# What are the most demanding roles in all of opera?



## Itullian (Aug 27, 2011)

Acting, singing, everything combined...............


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## BalalaikaBoy (Sep 25, 2014)

Norma, hands down.
Edit: Turandot comes in second imo


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## Becca (Feb 5, 2015)

If we are talking stamina, then Wagner and probably Tristan & Isolde although it depends on lot on the staging. Being part of a Wieland Wagner production would be worlds different from Otto Schenk or some of the more bizarre current stagings. If you add in a significant acting component, then perhaps Salome or Lulu. Comic opera adds in another component so a good case could be made for Mozart's Figaro or Hoffman. Then there are a few operas which even require some dancing ability - Carmen. So you pays your money and you takes your choice


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## Celloman (Sep 30, 2006)

Brunnhilde from the Ring Cycle. Here's why.

1. You have to sing in _three_ different operas, actually. If the cycle is performed as Wagner originally intended it, then you will have to sing for _three consecutive nights_.

2. Brunnhilde has more lines to sing than any single character in the cycle. In Gotterdammerung, the longest opera, she has a significant role in all three acts. In Siegfried, she must wait until the last 20 minutes of the third act after she has been lying down for the better part of an hour.

3. The role of Brunnhilde requires a special voice type known as a Wagnerian soprano. _No true Wagnerian sopranos currently exist_. They are some of the rarest voice types and must have many years, sometimes decades, of experience before they are properly prepared for the task. There are usually only one or two of these sopranos active at the same time, and consequently, they are the first to get offered the role when a Ring cycle is produced.

4. And it ain't over 'till the fat lady sings. You'd better hold that cake until _after_ the opera, because you have to save that third lung for the "Immolation Scene" - no, it's not a piece of cake.

Brunnhilde: the Mount Everest of opera roles?


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## Itullian (Aug 27, 2011)

Celloman said:


> Brunnhilde from the Ring Cycle. Here's why.
> 
> 1. You have to sing in _three_ different operas, actually. If the cycle is performed as Wagner originally intended it, then you will have to sing for _three consecutive nights_.
> 
> ...


Yeah, but for just one opera?


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## Woodduck (Mar 17, 2014)

It may be difficult for anyone not a singer to answer this definitively, but I would say it would depend on the singer as much as the role. Lilli Lehmann famously said she would rather sing all three Brunnhildes than one Norma, but I suspect Joan Sutherland would have felt differently. Either part might be a candidate for most difficult female role, with Isolde very much in the running. For tenors, Tannhauser, the _Siegfried_ Siegfried, and Tristan are all notorious killers, but I imagine Otello is a close challenger. Staying with Wagner, the _Walkure_ Wotan requires just about everything, vocally and dramatically, a bass-baritone can give.


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## perempe (Feb 27, 2014)

I saw Ariadne auf Naxos yesterday. Zerbinetta's "Großmächtige Prinzessin" is such a long coloratura aria.


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## BalalaikaBoy (Sep 25, 2014)

Woodduck said:


> It may be difficult for anyone not a singer to answer this definitively, but I would say it would depend on the singer as much as the role. Lilli Lehmann famously said she would rather sing all three Brunnhildes than one Norma, but I suspect Joan Sutherland would have felt differently. Either part might be a candidate for most difficult female role, with Isolde very much in the running. For tenors, Tannhauser, the _Siegfried_ Siegfried, and Tristan are all notorious killers, but I imagine Otello is a close challenger. Staying with Wagner, the _Walkure_ Wotan requires just about everything, vocally and dramatically, a bass-baritone can give.


this is definitely true to some degree, but I think some roles are pretty universally difficult. I mentioned Norma because the singer needs to be practically switch voices depending on which part of the roles they are singing. for example
*Miro o Norma:* lyric soprano
*Act I Trio:* dramatic coloratura soprano
*Casta Diva:* lyric soprano/lyric coloratura soprano (depending on the key)
*Ah Belo A Me Ritorna:* dramatic coloratura soprano
*In Mia Man:* some bizarre brand of dramatic mezzo, but with Rossini-esque coloratura and a solid high C
*Deh! Non Volerli Vittime:* spinto soprano

while I am aware you (quite understandably) don't share my fondness for elaborate fach distincts, it's not difficult to agree that a bright, high-lying soprano voice and a dark, aggressive, witchy dramatic mezzo voice are drastically different, and that any singer able to convincingly sing the vast array of colors, weights and tessituras of Norma is nothing short of a miracle.


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## Belowpar (Jan 14, 2015)

No mention oF Sacks? The longest part in Opera?


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## Tsaraslondon (Nov 7, 2013)

On the question of Norma and Brunnhilde, not only did Lilli Lehmann once say she would rather sing all three Brunnhildes in one night, but Callas also stated that both Isolde and Brunnhilde were a piece of cake in comparison. Admittedly she only ever sang the *Walkure* Brunnhilde. No doubt also she forgot that when she was singing those roles her voice had reserves of power that she could only intermittently summon up after the weight loss. Her reasons for saying so were that high notes were few and far between, that neither Isolde nor Brunnhilde asked much for the kind of vocal dexterity and flexibility of Norma, that nowhere was the voice exposed as it is in *Norma* and that neither of Isolde nor Brunnhilde dominated the opera in quite the same way Norma does, who is hardly off the stage once she has made her entrance.

Nowadays, unfortunately too many ill-equipped sopranos try out the role, skating over its difficulties and ignoring its demands. I'd venture to suggest, though, that there have been far more great Isoldes and Brunnhildes than Normas since the operas were written.

When the opera was new there were Pasta and Malibran. Later Lilli Lehmann and Ponselle, and, in the modern age (ie complete performances preserved in sound) only Callas would seem to have truly embraced and conquered all aspects of this monumental role. Sutherland and Caballe were both appreciable Normas, and far and away better than anyone we will hear today, but I am not sure even they matched Callas's achievement in _all_ aspects, that is both acting and singing.

So, yes, I still say Norma.


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## BalalaikaBoy (Sep 25, 2014)

GregMitchell said:


> No the question of Norma and Brunnhilde, not only did Lilli Lehmann once say she would rather sing all three Brunnhildes in one night, but Callas also stated that both Isolde and Brunnhilde were a piece of cake in comparison. Admittedly she only ever sang the *Walkure* Brunnhilde. No doubt also she forgot that when she was singing those roles her voice had reserves of power that she could only intermittently summon up after the weight loss. Her reasons for saying so were that high notes were few and far between, that neither Isolde nor Brunnhilde asked much for the kind of vocal dexterity and flexibility of Norma, that nowhere was the voice exposed as it is in *Norma* and that neither of Isolde nor Brunnhilde dominated the opera in quite the same way Norma does, who is hardly off the stage once she has made her entrance.


considering that, with the exception of Marisa Galvany, Callas is the only singer who comes to mind with the vocal apparatus to sing _all_ of Norma respectably, her comment here holds even more weight.



> Nowadays, unfortunately too many ill-equipped sopranos try out the role, skating over its difficulties and ignoring its demands. I'd venture to suggest, though, that there have been far more great Isoldes and Brunnhildes than Normas since the operas were written.


most of today's "Normas" make me want to shoot myself. singers choosing the wrong rep is always a pet peeve of mine, but in this case, it's nothing short of _arrogant_.



> When the opera was new there were Pasta and Malibran. Later Lilli Lehmann and Ponselle, and, in the modern age (ie complete performances preserved in sound) only Callas would seem to have truly embraced and conquered all aspects of this monumental role. Sutherland and Caballe were both appreciable Normas, and far and away better than anyone we will hear today, but I am not sure even they matched Callas's achievement in _all_ aspects, that is both acting and singing.


^this. I prefer Sutherland in certain sections (she is second to none in the Act 1 trio, Casta Diva and Ah Bello), but _overall_, Callas wins hands down. Sutherland lacked the ability sing like a dramatic mezzo and project the aggression and mania necessary to fully capture Norma. generally, interpretation is not a huge concern of mine, but Norma is the exception. she is a scorned lover who murdered her children and wants to murder her ex-lover. to put it bluntly, Norma is a psychotic bitch, and the characterization of Sutherland, which perpetually sounded as if she were playing the Statue of Liberty, does not cut it.


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## Couac Addict (Oct 16, 2013)

I'd be inclined to rule out the Wagner roles. Whilst plenty of power/stamina is required, the score reveals that not much range is required by the singers. It doesn't test them nearly as much as the Wagnerians would have us believe 

Most difficult? Perhaps, Lulu?


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## BalalaikaBoy (Sep 25, 2014)

Couac Addict said:


> I'd be inclined to rule out the Wagner roles. Whilst plenty of power/stamina is required, the score reveals that not much range is required by the singers. It doesn't test them nearly as much as the Wagnerians would have us believe
> 
> Most difficult? Perhaps, Lulu?


imo, the reason Wagner is difficult to sing is not the actual score, it's the way in which conductors pump up the orchestra louder than a friggin Queen concert.


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## Becca (Feb 5, 2015)

It seems that the focus of this thread has moved away from the OP's original question, i.e. not just which is vocally most demanding but which roles require_ Acting, singing, everything combined............... _


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## Marschallin Blair (Jan 23, 2014)

GregMitchell said:


> On the question of Norma and Brunnhilde, not only did Lilli Lehmann once say she would rather sing all three Brunnhildes in one night, but Callas also stated that both Isolde and Brunnhilde were a piece of cake in comparison. Admittedly she only ever sang the *Walkure* Brunnhilde. No doubt also she forgot that when she was singing those roles her voice had reserves of power that she could only intermittently summon up after the weight loss. Her reasons for saying so were that high notes were few and far between, that neither Isolde nor Brunnhilde asked much for the kind of vocal dexterity and flexibility of Norma, that nowhere was the voice exposed as it is in *Norma* and that neither of Isolde nor Brunnhilde dominated the opera in quite the same way Norma does, who is hardly off the stage once she has made her entrance.
> 
> Nowadays, unfortunately too many ill-equipped sopranos try out the role, skating over its difficulties and ignoring its demands. I'd venture to suggest, though, that there have been far more great Isoldes and Brunnhildes than Normas since the operas were written.
> 
> ...


Lord Harewood knows a thing or two about singing.

Yet, when he was interviewing Callas, he mentioned that _bel canto_ was "harder in some ways" than Wagner. Callas without pausing added, "in_ EVERY _way."

I love a Wagnerian _Hochdramatischer Sopran_ in her prime like Kirsten Flagstad, but I just don't see it in the cards that she'd have the agility to sing Norma the way Callas did in her prime.

Callas could sing Isolde compellingly but the reverse is not true with Flagstad being able to sing Norma.


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## DavidA (Dec 14, 2012)

I think demanding can have various meanings. Not just stamina or volume or even virtuoso tricks. Why some of Mozart's female roles are very demanding as they involve bags of character and agility. For example, a great Donna Elvira is truly something special as indeed dear old Liz S was!


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## Marschallin Blair (Jan 23, 2014)

DavidA said:


> I think demanding can have various meanings. Not just stamina or volume or even virtuoso tricks. Why some of Mozart's female roles are very demanding as they involve bags of character and agility. For example, a great Donna Elvira is truly something special as indeed dear old Liz S was!


'Character?'

'Agility?'

Ever-shifting, kaleidoscopic emotional and psychological states that demand the highest and most penetrating psychological intelligence, dramatic inflection, coloring, shading, and technical facility?

Look no father than Norma or Lucia. . .

(Liz _is fan-TAS-tic _though. _;D_)


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## DavidA (Dec 14, 2012)

Marschallin Blair said:


> 'Character?'
> 
> 'Agility?'
> 
> ...


Sorry, these operas leave me cold. Can't stand them in fact! Not a patch on the great Wolfie.


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## Marschallin Blair (Jan 23, 2014)

DavidA said:


> Sorry, these operas leave me cold. Can't stand them in fact! Not a patch on the great Wolfie.


I certainly have a qualified acceptance of that thesis _;D_ : I love some Mozart operas more than _Lucia _and _Norma_, but _none of them _more than Callas _doing__ Lucia __and __Norma_.


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## nina foresti (Mar 11, 2014)

Speaking of Italian operas...
Sopranos:
Norma
Minnie
Turandot
Abigaille

Tenors:
Otello
Rhadames


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## Tsaraslondon (Nov 7, 2013)

nina foresti said:


> Speaking of Italian operas:
> Norma
> Minnie
> Turandot


I wouldn't call Turandot taxing if we are going from the point of view of the OP's statement. If a soprano has a stentorian voice with a good deal of volume and reliable top notes, she shouldn't have much difficulty singing it. Psychologically and from an acting point of view it doesn't really require too much of her. It certainly doesn't need the kind of finesse and vocal agility required to sing Mozart or bel canto. Nilsson sails through it with ease but is hard pressed on her recordings of Donna Anna, the voice being just too unwieldy.

Minnie asks more of the singer dramatically I think. She has to be sweet_ and_ strong, and vocally she needs a powerful upper register. My favourite Minnie on record is actually Carole Neblett, who has some of Nilsson's security on high, but also some of Tebaldi's lyricism. Still the role asks very little of her in terms of vocal dexterity.


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## Tsaraslondon (Nov 7, 2013)

Marschallin Blair said:


> Lord Harewood knows a thing or two about singing.
> 
> Yet, when he was interviewing Callas, he mentioned that _bel canto_ was "harder in some ways" than Wagner. Callas without pausing added, "in_ EVERY _way."
> 
> ...




_In the two periods before and after the 1939-45 war, *Norma* acquired two great protagonists: Rosa Ponselle and Maria Callas, something I know from first-hand knowledge in the one case, and reliable hearsay and gramophone records in the other. With such exponents, *Norma*, above all Bellini's operas, flowers, gains in expressiveness and dramatic impact, and the music grows to full stature as it cannot when the performance is in lesser hands. Partly, this gain is general and the result of technical attainments, of superior, more penetrating imagination; partly it is particular and the product of an ability to colour and weight every phrase individually and leave nothing open to the risks of the automatic or the routine. But, whatever the reason, let no one imagine he has genuinely heard *Norma* without a truly great singer in the title role. Not to have one is as dire in its consequences as a performance of *Gotterdammerung* with an inadequate Brunnhilde. The trouble as far as Bellini is concerned is that, in the twentieth century, there have been fewer great Normas than fine Brunnhildes._

Lord Harewood writing in Kobbe in 1976. I would venture to suggest that what was true in the twentieth century is even more true in the twenty-first.


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## Marschallin Blair (Jan 23, 2014)

GregMitchell said:


> _In the two periods before and after the 1939-45 war, *Norma* acquired two great protagonists: Rosa Ponselle and Maria Callas, something I know from first-hand knowledge in the one case, and reliable hearsay and gramophone records in the other. With such exponents, *Norma*, above all Bellini's operas, flowers, gains in expressiveness and dramatic impact, and the music grows to full stature as it cannot when the performance is in lesser hands. Partly, this gain is general and the result of technical attainments, of superior, more penetrating imagination; partly it is particular and the product of an ability to colour and weight every phrase individually and leave nothing open to the risks of the automatic or the routine. But, whatever the reason, let no one imagine he has genuinely heard *Norma* without a truly great singer in the title role. Not to have one is as dire in its consequences as a performance of *Gotterdammerung* with an inadequate Brunnhilde. The trouble as far as Bellini is concerned is that, in the twentieth century, there have been fewer great Normas than fine Brunnhildes._
> 
> Lord Harewood writing in Kobbe in 1976. I would venture to suggest that what was true in the twentieth century is even more true in the twenty-first.


I '*heart*' this post.


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## Albert7 (Nov 16, 2014)

Tristan and Isolde in Wagner's opera are probably the most difficult roles ever.


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## Marschallin Blair (Jan 23, 2014)

Albert7 said:


> Tristan and Isolde in Wagner's opera are probably the most difficult roles ever.


Would you articulate with specificity _why_ this is the case?


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## AndyS (Dec 2, 2011)

GregMitchell said:


> Nilsson sails through it with ease but is hard pressed on her recordings of Donna Anna, the voice being just too unwieldy.


Her "vacation" role :lol: (Turandot that is, not Donna Anna)

Esclarmonde anyone? lack of renown aside, there must be a reason that it hasn't been tackled very often?


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## Tsaraslondon (Nov 7, 2013)

AndyS said:


> Her "vacation" role :lol: (Turandot that is, not Donna Anna)
> 
> Esclarmonde anyone? lack of renown aside, there must be a reason that it hasn't been tackled very often?


It's quite hard admittedly. The opera's also a bit kitsch. That could be why it never quite caught on. :devil:


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## Woodduck (Mar 17, 2014)

Marschallin Blair said:


> Lord Harewood knows a thing or two about singing.
> 
> Yet, when he was interviewing Callas, he mentioned that _bel canto_ was "harder in some ways" than Wagner. Callas without pausing added, "in_ EVERY _way."
> 
> ...




Flagstad was offered Norma, considered (and probably practiced) it, but wisely decided against it. When the role was suggested to Nilsson, she said, also wisely, "too many small notes." It's interesting that the part should have been suggested to two such huge-voiced singers of different generations, indicating that it has long been regarded as a dramatic soprano role, but one calling for exceptional agility.


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## Albert7 (Nov 16, 2014)

Marschallin Blair said:


> Would you articulate with specificity _why_ this is the case?




Very lengthy vocal lines requiring lots of stamina. For me, it's the epitome of the post-bel canto era entering into modernism here.


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## Marschallin Blair (Jan 23, 2014)

Albert7 said:


> Very lengthy vocal lines requiring lots of stamina. For me, it's the epitome of the post-bel canto era entering into modernism here.


Yeah, that's what DJ Babu said.


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## silentio (Nov 10, 2014)

In addition to Norma, Medea is pretty much badass. No splashy coloratura, but it requires flexibility (for example,_"Dei tuoi figli""_). And think of all of the fortissimo madness.






In term of stamina only, I think Elektra dwarfs Isolde, Brunnhilde, Turandot and Cassandre.

And for some moment, I do consider that Salome insanely difficult. Think about it, Strauss preferred a girlish, silvery-toned voice, but that voice needs to pierce through a thick orchestra. In term of tessitura, the singer needs to reach a dramatic * low G♭ *. And, dancing (nude)


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## trazom (Apr 13, 2009)

Albert7 said:


> Very lengthy vocal lines requiring lots of stamina. For me, it's the epitome of the post-bel canto era entering into modernism here.


There are other technical demands--agility, range, dramatic portrayal-- made on singers besides simply requiring the breath control of a sperm whale.


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## Marschallin Blair (Jan 23, 2014)

silentio said:


> In addition to Norma, Medea is pretty much badass. No splashy coloratura, but it requires flexibility (for example,_"Dei tuoi figli""_).
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Absolutely, 'badass'- the ferocious, full-volume chest tones, the blood-curdling coloratura, and the relentless vocal line in "_E che? Io son Medea_" is one of my all time favorite 'high drama' Callas standards- possibly the most; certainly with the '53 Florence performance.


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## Woodduck (Mar 17, 2014)

Albert7 said:


> Tristan and Isolde in Wagner's opera are probably the most difficult roles ever.


For these roles sheer stamina is a prime factor. Singers literally run out of voice before the opera is over, with unfortunate results for some of the most dramatic and beautiful music in the work and an ending that should be cathartic and transfigured. It's the main reason why the opera has so often been cut; the traditional cuts are in two places, chunks being taken out of Act 2 and the middle section of Tristan's tripartite Act 3 delirium. In the production I saw at the Met, the cuts were made and Helge Brilioth ran out of voice anyway, after which the redoubtable Birgit swept in and brought down the house with the "Liebestod," sounding fresher than she had at the start of the opera.

I don't think anyone should underestimate the strain of these roles properly performed. The requisite combination of sustained dramatic intensity and sheer power needed to sound vocally firm and fresh against heavy orchestration throughout a long evening is rarely supplied in full, even by the most heroic-voiced singers. Tristan is widely regarded by tenors as the ultimate mountain and a late-in-life project, when one's voice, endurance, and sense of pacing is fully developed and there is less to be risked in terms of sabotaging one's career. There also seems to be a "deceptive simplicity" factor with Wagner, _pace_ Callas: the obvious technical difficulties of a role like Norma will keep many singers away from it, and those that do tackle it will soon have their weaknesses exposed; but singers who imagine they can handle Wagner's heroic parts may have some success with them and go on singing them for some time while their vocal facility and beauty gradually deteriorate under the strain. The notes themselves may be easy compared to Bellini or Handel, but the assiduous practice of bel canto technique is healthy for the voice in a way that constantly pitting your middle register against Wagner's orchestra is not.


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## Albert7 (Nov 16, 2014)

trazom said:


> There are other technical demands--agility, range, dramatic portrayal-- made on singers besides simply requiring the breath control of a sperm whale.


Much harder to sustain 40 minutes of straight singing without any breaks than a 5 minutes aria with 10 high notes honestly. Marathon versus sprint here.


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## Itullian (Aug 27, 2011)

Like Domingo singing Tristan on record but not on stage.


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## Itullian (Aug 27, 2011)

I don't know how Tristan gets thru that last act.

And what about Siegfried? What a Herculean role that is.


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## Il_Penseroso (Nov 20, 2010)

The Queen of Shemakha (from The Golden Cockerel) is a very demanding role in Russian opera repertory with very sliding chromatic passages intentionally written to sound unrealistic...

Dottor Bartolo from Il barbiere is really demanding for Basso buffo... 

Lucia (di Lammermoor)

...What else?


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## Tsaraslondon (Nov 7, 2013)

Albert7 said:


> Much harder to sustain 40 minutes of straight singing without any breaks than a 5 minutes aria with 10 high notes honestly. Marathon versus sprint here.


Norma is hardly a sprint!


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## Azol (Jan 25, 2015)

Tristan and Norma are two obvious choices here.

As for male bel canto repertoire, I would venture to say that Assur (from Rossini's Semiramide) is very difficult and demanding, including both acting and hell of a marathon singing in the second act.


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## BalalaikaBoy (Sep 25, 2014)

Azol said:


> Tristan and Norma are two obvious choices here.
> As for male bel canto repertoire, I would venture to say that Assur (from Rossini's Semiramide) is very difficult and demanding, including both acting and hell of a marathon singing in the second act.


Rossini's bass roles are some of the most difficult opera roles in general. 





in his day, it is likely that roles like Assur and Maometto would have been sung by low baritones/bass-baritones with darker voices rather than a real bass.


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## dgee (Sep 26, 2013)

Korngold and Schreker give their leads a tough time - lots of singing, big leaps, huge orchestras. I seem to recall hearing somewhere that Tote Stadt would happen more often if more good tenors were willing to put themselves through it


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## nina foresti (Mar 11, 2014)

Interesting that not one poster chose a tenor role in Italian opera.


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## Couac Addict (Oct 16, 2013)

Becca said:


> It seems that the focus of this thread has moved away from the OP's original question, i.e. not just which is vocally most demanding but which roles require_ Acting, singing, everything combined............... _


Maybe, Elektra

...............


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## Belowpar (Jan 14, 2015)

nina foresti said:


> Interesting that not one poster chose a tenor role in Italian opera.


Checkout post 20, nina foresti suggested 2!!!!!!!!!!!!


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## sospiro (Apr 3, 2010)

BalalaikaBoy said:


> Rossini's bass roles are some of the most difficult opera roles in general.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Spectacular!!! Thank you!


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## BalalaikaBoy (Sep 25, 2014)

DavidA said:


> I think demanding can have various meanings. Not just stamina or volume or even virtuoso tricks. Why some of Mozart's female roles are very demanding as they involve bags of character and agility. For example, a great Donna Elvira is truly something special as indeed dear old Liz S was!


I think this extends to Mozart in general: whose works are, imo, an odd combination of vivid characterization but vocal lines which feel somewhat mechanical and un-intuitive on the voice.


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## Woodduck (Mar 17, 2014)

BalalaikaBoy said:


> I think this extends to Mozart in general: whose works are, imo, an odd combination of vivid characterization but vocal lines which feel somewhat mechanical and un-intuitive on the voice.


Unlike Puccini, who writes big soaring lines and has the orchestra double them, Mozart leaves you on your own. He will not help you sound good if you aren't. His vocal writing requires perfect poise and technical discipline, and if you lack it everyone will hear by just how much you lack it. Singers know this; "practice your Mozart" means "mind your technique, find your weaknesses, fix them." It also means "don't force, keep it light, keep it flexible." Singers who specialize in Verdi or Wagner should practice their Mozart, even if they can't sing him well enough to perform him in public. Birgit Nilsson could never have sung the Queen of the Night successfully, but she sang her arias at parties, complete with high Fs.


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## Retired (Feb 15, 2015)

Demanding roles???...many good candidates have been mentioned. Take a look at the lead role in "Der Vampyr"...its like Holländer, only twice as long...and its been forgotten for good reason


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## BalalaikaBoy (Sep 25, 2014)

Woodduck said:


> Unlike Puccini, who writes big soaring lines and has the orchestra double them, Mozart leaves you on your own. He will not help you sound good if you aren't. His vocal writing requires perfect poise and technical discipline, and if you lack it everyone will hear by just how much you lack it. Singers know this; "practice your Mozart" means "mind your technique, find your weaknesses, fix them." It also means "don't force, keep it light, keep it flexible." Singers who specialize in Verdi or Wagner should practice their Mozart, even if they can't sing him well enough to perform him in public. *Birgit Nilsson could never have sung the Queen of the Night successfully, but she sang her arias at parties, complete with high Fs*.


I have heard this, and given her performances of Lady Macbeth's Sleepwalking Scene, I can believe it.

speaking of which, there's an exceedingly difficult role which hasn't gotten much attention on this thread


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## Tuoksu (Sep 3, 2015)

BalalaikaBoy said:


> generally, interpretation is not a huge concern of mine, but Norma is the exception. she is a scorned lover who murdered her children and wants to murder her ex-lover. to put it bluntly, Norma is a psychotic bitch, and the characterization of Sutherland, which perpetually sounded as if she were playing the Statue of Liberty, does not cut it.


She didn't murder her children  That's the difference between her and Medea.


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## nina foresti (Mar 11, 2014)

nina foresti said:


> Speaking of Italian operas...
> Sopranos:
> Norma
> Minnie
> ...


How could I have forgotten Butterfly?


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## Tuoksu (Sep 3, 2015)

The most demanding roles for Soprano are _the Assoluta roles:_
*1. Norma:* it's been already established on this thread. I have nothing to add.
*2. Abigaille in Nabucco:* The ultimate Dramatic Coloratura challenge. An epitome of Verdi's real and rarely-met demands, it calls for as much Volume as Wagner, as well all the Bel Canto virtuosity and agility. A wit called early Verdi "Bel Canto on Steroid" and it's perfectly true. 
The role is replete with treacherous scales and other crazy feats that only Callas could do justice. She made the roles even more exciting even interpolating a high Eb.
The stupid plot requires great acting skills as well to make it at least plausible. Abigaille should look and sound young, yet fierce and regal.
*3. Lady Macbeth:* Same as Abigaille but much more interesting and mature dramatically and only slightly more forgiving vocally. My personal favorite female role. The gran scena del sonnambulismo is one of Verdi's toughest challenges, not only musically but dramatically. In the same interview in which Callas explains why she thinks Wagner is "so easy" (for her at least) she also dissected this scene and talked about the nuances and colors she used for every single passage and why she used it. 



*4. Medea: *Norma minus the fioriture plus more wickeness.

Other difficult but underestimated _Verdi roles_: 

 Leonora in Il Trovatore: this is a long role, calls for incredible vocal beauty, tons of ornaments (trills, mezzo-trilli, trills in a slow melodic line, staccati etc..) as well as a very solid lower register. Miserere is Dramatic Mezzo material. It is followed by a very difficult Dramatic Coloratura cabaletta which is often dropped. D'amor sull'ali rosee is "perhaps Verdi's ultimate challenge". Besides, the acting has to be so subtle and convey the noble character of Leonora which I've only seen Kabaivanska do so well. 
Elena in Vespri Sciliani
Elizabeth de Valois in Don Carlo

What makes _Wagner_ difficult is indeed the Stamina it requires. I remember Dolora Zajick saying Verdi kills you in two hours but Wagner gives you three or four hours to die or something to that effect.

_Turandot_ is not difficult if you have the right voice. You only need to sound like trumpet. Nilsson did. That's why she was the best and she called it her "vacation role".

_Donizetti's three queens_ are somewhat underestimated in difficulty, especially Elizabeth in Roberto Devereux and Anna Bolena.


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## Pugg (Aug 8, 2014)

Elizabeth de Valois in Don Carlo and Lucia di Lammermoor 

Just think the tour the force they have to do at the end, after singing all the time.


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## nina foresti (Mar 11, 2014)

Pugg said:


> Elizabeth de Valois in Don Carlo and Lucia di Lammermoor
> 
> Just think the tour the force they have to do at the end, after singing all the time.


Yes, it's true that the role of Elisabetta is written in such a way that it has to be tempered early on or the singer will find herself in all kinds of trouble.


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## Bonetan (Dec 22, 2016)

Couac Addict said:


> I'd be inclined to rule out the Wagner roles. Whilst plenty of power/stamina is required, the score reveals that not much range is required by the singers. It doesn't test them nearly as much as the Wagnerians would have us believe
> 
> Most difficult? Perhaps, Lulu?


This is incomprehensibly dumb & 100% incorrect. Wotan (as one example) requires a larger range than any low voice role I've studied. Then add the strength & stamina on top of that.


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## Pugg (Aug 8, 2014)

Bonetan said:


> This is incomprehensibly dumb & 100% incorrect. Wotan (as one example) requires a larger range than any low voice role I've studied. Then add the strength & stamina on top of that.


Perhaps C.A means also acting, Lulu is quite demanding.


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## Bonetan (Dec 22, 2016)

Pugg said:


> Perhaps C.A means also acting, Lulu is quite demanding.


He'd be wrong in both cases, don't you think?


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## Meyerbeer Smith (Mar 25, 2016)

For Italian bel canto: Gemma di Vergy (Donizetti). Caballé thought it the equal of three Normas.

Other difficult roles not mentioned:

Ermione - described as a bel canto Elektra; vocally and emotionally demanding. Listen: 



 and 




The Adolphe Nourrit roles: Arnold in _Guillaume Tell_, Eléazar in _La juive_, Robert le Diable, Raoul in _Les Huguenots_ - demands heroic bel canto singing, acting and almost constant on-stage presence through five acts

Fidès in _Le prophète_: 




Esclarmonde: 



 and 




Abigaille, Odabella and Hélène

And, these days, the roles written for castrati.


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## Pugg (Aug 8, 2014)

Did we mention: *Rossini's Armida,* bless the soprano that one.


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## nina foresti (Mar 11, 2014)

nina foresti said:


> Speaking of Italian operas...
> Sopranos:
> Norma
> Minnie
> ...


How could I forget Butterfly?


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## JAS (Mar 6, 2013)

nina foresti said:


> How could I forget Butterfly?


Why not? Pinkerton did.


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## nina foresti (Mar 11, 2014)

JAS said:


> Why not? Pinkerton did.


(spraying coffee all over my monitor)


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