# Exploring Tchaikovsky



## John Galt (Feb 3, 2015)

Mozart was boring. Chopin was amazing. Bach was somewhere in between. Now I want to explore Tchaikovsky, and I'm asking for suggestions where to start 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_compositions_by_Pyotr_Ilyich_Tchaikovsky#Works_by_genre


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## musicrom (Dec 29, 2013)

His symphonic works are some of my favorites. I especially like Symphonies #4 and #5. 
His ballets (Nutcracker, Swan Lake, The Sleeping Beauty) are obvious places to start, as well as his first Piano Concerto.


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## Guest (Feb 8, 2015)

Just don't. If you found Beethoven dark and malevolent, then there is no hope for Tchaikovsky.


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## John Galt (Feb 3, 2015)

musicrom said:


> His symphonic works are some of my favorites. I especially like Symphonies #4 and #5.
> His ballets (Nutcracker, Swan Lake, The Sleeping Beauty) are obvious places to start, as well as his first Piano Concerto.


Thanks! Then I'm starting with the ballets


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## Guest (Feb 8, 2015)

Serenade for Strings, Romeo & Juliet Overture, Swan Lake, Symphony No. 6.


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## John Galt (Feb 3, 2015)

Halfway through Swan Lake. Great music, but too dark and malevolent for me, as DrMike might have expected.

*Swan Lake, Act II, No. 13 Dances of the Swans, VI Tempo di valse*

This is the only piece that I liked.


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## starthrower (Dec 11, 2010)

John Galt said:


> Halfway through Swan Lake. Great music, but too dark and malevolent for me, as DrMike might have expected.
> 
> *Swan Lake, Act II, No. 13 Dances of the Swans, VI Tempo di valse*
> 
> This is the only piece that I liked.


Do you think anyone here cares anymore? You're a bit of a provocateur, aren't you? You summed up Bach in an hour or two, and now onto Tchaikovsky?


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## GreenMamba (Oct 14, 2012)

John Galt said:


> Halfway through Swan Lake. Great music, but too dark and malevolent for me, as DrMike might have expected.


You're losing your poker face.


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## John Galt (Feb 3, 2015)

starthrower said:


> Do you think anyone here cares anymore? You're a bit of a provocateur, aren't you? You summed up Bach in an hour or two, and now onto Tchaikovsky?


Actually, I spent 7 hours on Bach.

Just ignore the thread if you don't care.


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## Dim7 (Apr 24, 2009)

I wonder if the first movement of Mendelssohn's 4th symphony 'Italian' is too dark and malevolent for you or just boring. Not Tchaikovsky, but what DrMike said is probably true.


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## SONNET CLV (May 31, 2014)

John Galt said:


> *Mozart was boring.* Chopin was amazing. Bach was somewhere in between. *Now I want to explore Tchaikovsky, and I'm asking for suggestions where to start*


Yeah. Try Tchaikovsky's Orchestral Suite No. 4, Op. 61.


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## Guest (Feb 9, 2015)

John Galt said:


> Actually, I spent 7 hours on Bach.


That's all you'd really need to write a dissertation on the man's life work. Hell, I'd try 5 hours next time. You're a busy man, I assume. 4 hours if you'd rather offset the horribly boring classical music with a Kanye West album.


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## bigshot (Nov 22, 2011)

I bet I can dismiss Bach faster than you! I think I can do it in thirty minutes or less!


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## OldFashionedGirl (Jul 21, 2013)

Here's pro-life music:


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## violadude (May 2, 2011)

OldFashionedGirl said:


> Here's pro-life music:


I see your Barney theme song and raise you a Care Bear theme song


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## Avey (Mar 5, 2013)

I may not agree with your sentiments -- referring to the OP -- but if you are delving into *Tchaikovsky*, the _Serenade for Strings_ and _Symphony No. 6_ are (my) obvious recommendations.


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## Marschallin Blair (Jan 23, 2014)

violadude said:


> I see your Barney theme song and raise you a Care Bear theme song


I'll up the ante with your _Care Bear_ theme song with a _Josie and the Pussycats_ main title:






Melodie (the blonde) is my girl.


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## neoshredder (Nov 7, 2011)

Try Grieg next.


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## MoonlightSonata (Mar 29, 2014)

neoshredder said:


> Try Grieg next.


He'll be too simple.


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## GreenMamba (Oct 14, 2012)

MoonlightSonata said:


> He'll be too simple.


Grieg or the OP?


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## Dave Whitmore (Oct 3, 2014)

Try his violin concerto. I love it!


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## John Galt (Feb 3, 2015)

nathanb said:


> *That's all you'd really need to write a dissertation on the man's life work. *Hell, I'd try 5 hours next time. You're a busy man, I assume. 4 hours if you'd rather offset the horribly boring classical music with a Kanye West album.


That never was my goal. 7 hours is more than most people will give him.


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## John Galt (Feb 3, 2015)

bigshot said:


> I bet I can dismiss Bach faster than you! I think I can do it in thirty minutes or less!


I didn't dismiss him. I found several excellent pieces:

Tiro Sonata BWV 525, first movement
BWV 832, Suite in A major, 1st and 2nd movement
BWV 846, Prelude and Fugue in C
Violin Concerto in A minor, BWV 1041, 1st movement
Violin Concerto in E major, BWV 1042, 3rd movement
Brandenburg Concerto no. 1, 1st and 3rd movement
Brandenburg Concerto no. 3, 1st movement
Brandenburg Concerto no. 4, 1st movement
Brandenburg Concerto no. 5, 1st movement


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## Piwikiwi (Apr 1, 2011)

John Galt said:


> I didn't dismiss him. I found several excellent pieces:
> 
> Tiro Sonata BWV 525, first movement
> BWV 832, Suite in A major, 1st and 2nd movement
> ...


I highly recommend this concerto


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## Nereffid (Feb 6, 2013)

Tchaikovsky suggestions:
Romeo and Juliet,
Overture in F,
Legend, op.54 no.5, and
Legend, op.54 no.5 again.


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## Skilmarilion (Apr 6, 2013)




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## Celloman (Sep 30, 2006)

Don't forget the _Manfred_ Symphony. The composer wrote it between his 4th and 5th symphonies and it's cyclical (meaning that you will hear the same theme in each movement). Very dramatic and plenty of "tunes", if that's your cup of tea.


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## Orfeo (Nov 14, 2013)

Try his songs (overlook often yet important in Russia), esp. his Romances. His operas are very much worth looking into also. (the fun one is "The Little Slippers, the morbid ones are "Mazeppa" & "The Queen of Spades."). Souvenir de Florence is brilliant, and his Third Suite is quite wonderful (his under-valued Second Piano Concerto ranks up there as well).

Happy Listening.
:tiphat:


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## Cosmos (Jun 28, 2013)

Adding to the other great Tchaikovsky pieces mentioned, I'd check out his four orchestral suites


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## Guest (Feb 12, 2015)

If you gave Bach 7 hours, it would really be an injustice to give Tchaikovsky more than 2. So ignore most of these posts.


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## bharbeke (Mar 4, 2013)

Besides the symphonies and ballets, I heard a great piece on the radio from Tchaikovsky that was identified only as Slavonic Dance. If anyone knows what they are referring to, please let me know, as I could not find an obvious match on his wikipedia list of compositions.


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## Chronochromie (May 17, 2014)

bharbeke said:


> Besides the symphonies and ballets, I heard a great piece on the radio from Tchaikovsky that was identified only as Slavonic Dance. If anyone knows what they are referring to, please let me know, as I could not find an obvious match on his wikipedia list of compositions.


Maybe it was Marche Slave? Or one of Dvorak's Slavonic Dances?


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## OldFashionedGirl (Jul 21, 2013)

Der Leiermann said:


> Maybe it was Marche Slave? Or one of Dvorak's Slavonic Dances?


I don't think he will like Marche Slave. Too malevolent.


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## Becca (Feb 5, 2015)

As I read this thread I have been reminded of the old line about the Tchaikovsky symphonies, i.e. he wrote 3 and perversely numbered them 4, 5 & 6.


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## bharbeke (Mar 4, 2013)

Der Leiermann: It is Marche Slave, Op. 31. Thanks for the help.

That music may be too "malevolent" for one listener, but it is absolutely one of my Tchaikovsky recommendations for general listeners.


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## Bevo (Feb 22, 2015)

Tchaikovky's my personal favorite composer, but even though he has a very distinct style he is very romantic in flavor. You might try his Piano Concertos. The first one gets all the love, but the second is my personal favorite. The second and third are both in major keys, but I find then ultimately darker than the first. If you like Chopin's concertos you might give those a try. Just a heads up on the Fourth Symphony, the opening movement is both in 9/8 time, and EXTREMELY chromatic. I love the piece now (one of my favorites), but it took quite a few hearings to grasp what was going on throughout that movement. You might enjoy though if you like Bach, because, unlike most of Mozart's work, Bach gets very chromatic at times. But yeah I would start with the ballets. Tchaikovsky is both melodic and depressively expressive!


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## trazom (Apr 13, 2009)

Bevo said:


> Tchaikovky's my personal favorite composer, but even though he has a very distinct style he is very romantic in flavor. You might try his Piano Concertos. The first one gets all the love, but the second is my personal favorite. The second and third are both in major keys, but I find then ultimately darker than the first. If you like Chopin's concertos you might give those a try. Just a heads up on the Fourth Symphony, the opening movement is both in 9/8 time, and EXTREMELY chromatic. I love the piece now (one of my favorites), but it took quite a few hearings to grasp what was going on throughout that movement. You might enjoy though if you like Bach, because, *unlike most of Mozart's work, Bach gets very chromatic at times.* But yeah I would start with the ballets. Tchaikovsky is both melodic and depressively expressive!


I'm not sure how you got that impression/which pieces you've heard so far, but you're wrong. The chromaticism that pervades much of Mozart's music is what set him apart from his contemporaries, including Haydn and Beethoven.






























Just for starters...


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## Bevo (Feb 22, 2015)

trazom said:


> I'm not sure how you got that impression/which pieces you've heard so far, but you're wrong. The chromaticism that pervades much of Mozart's music is what set him apart from his contemporaries, including Haydn and Beethoven.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I mean this in no way disrespectful, but I would still stick with what I said, and I've heard a good percentage of Mozart's output. There's no doubt that Mozart made use of chromaticism, especially in works like his 24th piano concerto, but I'm referring to overall output. Mozart began really exploring chromatic works towards the end of his tenure, but as a whole Mozart was rather diatonic, and I'd say that both Bach and Beethoven were more chromatic anyday. I agree he was more so than Haydn though.


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## trazom (Apr 13, 2009)

Bevo said:


> but I'm referring to overall output. Mozart began really exploring chromatic works towards the end of his tenure, but as a whole Mozart was rather diatonic, and I'd say that both Bach and Beethoven were more chromatic anyday. I agree he was more so than Haydn though.


I am referring to overall output, too, and you're free to stick with your opinion, but it's still incorrect and goes against pretty everything written on Mozart's style and use of chromaticism compared with his peers. Just looking at Idomeneo, a work he wrote still in his middle period has examples of chromaticism and dissonance that Beethoven didn't even approach until well into his late period.


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