# To Squillo or not to Squillo!!!



## ScottK (Dec 23, 2021)

*Talking about baritones, WKasimer put up Richard Bonelli singing a song gorgeously with a beautiful balance of color and ping in the voice. I looked for an aria and found a live from the Met Pagliacci Prologue. Still wonderful, I couldn't help but notice - TO ME - a swing in the direction of ping. Not picking on Bonelli because that was a fortunate discovery, Thank you WK!. But my observation brought up an age old question..."does the voice have enough sqillo?"....and added one I don't hear as much...."does the voice have too much squillo?"

In dramatic material, my favorite Carlo Bergonzi often does not have enough ping for many listeners. 
I ask, does my close to favorite, Franco Corelli's ring serve him well all the time? Are there times he'd do better with less?

Stefan Zucker says that for him "Squillo gives a tone elemental excitement. Most singers merely have resonance, which in and of itself never is exciting ....The full-bodied tones of Carreras and Domingo may please, but they cannot thrill." Zucker does include the all-important "For me". But Carreras, in particular, provided some very exciting sounds "for me!"

How important is squillo?
Does it's importance change with the music?
Does it affect timbre?









*


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## Op.123 (Mar 25, 2013)

I agree very much with Zucker and I like a bit of excitement with Opera. Domingo, Carreras, Bergonzi have never been my favourite tenors and I've never been overly responsive to Vickers either, all tenors with a tone which lacks ping and doesn't lend itself naturally to "elemental excitement". I know these tenors and old tenors with squillo through recordings not live performance but I find squillo even more important in the theatre than in the recording studio.


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## ScottK (Dec 23, 2021)

Op.123 said:


> I agree very much with Zucker and I like a bit of excitement with Opera. Domingo, Carreras, Bergonzi have never been my favourite tenors and I've never been overly responsive to Vickers either, all tenors with a tone which lacks ping and doesn't lend itself naturally to "elemental excitement". I know these tenors and old tenors with squillo through recordings not live performance but I find squillo even more important in the theatre than in the recording studio.


You have been very consistent on here in mentioning "the right amount of squillo" (or something close to that) as being important to you. Do you think the question, "is it equally important in all material?" to be significant?


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## Op.123 (Mar 25, 2013)

ScottK said:


> You have been very consistent on here in mentioning "the right amount of squillo" (or something close to that) as being important to you. Do you think the question, "is it equally important in all material?" to be significant?


In opera I would say squillo is essential for me, especially in smaller voices where it adds an immediacy to the sound that you wouldn't get otherwise. I find the presence of squillo makes me feel closer to what's happening on stage, more involved with the drama rather than someone spectating from afar in a hall full of people. Sometimes a larger voice will carry on its own but squillo still adds to the excitement and immediacy of the sound.


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## Woodduck (Mar 17, 2014)

Probably the least important of the vocal virtues. A voice can be enchanting and moving with minimal squillo, and throroughly irritating with an abundance of it. Personally, I'm more impressed by music than by noise, and the presence or absence of the "thrill factor" is a question that rarely crosses my mind.

Now, for Turandot and Calaf, the more squillo the merrier. But those creatures aren't really human anyway.


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## ScottK (Dec 23, 2021)

Woodduck said:


> I'm more impressed by music than by noise.


I can't imagine a person on this forum would doubt the truth of that declaration.


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## Woodduck (Mar 17, 2014)

ScottK said:


> I can't imagine a person on this forum would doubt the truth of that declaration.


Reassuring. I'd hate to think that anyone on this forum was part of the clamorous mob I used to hear on Met broadcasts in the '70s, screaming its heads off whenever Franco Corelli would excoriate, dismember and pulverize some hapless number from _Faust_ or _Werther. _


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## BalalaikaBoy (Sep 25, 2014)

Squillo is primarily caused by three things 
1) natural vocal characteristics
2) technique, notably singing with an open throat (NOT with mask singing)
3) repertoire 

Most good lyric voices from the golden age like Beniamino Gigli or Giuseppe di Stefano had some respectable squillo during more dramatic moments, but it would be weird to have an abundance of squillo when singing, say, Oh Quante Volte, Che Gelida Menina, etc.


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## Tsaraslondon (Nov 7, 2013)

Woodduck said:


> Probably the least important of the vocal virtues. A voice can be enchanting and moving with minimal squillo, and throroughly irritating with an abundance of it. Personally, I'm more impressed by music than by noise, and the presence or absence of the "thrill factor" is a question that rarely crosses my mind.
> 
> Now, for Turandot and Calaf, the more squillo the merrier. But those creatures aren't really human anyway.


I'm with you all the way. Give me artistry over brawn any day.

Incidentally, am I misunderstanding the term _squillo_? I keep reading that Vickers didn't have ping factor, but I hear it. He may have been chary of top Cs, but the voice had power and intensity and his _Esultate!_ has no problem cutting through the orchestra. It always sounds thrilling to me.


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## Woodduck (Mar 17, 2014)

Tsaraslondon said:


> I'm with you all the way. Give me artistry over brawn any day.
> 
> Incidentally, am I misunderstanding the term _squillo_? I keep reading that Vickers didn't have ping factor, but I hear it. He may have been chary of top Cs, but the voice had power and intensity and his _Esultate!_ has no problem cutting through the orchestra. It always sounds thrilling to me.


I too think I hear some squillo in Vickers, if less than in some other tenors. I seem to recall some debate around here over the term. Maybe someone would like to attempt a definition?


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## Op.123 (Mar 25, 2013)

Woodduck said:


> I too think I hear some squillo in Vickers, if less than in some other tenors. I seem to recall some debate around here over the term. Maybe someone would like to attempt a definition?


Squillo refers to high overtones to which the human ear is particularly receptive. In a properly produced voice it should be part of vocal production at any pitch and volume, it gives vitality and as I have said, immediacy, to the sound. It will be most notable in dramatic moments but still lends colour and tone in quieter passages.






Even despite the poor sound 15:34 is a great example of the sort of colour proper squillo can given to softer passages and, as she crescendos into the A, an example of how its presence becomes more obvious in more dramatic moments.


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## ScottK (Dec 23, 2021)

Tsaraslondon said:


> I'm with you all the way. Give me artistry over brawn any day.
> 
> Incidentally, am I misunderstanding the term _squillo_? I keep reading that Vickers didn't have ping factor, but I hear it. He may have been chary of top Cs, but the voice had power and intensity and his _Esultate!_ has no problem cutting through the orchestra. It always sounds thrilling to me.


I'm with you in not being able always to say for certain. Someone on another thread pointed out his "Oh Gioia" at the end of Dio mi Potevi for not cutting through the way they hoped and I, at least in that instant, found it a valid point. But everything you say about Vickers and his voice is my take exactly!


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## ScottK (Dec 23, 2021)

BalalaikaBoy said:


> Squillo is primarily caused by three things
> 1) natural vocal characteristics
> 2) technique, notably singing with an open throat (NOT with mask singing)
> 3) repertoire
> ...


I'm remembering the Aida Tomb scene contest in which I thought Corelli was very much on the mark except for my being distracted by the quantity of ring whenever he ascended. On many of those passages it didn't fit word and music to my ear.


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## Op.123 (Mar 25, 2013)

ScottK said:


> I'm remembering the Aida Tomb scene contest in which I thought Corelli was very much on the mark except for my being distracted by the quantity of ring whenever he ascended. On many of those passages it didn't fit word and music to my ear.


This is something that would certainly have sounded better in theatre. Squillo is far more effective in live performance than on recording.


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## ScottK (Dec 23, 2021)

I like very much that you took Woodduck up on the definition. I'll confess to doing a little Wiki research and they bore you out! I also like your take on how you respond to squillo and I recognize similar sensations when I'm listening.

The idea that it is created by the presence of overtones would seem to support varying degrees of squillo in a singer's sound, sometimes when its not so apparent.


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## Op.123 (Mar 25, 2013)

ScottK said:


> I like very much that you took Woodduck up on the definition. I'll confess to doing a little Wiki research and they bore you out! I also like your take on how you respond to squillo and I recognize similar sensations when I'm listening.
> 
> The idea that it is created by the presence of overtones would seem to support varying degrees of squillo in a singer's sound, sometimes when its not so apparent.


Yes, the high overtones produced by a singer with good chiaroscuro technique are not always obvious to the ear at lower levels but will be felt. Interestingly, the high overtones are similar to those produced by the howls of wild animals and the cries of babies, so naturally the human ear is greatly attuned to the sound and it can create a very instinctive reaction in some people.


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## ScottK (Dec 23, 2021)

Op.123 said:


> *Yes, the high overtones produced by a singer with good chiaroscuro technique are not always obvious to the ear at lower levels but will be felt.* Interestingly, the high overtones are similar to those produced by the howls of wild animals and the cries of babies, so naturally the human ear is greatly attuned to the sound and it can create a very instinctive reaction in some people.


I'm thinking this account for the, lets say "satisfactory" effect that the" less-squillo" singers have on an audience from a purely vocal stand point. There is a presence of overtones there, just possibly not as large a presence as others.

Squillo, like chest voice, has not been something I paid alot of attention to before coming on this forum. But now when I listen to Bergonzi at various points in his recorded life (he's genuinely NOT the reason I posted this thread, he's just a major point of reference  ) I have very different responses. My family teasingly called out "Siri play Carlo Bergonzi" and out came the climactic phrases of his early Donna Non Vidi Mai....I'll admit I was very aware of how it was not cutting through. But he has a whole bunch of live Aida's online, mostly from the late 60's, and every one of them has more ping...MUCH....than his earlier studio recording. I am guessing for a type that endlessly worked on the voice, increased technique made more overtones available.


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## Op.123 (Mar 25, 2013)

ScottK said:


> I'm thinking this account for the, lets say "satisfactory" effect that the" less-squillo" singers have on an audience from a purely vocal stand point. There is a presence of overtones there, just possibly not as large a presence as others.
> 
> Squillo, like chest voice, has not been something I paid alot of attention to before coming on this forum. But now when I listen to Bergonzi at various points in his recorded life (he's genuinely NOT the reason I posted this thread, he's just a major point of reference  ) I have very different responses. My family teasingly called out "Siri play Carlo Bergonzi" and out came the climactic phrases of his early Donna Non Vidi Mai....I'll admit I was very aware of how it was not cutting through. But he has a whole bunch of live Aida's online, mostly from the late 60's, and every one of them has more ping...MUCH....than his earlier studio recording. I am guessing for a type that endlessly worked on the voice, increased technique made more overtones available.


If you have an acoustic piano and hold down tones present in the harmonic series of a fundamental but only play the fundamental those strings above will vibrate sympathetically. That is not to say the fundamental played without holding down those notes does not have overtones but they are far less prominent. When a singer with good squillo sings the resonance comes from a properly relaxed and open throat and the effect will always be a lot stronger than those singers who do not fully open and relax their throat and larynx whether they are singing loudly or softly. I am not familiar with Bergonzi's later Aida's but listened to a little of him singing live in Verona in 1966 and could not detect much, if any, squillo in what I heard.


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## ScottK (Dec 23, 2021)

Op.123 said:


> If you have an acoustic piano and hold down tones present in the harmonic series of a fundamental but only play the fundamental those strings above will vibrate sympathetically. That is not to say the fundamental played without holding down those notes does not have overtones but they are far less prominent. When a singer with good squillo sings the resonance comes from a properly relaxed and open throat and* the effect will always be a lot stronger* than those singers who do not fully open and relax their throat and larynx whether they are singing loudly or softly. I am not familiar with Bergonzi's later Aida's but listened to a little of him singing live in Verona in 1966 and could not detect much, if any, squillo in what I heard.


The effect of the SQUILLO will be a lot stronger. Too many examples of audience's going nuts over singers without a lot of squillo to put too much emphasis on it, regardless of individual responses.

TRULY wasn't intending this as some sort of defense of Carlo Bergonzi's squillo, but since its mostly just you and I, I am eager for your take on this. To me this is squillo! Not Corelli level but plenty of buzz on the sound.

Agree, Verona Aida no ping. Verona Manrico much more.

PS Don't listen to the end of this. I always wished he'd let the soft ending thing go....I don't think he ever nailed it. here it's beautiful with one rather small problem....about a quarter tone smal l:lol:


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## Op.123 (Mar 25, 2013)

ScottK said:


> The effect of the SQUILLO will be a lot stronger. Too many examples of audience's going nuts over singers without a lot of squillo to put too much emphasis on it, regardless of individual responses.
> 
> TRULY wasn't intending this as some sort of defense of Carlo Bergonzi's squillo, but since its mostly just you and I, I am eager for your take on this. To me this is squillo! Not Corelli level but plenty of buzz on the sound.
> 
> ...


There are audiences going nuts over Anna Netrebko so I'm not convinced by that statement. But although I agree, squillo is not essential, it is preferable and it does well to remember there was a time when practically all major operatic stars possesed a reasonable amount of squillo in their sound.

I hear more squillo in this rendition than I did with the Verona 'Celeste Aida', although it isn't much and it is variable, he doesn't seem to sing consistently with squillo in the sound.


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## ScottK (Dec 23, 2021)

His sound and singing aren’t for you and they are for me that one’s pretty clear! But I love hearing your observations about squillo. As for your Netrebko remark, I cant believe that you have trouble distinguishing between audience enthusiasm for major opera singers who happen to be short on a component that you value (nobody has everything) and another singer with a beautiful face a pretty voice and major marketing skills.


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## kappablanca (9 mo ago)

For me, whether or not the charm of squillo comes through depends greatly on the singer in question. Del Monaco especially is one example of someone who pretty much always sang with plenty of squillo—because the metallic ring suited his voice.


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