# Disappointment in following opera singers to different works



## SixFootScowl (Oct 17, 2011)

After hearing Gundula Janowitz' wonderful singing in the Bernstein Fidelio, I bought Beethoven's Missa Solemnis and Ninth Symphonies with her in them, but was dissappointed. (I finally nailed a good Janowitz with Schubert Songs though.) It was not that Janowitz was not singing well in these other works, but that my liking her voice was intimately tied to the production I first heard it in. Same thing happened when I chased Lucia Popp from the Bernstein Fidelio only to be less excited when I got Strauss Four Last Songs featuring Popp. Then I discovered the beautiful voice of Frederica von Stade in the Abbado La Cenerentola DVD so I got a CD of her in Massenet's Cendrillon and her singing was not as wonderful to me because I did not care for that opera.

Has anyone else had this experience?


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## Bellinilover (Jul 24, 2013)

I haven't had the experience of only liking a singer in one production or work. However, I can say that as much as I love Joan Sutherland, I'd rather not listen to her in anything later than early-middle Verdi (e.g. _Rigoletto_ and _La Traviata_) -- namely, late-period Verdi or verismo. She does do a good job with the Willow Song from _Otello_ on her "Art of the Prima Donna" album -- but that doesn't necessarily mean I'd want to hear her complete Desdemona. I just don't think she was as effective outside the bel canto/school of bel canto repertoire. I have similar feelings about Samuel Ramey. Also, Thomas Hampson: I think he's done a good job with the Verdi that's more bel-canto like (e.g. Macbeth, Don Carlo in _Ernani_, Germont, and even parts of Ford in _Falstaff_); on the other hand, I didn't think his voice was the best fit for Simon Boccanegra, and I don't imagine I'd like his Iago much.


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## nina foresti (Mar 11, 2014)

I much prefer Jonas Kaufmann in the Wagnerian rep. His acting, however, is exemplary in everything he does. He's just a stage animal.


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## deggial (Jan 20, 2013)

Florestan said:


> I chased Lucia Popp from the Bernstein Fidelio only to be less excited when I got Strauss Four Last Songs featuring Popp.


I've never imagined Popp in Strauss beside Sophie (has she sung more???). I must now listen to her Four Last Songs out of sheer curiosity.


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## Marschallin Blair (Jan 23, 2014)

Florestan said:


> After hearing Gundula Janowitz' wonderful singing in the Bernstein Fidelio, I bought Beethoven's Missa Solemnis and Ninth Symphonies with her in them, but was dissappointed. (I finally nailed a good Janowitz with Schubert Songs though.) It was not that Janowitz was not singing well in these other works, but that my liking her voice was intimately tied to the production I first heard it in. Same thing happened when I chased Lucia Popp from the Bernstein Fidelio only to be less excited when I got Strauss Four Last Songs featuring Popp. Then I discovered the beautiful voice of Frederica von Stade in the Abbado La Cenerentola DVD so I got a CD of her in Massenet's Cendrillon and her singing was not as wonderful to me because I did not care for that opera.
> 
> Has anyone else had this experience?


I've had similar experiences. I almost always buy a female singer if she's beautiful looking on the cd. Once I find out that the singing doesn't match the cd, then I stop buying her cd's completely. But then, I'm sophisticated like that.


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## Woodduck (Mar 17, 2014)

I'm not sure whether the question is "do you find that singers perform some works well and other works less well" or "do you go out and randomly purchase anything by a singer you enjoyed, only to find that you've wasted your money."

The answer to the second question is "no," because the answer to the first question is "yes."


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## Tsaraslondon (Nov 7, 2013)

deggial said:


> I've never imagined Popp in Strauss beside Sophie (has she sung more???). I must now listen to her Four Last Songs out of sheer curiosity.


It's very good. Tennstedt is the conductor and I heard them perform the songs at the Royal Festival Hall around the time of the recording. Popp did of course go on to sing the Marshchallin towards the end of her career.


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## MAuer (Feb 6, 2011)

deggial said:


> I've never imagined Popp in Strauss beside Sophie (has she sung more???). I must now listen to her Four Last Songs out of sheer curiosity.


She sings Daphne on a very fine recording from (I think) the late '80s.


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## Divasin (Aug 8, 2014)

Florestan said:


> After hearing Gundula Janowitz' wonderful singing in the Bernstein Fidelio, I bought Beethoven's Missa Solemnis and Ninth Symphonies with her in them, but was dissappointed.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


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## Bellinilover (Jul 24, 2013)

I want to clarify something in my post above, because I just realized it's a bit ambiguous: I do consider _Rigoletto_ and _La Traviata_ "school of bel canto," and I do enjoy Sutherland's Gilda and Violetta on recordings. It's the later Verdi heroines like Amelia and Desdemona she probably wouldn't have done as well (and anyway, they hardly figured into her major career).

Another thing is that I don't generally care for Nicolai Gedda in the Italian repertoire, though I make an exception for his (Puccini) Rodolfo with Schippers.


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## SixFootScowl (Oct 17, 2011)

Well I am about to do it again. I bought a Cecilia Bartoli CD of various Rossini opera pieces and love it. At the same time I had discovered Joyce DiDonato on You Tube and was eying her Cenerentola but then found I really like how Bartoli sings in Cenerentola (and the rest of the singers) and so may be buying that CD instead of the DiDonato one. Bartoli and DiDonato both are more (is ornamented the correct word) in their singing than either von Stade or Berganza (two that I have Cenerentolas of and enjoy immensely).

Also, Woodduck nailed it:


Woodduck said:


> I'm not sure whether the question is "do you find that singers perform some works well and other works less well" or "do you go out and randomly purchase anything by a singer you enjoyed, only to find that you've wasted your money."
> 
> The answer to the second question is "no," because the answer to the first question is "yes."


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## Woodduck (Mar 17, 2014)

There are plenty of singers whose peculiar timbres or technical skills (or limitations) make them outstanding in certain repertoires but unsatisfying in others. Bellinilover cites Sutherland's strengths in bel canto and weakness elsewhere, though we can speculate on what she might have been good at (including perhaps enunciation ) if she had not specialized early. You can hear her as Eva in "O Sachs, mein Freund" from _Die_ _Meistersinger_ on YouTube, and her unmannered directness of utterance is lovely. I suspect she might have done well with other German lyric roles such as Agathe, Elsa and Elisabeth.

I'd cite Birgit Nilsson as an extraordinary singer whom I've found disappointing outside her special _fach_. Her huge, thrilling voice was clearly made for the heavy Wagner and Strauss roles - I think her Elektra is mind-boggling and probably vocally unsurpassable - but, I'd say, not very much for anything else except Puccini's two most strenuous soprano roles, Turandot and Minnie, both of which she did superbly. These roles call for great power and a free, soaring top, but not the flexibility which most 18th- and 19th-century opera requires. Even her effort to file her unwieldy voice down to song-recital size and perform concert repertoire betrayed a certain discomfort (her great Wagnerian predecessor Flagstad was more versatile and was a wonderful song recitalist). Back in the days of the LP I did buy some recordings of Nilsson outside her _fach_, but wouldn't care to hear them now.

Postscript: I should add that Nilsson was a good Leonore in _Fidelio_, and some liked her Tosca, though I don't think her bright timbre was awfully suitable. I heard her Tosca in a Met Saturday broadcast in 1968, and that broadcast was the Met debut of Placido Domingo. My ears definitely sat on the edge of their seats that day!


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## OperaGeek (Aug 15, 2014)

MAuer said:


> She sings Daphne on a very fine recording from (I think) the late '80s.


She also recorded "Intermezzo" with Sawallisch:









She recorded a lieder disc with Sawallisch, too:


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## OperaGeek (Aug 15, 2014)

deggial said:


> I've never imagined Popp in Strauss beside Sophie (has she sung more???). I must now listen to her Four Last Songs out of sheer curiosity.


I got curious and searched for more Strauss with Popp. I didn't know, but it turns out Warner has released an inexpensive all-Strauss Popp disc which collects the Four Last Songs, an excerpt from the Daphne mentioned by MAuer and 12 songs from the disc I mentioned earlier. If you want to sample Popp's Strauss, this seems like a good place to start!


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## Headphone Hermit (Jan 8, 2014)

Woodduck said:


> There are plenty of singers whose peculiar timbres or technical skills (or limitations) make them outstanding in certain repertoires but unsatisfying in others. Bellinilover cites Sutherland's strengths in bel canto and weakness elsewhere, though we can speculate on what she might have been good at (including perhaps enunciation ) if she had not specialized early. You can hear her as Eva in "O Sachs, mein Freund" from _Die_ _Meistersinger_ on YouTube, and her unmannered directness of utterance is lovely. I suspect she might have done well other German lyric roles such as Agathe, Elsa and Elisabeth.
> 
> I'd cite Birgit Nilsson as an extraordinary singer whom I've found disappointing outside her special _fach_. Her huge, thrilling voice was clearly made for the heavy Wagner and Strauss roles - I think her Elektra is mind-boggling and probably vocally unsurpassable - but, I'd say, not very much for anything else except Puccini's two most strenuous soprano roles, Turandot and Minnie, both of which she did superbly. These roles call for great power and a free, soaring top, but not the flexibility which most 18th- and 19th-century opera requires. Even her effort to file her unwieldy voice down to song-recital size and perform concert repertoire betrayed a certain discomfort (her great Wagnerian predecessor Flagstad was more versatile and was a wonderful song recitalist). Back in the days of the LP I did buy some recordings of Nilsson outside her _fach_, but wouldn't care to hear them now.


Woodduck is right - different performers suit different repertoire and different pieces .... the same applies to pianists, violinists, conductors, orchestras etc etc


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## deggial (Jan 20, 2013)

:tiphat: to all who recommended Popp's Strauss! I did listen to some of the Four Last Songs today and I liked what I heard. I think I may go for the Daphne recording to start with as I like the opera a lot.


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## SixFootScowl (Oct 17, 2011)

Here is the one I have (sorry but no large images on web):


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## SixFootScowl (Oct 17, 2011)

Wow, Lucia Popp! I first heard her in the 1978 Bernstein Fidelio and thought she was pretty good. Was not as impressed with her in Strauss' Four Last Songs, but then maybe it was the Four Last Songs and not Lucia Popp. But yesterday my Flotow Martha opera arrived on CD staring Lucia Popp as Martha--Absolutely wonderful!


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