# Piano Sonata in C minor



## beetzart (Dec 30, 2009)

I wrote this in 2015 and wonder if it is any good.


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## dzc4627 (Apr 23, 2015)

That intro is a bit of a chromatic jumbled mess. The discordance is very unwarranted and nasty to listen to. The movement proper has good ideas. The runs are annoying and would be annoying to play. Why in God's name did you end on a minor chord? That last slow movement is actually quite nice. 

This could be good if you articulated your ideas in a neater and better-organized manner.


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## beetzart (Dec 30, 2009)

dzc4627 said:


> That intro is a bit of a chromatic jumbled mess. The discordance is very unwarranted and nasty to listen to. The movement proper has good ideas. The runs are annoying and would be annoying to play. Why in God's name did you end on a minor chord? That last slow movement is actually quite nice.
> 
> This could be good if you articulated your ideas in a neater and better-organized manner.


Thank you for your input and in taking the time to listen to my composition. Yes there are definitely areas that need tidying up or orgonising better which I will address. Although, you mention the intro being a chromatic jumbled mess. What I was trying to do here was build up tension for when the main theme begins. Maybe I need to rework it but I actually quite like it. As for the final minor chord, well here I am try to ape Alkan's final cadence that he ends his symphony for piano 1st movement with. Sort of like a picardy third but in reverse. Again. something else I could look into.

Thanks again and I appreciate your comments.


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## Samuel Kristopher (Nov 4, 2015)

Hey beetzart, I'm always interested in Piano Sonatas (one of my favourite genres) and I enjoy writing in this form. Here's a few of my thoughts:

I can see what you're trying to achieve with the tension-release, but I think you draw it out too long. I was expecting the release on Bar 10 and if you'd done that I might have forgiven the previous chaos. As it is, re-establishing the chaos again feels almost like a betrayal - it doesn't so much as increase the tension now, but feels frustrating (and if that's the effect you're going for, there are better ways to do it  )

Also, chromatism is difficult. I try to avoid it, and when I use it, it's usually in short bursts. I don't have enough knowledge or expertise to recommend anything specific, but I feel like, even in good chromatic passages, the bass line is key - it helps us to feel movement. Even in dissonance and tension, I think we need movement, and your bass line can provide that by moving up through the chromatic scale.

Looking at your current bass line, we get two distinct whole notes on C, then up a major second to D (which isn't a chromatic interval) and two more distinct whole notes, then to your C minor chord. From there you seem to shift between stable and transition chords until Bar 9 (which actually does a decent job of leading into Bar 10). So there are three motifs here that don't seem to have any logical connection to each other. I'd suggest trying to use the octaves from the beginning to create an ascending/descending bass line through the chromatic scale - one whole note per bar. Tie it into Bar 9 with some reasonable connection - a diminished or suspended chord, so that Bar 9 sort of falls into Bar 10. Of course, a plain/straight ascending/descending line is not very original these days, and is by no means the only option available to you. But it's a starting point and it creates a sense of cohesion that I think this intro needs.

Speaking about the melody too - I'm of two minds. The fact that you repeat the ascending line on Bar 4 and 6 gives me that same feeling of listening to a vinyl record while someone constantly takes the arm and keeps skipping back a couple of seconds all the way through the song. In a way, I think it's neat that you've brought out such a strong emotion in me, but that's the sort of thing you'd be better saving for the development, in my opinion. Like with writing a book, the first moments are all about catching the observer's attention, and while a little bit of tension is good, it should be resolved quickly and without too much pain.

Almost my final point: I think the biggest thing that sticks out for me about the intro is not what it does wrong, but the missed opportunities. Tension-Release intros give the composer a chance to surprise the audience. I'm thinking of Haydn's 104th symphony - go and have a listen to how it opens. It's not chromatic, but it _is_ a tension and release. The symphony is designated in D major, but Haydn only gives us a very powerful series of D5 chords to begin with. While the 5th interval (A) is the most consonant interval available for D, having only these two notes creates a lot of ambiguity because we lack a third or sixth to tell us where the music is going to go - what key it is in. We're expecting a D major but we don't feel it yet - Haydn leaves us hanging. So, after these bursts of D5, when the strings enter in with a soft D minor - it's a chilling and surprising shift and it is one of my favourite introductions to a symphony. So, see if you can surprise us with an unusual harmonic resolution (the chromatic scale literally opens up the entire tonal landscape for you).

Lastly, regarding both the bass line and melody together, even in dissonance and chromatism the two should be aligned. The bass line should emphasis the tonal structure of the melody. When there's no logical connection between the two (as I feel with the beginning of this piece), it seems more like two people playing piano with earplugs, and they can't hear each other.

I don't have enough time right now to listen and analyse the whole piece, unfortunately, but hopefully that helps you somewhat!

Good luck!


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## beetzart (Dec 30, 2009)

Thank you, Samuel, that was very insightful and I am grateful you took the time to listen to my piece.


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