# Which Sibelius Symphony Do You Listen To Most Often?



## ArtMusic (Jan 5, 2013)

Sibelius wrote about eight symphonies although they are not all complete, most are. Which ones do you listen to most often? These were mostly composed between a thirty year period from the start of the 20th century. It was quite a competitive time for symphonies at around that time, with Mahler also busy writing/have completed his epic symphonies but Sibelius managed his own.


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## ArtMusic (Jan 5, 2013)

I think his first symphony remains his most original compared to the others notwithstanding no.8 is fragmentary. It was completed just before the start of the 20th century when he was thirty-three years old and still abiding the rich, warm and tonal qualities of Romanticism.


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## ArtMusic (Jan 5, 2013)

Symphony no.3 continues with that warm tradition:


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## Manxfeeder (Oct 19, 2010)

I listen to the 2nd the most for no particular reason, probably because that's the one I have a score for, and it's all marked up.


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## Barbebleu (May 17, 2015)

I’m just astonished that no one has voted for the eighth . I personally would pay good money for a cd of it.


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## ArtMusic (Jan 5, 2013)

Barbebleu said:


> I'm just astonished that no one has voted for the eighth . I personally would pay good money for a cd of it.


Only in sketch form:


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## ORigel (May 7, 2020)

I listen to the Third most often. I also listen to the Fourth a fair bit.

The symphony I listen to the least often is probably the First.


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## mbhaub (Dec 2, 2016)

It used to be the 2nd - it's by far the most popular. But the achingly beautiful second movement of the First became an ear worm that I love to pieces. The intro to the first...the coda of the finale. So many great moments. I've played 1, 2, 3 and 5 and getting so close to the First clinched it.


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## Xisten267 (Sep 2, 2018)

I tend to hear the first two and the fourth more than the others, what is curious because they aren't necessarily my favorites.


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## Barbebleu (May 17, 2015)

Hardly a symphony though. Three minutes of music? Really?

See posts #6 & 8.


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## bz3 (Oct 15, 2015)

Probably the 6th, but I listen to all of them about the same amount except for the 4th (it being my least favorite of the lot). 7th no doubt would be my favorite, however.


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## Heck148 (Oct 27, 2016)

1 or 5 ...about a toss-up
Played them both, and love them even more..Sibelius wrote excellent bassoon parts...played #2 many times, also 3 and 7....


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## BeatriceB (May 3, 2021)

None, his symphonies are boring.


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## Richannes Wrahms (Jan 6, 2014)

I listen to the first movement of No. 6 most often and then the whole of the 5th. 

Here's why the others didn't make it:

1st and 2nd: too much Tchaikovsky / Heavy Romanticism 
3rd: too easy
4th: too much Wagner
7th: too little material


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## tdc (Jan 17, 2011)

I like 1, 3 and 6 the most. 7 is growing on me. 4 seems a little too angsty to my ears, and it doesn't seem to work with Sibelius style... it is the odd one, and doesn't feel like Sibelius is quite at home in this symphony. 

Symphony's 2 and 5 have timpani parts that annoy me, the use of timpani seems repetitive and abused.


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## Xisten267 (Sep 2, 2018)

BeatriceB said:


> None, his symphonies are boring.


Opinions are opinions, and we all have ours, but, still, perhaps you may reconsider? Sibelius is a astonishing symphonist in my opinion, and he did quite well in the game of symphonies finished here at TC some weeks ago (that started with 400 works of the genre), what suggests that at least some of the other members who participated may agree with me:



Allerius said:


> I really liked this game, and decided to collect some data about it.
> 
> *Total scores of symphonies with at least 50 points overall (considering all rounds)*:*
> 
> ...


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## Art Rock (Nov 28, 2009)

The 4th is my favourite, but I love all 7.


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## ArtMusic (Jan 5, 2013)

Allerius said:


> Opinions are opinions, and we all have ours, but, still, perhaps you may reconsider? Sibelius is a astonishing symphonist in my opinion, and he did quite well in the game of symphonies finished here at TC some weeks ago (that started with 400 works of the genre), what suggests that at least some of the other members who participated may agree with me:


Where is the link to that, I can't seem to find it. Impressive list!


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## Xisten267 (Sep 2, 2018)

ArtMusic said:


> Where is the link to that, I can't seem to find it. Impressive list!


Thanks, it took a lot of work to do. The link can be accessed via the "View Post" icon to the right of my name ("Allerius") in the quoted post (the blue one with two white arrows pointing to the right).

Did you find it?

P.S.: Beethoven counts as having ten symphonies in the game because the "Battle symphony" ("Wellington's Victory") was also considered. It received zero points heh.


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## Brahmsianhorn (Feb 17, 2017)

How can Mahler 9 not be on that list of symphonies? Unless I missed it


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## Art Rock (Nov 28, 2009)

Brahmsianhorn said:


> How can Mahler 9 not be on that list of symphonies? Unless I missed it


That list was compiled based on a series of preliminary rounds with a few of the highest scorers going through to the next rounds and so on, and therefore has some oddities. Mahler 9 IIRC was eliminated relatively early due to severe competition in that particular round (luck of the draw). Also, in games tactics may dictate voting for symphonies you like less than others - as soon as you see that your favourite is not having a chance to qualify, one may switch to a second favourite that has a chance. Bottom line, this list must be seen in the perspective of the games.


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## Ned Low (Jul 29, 2020)

I'll never tire of the 3rd.


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## elgar's ghost (Aug 8, 2010)

I have my favourite(s) like everyone else, but I tend to work my way through the lot. In fact, this is what happens whether it's Sibelius or not - if I have some or all of a composer's symphonies I prefer to listen to them all in order, although obviously not all in one sitting unless there are only, say, two or three.


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## Malx (Jun 18, 2017)

The one I'm listening to at any given time.


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## HerbertNorman (Jan 9, 2020)

Malx said:


> The one I'm listening to at any given time.


Same here :tiphat:


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## Chilham (Jun 18, 2020)

I've laboured through 2 and 5, neither of which made my top-40 symphonies, so I've de-prioritised listening to the rest.


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## EdwardBast (Nov 25, 2013)

Chilham said:


> I've laboured through 2 and 5, neither of which made my top-40 symphonies, so I've de-prioritised listening to the rest.


You picked the wrong two.


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## Chilham (Jun 18, 2020)

EdwardBast said:


> You picked the wrong two.


Why am I surprised? They're the two highest rated by this site. :lol:

7 is my planned Saturday symphony for 03 July. 4, 6 and 3 by the end of the year.


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## janxharris (May 24, 2010)

Chilham said:


> Why am I surprised? They're the two highest rated by this site. :lol:
> 
> 7 is my planned Saturday symphony for 03 July. 4, 6 and 3 by the end of the year.


I always recommend Segerstam and the DNSO...something about the pacing, but it's totally subjective of course. 




A life changing experience for me.


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## joen_cph (Jan 17, 2010)

It's been changing all the time.

Sibelius' "Kullervo" symphony has been a favourite too, and I really like it, such as with Berglund. People should get to know this huge work.


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## MatthewWeflen (Jan 24, 2019)

I find that once I listen to one, I have to listen to the whole cycle. They're all wonderful, and his sound world draws me in completely.


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## starthrower (Dec 11, 2010)

I don't like to get hung up on the favorites thing and get sick of a symphony so I usually listen to them all when I reach for my Sibelius CDs.


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## Cristian Lee (Aug 13, 2017)

Symphony No. 1, the tune from the last movement always get me emotionally.


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## Pat Fairlea (Dec 9, 2015)

I voted for #6, which I probably listen to more than any of the others. Thinking about which one I listen to least, I'm surprised to realise it's probably #2. Nothing against it, it has some wonderful moments, not least the opening. Maybe #2 just flashes its charms around too immodestly, where as #6 and #3, another favourite, are more discreet?


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## Heck148 (Oct 27, 2016)

Cristian Lee said:


> Symphony No. 1, the tune from the last movement always get me emotionally.


It's the same tune as the clarinet opening (mvt I).


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## larold (Jul 20, 2017)

Nos. 4 and 7 followed by 3 and 6. Never 1, 2 or 5.


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## larold (Jul 20, 2017)

_Maybe #2 just flashes its charms around too immodestly, where as #6 and #3, another favourite, are more discreet?_

Sibelius and to lesser extent Richard Strauss were transition composers. There is more meat in Sibelius symphonies Nos. 3 and 6 than No. 2 which is a redo of a romantic symphony as are Nos. 1 and 5. Nos. 3 and 6, as well as 4 and 7, show the way to the modern (though not atonal) era of composers like Honneger, Milhaud, Poulenc in France and Harris, Schuman and Hanson in USA. 21st century English symphonists (about the only place where the symphony is still alive) like Philip Sawyers are still under his influence.

Sibelius was one of the strongest influences in 20th century music and was until the Mahler boomlet occurred considered the greatest symphonist since Beethoven.


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## jim prideaux (May 30, 2013)

Ned Low said:


> I'll never tire of the 3rd.


And neither ( I suspect!) will I......

But my favourite symphony by Sibelius annd indeed by anyone is the 5th.


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## janxharris (May 24, 2010)

larold said:


> _Maybe #2 just flashes its charms around too immodestly, where as #6 and #3, another favourite, are more discreet?_
> 
> Sibelius and to lesser extent Richard Strauss were transition composers. There is more meat in Sibelius symphonies Nos. 3 and 6 than No. 2 which is a redo of a romantic symphony as are Nos. 1 and 5. Nos. 3 and 6, as well as 4 and 7, show the way to the modern (though not atonal) era of composers like Honneger, Milhaud, Poulenc in France and Harris, Schuman and Hanson in USA. 21st century English symphonists (about the only place where the symphony is still alive) like Philip Sawyers are still under his influence.
> 
> Sibelius was one of the strongest influences in 20th century music and was until the Mahler boomlet occurred considered the greatest symphonist since Beethoven.


Though I respect your grouping of the the 5th with the 1st and 2nd and 'romanticism', I can't agree. It maybe that you have a different interpretation of 'romantic'. For me, the 5th is not backward looking at all. The 1st movement bassoon solo with tremulous strings is pretty radical - and the harmony is unusual right from the get-go.


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## Brahmsian Colors (Sep 16, 2016)

Pat Fairlea said:


> I voted for #6, which I probably listen to more than any of the others. Thinking about which one I listen to least....it's probably #2.... Maybe #2 just flashes its charms around too immodestly, where as #6 and #3, another favourite, are more discreet?


I concur with you here on *every* respect. :tiphat:


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## Chilham (Jun 18, 2020)

janxharris said:


> I always recommend Segerstam and the DNSO...something about the pacing, but it's totally subjective of course.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I had twenty minutes and found I had this, so Symphony No. 7:










Loved it


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## Heck148 (Oct 27, 2016)

Just listened to Syms 1 and 3 - Bernstein/NYPO...ah, nothing like it!!

Bernstein's complete Sibelius set with NYPO is unmatched - a long rime favorite, still at the top billing. 
Lenny's approach is well-paced, wonderfully dramatic, and the sound of the NYPO, for me, is perfect for the Finnish master:

powerful brass, long, searing crescendi, hard accents; wonderfully growling, snarling, basses and bassoons - Sibelius loved that low choir!!
Big, brawny, hefty strings - at times perhaps a little rough-hewn [intentionally] - but Sibelius, for me, benefits from that hard-edged, icy, craggy, powerful sound..it can also be very sweet, and cantabile...this music needs the full spectrum...
I give the Finnish orchestras "A" for effort in Sibelius, they definitely play with heart and conviction, but all too often, the string sound is scrawny, scruffy, thin....they're doing their best....but - others are simply better...


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## GraemeG (Jun 30, 2009)

There's not a dud in the pack, although 4 is a very tough nut.


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## Heck148 (Oct 27, 2016)

GraemeG said:


> There's not a dud in the pack, although 4 is a very tough nut.


6 is the misfire for me....I just don't get what he was trying to do.


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## Posauner (Nov 8, 2020)

I'm a bit of a newcomer to Sibelius. 5 was my first introduction to him, and I have come to adore 1, 2, and 3. The 3rd in particular seems to be consistently stuck in my head lately. The 4th is still incomprehensible to me, and I have not yet started studying his later ones.


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## Bruckner Anton (Mar 10, 2016)

2,5,7. BTW, i like ur poll.


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## bz3 (Oct 15, 2015)

Fairly tight vote total for a major symphonist. Most composers seem to have a maximum of 3 that will dominate these sorts of polls. Brahms excepted, I wonder who else would have such close vote totals. Perhaps Mahler, but I'm pretty sure that (without looking) 2, 4, and 9 tend to clean up in his polls.


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## Coach G (Apr 22, 2020)

When I was a teenager, Sibelius 2nd was the one I liked best just because it's so big, noisy, and blustery, like the cold clean air of the great white north. The American composer and critic, Virgil Thomson, really slammed it, though. I think he called it "vulgar". 

Later I came to regard the 4th as the finest of the Sibelius cycle. It's dark but also as tight and very well-crafted and balanced. 

Nowadays, I kind of like the 5th because its the most pastoral.


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## 89Koechel (Nov 25, 2017)

Beethoven, and that "Battle Symphony". Yes, "Wellington's Victory". What a FINE work, with only, maybe, a few recordings. Probably the Morton Gould is the BEST of all.


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## 89Koechel (Nov 25, 2017)

OH, gosh, Posauner ... that Sibelius' 4th Symphony. Yes, it's "craggy", and very-disciplined in it's development of the somewhat-dour framework of the melodic developments, such as they ARE. It opens, with low basses, etc. and almost-never gets to that "state" that Sibelius had, in other, more-beguiling Symphonies ... even the 6th ... in the usual appeal, in certain parts and movements. It's simply straight-through, in a consistent thread, one of the most-original works of the MANY, of the previous Century ... and that's considering Copland, Nielsen, Vaughan-Williams, Stravinsky, Prokofiev, William Walton and others. Just an opinion, of course, but there it is.


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## 89Koechel (Nov 25, 2017)

Hmm, Richannes Wrahms - the 4th has ... "too much Wagner"?! I'd like to know, in what WAY, since the 4th is probably leagues-away from anything that Wagner would compose, in such a context. Could you explain?


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## 89Koechel (Nov 25, 2017)

Anyhoo, and many thanks for the MANY fine posts, and here's a "vote", so to speak, for a certain performance of the 4th. It's the master - George Szell - and his Cleveland Orchestra, in a 1966 performance (at Oberlin), and still one of the best of the many from days and ages, including even Toscanini and Wilhelm Furtwangler (surprise, surprise! ... maybe).


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## jkl (May 4, 2021)

I might start with nos.2 and 7 it looks like they are the favorites. I have not yet explored Sibelius' symphonies.


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## joen_cph (Jan 17, 2010)

jkl said:


> I might start with nos.2 and 7 it looks like they are the favorites. I have not yet explored Sibelius' symphonies.


I'd say the 7th is not that initially easy to grasp. 
1 is, of course. And 3. The 4th is unusually sombre, almost a different world. Kullervo is a catchy, heroic work with choir and vocal soloists.


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## Kreisler jr (Apr 21, 2021)

I am not such an enthusiast as many others but I think that all 7 are worthwhile and as whole both diverse and clearly characteristic of their author. I don't really have a clear favorite; I thought I liked the 3rd less but when I listened to it a few months ago I liked it well enough, it's just a bit different.
(Although some of the often earlier tone poems show a less austere and more romantic side that is not as strong in the symphonies.)

The 2nd used to be or still is the most popular because it is catchy and has a triumphant end. The 1st might be even closer to popular late romantic aesthetics, also quite accessible. The 3rd and 6th seem the most emotionally detached and the least popular. The 4th is the darkest and rather austere (not sumptuously dark like Swan of Tuonela). The 5th is again very popular, a bit like a more "modern" version of an optimistic symphony like the 2nd. The 7th is unique with its one-movement-form and maybe together with the 4th the most modern. (But this is relative; compared to the 1900s-20s Avantgarde Sibelius might be highly individual but he is not as modern sounding to most listeners.)


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## SeptimalTritone (Jul 7, 2014)

89Koechel said:


> Hmm, Richannes Wrahms - the 4th has ... "too much Wagner"?! I'd like to know, in what WAY, since the 4th is probably leagues-away from anything that Wagner would compose, in such a context. Could you explain?


Not to speak for Richannes, but he's probably talking about various Wagner-ism events throughout. I completely agree with you that the trajectory of the 4th symphony is entirely different from the way Wagner would treat his materials, because these events are not like the leitmotifs of operatic characters/settings, but purely symphonic arrival points.

Examples:

Third movement, 



 The wind's sudden chord on top of the unison strings is Tristan-esque. Similar moments occur within the minute.
First movement, 



 Leaping yearning string melody, followed by horn calls over string tremelo, interrupted by sudden trombone chorale, all Ring-like.


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## Barbebleu (May 17, 2015)

I was listening to the 1915 version of the 5th last night. Can’t say I prefer it to the 1919 version but it is well worth hearing.


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## annaw (May 4, 2019)

I think I listen to his 2nd and 5th symphony the most. I particularly love the last movements of both symphonies - they're so idiomatically Romantic.


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## 89Koechel (Nov 25, 2017)

SeptimalTritone - I LIKE your examples, and they're well-chosen - thanks! Yes, that first example, from the 3rd movement DOES resemble Wagner, now that I see a connection - maybe somewhat Parsifal-esque? Sibelius was so purposely-original in this work, which resembles neither the one before (3rd) or the one after (5th), that it almost stands alone, IMO.


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## consuono (Mar 27, 2020)

The 2nd and 5th. I haven't listened to the others very much. At the beginning of that video of the first I got a mental picture of Don Corleone's dark home office, sorry. :lol:


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