# Help needed from the Haydn enthusiasts



## Gouldanian (Nov 19, 2015)

Dearest friends,

Would you kindly suggest me the definitive (or at least the greatest in your opinion) recording of the following pieces:

- the 104
- the Surprise
- the Drumroll
- any other one you see worthy

Why I ask the Haydn's enthusiasts specifically it's because I believe that those who love something the most are the ones who see its finest details and subtleties and thus their knowledge is most valuable and appreciated.

Should you provide me with your opinion, please do so by indicating me your absolute favorite for each piece and not a full listing of all great recordings out there.

Thanks in advance,


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## clavichorder (May 2, 2011)

102, the Clock, and 88 are tops as well to be added to that list of late great Haydn. These are actually my two favorite symphonies. Try Franz Bruggen's late Haydn set. Very musical phrasing, there is the breath of life from sensitive musicianship, but it's also HIP.

But I also strongly recommend taking an interest in the middle period symphonies, which are roughly(because the numbering is not chronological) 39 with some earlier exceptions to 64 or so with some later exceptions. Within that, my favorites are 45, 51, 43, 58, and 64.


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## KenOC (Mar 7, 2011)

Just get the entire London Symphonies set (93-104). Sir Colin Davis has a great set on two double CDs from Decca, about $25 total, or if you're a Hipster check out Kuijken's set for somewhat more. Both are first rate, and there are others as well.

You can always live large and get the entire Dorati cycle of all the symphonies. Yes, you should definitely do that!


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## Gouldanian (Nov 19, 2015)

clavichorder said:


> 102, the Clock, and 88 are tops as well to be added to that list of late great Haydn. These are actually my two favorite symphonies. Try Franz Bruggen's late Haydn set. Very musical phrasing, there is the breath of life from sensitive musicianship, but it's also HIP.
> 
> But I also strongly recommend taking an interest in the middle period symphonies, which are roughly(because the numbering is not chronological) 39 with some earlier exceptions to 64 or so with some later exceptions. Within that, my favorites are 45, 51, 43, 58, and 64.


Much appreciated.

Do you have recommendations for the middle period symphonies?

By the way I'm usually not a fan of cycles because rarely (if not never) a conductor's reading is the best for all of the composer's work.


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## Gouldanian (Nov 19, 2015)

KenOC said:


> Just get the entire London Symphonies set (93-104). Sir Colin Davis has a great set on two double CDs from Decca, about $25 total, or if you're a Hipster check out Kuijken's set for somewhat more. Both are first rate, and there are others as well.
> 
> You can always live large and get the entire Dorati cycle of all the symphonies. Yes, you should definitely do that!


Thanks KenOC. But for the reason stated above I usually hate cycles... But maybe this would be the exception?


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## clavichorder (May 2, 2011)

Gouldanian said:


> Thanks KenOC. But for the reason stated above I usually hate cycles... But maybe this would be the exception?


The Bruggen is not a COMPLETE cycle if that helps at all, it's just 80s onward. I recommend checking out any one of his readings of the symphonies you are interested in.


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## KenOC (Mar 7, 2011)

Gouldanian said:


> Thanks KenOC. But for the reason stated above I usually hate cycles... But maybe this would be the exception?


I consider the Dorati an exception to the "inefficient cycle" rule. But perhaps others will add their wisdom.


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## Vesteralen (Jul 14, 2011)

If you don't insist on period instruments, I would definitely recommend Szell for 93 and 96, and, oddly enough, Klemperer for 102. The latter will strike some listeners as a bit heavy-handed, but give it a chance.


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## Gouldanian (Nov 19, 2015)

Gentlemen,

I settled for the Dorati cycle.

After having spent the past couple of hours listening to different readings I was convinced of two things: 1- the Doratis sound great, 2- I like the middle ones as much as the later ones. I could not settle for 94-104 I needed a couple from the 40s and the 50s as well. Now I can't wait to discover all the other ones!

Thanks for your suggestions, it was very helpful.


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## HaydnBearstheClock (Jul 6, 2013)

Gouldanian said:


> Gentlemen,
> 
> I settled for the Dorati cycle.
> 
> ...


Dear Gouldanian,

I really love the London symphonies but, as of yet, do not own certain acclaimed readings, such as Davis's or Solti's, in order to be able to judge fully. I can, however, provide short reviews of the London Symphonies interpretations I own:

Full London symphony set - Genthür Herbig, Dresdner Philharmonie.









A very fine and not that well-known set - Herbig's orchestra plays powerfully, has a very nice sparkle in both strings and winds, and has a nice elegance to it. The very high quality of the orchestral sound on this record is one of its prime strenghts - the winds especially come through very colourfully. The only slight drawback of the recording might be that Herbig sometimes 'overdoes it' in the rhythm section and makes his Haydn a bit 'thumping', making the music lose some of its elegance. But, it is still a very fine set, imo.

Overall rating: 8.5-9.0/10

I will provide more reviews shortly.


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## Funny (Nov 30, 2013)

I like Bernstein's 104, though it's not his best Haydn, I just got it recently and have been enjoying it. I've really never heard a bad #104.



Gouldanian said:


> Do you have recommendations for the middle period symphonies?


OK, so you weren't asking me, but like clavichorder I would seriously recommend checking out pre-90s symphonies. Adam Fischer and the Austro-Hungarian Haydn Orchestra on #80 is a standout.

A quick route to the middle period is Trevor Pinnock's Sturm and Drang set. Excellent interpretations and good sound. There are many good bits, but I can't stress enough Symphony #46. One of the all-time greats, and Pinnock's is a good take on it.


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## hpowders (Dec 23, 2013)

104: Sir Colin Davis/Concertgebouw.

Surprise: Sir Colin Davis/Concertgebouw.

Drumroll: Leonard Bernstein/New York Philharmonic.

Best overall London Set, modern instruments: Sir Colin Davis/Concertgebouw.

Best overall HIP London Set: Sigiswald Kuijken/La Petite Bande.


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## Haydn man (Jan 25, 2014)

I think your choice if the Dorati set is an excellent one. The consistency of performance and recording is what makes this to my mind the essential set to have
I am far from an expert on Haydn but I have supplemented the Dorati with the following








HIP inspired fresh and certainly different though not to everyone's taste but I find them immensely enjoyable









This set of the Paris Symphonies was a Rossette recording in the Penguin guide and so enough said









More HIP from Pinnock and covers several of the middle numbered symphonies with an intensity and drive I have come to expect from this conductor.

Hopefully this gives a few options for you to try and all available via streaming

Happy listening to the works of the master


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## hpowders (Dec 23, 2013)

Gouldanian said:


> Gentlemen,
> 
> I settled for the Dorati cycle.
> 
> ...


That's a nice cycle. I hope someday you hear Sir Colin Davis and Leonard Bernstein in this music if you haven't already.

There's also the Leonard Bernstein/New York Philharmonic terrific set of the Paris Symphonies.
More great Haydn!!

Happy listening!!


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## Gouldanian (Nov 19, 2015)

Dear friends,

Happy to report that following your recommendations I have added the following to my Dorati cycle:















They were both going for a very cheap price...


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## Haydn man (Jan 25, 2014)

I have not heard the Davis cycle for many years, but remember that they were highly recommended at the time


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## HaydnBearstheClock (Jul 6, 2013)

For the middle period symphonies, I would also recommend the Bruno Weil cycle (which also contains all of the Paris symphonies and 3 of the so-called 'bridge' symphonies, 88-90) -









Weil's (Hip) sound is fresh, colourful, graceful and elegant, but he still has enough dynamic bite to make the music intense when it needs to be. Definitely an excellent set to come back to.


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## Gouldanian (Nov 19, 2015)

You fellas have been very generous with your time... Thanks for all the recommendations.


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## HaydnBearstheClock (Jul 6, 2013)

Gouldanian said:


> You fellas have been very generous with your time... Thanks for all the recommendations.


Further reviews of London Symphonies recordings:

Roger Norrington, Symphonies 99-104









A very fine, lively Hip recording of these masterpieces. Norrington pays strong attention to Haydn's wit - the winds blaze and the overall sound is fresh, elegant and dynamic. As a Hip alternative to recordings on modern instruments, this recording fares very well. Definitely recommended.


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## Haydn man (Jan 25, 2014)

K


HaydnBearstheClock said:


> For the middle period symphonies, I would also recommend the Bruno Weil cycle (which also contains all of the Paris symphonies and 3 of the so-called 'bridge' symphonies, 88-90) -
> 
> View attachment 78557
> 
> ...


I have heard some of Weil's Haydn and enjoyed it
I am at present comparing his Paris Symphonies with Kuijken


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