# What do classical music listeners think of rap/hip hop?



## PresenTense (May 7, 2016)

I wouldn't call myself a fan or follower of it but I find a couple of songs I like now and then.


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## Joe B (Aug 10, 2017)

PresenTense said:


> I wouldn't call myself a fan or follower of it but I* find *a couple of songs I like now and then.


To expose myself to rap or hip hop would require me to *"find"* songs that I would occasionally care for (radio, youtube, etc.); however, I don't. Since my interests lie elsewhere, I spend my time looking for music that is more up my alley. Nothing intrinsically wrong with rap or hip hop, and I'm sure there are good songs out there, but it's just not my cup of tea.


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## cimirro (Sep 6, 2016)

PresenTense said:


> I wouldn't call myself a fan or follower of it but I find a couple of songs I like now and then.


By the way, would you call yourself a fan or follower of classical music?... Can't remember any post of yours related to classical music at all, :devil: :lol:


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## violadude (May 2, 2011)

There's some rap/hip hop that I do like. Usually they have really involved instrumentals or they have a message that I really like.


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## Gordontrek (Jun 22, 2012)

Fate has yet to expose me to a rap/hip hop song that doesn't nauseate me.


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## MarkW (Feb 16, 2015)

I think of it more as "poetry with a beat" than music.


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## david johnson (Jun 25, 2007)

I never think of rap. There have been a few rap selections I've heard that were interesting. I believe it makes a good contrasting segment within the context of a mostly melodic song.


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## Mandryka (Feb 22, 2013)

MarkW said:


> I think of it more as "poetry with a beat" than music.


Like recitative maybe?


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## eugeneonagain (May 14, 2017)

My interest is not so involved these days, but I always liked original hip-hop music from the early-to-mid '80s and some from the later 80s and early '90s like Ice-T and especially KRS One. Positive social and political consciousness has not entirely disappeared from hip-hop culture.


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## Biwa (Aug 3, 2015)

It can be powerful stuff. Love the beat. 

Recently watched a good movie about Rap in the 1980s, called "Straight Outta Compton"


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## Alydon (May 16, 2012)

I've never written off any form of musical genre so a good bit of anything on a sunny day with a bottle of cheap wine can certainly do the trick.


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## Captainnumber36 (Jan 19, 2017)

I really dislike Rap/Hip Hop. It's never done it for me being that I really like melody.


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## Judith (Nov 11, 2015)

Don't!! I can't call that "music"!!!!


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## mtmailey (Oct 21, 2011)

THIS IS WHAT I THINK.the music has declined in quality.Also there is mumble rap which is proof of what i talking about.


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## eugeneonagain (May 14, 2017)

mtmailey said:


> Also there is mumble rap which is proof of what i talking about.


I just searched for "mumble rap" and ended up at Wikipedia... It's a strange article. It's 90% about it being a pejorative term and a discussion involving the views of people with bizarre names like: 'Lil Yachty', 'Wiz Khalifa' and 'Playboi Carti'.

More interesting is in the list under the 'See Also' section, the article author(s) added _Asemic writing_. It's the sort of thing that would start a revolution here at TC were a thread to be started about it.


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## Guest (Oct 15, 2017)

I can't adequately express my hatred of it without getting banned from this forum.


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## Blancrocher (Jul 6, 2013)

I tend to like the songs were the artist brags about having lots of money.


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## Kivimees (Feb 16, 2013)

I would rather listen to the sounds of jack-hammering.


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## isorhythm (Jan 2, 2015)

Most people here will never get it, I'm afraid.


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## eugeneonagain (May 14, 2017)

Wonder how many are willing to listen to that diabolical 'Christian Rock/Pop' though?


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## Bulldog (Nov 21, 2013)

I rarely listen to it, but I don't have any problem when I hear it.


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## Dim7 (Apr 24, 2009)

This is an example of rap with a good healthy message:


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## DaveM (Jun 29, 2015)

I don't mind some of it if there is some melody involved. If it's just pure rap with a steady beat, I classify it more as a form of poetry rather than music.


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## PlaySalieri (Jun 3, 2012)

dont know much rap - Blondie's Rapture was a great track and early example.
Ian Dury's reason's to be cheerful was a little masterpiece - but maybe not rap as such even though he talks it through.

as for the true black man rap - sounds mostly like angry boys in the hood twaddle

anyway I'm more likely to listen to country and western which is very unlikely

I suppose - in short - rap is c**p


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## SixFootScowl (Oct 17, 2011)

I don't think of Rap or Hip Hop.


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## senza sordino (Oct 20, 2013)

> What do classical music listeners think of rap/hip hop?


I can't speak for all classical music listeners, but this listener of classical doesn't think much of rap/hip hop. If I never hear rap or hip hop ever again I will be very grateful, and my life will be richer.


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## DaveM (Jun 29, 2015)

Here is one of my favorite melodic rap songs. Okay, I know it's probably considered to be 'white rap' , but I like it. Note the beautiful refrain with cello starting at 2:45.


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## Weston (Jul 11, 2008)

*Knee jerk reaction to the question:*
I like rap and hip hop even more than I like country, which is to say I'd rather have a root canal without anesthesia. I think it promotes violence. I certainly want to commit violence when I hear it.

*More considered answer:*
My biggest complaint with it is the diction of most of the lyric delivery I've heard so far. Why would one want to promote or even celebrate seeming near illiteracy? This is the same problem I have with some country music only more so.

Having said that I do like many genres of "electronica" that branched off from hip hop. Rap and hip hop are not really part of my culture, but I think when they bleed over and cross pollinate with other genres is where the creativity that most interests me may thrive.


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## MarkW (Feb 16, 2015)

Mandryka said:


> Like recitative maybe?


Except I never think of recitative has having a beat -- or of being poetic for that matter.


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## stevens (Jun 23, 2014)

Agressive, sexistic yelling. Nothing more


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## Ziggabea (Apr 5, 2017)

Isn't this thread in the wrong subforum?


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## St Matthew (Aug 26, 2017)

You old people are so out of the loop :lol:


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## St Matthew (Aug 26, 2017)

Blancrocher said:


> I tend to like the songs were the artist brags about having lots of money.


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## St Matthew (Aug 26, 2017)

senza sordino said:


> I can't speak for all classical music listeners, but this listener of classical doesn't think much of rap/hip hop. If I never hear rap or hip hop ever again I will be very grateful, and my life will be richer.


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## St Matthew (Aug 26, 2017)

Gordontrek said:


> Fate has yet to expose me to a rap/hip hop song that doesn't nauseate me.


Fate? Nauseate? OK!


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## St Matthew (Aug 26, 2017)

Classical music fans tend to criticize the general public for believing the stereotypes about classical music being a soft, old irrelevant type of music, yet they don't learn from it. 
Here on TC, everyone here is just rehashing the same boring cliches that even the rap/hip hop community make fun of, within their own musical culture. 

This is aside from personal taste, it just shows that these TC regulars both know little to no rap/hip hop and simply don't like rap (which is fine).


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## eugeneonagain (May 14, 2017)

St Matthew said:


> Classical music fans tend to criticize the general public for believing the stereotypes about classical music being a soft, old irrelevant type of music, yet they don't learn from it.


Quite true. A good observation.



St Matthew said:


> Here on TC, *everyone* here is just rehashing the same boring cliches that even the rap/hip hop community make fun of, within their own musical culture.


No sir, not everyone.


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## Simon Moon (Oct 10, 2013)

isorhythm said:


> Most people here will never get it, I'm afraid.


Oh please...

I get it. I understand the cultural context it arose from, the importance of it for certain cultures to make statements about their place in society, their anger, etc. I even get it as an important form of spoken word art form.

I can get all that and more about it, and still not find it appealing.

It has nothing I look for in music. That is the only reason why I dislike it.

I listen to several forms of music besides classical that all have certain attributes that I enjoy, those being: jazz, fusion, prog, avant-prog, prog-metal. The attributes they all have in common are; complexity, depth of emotion, musicianship, long form compositions, etc.

I hear none of the above in any Rap or hip hop I have ever heard.


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## ClassicalListener (Oct 17, 2014)

Complete trash.

I listen mostly to classical, but also jazz and hard rock. Hip-hop, rap, tropical, reguetón, under no circumstances.


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## EddieRUKiddingVarese (Jan 8, 2013)

Breaking news - early discovery of Hip Hop as originally a classical form invented by Debussy


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## EddieRUKiddingVarese (Jan 8, 2013)




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## St Matthew (Aug 26, 2017)

ClassicalListener said:


> Complete trash.
> 
> I listen mostly to classical, but also jazz and hard rock. Hip-hop, rap, tropical, reguetón, under no circumstances.


Have you ever thought of dyeing your hair purple and joining a circus?


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## Blancrocher (Jul 6, 2013)

Despite a lot of competition, I believe that no other musical genre has done so much to promote promiscuous sexuality.


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## Jos (Oct 14, 2013)

Blancrocher said:


> Despite a lot of competition, I believe that no other musical genre has done so much to promote promiscuous sexuality.


Yup, that and the consumption of astonishing amounts of weed.


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## EddieRUKiddingVarese (Jan 8, 2013)

^ Does that mean the Cheech and Chong are rap artists?


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## Larkenfield (Jun 5, 2017)

Rap and Hip-hop are about today and not about Europe 200 years ago. The world has changed. The lyrics, as crude and explicit as they sometimes are, often give insight into how an individual or community feels about today's world, and that revealing content just might be worth noting in an oftentimes troubled society. 

The extent of the lyrics goes way beyond the usual standard song lyrics of most contemporary songs. It's expanded free verse that can cram many times the usual amount of content and is a real breakthrough in the history of songs. It's similar to the free or blank verse that the poets of the 50s and 60s used to recite to jazz improvisation. So I believe there is an artistic impulse, perhaps even a genius, behind the expanded lyrics of rap and hip-hop.

Do I seek out the music? No. But some of what I've heard over the years has sounded inspired, other than so much of it reminded me of a cynical money-making machine where the rap artists are exploiting its audience with what sounds like the most base of sentiments regarding sex, $$, drugs, relationships, and community. 

Going back a few years, I thought Eminem's Lose Yourself, Mockingbird, and 8 Mile Road were deeply personal and inspired. He also upset a lot of people, and sometimes society needs to be shaken up to make room for change, or to wake up the powers-that-be living in their safe ivory-tower of (white?) privilege or indifference.


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## Phil loves classical (Feb 8, 2017)

Yeah, I like rap. Sometimes has some irresistible grooves, bass and rhythms (to me at least) especially in Beastie Boys Paul’s Boutique and Naughty by Nature’s first album.


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## LezLee (Feb 21, 2014)

Have a listen to The Streets (Mike Skinner) who is classified as Rap/Hip-Hop/Garage.
I haven't heard much rap and hate most of what I have, but this is tuneful with good lyrics and shows you can't dismiss anything out of hand.






BTW I'm a 77-year-old woman, hardly the target audience!


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## Simon Moon (Oct 10, 2013)

Larkenfield said:


> Rap and Hip-hop are about today and not about Europe 200 years ago. The world has changed. The lyrics, as crude and explicit as they sometimes are, often give insight into how an individual or community feels about today's world, and that revealing content just might be worth noting in an oftentimes troubled society.
> 
> The extent of the lyrics goes way beyond the usual standard song lyrics of most contemporary songs. It's expanded free verse that can cram many times the usual amount of content and is a real breakthrough in the history of songs. It's similar to the free or blank verse that the poets of the 50s and 60s used to recite to jazz improvisation. So I believe there is an artistic impulse, perhaps even a genius, behind the expanded lyrics of rap and hip-hop.
> 
> ...


And I can completely understand and respect this aspect of Rap.

When a large portion of a society is part of an underclass, with no real means of expressing their grievances and concerns, they will reach for any outlet they have access to.

As I've said on previous threads about Rap, as a form of a spoken word artform, a lot of it (especially when it's political) has real merit. But since I am not a fan of spoken word art forms, I am not interested in it on that level.

But I see nothing redeeming in, from a musical standpoint. It is poorly played, with little or no variety, repetitive, simple, etc. There are zero aspects of Rap or hip hop that I appreciate in music. And that is the only way I can evaluate music. My dislike of Rap and hip hop has nothing to do with anything except as music.


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## GraemeG (Jun 30, 2009)

Barely literate, either musically or lyrically. What's to like?
I get that it might be an outlet for social rage. or dispossession, or similar.
But as music, it holds no interest whatever, since it uses so little of the elements available.

Rather like asking a master chocolatier what they think of M&Ms...
Graeme


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## SixFootScowl (Oct 17, 2011)

PresenTense said:


> I wouldn't call myself a fan or follower of it but I find a couple of songs I like now and then.


Ya gotta love this one!


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## erki (Feb 17, 2020)

It is like with every kind of music that you get some really good examples and then you have tons of mediocre stuff. Classical music a bit less so because centuries have cleaned off some of the lame pieces.
I listen rap rarely but I like Eminem the best - he has most wonderful and intelligent rhymes. Now more recent mumble-rap gets fair a bit attention in my listening time mainly because we have some excellent artists right here in Estonia - namely Nublu and Tommy Cash. "Classic"(1970's) hip-hop no so much however the derivative trip-hop, house is what I like to listen rather often - Faithless, Lionrock.

Also the visual is fantastic:


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## ThaNotoriousNIC (Jun 29, 2020)

Rap and hip-hop fan here. Before classical music became my primary genre of music about two years ago or so, I was very heavy in rap. I started listening to rap back in high school, familiarizing myself with a lot of the really high quality and famous rappers and albums from the late 80s to the early 2000s. A common day for me would be the following rappers:

1) The Notorious BIG: The namesake of my username. The undisputed king of hop hop for me back in the day. Nowadays, I still love Biggie, but his catalog of only two albums during his life prevents you from finding any new or hidden gems within his discography. Shame he died so young. Favorite song: Everyday Struggle from Ready to Die

2) Snoop Dogg: Everything from Doggystyle to Tha Blue Carpet Treatment was and still is game for me. A lot of his albums after that are largely hit (Bush) or miss (Make America Crip Again). Favorite Song: Tha Shiznit from Doggystyle

3) Wu Tang Clan: Similar to Snoop Dogg, the group had an incredible run of albums from their debut (Enter the Wu Tang) to Iron Flag (the last album with ODB I believe). After ODB died, the group was never the same again, egos grew, and you are better off going into each member's solo works at that point. My favorite member of the group is GZA, who I believe has been said to have one of the highest volcabularies in the game. Favorite song: Duel of the Iron Mic from GZA's Liquid Swords

4) Busta Rhymes: I've been lucky to see him twice in concert before and he still has a lot of fuel left in the tank. He has been more about features and some mixtapes these days, but I am a big fan of his early albums from The Coming all the way to Genesis. Best song: Gimme Some More from Extinction Level Event

5) 2Pac: He has a large discography given the time he was in the game. His work is fairly consistent in my opinion and I think he was getting better as he was getting older. I don't think he has the same appeal to me as some of the East Coast rappers and I question his street cred at times (if you read up about Tupac Shakur, his life is full of complexities and quirks). Nonetheless, I have a lot of love for his music. Favorite song: Bury Me a G from Thug Life

What is my opinion of rap as a classical music fan, especially after I've delved into the genre more and I now listen to opera? I and other people will surely say how classical music is technically superior to genres like rap, pop, and rock. As these genres are all rooted in Western music theory, they do not explore theory to the nearest extent as classical music does. From an emotional perspective, it is all dependent on the listener. Rap is different from classical in that the lyrics are incredibly crucial whereas classical's emotions and themes can be captured in music without words. A good beat can make a great sounding rap song, but the lyrics are what can elevate a rap song to a level where it makes you think and can be considered higher art. Rap is based in poetry after all, so if you don't have impactful lyrics, your song is not going to stand out from any other typical song in popular music.

Much of the genre these days fails to reach that level, with mumble rap and other party tracks from the southern hip hop scene (Atlanta is the big scene of the last couple years) dominating all syndicated rap radio in the United States. You can of course name a couple of rappers in this era doing some good work (Kendrick, J. Cole, maybe DaBaby), but rap is a shell of its former self due to commercialism and marketing taking the lead (I believe the trend gained steam in the late 90s with Diddy's glam rap).

For the fun of it, I am going to link some songs below that utilize orchestral music in its beat.

1. Gimme Some More, Busta Rhymes: Sample is from Bernard Hermann's title music for Psycho






2. Animal Rap, Jedi Mind Tricks: From Dave Grusin's soundtrack for The Bonfire of the Vanities (very classical sounding beat)






3. The Soul Controller, Ghostface Killah: From J.S. Bach's Brandenburg Concerto No. 1 Mvmt II (sounds very different here)






4. Coming 2 America, Ludacris: Sample of Mozart's Requiem (Dis Irae) and Dvorak's 9th Symphony Mvmt IV (Warning explicit from the get-go)






5. I Can, Nas: Sample of Beethoven's Fur Elise (Not my favorite at all, but it is a very famous Nas song)


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## Granate (Jun 25, 2016)

I'm a causal Rap/Hip Hop listener. I had my hook era in 2014 along techno and still like many works from that year, but then switched to classical. I can't tell I really appreciate the genre enough because I barely care for the lyrics of any song. And it's music for me, with a heavy effort in lyricism and often really sophisticated, daring, agressive beats and instrumentation.

I would some times tell that I appreciate or know music from Young Fathers or Run The Jewels, but I don't really spin it often. Also, Opera has made me prove that I do care for music lyrics and librettos and would make the effort to get inside a masterwork like _La Forza del Destino_ or _Parsifal_, but not for Urban music as I usually call it.

I respect Kendrick Lamar and wish he got way more awards even if I don't get inside his music, just scratching the surface. Apart from not understanding anything about the complexity of Frank Ocean. But that's just my ignorant ranting about something I'm not as interested in as the complete Beethoven live performances conducted during Otto Klemperer's lifetime.


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## pianozach (May 21, 2018)

Hip Hop / Rap is a genre with which I'm extraordinarily unfamiliar. I couldn't tell a Tupac from a Biggie track even if there were a gun to my head.

There's a few reasons for this . . . I'm not that much of a lyrics guy for starters, being much more into composition, arrangement, development, complexity, counterpoint, virtuosity, creativity . . . 

Early rap completely turned me off . . . I really disliked the reliance on non-singing vocals, the yelling, the repetitive nature of the genre, and it's simplicity.

I do enjoy some of the singing hip hop, but I still can't tell one artist from another.


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## Ich muss Caligari werden (Jul 15, 2020)

_Pace_ biwa, I don't love the beat. Bass lines are too often too loud and oppressive for mine ears. However, some of the poetry - it _is_ that - is clever, amusing, sometimes brilliant. Its social commentary is significant, certainly worthy of greater attention than I give it.


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## HolstThePhone (Oct 11, 2015)

It's amazing how many people here feel well-informed on rap/hip-hop enough to definitively write it off as a genre. To be honest, it smacks of arrogance. When people here describe hip hop as just "about drugs, sex and violence" or "meaningless", it's on the same level of idiocy as someone describing baroque music as "just tapping away on harpsichords". The lyrical skill rappers have is unmatched to any other musical genre. Yes, some songs are meaningless, but judging any genre by it's worst examples is absurd. I'll give some examples of songs that demonstrate skill and have meaning to them.

Akala - Fire in the Booth (part 1) (social commentary that shows brilliant lyricism)





Joyner Lucas - Keep it 100 (tells the story from the perspective of a $100 bill changing hands over the course of a few days)





Immortal Technique - Dance with the Devil (BIG graphic content warning on this one, the lyrics are very disturbing. Tragic story of the dark side of ambition.)


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## Art Rock (Nov 28, 2009)

It's clear it has a target audience, also among TC members, but I'm not in it. The accidental exposure (usually on the street by teenagers playing it on their handphones without headphones) annoys me. I have tried several times in the past to listen to samples of this music recommended in TC threads (just now the Akala lnked above) and it fails to connect with me in any way (or vice versa). I'm sure that the prog rock bands that I listen to mostly aside from classical will also fail to connect with several people here. So be it.


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## CarlHaydn284 (Jul 12, 2020)

I am not a fan of rap at all, but I would rather be strapped down for one hour and be forced to listen to it rather than willfully listening to Debussy for more than 1 minute.


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## pianozach (May 21, 2018)

HolstThePhone said:


> *It's amazing how many people here feel well-informed on rap/hip-hop enough to definitively write it off as a genre*. To be honest, it smacks of arrogance. When people here describe hip hop as just "about drugs, sex and violence" or "meaningless", it's on the same level of idiocy as someone describing baroque music as "just tapping away on harpsichords". The lyrical skill rappers have is unmatched to any other musical genre. Yes, some songs are meaningless, but judging any genre by it's worst examples is absurd. I'll give some examples of songs that demonstrate skill and have meaning to them.
> 
> Akala - Fire in the Booth (part 1) (social commentary that shows brilliant lyricism)
> 
> ...


If it's not a genre, then what IS it? :devil:


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## Phil loves classical (Feb 8, 2017)

I relistened to my Public Enemy's Apocalypse 91 album recently as a break from Classical. It was highly entertaining. Loved the production. Plus notice old school rap did have more high-low pitch variation, not like Drake's monotone delivery.


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## erki (Feb 17, 2020)

Recently I acquired large(over 150 CDs) collection of various promo material sent to a radio station over the last decade. Mostly hip/hop, trip, electronic, rap etc. I have been enjoying this music last couple of weeks every day. Makes great background while working. My absolute favourite rap artist is Eminem. However some local mumble-rap is great as well - like Tommy Cash.


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## Oldhoosierdude (May 29, 2016)

I appreciate the artistry behind serious music of these genre, but it isn't for me. 

Besides, with hip hop at my age, if I hopped I might break a hip.


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## Varick (Apr 30, 2014)

Like any genre of music, it has good and bad. Like any genre of music, you will have people who love it, hate it, or just feel "meh" about it. To discard it as some worthless noise, MAY be a bit too far. I would never argue that "musically," it lacks as an overall genre. However, some of the lyrical and verbal acrobatics that some of these rap artists (and they truly are "artists") do is nothing short of brilliant. Eminem is the first to come to mind. My last piano teacher (who has a PhD in music and philosophy & used to be the Chairman for the PhD Music Program of NYU) is one of the most sought after "musicologist" experts in the Western World when it comes to lawsuits in the music industry. He has been the expert for lawsuits that included Prince, Allman Brothers, Billy Joel, Stevie Wonder, Michael Jackson, Metallica, Joe Satriani, David Bowie, Led Zepplin, Eminem and many many others. 

We still get together about once a year for dinner to catch up, and when he was telling me the process of Eminem's song writing, how he puts the lyrics together on paper, then records them is nothing short of astounding. He said that Eminem was one of the most talented people he has ever met and worked with. I had always enjoyed Eminem before that dinner, but since then (about 5 or 6 years ago), it has given me a much greater appreciation of Rap and Hip/Hop.

And Thank you HolstThePhone! That song Fire In The Booth by Akala is nothing short of brilliant. That man is talented. I just downloaded two of his albums and look forward to listening to them. The second song you posted was "meh" (IMO) and the third song by Immortal Technique was brilliant (and frightening) storytelling. Outright Shakespearean!

Like all genre's of music, you have to sift through a lot of garbage to find the gems. As one person put it above, thankfully when it comes to Classical Music, time has done that for us to large degree. If you don't like Rap, fine. I can't stand Metal and Country Music (makes my skin crawl), but I would never deny there is some great talent and material in both of them.

HolstThePhone, does Immortal Technique have a lot of material of that kind of quality? and are there any other artist out there who are in line with Eminem and Akala? I'm a huge Tupac fan as well, but there are a lot of other popular rap artists that I can't stand, like NAS. I'm always looking for another Eminem or Tupac. I'm hoping Akala fits that bill, but still looking for more.

V


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## pianozach (May 21, 2018)

senza sordino said:


> I can't speak for all classical music listeners, but this listener of classical doesn't think much of rap/hip hop. If I never hear rap or hip hop ever again I will be very grateful, and my life will be richer.


I am very close to having this opinion as well.

These is very little in the hip hop and rap catalog that love. There's some that doesn't rub me the wrong way. Some of it is grating, irritating. I understand rap intellectually, but I really don't like hearing it.

In fact, I just created a new Youtube playlist using tracks from the *Rolling Stone Greatest Albums of All Time*, 2020 version, which is pretty heavy on the rap/hip hop. Methodology, since I am unfamiliar with the artists, albums, or songs, was to

When they update their list again in another 7 years a lot of the shinola will have left those albums, and they'll have dragged in a bunch of albums from the 2020s.


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## SanAntone (May 10, 2020)

I have listened to some hip-hop, or at least I think I have. I am not educated enough in the varients of rap/hip-hop to know where someone like *D'Angelo* falls, but I consider his music to be excellent. Also *Lauren Hill* and *Jill Scott*, *The Roots*, *Fugees*, *A Tribe Called Quest*, the *Black Eyed Peas*. These groups write really good stuff - but I'm not sure if it is really rap or hip-hop, even though it features some aspects of these styles. But as anyone who's really "in the know" can tell, these groups are kind of dated.

An album I thought was very good was by *Quincy Jones* that featured some rap/hip-hop artists - _Back on the Block._ It also mixed jazz with hip-hop, *Ron Carter* playing bass behind some rap.

I definitely think there are some very talented people involved with rap, the lyrics can be very clever and well put together. I just don't have the time to spend on it, because there is other music I want to listen to more than investigate rap.


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## pianozach (May 21, 2018)

pianozach said:


> I am very close to having this opinion as well.
> 
> These is very little in the hip hop and rap catalog that love. There's some that doesn't rub me the wrong way. Some of it is grating, irritating. I understand rap intellectually, but I really don't like hearing it.
> 
> ...


 . . . was to familiarize myself with it. I'll assume that the hip hop and rap are the amongst the best in the genre.

Well, I've heard some of that already, and there's some that's OK, but there are elements that I find annoying. For instance, the repetitiveness, which isn't necessarily a bad thing: *Ravel*'s *Bolero*, *Yes*' _*Würm*_, the end of _*Hey Jude*_, _*I Am the Walrus*_, or _*I Want You (She's So Heavy)*_ from the *Beatles*, even the _*Canon in D*_.

I also don't really like the yelling, and the self-praise. Dr. Dre's lyrics seem to be focused on how many times he can squeeze the words motherf**ck*r, n*gg*r, and b*tch into a song.

Yeah, there are some nifty licks, and clever rhythms, and other hooks, but overall I just don't enjoy it.


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## Open Book (Aug 14, 2018)

So much of it sounds aggressive and angry. I don't like angry music. Oh, and there's very little music to most of it.


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## Aerobat (Dec 31, 2018)

I'd say that in general it's a genre that I just don't get. Especially the 'Grime', 'Drill' end of it. Although TBH, I can't really tell the difference.

Of course, we have to have an exception, as with almost anything. Sergio George created the Latin Hip-Hop band 'DLG' (Dark Latin Groove) in the 90s, and they were frankly brilliant (you'll find plenty on Youtube if you're interested). Similarly, Marc Anthony's collaboration with Pitbull 'Rain Over Me' is enjoyable in a light-hearted way, and (again) Marc Anthony with Daddy Yankee 'De Vuelta Pa La Vuelta' is great fun and really very danceable (rap only forms a small part of this though). But I'm biased - I used to be a Salsa teacher and DJ in my spare time.


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## Open Book (Aug 14, 2018)

St Matthew said:


> Classical music fans tend to criticize the general public for believing the stereotypes about classical music being a soft, old irrelevant type of music, yet they don't learn from it.
> Here on TC, everyone here is just rehashing the same boring cliches that even the rap/hip hop community make fun of, within their own musical culture.
> 
> This is aside from personal taste, it just shows that these TC regulars both *know little to no rap/hip hop *and simply don't like rap (which is fine).


Are you kidding? As if we can escape rap/hip hop. It's everywhere.


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## Open Book (Aug 14, 2018)

DaveM said:


> Here is one of my favorite melodic rap songs. Okay, I know it's probably considered to be 'white rap' , but I like it. Note the beautiful refrain with cello starting at 2:45.


That's not white rap. That's a white artist's music with rap grafted onto it. It's a common thing artists do today.

For some reason it can make a song into more than the sum of its parts, more interesting than either part of it would be alone, with those juxtaposed genres.


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## Mahlerton (Dec 16, 2020)

Digable Planets, A Tribe Called Quest, The Pharcyde are good for me


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## Haydn70 (Jan 8, 2017)

Kontrapunctus said:


> I can't adequately express my hatred of it without getting banned from this forum.


Excellent post, Kontrapunctus...my sentiments exactly!


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## 6Strings (Feb 16, 2021)

Kontrapunctus said:


> I can't adequately express my hatred of it without getting banned from this forum.


Same here--can't stand it!


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## Strange Magic (Sep 14, 2015)

There is no overlap of the Venn diagram circle representing me and the one representing rap/hip hop.


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## HenryPenfold (Apr 29, 2018)

I enjoyed it very much and thought it was a lithe, vibrant Zeitgeist art form (honestly). Now I'd be happy if I never heard another fecking note of it ....


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## Andrew Kenneth (Feb 17, 2018)

Apparently this hiphopper (Stromae) likes Bizet a lot =>

video clip =>





on stage =>


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