# If You Like Mahler Then You Might Like...



## Klassic (Dec 19, 2015)

I'll begin: 

Franz Schmidt Symphony No.4 

Ernst Bloch Symphony in C Sharp Minor


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## Orfeo (Nov 14, 2013)

*Myaskovsky* (esp. Symphony no. VI & no. XIII).
*Shostakovich* (esp. Symphony no. V).
*Josef Suk* (esp. Asrael Symphony & Epilogue).
*Weinberg* (esp. Symphony no. VI).
*Allan Pettersson* (esp. Symphony no. VII).
*Alexander Zemlinsky* (esp. opera "The Dwarf").
*Richard Strauss* (esp. Sinfonia Domestica & opera "Die Frau ohne Schatten").
*Franz Schrecker* (esp. his opera "Die Gezeichneten" a/k/a "The Stigmatized").
*Han Gal* (esp. his early piano works, the idyllic side that evokes some of Mahler).
*Anton Bruckner*, of course (look at his last two symphonies, as they point to Mahler).
*Nikolai Roslavets* (Violin Concerto).
*Samuil Feinberg* (examine his piano sonatas).


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## Ukko (Jun 4, 2010)

Artur Schnabel - Symphony No. 3


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## Xaltotun (Sep 3, 2010)

Orff's _Carmina Burana_ is much more Mahlerian than people think! Some very Mahlerian passages there.


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## Eva Yojimbo (Jan 30, 2016)

Orfeo said:


> Shostakovich (esp. Symphony no. V).


IIRC, Shostakovich's 4th was composed shortly after he became interested in Mahler, and I still feel it's his most overtly Mahlerian (though Shosta always had something of Mahler's dark and twisted sense of humor).


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## Klassic (Dec 19, 2015)

Eva Yojimbo said:


> IIRC, Shostakovich's 4th was composed shortly after he became interested in Mahler, and I still feel it's his most overtly Mahlerian (though Shosta always had something of Mahler's dark and twisted sense of humor).


I have a friend who listens to Shosti all the time, he always says this about his 4th.


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## Orfeo (Nov 14, 2013)

Eva Yojimbo said:


> IIRC, Shostakovich's 4th was composed shortly after he became interested in Mahler, and I still feel it's his most overtly Mahlerian (though Shosta always had something of Mahler's dark and twisted sense of humor).


That's true (esp. the beginning of the finale that reminds me of the funereal music of Mahler's First Symphony, third movement). Somehow I've overlooked that.


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## Cosmos (Jun 28, 2013)

Orfeo said:


> *Myaskovsky* (esp. Symphony no. VI & no. XIII).
> *Shostakovich* (esp. Symphony no. V).
> *Josef Suk* (esp. Asrael Symphony & Epilogue).
> *Weinberg* (esp. Symphony no. VI).
> ...


I love Franz Schmidt, which OP mentioned, and I haven't heard the other one OP mentioned {Bloch},

Thanks for this list! It has some familiar ones, but also a few names I haven't heard. Ill need to check these guys out pronto


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## Mahlerian (Nov 27, 2012)

Eva Yojimbo said:


> IIRC, Shostakovich's 4th was composed shortly after he became interested in Mahler, and I still feel it's his most overtly Mahlerian (though Shosta always had something of Mahler's dark and twisted sense of humor).


The Fifth is too bare to approach Mahler's density and too obvious to come near his formal complexity, but the Fourth has both of these qualities in much greater profusion than any of Shostakovich's subsequent symphonic works.

I also appreciate the symphonies of Franz Schmidt, especially the Fourth, but I've recently come around to the Second and Third as well.


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## TxllxT (Mar 2, 2011)

Sibelius, Glière, 19th century Bach, Wagner, Berlioz


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## Eva Yojimbo (Jan 30, 2016)

Mahlerian said:


> The Fifth is too bare to approach Mahler's density and too obvious to come near his formal complexity, but the Fourth has both of these qualities in much greater profusion than any of Shostakovich's subsequent symphonic works.


Completely agree. It maybe why Shosta's 4th has become my favorite from him, and one of the few I still listen to with somewhat regularity. Though I also strangely like his smaller-scale, wittier symphonies like the 6th and 9th. Those that go to Shosta for the dramatic extremes and despair tend to dismiss these, but I think Shosta's lightness and humor are two of his more attractive qualities when he exercised them without pretension.


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## Becca (Feb 5, 2015)

Cosmos said:


> I love Franz Schmidt, which OP mentioned, and I haven't heard the other one OP mentioned {Bloch},
> 
> Thanks for this list! It has some familiar ones, but also a few names I haven't heard. Ill need to check these guys out pronto


If you like the Mahler 6th and (particularly) the 9th, then I strongly recommend Josef Suk's Asrael Symphony.


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## poconoron (Oct 26, 2011)

I am reading this thread in order to know which composers I should avoid, since I find Mahler to be excruciatingly boring - sorry to say.


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## Mahlerian (Nov 27, 2012)

poconoron said:


> I am reading this thread in order to know which composers I should avoid, since I find Mahler to be excruciatingly boring - sorry to say.


Mozart is one of my favorite composers, and like Mahler himself, I find Mozart's music to be one of the supreme contributions of the classical tradition.

Ready to give him up too?


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## Chronochromie (May 17, 2014)

Hans Rott's Symphony in E major.



poconoron said:


> I am reading this thread in order to know which composers I should avoid, since I find Mahler to be excruciatingly boring - sorry to say.


That's rich coming from a Mozart fan. :devil:


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## poconoron (Oct 26, 2011)

Mahlerian said:


> Mozart is one of my favorite composers, and like Mahler himself, I find Mozart's music to be one of the supreme contributions of the classical tradition.
> 
> Ready to give him up too?


No...........not a chance on that.  For some reason, I find that Dvorak is the "latest" composer that I can "get into" when it comes to symphonies. I've tried Mahler, Shostakovich, Bruckner................ and no dice. And forget about 20th century composers altogether. I guess it's just a defect of mine somehow, or the styles just don't fit with me.


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## Orfeo (Nov 14, 2013)

Cosmos said:


> I love Franz Schmidt, which OP mentioned, and I haven't heard the other one OP mentioned {Bloch},
> 
> Thanks for this list! It has some familiar ones, but also a few names I haven't heard. Ill need to check these guys out pronto


You're welcome.....


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## manyene (Feb 7, 2015)

Jan van Gilse, Symphony 3
Erkki Melartin, Symphony 3


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## Cosmos (Jun 28, 2013)

Becca said:


> If you like the Mahler 6th and (particularly) the 9th, then I strongly recommend Josef Suk's Asrael Symphony.


Since Mahler's 9th is my favorite symphony in general, you've caught my attention :lol: I'll give it a listen soon


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## Orfeo (Nov 14, 2013)

manyene said:


> Jan van Gilse, Symphony 3
> Erkki Melartin, Symphony 3


Here's the new performing edition of Melartin's Third Symphony. I do think, though, that the Sixth is closer to Mahler (it evokes the Austrian's Fifth, first movement, in particular).
-->


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## starthrower (Dec 11, 2010)

Schreker, Wellesz, and Zemlinsky I enjoy a lot.

I haven't fallen in love with Bruckner yet.


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## Mahlerian (Nov 27, 2012)

poconoron said:


> No...........not a chance on that.  For some reason, I find that Dvorak is the "latest" composer that I can "get into" when it comes to symphonies. I've tried Mahler, Shostakovich, Bruckner................ and no dice. And forget about 20th century composers altogether. I guess it's just a defect of mine somehow, or the styles just don't fit with me.


I'm not trying to get you to throw away Mozart, of course, it's just that people often mistakenly believe that their own tastes and others' will be similar.

Case in point, I don't care for many of the names on Orfeo's list, and some of the works he listed are completely anathema to me (if I never hear Sinfonia Domestica again in this lifetime, I will be content), but I wouldn't suggest that someone who loves Mahler's music as I do would probably not enjoy them.


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## aleazk (Sep 30, 2011)

Based on my experience here, I would say Schoenberg, Boulez, Takemitsu and Unsuk Chin.


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## hpowders (Dec 23, 2013)

Klassic said:


> I'll begin:
> 
> Franz Schmidt Symphony No.4
> 
> Ernst Bloch Symphony in C Sharp Minor


Franz Schmidt Symphony No. 4? More like Richard Strauss than Mahler, IMHO.


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## Alfacharger (Dec 6, 2013)

This version of Vaughan Williams' Second Symphony


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## violadude (May 2, 2011)

poconoron said:


> I am reading this thread in order to know which composers I should avoid, since I find Mahler to be excruciatingly boring - sorry to say.


Glad you popped in to say that. I'm sure it was beneficial to all of us


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## Klassic (Dec 19, 2015)

hpowders said:


> Franz Schmidt Symphony No. 4? More like Richard Strauss than Mahler, IMHO.


Yes, it could be mentioned on a Strauss thread as well.


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## Manxfeeder (Oct 19, 2010)

Tyberg's 3rd Symphony has been called Brucknerian, but I hear Mahler in it.


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## Avey (Mar 5, 2013)

Erich Wolfgang Korngold! 

...namely, all that instrumental chamber music Herr Mahler passed on.


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## Huilunsoittaja (Apr 6, 2010)

I would think Mahler fans would like Sibelius too, no? Really all of his symphonies, but perhaps in particular the "unusual" ones, which are 4, 5, and 7 because of their unusual forms and styles.


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## brotagonist (Jul 11, 2013)

Alfacharger said:


> This version of Vaughan Williams' Second Symphony


That is interesting! It always amazes me what unexpected connections there can be. I like Mahler a great deal and Vaughan Williams is kind of starting to look a bit interesting, but I still haven't listened enough to say "wow!" Another unexpected connection I learned of yesterday was between Holst and Schoenberg. Apparently, Holst wrote the Planets after hearing one of Schoenberg's pieces and there are Schoenbergian elements in the work. It even initially bore a different title. Holst was always sort of a one-trick pony for me and I wasn't all that wild about his one trick. Well, now I have a reason to listen in a new way and to a lot more of his works.


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## Nereffid (Feb 6, 2013)

The responses here fascinate me. I love Mahler's music, and like/love a lot of the other music mentioned so far, but to me little of it is similar enough to Mahler in my mind to allow me to say with any confidence "if you like Mahler, you'll like this".

One work that on first listen made me think I was listening to someone deliberately imitating Mahler is Johan Wagenaar's Sinfonietta of 1917. I don't know if it _was_ deliberate imitation - but aside from the Rott symphony it's actually the only piece of music I've heard that sounds like it might feasibly have been written by Mahler. I assume other Mahler fans will disagree with that!

You could also try Edward Gregson's _Dream Song_ of 2010, which is heavily based on Mahler's 6th, the overall listening effect being akin to a half-remembered dream of that work.


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## GioCar (Oct 30, 2013)

If you like the young Mahler, the Mahler of the first symphonies, then you might like Casella's 2nd symphony

I'd recommend this recording


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## echmain (Jan 18, 2013)

> If You Like Mahler Then You Might Like...

Grilled cheese.


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## Klassic (Dec 19, 2015)

GioCar said:


> If you like the young Mahler, the Mahler of the first symphonies, then you might like Casella's 2nd symphony
> 
> I'd recommend this recording


Am listening now. Opening is promising.


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## SONNET CLV (May 31, 2014)

My obvious suggestion here is the Hans Rott Symphony (already mentioned).

The additional pieces mentioned, all good choices and well worth listening to, seem to be post-Mahler works. Let me also suggest a pre-Mahlerian composer (other than Rott) whom you might equate somewhat with Mahler's "programmatic-like and myriad instrumental color-tinged" music, and that fellow is Joachim Raff, who has some eleven symphonies. I've long admired several of these, including No.3 in F, _Im Walde_ (In the Forest) op.153, my favorite of the set, and I suspect Gustav admired them, too.

Perhaps Mahlerian can shed light on this opinion.


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## Mahlerian (Nov 27, 2012)

SONNET CLV said:


> My obvious suggestion here is the Hans Rott Symphony (already mentioned).
> 
> The additional pieces mentioned, all good choices and well worth listening to, seem to be post-Mahler works. Let me also suggest a pre-Mahlerian composer (other than Rott) whom you might equate somewhat with Mahler's "programmatic-like and myriad instrumental color-tinged" music, and that fellow is Joachim Raff, who has some eleven symphonies. I've long admired several of these, including No.3 in F, _Im Walde_ (In the Forest) op.153, my favorite of the set, and I suspect Gustav admired them, too.
> 
> Perhaps Mahlerian can shed light on this opinion.


The only time Mahler appears to have ever conducted Raff was an 1886 performance of the Violin Concerto No. 2 in Prague. I've never known him to have commented on the composer at any time.

https://www.gustav-mahler.org/mahler/dirigate-e.cfm?ziel=chrono

Many people cite Berlioz and (especially) Wagner as Mahler's most important precursors.


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## violadude (May 2, 2011)

Honestly, Mahler's music seems very unique to me and I can't see any composer being "similar" enough to him that you could say someone who likes Mahler will like the other. Even a composer like Bruckner is very different from Mahler in so many ways.


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## Orfeo (Nov 14, 2013)

Interesting link Mahlerian provided, thank you. Quite a bit of self-promotion (though nice dosages of Rubinstein, Tchaikovsky (Manfred?!), Schumann thrown in (plus Stanford)). It may be incomplete, though (for instance, Mahler did conduct Goldmark's "The Queen of Sheba" at around 1898, from what I read).


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## Eva Yojimbo (Jan 30, 2016)

violadude said:


> Even a composer like Bruckner is very different from Mahler in so many ways.


The similarities between Mahler and Bruckner:

1. Both composed (roughly) 9 symphonies and some vocal/choral works that are like symphonies. 
2. Both's symphonies tended to be very long. 
3. Ummm... errrr... They were both from Austria!

Beyond that, I find Bruckner and Mahler extremely different. Besides Brahms, Bruckner may have been the most classicist of the late romantics. His symphonies often sound like what I'd imagine Haydn doing had he lived late into romanticism and was still composing symphonies (and decided that brevity WASN'T the soul of wit). Mahler is closer to Wagner's sturm and drang, with a (post)modernist's dark sense of humor, with emphasis on color and texture as much as development.


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## Mahlerian (Nov 27, 2012)

Orfeo said:


> Interesting link Mahlerian provided, thank you. Quite a bit of self-promotion (though nice dosages of Rubinstein, Tchaikovsky (Manfred?!), Schumann thrown in (plus Stanford)). It may be incomplete, though (for instance, Mahler did conduct Goldmark's "The Queen of Sheba" at around 1898, from what I read).


It doesn't include the operas he conducted, only the orchestral pieces. We would add in lots more Mozart and Wagner if we added his operatic repertoire.


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## Alfacharger (Dec 6, 2013)

David Mason Greene in his book "Greene's Biographical Encyclopedia of Composers" mentions Otto Klemperer composing 6 very "Mahlerian" symphonies. I have a recording of his second and it does sound like a satirical take on Mahler.

I really don't like it!


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## Orfeo (Nov 14, 2013)

Mahlerian said:


> It doesn't include the operas he conducted, only the orchestral pieces. We would add in lots more Mozart and Wagner if we added his operatic repertoire.


I see.
I should've realized. 
My bad.
My apologies.


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## SONNET CLV (May 31, 2014)

Mahlerian said:


> https://www.gustav-mahler.org/mahler/dirigate-e.cfm?ziel=chrono


Indeed, that is a wonderful link!
I will perhaps program some listening sessions based upon particular concerts on the list. (I'm curious about that final work on the list, the last piece Mahler ever conducted? Bossi: Intermezzi Goldoniani op. 127. I don't know that piece. The first work on the list is stellar, one of my favorite Beethoven pieces -- quintessential Beethoven -- and a _great _starting point for any conductor's career, I would suggest!)
Thanks, greatly, Mahlerian.


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## Guest (Feb 5, 2016)

Wolfgang Rihm of course.


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## Howling Moon (Jan 8, 2015)

Glazunov! Not really, but I love to promote him whenever possible. How about Strauss' Metamorphosen for 23 strings? It brings Mahler's weighty adagios to mind.


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## Orfeo (Nov 14, 2013)

Howling Moon said:


> Glazunov! Not really, but I love to promote him whenever possible. How about Strauss' Metamorphosen for 23 strings? It brings Mahler's weighty adagios to mind.


Glazunov's Eighth Symphony (mesto movement) is worth a thought, although decidedly Brahmsian & Tchaikovskian in expression and mood. His unfinished Ninth, I'm still pondering.


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## Mahlerian (Nov 27, 2012)

SONNET CLV said:


> Indeed, that is a wonderful link!
> I will perhaps program some listening sessions based upon particular concerts on the list. (I'm curious about that final work on the list, the last piece Mahler ever conducted? Bossi: Intermezzi Goldoniani op. 127. I don't know that piece. The first work on the list is stellar, one of my favorite Beethoven pieces -- quintessential Beethoven -- and a _great _starting point for any conductor's career, I would suggest!)
> Thanks, greatly, Mahlerian.


It was an interesting program, for sure. All four works were pieces he only played that one time. The Busoni at that concert was a premiere, even!


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## Klassic (Dec 19, 2015)

GioCar said:


> If you like the young Mahler, the Mahler of the first symphonies, then you might like Casella's 2nd symphony
> 
> I'd recommend this recording


I have now listened to this several times. Gets better each time I listen. I *heartily* second this recommendation!


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## Morimur (Jan 23, 2014)

OP: You might also like *Jón Leifs*


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## Klassic (Dec 19, 2015)

Morimur said:


> OP: You might also like *Jón Leifs*


This is next on my list. Thanks.


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## Klassic (Dec 19, 2015)

Regarding *Casella Symphony No.2*, I actually like this recording better (I suspect this cuts against the grain of quality for most people):


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## Klassic (Dec 19, 2015)

Morimur said:


> OP: You might also like *Jón Leifs*


I took a listen. This is an interesting piece, but it didn't register on my first hearing, I will perhaps, listen again in the future. I do think this piece is very much composed in the style of Mahler. Thanks for recommending.


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## motoboy (May 19, 2008)

This thread is up there with the "lesser known symphony" thread. Lots of great new music to explore. Thanks!


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## hpowders (Dec 23, 2013)

If you like Mahler, then you should also like Shostakovich's Fourth Symphony, the most Mahler-like of the Shostakovich Symphonies, IMO.


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## poconoron (Oct 26, 2011)

For a relative newcomer to Mahler like myself, which symphony would you recommend? My musical preferences are Mozart, Haydn, Beethoven, Schubert, Brahms, Handel. Which Mahler work should I _ease_ my way into?

Thanks.


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## Chronochromie (May 17, 2014)

poconoron said:


> For a relative newcomer to Mahler like myself, which symphony would you recommend? My musical preferences are Mozart, Haydn, Beethoven, Schubert, Brahms, Handel. Which Mahler work should I _ease_ my way into?
> 
> Thanks.


I'd recommend the 1st symphony. Not his best but it's still very good and quite accessible and short for Mahler. Worked for me, anyway.


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## hpowders (Dec 23, 2013)

OP: Manic depression.


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## poconoron (Oct 26, 2011)

Chronochromie said:


> I'd recommend the 1st symphony. Not his best but it's still very good and quite accessible and short for Mahler. Worked for me, anyway.


Thanks, I haven't tried that one yet. I figure that Mahler is worth another try for me, especially since I read somewhere that Mahler's last word was "Mozart". He must have had exquisite musical taste! :clap::clap::tiphat:


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## Klassic (Dec 19, 2015)

poconoron said:


> For a relative newcomer to Mahler like myself, which symphony would you recommend? My musical preferences are Mozart, Haydn, Beethoven, Schubert, Brahms, Handel. Which Mahler work should I _ease_ my way into?
> 
> Thanks.


I wouldn't recommend to start with a full symphony, but select movements: the obvious recommendation is the Adagietto from his 5th Symphony. You might also try the first movement to his second symphony.

I would recommend Karajan on the 5th and Rattle on the 2nd.


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## Becca (Feb 5, 2015)

poconoron said:


> For a relative newcomer to Mahler like myself, which symphony would you recommend? My musical preferences are Mozart, Haydn, Beethoven, Schubert, Brahms, Handel. Which Mahler work should I _ease_ my way into?
> 
> Thanks.


My recommendation is the 4th. I won't attempt to suggest whose as that will certainly trigger a fire-storm :lol:


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## Klassic (Dec 19, 2015)

Without a doubt, the emotional, dark, turmoil-ridden symphonies of Pettersson. Truly wonderful, yet majorly underrated composer.


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