# Single Round:Verschwiegene Liebe: Ludwig, Streich, Streisand, Bostridge, Rehfuss



## Seattleoperafan (Mar 24, 2013)

To give a break from the intense Die Frau music I thought wed have some anti-intense music. This Wolf lied is impossibly beautiful to me, very short at 2.5 min so 5 contestants is not a big investment in time, and I think I have found some superlative but very different talent for you to pass judgement on. Only Ludwig has been in one of our contests before. I have another Empress contest later in the week.


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## Woodduck (Mar 17, 2014)

TEXT AND TRANSLATION

*Verschwiegene Liebe* - "Silent Love"
(Joseph von Eichendorff; translation © Richard Stokes

Über Wipfel und Saaten
In den Glanz hinein -
Wer mag sie erraten,
Wer holte sie ein?
Gedanken sich wiegen,
Die Nacht ist verschwiegen,
Gedanken sind frei.

Errät es nur eine,
Wer an sie gedacht
Beim Rauschen der Haine,
Wenn niemand mehr wacht
Als die Wolken, die fliegen -
Mein Lieb ist verschwiegen
Und schön wie die Nacht.

_Over treetops and cornfields
Into the gleaming light -
Who may guess them,
Who catch them up?
Thoughts go floating,
The night is silent,
Thoughts are free.

If only she could guess
Who has thought of her
In the rustling groves,
When no one else is awake
But the scudding clouds -
My love is silent
And lovely as night._


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## Seattleoperafan (Mar 24, 2013)

Woodduck said:


> TEXT AND TRANSLATION
> 
> *Verschwiegene Liebe* - "Silent Love"
> (Joseph von Eichendorff; translation © Richard Stokes
> ...


Thanks for that. Germans have such gorgeous poetry to set to music!!!!!!!!!


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## Seattleoperafan (Mar 24, 2013)

I love them all. That gorgeous chest voice Streisand dips into is so sensuous to me, the mood she sets is so perfect, and I've listened to her version since I was in college. It gets my vote but I just discovered Rehfuss and he is just a hair behind her. I've never heard of him but he is wonderful!!!!!!!!!!


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## Woodduck (Mar 17, 2014)

Streisand was a nice inclusion, though a special case to be taken on its own terms. I've always rather enjoyed her classical excursions, without ever considering them competitive. She makes me think of what a lot of people who don't listen to much classical music say about it: "it's so relaxing!" I'd sort of like to see what happens to these nice folks at a performance of _Wozzeck._

Of the more conventional renditions, the least conventional is that of Bostridge. I think I read somewhere that he has a doctorate in philosophy, or something equally cerebral, and he sings as if the text of a song is an argument of which he doesn't want us to doubt for a millisecond that he knows what he's talking about. In pursuit of this he varies dynamics and vibrato constantly, as if to say "but take note!" It actually amounts to a different way of articulating the musical line, bulding it up out of musical-verbal units rather than spinning a legato line on which words float. I'm inclined to think of this as the legacy of Fischer-Dieskau, but taken to an extreme. Do I like it? If I set aside my usual expectations of classical vocalism, I can enjoy Bostridge doing his thing. It's original, it gets to the heart of the song, and in its own mannered, slightly effete way it's beautiful. (I might add that I've greatly enjoyed his recordings of Britten's orchestral song cycles, to which I find his style ideally suited).

I don't think I've heard much of Rehfuss, at least not recently. He's obviously a fine singer with an attractive warm tone and an easy emission, but his version of this is too fast to do justice to its moods. That leaves Ludwig and Streich, and both are lovely. But, with a nod to Streich's exquisitely floated high notes, I'll take Ludwig and her pianist as making more of the song than anyone here except for the somewhat eccentric Bostridge.

I'll stick with Ludwig.


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## Seattleoperafan (Mar 24, 2013)

Woodduck said:


> Streisand was a nice inclusion, though a special case to be taken on its own terms. I've always rather enjoyed her classical excursions, without ever considering them competitive. She makes me think of what a lot of people who don't listen to much classical music say about it: "it's so relaxing!" I'd sort of like to see what happens to these nice folks at a performance of _Wozzeck._
> 
> Of the more conventional renditions, the least conventional is that of Bostridge. I think I read somewhere that he has a doctorate in philosophy, or something equally cerebral, and he sings as if the text of a song is an argument of which he doesn't want us to doubt for a millisecond that he knows what he's talking about. In pursuit of this he varies dynamics and vibrato constantly, as if to say "but take note!" It actually amounts to a different way of articulating the musical line, bulding it up out of musical-verbal units rather than spinning a legato line on which words float. I'm inclined to think of this as the legacy of Fischer-Dieskau, but taken to an extreme. Do I like it? If I set aside my usual expectations of classical vocalism, I can enjoy Bostridge doing his thing. It's original, it gets to the heart of the song, and in its own mannered, slightly effete way it's beautiful. (I might add that I've greatly enjoyed his recordings of Britten's orchestral song cycles, to which I find his style ideally suited).
> 
> ...


I love how you write about this. You make me aspire to be better at interpretation. My language skills are a liability I'm afraid. Thanks.


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## Barbebleu (May 17, 2015)

Woodduck said:


> Streisand was a nice inclusion, though a special case to be taken on its own terms. I've always rather enjoyed her classical excursions, without ever considering them competitive. She makes me think of what a lot of people who don't listen to much classical music say about it: "it's so relaxing!" I'd sort of like to see what happens to these nice folks at a performance of _Wozzeck._
> 
> Of the more conventional renditions, the least conventional is that of Bostridge. I think I read somewhere that he has a doctorate in philosophy, or something equally cerebral, and he sings as if the text of a song is an argument of which he doesn't want us to doubt for a millisecond that he knows what he's talking about. In pursuit of this he varies dynamics and vibrato constantly, as if to say "but take note!" It actually amounts to a different way of articulating the musical line, bulding it up out of musical-verbal units rather than spinning a legato line on which words float. I'm inclined to think of this as the legacy of Fischer-Dieskau, but taken to an extreme. Do I like it? If I set aside my usual expectations of classical vocalism, I can enjoy Bostridge doing his thing. It's original, it gets to the heart of the song, and in its own mannered, slightly effete way it's beautiful. (I might add that I've greatly enjoyed his recordings of Britten's orchestral song cycles, to which I find his style ideally suited).


If you get a chance and you have a few spare hours try reading his book, Schubert's Winter Journey: Anatomy of an Obsession. Interesting, illuminating and frustrating in equal measure. I think it tells us more about Bostridge than Winterreise. Btw, I agree with you about Bostridge and Britten. In fact I feel that his true metier lies in the English songbook.


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## nina foresti (Mar 11, 2014)

Not a particular favorite.
Streich


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## MAS (Apr 15, 2015)

The song changes complexion with each singer and here we have a seemingly endless variety. I thought I’d go with Ludwig automatically, but Streich’s bright tone bought me a more hopeful dimension than the others.


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## Tsaraslondon (Nov 7, 2013)

Well what a range of different styles we have here, all of which I enjoyed in one way or another.

Streisand's version had more in common styistically with the others than I would have expected and she sings the song with a pure line and legato. It's a long time since I've heard it, but I really enjoyed hearing it again. 
As so often I find Bostridge beautiful but over-inflected and Rehfuss too fast to do the song justice.
That leaves Ludwig and Streich and here I preferred the lighter, brighter sound of Streich, which conjures up so beautifully the effect of moonlight on the water.
I'm going to go with Streich, whilst noting that Streisand came in second place for me.


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## The Conte (May 31, 2015)

Pre-listening prediction: I am very fussy when it comes to Lieder and most of what passes for Lieder singing I find too dry, predictable and academic to the point of being totally lacking in personality or overdone as if it were opera arias accompanied with piano. Then there is the so anaemic, it's just plain dull!

Therefore, there are very few artists that I think can sing Lieder well, but Ludwig is one of those, I expect her to win by a mile.

Some thoughts on listening: I'm not all that keen on Wolf, his miniatures are too subtle to be clever by half. This one has a beguiling simplicity that is as enigmatic as the Mona Lisa's smile isn't. Ludwig's interpretative gifts are wasted on this, despite her giving a performance that is as authentically German art song as you could get. Streich is thoroughly charming. Bostridge is not a singer I like and I'm not sure what is going on here.

Now Streisand, I had no idea that she had sung this sort of rep and I listened to her first because I was so intrigued. I like it and I was amazed at how well it worked. This gets my vote for top crossover track ever and her version feels more authentic than Bostridge's strange assay of this short song.

I like Rehfuss, but is he suitably restrained or just plain cold?

Did Fischer-Dieskau not sing this (and _surely_ he would have sung it better!)

Post listening considerations: Fischer-Dieskau DID record it! His version is exquisite and just about beats all of these. However, let's consider the five in the contest.

Streisand's simple approach captures the enigmatic simplicity of the song and that's quite something. However, Streich just takes the lead for me due to a greater range of dynamics and vocal inflections, whilst keeping it simple.

N.


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## Seattleoperafan (Mar 24, 2013)

The Conte said:


> Pre-listening prediction: I am very fussy when it comes to Lieder and most of what passes for Lieder singing I find too dry, predictable and academic to the point of being totally lacking in personality or overdone as if it were opera arias accompanied with piano. Then there is the so anaemic, it's just plain dull!
> 
> Therefore, there are very few artists that I think can sing Lieder well, but Ludwig is one of those, I expect her to win by a mile.
> 
> ...


I liked what you said a lot. I was aware of Dietrich's version but I've never been drawn much to him. Sorry.
An interesting point is that Helen Traubel spent years studying to sing lieder and sang lots of concerts where she sang them. What is interesting is that she ended up making her best money singing popular music where her studying of the art of lieder singing would have had a very direct impact. Unlike opera it is much more of an intimate connection with the audience.


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## ScottK (Dec 23, 2021)

Great contsest!!! I'm thrilled to find this beautiful song and a fascinating array of singers, awesome!

I left Ludwig for last because she is the only real bias I had amongst these singers.

5 - Streisand - She sounded essentially appropriate in style but that unsupported sound on top of a mic is not, to me, the same thing.

4 - Rehfuss - Very inviting down low but, to me, not convincing in the higher parts of the song, which obviously are not that high. Maybe they lie on his break. That tricky interval leap up that happens twice did not have a convincing feel of confidence and that final note was most unfortunate.

3 - Bostridge - Toughest call is here because I enjoy Bostridge and could put him 2nd. I think he's a great story-teller - even if he relishes his unusualness a little much in concert - and I like his rendition alot....kind of an alternative to the more straightforward approaches of Streich and Ludwig.

4 - Streich - Great! I love a clear voice with a little grain in it (I guess that's a contradiction!) and she just sings it beautifully. I listened to her first and all along I was definitely prepared for hers to be my favorite rendition but...

5 - Christa reigns! At first I thought the live recording ( didn't realize it was live at the time, thought it was just a little more back and full) might make her rendition less personal but it wasn't. That beautiful sound and that beautiful way of singing ...everything! My bias held...Christa reigns!


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## ScottK (Dec 23, 2021)

The Conte said:


> This one has a beguiling simplicity that is as enigmatic as the Mona Lisa's smile isn't.
> 
> N.


Just had to tell you that my wife and I passed a print of the Mona Lisa two days ago and discussed...."what is it about the Mona Lisa??????" I shared your comment with her and she said "He must be our kind of guy!":lol::lol::lol:


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## The Conte (May 31, 2015)

ScottK said:


> Just had to tell you that my wife and I passed a print of the Mona Lisa two days ago and discussed...."what is it about the Mona Lisa??????" I shared your comment with her and she said "He must be our kind of guy!":lol::lol::lol:


I remember reading an article some years ago that said that the general public was ignorance of the Mona Lisa's existence until it hit the headlines in 1911 when it was stolen. It was an important portrait in its time (when secular portraiture was somewhat rare), but I prefer the ancient roman portraits from Pompei and it was soon bettered after it was painted.

N.


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