# Don Giovanni: Ah tempo più non v'è!



## mchriste (Aug 16, 2013)

Hi all,

I adore Mozart's Don Giovanni and have become quite obsessed with a single aspect of it,
namely the final line from the Commendatore just before (spoiler!) Don Giovanni is sent to Hell :devil:.

Personally, I think that final note on "v'è" sounds absolutely incredible when sung as *D2*.
It really makes me shiver. Sort of a musical *pollice verso*!

However, I only know of two performers who sing it like that, namely:

*Gottlob Frick* (the line starts here)





and *Kurt Moll* (the line starts here)





Instead, most singers end on *D3*.

See youtube for many excellent performances, for instance here, here, here, here, here, here, here...

(all links should point directly to that line)

That made me curious. Why doesn't everybody "go low"?
"Of course", I thought, "most performers have to cheat on Mozart's score, simply because their D2 doesn't cut it!"

So I looked up the sheet music myself...

...
...
...

lo and behold, Mozart appears to have composed it as *D3*!! 









(the above is a composite of the score Mozart-K527fs1801.2, p. 202 - 203 from IMSLP #18383)

I am even more puzzled now! Far be it from me to critique the Maestro himself but... WHY?

Again, the two versions (I created these using Noteflight):

As composed by Mozart







View attachment DG original.mid


As sung by Moll / Frick







View attachment DG d2.mid


For me the second version just sounds sooo much more powerful! Do you agree? Vote in the poll!

Why would Mozart prefer D3? Does anybody know anything more about this?
Because D2 is so crazy low that he knew that (almost) no singer could ever do it?
Or is he including a "redemption" aspect in his music - there's "hope" for the evil Don Giovanni yet to "rise" to Paradise and so forth?

Is there a treatise on Don Giovanni that discusses this aspect?

... or am I just plain weird?

Yes, your honor, I have been looking for and judging many performances of a three-hour opera _*based on a single note!*_

I will freely admit to not having any formal musical training, except from high school... 
Oh, and I trust this clarifies why I selected the "thumbs down" icon for this post


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## Dongiovanni (Jul 30, 2012)

Interesting details !

There's another note, sung by the Don, that is heard in two versions, the one in your score, but also one octave lower.

See my marking:


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## Pip (Aug 16, 2013)

I think the answer is quite simple - your favoured D2 ending requires the low note of a Basso Profundo, however most basses who sing the Commendatore are either Bass Baritones who can go low e.g. Greindl or most often They are in the Basso Cantante range .BUT neither of the two types can get down to that very low note. That is why is is rare to hear it like that. Kurt Moll had a tremendous low register and Gottlob Frick was just one of the greatest basses ever.
If you could find the two Italian basses with a great low register, either Tancredi Pasero or Giulio Neri, then you would hear that low note in Don Giovanni again, but I doubt you will find them on you tube.
Another Bass with a tremendous low register was the Russian Mark Reizen.


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## superhorn (Mar 23, 2010)

Unfortunately , Wolfie has been dead for 222 years and can't tell us what he wanted . And composers chnge their minds while they're live so we'll never know for sure .


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## mchriste (Aug 16, 2013)

Thanks for the interesting replies!

@Dongiovanni: Fancy that, I never noticed this difference! Great find as well.

@Pip: I know that Basso Profundos are rare, and I can imagine (well no, I can't - that's the point) that singing so low would be fiendishly difficult. I also want to be quite clear that I am not trying to put down other great basses as being somehow sub-par for this opera, not at all!

@superhorn: That's what makes it so interesting, innit? Also, I have no way of being certain that the sheet music I found indeed reflects Wolfie's original score note-for-note. Is his handwritten score still preserved somewhere? Just imagine if he'd written both notes and scratched the lower one out with a comment like "unmöglich, schade!" - I know I'd be tickled silly


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## deggial (Jan 20, 2013)

Wolfie wrote for the capabilities of whoever was available for the role, isn't it? the likelihood that there was no basso profundo around is good.


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## Dongiovanni (Jul 30, 2012)

Dongiovanni said:


> Correction:
> 
> It should read "one octave higher"
> /QUOTE]


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## Dongiovanni (Jul 30, 2012)

In my previous message it should read "one octave higher"


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## Amagliani (Jul 28, 2013)

*Don Giovanni:*








*Le nozze di Figaro:*


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