# Bossa nova



## Guest (Jan 10, 2016)

I love bossa nova.





Stan Getz, Tom Jobim and Joao Gilberto. What are you gonna do against that?





Joao and daughter Babel who is now a grown woman and one of the greatest singers in the history of Brazil but then she's descended from Brazilian musical royalty. The song was written by Jobim and utterly beautiful--as usual.

Oddly, though, neither Tom nor Joao ever made any money. Joao was a Bahian vagabond who didn't even have his own home and Tom was a Carioca beach bum who played piano in lounges and could barely afford his apartment. And neither man really liked the other but both recognized the other's sheer genius. And both were geniuses--make no mistake. Joao, however, was an extremely difficult man to work with in the studio. He fought and argued about everything nearly driving Tom crazy. Tom also had to keep contact between Stan and Joao to a minimum because Joao was so irascible and didn't really like Stan much. Stan probably didn't like Joao much either but he certainly liked Joao's wife, Astrud, and Joao, no doubt, sensed it. Strangely, Astrud never sang in public and yet Joao wanted her to sing "Girl From Ipanema" and thought the others would say no and was prepared to make a scene over it. The others, however, had no problem with it and so Astrud sang it and the song became a huge hit and an immortal classic and Astrud became a much sought after singer overnight and thereafter. Tom was prepared to record Joao just by himself if need be because the man was an orchestra in and of himself--just him and his guitar was you really needed. Tom also played guitar but moved to piano when backing Joao who didn't need a second guitarist.

Tom also wrote the music for the lovely Brazilian classic movie, "Black Orpheus" or "Orfeo Negro" as it's called. It was some of the first bossa nova ever written as was Joao's "Bim Bom" recorded at the same time (late 50s) even though neither man knew the other at the time.











In fact, when Tom first met Joao, he had no idea the man played guitar. Joao was known then as Joe Reefer because he grew his own dope and smoked a great deal of it. He never could stand tobacco but all Brazilian musicians smoked so Joao took up pot and was a real pothead for most of his adult life and was quite an expert on how to grow it.





But Tom didn't just write bossa nova. Here is a piece he wrote for Claus Ogerman's orchestra that is breath-taking lovely. What an incredible genius he was.


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## Guest (Jan 10, 2016)

Tom and Joao later in life. They had a testy friendship all those years but it was enduring. Each needed the other. A huge part of Joao's repertoire was Tom's songs and a great many of Tom's songs were first heard by the public through Joao. They had a tremendous respect for one another and it shows here. Joao is stlll alive, Tom died in '94, if I remember correctly. I'm sure when Tom went, Joao was utterly heartbroken.


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## Guest (Jan 10, 2016)

There has always been a large population of Japanese in Brazil. In fact the largest population of Japanese outside of Japan is Brazil. It used to be the US but the internment took care of that. The Japanese were immediately taken with bossa nova and Japanese and Brazilian musicians shuttle back forth between Brazil and Japan constantly and many Brazilian musicians sing in Japanese. Americans generally only come to know bossa nova through jazz musicians but the Japanese did straight bossa nova, bossa nova jazz and bossa nova pop. Japan is known as the second home of bossa nova. In many karaoke bars in Japan, they hold "Bossa Nova Night." I can't imagine that ever being done in America. It's a shame because I've performed a few bossa nova songs on guitar while singing in Portuguese in cafes and people really like it. Other musicians will say, "I gotta learn how to do some of that stuff!" But Americans overall are not exposed to it. It's there, but they don't hear it.




















A Japanese man bringing bossa nova to Vietnam. The Japanese have also popularized the music in Korea where it has found quite a receptive audience. I expect in a few years, bossa nova will become the music of the Far East and kind of musical lingua franca.


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## Guest (Jan 10, 2016)

An excellent bossa nova from Blood, Sweat & Tears from their first album when Al Kooper ran the band in '67. The song is written, strangely enough, by Harry Nilsson.





Dionne warwick once stated that bossa nova was invented by Burt Bacharach. While this is so much horse hockey, I can see why she feels that way. There is something rather bossa nova in Bacharach's songs. Here some kid plays one of Burt's biggest hits and you can sort of hear it. I don't like the ending the boy uses. He should have bossa nova-ed that ending up like crazy. That's an ending that begs to be bossa nova-ed. But then, I didn't know one end of a guitar from the other when I was this age. I barely do now. And some will even dispute that.


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## norman bates (Aug 18, 2010)

Victor Redseal said:


> Dionne warwick once stated that bossa nova was invented by Burt Bacharach. While this is so much horse hockey, I can see why she feels that way. There is something rather bossa nova in Bacharach's songs.


yes, anyway I guess it's very difficult to say who invented it, since it's not very clear whar bossa nova was. I've read many times that it was basically the samba cancao but with the harmonic influence of jazz (and classical composers like Debussy). 
But that was done before Jobim by Johnny Alf, who in the early fifties wrote magnificent songs like this one





and before Getz and Joao there was Laurindo Almeida with Bud Shank, and in the thirties and forties there were Garoto, Valzinho, certain pieces of Ary Barroso like the amazing Inquietacao... Jobim was certainly a wonderful songwriter but he didn't really started anything (and certainly it's the same for Bacharach).


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## norman bates (Aug 18, 2010)

anyway I confess I didn't know that Gilberto was a difficult guy. I've always thought he was the opposite, kind of shy and gentle like Bill Evans or something like that, probably because of his musical style.


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## DeepR (Apr 13, 2012)

It's probably nothing like the "real" bossa but I like to listen to bossa/latin flavored electronic/club music sometimes. I get really nice summer vibes from it. 
Most of it is pretty terrible though, so it's a matter of finding the right tracks/artists that get me grooving. One group I like is The Juju Orchestra (they're Germans.. ).


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## starthrower (Dec 11, 2010)

I love all kinds of Brazilian music. Jobim, Milton Nascimento, Hermeto Pascoal, Flora Purim & Airto, Elis Regina, Astrud Gilberto.

I met Airto after a show in 2001. He played the drum kit for the entire show, and did a feature with his amazing tamborine solo. He told me he was going on one hour of sleep, due to logistical problems coming from the last gig. I was amazed at his energy and graciousness for hanging around to greet fans.


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## Guest (Jan 10, 2016)

I'm going to disagree that bossa nova was around in the 40s. I'm going to give its primary invention to Joao. "Bim Bom" was written in 1956 and that is bossa nova. It bears great resemblance to earlier forms of samba but Joao had a guitar style that introduced a different beat. When he and Tom began working with Elizabeth Cardoso in 1958, it was said that bossa nova began but Joao already had the idea of it in mind.





Joao's guitar introduces a new beat. Tom wrote the songs but Joao's guitar is what makes them bossa nova. Joao got the idea for bossa nova guitar when he was watching a young woman from his window hanging clothes on a line. Her hip movements inspired him to strum in a certain rhythm and that was how "Bim Bom" was written.


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## Guest (Jan 10, 2016)

starthrower said:


> I love all kinds of Brazilian music. Jobim, Milton Nascimento, Hermeto Pascoal, Flora Purim & Airto, Elis Regina, Astrud Gilberto.
> 
> I met Airto after a show in 2001. He played the drum kit for the entire show, and did a feature with his amazing tamborine solo. He told me he was going on one hour of sleep, due to logistical problems coming from the last gig. I was amazed at his energy and graciousness for hanging around to greet fans.


I saw Airto and Flora with band many moons ago on the roof of the Hotel Pontchartrain in Detroit.


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## Triplets (Sep 4, 2014)

Victor Redseal said:


> I saw Airto and Flora with band many moons ago on the roof of the Hotel Pontchartrain in Detroit.


"Top of the Ponch"?

I used to go there quite a bit in the early 1980s.


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## SONNET CLV (May 31, 2014)

I, too, count myself a fan of _bossa nova_, and so much of the music mentioned thus far in this thread is familiar stuff to me. (I seem to have about as much Jobim on my record shelves as I have Beethoven!)

Recently I've been working up versions of Bronisław Kaper's "On Green Dolphin Street" and Horace Silver's "Song for my Father" on my old guitar. I'm reminded that these tunes too feature the _bossa_ beat.


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## Guest (Jan 15, 2016)

And "Song For My Father" inspired Steely Dan to write "Rikki Don't Lose That Number." So we see how the ripples spread from the source and create new things.


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## Badinerie (May 3, 2008)

Nothing against the Bossa Nova here....Used to share house with three ballroom dancing couples...Nice costumes the women wore...Used to help them out before shows by sticking Diamontes on parts of their bodies the costumes didnt cover. 
....Ooh La La!


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## Guest (Jan 15, 2016)

How many here have seen "Orfeu Negro?"


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## Larkenfield (Jun 5, 2017)

I feel the soul of the bossa nova as subtlety and _romance_ and the love of what can happen on the beaches of Brazil. I can see why Stan Getz fell in love with it (and Jobim's wife) because of its great harmonic variety and sophistication, such as _Wave_, which is an incredible challenge to play well. I think Jobim was an harmonic genius. I loved playing him when I was active as a musician (alto sax). The gentle beat is like the in and out rolling of the waves.






Anyone who loves the bossa nova should watch the movie with Amy Irving of the same name. You'll feel like a million $s. Portuguese is one of the most beautiful languages in the world! The marvelous soundtrack was arranged by Eumir Deodato, whom I had the good fortune to meet many years ago in LA when he first came to America.






Sorry this couldn't be in better sound quality. Better after seeing the movie and as a CD!


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## norman bates (Aug 18, 2010)

I think it's a shame that many persons seems to consider Bossa nova as "elevator music" (thanks Blues brothers), while it's actually one of the most sophisticated genres in popular music.



Larkenfield said:


> I think Jobim was an harmonic genius. I


yes he was... many songs he wrote were way more complex than pop-rock and even progrock music. Dindi, Olha maria, eu nao existo sem voce, pro causa de voce... My favorite song of him si probably Inutil paisagem, especially the version with Elis Regina... I love the dissonances he used. Just brilliant.


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## Bluecrab (Jun 24, 2014)

It's a beautiful form of Brazilian popular music. As a Brazilian friend of mine explained to me about 45 years ago, when bossa nova became popular, the term "bossa" was popular in Brazilian slang. It meant something like to do something with style, to be cool. So "bossa nova" ("nova" meaning "new") was a new way of doing something cool in music.

Here's a great song from two of the best of contemporary Brazilian music, Caetano Veloso and Gilberto Gil. Even though the song is called "Desde que o samba é samba" (Ever since samba has been samba), to me it sounds clearly like a bossa nova rhythm. As Caetano introduces the song, he tells the audience that they will sing only one song, from their new album, and that the last line from the first verse is repeated at the end of the song; he then invites the audience to sing along at the end. I had the great fortune to see these two at Lincoln Center right around this time (1993-1994). MPB really doesn't get any better than this.


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