# Your Production "Requirements"



## Bellinilover (Jul 24, 2013)

With opera productions or recordings, do you have certain "requirements" that must be satisfied before you can like the performance? Some opera-goers, for instance, want always to hear a mezzo rather than a soprano Rosina in _Il barbiere di Siviglia_. Others like _Les contes d'Hoffmann_ performed with the "Venetian act" before the "Antonia act," or vice versa.

As for me, I have to have a Germont (_La Traviata_) who is basically sympathetic. It's apt for Germont to be angry with Violetta at the start of their scene together, but he needs to soften visibly and audibly as the scene progresses; he shoudn't be stern or stodgy throughout. From the few productions of the opera I've seen I've already found that some baritones who sing Germont are too intent on showing us how emotionally repressed the character is (and how repressive his middle-class values are). I recently decided that if I buy a _Traviata_ DVD, I'll buy the La Scala one with Edita Gruberova because her Germont, Giorgio Zancanaro, is much "softer" than Renato Bruson with Renee Fleming.

And -- this is going to sound weird -- I actually chose to buy the Beecham _La Boheme_ rather than the Schippers one on the basis of Marcello: Robert Merrill with Beecham is warmer and more personable than Mario Sereni with Schippers. So I'd say a Marcello who is compassionate and not just hot-tempered (or a cipher) is another of my requirements.


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## Vesteralen (Jul 14, 2011)

Everyone already knows one of my production requirements...

The other one is, if I'm going to watch it on the small screen, I definitely want singers who visually fit the part they are playing. No 50 year olds playing teenagers. No defensive ends playing waifs. etc etc

If it's only audio - then vocals rule.


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## MAuer (Feb 6, 2011)

I want to hear lyric spinto voices in the roles of Leonore and Florestan -- no hochdramatische types. Or a dramatic coloratura in the role of Leonore, since this is the voice type for which Beethoven actually wrote the part.
I prefer the version of _Idomeneo_ with a tenor Idamante -- likewise the French version of _Orphee et Eurydice _with a tenor Orphee. I'll also admit to being a purist in that I do want to hear a mezzo Rosina, and sopranos in the roles of Despina, Zerlina, and Donna Elvira.


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## Bellinilover (Jul 24, 2013)

*Mauer:* I agree about the mezzo Rosina, though I did once hear an excellent soprano sing the part. I'm more indifferent about the three Mozart ladies. I never considered the issue of Leonore and Florestan. I guess the ideal Leonore for you would be someone like Lilli Lehmann...and the ideal Florestan would be Jonas Kaufmann?


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## deggial (Jan 20, 2013)

Vesteralen said:


> Everyone already knows one of my production requirements...


no countertenors within a square mile of the production? 

weirdly enough (considering I'd rather have mezzos in all female roles), I don't mind a soprano singing Rosina unless she can't trill to save her life. Rather, I'm a stickler about my idea of a good belcantist. No trill, no deal. A lack of imagination, no elastic voice, no morbidezza for Bellini heroines, no smooth legato, no rubato = out they go, I don't care if they can act, look the part or are indeed otherwise good singers. Additionally, I like muscular sounding basses for Rossini and sprightly conducting for his comedies whilst for Bellini the orchestra should be rather gentle and the singers shouldn't shout.

Don Giovanni IS a comedy, I don't like it overly dark or with a _menacing_ title role, I see DG as very smooth and easy going in spite of a lot of questionable actions (by today's standards). Zerlina should be very funny and sly (instead of kinda dumb) and rather a mezzo whilst I agree that Donna Elvira sounds good as a soprano. Cherubino (surprise!) also sounds better as a soprano or a very bright mezzo. The Duke of Mantua _should not_ be camp... won't name names, but, yea. Ideally, I like a manlier sounding Tito, although I know that's not how it's written (Don Ottavio isn't the paragon of manliness, eh?) but it just sounds better to me. No whiny Sestos, either (which is 90% of them). Just no.


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## schigolch (Jun 26, 2011)

Though the role of Rosina was written for the alto Geltrude Righetti (that was also the first Angelina, in La Cenerentola), Rossini himself adapted the part for a soprano, Joséphine Fodor-Mainvielle. So both options are perfectly "purist". 

Rossini even introduced an aria "Ah se é ver che in tal momento" for the soprano version.


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## mamascarlatti (Sep 23, 2009)

MY main production requirement is more general than these. It is that, as well as singing, singers should act. This includes listening to other singers and reacting appropriately. If you are supposed to be in love with the soprano, look at her when you say so. Don't stare out at the audience looking self-satisfied. Singers that have their eyes glued to the conductor and simply park and bark can really ruin a production for me.


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## Volve (Apr 14, 2013)

My only requirement is that the production is either traditional or at least tasteful, or fits the story. As some of you may know already, I'm a huge Wagner fan, and it pains me to see what's being done to his operas... the valkeries as punk bikers, with helmets and everything, dressing Brunnhilde up as a space tomato, making Sachs a painter (quite a comic result when he is singing about cobbling), and many other suchs. I also hate, hate cuts!. Other than that, if the musicians give it their best, that's good enough


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## deggial (Jan 20, 2013)

Volve said:


> dressing Brunnhilde up as a space tomato


:lol::lol::lol: which production is that?


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## mamascarlatti (Sep 23, 2009)

deggial said:


> ... which production is that?


I can't speak for the OP, but this is what came to mind, from the Valencia Ring:


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## Itullian (Aug 27, 2011)

deggial said:


> *no countertenors within a square mile of the production? *
> weirdly enough (considering i'd rather have mezzos in all female roles), i don't mind a soprano singing rosina unless she can't trill to save her life. Rather, i'm a stickler about my idea of a good belcantist. No trill, no deal. A lack of imagination, no elastic voice, no morbidezza for bellini heroines, no smooth legato, no rubato = out they go, i don't care if they can act, look the part or are indeed otherwise good singers. Additionally, i like muscular sounding basses for rossini and sprightly conducting for his comedies whilst for bellini the orchestra should be rather gentle and the singers shouldn't shout.
> 
> Don giovanni is a comedy, i don't like it overly dark or with a _menacing_ title role, i see dg as very smooth and easy going in spite of a lot of questionable actions (by today's standards). Zerlina should be very funny and sly (instead of kinda dumb) and rather a mezzo whilst i agree that donna elvira sounds good as a soprano. Cherubino (surprise!) also sounds better as a soprano or a very bright mezzo. The duke of mantua _should not_ be camp... Won't name names, but, yea. Ideally, i like a manlier sounding tito, although i know that's not how it's written (don ottavio isn't the paragon of manliness, eh?) but it just sounds better to me. No whiny sestos, either (which is 90% of them). Just no.


yes!!!!! ...........................


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## mamascarlatti (Sep 23, 2009)

Itullian said:


> yes!!!!! ...........................


No!!!!!!!............................................................


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## deggial (Jan 20, 2013)

mamascarlatti said:


> I can't speak for the OP, but this is what came to mind, from the Valencia Ring:


the Valencia Ring is a thing of beauty! if I ever feel the urge to Wagnerise my life that's how I'm going to start.


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## Itullian (Aug 27, 2011)

mamascarlatti said:


> No!!!!!!!............................................................


Give me sopranos :angel:


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## Volve (Apr 14, 2013)

deggial said:


> :lol::lol::lol: which production is that?






Here it be. Musically speaking, it was very enjoyable (though I did not like the Siegmund and the Wotan very much). But seriously, she looks like a tomato...


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## mamascarlatti (Sep 23, 2009)

Itullian said:


> Give me sopranos :angel:


If I ever have a spare one I'll try to oblige.


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## Bellinilover (Jul 24, 2013)

Volve wrote:
*I also hate, hate cuts!*

That reminds me. There are two cuts I really don't like, both of them in _Lucia di Lammermoor_. The first concerns the fast section of the Act II finale. I can't stand it when the repeat is omitted, because then the piece fails to build momentum and is far less exciting. The second concerns Raimondo's aria and cabaletta in scene one of Act II; these may not be the most thrilling pieces of music in the world, but I feel that the opera is stronger when Raimondo's character is given more stage time. Additionally, I think the Wolf's Crag duet between Enrico and Edgardo is thrilling and would rather see it included than omitted (though I can understand _why_ it's sometimes omitted -- it sounds pretty difficult to sing). As a matter of fact, _Lucia_ with cuts seems to me like a much weaker opera than _Lucia_ without cuts. Without cuts I think it's as great as any of the middle-period Verdi operas.


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## deggial (Jan 20, 2013)

mamascarlatti said:


> If I ever have a spare one I'll try to oblige.


I just found one under the sofa cushions. Any takers? she's a bit creased and sleepy but otherwise in good working condition. She says she might attempt a Brunnhilde once she gets enough air pumped into her


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## MAuer (Feb 6, 2011)

Bellinilover said:


> *Mauer:* I agree about the mezzo Rosina, though I did once hear an excellent soprano sing the part. I'm more indifferent about the three Mozart ladies. I never considered the issue of Leonore and Florestan. I guess the ideal Leonore for you would be someone like Lilli Lehmann...and the ideal Florestan would be Jonas Kaufmann?


Definitely Jonas Kaufmann for Florestan. Leonore would be either Sena Jurinac or Camilla Nylund. The latter has actually sung the extremely difficult original version of this role as well as the final -- and Beethoven had the same soprano, Anna Milder, at the premieres of the 1805, 1806, and final 1814 versions of the opera. I suspect I would have liked Lehmann had I heard her in person; with the antiquated recording equipment of her time, it's difficult to tell.


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## Itullian (Aug 27, 2011)

Bellinilover said:


> Volve wrote:
> *I also hate, hate cuts!*
> 
> That reminds me. There are two cuts I really don't like, both of them in _Lucia di Lammermoor_. The first concerns the fast section of the Act II finale. I can't stand it when the repeat is omitted, because then the piece fails to build momentum and is far less exciting. The second concerns Raimondo's aria and cabaletta in scene one of Act II; these may not be the most thrilling pieces of music in the world, but I feel that the opera is stronger when Raimondo's character is given more stage time. Additionally, I think the Wolf's Crag duet between Enrico and Edgardo is thrilling and would rather see it included than omitted (though I can understand _why_ it's sometimes omitted -- it sounds pretty difficult to sing). As a matter of fact, _Lucia_ with cuts seems to me like a much weaker opera than _Lucia_ without cuts. Without cuts I think it's as great as any of the middle-period Verdi operas.


TOTALLY TOTALLY with you. Why this great opera is always cut is beyond me.


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## guythegreg (Jun 15, 2012)

What Mama S. said. Good acting. That's really what spoiled the recent Ballo with Gregory Kunde in it for me - the Amelia (sorry, forgot her name) didn't seem to realize she was on camera! It was very odd.


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## deggial (Jan 20, 2013)

^ what did she do? park and bark? (love that expression, haha. Reminds me of my dear Caballe, a park and barker if there was one).


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## guythegreg (Jun 15, 2012)

No, she made faces at Kunde and spoke to him directly when she thought no one was looking.


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## Guest (Sep 27, 2013)

I have no special production requirements, but I don't care about the gender of the body producing the voice.
_A propos_, saw *George Benjamin*'s _Written on Skin_ just a few days ago. 




 (interviews and rehearsal with piano)




 (extract, with orchestra)


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## deggial (Jan 20, 2013)

guythegreg said:


> No, she made faces at Kunde and spoke to him directly when she thought no one was looking.


!!! dude. Wow. How unprofessional.


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## Notung (Jun 12, 2013)

My 3 criteria:

1. Little to no deviation from the written score. I don't care if it was period practice, but extensive ornamentation is distracting from what the composer originally wrote.

2. The director must have a healthy respect for the composer. Some regie directors like to degrade the composer's vision (happens in Wagner a lot). The production could be as modern as the director wants, so long as it is in service to the composer and his music.

3. No wire hangers. Ever!


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## Bellinilover (Jul 24, 2013)

I'd much rather hear Alfredo's cabaletta in Act II of LA TRAVIATA end with the lower note rather than the high note. The high-note ending sounds awkward and out-of-place to me (even, or especially, with such a tasteful tenor as Carlo Bergonzi). Also: some people don't seem to like Germont's cabaletta, but I think it should be included in performance, not because it's the greatest piece of music but because I feel it rounds off the scene nicely, making the ending sound less abrupt. But as with Alfredo, Germont really only needs to sing one verse of the cabaletta, IMO.


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## deggial (Jan 20, 2013)

Notung said:


> I don't care if it was period practice, but extensive ornamentation is distracting from what the composer originally wrote.


they did imply it though.


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## Don Fatale (Aug 31, 2009)

The scenery and costumes must not consist solely of black and white and drab colours. It's not clever or arty, it's just dull.


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## Woodduck (Mar 17, 2014)

I'm such a fussy old son of a whichever that almost any flaw greater than a zit on the soprano's nose can make me wish I'd bought the Schwarzkopf recording instead. But my first requirement of opera in any format is fine singing - strong, clear voices with no wide vibratos that obscure pitch, technically up to the demands of the music being sung, and employed with musicality and sincere expression. Once that requirement is met, we're on to productions that seek to discover and illuminate the composer's and librettist's intentions and which harmonize with the style of the music. Mozart does not sound quite right in a laundromat, unless someone is listening to him while waiting for the spin cycle to finish.


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## Marschallin Blair (Jan 23, 2014)

Woodduck said:


> I'm such a fussy old son of a whichever that almost any flaw greater than a zit on the soprano's nose can make me wish I'd bought the Schwarzkopf recording instead. But my first requirement of opera in any format is fine singing - strong, clear voices with no wide vibratos that obscure pitch, technically up to the demands of the music being sung, and employed with musicality and sincere expression. Once that requirement is met, we're on to productions that seek to discover and illuminate the composer's and librettist's intentions and which harmonize with the style of the music. Mozart does not sound quite right in a laundromat, unless someone is listening to him while waiting for the spin cycle to finish.


--
Ha. Ha. Ha. Ha. Ha. . . If its lyrical and light- Schwarzkopf just ruins _everyone_ for me. Well, at least I'm not alone.


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## Bellinilover (Jul 24, 2013)

I like productions of the "Shakespeare operas" -- Verdi's OTELLO and MACBETH, Thomas's HAMLET, etc. -- to look like elaborate, traditional productions of Shakespeare's plays. So, no updated productions of those for me. I feel the same way about RIGOLETTO, which seems very Shakespearean to me.

I don't care for "minimalist" productions of Bellini's operas. Here's a good example of the type of set I don't like for Bellini:






IMO, it doesn't look the way the music sounds.


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## Badinerie (May 3, 2008)

Bellinilover said:


> . I recently decided that if I buy a _Traviata_ DVD, I'll buy the La Scala one with Edita Gruberova because her Germont, Giorgio Zancanaro, is much "softer" than Renato Bruson with Renee Fleming.


And of course because Edita Gruberova's "Estrano" is very very VERY good!

With studio recordings I wish engineers wouldnt treat Stereo panning as an olympic event! And the Reverb fader should be wired to their genitals. this might prevent the over use of said effect.

As far as live production is concerned Please! give me some scenery, and costumes and at least have them ballpark relevant to the opera. With the cost of tickets being what they are, I dont want to see bare stage lit by an energy conserving light bulb and Azucena dressed as a Panda.


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## Couac Addict (Oct 16, 2013)

I'm probably the only one on this thread who cares more about what happens in the pit than on stage. The tempo and dynamics need to be excellent as does the quality of the beat.


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## Figleaf (Jun 10, 2014)

deggial said:


> The Duke of Mantua _should not_ be camp... won't name names, but, yea. Ideally, I like a manlier sounding Tito, although I know that's not how it's written (Don Ottavio isn't the paragon of manliness, eh?) but it just sounds better to me. No whiny Sestos, either (which is 90% of them). Just no.


Great post, deggial! I don't like camp Dukes of Mantua either. I do, however, have a soft spot for ferocious sounding ones (see attachment).

I don't know how true to the character and the music such muscularity is, though. Alessandro Bonci's records of the Duke's music always sound to me like some of the most idiomatic and character-appropriate performances of all the many, many versions of the Duke's songs:






He's not really my cup of tea though, being at the camp end of the tenor spectrum, but he does sound believable as the slippery cad. The more robust sounding Dukes maybe don't seem quite so true to the character.


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## Figleaf (Jun 10, 2014)

Figleaf said:


> irrelevant nerdy stuff about dead tenors
> 
> .


Production requirements: this is what I meant to talk about in the previous post but got distracted. The most obvious one, which shouldn't even need stating, is that singers should sing their role live and not mime. I was disturbed to find out recently that miming in live opera performances has become common. I don't personally go to the theatre any more, so this ought to be no skin off my nose, but it really bothered me for some reason. In spoken theatre audiences would be unlikely to applaud an actor who mouthed and gesticulated while another actor spoke their lines from the wings, so why on earth would this be tolerated in opera, where the voice is so much more important? The particular example I heard of was a WNO production of Guillaume Tell, where the Mathilde was unable to sing but mimed her part while the understudy sang it from the wings- presumably mike boosted in order to be audible. It seems like such a tortuous and unsatisfactory solution- in the past, surely, the understudy would have gone onstage in the lead soprano's place, or if the star singer was that important the performance would have been postponed. I am told (by random and not overly polite people elsewhere on the internet) that this is completely normal practice and no reasonable person would object to it. Seriously? I find it hard to believe, though if it's true, it's another nail in opera's coffin!


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## SixFootScowl (Oct 17, 2011)

Good voices, traditional staging and costumes, full production, actors who reasonably fit the parts (no fat guy for the starving Florestan in Fidelio, no 60-year-old playing the daughter of the regiment, etc.).


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## Albert7 (Nov 16, 2014)

I think that I dig the productions of Hans Neuenfels!

I prefer avant-garde, contemporary stagings of opera. Sometimes a traditional production will do for me too. But I like when the production is off the rails and forces the viewer to re-interpret the piece.


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## Sloe (May 9, 2014)

albertfallickwang said:


> I think that I dig the productions of Hans Neuenfels!
> 
> I prefer avant-garde, contemporary stagings of opera. Sometimes a traditional production will do for me too. But I like when the production is off the rails and forces the viewer to re-interpret the piece.


I think regietheater directors should compose their own operas instead or at least write librettos to new operas. Or create something else new based on the operas they are intending to partially destroy.
I really don´t see what makes it avant-garde either. When nearly every opera production have non traditional staging it is not an avant-garde it is following a norm.


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## Albert7 (Nov 16, 2014)

Florestan said:


> Good voices, traditional staging and costumes, full production, actors who reasonably fit the parts (no fat guy for the starving Florestan in Fidelio, no 60-year-old playing the daughter of the regiment, etc.).


In the golden age of opera, it was all about the voice so suspension of disbelief happened a lot more. A fat guy could play a starving character as long as he could sing. Now the theater has superseded mere vocal technique.


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## Speranza (Nov 22, 2014)

I don't mind modern productions as long as they add somthing to the opera for example I saw an Elektra were the stage was completly bare, harsh almost and that seemed to fit with Elektra's state of mind and her unhappiness. If they are being modern for the sake of it or the set/costumes detract or distract from the opera then I don't like it. I much prefer great actors to great singers as long as they can sing well enough. I do prefer " no fat guy for the starving Florestan"

These are all preferences not requirements to be honest I pretty much sit through anything just to listen to the music.


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## sharik (Jan 23, 2013)

Bellinilover said:


> Your Production "Requirements"


want them be *decent* in all respects.


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## Figleaf (Jun 10, 2014)

albertfallickwang said:


> In the golden age of opera, it was all about the voice so suspension of disbelief happened a lot more. A fat guy could play a starving character as long as he could sing. Now the theater has superseded mere vocal technique.


I think that's a bit too much of a generalisation: critics have always faulted singers for their appearance, acting, costumes etc. But you are right that the golden age of the late 19th century was about the quality of the singing, to a much greater extent than has been the case since.


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