# Bruckner's Eighth - the Adagio coda, is there anything better?



## Octo_Russ (May 11, 2010)

Here's a question, what is the best moment for you in any Bruckner Symphony?, for me it has to be the great coda at the ending of Adagio of the 8th Symphony, roughly about the last 4 minutes, here's what i wrote about it in my Blog that day, [the timings are for Barenboim's Berliner Philharmoniker recording 1994, the Adagio lasts 25:44].

"then... comes the coda, it's the most achingly beautiful part of this symphony [21:43 to the end], it has those sorrowful touches, the fading light at the end of the day, sorrow mixed with a bittersweet nostalgia, like two people who can't bear to say goodbye and part, there's this phrase, first called out on the clarinet [22:19], but then repeated again and again on the strings, with the horns joining in [23:21-23:56], this is the moment of moments in this Symphony, is there anything so gut-wrenchingly emotional as the ending of this movement?".

So what's your 'moment of moments' in any Bruckner Symphony?.


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## teccomin (Mar 21, 2008)

I have only listened to 4, 5, 7, 8, 9.
My favourite moment is the last 3 minutes of finale of the 4th.
By the way, I loved what you wrote in the blog. I will give this symphony a good listen again.


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## World Violist (May 31, 2007)

I prefer the part of the adagio of the 8th right before the coda, in which everything just falls into place. In a recording such as Boulez's, it is absolutely overwhelming, not so much the enormous deceptive cadence but the moment of sheer beauty that follows. That, to me, is not only my favorite moment in all of Bruckner, but one of my favorite moments in any symphony.


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## GraemeG (Jun 30, 2009)

Impossible question.
He can make the world stand still, the very mountains dance, and conjure up a vision of the whole of the created universe.
Where speech and words and gestures and experience and explanations fail, Bruckner's sound world takes over.
An extraordinary gift to humanity.
cheers,
G


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## Jaime77 (Jun 29, 2009)

wow I must listen to this - i have the boulez recording


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## Falstaft (Mar 27, 2010)

My favorite moment picks up right where yours leaves off - the first minute or so of the 4th movement. What a theme! (and what wondrous variations he sends it through in the rest of the mvt)!


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## ncmtman (May 22, 2010)

*"One of the greatest inspirations in all music"*

These are the words of the late Georg Tintner, conductor of the Bruckner Eighth Symphony on the Naxos label. He was specifically referring to the coda of the Adagio. I would have to agree with both Tintner and the originator of this post as well. Arguably there are other shining moments in Bruckner's symphonies. However, this is the one that stays with me, even days and weeks after listening to it again. It still gives me goose bumps every time. What an amazing 4 minutes (give or take) of music. Tintner's recording is the original 1887 version, edited by Nowak. I only have two recordings of the 8th, the other being the praised Karajan's VPO. Karajan's is the 1890 version edited by Haas. I went back and listened to the latter, being a little concerned that perhaps Bruckner had somehow changed this part of the movement. But, thankfully, he did not. And why would he? Without a doubt, he must have realized what an awesome thing he had created. Both Tintner and Karajan, in my opinion, bring out the magic of the coda amazingly well. The entire movement is incredible, Tintner even going as far as stating that "The Adagio is in my opinion, with that of Beethoven's Ninth Symphony, the greatest symphonic slow movement ever written." For anyone reading this thread, and who have not yet discovered the immense satisfaction and joy of hearing this inspiration by Anton Bruckner, then give it another spin. Crank up the volume somewhat during these last 4 minutes of the Adagio, and see if you don't agree with at least these two listeners, and likely many others.


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## ScipioAfricanus (Jan 7, 2010)

Hugo Wolf, "The work renders all criticism futile; the Adagio is absolutely incomparable."


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## ScipioAfricanus (Jan 7, 2010)

The Bruckner moment that sticks with me is the following.
I was researching Classical music for an introductory music college class. I used the 1995 encarta encyclopedia as my main source. This magnificent software had short clips of classical music of various composers loaded in the composers' biographies. For Bruckner it had the crashing crashing chords of the first movement of the fourth (which occurs after the introductory of the horns and the string tremolo. I think it is bar 40). That shocked me by its sheer beauty. I constantly replayed it, and I have been a Bruckner fan ever since.


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## maestro267 (Jul 25, 2009)

I first heard the original version of Bruckner 8 (conducted by Tintner) about 3 years ago. My favourite moment is the sudden return of the galloping theme in the Finale; then he repeats it, first in B and then in E before a shattering climax in A flat.

In fact, reading this topic has made me want to listen to said symphony, so I am. 90 minutes of heaven!


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## Art Rock (Nov 28, 2009)

As good as the 8th adagio is, the whole 9th is even superior. IMHO.


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## Billbob32 (Jul 12, 2010)

The first movement of the seventh when the second theme builds to the massive chord. The brass stacks, and the violins build and eventually the small motive becomes a massive chord made of enough air to drown a whale, and he takes it all away for the smallest fragment of melody.
Then at the end when the same theme reappears to build to the coda. Its musical perfection.


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## tgtr0660 (Jan 29, 2010)

The moment I love the most is the one I remember as the one that made my fall in love with Bruckner's symphonies: the big climax in the adagio of the 7th, that one where the master originally planned a cymbal crash, only to write "gilt es nicht" in the score (I prefer Karajan's version with the ymbal, though)


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## foscari (May 6, 2012)

There are many great coda's in Bruckner's Symphonies.Whilst I think the adagio of the eighth is one of his masterpieces. I like the similarity between the second subject and the cello entrance of Otello in the last act of Verdi's opera , actualy composed at the same time.It must of been the Wagner influence on both.However the chorale coda of the first movement of the sixth with over thirty modulatations, the coda of the final movement of the fifth, where for once Bruckner lets himself go completely,without any restraints are also right up there. BUT in my opinion what really tops the lot ,is the dark , frightening coda of the first movement of the ninth, where Bruckner is taking us to the gateway of HELL.I was lucky to hear the redemption of this "terror of terrors" at the first performance of the completed ninth in Berlin in February, with the Berlin Philharmonic and Sir Simon Rattle.


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## Xaltotun (Sep 3, 2010)

This changes daily - to me Bruckner's symphonies are almost equal in greatness; I don't put the 8th and the 9th to such a high pedestal above the others as some do. For example, the ending of the first movement of the 2nd symphony is downright terrifying. I have equated it with Kant's concept of the "sublime" - imagining something so large that you realize your reason isn't capable of really grasping it at all, and the gut-wrenching sensation that follows this.


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## Polyphemus (Nov 2, 2011)

For me the final movement of No 5 where all of the musical ideas are resolved cogently. As Robert Simpson said this symphony was where Bruckner reached his maturity as a Symphonist. I am biased in this opinion, however, as No 5 is my favourite Bruckner symphony.


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## tgtr0660 (Jan 29, 2010)

GraemeG said:


> Impossible question.
> He can make the world stand still, the very mountains dance, and conjure up a vision of the whole of the created universe.
> Where speech and words and gestures and experience and explanations fail, Bruckner's sound world takes over.
> An extraordinary gift to humanity.
> ...


To the impossible question, you have given the perfect answer.


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## Arsakes (Feb 20, 2012)

His 3rd, 5th, 6th and 7th adagios are great as well. Sadly, I haven't listened enough to his 1st, 2nd and 9th symphonies.
I like the 7th's adagio the most, it's very emotionally engaging...

As a whole I like Buckner's 5th symphony.


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## Jeremy Marchant (Mar 11, 2010)

Octo_Russ said:


> Here's a question, what is the best moment for you in any Bruckner Symphony?, for me it has to be the great coda at the ending of Adagio of the 8th Symphony, roughly about the last 4 minutes...


I agree.

But the nomination of this passage of the eighth symphony as the "best moment" is essentially an emotional response rather than a musical one.

So, maybe, the end of the finale of 8: you have to have heard the whole symphony to recognise that Bruckner is drawing together the themes of all four movements. It doesn't stand alone - by itself it is only best moment if you've heard the other seventy minutes. But it is so powerful precisely _because _it is the culmination of that long term vision.


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## JohnProffitt (Jun 16, 2012)

The best moment in Bruckner? For me, there are so many it's impossible to pick only one. But I'll mention three that I come back to, time and again.

1. The entry of the Chorale fortissimo at the conclusion of the Fifth Symphony finale. A hair-raisingly exultant moment; certainly the last such unambiguously triumphant and optimistic symphonic conclusion that Bruckner would write. The coda to the Finale of the Ninth would probably be similar in affect, but that portion of the Ninth's finale is most likely lost to us forever.

2. The statement in the full strings of the 2nd theme "Gesangsperiode" of the Ninth Symphony, 1st movement. Utterly sublime, and it breaks my heart every time I listen to it.

3. The first statement, fortissimo, of the grand Chorale of the Ninth Symphony, 4th movement. This portion of the Finale survives in virtually complete orchestration by Bruckner and it is indeed one of his greatest inspirations: Heaven throws open its Gates!

OK, I'll mention a fourth favorite: the prolonged build-up to the (in)famous climax of the Seventh Symphony Adagio, certainly with timpani and percussion! This is IMO one of the most visceral evocations in music of sexual tension ending in orgasm.


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## Andreas (Apr 27, 2012)

There are so many incredible climaxes and codas to choose from, it's quite impossible. In terms of sheer out-of-this-world-ness, the coda of the Fourth, as performed by Celibidache and the Munich Philharmonic, probably stands out for me.

Other than that, the wonderful fugato development section of the finale of the Fifth is a great pleasure to listen to. And somehow, the coda of that symphony strikes me as Bruckner's most fulfilling, outshining even that of the Eigth.


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## afterpostjack (May 2, 2010)

Another lovely finale is that of Saturn from Holst's Planets Suite. I think this is rather in the same spirit as the finale of the adagio in Bruckner's 8th.
In the finale of the adagio in Beethoven's 9th, the music is also very nice after the big climax.

On the theme of this thread, I think the finale of the 7th, first movement is one of the very best. It might be inspired by the lovely prelude to Wagner's Das Rheingold. In the finale of the 4th, the initial climax is amazing as well. The movement as a whole is one of my favorites.


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## guitar (Mar 12, 2014)

Hi,

I do not want to start a new thread, so I'm asking it here. I remember reading somewhere online what Bruckner considered himself his best composition/movement... and of course I can't seem to find this info anywhere anymore. The only thing I seem to find is that he thought his Te Deum was his best composition. But what about all the symphonic movements he wrote?

Hopefully someone is able to inform me about this, preferably with a source. Many thanks in advance!


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## Muddy (Feb 5, 2012)

Hello Guitar, and welcome to the forum! I am not sure what Bruckner thought was his greatest symphonic movement, but my vote goes to the Adagio to the 8th. I am a Bach, Mozart and Beethoven man...and that Adagio drops me to my knees.


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## hpowders (Dec 23, 2013)

The best moment for me in any Bruckner Symphony is the very opening of the Seventh Symphony.

That is one heck of a gorgeous, hauntingly beautiful melody!!

Bombast does nothing for me. Intimacy and poetry are everything.


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## Albert7 (Nov 16, 2014)

I enjoy all of Bruckner but want to single out this movement for special highlight.






Note: many of his symphonies specify first or second revision and often I favor the first round.


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## HIDEKI SUKENOBU (Mar 31, 2015)

hpowders said:


> The best moment for me in any Bruckner Symphony is the very opening of the Seventh Symphony.
> 
> That is one heck of a gorgeous, hauntingly beautiful melody!!
> 
> Bombast does nothing for me. Intimacy and poetry are everything.


My favorite one is also #7. To listen to his whole symphony is a hard work. So rarely I take his masterpieces in hand. When young I chose his symphonies as often as I chose Mahler's ones. But now they are too long for me to enjoy. Everyone likes to talk about the moment they feel so to speak the extacy. Honestly I got too old to endure and wiat for the moment.


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## Ken Cohen (Apr 10, 2015)

I'd be interested in knowing how others first came to Bruckner. In my case, in the early 1970's I read a newspaper interview. The Toronto Symphony youth orchestra was to travel to Europe. When its conductor told the players that they would be learning a Bruckner symphony, there was little enthusiasm, as Bruckner was new to most of them and somehow came with a reputation: musty, dark and heavy.

In the interviews, most expressed surprise at how much they enjoyed playing the music, how rewarding an experience it was.

All I knew then of Bruckner was the name. I looked him up in Stereo Review's 'Basic Repertoire', selected the ninth symphony as a likely easy to learn starting point, and bought the Zubin Mehta / Israel Philharmonic LP. What a shock it was. All I could hear at first was a great mass of dissonant counterpoint. But after several listenings I gained a deep appreciation for the music. By comparison, when I later listened for the first time to the seventh, I understood it immediately. And each listening brought new little discoveries - for me one of the basic attributes of great art. I was hooked.


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## Ken Cohen (Apr 10, 2015)

I should have mentioned in my previous post: I sometimes think that if JS Bach had written music 150 years later than he did, his music might have been similar in style to Bruckner's. Both were supreme masters of counterpoint, both dedicated virtually everything they wrote to the glory of God, both developed the existing musical styles of their times in novel directions, and their music had the 'shiver' factor that touches the soul.


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## hpowders (Dec 23, 2013)

The final coda of Schumann's Second Symphony as played by Karajan/Berlin is better.


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## hpowders (Dec 23, 2013)

HIDEKI SUKENOBU said:


> My favorite one is also #7. To listen to his whole symphony is a hard work. So rarely I take his masterpieces in hand. When young I chose his symphonies as often as I chose Mahler's ones. But now they are too long for me to enjoy. Everyone likes to talk about the moment they feel so to speak the extacy. Honestly I got too old to endure and wiat for the moment.


Yes. Just when one is falling asleep, along comes a glorious moment snapping you back to attention!! 

Nobody puts me to sleep more quickly than Bruckner.

Portions of his Seventh and Eighth symphonies are exceptions.


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## DiesIraeCX (Jul 21, 2014)

Why, yes. The coda to the first movement of Bruckner's 9th. ;-)


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## Skilmarilion (Apr 6, 2013)

I assume that 23:36 - 24:35, below, has been overlooked by the OP.

Frankly ridiculous.


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## Azol (Jan 25, 2015)

- The coda of the Finale of B4 as performed by Celi/Munchner Philharmoniker.

- The arrival of the powerful onslaughts in Adagio of B9:
at 2:08 onwards and 15:17 onwards... it feels llike a water rising to submerge everything around you





- And of course the coda to B9 Adagio - never fails to bring a tear to my eye.


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## HIDEKI SUKENOBU (Mar 31, 2015)

Yesterday I happened to listen to several Schubert's pieces and brought to my mind that #15 SQ. of Schubert's foretell Bruckner's characteristic beginning of symphonies as if they were clad with fog and that the length of the symphony #9 was the predecessor of all Bruckner's symphonies.


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## Larkenfield (Jun 5, 2017)

Skilmarilion said:


>


Bump. I heard this twice tonight... venerable conductor and seasoned orchestra full of golds, precious metals, scents and colors. The Adagio was like hearing something glorious at the close of one's life when only the most exalted and exquisite music will do. It sounds more related to the human kingdom than to Bruckner's spiritual one, and this might have been as blissed-out and serene as Bruckner ever got... Everything I've ever heard of his sounds entirely genuine as if he was incapable of writing a false note. It seems so obvious... and it must have been a terrible burden and frustration when his music was continually rejected during his lifetime. But what a rich inner life did he have!... He was in touch and shared the depth of it.


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## NLAdriaan (Feb 6, 2019)

Larkenfield said:


> Bump. I heard this twice tonight... venerable conductor and seasoned orchestra full of golds, precious metals, scents and colors. The Adagio was like hearing something glorious at the close of one's life when only the most exalted and exquisite music will do. The Adagio sounds more related to the human kingdom than the spiritual one, and this might have been as blissed-out and serene as Bruckner ever got... Everything I've ever heard of his sounds entirely genuine as if he was incapable of writing a false note. It seems so obvious... and it must have been a terrible burden and frustration when his music was continually rejected during his lifetime. But what a rich inner life did he have!... He was in touch with it and able to share it.


If you like this, please also listen to Gunter Wands Bruckner recordings with the BPO on RCA, here he reaches even new heights (or should I say depths), with the help of an even better orchestra. These is in my opinion the best ever Bruckner to be recorded. It was also Wand's testament, as he couldn't complete the cycle before passing. But the most important ones are there (4,5,7,8,9).


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## larold (Jul 20, 2017)

The coda in the adagio of the 8th is nice, as is its contemporary in the 7th. However, I find the finale of the 5th symphony, from the repeat at the coda to the end (3-4 minutes) the most powerful and memorable piece of music Bruckner wrote …. aside from Te Deum which he himself called his greatest masterpiece.

Wikipedia has a reference to Bruckner calling Te Deum "the pride of my life." I saw another quote where he said words to this effect: "If I am called before God to account for my life I shall show him my Te Deum." 

Whether you like choral music or no you should hear Bruckner's Te Deum if you enjoy his symphonies. There is an outstanding free download at abrucker.com of Eugene Ormandy leading the Philadelphia Orchestra that is among my favorites. Te Deum lasts about 18 minutes.


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## DeepR (Apr 13, 2012)

The coda of the Adagio of the 8th is great, but so is everything else of this Adagio; so it doesn't stand out to me. My favorite moment would be the tremendous climax and some of those breathtaking moments during the 3-4 minutes leading up to the climax.
The codas of movements 9-1, 8-4 and 5-4 are my favorites, for now.


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