# "Bland" Classical Music and Composers



## peeyaj (Nov 17, 2010)

*"Bland"* - Lacking strong features or characteristics and therefore uninteresting.

Who is guilty of that, in your own opinion?


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## ComposerOfAvantGarde (Dec 2, 2011)

Land of hope and glory......blandness kills my ears....music sounds so snory......zzzzzzzz

Probably Elgar.


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## peeyaj (Nov 17, 2010)

*Carl Neilsen.* Found his music quite bland.


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## peeyaj (Nov 17, 2010)

ComposerOfAvantGarde said:


> Land of hope and glory......blandness kills my ears....music sounds so snory......zzzzzzzz
> 
> Probably Elgar.


I'm actually fond of that music, COAG. Especially when it was played in Proms.


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## KenOC (Mar 7, 2011)

Bland...most of the Russian music of The Five, with some (a few!) exceptions. I'd mention Glazunov but don't want to offend a particular person...


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## peeyaj (Nov 17, 2010)

KenOC said:


> Bland...most of the Russian music of The Five, with some (a few!) exceptions. I'd mention Glazunov but don't want to offend a particular person...


That particular person would ban you in TC forever..   Peace!


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## violadude (May 2, 2011)

peeyaj said:


> *Carl Neilsen.* Found his music quite bland.


If you just heard a noise, it was the sound of my jaw dropping to the floor.


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## ComposerOfAvantGarde (Dec 2, 2011)

Got one...dare I mention Ludovico Einaudi? Not really classical but anyway...definitely bland.


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## Weston (Jul 11, 2008)

Dare I mention Delius? His themes kind of meander around. They ascend a little then maybe descend, then they may ascend a little less or a little more, then they sort of putter around a bit more. A major snooze fest for me. He has a very cool Latinized name though.


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## GGluek (Dec 11, 2011)

Without wanting to offend anyone, yes, Delius (to me). Youthful Mozart. Most Vivaldi. Much of The Five (minus Mussorgsky). Anyone who repeats phrases several times verbatim for the sake of "drama." Romantic ballet scores by Adolphe Adam and his ilk.


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## Crudblud (Dec 29, 2011)

It's interesting to note that there's already more mention of English composers than those of any other nationality, a list to which I will add Vaughan Williams.


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## Mahlerian (Nov 27, 2012)

The problem with the answers so far as that they're not bland enough. They all have recognizable personalities (well, except maybe Cesar Cui...).

If I think of bland, I think of 19th century American classical music like MacDowell.


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## Art Rock (Nov 28, 2009)

Apparently I like bland music if these posts are to be believed.


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## ahammel (Oct 10, 2012)

peeyaj said:


> *Carl Neilsen.* Found his music quite bland.


That seems an odd description for a guy who once wrote an instruction in a score to the effect that the snare drummer should play so crazily as to throw off the rest of the orchestra.


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## presto (Jun 17, 2011)

peeyaj said:


> *Carl Neilsen.* Found his music quite bland.


That's very interesting, I've just purchased the symphonies 4 & 5 and cant get into them, they don't seem to go anywhere!


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## superhorn (Mar 23, 2010)

I fail to see how anyone could call Nielsen's music "bland" . It's not spelled Neilsen . The great "Inextinguishable " symphony no 4? The amazing 5th? The clarinet concerto and other works?
Nor are works by Elgar such as his two great symphonies , which ar elike Brahms on steroids,
the cello and violin concertos, the jolly "Cockgaine" overure, th e"In the South " overture, the profound oratorio "The Dream of Gerontius", the symphonic poem "Falstaff "? 
For me, the epitome of blandness is Charles Gounod . Pretty melodies, yes . But to quote Gertude Stein,
"There's no there there ". Faust is an utter trivialization of the nonumental Goethe drama and the Faust legend in general . Busoni's "Doktor faust" is an infinitely more interestng opera . 
The opera Romeo &Juliette is filled with with music of cloying sentimentality . The Saint Cecilia mass is the most insipid setting of the mass I've ever heard . The patron saint of music deserves better .


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## ptr (Jan 22, 2013)

Bland... Yeah, I don't get the taste any composer... No, wait, wait, there is something creeping up my tongue... James A. Bland, Edward Bland, those are about the only Bland composers I can come up with*... 

/ptr

*Thanks Google!


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## neoshredder (Nov 7, 2011)

Probably one of the minimalist Composers.


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## jani (Jun 15, 2012)

I know that i am gonna get shot from saying this but i find lots of Bach's music bland but i also love loads of it.
It's mostly his organ works i don't like, so i guess i don't like the timbre of the organ.


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## Stargazer (Nov 9, 2011)

I've always found Haydn really bland for the most part. When you write that many symphonies though, its not exactly expected that every one will be a masterpiece!


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## Celloissimo (Mar 29, 2013)

neoshredder said:


> Probably one of the minimalist Composers.


Your standpoint is quite understandable, but I've always loved Adams. For me, his style of minimalism has a certain nuance in it that removes minimalism's stereotypical blandness and reveals an inner depth of subtle orchestration and complexity. I've listened to his Violin Concerto, Shaker Loops and arias from Nixon In China time and time again and always pick up on something new each time. For me, to be able to build upon a banal repetition of notes into a beautiful and harmonious blend is quite remarkable.


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## ahammel (Oct 10, 2012)

jani said:


> I know that i am gonna get shot from saying this but i find lots of Bach's music bland but i also love loads of it.
> It's mostly his organ works i don't like, so i guess i don't like the timbre of the organ.


Once one's catalogue number reach the thousands, some of it isn't going to be that great.


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## violadude (May 2, 2011)

Stargazer said:


> I've always found Haydn really bland for the most part. When you write that many symphonies though, its not exactly expected that every one will be a masterpiece!


Another jaw dropper.

As for me, most of the composers that I have found bland I have already forgotten about or had the fortune of never hearing at all.


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## Huilunsoittaja (Apr 6, 2010)

KenOC said:


> Bland...most of the Russian music of The Five, with some (a few!) exceptions. I'd mention Glazunov but don't want to offend a particular person...


You can say that again.... 

Although, I am rather surprised you'd disparaged the Five too, I think I may be equally offended at that. Rimsky-Korsakov, Borodin, Mussorgsky... bland? You must be a russophobe, and also germano-centric in your tastes. But that's how it was centuries ago, the only thing Germans could consider the Russians was as _barbarians_.

Proud to have barbaric tastes!


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## PetrB (Feb 28, 2012)

Mahlerian said:


> The problem with the answers so far as that they're not bland enough. They all have recognizable personalities (well, except maybe Cesar Cui...).
> 
> If I think of bland, I think of 19th century American classical music like MacDowell.


so many later / late 19th century romantics throughout the west fit the bill:

Yeah, 'the five' -- also excepting Mussorgsky; while Rimsky Korsakov is 'colorful' it is also bland... Sheherezade anyone, with its endless sequencing and highly repeated and very slightly varied variations? -- and later Russian Nikolai Medtner (just do not hear or see the present trend / fascination with what is to me another completely bland composer, his contrapuntal skill set is moot if the material is so, bleh....

I'd include those 'bland British' as listed elsewhere in this thread...

Cesar Franck, etc. The bland epoch does not know just one nationality...

But, once I became aware of it, well, try the Gabriel Pierne Piano Concerto No. 1 -- flat as unleavened bread, no distinct flavor at all. I can think the only reason to compose something like it is to have a severe sort of horror vacui related to sound vs. silence -- certainly, within 'classical' parameters, one of the major contenders for first place in bland...

On the pop front, well, the already nominated Euinaudi is certainly one very major contender, along with whomever penned the musicals Les Miserables, Miss Saigon, the bulk of Andrew Lloyd Weber, a lot of film scores, including the famous John Williams and Mr. Shore's Lord of the Rings, 'The Legend of Zelda' couldn't be much more forgettable or ever so slightly annoying than it already is... another prize winner. The world is awash in bland


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## Tristan (Jan 5, 2013)

A lot of people keep mentioning The Five. I'm still confused as to how Rimsky-Korsakov is bland, but alright. Probably best not to get into it 

I used to find Brahms bland and boring. I've since changed my opinion on that. I obviously don't have any music that I consider "bland" so it's hard for me to come up with any examples. There are some sub-genres that I've avoided altogether and perhaps some of that music would seem "bland" to me, but I'd really have to do more investigation.


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## neoshredder (Nov 7, 2011)

Art Rock said:


> Apparently I like bland music if these posts are to be believed.


Yeah I know what you are saying. Vaughan Williams, Nielsen, Haydn...? GIve me more of those bland Composers. lol


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## Andreas (Apr 27, 2012)

I would have to put Chopin near the very top of the list.


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## Mahlerian (Nov 27, 2012)

I think we're just turning this into "music that you dislike". Often, we dislike things, and they seem bland to us, when we are simply not open to whatever charm they may have.

As I said before, the problem with a lot of the composers people have been citing is that they have quite distinct musical personalities, whether we like those personalities or not.

As an example of utterly personality-free, by-the-numbers music from a period/style I usually enjoy, here's the tone poem Taormina by Ernst Boehe.










If you can find music blander than that....


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## aleazk (Sep 30, 2011)

Andreas said:


> I would have to put Chopin near the very top of the list.


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## trazom (Apr 13, 2009)

Mendelssohn, his string quartets make Mozart's "Haydn quartets" sound like Scriabin and the piano trios and Songs Without Words always remind me of being on a treadmill: There's motion but you never go anywhere.


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## norman bates (Aug 18, 2010)

Weston said:


> Dare I mention Delius? His themes kind of meander around. They ascend a little then maybe descend, then they may ascend a little less or a little more, then they sort of putter around a bit more.


but this is not what i would call "bland". Some say that his music is shapeless, and it seems that you have a similar idea. But his harmonies are always very complex and unique, something that it's difficult to associate with the idea of bland music.


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## Guest (Apr 4, 2013)

To answer the OP, may I suggest Czerny, Ries and Salieri? Or even a lot of the stuff that William Christie does? This is a personal opinion aimed at replying honestly to the OP.


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## HarpsichordConcerto (Jan 1, 2010)

neoshredder said:


> Probably one of the minimalist Composers.


Not a bad suggestion. But they would argue "the music is already there and that's the whole point of minimalism". I call foul. Minimal (lack of?) invention and lots and lots and lots ... and lots of repetition.


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## peeyaj (Nov 17, 2010)

presto said:


> That's very interesting, I've just purchased the symphonies 4 & 5 and cant get into them, they don't seem to go anywhere!


Amen to that. They go nowhere.


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## Sid James (Feb 7, 2009)

peeyaj said:


> *Carl Neilsen.* Found his music quite bland.


If you mean bland to equate with restrained or pared down then yeah, his first couple of symphonies do speak to that aesthetic (influenced by Brahms). But more you get towards his last symphony - 4, 5, 6 - I don't find them bland. Not to speak of the Aladdin Suite (nothing but colour). Mind you, his Clarinet Concerto does have that austere, pared down feel to some extent. But in terms of his symphonies, Nielsen's the opposite of Sibelius who starts of more colourful with his 1st and 2nd symphonies and then then progresses to his 7th symphony, which is like black and white, monochrome. I think as he progressed, Nielsen also used larger orchestras, basically for more colour and impact/contrast.

But going on that, do you think Brahms to be bland? Then maybe what you're saying re Nielsen - well some of this stuff - makes sense. The restraint (relative to guys like Tchaikovsky for example, I'm talking mainly of orchestration).



Mahlerian said:


> ...
> If I think of bland, I think of 19th century American classical music like MacDowell.


We in Australia, like USA, had a good deal of those composers who just aped Europe. Its after 1945 composers here fashioned a more distinct sound. But in America, it happened earlier, in the early 20th century. An exception of pre-1945 era for Oz is Percy Grainger, now he was unique, but he didn't spend that much of his career here.



Mahlerian said:


> I think we're just turning this into "music that you dislike"...


That's right.


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## CypressWillow (Apr 2, 2013)

I'm with you, aleazk. And may I add: Yikes!



aleazk said:


>


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## CypressWillow (Apr 2, 2013)

For me, bland is Telemann.


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## HarpsichordConcerto (Jan 1, 2010)

CypressWillow said:


> For me, bland is Telemann.


Try his violin concertos on the CPO label played by Elisabeth Wallfisch (on period instruments). Modern instrument style can make Telemann (and others) bland / sound like a Romantic piece, which it is not. If that didn't work; ah well, you are entitled to your opinion!


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## Novelette (Dec 12, 2012)

Yeah, I definitely have to add my vote for Vaughan-Williams. =\


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## Mahlerian (Nov 27, 2012)

Sid James said:


> We in Australia, like USA, had a good deal of those composers who just aped Europe. Its after 1945 composers here fashioned a more distinct sound. But in America, it happened earlier, in the early 20th century. An exception of pre-1945 era for Oz is Percy Grainger, now he was unique, but he didn't spend that much of his career here.


Well, early in the 20th century, we had all sorts of great music developing on the popular front, but, aside from Ives, not much in classical, and given that he labored in solitude, his impact wasn't felt until much later, when an American style of classical music had already begun to develop.


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## StlukesguildOhio (Dec 25, 2006)

I think we're just turning this into "music that you dislike".

Does that actually surprise you? What else was the intention? The thread could have been titled "Classical Music that Sucks" or "Classical Music that's Annoying" or "Classical Music that's Boring" and the result would have been the same.


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## Mahlerian (Nov 27, 2012)

StlukesguildOhio said:


> Does that actually surprise you? What else was the intention? The thread could have been titled "Classical Music that Sucks" or "Classical Music that's Annoying" or "Classical Music that's Boring" and the result would have been the same.


Well, those are all significantly different questions, and I would answer them differently. There's plenty of music I dislike that I wouldn't go around calling bland just because it strikes me that way.


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## Feathers (Feb 18, 2013)

Andreas said:


> I would have to put Chopin near the very top of the list.




Are you sure you sure you didn't get this thread mixed up with the one about the greatest composers for piano?


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## Sid James (Feb 7, 2009)

Mahlerian said:


> Well, early in the 20th century, we had all sorts of great music developing on the popular front, but, aside from Ives, not much in classical, and given that he labored in solitude, his impact wasn't felt until much later, when an American style of classical music had already begun to develop.


Yeah I think its post WW1 that most of your 'distinct' music emerged. In Australia it was post WW2, as I said. & I don't think that things got moving in both countries after world wars is entirely coincidental either. During/after WWI, Europe got exposed to American music too (it went both ways). Stravinsky actually wrote a ragtime, based on what he'd heard the American soldiers bring/listening to when they finally entered the war (after sinking of Lusitania, the passenger ship). Echoes of it in WW2 when America entered after Pearl Harbour. They needed that kind of 'jolt.' But anyway I digress.

BTW re popular type music early 20th century in USA, I read recently that it was an anniversary of Scott Joplin's death. He actually died in poverty!?

Re the meaning of 'bland' usually I take it to mean less colourful/monochromatic orchestration. Its why I asked peeyaj those questions. Think Shostakovich, later Sibelius, Brahms (in comparison to others). Even Beethoven has been called utilitarian in the orchestration department, but so what? As a chamber fan I don't mind lack of colour, some composers aim at that aesthetic deliberately, to get certain effects.


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## peeyaj (Nov 17, 2010)

In opposites side, what classical music and composers are colorful and meaty? Tchaikovsky' orchestration is colorful, same to Grieg's Piano concerto!


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## Mahlerian (Nov 27, 2012)

Sid James said:


> BTW re popular type music early 20th century in USA, I read recently that it was an anniversary of Scott Joplin's death. He actually died in poverty!?


Well, he didn't make any money off of the rags that sold in reams (one time publisher's fee only, I think), and he spent a good deal of time working on a project he wanted to be a full-fledged opera, but because of his race, no one would have ever taken him seriously. He was also hit hard with syphilis.



peeyaj said:


> In opposites side, what classical music and composers are colorful and meaty?


Debussy!


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## ComposerOfAvantGarde (Dec 2, 2011)

Mahlerian said:


> StlukesguildOhio said:
> 
> 
> > I think we're just turning this into "music that you dislike".
> ...


So would I.

Classical music that is bland: the trio from Elgar's Pomp and Whatever...the first one
Classical music that that sucks: the string quartet attributed to Benjamin Franklin
Classical music that's annoying: the first mvt of Brandenburg concerto no. 2 
Classical music that's boring: hmm I don't really find anything that boring actually....


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## Andreas (Apr 27, 2012)

aleazk said:


>


Somehow, this reminds me of the beginning of the slow movement of Bartók's Music for Strings, Percussion and Celesta.

No offense to anyone who's fond of Chopin, but his music is the kind of lyric-virtuosic piano music that passes right through me and leaves nothing behind.


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## violadude (May 2, 2011)

HarpsichordConcerto said:


> Try his violin concertos on the CPO label played by Elisabeth Wallfisch (on period instruments). Modern instrument style can make Telemann (and others) bland / sound like a Romantic piece, which it is not. If that didn't work; ah well, you are entitled to your opinion!


HC, I like you a lot better when you are talking about music you like rather than music you dislike.


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## violadude (May 2, 2011)

neoshredder said:


> Probably one of the minimalist Composers.


Hmm...maybe that applies to Philip Glass, but the minimalist style has grown up and developed ino something quite colorful.


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## KenOC (Mar 7, 2011)

Andreas said:


> No offense to anyone who's fond of Chopin, but his music is the kind of lyric-virtuosic piano music that passes right through me and leaves nothing behind.


"Leaves no messy residue..." Can be a good thing!


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## neoshredder (Nov 7, 2011)

violadude said:


> Hmm...maybe that applies to Philip Glass, but the minimalist style has grown up and developed ino something quite colorful.


Steve Reich would be my choice.


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## violadude (May 2, 2011)

neoshredder said:


> Steve Reich would be my choice.


Your choice as to which minimalist you like the most or your choice as to which is the most bland?


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## neoshredder (Nov 7, 2011)

violadude said:


> Your choice as to which minimalist you like the most or your choice as to which is the most bland?


Most bland. But I haven't heard John Adams yet. I just know that style isn't for me. It drives me crazy when something doesn't change over time.


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## EricABQ (Jul 10, 2012)

neoshredder said:


> It drives me crazy when something doesn't change over time.


I would advise you not to get married.


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## KenOC (Mar 7, 2011)

Music is "bland" to me if it's just more of the same old same old, with nothing interesting happening. Even "annoying" relaxes the pressure on my bland gland.


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## Couchie (Dec 9, 2010)

For myself, the symphonists who focused on texture at the expense of stimulating musical motifs. 

Mahler, Bruckner, Sibelius, etc.


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## Crudblud (Dec 29, 2011)

neoshredder said:


> Most bland. But I haven't heard John Adams yet. I just know that style isn't for me. It drives me crazy when something doesn't change over time.


Reich's brand of minimalism is all about changing over time. Maybe your problem is that it changes gradually rather than immediately?


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## elgar's ghost (Aug 8, 2010)

The nearest I can equate with 'bland' is Anton Rubinstein (excepting 'Ivan the Terrible' symphonic poem). Most of what I've heard sounds rather generic and completely earthbound - like the classical equivalent of Hootie & The Blowfish.


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## Huilunsoittaja (Apr 6, 2010)

peeyaj said:


> In opposites side, what classical music and composers are colorful and meaty? Tchaikovsky' orchestration is colorful, same to Grieg's Piano concerto!


Russian Composers of course!


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## DeepR (Apr 13, 2012)

neoshredder said:


> It drives me crazy when something doesn't change over time.


In certain kinds of music (minimal, ambient) there doesn't seem to happen much on the surface, but IMO the good stuff always has subtle changes going on. Some of these changes may occur at a very slow pace, others may occur quicker, but it will take time before you start to notice their subtleties. 
It's a matter of patience, listening without any expectations and getting accustomed to it. I think that some of this music may be best listened to for the first time while doing other things, like browsing this forum. In time, you may start to appreciate the music also when listening "actively".


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## Mahlerian (Nov 27, 2012)

Couchie said:


> For myself, the symphonists who focused on texture at the expense of stimulating musical motifs.
> 
> Mahler, Bruckner, Sibelius, etc.


I don't understand what the first part of this post has to do with the latter part...none of the composers mentioned cared more about texture than motivic development...

In the case of Bruckner, people usually complain about the exact opposite, that he cared too much about development at the expense of texture.


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## tdc (Jan 17, 2011)

"colorful and meaty" this just strikes me as - yuk! Not two words I'd like to combine to describe anything I like musically. Though I think I understand the meaning and agree it could make perfect sense, it just strikes me as a bad combination of terms. :lol:


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## violadude (May 2, 2011)

Couchie said:


> For myself, the symphonists who focused on texture at the expense of stimulating musical motifs.
> 
> Mahler, Bruckner, Sibelius, etc.


Hm I would think composers that fit that description would be more like Rautavaarra or *SEGERSTAM*


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## Xaltotun (Sep 3, 2010)

tdc said:


> "colorful and meaty" this just strikes me as - yuk! Not two words I'd like to combine to describe anything I like musically. Though I think I understand the meaning and agree it could make perfect sense, it just strikes me as a bad combination of terms. :lol:


I'll tell you what's colorful and meaty, and something I like musically. Segerstam conducting an orchestra! His face goes pretty red from the exertion these days, you see!


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## neoshredder (Nov 7, 2011)

Crudblud said:


> Reich's brand of minimalism is all about changing over time. Maybe your problem is that it changes gradually rather than immediately?


Well to my ears, the changes aren't enough to avoid the irritation. Horrible imo. But its more the idea of Minimalism as Reich is just a part of that subgenre I don't like.


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## Novelette (Dec 12, 2012)

Sid James said:


> As a chamber fan I don't mind lack of colour, some composers aim at that aesthetic deliberately, to get certain effects.


If I may interpose, I think that a great appreciation for chamber music gives a listener a more discerning appreciation for the nuances and subtleties of orchestral coloration that a less discerning listener would never detect. It was certainly the case with me that I had to learn to appreciate the expertise with which composers create a full bouquet of sound in the limited timbre of the string quartet before I could gain a good appreciation for that which makes Haydn and Mozart great.


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## DeepR (Apr 13, 2012)

DeepR said:


> In certain kinds of music (minimal, ambient) there doesn't seem to happen much on the surface, but IMO the good stuff always has subtle changes going on. Some of these changes may occur at a very slow pace, others may occur quicker, but it will take time before you start to notice their subtleties.
> It's a matter of patience, listening without any expectations and getting accustomed to it. I think that some of this music may be best listened to for the first time while doing other things, like browsing this forum. In time, you may start to appreciate the music also when listening "actively".


I mentioned minimal and ambient music, because this is music that a lot of people will find particularly bland. In my experience, some music only appears to be bland on first listenings, but once you start discovering its subtleties and find a way to listen to the music comfortably, worlds open up. Although it may take years before you can fully appreciate it.
I like how certain minimal and ambient music doesn't force anything upon you. There doesn't have to be any meaning behind it, as long as you can find your own meaning in it.

Not that I don't like music that is highly active, melodic, emotionally charged, dramatic, turbulent, bombastic even... on the contrary... I guess different kinds of music stimulate different areas of the brain. I like these extremes in music.


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## Novelette (Dec 12, 2012)

neoshredder said:


> Well to my ears, the changes aren't enough to avoid the irritation. Horrible imo. But it's more the idea of Minimalism, as Reich is just a part of that subgenre, that I don't like.


My sentiments precisely with respect to Reich. =S


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## neoshredder (Nov 7, 2011)

DeepR said:


> I mentioned minimal and ambient music, because this is music that a lot of people will find particularly bland. In my experience, some music only appears to be bland on first listenings, but once you start discovering its subtleties and find a way to listen to the music comfortably, worlds open up. Although it may take years before you can fully appreciate it.
> I like how certain minimal and ambient music doesn't force anything upon you. There doesn't have to be any meaning behind it, as long as you can find your own meaning in it.
> 
> Not that I don't like music that is highly active, melodic, emotionally charged, dramatic, turbulent, bombastic even... on the contrary... I guess different kinds of music stimulate different areas of the brain. I like these extremes in music.


Or you can take mind altering drugs as a short cut. lol


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## Crudblud (Dec 29, 2011)

neoshredder said:


> Well to my ears, the changes aren't enough to avoid the irritation. Horrible imo. But its more the idea of Minimalism as Reich is just a part of that subgenre I don't like.


Yes, I'm not much of a fan myself. I was just trying to establish what aspects of the music you took issue with.


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## Sid James (Feb 7, 2009)

Novelette said:


> If I may interpose, I think that a great appreciation for chamber music gives a listener a more discerning appreciation for the nuances and subtleties of orchestral coloration that a less discerning listener would never detect. It was certainly the case with me that I had to learn to appreciate the expertise with which composers create a full bouquet of sound in the limited timbre of the string quartet before I could gain a good appreciation for that which makes Haydn and Mozart great.


What you say makes sense with the Classical Era especially, in terms of how orchestras then where small, or the size of a chamber orchestra. But also in terms of how in the 20th century, many composers opted for a kind of 'less is more' approach to orchestration, avoiding/rejecting the 'bigger is better' aesthetic of their predecessors. But even Mahler, who comes into the picture early on, sometimes divides his orchestra into these tight units (eg. his 4th symphony) and guys like Shostakovich would do the same thing later (eg. his 5th symphony). I'm talking esp. of their use of the string section in those.

But in terms of my own taste, what you say holds true, I generally dislike what I call 'music on steroids.' But composers like Mahler and Bruckner, though using sometimes mammoth orchestras (and the vocal element sometimes added), they still could balance the big and small aspects. So too even R. Strauss and Wagner, eg. in their chamber works, but I got little time for their gargantuan things (its only a matter of my taste, I must emphasise this!).

So some people may call chamber music bland, or what I sometimes hear is its without colour, but for me there's that added intimacy which makes up for not having a whole orchestra at your disposal. & I like orchestral music too, probably equally, just that chamber holds a special place for me as well.

*& re those subtle changes in minimalism*, I read in a book that a way to 'cheat' and hear the difference in the sea of sameness (or whats seemingly all the same) is to listen to the beginnig of a long minimalist work, and then skip forward and listen to the end. Maybe the first and last minute or two. Contrast those and you hear what the work progresses from. Its often a considerable/noticeable difference. But the stuff in between only gradually changes, so you don't hear it. Like time lapse photography maybe, how it captures a flower blooming, whereas in real life its VERY slow. Do it with Reich or Glass, one of their long works, and maybe you will notice that progression.


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## drpraetorus (Aug 9, 2012)

Chopin. Almost like Xanax


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## drpraetorus (Aug 9, 2012)

Ketelby, Arne, Coates, Goldmark, Ponchielli, Most Obscure Baroque Composers (there's a reason they're obscure). Most Brahms pieces. Elgar. Salieri (yeah, that guy).


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## MagneticGhost (Apr 7, 2013)

It is painful to read that some people find Vaughan Williams bland. So much so that I had to register to the site to post this message  
Still each to there own.
I listened to Schumann's symphonies the other day and they left me cold. 
I find a lot of early "Classical period" music like Dittersdorf and early Haydn too formulaic and obvious.


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## Xaltotun (Sep 3, 2010)

This is hard one, I don't find many composers bland. Now, on the other hand, conductors... we have bland conductors in spades, it sometimes feels hard to find one who _isn't_ bland. Or maybe I'm spoiled?


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## TheVioletKing (Jan 9, 2013)

ComposerOfAvantGarde said:


> Classical music that's annoying: the first mvt of Brandenburg concerto no. 2


Howwwwww????????


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## Richannes Wrahms (Jan 6, 2014)

CypressWillow said:


> I'm with you, aleazk. And may I add: Yikes!


I am not.

...those overly figurated melodies chromatically running down like some kind of rainbow slime...

....those never ending arpeggios...

Saved by his inventive harmony.


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## quack (Oct 13, 2011)

Its rare to find composer Edward Osmund Bland mentioned, let alone a whole thread about him.






Oh well, that does rather live up to his name. He was definitely better at jazz and funk.


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## Albert7 (Nov 16, 2014)

Only bland composer for me is Havergal Brian but that's it.


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## MoonlightSonata (Mar 29, 2014)

MagneticGhost said:


> It is painful to read that some people find Vaughan Williams bland. So much so that I had to register to the site to post this message
> Still each to there own.
> I listened to Schumann's symphonies the other day and they left me cold.
> I find a lot of early "Classical period" music like Dittersdorf and early Haydn too formulaic and obvious.


Vaughan Williams? Bland?! No wonder you joined!


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## mtmailey (Oct 21, 2011)

To be honest there are to many to list therefore i am not going to try.


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