# Second Round: Turandot Finale Turandot Solo. Nilsson and Sutherland



## Seattleoperafan (Mar 24, 2013)

I found it interesting to read the review of Turandot recordings by the famous critic John Steane:Puccini's Turandot – a survey of recordings




Go to 32:37. Turnadot: Act III · The Rome Opera House Chorus · Giacomo Puccini · Erich Leinsdorf · The Rome Opera House Orchestra · Renata Tebaldi · Birgit Nilsson · Jussi Bjoerling 





Go to 148:49
*Dame Joan Sutherland; Luciano Pavarotti; Montserrat Caballé; "TURANDOT"; Giacomo Puccini Zubin Mehta*


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## Seattleoperafan (Mar 24, 2013)

If I were to see a live Turandot I'd love to see Nilsson, Grob-Prandl, Cigna, and Marc in that order. Sutherland never sang it live but in a recording I prefer her over Nilsson.


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## MAS (Apr 15, 2015)

The Nilsson *Turandot* here is of her first recording, with Björling, who in my opinion is no
Calaf however beautiful his voice. Nilsson is, however the princess and her high notes are incomparable. 

The Sutherland recording is for those who dislike the Nilsson example; she waited just a little too long to record it - the sustained notes have a “beat” to them and while the voice is warmer (than Nilsson’s), it is still somewhat unintelligible, though one can discern the odd word here and there. Yes, she still has great high notes, but the lower middle is cloudy. The voice is too soft-grained for *Turandot*.

The Sutherland recording is, for me, a curiosity and its appeal is for the luxurious sound and casting and I used to love the LP cover. My uncle had the LPs and I coveted it for years.


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## MAS (Apr 15, 2015)

Seattleoperafan said:


> If I were to see a live Turandot I'd love to see Nilsson, Grob-Prandl, Cigna, and Marc in that order. Sutherland never sang it live but in a recording I prefer her over Nilsson.


Unfortunately, I haven’t seen Nilsson as *Turandot* - but my first was Caballe’s with Pavarotti and Leona Mitchell.


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## Woodduck (Mar 17, 2014)

The Leinsdorf recording comes through my computer speakers very oddly, with Nilsson sounding as if she's in another room, while the orchestra and Bjorling sound more present. I had to go put on my CD to remind myself that this is not the way the recording actually sounds. But even so, we have to turn to any of several other recordings to experience the full impact of Nilsson's voice.

Between the least exciting of Nilsson's Turandots and Sutherland's very good outing in the part it's hard to choose. But I don't hear much of Sutherland's alleged greater warmth and vulnerability, unless it's a greater vocal vulnerability; as MAS points out, the vibrato has taken on the quality of a "beat," the lower voice is somewhat cottony, and the diction is so-so. Nilsson projects the character's vulnerability adequately, and the clear shafts of light that are her high notes really are incomparable (but hear her live Turandots with Corelli for another level of brilliance!).

Nilsson by a hair.


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## MAS (Apr 15, 2015)

I thought the Nilsson sounded strange but, as I’d never heard it before I took it at face value. I know the Corelli one better.


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## Woodduck (Mar 17, 2014)

Seattleoperafan said:


> I found it interesting to read the review of Turandot recordings by the famous critic John Steane:Puccini's Turandot – a survey of recordings


 There are a least three live Turandots with Nilsson and Corelli. I wonder why Steane reviews only one of them. Maybe the other two weren't available in 2012.


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## Seattleoperafan (Mar 24, 2013)

Woodduck said:


> The Leinsdorf recording comes through my computer speakers very oddly, with Nilsson sounding as if she's in another room, while the orchestra and Bjorling sound more present. I had to go put on my CD to remind myself that this is not the way the recording actually sounds. But even so, we have to turn to any of several other recordings to experience the full impact of Nilsson's voice.
> 
> Between the least exciting of Nilsson's Turandots and Sutherland's very good outing in the part it's hard to choose. But I don't hear much of Sutherland's alleged greater warmth and vulnerability, unless it's a greater vocal vulnerability; as MAS points out, the vibrato has taken on the quality of a "beat," the lower voice is somewhat cottony, and the diction is so-so. Nilsson projects the character's vulnerability adequately, and the clear shafts of light that are her high notes really are incomparable (but hear her live Turandots with Corelli for another level of brilliance!).
> 
> Nilsson by a hair.


I thought catching Nilsson when she was younger would be better since that is usually the case and since the tenor didn't matter here Corelli didn't matter. I do know how great they were together. I didn't know about the live one's with Corelli, just the studio ones. It sounded fine to me listening in my car. It is hard to beat Nilsson in Turandot. I should have asked for suggestions as I don't have time to compare versions. If I had been made aware of the issues early in the contest I would have changed it Thanks for your insights into the performances. Nilsson will likely win anyway.


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## Woodduck (Mar 17, 2014)

Seattleoperafan said:


> I thought catching Nilsson when she was younger would be better since that is usually the case and since the tenor didn't matter here Corelli didn't matter. I do know how great they were together. I didn't know about the live one's with Corelli, just the studio ones. It sounded fine to me listening in my car. It is hard to beat Nilsson in Turandot. I should have asked for suggestions as I don't have time to compare versions. If I had been made aware of the issues early in the contest I would have changed it Thanks for your insights into the performances. Nilsson will likely win anyway.


I believe the Leinsdorf _Turandot_ was recorded in 1959. Leinsdorf is rather brisk and prosaic. All the singers are fine, but I enjoy it mainly for Bjorling.


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## Op.123 (Mar 25, 2013)

Sutherland is not bad here and usually I dislike her later recordings. Her diction is not as distorted as usual and I can make out the words okay. However, Nilsson is ideal for this role despite the odd acoustics noted above. Her voice is steadier and more incisive, and her voice has, if not the impression of youth, a sense of agelessness about it while Sutherland's odd vowel formations have always made her sound a little old, especially when coupled with a loosening vibrato.


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## BalalaikaBoy (Sep 25, 2014)

Woodduck said:


> Between the least exciting of Nilsson's Turandots and Sutherland's very good outing in the part it's hard to choose. But I don't hear much of Sutherland's alleged greater warmth and vulnerability, unless it's a greater vocal vulnerability; as MAS points out, the vibrato has taken on the quality of a "beat," the lower voice is somewhat cottony, and the diction is so-so. Nilsson projects the character's vulnerability adequately, and the clear shafts of light that are her high notes really are incomparable (but hear her live Turandots with Corelli for another level of brilliance!).


Sutherland does a very "British" (and, to a lesser extent, American) thing where, when trying to create better diction, she focuses heavily on crisp, exaggerated consonants, rather that placing the consonants on the vowel. Italian in particular is a language where getting the vowels right is 90% of the work, after which the 10% vowels normally take care of themselves.


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## Tsaraslondon (Nov 7, 2013)

As most of you will know, I don't normally like the sound of Nilsson's voice, especially in the middle where she can sometimes have intonation problems. The recording here is not good, but those top notes fly out with spectacular ease, and the voice sounds more beautiful than it usually does for me.

I expected to be going for the Sutherland performance, as it's one of the few Sutherland performances I have in my collection, but I was more aware of the beat in the middle of the voice than I usually am. Her diction isn't that good either, though better than it often was. The high notes are splendid of course, but Nilsson's leap out like shafts of light. Sutherland has the better conductor and Calaf was also one of Pavarotti's best recorded roles, but I'm going for Nilsson here.

Out of curiosity, afterwards I turned with some trepidation to the Callas recording, as almost everyone will tell you that she wobbles through most of the role. Well, whilst wishing that she'd recorded it maybe three of four years before this and whilst I can hear the role is now a bit of a stretch for her (she would never have sung it on stage at this time in her career), she doesn't wobble anywhere near as most modern sopranos these days, nor as much as Gwyneth Jones who sang the role an awful lot. Furthermore she makes more of the words than anyone and her range of colour is unparalleled. She also is fortunate enough to have Serafin at the helm, who conducts it better than anyone. Too bad it wasn't stereo. To put it another way, while listening to Sutherland and Nilsson I was only really listening for the top notes. Callas made them less significant and I listened to more of the music. Alfano did a fine job and Serafin and Callas serve him well.


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## Tsaraslondon (Nov 7, 2013)

Assuming that she would not be part of the competition, I then turned to an even less likely Turandot in the shape of Ricciarelli. The Karajan is worth hearing if only for the conducting and the sonics, which, in my view, surpass even the Mehta. Ricciarelli can't of course pluck fabulous hgh notes out of the air as Nilsson and Sutherland appear to do, but again, she is nowhere near as bad as she is often described and she too makes more of the words than either Nilsson or Sutherland. I actually enjoyed it. Maybe I don't really care about high notes that much.


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## nina foresti (Mar 11, 2014)

Despite the fact that the Nilsson recording sounds like she is recording in the next room or something, I shall grant her the rose for this particular recording only because there is more tenderness at the end which indicates to me that the ice is melting from the Ice Princess through the passages of love.
Sutherland was also just fine--which makes it all the more difficult to make a succinct choice. It's close.


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## Woodduck (Mar 17, 2014)

Turning to my CD of the Nilsson/Bjorling/Tebaldi/Tozzi/Leinsdorf _Turandot_, I'm pleasantly reminded of why I've kept it all these years, along with one of the live Nilsson/Corelli collaborations and the Callas/Serafin. All the singers live up to their reputations. I gather that Bjorling was nervous about recording with Nilsson, but thanks to the wonders (?) of technology he needn't have worried. There are moments, in his scenes with her, when he seems to have his face right up to the microphone while she sounds slightly farther from it, which I assume is a perfectly ordinary way of equalizing voices of unequal size. Beverly Sills recounts how Eileen Farrell had to stand well back, behind the other singers, when they recorded Donizetti's _Maria Stuarda._

Having listened again to my CD, I'm more baffled than ever by the way this Nilsson excerpt sounds coming through my external ccomputer speakers. I've never noticed a problem with them. Why would Nilsson sound so distant? I suspect the person who put it on YouTube.

BTW, for reasons unremembered I have two copies of the Nilsson/Bjorling/Tebaldi/Tozzi/Leinsdorf _Turandot. _If anyone would like one, let me know.


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## ewilkros (8 mo ago)

nina foresti said:


> ...the Nilsson recording sounds like she is recording in the next room or something...


The YouTube video used is of a villainously-awful "transfer" on the part of somebody taking advantage of the fact that the 1959 recording is now in public domain for most of the world (but not the US). Here it is from a RCA/BMG licensed source (and don't feel bad if you couldn't find it--it's buried in a set of Erich Leinsdorf playlists).



Spoiler: 1. Del primo pianto













Spoiler: 2. Diecimila anni











It's cut into 2 pieces as part of a "Turandot highlights" playlist, but it's all there.


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## The Conte (May 31, 2015)

I find it very difficult to listen to the Nilsson recording due to the sound quality in this YouTube version. However, her voice is glorious. I just can't tell what she's singing. (Just compare with the purity of Bjorling's vowels!) I think this is probably the part of the opera that suited Nilsson the least.

I wonder whether this will be Sutherland's moment. Well, at least her diction is better than Nilsson. Nilsson's the mush mouth here! It only takes a few minutes of the music for Sutherland to win this. Nobody has the searing high notes of Nilsson in this role, but something else is required in this tender moment and Sutherland has it. She is affecting whilst also being noble (and there's a coldness in her tone at all times that just works for this role). On paper this recording should have been an oddity, but for whatever reason it's actually very good.

I vote for Joan!

N.


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