# Special Contest: The Ring - Dawn Duet: Traubel/Melchoir, Leider/ Soot, Flagstad/ Melchoir, Varnay/ Windgassen,Hunter/ Remedios



## Seattleoperafan (Mar 24, 2013)

This is my favorite duet. It is not as long as Ah! Perfido! but I find the music to be extremely intense and excitable. I think listening to two in a day might be too much. Mas suggested that we all listen to these at your leisure and take notes. I think a week will be enough time to hear all of them, but if you need more time tell me. I will remind you to listen in other contests. If we settle on a week I will do the second part of this with a poll and you can discuss. Second only to Callas this is a Wagner crowd so people will have opinions. Goerke is actually pretty good but is not in the league of these singers I think and we really haven't had any first rate Wagnerian singers for a long time.. All of these singers today are wonderful in their own way. I didn't include the great Nilsson as she doesn't compete well against Flagstad. Farrell and Thomas are wonderful singers but Bernstein needed several cups of coffee before he conducted their orchestra.


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## ALT (Mar 1, 2021)

It’s Traubel.


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## ColdGenius (9 mo ago)

Seattleoperafan said:


> Farrell and Thomas are wonderful singers but Bernstein needed several cups of coffee before he conducted their orchestra.


I hope he had Irish coffee.


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## damianjb1 (Jan 1, 2016)

That's a fabulous selection of Brunnhilde's.
If I have to choose one - Flagstad.


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## Seattleoperafan (Mar 24, 2013)

damianjb1 said:


> That's a fabulous selection of Brunnhilde's.
> If I have to choose one - Flagstad.


Remember .... it's the team.


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## Woodduck (Mar 17, 2014)

Among other things, these four recordings allow us to hear the progress of recording technology over a span of about forty years, from the first years of electrical recording in the early 1920s to the stereo era.

The Frida Leider/Fritz Soot recording makes a misery of Wagner's sumptuous orchestration, and the tempo is comically rushed to accommodate the side lengths of 78 rpm discs, which allowed less than five minutes per side. The singers seem mostly unfazed except for one mistake by Soot. Leider, in general, sounds terrific as usual, even in poor sound, and it's a shame she couldn't have a better setting.

The Flagstad/Melchior recording from 1939 is just as fast, and for the same reason, but seems less absurd in that we can begin to hear something close to the actual sound of an orchestra. The voices too are better reproduced, and with voices as gob-smackingly splendid as these it's easy to overlook technical shortcomings. (Factoid: on the original recording the conductor, Edwin MacArthur, can be heard releasing a gasp of relief at the end. That's been cut out in this transfer. I miss it!)

Traubel/Melchior/Toscanini from 1941 is a live radio broadcast. Since those were free from the timing restrictions of studio recording, we get to hear the music played the way it should be. Singing and conducting are superb, and I think this may be the best performance of this scene ever recorded. The only flaw is Traubel's attempt at the final high C, which she'd have done better to leave out.

I enjoyed the Varnay/Windgassen more than I expected to, given that neither singer has a vocal tone I find especially ingratiating. But both were vital artists with strong voices, and they knew their Wagner. Windgassen was at his best here, a bit fresher than on the Solti _Ring,_ and Varnay doesn't sound a day over twenty years older than Brunnhilde ought to sound. 

With the Hunter/Remedios performance, majestically led by Charles Mackerras, we can finally hear the orchestra in all its tonal glory and all the complexity of its textures, woven entirely from leitmotifs. The singers are fresh-voiced and appealingly youthful, alhough they haven't the verbal sharpness and heroic tonal force of the old-time Wagnerians. Pity we can't hear Flagstad and Melchior surrounded by such orchestral splendor.


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## Seattleoperafan (Mar 24, 2013)

Woodduck said:


> Among other things, these four recordings allow us to hear the progress of recording technology over a span of about forty years, from the first years of electrical recording in the early 1920s to the stereo era.
> 
> The Frida Leider/Fritz Soot recording makes a misery of Wagner's sumptuous orchestration, and the tempo is comically rushed to accommodate the side lengths of 78 rpm discs, which allowed less than five minutes per side. The singers seem mostly unfazed except for one mistake by Soot. Leider, in general, sounds terrific as usual, even in poor sound, and it's a shame she couldn't have a better setting.
> 
> ...


You're up to your old tricks and I love it. Beautifully digested and expostulated. Actually it is a high B, which sometimes Traubel could make... but didn't. Siegfried 's end is the only climax C Brunhilde and Isolde sing I believe other than briefly hit ones.


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## Woodduck (Mar 17, 2014)

Seattleoperafan said:


> You're up to your old tricks and I love it. Beautifully digested and expostulated. Actually it is a high B, which sometimes Traubel could make... but didn't. Siegfried 's end is the only climax C Brunhilde and Isolde sing I believe other than briefly hit ones.


I must correct you. Brunnhilde's final note is C. Siegfried's Rhine Journey is in the key of Eb, not D. Of our favorite Wagnerian sopranos, only Nilsson does that note, and the final one in _Siegfried,_ justice.


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## Seattleoperafan (Mar 24, 2013)

Woodduck said:


> I must correct you. Brunnhilde's final note is C. Siegfried's Rhine Journey is in the key of Eb, not D. Of our favorite Wagnerian sopranos, only Nilsson does that note, and the final one in _Siegfried,_ justice.


I didn't know Traubel could even APPROXIMATE a C!!! Life continually surprises me. That Nilsson was the best I doubt not, but Rita Hunter and Astrid Varnay both could make the hair stand up on my arms with this C.


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## Woodduck (Mar 17, 2014)

Seattleoperafan said:


> I didn't know Traubel could even APPROXIMATE a C!!! Life continually surprises me. That Nilsson was the best I doubt not, but Rita Hunter and Astrid Varnay both could make the hair stand up on my arms with this C.


That was 1941, when Traubel was 42. It was the year Flagstad returned to Norway and Marjorie Lawrence contracted polio, leaving Traubel in charge of Brunnhilde's high Cs. I believe she gave up attempting them.


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## ColdGenius (9 mo ago)

The lack of a poll has its advantages, we can just write what we like.
Leider, Flagstad and Melchior expectively lead in the thread. But the rest deserve attention too.
There is a Russian proverb: when you can't have a lady, a chambermaid would serve for a moment. It's a way that Varnay, Travel and even Nilsson, and many others are treated in such threads. I must say, if we voted, I woul doubt between Varnay and Traubel. The couple Hunter - Remedios was notable too. I think they are unjustly lesser known wagnerians, and Remedios is a rarest Spanish in that repertoire.
I took for a base Brunhilde, because it's her who bears all the responsibility and intelligence (but not always a common sense) in this opera (like in almost all the other) compared to a tenor part. Siegfried, on his side, is a typical tenor, a romantic and not very clever youth, aging and loosing a battle against his metabolism. Only Soot seems to me a little miscast, with too light and reedy timbre. I couldn't choose between Melchior, Windgassen and Remedios (did you know that his family name translates as a medicine or curation?). And Melchior... Everything became complicated. I can't stop thinking about a bushbuck and kicking Flagstad.


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## Becca (Feb 5, 2015)

ColdGenius said:


> The lack of a poll has its advantages, we can just write what we like.
> Leider, Flagstad and Melchior expectively lead in the thread. But the rest deserve attention too.
> There is a Russian proverb: when you can't have a lady, a chambermaid would serve for a moment. It's a way that Varnay, Travel and even Nilsson, and many others are treated in such threads. I must say, if we voted, I woul doubt between Varnay and Traubel. The couple Hunter - Remedios was notable too. I think they are unjustly lesser known wagnerians, and *Remedios is a rarest Spanish in that repertoire*.
> I took for a base Brunhilde, because it's her who bears all the responsibility and intelligence (but not always a common sense) in this opera (like in almost all the other) compared to a tenor part. Siegfried, on his side, is a typical tenor, a romantic and not very clever youth, aging and loosing a battle against his metabolism. Only Soot seems to me a little miscast, with too light and reedy timbre. I couldn't choose between Melchior, Windgassen and Remedios (did you know that his family name translates as a medicine or curation?). And Melchior... Everything became complicated. I can't stop thinking about a bushbuck and kicking Flagstad.


Actually Alberto Remedios is English, from Liverpool!


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## Seattleoperafan (Mar 24, 2013)

Becca said:


> Actually Alberto Remedios is English, from Liverpool!





ColdGenius said:


> The lack of a poll has its advantages, we can just write what we like.
> Leider, Flagstad and Melchior expectively lead in the thread. But the rest deserve attention too.
> There is a Russian proverb: when you can't have a lady, a chambermaid would serve for a moment. It's a way that Varnay, Travel and even Nilsson, and many others are treated in such threads. I must say, if we voted, I woul doubt between Varnay and Traubel. The couple Hunter - Remedios was notable too. I think they are unjustly lesser known wagnerians, and Remedios is a rarest Spanish in that repertoire.
> I took for a base Brunhilde, because it's her who bears all the responsibility and intelligence (but not always a common sense) in this opera (like in almost all the other) compared to a tenor part. Siegfried, on his side, is a typical tenor, a romantic and not very clever youth, aging and loosing a battle against his metabolism. Only Soot seems to me a little miscast, with too light and reedy timbre. I couldn't choose between Melchior, Windgassen and Remedios (did you know that his family name translates as a medicine or curation?). And Melchior... Everything became complicated. I can't stop thinking about a bushbuck and kicking Flagstad.


You guys and gals are making what you want of this contest which is wonderful. I just want you to enjoy it. We will have a formal poll next week when everyone has time to hear all the selections - my major consideration since this music for me is overwhelming!!!


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## MAS (Apr 15, 2015)

Becca said:


> Actually Alberto Remedios is English, from Liverpool!


The origin of the name could be Portuguese, as in _dos Remédios _(literally, of the medicines). A good friend of my parents had that name.


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## ColdGenius (9 mo ago)

Spanish and Portuguese have much in common, except pronouncing. The translation is similar. All these family names and female names originate from Virgin Mary's epithets. So, he was born in Great Britain and isn't an exclusion among Wagner singers then.


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## The Conte (May 31, 2015)

I found it strange how the volume on the Toscanini is so low when Traubel sings (although it faded in and out). I really like her voice here when I can hear it. It's warm without the darkness of a Varnay or Modl. It's wonderful to hear a truly beautifully sung Brunhilde, but perhaps others will find it too light. Unfortunately, that means I don't find her a good partner for Melchior. I will have to listen to the recording with him and Lawrence to compare. I will also fish out the Nilsson/Windgassen with Bohm conducting as well. This is one stretch in the Ring where I find little to like in Modl's singing as she screams the high notes uncomfortably. Something that certainly doesn't apply to Traubel. To sum up, Traubel very good, could win the contest, Melchior isn't the right partner for her though.

Oh wait, but Leider has it all, she has everything Traubel does, but with a brighter more heroic tone. Whilst we can't tell from these recordings (or recordings in general), I wouldn't mind betting that her voice was quite a few sizes bigger than Traubel's. She also has better diction. This is Brunhilde heaven! I'm not sure about Soot though. His intonation is somewhat off and he sounds a bit too light for Siegfried. This is going to be tough as we have to take two voices into account. Can we pick our two favourite Brunhildes and suggest we imagine them in the duet together?

Wow, I really like Flagstad here and Melchior doesn't sound out of place next to her fine, heroic Brunhilde. This recording is my favourite so far. I may prefer Melchior on the other recording and Leider has cleaner diction and a smoother line, but Flagstad isn't far behind and Melchior is head and shoulders above Soot. I think we may have a winner.

I'm not sure who the tenor on the Varnay is (and I haven't clicked on the YouTube link to check). The conducting is wonderfully lush and rich and the improvement in sound is really welcome. Varnay isn't to my taste in soprano roles, but I do appreciate the importance of her voice. That said, when I heard her start singing I thought, "Oh, no!" I soon got accustomed to her tone and enjoyed her singing, but no more than that. Windgassen is ok, but which tenor can beat Melchior in Wagner? 

I like the orchestra on the last ones and there's some fine singing from Hunter and Remedios. (I certainly prefer them over Varnay and Windgassen and not only due to the more pleasant sound of their voices to my ear.) The singing is very good, both sound more secure and confident in the music than Varnay and Windgassen. However, we have that wonderful recording from Flagstad and Melchior AND I actually really liked Flagstad (which isn't usually the case).

SOF, you're now turning me into a Flagstad fan!

N.


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## Woodduck (Mar 17, 2014)

The Conte said:


> I found it strange how the volume on the Toscanini is so low when Traubel sings (although it faded in and out). I really like her voice here when I can hear it. It's warm without the darkness of a Varnay or Modl. It's wonderful to hear a truly beautifully sung Brunhilde, but perhaps others will find it too light.
> ..............
> Oh wait, but Leider has it all, she has everything Traubel does, but with a brighter more heroic tone. Whilst we can't tell from these recordings (or recordings in general), I wouldn't mind betting that her voice was quite a few sizes bigger than Traubel's.


Judging the size of voices on recordings, especially old recordings, really isn't possible. I've heard numerous recordings by these two singers, and I wouldn't even try to guess who was louder. They both sang Wagner with the indefatigable and unfatiguable Melchior and made recordings with him, and they both held their own. My own impression is that Traubel's voice was quite large.



> Wow, I really like Flagstad here and Melchior doesn't sound out of place next to her fine, heroic Brunhilde. This recording is my favourite so far. I may prefer Melchior on the other recording and Leider has cleaner diction and a smoother line, but Flagstad isn't far behind and Melchior is head and shoulders above Soot. I think we may have a winner.


Back in the '60s Conrad L. Osborne called that recording one of the greatest exhibitions of sheer vocal health on record. 1939 found both singers at their peak.



> SOF, you're now turning me into a Flagstad fan!


Her several live Isoldes will do that if anything will.


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## Seattleoperafan (Mar 24, 2013)

The Conte said:


> I found it strange how the volume on the Toscanini is so low when Traubel sings (although it faded in and out). I really like her voice here when I can hear it. It's warm without the darkness of a Varnay or Modl. It's wonderful to hear a truly beautifully sung Brunhilde, but perhaps others will find it too light. Unfortunately, that means I don't find her a good partner for Melchior. I will have to listen to the recording with him and Lawrence to compare. I will also fish out the Nilsson/Windgassen with Bohm conducting as well. This is one stretch in the Ring where I find little to like in Modl's singing as she screams the high notes uncomfortably. Something that certainly doesn't apply to Traubel. To sum up, Traubel very good, could win the contest, Melchior isn't the right partner for her though.
> 
> Oh wait, but Leider has it all, she has everything Traubel does, but with a brighter more heroic tone. Whilst we can't tell from these recordings (or recordings in general), I wouldn't mind betting that her voice was quite a few sizes bigger than Traubel's. She also has better diction. This is Brunhilde heaven! I'm not sure about Soot though. His intonation is somewhat off and he sounds a bit too light for Siegfried. This is going to be tough as we have to take two voices into account. Can we pick our two favourite Brunhildes and suggest we imagine them in the duet together?
> 
> ...


Marvelous read. Traubel's voice was ENORMOUS according to testimony. Gigantic but so effortless it never sounded pushed. I posted this earlier: I chatted online with someone who's voice teacher heard Traubel in Chicago. When she cut loose he felt the sound push against her chest bounce off the back walls and bump her head again. It was just a notch smaller than Flagstad. Flagstad was a freak with a mic in her throat. It was said wherever you sat in the house it sounding like she was standing singing right in front of you. She could sing with full vocal dynamics over a full orchestra and be heard. Also, unlike most women with gigantic voices she was a normal sized person. This will win you over to her. Listen to the last couple of minutes where she sings a cappela down low. OMGGGGGGGGG!!!




As to Traubel, this recording really reveals the massive size of her gorgeous voice. About 45 minutes in Brunhilde lets it RIP before Wotan punishes her. OMGGGGGGGGGGGGGGG! 




Finally Flagstad ripping off the roof in her curse about a minute and a half from the end.


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## The Conte (May 31, 2015)

Woodduck said:


> Judging the size of voices on recordings, especially old recordings, really isn't possible. I've heard numerous recordings by these two singers, and I wouldn't even try to guess who was louder. They both sang Wagner with the indefatigable and unfatiguable Melchior and made recordings with him, and they both held their own. My own impression is that Traubel's voice was quite large.


Very true. I now remember that Traubel was said to have a very large voice. It sounds like Leider had more squillo in her voice than Traubel, which led me to thinking it may have been bigger.




Woodduck said:


> Her several live Isoldes will do that if anything will.


Alas not, I've heard most of them and she leaves me cold. However, I have the Melchior disc that includes both the duet in this contest (with Flagstad) and their recording of the duet from Tristan, I might give it a listen later...

N.


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## ALT (Mar 1, 2021)

The voices of Traubel and Eileen Farrell (not featured) sound uncannily similar. If anyone told me it’s Farrell I’d believe them (knowing that Toscanini preceded her days as singer).


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## Woodduck (Mar 17, 2014)

ALT said:


> The voices of Traubel and Eileen Farrell (not featured) sound uncannily similar. If anyone told me it’s Farrell I’d believe them (knowing that Toscanini preceded her days as singer).


I've noticed that too.


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## Woodduck (Mar 17, 2014)

The Conte said:


> Alas not, I've heard most of them and she leaves me cold. However, I have the Melchior disc that includes both the duet in this contest (with Flagstad) and their recording of the duet from Tristan, I might give it a listen later...


Flagstad could be reserved - cool as snow in the fjords, I'm tempted to say. I sometimes suspect that she needed more extroverted colleagues to get her excited. Melchior was certainly extroverted! But if her Wagner doesn't do it for you, try her Grieg songs; her _Haugtussa_ cycle is delightful (there are early and late recordings). As with many singers, she sounds especially lovely in her native language.


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## Francasacchi (7 mo ago)

Woodduck said:


> I must correct you. Brunnhilde's final note is C. Siegfried's Rhine Journey is in the key of Eb, not D. Of our favorite Wagnerian sopranos, only Nilsson does that note, and the final one in _Siegfried,_ justice.


Traubel transposed the Battle Cry down to avoid the high Cs. I think she may have attempted one live high C in the Dawn Duet in addition to this recording. Anny Konetzni was another Wagnerian soprano who routinely avoided high Cs pretty much after the late 1930s. At one point she had the note because Vespri, Trovatore, and Ballo were in her repertoire. The Met offered Traubel Aida in I think 1937 but she turned it down. I don't think O patria Mia unless transposed would have worked. Whatever some may say about the flaws of Varnay, she could certainly emit stunning high Bs and Cs. That voice was not a pushed up mezzo like Modl. Also Traubel and Konetzni started out as contraltos.


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## Francasacchi (7 mo ago)

ALT said:


> The voices of Traubel and Eileen Farrell (not featured) sound uncannily similar. If anyone told me it’s Farrell I’d believe them (knowing that Toscanini preceded her days as singer).


Farrell sang the Beethoven Ninth under Toscannini.


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## ewilkros (8 mo ago)

Francasacchi said:


> Farrell sang the Beethoven Ninth under Toscannini.


Farrell sang everything imaginable on the radio from 1941 to abt 1948, but it was for CBS, not NBC, where Toscanini was [the Beethoven 9th wasn't until 1952, when she was a free(er) agent]. This included quite a bit under Bernard Herrmann (head of the CBS Symphony) and his predecessor Howard Barlow. Besides the full-length concerts of the CBS Sym (summer fill-ins for the New York Philharmonic broadcasts), Herrmann had this crazy show called "Invitation to Music" that ran from 11:30 _pm_ to _midnight_, where he basically did all the classical music that Toscanini wouldn't touch with a 10-foot pole--Baroque revival, forgotten German Romantics like Raff, post-romantics and 20th Century (mostly tonal), with a particular fondness for 20th c Brits. Farrell would frequently turn up here -- Delius' _Idyll_ with Mack Harrell and guest cond Beecham, last act of _Louise_ with Mack Harrell, a concert aria by Mendelssohn called "Infelice", Ah Perfido, toe-tappers from _Wozzeck_ years before she did the whole thing with Mitropoulos, Loeffler's _5 Irish Fantasies_, etc. "Invitation" became popular enough so that it spun off into multiple graveyard-shift shows, including vocal-concert shows, and these would often include Farrell on a weekly basis for months at a time. Meanwhile she would turn up on 15-min shows tucked in between the afternoon soap-operas or the evening news shows, or headline the far popsier "Prudential Family Hour" for its summer runs, while usual headliners Gladys Swarthout or Risë Stevens were on vacation. Outside of the Prudential gig there was lots of Verdi and Massenet and a whole lot of Wagner including the Immolation, the Liebestod and the Wesendoncks (separately or as a unit) - but no Dawn Duet AFAIK, to get back to subject. 

I don't think much of this survives as recordings, except for the Prudential show, which was picked up by the Armed Forces Radio Service and pressed into 16-in syndication discs, which still turn up on Ebay.


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## Woodduck (Mar 17, 2014)

ewilkros said:


> Farrell sang everything imaginable on the radio from 1941 to abt 1948, but it was for CBS, not NBC, where Toscanini was [the Beethoven 9th wasn't until 1952, when she was a free(er) agent]. This included quite a bit under Bernard Herrmann (head of the CBS Symphony) and his predecessor Howard Barlow. Besides the full-length concerts of the CBS Sym (summer fill-ins for the New York Philharmonic broadcasts), Herrmann had this crazy show called "Invitation to Music" that ran from 11:30 _pm_ to _midnight_, where he basically did all the classical music that Toscanini wouldn't touch with a 10-foot pole--Baroque revival, forgotten German Romantics like Raff, post-romantics and 20th Century (mostly tonal), with a particular fondness for 20th c Brits. Farrell would frequently turn up here -- Delius' _Idyll_ with Mack Harrell and guest cond Beecham, last act of _Louise_ with Mack Harrell, a concert aria by Mendelssohn called "Infelice", Ah Perfido, toe-tappers from _Wozzeck_ years before she did the whole thing with Mitropoulos, Loeffler's _5 Irish Fantasies_, etc. "Invitation" became popular enough so that it spun off into multiple graveyard-shift shows, including vocal-concert shows, and these would often include Farrell on a weekly basis for months at a time. Meanwhile she would turn up on 15-min shows tucked in between the afternoon soap-operas or the evening news shows, or headline the far popsier "Prudential Family Hour" for its summer runs, while usual headliners Gladys Swarthout or Risë Stevens were on vacation. Outside of the Prudential gig there was lots of Verdi and Massenet and a whole lot of Wagner including the Immolation, the Liebestod and the Wesendoncks (separately or as a unit) - but no Dawn Duet AFAIK, to get back to subject.
> 
> I don't think much of this survives as recordings, except for the Prudential show, which was picked up by the Armed Forces Radio Service and pressed into 16-in syndication discs, which still turn up on Ebay.


Thanks for this. It tells me much more about Farrell than I knew, and it's very good to know. It's also a huge misfortune that little of it is documented on recordings. With such a magnificent singer, and so many other irreplaceable artists, poorly documented when documentaion on tape and film was eminently possible (Callas onstage!), I'm beginning to think the "greatest generation" had its head up its backside when it came to the arts. And yet it was so much better then than it is now. At least then there were great singers worth recording, and they turned up often enough in the media for the public to know who they were and to hear what they sounded like.


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## Seattleoperafan (Mar 24, 2013)

Woodduck said:


> Thanks for this. It tells me much more about Farrell than I knew, and it's very good to know. It's also a huge misfortune that little of it is documented on recordings. With such a magnificent singer, and so many other irreplaceable artists, poorly documented when documentaion on tape and film was eminently possible (Callas onstage!), I'm beginning to think the "greatest generation" had its head up its backside when it came to the arts. And yet it was so much better then than it is now. At least then there were great singers worth recording, and they turned up often enough in the media for the public to know who they were and to hear what they sounded like.


More stuff on Farrell like the rehersal with Schippers I posted today are showing up. I had never seen it before and her voice was GLORIOUS. You could rarely tell how enormous her voice was unless she was cutting loose on Wagner.


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## Woodduck (Mar 17, 2014)

Seattleoperafan said:


> More stuff on Farrell like the rehersal with Schippers I posted today are showing up. I had never seen it before and her voice was GLORIOUS. You could rarely tell how enormous her voice was unless she was cutting loose on Wagner.


I have a motto and bumper sticker for you:

SIZE MATTERS!


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## ewilkros (8 mo ago)

n


Seattleoperafan said:


> More stuff on Farrell like the rehersal with Schippers I posted today are showing up. I had never seen it before and her voice was GLORIOUS. You could rarely tell how enormous her voice was unless she was cutting loose on Wagner.


That was "War es so schmählich", the duet leading up to Wotan's Farewell and Magic Fire Music in Walküre Act III. Do we have her actually doing that in performance?


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## Seattleoperafan (Mar 24, 2013)

ewilkros said:


> n
> 
> That was "War es so schmählich", the duet leading up to Wotan's Farewell and Magic Fire Music in Walküre Act III. Do we have her actually doing that in performance?


Not that I know of. She did only concert performances of Wagner. She is every bit as good as Traubel and that is saying A LOT. Wow!!!!!!!! She wasn't so much gobby fat as much as she was built like a tank: a real barrel chest. She looked heavier because she had no neck but it was like Pavarotti= that sound just poured out of her larynx with no impedance.


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## ewilkros (8 mo ago)

Seattleoperafan said:


> Not that I know of. She did only concert performances of Wagner.


I mean, did she ever perform it with actual orchestra and whatnot. This looks like a session where she's learning the piece, or rehearsing it, to do with Schippers and an orchestra.


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## Seattleoperafan (Mar 24, 2013)

ewilkros said:


> I mean, did she ever perform it with actual orchestra and whatnot. This looks like a session where she's learning the piece, or rehearsing it, to do with Schippers and an orchestra.


I'm sure she did. Like I said, she sang Wagner in recitals only but did so frequently. I see no reason why Schippers would be wasting his time coaching her if she wasn't going to sing with him. She thought singing a whole Wagnerian role would damage her voice and I guess she made a good call as she was still recording in her 70's. She liked recitals because they allowed her to sing in a city and she could get home to her husband and children.


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## Woodduck (Mar 17, 2014)

Seattleoperafan said:


> More stuff on Farrell like the rehersal with Schippers I posted today are showing up. I had never seen it before and her voice was GLORIOUS. You could rarely tell how enormous her voice was unless she was cutting loose on Wagner.


Where I really found it easy to guage Farrell's physical impact was in her singing of Donizetti's Queen Elizabeth in _Maria Stuarda_, with Beverly Sills as Mary. Sills was perfectly audible in the theater despite her slender sound, but her confrontation scene with Farrell makes the difference in amplitude obvious. They're an odd match, really, and I don't think either of them was ideally cast, but at least we always know who's singing! I'd only remark that calling Eileen Farrell "vil bastarda" takes guts.


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## ALT (Mar 1, 2021)

Francasacchi said:


> Farrell sang the Beethoven Ninth under Toscannini.


I see. Thank you and I stand corrected.


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## Shaughnessy (Dec 31, 2020)

Woodduck said:


> Where I really found it easy to guage Farrell's physical impact was in her singing of Donizetti's Queen Elizabeth in _Maria Stuarda_, with Beverly Sills as Mary. Sills was perfectly audible in the theater despite her slender sound, but her confrontation scene with Farrell makes the difference in amplitude obvious. They're an odd match, really, and I don't think either of them was ideally cast, but at least we always know who's singing! I'd only remark that calling Eileen Farrell "vil bastarda" takes guts.


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## Seattleoperafan (Mar 24, 2013)

Shaughnessy said:


>


That MADE my day. When I heard Farrell it was in a wrestling arena so the acoustics were not ideal and why would she want to give us her all in a podunk place like Jackson MS. I remember Un Bel Di.


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