# How much do you know about China?



## crazychopin (Dec 16, 2010)

As you know,I am a boy from China and want to make friends with people from all over the world.In the last few years,my country has made great progress in economy.For this reason,more and more people want to get to know about China.And many people worry about the threat of China's development. So,I am here to answer any question from you about my country(if it isn't beyond my knowledge)


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## Art Rock (Nov 28, 2009)

How much do you know about China? More than most people here probably, my wife is Shanghainese, I visited the country about a dozen times (mainly Shanghai, but also Hangzhou, Beijing, Shenyang, Hong Kong, Guilin) and we intend to move to Shanghai in the course of 2012.

That said, good idea for a thread.

How popular is western style classical music by Chinese composers in China? Thinking of obvious examples like the butterfly concerto and the yellow river concerto, but even more compoers like Tai Dun and Bright Sheng. Any recommendations?


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## emiellucifuge (May 26, 2009)

Economic growth sure but at the cost of the enviroment and human rights, whats your opinion on that?


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## Delicious Manager (Jul 16, 2008)

I would agree with emiellucifuge is asking how you reconcile China's startling increase in economic success with its appalling record on human rights and freedoms. And what about poor old Tibet?

And I wonder what you thought of the 2008 Beijing Olympics? Many commentators have accused China of 'cheating' and unfairly influencing the outcome of many events in China's favour.

Finally, I wonder would you think about your country's hysterical reaction to the awarding of the Nobel Peace Prize to Liu Xiaobo?


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## jurianbai (Nov 23, 2008)

well, I do know some stuff about China , being in the SE Asia where a lot of chinese overseas around.

For member emiellucifuge and Delicious Manager , with all respect, I think we should hold on on topic as such, for such a warm and peaceful thread. There is a "face" concept in Chinese (and most Asians), we do not talking 'politic' subject on your first sentence


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## opus55 (Nov 9, 2010)

This thread is bound to get political.. I shall avoid.


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## emiellucifuge (May 26, 2009)

Okay ignoring human rights, how about the enviroment? The huge enviromental damage caused by China as the largest emitter of GHGs, not to mention the hundreds of thousands poisoned by pollutants within china. China is also home to many rare species most notably the tiger and panda - both have suffered in the name of humanities prosperity.


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## Aramis (Mar 1, 2009)

What I know about China... hmmm... isn't that this place when they have factories for producing artificial musicians for large scale?


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## Head_case (Feb 5, 2010)

> What I know about China... hmmm... isn't that this place when they have factories for producing artificial musicians for large scale?


That'll be the baroque factory hidden in the middle of pre-Weimar Republic 



> Okay ignoring human rights, how about the enviroment? The huge enviromental damage caused by China as the largest emitter of GHGs, not to mention the hundreds of thousands poisoned by pollutants within china. China is also home to many rare species most notably the tiger and panda - both have suffered in the name of humanities prosperity.


What's so difficult about the concept of respect Emile? Would you like to talk about Dutch colonialism and massacres; white American subversion of the native Indians; British cruelty overseas in the age of the Empire - or perhaps British hypocrisy in damaging the environment during its own industrial revolution? American hypocrisy in the face of G20 criticism; American consumption and carbon footprints greater per person than equivalent per person in China? The extinction of the dodo due to western greed, or perhaps the buffalo? Or maybe several different species of butterflies and others?

What indeed is wrong with respect? Jurianbai's request was very simple. Is it so hard to just kindly refrain from trolling before Christmas and make a newcomer to the forum welcome?


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## crazychopin (Dec 16, 2010)

to second floor:quite popular
to third floor:I agree with you 
to fourth floor:some part of China become rich earlier.It's typical in many developing ****ries' situation 
Government is afraid of being misunderstanded.Actually not many people in China care about Liu
to sevenh floor:we are trying to solve the problem.But the damage is unavoidable if you need to grow economy
to eighth floor:what do you mean?


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## ulyssestone (Jan 6, 2010)

Not many people care about Liu Xibaobo? How many Chinese have the slightest chance to know his ideas? Try to search Charter 08 in google.cn (now google.com.hk) or baidu.com (biggest search engine in China) to see if you can find any page that is not blocked.

What bores me to death is that our government, and some nationalists always act like China is the only country that takes the moral high ground, and all western countries are in a conspiracy against us blah blah... I pity those people, just like Boxer from Animal Farm, they defend those who rip them off and they defend them spontaneously. Environment must be sacrificed, oh yes, to benefit whom? Ain't the majority of native people in those polluted areas still poor？Have you ever asked them if they want to make the sacrifice?

In a word, "Using uncivilized means cannot achieve civilized ends."

Don't expect respect from foreign countries while your own government does not respect their own people. And don't say China is always being misunderstood, please. If you must, go bragging about how free China really is on Facebook, Twitter, Blogger or Youtube. Unfortunately, our dear government blocked them all.


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## ulyssestone (Jan 6, 2010)

With all due respect, the way you started this thread shows you probably don't know much about your own country.

Do you know how many coal miners died from accidents last year?

2691, if you are going to believe the official number.

Do you know how many migrant laborers lost their fingers from accidents in the factories of Guangdong alone, last year?

30,000. No kidding.

Do you know how many days there's no blue sky in Beijing every year?

I didn't count it, but it feels like at least half of the year there's only smog.

Have you ever heard of the name Zhao Lianhai?

Do your self a fovour to read this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zhao_Lianhai Chopin cannot save your children from poisoned milk.

I can't go on. I'll go on.


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## ulyssestone (Jan 6, 2010)

Regarding Tibet, here's my two cents:

http://www.spotifyclassical.com/2010/05/pavarotti-and-his-pop-star-friends.html


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## crazychopin (Dec 16, 2010)

no one ever deny Chinese government likes to block the news that against China.And we don't get news only from google.cn or baidu ,did you know that?You can't find the related news doesn't mean people in China can't find it.

Let me be clear,I open the thread because I want more people to know about Chinese culture.Chinese culture can represent China most not its politics.
So please stop talking about politics in this thread.If you want to,you can touch me by sending private message


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## ulyssestone (Jan 6, 2010)

I signed Charter 08. The point is most people don't even have the access to Liu's ideas, so saying most people don't care for him is nonsense.

I cannot see there's any Chinese culture left undamaged by CCP. I cannot see any moral, faith or virtue in the modern Chinese society, except for people's extreme respect for their own motives, and the only motive is money. What Mao did was not merely 30 millions people starved to death in peace times, but the destruction of the whole tradition of Chinese culture and moral.

If you are interested in traditional Chinese culture, I advise you to seek for them in Taiwan, Hong Kong, or even Japan. They preserved them much better than we do.


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## ulyssestone (Jan 6, 2010)

crazychopin said:


> no one ever deny Chinese government likes to block the news that against China.


Let me correct you, our government never blocked the news that there are people/countries against China, they planted plenty of those on the papers.

http://www.smh.com.au/opinion/polit...spiracies-delivered-daily-20101217-190pb.html

They only block news that against the dictating of the CCP.


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## Chi_townPhilly (Apr 21, 2007)

crazychopin said:


> *How much do you know about China?*


Not nearly enough, I'm sure.


opus55 said:


> This thread is bound to get political.


I hope not, for the sake of this thread.

The original poster has expressed a wish to steer conversation away from politics. Be assured that I, too, have strong ideas about the politics of the region- but out of respect for the wishes of the topic-starter, I think I'll steer clear of disseminating them here.

A review of my profile-info shows that I admit to a fondness for "racket sports." Consequently, I sort of know my way around the game of Table Tennis (or Ping-Pong, as basement and recreational players would say). That interest has brought me into close contact with more than a few Chinese expats. I feel like I have a better-than-average grasp of Chinese culture... but in reality, if I knew a little more, I'd probably be shocked at how little I know!


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## jhar26 (Jul 6, 2008)

Chi_townPhilly said:


> Not nearly enough, I'm sure.I hope not, for the sake of this thread.
> 
> The original poster has expressed a wish to steer conversation away from politics. Be assured that I, too, have strong ideas about the politics of the region- but out of respect for the wishes of the topic-starter, I think I'll steer clear of disseminating them here.


Besides, if you go through the history of any nation big or small you'd find that they all have done some (and usually many) terrible things and that they all have some skeletons in the closet that make it inappropriate for any of us to take the moral highground in my opinion. We're all human which means that we're all capable of doing good and bad and all those artificial lines we've drawn all over the globe doesn't change that fact.


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## Herkku (Apr 18, 2010)

I know that they are building a modern opera house in Wuxi, near Shanghai, designed by Finnish architects. How popular is the Western opera in China?


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## ulyssestone (Jan 6, 2010)

jhar26 said:


> Besides, if you go through the history of any nation big or small you'd find that they all have done some (and usually many) terrible things and that they all have some skeletons in the closet that make it inappropriate for any of us to take the moral highground in my opinion. We're all human which means that we're all capable of doing good and bad and all those artificial lines we've drawn all over the globe doesn't change that fact.


And that's what exactly makes the holier-than-thou tone in all official Chinese medias laughable. Big Brother never made any mistake. And "we are all sinner" doesn't make the crimes against humanity any more tolerable, especially when the sinner are still busy covering up their fault.

You may choose to avoid politic all you want, but not in a country where politic comes after you. Ture artists, like Furtwangler, create art under all circumstances, because they cannot help to. I doubt any of us is in that league.


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## ulyssestone (Jan 6, 2010)

Herkku said:


> I know that they are building a modern opera house in Wuxi, near Shanghai, designed by Finnish architects. How popular is the Western opera in China?


Certainly there are a few opera enthusiasts in China, we are talking about a country with 1.4 billion people anyway. But to measure the exact popularity is simply impossible. Alex Ross once wrote about classical music in China on the New Yorker, which offers a good overview of the classical music scene here:

http://www.newyorker.com/arts/critics/atlarge/2008/07/07/080707crat_atlarge_ross

In September I saw Don Giovanni by the Cologne Opera in the national theater, the house was only 70% full. The ticket price was reasonable, and decent opera production like that is still relatively rare here.


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## emiellucifuge (May 26, 2009)

I apologise, I misunderstood Jurianbai's request. Talking about all the faults of the western world - I completely agree they are wrong, even with the economic benefits we have received.


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## jhar26 (Jul 6, 2008)

ulyssestone said:


> "we are all sinner" doesn't make the crimes against humanity any more tolerable, especially when the sinner are still busy covering up their fault.


I never said that it did.


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## graaf (Dec 12, 2009)

I thought that our Chinese friend and topic starter might be interested in founding out what are some of the first associations people have about his country, so here are mine (some good, some bad):

- complicated but beautiful writting system
- Confucius, Laozi, Tao
- interesting food (rice and vegetables come to mind)
- cheap labour, low quality products (although getting better)
- forbidden city (also movie "last emperor of china")
- Hong Kong movies
- opium wars
- terracotta army
- zheng he
- communism and Mao
- pagodas
- landscape that I had to consult google for and ended up to be Li river in Guilin

Best regards


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## crazychopin (Dec 16, 2010)

to 19th floor:things are different in Chinese cities.If a famous orchestra come to Beijing or shanghai or other big cities,the tickets will sell out in a day.But most people in Chinese can't appreciate western opera.The old prefer Chinese opera


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## ulyssestone (Jan 6, 2010)

crazychopin said:


> If a famous orchestra come to Beijing or shanghai or other big cities,the tickets will sell out in a day.


I don't know where did you get this but it's simply not true.

Tickets price is often ridiculous. Average monthly income of a Beijinger is 3000-4000 RMB, and a night in the opera costs 200-2000. Most 200 tickets would sold out very soon, but the high priced ones almost never sold. They were given out to officials who often failed to show up. Lots of those high priced tickets went to the black market and were sold at much cheaper price, that's how I normally buy my tickets.

I saw Abbado with Lucerne Festival Orchestra in the national theater, the maestro's first visit of China in 30 years, the house was about 80% full.

An old article, but still worth a read.

http://www.mca.org.au/pdf/summit2010/ContributedPapers/China-the Saviour of Classical Music.pdf


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## crazychopin (Dec 16, 2010)

"black market" I shoud have emphasize the word.Without it,the tickets can't be sell out in a day.And if you want to make a survey, you will know most people sitting in theater in Beijing nowadays get more than 6000RMB a month


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