:


> Dvorak owns Brahms almost in every field and genre! Maybe except Choral works and Piano Concerto.


*coughs* _What do you mean to say? _Dvorak's concerti [whether piano or violin] are fantastic. Maybe not the grand Romantic virtuosic masterpieces of Brahms, but 'tis merely different scale and intended audiences. Or perhaps, I just love Dvorak more than you do. _Traitor._


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## leroy

Lord Lance said:


> *coughs* _What do you mean to say? _Dvorak's concerti [whether piano or violin] are fantastic. Maybe not the grand Romantic virtuosic masterpieces of Brahms, but 'tis merely different scale and intended audiences. Or perhaps, I just love Dvorak more than you do. _Traitor._


I believe you got that backward he is saying Dvorak> Brahms


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## Lord Lance

leroy said:


> I believe you got that backward he is saying Dvorak> Brahms


Perhaps, you don't understand that my posts were made knowing what he said. Perhaps re-read it?


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## Albert7

Tonight a quick and dirty clip of Vivaldi that isn't the 4 Seasons Hotel.


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## leroy

Lord Lance said:


> Perhaps, you don't understand that my posts were made knowing what he said. Perhaps re-read it?


Well I guess I am confused then, never mind


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## jim prideaux

this thread seems to be the appropriate place to recommend Atterberg's Cello Concerto-Truls Mork, Kristian Jarvi etc,Bis CD...to this listener seems to inhabit a similar space to the equally impressive Miaskovsky concerto.....


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## Steatopygous

Arsakes said:


> Dvorak owns Brahms almost in every field and genre! Maybe except Choral works and Piano Concerto.


I love and esteem Dvorak. But if I were dividing them from 100 it would be Brahms 72, Dvorak 28. Besides choral works, add solo piano and songs. Chamber music a draw perhaps, symphonies Brahms well ahead. IMHO, I hasten to add. Dvorak wins in opera, if it's any consolation.


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## nightscape

Steatopygous said:


> Arsakes said:
> 
> 
> 
> Dvorak owns Brahms almost in every field and genre! Maybe except Choral works and Piano Concerto.
> 
> 
> 
> I love and esteem Dvorak. But if I were dividing them from 100 it would be Brahms 72, Dvorak 28. Besides choral works, add solo piano and songs. Chamber music a draw perhaps, *symphonies Brahms well ahead*. IMHO, I hasten to add. Dvorak wins in opera, if it's any consolation.
Click to expand...

Hardly. I know this is a senseless argument since it boils down to preference, but Dvorak 6-9 are clearly on the same level as Brahms, and in my opinion exceed them. And then you have 3, 4 and 5, which are wonderful symphonies that do not get nearly the amount of attention in the concert hall that they deserve.


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## Steatopygous

nightscape said:


> Hardly. I know this is a senseless argument since it boils down to preference, but Dvorak 6-9 are clearly on the same level as Brahms, and in my opinion exceed them. And then you have 3, 4 and 5, which are wonderful symphonies that do not get nearly the amount of attention in the concert hall that they deserve.


Senseless arguments can be the most fun, especially as there is nothing at stake. We are at little risk of becoming heated.
Ok, in a spirit of charity, I'll give you a draw on the symphonies. And a win on opera for the obvious reason that Brahms never wrote any. Chamber, I put Brahms ahead for the depth, richness, variety and profundity while also admiring Dvorak.

But the whole reason for my reply is to adapt Bob Newhart's marvellous insult to country music listeners. Ie, I prefer Brahms to Dvorak, but I don't mean to denigrate Dvorak. And for Dvorak-lovers, "denigrate" means put down. :lol:


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## KenOC

Cello concerti -- how can one speak of Saint-saens, Schumann, or even Dvorak and Elgar, when there's ...Shostakovich?


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## Arsakes

I totally had forgotten how good was Elgar's Cello concerto...


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## KenOC

Elgar is #1 or maybe #2, for sure. But where's Beethoven??? I sent him an e-mail but he hasn't answered yet. Can we crowd-fund a commission for him?


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## Dr Johnson

I'd like to add Delius' Cello Concerto.


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## Lord Lance

*Where's Raff?*

Looks like Raff is missing out on the Cello action here. Unfortunate but I will recommend them wholeheartedly!














​


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## Steatopygous

Wiki says Raff's work is largely forgotten today. Not by me, because I didn't know it. But I will be interested in following this up, possibly via Youtube first (haven't checked yet what's there).
Thanks for drawing this to our attention.


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## cjvinthechair

Gee...so many glorious works for this instrument !

A few additions: because I'm English, & my passion for music started with slightly lesser known British composers, can I mention Stanford 



 & Bliss 



 .
If you don't mind a surfeit, how about Aho double concerto 



 , or even better Penderecki Concerto Grosso for 3 cellos 



 .
Thanks for mentioning Myaskovsky, my favourite slightly less celebrated Russian : another who I feel underrated is Sergei Slonimsky (link to Part 1) 



Finally, an American rather better known for film scores - Howard Shore (link to Part 1) 



 - he can write, this guy !


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## Selby

Has Saariaho's Amers been mentioned yet?


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## Beban

Juro Tkalčić 
Cello Concerto 




(The person on the photo is the composer)


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## worov

Barber :


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