# The transformative power of classical music



## pcnog11 (Nov 14, 2016)

I came across the following lecture of Benjamin Zander. Very famous musical educator and conductor.

http://www.ted.com/talks/benjamin_zander_on_music_and_passion#t-1155224

Let me know what do you think.


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## Richard8655 (Feb 19, 2016)

I always liked Ben Zander. His Mahler symphonies are wonderful. He also has a fine accompanying background disc that comes with his Mahler #5 SACD on Telarc.


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## Pugg (Aug 8, 2014)

> Benjamin Zander has two infectious passions: classical music, and helping us all realize our untapped love for it - and by extension, our untapped love for all new possibilities, new experiences, new connections.


As long as we all keep that in mind.... we are okay.


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## Triplets (Sep 4, 2014)

I think I discovered that Zander lecture the first time I googled this site, because it pops up on Google when one enters 'talk classical'. As noted, Zander is a provacative speaker, in a good way


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## hpowders (Dec 23, 2013)

Zander, (like Leonard Bernstein was), is a typical intellectual who doesn't know when to stop bloviating and hence, makes listening to music after one of his lectures, such an unpleasant experience.

Perhaps, if his Mahler Symphony cycle was as fine as Bernstein's efforts, all that hot air wouldn't bother me. As a matter of fact the only thing about Zander's Mahler Symphony cycle I can tolerate is the fourth movement of the Mahler 4, but that's because he got a perfect match for the child-like soprano part.

It's no accident that Zander always seemed to record with second rate orchestras.


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## Bettina (Sep 29, 2016)

hpowders said:


> Zander, (like Leonard Bernstein was), is a typical intellectual who doesn't know when to stop bloviating and hence, makes listening to music after one of his lectures, such an unpleasant experience.
> 
> Perhaps, if his Mahler Symphony cycle was as fine as Bernstein's efforts, all that hot air wouldn't bother me. As a matter of fact the only thing about Zander's Mahler Symphony cycle I can tolerate is the fourth movement of the Mahler 4, but that's because he got a perfect match for the child-like soprano part.
> 
> It's no accident that Zander always seemed to record with second rate orchestras.


I agree with you about Zander's conducting--I've never cared for it. But I do enjoy listening to him talk about music.

He doesn't strike me as a bloviator. Actually, I find him quite witty and down to earth. I like his ideas about sitting on "one cheek."


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## pcnog11 (Nov 14, 2016)

hpowders said:


> Zander, (like Leonard Bernstein was), is a typical intellectual who doesn't know when to stop bloviating and hence, makes listening to music after one of his lectures, such an unpleasant experience.
> 
> Perhaps, if his Mahler Symphony cycle was as fine as Bernstein's efforts, all that hot air wouldn't bother me. As a matter of fact the only thing about Zander's Mahler Symphony cycle I can tolerate is the fourth movement of the Mahler 4, but that's because he got a perfect match for the child-like soprano part.
> 
> It's no accident that Zander always seemed to record with second rate orchestras.


Zander is more of an educator than a conductor/performer. He is currently working the Boston Youth Orchestra. He is grooming younger musicians and inspiring them to realize their full potential.


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## Richard8655 (Feb 19, 2016)

Interesting all the negativity about Zander's conducting style. I find it involving and doing justice to Mahler. Exactly what is the minus... that he's not Bernstein?


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## Mal (Jan 1, 2016)

Where does he get that 3% figure from? In the UK 6 million people listen to Classic FM on a regular basis, if you throw in BBC Radio 3, CDs, Spotify,and other sources, the figure must be at least 10%.


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## pcnog11 (Nov 14, 2016)

Mal said:


> Where does he get that 3% figure from? In the UK 6 million people listen to Classic FM on a regular basis, if you throw in BBC Radio 3, CDs, Spotify,and other sources, the figure must be at least 10%.


He is referring to a small minority. The lecture is in the US, the percentage he quote could apply the US.


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## Pugg (Aug 8, 2014)

Richard8655 said:


> Interesting all the negativity about Zander's conducting style. I find it involving and doing justice to Mahler. Exactly what is the minus... that he's not Bernstein?


Some people thriving on that point.


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## Barelytenor (Nov 19, 2011)

pcnog11 said:


> I came across the following lecture of Benjamin Zander. Very famous musical educator and conductor.
> 
> http://www.ted.com/talks/benjamin_zander_on_music_and_passion#t-1155224
> 
> Let me know what do you think.


A wonderful optimistic take on life, love, and KINDNESS. It only takes an extra moment to be kind.

:tiphat:

Kind regards,

George


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## David OByrne (Dec 1, 2016)

The transformative power of c̶l̶a̶s̶s̶i̶c̶a̶l̶ Music


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## helenora (Sep 13, 2015)

David OByrne said:


> The transformative power of c̶l̶a̶s̶s̶i̶c̶a̶l̶ Music


+1 transformative power not only in a positive way...should keep that in mind too


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## Pugg (Aug 8, 2014)

helenora said:


> +1 transformative power not only in a positive way...should keep that in mind too


+ another 1, nice word game also.


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## helenora (Sep 13, 2015)

Pugg said:


> + another 1, nice word game also.


DavidOByrne's message made me think of that, brainwashing power of pop music
and how people's tastes can be downgraded by listening to a low quality music


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## David OByrne (Dec 1, 2016)

helenora said:


> DavidOByrne's message made me think of that, brainwashing power of pop music
> and how people's tastes can be downgraded by listening to a low quality music


Music has nothing to do with intelligence :lol:
That's another stereotypical placebo effect

Listening to 50 years of Beethoven won't make you any smarter, or wiser than listening to 50 years of Elvis. *That's* the truth


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## helenora (Sep 13, 2015)

yes,no talk about intelligence. only about tastes. some intelligent people listen to terrible low quality music , nothing even close to Elvis :lol:


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## David OByrne (Dec 1, 2016)

helenora said:


> yes,no talk about intelligence. only about tastes. some intelligent people listen to terrible low quality music , nothing even close to Elvis :lol:


Madonna, Beyonce, Taylor Swift, Justin Beiber, Skrillex.
It does matter what it is, it doesn't affect your intellect.

If anything, it's ego. Another thing that put me off before I started becoming a fan of classical music: people who think they're greater or more special because they listen to Mozart piano concertos :lol:

I think it's ridiculous


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## Richard8655 (Feb 19, 2016)

What about the famous "Mozart Effect" 1993 study in Science magazine? It showed that teenagers and college students who listened to a certain number of hours of classical music did measurably better on tests.


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## David OByrne (Dec 1, 2016)

Richard8655 said:


> What about the famous "Mozart Effect" 1993 study in Science magazine? It showed that teenagers and college students who listened to a certain number of hours of classical music did measurably better on tests.


That was a hoax. :lol: I've read about it


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## pcnog11 (Nov 14, 2016)

David OByrne said:


> Madonna, Beyonce, Taylor Swift, Justin Beiber, Skrillex.
> It does matter what it is, it doesn't affect your intellect.
> 
> If anything, it's ego. Another thing that put me off before I started becoming a fan of classical music: people who think they're greater or more special because they listen to Mozart piano concertos :lol:
> ...


Agreed. Since classical music has a wider range of emotions embedded in it (partly because the length of the piece are so different), people like us listening to classical music (say Beethoven symphony no. 1) could have a different set of emotional responses compared to a 4-minute piece form Justin Beiber. I am not saying pop music is shallow, but I am challenging the fact that pop music cannot be compared to classical music in creating emotional responses. The example from Zander in playing Chopin demonstrated that very point. Could having a wider range of emotional experience make people smarter, wiser or more intelligent? That is up for debate.


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## Strange Magic (Sep 14, 2015)

pcnog11 said:


> Agreed. Since classical music has a wider range of emotions embedded in it (partly because the length of the piece are so different), people like us listening to classical music (say Beethoven symphony no. 1) could have a different set of emotional responses compared to a 4-minute piece form Justin Beiber. I am not saying pop music is shallow, but I am challenging the fact that pop music cannot be compared to classical music in creating emotional responses. The example from Zander in playing Chopin demonstrated that very point. Could having a wider range of emotional experience make people smarter, wiser or more intelligent? That is up for debate.


How about the reverse hypothesis--that being smarter, wiser or more intelligent makes people have a narrower emotional range by imbuing them with the knowledge to forestall, say, rage or joy at the seeming cruelties or sudden benevolences of Life, Fate, the gods, etc.? How about that Zen-like calm?


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## Lenny (Jul 19, 2016)

David OByrne said:


> Madonna, Beyonce, Taylor Swift, Justin Beiber, Skrillex.
> It does matter what it is, it doesn't affect your intellect.
> 
> If anything, it's ego. Another thing that put me off before I started becoming a fan of classical music: people who think they're greater or more special because they listen to Mozart piano concertos :lol:
> ...


Music has something to do with music, don't you think? If someone really likes music, it is not possible to get away with Skrillex for 50 years. There's not so much Skrillex can provide for a music enthusiast. If saying this makes you think my ego is bloated, well... what can I say.

(Actually_ it is_ bloated, but I'd like to leave Mozart out of that... I never brag about my CM hobby - barely no one even knows about it!)


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## pcnog11 (Nov 14, 2016)

Strange Magic said:


> How about the reverse hypothesis--that being smarter, wiser or more intelligent makes people have a narrower emotional range by imbuing them with the knowledge to forestall, say, rage or joy at the seeming cruelties or sudden benevolences of Life, Fate, the gods, etc.? How about that Zen-like calm?


The reverse would be the consequence of the original assumption. I call it emotional intelligence. It has been demonstrated that a higher emotional intelligence would make people more successful in life. We all learn everyday from life and how we react to things. The more you learn from life, the more cool you become. Those who are (appears to be) calm, cool and collected could have a higher emotional intelligence. This does not mean they have a narrower emotional range, but a better control on their emotions.

Life is what 10% that happen to you and 90% how you react to them.


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