# 15 Forgotten Operas Ripe for Rediscovery



## SixFootScowl (Oct 17, 2011)

So, anybody familiar with any of these? Seems I have at least heard of #6 Undine.

Listing the titles *from this article* which includes brief synopses of each one.

1. Tsar Saltan - Nikolay Rimsky-Korsakov, 1900
2. Iris - Pietro Mascagni, 1898
3. The Dragon of Wantley - John Frederick Lampe, 1737
4. Ivan IV - Georges Bizet, 1863
5. Acante et Céphise - Jean-Philippe Rameau, 1751
6. Undine - Ernst Theodor Amadeus Hoffmann, 1815
7. Die Rheinnixen - Jacques Offenbach, 1864
8. Die Loreley - Max Bruch, 1863
9. Le roi d'Ys - Edouard Lalo, 1875
10. The Wreckers - Ethel Smyth, 1906
11. La gioventù di Enrico V - Saverio Mercadante, 1834
12. Gli equivoci - Stephen Storace, 1786
13. Salvator Rosa - Carlos Gomes, 1874
1 4. La libertà contenta - Agostino Steffani, 1693
15. Maddalena - Sergei Prokofiev, 1911


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## Orfeo (Nov 14, 2013)

Ripe for rediscovery is right, for many of these operas were successful and popular in their days, but rarely performed now and in many years past for a variety of reasons. I'm thinking of:


*Le Roi d'Ys* (Edouard Lalo), definitely.
*The Queen of Sheba* (Karl Goldmark), conducted by Mahler, Strauss, Toscanini, among many others (performed regularly in Hungary before WWI).
*The Demon* (Anton Rubinstein), among the most performed operas during the latter half of the 19th Century.
*Esclarmonde* (Jules Massenet), which enjoy quite a success right up to the early 20th Century.
*Herodiade* (Jules Massenet).
*The Golden Cockerel* (Nikolai Rimsky-Korsakov).
*La Juive* or *The Jewess* (Fromental Halévy), which was quite ahead of its time. Wagner even admired it.
*Merry Mount* (Howard Hanson), which had a hugely successful premiere at the MET.
*L'Africaine* (Giacomo Meyerbeer).
*Sarka* (Zdenek Fibich).
*Juha* (Aarre Merikanto), a Finnish classic.
*Maskarade* (Carl August Nielsen), Denmark's national opera (as widely deemed), but rarely staged elsewhere.
*Guercoeur* (Alberic Magnard).
*The Taming of the Shrew* (Vissarion Shebalin).
*The Ostrobothnians* (Leevi Madetoja).
*Ariane et Barbe-Bleue *(Paul Dukas), kinda getting its due, if only too slowly and sporadically.
*Mazeppa* (Pyotr Ilyich Tchaikovsky), similar state as with Ariane (above).
*Taras Bulba* (Mykola Lysenko).
*The Sacred Duckling *(Hans Gal).
*The Dwarf* (Felix Zemlinsky).


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## nina foresti (Mar 11, 2014)

Montemezzi: L'amore dei tre re


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## Sloe (May 9, 2014)

Definitely Iris one of my favourite operas. That should be a war horse. It is at least more popular than Hosokawa Grazia by Vincenzo Cimatti and Da gelo a gelo by Salvatore Sciarrino and certainly deserves so.
The Ostrobothnians have a status as national opera in Finland but as long as operas are performed on their original language it is a problem since few singers can sing in Finnish outside Finland.


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## Pugg (Aug 8, 2014)

I would like to see Loreley from Catalani.


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## alan davis (Oct 16, 2013)

The operas of Korngold are all magnificent works but except for The Dead City, rarely performed.


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## timh (Nov 14, 2014)

Orfeo said:


> Ripe for rediscovery is right, for many of these operas were successful and popular in their days, but rarely performed now and in many years past for a variety of reasons. I'm thinking of:
> 
> .....
> 
> ...


http://www.theoperaplatform.eu/en/opera/rimsky-korsakov-golden-cockerel


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## Barbebleu (May 17, 2015)

Opera Platform is a fantastic site. I've watched Orpheé, Capriccio and Otello on it in very clever productions.


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## Pugg (Aug 8, 2014)

timh said:


> http://www.theoperaplatform.eu/en/opera/rimsky-korsakov-golden-cockerel


Not so long ago it was performed in Belgium.


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## Meyerbeer Smith (Mar 25, 2016)

Florestan said:


> So, anybody familiar with any of these? Seems I have at least heard of #6 Undine.


I've heard some of them, and heard of most of them.



> Listing the titles *from this article* which includes brief synopses of each one.
> 
> 1. Tsar Saltan - Nikolay Rimsky-Korsakov, 1900


I know of it, but haven't heard it (other than the Flight of the Bumblebee).
1959 Nebolsin recording: 



 (complete with synopsis)



> 2. Iris - Pietro Mascagni, 1898


Have it on LP. Isn't this one of your favorites?



> 3. The Dragon of Wantley - John Frederick Lampe, 1737
> 4. Ivan IV - Georges Bizet, 1863


Recording of _Ivan IV_ here: 



No score (even on IMSLP) and no libretto. Probably because it was never performed.



> 5. Acante et Céphise - Jean-Philippe Rameau, 1751
> 6. Undine - Ernst Theodor Amadeus Hoffmann, 1815


_Undine_ used to be online. Lortzing's opera of the same name adapts Hoffmann's libretto.



> 7. Die Rheinnixen - Jacques Offenbach, 1864


This has been recorded as the _Fées du Rhin_. Like _Fantasio_ and _Hoffmann_, it shows Offenbach's melancholy, Romantic strain - different from the brilliant satirist. Review here: http://www.operatoday.com/content/2005/10/offenbach_les_f.php



> 8. Die Loreley - Max Bruch, 1863


Recording: 






> 9. Le roi d'Ys - Edouard Lalo, 1875


Terrific work, part way between Wagner (the overture is influenced by Tannhäuser) and Gounod. Dramatic (Margared, the evil sister, should be a great role for a mezzo) and with some beautiful or powerful music (the aubade, the lovely duet in Act I).

Cluytens recording: 



Dervaux recording: 






> 10. The Wreckers - Ethel Smyth, 1906


Smyth is good - robust and powerful.

Retrospect Opera (specialising in obscure British opera) have recorded Smyth's comic opera _The Boatswain's Mate_; this was BBC Radio 3's top selection in 'Building a Library', part of their weekly programme Record Review.



> 11. La gioventù di Enrico V - Saverio Mercadante, 1834


I don't think this has been recorded. Probably an adaptation of Herold's opera of the same name (1815) - the first Italian opera by a French composer in 50 years.



> 12. Gli equivoci - Stephen Storace, 1786


Brother of the first Susanna in _Figaro_ - and the Emperor's mistress. (The Mozart and Salieri collaboration found in 2015 was a cantata for her recovery from illness.) Here's the recording: 






> 13. Salvator Rosa - Carlos Gomes, 1874


Gomes is rather good; _Il Guarany_ is his most famous work, but I also recommend _Maria Tudor_. (Sofia Opera's productions of those two and _Fosca_ are on YouTube.)

Here's Salvator Rosa: 






> 1 4. La libertà contenta - Agostino Steffani, 1693


Never heard of it. Some of the arias are on YouTube.



> 15. Maddalena - Sergei Prokofiev, 1911


Haven't heard it.
Recordings:


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## nina foresti (Mar 11, 2014)

Pugg said:


> I would like to see Loreley from Catalani.


Which reminds me, I'd love to have them resurrect Catalani's _La Wally_.


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## Pugg (Aug 8, 2014)

nina foresti said:


> Which reminds me, I'd love to have them resurrect Catalani's _La Wally_.


At least we have a recording with Magda


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## hpowders (Dec 23, 2013)

I would add to the list any opera by Meyerbeer.


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## Pugg (Aug 8, 2014)

Bizet's Djamileh, thank goodness we have a recording with Lucia Popp.


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## Meyerbeer Smith (Mar 25, 2016)

Orfeo said:


> Ripe for rediscovery is right, for many of these operas were successful and popular in their days, but rarely performed now and in many years past for a variety of reasons. I'm thinking of:
> 
> *Le Roi d'Ys* (Edouard Lalo), definitely.


Definitely!



> *The Queen of Sheba* (Karl Goldmark), conducted by Mahler, Strauss, Toscanini, among many others (performed regularly in Hungary before WWI).


Wonderful opera. Halfway between Meyerbeer and Wagner, and much better than Gounod's _Reine de Saba_. The score is full of exotic Middle Eastern touches and grand opera pomp; beautiful overture, "Magische Töne" (sung by Gedda), and powerful choruses (especially the Anathema scene).

_Merlin_ has also been recorded.



> *The Demon* (Anton Rubinstein), among the most performed operas during the latter half of the 19th Century.
> *Esclarmonde* (Jules Massenet), which enjoy quite a success right up to the early 20th Century.
> *Herodiade* (Jules Massenet).


Both good - but I think Massenet's operas from the turn of the century are more interesting. I'll see those two and raise you _Grisélidis_, _Cendrillon_, _Chérubin_, _Ariane_, _Panurge_ and _Amadis_.



> *The Golden Cockerel* (Nikolai Rimsky-Korsakov).


Really any Rimsky-K opera deserves exposure. I like _Sadko_, _Kitezh_ and _The Tsar's Bride_ more, though.



> *La Juive* or *The Jewess* (Fromental Halévy), which was quite ahead of its time. Wagner even admired it.


_La juive_ is magnificent. Dramatically taut, three great roles (Eléazar, Rachel and Brogni), and a score of a very high calibre. Must have been a sight to see; critics joked that the Opéra could throw its weight into European politics with its armies. The Opéra had its own armorer; I was looking at the costume designs yesterday - armored knights on horseback, designs for flags, banners, helms, halberds, &c.

Wagner was a big Halévy fan. He wrote a long article praising _La reine de Chypre_: https://fr.wikisource.org/wiki/Halévy_et_«_la_Reine_de_Chypre_» (in French). (He wrote the piano transcription.) He , and that "weirdly, glittering phrase" in the Act III finale of _La juive_ ends up verbatim at the end of Act III of _Walküre_.

Depends on what you mean by ahead of its time! French _grand opéra_ was the most advanced in Europe, and a major influence on Wagner and Verdi.

It's re-entered the repertoire, at least in Europe; regular performances for the last decade. Politics?



> *Merry Mount* (Howard Hanson), which had a hugely successful premiere at the MET.
> *L'Africaine* (Giacomo Meyerbeer).


Great opera, but...

_Vasco da Gama_, please! _L'Africaine_ was the name Meyerbeer's wife Minna and Fétis (who arranged the work for the stage) gave to the opera, because it was the name the public expected since the 1830s. That was the original version, in which Vasco doesn't appear, and which doesn't seem to have the opera's critique of imperialism. Since the 1840s, Meyerbeer and Scribe thought of the work as _Vasco_ (separate from "la vecchia _Africana_"). I]L'Africaine[/I] as it reached the stage in 1865 also doesn't reflect Meyerbeer's intentions; Fétis changed orchestration, cut songs, rearranged others - it's really "edited highlights from _Vasco_". Besides, it leaves the opera open to the charge of not knowing basic geography; in _Vasco_, Meyerbeer and Scribe had India or Sri Lanka in mind.



> *Sarka* (Zdenek Fibich).
> *Juha* (Aarre Merikanto), a Finnish classic.
> *Maskarade* (Carl August Nielsen), Denmark's national opera (as widely deemed), but rarely staged elsewhere.
> *Guercoeur* (Alberic Magnard).


And _Bérénice_!



> *The Taming of the Shrew* (Vissarion Shebalin).
> *The Ostrobothnians* (Leevi Madetoja).
> *Ariane et Barbe-Bleue *(Paul Dukas), kinda getting its due, if only too slowly and sporadically.
> *Mazeppa* (Pyotr Ilyich Tchaikovsky), similar state as with Ariane (above).


Yes to these two!



> *Taras Bulba* (Mykola Lysenko).
> *The Sacred Duckling *(Hans Gal).
> *The Dwarf* (Felix Zemlinsky).


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## Meyerbeer Smith (Mar 25, 2016)

hpowders said:


> I would add to the list any opera by Meyerbeer.


YES! (Marry me.)


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## Meyerbeer Smith (Mar 25, 2016)

My suggestions:
None of these operas have been recorded.

Orfeo mentioned _La juive_. Everything I've read about Halévy suggests that he's a major neglected composer - how else would you describe a musician admired by both Wagner and Berlioz, and who was seen in his lifetime as the leading French opera composer? _La reine de Chypre_ will be performed in a concert version in Paris in June. (Triste exilé!) I also want:

_L'éclair_ (his other big hit of 1835 - an opéra comique with only 4 parts)
_Guido et Ginevra_
_Les mousquetaires de la reine
_
_Le val d'Andorre_ (Berlioz liked it)
_La fée aux roses_ (Berlioz liked it)
_La tempesta (La tempête)_ (based on Shakespeare; smash hit in London, where it was premièred)
_Le juif errant_ (Théophile Gautier thought it an important philosophical work)
_Jaguarita l'indienne_

Paladilhe - _Patrie!_ (unquestionably a major work; the extracts I've heard from it are powerful and beautiful)

Salvayre - _La dame de Monsoreau_ (David LeMarrec at Carnets sur Sol thinks it's the equal of the major Meyerbeers - and he's a big fan of M's: http://operacritiques.free.fr/css/index.php?2008/08/01/1003)

Herold - _Marie_ (his best after _Zampa_ and the _Pré aux clercs_)

Reyer - _La statue_ (Bizet thought it the most remarkable work written in France for twenty or thirty years. Massenet, who played the timpani in the orchestra, called it a superb score. Berlioz raved about it. 50 years later, the critic Adolphe Jullien thought it would have the sustained popularity of _Faust_ if Miolan-Carvalho had starred.)

Saint-Saëns - _Ascanio_
(Bru Zane recorded _Proserpine_ last year)

Niedermeyer - _Stradella_, _Marie Stuart_ et _La fronde_ (Clément in his _Dictionnaire des opéras_ says good things about them)

Isidore de Lara - _Messaline_

I'd also like to hear Massenet's _Bacchus_ and Gounod's _Tribut de Zamora_ - maybe not great works, but they're the only ones by those composers that haven't been recorded yet.

We could also do with more Auber: _La circassienne_, _Le lac des fées_, _Le philtre_ (the model for _L'elisir d'amore_)


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## elgar's ghost (Aug 8, 2010)

Off the top of my head...

_Maschinist Hopkins_ by Max Brand
_Transatlantic_ by George Antheil
_Diary of a Madman_ by Humphrey Searle

I'd love to hear these based on what little info I've got on them, but as there are no available recordings I'd imagine performances are as common as hens' teeth.


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## Sloe (May 9, 2014)

Ifigenia by Ildebrando Pizetti. It is a radio opera so there is no need to stage it. Even if it was staged later.


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## SixFootScowl (Oct 17, 2011)

timh said:


> http://www.theoperaplatform.eu/en/opera/rimsky-korsakov-golden-cockerel


This one I have, because of Beverly Sills. Oddly they use the original language title but sung in English.


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## Pugg (Aug 8, 2014)

Florestan said:


> This one I have, because of Beverly Sills. Oddly they use the original language title but sung in English.


Even if it was in Chinese I would have bought it.


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## SixFootScowl (Oct 17, 2011)

Pugg said:


> Even if it was in Chinese I would have bought it.


Absolutely! Even Swahili. And somehow I knew you would give a "LIKE" for that one.


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## nina foresti (Mar 11, 2014)

Pugg said:


> At least we have a recording with Magda


Re: The Great Magda: Amen miluv!


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## Don Fatale (Aug 31, 2009)

Seeking out rarities has become an accidental operatic side interest for me. Here's 15 from me, all but the last one seen in live performances over the years. How rare some of them are is debatable, but certainly none are common.

*
Ruslan and Lyudmila*
Glinka
_Important Russian opera_

*King Arthur*
Purcell
_The Covent Garden performance in the 90's was a great night._

*Stiffelio*
Verdi
_The link between Verdi's galley years and Rigoletto. aka Aroldo which UCOpera in London are performing around now. A really good drama with a very satisfying ending.
_

*Hulde*
Cesar Franck
_Saw this a while back at UCOpera. As a Franckophile, I'd love to see and hear this again._

*Penthesilia*
Pascal Dusapin
_Premiered last year. I saw it last year in Brussels. It was one of the rare times I thought a new opera deserved a wider showing._

*I Gioielli della Madonna*
Wolf-Ferrari
_His lush verismo opera. Saw it in Bratislava two years ago and liked it a lot. A little teary-eyed at the end. Covent Garden couldn't go wrong with this surely._

*Cardillac*
Hindemith
_Much maligned composer now. Used to get more outings than it does now. Not that great. Has a lot of critics of his lumpen orchestrations._

*Orontea*
Cesti
_Saw this in Budapest recently. Bridging the gap between Monteverdi and baroque. 
Pretty lively and entertaining. This conservatoire performance featured on-the-way-up Emoke Barath who'll soon be in a leading role at Glyndebourne in Cavalli's Hipermestra. And speaking of Cavalli, I hope it's more entertaining than this one...._

*Eliogabalo*
Cavalli
_Recently rediscovered. Had a tedious evening at Paris Opera last year, and so too did the singers I think. Getting a run at Amsterdam later this year. I wish them luck._

*The Greek Passion, Juliette *
Martinu
_Saw these on successive nights in Germany last year. Loved them both. Solid works._

*Strasny Dwor (Haunted Manor)*
Moniouszko
_Saw this in Warsaw recently in a great David Pountney production, designs by Leslie Travers. I'd recommend this to ENO._

*Sakuntala* 
Franco Alfano
_The guy who completed Turandot. Saw this in Sicily recently. It becomes clear Alfano just didn't have a good tune in him, despite the lush orchestration. I hope to see his *Resurrezione* at Wexford (home of rarities!) later this year, although, as much for being a fan of Tolstoy's novel than Alfano._

*Le Vin Herbe*
Frank Martin (that's a Swiss name don't you know!)
_A semi-opera based on the Tristan and Isolde legend. Seen just last week at the Royal Conservatoire of Scotland. Much enjoyed and appreciated, by me and critics alike. Definitely deserves a wider audience. Welsh National Opera have also been performing it recently. _

And finally, for Boitophiles, one I haven't seen. I'll travel far if it shows up....

*Nerone*
Arrigo Boito
_Quite simply, one of my favourite operas._


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## Sloe (May 9, 2014)

Il dottor Antonio by Franco Alfano very beautiful opera.

Yuzuru by Ikuma Dan also very beautiful it is the most famous Japanese opera.

Dante by Benjamin Godard I had a big impression when I heard that one.

L'oracolo by Franco Leoni great opera set in the Chinese parts of San Fransisco.

A Life for the Tsar by Michail Glinka is apparently much less popular than I thought it would.


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## SixFootScowl (Oct 17, 2011)

Don Fatale said:


> *Strasny Dwor (Haunted Manor)*
> Moniouszko
> _Saw this in Warsaw recently in a great David Pountney production, designs by Leslie Travers. I'd recommend this to ENO._


Now that I saw on an online video with English subtitles, and it is a great opera. I also have it on CD because of seeing the video.


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## Meyerbeer Smith (Mar 25, 2016)

Don Fatale said:


> Seeking out rarities has become an accidental operatic side interest for me. Here's 15 from me, all but the last one seen in live performances over the years. How rare some of them are is debatable, but certainly none are common.
> 
> *
> Ruslan and Lyudmila*
> ...


Wonderful opera. Should be wider known in the West than it is; lots of great numbers - the exhilarating overture, a beautiful Act I finale, Farlaf's rondo (a patter song in Russian), Chernomor's March, Ratmir's "I zhar, i znoy smenila nochi ten". Have you seen the Kirov production?



> *Stiffelio*
> Verdi
> _The link between Verdi's galley years and Rigoletto. aka Aroldo which UCOpera in London are performing around now. A really good drama with a very satisfying ending.
> _


One of Verdi's better operas - his first step into intimate, naturalistic operas, with fluid handling of ensembles (e.g. in Act I). Also has an interesting aria ("O gioia inesprimibile") where the baritone is so furious he's singing in half voice.



> *Strasny Dwor (Haunted Manor)*
> Moniouszko
> _Saw this in Warsaw recently in a great David Pountney production, designs by Leslie Travers. I'd recommend this to ENO._


Delightful from start to finish, and easily in my top half dozen operas. This was one of the first operas I heard, when I was a kid; Polish friends gave it to my parents. The other Moniuszko music I've heard is fine, too - certainly a composer who deserves to be widely known outside Poland!



> *Sakuntala*
> Franco Alfano
> _The guy who completed Turandot. Saw this in Sicily recently. It becomes clear Alfano just didn't have a good tune in him, despite the lush orchestration. I hope to see his *Resurrezione* at Wexford (home of rarities!) later this year, although, as much for being a fan of Tolstoy's novel than Alfano._


Alfano's _Cyrano de Bergerac_ is pretty good, too; there's a DVD with Alagna.


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## Meyerbeer Smith (Mar 25, 2016)

Sloe said:


> Il dottor Antonio by Franco Alfano very beautiful opera.
> 
> Yuzuru by Ikuma Dan also very beautiful it is the most famous Japanese opera.
> 
> Dante by Benjamin Godard I had a big impression when I heard that one.


Perhaps Godard fell from favor because he was anti-Wagnerian - his operas were well received by the public, but critics found them conservative. _Dante_ is a formal number opera in 1890, and _La vivandière_ uses a lot of folk songs from the Revolutionary period. I'm not going to claim _Dante_ is a masterpiece, but it's an interesting work. Act I has a luminous chorus, and a noble and expansive finale where the people acclaim Dante as their leader, choosing idealism and a unified view of humanity ("fraternité") over party politics. Act III is almost Berliozian, with its homage to Virgil, and depiction of Heaven and Hell à la _Damnation de Faust_.



> L'oracolo by Franco Leoni great opera set in the Chinese parts of San Fransisco.


Powerful little opera; Florestan suggested this one last year.



> A Life for the Tsar by Michail Glinka is apparently much less popular than I thought it would.


Another great Russian opera that's little known in the West! The Act III quartet is GLORIOUS. I'm listening to Christoff and Gedda sing it now: 



.


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## Orfeo (Nov 14, 2013)

SimonTemplar said:


> _La juive_ is magnificent. Dramatically taut, three great roles (Eléazar, Rachel and Brogni), and a score of a very high calibre. Must have been a sight to see; critics joked that the Opéra could throw its weight into European politics with its armies. The Opéra had its own armorer; I was looking at the costume designs yesterday - armored knights on horseback, designs for flags, banners, helms, halberds, &c.
> 
> Wagner was a big Halévy fan. He wrote a long article praising _La reine de Chypre_: https://fr.wikisource.org/wiki/Halévy_et_«_la_Reine_de_Chypre_» (in French). (He wrote the piano transcription.) He , and that "weirdly, glittering phrase" in the Act III finale of _La juive_ ends up verbatim at the end of Act III of _Walküre_.
> 
> ...


I mean in terms of subject matter(a Jew marrying a gentile, or even a thought of it was considered taboo back then).


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## Scott in PA (Aug 13, 2016)

La Juive was performed at the Met in 2003 after a long absence. It was done in a updated production, which I don't believe was well received. 

We're coming up on the 100 year anniversary of Die Tote Stadt (1920). Will the Met do a centennial production?


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## Meyerbeer Smith (Mar 25, 2016)

Orfeo said:


> I mean in terms of subject matter(a Jew marrying a gentile, or even a thought of it was considered taboo back then).


From what I've read, anti-Semitism existed in the early 19th century, but was minor compared to the late 19th century (Dreyfus in France, the rise of German and Italian nationalism).

French Jews were emancipated in the late 18th century; Judaism became an official religion of France in 1807; and in 1831, Judaism, like Catholicism and Protestantism, was financially supported by the state. (They had to swear the "More Judaico" oath until 1846, however.) Anti-Semitism still persisted, but was minor compared to the late 19th century, when it increased across Europe - because of nationalism in Germany and Italy, and because of France's defeat in 1870/71.

Were interfaith marriages taboo? By the mid-19th century, they happened quite frequently; Halévy's own daughter married the Gentile Bizet, while two of Meyerbeer's daughters married German aristocrats; the third married the court painter Richter. Jews also occupied important positions in 19th century France; by the 1830s / 1840s, there were many Jewish politicians and businessmen in Paris.

Have you read Diana Hallman's study of the opera, _Opera, Liberalism and Anti-Semitism in 19th Century France_?


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## Meyerbeer Smith (Mar 25, 2016)

Scott in PA said:


> La Juive was performed at the Met in 2003 after a long absence. It was done in a updated production, which I don't believe was well received.
> 
> We're coming up on the 100 year anniversary of Die Tote Stadt (1920). Will the Met do a centennial production?


Wasn't the Vienna production of _La juive_ staged in NY?


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## Orfeo (Nov 14, 2013)

SimonTemplar said:


> From what I've read, anti-Semitism existed in the early 19th century, but was minor compared to the late 19th century (Dreyfus in France, the rise of German and Italian nationalism).
> 
> French Jews were emancipated in the late 18th century; Judaism became an official religion of France in 1807; and in 1831, Judaism, like Catholicism and Protestantism, was financially supported by the state. (They had to swear the "More Judaico" oath until 1846, however.) Anti-Semitism still persisted, but was minor compared to the late 19th century, when it increased across Europe - because of nationalism in Germany and Italy, and because of France's defeat in 1870/71.
> 
> ...


I see. Well argued (I will have to look into it further). I have not read Hallman's book, but I'll look into that also. Thanks for clarifying the matter.


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## superhorn (Mar 23, 2010)

Padmavati : Opera/ballet by Albert Roussel - rarely performed since its 1923 premiere at the Paris opera , this exotic and fantastically colorful work about the Mughal conquest of India centuries ago deserves to be performed more often . The last production was in Paris at the Chatelet theater in Paris 
in 2008 , and the director was one of the leading Bollywood film directors who had never staged an opera before !
Roussel had actually spent time in India some years before writing the opera , and he was able to come closer to the true Indian atmosphere in the opera than Bizet in The Pearl Fishers and Delibes in Lakme .


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## Sloe (May 9, 2014)

superhorn said:


> Padmavati : Opera/ballet by Albert Roussel - rarely performed since its 1923 premiere at the Paris opera , this exotic and fantastically colorful work about the Mughal conquest of India centuries ago deserves to be performed more often . The last production was in Paris at the Chatelet theater in Paris
> in 2008 , and the director was one of the leading Bollywood film directors who had never staged an opera before !
> Roussel had actually spent time in India some years before writing the opera , and he was able to come closer to the true Indian atmosphere in the opera than Bizet in The Pearl Fishers and Delibes in Lakme .


Padmavati is a beautiful opera but for operas set in India I personally prefer Alfano´s La leggenda di Sakuntala.


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## Eddy Rodgers K (Feb 12, 2017)

Sloe said:


> Padmavati is a beautiful opera but for operas set in India I personally prefer Alfano´s La leggenda di Sakuntala.


Someone made an opera about Shakuntala? That is one of my favorite plays ever! It is one of the treasures of world art if you ask me.


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## Sloe (May 9, 2014)

Eddy Rodgers K said:


> Someone made an opera about Shakuntala? That is one of my favorite plays ever! It is one of the treasures of world art if you ask me.


Yes Franco Alfano in 1920 premiered in 1921. The orchestral score was believed to be destroyed during the war so Alfano had to make a reconstruction of it based on the piano score called Sakuntala but the original orchestral score was discovered a few years ago. I would say one of the most beautiful operas ever.


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## Eddy Rodgers K (Feb 12, 2017)

Sloe said:


> Yes Franco Alfano in 1920 premiered in 1921. The orchestral score was believed to be destroyed during the war so Alfano had to make a reconstruction of it based on the piano score called Sakuntala but the original orchestral score was discovered a few years ago. I would say one of the most beautiful operas ever.


I'm definitely going to look for it.


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## Meyerbeer Smith (Mar 25, 2016)

Eddy Rodgers K said:


> Someone made an opera about Shakuntala? That is one of my favorite plays ever! It is one of the treasures of world art if you ask me.


Schubert wrote an opera based on _Abhijñānashākuntala_, a play by the Classical Sanskrit writer Kālidāsa (4th century AD): 



.

Théophile Gautier adapted the play as a ballet-pantomime in 1858, with music by Ernest Reyer. Berlioz thought the music was fresh and original.

Auber's _Dieu et la bayadère_ also comes from the same play, via Goethe.

Goldmark (



) also wrote music based on the play.


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## SixFootScowl (Oct 17, 2011)

Orfeo said:


> [*]*Ariane et Barbe-Bleue *(Paul Dukas), kinda getting its due, if only too slowly and sporadically.


This one seems to be an expanded sort of Bluebeard's Castle.


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## Woodduck (Mar 17, 2014)

Fritz Kobus said:


> This one seems to be an expanded sort of Bluebeard's Castle.


Same underlying story, opposite point of view. Bartok delves into the dark side of the male psyche, and show's the fate of woman when she pries too deeply into its secrets. Dukas centers on the power of the woman, who through wisdom, will and compassion escapes the fate of Bluebeard's previous wives. Dukas's score is sumptuous, a prime example of French "wagnerisme." The difficulty of the title role may partly account for the rarity of performances. Katherine Ciesinski, in the recording I have, handles it magnificently.


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## SixFootScowl (Oct 17, 2011)

Woodduck said:


> Same underlying story, opposite point of view. Bartok delves into the dark side of the male psyche, and show's the fate of woman when she pries too deeply into its secrets. Dukas centers on the power of the woman, who through wisdom, will and compassion escapes the fate of Bluebeard's previous wives. Dukas's score is sumptuous, a prime example of French "wagnerisme." The difficulty of the title role may partly account for the rarity of performances. Katherine Ciesinski, in the recording I have, handles it magnificently.


Thanks for enlightening me. I did sense that there was a more positive angle on this one. I tried Bluebeard's Castle and just could not get into it, but this one seems worth my pursuit.


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## Eramire156 (Sep 28, 2017)

Apropos to this thread, an article from Opera Quarterly

https://muse.jhu.edu/article/25453/pdf


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## Don Fatale (Aug 31, 2009)

Eramire156 said:


> Apropos to this thread, an article from Opera Quarterly
> 
> https://muse.jhu.edu/article/25453/pdf


Would love to have chatted with this guy!


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## Eramire156 (Sep 28, 2017)

Don Fatale said:


> Would love to have chatted with this guy!


Yes it would have interesting to have known him, I believe his manuscript iis now part of a University library collection.


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## nina foresti (Mar 11, 2014)

Poliuto
Lucrezia Borgia


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## Bardamu (Dec 12, 2011)

I quatro rusteghi - Wolf-Ferrari Ermanno (1906)
Francesca da Rimini - Zandonai Riccardo (1914)
L'amore dei tre Re - Montemezzi Italo (1914)
Arlecchino ovvero le finestre - Busoni Ferruccio (1917)
La leggenda di Sakuntala - Alfano Franco (1921)
Dafni - Mulè Giuseppe (1928)
La fiamma - Respighi Ottorino (1934)
Il Dibuk - Lodovico Rocca (1934)
Le astuzie di Bertoldo - Ferrari Trecate Luigi (1934)
La favola del figlio cambiato - Malipiero Gian Francesco (1934)
Re Lear - Frazzi Vito (1939)
La pulce d'oro - Ghedini Giorgio Federico (1940)
Il prigioniero - Dallapiccola Luigi (1949)
Il contrabbasso - Bucchi Valentino (1954)
Re Salomone - Luzzatto Livio (?)
I Shardana - Porrino Ennio (1959)
Il dottore di Vetro - Vlad Roman (1960)
La danza di Salome - Lupi Roberto (1960)
Il calzare d'argento - Pizzetti Ildebrando (1961)
Il tamburo di panno - Fiume Orazio (1962)


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## cougarjuno (Jul 1, 2012)

What about the Chabrier's Gwendoline or Le Roi Malgre Lui. There is some beautiful music in both.

Regarding Massenet operas -- Cendrillon is at the Met this year. I might like to see this next month. I'm not familiar with it, but I love Manon, Werther and Thais. How does Cendrillon compare with those or even with the more "obscure" Massenet operas Herodiade, Esclarmonde and Le Jongleur de Notre Dame. Typical Massenet beautiful melodies and delicate orchestrations?


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## Don Fatale (Aug 31, 2009)

I saw Cendrillon recently with the requisite listening research beforehand. There's no reason at all why it shouldn't be an operatic staple. The music is delightful, cute and a lot of fun.


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## Meyerbeer Smith (Mar 25, 2016)

cougarjuno said:


> What about the Chabrier's Gwendoline or Le Roi Malgre Lui. There is some beautiful music in both.
> 
> Regarding Massenet operas -- Cendrillon is at the Met this year. I might like to see this next month. I'm not familiar with it, but I love Manon, Werther and Thais. How does Cendrillon compare with those or even with the more "obscure" Massenet operas Herodiade, Esclarmonde and Le Jongleur de Notre Dame. Typical Massenet beautiful melodies and delicate orchestrations?


_Cendrillon_ is exquisite - more intimate and melancholy than Rossini's famous comic take. Highlights include the Act II love duet (similar to the Liebesnacht from _Tristan_); the scene at the fairy godmother's oak tree in Act III; and the duet between Lucette ("Cendrillon") and her father Pandolfe. Plus some clever 18th century pastiche. And Mme de la Haltière, the appalling, snobbish stepmother, is great fun.

How does it compare? Better than either _Manon_ or _Werther_, which overshadow the rest of M's other, often more interesting, operas! Easily better than _Hérodiade_, which, like _Le Cid_, was a hit at the time, but isn't one of his best. Like _Thaïs _and the _Jongleur_, excellent, while being very different from either - the chameleonic M. Massenet!


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## Tsaraslondon (Nov 7, 2013)

NickFuller said:


> _Cendrillon_ is exquisite - more intimate and melancholy than Rossini's famous comic take. Highlights include the Act II love duet (similar to the Liebesnacht from _Tristan_); the scene at the fairy godmother's oak tree in Act III; and the duet between Lucette ("Cendrillon") and her father Pandolfe. Plus some clever 18th century pastiche. And Mme de la Haltière, the appalling, snobbish stepmother, is great fun.
> 
> How does it compare? Better than either _Manon_ or _Werther_, which overshadow the rest of M's other, often more interesting, operas! Easily better than _Hérodiade_, which, like _Le Cid_, was a hit at the time, but isn't one of his best. Like _Thaïs _and the _Jongleur_, excellent, while being very different from either - the chameleonic M. Massenet!


I do like the sugary sweet *Cendrillon*, but wouldn't necessarily say it was _better_ than either *Manon* or *Werther*. *Manon*, in particular, is much closer in spirit to the original Abbé Prévost novel than Puccini's take on the same subject. I'm sure Beecham was only half joking when he said he'd take *Manon* over all Bach's Brandenburgs.

I also enjoy *Werther*'s dark, crepuscular beauty, and prefer it to the somewhat kitsch religiosity of something like *Thaïs*, though there's much to enjoy in that opera too.


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## Meyerbeer Smith (Mar 25, 2016)

GregMitchell said:


> I do like the sugary sweet *Cendrillon*, but wouldn't necessarily say it was _better_ than either *Manon* or *Werther*. *Manon*, in particular, is much closer in spirit to the original Abbé Prévost novel than Puccini's take on the same subject. I'm sure Beecham was only half joking when he said he'd take *Manon* over all Bach's Brandenburgs.
> 
> I also enjoy *Werther*'s dark, crepuscular beauty, and prefer it to the somewhat kitsch religiosity of something like *Thaïs*, though there's much to enjoy in that opera too.


Like most judgements of quality, it's subjective! I'm not a fan of _Werther_, partly because the protagonist is so unsympathetic, partly because the story doesn't engage me, and partly because I've only heard one recording that _works_ - the Thill / Vallin. It has some fine pieces of music, though, such as "Pourquoi me réveiller", the Larmes aria, and the Letters aria.

Is _Thaïs_ a religious work? It's not so much spiritual (in the _Parsifal _/ _Saint François d'Assise_ sense) as a character study about the effect of religion. The psychological journey of the two leads - from courtesan to saint, and from ascetic to neurotic - is fascinating.

_Manon_ I quite like. But there are a lot of Massenets I prefer: _Ariane, Grisélidis, Roma, Amadis, Jongleur, Thérèse, Cendrillon, Chérubin, Don Quichotte_...!


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## Meyerbeer Smith (Mar 25, 2016)

GregMitchell said:


> I do like the sugary sweet *Cendrillon*, but wouldn't necessarily say it was _better_ than either *Manon* or *Werther*. *Manon*, in particular, is much closer in spirit to the original Abbé Prévost novel than Puccini's take on the same subject. I'm sure Beecham was only half joking when he said he'd take *Manon* over all Bach's Brandenburgs.
> 
> I also enjoy *Werther*'s dark, crepuscular beauty, and prefer it to the somewhat kitsch religiosity of something like *Thaïs*, though there's much to enjoy in that opera too.


Oh, and "crepuscular" is a great description! It does feel like a twilit, autumnal opera; as the seasons pass from spring sunshine to dark winter days, so youthful optimism turns to despair.


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## Tsaraslondon (Nov 7, 2013)

NickFuller said:


> Oh, and "crepuscular" is a great description! It does feel like a twilit, autumnal opera; as the seasons pass from spring sunshine to dark winter days, so youthful optimism turns to despair.


I think modern audiences tend to forget that *Werther* is an adaptation of Goethe's *Leiden des jungen Werther*, the epitome of the Romantic sensibility of the age. Hard to suspend disbelief, I suppose, when he is usually sung by men in their thirties, forties or even older. In Goethe he is little more than a teenager. Allegedly, the book led to a spate of copycat suicides among young men.


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## Sloe (May 9, 2014)

GregMitchell said:


> I think modern audiences tend to forget that *Werther* is an adaptation of Goethe's *Leiden des jungen Werther*, the epitome of the Romantic sensibility of the age. Hard to suspend disbelief, I suppose, when he is usually sung by men in their thirties, forties or even older. In Goethe he is little more than a teenager. Allegedly, the book led to a spate of copycat suicides among young men.


But that applies to almost every opera role.


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## Tsaraslondon (Nov 7, 2013)

Sloe said:


> But that applies to almost every opera role.


You rather miss my point. *Werther* is an opera, and a book, about teen angst. When you take that into consideration, it makes Werther's actions more understandable.


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