# Round Two: Donna no vidi mai: Gigli, Corelli, Volpi



## Seattleoperafan (Mar 24, 2013)

Manon Lescaut: Donna non vidi mai (Recorded 1926) · Beniamino Gigli · Giacomo Puccini 




Tenor Vocals: Franco Corelli Conductor: Franco Ferraris 




*Lauri Volpi Sings "Donna Non Vidi Mai," from Manon Lescaut*


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## Woodduck (Mar 17, 2014)

Gigli at his vocal and musical best is hard to beat, and he's unbeaten here. Halfway through Corelli's scoop-and-slidefest I could bear no more and shut him down, while Lauri-Volpi is past his prime.

Gosh, that was easy.


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## ScottK (Dec 23, 2021)

To my ears this aria is being VERY well served in this contest! I thought this group would be up against it but I believe it contains my favorite so far.

Lauri-Volpi seems to me just a tad behind. Where the live audience seemed to goose Bjoerling in a good way, I think it pulled lauri-Volpi off focus later in the aria, where he seems to be making effects. And his tone has a very compressed sound, still great but maybe not his greatest.

Franco does very well, virile and ardent as all get out and not indulging his histrionic side. My only fault is really just a case of my finding him slightly out of his ideal repertoire. When he goes up to the top, that heroic tone - that helped make him famous - just pulls me out of Des Grieux. Its the sound that everyone finds missing in so many Manricos, but here, for me, the presence of that sound dims the effect just as the absence of this sound takes away from those Manricos.

The sound of the recording and the voice in the Gigli rendition reminded me very much of the Bjoerling....back from the mic and very full but not pushed. Gigli's early sound was my first love in opera and it took me years to recognize that the extra sweetness wasn't for me as I grew older. But I find this almost an ideal blend of beautiful tone and full bodied projection. Yes....it does sound like he's laying on a little emoting early on but it seemed to stop as he went on. I wouldn't have thought someone could rival Bjoerling for full bodied, gorgeous sound in this but for me, Benny does! He's my guy!


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## ScottK (Dec 23, 2021)

Woodduck said:


> Gigli at his vocal and musical best is hard to beat, and he's unbeaten here. Halfway through Corelli's scoop-and-slidefest I could bear no more and shut him down, while Lauri-Volpi is past his prime.
> 
> Gosh, that was easy.


It's always easy for you!!!


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## Woodduck (Mar 17, 2014)

ScottK said:


> It's always easy for you!!!


 I wish singing had been as easy for me as critiquing others doing it.


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## nina foresti (Mar 11, 2014)

All tops and each has a plus with Lauri-Volpe really feeling it but then so was Gigli and without the usual sobs. 
On the other hand, Corelli, he of the heroic sound but lacking in depth, sang while listening more to his own voice than gettig into the role itself and lost some of the quality because of that.
For me, it is Gigli with Lauri-Volpi a close second.


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## ScottK (Dec 23, 2021)

Woodduck said:


> I wish singing had been as easy for me as critiquing others doing it.


You got company right here    !!!


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## Seattleoperafan (Mar 24, 2013)

D


ScottK said:


> You got company right here    !!!


Are we good or do we need another round. Calleja was the only one I felt I should have included.


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## ScottK (Dec 23, 2021)

Seattleoperafan said:


> D
> 
> Are we good or do we need another round. Calleja was the only one I felt I should have included.


Pretty tough to imagine him taking it from Gigli or Bjoerling or Caruso! Great cuts here!!!


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## Seattleoperafan (Mar 24, 2013)

ScottK said:


> Pretty tough to imagine him taking it from Gigli or Bjoerling or Caruso! Great cuts here!!!


I agree but he is a rare contemporary singer to get good marks in our forum. Thanks. I try not to have the same names all the time but it is work.


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## MAS (Apr 15, 2015)

Of the three tenors, I love Corelli the most, despite his short comings.


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## Op.123 (Mar 25, 2013)

Gigli is perfection here. Preferable even to Caruso. Beautiful singing, expressive, warm, everything you could want in a role like this and more. Sweeps all the competition aside.


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## Shaughnessy (Dec 31, 2020)

Seattleoperafan said:


> D
> 
> Are we good or do we need another round. *Calleja was the only one I felt I should have included.*


He would have acquitted himself honorably...



Spoiler: Puccini: Manon Lescaut / Act 1 - "Donna non vidi mai" - Calleja 











as would Mario Del Monaco -



Spoiler: Puccini: Manon Lescaut / Act 1 - "Donna non vidi mai" - del Monaco - Molinari-Pradelli











as would Jonas Kaufmann -



Spoiler: Manon Lescaut – Donna non vidi mai (Jonas Kaufmann, The Royal Opera)


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## ScottK (Dec 23, 2021)

Seattleoperafan said:


> I agree but he is a rare contemporary singer to get good marks in our forum. Thanks. I try not to have the same names all the time but it is work.


I love Calleja and you're right, he does! Thank you for your effort and wonderful results!


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## ScottK (Dec 23, 2021)

MAS said:


> Of the three tenors, I love Corelli the most, despite his short comings.


Really Mas????......No!!!!!!!.......faithful to the last


MAS said:


> Of the three tenors, I love Corelli the most, despite his short comings.


Really Mas????......No!!!!!.......faithful to the last.....con onor muore!!


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## MAS (Apr 15, 2015)

ScottK said:


> Really Mas????......No!!!!!!!.......faithful to the last
> 
> Really Mas????......No!!!!!.......faithful to the last.....con onor muore!!


Yes, indeed, ScottK, am faithful - I fell in love with that voice!


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## ScottK (Dec 23, 2021)

MAS said:


> Yes, indeed, ScottK, am faithful - I fell in love with that voice!


You and I will carry the sixties passionately in our operatic hearts, me with Carlo and you with Franco!


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## ScottK (Dec 23, 2021)

Shaughnessy said:


> He would have acquitted himself honorably...
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Calleja was indeed good enough to make me go back and listen to Gigli again. And it's no insult to him to say that good as he is - and interpretively he concedes nothing - everything he does well, Gigli does better. Mario surprised me. It may not be a classic Des Grieux voice but I'd go hear him any day! Kaufman's voice is just not a Des Grieux.


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## Tsaraslondon (Nov 7, 2013)

Pretty easy. Neither Corelli nor Lauri-Volpi had the right voice character for the young student, Des Grieux and Gigli was also on his best behaviour. An easy win for him.

When was the Lauri-Vopli recording made? He seems a bit past his best. Corelli just sounded all wrong.


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## Seattleoperafan (Mar 24, 2013)

Tsaraslondon said:


> Pretty easy. Neither Corelli nor Lauri-Volpi had the right voice character for the young student, Des Grieux and Gigli was also on his best behaviour. An easy win for him.
> 
> When was the Lauri-Vopli recording made? He seems a bit past his best. Corelli just sounded all wrong.


I wanted to use Lauri-Volpi as many consider him an influence on Corelli. He also tends to get a good reception here. A shortcoming of mine is I don't know when is early and late for many singers and most recordings on Youtube don't help as more often than not dates of recording are almost never given. I do know that with Callas, Caballe, Tebaldi, Price, diStefano and Gigli dates can be important. Also NO Sutherland after 1960.


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## Tsaraslondon (Nov 7, 2013)

Seattleoperafan said:


> I wanted to use Lauri-Volpi as many consider him an influence on Corelli. He also tends to get a good reception here. A shortcoming of mine is I don't know when is early and late for many singers and most recordings on Youtube don't help as more often than not dates of recording are almost never given. I do know that with Callas, Caballe, Tebaldi, Price, diStefano and Gigli dates can be important. Also NO Sutherland after 1960.


Dates are also important with Moffo. She was practically voiceless when she recorded *Thaïs*, which was released in 1975. The early stuff when she recorded for EMI and the RCA stuff up until around the mid 1960s are best. She's excellent on *Luisa Miller*, which was 1965.


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## The Conte (May 31, 2015)

I've never been a Gigli fan, but I like him in this and his ardent, passionate heart on sleeve approach will be too much for some, but I think it's quite endearing. Does what it says on the tin.

This isn't the most suitable aria for Corelli, but I do enjoy his voice in almost anything. It's oversung though and, unlike Gigli, he stretches it out to wring even more emotion out of it.

Lauri-Volpi can't rival either of the two previous versions and his top is somewhat pinched and he sounds uncomfortable in much of the aria. How old was he here?

Gigli wins the vote on this round. I still don't think we have had an obvious winner (Bjorling is possibly my favourite so far).

N.


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## Shaughnessy (Dec 31, 2020)

Tsaraslondon said:


> *When was the Lauri-Vopli recording made? He seems a bit past his best.* Corelli just sounded all wrong.





The Conte said:


> *Lauri-Volpi can't rival either of the two previous versions and his top is somewhat pinched and he sounds uncomfortable in much of the aria. How old was he here?*
> N.


Lauri-Volpi was 62 when the recording was made in 1954 -

"It was in Milan, in 1954, that the following recording was made, and Lauri Volpi, now 62 years of age, sings with all the clarity, beauty of sound, stylistic excellence, and immaculate pronunciation that characterized his singing from the beginning to the end of his career. The words are so clear that it sometimes seems that it would not even be necessary to understand Italian in order to understand him!"

*The Legendary Giacomo Lauri Volpi, Featured In Some Of His Rare Recordings*









<strong>The Legendary Giacomo Lauri Volpi, Featured In Some Of His Rare Recordings</strong>


There is no question that Giacomo Lauri Volpi (1892-1979) was one of the greatest tenors of all time. Trained in the classic bel canto tec...




greatoperasingers.blogspot.com





The recording that is featured here was provided by Dr. Gian Paolo Nardoianni - "who was a personal acquaintance of Lauri Volpi and who possesses an uncommonly good musical library of the great tenor's recordings. This is quite important, because Lauri Volpi in fact did not like to record. Like Giuseppe Giacomini, he was more a creature of the theater, where his extraordinary voice could be heard in all its glory. Any Lauri Volpi recording, therefore, is valuable, and if they are rare, they are even more so."

"Lauri Volpi was a highly cultivated, deeply religious man. He studied law at the University of Rome and took part in World War One, fighting bravely. He shunned publicity in every form and—unfortunately for us—hated making records. He was fundamentally a timid man, but had to be aggressive in order to survive in the cynical operatic environment. On stage, but only when pushed, he could be diffident, touchy, even unruly. In his private life he was sensitive, refined, courteous and chivalrous. His generosity towards the needy was legendary and he had a very happy married life."

I voted for Lauri-Volpi - Unapologetically -The Nimbus Prima Voce Gigli is absolutely dreadful - and I don't have the lad's version of a school-girl crush on Corelli so that rules him out...

While I am not, in fact, a personal acquaintance of Lauri-Volpi, he did write in his autobiography - "Lauri-Volpi - "Ho due cognomi perché uno non basta" -

"Se non potessi essere italiano, mi sarebbe piaciuto essere irlandese - Tutti gli uomini sono coraggiosi come leoni nella giungla e tutte le donne sono belle come angeli dai capelli rossi del cielo. Hanno voci di tenore così adorabili - anche le donne! E le storie che raccontano - Gli irlandesi - Gesù - non ho mai riso così tanto in vita mia - ho riso così tanto che mi sono pisciato addosso!"


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## ScottK (Dec 23, 2021)

Shaughnessy said:


> Lauri-Volpi was 62 when the recording was made in 1954 -
> 
> "It was in Milan, in 1954, that the following recording was made, and Lauri Volpi, now 62 years of age, sings with all the clarity, beauty of sound, stylistic excellence, and immaculate pronunciation that characterized his singing from the beginning to the end of his career. The words are so clear that it sometimes seems that it would not even be necessary to understand Italian in order to understand him!"
> 
> ...


Would Lauri-Volpi still sound good if he didn't like the Irish?😉


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## Shaughnessy (Dec 31, 2020)

ScottK said:


> *Would Lauri-Volpi be good in this rendition if he didn't like the Irish?*


Gigli and Corelli, in addition to Lauri-Volpi, were also notable Hibernophiles but that didn't factor into my decision - The sale of my integrity comes with a higher price tag - 

There's a well-known Italian phrase - "Vorrei poter essere irlandese ogni giorno dell'anno invece che solo il giorno di San Patrizio!"


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## ScottK (Dec 23, 2021)

Shaughnessy said:


> Gigli and Corelli, in addition to Lauri-Volpi, were also notable Hibernophiles and that didn't factor into my decision - The sale of my integrity comes with a higher price tag - There's a well-known Italian phrase - "Vorrei poter essere irlandese ogni giorno dell'anno invece che solo il giorno di San Patrizio!"


Set me up on a bike on Inishmore , on a beautiful day, peddling along with my wife and son (and I'm picturing the wonderful day when that happened) and add any of those glorious voices and there's not much else I'd ask for!.....actually, without the voices I remember thinking that exact thought!


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## Seattleoperafan (Mar 24, 2013)

Tsaraslondon said:


> Dates are also important with Moffo. She was practically voiceless when she recorded *Thaïs*, which was released in 1975. The early stuff when she recorded for EMI and the RCA stuff up until around the mid 1960s are best. She's excellent on *Luisa Miller*, which was 1965.


I don't know that opera but created a contest with her in it from that opera. I read she was well known as Mimi and I didn't have any of her arias anyway so I added her. I also added her in Faust.


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## Shaughnessy (Dec 31, 2020)

Seattleoperafan said:


> I don't know that opera but created a contest with her in it from that opera. I read she was well known as Mimi and I didn't have any of her arias anyway so I added her. *Maybe Lucia?*


Lucia Aliberti? - Hmmm... Let's do a thorough analysis utilizing the "Shaughnessy Method"... Okay, done - Certainly looks as if she has talent - She's in...


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## ScottK (Dec 23, 2021)

Tsaraslondon said:


> Dates are also important with Moffo. She was practically voiceless when she recorded *Thaïs*, which was released in 1975. The early stuff when she recorded for EMI and the RCA stuff up until around the mid 1960s are best. She's excellent on *Luisa Miller*, which was 1965.


Early seventies as I'm just starting to go to the opera - which means of course that my "inner critic" was already holding forth - I heard Moffo twice as Gilda and then the program advertised her RCA recording as "L'essence de Thais" , I had a few things to say!!! She was well past. But then I discovered that she was the Susanna on the Figaro record at home and that was quite a different story!


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## BBSVK (10 mo ago)

Seattleoperafan said:


> Manon Lescaut: Donna non vidi mai (Recorded 1926) · Beniamino Gigli · Giacomo Puccini
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Gigli wins. A little deeper voice than the others, although some vowels sounded distorted to me. Somehow his aria flew very naturally, didn't drag on. I thought he might have an advantage of the first contestant, but no, it stayed fluent and not boring for the second listening as well.

Corelli has more pronounced vibrato than the other singers, still not bad, but I noticed it, because it was a topic of a discussion recently.

The third singer interested me the least, but he was'nt bad, just in a tough company.


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## ewilkros (8 mo ago)

Shaughnessy said:


> ...-The Nimbus Prima Voce Gigli is absolutely dreadful...


If you mean the "transfer" (better "travesty"), I agree. It also sounds pitched down to me. Can anyone check it against score?


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## BBSVK (10 mo ago)

Shaughnessy said:


> Lucia Aliberti? - Hmmm... Let's do a thorough analysis utilizing the "Shaughnessy Method"... Okay, done - Certainly looks as if she has talent - She's in...


I'm afraid I have seen a video of a production of Norma, where the costume designer cut the neck part too low. So she did't look gifted, and the other (Dimitra Theodossiou) looked gifted in an obscene way. But take me with the grain of salt. After two kids and the pandemic, I would gladly trade my figure with any of those two.


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