# Dies Irae, Mozart



## Actor

I really love this piece by Mozart, but I was just wondering, was Dies Irae created prior to Mozart's Requiem?






Thank you, Actor


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## KenOC

The Dies Irae is part of the mass used in the Roman Catholic church. Musical settings exist from several hundred years prior to Mozart. They are still being composed today.


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## Actor

Thank you KenOC 

-Ator


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## KenOC

Ator, here's a more recent Dies Irae, not quite like Mozart's...


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## Actor

O wow thats neat. Thank you very much!


KenOC said:


> Ator, here's a more recent Dies Irae, not quite like Mozart's...


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## Alfacharger

A couple of other famous "Dies Irae" moments.


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## TomDickson

One of my favourites.


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## millionrainbows

KenOC said:


> The Dies Irae is part of the mass used in the Roman Catholic church. Musical settings exist from several hundred years prior to Mozart. They are still being composed today.


The Consilium felt that the funeral rite was in need of reform and eliminated the sequence as such from the Masses for the Dead. They got rid of texts that smacked of a *negative spirituality inherited from the Middle Ages. *Thus they removed the "Dies Irae", and others that overemphasized *judgment, fear, and despair.* These they replaced with texts urging Christian hope and arguably giving more effective expression to faith in the resurrection.

But now, with his "tough love" philosophy, Dr. Phil is bringing it back. We apparently need judgement and fear in order to produce more efficient members of society.


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## DiesIraeCX

Since KenOC already answered, I'll chime in and say I love both Mozart and Verdi's _Dies Irae_.

I chose my username specifically because of Mozart's. His requiem still floors me every time I hear it.


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## hpowders

Imagine how good it would have been if he wrote the whole thing.


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## Guest

hpowders said:


> Imagine how good it would have been if he wrote the whole thing.


Was the Dies irae his, or is that Sussmayr?


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## Mahlerian

DrMike said:


> Was the Dies irae his, or is that Sussmayr?


The Dies Irae is Mozart's. Sussmayr's contributions come later.


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## hpowders

DrMike said:


> Was the Dies irae his, or is that Sussmayr?


If you read the man's comment he stated "his requiem still floors me every time I hear it."

It was THAT comment I was responding to:

"Imagine if Mozart wrote the whole thing."


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## hpowders

Mahlerian said:


> The Dies Irae is Mozart's. Sussmayr's contributions come later.


Of course!!


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## Guest

hpowders said:


> If you read the man's comment he stated "his requiem still floors me every time I hear it."
> 
> It was THAT comment I was responding to:
> 
> "Imagine if Mozart wrote the whole thing."


Yeah, I know. But I didn't know what parts were actually Mozart, and what parts were Sussmayr. Just wondering whether the Dies irae was actually his, as it is one of my favorite parts of the Requiem. Good to know that is still pure Mozart.


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## Manxfeeder

DrMike said:


> Yeah, I know. But I didn't know what parts were actually Mozart, and what parts were Sussmayr.


If you want to pin those parts down, Christoph Wolff's book  Mozart's Requiem will guide you through what is pure and what is not. Then, if you're so inclined, you can be confident that you're holding your nose at the proper non-Mozart sections.


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## hpowders

Manxfeeder said:


> If you want to pin those parts down, Christoph Wolff's book  Mozart's Requiem will guide you through what is pure and what is not. Then, if you're so inclined, you can be confident that you're holding your nose at the proper non-Mozart sections.


It's pretty easy to hear where the quality drops off. It's like the guys who try and reconstruct a Mozart Horn Concerto left uncompleted. A lack of genius is all too easy to spot.


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## hpowders

DrMike said:


> Yeah, I know. But I didn't know what parts were actually Mozart, and what parts were Sussmayr. Just wondering whether the Dies irae was actually his, as it is one of my favorite parts of the Requiem. Good to know that is still pure Mozart.


Okay. No problem.


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## drpraetorus

I'm going to have fefdecdd on my vanity license plate.


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## Wicked_one

My favorite of them all!


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## millionrainbows

This thread is dark and scary.


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## hpowders

For me the Mozart Requiem becomes dark and scary when the hacks take over.


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