# Stracciari vs Ruffo



## Tuoksu (Sep 3, 2015)

Two of the greatest baritones (and voices) ever recorded. I know this might be a very tough choice, but who, according to you, is the better baritone and why?


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## nina foresti (Mar 11, 2014)

Ruffo .... because!


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## Tsaraslondon (Nov 7, 2013)

Can I vote for both? So different but both wonderful. 

I think Stracciari possibly has the edge in artistry and musicality, but Ruffo's instrument is magnificent. I really can't decide.


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## Woodduck (Mar 17, 2014)

Stracciari. In general, and in this aria in particular. I like the brilliance in his tone - "a shower of diamonds," Ponselle called it - and there's more chiaroscuro and subtlety in his phrasing. But both singers represent the best of the best, from a time when Italy was flooding the world with the kind of singer that still serves as a measuring stick in 19th-century Italian opera. They exemplify our idea of the "Verdi baritone."


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## The Conte (May 31, 2015)

Ruffo's voice has never been equaled in terms of sheer, solid mass and the weight and heft with which he brings the characters to life is something that must be heard.

Stracciari's was possibly a more beautiful, noble and refined instrument - perhaps he was the better artist?

However, Ruffo says to me personally with his vivid, heart on sleeve interpretations than Stracciari so he gets my vote. (I have to add that I am far less familiar with Stracciari than Ruffo though.)

N.


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## The Conte (May 31, 2015)

However...

I was rather hasty and read the poll as meaning in general rather than voting on the two recordings presented here. I prefer Stracciari out of the examples above and I agree with Woodduck's assessment of his singing. I imagine that Ruffo would be better in some of the more dramatic moments of _Trovatore_ such as the act one trio and the duet with Leonora.

I've just had a look on Amazon and there is very little available in terms of Stracciari. There's a couple of out of print Pearl and Nimbus discs, but nothing much else. Meanwhile I bet the latest disc of "Frilly Heroines" from whichever soprano has the sexiest pout these days is on sale everywhere...

N.


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## Woodduck (Mar 17, 2014)

The Conte said:


> I've just had a look on Amazon and there is very little available in terms of Stracciari. There's a couple of out of print Pearl and Nimbus discs, but nothing much else. Meanwhile I bet the latest disc of "Frilly Heroines" from whichever soprano has the sexiest pout these days is on sale everywhere...


Don't forget Stracciari's more or less complete 1929 _Rigoletto_ and _Barber of Seville,_ both with Dino Borgioli and Mercedes Capsir under Lorenzo Molajoli.


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## The Conte (May 31, 2015)

Woodduck said:


> Don't forget Stracciari's more or less complete 1929 _Rigoletto_ and _Barber of Seville,_ both with Dino Borgioli and Mercedes Capsir under Lorenzo Molajoli.


Neither of which are readily available. 

I'm sure I can find them on YouTube (that will be this week's listening project - along with a Mahler survey).

The Barber also has the superb Baccaloni in!

N.


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## Woodduck (Mar 17, 2014)

The Conte said:


> Neither of which are readily available.
> 
> I'm sure I can find them on YouTube (that will be this week's listening project - along with a Mahler survey).
> 
> ...


Yes, both are on YT.

As an appetizer, here's Stracciari's phenomenal "Largo al factotum." One can only imagine the five-minute ovation and the shouts of "Encore!" that followed it in the opera house. This was one of my first opera recordings as a teenager, and I've been a Stracciari fan ever since. I played it for a very good baritone I knew in college. He was appropriately stunned!

Titta Ruffo's excellent version follows.


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## 89Koechel (Nov 25, 2017)

(… readily available.") - Pristine Classical has just recently added "Barber" to it's long list of reissues - PACO 161 (14 pounds for download). …. BTW, Amazon/England (amazon.co.uk) has the Stracciari "Rigoletto" in 4 forms (including cassette!) for reasonable prices.


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## Revitalized Classics (Oct 31, 2018)

Ruffo as a preference. There's a doleful quality to his voice which is unique.

Ruffo in Andrea Chenier





I find I listen to Ruffo's recordings to their conclusions like I am hooked - even though he can sound gruff, curt, and loud. Other moments he can be the virtuoso.

With Stracciari I admire his skill, and appreciate what he achieves, without usually falling head over heels.

Sometimes when listening for comparison, less familiar music can help: they both sang an aria from Dinorah which caught them near their best form

Stracciari in Dinorah





Ruffo in Dinorah





I'd point to all Stracciari's virtues like his diction, phrasing, focused tone... but I'm probably going to re-listen to Ruffo for that baleful "Dinoraaaah!" and much besides.

The scales tipped by the '20s since in Ruffo's case his phrasing had become less pliant and some of the graces had been scorched away even in such elegant music as the Ernani solo





By that time, it was Stracciari who in all his glory could still manage all the expected graces and approach the ideal





I'd sell the family silver (and possibly a few family members come to that...) to have heard either in the theatre
Best wishes
David


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## 89Koechel (Nov 25, 2017)

Excellent examples, David/Revitalized, and thanks! Yes, there IS a certain, doleful quality to Ruffo, but it's counterbalanced by rock-solid intonation a strength of delivery. Stracciari has a similar strength, of course, but within a different timbre, and characterization. BTW, it's nice how the old acoustical recording process could FAVOR great singers, as the accompanying orchestra (and/or chorus) almost never (if ever) could never overwhelm a singer - actually, their subsidiary role, in effect, helped to ENHANCE the vocal delivery of many singers.


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## 89Koechel (Nov 25, 2017)

So, thanks to Tuoksu for the original thread; there are no LOSERS here (whoever garners the most votes), at all. In fact, us listeners are the winners, as we enjoy great singing of the type that made-up the Golden Age, a century (more or less) ago.


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## nina foresti (Mar 11, 2014)

It truly seems unfair to compare the two. Their sounds and presentations are so different. 
Stracciari has the more classic, precise and beautiful sound and that typical vibrato I so love of the golden age, but Ruffo makes my gut react with his power and drama that I find lacking in Stracciari.
I guess it all depends upon the type of voice one seems to prefer most.
They are both winners of their time (and any time!)


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## Tuoksu (Sep 3, 2015)

The Conte said:


> However...
> 
> I was rather hasty and read the poll as meaning in general rather than voting on the two recordings presented here.
> 
> N.


No actually I meant in general, I only posted the two arias to make the comparison fair.


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## Tuoksu (Sep 3, 2015)

89Koechel said:


> So, thanks to Tuoksu for the original thread; there are no LOSERS here (whoever garners the most votes), at all. In fact, us listeners are the winners, as we enjoy great singing of the type that made-up the Golden Age, a century (more or less) ago.


Thank you too for understanding the purpose of this thread


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## Woodduck (Mar 17, 2014)

89Koechel said:


> BTW, it's nice how the old acoustical recording process could FAVOR great singers, as the accompanying orchestra (and/or chorus) almost never (if ever) could never overwhelm a singer - actually, their subsidiary role, in effect, helped to ENHANCE the vocal delivery of many singers.


The voice is certainly going to be prominent when the singer is standing directly in front of the recording horn and the accompanying instruments are seated somewhere around and behind. Another advantage is the absence of excessive reverberation, an annoyance on some modern recordings; in that way, as well, we feel ourselves in direct contact with the singer. But with regard to capturing the actual timbres of voices it would be hard to say that the acoustic process did most singers any favors.

Low voices - basses, baritones, some tenors - could be reproduced with reasonable fidelity by the acoustic process. We can get a fair idea of the real-life impact of baritones like Stracciari and Ruffo even on their early recordings. Higher, brighter voices, though, most particularly high sopranos, were robbed of so many of their upper overtones that we often have only a poor approximation of how they sounded. Birgit Nilsson, whose timbre was especially brilliant, with prominent upper partials, once made a recording using the acoustic technique, and the record was given to several critics who declared her a no-voice, no-talent singer with no operatic potential! She said that after that experiment she would hesitate to judge singers from the acoustic era on the basis of their recordings.

For a similar experiment, here are three recordings of Stracciari, the first two made in 1906 and 1917 by the acoustic process, and the third an electrical recording from 1927:


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## 89Koechel (Nov 25, 2017)

Very good, nina ... but I might disagree, just a little (".. power and drama that I find lacking in Stracciari."). There are certain excerpts of Stracciari's exceptional recording of "Rigoletto" on YouTube, and THERE you'll find, I think, the drama & power you were looking for ...


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## 89Koechel (Nov 25, 2017)

Also, to all, just a comment or two about Golden Age baritones. Back in 1967 (!) there was an exceptional article in High Fidelity - "A Plain Case for The Golden Age/Why they don't make singers like they used to", by Conrad L. Osborne. Osborne, of course, mentioned Ruffo and Stracciari, even on the scant (number of) LP reissues of the time, but also mentioned OTHER stalwarts from that age. These would include Antonio Magini-Coletti, Domenico Viglione-Borghese, Antonio Scotti, Giuseppe Kaschmann, Mattia Battistini, Mario Ancona, Giuseppe de Luca, Mario Sammarco and Pasquale Amato ...


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## 89Koechel (Nov 25, 2017)

So, to finish, here are some sentences from that article, and that last singer - Amato - "Let me use Amato's immensely rich, soulful and poetic 'Eri tu' ... What impresses most on Amato's records is the extraordinarily full, even scaling, just as meaty at the extremes of the range as in the middle, and the joyous clarity of tone that comes of a truly pure, clean articulation of the vowels. He could turn the tone color to an extreme brightness and brilliance without a trace of thinness, and to a richness and darkness without any sense of weight. The legato never ends - the line extends from the beginning of an aria to its end. Max de Schauensee, a knowledgeable observer and a veteran of live Amato performances, describes the voice as 'very large, round and sonorous with a soaring bell-like quality in its top register,' and this jibes well with what he hear on his records. .... The first section of 'Eri tu' is rendered in a splendidly firm, strong-lined legato, the words crystal-clear; it comes to an end with a decrescendo and portamento down from the top F on 'guisa', a most-expressive turn and acciaccatura on 'primo', and a fermata at the end of the phrase. The cantabile portion is quite straightforward (topped by a thrilling G) until the 'e finita', from which point Amato treats the phrases as sections of a cadenza, rushing headlong down from the F sharp on 'nonsiede che l'odio'; executing a gorgeous mezza-voce fermata and portamento on 'vedovo cor', full of mournfulness; then swelling the top F ('O sperance') from mezzo-forte to ff and breaking it off with a sob; lingering in a beautiful mezza-voce on the turn; then returning to tempo for the final 'd'amor's". The thing is, it works. It does not sound phony, but genuine; not softly indulgent, but manly; not unmusical, but eminently tasteful." ... Well, this is GREAT writing, about great SINGING; I don't think we'll see it's like (in either sense), anymore ... so there it is.


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## Woodduck (Mar 17, 2014)

89Koechel said:


> Also, to all, just a comment or two about Golden Age baritones. Back in 1967 (!) there was an exceptional article in High Fidelity - "A Plain Case for The Golden Age/Why they don't make singers like they used to", by Conrad L. Osborne. Osborne, of course, mentioned Ruffo and Stracciari, even on the scant (number of) LP reissues of the time, but also mentioned OTHER stalwarts from that age. These would include Antonio Magini-Coletti, Domenico Viglione-Borghese, Antonio Scotti, Giuseppe Kaschmann, Mattia Battistini, Mario Ancona, Giuseppe de Luca, Mario Sammarco and Pasquale Amato ...


Delighted that you recall that article! It was formative in my thinking about singers when I was a high-school student discovering music and my own singing voice (which, alas, age has long since stilled). Upon reading Osborne I marched out and bought recordings of Stracciari, Battistini and Amato, and I've been making myself obnoxious to lovers of Sherrill Milnes ever since. :tiphat:


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## 89Koechel (Nov 25, 2017)

Woodduck - Thanks for remembering C L Osborne - he was one of the greatest (with Martin Bookspan, David Hamilton, etc.) of the vocal "assessors", so to speak, of the past, in-print or on-the-air. Sorry 'bout your singing voice; am sure it's better than mine, which I only use, rarely, in the shower (haha). ... BTW, C L O and others of the High Fidelity or Stereo Review days can still be FOUND, from www.americanradiohistory.com ... and it's voluminous catalog of old magazines.


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## Woodduck (Mar 17, 2014)

89Koechel said:


> Woodduck - Thanks for remembering C L Osborne - he was one of the greatest (with Martin Bookspan, David Hamilton, etc.) of the vocal "assessors", so to speak, of the past, in-print or on-the-air. Sorry 'bout your singing voice; am sure it's better than mine, which I only use, rarely, in the shower (haha). ... BTW, C L O and others of the High Fidelity or Stereo Review days can still be FOUND, from www.americanradiohistory.com ... and it's voluminous catalog of old magazines.


Osborne is still writing: http://conradlosborne.com/

I get his blog in my email box and can recommend it. The old boy can be verbose, but I don't mind and suspect you won't either.


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## 89Koechel (Nov 25, 2017)

Great examples of one of the "holes"/shortcomings of acoustic recordings, Woodduck! Yes, we (esp. in a modern age, and the great components of phono cartridges, phono pre-amps, amps, speakers, etc.) shouldn't expect that old, pioneering engineering could cover "all the bases", of vocalisms, up and down the scale. I'd still say that there are SOME of the soprano (high voice) recordings of olden days that MIGHT give a fair approximation of the female voices, of the time. Of course, there were portamentos, swoops, etc. from such as Lilli Lehmann (maybe), and some others … and maybe it's possible (my opinion, probably only) that some of the best soprano and/or HIGH-voiced recordings were to come … from Lotte Lehmann, Flagstad, Traubel, Supervia, Galli-Curci, Ponselle, Frida Leider and so many others, as these ladies usually (maybe not always) recorded in the ELECTRICAL era of engineering.


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## 89Koechel (Nov 25, 2017)

Thanks, also, for that info 'bout C L O/Conrad Osborne. I contacted him, a few years ago, and am GLAD that he's still (verbose or not) one of the best reviewers, that I've ever read.


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