# Good old Europe = Venice



## TxllxT (Mar 2, 2011)

Just back from our 12 days holiday in Italy. For me it was the first time to see & be thoroughly impressed by Venice. The touristic guidebook pointed out that Tchaikovsky's 4th symphony was composed on _Riva degli Schiavoni_, the quai-promenade close to St.Mark's square. Wonderful, such a bright & optimistic work having come into being on such a bright & lively spot (Venice is visited by 14 million tourists each year)! 
Now this thought came to me. The idea of being Russian didn't come into being in Russia. It originates from Venice; St Petersburg is the result of the Russian processing of Venice. But also the idea of being Dutch is not to be found in Holland. It originates from Venice; Amsterdam is the result of the Dutch processing of Venice. And what about being English? What would a true Englishman (/woman) be without having done the _grand tour_ in which Venice performs a pivotal part? 
Richard Wagner loved Venice. He visited it many times. I still have to find out how deep Venice influenced his writing of operaworks. But just to follow the German addiction to idealist speculation: isn't the idea of being German heavily touched (& :angel: civilised :angel by the charm of Venice? 
I will let the Americans define their own Americanness in relation to Venice....


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## Klavierspieler (Jul 16, 2011)

I'm not sure I get your point. You seem to be saying that Europe revolves around Venice or something like that.


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## TxllxT (Mar 2, 2011)

Klavierspieler said:


> I'm not sure I get your point. You seem to be saying that Europe revolves around Venice or something like that.


You get it.


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## kv466 (May 18, 2011)

Well, then I couldn't agree with that...as I've been to Venice at least a half a dozen times and all over Europe,...it's a great and magical place but there are many of those scattered throughout Europe and the World.


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## sospiro (Apr 3, 2010)

So pleased you enjoyed Venice so much. I've only been once & was captivated & would love to go again.


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## TxllxT (Mar 2, 2011)

sospiro said:


> So pleased you enjoyed Venice so much. I've only been once & was captivated & would love to go again.


 The _Ponte dei Sospiri_ was packed for restoration in enormous blue sheets of advertisements for Italian kitchens.... Sigh, sigh, sospiro....


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## KaerbEmEvig (Dec 15, 2009)

To be frank, pigeon **** everywhere. I mean it.


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## Vaneyes (May 11, 2010)

TxllxT said:


> Just back from our 12 days holiday in Italy. For me it was the first time to see & be thoroughly impressed by Venice. The touristic guidebook pointed out that Tchaikovsky's 4th symphony was composed on _Riva degli Schiavoni_, the quai-promenade close to St.Mark's square. Wonderful, such a bright & optimistic work having come into being on such a bright & lively spot (Venice is visited by 14 million tourists each year)!
> Now this thought came to me. The idea of being Russian didn't come into being in Russia. It originates from Venice; St Petersburg is the result of the Russian processing of Venice. But also the idea of being Dutch is not to be found in Holland. It originates from Venice; Amsterdam is the result of the Dutch processing of Venice. And what about being English? What would a true Englishman (/woman) be without having done the _grand tour_ in which Venice performs a pivotal part?
> Richard Wagner loved Venice. He visited it many times. I still have to find out how deep Venice influenced his writing of operaworks. But just to follow the German addiction to idealist speculation: isn't the idea of being German heavily touched (& :angel: civilised :angel by the charm of Venice?
> I will let the Americans define their own Americanness in relation to Venice....


The influence is enormous. Two recommended books: Italian Hours by Henry James; Veneti by Savli, Bor, Tomazic.


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## Almaviva (Aug 13, 2010)

TxllxT said:


> I will let the Americans define their own Americanness in relation to Venice....


I don't know about other Americans but for me it was crucial, since my family comes from the Veneto province, that is, the areas surrounding Venice. But considering that Christopher Columbus was from Liguria (the province surrounding Genoa - at the time, what was known as the Republic of Genoa) they may have a better claim. Not to forget Amerigo Vespucci who was from Florence.


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## TxllxT (Mar 2, 2011)

When you walk along the promenade _Riva degli Schiavoni_ to the south (into the _Castello_ quarter), one will meet Venice's beautiful green parks in which the _Biennale_ is hidden. There is also a small strip of green right at the promenadewalk, where they put lots of bustes and statues. Of course: Richard Wagner and Guiseppe Verdi will greet you from their stands. But I noticed that no one cares very much about those bustes. Verdi's hair is covered by the foliage from the tree above it and soon his whole face will be fully hidden behind leaves. Perhaps TC could adopt these bustes: every TC member who visits Venice will take care to free Verdi and Wagner from nature's unruly overgrowth. Later on I will be able to show photos of the location.

We did not see any pigeons nor the **** they tend to leave behind. I heard rumors about Venice being dirty and in a bad unkept state: the opposite is true. Newly renovated bridges and quays everywhere. The best period for visiting Venice is probably the first week of october. We had 27 degrees at one o'clock, but after three the aftersummer heat became very pleasant and bearable with excellent daylight for making pictures.


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## Xytech (Apr 7, 2011)

I'm not sure if I was captivated, at least during the day. Every step I took I was surrounded by tourists and people trying to sell me things. Oddly enough, some time just after dinner, the streets seem to totally empty. I have some fond memories of just wandering around exploring with a certain special person  THAT was when Venice captivated me


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## Dster (Oct 3, 2011)

I last visited Venice in 1996 just after the fire that destroyed the La Fenice. Just my rotten luck!!***


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## Almaviva (Aug 13, 2010)

TxllxT said:


> We did not see any pigeons


Are you serious? There are pigeons everywhere in Venice. Do they migrate away or something at certain times of the year?


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## TxllxT (Mar 2, 2011)

Almaviva said:


> Are you serious? There are pigeons everywhere in Venice. Do they migrate away or something at certain times of the year?


To be precise: I am now busy with processing my photos and there I see some of them flying. But really, they didn't catch my attention during our walks or _vaporetti_trips. Perhaps there are now so many needles glued to all monuments, that the poor ******** have no place left to rest & .....


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## joen_cph (Jan 17, 2010)

From what I´ve heard Venice authorities are considering the pigeons a problem and for instance they have made regulations forbidding the feeding of them. It´s been a while since I was in Venice (4 years I think), but even back then the rules - also including forbiiding the sitting at the San Marco Square outside cafe areas, for instance - were strictly kept. The problems may have been somewhat reduced.

http://wierd-wonderful.over-blog.com/article-venetian-law-no-feeding-the-pigeons-49410365.html
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/05/08/world/europe/08iht-pigeon.4.12710015.html
http://www.travelvivi.com/venice-closed-for-tourists/


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## Vaneyes (May 11, 2010)

And if you absolutely must brown-bag in Venice (Italy), please conceal it until you find (skulk to) the darkest alley to consume your bag's contents. Penalty for not doing so is a dunking in the Grand Canal.


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## Guest (Oct 17, 2011)

Venice is wonderful, but not during the height of the tourist season. Definitely much better during off months - like now!

Last one there is a rotten egg!


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## TxllxT (Mar 2, 2011)

Here are Venice's bustes of Wagner & Verdi. Verdi's green haircover badly needs some trimming....


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## joen_cph (Jan 17, 2010)

> Verdi's green haircover badly needs some trimming....


Quite agree. Great picture


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## kv466 (May 18, 2011)

"Brown bag"?...lol, guess I missed something...either way, good to see you around Vaneyes!


There's this restaurant, Marlin, on Murano island and it has excellent seafood...so, last time I was there (about 5 years ago), my girlfriend and I hop onto one of the small water taxis and noticing that we'd taken the wrong one, we got off at Lido. What a pleasant surprise that was! I mean,...first off there are streets and cars everywhere and very nice little shops and best of all, no tourists. So we had lunch there and a couple of beers and then hopped back onto the taxi which again we didn't know nor care where it was taking us; we ended up getting off at Stazione Centrale.

On other trips I've spent all night, literally 'til Sun rises, wandering the 'streets' and narrow passages loving each time I'd find just one tiny place open full of local drinking wine and beer and snacking on great stuff...that's about the time you see the drunken fools jump into the canal of a bridge and into the murkiest water known to man. Great place, and I haven't even begun to recall the musical memories I have of the city which began one of my first trips there. Maybe for another post.


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## TxllxT (Mar 2, 2011)

*Nice Memories*

Just a few photos for Venice lovers. On the panorama the Pietà Church of Vivaldi's Young Women's Choir can be seen.


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## Vaneyes (May 11, 2010)

Did someone say off season?


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## sospiro (Apr 3, 2010)

TxllxT said:


> Just a few photos for Venice lovers. On the panorama the Pietà Church of Vivaldi's Young Women's Choir can be seen.


:tiphat:

Great photos Txllxt


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## Vaneyes (May 11, 2010)

For off season, one would probably have better "luck" with Venice II. The horror, the horror, the horror.


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## joen_cph (Jan 17, 2010)

(deleted, sorry).


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## norman bates (Aug 18, 2010)

KaerbEmEvig said:


> To be frank, pigeon **** everywhere. I mean it.


To be Frank


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## Vaneyes (May 11, 2010)

Give me the pigeon poo, and take the schmaltzy orchestra.


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## myaskovsky2002 (Oct 3, 2010)

I know the two more magnificient Venices: in Italy and St-Petersburg.

Martin, in love with Russia


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## EddieRUKiddingVarese (Jan 8, 2013)

the Grand Tour, is that not a TV show


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