# Best way of learning about the various parts of an orchestra?



## Manok (Aug 29, 2011)

What I am after is what is possible, like for instance, how long a wind player can play before they need a breath, what kinds of rests are needed when a harpists plays, and any of the various little things you may not think of just listening to the music. So any thoughts?


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## R3PL4Y (Jan 21, 2016)

many people on this forum are musicians, and I am sure they will be happy to answer questions posted in the instrumental forums. I play tenor trombone if you have any questions about that. In addition, Berlioz's treatise on instrumentation has some useful information on capabilities of certain instruments, but is somewhat outdated as far as what professionals today are capable of. (for example, trombonists today have a much greater range than what he says in this text, and many instruments have evolved since then)


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## Mahlerian (Nov 27, 2012)

There are all kinds of little idiosyncrasies that you might not expect. For instance, a harp is not a chromatic instrument, so you have to be careful about how fast you ask a harpist to change notes (pulling the lever while a note is sounding gives a _boing_ effect that won't be what you want most of the time).

I can back up what R3PL4Y is saying and recommend manuals on orchestration, supplemented by dialogue with musicians who know the possibilities of their instrument.


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## Manok (Aug 29, 2011)

Thanks for the advice, I'm aware of the harp after having tried to find a couple of decent YouTube videos on the subject of orchestration (Without much luck finding exactly what I wanted) I'm open to suggestions on the best books on the subject


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## superhorn (Mar 23, 2010)

Speaking as a former free lance horn player who has spent most of his life playing in all kinds of orchestras, including ones for opera etc , the amount of breath requires varies in general based on the particular work you are playing . 
Sometimes for horn players, composers write extended sustained passages in which one has to hold the same note for many measures, and this can be a problem. So we horn players in the section would sometimes stagger the breathing and have the other horns who are not playing these sustained notes
play them some of the time. 
Wind players, whether woodwind or brass, do not play as continuously as a whole as the strings do ,
because they ate not constrained by the need to breathe , so composers generally give the winds less t play on the whole . So these players often have to wait for sometimes several minutes before even required to play .
For brass players, the difficult thing about playing is not breathing , but the lip fatigue caused by the constant pressure of the mouthpiece on the lip , particularly if you are playing a part with a lot of high notes . The higher the note, the greater the pressure on the lip, and the more fatigue . After a long rehearsal or performance, your lips get soft and mushy , and can feel tender .
In top professional orchestras , t he first horn has the most daffily and high lying part usually, and this can cause terrible lip fatigue, particularly if you are playing one of those long, heavily scored symphonies by Bruckner or Mahler for example. So the first horn has an assistant horn player, who will take over for him or her periodically to lessen the lip fatigue and ensure greater chance of playing big solos well . 
Sometimes the assistant doubles the first part to strengthen the sound of the horns. The first horn decides at rehearsals which passages will be played by the assistant. But if he or she feels the need during a performance, he will nod to the assistant to start playing .


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## R3PL4Y (Jan 21, 2016)

With brass instruments especially, playing large intervals can be very difficult. Up to an octave is not too bad if the range is not extreme, but over an octave can be difficult for brass players, especially if it is during fast passages.


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## GraemeG (Jun 30, 2009)

A good general guide to all things orchestral in Norman del Mar's "Anatomy of the Orchestra".
Full of a lifetime's observations of orchestral quirks, traditions, tips, traps, etc.
Graeme


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## Judith (Nov 11, 2015)

Manok said:


> What I am after is what is possible, like for instance, how long a wind player can play before they need a breath, what kinds of rests are needed when a harpists plays, and any of the various little things you may not think of just listening to the music. So any thoughts?


As I don't play an instrument I'm learning about them. Every month, I choose an instrument to study and research. I've learnt quite a lot about them this way.


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