# Unknown composers we should talk classical about



## Casebearer (Jan 19, 2016)

Social networks have a natural tendency to make stronger what is already strong. And so we end up with a small list of 'great composers' that are always at the center of attention, while others are marginalized or never get real attention. I think especially this forum should focus on efforts to broaden the interest in classical music. Maybe a good way is to have a (relatively) unknown Composer of the Month (maybe as a temporary Sticky?). 

What's your opinion on this?


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## ST4 (Oct 27, 2016)

Casebearer said:


> Social networks have a natural tendency to make stronger what is already strong. And so we end up with a small list of 'great composers' that are always at the center of attention, while others are marginalized or never get real attention. I think especially this forum should focus on efforts to broaden the interest in classical music. Maybe a good way is to have a (relatively) unknown Composer of the Month (maybe as a temporary Sticky?).
> 
> What's your opinion on this?


Very great idea! I hope this can happen :tiphat:


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## Bulldog (Nov 21, 2013)

Casebearer said:


> Social networks have a natural tendency to make stronger what is already strong. And so we end up with a small list of 'great composers' that are always at the center of attention, while others are marginalized or never get real attention. I think especially this forum should focus on efforts to broaden the interest in classical music. Maybe a good way is to have a (relatively) unknown Composer of the Month (maybe as a temporary Sticky?).
> 
> What's your opinion on this?


If you like the idea, follow through on it. Personally, it isn't my perception that only a small list of composers get the attention. Also, a member is always free to start a thread on little known composers.


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## Weston (Jul 11, 2008)

Some time ago there was a lesser known symphony thread that I enjoyed, but it was obviously a bit specific and then sank into the sea of threads.

I like the idea and would really such a thread, but there needs to be some way of insuring an over-enthusiastic or not quite mature attention seeker doesn't try to out-weird everyone else by promoting "_Music composed for soggy corn flakes dropped from specified heights onto amplified dried palm frond laden trampoline and boy's choir in Q-minor, Op. 1a_"

While that might be a great composition, how do we know people are not just trying to impress us with their tedious eclectic knowledge?


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## Medtnaculus (May 13, 2015)

I always champion the same composers everywhere. Just have to really rely on others to actually take the time to listen to what's mentioned. Totally for this idea. Too many composers out there who deserve more attention.


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## Casebearer (Jan 19, 2016)

Bulldog said:


> If you like the idea, follow through on it. Personally, it isn't my perception that only a small list of composers get the attention. Also, a member is always free to start a thread on little known composers.


You are right about our personal freedom to start any topic but then we might get 40 views and 3 replies. That's not what I mean. I mean attention from a larger group of members during a longer period to make a worthwhile but more obscure composer stick a little bit more. To do that we would need an attractive form.


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## Casebearer (Jan 19, 2016)

Weston said:


> Some time ago there was a lesser known symphony thread that I enjoyed, but it was obviously a bit specific and then sank into the sea of threads.
> 
> I like the idea and would really such a thread, but there needs to be some way of insuring an over-enthusiastic or not quite mature attention seeker doesn't try to out-weird everyone else by promoting "_Music composed for soggy corn flakes dropped from specified heights onto amplified dried palm frond laden trampoline and boy's choir in Q-minor, Op. 1a_"
> 
> While that might be a great composition, how do we know people are not just trying to impress us with their tedious eclectic knowledge?


You are right about the risk of people outweirding everyone else which would soon lead to a lack of interest from membership. So we may need an editorial board of some kind to select 'Composer of the Month' from suggestions done by members?


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## superhorn (Mar 23, 2010)

A while ago, I started a thread on really obscure composers on youtube. This might be a good place to start . I listed dozens of composers hardly anyone has ever heard of , even the most knowledgeable and experienced listeners . You can hear their music easily on youtube.


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## Casebearer (Jan 19, 2016)

I know YouTube is a goldmine. It's not about if we have access as individuals, often we do, at least potentially. My idea is about sharing thoughts on unknown composers and thereby giving them more attention in a social context suc as this forum. YouTube can be very helpful for the purpose of exchaging music and sharing thoughts.


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## Nereffid (Feb 6, 2013)

I think in principle it's a good idea, though it might be hard to come up with a format that succeeds the way you'd like it to.

People do often try to start composer threads, and of course we have the Guestbooks. But these don't often generate much in the way of responses. Last year there was an attempt at a "composers of the month", and although there were plenty of contributions it lasted I think 2 months.

My suggestion is that you follow the lead of other users - I've got my composer polls, ArtMusic does his letter polls, there's the Saturday Symphonies series, the Recommended Lists. In other words: if you think it's a good idea to have a recurring feature, you should just go ahead and start it, and hopefully others will take an interest. In fact I'd say make it an Unknown Composer of the Week, so that it soon becomes "Casebearer's thing" - get it into the fabric of TC so that everyone's used to having it around.


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## Casebearer (Jan 19, 2016)

Thanks for your advice Nereffid. 

I've been thinking about it somewhat. I'm sure I could come up with an unknown composer's name every week but to share more than just a name would be soon be a problem. For the format you suggest to succeed I think I would have to be able to bring enough meat to the table every week to make it interesting for other people which would somehow put me in some expert position, which I'm not and don't want to be. 

It would be different of course if there was a larger group of people that together would take care of the Unknown Composer of the Week. So if it could somehow be done in the way of an open invitation to all of us to start a thread on the composers of the week, I would be fine with that.


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## mmsbls (Mar 6, 2011)

I think this is a wonderful idea. I completely understand that one person cannot carry this topic alone. Maybe you could solicit others to suggest one or more composers they'd like to "champion." Once you get several people chiming in, you could start the ongoing series. If you have several composers you'd be happy to discuss, you could fill in when no one else is willing. I think once it got started, we'd have little trouble keeping it going for awhile (at least I hope so). 

I think the one possible issue would be just how unknown must a composer be to qualify. There's quite a range from those whose name is reasonably well known but whose music might not be to those whose name is almost completely unknown. Are you thinking of the latter or would names such as Cannabich, Arne, Atterberg, Bantock, Field, etc. qualify?


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## starthrower (Dec 11, 2010)

And there's a backlog of interesting threads in the Composer Guestbook forum to comb through. I can testify to the fact that I've learned about several dozen composers at this forum in the past six years. "Unknown" is relative to the individual's knowledge. Before 2010, names such as Norgard, Schnittke, Gerhard, Bacewicz, Martinu, Hartmann, Henze, Panufnik, Saariaho, Aho, Sallinen, Gubaidulina, Grisey, Harvey, Krenek, Wellesz, Toch, Searle, Ohana, Schuman, Roussel, Zemlinsky, were all unknown to me.


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## senza sordino (Oct 20, 2013)

It's a good idea to champion unknown composers. In the past few weeks, I've been nominating the piano trios of Sergei Tanayev, Rebecca Clarke, Albert Roussel and Gabriel Pierne. I had never heard of these composers until recently. I found out about them here. But what that means is that for someone else, they are known composers. For someone, an unknown composer might be someone else's favourite composer. 

It's a good idea to let the world know of lesser known composers. There are some real gems hidden, but they need someone to champion them.


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## Nereffid (Feb 6, 2013)

Casebearer said:


> Thanks for your advice Nereffid.
> 
> I've been thinking about it somewhat. I'm sure I could come up with an unknown composer's name every week but to share more than just a name would be soon be a problem. For the format you suggest to succeed I think I would have to be able to bring enough meat to the table every week to make it interesting for other people which would somehow put me in some expert position, which I'm not and don't want to be.
> 
> It would be different of course if there was a larger group of people that together would take care of the Unknown Composer of the Week. So if it could somehow be done in the way of an open invitation to all of us to start a thread on the composers of the week, I would be fine with that.





mmsbls said:


> I think this is a wonderful idea. I completely understand that one person cannot carry this topic alone. Maybe you could solicit others to suggest one or more composers they'd like to "champion." Once you get several people chiming in, you could start the ongoing series. If you have several composers you'd be happy to discuss, you could fill in when no one else is willing. I think once it got started, we'd have little trouble keeping it going for awhile (at least I hope so).
> 
> I think the one possible issue would be just how unknown must a composer be to qualify. There's quite a range from those whose name is reasonably well known but whose music might not be to those whose name is almost completely unknown. Are you thinking of the latter or would names such as Cannabich, Arne, Atterberg, Bantock, Field, etc. qualify?


Yes, it was a bit presumptuous of me to suggest one person should do all the work! 
I think once there's some semi-organised way of everyone getting a shot at nominating their own composer in turn - I know I'd be happy to do it - then it should have legs.

As regards "unknowns", of course my own polls are revealing at least which composers don't get "like"s - maybe they're widely disliked, but more probably they're merely unknown. Of mmsbls's list, Arne is the only one voted on so far, and he had support from 8 of 64 voters, which puts him in the low-middle of composers. In fact, fully half the composers on the list are liked by fewer than one-seventh of voters, so it seems there's many names that those of us who listen widely might think are "known" that to many others are definitely "unknown".


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## Casebearer (Jan 19, 2016)

Hey, very nice some of you are joining in a collective effort to think this through. If we do it together like this I'm sure we'll arrive at something that might have some success. Let it be clear I have no urge to any form of ownership. Having this kind of an idea is very easy, the hard work is in making it a success so I would be very happy if many people contributed under this flag and it became something of all of us.

With regard to the question of what is an unknown composer. I would say immediately that that is of course relative in every aspect, impossible to define and in my opinion not something to worry about too much. What is knowing? If I speak for myself I can honestly say there is not one composer who's work I know completely (maybe Bartók comes close), only very few I have heard a lot of, many I've heard some of and many more I don't know anything about. As I'm an average listener, many of you will know more and several will know less than I do. But when we all focus on 'unknown composers' (whatever that is exactly) I'm sure almost all of us, except the happy few, will soon find we don't know that much about them most of the time. And if you do the thread is an opportunity to share what you know and like. So individual people will find they can share their knowledge in some weeks and absorb other people's knowledge in other weeks. In such a context it's not an appropriate reaction to post: hey, I know this composer well, so he's not unknown. We could reply: well, do you know all the composers of the week well then? Or: why don't you just share what you know?

So in my opinion we should be pragmatic about it. It's of greater importance that someone is willing to share his knowledge on a lesser known composer and inspire the rest of us than it is to agree on a definition. I also think we could clear the intent of the thread up enough for people by having an opening statement that goes into this aspect.

What would worry me more is how to make sure the threads have some quality, especially the opening thread on an unknown composer. It would have to be a little bit more than just a name and a YouTube-link. Personally I would like to read something about a composers biography, something about his/her place in musical history and something about his work. I wouldn't mind if this was borrowed or quoted from wikipedia, record sleeves or whatever as long as it would give me some context and clues for further listening. What are your ideas about this? Could we ask people to adhere to some simple minimum requirements?

Another question who be how to organize/coordinate this so we don't get three composers of the week and then nothing for six weeks.


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## Nereffid (Feb 6, 2013)

Casebearer said:


> What would worry me more is how to make sure the threads have some quality, especially the opening thread on an unknown composer. It would have to be a little bit more than just a name and a YouTube-link. Personally I would like to read something about a composers biography, something about his/her place in musical history and something about his work. I wouldn't mind if this was borrowed or quoted from wikipedia, record sleeves or whatever as long as it would give me some context and clues for further listening. What are your ideas about this? Could we ask people to adhere to some simple minimum requirements?
> 
> Another question who be how to organize/coordinate this so we don't get three composers of the week and then nothing for six weeks.


Yeah, there's always the risk of low content, so I think there will have to be an assumption that anyone who picks a composer has to be willing to put some bit of effort in (and I think "borrowed" is fine, too). Possibly this might reduce the number of people willing to choose a composer, but I suppose conversely that reduced number would make it easier to coordinate whose turn it is.
Perhaps at some point late in the weekly cycle, everyone who's interested in doing the next composer should put themselves forward, and whoever's curating the current thread could just pick one. And each new thread should include an updated list of who's had a go so people don't get missed out.


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## senza sordino (Oct 20, 2013)

If before this venture is undertaken you ask for submissions, then you might get as much as a year's worth of material. If ten people suggest five composers each, that's about one year of weekly composers. Somehow on a weekly rotation, someone starts a new thread with one of their composers and a few choice works. People can comment and add new pieces. 

I don't know who decides which composer we have each week. Those people who initially make submissions would be expected to start their weekly thread. I don't know how we decide on an order.


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## arpeggio (Oct 4, 2012)

Weston said:


> Some time ago there was a lesser known symphony thread that I enjoyed, but it was obviously a bit specific and then sank into the sea of threads.


This is one of the few threads that is still active that I subscribe to: http://www.talkclassical.com/9822-some-great-lesser-known.html

There were over fifteen entries in October, 2016.

There have been many threads which have pursued this. For example:

http://www.talkclassical.com/44264-composers-traditionally-considered-great.html

http://www.talkclassical.com/43692-underappreciated-composers.html?highlight=fibich#post1068393

http://www.talkclassical.com/1135-forgotten-composers-do-you.html

http://www.talkclassical.com/36784-what-sets-symphonies-non.html

Based on my experiences with several classical music forums the real problem is not trying to determine the definition of an "unknown" composer but what is "classical music". Some members have a very broad definition; others a very narrow.

An example is the Dutch composer Henk Badings. There are some who consider him an outstanding composer. starthrower recently started a thread about him: http://www.talkclassical.com/43488-henk-badings-1907-1987-a.html. Sadly this thread only generated five replies.


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## Blancrocher (Jul 6, 2013)

I try to listen to unknown composers, but despite my best intentions I usually end up listening to the same 2 or 3 million warhorses over and over again.


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## Antiquarian (Apr 29, 2014)

Blancrocher said:


> I try to listen to unknown composers, but despite my best intentions I usually end up listening to the same 2 or 3 million warhorses over and over again.


I'm afraid I'm guilty of this too. Sometimes I get in a rut, and listen Beethoven pretty much exclusively for a week, and only then go on to something else. I think I would like to see the unknown composers thread, perhaps exploring the works of pretty well known but unrepresented composers like George Chadwick, to really obscure composers like Salomon Jadassohn (1831-1902).


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## Francis Poulenc (Nov 6, 2016)

Respighi deserves some love. Vastly underrated composer.


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## arpeggio (Oct 4, 2012)

Francis Poulenc said:


> Respighi deserves some love. Vastly underrated composer.


Not around here. I did a search and found over 125 posts about him here at Talk Classical in the past year.

According to Bachtrack there are over 47 concerts that are scheduled over the next six months that feature works by Respighi, including: _Belkis_, several performance of the _Pines, The Birds, Ancient Airs and Dances, Rossiniana, Roman Festivals_ and many others.


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## Casebearer (Jan 19, 2016)

Summing it up so far (open to discussion):

We’ll need an opening statement that is clear on:
-	the intent of the series 
-	the loose definition of unknown or lesser known classical composers
-	the loose definition on what is to be considered classical music (we want as many people as possible to contribute and gain attention for a composer of their liking. If you don’t like the choice of the week, you’ll probably like next weeks choice).
-	it’s collective ownership which means anybody on this forum can submit a classical composer or take turn in the programming board
-	the way it works: submission of proposed composers of the week to some kind of programming board in a separate thread. The board does a monthly programming for the next two months or so, so people can prepare. (So the programme is ‘rolling’ and renewed every month.) 
-	a few informal rules we propose that are meant to maintain some minimum standards on the opening post (biography, position in musical history, major or preferred works, links to further listening and/or reading 

We would need a separate thread in the form of a sticky (so people can find it easily) for the opening statement, the submissions and the programming I think. It might also be necessary to PM members when they are expected to make their contribution.

Finally we would need some kind of a board – or maybe one person – that does the programming (for a limited amount of time?). If it’s a board of more than one person it would have to be worked out how they can communicate easily and decide on the order of contributions.

Any ideas on how to make it work even better and simpler?


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## Francis Poulenc (Nov 6, 2016)

delete (.......................................)


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## Klassic (Dec 19, 2015)

Cool stuff here.


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## Francis Poulenc (Nov 6, 2016)

Another great underrated composer is Sergei Bortkiewicz.


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## Medtnaculus (May 13, 2015)

While we're all naming composers I'll chip in a few.

Names like Maurice Emmanuel, Florent Schmitt, Nikolai Roslavets, Alexander Mosolov, Pierre-Octave Ferroud, Abel Decaux, Alexei Stanchinsky, Georg von Albrecht, Leonid Sabaneyev, Kurt Atterberg, Gerr Tveitt, Alexander Tcherepnin, Jean Huré, Antoine Mariotte, Marie Jaell, Erwin Schulhoff, Heino Eller, Alfredo Casella, William Baines, Guy Ropartz, Charles Griffes, Arthur Lourié, Anatoli Nikolayevich Alexandrov, Konstantin Eiges, Samuil Feinberg, Jehan Alain, George Antheil, Charles Tournemire, Louis Vierne, Joseph Jongen, Ernest John Moeran, John Ireland, Frank Bridge, Arnold Bax, Herbert Howells, Charles Koechlin, George Enescu, Joseph Marx, Alexander Zemlinsky and Franz Schreker are all composers with amazing outputs which deserve far more attention. Some are better known than others, but I'd wager not everyone is familiar with all of them. Most if not all of them have numerous lesser known works which deserve to be known.

If you can't tell I'm super into Impressionism and Mysticism -- the French and the Russians.


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## Bettina (Sep 29, 2016)

Medtnaculus said:


> While we're all naming composers I'll chip in a few.
> 
> Names like Maurice Emmanuel, Florent Schmitt, Nikolai Roslavets, Alexander Mosolov, Pierre-Octave Ferroud, Abel Decaux, Alexei Stanchinsky, Georg von Albrecht, Leonid Sabaneyev, Kurt Atterberg, Gerr Tveitt, Alexander Tcherepnin, Jean Huré, Antoine Mariotte, Marie Jaell, Erwin Schulhoff, Heino Eller, Alfredo Casella, William Baines, Guy Ropartz, Charles Griffes, Arthur Lourié, Anatoli Nikolayevich Alexandrov, Konstantin Eiges, Samuil Feinberg, Jehan Alain, George Antheil, Charles Tournemire, Louis Vierne, Joseph Jongen, Ernest John Moeran, John Ireland, Frank Bridge, Arnold Bax, Herbert Howells, Charles Koechlin, George Enescu, Joseph Marx, Alexander Zemlinsky and Franz Schreker are all composers with amazing outputs which deserve far more attention. Some are better known than others, but I'd wager not everyone is familiar with all of them. Most if not all of them have numerous lesser known works which deserve to be known.
> 
> If you can't tell I'm super into Impressionism and Mysticism -- the French and the Russians.


Great suggestions! I'd also like to add one of my favorite lesser-known impressionists: Cyril Scott. He's extremely underrated.

Not only is his music interesting, but he himself was a quite interesting and eccentric man. He believed that he was reincarnated from a pharaoh and he wrote several Egyptian-themed pieces in honor of his former self. Also, he wrote a book on the medicinal properties of molasses!


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## Casebearer (Jan 19, 2016)

Looks like there's a list, growing and growing!


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## Medtnaculus (May 13, 2015)

Bettina said:


> Great suggestions! I'd also like to add one of my favorite lesser-known impressionists: Cyril Scott. He's extremely underrated.


Absolutely! I was thinking of adding him but decided not to/forgot for some reason. The first piano sonata is a favourite of mine; it just keeps evolving (with a time signature which seems to change every bar) with morphing melodies which just flash for a second before transforming yet again. Michael Schafer does a great job on his CD featuring the sonatas (he also has a fantastic recording of Sabaneyev's works)

A few more names: Ernest Fanelli, Selim Palmgren, Viteszlav Novak, Sergei Lyapunov, Felix Blumenfeld, Leo Ornstein, Leopold Godowsky (more to him than his transcriptions!), Alexander Glazunov, Chesnokov, and Georgy Catoire.

Hope noone minds the spam. I'll stop now.


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## Casebearer (Jan 19, 2016)

Don't call this spam or I'll spank you


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## mmsbls (Mar 6, 2011)

I spoke with Casebearer, and unfortunately due to other commitments, he is unable to organize this project idea. I believe it is a fantastic idea and would like to move it along. I think we need to iron out a few details (not too many) before starting. In the next post I will include some project details. Please feel free to suggest changes or additions. Once we have a reasonable consensus, we can take suggestions on unknown composers. We'll create a schedule, and when we have several (or more) composers scheduled, we'll start the project. 

Again, thanks so much to Casebearer for suggesting this project. I hope he can participate and host a composer or two.


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## mmsbls (Mar 6, 2011)

Project details - please suggest changes or additions.

*Unknown Composer of the Week*

_Intent of the Series: _

To expose members to composers with whom they are relatively or completely unfamiliar. To share descriptions of, thoughts about, and especially the music of those composers.

_What is an unknown composer?_

Given that a composer unknown to one member might be well known to another, members can simply suggest composers they feel should qualify. Perhaps participants will vote on the suggestions.

_Methodology_

Members will suggest unknown composers on this thread. Once a decision is made on a particular composer, that composer will be added to the schedule. A schedule will be kept either on this thread or on another appropriate thread so members can always check to see what's coming. Members will take turns participating as the "host" of the series. A new Unknown Composer of the Week thread will be started every week for fun and education.

At the appropriate date, the designated member will start a thread on their unknown composer, and others will discuss, suggest music, or just listen and learn. Each week a new thread will ne started.

_ Requirements for threads:_

Thread title: Unknown Composer Week #X: Composer full name
(The entire title hopefully should be visible when searching new posts)

Thread content for first post: Short biography including birth and death dates, major and selected works, links to music and further reading. Each composer should have at least 3(?) links to works so members can listen to selected pieces.

_Initial organizer of project:_

I will act as the initial organizer. I will ensure that this thread remains prominent (probably does not have to be a sticky thread) so people can view it easily. I will make sure the hosts know they are to start a new thread on the specified day. I will order the hosts and make sure the list of scheduled host/composer/date is updated appropriately.


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## brianvds (May 1, 2013)

It's perhaps not just a question of unknown composers, but also unknown works. I heard an interesting quote by Vaughan Williams the other day, to the effect that any composer worth his salt will sooner or later compose a work that no one else could have done. Such a work may then stand out in an otherwise not so remarkable oeuvre.

Some of these are war horses (something like Carmina Burana comes to mind) but perhaps there are plenty of individual works out there that are pretty great, despite their composers on the whole not being all that noteworthy.


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## Bettina (Sep 29, 2016)

mmsbls said:


> Project details - please suggest changes or additions.
> 
> *Unknown Composer of the Week*
> 
> ...


Sounds like a good plan! Can I go ahead and nominate composers in this thread? Or will you be starting a separate thread for nominations?


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## mmsbls (Mar 6, 2011)

To be honest I expected much more interest. Only two people have responded to this in 6 days. That's hardly enough to begin a project. I guess I'll see if we get more interest. In the meantime you're welcome to nominate composers, but unless significantly more people weigh in, I don't think I'll start anything.


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## Bettina (Sep 29, 2016)

mmsbls said:


> To be honest I expected much more interest. Only two people have responded to this in 6 days. That's hardly enough to begin a project. I guess I'll see if we get more interest. In the meantime you're welcome to nominate composers, but unless significantly more people weigh in, I don't think I'll start anything.


Thanks for getting back to me so quickly. It's too bad that there hasn't been more interest.

In any case, I'll go ahead and nominate Déodat de Séverac. If the project works out, I'd be happy to host a thread about him, including an introductory description of his life and works, with video links.


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## mmsbls (Mar 6, 2011)

I'll probably push this a bit more to make sure people see it, and hopefully there will be enough interest to get things started. We'll see.


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## Meyerbeer Smith (Mar 25, 2016)

This sounds like a fantastic idea! I'm all for championing unfamiliar composers (or unfamiliar works by familiar composers).

Bettina suggested Sévérac; I'll drink to that.

Some other composers:

Franco Alfano
Claude Arrieu
Edmond Audran
Arnold Bax
Victor Bendix
Peter Benoit
Louise Bertin
Ernest Bloch
Ernst Boehe
François-Adrien Boieldieu
Alfred Bruneau
Antonio Cagnoni
Luigi Canepa
Georgy Catoire
Ernest Chausson
Luigi Cherubini
Peter Cornelius
Jean Cras
César Cui
Jean-Michel Damase
Alexander Dargomyzhsky
Félicien David
Louis Dietsch
Gabriel Dupont
Stéphan Elmas
Camille Erlanger
Ernest Farrar
Henry Février
Zdeněk Fibich
Robert Fuchs
Alberto Franchetti
Sir Edward German
Benjamin Godard
Karl Goldmark
Antônio Carlos Gomes
Théodore Gouvy
Alexander Grechanikov
André Grétry
Johann Peter Emilius Hartmann
Fromental Halévy
Victor Herbert
Ferdinand Herold
Hervé
E.T.A. Hoffmann (as musician)
Victorin Joncières
Uuno Klami
August Klughardt
Charles Koechlin
Friedrich Kuhlau
Raoul Laparra
Daniël de Lange
Isidore de Lara
Guillaume Lekeu
Jean-François Le Sueur
Charles Lecocq
Franco Leoni
Adolf Frederik Lindblad
Albéric Magnard
Aimé Maillart
Filippo Marchetti
Victor Massé
Simon Mayr
Sir John Blackwood McEwen
Sir George McFarren
Martin-Joseph Mengal
André Messager
Stanisław Moniuszko
Mortiz Moszkowski
Peter Lange Müller
Eduard Napravnik
Viktor Nessler
George Onslow
Giovanni Pacini
Ferdinando Paër
Giovanni Paisiello
Emile Paladilhe
Horatio Parker
Errico Petrella
Gabriel Pierné
Józef Michał Poniatowski
Henri Rabaud
Joachim Raff
Johann Valentin Rathgeber
Napoléon Henri Reber
Ernest Reyer
Federico & Luigi Ricci
Guy Ropartz
Hans Rott
Albert Roussel
Antonio Sacchini
Gaston Salvayre
Giuseppe Sarti
Henri Sauguet
Franz Xaver Scharwenka
Max von Schillings
Cyril Scott
Alexander Serov
Giovanni Sgambati
Yuri Shaporin
Ethel Smyth
Louis Spohr
Gaspare Spontini
Charles Villiers Stanford
Alexander Taneyev
Ludwig Thuille
Henri Tomasi
Louis Tournemire
Marcel Tyberg
Nicola Vaccai
Louis Vierne
Wagner - Siegfried Wagner
William Vincent Wallace
Felix Weingartner
Richard Wetz


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## Heliogabo (Dec 29, 2014)

I've los this thread before. Nice idea. Let's begin with Deodat de Séverac (Ciccolini championed his music I think) as Bettina suggest.

There are plenty of composers which will be interesting to remember and discover here.


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## Meyerbeer Smith (Mar 25, 2016)

Heliogabo said:


> I've los this thread before. Nice idea. Let's begin with Deodat de Séverac (Ciccolini championed his music I think) as Bettina suggest.
> 
> There are plenty of composers which will be interesting to remember and discover here.


Looking at your name, Heliogabo: Séverac composed an opera _Héliogabale_, which I'd like to hear. There's an unofficial recording (in Occitan) from the 1970s; it's listed but not available on Operapassion.


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## Woodduck (Mar 17, 2014)

More possibilities. Many English and Americans here.

William Alwyn
Richard Arnell
Edgar Bainton
Granville Bantock
William Sterndale Bennett
William Bergsma
Lennox Berkeley
Arthur Bliss
Marc Blitzstein
Felix Blumenfeld
Charles Wakefield Cadman
John Alden Carpenter
Georges Catoire
George Whitefield Chadwick
Samuel Coleridge-Taylor
Paul Creston
Norman Dello Joio
Felix Draeseke
Jacob Druckman
Irving Fine
Nicolas Flagello
Carlisle Floyd
Arthur Foote
John Foulds
Robert Fux
Friedrich Gernsheim
Vittorio Giannini
Carlos Guastavino
Henry Kimball Hadley
Adolphus Hailstork
Lee Hoiby
Joseph Holbrooke
Mary Howe
William Hurlstone
Frederick Jacobi
Gustav Jenner
Paul Juon
Ulysses Kay
Leon Kirchner
Ernst Krenek
Charles Martin Loeffler
Leevi Madetoja
Daniel Gregory Mason
Erkki Melartin
Peter Mennin
Aare Merikanto
Ernest John Moeran
George Onslow
Leo Ornstein
Quincy Porter
Alan Rawsthorne
Wallingford Riegger
George Rochberg
Carl Ruggles
Anthony Louis Scarmolin
Elie Siegmeister
Leo Sowerby
Charles Villiers Stanford
William Grant Still
George Templeton Strong
Deems Taylor
Ludwig Thuille
Robert Ward
David Ward-Steinman
Richard Yardumian


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## Heliogabo (Dec 29, 2014)

SimonTemplar said:


> Looking at your name, Heliogabo: Séverac composed an opera _Héliogabale_, which I'd like to hear. There's an unofficial recording (in Occitan) from the 1970s; it's listed but not available on Operapassion.


Yes, my name is based on Héliogabale name of course, but didn't knew abot that opera. Thanks for the tip, I'll try to listen to it someday! :tiphat:


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## musicrom (Dec 29, 2013)

This sounds like fun, but I'm a bit unclear as to how we will choose the composers in the future. Séverac works for me, but just wondering.

Edit: I'll add some suggestions I suppose. Of varying popularity, but mostly obscure, I hope.

Lera Auerbach
Johann Georg Heinrich Backofen
York Bowen
Christian Cannabich
George Whitefield Chadwick
Luigi Cherubini
Rebecca Clarke
Bernhard Crusell
Einar Englund
Arthur Foote
Jean Francaix
Berthold Goldschmidt
Charles Tomlinson Griffes
Alfred Hill
Leopold Kozeluch
Magnus Lindberg
George Lloyd
Frank Martin
Rodion Shchedrin
Christopher Theofanidis
Miecyslaw Weinberg
Dag Wiren


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## Casebearer (Jan 19, 2016)

I would sincerely like to see the idea work. In the early days of this thread there were many enthousiasts to cooperate.
I think it would be practical if people would name one or two composers that they themselves would be willing to put the spotlight on.


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## Meyerbeer Smith (Mar 25, 2016)

Casebearer said:


> I would sincerely like to see the idea work. In the early days of this thread there were many enthousiasts to cooperate.
> I think it would be practical if people would name one or two composers that they themselves would be willing to put the spotlight on.


I'd be happy to sponsor any French opera composers; I've written overviews about Meyerbeer, Massenet, Reyer and Gounod for MusicWeb International. (Working on Herold now.)


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## cimirro (Sep 6, 2016)

I can add more information about the composers I made recordings and the ones I'm still recording, mostly _première_ recordings, if that sounds interesting you can count my help. (Tausig, Michalowski, Zichy, Szántó, and others on the way)


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## mmsbls (Mar 6, 2011)

We've gotten some good responses now. I agree with Casebearer that it would be good if people would suggest 1 or 2 composers they would be interested in "hosting." Going back over the thread since I posted the tentative rules, we have:

Bettina: Déodat de Séverac
SimonTemplar: Meyerbeer, Massenet, Reyer and Gounod 
cimirro: Tausig, Michalowski, Zichy, Szántó

One criteria is that there must be music available for people to listen to. I suggested maybe at least 3 works (or reasonable parts of works). I haven't checked, but maybe those who suggested composers could check to make sure they can link to 3 or more works. 

Maybe we could have those who listed a large number whittle their list down to a couple that they'd like to host?

After we have a couple more nominations as host, I can put together a starting schedule. Once we have agreement from the hosts, we'll begin (probably on a Saturday).


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## cimirro (Sep 6, 2016)

mmsbls said:


> cimirro: Tausig, Michalowski, Zichy, Szántó
> ...
> One criteria is that there must be music available for people to listen to. I suggested maybe at least 3 works (or reasonable parts of works). I haven't checked, but maybe those who suggested composers could check to make sure they can link to 3 or more works.


Nice idea. No problems from my part, I will add more recordings of mine as mp3 and check others already available (if any) as you suggest.

All the best
Artur


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## KenOC (Mar 7, 2011)

All: I have started a more formal game to build a "neglected composers" list. I hope you will participate!

http://www.talkclassical.com/47997-neglected-composers-game-round.html


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## mmsbls (Mar 6, 2011)

Bettina will start a thread this Saturday on our first unknown composer - Déodat de Séverac. So look for the thread and please feel free to participate will thoughts, further suggested music, and any other appropriate responses.


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## cimirro (Sep 6, 2016)

Good, I shall use the same "model" when my turn arrives


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## hpowders (Dec 23, 2013)

Heliogabo said:


> Yes, my name is based on Héliogabale name of course, but didn't knew abot that opera. Thanks for the tip, I'll try to listen to it someday! :tiphat:


I thought everybody knew that.


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## Pugg (Aug 8, 2014)

mmsbls said:


> Bettina will start a thread this Saturday on our first unknown composer - Déodat de Séverac. So look for the thread and please feel free to participate will thoughts, further suggested music, and any other appropriate responses.


This could be exiting....


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## mmsbls (Mar 6, 2011)

Just a reminder:

The series has started with Bettina hosting Déodat de Séverac. I'll post the next host and composer soon and also start a list of the threads with links.


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## mmsbls (Mar 6, 2011)

The next unknown composer in the series is Meyerbeer who will be hosted by SimonTemplar. The thread will start Saturday.

Anyone interested in hosting a composer, please post in this thread and I'll add you to the schedule.


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## Pugg (Aug 8, 2014)

mmsbls said:


> The next unknown composer in the series is Meyerbeer who will be hosted by SimonTemplar. The thread will start Saturday.
> 
> Anyone interested in hosting a composer, please post in this thread and I'll add you to the schedule.


Oh dear, now it's getting even more serious......


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## Meyerbeer Smith (Mar 25, 2016)

Pugg said:


> Oh dear, now it's getting even more serious......


I'm writing an addendum to Forman's Good Opera Guide.


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## hpowders (Dec 23, 2013)

How can one talk about composers who are "unknown"? Doesn't that mean none of us know any of their names?


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## Bettina (Sep 29, 2016)

hpowders said:


> How can one talk about composers who are "unknown"? Doesn't that mean none of us know any of their names?


"Unknown" is a colorful substitute for "lesser-known."


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## hpowders (Dec 23, 2013)

Bettina said:


> "Unknown" is a colorful substitute for "lesser-known."


Not in this swampy hell-hole where the gigantic roaches are walked three times a day on a leash.


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## lluissineu (Dec 27, 2016)

hpowders said:


> Not in this swampy hell-hole where the gigantic roaches are walked three times a day on a leash.


you're always so 'impressionist'


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## Omicron9 (Oct 13, 2016)

Casebearer said:


> Social networks have a natural tendency to make stronger what is already strong. And so we end up with a small list of 'great composers' that are always at the center of attention, while others are marginalized or never get real attention. I think especially this forum should focus on efforts to broaden the interest in classical music. Maybe a good way is to have a (relatively) unknown Composer of the Month (maybe as a temporary Sticky?).
> 
> What's your opinion on this?


I might even suggest somewhat known composers whose works are so underrated as to be borderline unknown. Elliott Carter comes to mind.

Then again, this could be an idea for a whole other thread, so just ignore me. I'll go sit over there ------->

-09


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## mmsbls (Mar 6, 2011)

Anyone wishing to "host" an "unknown" composer please suggest a composer's name and I can add you to the list. Presently the list of hosted composers with links is:

Déodat de Séverac
Giacomo Meyerbeer


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## Portamento (Dec 8, 2016)

Salomon Jadassohn.


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## mmsbls (Mar 6, 2011)

This Saturday cimirro will host Unknown Composer #3:Carl Tausig

_Upcoming List_:

Portamento: Salomon Jadassohn

Anyone wishing to "host" an "unknown" composer please suggest a composer's name and I can add you to the list. Presently the list of hosted composers with links is:

Déodat de Séverac
Giacomo Meyerbeer


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## cimirro (Sep 6, 2016)

Good, Tausig will be done, hope not disappoint anyone.
Best
Artur


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## hpowders (Dec 23, 2013)

lluissineu said:


> you're always so 'impressionist'


I don't mind the gigantic roaches...actually called "water bugs" as long as they don't try and abscond with my iPod.


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## Pugg (Aug 8, 2014)

> This Saturday cimirro will host Unknown Composer #3:Carl Tausig


I am so curious about this one, I only know some transcriptions from him.


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## hpowders (Dec 23, 2013)

lluissineu said:


> you're always so 'impressionist'


Thanks for noticing. You tend to make a fine impression on TC, by the way.


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## mmsbls (Mar 6, 2011)

Reminder:

The Unknown Composer series has the following entries:

Déodat de Séverac
Giacomo Meyerbeer
Carl Tausig

If you are interested in "hosting" a composer, please reply to this thread. Also don't worry if you wouldn't include as much information as in some of the above threads. While that information is great, just some simple descriptions of the composer and links to some music will get people investigating, and that's the real point.


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## Bettina (Sep 29, 2016)

mmsbls said:


> Reminder:
> 
> The Unknown Composer series has the following entries:
> 
> ...


Can I nominate members who I think would do a great job? Portamento has been writing a lot of good posts about Toch - he should host a thread (only if he's interested in doing so, of course). Also, I'd love to see Ingélou do a thread on Lully. Her passion for his work is inspiring!


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## mmsbls (Mar 6, 2011)

Bettina said:


> Can I nominate members who I think would do a great job? Portamento has been writing a lot of good posts about Toch - he should host a thread (only if he's interested in doing so, of course). Also, I'd love to see Ingélou do a thread on Lully. Her passion for his work is inspiring!


Maybe a PM would put less pressure on them? But that would be great. Also Portamento already suggested Salomon Jadassohn.


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## Portamento (Dec 8, 2016)

mmsbls said:


> Maybe a PM would put less pressure on them? But that would be great. Also Portamento already suggested Salomon Jadassohn.


I _did_ suggest Jadassohn - I think he is more 'unknown' than Toch is. The latter I would say is more neglected; many know his name, but few have decided to explore his music. Other examples of neglected composers include Schmitt, Ashton, Emmanuel, and Stanford, whom I've posted on in the past.

Is it possible to host twice in this "Unknown Composer" series? If not I could write an informative piece about Toch for anyone who wishes, probably on the composer's guestbook.


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## mmsbls (Mar 6, 2011)

So far there has not been a rush to host composers so I'd say it's absolutely possible to host twice (or more).


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## Portamento (Dec 8, 2016)

mmsbls said:


> So far there has not been a rush to host composers so I'd say it's absolutely possible to host twice (or more).


In that case, if there is no rush after Jadassohn, I will host Toch for week #5.


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## mmsbls (Mar 6, 2011)

The *Unknown Composer series* has the following entries:

Déodat de Séverac
Giacomo Meyerbeer
Carl Tausig
Salomon Jadassohn

Starting Saturday, April 15: Ernst Toch

If you are interested in "hosting" a composer, please reply to this thread. Also don't worry if you wouldn't include as much information as in some of the above threads. While that information is great, just some simple descriptions of the composer and links to some music will get people investigating, and that's the real point.


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## cimirro (Sep 6, 2016)

I'm curious about the next one now, this idea of "unknown composers" must not die!


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## mmsbls (Mar 6, 2011)

I would like the series to continue so I will occasionally post a request for someone to host another composer. We'll take this week off and hopefully have a candidate for next Saturday.

Anyone wishing to host an Unknown Composer please suggest the composer name in this thread, and I'll schedule it.


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## Zingara62 (Apr 20, 2017)

lots of interesting music to discover, I'll be around these posts!


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## Omicron9 (Oct 13, 2016)

Kalevi Aho.


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## mmsbls (Mar 6, 2011)

Omicron9 said:


> Kalevi Aho.


Are you suggesting that you'd like to host an Unknown Composer of the Week thread or just saying he's an interesting and relatively unknown composer?


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## Portamento (Dec 8, 2016)

I'd like to do Algernon Ashton next week, if you could schedule that.


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## bioluminescentsquid (Jul 22, 2016)

I just found this guy Reijnold Popma van Oevering; don't have the recording but seems interesting!


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## Nevum (Nov 28, 2013)

Here is a remarkable symphony by an "unknown" composer






Stjepan Sulek


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## JAS (Mar 6, 2013)

Nevum said:


> Here is a remarkable symphony by an "unknown" composer. Stjepan Sulek


He certainly seems to be mostly very unknown, and his symphonic works are entirely unrepresented on CD. (I will do some listening when I get home.)

Here is a nice article about the composer: http://www.musicweb-international.com/classrev/2016/Sep/Sulek_symphonies.htm

It seems that he has no champion, perhaps because he is a bit too modern for most fans of more romantic era music, and too romantic for fans of more modern music.


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## Portamento (Dec 8, 2016)

JAS said:


> He certainly seems to be mostly very unknown, and *his symphonic works are entirely unrepresented on CD.* (I will do some listening when I get home.)


Not true; here's a quote from the article you linked:

"In honor of the composer's centennial, the Cantus label issued in 2014 a 5CD box set of the complete Šulek symphonies. It includes mono recordings (in good sound) from 1963 and 1964 of the first and fifth symphonies, a 1991 recording of the second, a 1971 recording of the sixth, a 1983 recording of the eighth, and 2012 and 2013 recordings of the third, fourth, and seventh. These last three recordings are with the Croatian Radio and Television Symphony Orchestra. The rest are played by the Zagreb Radio and Television Symphony Orchestra. The fifth and sixth symphonies are conducted by the composer, while the rest are conducted by Šulek's protégé and champion, Pavle Despalj. There are also Jugoton LP recordings, often available on used LP sites, of the Sixth Symphony conducted by the composer (presumably the same one as in the Cantus boxed set), and an earlier recording by Despalj of the Seventh Symphony from 1980 but by all means acquire the boxed set if you can. It is one of the most treasured sets in my collection."


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## JAS (Mar 6, 2013)

Portamento said:


> Not true; here's a quote from the article you linked:
> 
> "In honor of the composer's centennial, the Cantus label issued in 2014 a 5CD box set of the complete Šulek symphonies. It includes mono recordings (in good sound) from 1963 and 1964 of the first and fifth symphonies, a 1991 recording of the second, a 1971 recording of the sixth, a 1983 recording of the eighth, and 2012 and 2013 recordings of the third, fourth, and seventh. These last three recordings are with the Croatian Radio and Television Symphony Orchestra. The rest are played by the Zagreb Radio and Television Symphony Orchestra. The fifth and sixth symphonies are conducted by the composer, while the rest are conducted by Šulek's protégé and champion, Pavle Despalj. There are also Jugoton LP recordings, often available on used LP sites, of the Sixth Symphony conducted by the composer (presumably the same one as in the Cantus boxed set), and an earlier recording by Despalj of the Seventh Symphony from 1980 but by all means acquire the boxed set if you can. It is one of the most treasured sets in my collection."


I missed that detail, but was not able to find any CDS in an admittedly somewhat hasty search.


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## 20centrfuge (Apr 13, 2007)

Along these lines, I'd like to invite everyone to visit the various threads on 21st century music. These are largely lesser known composers, young composers who benefit from your attention. You certainly won't like everything you hear, but you certainly will like *something* you hear!


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## mmsbls (Mar 6, 2011)

Portamento said:


> I'd like to do Algernon Ashton next week, if you could schedule that.


Would you like to present Ashton on Saturday. Let me know and I'll "schedule" it. Maybe we can get some more people to champion more composers.


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## Pugg (Aug 8, 2014)

Portamento said:


> Not true; here's a quote from the article you linked:
> 
> "In honor of the composer's centennial, the Cantus label issued in 2014 a 5CD box set of the complete Šulek symphonies. It includes mono recordings (in good sound) from 1963 and 1964 of the first and fifth symphonies, a 1991 recording of the second, a 1971 recording of the sixth, a 1983 recording of the eighth, and 2012 and 2013 recordings of the third, fourth, and seventh. These last three recordings are with the Croatian Radio and Television Symphony Orchestra. The rest are played by the Zagreb Radio and Television Symphony Orchestra. The fifth and sixth symphonies are conducted by the composer, while the rest are conducted by Šulek's protégé and champion, Pavle Despalj. There are also Jugoton LP recordings, often available on used LP sites, of the Sixth Symphony conducted by the composer (presumably the same one as in the Cantus boxed set), and an earlier recording by Despalj of the Seventh Symphony from 1980 but by all means acquire the boxed set if you can. It is one of the most treasured sets in my collection."


Can't wait for you're inside this composer, I am honest, never heard the name before .


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## Bettina (Sep 29, 2016)

mmsbls said:


> Would you like to present Ashton on Saturday. Let me know and I'll "schedule" it. Maybe we can get some more people to champion more composers.


I'd like to do Cyril Scott on Saturday, July 8. I mentioned him a long time ago in this thread, before we were actually making specific plans, and now is a good time for me to follow through on this idea. Let me know if this is OK.


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## Portamento (Dec 8, 2016)

mmsbls said:


> Would you like to present Ashton on Saturday. Let me know and I'll "schedule" it. Maybe we can get some more people to champion more composers.


Oops, I completely missed this. I'm ready with Ashton whenever you want to schedule it.


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## mmsbls (Mar 6, 2011)

Portamento said:


> Oops, I completely missed this. I'm ready with Ashton whenever you decide to schedule it.


How about this Saturday, July 22? I apparently missed Bettina's request. Bettina would you like to do Scott next Saturday July 29th?


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## Bettina (Sep 29, 2016)

mmsbls said:


> How about this Saturday, July 22? I apparently missed Bettina's request. Bettina would you like to do Scott next Saturday July 29th?


Yes, Saturday July 29 works great for me! Thanks for offering me that slot. I'm looking forward to doing Scott - he was an eccentric character with some fascinating hobbies. He wrote some poems about reincarnation and books about natural health cures. I'll cover a bit of that stuff along with his music.


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## Portamento (Dec 8, 2016)

mmsbls said:


> How about this Saturday, July 22? I apparently missed Bettina's request. Bettina would you like to do Scott next Saturday July 29th?


Sounds good. I am looking forward to Cyril Scott - he is in the same boat as so many other British composers (Berkeley, Arnold, Rawsthorne, _Ashton_), all underappreciated (if not 'unknown').


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## eugeneonagain (May 14, 2017)

I look forward to the Scott. I posted a few of his piano pieces and a cello concerto. 

I've been listening to his music for the last two or three months. The 3rd Symphony is interesting; I'm fair convinced that both Miklos Rozsa and John Williams have been influenced by this in terms of harmony and orchestration. Others I have in rotation on the player are his Piano Quintet No.1; Vistas; Aubade and Piano Sonata no.1.


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## mmsbls (Mar 6, 2011)

This Saturday (July 22) Portamento will host Unknown Composer #6: Algernon Ashton. Next Saturday (JUly 29) Bettina will host Unknown Composer #7: Cyril Scott. Thanks for both of your efforts.

The *Unknown Composer series* has the following entries:

Déodat de Séverac
Giacomo Meyerbeer
Carl Tausig
Salomon Jadassohn
Ernst Toch

Anyone wishing to host an unknown composer may post here and suggest the name of a composer. The next available Saturday is August 5th.


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## hpowders (Dec 23, 2013)

Since when is Meyerbeer "unknown"? Underappreciated, yes. Unknown, no.


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## mmsbls (Mar 6, 2011)

hpowders said:


> Since when is Meyerbeer "unknown"? Underappreciated, yes. Unknown, no.


The thread, as discussed in the OP, focuses on _lesser known_ or "relatively unknown" composers. The goal is to discuss composers who are "marginalized or never get real attention on TC". There is no exact cutoff since members have largely varying experience.


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## eugeneonagain (May 14, 2017)

I wonder if perhaps anyone is familiar enough with Georges Onslow to want to do something on him? I only recently came across him, so I don't have that much listening experience. His string works - quartets and quintets - are excellent examples of chamber music and mastery of the quartet, very close to Beethoven.


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## S P Summers (Dec 23, 2016)

I haven't read any of this thread so I apologize if these lesser-known greats have already been mentioned, but here's my list. I should note that the vast, vast majority of the music I listen to is centered around the piano; so I am recommending these composers based on their piano concerti and piano sonatas:

- Moritz Moszkowski (1854-1925)
- Nikolai Medtner (1880-1951)
- Franz Xaver Scharwenka (1850-1924)
- Henryk Melcer-Szczawinski (1869-1928)
- Charles-Valentin Alkan (1813-1888)
- Władysław Żeleński (1837-1921)
- Anton Arensky (1861-1906)
- Zygmunt Stojowski (1869-1946)
- Johann Nepomuk Hummel (1778-1837)
- Charles-Marie Widor (1844-1937)
- Friedrich Kalkbrenner (1785-1849)
- Aleksander Zarzycki (1834–1895)
- Sergei Bortkiewicz (1877-1952)

Id also like to mention Camille Saint-Saëns (1835-1921). Even though he is *relatively* known (compared to the other composers I mentioned anyways); his music deserves more recognition.


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## S P Summers (Dec 23, 2016)

Here are two more who are alive today, unlike every other composer I mentioned:

- Jack Gibbons ( https://www.youtube.com/user/JackGibbonsHQ ) - My favorite interpreter of the music of Charles-Valentin Alkan; Gibbons has composed some excellent piano pieces.

- J Joe Townley ( https://www.youtube.com/user/JoeTownley ) - He composed a fantastic piano concerto and some wonderful smaller pieces; he deserves more recognition.


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## Portamento (Dec 8, 2016)

eugeneonagain said:


> I wonder if perhaps anyone is familiar enough with Georges Onslow to want to do something on him? I only recently came across him, so I don't have that much listening experience. His string works - quartets and quintets - are excellent examples of chamber music and mastery of the quartet, very close to Beethoven.


I completely agree! Amazing composer, whose string quartets were often coupled with Beethoven's and Mozart's. I would do a thread on him, but I need a break!


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## eugeneonagain (May 14, 2017)

I would like to have a go at doing Harald Genzmer, but I have a bit of a schedule at the moment. August 5th is a bit close, but I could try for it if no-one else is going to fill that date.


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## mmsbls (Mar 6, 2011)

eugeneonagain said:


> I would like to have a go at doing Harald Genzmer, but I have a bit of a schedule at the moment. August 5th is a bit close, but I could try for it if no-one else is going to fill that date.


That would be great. Why don't I follow up later next week to see if you can do Aug 5.


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## mmsbls (Mar 6, 2011)

The *Unknown Composer series* has the following entries:

Déodat de Séverac
Giacomo Meyerbeer
Carl Tausig
Salomon Jadassohn
Ernst Toch
Algernon Ashton
Cyril Scott

Anyone wishing to host an unknown composer may post here and suggest the name of a composer.


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## cimirro (Sep 6, 2016)

If eugeneonagain will be busy I can do Jozef Wieniawski this weekend (5) since I'll be at home


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## eugeneonagain (May 14, 2017)

cimirro said:


> If eugeneonagain will be busy I can do Jozef Wieniawski this weekend (5) since I'll be at home


Thanks Artur, that would be very convenient. I don't think I can make that date andI don't yet have enough material to do the composer proper justice.


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## mmsbls (Mar 6, 2011)

cimirro said:


> If eugeneonagain will be busy I can do Jozef Wieniawski this weekend (5) since I'll be at home


That sounds great.


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## Anankasmo (Jun 23, 2017)

Just wanted to add that this is a grat idea. I get the feeling that except of the German-Austrian tradition many composers on Tc are quite overlooked sadly.


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## cimirro (Sep 6, 2016)

Ok, It will be done, I'll try my best to make the old Jozef happy


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## Anankasmo (Jun 23, 2017)

Id also like to mention Camille Saint-Saëns (1835-1921). Even though he is *relatively* known (compared to the other composers I mentioned anyways); his music deserves more recognition.[/QUOTE]
Second that he is indeed quite overlooked especially his chamber music...... Should be placed next to Mendelssohn in term of popularity and importance for they were quite similiar in style and genius (both probably surpassed Mozart btw). Both ot their music flows so naturally it is a marvel indeed. Both were composers who valued form above everything else and who looked back to the baroque and especially classics. They were classicist in the Romantic Period and as such one century too early or to late haha. Both of them did not found a school or many imitators as their style is rather special.

Well i would say Widor, Kalkbrenner, Hummel, Arensky, Alkan, Scharwenka, Metdner and Moszkowski are quite know to the connoisseurs


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## Anankasmo (Jun 23, 2017)

S P Summers said:


> I haven't read any of this thread so I apologize if these lesser-known greats have already been mentioned, but here's my list. I should note that the vast, vast majority of the music I listen to is centered around the piano; so I am recommending these composers based on their piano concerti and piano sonatas:
> 
> - Moritz Moszkowski (1854-1925)
> - Nikolai Medtner (1880-1951)
> ...


 i wanted to reply to this post ...... my Tc skills are not polished yet


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## S P Summers (Dec 23, 2016)

Anankasmo said:


> Well i would say Widor, Kalkbrenner, Hummel, Arensky, Alkan, Scharwenka, Metdner and Moszkowski are quite know to the connoisseurs


Moszkowski, Kalkbrenner, Hummel and Medtner _do_ indeed receive *some* appreciation at least, but I'd say they are completely unknown outside of the "romantic piano aficionado" world... I almost included Anton Rubinstein in my list; but he is such a titanic figure in music history, it seems that everybody has heard of Rubinstein before any of the 12-15 pianist-composers I mentioned...

As for Alkan, Scharwenka, and Arensky: I feel this is rather ironic. Three of the greatest pianist-composers in history ("legends", if you will), and a *substantial* number of people who *should* be familiar with these great men, are not. I remember reading a YouTube comment on an Alkan video, where somebody commented: "It is a sad day when not even my music professor has heard of Alkan...". WOW. I believe it too.

Even the piano teacher I was with in my late teens/early 20s- conservatory trained, Beethoven specialist, and very passionate about 19th-early 20th century music... She told me that if it were not for her discovering Alkan by chance on her own; she would have never heard of him during the entirety of her music education.

I'd argue that Charles-Valentin Alkan is *_probably_* the most underrated pianist-composer in history. This is the man who Franz Liszt himself claimed was the "greatest living pianist". Apparently S.Thalberg was in the top tier as well; but for Liszt to be nearly universally regarded as "the greatest pianist of all time", and (apparently) Alkan's name barely receiving any mention in conservatories today ffs... It is a travesty. Alkan's unbelievable piano compositions are the product of an individual possessing the most absolute, fundamental mastery of the piano. Alkan, Moszkowski, and Godowsky's piano scores are the most beautiful, elegant, and efficient expressions of emotion communicated through the piano I have ever seen/heard.

Now, I'd like to briefly mention two of the pianist-composers on my list who are personal favorites, and who I have also quite literally NEVER met anyone else who has heard of them... They are Zygmunt Stojowski, and Henryk Melcer. Both of them composed two piano concerti, and those four pieces of music all occupy a place on my "top 10 all time favorite pieces of music" list. Especially the Melcer PC#1 and the Stojowski PC#2. They are simply magnificent beyond what English is capable of describing, so I'm not even going to try.

Here is a link to buy these concerti, I cannot recommend them enough (start with the Melcer):

- http://www.hyperion-records.co.uk/dc.asp?dc=D_CDA67630
- http://www.hyperion-records.co.uk/dc.asp?dc=D_CDA67314


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## mmsbls (Mar 6, 2011)

The *Unknown Composer series* has the following entries:

Déodat de Séverac
Giacomo Meyerbeer
Carl Tausig
Salomon Jadassohn
Ernst Toch
Algernon Ashton
Cyril Scott
Józef Wieniawski

Anyone wishing to host an unknown composer may post here and suggest the name of a composer.


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## Roger Knox (Jul 19, 2017)

Maybe its my academic music background but I find these lists daunting -- there are just too many composers. Like right now I'm investigating lesser-known German and Austrian orchestral composers active between c. 1880-c. 1950, and even that seems overly broad. And a BIG need for some of us is the revival of great music by excellent composers from that time period who didn't follow the tenets of modernism and became neglected as a result. I'm not against modernism and do realize that some modernists have been neglected too. So often in reading of unknown composers it's really some version of "Romanticism vs. Modernism" that's involved.


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## adrien (Sep 12, 2016)

Manfredini. And Torelli.


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