# Franz Berwald



## jurianbai

Franz Berwald 1796-1868

Now that I read this name oftenly in the forum, should he need a thread. I got the string quartets by him, which I found just above mediocre. But then I have listen his Violin concerto in C sharp , sounds good and plan to getting it.










He lived in quite the same era of Beethoven (17 December 1770 - 26 March 1827).


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## HarpsichordConcerto

Seems we're the only two members who mentioned poor old Berwald. I bought some of his chamber music recently. Listenable stuff but not over the moon.


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## jurianbai

Well, I saw members vote for his Symphony no.3 and also his Violin Concerto been mentioned in other thread. But for chamber looks like we are his only listener :lol:



> Of Berwald's E-flat major String Quartet, Paul Griffiths finds that the "achievement ... of a new formal shape is remarkable enough, even if the single-movement structures of Liszt or Schumann are more tightly bound."
> 
> Paul Griffiths, The String Quartet: A History. New York: Thames & Hudson (1983): 124 - 125.


There is also a Piano concerto and few Operas that applaud from wikipedia article.


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## joen_cph

Well I also have his works; as regards the chamber music the Piano Trios and String Quartets have gained my attention so far, but the orchestral works are often very nice. He was anything but a conformist, the works are very inventive and capricious, often pleasantly unpredictable and fresh, which is why the rather conservative public of his own days even laughed him out in his early years. 
Regrettably it must be admitted that he is much more interesting than his Danish contemporaries - such as Weyse, N.W.Gade, Hornemann, Hartmann and Heise, not to say the Norwegians Ole Bull and Thomas Tellefsen.

*PS:* (a later remark) ... perhaps the Swedish recording on the caprice label should be checked out by those finding him dull - or the more recent BIS one ...
But *Kuhlau* might be a rival as regards attractive music ...


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## Head_case

Well, you're not the only two....!

I used to have the Berwald string quartets (Chilingirian Quartet). I must confess, that like you, I found them bland and generally indifferent. 

There's much Scandanavian string quartet works which are superb - maybe it's Berwald's conventional, if not unimaginative style. Perhaps the string quartet was not his forte and he applied himself better elsewhere. 

The new formal shape which Paul Griffiths lauds, may very well be an academic and theoretical compositional achievement. It isn't the quite of achievement which makes for emotionally engaging music for listeners imho.


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## JSK

Don't dismiss Berwald based solely on his quartets. He wrote four excellent symphonies and some good opera overtures as well.


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## Weston

I am championing Berwald's Symphony No. 3 in the TC Top 150 Symphonies thread, for what it's worth.


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## starry

I've loved his 3rd since the 90s when I heard Sixten Ehrling's pioneering recording on an lp.


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## TresPicos

I have seen Franz Berwald being described as the...


Swedish Beethoven
Swedish Mendelssohn
Swedish Schumann
Does any of those descriptions make sense? I'm not into the Romantic Era myself, so I'm not that familiar with Berwald's music.


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## Toccata

TresPicos said:


> I have seen Franz Berwald being described as the...
> 
> 
> Swedish Beethoven
> Swedish Mendelssohn
> Swedish Schumann
> Does any of those descriptions make sense? I'm not into the Romantic Era myself, so I'm not that familiar with Berwald's music.


I'm not that familar with Berwald's music but I have a small sample of his works:

- Grand Septet in B flat major
- Overture to the Queen of Golconda
- Play of the Elves
- Sinfonie singuliere

I only bought because I spotted some-one raviing about it somewhere on some forum. I've often done that kind of thing and have seldom been pleased with the results. In my view all the material listed above is unremarkable stuff. In style it could be Mendelssohn on a bad hair day, but it doesn't really seem to have any clear identity. To be fair, the Grand septet isn't that bad, but it's not a patch on Mendelssohn's Octet, let alone Schubert's Octet, both which are far better. Sorry I can't give any of it a better recommendation.


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## elgar's ghost

I have his 4 symphonies and am happy enough with them but they are all I've heard. I was once told that even his better chamber works would struggle for parity with the likes of Hummel and Spohr (let alone comparisons with Mendelsohn and Schubert).


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## science

David Horwitz is also a champion of Symphony #3, and of the piano concerto, as a result of which I bought and once listened to the Naxos recording he was promoting. I don't remember it, but that makes at least 2 fans of Berwald 3.


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## mmsbls

I have all 4 of his symphonies, the piano and violin concerto, tone poems, and some chamber works. To me his best works are the 3rd symphony that others here have talked about and his violin concerto, which I especially like. The piano concerto is a nice work but nothing overwhelming. I agree that his chamber work is not special.


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## ArtsongLind

I heard Berwalds symphonic poem "Memories from the Norwegian Mountains" (-"Fjällen") live a few weeks ago in Ulm, Germany.
Great piece!


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## GoneBaroque

I have Berwald's symphonies 1 and 4 conducted by Herbert Blomstedt which I enjoy. Am not familiar with his chamber works.


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## Tiziana

Could anybody tell me why he used French titles for his symphonies? 

Did he have any connection to France?

Thanks a lot.

Tiz


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## violadude

I thought parts of Sweden did speak french?...or was that Switzerland? I forgot.


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## TresPicos

violadude said:


> I thought parts of Sweden did speak french?...or was that Switzerland? I forgot.


I haven't noticed any such parts here in Sweden so far, but we're a sparsely populated country, so there could very well exist some undiscovered French-speaking pockets somewhere.


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## clavichorder

I'm listening to his 3rd symphony right now. I am finding it pleasant and a little different. It has a smooth style but with some interesting idiosyncrasies.


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## elgar's ghost

TresPicos said:


> I haven't noticed any such parts here in Sweden so far, but we're a sparsely populated country, so there could very well exist some undiscovered French-speaking pockets somewhere.


Perhaps he was trying to wheedle his way into House of Bernadotte's favour? :devil:


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## Guest

Hmm...never visited this particular thread until now. I enjoy Berwald's orchestral works and have thought of trying some of his chamber music. Is it safe to say, however, that reactions to his chamber works are still lukewarm, as they seem to have been 3-4 years ago?


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## elgar's ghost

arcaneholocaust said:


> Hmm...never visited this particular thread until now. I enjoy Berwald's orchestral works and have thought of trying some of his chamber music. Is it safe to say, however, that reactions to his chamber works are still lukewarm, as they seem to have been 3-4 years ago?


Berwald's chamber output is as rarely-mentioned now as it was before, so I'm assuming most have never heard any or aren't exactly crazy about the ones they have. I think Berwald's reputation is destined to remain with his symphonies unless there is some serious re-evaluation of his other works at some point in the future.


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## Triplets

I have his Symphonies, both on Naxos and the Roy Goodman recordings. Good luck ever encountering this Music in a Concert Hall, except perhaps in Sweden.


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## clavichorder

That rhythm/motif with downward fourth interval in the first movement of the third symphony, that perpetuates through the whole movement, sounds really exhilarating when the horns are played with proper precision and punch. 

I think the Swedish radio symphony recording really does it justice.


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## GioCar

I've just listened for the first time to his third symphony "Singulière". It's on today's _Saturday Symphonies_ program.

Undoubtely an interesting work, which left me a bit cold anyway. The first movement is quite curious with all those repeating fourths.

I've also found a good introduction to all his symphonies on classical.net


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## science

Thanks for that link, Giocar; and for the recommendation, Clavi.


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## GioCar

science said:


> Thanks for that link, Giocar; and for the recommendation, Clavi.


You're welcome


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## SixFootScowl

I just discovered this composer while flipping through a book on classical music. I checked out some clips and was excited, and so just ordered Roy Goodman's set of the four symphonies.


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## KenOC

Tiziana said:


> Could anybody tell me why he used French titles for his symphonies?
> 
> Did he have any connection to France?
> 
> Thanks a lot.
> 
> Tiz


A lot of people used French in those days for artistic works. Think of Beethoven's "Pathetique" sonata - or his Op. 81a, that the publisher named "Les adieux" even though Ludwig wanted the German "Das Lebewohl". I guess the French were considered refined or something.

Same today when expensive cars are always sold on TV by people with plummy British accents -- even if the cars are Japanese!


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## Pugg

KenOC said:


> A lot of people used French in those days for artistic works. Think of Beethoven's "Pathetique" sonata - or his Op. 81a, that the publisher named "Les adieux" even though Ludwig wanted the German "Das Lebewohl". I guess the French were considered refined or something.
> 
> Same today when expensive cars are always sold on TV by people with plummy British accents -- even if the cars are Japanese!


For some reason I don't think this post will be read by Tiziana...


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## Vaneyes

Pugg said:


> For some reason I don't think this post will be read by Tiziana...


You and I reading it is enough. Quite enough. 

While I'm here, I think the *Berwald *Piano Quintets (1853, 1857) hold their own with early Romantic and somewhat later brethren. They won't go toe-to-toe with Franck, Dvorak, and Brahms, but respectable nonetheless.


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## Pugg

Vaneyes said:


> You and I reading it is enough. Quite enough.
> 
> While I'm here, I think the *Berwald *Piano Quintets (1853, 1857) hold their own with early Romantic and somewhat later brethren. They won't go toe-to-toe with Franck, Dvorak, and Brahms, but respectable nonetheless.


You are right, :cheers:


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## sbmonty

I enjoyed Berwald's Grand Septet. I am planning on purchasing his Symphonies, which seem to be his most regarded compositions. Suggestions anyone?


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## Pugg

sbmonty said:


> I enjoyed Berwald's Grand Septet. I am planning on purchasing his Symphonies, which seem to be his most regarded compositions. Suggestions anyone?


If you only want the symphonies , you have two options:
Gothenburg Symphony Orchestra, Neeme Järvi on DG or the Swedish Radio Symphony Orchestra, Roy Goodman, on Hyprion.
Naxos however recorded the also but the are spread over several disc with other works.
The Jarvi set is very good.


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## KenOC

Berwald symphonies: You can also choose Kamu, Dausgaard, and Ehrling Sixten. I prefer the Dausgaard but haven’t heard the Sixten, which has some very enthusiastic fans, or the Kamu. All are available from Amazon.


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## Haydn man

Having listened to the Berwald symphonies via Spotify before I purchased then I can recommend either the Roy Goodman or the Ehrling Sixten set.
I chose the Goodman one as it was cheaper


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## sbmonty

Once again everyone is very helpful. Thanks. I will begin listening and choose.


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## Pugg

sbmonty said:


> Once again everyone is very helpful. Thanks. I will begin listening and choose.


Please let us know how you are did get on in time.


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## Joachim Raff

Berwald: Symphony No. 1 in G minor 'Sinfonie sérieuse'








Ehrling is the perfect Berwald conductor


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