# Are you male or female?



## Air

I thought this would be an interesting little experiment. Represent!

I also allowed voters' names to appear under each poll option in order to help us to be able to better identify forum members by sex. Sometimes, it can be a bit unclear! 

Of course, if you are unsure, please state so, and we will help determine which way you swing.


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## Huilunsoittaja

Haha I wanted to make this poll some weeks ago, but wasn't sure. I will also use this experiment to ask a question later, after more numbers come in.


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## Air

Huilunsoittaja said:


> Haha I wanted to make this poll some weeks ago, but wasn't sure. I will also use this experiment to ask a question later, after more numbers come in.


Thanks for voting. BTW, I'm thinking that things are looking quite even! 

All questions and discussions are highly encouraged.


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## sospiro

Good idea. 

Can be confusing. Some of the guys use a picture of a pretty girl as an avatar and vice versa.


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## Air

sospiro said:


> Good idea.
> 
> Can be confusing. Some of the guys use a picture of a pretty girl as an avatar and vice versa.


Definitely. I mean how many times have we seen Gaston being referred to as a she? 

And thanks, Aramis, for "representing" in the poll as a member of the gender opposite yours. It seems that I have been terribly "wrong" the whole time.


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## Ukko

Air said:


> I thought this would be an interesting little experiment. Represent!
> 
> I also allowed voters' names to appear under each poll option in order to help us to be able to better identify forum members by sex. Sometimes, it can be a bit unclear!
> 
> Of course, if you are unsure, please state so, and we will help determine which way you swing.


I like women. Um, what was the question?

:tiphat:


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## jurianbai

I encourage all the female species of this forum to take part in http://www.talkclassical.com/5179-do-you-have-photo.html .......:trp:


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## myaskovsky2002

*mauvais goût*

this is a not-very-smart thread. And the invitation to put photos to female seems a very "cheap" invitation...This is not a "look-for-your-soul-mate" group nor a look-for-your f...-friend group.

Go somewhere else.

Martin, male and a bit macho.


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## Yoshi

I'm confused. I was wrong about so many members. :lol:

Edit: And I agree with myaskovsky2002 about the invitation. That was just silly.


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## Weston

Are you male or female? 

I was tempted to answer "Yes." I do have several friends who could answer that way, but I am a normal male.


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## Sid James

Male (& I'm human, not a cat!*hopelessly trying to be funny*)...


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## ricardo_jvc6

I am male. From Homo Sapiens Sapiens species.


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## Edward Elgar

Wah, wah! There's no "other" option in this poll!


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## Huilunsoittaja

If I were to put up a picture of a woman as my profile, I would do her:


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## starry

myaskovsky2002 said:


> this is a not-very-smart thread. And the invitation to put photos to female seems a very "cheap" invitation...This is not a "look-for-your-soul-mate" group nor a look-for-your f...-friend group.
> 
> Go somewhere else.
> 
> Martin, male and a bit macho.


It sounded just in fun. And really I've heard alot worse than that here, recently too.


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## Sid James

Huilunsoittaja said:


> ...I would *do* her...


Nice choice of words...


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## Huilunsoittaja

Andre said:


> Nice choice of words...


:scold::scold::scold:

OH. Would you prefer "use" ?


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## mamascarlatti

Huilunsoittaja said:


> OH. Would you prefer "use" ?


"choose, select, opt for, settle on, post" are also options without unintentional sexual connotations.


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## Huilunsoittaja

mamascarlatti said:


> "choose, select, opt for, settle on, post" are also options without unintentional sexual connotations.


Indeed.

Well, enough votes are in to match what my prediction was, a huge majority of males. So here's my question: Why? Are men more attracted to classical than women? Are there simply more men in general that like it? Or, are men just more likely to come on forums and debate?


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## starry

Men tend to collect more than women perhaps, and music tends to be a collector's area. Some women may be collectors and like to explore things in depth but more men might be like that.


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## Guest

Bobby Peru, just like country.


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## Meaghan

Huilunsoittaja said:


> Indeed.
> 
> Well, enough votes are in to match what my prediction was, a huge majority of males. So here's my question: Why? Are men more attracted to classical than women? Are there simply more men in general that like it? Or, are men just more likely to come on forums and debate?


It seems to me that most internet forums have more men than women. However, my firsthand knowledge of this subject is very limited. But it is my hunch that the skewed gender balance has more to do with gender disparities in general forum membership than taste in music. The people I know who are interested in classical music and in studying it in depth are relatively evenly split between men and women.


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## Polednice

Meaghan said:


> It seems to me that most internet forums have more men than women. However, my firsthand knowledge of this subject is very limited. But it is my hunch that the skewed gender balance has more to do with gender disparities in general forum membership than taste in music. The people I know who are interested in classical music and in studying it in depth are relatively evenly split between men and women.


I agree. Discussion over.


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## Ravellian

Women are too busy getting laid and going to parties to be posting in internet forums.


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## Polednice

Perhaps a more appropriate question would be whether or not the people on this forum would rate themselves as having any kind of social life


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## World Violist

Polednice said:


> Perhaps a more appropriate question would be whether or not the people on this forum would rate themselves as having any kind of social life


Something tells me that would rapidly turn into a moot point.

And I am in fact a male. With no social life.


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## Meaghan

Ravellian said:


> Women are too busy getting laid and going to parties to be posting in internet forums.


:lol:
Of course, that's exactly why I don't post all that much!
_(kidding)
_


World Violist said:


> And I am in fact a male. With no social life.


Well, you're only 3 posts away from being the first member to reach 3,000; that's got to count for something!


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## gurthbruins

myaskovsky2002 said:


> this is a not-very-smart thread. And the invitation to put photos to female seems a very "cheap" invitation...This is not a "look-for-your-soul-mate" group nor a look-for-your f...-friend group.
> 
> Go somewhere else.
> 
> Martin, male and a bit macho.


- An unnecessarily rude and obnoxious reply. Why not follow your own suggestion?

----------------------

IMO we are all women here, some of whom think they are men.
:lol:


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## toucan

sospiro said:


> Good idea.
> 
> Can be confusing. Some of the guys use a picture of a pretty girl as an avatar and vice versa.


Would be just as confusing if the guys used pictures of... pretty boys 



Ravellian said:


> Women are too busy getting laid and going to parties to be posting in internet forums.


With whom - if males are posting on the internet?


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## emiellucifuge

Oh well at least were better than these guys:


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## sospiro

myaskovsky2002 said:


> this is a not-very-smart thread. And the invitation to put photos to female seems a very "cheap" invitation...This is not a "look-for-your-soul-mate" group nor a look-for-your f...-friend group.
> 
> Go somewhere else.
> 
> Martin, male and a bit macho.


I didn't really see this as a serious discussion. I thought it was just a bit of fun (from someone who really did think our esteemed jhar26 was female )


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## starry

Meaghan said:


> It seems to me that most internet forums have more men than women. However, my firsthand knowledge of this subject is very limited. But it is my hunch that the skewed gender balance has more to do with gender disparities in general forum membership than taste in music. The people I know who are interested in classical music and in studying it in depth are relatively evenly split between men and women.


Being a musician can be quite a single minded thing though and is maybe different to just exploring music in general as a listener/collector/hobby.

Also perhaps men are into debate more in general, I suppose for some it becomes an almost competitive thing.


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## Delicious Manager

myaskovsky2002 said:


> this is a not-very-smart thread. And the invitation to put photos to female seems a very "cheap" invitation...This is not a "look-for-your-soul-mate" group nor a look-for-your f...-friend group.
> 
> Go somewhere else.
> 
> Martin, male and a bit macho.


Come on, Martin - lighten up  No place for testosterone-fuelled machismo here (and most women find it SO unattractive!  )

Male here (and, hopefully, very NON macho!)


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## Huilunsoittaja

I agree with the reason about men more likely to come for debate.

Could it also be that men are attracted to the feminine qualities of classical music the same way they would be attracted to any woman???


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## starry

Classical music has masculine as well as feminine qualities.


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## SalieriIsInnocent

It's a friggin' sausage fest in here.


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## Delicious Manager

An interesting idea about music having 'male' and 'female' qualities. Would anyone like to try and articulate what traits make music masculine or feminine?

Also, do people detect any discernible difference in the music composed by male and female composers?


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## Yoshi

There's a ridiculous amount of males here :lol:.


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## Huilunsoittaja

Delicious Manager said:


> An interesting idea about music having 'male' and 'female' qualities. Would anyone like to try and articulate what traits make music masculine or feminine?
> 
> Also, do people detect any discernible difference in the music composed by male and female composers?


I believe classical music can definitely be "feminine" or "masculine," it depends on the style and predilection. But I'm not talking about Tchaikovsky. I really believe _Glazunov_ made more feminine music than Tchaikovsky any day, especially ballet music. To go farther, I've heard more masculine music from Cecile Chaminade with her brooding piano works than Glazunov's own salon pieces for piano! So, I assumed for a long time, years in fact, that more women would tend to like his music the same way I do. I was dead wrong!  You get my implications, right? I have a notion why Glazunov wrote music that way, but he was definitely straight. I'll beat up whoever says otherwise.

So on the point of any differences between male and female composers, I've heard proof for quite the opposite.


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## Meaghan

starry said:


> Being a musician can be quite a single minded thing though and is maybe different to just exploring music in general as a listener/collector/hobby.


Hm, I definitely don't think "single-mindedness" is a gendered characteristic. I personally know at least as many talented and serious female musicians as male.


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## starry

Meaghan said:


> Hm, I definitely don't think "single-mindedness" is a gendered characteristic. I personally know at least as many talented and serious female musicians as male.


Of course, I just meant maybe singlemindedness in different ways. Man and women are most likely equally adept at musical instruments, but a forum like this isn't just about playing musical instruments. If it was maybe there might be more females than there are. Anyway I'm really just thinking out loud exploring the topic.

Most classical music is of course composed by males so I assume most of it is 'masculine' in some way in thought process or emotion.


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## Chi_townPhilly

I think that my gender is an open secret to anyone who reads my posts, if only occasionally. 
Even for non-readers, that info can be found in my Profile Data.


Delicious Manager said:


> An interesting idea about music having 'male' and 'female' qualities. Would anyone like to try and articulate what traits make music masculine or feminine?


I can't specifically answer that question, but it reminds me of a New York Philharmonic radio broadcast of a concert conducted by David Robertson. I'm probably abridging the intent somewhat by pulling it a little out of context... but Robertson said something like Debussy's _Prélude à l'après-midi d'un faune_ had quite a bit of testosterone in it. I found myself utterly unable to take the remark seriously.


Delicious Mananger said:


> Also, do people detect any discernible difference in the music composed by male and female composers?


Potential topic-derailment risk in responding to that query. For my part, I think I'll stay away from that one.


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## myaskovsky2002

*maybe we are polite*



PHP:


It sounded just in fun. And really I've heard alot worse than that here, recently too.

We are polite, aren't we?

I am a Tom cat.

Martin


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## myaskovsky2002

*without knowing*

You have made interesting statistics.

We are more male than female in these groups. Female composers? I don't know many....(do you?) Why? Are women less interested than man by Classical music? Why?

This is becoming more interesting...

New Thread: Does classical music have a sex???????

If you don't like it here, I'll launch it elsewhere, separetaly.

Martin

:tiphat:


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## Polednice

I'm not all that fond of the idea of music having 'masculine' and 'feminine' qualities; if forced, I could probably describe various pieces using those words, but I don't think it would serve to do anything other than play into our long-outdated gender stereotypes.


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## myaskovsky2002

*I was speaking about...*

male composers: 95-97%
female composers: 3-5%

WHY? POURQUOI? ¿POR QUÉ? Patchimu?

Are women less interested in composition than men?

Martin, a real Neanderthal (as you can see)

:devil:


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## Huilunsoittaja

myaskovsky2002 said:


> Are women less interested in composition than men?


Maybe. But women were looked down upon in the 17-19th centuries.  The only music-related things they could do were singing, playing piano, and ballet. Otherwise, they had to be homemakers.

An interesting thought:
Tchaikovsky thought of committing suicide for fear of being discovered as a homosexual, but today, if you are a composer and not homosexual, you might as well put a bullet through your head.
-- Sergei Diaghilev


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## myaskovsky2002

*yeah!*



PHP:


Maybe. But women were looked down upon in the 17-19th centuries.  The only music-related things they could do were singing, playing piano, and ballet. Otherwise, they had to be homemakers.

And now they can compose we have very talented women as Sofia Giubaldina or something like that...I do not like her music! In the group of 6 (France) you had a woman, she composed awfully

Les membres de ce groupe étaient :

Georges Auric (1899-1983) 
Louis Durey (1888-1979) 
Arthur Honegger (1892-1955) 
Darius Milhaud (1892-1974) 
Francis Poulenc (1899-1963) 
Germaine Tailleferre (1892-1983), la seule femme du groupe

Martin


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## Yoshi

Not the female composers vs male composers talk again... :lol:


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## Aramis

I would say that females have no balls to write good music. That's all.


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## myaskovsky2002

*Lol*



PHP:


I would say that females have no balls to write good music. That's all.

I guess Aramis is Arabic, then more macho than I am...

Let's say that women brain is different! Less artistic, maybe? In painting they are not better, are they?

Martin, waiting for good answers to his dilemma.

Martin


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## Air

I just want to point out that the winner of last year's Pulitzer Prize _and_ Grammy Award in music was indeed a woman, Jennifer Higdon (not that I enjoy her music much).

Saariaho's _L'amour de loin_ was also the only opera from the current millenium to make our top 100 operas list, and that's got to count for something.

For the record, I thoroughly disagree with your assessment of Gubadulina, she's brilliant.


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## Huilunsoittaja

myaskovsky2002 said:


> PHP:
> 
> 
> I would say that females have no balls to write good music. That's all.
> 
> I guess Aramis is Arabic, then more macho than I am...
> 
> Let's say that women brain is different! Less artistic, maybe? In painting they are not better, are they?
> 
> Martin, waiting for good answers to his dilemma.
> 
> Martin


Ummmm......

Is it an issue of intelligence? No, I believe men and women are equally intelligent, it just might be in different ways. Women can have pretty strong characters. Women definitely connect with the emotions more than men, but I bet those composers were more sensitive than most men. Not less artistic either.

It could be the level of "drivenness" to achieve, to be respected, etc. Women have nothing to prove, we have other concerns.


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## mamascarlatti

Huilunsoittaja said:


> Ummmm......
> 
> Is it an issue of intelligence? No, I believe men and women are equally intelligent, it just might be in different ways. Women can have pretty strong characters. Women definitely connect with the emotions more than men, but I bet those composers were more sensitive than most men. Not less artistic either.
> 
> It could be the level of "drivenness" to achieve, to be respected, etc. Women have nothing to prove, we have other concerns.


I think that composing or any creative enterprise can be pretty time consuming, and costly in terms of family commitment and so on. This might be a deterrent. But there are at least as many great female writers (now) as male, so maybe it's something more exclusively to do with the musical brain.

As for general intelligence, it's an issue of different distribution along the bell curve, with women on average clustering more in the middle, and men more strung out along the edges so that you get more geniuses (and dunces).


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## Yoshi

Err... rationaly speaking, you just can't separate female human beings and male human beings intellectualy. 
How on earth can you just assume that every single person who happens to be born with female sexual organs, will have certain traits or certain intelligence? We are all the same species and regardless of gender, we all have different personalities that result from random connections in our brains. Intelligence or personality has nothing to do with gender. 

Sadly, certain societies have tried to separate females and males like they came from different planets or something.
This whole talk about how people who happened to be born female are less interested in classical music or less skilled to compose, makes absolutely no sense to me.

I find it funny that some people here came to the conclusion that females are less interested in classical music based on some forum poll result :lol:.


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## Huilunsoittaja

Jan said:


> I find it funny that some people here came to the conclusion that females are less interested in classical music based on some forum poll result :lol:.


Then why don't females come here and talk? That's what I don't understand. It really doesn't make sense to me.

We need to advertise this forum to women classical-lovers!


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## Yoshi

Huilunsoittaja said:


> Then why don't females come here and talk? That's what I don't understand. It really doesn't make sense to me.
> 
> We need to advertise this forum to women classical-lovers!


There are people that might love classical music and not post in forums.
This particular forum doesn't seem popular around females, but another one will be.

Don't get me wrong, I would love to see more females here but I was just saying that this poll doesn't mean that females are less interested in classical music. I'm pretty sure there are as much female students as male students at my conservatory for example. :trp:


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## starry

myaskovsky2002 said:


> PHP:
> 
> 
> I would say that females have no balls to write good music. That's all.
> 
> I guess Aramis is Arabic, then more macho than I am...
> 
> Let's say that women brain is different! Less artistic, maybe? In painting they are not better, are they?
> 
> Martin, waiting for good answers to his dilemma.
> 
> Martin


Women are good in literature, very good with words. Women aren't supposed (in general) to have as good spacial awareness as men.


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## mamascarlatti

Huilunsoittaja said:


> Then why don't females come here and talk? That's what I don't understand. It really doesn't make sense to me.


I don't get it either. Is it to do with the technology? I'm definitely the only woman of my age (50) who is the tecchie in the couple, so that I'm usually the one with primary access to the computer.


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## mamascarlatti

Jan said:


> Err... rationaly speaking, you just can't separate female human beings and male human beings intellectualy.
> How on earth can you just assume that every single person who happens to be born with female sexual organs, will have certain traits or certain intelligence? We are all the same species and regardless of gender, we all have different personalities that result from random connections in our brains. Intelligence or personality has nothing to do with gender.


Don't confuse individuals and trends. And there is nothing random about our brains.


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## Almaviva

Huilunsoittaja said:


> Indeed.
> 
> Well, enough votes are in to match what my prediction was, a huge majority of males. So here's my question: Why? Are men more attracted to classical than women? Are there simply more men in general that like it? Or, are men just more likely to come on forums and debate?


The Internet has always had more male participants. You know, we're wired differently. Males seem to like more the electronic stuff full of little keys and buttons to press on, than females do. So, this result doesn't necessarily indicate that males are more likely to appreciate classical music than females; just, that males are more likely to be Internet users, which is a fact that is well documented all over the world even when you control for equal access.

Specifically in the case of opera (my main interest here) I've seen statistics showing that female opera lovers are slightly more numerous than males. This may be due to the fact that many opera lovers are in the senior range of the population, and females have a longer life expectancy than males.

Still, even though there are more female opera lovers than males, in our Opera subforum I'd bet that we have more male users, due to the factor I have mentioned above.


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## Huilunsoittaja

I googled "classical forum for females" and I came up with this particular thread of alllll things. :lol: But no luck for a "female" forum.

Also found this: http://www.brightcecilia.com/forum/index.php :O I never knew! Looks very similar. I recognized some names there from this forum, straddlers. I don't like exactly how it's organized though, a little too rigid. I wouldn't be able to talk about _transitional_ composers!


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## Yoshi

mamascarlatti said:


> Don't confuse individuals and trends. And there is nothing random about our brains.


I guess I wasn't clear sorry... When I said random I meant that each brain is individual.


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## TresPicos

Jan said:


> Not the female composers vs male composers talk again... :lol:


I agree.

We can discuss brains back and forth all we want in search of an explanation, but we will just never get past the overwhelming and obvious factor of inequality in opportunities for men and women throughout history.


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## Almaviva

Jan said:


> Err... rationaly speaking, you just can't separate female human beings and male human beings intellectualy.
> How on earth can you just assume that every single person who happens to be born with female sexual organs, will have certain traits or certain intelligence? We are all the same species and regardless of gender, we all have different personalities that result from random connections in our brains. Intelligence or personality has nothing to do with gender.
> 
> Sadly, certain societies have tried to separate females and males like they came from different planets or something.
> This whole talk about how people who happened to be born female are less interested in classical music or less skilled to compose, makes absolutely no sense to me.
> 
> I find it funny that some people here came to the conclusion that females are less interested in classical music based on some forum poll result :lol:.


While I generally agree with what you're saying, I don't entirely agree with your first paragraph. There are verifiable differences between males and females that are not cultural. I wouldn't make such a sweeping statement that intelligence *or* personality has *nothing* to do with gender. First of all, you're using a singular form, apparently putting intelligence and personality in equal terms (as opposed to saying 'intelligence or personality *have* nothing to do with gender). While intelligence averages are equal for males and females, certain abilities and capacities do differ. Personality-wise, there are clear-cut differences that have been demonstrated by experimental psychology over and over.

This is not to say that either gender is *better* than the other in terms of personality or *smarter* than the other. But they are definitely not identical. And like the French say, vive la différence.


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## Yoshi

Almaviva said:


> While I generally agree with what you're saying, I don't entirely agree with your first paragraph. There are verifiable differences between males and females that are not cultural. I wouldn't make such a sweeping statement that intelligence *or* personality has *nothing* to do with gender. First of all, you're using a singular form, apparently putting intelligence and personality in equal terms (as opposed to saying 'intelligence or personality *have* nothing to do with gender). While intelligence averages are equal for males and females, certain abilities and capacities do differ. Personality-wise, there are clear-cut differences that have been demonstrated by experimental psychology over and over.
> 
> This is not to say that either gender is *better* than the other in terms of personality or *smarter* than the other. But they are definitely not identical. And like the French say, vive la différence.


I didn't mean to put intelligence and personality in equal terms. 
Well sure, I just feel that many personality differences people talk about are based on stereotypes and things like that.
And yes, intelligence averages are equal for males and females that's what I was trying to say aswell.


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## mamascarlatti

Jan said:


> And yes, intelligence averages are equal for males and females that's what I was trying to say aswell.


Averages, yes, distribution along the curve, no.


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## jhar26

TresPicos said:


> I agree.
> 
> We can discuss brains back and forth all we want in search of an explanation, but we will just never get past the overwhelming and obvious factor of inequality in opportunities for men and women throughout history.


Which is why now that there are more opportunities for women there are more female composers than ever before. When at the end of the 21st century everyone starts compiling those "top 100 greatest composers of the century" lists women will probably be strongly represented.


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## Almaviva

Jan said:


> I didn't mean to put intelligence and personality in equal terms.
> Well sure,_*I just feel that many personality differences people talk about are based on stereotypes* _and things like that.
> And yes, intelligence averages are equal for males and females that's what I was trying to say aswell.


Many, but not all. There are real differences between a male brain and a female brain that aren't sociocultural or stereotypical. As much as the politically correct speech would want to say otherwise, males and females are not identical. They are members of the same species but they have different biologies.


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## myaskovsky2002

*The difference!*



mamascarlatti said:


> Averages, yes, distribution along the *curve*, no.


That is the difference my friend, between men and women: CURVES. You have said it!

Martin, Neanthertal man.

LOL


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## emiellucifuge

Its all evolutionary biology, men and women had to fulfill different roles within society (tribe etc..), it was necessary for them to physically and mentally evolve different characteristics. After all - men have an XY chromosome pair while women have an XX - this alone means certain alleles (forms of a gene) are only inheritable to females. One example is Haemophilia which only men can exhibit fully (though women can carry it for the next generation)


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## Wicked_one

Reptilian myself


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## PatF

I've often wondered about this - not sure if the question is about forum membership, or proficiency in some form of classical music.
Music demands single minded devotion and discipline, and is very time consuming.
Most women have lots of other roles to play so don't have the time (and they're not just doing the two things Ravellian mentioned on ?p2)
So for most of us our minds are constantly jumping from one thing to another.
I love to listen to CM, and play the piano, and sing, but I know I'll never be good enough to perform in public.
The only branch of music where you tend to get more women is choir - there's always a shortage of men (in UK anyway.) So you know where to go, you guys, if you want to meet musical women.


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## KJohnson

These kind of questions are better left to scientists. There may very well be a biological reason why women are less interested in abstract discussions. But until we hear it from a scientist, we have to assume that we just don't know. 

The liberation of women is a new thing maybe in time they will catch up. Let's not forget, not long ago they couldn't even vote in this country.


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## Almaviva

emiellucifuge said:


> Its all evolutionary biology, men and women had to fulfill different roles within society (tribe etc..), it was necessary for them to physically and mentally evolve different characteristics. After all - men have an XY chromosome pair while women have an XX - this alone means certain alleles (forms of a gene) are only inheritable to females. One example is Haemophilia which only men can exhibit fully (though women can carry it for the next generation)


Regardless of the cause (yes, evolutionary biology did play a role), like you said the differences are real.

Hey, for one thing, women are soft and squeezable, while men are hard and hairy (eeewwww).:lol:


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## myaskovsky2002

*mmm....*

La France veut nous amener à leur dicton "cherchez la femme". La femme est charmante donc pas besoin de composer de la musique classique.... Tout cela est douteux, permetez-moi de vous le dire...Je ne comprends toujours pas pourquoi il y a si peu de femmes compositeurs (compositrices????)....Tout cela est bizarre.

French people carry us to the saying "cherchez la femme" (look for the female)...French guys are as machos as Argentinian guys (I am Argentinian)....Latinos in general, we are...

This subject is becoming a war! LOL

Martin.

Make love not war

:tiphat:


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## mamascarlatti

myaskovsky2002 said:


> La France veut nous amener à leur dicton "cherchez la femme". La femme est charmante donc pas besoin de composer de la musique classique.... Tout cela est douteux, permetez-moi de vous le dire...Je ne comprends toujours pas pourquoi il y a si peu de femmes compositeurs (compositrices????)....Tout cela est bizarre.
> 
> French people carry us to the saying "cherchez la femme" (look for the female)...French guys are as machos as Argentinian guys (I am Argentinian)....Latinos in general, we are...
> 
> This subject is becoming a war! LOL
> 
> Martin.
> 
> Make love not war
> 
> :tiphat:


Et si on est une femme qui n'a pas intérêt at être charmante? Qui, franchement, s'en fout?

I'd rather be fulfilled than charming.


----------



## Jacob Singer

*Are you male or female?*

Yes.


----------



## Kopachris

Jacob Singer said:


> *Are you male or female?*
> 
> Yes.


Boolean logic does not work here.


----------



## Duke

Almaviva said:


> Many, but not all. There are real differences between a male brain and a female brain that aren't sociocultural or stereotypical. As much as the politically correct speech would want to say otherwise, males and females are not identical. They are members of the same species but they have different biologies.


Yes, there are biological differencies and I agree with you.

Males are more musical than females. Thats a gift we have.

To the subject. There is no coincidence that all great composers through out history are men. Simply the male brain has musical abilities that the female brain does not have.


----------



## Yoshi

Did you seriously bump this thread just to generate yet another discussion of "Men are better musicians/composers than Women"? :lol:
I could just ask where's the source of that "Males are more musical than Females" statement but I would go off-topic and waste my time.


----------



## Couchie

Hmmmm... Only 2 options. A recent survey I did for my university had 5!


----------



## Almaviva

Couchie said:


> Hmmmm... Only 2 options. A recent survey I did for my university had 5!


What were the five options?


----------



## mmsbls

I spoke to my wife about some of the threads in TC. Based on how many threads rank composers of pieces, she suspected that the vast majority of people were male. She feels that "ranking" is much more a male trait.


----------



## Huilunsoittaja

Wow, the proportion of women to men is now about 1:9.

Abuse occurs in such situations, if you get me.


----------



## the_emptier

it's hard to determine whether a sex is better at something, like music, particularly composing. for one the time period that classical music was in its prime was at a point where a woman even wanting to take up a legitimate profession, even get a proper education, would be out of line, so the opportunity just wasn't there. I think women have a more level playing field in terms of instrumental/singing, but composing....it is clearly a male dominated field. and now with such an open society you would expect more female composers to come out, which has happened, but i haven't been wowed by any. but i take no bias if a composer is male or female. oh and also this is just in the instance of classical music, pop is definitely half and half, if not more in favor, of women. certainly not all of them are extremely talented, but it does take a certain tenacity and drive to get where they are


----------



## tdc

^ I've been pretty wowed by Sofia Gubaidulina. Have you listened to any of her works?


----------



## Igneous01

both? it likes to change places down there from time to time, its not easy sharing a room with 2 people!


----------



## Couchie

Almaviva said:


> What were the five options?


In addition to male and female:
- Transgender
- Intersex
- Other

Admittedly catering to a very small populace, but this was after all being run by our student government.


----------



## Huilunsoittaja

I think it's biased to think that women are somehow better sopranos than men... and do men really make better basses?


----------



## Almaviva

Huilunsoittaja said:


> I think it's biased to think that women are somehow better sopranos than men... and do men really make better basses?


As a straight male, I confess to some bias. I think that female sopranos are often better looking than male sopranos - Anna Netrekbo, for instance. In my defense, I must say that I'm *very* ashamed of my horrible bias. [Alma crosses his fingers]


----------



## Edward Elgar

Over 90% of this forum is male? Interesting, but what does it mean? Do men prefer talking about music? Do men have more time on their hands? Curious.


----------



## Almaviva

Edward Elgar said:


> Over 90% of this forum is male? Interesting, but what does it mean? Do men prefer talking about music? Do men have more time on their hands? Curious.


I think it just means that men are more likely to participate of Internet message boards.


----------



## Duke

Almaviva said:


> I think it just means that men are more likely to participate of Internet message boards.


Not totally true I think. I know plenty of forums where almost everyone are women. Whether the majority is male or female on a forum has very much to do with its subject.

Visit a forum about children, relationships, clothes or cute animals and the vast majority will be women.

Visit a forum about computers, music, sports or dangerous animals and the vast majority will be men.


----------



## mmsbls

Almaviva said:


> As a straight male, I confess to some bias. I think that female sopranos are often better looking than male sopranos - Anna Netrekbo, for instance. In my defense, I must say that I'm *very* ashamed of my horrible bias. [Alma crosses his fingers]


Actually I have asked my wife about the issue of appearance in music performers. We both believe that male performers seem relatively average looking in general; whereas, female performers are significantly better than average looking. The same trend holds true in other areas such as movies, TV, even business to some extent. I fully understand how movies and TV would have significantly better looking women than men.

First do others think this is true? If so, the question is why would music (classical) have better looking women? Presumably the variation in performance at the top would have to be small (probably true due to the competition for few positions). Also men would have to essentially have the say in who gets "promoted" to top recording and solo performing positions.


----------



## Duke

mmsbls said:


> Actually I have asked my wife about the issue of appearance in music performers. We both believe that male performers seem relatively average looking in general; whereas, female performers are significantly better than average looking. The same trend holds true in other areas such as movies, TV, even business to some extent. I fully understand how movies and TV would have significantly better looking women than men.
> 
> First do others think this is true? If so, the question is why would music (classical) have better looking women? Presumably the variation in performance at the top would have to be small (probably true due to the competition for few positions). Also men would have to essentially have the say in who gets "promoted" to top recording and solo performing positions.


That female pearformers are "better looking" in classical music than male isnt strange. As you mention it is like this all over the society. Women are much more than men judged by their looks. Classical music is no exception.


----------



## Meaghan

In my sociology courses, we've learned about how physical appearance has an impact on job prospects for everyone (better-looking people are more likely to be hired), but has a significantly greater impact for women than for men. I wish I had the research handy, because this is probably less credible without citations. If I remember places where I've read this, I'll be back.


----------



## mmsbls

Meaghan said:


> In my sociology courses, we've learned about how physical appearance has an impact on job prospects for everyone (better-looking people are more likely to be hired), but has a significantly greater impact for women than for men. I wish I had the research handy, because this is probably less credible without citations. If I remember places where I've read this, I'll be back.


I have read summaries of such studies, and I certainly believe the general conclusion. I would be more concerned about this bias if I felt that it had caused a noticeable decrease in performance ability. I don't think I can tell the difference between the ability of women and men soloists.


----------



## myaskovsky2002

Hilltroll72 said:


> I like women. Um, what was the question?
> 
> :tiphat:


 Are you a lesbian?

Martin, afraid


----------



## myaskovsky2002

Almaviva said:


> As a straight male, I confess to some bias. I think that female sopranos are often better looking than male sopranos - Anna Netrekbo, for instance. In my defense, I must say that I'm *very* ashamed of my horrible bias. [Alma crosses his fingers]


 Machos don't impress me


----------



## myaskovsky2002

It depends


----------



## Ukko

I haven't bothered to read all of the posts, so I may be repeating someone when I answer the thread title question with *Yes*.


----------



## LordBlackudder

fashion and style seems to be important to women.

since classical music has a terrible decrepit image no women want to know.

to remedy this you should include classical music in the media and show young artists. perhaps show women a sense of empowerment that comes from learning music.


----------



## MaestroViolinist

LordBlackudder said:


> fashion and style seems to be important to women.
> 
> since classical music has a terrible decrepit image no women want to know.
> 
> to remedy this you should include classical music in the media and show young artists. perhaps show women a sense of empowerment that comes from learning music.


I never noticed the decrepit image...


----------



## Huilunsoittaja

It may be... women have better things to do. 

They shop, cook (for fun even!), garden, listen to music on their own, clean (also for fun!), exercise, read, make art, play instruments, do errands, visit friends, and have part- or even full-time jobs. Not to mention raising children.  Computers little interest many women. Except me.  Only, I do some of those things _too_, and also internet. Main reason I'm here is I enjoy talking about music, and my inability to talk in person with many people in my current situation, even at my Music School, draws me to come here.

This forum needs a women's touch anyhow.


----------



## MaestroViolinist

^True, true. But I must say I don't like cooking and I hate cleaning.  

"This forum needs a women's touch anyhow." Definitely.


----------



## ComposerOfAvantGarde

MaestroViolinist said:


> ^True, true. But I must say I don't like cooking and I hate cleaning.
> 
> "This forum needs a women's touch anyhow." Definitely.


Knowing what I'm like in the kitchen I don't think you want me to cook for you.


----------



## MaestroViolinist

ComposerOfAvantGarde said:


> Knowing what I'm like in the kitchen I don't think you want me to cook for you.


Ahaha, at least you can make an omelette now!  I don't think even I can make an omelette... Actually I think I did once, can't remember what it tasted like though.


----------



## ComposerOfAvantGarde

MaestroViolinist said:


> Ahaha, at least you can make an omelette now!  I don't think even I can make an omelette... Actually I think I did once, can't remember what it tasted like though.


I can make toast, sandwiches, omelettes and pasta. I want to learn how to make fried polenta with mushrooms and Gorgonzola.


----------



## MaestroViolinist

ComposerOfAvantGarde said:


> I can make toast, sandwiches, omelettes and pasta. I want to learn how to make fried polenta with mushrooms and Gorgonzola.


Good for you, I can make those things too. 

Fried polenta with mushrooms and gorgonzola???


----------



## ComposerOfAvantGarde

MaestroViolinist said:


> Good for you, I can make those things too.
> 
> Fried polenta with mushrooms and gorgonzola???


It's delicious.


----------



## MaestroViolinist

ComposerOfAvantGarde said:


> It's delicious.


I'm sure.


----------



## afterpostjack

IQ scores for males are on average 3-5 points above those for females. This, together with more variance for males, is probably the greatest contributor to male dominance in music, the sciences, etc.


----------



## ComposerOfAvantGarde

Nuukeer said:


> IQ scores for males are on average 3-5 points above those for females. This, together with more variance for males, is probably the greatest contributor to male dominance in music, the sciences, etc.


IQ is stupid.


----------



## MaestroViolinist

Nuukeer said:


> IQ scores for males are on average 3-5 points above those for females. This, together with more variance for males, is probably the greatest contributor to male dominance in music, the sciences, etc.


WHY is there no dislike???????????????????????? :scold:


----------



## Meaghan

Edited, all gone.


----------



## myaskovsky2002

I couldn't find transexual here...

Martin(a) desoriented


----------



## ComposerOfAvantGarde

myaskovsky2002 said:


> I couldn't find transexual here...
> 
> Martin(a) desoriented


Haha, I used to think I was a hermaphrodite. Asexual is not here either.


----------



## myaskovsky2002

ComposerOfAvantGarde said:


> Haha, I used to think I was a hermaphrodite. Asexual is not here either.


You are not very kind... I have just two operations left and I will be a...Surprise!

Martin(a)


----------



## clavichorder

Meaghan said:


> Edited, all gone.


Aww, Meaghan with the bashfulness again. There was nothing wrong with your post!

P.S., Aramis is a girl I guess...


----------



## Philip

Nuukeer said:


> IQ scores for males are on average 3-5 points above those for females. This, together with more variance for males, is probably the greatest contributor to male dominance in music, the sciences, etc.


Totally agree.

By looking at the IQ thread and this poll, we can only come to this conclusion:

If TC members are smarter than average,
and TC members are mostly males,
then _males are mostly smarter than average_, ie. *men are smarter then women*.


----------



## clavichorder

Philip said:


> men are smarter *than* women.


----------



## Philip

it was deliberate


----------



## clavichorder

Philip said:


> it was deliberate


Just checking, I guess.


----------



## ComposerOfAvantGarde

It would have been more ironic if one of the female members picked out that grammar mistake.


----------



## Philip

ComposerOfAvantGarde said:


> It would have been more ironic if one of the female members picked out that grammar mistake.


HERE YOU GO: *_Men are smarter *than* woman_


----------



## ComposerOfAvantGarde

Philip said:


> HERE YOU GO: *_Men are smarter *than* woman_


So with the people who are logged in at the moment, you are female?


----------



## Philip

Anyways... i don't care how smart she is, my girlfriend is a beautiful women <3


----------



## Huilunsoittaja

Aramis did this poll long ago, and marked himself down as female :lol: I wonder why...


----------



## ComposerOfAvantGarde

Huilunsoittaja said:


> Aramis did this poll long ago, and marked himself down as female :lol: I wonder why...


I've heard him/her sing "Der Hölle Rache"


----------



## mamascarlatti

Philip said:


> HERE YOU GO: *_Men are smarter *than* woman_


so are you checking whether we can pick this one out:

*women

and this one:



Philip said:


> Anyways... i don't care how smart she is, my girlfriend is a beautiful women <3


*woman


----------



## ComposerOfAvantGarde

How do you know he didn't mean "my girlfriends are beautiful women <3 ?"


----------



## neoshredder

ComposerOfAvantGarde said:


> How do you know he didn't mean "my girlfriends are beautiful women <3 ?"


2 is better than 1 right?


----------



## ComposerOfAvantGarde

neoshredder said:


> 2 is better than 1 right?


I was thinking around six, but whatever.


----------



## neoshredder

ComposerOfAvantGarde said:


> I was thinking around six, but whatever.


That would be hard work. lol


----------



## Philip

mamascarlatti said:


> so are you checking whether we can pick this one out:
> 
> *women
> 
> and this one:
> 
> *woman


I'm really confuse now..


----------



## Lenfer

Philip said:


> I'm really confuse now..


Woman = One women while women = more than one. 

Like sheep and sheep no wait...


----------



## Moscow-Mahler

I am male.....


----------



## Crudblud

I am mail. Put me in your box.

This innuendo brought to you by Crudblud. Crudblud, when only the worst will do.


----------



## Vesteralen

Never liked this question. If someone is lying about it till now, what's going to make them suddenly tell the truth?


----------



## Mesa

I was born without discernible genitalia.


----------



## moody

Mesa said:


> I was born without discernible genitalia.


I don't wish to know that!!


----------



## Crudblud

^Yeah? Well I paid good money for that information, pal!


----------



## drpraetorus

Judging from the poll results, this is no place to meet women.


----------



## ComposerOfAvantGarde

drpraetorus said:


> Judging from the poll results, this is no place to meet women.


Speaking as a person who actually _has,_ I think you may find one to suit your liking. There are plenty to go around as long as your willing to share. :lol:


----------



## jani

drpraetorus said:


> Judging from the poll results, this is no place to meet women.


The pool tells that we have only 14 females here, so we must FIGHT FOR THEM!!!


----------



## Huilunsoittaja

Profile for Huilunsoittaja:









Status: Single
Occupation: BM Flute Performance College Student
Hobbies: Studying Russian music, writing stories, flute and music stuff in general, reading, walking, biking, swimming. Also, apparently bunnies, and wearing blue dresses. 
Looking for: Sorry, no online dating. 

:tiphat:


----------



## jani

Huilunsoittaja said:


> Profile for Huilunsoittaja:
> 
> View attachment 7253
> 
> 
> Status: Single
> Occupation: BM Flute Performance College Student
> Hobbies: Studying Russian music, writing stories, flute and music stuff in general, reading, walking, biking, swimming. Also, apparently bunnies, and wearing blue dresses.
> Looking for:* Sorry, no online dating. *
> 
> :tiphat:


... ... ...

:lol:


----------



## neoshredder

I guess women don't like classical music.


----------



## Philip

neoshredder said:


> I guess women don't like classical music.


Logic fail.


----------



## Guest

Huilunsoittaja said:


> Profile for Huilunsoittaja:
> 
> View attachment 7253
> 
> 
> Status: Single
> Occupation: BM Flute Performance College Student
> Hobbies: Studying Russian music, writing stories, flute and music stuff in general, reading, walking, biking, swimming. Also, apparently bunnies, and wearing blue dresses.
> Looking for: Sorry, no online dating.
> 
> :tiphat:


...bagpipe-playing, Jane Eyrie-faerie!


----------



## neoshredder

Philip said:


> Logic fail.


Stats say otherwise. Explain why the poll is so lopsided?


----------



## MaestroViolinist

neoshredder said:


> Stats say otherwise. Explain why the poll is so lopsided?


Women have better things to do then join classical music websites. ut:


----------



## neoshredder

True. They got a lot more going on than being on the internet in general.  Glad you are the exception.


----------



## MaestroViolinist

:lol: I'll take that as a compliment, although I don't think it was...


----------



## neoshredder

Don't worry. It's an insult to me as well. I got nothing going on. But I am a conservative when it comes to living.


----------



## Philip

neoshredder said:


> Stats say otherwise. Explain why the poll is so lopsided?


Stats say that out of 120 registered members who voted on this poll, 105 answered male and 15 female. Not much else.

If i were to draw any other conclusion, personally i would propose that perhaps females do not feel the same need as males do to join an internet forum and circle jerk about classical music.

What if i told you that every single conservatory and music university/college i myself or my friends have attended or visited had a higher proportion of females than males?


----------



## neoshredder

Philip said:


> Stats say that out of 120 registered members who voted on this poll, 105 answered male and 15 female. Not much else.
> 
> If i were to draw any other conclusion, personally i would propose that perhaps females do not feel the same need as males do to join an internet forum and circle jerk about classical music.
> 
> What if i told you that every single conservatory and music university/college i myself or my friends have attended or visited had a higher proportion of females than males?


I don't feel a need to talk to you any more.


----------



## PetrB

Your poll categories are incomplete: it should be ladies, gentlemen -- & tenors


----------



## BurningDesire

There should also be an "Other" category.


----------



## Crudblud

BurningDesire said:


> There should also be an "Other" category.


I feel like everything and nothing at once.


----------



## Philip

neoshredder said:


> I don't feel a need to talk to you any more.


I don't understand why you're taking it personally. The only thing i said that wasn't fact is my way of interpreting the imbalance in the female to male ratio, to demonstrate that you saying that "women don't like classical music" makes no sense regardless of the results of this poll. What you've given me is an easy logical proposition to contradict.

Your comment, maybe you don't realize it, could be perceived as sexist. You assert a stereotype or preconceived idea to a particular sex. 'Preconceived' because you have no basis in this poll to draw your conclusion. In order to come to that conclusion, you would have to conduct a proper survey in the general population. Taking for granted that TC represents the general population is making one too many assumptions.


----------



## neoshredder

The poll tells a story though. You can perceive it any way you want. It's not going to change my opinion. Different types of music attract different crowds. Jazz might be even more slanted. Calling me sexist is ridiculous though. I find that insulting.


----------



## Philip

neoshredder said:


> The poll tells a story though. You can perceive it any way you want. It's not going to change my opinion. Different types of music attract different crowds. Jazz might be even more slanted. Calling me sexist is ridiculous though. I find that insulting.


Saying that i said that you were sexist is insulting. I said that your *comment* _may_ be perceived as sexist.


----------



## neoshredder

So the 'may be perceived' and 'are' far apart from each other? Sorry but you offended me either way. Ignore list is a great feature in things like this.


----------



## BurningDesire

I'm a woman, I like classical music. I play music. I write music. And I'm not unique in those respects.


----------



## Philip

BurningDesire said:


> I'm a woman, I like classical music. I play music. I write music. And I'm not unique in those respects.


That's impossible.



neoshredder said:


> women don't like classical music.


----------



## Crudblud

I voted female as a sign of solidarity. I feel like more of a man now. No I don't.


----------



## neoshredder

Philip said:


> That's impossible.


I see you still can't get over that post. Obviously, you took my comments too literally. Others would see that as a trend. And I agree that forums tend to attract more men in general. Many posts later, you ignore those conversations and going back to square 1. If the poll wasn't so lopsided, I wouldn't have said that. But feel free to keep talking about it. If you enjoy doing this to me. I took you off ignore because Crudblud defends you as a poster.


----------



## Philip

neoshredder said:


> I see you still can't get over that post.


Oh, i'm sorry, i thought i was on your ignore list? 

It was a test. :lol:


----------



## Crudblud

It would probably be nice if you stop goading him now.


----------



## jani

Profile for Jani:








Status: single
Hobbies: Guitar playing, Writing/Listening to music
Loves: Music, Coffee, Money and women
Looking for: My other half.... >_> ....<_<.... >_> ....<_< just joking:lol:


----------



## ComposerOfAvantGarde

jani said:


> Profile for Jani:
> View attachment 7346
> 
> 
> Status: single
> Hobbies: Guitar playing, Writing/Listening to music
> Loves: Music, Coffee, Money and women
> Looking for: My other half.... >_> ....<_<.... >_> ....<_< just joking:lol:


I'll be a woman for you


----------



## neoshredder

ComposerOfAvantGarde said:


> I'll be a woman for you


Poor Maestroviolinist. :lol:


----------



## jani

ComposerOfAvantGarde said:


> I'll be a woman for you


You be a woman for Mv, If you would be a woman for me i would be in loads of trouble


----------



## Itullian

itullian is male.


----------



## MaestroViolinist

ComposerOfAvantGarde said:


> I'll be a woman for you
> 
> 
> neoshredder said:
> 
> 
> 
> Poor Maestroviolinist. :lol:
Click to expand...

Thank you neoshredder.


----------



## ComposerOfAvantGarde

MaestroViolinist said:


> Thank you neoshredder.


I will reply to you privately.


----------



## Philip

Hey, i hate to bring this back up, but interestingly the pitchfork People's list has the exact same ratios of men and women as Talk Classical.

Does that mean that only men like hipster music? ie. Can we assume that most hipsters are men? Or that women don't like indie music? Maybe women can only appreciate mainstream music?

Just sayin.


----------



## neoshredder

Philip said:


> Hey, i hate to bring this back up, but interestingly the pitchfork People's list has the exact same ratios of men and women as Talk Classical.
> 
> Does that mean that only men like hipster music? ie. Can we assume that most hipsters are men? Or that women don't like indie music? Maybe women can only appreciate mainstream music?
> 
> Just sayin.


Most women I know or knew are into mainstream music or something far away from Classical Music. In my Jazz Band at College years ago, there was one women and about 20 men.


----------



## Philip

neoshredder said:


> Most women I know or knew are into mainstream music or something far away from Classical Music. In my Jazz Band at College years ago, there was one women and about 20 men.


Actually, for the most part, Pitchfork reviews, and its readers prefer, mainstream music (look at the list!). What it doesn't review is _commercial_ music. Now, what is the next logical implication...? Do you have any other examples from your personal experience which you could extrapolate?


----------



## neoshredder

Nope. That's all I have to say.


----------



## Ravndal

Philip said:


> Hey, i hate to bring this back up, but interestingly the pitchfork People's list has the exact same ratios of men and women as Talk Classical.
> 
> Does that mean that only men like hipster music? ie. Can we assume that most hipsters are men? Or that women don't like indie music? Maybe women can only appreciate mainstream music?
> 
> Just sayin.


Or it just means that men explores the internet and are more active. Peoples List has probably more manly readers. Etc etc.

I don't think women are so different.


----------



## jani

MaestroViolinist said:


> Thank you neoshredder.


This comment makes me think that she doesn't like me.


----------



## MaestroViolinist

jani said:


> This comment makes me think that she doesn't like me.


I like you, it's just I agreed when neoshredder said "Poor Maestroviolinist." CoAG seems quite enamoured by you lately. :lol:


----------



## SiegendesLicht

I am female and I love Internet forums and classical music. But then I am quite sexist against my own sex.


----------



## Mephistopheles

I am an honorary female.


----------



## jani

Mephistopheles said:


> I am an honorary female.


Hello


----------



## presto

Air said:


> Are you male or female?


You decide!


----------



## jani

presto said:


> You decide!


Are you tryin to steal our girls? ?
With all that manly chest hair, i feel like a little boy because i don't have any .


----------



## moody

MaestroViolinist said:


> I like you, it's just I agreed when neoshredder said "Poor Maestroviolinist." CoAG seems quite enamoured by you lately. :lol:


You've noticed that have you?


----------



## jani

moody said:


> You've noticed that have you?


Coag ignore that post he is obviously jealous.


----------



## Mephistopheles

presto said:


> You decide!


I have not yet seen enough to be able to reach a conclusion.


----------



## BurningDesire

jani said:


> Are you tryin to steal our girls? ?
> With all that manly chest hair, i feel like a little boy because i don't have any .


You're assuming all the girls on this site are heterosexual~


----------



## Crudblud

BurningDesire said:


> You're assuming all the girls on this site are heterosexual~


And assuming that all heterosexual women find vain men attractive.


----------



## Guest

...and assuming that gay men won't find a man in Hawaiian shorts attractive.


----------



## ErinD

Are we talking biological sex or social gender here?


----------



## ComposerOfAvantGarde

ErinD said:


> Are we talking biological sex or social gender here?


Biological. That's why Aramis went female.


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## Huilunsoittaja

16.55% females, not bad, not bad.


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## clavichorder

Meaghan for some reason hasn't voted.


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## jani

Huilunsoittaja said:


> 16.55% females, not bad, not bad.


It should be 83.45% Female and 16.55 male.


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## Crudblud

At least three of us are just pretending to be women.


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## jani

Crudblud said:


> At least three of us are just pretending to be women.


Are you one of them?


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## SiegendesLicht

Somtimes I wish I could be a male.


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## ComposerOfAvantGarde

Crudblud said:


> At least three of us are just pretending to be women.


I had several at least confused by my gender when I went through that _phase....._


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## aleazk

ComposerOfAvantGarde said:


> I had several at least confused by my gender when I went through that _phase....._


Considering that you are moved by love movies for "teenage girls", I would not say "went"...


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## ComposerOfAvantGarde

aleazk said:


> Considering that you are moved by love movies for "teenage girls", I would not say "went"...


That's only ONE MOVIE. I hate modern American chick flicks for teenage girls.


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## Crudblud

jani said:


> Are you one of them?


I don't talk about what's between my legs on the internet.


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## Mephistopheles

Crudblud said:


> I don't talk about what's between my legs on the internet.


Is there something else between your legs off the internet?


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## Crudblud

Mephistopheles said:


> Is there something else between your legs off the internet?


That one got the giggles in my belly but good, so it did!


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## BurningDesire

ComposerOfAvantGarde said:


> I had several at least confused by my gender when I went through that _phase....._


what Phase?


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## ComposerOfAvantGarde

BurningDesire said:


> what Phase?


About January or February this year.


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## BurningDesire

ComposerOfAvantGarde said:


> About January or February this year.


I wasn't on this forum at that time o3o


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## BlazeGlory

Yes!!!!!!!!!!!


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## Guest

I've voted already. Is it too late to change my mind?


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## Tristan

I'm a dude  And almost every forum site I've ever been to has been by far dominated by males.


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## clavichorder

Tristan said:


> I'm a dude  And almost every forum site I've ever been to has been by far dominated by males.


Yeah, try going on the personality type/other pop psychology oriented forums. Also a surprising amount of equal gender representation on mental health forums.


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## lorelei

In the minority...


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## jani

lorelei said:


> In the minority...


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## Flamme

Male or female?
- A box
Male a female?
- A box


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## SixFootScowl

A lot of new members since January 2013 so I am bumping this in hopes of updated poll results.


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## Bettina

Female (which should be obvious from my user name and the charming coquettishness of my posts...)


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## hpowders

Who wants to know?


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## hpowders

Bettina said:


> Female (which should be obvious from my user name and the charming coquettishness of my posts...)


Never any doubt.


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## Becca

I believe that I answered that in an Area 51 thread...

http://www.talkclassical.com/42947-testosterone-art-tc-posting.html


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## Pugg

Florestan said:


> A lot of new members since January 2013 so I am bumping this in hopes of updated poll results.


I wonder if all are all still amongst us.


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## EddieRUKiddingVarese

No sure at all .


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## Capeditiea

i am neither of the binaries...


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## EddieRUKiddingVarese

A Singularity then are we?


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## ST4

Rogerx said:


> I wonder if all are all still amongst us.


Probably quite a few, gladly you haven't left us yet


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## laurie

Capeditiea said:


> i am neither of the binaries...


..............


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## EddieRUKiddingVarese

Is better than being a four legged human I guess


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## Klassik

EddieRUKiddingVarese said:


> Is better than being a four legged human I guess


What about a three legged human?


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## EddieRUKiddingVarese

Klassik said:


> What about a three legged human?


You mean, Jake the Peg- Oh he got arrested


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## ST4

I am a modest man


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## Klassik

ST4 said:


> I am a modest man


Mussorgsky or Tchaikovsky?


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## Capeditiea

laurie said:


> ..............


to alleviate some confusion.  i have no gender... not exactly a human. :3


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## laurie

Capeditiea said:


> to alleviate some confusion.  i have no gender... not exactly a human. :3


Yeah, ok .... 'cuz_ that's_ not confusing at all!  :lol:


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## Capeditiea

laurie said:


> Yeah, ok .... 'cuz_ that's_ not confusing at all!  :lol:


i am glad i could help


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## EddieRUKiddingVarese

Capeditiea said:


> i am glad i could help


I'm so glad also the we cleared that up or down and maybe round and round.......


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## Huilunsoittaja

I think the easiest way to fix the gender disparity of this forum is ban those 120 extra male members, so we have 30 and 30. It's much too hard to get more women to come on this forum, and they have every right not to be forced to do _anything_. I'm pro-choice for women!

:tiphat:


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## Klassik

Huilunsoittaja said:


> I think the easiest way to fix the gender disparity of this forum is ban those 120 extra male members, so we have 30 and 30. It's much too hard to get more women to come on this forum, and they have every right not to be forced to do _anything_. I'm pro-choice for women!
> 
> :tiphat:


Who is picking which men get to stay? :lol:

I'm not sure if I want to know the answer, but is Klassik on the list of the 30 men who get to stay?


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## Capeditiea

Am I safe? even though i am neither? :O


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## Huilunsoittaja

Capeditiea said:


> Am I safe? even though i am neither? :O


I'll snap my fingers and so it will be a randomized, yet merciful selection. :tiphat:

(You better know what I'm alluding to!)


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## Klassik

Huilunsoittaja said:


> I'll snap my fingers and so it will be a randomized, yet merciful selection. :tiphat:
> 
> (You better know what I'm alluding to!)


The reality is that there are only ~25 men on TC, but most of them have multiple usernames.  I assume the women of TC (and the Capeditieas) are too honest to do such things.


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## Capeditiea

Huilunsoittaja said:


> I'll snap my fingers and so it will be a randomized, yet merciful selection. :tiphat:
> 
> (You better know what I'm alluding to!)


i hope i won't end up a giraffe like the last time.


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## Harmonie

Wow, that is quite a gap. It makes me sad. =(


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## Klassik

I'm looking at the results now. Who knew EddieRUKiddingVarese was female?!  RUKidding, EddieRUKiddingVarese?


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## Capeditiea

Klassik said:


> I'm looking at the results now. Who knew EddieRUKiddingVarese was female?!  RUKidding, EddieRUKiddingVarese?


:O it all makes sense now...


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## znapschatz

Huilunsoittaja said:


> I'll snap my fingers and so it will be a randomized, yet merciful selection. :tiphat:
> 
> (You better know what I'm alluding to!)


Actually, I have no idea. Dare I ask?


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## Norman Gunston

Will having gender reassignment surgery help


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## EddieRUKiddingVarese

Klassik said:


> I'm looking at the results now. Who knew EddieRUKiddingVarese was female?!  RUKidding, EddieRUKiddingVarese?


You've seen me in my dress right ?


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## Klassik

EddieRUKiddingVarese said:


> You've seen me in my dress right ?


I have. It's why I'm asking if you are kidding.


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## Capeditiea

---edited to make it more family friendly

... *nosebleeds


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## Klassik

Harmonie said:


> Wow, that is quite a gap. It makes me sad. =(


It would be nice to have more female posters here at TC. In my experience, female posters are usually very knowledgeable about music as they usually have some sort of musical background. Even though they are well-informed, the female posters usually also enjoy the lighter and sometimes silly aspects of classical music. That's wonderful, IMO! 

I suppose potential female posters have the option of enjoying the music they love or reading lovely threads like the _Assumption of greatness_ one. Given those two options, I think we can pretty much explain our lack of female members here at TC.


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## Guest

Plus, you need to factor in the high %age of male accounts that are multiples.


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## Klassik

dogen said:


> Plus, you need to factor in the high %age of male accounts that are multiples.


The women of TC don't seem like the kind who would create multiple accounts. Given how infrequently many of them post, I don't think they're looking to do more posting. :lol: That said, if one of the well-informed women I mentioned above did create multiple accounts, they'd probably be much better at hiding themselves and getting away with it! As I've learned on TC, most of them have multiple musical crushes. That would really throw us men off!


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## LezLee

LordBlackudder said:


> fashion and style seems to be important to women.
> 
> since classical music has a terrible decrepit image no women want to know.
> 
> to remedy this you should include classical music in the media and show young artists. perhaps show women a sense of empowerment that comes from learning music.


What a load of insulting b.....ks! I hope (but fear it wasn't) this was tongue-in-cheek?


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## Guest

LezLee said:


> What a load of insulting b.....ks! I hope (but fear it wasn't) this was tongue-in-cheek?


What's up LezLee, don't you like being patronised?


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## Norman Gunston

I'll vote for ya


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## atsizat

I am a male who wishes he had been born a female. Females are so lucky to have been born females. It sucks to be a man.


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## Capeditiea

atsizat said:


> I am a male who wishes he had been born a female. Females are so lucky to have been born females. It sucks to be a man.


*nods, though there are many issues being a female. (seeing as i am neither... yet am clearly understands the hardships of both...)

Females have this monthly experience where blood decides to jump out. Which in turn makes them really moody and want to destroy everything around them while crying frantically over the fact the color of the room is off by .2% of a shade... which would lead to some scary refurbashing plans, which then get frantic about how much it would cost and decide that it is a great time to go and discuss things with another human who happens to be quite scared, since they appear out of no where weilding a broom... which they grabbed for some unknown reason... but they realize now what they have to do with the broom. They attack this other human chanting "Go work! Get Money!" which after they calmed down from this the world seems to have a peaceful revolution. 
this routine happens 2-4 days every month.

but then sometimes they are late... which they then go and investigate, realizing that they might be pregnant... so they try and configure who the father was...

Males on the other hand... have it easy. only detriments of being a male is all that hair that grows in many locations on the body... and the sure sign of being aroused. Which during adolescence can be seen by everyone. But that is about it as far as i know.

now the humans who have it the worst are those who want to transistion to the other gender... :O which is that much more of a challenge... 
(i could get into this but it would be a book and a half...)


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## Klassik

Capeditiea said:


> *nods, though there are many issues being a female. (seeing as i am neither... yet am clearly understands the hardships of both...)
> 
> Females have this monthly experience where blood decides to jump out. Which in turn makes them really moody and want to destroy everything around them while crying frantically over the fact the color of the room is off by .2% of a shade...


This is not always a problem for women. Take the example of the woman who uses her polka-dotted granny panties season as a time to dump her usual partner, Beethoven, for Franz Liszt. I'm not so sure when or why Liszt turned into the Romantic-era Gesualdo, but I guess being historically informed does not matter too much during fantasies. :lol: What is historically informed, probably, is that Liszt is a much more potent lover than Beethoven. Thus, they have a great time during their period. It's something to look forward to, not regret. :devil:



> Males on the other hand... have it easy. only detriments of being a male is all that hair that grows in many locations on the body... and the sure sign of being aroused. Which during adolescence can be seen by everyone. But that is about it as far as i know.


The hair part is certainly true.  As for the sure sign of being aroused, Klassik views that as being a positive.


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## hpowders

Klassik said:


> The women of TC don't seem like the kind who would create multiple accounts. Given how infrequently many of them post, I don't think they're looking to do more posting. :lol: That said, if one of the well-informed women I mentioned above did create multiple accounts, they'd probably be much better at hiding themselves and getting away with it! As I've learned on TC, most of them have multiple musical crushes. That would really throw us men off!


Yeah. Women have to be extra-cautious on the net. I can't see too many being DUPS.


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