# favorite Brandenburg



## science (Oct 14, 2010)

I'm not asking about recordings but the works themselves. Which Brandenburg Concerto do you enjoy most?


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## mmsbls (Mar 6, 2011)

For a long time number 2 was my favorite with the third second. In the past year or so the sixth has vaulted to the top. I guess I'd order them 6,2,3, others. 

Interestingly I just bought tickets to see Nos. 1,4, and 5 later this year.


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## Ravellian (Aug 17, 2009)

5 is the best because of the keyboard cadenza 
I like 2 very much as well, it's always funny to hear the trumpeter screw up the part because it's so darn hard.


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## Couchie (Dec 9, 2010)

I also like the 6th the best, love the violas playing a tightly knit canon in the first movement:






After that, it's probably goes 3, 4, 2, 5, 1


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## violadude (May 2, 2011)

I'd rank them 4, 5, 6, 1, 2, 3.

Sorry three...You're another poor victim of overexposure...


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## Weston (Jul 11, 2008)

#3 is my favorite. The outer allegro movements are joyous complimentary bookends for the non-existent middle movement.


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## violadude (May 2, 2011)

Weston said:


> #3 is my favorite. The outer allegro movements are joyous complimentary bookends for the non-existent middle movement.


Weston, you don't play and instrument do you?


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## Vesteralen (Jul 14, 2011)

violadude said:


> Weston, you don't play and instrument do you?


Unless you count the guitar, neither do I. I also like the third best. It doesn't have any dull parts. 

My unsophisticated list: 3, 2, 4, 6, 1, 5 (too, too long)

Happy in my ignorance.


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## violadude (May 2, 2011)

Vesteralen said:


> Unless you count the guitar, neither do I. I also like the third best. It doesn't have any dull parts.
> 
> My unsophisticated list: 3, 2, 4, 6, 1, 5 (too, too long)
> 
> Happy in my ignorance.


Well no, I wasn't trying to say you or Weston was ignorant. I was actually going to say that I am very envious of people who don't play instruments in some ways. I can't tell you how many pieces that have lost their thrill to me because I had to play them way too many times (Brandenberg 3 being one of them). So I actually think it's cool that you guys love #3 so much.

Unfortunately, it is far too late for me.


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## Vesteralen (Jul 14, 2011)

Sorry for jumping to a bit of a wrong conclusion, violadude. I get what you're saying, but in a way, I envy you too for at least having had an experience I know I never will.


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## mmsbls (Mar 6, 2011)

violadude said:


> Well no, I wasn't trying to say you or Weston was ignorant. I was actually going to say that I am very envious of people who don't play instruments in some ways. I can't tell you how many pieces that have lost their thrill to me because I had to play them way too many times (Brandenberg 3 being one of them). So I actually think it's cool that you guys love #3 so much.
> 
> Unfortunately, it is far too late for me.


I always thought that playing a work often allowed one to enjoy and appreciate it even more. I don't really play piano, but I try. Trying to play the few pieces I do has made me like them more. I don't know how often is "way too many times", but do you think your experience is common among musicians?


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## violadude (May 2, 2011)

mmsbls said:


> I always thought that playing a work often allowed one to enjoy and appreciate it even more. I don't really play piano, but I try. Trying to play the few pieces I do has made me like them more. I don't know how often is "way too many times", but do you think your experience is common among musicians?


I'm not sure how common it is. Certainly playing a piece helps gain understanding of it. But it starts to get old for me when I have to play a the same piece at least once a year or so.


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## hawk (Oct 1, 2007)

My favorite is #5~well it is my favorite this week anyway. Don't really enjoy any of them more than the other's. They are all Fantastic!!!


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## Couchie (Dec 9, 2010)

violadude said:


> I'm not sure how common it is. Certainly playing a piece helps gain understanding of it. But it starts to get old for me when I have to play a the same piece at least once a year or so.


Playing a piece definitely aids in understanding, but I find practicing a (piano) piece to perfection is the best way to kill my interest in it. Which is why I've never really polished any single piece to a level that would impress anybody if I were to play it for them after I quit formal lessons. However, my enjoyment of the instrument has increased dramatically.


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## Ravellian (Aug 17, 2009)

Couchie said:


> Playing a piece definitely aids in understanding, but I find practicing a (piano) piece to perfection is the best way to kill my interest in it. Which is why I've never really polished any single piece to a level that would impress anybody if I were to play it for them after I quit formal lessons. However, my enjoyment of the instrument has increased dramatically.


Practicing a piece for hours and hours may make you very sick of the piece, but the payoff at the end, when you get to show off your skills in a recital for you family, friends, and jealous onlookers, is well worth it. You will also come to a very intimate familiarity with the piece and its idiomatic relationship to the required instrument, a type of understanding only possible through extensive practice and physically getting the piece "under the fingers." That is partly why I feel I will never be able to understand pieces such as symphonies or chamber pieces as well as keyboard music, because I don't play a stringed instrument.

Of course there are times when a bad recital or competition experience can result in intense dislike of a piece. For example, thanks to an incident at a competition I participated in a couple years ago, I never want to hear Schubert's D960 sonata again..


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## Nix (Feb 20, 2010)

violadude said:


> Well no, I wasn't trying to say you or Weston was ignorant. I was actually going to say that I am very envious of people who don't play instruments in some ways. I can't tell you how many pieces that have lost their thrill to me because I had to play them way too many times (Brandenberg 3 being one of them). So I actually think it's cool that you guys love #3 so much.
> 
> Unfortunately, it is far too late for me.


That's to bad. I've played Brandenburg 3 many times, but I still love it. 3, 5, 6 are all on equal footing. 1,2,4 are wonderful, but not on the same level. I've never gotten the hubub over #2. It's nice, but not really any nicer then your typical Bach.


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## Weston (Jul 11, 2008)

violadude said:


> Weston, you don't play and instrument do you?


Well, ignorance is bliss they say. I know what you mean. A similar thing happened to me in my (so called) illustration/art career. I was inspired by illustrators whom I now consider rather pedestrian and even a bit cheesy. I look back on their works and the magic is gone. Not saying I am any better than those illustrators, only that I know the gimmicks. Of course none of the Brandenburgs are pedestrian.



Nix said:


> That's to bad. I've played Brandenburg 3 many times, but I still love it. 3, 5, 6 are all on equal footing. 1,2,4 are wonderful, but not on the same level. I've never gotten the hubub over #2. It's nice, but not really any nicer then your typical Bach.


As for #2, I thought that was for oboe. Or is it for either oboe or trumpet? I think they were renumbered on one of my older albums, more in the order of composition so that 1 became 6, etc. So I get confused about the numbers. If it's the one for oboe, I think the bouncy oboe melody is what gets people going. It was also used as the theme for some well known public tv or public radio program (but maybe not that well known since I've forgotten the program now). It has had a lot of exposure compared to the others.


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## tdc (Jan 17, 2011)

Nix said:


> That's to bad. I've played Brandenburg 3 many times, but I still love it. 3, 5, 6 are all on equal footing. 1,2,4 are wonderful, but not on the same level. * I've never gotten the hubub over #2. It's nice, but not really any nicer then your typical Bach*.


Except the 2nd movement of it imo, which is one of the best movements of all the Brandenburgs. Aside from that 3 is my favorite, the rest are all nearly equal for me at this time.


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## HarpsichordConcerto (Jan 1, 2010)

tdc said:


> Except the 2nd movement of it imo, which is one of the best movements of all the Brandenburgs. Aside from that 3 is my favorite, the rest are all nearly equal for me at this time.


There is a personal story from me about _Brandenburg 3_. It was the first classical instrumental music of any period/genre that I listened to the most number of times during my early exploration of classical music, around when I was 14/15 years old, and really got seriously hooked by it, in that I simply listened to the first movement over and over and over. It was some modern instrument version of the work that I no longer have (lost/thrown away), and have since moved on to discovering period instrument versions of it that heightened my enjoyment of it. From this one concerto, I expanded into _Bradenburg 1, 2_ on a different recording and thought they were just about as astounding. So the _Brandenburgs_ have a special place in my listening history.

I enjoy them all, but #3 is a bit special from that perspective. Last count, I have 12 versions on CD (all on period instruments).


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## clavichorder (May 2, 2011)

I enjoy the melody to the fourth the most.


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## Sid James (Feb 7, 2009)

I'm not a huge fan of them, but I remember my parents had a recording of the first and fifth. I think the first was the most memorable, isn't that the one with a recurring slow/graceful theme, which is repeated throughout the work? Anyway, bits of the second & third are also quite memorable to me now. That leaves the fourth, which I've heard, but can't remember anything about at all. The fifth is also only vaguely in my mind, or not at all. I don't know why the _Brandenburgs_ haven't been that attractive to me like other chamber works of the period, eg. Corelli's _12 Concerti Grossi_, maybe because I really like string music more than mixed chamber orch. music for that period?...


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## HarpsichordConcerto (Jan 1, 2010)

Sid James said:


> I'm not a huge fan of them, but I remember my parents had a recording of the first and fifth. I think the first was the most memorable, isn't that the one with a recurring slow/graceful theme, which is repeated throughout the work? Anyway, bits of the second & third are also quite memorable to me now. That leaves the fourth, which I've heard, but can't remember anything about at all. The fifth is also only vaguely in my mind, or not at all. I don't know why the _Brandenburgs_ haven't been that attractive to me like other chamber works of the period, eg. Corelli's _12 Concerti Grossi_, maybe because I really like string music more than mixed chamber orch. music for that period?...


You mentioned you don't like Bach's music much anyway, "strait-jacket stuff" you said about Bach's music recently?


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## Sid James (Feb 7, 2009)

^^ I think that's what I said some time ago, maybe a year ago or more. In recent months I've come to enjoy his instrumental music more, esp. the solo instrumental things. But I don't like his vocal/choral things that much, which I said just today, it's kind of like preaching to me, too churchy, but I don't want to derail this thread (I'm still interested in hearing the _Mass in B minor _in full once I get the headspace to do that, I've been okay with the parts of it that I've heard, but right now I'm mainly listening to other less weighty things, or romantic/modern/contemporary things, etc.). I tend to like the Italians' more melodic style/approach, or those that married them with Germanic counterpoint in more obvious ways, eg. Handel...


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## hawk (Oct 1, 2007)

HarpsichordConcerto said:


> There is a personal story from me about _Brandenburg 3_. It was the first classical instrumental music of any period/genre that I listened to the most number of times during my early exploration of classical music, around when I was 14/15 years old, and really got seriously hooked by it, in that I simply listened to the first movement over and over and over. It was some modern instrument version of the work that I no longer have (lost/thrown away), and have since moved on to discovering period instrument versions of it that heightened my enjoyment of it. From this one concerto, I expanded into _Bradenburg 1, 2_ on a different recording and thought they were just about as astounding. So the _Brandenburgs_ have a special place in my listening history.
> 
> I enjoy them all, but #3 is a bit special from that perspective. *Last count, I have 12 versions on CD (all on period instruments*).


HC is it just #3 you have 12 versions of or all the Brandenburgs? Would you recommend a few recordings? I would like to hear them played on period instruments...thanks.


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## Webernite (Sep 4, 2010)

My favorites are 4 and 5, but there are a lot of mediocre performances of 4.


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## HarpsichordConcerto (Jan 1, 2010)

hawk said:


> HC is it just #3 you have 12 versions of or all the Brandenburgs? Would you recommend a few recordings? I would like to hear them played on period instruments...thanks.


I meant 12 versions of all six. Sure, I can recommend. Overall, I find the period instrument versions consistently satisfying so it's like picking a few best of the best.

(1) I like spirited performances of these works, tempi on the "fast side". In no particular order, and some of these might have different covers (the record companies might have now re-released them in a collection/budget price etc.)

*Boston Baroque/Martin Pearlman*









*Musica Antiqua Köln/Reinhard Goebel* (This was my first CD that I ever bought! This version was the reference version for many years, it also includes the _Triple Concerto_. It also has different album covers on budget price).









(2) Stylish versions that occasionally highlight some "nuances" of the score not often heard in other versions. These are warmly recommended in addition to other versions you might already have.

*The English Baroque Soloists/John Eliot Gardiner*









*The Academy of Ancient Music/Christopher Hogwood*. This version played, as far as they could have researched, the original pre-Margrave versions that might have been played at Köthen, including the shorter version of #5 without the expanded harpsichord cadenza.









(3) Solid versions if you prefer just being a little on the "safe" side, especially if you are already used to listening to modern instrument versions of these pieces.

*Bach Collegium Japan/Suzuki*









*The English Concert/Trevor Pinnock* (*Note*: Trevor Pinnock has also recorded another version with the European Brandenburg Ensemble in 2007, which I do not have. I am referring to the version with his band *The English Concert* done in the 1980s). Many budget re-releases of this version.


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## hawk (Oct 1, 2007)

HC~Thanks for these suggestions. After reading your post I was inspired to look through the albums I have. I only recently aquired a turntable so as yet have not listened to the albums I found in my collection. The collection is new to me though some old (relatively speaking) pressings;













Mainz Chamber Orchestra, Gunter Kehr conducting
Brandenburg concerti no2, no5 and no6
On Vox records~1964 (can't find a picture or video)






The Six Brandenburg Concerti.

Musicians of Aston Magna, directed by Albert Fuller. Recorded 1977. First recording on period instruments done in America.










ARS Musica~Lyndon lawless musical director
Fourth and Fifth Brandenburgs
A Timegate Recording (DCM) ~recorded 1981










These are just a few of the albums I've found at estate sales, yard sales etc. Some of the covers aren't in pristine condition (though not bad) but the albums are all in great condition!
Since my first serious encounter with "classical" music in 2007 I am always on the hunt for recordings. I have amassed a collection of about 175 albums (some box/complete sets ie JS Bachs complete set of Concerti excluding the Brandenburgs) for little cost if any. Often folks are happy that someone is interested in their important music collection and they happily give them away!!!


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## Webernite (Sep 4, 2010)

I always like this guy's videos.


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## HarpsichordConcerto (Jan 1, 2010)

hawk said:


> HC~Thanks for these suggestions. After reading your post I was inspired to look through the albums I have. I only recently aquired a turntable so as yet have not listened to the albums I found in my collection. The collection is new to me though some old (relatively speaking) pressings; ...


Yes, it's quite interesting to compare the versions especially between HIP and relatively older modern instrument versions. I listened to your first clip above (first movement of concerto #1), which sounded a world of a difference with say, Musica Antiqua Köln/Reinhard Goebel's version. This one should get you moving to the edge of your seat!


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## StlukesguildOhio (Dec 25, 2006)

Hmmm...? I might just go with no. 1 for the simple reason that the minuet must be my single favorite movement in the whole cycle:


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## StlukesguildOhio (Dec 25, 2006)

I think that's what I said some time ago, maybe a year ago or more. In recent months I've come to enjoy his instrumental music more, esp. the solo instrumental things. But I don't like his vocal/choral things that much, which I said just today, it's kind of like preaching to me, too churchy, but I don't want to derail this thread (I'm still interested in hearing the Mass in B minor in full once I get the headspace to do that, I've been okay with the parts of it that I've heard, but right now I'm mainly listening to other less weighty things, or romantic/modern/contemporary things, etc.). I tend to like the Italians' more melodic style/approach, or those that married them with Germanic counterpoint in more obvious ways, eg. Handel...

As I've suggested before, I suspect that a good deal of your aversion to Bach is unrelated to the actual music considering that his work ranges from the most "heavy" and "tragic" to sheer light and joy. Personally, I understand your like of the Italianate style. I somewhat prefer Handel's earlier Italian works to some of the "heavier" more "English" compositions. Yet in many ways the performance can change everything. Jordi Savall's recording of the Water Music and the Royal Fireworks music... overplayed and laden with English bombast by any standard... absolutely enthralled me... and sold me again on the brilliance of these works. You might find a more Italianate performance of the Brandenburgs by Concerto Italiano and Rinaldo Alessandrini or the crisp clarity of Suzuki far more to your liking... and quite eye-opening.

As for Bach's choral works. I think certain older recordings with huge massed forces of instruments and singers can deaden these. A great many of these are truly chamber works... written for small ensembles and a few vocalists. Some, such as "Ich habe genug..." are certainly "heavy"... but there are many filled with light and joy as well. Among my favorites I love the love duet between the bride and the bride groom from the cantata 140






This is perhaps the best version I've been able to find on the internet. I've heard others that absolutely kill it with reverence and "seriousness" when it should be sung as an almost erotic duet between lovers regardless of the symbolism of the lovers as the church and Christ.

The alto cantatas are also among the most beautiful...


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## Charon (Sep 8, 2008)

I think my list of favourite to least favourite would be:

5, 3, 6, 4, 2, 1

I think. This probably changes month to month.


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## science (Oct 14, 2010)

My new favorite is 5 because of the keyboard part. 

Pause a moment or two to let this sink in, and then return, changed, to your life.


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## KenOC (Mar 7, 2011)

I'd have a hard time choosing between #2 and #5. And maybe some of the others too.


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## Schubussy (Nov 2, 2012)

Another vote for 5 here.


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## Feathers (Feb 18, 2013)

It's 4 and 5 for me.


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## Novelette (Dec 12, 2012)

KenOC said:


> I'd have a hard time choosing between #2 and #5.


I second that!


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## TheVioletKing (Jan 9, 2013)

2 and 4 all the way!

This my favorite recording of them.


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## Skilmarilion (Apr 6, 2013)

My favourite would have to be 4. The andante 2nd movement is really wonderful.


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## aleazk (Sep 30, 2011)

4 and 5.


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## Vaneyes (May 11, 2010)

As with so many concerti, suites, variations, etc. from various composers, no preferences. :tiphat:


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## quack (Oct 13, 2011)

^ I'd agree with that, they seem like such a cohesive set that picking out one does them a disservice.

Fun fact No. 54: I picked my username while listening to the brandeburgs as the horns on some recording seem to quack.


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## violadude (May 2, 2011)

I changed my mind. I can't decide which one is my favorite now. They are all so great. I'm going to be doing reviews of them soon on my review channel.


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## chrisco97 (May 22, 2013)

One night, a friend and I had to go out and run an errand. On the way there, the third Brandenburg came on and I recognized what a great piece it was. I had no distractions, just a friend and I in a car. I loved it so much. I was analyzing every bit of it and many different parts of it made me smile. I just had to wait in the car to be absolutely sure it was the 3rd Brandenburg so I could listen to it again (I had heard the opening of it before).

Once we had returned home, I got on the computer and did some research on these concertos and was so happy with what I was hearing, and ended up buying a set of them. It kinda re-sparked my love for classical music (for a few months or so I drifted away from it).

I love the harpsichord solo in the 5th one though. I would say it is a tie between 3 and 5 for me.


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## brianvds (May 1, 2013)

For me, definitely number 5, with number 4 perhaps second, at least when they use recorders for the solos.


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## violadude (May 2, 2011)

chrisco97 said:


> One night, a friend and I had to go out and run an errand. On the way there, the third Brandenburg came on and I recognized what a great piece it was. I had no distractions, just a friend and I in a car. I loved it so much. I was analyzing every bit of it and many different parts of it made me smile. I just had to wait in the car to be absolutely sure it was the 3rd Brandenburg so I could listen to it again (I had heard the opening of it before).
> 
> Once we had returned home, I got on the computer and did some research on these concertos and was so happy with what I was hearing, and ended up buying a set of them. It kinda re-sparked my love for classical music (for a few months or so I drifted away from it).
> 
> I love the harpsichord solo in the 5th one though. I would say it is a tie between 3 and 5 for me.


Great story!.........................


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## KRoad (Jun 1, 2012)

No. 3 - without a doubt my favourite.


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## Dustin (Mar 30, 2012)

I'd say my top 3 are 5, 3, 6. In that order. The opening of #5 is just amazing. The final movement of the 3rd seals the deal for that one. And I love the opening and closing movements of 6 equally. I have still yet to become a fan of many of the slow movements. The melodies don't grab me like the faster ones do.


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## Huilunsoittaja (Apr 6, 2010)

I do like 5th, after all, it's the only one that I might ever possibly perform in, since it's the only Brandenburg Concerto with flute. But somehow I do like the 3rd a lot. That warm tone quality of the strings from the get-go attracts me right away, no waiting around to be impressed.


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## DavidA (Dec 14, 2012)

Number two is tremendous. But I enjoy number five as well. I have a recording of Gould playing it on the piano as well as hif performances by Gardiner and Harnoncourt, not to mention the outrageous ones by Goebel - all played at top speed!


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## Schumann (Aug 12, 2013)

Brandenburg Concerto #1 In F, BWV 1046 - 2. Adagio
Brandenburg Concerto #3 In G, BWV 1048 - 1. Allegro
Brandenburg Concerto #3 In G, BWV 1048 - 3. Allegro
Brandenburg Concerto #4 In G, BWV 1049 - 2. Andante


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## spradlig (Jul 25, 2012)

Ditto a previous response - the one with the long harpsichord cadenza! That response said it was #5 and I have no reason to doubt it.


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