# classical composer on drugs?



## deprofundis (Apr 25, 2014)

Ockay let make it clear from the start im not a drughead apologist, but sometime i smoke and lisen to classical, since i have somesort of asian intolerance to alcohol( all do im white).

But im not a potheads or anything?

It's just some classic interresting when your stone, but if you are a mormon or a straigh edge i respect your point of view.

But im not into hard drug, but i beleive sometime drug can bring creativity even genieous.What is your view on this.Imagine if frank zappa never smoke is like his music would have sound like hottie and the blowfish(well perhaps, i made a joke).

This subject is hudge, i bet some classical composer were into opium or hashchich, let talk about this issue shawll we, an *if your Under 18 or 21 your VERBOTEN to read this post, i dont wont to be a bad exemple for the youth*.

Some classic i preffer to enjoy sober like Debussy i dont know why its like this, some music actually better sober .

Please guys dont be judgemental about it and have a nice day :tiphat:

P.s i bet Vivier and Scelsi took lsd or shroom to compose some of there works(well perhaps so).


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## Triplets (Sep 4, 2014)

Berlioz seemed to have a familiarity with Opium, which was legal in his day.


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## Giordano (Aug 10, 2014)

As far as I know, great composers need(ed) no drugs to get high.


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## TurnaboutVox (Sep 22, 2013)

Well, I certainly like to relax in front of the speakers with some good red wine or malt whisky (my closest analogue to that which you're suggesting). I'm also quite keen to listen to music stone cold sober. It's just different; you listen in different states of mind, you hear different things, you feel different feelings and different things come to mind.

I think the principal effect would be to alter your mind state so that you're more or less aware of certain perceptions and apperceptions (the 'inner' equivalent), creating different associations, images, sounds and meanings (etc.), perhaps. Not much use in many jobs, but in the process of artistic creation I could imagine so, potentially yes. However, there have been many people who have tried this only to find when they regained some capacity for rational judgement, that what they have created isn't a work of genious.

Some artists clearly are or were alcoholics but addicts get (biochemically and psychologically) tolerant to the effects of the drug and I suspect they create in spite of their 'condition' rather than being aided in their work by it.

I'd have to be quite drunk to put any attempt of mine at artistic creation before any sort of public, actually!

Good luck with this, by the way:  (MS, stop reading this at once!)


> Originally posted by *deprofundis*
> 
> ...if your Under 18 or 21 your VERBOTEN to read this post, i dont wont to be a bad exemple for the youth


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## Schubussy (Nov 2, 2012)

I read somewhere that Debussy had smoked opium, though I don't know how true this is. There was definitely some going around France at the time.

I find symphonies and such a bit too intense to listen to high. Occasionally I'll put on a sonata or some chamber music but I'm more likely to be playing a Spacemen 3 album 

Frank Zappa was actually very anti-drug by the way.


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## tdc (Jan 17, 2011)

Giordano said:


> As far as I know, great composers need(ed) no drugs to get high.


I'm pretty sure that a lot of the great composers tried some drugs. According to Sir John Eliot Gardiner in his documentary J.S. Bach was at the very least a user of caffeine, nicotine and alcohol.


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## starthrower (Dec 11, 2010)

Hey, can I start the transgender, cross-dressing composers thread next?


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## GGluek (Dec 11, 2011)

Other than Coleridge's "Kubla Khan" I am unaware of any significant work of art being created while under the influence of drugs -- although an altered start of consciousness has been shown to make many people overvalue the significance of what they are creating at the time. .


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## Figleaf (Jun 10, 2014)

That's Ernest Reyer in the Album Mariani. Vin Mariani was a proprietary mixture of wine and cocaine which was developed in the nineteenth century to help ease singers' sore throats. The company produced a book of endorsements of the wine by famous musicians of the day, which was a virtual Who's Who of the operatic world, with potted biographies and beautiful engraved portraits of the stars. I don't know whether they all drank the stuff, or just did it for the cash or the publicity.

Re drugs: the fin de siecle was of course more tolerant of self medication than governments and mainstream media (if not society as a whole) are today: the whole moral panic over drug use seems not to help the cause of abstinence much, a point made by de Quincey a long time ago.


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## Mandryka (Feb 22, 2013)

Cortot smoked heroin I believe. This shows in quite a few of his recorded performances, try the Chopin nocturne op 27/1 and the second recording he made of Schumann's Symphonic Etudes. In my opinion you can hear a similar style sometimes from Pletnev, in Chopin especially. 

André Isoir's recording of Art of Fugue also seems very trippy to me.

Sometimes I feel the same about Arrau, in Schubert D959/2. At any rate, it goes deep into hallucinatory states of mind. And same for Horowitz - there's a Kreisleriana from Carnegie Hall, 24 Nov 1968, which is so crazy he must have be stoned. 

Gulda and Samson Francois both used drugs for fun, but I don't believe their music making is positively effected by the experience.


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## Weston (Jul 11, 2008)

GGluek said:


> Other than Coleridge's "Kubla Khan" I am unaware of any significant work of art being created while under the influence of drugs -- although an altered start of consciousness has been shown to make many people overvalue the significance of what they are creating at the time. .


That would be true of cannabis I think. Based on my experiences in college, cannabis makes music and everything else, seem unimaginably more profound. And I would think creating art under its influence would be turning off important critical thinking. (Actually when it comes to painting, I could probably use turning off that little critic in my head, but those days are many decades gone.)

However other drugs would have different effects. We can't lump them all together as just "drugs." Look at The Beatles and their hallucinogen experiments. I think this had a huge impact on their music.


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## Albert7 (Nov 16, 2014)

Weston said:


> That would be true of cannabis I think. Based on my experiences in college, cannabis makes music and everything else, seem unimaginably more profound. And I would think creating art under its influence would be turning off important critical thinking. (Actually when it comes to painting, I could probably use turning off that little critic in my head, but those days are many decades gone.)
> 
> However other drugs would have different effects. We can't lump them all together as just "drugs." Look at The Beatles and their hallucinogen experiments. I think this had a huge impact on their music.


And the "White Album" resulted. One of the grandest experiments in music history created under the influence.


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## isorhythm (Jan 2, 2015)

Terry Riley has said in interviews that his music was influenced by his experiences with LSD. I'm sure he wasn't the only one working at that time.

Cannabis is always great for listening, of course.


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## Simon Moon (Oct 10, 2013)

A quick google search turned up the following list of composers and the drugs they used as inspiration:

Andre Previn - LSD
Terry Riley - peyote, LSD, mushrooms
Berlioz - opium
La Monte Young - various hallucinogens, cannabis 
Shostakovitch - opium (might have been to relieve TB)
John Cage - psylocibin mushrooms
John Corigliano - various hallucinogens
John Adams - LSD
Philip Glass - LSD
William Bolcom - LSD

Opium was very popular among the artistic elite in Western Europe in the Romantic period, so the chances that other composers beside Berlioz used it are pretty good.


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## ahammel (Oct 10, 2012)

Simon Moon said:


> John Cage - psylocibin mushrooms


Ah, but did he ingest them, or just collect them?


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## Simon Moon (Oct 10, 2013)

ahammel said:


> Ah, but did he ingest them, or just collect them?


What would you think? 

Arnold Schoenberg - opium


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## Albert7 (Nov 16, 2014)

I know that for orchestra players I heard that cocaine was the choice drug during the Reagan era. But then again it reads more like Bret Easton Ellis novel here.


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## brotagonist (Jul 11, 2013)

Users of substances, whether licit (alcohol, tobacco), controlled (prescription and over-the-counter drugs) or illicit, commonly seek to justify their own use by citing the great works of art and heroic deeds of other users.


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## Simon Moon (Oct 10, 2013)

albertfallickwang said:


> I know that for orchestra players I heard that cocaine was the choice drug during the Reagan era. But then again it reads more like Bret Easton Ellis novel here.


I read that they take beta-blockers to cut down on anxiety and steady their hands.

According to these articles, as far back as 1987 it was 1-in-4 orchestra members took them. It is more now.

http://www.wqxr.org/#!/story/312920-musicians-use-beta-blockers-relieve-stage-fright/

http://www.nytimes.com/2004/10/17/arts/music/17tind.html?pagewanted=all&_r=0


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## ahammel (Oct 10, 2012)

Beta blockers are not a recreational drug, though.


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## Simon Moon (Oct 10, 2013)

ahammel said:


> Beta blockers are not a recreational drug, though.


I know.

I was just responding to the post about the drug of choice for orchestra players.

I guess it was more of an off topic observation.


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## Albert7 (Nov 16, 2014)

This book indicates a lot of drug use in orchestras perhaps?


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## Figleaf (Jun 10, 2014)

albertfallickwang said:


> I know that for orchestra players I heard that cocaine was the choice drug during the Reagan era. But then again it reads more like Bret Easton Ellis novel here.


I wonder if that was a class thing rather than a music thing. When I was at university in the mid-late 90s, cocaine was the exotic, prestigious drug of the old Etonians and their coterie. Regular people smoked pot, and only religious fundamentalists and weirdos like me stayed clean and sober. (I'm already intellectually challenged and paranoid enough, thank you, why would I need a drug that makes me even worse? )


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## Albert7 (Nov 16, 2014)

My only drugs are coffee, alcohol and ITunes.


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## Mahlerian (Nov 27, 2012)

Simon Moon said:


> Arnold Schoenberg - opium


This was in the period after his first wife died. Despite their marital problems, he continued to stick with her. When she died in 1923, it was a time of great change for Schoenberg, as he had just created the first pieces using the 12-tone method. After the death of his wife, he worked on a "Requiem" text which he had set aside after beginning it in 1920. He never set it to music.

He remarried the next year, and he was happier than ever before with his new young wife (who ended up writing the libretto for his one-act opera Von Heute auf Morgen), until anti-Semitism forced him out of his lifetime appointment in Berlin and he left to eventually settle in the US.

Anyway, the point is that he wasn't composing under the influence of opioids, but rather took them at a difficult time in his life.


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## papsrus (Oct 7, 2014)

albertfallickwang said:


> I know that for orchestra players I heard that *cocaine was the choice drug during the Reagan era.* But then again it reads more like Bret Easton Ellis novel here.


For orchestra players and virtually everyone else, during the Reagan era.


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## Weston (Jul 11, 2008)

ahammel said:


> Ah, but did he ingest them, or just collect them?


Or as I used to say, "I tried acid in college, but I didn't inhale."


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## tdc (Jan 17, 2011)

I read somewhere that while Beethoven was composing his late works he was ingesting massive amounts of sugar (in chocolate, I think?). Now this might not be thought of as a drug to a lot of people, however I believe refined sugar is a drug and I have no doubt this kind of thing would influence his compositional process and the compositions themselves.

Drugs are drugs. Alcohol was commonly consumed by a large percentage of composers and it is every bit as damaging and intoxicating as things like marijuana and cocaine. 

I don't say these things to encourage the use of drugs. I don't believe they are necessary for creativity. I think in general drugs do a lot more harm than good, and in the long term ruin creativity. I'm just pointing out facts.


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## GreenMamba (Oct 14, 2012)

tdc said:


> Drugs are drugs. Alcohol was commonly consumed by a large percentage of composers and it is every bit as damaging and intoxicating as things like marijuana and cocaine.


But they don't have the same effect on the brain. In the context of talking about music composition, sugar and LSD are radically different things.


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## KenOC (Mar 7, 2011)

In the early days of acid, LSD was often bought as a drop of the dissolved chemical dripped onto a sugar cube. An obvious connection, I'd say! Did Beethoven, perhaps unknowingly, drop a cube or two into his 60-bean coffee? Musicologists everywhere are asking.


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## violadude (May 2, 2011)

Weston said:


> That would be true of cannabis I think. Based on my experiences in college, cannabis makes music and everything else, seem unimaginably more profound. And I would think creating art under its influence would be turning off important critical thinking. (Actually when it comes to painting, I could probably use turning off that little critic in my head, but those days are many decades gone.)
> 
> However other drugs would have different effects. We can't lump them all together as just "drugs." Look at The Beatles and their hallucinogen experiments. I think this had a huge impact on their music.


Interesting thought. I'll compose something while high sometime this week and report back my experience.

As for listening to music on marijuana, I find the music stimulates my imagination more, but dulls my ability to follow the logic part of the piece. So I think being high while listening to music is good for hearing textures, hearing many layers of the music going on and for the heightened emotional response it may bring, but bad if you want to figure out the form or look for thematic development or something like that.


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## 20centrfuge (Apr 13, 2007)

John Adam's work "Grand Pianola Music" was based on a drug induced hallucination.


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## Mahlerian (Nov 27, 2012)

violadude said:


> Interesting thought. I'll compose something while high sometime this week and report back my experience.


Be sure to take a look/listen afterwards when you're sober. :lol:


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## tdc (Jan 17, 2011)

GreenMamba said:


> But they don't have the same effect on the brain. In the context of talking about music composition, sugar and LSD are radically different things.


LSD is certainly radically different in terms of its effect on our sense of perception, as a result it can lead to some interesting and unique insights. However it is certainly not the only drug that is used as a creative aid. I think drugs such as caffeine and sugar are more commonly used for this purpose - even if many don't consciously realize it.

*edit *- a lot of street LSD is synthetic and laced with poison (strychnine), so definitely not something I would recommend using.


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## ahammel (Oct 10, 2012)

tdc said:


> LSD is certainly radically different in terms of its effect on our sense of perception, as a result it can lead to some interesting and unique insights. However it is certainly not the only drug that is used as a creative aid. I think stimulants such as caffeine and sugar are more commonly used for this purpose - even if many don't consciously realize it.


Sugar is not a stimulant.


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## Guest (Feb 8, 2015)

brotagonist said:


> Users of substances, whether licit (alcohol, tobacco), controlled (prescription and over-the-counter drugs) or illicit, commonly seek to justify their own use by citing the great works of art and heroic deeds of other users.


I know exactly what you mean, but I certainly hope none of the kind folk here that I quite enjoy are guilty of such fallacious reasoning. Drugs are scary stuff. This message comes not only from a wide array of hearsay, data, etc, but from personal experience and experiences with close friends.

Perhaps the best friend I have remaining was a heroine addict in his past life. Some things can never be the same. And for that reason, I always hesitate to call him my best friend.

(And of course there's no need to mention my own near-death experience. Oops, I suppose that counts as a mention. But no more will be needed.)


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## tdc (Jan 17, 2011)

ahammel said:


> Sugar is not a stimulant.


Sorry, you are right. Due to its addictive properties I still consider it a drug though. Post fixed.


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## Mandryka (Feb 22, 2013)

tdc said:


> LSD is certainly radically different in terms of its effect on our sense of perception, as a result it can lead to some interesting and unique insights. However it is certainly not the only drug that is used as a creative aid. I think drugs such as caffeine and sugar are more commonly used for this purpose - even if many don't consciously realize it.
> 
> *edit *- a lot of street LSD is synthetic and laced with poison (strychnine), so definitely not something I would recommend using.


Why would anyone cut LSD with strychnine?


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## tdc (Jan 17, 2011)

Mandryka said:


> Why would anyone cut LSD with strychnine?


I'm not a chemist but this is what I've heard - when it is made synthetically the effects do not last long, so it is cut with a small amount of strychnine which basically knocks a person's liver out of commission for around 9 hours which allows the drugs effects to last longer.


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## PetrB (Feb 28, 2012)

20centrfuge said:


> John Adam's work "Grand Pianola Music" was based on a drug induced hallucination.


If dreams be a drug, then you're correct. If dreams are not a drug, you be dead wrong.


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## KRoad (Jun 1, 2012)

My experience as musician with three released albums under my belt is that, certainly in the case of cannabis, creative possibilities are without question enhanced. When noodling, I'll hit the record button to capture what's running through my musical imagination at the time, then I'll come back the next morning, hit the play button and often think - hey, that's really not too bad. What I discover is, I have approached an idea from an angle melodically or harmonically that, straight, I would not have arrived at otherwise. In terms of actual performance though (other than vocal delivery perhaps) the effect is generally not so positive.

But it all comes at a cost. After a while, I discovered that I didn't want to approach a writing or recording session without being high i.e. it was in my case, psychologically addictive. Listening, writing, playing, etc, was, without being high, a diminished, rather dull and uninspired experience by comparison.

So that's my two cents on the subject. I prefer now to be straight in all but my listening to the final, retail-ready product. I can't say I don't miss it though...


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## PetrB (Feb 28, 2012)

One way or t'other, the basic effect of any drug is the temporary turn-off / suspension of critical thinking and judgement. This is at least true for all those drugs classed as depressants, euphorics, but excludes the stimulants such as amphetamine, etc. (Reminding any who think it not, alcohol is a drug.)

That critical faculty out to lunch, the person so drug-affected is in that sometimes desired now-ness of the moment, and if listening to music, 'just hears' without so much interference from that thinking critical quarter.

As far as creativity being enhanced, that is a big relative bunch of hooey, _but_ for that factor again of the critical judgment area being dulled or quieted. From that perspective, the person in the midst of creating has 'less interference' from the "what do I think / how good is this really" area and is forced, in a way, to rely more upon their intuition without judging the work at hand. The down side is equal and equally possible, without the critical discerning factor, the maker could think what they are making is amazingly good, only to find out when they are 'sober' that what they made was really lame to bad 

Of course, the same state can be reached any number of ways, one of the most basic is working when you are tired enough that that left brain function gets ignored, and again, reliance upon the right brain intuitive intelligence takes over. This state is what prompts many to believe 'I am more creative while on drug ______." Yes, no, the fact is the drug did not make anyone more creative, just stilled that part of the brain which can be far too busy to 'get to work' in the area of inventive tasks.

The hallucinogens are in their own category, and there is less a firm verdict there. "Tripping," mechanically, is a massive hit which blows out a number of brain-cells, the trip itself is the damaged brain in emergency mode re-wiring itself. This can and does make for conscious realizations, various parts rapidly connecting which were more functioning apart prior the repair. I would imagine in the middle of this drugged effect, not much worthwhile work could be done, with the critical faculty out to lunch as well as the brain scrambling to repair itself, but if any 'new thoughts' or other realizations are remembered, they _may_ be of later use.

Meditation, 'thinking of nothing,' 'clearing your mind' are all rather innately difficult for most westerners, yet if done successfully get a person to very much the same place, without the slowed mind, or the liver damage. Ditto for going at something until you are "too tired to think."

More practiced composers know full well that a deadline eliminates the luxury of time to think about 'how many ways and how many choices there are' in writing a piece, or each measure of a piece, and there too, the time constriction near to forces the artist to 'go with the first hunch' -- which is of course the intuition, not the intellect.

Any of these states where you pay less attention to the critical judging brain activity and become more reliant or trusting of the intuitive powers could fall under that pat phrase, "Getting out of your own way."


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## Weston (Jul 11, 2008)

PetrB said:


> . . . "Tripping," mechanically, is a massive hit which blows out a number of brain-cells, the trip itself is the damaged brain in emergency mode re-wiring itself.


I've found no evidence to back this claim. It appears to me the chemical reactions of the dopamine and serotonin receptors are temporarily altered, though I can't pretend to understand the complex jargon I just read in Wikipedia. The trouble with claims like this is that there has been so much propaganda from both sides of the drug argument.

Those who are starting to think I'm falling on the pro-drug side of things, I'm not. I'm merely against arresting people and ruining their lives for wanting to experiment with it. For my part, I did my own experiments back in the 70s, found no creative enhancement whatsoever and got quickly bored with the whole thing. But I don't regret the experiment.

I'll stop there as I am at the risk of going off topic and getting moved to one of the political threads.


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## Guest (Feb 8, 2015)

Weston said:


> I'm merely against arresting people and ruining their lives for wanting to experiment with it.


Yes, yes, let them ruin their own lives


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## isorhythm (Jan 2, 2015)

I don't want to get in an argument about drugs, as I'm not a huge advocate for drugs or anything, but there is no evidence that LSD or other psychedelic drugs have any structural effects on the brain or kill any brain cells or anything like that. How exactly they produce their effects is not known. We know that they bind to one particular kind of serotonin receptor but our knowledge of how the brain works is primitive at this point.

As for enhancing creativity, I doubt it's possible for most people to create anything while actually tripping, but what happens later is less clear and there is some evidence that it might boost creativity or problem-solving. There is interesting research on this from the 50s and 60s before it was made illegal. Research on psychedelics has also started to pick up in the last couple years again, but for treating depression and PTSD.

Listening stoned has certainly helped me "get" certain things about some music, and that effect continues after I'm sober. A lot of people have that experience. I'd say violadude is right that it diminishes one's ability to follow long-term structures, though. I suppose "turning off critical thinking and judgment," of a certain kind, is what it does, but I don't see that as a bad thing. Critical thinking and judgment can be a real drag sometimes, in music as in everything else.

But all in moderation.


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## Avey (Mar 5, 2013)

deprofundis said:


> Ockay let make it clear from the start im not a drughead apologist, but sometime i smoke and lisen to classical, since i have somesort of asian intolerance to alcohol( all do im white).
> 
> But im not a potheads or anything?


Is that a question? I cannot say either way, but I can say that I am fairly confident you were on something when you wrote this Post. It is almost indecipherable.


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## Guest (Feb 8, 2015)

starthrower said:


> Hey, can I start the transgender, cross-dressing composers thread next?


Only if they do drugs, too.


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## Simon Moon (Oct 10, 2013)

tdc said:


> I'm not a chemist but this is what I've heard - when it is made synthetically the effects do not last long, so it is cut with a small amount of strychnine which basically knocks a person's liver out of commission for around 9 hours which allows the drugs effects to last longer.


Sorry to necropost, but I _hate_ misconceptions concerning psychedelics.

Strychnine being found in LSD is a myth. It has never been found in any sample of street drugs.

The following text was written by Alexander T. Shulgin, Ph. D., in response to the overwhelming misconception that strychnine is commonly found in street samples of LSD:

Alexander Shulgin, Ph.D - "The observation of strychnine as being present in any street drug, as a by-product, or a contaminant, or an impurity has never been documented. It is a natural plant product, as are the ergots which are used in the synthesis of LSD. But they come from totally unrelated plants; there has never been a report of strychnine and an ergot alkaloid co-existing in a single species. So if the two materials are together in a drug sample, it could only be by the hand of man. I have personally looked a large number of illicit street offerings and have never detected the presence of strychnine. *The few times that I have indeed found it present, have been in legal exhibits where it usually occurred in admixture with brucine (also from the plant Strychnos nux-vomica) in criminal cases involving attempted or successful poisoning*."

Shulgin's note that he has analyzed many samples of LSD and never found strychnine is *backed up by published analyses done by PharmChem and the LA County Street Drug Analysis program, which likewise never found any strychnine*.

Not to mention, that the amount of strychnine necessary to cause poisoning is way more that would or could be present on or in any dose of LSD. Even if a blotter paper holding a dose was made entirely of strychnine, no poisoning would occur.


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## Dedalus (Jun 27, 2014)

I'd also like to address the idea that "drugs are drugs" and you can just lump them all together into a single category. The fact is that there are many drugs all with very radically different properties, effects, and dangers. The term "drug" is so vague that it's almost useless. A common analogy is that of "sports". Things like Football and Tennis are sports, but so is ice fishing, cycling, and golf. Some sports are similar, but others are so different from each other it's almost curious that we refer to them by the same word. The word "drug" is the same way.


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## hpowders (Dec 23, 2013)

I believe Berlioz' Symphonie Fantastique was composed on a "drug trip".


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## tdc (Jan 17, 2011)

Simon Moon said:


> Sorry to necropost, but I _hate_ misconceptions concerning psychedelics.
> 
> Strychnine being found in LSD is a myth. It has never been found in any sample of street drugs.
> 
> ...


Yeah, I don't know, you might be right. I'm just going by what I've heard from a couple of different people. One thing I've observed is that the quality of street LSD varies a lot, so it would make sense that it is not all made in the same way, or "pure" LSD.


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## Albert7 (Nov 16, 2014)

Quick question: better to have the composer on drugs or the listener?


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## Couac Addict (Oct 16, 2013)

Not sure how much it's going to help the composer...unless you're in Pink Floyd. In which case, just play Em and A until the mescaline kicks in.


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## Albert7 (Nov 16, 2014)

And astonishingly I wouldn't be surprised if avant-garde composers didn't take any drugs but all that complex reasoning skills would be out the window trying to compose those type of works.


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## Gaspard de la Nuit (Oct 20, 2014)

I know Wagner was an opiates late in his life but it was for health reasons.


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## Albert7 (Nov 16, 2014)

Gaspard de la Nuit said:


> I know Wagner was an opiates late in his life but it was for health reasons.


We could start a composers on medications thread then soon.


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## Couac Addict (Oct 16, 2013)

Gaspard de la Nuit said:


> I know Wagner was an opiates late in his life but it was for health reasons.


"....es ist für meine Glaukom" - Wagner (1850).


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## Kivimees (Feb 16, 2013)

Couac Addict said:


> "....es ist für meine Glaukom" - Wagner (1850).


"...für mein Glaukom" :tiphat:


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## joen_cph (Jan 17, 2010)

The title of *Lyapunov*´s symphonic poem for orchestra, "Hashish", does naturally raise a few eyebrows, including in the MusicWeb review:

"_In a world where most political leaders (with the honourable exception of Barack Obama) deny ever inhaling, I wonder if it's political correctness that has inhibited more performances or recordings of Lypunov's "oriental symphonic poem" Hashish? It cannot be that the music is thought to lack interest. Reminiscent quite often of Scheherazade (at around the 10:00 mark you'd swear that you were listening to a discarded page from The young prince and the young princess), its somewhat episodic form clearly reflects Lyapunov's intention to depict the random images produced by a drug-induced dream. I enjoyed this (for me) new discovery a great deal, especially in Svetlanov's fervently idiomatic performance."_
Read more: http://www.musicweb-international.com/classrev/2008/Oct08/Balakirev_svet040061.htm#ixzz3TQKJn1wk

I´m not able to read the Russian liner notes of my LP version, but it would be interesting if anyone had the programme of the piece - maybe the name is not really related to the drug.

Also worth mentioning is *Jaroslav Jezek*´s "Opium - Chinese Intermezzo" - he´s a very interesting composer who worked both with jazz music and classical pieces of good quality, a sort of Czech Kurt Weill.


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## Dedalus (Jun 27, 2014)

albertfallickwang said:


> And astonishingly I wouldn't be surprised if avant-garde composers didn't take any drugs but all that complex reasoning skills would be out the window trying to compose those type of works.


Not all drugs would throw complex reasoning skills out the window. Drugs like Adderall and Focalin are used by students for studying, essay writing, and test taking all the time specifically because they increase concentration and even reasoning skills. Once again, I'm adamant that not all drugs can be treated the same. There are just too many of them, and their effects are too varied to paint them all with the same brush.


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## Albert7 (Nov 16, 2014)

Dedalus said:


> Not all drugs would throw complex reasoning skills out the window. Drugs like Adderall and Focalin are used by students for studying, essay writing, and test taking all the time specifically because they increase concentration and even reasoning skills. Once again, I'm adamant that not all drugs can be treated the same. There are just too many of them, and their effects are too varied to paint them all with the same brush.


That is true. I forgot about Adderol.


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