# What do you think about those 10-CD sets from Membran?



## Centropolis

I just came back from a trip to Prague, Vienna and Budapest. Although the food over there was cheaper than North America, the CDs were very expensive. I thought I was going to come back with some bargains but no.....they sell CDs almost double the price. I am assuming they don't have access to Amazon or something because there is no way people would pay that much for a CD. It was almost $20 per disc.

Anyhow, while I was there, the only "cheap" CDs I saw were a lot of these Membran 10-CD box sets for different composers. I didn't end up buying any because I checked the prices on Amazon and they were all cheap.

I know I shouldn't judge the quality of the music based on the price alone but I noticed Membran comes out with many different 10-CD sets for a very reasonable price. What's the general consensus on these Membran sets? I don't see a lot of people talking about them on here.

I will link to one for as an example. Why is this one so cheap?

http://www.amazon.ca/Liszt-Revoluti...TF8&colid=170P8I408FV5S&coliid=I2JXQ3SDMTILS4


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## joen_cph

Lots of good stuff, simple as that, especially their box sets focusing on a performer, whereas their composer portraits are a mixture of historical recordings and recordings from the Danish Classico label, often less distinguished.

It´s discount price and people tend to look down a bit on that, but they are often very acclaimed old recordings from major labels. Sound restoriation varies, but it´s a good opportunity to get a lot of classic recordings.

There´s been quite a bewildering lot of box sets from Membran during the years. In my case, I´ve got a lot of the material on LPs already, but decided to supplement or expand the collection with Membran issues. They include

- *4CD sets called "Artone*" with booklets like








Am very satisfied with my Horowitz, Serkin, Arrau, Michelangeli, Kempff, Rubinstein, Heifetz, Celibidache and Mengelberg sets in this series. The Kempff for instance includes a lot of his early and rare Decca Brahms recordings, just as an example.

- *4CD sets of composer portraits*, like








Having studied this series, only the Ravel was of interest to me due to the early recordings included there - no new but less interesting recordings, unlike in most of the other composer portraits.

- *an initial 10 CD box set series *focusing mainly on conductors, often with recordings from the 30s, and often with several box sets for each conductor.








The sound quality is usually not very good. I´ve got a good deal of the Mengelberg (where the alleged premiere of Bartok´s 2nd Violin Concerto in the set consisted of tracks with popular music, the only case in the Membran series where I´ve encountered such a problem), a Mitropoulos, an Ormandy and a Schnabel set plus some Furwängler, whereas I culled a Beecham set.

- *the 10CD series you mention*, such as









*There´s a short list here*: http://www.membran-online.de/index.php?cPath=6_12_13&XTCsid=1br4i4j7eu2110n77t8g8jdvi6

Lots and lots of interesting names, fine compilations of say Richter, Horowitz, Arrau, Cziffra etc. etc. As far as I remember, I´ve only got the Schnabel Beethoven Sonatas (which I also own on LPs), since I own most of the interesting ones as LP or CD material already.

Finally some *other box sets *as well, such as the famous Furtwängler 107 CD portrait









Go for those you find interesting, but study the exact content of each issue. I´d avoid the Paternostro Bruckner set for sure. If you are very focused on modern sound quality, you will probably find most of the material off-putting - but that would be a pity due to the musicianship found there. Recordings tend to improve say after WW II.


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## Centropolis

Thanks for the input joen_cph.

I am still looking for my first Bartok purchase(s). I was pretty much settled on the Solti box but it seems there are a lot more music that was worth listening on top of what's in that Solti box. Would the Membran one cover more essential Bartok stuff? But I do notice that the Solti box also contains things that are not in the Membran 10-CD set either.

http://www.membran-online.de/product_info.php?products_id=4332&XTCsid=1br4i4j7eu2110n77t8g8jdvi6

I know I would still have to get a set of Bartok string quartets. Probably settled on Tokyo.


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## Pip

the reason they are all so cheap is because the recordings are out of copyright.
that means they can use any old version they can find of various recordings and issue them under their name for pennies.
this may mean that the quality of some of the recordings are not as good as they should be because they don't have access to the master tapes from the original companies.
this may cease to be very soon as the new copyright laws are coming into effect very soon and these companies are literally trying to beat the clock. any already issued material will be allowed to remain as before the new laws come into being.
that is why there are so many on the market at the moment.


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## joen_cph

That Bartok set contains a lot of acclaimed recordings. All are mono, but a good deal of those from the 50s have decent sound. You´ll get a lot of classic points of reference - Kubelik, Fricsay, Katchen, Bartok himself, Anda, Markevitch, Menuhin, Foldes etc. 

Definitely one of the best ones, and a very, very nice choice of works (but do get piano concerto no. 1 some time as well).

(I´ve got the Fricsay "Music for Strings .". and another Fricsay "Divertimento", plus Katchen/Ansermet in the 3rd Piano Concerto; these have quite good sound; and Bartok etc. in "Contrasts" and "Sonata for 2 Pianos". The "Contrasts" do have a rather poor sound though.)


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## bigshot

I have a lot of Membran's boxes... classical, opera, jazz, popular music... I find it hard to make any kind of generalization about them, except to say that they are a bargain and they're a great way to sample a lot of different things. Sound quality varies, but there's always enough good stuff to make it worth it. The more recent boxes have better sound overall than the older ones.

One tip... If you rip these CDs, always rip them as true mono, not stereo. It improves the sound considerably.


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## Centropolis

I do prefer better recorded sound. Someone did say in one of my first threads about newbies should get over the old historical recordings as soon as possible. But honestly, it's really hard to do. I've listened to this,

http://www.amazon.ca/The-Elgar-Edit...TF8&colid=170P8I408FV5S&coliid=I223ZEL6QFUS14

on Naxos online and the recording wasn't very good and I couldn't even hear all of the instruments.

I think for the price of these Membran box sets, I will probably pick one and give it a try but I am hoping the sound will be slightly better than in that Elgar box linked above. (Mind you though, I've only listened to the first CD in that box. Maybe the later discs are newer recordings)


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## bigshot

Membran isn't always responsible for the bad sound. Sometimes things just weren't well recorded.

The best sounding Membran box I have heard is the Meisterkonzerte box. Everything on there is golden, and only a couple of things have iffy sound.


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## joen_cph

Elgar´s own recordings above are very early, from the 20s and 30s, so they aren´t representative of post WW-II sound. I prefer Elgar in good sound too.

Here´s a you-tube excerpt of the mentioned Fricsay in Bartok´s "Music for Strings ..."


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## starthrower

I can vouch for the Nielsen box. The sound is very good, and the performances by the Royal Liverpool Philharmonic have received uniformly good reviews.


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## Pip

Centropolis said:


> I do prefer better recorded sound. Someone did say in one of my first threads about newbies should get over the old historical recordings as soon as possible. But honestly, it's really hard to do. I've listened to this,
> 
> http://www.amazon.ca/The-Elgar-Edit...TF8&colid=170P8I408FV5S&coliid=I223ZEL6QFUS14
> 
> on Naxos online and the recording wasn't very good and I couldn't even hear all of the instruments.
> 
> I think for the price of these Membran box sets, I will probably pick one and give it a try but I am hoping the sound will be slightly better than in that Elgar box linked above. (Mind you though, I've only listened to the first CD in that box. Maybe the later discs are newer recordings)


The Elgar box you mentioned cannot be compared to any Membran box. it is an HMV issue of their own recordings. however all works are conducted by Elgar himself, and as he died in 1934, none of the recordings are going to sound as good as post-WW2 recordings.
With the Membran boxes, a little detective work is sometimes necessary , EG the Barbirolli box is full of his war time NYPO recordings, which are not the best and the Brahms violin co.with Kreisler was recorded in 1936.
So some of the Membrans are better than others.


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## moody

Centropolis said:


> I just came back from a trip to Prague, Vienna and Budapest. Although the food over there was cheaper than North America, the CDs were very expensive. I thought I was going to come back with some bargains but no.....they sell CDs almost double the price. I am assuming they don't have access to Amazon or something because there is no way people would pay that much for a CD. It was almost $20 per disc.
> 
> Anyhow, while I was there, the only "cheap" CDs I saw were a lot of these Membran 10-CD box sets for different composers. I didn't end up buying any because I checked the prices on Amazon and they were all cheap.
> 
> I know I shouldn't judge the quality of the music based on the price alone but I noticed Membran comes out with many different 10-CD sets for a very reasonable price. What's the general consensus on these Membran sets? I don't see a lot of people talking about them on here.
> 
> I will link to one for as an example. Why is this one so cheap?
> 
> http://www.amazon.ca/Liszt-Revoluti...TF8&colid=170P8I408FV5S&coliid=I2JXQ3SDMTILS4


I imagine the prices are because they are now in the Eurozone--a great curse,the Uk refused to join.


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## joen_cph

They have been cheap here to, mostly due an effective, very independent-minded seller (we stick to our own currency). Down to 7 - 12 € per 10 CD box, Down to 3 € per 4 CD box. But in Germany (and maybe Prague) I´ve seen them for even less.


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## Mookalafalas

I bought three of the 100 CD jazz boxes (there are 5 altogether, but 2 are out of print). The Big bands and Be-bop use a lot of poor recordings and radio broadcasts. It's stuff you can't get anywhere else, but the sound is often poor. The "Modern Jazz" is actually 1950s stuff, and if you like '50s straight ahead jazz, it is the greatest thing that will ever happen to you. Tons of incredible albums at $1 each.


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## moody

joen_cph said:


> They have been cheap here to, mostly due an effective, very independent-minded seller (we stick to our own currency). Down to 7 - 12 € per 10 CD box, Down to 3 € per 4 CD box. But in Germany (and maybe Prague) I´ve seen them for even less.


The strange thing is that I've never come across them,I wonder if they're sold in Britain.


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## joen_cph

Sometimes they are avoided by major record shops because of.the extremely low prices. Alas it' s been too long since I visited any of the British Isles.


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## moody

I've looked deeper ! At Presto.

Mitropoulos, Mozart Symphonies, Tchaikovsky Historical, al 10 cd boxes are priced at £18.25
Carl Schuricht collection four CDs is priced at £24.25.

All very reasonable to say the least ,but I am not aware of standards with these people.


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## Centropolis

I decided to give Membran a crack and ordered the 10-CD Nielson box.

http://www.amazon.ca/gp/product/B005NKS2TS/ref=oh_details_o00_s00_i00?ie=UTF8&psc=1


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## DavidA

I bought 10 CD sets of Anda, Richter, Horowitz, Kempff, Klemperer, Lipatti from Amazon....all at about £10 each. Recording quality varies but some priceless performances. And some duds too, on recording. But the good far outweighs the bad.


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## moody

Centropolis said:


> I do prefer better recorded sound. Someone did say in one of my first threads about newbies should get over the old historical recordings as soon as possible. But honestly, it's really hard to do. I've listened to this,
> 
> http://www.amazon.ca/The-Elgar-Edit...TF8&colid=170P8I408FV5S&coliid=I223ZEL6QFUS14
> 
> on Naxos online and the recording wasn't very good and I couldn't even hear all of the instruments.
> 
> I think for the price of these Membran box sets, I will probably pick one and give it a try but I am hoping the sound will be slightly better than in that Elgar box linked above. (Mind you though, I've only listened to the first CD in that box. Maybe the later discs are newer recordings)


There's something wrong here you mention Naxos but your link is to : The Elgar Edition : The Complete Electrical Recordings.
EMI 9 Discs £26.75.
This set is excellent in every way and taken from the original masters and the sound for its age first class.
Naxos has no access to the originals.


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## Centropolis

moody said:


> There's something wrong here you mention Naxos but your link is to : The Elgar Edition : The Complete Electrical Recordings.
> EMI 9 Discs £26.75.
> This set is excellent in every way and taken from the original masters and the sound for its age first class.
> Naxos has no access to the originals.


Naxos online has access to other labels as well. I honestly don't know how they do it but they have it.



Uploaded with ImageShack.us


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## moody

Centropolis said:


> Naxos online has access to other labels as well. I honestly don't know how they do it but they have it.
> 
> 
> 
> Uploaded with ImageShack.us


I certainly didn't know that,is it only in America ?


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## quack

Naxos website sell a variety of smaller label's catalogues: Capriccio, Ondine, Decapo, BBC Legends etc.

http://www.naxos.com/labels/default.asp

Their online streaming service Naxos Music Library supply the back catalogues of numerous major labels:

ARC, Berlin Classics, BIS, Chandos, EMI Classics, Erato, Hänssler Classic, Hungaroton, Naïve, Naxos, Nimbus, Ondine, RCA, Virgin Classics and Warner Classics


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## MrGramophone

I have two of the Membran boxed sets here. The first one I purchased was the Mengelberg. The sound quality varies from very good to just acceptable. I also have the Mitropoulous and here the sound quality is not so good -- too much noise reduction lead to a hard, and glassy sound.


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## SixFootScowl

This looks like a great set, especially for $12.19 new:








https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00DV1DEAI/


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## Pugg

Florestan said:


> This looks like a great set, especially for $12.19 new:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00DV1DEAI/


\
Looking good Florestan, alas that shipping costed this way.


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## SixFootScowl

Pugg said:


> \
> Looking good Florestan, alas that shipping costed this way.


Can you get reasonable shipping at Amazon UK? They have many listings of this set in the £10 - £12 price range, new.
https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B00DV1DEAI/

Here is a You Tube of it with sound clips:


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## Pugg

Florestan said:


> Can you get reasonable shipping at Amazon UK? They have many listings of this set in the £10 - £12 price range, new.
> https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B00DV1DEAI/


Thanks mate,I did make a note from it so I am going to use BookButlerr later, Switzerland can be a good option too.


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## SixFootScowl

Pugg said:


> Thanks mate,I did make a note from it so I am going to use BookButlerr later, Switzerland can be a good option too.


Sounds good (your plan and the Varnay set)! As for me, I think rather than invest in this set, I need to revisit the Krauss Ring as it has plenty of this fine lady on it, and I have it going now in the background. Think it is time to give Krauss Ring another full listen, though I am on a Fidelio Frenzy at the moment. After some more Fidelio, Krauss Ring.


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## chill782002

moody said:


> I've looked deeper ! At Presto.
> 
> Mitropoulos, Mozart Symphonies, Tchaikovsky Historical, al 10 cd boxes are priced at £18.25
> Carl Schuricht collection four CDs is priced at £24.25.
> 
> All very reasonable to say the least ,but I am not aware of standards with these people.


I have the Stokowski and Bohm sets. The sound is variable (as is only to be expected, given the age of some of the recordings) and there are times when they got a bit carried away with the noise reduction but, for the price, I can't complain. I got mine through Amazon, there are a few copies available (both new and used) through third party sellers and occasionally from Amazon itself.


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## premont

DavidA said:


> Recording quality varies but some priceless performances. And some duds too, on recording. *But the good far outweighs the bad*.


My experience too.

So all in all you get value for money.


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## Merl

I only have the Paternostro Bruckner set and it's not bad. I only paid £4 for it though.


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## Manxfeeder

Has anyone heard the Mitropoulos box set?

I see a couple previous posts say that its sound isn't that good.


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## Geoff48

Knowing little about Mitropoulus I picked up this set second hand from Amazon U.K. and paid less than a fiver for it.There are some incredible performances but the sound quality varies from poor to abysmal. Generally the recording is thin and there is an excess of treble and an absence of bass. Whether this is down to Cedar technology I’m not sure and I suspect that they sound better on a basic reproducer. 
If you can get the set cheaply it’s not a bad investment.There is a recording of Chopiniana, a precursor of Les Sylphides, which is so bad it’s almost comic, probably all the music deserves to be fair. But there are some gems which are perfectly listenable to. Issac Stern in the Dvorak Concerto is more than acceptable as is Rubinstein in the Saint Saens 2nd Concerto. Rubinstein in the Tchaikovsky is incredible despite the recorded sound, he is also good in the Beethoven 4th. There is a good, if cut, Rachmaninov Symphony 2 and a Prokofiev Concerto 3 with Mitropoulos as pianist.
I guess the set is better as a study aid rather than to listen to for pleasure. 
Incidentally given that Membran are now able to issue sets including original recordings from the fifties and sixties they can be incredible value. For example they have issued a set by Kletzki which includes his legendary first three Sibelius symphonies, his Mahler 9th and his Manfred and concert classics Pathetique as well as a live Pollini Chopin 1 and 2.In fact this is an advantage of the current Membran sets, often described as ‘milestones’, as they often include live recordings as alternatives to famous recordings.


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## Manxfeeder

Geoff48 said:


> For example they have issued a set by Kletzki which includes his legendary first three Sibelius symphonies, his Mahler 9th and his Manfred and concert classics Pathetique as well as a live Pollini Chopin 1 and 2.In fact this is an advantage of the current Membran sets, often described as 'milestones', as they often include live recordings as alternatives to famous recordings.


Thanks for the Mitropoulus review and for the heads-up on Kletzki.


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## flamencosketches

I have the Schnabel/Beethoven but haven't opened it yet because I'm considering selling it and getting it in a different guise (ie. the Warner, maybe). But I see these frequently and am curious about them. They're mostly really old recordings, and I've heard some of them are over-filtered to reduce background noise.


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## premont

flamencosketches said:


> I have the Schnabel/Beethoven but haven't opened it yet because I'm considering selling it and getting it in a different guise (ie. the Warner, maybe). But I see these frequently and am curious about them. They're mostly really old recordings, and I've heard *some of them are over-filtered to reduce background noise*.


Yes, I recall this being a problem with the Membran Schnabel/Beethoven box, which I have culled. But I have also purchased other Membran boxes which didn't suffer from this (e.g Hindemith, Böhm, Arrau and Solomon boxes).


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