# Do you read reviews?



## Mephistopheles

Reviews of classical music recordings can be useful and dubious all at the same time. I think there is a wisdom of the crowd mentality that can be very helpful (I thought the Mahler symphonies People's Edition by DG was a fantastic idea for a Mahler n00b like me), although I find it also has a certain bias towards older recordings except when you're asking about HIP. There's nothing wrong with that, some of the oldies really are the best, but there are also some great young conductors and performers that we shouldn't neglect - we should always be aware that sometimes it's just popularity that garners more popularity rather than actual quality.

Personally, I don't read many reviews, but I do subscribe to a magazine almost exclusively for its reviews section (I don't care much for their articles). I start by homing in on anything with 4 or 5 stars and then go on a Spotify/Grooveshark exploration, either comparing an unfamiliar recording to something I already own, or wondering if this piece by Bach/Mozart/Beethoven/Schubert/Brahms/etc. that I've never heard before might be worth the time. Even reviews of recordings that give only 1-3 stars can be useful because they can warn you where not to put your effort in, and they could still be listing pieces that you might never have thought of before which you can go in search of elsewhere.

I find this one of the best ways to find new classical music. _Not_ because you should ever take the reviews at face value (I was this week introduced to the Janacek string quartets by a review but found a recording on my own that I thought just pipped their suggestion), but because they help narrow the search when, sometimes, finding that next piece that tickles your musical fancy can be like finding a needle in a haystack. I also think that, where they exist, the reviews on Amazon can be quite helpful, and you can usually tell when someone knows what they're talking about.


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## Ukko

Yep, I read 'em and write 'em. The reviews I write for amazon.com are usually not considered to be of help, but that may be because I calls 'em like I sees 'em.


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## Ramako

I sometimes ask here rather than go for reviews. I prefer the word of mouth approach, and I have to say it really works. I have grown to like some of the lesser Classical composers, and other stuff I've been recommended here is excellent. I think being recommended something and actually asking someone gives you a kind of initial enthusiasm which helps you like stuff.

I like the following for Mahler, although it very much biases old recordings. This is just a problem because they are more expensive (£15 for an amount of music which would more normally be £8).


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## Manxfeeder

When I'm interested in a recording, I tend to read whatever reviews I can find, whether it's Amazon or Musicweb International or whomever, because the good reviews will point out what to look out for that is good or bad. But if I can then hear it for myself, that's the final arbiter, which is why I like Spotify. For example, everyone loves the LaSalle Webern recordings, but they don't do anything for me personally. 

This forum is also helpful because it is interactive. I've found there are members here whose ears are like mine, and I tend to lean toward their reviews.


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## quack

Only the negative ones usually. Positive reviews are full of the the most cringe-worthy adulation and dreadful purple prose. Negative reviews are nice and blunt, you can decide for yourself if the criticism is justified. "So you say it is played too fast, well that's good it should be, i'll buy it."


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## Mephistopheles

quack said:


> Only the negative ones usually. Positive reviews are full of the the most cringe-worthy adulation and dreadful purple prose. Negative reviews are nice and blunt, you can decide for yourself if the criticism is justified. "So you say it is played too fast, well that's good it should be, i'll buy it."


I think there's something to this. Especially when you're trying to decide between multiple recordings that all have 90% 5-star ratings from critics and fans, it's going to be the 10% negativity that actually tells you whether you'll enjoy it.


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## realdealblues

When I hear something I've never heard I will usually go to http://www.arkivmusic.com/classical/main.jsp

I look through the available recordings and start with conductors or orchestras I know well or have faith in.

If there are several from each then I will go read various reviews although I do take 90% of the reviews I read with a grain of salt.

I grew up knowing 3 conductors: Bernstein, Karajan and Marriner. They were popular and easy to get recordings of and I still believe they did fine jobs on most of their recordings. I see reviews where people bash them right and left but you don't become the conductor for the New York Philharmonic or the Berlin Philharmonic and hold the position for years by being a hack in my opinion.

Sometimes I run into a work that only has 1 or 2 recordings so that makes it pretty simple.

If it comes down to something I don't know a ton about such as "violin concertos", I'll usually ask around here.


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## Artikulus

Reviews are NEVER unbiased, never decent. Take Herbert Von Lebrecht, as a prime example.


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## Flamme

Dont read them for books but read them for music...Want to see in what circumstances one piece was written sometimes is very important for understanding...


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## Head_case

Mephistopheles said:


> There's nothing wrong with that, some of the oldies really are the best, but there are also some great young conductors and performers that we shouldn't neglect - we should always be aware that sometimes it's just popularity that garners more popularity rather than actual quality.
> 
> Personally, I don't read many reviews, but I do subscribe to a magazine almost exclusively for its reviews section (I don't care much for their articles). I start by homing in on anything with 4 or 5 stars and then go on a Spotify/Grooveshark exploration, either comparing an unfamiliar recording to something I already own, or wondering if this piece by Bach/Mozart/Beethoven/Schubert/Brahms/etc. that I've never heard before might be worth the time. Even reviews of recordings that give only 1-3 stars can be useful because they can warn you where not to put your effort in, and they could still be listing pieces that you might never have thought of before which you can go in search of elsewhere.


Reviews are important; as a performing artist, it determines the public opinion/weight; for the uninitiated who have no signpost, a magazine's reviews helps choose when the uninitiated have no knowledge otherwise. For the more skilled classical listener who has already formed his opinions, perhaps there is less room for reviews.

This is when, the mind is more likely to close off and become stubborn and set in its narrowness, such that it cannot open up and accept the insights offered by a review.

I like reviews; the qualitative ones, by David Fanning; Jonathan Woolf etc. The star ratings like * or ** or *** in something like the Penguin Guide is helpful in a repertoire which I have had no experience of.

Ultimately, reviews are information: that information has to be filtered - as you suggest - market forces and commercialism often control whether an album or performer gets *** out of ***.

Musicweb-international as a free resource, is rapidly becoming my favourite resource for reviews. Albums like Bonnal's string quartets










http://www.musicweb-international.com/classRev/2001/Aug01/Bonnal.htm

herald a point when I bought blindly based on the review. Rob Barnett's words are well-written and considered; having listened to this album intensely over the year, I couldn't agree more with his reviews' insights. Thus, I look out for his reviews, since his taste shares similarities to mine, which makes his reviews worthwhile reading for me.



> I find this one of the best ways to find new classical music. _Not_ because you should ever take the reviews at face value (I was this week introduced to the Janacek string quartets by a review but found a recording on my own that I thought just pipped their suggestion), but because they help narrow the search when, sometimes, finding that next piece that tickles your musical fancy can be like finding a needle in a haystack. I also think that, where they exist, the reviews on Amazon can be quite helpful, and you can usually tell when someone knows what they're talking about.


Which recording did you find? 

The problem with globalisation, is that there is probably a rave review somewhere ...in some language...in some obscure country, which raves about every single interpretation which was ever made!

The idea of a 'meta-analysis' of reviews appeals to me. This is way Google will ultimately go - by pooling just about every single internet review available, and translating them all in googletranslate, and pooling all the positive words or values, and assign them a rating * or ** or *** out of ***. Such ideas already exist in Metacritic or Pitchfork websites for pop/rock music:

http://www.metacritic.com/music

We classical listeners are a bit behind the times lol. This is what we need - a meta-analysis of reviews, rather than reading singular reviews, or trying to pip one review by another review. Instead: pooling all the reviews together to work out their overall direction


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## bigshot

Descriptive reviews are helpful. Even if I disagree with the reviewer on the best way to present the music, I can still discern whether it fits my criteria or not. Star ratings are meaningless. They simply reflect taste.


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## joen_cph

I tend to read reviews somewhat less these days, except from reviews regarding old recorded material: "Gramophone" pre-1985, sometimes "American Record Guide" and "Fono Forum", but primarily web sources such as "Music Web" and the excellent "Classical Notes" etc. At times also "Amazon.com", provided that the reviewer is informed there and makes detailed comparisons, which is quite rare. 

Reviews in newspapers and magazines in our local language have unfortunately become scarce and very superficial.


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## DavidA

I subscribe to the gramophone magazine and read the reviews avidly. I have done for about the last 50 years. That's not to say reviews are all helpful or unbiased. Critics have their own biases like we all do. For them one man's meat is another man's poison just like everyone else. I do think most critics do try and at least give the fair assessment. However there are rogue critics like Norman Lebrecht who go out it seems to make mischief. He is entertaining to read but what he says must be taken with a fair pinch of salt. Claudia Cassidy was another in Chicago years ago. She literally drove that excellent musician Rafael Kubilik out of Chicago with her damning reviews. More fool the people who read and believed her!
It is always amusing when critics make fools of themselves. During the infamous Joyce Hatto affair poor Bryce Morrison praised one of her 'recordings' of the Rach 3 to the skies. Unfortunately it was later found that it was actually a recording by another pianist who three years before Morrison had dismissed as a rather sub standard recording. Quite a lot of critics got egg on their faces during the Hatto hoax. Which shows that if you read the critics you shouldn't put too much store by what they say. They sometimes disagree even with themselves!


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## Vaneyes

Artikulus said:


> Reviews are NEVER unbiased, never decent. Take Herbert Von Lebrecht, as a prime example.


And let us not forget The Hurwitzer.


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## Vaneyes

It's too bad Gramophone has discontinued *free* access to reviews archives, but I got over it quickly.

If I can offer two pieces of advice to newbies.

One: Listen to a lot, and then more, and then more after that.

Two: Never buy a recording without sampling.

Learn works from various viewpoints or interpretations. Online classical radio is a very good inexpensive source. You may like it done a little slower, or slightly faster. You may like more emphasis on certain instruments. How are the recording's clarity, balance, dynamics?

Tip Two sometimes is not possible. Just be very wary of only text, or word-of-mouth recommendations. Reducing the risks becomes easier.

Happy learned listening.:tiphat:


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## bigshot

I can't tell anything at all about classical music from the samples at iTunes or Amazon.


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## Vaneyes

bigshot said:


> I can't tell anything at all about classical music from the samples at iTunes or Amazon.


Atleast one of your legs must be in a cast, from that leap of logic. Maybe my fault, for not being specific enough? Oh well. :tiphat:


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## bigshot

There haven't been listening booths since I was a kid, and youtube doesn't have everything I am interested in. Is there another source for samples I'm not aware of?


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## quack

bigshot said:


> There haven't been listening booths since I was a kid, and youtube doesn't have everything I am interested in. Is there another source for samples I'm not aware of?


Most larger shops, in my experience, have listening points. Don't know how willing they are to put on anything you ask for, probably with physical shops squeezed by online retailers they might be more willing to offer the personal service. Then there are record label websites, streaming services (pandora, grooveshark, spotify) even downloads from less than legal sites. Certainly you can't hear everything you might want to, but you can sample lots.


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## PetrB

Rarely. I know much of the 'older' and 'deceased' stable of individuals and bands. When something is 'newer' or outside my ken, I confer directly with friends and colleagues, who never fail to provide good recs.

When I can, I get at least a taste of a listen; after so many decades at it, like an audition, I'm pretty quick to get an idea of 'what the rest' will be.

I also consume very little, the avid days of acquiring relatively past.


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## Head_case

For those who don't read reviews: "Do you read?"


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## PetrB

Head_case said:


> For those who don't read reviews: "Do you read?"


Lots........................


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## Head_case

....but why lol


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## Wandering

Yes. Almost everyone does who makes online purchases, not just musical buys either.


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## Ralfy

Absolutely, as I don't have enough time or money to sample performances, especially given the number of performances and works to consider, not to mention the same for books, films, etc., all of which I also collect.


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## Guest

I read them, but I often take them with a grain of salt, especially when a recording receives a rave review and also has a full page ad in the magazine!


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## vertigo

......delete


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## Vaneyes

Article: The Cult of Amazon (Reviewers)

http://www.psmag.com/culture/the-cu...wers-classical-music-movies-television-63115/


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## Ravndal

Anyone got any tips on where I can read reviews? Something else than the guardian.


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## moody

Ravndal said:


> Anyone got any tips on where I can read reviews? Something else than the guardian.


Do they sell the Gramophone Magazine in your town ?


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## Vaneyes

Ravndal said:


> Anyone got any tips on where I can read reviews? Something else than the guardian.


http://www.musicweb-international.com/

http://www.classicalsource.com/home.php

http://www.classicstoday.com/

http://www.classicstodayfrance.com/

http://www.classical.net/music/recs/reviews/index.php

http://www.therestisnoise.com/cd_picks/

:tiphat:


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## Ondine

No, I don't. I first listen to the oeuvre; then just because curiosity -and very seldom- I read a review. Most of the time I don't see them really useful.


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## arpeggio

*Depends on the reviewer*

It depends on the reviewer.

Unlike many people I know, I tend to take more seriously reviews by experienced musicians. I have problems with a reviewer that critiques a recording of a Beethoven Symphony who has never played in or conducted a symphony orchestra. I have had the fortune to perform Beethoven's _Fifth Symphony_ at least five times. Actually performing the work gives one insight into the music that one can never get from being familiar with fifty recordings.


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## brotagonist

The reviews I read, as I am narrowing down my album choice, are the customer reviews on Amazon. Sometimes, a lot of 4-5* reviews will sway me to a certain album, but, as often as not, I will just get the one I want, based on performers, packaging and price.

Once in a rare while, I will read a critical review of an album I already own, particularly when it is an album I especially enjoy and it comes to my attention that others are lauding another disc. I want to know why the other disc is supposed to be better than the one I chose. I have never sold an album due to a bad review, nor have I gotten the supposed better one. I don't yet own a lot of pieces in duplicate, although I do have a few.

What I do like to read are analyses of the work as I am listening... the technical aspects of the composition, how it is constructed, what to listen for in each movement, etc. These are difficult to find.


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## moody

arpeggio said:


> It depends on the reviewer.
> 
> Unlike many people I know, I tend to take more seriously reviews by experienced musicians. I have problems with a reviewer that critiques a recording of a Beethoven Symphony who has never played in or conducted a symphony orchestra. I have had the fortune to perform Beethoven's _Fifth Symphony_ at least five times. Actually performing the work gives one insight into the music that one can never get from being familiar with fifty recordings.


Does this amazing logic also cover art,theatre,cinema,china,restaurants, etc. etc.
I presume that I'm not allowed to give my opinions of music as I'm not a musician,


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## Ravndal

moody said:


> Do they sell the Gramophone Magazine in your town ?


Good question! Il take a look  thanks



Vaneyes said:


> http://www.musicweb-international.com/
> 
> http://www.classicalsource.com/home.php
> 
> http://www.classicstoday.com/
> 
> http://www.classicstodayfrance.com/
> 
> http://www.classical.net/music/recs/reviews/index.php
> 
> http://www.therestisnoise.com/cd_picks/
> 
> :tiphat:


Woah. Thanks Vaneyes


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## arpeggio

*I do not know.*



moody said:


> Does this amazing logic also cover art,theatre,cinema,china,restaurants, etc. etc.
> I presume that I'm not allowed to give my opinions of music as I'm not a musician,


I do not know. For example, I have no experience as an actor so I can not say in the medium of movies or the stage.

I have spent my entire adult life performing in amateur and sometimes professional music organizations. All I can do is draw on my experiences at making music. This is one of the reasons I have such a contentious relationship with some non-musicians and I avoid having futile discussions with them.


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## moody

arpeggio said:


> I do not know. For example, I have no experience as an actor so I can not say in the medium of movies or the stage.
> 
> I have spent my entire adult life performing in amateur and sometimes professional music organizations. All I can do is draw on my experiences at making music. This is one of the reasons I have such a contentious relationship with some non-musicians and I avoid having futile discussions with them.


I think that your post sounds more contemptuous than contentious and has no place in a discussion about music in this forum.
All members are allowed their opinion based on their experience of music,which in my case is far more than yours.I am also quite sure that the music loving public are not musically trained in most cases, they of course are the people who made up your audience.
Perhaps you should rephrase your post ?? I remember a similar "discussion" last year.


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## Novelette

I definitely read reviews. I like to read for sound quality [not a quality that makes or breaks a recording, but I do like to hear everything fairly clearly without too much crackle--that said, with very excellent performances, the crackle isn't a great drawback], in making my choices. But I also find that sometimes reviewers, musicians or not, will have interesting background information about the performances, artists, composers, etc.

Our friend here on TC, Bejart, writes very thorough and informative reviews. They have definitely influenced my purchasing behavior.


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## Vesteralen

I do read reviews - mostly in *Listen* and *Opera News*, and sometimes in* BBC Music Magazine *- but I always take them with a grain of salt.

Particularly when it comes to rating the sound quality of a disc, I find that a lot of the comments are irrelevant to me since I don't have high-end equipment. I listen on the computer at work, in the car in transit, and at my apartment with headphones (so as not to disturb my wife or the neighbors). None of this equipment is state of the art, and I often find that a disc that sounds good in the car, doesn't sound so well with headphones, and vice versa.

I often end up purchasing something as much from an _ad_ in the magazines I read as from the _reviews_.


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## Downbeat

I do read reviews on Amazon, and generally find them helpful. It is always good to remember that all reviews (professional or otherwise) are based on personal opinion exclusively. I have some recordings I really enjoy (Bohme's last recording of Beethoven's 9th, for example) which is slated by written opinions.

Also good to bear in mind that recordings don't have to be good or bad, just with their strong and weak points...I always try to be open to a new approach to see if it 'works' musically in my ears.

I think it was Jimi Hendrix who listened to any old thing just to find something original he could use...if he did this to improve on his already dazzling ability, why not us mortals as well?


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## Nereffid

I read a lot of reviews. I find that, collectively, critics are a useful bunch.


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## LFTBR

I read reviews, but only from authors whose opinions I have come to trust. I don't use them to form my opinions about a new recording, but I do enjoy using them to sift through discs that aren't quite yet in my library as a means to find new and worthwhile additions.


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## Itullian

Of course I read them. Amazon and Amazon classical discussion. And where ever else I find them.


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