# Suk and Bax



## kanishknishar (Aug 10, 2015)

I heard Suk's Ripening and there are many similarities with Bax's music. They were contemporaries. Were they aware of each other? Was Bax influenced by Suk or vice-versa?


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## Orfeo (Nov 14, 2013)

Yes, you can say that these two composers crossed paths (as Suk got older and more of a modernist). But I'm not so sure that they influenced each other per se. It could be that the occasional reflections or evocations of each other's music was by accident or coincidence (like, say, Bax and Myaskovsky). 

But Suk (and to some extent, Novak) was influential on the music of Philip Sainton.


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## kanishknishar (Aug 10, 2015)

Orfeo said:


> Yes, you can say that these two composers crossed paths (as Suk got older and more of a modernist). But I'm not so sure that they influenced each other per se. It could be that the occasional reflections or evocations of each other's music was by accident or coincidence (like, say, Bax and Myaskovsky).
> 
> But Suk (and to some extent, Novak) was influential on the music of Philip Sainton.


I am not sure I see Bax's and Myaskovsky's music styles being similar.

What's your opinion on Bax's music? He wrote a great deal of orchestral music that is appealing and easy-listening.


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## Orfeo (Nov 14, 2013)

kanishknishar said:


> I am not sure I see Bax's and Myaskovsky's music styles being similar.
> 
> What's your opinion on Bax's music? He wrote a great deal of orchestral music that is appealing and easy-listening.


I find his music pretty extraordinary. Bax was a great orchestrator and a master of form and development. The late Vernon Handley described him as a master of mood music (the way he conveyed various moods with alluring coloring and keen articulation). Like Myaskovsky, even Bruckner and Lyatoshynsky (perhaps even Sibelius), Bax was at his best in slow movements. As in, say, the music of Glazunov, there is a certain level of self-effacement or elusiveness in their music, and it uncovers its secrets, but slowly and only by layers. But the patience pays off.

I wrote about his music in length here. Please check it out if you wish.
-->Bax symphony recommendations


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## larold (Jul 20, 2017)

_What's your opinion on Bax's music? He wrote a great deal of orchestral music that is appealing and easy-listening. _

Bax was strongly influenced by the ocean like many composers. The ebb and flow of waves, storms, calm seas and weather change is episodic in his music. He expressed ideas about Celitc culture in his tone poems, less so in his symphonies which are more absolute.

I liked his music for a time but unlike you never found it easy listening. To me it was demanding, even on repeated hearing. I thought him more in common with Elgar and his obliqueness. Like Elgar, I never found an easy flow in Bax's orchestral music.

This was his music that made the greatest impression on me:















As to the comparison of Suk and Bax … Suk was a tortured soul and Bax was romantic and angry a lot of the time. Their careers both began in the 19th century and straddled the 20th. Both were romantics well after the time but not unlike others of the 1930s such as Rachmaninoff.


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## starthrower (Dec 11, 2010)

I listen to Bax's symphonies but I can't seem to retain any of the music. I've also been listening to Martinu, Nielsen, Honegger, and Sibelius symphonies. These I can absorb and recognize when I re-listen. Bax just goes in one ear and out the other. I've haven't listened to Suk.


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## larold (Jul 20, 2017)

I would agree a lack of memorable themes endemic to Bax's symphonies. To love Bax is to love other elements.


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## MusicSybarite (Aug 17, 2017)

larold said:


> I would agree a lack of memorable themes endemic to Bax's symphonies. To love Bax is to love other elements.


An element I find extremely noticeable in most of his music is the atmosphere he manages to conjure up. He's quite efficient and an assured master in that regard. Despite many of his works seem to wander, the atmosphere almost always saves the moment.


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## christomacin (Oct 21, 2017)

I'm not sure how at the very least the Symphony No. 1 and Symphony No. 3 don't leave an impression on the listener. The orchestral work In Memoriam is pretty memorable as well:


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## Bulldog (Nov 21, 2013)

larold said:


> I would agree a lack of memorable themes endemic to Bax's symphonies. To love Bax is to love other elements.


I have a different take on Bax's themes/melodies. He packs more themes into his symphonic movements than most other composers. One thing Bax does not do is keep hitting us with the same theme over and over. For me, that's a virtue that doesn't equate to a lack of memorability.


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## larold (Jul 20, 2017)

_An element I find extremely noticeable in most of his music is the atmosphere he manages to conjure up. He's quite efficient and an assured master in that regard. Despite many of his works seem to wander, the atmosphere almost always saves the moment. _

Agree he was something of a romantic impressionist akin to his countryman Delius with more temperament.


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## SONNET CLV (May 31, 2014)

_Tintagel_ remains a fine entry point into the music of Bax. Then comes that body of symphonies, which I have long found irresistible. Bax's body of symphonies reminds me somewhat of Bruckner's; not that they sound similar to Bruckner's symphonies (they don't) but that they share a similar sound world with one another as do those of the Austrian master. Yet each symphony _is _unique and presents its own universe. A paradox, perhaps, but one well worth exploring.

My reason for posting here, to say: if you enjoy Bax, try the music of William Alwyn, especially his Fourth Symphony, a profoundly beautiful work with one of the most stunning final movements in the literature.

And, of course, you can't go wrong exploring the music of Suk and Novak, either.


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