# Classical Zappa



## misterjones

Does Frank Zappa deserve his own discussion thread? Most know him for his avant-garde "pop" music - is that oxymoron? - but he composed more "serious" music his entire life. An fan of Varese and Stravinsky even as a teenager, Zappa used classical motifs in his rock and roll music and wrote small- and large-scale classical compositions that he (and others) conducted and performed.

Some of his better-known compositions were officially released as Orchestral Favorites (1979) - incorporated with great effect into Lather - London Symphony Orchestra I-II (1983 and 1987), Boulez Conducts Zappa: The Perfect Stranger (1984) and The Yellow Shark (1993). I also like (and prefer) his June 6, 1984 concert in Berkeley, California - not officially available - in which he conducted the Berkeley Symphony Orchestra.


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## Crudblud

Actually that's Kent Nagano conduction the Berkeley SO, if I'm not mistaken.

I would also include the 1975 Royce Hall, UCLA concerts, the second of which features an instrumental prototype of Greggery Peccary. Speaking of which, Greggary Peccary is kind of an "electric orchestra" piece.


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## misterjones

Correct, though Zappa can be heard directing the orchestra on Spontaneous Minimalst Composition. I'm not sure if he conducted any of the other pieces.

Some of the Royce Hall music is on Orchestral Favorites (as well as part of Greggary Peccary). If there are more official recordings of Royce Hall I wish they would be released. The unofficial versions aren't very good.


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## Crudblud

I'm something of an audience recording/SBD fanatic when it comes to Zappa, so I don't mind bad sound quality too much, although A/A- concert recordings are always welcome. There's similar prototype Greggery material on the 2007 Wazoo album, coincidentally one of the few releases that legitimises the ZFT's existence.


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## chalkpie

Zappa was so brilliant, its sickening. Great calls so far - also don't underestimate the scores on 200 Motels, some great music there. 

IMO Civilization Phaze III was his magnum opus and one of the greatest creations of the 20th century.


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## chalkpie

Crudblud said:


> I'm something of an audience recording/SBD fanatic when it comes to Zappa, so I don't mind bad sound quality too much, although A/A- concert recordings are always welcome. There's similar prototype Greggery material on the 2007 Wazoo album, coincidentally one of the few releases that legitimises the ZFT's existence.


How great is Occam's razor?! I have heard On the Bus for years, and then to hear this in its original form could bring tears to your eyes. A composition within a composition.


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## misterjones

chalkpie said:


> IMO Civilization Phaze III was his magnum opus and one of the greatest creations of the 20th century.


Love the music, hate the talking. My solution was to edit out the conversations. Now it's a great CD (for me).

The talking on Lumpy Gravy is much more tolerable, so I left it in on that CD.

Zappa often includes songs in his concerts that I find painfully infantile, so it's hard for me to find a complete concert I can add to my collection. I often have to edit out the silly/perverted/sexist stuff. For example, I took the 12 YCDTOSA CDs and trimmed them down to 6. Yes, there was that much painful material on those compilations. But, being optimistic, 6 CDs of choice material remained.


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## chalkpie

misterjones said:


> Does Frank Zappa deserve his own discussion thread? Most know him for his avant-garde "pop" music - is that oxymoron? - but he composed more "serious" music his entire life. An fan of Varese and Stravinsky even as a teenager, Zappa used classical motifs in his rock and roll music and wrote small- and large-scale classical compositions that he (and others) conducted and performed.
> 
> Some of his better-known compositions were officially released as Orchestral Favorites (1979) - incorporated with great effect into Lather - London Symphony Orchestra I-II (1983 and 1987), Boulez Conducts Zappa: The Perfect Stranger (1984) and The Yellow Shark (1993). I also like (and prefer) his June 6, 1984 concert in Berkeley, California - not officially available - in which he conducted the Berkeley Symphony Orchestra.


Where does one hear the Berkeley 1984 concert?


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## brotagonist

misterjones said:


> Zappa often includes songs in his concerts that I find painfully infantile...


Frank was a great rock guitarist, but the goofy satire wears thin rapidly. I feel that his 'classical' music has a better prognosis for longevity than does his rock music. Unfortunately, even there, it is not always possible to avoid the silliness completely, eg., _The Yellow Shark_. I like _The Perfect Stranger_. I am intrigued by the Kent Nagano/LSO albums, which have recently been reissued in one package, but I don't know if they would really be worth having, as I haven't been able to listen to them.


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## Neo Romanza

I'm about to embark on a Zappa-a-thon. I haven't listened to any of Zappa's music in years, so what do all you Zappa-heads suggest I listen to first?

Please note: I own almost all of Zappa's recordings including some rarities that I haven't seen reissued and remain OOP.


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## brotagonist

Freak Out
Absolutely Free
We're Only In It For The Money
Cruising With Ruben And The Jets
Hot Rats
Weasels Ripped My Flesh
Waka/Jawaka
Grand Wazoo
Over-Nite Sensation
Apostrophe
The Perfect Stranger

Somewhere around 1978, I started to feel that his humour and weirdness were getting to be a turn-off.


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## Crudblud

I would personally opt for _Läther_ as a first listen, whether you're starting fresh or coming back after a long absence there's no other album in his body of work that draws you into that world quite so effectively.


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