# traditional Chinese classical music



## science (Oct 14, 2010)

Is anyone here particularly familiar with the old Chinese classical music? I'm especially curious about the opera traditions, court music, and ritual music, but if you know anything about traditional folk music, that'd be fun to know too.


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## Sloe (May 9, 2014)

Here is something I came across a while ago Chinese opera version of Turandot:






I know many people think the singing is ugly personally I like it.


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## science (Oct 14, 2010)

Sloe said:


> Here is something I came across a while ago Chinese opera version of Turandot:
> 
> I know many people think the singing is ugly personally I like it.


Thank you!

Very interesting.


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## joen_cph (Jan 17, 2010)

Though I only sampled it, there was some intensity to that thing ... at least as regards the more popular versions, Chinese folk music tends to be a bit too simple or sentimentally tuneful for my taste, but there seemed to be quite a lot going on musically here, with fast monologues, abrupt body movements, very colourful visuals, etc ... 

Obviously I only have very superficial knowledge on Chinese musical traditions, but if people know of more complicated, purely instrumental music than what I´ve hinted at, I´d be interested in hearing some examples. I don´t mean instrumental or concertante pieces by contemporary, folkishly inspired, Chinese composers, but pieces from the original, ancient tradition.


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## Woodduck (Mar 17, 2014)

joen_cph said:


> Obviously I only have very superficial knowledge on Chinese musical traditions, but if people know of more complicated, purely instrumental music than what I´ve hinted at, I´d be interested in hearing some examples. I don´t mean instrumental or concertante pieces by contemporary, folkishly inspired, Chinese composers, but pieces from the original, ancient tradition.


I'm in the same position. All the more sophisticated Chinese music I've heard seems to be of modern vintage, and I often suspect, rightly or not, some Western influence. Sometimes the blend of traditions is obvious and intentional. That said, I enjoy the guzheng, an ancient zither-like instrument, and the erhu, which is played like a cello.

Here are some nice samples that seem authentic:


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## pcnog11 (Nov 14, 2016)

Have you heard about the Butterfly Lovers?


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## pcnog11 (Nov 14, 2016)

You may also find this link better with an orchestra:


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## Sid James (Feb 7, 2009)

I'm not knowledgeable on this, but I have a few discs of Chinese folk music, its hard to find the exact ones online. The closest equivalent I could find online is this:
https://www.domomusicgroup.com/treasuresofchineseinstrumentalmusic/
25 discs would be going too far as far as I'm concerned, but perhaps its not a lot in covering 5000 years of music!

I found some clips at youtube from that collection with the same folk songs as on the discs I own.

Here are a few -

Three Variations of Plum Blossom





A Dialogue Between a Fisherman and a Woodcutter





The Mist and Clouds of Xiao-Xiang





I quite like this music for relaxation, and listening to this its easy to hear how European composers from Debussy onwards where inspired by music of Asia.


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## joen_cph (Jan 17, 2010)

> Have you heard about the Butterfly Lovers?


Yes, but this is among the pastiche-, rather sentimental and idyllic works composed in ~communist China, like the _Yellow River Concerto_, for a Western orchestra etc. I'm looking for stuff that is more traditional, yet more challenging too. Btw there are Chinese composers who have written symphonies say like in the Shostakovich vein etc., but that´s of course something else too.



Sid James said:


> I'm not knowledgeable on this, but I have a few discs of Chinese folk music, its hard to find the exact ones online. The closest equivalent I could find online is this:
> https://www.domomusicgroup.com/treasuresofchineseinstrumentalmusic/
> 25 discs would be going too far as far as I'm concerned, but perhaps its not a lot in covering 5000 years of music!
> 
> ...


Thanks, yes, it´s stuff like this I´d like to know more about, seems to have an authentic air to it.


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## joen_cph (Jan 17, 2010)

Woodduck said:


> I'm in the same position. All the more sophisticated Chinese music I've heard seems to be of modern vintage, and I often suspect, rightly or not, some Western influence. Sometimes the blend of traditions is obvious and intentional. That said, I enjoy the guzheng, an ancient zither-like instrument, and the erhu, which is played like a cello.
> 
> Here are some nice samples that seem authentic:


Yes, that´s quite lovely indeed, I like it.

Amusing how the Erhu piece has a bit of similarity with the 2nd movement in the Kodaly Solo Cello Sonata ...

Erhu 



Kodaly


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## KenOC (Mar 7, 2011)

When I lived in northern Thailand in 1967-69, I used to listen to Radio Beijing on the shortwave at night. Sometimes they would play classical-type music, very much in the Western idiom but with Chinese flavor. I remember several pieces, like harmonica concertos or other odd combinations, that were really quite good. They have all vanished now, it seems.

Remaining from this “Cultural Revolution” music are the Yellow River Concerto and the Great Wall Symphony, both available on YouTube. The Yellow River concerto ends with the melody to “The East is Red.” Here are the words:

The east is red, the sun is rising.
From China comes Mao Zedong.
He strives for the people's happiness,
Hurrah, he is the people's great saviour! 

Chairman Mao loves the people,
He is our guide
to building a new China
Hurrah, lead us forward!

The Communist Party is like the sun,
Wherever it shines, it is bright
Wherever the Communist Party is
Hurrah, the people are liberated!


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## sonance (Aug 20, 2018)

Some years ago the CD label Channel released an edition „Channel of China", featuring a CD completely dedicated to the pipa, another dedicated to the erhu, another for plucked instruments in general and one by the China National Symphony Orchestra. 
All works on the pipa CD are traditionals. The other CDs contain also traditionals or transcriptions of traditional folk songs, but are interspersed with some works by known composers. Although I'm sure that those composers composed in the classical Chinese style, not mixed with Western style.

Anyway: I can recommend all those four CDs.


































Here is a pipa traditional (from the aforementioned CD):





There's another one in this edition dedicated to various flutes (which I don't possess). - Channel offers you the download of the booklets - so you might be able to learn more.

Another series dedicated to world music had been "World Network". I've got some CDs, but not the one with Chinese music. Judging from the other recordings, the music is all traditional. (I guess that the names on the back of the cover indicate the musicians, not composers.)


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## pcnog11 (Nov 14, 2016)

KenOC said:


> When I lived in northern Thailand in 1967-69, I used to listen to Radio Beijing on the shortwave at night. Sometimes they would play classical-type music, very much in the Western idiom but with Chinese flavor. I remember several pieces, like harmonica concertos or other odd combinations, that were really quite good. They have all vanished now, it seems.
> 
> Remaining from this "Cultural Revolution" music are the Yellow River Concerto and the Great Wall Symphony, both available on YouTube. The Yellow River concerto ends with the melody to "The East is Red." Here are the words:
> 
> ...


The original version of the Yellow River Piano Concerto did not have " The East is Red". It is an add on based on the request of Mao's wife during the Cultural Revolution. The Yellow River Concerto is based on a choral piece of the same name. It was composed earlier during WWII to boost moral in China to fight the Japanese.


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## KenOC (Mar 7, 2011)

pcnog11 said:


> The original version of the Yellow River Piano Concerto did not have " The East is Red". It is an add on based on the request of Mao's wife during the Cultural Revolution. The Yellow River Concerto is based on a choral piece of the same name. It was composed earlier during WWII to boost moral in China to fight the Japanese.


Yes, I've never heard the original Yellow River Cantata. But I see there are several recordings of it, and it can be streamed for free by Amazon Prime members. Gotta give this a listen, thanks!


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## pcnog11 (Nov 14, 2016)

KenOC said:


> Yes, I've never heard the original Yellow River Cantata. But I see there are several recordings of it, and it can be streamed for free by Amazon Prime members. Gotta give this a listen, thanks!


Please check this out -






It is a live performance with traditional Chinese instruments and Western instruments. The spirit is excellent!


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## Phil loves classical (Feb 8, 2017)

This is my favourite Chinese Music collection. My Dad loves the Butterfly Lovers, but it always puts me to sleep.






For older music, this one is nice:


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## Myriadi (Mar 6, 2016)

China has a funny way of dealing with its history. You can see it in their older cities where instead of restoring old buildings they're demolishing them and replacing them with modern replicas - nobody cares if they're modern as long as they look more or less the same. Build quality doesn't matter, either, since the replicas can be rebuilt with comparatively little effort.

With traditional music, it's a bit of a similar situation. Take the erhu for example, the "Chinese violin" as some have called it. The instrument was traditionally adapted from a folk version for classical ensemble playing. In the early 20th century a certain Chinese composer who really liked Western music endeavoured to create a solo repertoire for the erhu, so elevating it to a higher status. This happened in the 1930s, and today the erhu is ubiquitous, yet it is a modern tradition heavily influenced by Western violin concerti, sonatas, and whatnot. It's up to you to decide how traditional and how Chinese this tradition is.

The two traditions which have survived relatively well into the 21st century are Chinese opera and qin (guqin) music. The opera (which really shouldn't be called that, but...) tradition has many different branches from ancient to modern, and while stagings are rare, there are quite a few records available: 
- Opera classique Kunqu - Le Pavillon Aux Pivoines (on Maison des Cultures du Monde)
- An Introduction to Chinese Opera (on Marco Polo, probably out of print)
- Opera du Sichuan - La legende de serpent blanc and Opera de Pekin - La foret en feu, la princesse Cent-Fleurs (on Buda Musique, probably out of print as well)
- Chinese Academy of Peking Opera - The World of Peking Opera (on Victor, ditto for availability)

Some styles of Chinese opera are more dynamic than others, some use a lot of percussion while others use almost none, and there's a multitude of other differences. It's not an easy music tradition to get into, even for those who speak Chinese. But at least there are stories to follow and dialogue to listen to.

The qin (guqin) is an ancient zither-type instrument. Traditionally it was the educated person's instrument of choice. Roughly speaking, the music contains 70% melodies and rhythms and 30% isolated notes, noises, and whatnot. This is because most pieces tell stories, and the music encodes particular events. The sound of feet marching, the sound of someone crying, etc. You can't really decipher any of this from just listening, and in the past the elite could act all snobbish because they knew the code and the others didn't. Regardless, it's fasinating music and well worth spending some time with. There are plenty of records available. Li Xiangting and Cheng Gongliang are two of the most famous players from recent times, and Guan Ping-hu is perhaps the most famous of older players (one of his records was included on the Voyager Golden Record). There are some technicalities here, too, regarding the authenticity of the music: modern players tend to be influenced by Western practices and produce more abstract renditions of classic tunes, while on older records the rhythms are much more regular and even dance-y. Traditionally silk strings have been employed, but barely anybody plays that way anymore; there are just a few records of silk stringed guqin.

Some other CDs worthy of attention are 



 (a modern, but sensitively played, version of Jiangnan Sizhu, a traditional style Wikipedia has an article about; it's a good introduction since most of the pieces are traditional and exist in a multitude of versions - you can use the CD as a starting point in studying the various styles of playing), most CDs of Chinese music released by Ocora (esp. Chen Zhong - Musiques de Shanghai and Nan-Kouan - Chants courtois de la Chine du sud), and a collection of Chinese 78RPM records released on CD: https://www.discogs.com/Various-Gen...ves-His-Master-All-By-Himself/release/1522143 - the sound quality is abysmally bad, but for the most part it's about as authentic as you can possibly get.

As for ritual and folk music, it's too huge a topic. There are over 50 different ethnic groups living in China. And I feel like this post is already far too long...

Hope this helps.


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## Xisten267 (Sep 2, 2018)

I have a book of music's history that includes suggestions of listening of what would be some key works for each chapter. About Chinese music, the recommendations by chapter are:

*Music in Ancient China:*

Zhu Xi - _Shijing_ (Book of Songs)
Jiang Kui - Song of Yangzhou
Yang Zuan - Qin anthology _Purple Cloud Cave_
Zhu Quan - Qin anthology _Manual of the Mysterious and the Marvellous_
Tang Xianhu - _Kunqu_ opera _The Peony Pavilion_

*Chinese Traditional Opera:*

_The Peony Pavilion
Peach Blosson Fan
The Three Kingdoms
The Water Margin
Journey To The West
Dream of the Red Chamber
Romance of the West Chamber_


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