# SS 19.03.16 - Sibelius #1



## realdealblues

A continuation of the Saturday Symphonies Tradition:

Welcome to another weekend of symphonic listening! 
_*
*_For your listening pleasure this weekend:*

Jean Sibelius (1865 - 1957)*

Symphony No. 1 in E minor, Op. 39 

1. Andante, ma non troppo - Allegro energico
2. Andante (ma non troppo lento)
3. Scherzo: Allegro
4. Finale (Quasi una fantasia): Andante - Allegro molto - Andante assai - Allegro molto come prima - Andante (ma non troppo)

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Post what recording you are going to listen to giving details of Orchestra / Conductor / Chorus / Soloists etc - Enjoy!


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## realdealblues

I really enjoy this first symphony from Sibelius so I'm looking forward to the weekend already  I'll be listening too:

View attachment 82626


Leonard Bernstein/New York Philharmonic


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## Bayreuth

I listened to this symphony yesterday. It was a live recording of Leonard Bernstein conducting the New York Philarmonic Orchestra on DG. Really enjoyable music

_EDIT: It was Bernstein with the Wiener Philarmoniker, not the NYPO_


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## Pugg

I am going with _Bernstein_ also, only this time the V.P

​


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## Jeff W

With music this good, why limit yourself to just one? Going to go with Paavo Berglund and the Bournemouth Symphony Orchestra and Osmo Vanska and the Lahti Symphony Orchestra.


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## shadowdancer

I will join this weekend with the Helsinki Radio Symphony Orchestra and Okko Kamu


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## D Smith

I just listened to this last week with Colin Davis conducting the LSO. So I'll give Berglund a try.


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## Bayreuth

Pugg said:


> I am going with _Bernstein_ also, only this time the V.P
> 
> ​


Is it a live recording from 1992??


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## shadowdancer

Bayreuth said:


> Is it a live recording from 1992??


Shouldn't it be 1990?


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## realdealblues

shadowdancer said:


> Shouldn't it be 1990?


Yes, the Deutsch Grammophon recording with the Vienna Philharmonic is from 1990, which is also the year Lenny passed away.


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## Bayreuth

realdealblues said:


> Yes, the Deutsch Grammophon recording with the Vienna Philharmonic is from 1990, which is also the year Lenny passed away.


Yup. My bad. I was looking at the (P) date, not the recording date on my CD. It was, indeed, recorded in February of 1990

BTW realdealblues we are only 9 weeks away from finishing the 150 Symphonies list. What is to come from such ominous date onwards to us lovers of the Saturday Symphonies??


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## Mahlerian

I'll be going with Berglund's earlier recording with Bournemouth as well.


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## AClockworkOrange

I enjoy Sibelius' Symphonies a lot so I'll give this Symphony a listen or two - starting with Simon Rattle & the Berliner Philharmoniker.


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## realdealblues

Bayreuth said:


> Yup. My bad. I was looking at the (P) date, not the recording date on my CD. It was, indeed, recorded in February of 1990
> 
> BTW realdealblues we are only 9 weeks away from finishing the 150 Symphonies list. What is to come from such ominous date onwards to us lovers of the Saturday Symphonies??


I haven't added it up yet as to how many I have, but I have a fairly long list of suggestions from talkclassical members that weren't on the original 150 most recommended list. I could go on for probably another couple years easily with just the suggestions I've received. I will be doing them in order of how many times a work was suggested. The idea of having a flashback weekend once in a while to go back and revisit some on the original list has been thrown out there so it will continue for a while I think.

I thought about just posting the final Saturday Symphony from the list and at end adding in "next weeks Symphony will be" kind of deal so everyone would have a week to find a recording or whatever if they wanted and just do that each week or I may type up the list officially and post it before then. I guess it depends on whether people would like to have some surprise or if everyone wants to see what's coming for the next year.


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## TxllxT

Lovely heavyhanded approach + super overdone Karelia suite!!!


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## Bayreuth

realdealblues said:


> I haven't added it up yet as to how many I have, but I have a fairly long list of suggestions from talkclassical members that weren't on the original 150 most recommended list. I could go on for probably another couple years easily with just the suggestions I've received. I will be doing them in order of how many times a work was suggested. The idea of having a flashback weekend once in a while to go back and revisit some on the original list has been thrown out there so it will continue for a while I think.
> 
> I thought about just posting the final Saturday Symphony from the list and at end adding in "next weeks Symphony will be" kind of deal so everyone would have a week to find a recording or whatever if they wanted and just do that each week or I may type up the list officially and post it before then. I guess it depends on whether people would like to have some surprise or if everyone wants to see what's coming for the next year.


Well, whatever it ends up being, I'm on board


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## Balthazar

I'll be listening to Simon Rattle lead Birmingham.


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## Haydn man

Davis with the LSO for me


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## elgar's ghost

Sir Colin Davis with the Boston SO for me.


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## KenOC

For Saturday Symphony: Sibelius Symphony No. 1 from the recent Okko Kamu set. I'm not very familiar with this symphony but found it quite impressive on a close listening. Lots of things here he didn't pursue in later works as he seemed to adopt a more and more ascetic style. The scherzo is the most immediately striking movement, kind of a Brucknerian rub-a-dub-dub without sounding the least bit like Bruckner. Overall, liked it a lot.


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## Manxfeeder

Berglund with Helsinki.

I have several recordings of this, but I haven't spent much time with this one.


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## Ondine

I will go with Paavo Berglund and the Chamber Orchestra of Europe


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## Mika

Storgårds & BBC Philharmonic


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## MrTortoise

Osmo Vänskä and the Minnesota Orchestra.


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## Mahlerian

KenOC said:


> The scherzo is the most immediately striking movement, kind of a Brucknerian rub-a-dub-dub without sounding the least bit like Bruckner. Overall, liked it a lot.


Apart from the orchestration, it sounds a good bit like Bruckner.


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## bz3

Listening to Bernstein with VPO right now and I'll probably listen to Ashkenazy tomorrow because I enjoy this one quite a bit!


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## R3PL4Y

Live performance for me, just saw Thomas Dausgaard conduct this with the Detroit Symphony Orchestra.


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## Triplets

Stokie and the National Philharmonic. I love the Clarinet solo that starts this piece.


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## techniquest

Looking through this thread, I think I'll listen to a couple of recordings that haven't proven so obvious: Jansons with the Oslo PO and Bernstein with the NYPO. This is a truly wonderful symphony - what surprises me most is that it finds itself so close to the tail end of the 150 symphonies list


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## R3PL4Y

techniquest said:


> Looking through this thread, I think I'll listen to a couple of recordings that haven't proven so obvious: Jansons with the Oslo PO and Bernstein with the NYPO. This is a truly wonderful symphony - what surprises me most is that it finds itself so close to the tail end of the 150 symphonies list


As much as I like this symphony, it definitely ranks last among all of Sibelius's symphonies. It kind of feels like a watered down version of Tchaikovsky. There are some really good original parts, like the clarinet solo that opens the symphony. Overall, a lot of things in this symphony feel like they are there to fill space that Sibelius didn't know what to do with. While in his later works he became more comfortable with a more minimalistic approach to his music, it seems as though he is still figuring himself out in this piece.


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## Triplets

R3PL4Y said:


> As much as I like this symphony, it definitely ranks last among all of Sibelius's symphonies. It kind of feels like a watered down version of Tchaikovsky. There are some really good original parts, like the clarinet solo that opens the symphony. Overall, a lot of things in this symphony feel like they are there to fill space that Sibelius didn't know what to do with. While in his later works he became more comfortable with a more minimalistic approach to his music, it seems as though he is still figuring himself out in this piece.


The Tchaikovsky and Bruckner influences are pretty evident, and Sibelius was to chart new musical territories in his later works. It's still a great, moving, and deliciously orchestrated work


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## Classical Music Fan

Yesterday I listened to Mariss Jansons conduct the Oslo Philharmonic and today I went with Karajan in Berlin. I'm actually starting a Sibelius cycle with the mentioned first with Jansons. Two is with Yuri Temirkanov conducting the St. Petersburg Philharmonic, three is with Jukka-Pekka Saraste conducting the Finnish Radio Symphony, and 4-7 are with Bernstein and the New York Philharmonic.


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## kanishknishar

AClockworkOrange said:


> I enjoy Sibelius' Symphonies a lot so I'll give this Symphony a listen or two - starting with Simon Rattle & the Berliner Philharmoniker.
> 
> View attachment 82645


Hey! Let me know how you liked the recording!


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## kanishknishar

*Karajan*

I'll be hearing Karajan's version:








​
Recording's from 1981 - the so called dreadful decade for Karajan. I think not!


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## AClockworkOrange

Herrenvolk said:


> Hey! Let me know how you liked the recording!


I really enjoyed this recording of Sibelius' First Symphony. I have never heard his Birmingham recordings but he channels the power and musicianship of the Berliner Philharmoniker with remarkable results.

It doesn't quite dislodge Paavo Berglund & the Helsinki forces from my top spot but it comes surprisingly close.

I have been critical of Simon Rattle in the past but these recordings of Sibelius' Symphonies have lifted my view of him.


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## Marschallin Blair

*


Herrenvolk said:



I'll be hearing Karajan's version:


View attachment 82723
​
Recording's from 1981 - the so called dreadful decade for Karajan. I think not!

Click to expand...

*Karajan's BPO/EMI Sibelius _Sixth_ from around the same time period is even better. _;D_

Exquisite, in fact.


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## AClockworkOrange

Marschallin Blair said:


> Karajan's BPO/EMI Sibelius _Sixth_ from around the same time period is even better. _;D_
> 
> Exquisite, in fact.


I believe you made this recommendation to me a while ago too Marschallin and you are definitely not wrong :tiphat:


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## PeterF

Have just pulled off the shelf my Sibelius set of symphonies 1-7 by Neeme Jarvi and the Gothenburg Symphony Orchestra.
Will be listening to Symphony No. 1 soon.


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## gumnut

I am fairly new to classical music generally (about a year or so). I really enjoyed this symphony. Each movement has a lot to appreciate. I have the Vanska recording from the 90's . I would say this right up there in the top two or so for me out of Sibelius' symphonies. My favourite movement is the 2nd. 

I saw someone earlier in the thread say this was the least impressive/least good for them (or something to that effect). I often wonder what goes into peoples judgments about this sort of thing. Is it really subjective and can 'everyone can be right'? 

I have a lot of specific hobbies and from experience really do believe that appreciation stems from understanding. So when someone says they think the 4th and 7th are the best I do wonder that maybe they are just more experienced listeners than I am. Maybe I am still conditioned by the cheap thrills of modern music? 

I really don't understand the 4th in particular. To me it just sounds like four slow movements in a row and never really gets to the point. Maybe it just takes some more time.


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## Triplets

gumnut said:


> I am fairly new to classical music generally (about a year or so). I really enjoyed this symphony. Each movement has a lot to appreciate. I have the Vanska recording from the 90's . I would say this right up there in the top two or so for me out of Sibelius' symphonies. My favourite movement is the 2nd.
> 
> I saw someone earlier in the thread say this was the least impressive/least good for them (or something to that effect). I often wonder what goes into peoples judgments about this sort of thing. Is it really subjective and can 'everyone can be right'?
> 
> I have a lot of specific hobbies and from experience really do believe that appreciation stems from understanding. So when someone says they think the 4th and 7th are the best I do wonder that maybe they are just more experienced listeners than I am. Maybe I am still conditioned by the cheap thrills of modern music?
> 
> I really don't understand the 4th in particular. To me it just sounds like four slow movements in a row and never really gets to the point. Maybe it just takes some more time.


 Don't be intimidated just because you are a newbie. To answer your question, in the end subjectivity reigns. We either like something or we don't.
What may change over time is your ability appreciate works that don't click with you at first, such as the 4th. Sibelius style as a Symphonist really evolved over his creative career. The First is a vey original work but was heavily influenced by Tchaikovsky. Later Symphonies show some Brucknerian influence but primarily show the Composer experimenting with the Symphonic structure. The important thing is to be open to music and allow for the possibility that you may change your mind in time.


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## Mahlerian

gumnut said:


> I really don't understand the 4th in particular. To me it just sounds like four slow movements in a row and never really gets to the point. Maybe it just takes some more time.


In a sense it doesn't get to the point, as the work is always striving towards an affirmative conclusion that it never reaches, but neither the second nor the fourth movement is slow in tempo (though there's a slower coda at the end of the work).


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