# Three Entities



## chee_zee

here

placed in a competition for new music, scores and audio after the jump


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## PetrB

chee_zee said:


> here
> 
> placed in a competition for new music, scores and audio after the jump


A link to the exact Sibelius plug-in required to play these would be politic, and useful


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## Kopachris

I quite like it. Looking through the score, I'm seeing a lot of extended technique--I can't wait until we can get a recording of that performance.



PetrB said:


> A link to the exact Sibelius plug-in required to play these would be politic, and useful


What? The player on the website he linked is just Flash, and links on the website for the scores should simply open up Google Docs in a new window.


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## chee_zee

yeah not sure what is needed sibelius wise, didn't know that site uploaded that way as all I did was attach pdfs and an mp3.


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## Igneous01

PetrB said:


> A link to the exact Sibelius plug-in required to play these would be politic, and useful


if your talking about the samples, im afraid you would need to purchase those (search east west symphonic orchestra, or EWQLSO for short)

be warned its quite pricey


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## chee_zee

nothing compared to VSL, though it doesn't have as much articulations.


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## Couchie

I was worried from the name that you might have might have tried to generate the score by iterating a complex polynomial, and ended up with something that sounds like crap. Unfortunately, it looks like you wrote these notes deliberately.


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## Lunasong

I'd like to know the name of the competition so we all can enter it next year 

I didn't find this piece interesting and, as a clarinet player, I didn't hear effective use of the instrument's capabilities. Obviously others disagree. Good for you!


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## chee_zee

I take criticism with stride, lunasong exactly what's missing from the clarinet part, I'd love to get feedback from an actual performer! What's so uninteresting about it? It used slap tongue, key clicks, sub tones, idiomatic melodies, quarter tone bends (a lot of this you can't really tell with samples). dynamics out the wazoo, it was featured as a soloist, an accompaniment, and background drone.

also, couchie I can't tell but are you saying you dislike the piece?


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## Couchie

chee_zee said:


> also, couchie I can't tell but are you saying you dislike the piece?


Are you Wagner? Shouldn't be too hard to figure it out from there.


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## chee_zee

what exactly do you dislike about it?


also, lunasong it was a competition for community college composers only, jack stone award for new music I believe it was called.


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## Couchie

chee_zee said:


> what exactly do you dislike about it?


- The name: Don't get it. Please explain.
- Moderato Empyreal: "Moderately Celestial", if I'm not mistaken. As in celestial, but not too celestial. Stupid.
- Too many written instructions. Nobody like micromanagement.
- Many of these instructions are too small to read at comfortable playing distance.
- I'm confused by some of the terminology, like "Multidimensional dilemma: Preternatural." It's going to be difficult to find instrumentalists capable of playing their instruments preternaturally. 
- Then you have "Arhythmic Delirium" next to a precise indication of 54 bpm to the quarter note, and the music becomes particularly rhythmic at that point. Why.
- The challenge with writing for small ensembles is that it is more difficult to establish the underlying harmonic progressions responsible for creating the sense of dramatic tension and release, which is generally what keeps music from getting boring. It appears you made no attempt here. You do have a piano, but you don't use it.
- I think most people upon hearing are going to be wondering what the pianist is trying to accomplish with his long stretches of notes devoid of any interesting thematic material.
- The melodies are not memorable.


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## chee_zee

moderato is the tempo, empyreal is a description. moderato is around 100, empyreal implies slightly slower than this.

rhythm cannot be blurred without a tempo to refer to. it's indian based in that section.

don't really see how tension and release aren't made in this piece to be honest with you. harmony isn't the only way of establishing tension/release anyways. gagaku, adi-vilambit khyal, gong kebyar, and several other world musics were incorporated. 

I also disagree about the lack of memorable melodies, perhaps the only one would be the first 'happy' section and perhaps a large chunk of the gagaku section (seeing as how it's gagaku after all it's a timbral music). 

again, I disagree about the lack of interesting thematic material of the piano, perhaps just the first happy section but I actually quite like it. If I didn't like the melody I wouldn't have written it and left it I'll put it that way. 

The performers did not seem to care about the level of detail in the instructions, , and in fact they seemed rather thankful for that especially the arhythmic section. 99 percent of the text commands are normal size, there are a couple (such as the instructions for the indian section) that are obviously intended to be read once before hand and you'll never have to read them again, certainly not during a performance as it's a description of the style of the whole section. 

same with the piano arpeggio instructions emulating sho nonsynchronicity of pipes in lower volumes. Again, I received no complaints by the performers in this regard. The pianist in fact messed up several times at rehearsal because he was so caught in the "pretty" melodies.

I do thank you for actually giving constructive feedback rather than the usual rude insults with no basis in anything.


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## Couchie

chee_zee said:


> moderato is the tempo, empyreal is a description. moderato is around 100, empyreal implies slightly slower than this.
> 
> rhythm cannot be blurred without a tempo to refer to. it's indian based in that section.
> 
> don't really see how tension and release aren't made in this piece to be honest with you. harmony isn't the only way of establishing tension/release anyways. gagaku, adi-vilambit khyal, gong kebyar, and several other world musics were incorporated.
> 
> I also disagree about the lack of memorable melodies, perhaps the only one would be the first 'happy' section and perhaps a large chunk of the gagaku section (seeing as how it's gagaku after all it's a timbral music).
> 
> again, I disagree about the lack of interesting thematic material of the piano, perhaps just the first happy section but I actually quite like it. If I didn't like the melody I wouldn't have written it and left it I'll put it that way.
> 
> The performers did not seem to care about the level of detail in the instructions, , and in fact they seemed rather thankful for that especially the arhythmic section. 99 percent of the text commands are normal size, there are a couple (such as the instructions for the indian section) that are obviously intended to be read once before hand and you'll never have to read them again, certainly not during a performance as it's a description of the style of the whole section.
> 
> same with the piano arpeggio instructions emulating sho nonsynchronicity of pipes in lower volumes. Again, I received no complaints by the performers in this regard. The pianist in fact messed up several times at rehearsal because he was so caught in the "pretty" melodies.


And now, you have your program note.



chee_zee said:


> I do thank you for actually giving constructive feedback rather than the usual rude insults with no basis in anything.


Save for reality, which I find seldom constructive and all too often rude.


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## PetrB

Kopachris said:


> I quite like it. Looking through the score, I'm seeing a lot of extended technique--I can't wait until we can get a recording of that performance.
> 
> What? The player on the website he linked is just Flash, and links on the website for the scores should simply open up Google Docs in a new window.


Saw it - technopeasant here / also tiny screen, often have to scroll back and forth :-/


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## PetrB

Couchie said:


> - The name: Don't get it. Please explain.
> - Moderato Empyreal: "Moderately Celestial", if I'm not mistaken. As in celestial, but not too celestial. Stupid.
> - Too many written instructions. Nobody like micromanagement.
> - Many of these instructions are too small to read at comfortable playing distance.
> - I'm confused by some of the terminology, like "Multidimensional dilemma: Preternatural." It's going to be difficult to find instrumentalists capable of playing their instruments preternaturally.
> - Then you have "Arhythmic Delirium" next to a precise indication of 54 bpm to the quarter note, and the music becomes particularly rhythmic at that point. Why.
> - The challenge with writing for small ensembles is that it is more difficult to establish the underlying harmonic progressions responsible for creating the sense of dramatic tension and release, which is generally what keeps music from getting boring. It appears you made no attempt here. You do have a piano, but you don't use it.
> - I think most people upon hearing are going to be wondering what the pianist is trying to accomplish with his long stretches of notes devoid of any interesting thematic material.
> - The melodies are not memorable.


zOMG - demonstrating what you've already announced about yourself: it really seems that you believe music should be accompaniment, back up and illustration of a literal program for it to have 'real' value.

zOMG -- even more so -- it seems you're looking for 'Melodies' of yore in music from 2012 -- not that there's anything I'd call a "melody" in most of the hours and hours of Richard's sea of notes.

You haven't a legitimate critique of this piece except from the perspective it is not Wagner, does Not Behave Like Wagner made music behave - I find the instruments used pretty idiomatically, not a bad thing.

Do you know how pissed-off violinists get about the endless drivel of the gratuitous orchestral filler arpeggiations they have to play in a lot of Wagner's scores? A lot! -- i.e. speaking of unimaginative and non-idiomatic instrumental writing - LOL.


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## chee_zee

not to mention it was meant as a conglomeration of many different world musics, indian hindustani adi-vilambit khyal alap, japanese togaku gagaku, indonesian balinese gamelan gong kebyar, and elements of manlinka and mandinka mande/west african music. none of these have much in the way of harmony. harmony is not a requirement of music. sorry, but it's the truth. nor is melody, some musics the basis is not the ultra simple melodies, it's timbral listening *cough gagaku cough*


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## Couchie

PetrB said:


> zOMG - demonstrating what you've already announced about yourself: it really seems that you believe music should be accompaniment, back up and illustration of a literal program for it to have 'real' value.


What? No.



PetrB said:


> zOMG -- even more so -- it seems you're looking for 'Melodies' of yore in music from 2012 -- not that there's anything I'd call a "melody" in most of the hours and hours of Richard's sea of notes.


Implying that I have a pretty loose definition of melody, which I do. It doesn't have to be of Mozartean hummability. But it should be a memorable sequence of notes, otherwise it's just forgettable, right?



PetrB said:


> You haven't a legitimate critique of this piece except from the perspective it is not Wagner, does Not Behave Like Wagner made music behave - I find the instruments used pretty idiomatically, not a bad thing.


Its unremarkable, I could care less whether it's Wagner.



PetrB said:


> Do you know how pissed-off violinists get about the endless drivel of the gratuitous orchestral filler arpeggiations they have to play in a lot of Wagner's scores? A lot! -- i.e. speaking of unimaginative and non-idiomatic instrumental writing - LOL.


Thats why violin concertos were developed. Wagner was right to put these entitled ***holes out of sight 9 feet below the stage.


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## Iforgotmypassword

I really like the rhythmic grooves the piano gets into at times.


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## chee_zee

*bows* thank you thank you


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## chee_zee

dont ya just love how you cant even edit your own posts, thus necromancing threads? anyways, they finally gave us the recordings, here is mine


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