# Similar composers to bruckner



## BenG (Aug 28, 2018)

Hi, 

I've been listening to lots of Bruckner lately (mostly the symphonies), my personal favourite being the 9th, and I love the mystical feel of the piece and the huge build ups. Does anyone know another composer that can create that effect? (setting aside the obvious examples: Wagner, Mahler).

Thank you.


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## Triplets (Sep 4, 2014)

Are you familiar with Jean Sibelius, or Ralph Vaughn Williams? If not, I think that you will enjoy their Symphonies immensely. There was also a fellow named Beethoven who wrote some Symphonies that could answer to the descriptions that you have made...


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## hpowders (Dec 23, 2013)

Try Richard Strauss tone poems such as Ein Heldenleben and Death and Transfiguration.


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## elgar's ghost (Aug 8, 2010)

Post-Bruckner, I would suggest the symphonies of Franz Schmidt (four: 1899-1933), Karl Amadeus Hartmann (eight: 1946-1962) and Robert Simpson (eleven: 1951-1990). How connected they are (or aren't) to Bruckner's actual sound-world isn't the point I'm making with these suggestions, but the symphonies of all three composers have a specific gravity, depth, whatever you want to call it, which you may find satisfying.


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## CnC Bartok (Jun 5, 2017)

One could argue that Bruckner's 10th, 11th and 12th Symphonies were composed by Richard Wetz!


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## isorhythm (Jan 2, 2015)

You might be interested in Einojuhani Rautavaara's 3rd Symphony....


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## Überstürzter Neumann (Jan 1, 2014)

Robert Pickett said:


> One could argue that Bruckner's 10th, 11th and 12th Symphonies were composed by Richard Wetz!


Well said. 
One could also argue that Furtwängler's 2nd symphony is out-brucknering Bruckner.


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## eugeneonagain (May 14, 2017)

I find it hard to compare things to Bruckner. Structurally he wrote the same symphony nine times with excellent variations and when you're in his listening world you know what you're getting. I like that.


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## Itullian (Aug 27, 2011)

Martucci, Furtwangler, Shmidt


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## Überstürzter Neumann (Jan 1, 2014)

eugeneonagain said:


> I find it hard to compare things to Bruckner. Structurally he wrote the same symphony nine times with excellent variations and when you're in his listening world you know what you're getting. I like that.


Or ten really. Don't forget the wonderful Nullte.
I only listen to Bruckner these days. I don't think I will need anything more for the rest of my life-


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## Überstürzter Neumann (Jan 1, 2014)

You might also want to check out Wilhelm Stenhammar's first symphony. 
Before he discovered Sibelius, he was a Bruckner partisan, and he described this symphony as "idyllic Bruckner.


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## DaveM (Jun 29, 2015)

After years of listening to almost every symphony of the classical and romantic periods I could get my handsome, I came to Bruckner late. His are astounding works. I hear more accolades for his later symphonies, but I find his 2nd and 3rd to be on a par with his later works. 

What amazes me is how wonderful the first version of the 2nd symphony Adagio is -specifically as conducted by Tintner- and yet, he thought he had to revise it...several times. The same goes for the 3rd symphony Adagio: the first version cleverly works in a tip of the hat to Wagner, but inexplicably he removed it in later versions.


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## Eusebius12 (Mar 22, 2010)

Hans Rott's symphony


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## Guest (Aug 30, 2018)

No mention of Schubert yet? To me, his symphonies are far closer to the kinds of things that Bruckner was writing before Bruckner even put pen to paper.


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## eugeneonagain (May 14, 2017)

shirime said:


> No mention of Schubert yet? To me, his symphonies are far closer to the kinds of things that Bruckner was writing before Bruckner even put pen to paper.


I don't see that comparison at all. I'm not saying you're wrong, but to my mind Schubert's symphonies are not 'expansive' in anything like the same way.


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## Guest (Aug 30, 2018)

eugeneonagain said:


> I don't see that comparison at all. I'm not saying you're wrong, but to my mind Schubert's symphonies are not 'expansive' in anything like the same way.


Fair enough, but really I was just thinking back to this thread Schubert and Bruckner

I still think Bruckner's brass writing is boring.


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## DaveM (Jun 29, 2015)

What eugeneonagain said. To compare Bruckner to Schubert is to dismiss the originality of Bruckner symphonies. These are two separate eras, notwithstanding Schubert anticipating romanticism. I’ve come to believe that Bruckner belongs to a very short list of those that were at the pinnacle of romanticism at the tail end of the 19th century. Sadly, with a few exceptions, it was very soon to be the end of truly romantic classical music as it had been known for preceding decades.


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## SONNET CLV (May 31, 2014)

Seems there was a post a while back titled

https://www.talkclassical.com/52311-if-you-have-run.html?highlight=If+you+have+run+out+of+Bruckner...

which may prove helpful, too.


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## Guest (Aug 30, 2018)

DaveM said:


> What eugeneonagain said. To compare Bruckner to Schubert is to dismiss the originality of Bruckner symphonies. These are two separate eras, notwithstanding Schubert anticipating romanticism. I've come to believe that Bruckner belongs to a very short list of those that were at the pinnacle of romanticism at the tail end of the 19th century. Sadly, with a few exceptions, it was very soon to be the end of truly romantic classical music as it had been known for preceding decades.


Well, I love Bruckner and I love Schubert and, as I understand it, they were two highly original composers with some things in common when it came to how they approached symphonic form. It might actually be useful to make comparisons between composers for the purpose of this thread, actually, and I don't think it would be dismissing the originality of anyone.


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## licorice stick (Nov 24, 2014)

To make the OP even more specific, are there other pieces comparable to Bruckner's 6th, which stands apart from the others and is by far my favorite of the cycle? I can't think of any pieces that inhabit the same sonic universe (purgatory?) as the 6th. I always hear the strings tapping out a message in Morse code in the first measures, with the cellos then decrypting it into an ineffably probing and profound question.


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## eugeneonagain (May 14, 2017)

shirime said:


> I still think Bruckner's brass writing is boring.


What?! I need a lie down in a dark room.


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## Art Rock (Nov 28, 2009)

Alberic Magnard has been called the French Bruckner. I have my doubt about that, but his four symphonies are well worth exploring.


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## eugeneonagain (May 14, 2017)

licorice stick said:


> To make the OP even more specific, are there other pieces comparable to Bruckner's 6th, which stands apart from the others and is by far my favorite of the cycle? I can't think of any pieces that inhabit the same sonic universe (purgatory?) as the 6th. I always hear the strings tapping out a message in Morse code in the first measures, with the cellos then decrypting it into an ineffably probing and profound question.


The 6th is also my favourite. There is that section about 8/9 minutes into the first movement where the development is burbling in the strings like a little brook and then just explodes in all directions in a huge fanfare with a crescendo in the horns. Gets me every time.


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## eugeneonagain (May 14, 2017)

Art Rock said:


> Alberic Magnard has been called the French Bruckner. I have my doubt about that, but his four symphonies are well worth exploring.


I have a string quartet by Magnard, but never looked further into his works. I'm listening to the first symphony on youtube and I can understand the reason for the comparison. The quartet is very different in tone and style to this symphony.

Cheers.


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## Enthusiast (Mar 5, 2016)

Who to follow Bruckner with depends a lot on what you like about Bruckner. There is a Schubertian side to his music - from what I've heard it comes through most clearly in Harnoncourt's recordings - but there are other, heavier elements that are not Schubert at all (not even the Gothic Schubert of the Unfinished). All those big brassy climaxes: I'm not sure of any music like that but to me they require such careful handling if they are not to sound bombastic and ugly so it is probably not that aspect that you would want to pursue in other composers? And then there is the sublime Bruckner, the slow movements and so on, and I guess some Strauss can be a good follow on except that Strauss is rarely sublime .... so the nearest I can think of might be some late Beethoven slow movements. I won't mention the scherzos which I often find a little tedious. Overall, the symphonies somehow seem to stand still - like mountain ranges or cathedrals - and many conductors (Karajan, Wand, Bohm) seem to exaggerate this and if that is what you like then you might look to some Debussy? Personally, I prefer Bruckner that has some sort of narrative thread and is less "architectural" ... but approaches that do this seem to fit well within the whole Romantic tradition. As general and slightly obscure follow-ons you could try Bloch's Symphony in C or Suk's Asrael.


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## CnC Bartok (Jun 5, 2017)

Art Rock said:


> Alberic Magnard has been called the French Bruckner. I have my doubt about that, but his four symphonies are well worth exploring.


I have my doubts about that epithet too, especially as it makes Magnard out to be a derivative composer, while he is very much his own man. I think the closest he comes to Bruckner is in the glorious slow movement of the Third Symphony?

For me, his Fourth is an even finer piece. The greatest Symphony ever composed by a Frenchman; just my humble opinion......

......but I'm right :tiphat:

Very happy to echo the positive recommendation for Schmidt and the grossly under-rated Hartmann. Ditto Asrael. If it's the discursive nature of Bruckner that appeals specifically, maybe Vaughan Williams London Symphony, especially in its original uncut version?


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## kyjo (Jan 1, 2018)

Robert Pickett said:


> I have my doubts about that epithet too, especially as it makes Magnard out to be a derivative composer, while he is very much his own man. I think the closest he comes to Bruckner is in the glorious slow movement of the Third Symphony?
> 
> For me, his Fourth is an even finer piece. The greatest Symphony ever composed by a Frenchman; just my humble opinion......


Very much agreed here. Magnard sometimes uses chorale textures to great effect in his music, hence the Bruckner comparison, but he's very much his own man. His Fourth Symphony is a deeply moving masterpiece which is one of my very favorite French symphonies alongside Saint-Saens' Third and Damase's. The final minutes of the work are glorious beyond words...


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## joen_cph (Jan 17, 2010)

There Can Be Only One Anton Bruckner.


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## Tallisman (May 7, 2017)

eugeneonagain said:


> I find it hard to compare things to Bruckner. Structurally he wrote the same symphony nine times with excellent variations and when you're in his listening world you know what you're getting. I like that.


Blasphemy! I'll grant the form stays (largely) the same, but the content is highly varied. The massive orchestral fugue in the finale of the 5th is like nothing in any other of his symphonies; nay, in all music. The 8th and 9th occupy different worlds to the 4th!


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## Tallisman (May 7, 2017)

Nothing is like Uncle Anton, but if you like lush post-Wagnerian romanticism, try Schmidt.


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## Roger Knox (Jul 19, 2017)

*Schubert, Bruckner, and ... Scherber*

I think Schubert's Symphony No. 9 in C Major influenced Bruckner (compare the slow movement with that of Bruckner's Symphony No. 4).

Also, check out Martin Scherber for Bruckner-influenced minimalism before its time!


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## Tallisman (May 7, 2017)

eugeneonagain said:


> I don't see that comparison at all. I'm not saying you're wrong, but to my mind Schubert's symphonies are not 'expansive' in anything like the same way.


One begins to hear more and more shades of proto-Bruckner in so much of Schubert's work. Even the scherzos of the piano sonatas. There's also a certain naivety and purity in melody and overall atmosphere that both possess.


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## tortkis (Jul 13, 2013)

Roger Knox said:


> I think Schubert's Symphony No. 9 in C Major influenced Bruckner (compare the slow movement with that of Bruckner's Symphony No. 4).
> 
> Also, check out Martin Scherber for Bruckner-influenced minimalism before its time!


It seems reasonable to compare Schubert's symphony No. 9 with Bruckner's symphonies. They have long, organic development with the repetition of small motifs. There is a relevant thread "Schubert and Bruckner". Schubert's 15th string quartet and masses are also mentioned in relation to the comparison.

Bruckner was an organist and his brassy sounds are associated with pipe organ's grand sounds. Bruckner didn't compose major organ works, but there might have been romantic/modern composers who wrote Brucknarian organ music?


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## Nevum (Nov 28, 2013)

Robert Pickett said:


> One could argue that Bruckner's 10th, 11th and 12th Symphonies were composed by Richard Wetz!


No question. Wetz is the ONLY composer that has completely identical style with Bruckner. Could easily be the re-incarnation of Bruckner! At least musically.


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## Nevum (Nov 28, 2013)

Art Rock said:


> Alberic Magnard has been called the French Bruckner. I have my doubt about that, but his four symphonies are well worth exploring.


Despite the French Bruckner title, only the first symphony of Magnard has some similarities. The other 3 are not related in my opinion. Although they are all great symphonies!


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## eugeneonagain (May 14, 2017)

Nevum said:


> No question. Wetz is the ONLY composer that has completely identical style with Bruckner. Could easily be the re-incarnation of Bruckner! At least musically.


Quite a blow to Wetz's existence as an original composer!


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## Nevum (Nov 28, 2013)

joen_cph said:


> There Can Be Only One Anton Bruckner.


One and only.............


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## Nevum (Nov 28, 2013)

eugeneonagain said:


> Quite a blow to Wetz's existence as an original composer!


Have you listened to him? Totally Bruckner style. Great symphonies.


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## Nevum (Nov 28, 2013)

eugeneonagain said:


> Quite a blow to Wetz's existence as an original composer!


Beyond the Bruckner - like symphonies, Wetz has written an amazing Violin concerto that is very original and truly stunning. Notably Bruckner never wrote violin concertos..........


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## eugeneonagain (May 14, 2017)

Nevum said:


> Have you listened to him? Totally Bruckner style. Great symphonies.


I haven't, but I'm going to listen. I love a good rousing symphony these days. I also need equivalents to Bruckner scherzos for when I'm kneading my bread dough.


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## philoctetes (Jun 15, 2017)

I thought it was common opinion that Schubert's later pieces are predecessors to Bruckner, and Bruckner to Feldman. No?

Anyway, to the broader category of monumentalism, i would add Braga-Santos, but that's more like Sibelius.


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## KenOC (Mar 7, 2011)

Listening to Wetz's 2nd Symphony on YouTube right now. I'm not much of a Bruckner fan but I like this quite a bit. It has an immediate appeal.


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## Pure Fool (Jul 30, 2018)

Ture Rangstrom's symphonies.


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## Jacck (Dec 24, 2017)

Hans Rott - Symphony in E Major


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## jdec (Mar 23, 2013)

Nevum said:


> No question. Wetz is the ONLY composer that has completely identical style with Bruckner. Could easily be the re-incarnation of Bruckner! At least musically.


Similar yes, but I would never mistake him for Bruckner, who still is in a higher plane.


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## joen_cph (Jan 17, 2010)

_George Perle_´s Adagio for Orchestra is a homage to Bruckner.





His "Transcendental Modulations" for orchestra can perhaps be said to have a bit of the same traits. 



 in a way, it sounds like a lot of splintered Bruckner fragments put together in a new mix (though the solo violin passages do t sound like Bruckner).

Some of the works by _Onute Narbutaite_ (especially Symphony no.2, and to some extent "La Barca" and the "Riverbank Symphony") sound like neo-Brucknerian adagios with a modern twist, IMHO.






https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Onutė_Narbutaitė


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## BenG (Aug 28, 2018)

Thank you for all these fabulous suggestions. I have now listened to all of them, my favourite being furtwanglers second symphony.


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## Azol (Jan 25, 2015)

Frederic Cliffe is a must-hear. Walk, no, run to the [online] music store and get the Sterling CD!


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## larold (Jul 20, 2017)

_One could argue that Bruckner's 10th, 11th and 12th Symphonies were composed by Richard Wetz! _

Wetz also composed, and has had recorded, a violin concerto and mass that are Brucknerian. Interested parties should begin with the Symphonies 2 and 3.

While they don't necessarily sound alike, much of Franz Liszt's music shows up in Bruckner because Bruckner was influenced by him. Try the nationalist symphonic poem *Hungarica* and particularly the philosophical symphonic poems *What One Hears On the Mountain *(Ce qu'on entend sur la montagne) and *From The Cradle to the Grave* (Von der Wiege bis zum Grabe.)


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