# In need of people with broad musical knowledge to make specific suggestions please.



## UnMerryGoRound (Nov 13, 2017)

Hi everyone,

I have registered for one purpose only, to seek help in finding music that caters to my tastes. In the process, hopefully, those of you that are not familiar with the particular composer I have in mind will come to appreciate his genius. Anyway, I will start getting to the point with a brief overview of my "classical" music tastes.

If I was going to lump my tastes in any particular period it would be Romanticism, however my knowledge of anything that is called "classical" music is very basic. I was introduced to Rachmaninoff's Piano Concerto No. 2, some of his famous preludes and the variations on a theme of Paganini in my youth and was very moved by them. Other than those pieces the only other name I can put forth with any certainty is J.S. Bach, though I strongly suggest that most other Baroque composers would probably not interest me. As I'm sure you'll all agree, and if I've heard a lot of Bach, there is something exquisitely pleasant, beautiful and moving about his music. I guess with his music being a strong influence with those like Beethoven (may be chatting out of my ****), I guess the reasons why I appreciate Rachmaninoff, Romanticism and Bach are easily apparent.

This is where I need guidance and my views will cloud matters, though I'm going to try and keep things as simple as possible. There are pieces here and there from those such as Mozart, Chopin and Rimsky-Korsakov, to Stravinsky, Schoenberg and Atterburg (generally all concerto forms) that I like but my typical music tastes are firmly rooted in progressive metal, jazz, fusion and more specifically John Coltrane and Allan Holdsworth. For the purpose of this posts I will be focusing on the latter, as for me, musically he is the most revolutionary since the former and to my ears would be the easiest to relate back to classical. Well that's pretty obvious to any one with musical knowledge, but not only that no one man's music can move me like his does.

Anyway, I will attach some links from YouTube as a point of reference. Please listen to the pieces in their entirety as I'm looking for suggestions that are as close to his harmonic language and sense of timing as much as possible, and the selections are the most representative of what I like that I can find. To clarify, I guess I'd prefer concerto forms more than anything else as I like to have something front and centre, though don't let that sway you from suggesting anything else and anything from composers that I've mentioned. Apparently Debussy, Ravel and Bartok are influences on Holdsworth, but I still have a very limited knowledge on their works, and as I don't have the greatest ear I'm not too sure how his music can relate to what I've heard in the past. Thank you x


----------



## MarkW (Feb 16, 2015)

Not trying to sound like a jerk (though maybe I am), why don't you just keep listening to Holdsworth? There may be CM that sounds like him, but more likely you'll find what you are looking for in the avant garde pop/jazz world. Most (but not all) CM has a beginning, a middle, and an end. If you are looking for a mystical quality, you could try Messiaen's Quartet for the End of Time. If it's endlessness, you could try the last movement of Holst's The Planets.

Good luck!


----------



## UnMerryGoRound (Nov 13, 2017)

Thanks Mark,

Well there's no one like Holdsworth, I'm just wanting more lush symphonic harmonies that i figure classical can cater for better than most. And I can hardly listen to Holdsworth all the time, though I've been listening to a bit of Stravinsky, Sibelius and others as of late.

Messaien is indeed on my radar, thanks for a starting point at least. There's just so much music out there, I guess I've bin feeling the need for more dissonance than most seem to provide. Though there's too much in Schoenberg most of the time.

Thanks


----------



## starthrower (Dec 11, 2010)

Try some Alban Berg.






Quoting from your post:
*Apparently Debussy, Ravel and Bartok are influences on Holdsworth*

Excellent composers to explore. And you might enjoy the lush orchestral sounds of Mahler or Sibelius. I find these two irresistible.


----------



## arpeggio (Oct 4, 2012)

*Philip Sparke?*

I can think of several contemporary composers that are not quite in the mainstream around here.

Why don't we try Philip Spark. He is an English composer. If that works I can think of a few others.

The following is called _Dance Movements_ and it was composed for the United States Air Force Band.


----------



## Simon Moon (Oct 10, 2013)

I'm a *HUGE* Holdsworth fan!

But I have a hard time relating his music to classical, in the sense that I could recommend stuff that sounds like the classical version of his harmonic language.

Maybe try Bartok's Music for strings, percussion and celesta.






Or his Concerto for Orchestra.

Many 20th century and contemporary composes may fit what you are looking for, just explore Youtube.

Try the following composers:

Magnus Linbnerg
Joan Tower
Eliott Carter
Penderecki

In the realm of Holdsworth, have you heard Alex Machacek?






Or Richard Hallabeek?






Neither are clones, but definitely used Holdsworth as a "jumping off point" to explore their own thing.


----------



## UnMerryGoRound (Nov 13, 2017)

Thanks for the suggestions guys, i will get onto them later tonight and let you know how i get on tomorrow.

As for Machacek and Hallebeek, Simon, of course i am familiar with them. I don't hear much i like in Hallebeek, too straight rock fusion for my tastes.


----------



## eugeneonagain (May 14, 2017)

Seems odd to me that a post begins with very specific requests and a fairly broad list of composers, then asks for 'suggestions'. Type all those names into you tube and the suggestion list in the sidebar will fill up with possibilities. If you have specific tastes asking for other people's tastes may not deliver the results you want.


----------



## UnMerryGoRound (Nov 13, 2017)

Thanks for the input Eugene,

To be honest at first i wanted to fully explain my tastes so you could see why I'm seeking guidance. In the end i didn't want to clog the post up.

For me, that is at least to my ears, music needs to have an originality all of its own. What I'm finding is that the forms in classical can make a piece boring for me. I guess by that i mean, although my ear isn't great, it can have harmelodic originality and emotional content, but be predictable structurally. I guess I'm also feeling it's predictable intervalically (is that a word!?) or in the way it modulates. Having said that I'm finding feer compositions to be too dissonant or atonal.

I was hoping by providing the links, those with a sophisticated ear could pick up what's happening theoretically and guide me to something similar. Maybe that's just not possible, but in terms of originality of self expression and emotional content, nothing resonates with me like Holdsworth. Which is why I'm here, by myself i can find something here and there, but there's so much to sift through, and more often than not i end up back to Holdsworth after being unmoved. If i was going to pick my two favourite classical pieces they'd be air on g and Rachmaninoff's 2nd piano concerto, which probably clouds matters.

Basically I'm looking for something that's "harmonically fluid", structurally innovative but not overtly atonal or dissonant. Now, whether that is an apt description i have no idea.

Thanks again, and apologies if this is a redundant topic.


----------



## manyene (Feb 7, 2015)

In your first post you mention Atterberg's Concertos. Have you come across his symphonies?


----------



## R3PL4Y (Jan 21, 2016)

You could listen to some Scriabin, especially these two works


----------



## UnMerryGoRound (Nov 13, 2017)

Hey guys, just wanted to pop in quickly to thank you all for the suggestions.

It's taking me awhile to work through and assess, but will hopefully have some input tomorrow.

Thanks x


----------

