# Synaesthesia



## flamencosketches (Jan 4, 2019)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Synesthesia

^A pretty good synopsis for anyone unfamiliar with the concept.

Does anyone experience this with music? As far back as I can remember, I experience it to a limited degree. Certain sounds, certain pieces, etc. correspond in my head with certain colors. This doesn't manifest in full blown hallucinations, just instant associations in my mind - what would be known according to the article I shared as "associative synesthesia".

For example, I tend to associate a lot of Beethoven's music with royal blues, and golden yellows. Mozart I associate more with warm, fire red (not blood red) and greens, and sometimes shimmering white (the Clarinet Quartet is an example of this). Some of Bach's cantatas are more of a blood red with gold adornment. Webern I associate with swirls of mostly red and black, Schoenberg with swirls of yellow and black, Berg with "breathing" pinks and purples. Some others are harder to nail down. And then most of these associations vary with piece, mood, and recording. The examples I presented are generalizations formed out of the composers' style of writing.

Am I delusional/crazy? Does anyone experience anything similar to what I'm talking about? I am not like Scriabin who saw different pitches in different colors, it's something that comes more out of the whole of what I am listening to. Regardless, I think it's kind of an interesting phenomenon.


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## Art Rock (Nov 28, 2009)

I remember seeing this example some time ago:

link


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## flamencosketches (Jan 4, 2019)

^That is cool. I'm not sure I see distinct shapes like that for everything (even such expressionistic ones), moreso simply colors. Alas, I am no artist and couldn't visualize it with such successful execution if I tried.


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## Enthusiast (Mar 5, 2016)

I do associate music with colours and often with more complex but usually figurative (if stylised) images. Not all music and not all the time but quite a lot of music and quite a lot of the time. Less so recently. Perhaps participation in this forum interferes with it. If the music has a programme or subject then this can interfere with what I see or stop me from seeing anything.


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## joen_cph (Jan 17, 2010)

Only associations that are personal memories, mainly visual, and content said to be in the work. And very rarely. So sadly no. I don't know if one can develop a habit of synaesthesia by training it, I guess so  , though probably with a strong individual touch, which I suppose these experiences are.


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## Enthusiast (Mar 5, 2016)

No. I don't think it could be trained. It is too weird and unpredictable and yet so natural when it happens. A bang on the head in the right place might work, though.


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## Simon Moon (Oct 10, 2013)

joen_cph said:


> O So sadly no. I don't know if one can develop a habit of synaesthesia by training it, I guess so  , though probably with a strong individual touch, which I suppose these experiences are.


Synaesthesia is most likely caused by hard wired differences in the brain of one who experiences it. Neurons between different sense centers in the brain, are cross connected. In other words, the neurons from the auditory cortex, are crossed with neurons from the visual cortex, causing sounds to trigger part of the visual cortex.

So, no, it can't be trained.

Interesting that this subject just came up. I recently discovered a contemporary composer from the US, Michael Torke, that has Synaesthesia. I bought a CD of his called, "One" which has 5 pieces based on his Synaesthesia. Green, Purple, Ecstatic Orange, Ash, Bright Blue Music.


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## Dimace (Oct 19, 2018)

flamencosketches said:


> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Synesthesia
> 
> ^A pretty good synopsis for anyone unfamiliar with the concept.
> 
> ...


Let us first analyze the word Synesthesia… It is a Greek word> Συναίσθησης> Συν and Αίσθησης. It means something I feel not epidermically and with the help of my brain (this is the aesthesia) but something we mainly feel with our instinct or with our soul. Something deeply emotional and certainly of (somehow) unknown origin. "I have the Synesthesia of my acts" Or "My Synesthesia tells me that something is wrong with him" The Συν is the English Plus. So, at the end, we have something like Plus Sense! More sense that the normal one! OK! This, after all, is what ALL the (serious) arts are doing with us. They MUST do it. Otherwise they had failed. Emotionless arts? Arts which don't target our senses? To finish: Its like you are reading a book and behind the words you can see images. (faces, landscapes, wide seas etc.) Personally I don't see (with music) colors but I feel pain, misery, enthusiasm, isolation, happiness etc. Pure emotional situations without somethin visible, like your colors. These are closer to the fantastic word synesthesia you have used. Thanks for the quality post. Music is SCIENCE! And the best art of the arts. To discuss only about CDs and composers are inferior to its purpose, which is bigger than some notes and persons.


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## joen_cph (Jan 17, 2010)

Enthusiast said:


> No. I don't think it could be trained. It is too weird and unpredictable and yet so natural when it happens. A bang on the head in the right place might work, though.


It was a quick thought of mine. Still, if you repeatedly give yourself the task of seeing colours etc when listening to music, in a sort of meditative state, I think it can't be ruled out that you could come into some sort of trance-like habit when doing so. To this could of course be added the use of certain drug/drug-like stimuli of various sorts, which can produce results; shamanistic sessions are usually planned events. But not an oncoming project of mine.

I'd be interested to know however of any tests telling of identical, concrete such experiences promoted by the same work. Haven't heard of that. Am of course not thinking of the emotional response mentioned above, but for example identical colour-visions.

Btw, Scriabin wanted to 'help' people in that respect in 'Mysterium', by projecting colours among the public during performances of the work.


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## MarkW (Feb 16, 2015)

Some composers -- I'm thinking specifically of Messiaen -- are known to have experienced this.


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## flamencosketches (Jan 4, 2019)

MarkW said:


> Some composers -- I'm thinking specifically of Messiaen -- are known to have experienced this.


That makes Messiaen, Scriabin, and this Michael Torke a poster mentioned in this thread, at least. Surely there must be others, I'd be curious to know of them. I love Scriabin and know Messiaen as a massive talent, even if I don't quite appreciate his music like some do.


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## SixFootScowl (Oct 17, 2011)

5 Composers with Synesthesia:


> Alexander Scriabin
> The composer was very much influenced by his colour sense, going on to write Prometheus: The Poem of Fire, which featured the clavier à lumières (or luce), a keyboard 'instrument' which emitted light instead of sound.
> 
> Jean Sibelius
> ...


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## Eva Yojimbo (Jan 30, 2016)

The short answer is "no, I don't," but I will say that I find that many of the composers who seemed to experience this, especially Scriabin, Sibelius, and Messiaen, are personal favorites of mine, and I think a big reason for that is because I find their music extremely "colorful." When I say "colorful" I don't mean that I associate their music with specific colors, but rather they seem to produce music that is richly textured in such a way that seems to evoke a wide range of intangible and ephemeral feelings/emotions that I associate with things like fleeting sense-memory and, yes, colors.


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## Enthusiast (Mar 5, 2016)

joen_cph said:


> It was a quick thought of mine. Still, if you repeatedly give yourself the task of seeing colours etc when listening to music, in a sort of meditative state, I think it can't be ruled out that you could come into some sort of trance-like habit when doing so. To this could of course be added the use of certain drug/drug-like stimuli of various sorts, which can produce results; shamanistic sessions are usually planned events. But not an oncoming project of mine.
> 
> I'd be interested to know however of any tests telling of identical, concrete such experiences promoted by the same work. Haven't heard of that. Am of course not thinking of the emotional response mentioned above, but for example identical colour-visions.
> 
> Btw, Scriabin wanted to 'help' people in that respect in 'Mysterium', by projecting colours among the public during performances of the work.


I believe it is a possible experience during an LSD "trip".


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## Larkenfield (Jun 5, 2017)

Recent findings: https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2007/12/071226003600.htm


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## flamencosketches (Jan 4, 2019)

Enthusiast said:


> I believe it is a possible experience during an LSD "trip".


In my experience, such drugs certainly do bring out these mental phenomena more than otherwise. Unsure how this would work in someone not otherwise prone to synaesthesia... but maybe so.


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## Enthusiast (Mar 5, 2016)

You could always try and then report back!


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## fliege (Nov 7, 2017)

Enthusiast said:


> You could always try and then report back!


I've tried many times. For me psychedelics don't produce effects similar to what people with synaesthesia describe. At least at medium to higher doses the experience is just too muddled. Multiple different effects may well be happening at the same time and you are often very confused and not operating as normal. For instance, I might be unable to identify what sort of instruments I'm hearing or even understand what an instrument is. The emotion or beauty of a piece is amplified but the intellectual understanding is gone because thinking is not an option. The one experience that sticks out is that every time I've listen to Bach's cello suites I get a very strong sensation of wood and wood grain, I feel as though I'm inside and surrounded by the instrument.


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