# Boycott hip hop



## mtmailey (Oct 21, 2011)

http://mmailey1974.blogspot.com/2011/11/boycott-hip-hop.html read this post about one should boycott hip hop for various reasons.


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## regressivetransphobe (May 16, 2011)

I'm boycotting you.


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## violadude (May 2, 2011)

That whole list could be applied to any of the various genres who have been largely overtaken by cooperations and fat-cat record companies, not just hip hop.


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## Stasou (Apr 23, 2011)

Well written article! I'm convinced.


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## jhar26 (Jul 6, 2008)

Boycott? Seems to me you either listen to it or you don't. But it's always a bit risky to condemn an entire genre. You may think you hate a type of music and before you know it someone may come up with something you really like.


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## misterjones (Oct 9, 2007)

I've been boycotting rap and hip hop my entire life, and it has nothing to do greed or lack of altruism or excessive misogyny and/or violence. It's a pretty one dimensional art form that has, and probably always will have, merely unfulfilled potential. If you want to hear what the music could sound like, check out Pete Townshend's reworking of "Who Are You?" in the Lifehouse Chronicles. The rap portion starts a little after the one minute mark.


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## elgar's ghost (Aug 8, 2010)

A lot of rap and hip-hop is all too generic now - same tired topics, same 'attitude', same tired 'moves', same bling, same clothes, same babes gyrating near a pimpmobile...most of what is aired now is lowest common denominator push-button bullsh*t. Watch any bog-standard rap or hip-hop vid released these days and it could be from any year between now and 1991. Probably why more semi-feral juveniles like it now more than ever - the musical cul-de-sac that the genre finds itself in keeps them in their chavvy comfort zone while they fantasise about being from Compton or the Bronx. It goes without saying that any intelligent and thought-provoking stuff (i.e. like quite a lot of it used to be) remains underground - away from the mainstream charts and to a large degree away from the hoodie-wearing losers who aren't interested in anything that goes beyond the same old sex, weed and violence cliches.


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## clavichorder (May 2, 2011)

Edit. Nevermind.


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## Kopachris (May 31, 2010)

elgars ghost said:


> A lot of rap and hip-hop is all too generic now - same tired topics, same 'attitude', same tired 'moves', same bling, same clothes, same babes gyrating near a pimpmobile...most of what is aired now is lowest common denominator push-button bullsh*t. Watch any bog-standard rap or hip-hop vid released these days and it could be from any year between now and 1991. Probably why more semi-feral juveniles like it now more than ever - the musical cul-de-sac that the genre finds itself in keeps them in their chavvy comfort zone while they fantasise about being from Compton or the Bronx. It goes without saying that any intelligent and thought-provoking stuff (i.e. like quite a lot of it used to be) remains underground - away from the mainstream charts and to a large degree away from the hoodie-wearing losers who aren't interested in anything that goes beyond the same old sex, weed and violence cliches.


Very eloquent.

I think it should be noted that the OP's blog consists of six posts, each calling to boycott something different. Along with hip-hop, the OP is boycotting the music industry in general, sports, religions (with a picture of Hitler), "evil Asians," and the rich.


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## elgar's ghost (Aug 8, 2010)

To be honest, I couldn't get past the OP's link so I haven't seen what was said - I'm guessing it's a bit on the inflammatory side, then.


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## misterjones (Oct 9, 2007)

Kopachris said:


> Very eloquent.
> 
> I think it should be noted that the OP's blog consists of six posts, each calling to boycott something different. Along with hip-hop, the OP is boycotting the music industry in general, sports, religions (with a picture of Hitler), "evil Asians," and the rich.


Gadzooks. Then I'm sorry I dignified it with a response. I did not venture further than the hip hop rap.

I was going to additionally mention a nice rap-country combo performed by Wyclef Jean at a Johnny Cash tribute back in the late 1990s. Rap as a stand alone muscial form is very limited. I think it could be combined with other genres to great effect (as Townshend and Jean showed). I'm not sure why it has not been, since most other types of music have successfully done so to liberate themselves from the confines of their musical idioms.


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## Sid James (Feb 7, 2009)

I think I'll boycott HIP, or boring wig operas at least. A friend was dragged along to one here recently by his partner and he was in a comatose state by the end of the first half. So give me hip-hop over that any day, & I don't mind some things like Kanye West once in a while. More relevant to my life than some guys in wigs standing around singing about the gods...


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## Dodecaplex (Oct 14, 2011)

Sid James said:


> I think I'll boycott HIP, or boring wig operas at least. A friend was dragged along to one here recently by his partner and he was in a comatose state by the end of the first half. So give me hip-hop over that any day, & I don't mind some things like Kanye West once in a while. More relevant to my life than some guys in wigs standing around singing about the gods...


Sid James, you constantly say that people who bash and attack modern music are disrespectful. Yet, in this occasion, even though no one has particularly bashed any of your favorites, you go and show the exact same disrespect, but this time towards the music that you don't like.
It doesn't have to be this way, is all I'm saying.


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## Sid James (Feb 7, 2009)

^^Well it's *** for tat kind of thing.

I've been here for a while and had heaps of stuff thrown in my face from the other direction (the HARD conservative direction I mean). People who insinuate that if you don't like certain types of music they like, you're not a "real" classical listener. Or if you like things they don't, then that's a problem.

We all make value judgements, but usually I talk from experience, or a degree of it. We all have our own ideologies and ways of seeing the world. But these people don't understand - there are many ways, not just THEIR way.

BTW, the guy who started this thread, his avatar is Beethoven. I love Beethoven's music, he's one of my favourite composers. Just listened to his_ Fidelio _after like 10 years. A joy. But one must understand that there are a hell of a lot of people out there who don't care about Beethoven, they prefer something like hip-hop. Just as I prefer hip-hop, or some types of it, over wig operas.

So that's all I'm saying. There's an element of tongue in cheek, but also giving back these jokers a taste of their own medicine. But I get the message, and I'm trying to not rant that much, it's become cliche as well now...


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## Oskaar (Mar 17, 2011)

I absolutely dont like hip hop and rap. But I like young people that find it as a part of their integration an selfe esteem. But looking to that article..... I must say that I found it ironical...


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## Oskaar (Mar 17, 2011)

Dodecaplex said:


> Sid James, you constantly say that people who bash and attack modern music are disrespectful. Yet, in this occasion, even though no one has particularly bashed any of your favorites, you go and show the exact same disrespect, but this time towards the music that you don't like.
> It doesn't have to be this way, is all I'm saying.


Show me ANY disrespect that Sid James ever did.


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## Oskaar (Mar 17, 2011)

And if you try to cut and past out of the meaning, I warn you, I will notice.


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## Dodecaplex (Oct 14, 2011)

oskaar said:


> And if you try to cut and past out of the meaning, I warn you, I will notice.


Kay, I'll just cut and paste the entire thing. 



Sid James said:


> I think I'll boycott HIP, or boring wig operas at least. A friend was dragged along to one here recently by his partner and he was in a comatose state by the end of the first half. So give me hip-hop over that any day, & I don't mind some things like Kanye West once in a while. More relevant to my life than some guys in wigs standing around singing about the gods...


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## Oskaar (Mar 17, 2011)

It is a reaction towards others disrespect.


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## Philip (Mar 22, 2011)

mtmailey said:


> http://mmailey1974.blogspot.com/2011/11/boycott-hip-hop.html read this post about one should boycott hip hop for various reasons.


Hip-hop is about saying what's on your mind to a beat. if you can't understand that, well i don't know what to tell you. take it for what it is -- if you don't like the commercial aspect of the whole thing, then go live in a communist country. or maybe actually try to figure out what hip-hop is all about, before opening your mouth and sounding like a fool.


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## Dodecaplex (Oct 14, 2011)

Philip said:


> Hip-hop is about saying what's on your mind to a beat. if you can't understand that, well i don't know what to tell you. take it for what it is -- if you don't like the commercial aspect of the whole thing, then go live in a communist country. or maybe actually try to figure out what hip-hop is all about, before opening your mouth and sounding like a fool.


This is the first time I've ever seen you post something serious. Amazing. :clap:


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## mtmailey (Oct 21, 2011)

elgars ghost said:


> To be honest, I couldn't get past the OP's link so I haven't seen what was said - I'm guessing it's a bit on the inflammatory side, then.


 to be honest it is the truth the blog that is and people can not stand it.


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## mtmailey (Oct 21, 2011)

hip hip is about money and material,older hip hip/rap had meaning not anymore also hip hop been dead.


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## mtmailey (Oct 21, 2011)

violadude said:


> That whole list could be applied to any of the various genres who have been largely overtaken by cooperations and fat-cat record companies, not just hip hop.


 that is true rock,heavy metal and other music forms i also boycott,but not chamber music ,orchestral music or jazz.


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## mtmailey (Oct 21, 2011)

jhar26 said:


> Boycott? Seems to me you either listen to it or you don't. But it's always a bit risky to condemn an entire genre. You may think you hate a type of music and before you know it someone may come up with something you really like.


 I used to listen to rap/hip hop therefore i know what i am talking about hip hop and rap is one of the problems today such as the violence,disrespect and so on.


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## violadude (May 2, 2011)

mtmailey said:


> hip hip is about money and material,older hip hip/rap had meaning not anymore also hip hop been dead.


Instead of boycotting an entire genre of music, why not just boycott the artists or songs that your description applies to, and seek out the ones that it doesn't?


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## jhar26 (Jul 6, 2008)

mtmailey said:


> I used to listen to rap/hip hop therefore i know what i am talking about hip hop and rap is one of the problems today such as the violence,disrespect and so on.


Sure, but I'm not saying that you should like HipHop or rap. I only wonder what is meant by the word 'boycott.' If it means nothing more than that you just don't listen to it than everyone is basically boycotting the music he/she doesn't listen to. 'Boycott' sounds like too strong a word to me. I rarely (if ever) listen to HipHop, but I haven't got the idea that I'm boycotting it - I just don't listen to it.


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## misterjones (Oct 9, 2007)

I wouldn't want to boycott this . . .


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## mtmailey (Oct 21, 2011)

violadude said:


> Instead of boycotting an entire genre of music, why not just boycott the artists or songs that your description applies to, and seek out the ones that it doesn't?


 i am staying with chamber and orchestral music it sounds better than rap,hip hop,rock,heavy metal and so forth.


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## mtmailey (Oct 21, 2011)

jhar26 said:


> Sure, but I'm not saying that you should like HipHop or rap. I only wonder what is meant by the word 'boycott.' If it means nothing more than that you just don't listen to it than everyone is basically boycotting the music he/she doesn't listen to. 'Boycott' sounds like too strong a word to me. I rarely (if ever) listen to HipHop, but I haven't got the idea that I'm boycotting it - I just don't listen to it.


 boycott means to not give support like with money in this case-hip hoppers mistreat people therefore they should be boycotted/


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## mtmailey (Oct 21, 2011)

elgars ghost said:


> A lot of rap and hip-hop is all too generic now - same tired topics, same 'attitude', same tired 'moves', same bling, same clothes, same babes gyrating near a pimpmobile...most of what is aired now is lowest common denominator push-button bullsh*t. Watch any bog-standard rap or hip-hop vid released these days and it could be from any year between now and 1991. Probably why more semi-feral juveniles like it now more than ever - the musical cul-de-sac that the genre finds itself in keeps them in their chavvy comfort zone while they fantasise about being from Compton or the Bronx. It goes without saying that any intelligent and thought-provoking stuff (i.e. like quite a lot of it used to be) remains underground - away from the mainstream charts and to a large degree away from the hoodie-wearing losers who aren't interested in anything that goes beyond the same old sex, weed and violence cliches.


 VERY GOOD POST older hip hop is gone.


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## mtmailey (Oct 21, 2011)

regressivetransphobe said:


> I'm boycotting you.


 you are not hurting me and i am not hiding but going for the money.


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## mtmailey (Oct 21, 2011)

Philip said:


> Hip-hop is about saying what's on your mind to a beat. if you can't understand that, well i don't know what to tell you. take it for what it is -- if you don't like the commercial aspect of the whole thing, then go live in a communist country. or maybe actually try to figure out what hip-hop is all about, before opening your mouth and sounding like a fool.


 Nice try but those in hip hop are the fools they want to be a gangster but do not know what a real gangster is!! therefor they are apart of the dummy force.


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## mtmailey (Oct 21, 2011)

*The truth be told*













read the photo for the truth older hip hop is long gone.


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## Philip (Mar 22, 2011)

mtmailey said:


> read the photo for the truth older hip hop is long gone.


do you even know where that image comes from, and who actually said these words?

http://ucarts.deviantart.com/art/Hip-Hop-Been-Dead-48109713


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## Sid James (Feb 7, 2009)

I think that hip-hop has become kind of more commercial as elgar's ghost says, and as mtmailey implies. It is less political now than it used to be. I'm talking here from perspective of someone not ever fully into hip-hop, just an outside casual observer. I listen to a good amount of non-classical on radio, incl. hip-hop, but it's a side thing to my main area of music, which is of course classical...


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## mtmailey (Oct 21, 2011)

Philip said:


> do you even know where that image comes from, and who actually said these words?
> 
> http://ucarts.deviantart.com/art/Hip-Hop-Been-Dead-48109713


 i know where but i do not care hip hip/rap is the whiteman's junk now-sex drugs and rock n'roll was not in hip hip until the edomites put it there.


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## mtmailey (Oct 21, 2011)

*Crap music*









Sid James said:


> I think that hip-hop has become kind of more commercial as elgar's ghost says, and as mtmailey implies. It is less political now than it used to be. I'm talking here from perspective of someone not ever fully into hip-hop, just an outside casual observer. I listen to a good amount of non-classical on radio, incl. hip-hop, but it's a side thing to my main area of music, which is of course classical...


 if you take the c from crap you get rap.


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## Philip (Mar 22, 2011)

mtmailey said:


> i know where but i do not care hip hip/rap is the whiteman's junk now-sex drugs and rock n'roll was not in hip hip until the edomites put it there.


Perhaps you don't get the irony here, "Hip-Hop Been Dead" is itself a rap lyric. It's also a slang, hence the incorrect syntax.

At the end of the day, this is only a testament to your own incapability at recognizing such nuances.

(Read between the lines)


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## Kopachris (May 31, 2010)

mtmailey said:


> i know where but i do not care hip hip/rap is the whiteman's junk now-sex drugs and rock n'roll was not in hip hip until the edomites put it there.


I hate to bring this up, because it might sound like an attack on your character, which is never good in an argument unless it goes undetected, but you're in violation of the Creative Commons license under which the artist of that poster chose to distribute it.


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## mtmailey (Oct 21, 2011)

Kopachris said:


> I hate to bring this up, because it might sound like an attack on your character, which is never good in an argument unless it goes undetected, but you're in violation of the Creative Commons license under which the artist of that poster chose to distribute it.


 Nice try but i downloaded the file and it is not being sold by me-now i have to see what else you want to put up.


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## mtmailey (Oct 21, 2011)

Philip said:


> Perhaps you don't get the irony here, "Hip-Hop Been Dead" is itself a rap lyric. It's also a slang, hence the incorrect syntax.
> 
> At the end of the day, this is only a testament to your own incapability at recognizing such nuances.
> 
> (Read between the lines)


 read between what lines?You are making no sense of course HIP HOP BEEN DEAD is the truth whether or not it is a song or a rap!!!Now my point is this hip hoppers are trouble,disrespectful,violent and so forth,therefore they do not need people support.


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## Philip (Mar 22, 2011)

so if a dogman came to your door and said: "dogmen do not exist", how would you resolve this paradox?


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## Kopachris (May 31, 2010)

mtmailey said:


> Nice try but i downloaded the file and it is not being sold by me-now i have to see what else you want to put up.





UCArts (the original artist of that image) said:


> This work is licensed under a Creative Commons Attribution-Noncommercial-No Derivative Works 3.0 License.


The license requires you to mention the original artist when posting the image on your blog, whether you're making money off of it or not. We had to ask if you knew the source of that image because you failed to provide proper attribution in accordance with that license. If you had provided proper attribution, as the license dictates, we wouldn't have had to ask because it would've been obvious that you knew the source. Therefore, you are in violation of the license. Here's the legalese and fine print if you wish to consult a lawyer: http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-nd/3.0/legalcode

Of course, that has nothing to do with hip-hop, so I shall now exit this discussion unless you prompt me to return.


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## mtmailey (Oct 21, 2011)

Kopachris said:


> The license requires you to mention the original artist when posting the image on your blog, whether you're making money off of it or not. We had to ask if you knew the source of that image because you failed to provide proper attribution in accordance with that license. If you had provided proper attribution, as the license dictates, we wouldn't have had to ask because it would've been obvious that you knew the source. Therefore, you are in violation of the license. Here's the legalese and fine print if you wish to consult a lawyer: http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-nd/3.0/legalcode
> 
> Of course, that has nothing to do with hip-hop, so I shall now exit this discussion unless you prompt me to return.


FIRST of all can you prove what you are putting up? can you prove that that hip hop been dead image is protected by the creative commons?Also you can not sue me you have not my address or full name therefore you are wasting time.So far you have not proved that the image is protected by the creative commons.


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## misterjones (Oct 9, 2007)

Are we certain we understand what this so-called "Creative Commons" is? I'm familiar with copyright and trademark law (as well as international conventions, such as the Berne Convention), but I've never heard of Creative Commons. Nor have I ever heard of a law or other agreement that would permit the holder of a copyright/trademark such as the one in question to sue someone for the kind of non-commercial display that appears to be at issue here.

From what I can gather from the internet, Creative Commons appears to be some sort of vehicle to help artists license their copyrighted material (somewhat like ASCAP or BMI for music). If that is correct, that would make Creative Commons a mere licensing agency. The substantive source of the artist's rights - assuming his or her work would qualify for protection - appears to be applicable copyright law, not Creative Commons.


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## Philip (Mar 22, 2011)

misterjones said:


> Are we certain we understand what this so-called "Creative Commons" is? I'm familiar with copyright and trademark law (as well as international conventions, such as the Berne Convention), but I've never heard of Creative Commons. Nor have I ever heard of a law or other agreement that would permit the holder of a copyright/trademark such as the one in question to sue someone for the kind of non-commercial display that appears to be at issue here.
> 
> From what I can gather from the internet, Creative Commons appears to be some sort of vehicle to help artists license their copyrighted material (somewhat like ASCAP or BMI for music). If that is correct, that would make Creative Commons a mere licensing agency. The substantive source of the artist's rights - assuming his or her work would qualify for protection - appears to be applicable copyright law, not Creative Commons.


I think this is more about respect than it is about law.


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## misterjones (Oct 9, 2007)

Really? For a discussion that's about respect rather than the law, I see an inordinate amount of discussion about who can sue whom, licensing agreements, consulting lawyers, etc.


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## Philip (Mar 22, 2011)

OK so people get carried away... what else is new? I'm sure a good lawyer could swing it both ways anyway...


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## Kopachris (May 31, 2010)

misterjones said:


> Are we certain we understand what this so-called "Creative Commons" is? I'm familiar with copyright and trademark law (as well as international conventions, such as the Berne Convention), but I've never heard of Creative Commons. Nor have I ever heard of a law or other agreement that would permit the holder of a copyright/trademark such as the one in question to sue someone for the kind of non-commercial display that appears to be at issue here.
> 
> From what I can gather from the internet, Creative Commons appears to be some sort of vehicle to help artists license their copyrighted material (somewhat like ASCAP or BMI for music). If that is correct, that would make Creative Commons a mere licensing agency. The substantive source of the artist's rights - assuming his or her work would qualify for protection - appears to be applicable copyright law, not Creative Commons.


The Creative Commons is basically just a group that created a set of licenses that artists can use. By marking a work as "licensed under Creative Commons such-and-such," it's basically saying "the copyright holder will give you the right to copy this work as long as you agree to these terms." They're usually also marked with _Some rights reserved,_ as opposed to the usual _All rights reserved_ that's found in a copyright statement. And contrary to popular belief, posting someone else's image on a blog without permission is _not_ considered fair use, whether it's commercial or not (at least, under US copyright law).


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## jhar26 (Jul 6, 2008)

Thread is 'under review' and temporarily closed. Sorry folks.


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