# Symphony Composing Help



## GrandMasterK

I can write strings with percussion, strings with winds and brass with percussion. I haven't been able to arrange 3 or more yet, I always get frustrated and quit after nothing but failed attempts to get it to sound how it is in my head. Some of it goes to my poor production mixing that despite my best efforts I can't get any useful assistance on, and instrument sample limitations, like not being able to fade a notes in and out when I want to. Still, the biggest problem is I can't arrange brass in with strings and percussion for the life of me, it always sounds bad. I always fail to get the orchestra hits to sound like they do in my head, clean and powerful and I haven't been able to get my thumb on why.

I need to learn more about large orchestra arrangements, I just don't know any sources. I'd like to get a hold of orchestra music sheets so I can compose them on the computer and see how the composers has them work together and see if that helps.


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## Krummhorn

Hi GrandMasterK ...

I share your frustrations at times, too, and I'm only dealing with 5 part organ scores!!

If you want to see existing orchestral scores, you might check out this site: http://imslp.org/wiki/Main_Page.

For a general orchestral user manual, there's this one: http://www.mti.dmu.ac.uk/~ahugill/manual/intro.html.

I've used both extensively, especially the latter when arranging existing scores for organ and brass.

Don't ever get discouraged - becoming proficient at writing music takes time and practice. A good place to have your scores critiqued is right here on TC. Lots of members here have been scoring for many years and may be able to offer help and guidance in your composing endeavor.


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## david johnson

hmmm...i suggest arranging 'aura lee', 'amazing grace', 'my country, 'tis of thee', etc., for each instrument family. then work on your blending of all the families.

chord voicing is what really helps the tone color. good luck.

dj


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## GrandMasterK

Thanks for the links!

I want to start with aura lee but I can't find it in that sheet music site. Know of one David?

I'll post my attempt here when I'm done.


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## david johnson

i see several for sale on line, but none free as of yet. 'love me tender' by elvis is the same music but different lyrics.

dj


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## MeLikeTchaik

GrandMasterK said:


> I haven't been able to arrange 3 or more yet, I always get frustrated and quit after nothing but failed attempts to get it to sound how it is in my head.


This will happen a lot in your composing career! Guaranteed! But don't sweat it, it happened to everyone. Why do you think so many composer hid so much of their work from the public? *cough*Dvoark*cough*. Anyway, I would start out simple. Try writing a string quartet, or on a piano grand staff, and just fool around with notes. Don't start with a melody, let the melody come to you as you write. I've been composing for about 6ish years, and my first orchestra compositions sounded like poo-poo. But now, I'm nearly finished with my second symphony. You'll get the hang of it. As long as you have the passion and the drive it'll come to you.


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## GrandMasterK

Well I'm working on the passion part, I think it'll come with better results cause it's kinda getting flushed out with frustration. However I seem to have the drive cause I find myself always comming back to write more habitually without having to force myself. I see myself getting a little better with every session. Thanks for the encouraging words.


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## Oneiros

Have you got any orchestration/instrumentation books? These are really useful, and some have detailed suggestions on scoring for orchestra.

If its getting really frustrating, maybe its best to write for fewer instruments for a while? I think that a symphony is something that you need a fair bit of composing experience before writing one. But that's just me.

Just remember Brahms, and how long it took him before he wrote his first symphony. And the terrible mess he got into writing the D minor piano concerto, which was going to be his first symphony, but didn't quite work out that way. How maddening!


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