# Which piece has the most key signature changes?



## LordBlackudder (Nov 13, 2010)

Which piece has the most key signature changes?


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## Olias (Nov 18, 2010)

Not sure if its the most but the 2nd movement in Debussy's "La Mer" changes keys about six times in 30 seconds.


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## Toddlertoddy (Sep 17, 2011)

The Rite of Spring of course.









And this is only the beginning.


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## powerbooks (Jun 30, 2012)

Toddlertoddy said:


> The Rite of Spring of course.
> 
> View attachment 6087
> 
> ...


Are we talking about change of key or rhythm/beat signature?

I was wondering this when I first read this topic. If it is the beat (time signature) you are referring to, then the Rite would be on top of the list. But I am not sure about key signature changes......


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## emiellucifuge (May 26, 2009)

Do you want the Key _Signature_ change _per se._ Or are you looking for the most modulations?


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## powerbooks (Jun 30, 2012)

emiellucifuge said:


> Do you want the Key _Signature_ change _per se._ Or are you looking for the most modulations?


Exactly my question......


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## Huilunsoittaja (Apr 6, 2010)

Totally the rite of spring.

Piccolo 1 part which I sightread for a Lab Orchestra meet. It was   .


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## aleazk (Sep 30, 2011)

In the case of those wild time signature changes, the current trend is not to use a time signature in the first place, just mark the bar lines.


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## Couchie (Dec 9, 2010)

I think you mean "what piece has the most key signature changes".


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## LordBlackudder (Nov 13, 2010)

the ones that go from c minor to a major than d minor the most times. like that.


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## ComposerOfAvantGarde (Dec 2, 2011)

aleazk said:


> In the case of those wild time signature changes, the current trend is not to use a time signature in the first place, just mark the bar lines.


Bar lines? What for?


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## aleazk (Sep 30, 2011)

ComposerOfAvantGarde said:


> Bar lines? What for?


for the phrasing, if there's any. If the phrasing is very irregular, but you still want to use bar lines, it's covenient not to use a time signature, because you will need to change it very often. Ligeti does this quite often, for example.


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## ComposerOfAvantGarde (Dec 2, 2011)

aleazk said:


> for the phrasing, if there's any. If the phrasing is very irregular, but you still want to use bar lines, it's covenient not to use a time signature, because you will need to change it very often. Ligeti does this quite often, for example.


Makes sense. I often don't use bar lines when writing solo pieces.


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## aleazk (Sep 30, 2011)

ComposerOfAvantGarde said:


> Makes sense. I often don't use bar lines when writing solo pieces.


see this, for example:









the bar lines are quite convenient here, for a clear understanding of what is going on, but there's a "shortening" of the main phrase very often, and only in one hand! (the right hand), it would be very awkward to use time signatures here, not so, bar lines.


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## powerbooks (Jun 30, 2012)

LordBlackudder said:


> the ones that go from c minor to a major than d minor the most times. like that.


OK, in that case, the time key change in the rite may not count since even though at certain sections the Rite changes the time/beat every bar, the key remains the same (C minor, for example).


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## Toddlertoddy (Sep 17, 2011)

Woops, I misread it as time signature...Also, wouldn't it be borderline atonal because there's no strict key if there are a bunch of key changes?


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## ComposerOfAvantGarde (Dec 2, 2011)

If that's the case, my Ode to Marxism for five guitars (all of equal importace) wins.


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## SuperTonic (Jun 3, 2010)

A key signature is not really a musically relevant attribute of a piece. Its just a shorthand that reduces clutter on the page and makes the music easier to read. When you see a key signature of 2 sharps for instance, you can't automatically assume that the music is in the key of D major/b minor. You have to look at the context of any given passage to determine the actual key. In fact, changes in key signature within a piece are actually somewhat rare relative to the number of modulations to different keys that typically occur within a piece.


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## Delicious Manager (Jul 16, 2008)

Toddlertoddy said:


> The Rite of Spring of course.
> 
> View attachment 6087
> 
> ...


KEY signature changes, not time signature changes...


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