# Who should be included in "Sombre forêt" competition ?



## BBSVK (10 mo ago)

I would like to see a competition for "Sombre forêt", the aria of Mathilde from Guillaume Tell by Rossini. Who should be there, and, ideally, which recording ? I prefer French. Callas version could be Italian, because it's Callas. For Montserat Caballe - which one ?


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## Francasacchi (7 mo ago)

BBSVK said:


> I would like to see a competition for "Sombre forêt", the aria of Mathilde from Guillaume Tell by Rossini. Who should be there, and, ideally, which recording ? I prefer French. Callas version could be Italian, because it's Callas. For Montserat Caballe - which one ?


Crespin's commercial recording


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## BBSVK (10 mo ago)

Francasacchi said:


> Crespin's commercial recording


Is the aria available online ?


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## Francasacchi (7 mo ago)

Yes. I don't know how to insert link from my phone. It's on youtube. I did a search for Crespin Rossini and it comes up.


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## ColdGenius (9 mo ago)

Studer


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## Otis B. Driftwood (4 mo ago)




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## ALT (Mar 1, 2021)

Regine Crespin





Cheryl Studer - “Selva opaca” (on film)





IMO, this aria, the ensembles, the whole of Tell, is his finest work. Period. I am in the minority on this but I can live happily without hearing a note of Semiramide or Barbiere, to name but two. The mash up that is Viaggio does appeal to me, though. Some other Rossini works have been recommended and I am open to hear them sometime but just haven’t had the time or motivation.


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## Otis B. Driftwood (4 mo ago)

ALT said:


> IMO, this aria, the ensembles, the whole of Tell, is his finest work. Period.


That's certainly a bold statement. It's not among my favorite Rossini, but maybe I just haven't heard a performance that does it justice. Have you listened to both languages and which do you prefer?


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## ALT (Mar 1, 2021)

Otis B. Driftwood said:


> That's certainly a bold statement. It's not among my favorite Rossini, but maybe I just haven't heard a performance that does it justice. Have you listened to both languages and which do you prefer?


About performances doing it full justice, well, it’s a long night with lots of very difficult singing. Then there are the original French and later Italian editions. I am only familiar with the Italian. And then, cuts. Anyway, I believe there is a recording in French with Caballé and Gedda. Others here may be familiar with it and can comment.


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## BBSVK (10 mo ago)

ALT said:


> The mash up that is Viaggio does appeal to me, though.


I love Il Viaggio a Reims ! 
It happened this summer, when they put on youtube both performances from Pesaro, plus my friend kept sharing the concertato with the stars of the past.


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## Aerobat (Dec 31, 2018)

I can't see who's in Otis B's list, as all the videos show 'Not Available'.

May I add Marina Rebeka to provide a modern version?

There's also a performance by Julia Lezhneva on Youtube, but it's a *very* young Lezhneva and possibly before she reached her prime.


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## BBSVK (10 mo ago)

Aerobat said:


> I can't see who's in Otis B's list


Karita Matilla, June Anderson, Montserrat Caballe, Regine Crespin.


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## BBSVK (10 mo ago)

Aerobat said:


> May I add Marina Rebeka to provide a modern version?


Totally, I love her !


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## The Conte (May 31, 2015)

Callas
Caballe
Freni
Studer
Ponselle

Only the Caballe is in French.

N.


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## BBSVK (10 mo ago)

The Conte said:


> Callas
> Caballe
> Freni
> Studer
> ...


Should it be divided into French and Italian group ? Even after that it is way too many for real attentative listening. I admire @Seattleoperafan for doing this regularly.


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## BBSVK (10 mo ago)

I guess I will go for French only.


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## ALT (Mar 1, 2021)

BBSVK said:


> Should it be divided into French and Italian group ? Even after that it is way too many for real attentative listening. I admire @Seattleoperafan for doing this regularly.


Two separate surveys: One French; the other Italian


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## ColdGenius (9 mo ago)

I didn't know Lezhneva did it. I think it was really early in her carrier, lately she set all her sights on barocco. As I know, she might record Rossini arias, but then she didn't take part in stage productions yet.


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## OffPitchNeb (Jun 6, 2016)

A few more

Tebaldi
Frances Alda
Gencer
Cerquetti
Lina Pagliughi
Freni


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## Seattleoperafan (Mar 24, 2013)

BBSVK said:


> Should it be divided into French and Italian group ? Even after that it is way too many for real attentative listening. I admire @Seattleoperafan for doing this regularly.


Are you going to do this on your own? I don't know this aria but I could make one if you prefer if you pick the contestants. Either way is fine with me.


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## BBSVK (10 mo ago)

OffPitchNeb said:


> A few more
> 
> Tebaldi
> Frances Alda
> ...


Who sang it in French ?


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## BBSVK (10 mo ago)

Seattleoperafan said:


> Are you going to do this on your own? I don't know this aria but I could make one if you prefer if you pick the contestants. Either way is fine with me.


Thanks, maybe I will leave it to you then, you know the buttons for creating polls already. Picking contestants seems really hard. Maybe I will take all French versions and divide them randomly into 2 groups.


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## BBSVK (10 mo ago)

I don't know yet. I want to at least check them out.


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## Seattleoperafan (Mar 24, 2013)

BBSVK said:


> I don't know yet. I want to at least check them out.


If you can direct message me the videos you want I will post it with a poll or if you create a thread yourself then at the bottom it asks if you want a poll and you create a question and the artists. I don't know the aria well enough to pick out contestants and selections.


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## ALT (Mar 1, 2021)

Seattleoperafan said:


> If you can direct message me the videos you want I will post it with a poll or if you create a thread yourself then at the bottom it asks if you want a poll and you create a question and the artists. I don't know the aria well enough to pick out contestants and selections.


You seem to know a lot of arias so it is odd that you don’t know this one well enough. After all, it is one of the most beautiful things Rossini ever wrote. IMO, he surpassed himself with this work … and then never wrote another note in the many decades he lived after its composition. I can’t say I blame him.


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## Shaughnessy (Dec 31, 2020)

BBSVK said:


> Thanks, maybe I will leave it to you then, you know the buttons for creating polls already. *Picking contestants seems really hard.* .





Seattleoperafan said:


> * I don't know the aria well enough to pick out contestants and selections.*





ALT said:


> *You seem to know a lot of arias so it is odd that you don’t know this one well enough.*


This is code for "Do your own homework"...


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## Seattleoperafan (Mar 24, 2013)

BBSVK said:


> Thanks, maybe I will leave it to you then, you know the buttons for creating polls already. Picking contestants seems really hard. Maybe I will take all French versions and divide them randomly into 2 groups.


You're telling me it's hard


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## BBSVK (10 mo ago)

Shaughnessy said:


> This is code for "Do your own homework"...


Yes, I plan to do that and need some time.

But if it feels too much like homework and stops being enjoyable, I will just end it and and return to my original motivation. It was a strong emotional contrast between 4 singers, one of them not listed here, which made me want the contest.


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## BBSVK (10 mo ago)

Did Callas do only one version ? Which year ? Youtube doesn't say.


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## MAS (Apr 15, 2015)

BBSVK said:


> Did Callas do only one version ? Which year ? Youtube doesn't say.


There were two days, November 13th and 14th, 1961 for which the aria (“_S’alontanano alfine…Selva Opaca”) _is listed in an EMI recording session. (source: Frank Hamilton _Maria Callas Performance Annals, 1996. Edited 2010)_


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## Tsaraslondon (Nov 7, 2013)

MAS said:


> There were two days, November 13th and 14th, 1961 for which the aria (“_S’alontanano alfine…Selva Opaca”) _is listed in an EMI recording session. (source: Frank Hamilton _Maria Callas Performance Annals, 1996. Edited 2010)_


The Tonini one is on this two disc selection, first issued in the Warner red box. Except for the scene from *Il Pirata *none of the items from the Tonini sessions were approved by Callas for release.










She also recorded it in 1964 with Rescigno for her Rossini/Donizetti disc










By this time she can't disguise her vocal problems but she captures a sort of sighing loneliness that no one else does.


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## MAS (Apr 15, 2015)

Tsaraslondon said:


> The Tonini one is on this two disc selection, first issued in the Warner red box. Except for the scene from *Il Pirata *none of the items from the Tonini sessions were approved by Callas for release.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Damn! I completely missed that one. It was recorded on December 4, 1963.


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## BBSVK (10 mo ago)

Is there a good Caballe recording for the whole aria, including the recitative ? I am asking, so that I do not thoughtlessly pick from youtube something not from the peak of her career.
With the recitative, it should take 8 - 10 minutes.


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## Tsaraslondon (Nov 7, 2013)

BBSVK said:


> Is there a good Caballe recording for the whole aria, including the recitative ? I am asking, so that I do not thoughtlessly pick from youtube something not from the peak of her career.
> With the recitative, it should take 8 - 10 minutes.


I don't know if it's on youtube, but the one from the complete recording under Gardelli would be the obvious choice.


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## BBSVK (10 mo ago)

I also would be thankful for a good recommendation on Sutherland. The aria with the recitative again, so 8 - 10 minutes.


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## ewilkros (8 mo ago)

BBSVK said:


> I would like to see a competition for "Sombre forêt", the aria of Mathilde from Guillaume Tell by Rossini. Who should be there, and, ideally, which recording ? I prefer French. Callas version could be Italian, because it's Callas. For Montserat Caballe - which one ?


For one with a Mimi voice rather than a Tosca one, try Bidú Sayão in a live concert at the San Francisco Opera in 1950 -- with recit, inevitably in Italian:






This was a Standard Hour broadcast, with Giuseppe di Stefano (it's his "other" recording of _Salut, demeure_ with _dimenuendo_ on the high C), and conductor is Gaetano Merola. You know--just another Sunday evening. Flagstad stopped by the following week, and sends her regards.

It exists in much better sound, but my Youtube choices seem to be either Muffled or Peaky, so I went with Peaky.


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## BBSVK (10 mo ago)

ewilkros said:


> For one with a Mimi voice rather than a Tosca one, try Bidú Sayão in a live concert at the San Francisco Opera in 1950 -- with recit, inevitably in Italian:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Thank you. I probably have too many contestants already, so I will focus on French, and still will have to omit some of those. I think about making 2 more rounds and point people to this thread for leisure listening. I want to hear them all, sooner or later.


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## solutio (2 mo ago)

Great aria! Thx for the Sayao post! For me the best interpretation AND the best recording (happy coincidence!) is: Caballé (Gardelli) in french.





My favorite in italian is Freni (Chailly):





And very touching and fantastic: Rebeka in Pesaro singing on a white horse. Legendary!




(unfortunately without video)


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## BBSVK (10 mo ago)

solutio said:


> Great aria! Thx for the Sayao post! For me the best interpretation AND the best recording (happy coincidence!) is: Caballé (Gardelli) in french.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


@solutio
Marina Rebeka is already included in our singing contest game. Even the video is there, although I am not sure if it is from Pesaro. You can vote for her, or Julia Lezhneva, after listening. The contest link is here:
Rebeka vs Lezhneva as Mathilde

For another round, I am looking for a version with Caballe, but I would like to have a recitative included, and I also prefer it to be from her prime years.


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## Tsaraslondon (Nov 7, 2013)

This one is also from the complete studio recording under Gardelli and includes the introduction and recitative.


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