# Works/Composers You've Changed Your Mind About?



## mmsbls (Mar 6, 2011)

This is a spin off of science's thread "What have you changed your mind about?" In that thread people are posting things in life they have changed their minds about. I just read Orange Soda King's post stating, "I've changed my mind about ... Tchaikovsky's 1st piano concerto. When I first heard it, I liked it, but now I don't like it that much at all." That remark made me curious about people's changing views on music.

I think most of us have come across works that we did not like or love at first, but after several hearings we changed our minds and came to enjoy the piece. I suspect that it is more uncommon to love/like a work and then later find it much less appealing. I'd be interested to hear people's experiences with significant changes in response to a work. 

In addition it might be interesting for people to talk about their changing views of composers especially those who have fallen from their favor.

For me I can't think of works or composers I used to like and now do not so I'll give examples of positive conversions. After listening to many of Haydn's symphonies and several concertos, I was not overly impressed. I knew that Haydn was considered a truly great composer and was confused by that assessment. I realized that some of that assessment was due to his pioneering of the symphony and quartet; nevertheless, I felt he was overrated. I slowly have come to enjoy his works more and more (especially the quartets), and now I would place him probably slightly below the general assessment but in the ballpark.


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## Argus (Oct 16, 2009)

Opera - I used to think it was rubbish, but now I think it's worse than that.


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## haydnfan (Apr 13, 2011)

I used to dislike Carter, now he is one of my favorite composers.


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## Chi_townPhilly (Apr 21, 2007)

Here's a *similar thread*....

and *this post* contains my previous thoughts on the matter.


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## tdc (Jan 17, 2011)

In the last few months I've listened to a LOT of new music and my tastes have evolved a lot. One composr I've really come around to is Bartok. Where before his music just sounded muddled and noisy to me, I've found many of his works I very much appreciate now. At this point I would easily place him in my top 25 composers. Speaking of which, when I first started posting here there was a thread where we list our top 25 favorite composers, and I'd have to say I cringe now when I think of the list I posted back then already. Just a few months later and my list would look very different.


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## Webernite (Sep 4, 2010)

I like Mozart and Brahms much more than I did a year or so ago.


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## Polednice (Sep 13, 2009)

In terms of folks that I'd never really liked before, but for whom I am gaining a greater appreciation each day, I'd list Bruckner, Prokofiev, and Shostakovich. I think a great deal of the issue finding certain composers accessible - for me at least - is that I really need to listen to them in concert to get a feel for their works; sitting at home with CDs or Spotify just isn't conducive to understanding.

On the other side of the spectrum, I _used_ to really love Rachmaninov - he was probably the first composer I felt fanatical about, but I really just cannot stand his music at all now; even the piano concertos get on my nerves.

At least I used to like him though; I've _never_ liked Liszt, and every time I try to listen to his music, he just seems worse and worse


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## Pieck (Jan 12, 2011)

I started out with the Baroque, and today I almost dont listen to it at all (though still like it)
I moved to Romantic and still love it.
Couldn't stand Classical, but today I can appreciate it, though not listening to it very much.
I was afraid of Modern, but about two months ago I started to explore it thoroughly and today love it.


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## mmsbls (Mar 6, 2011)

Pieck said:


> I was afraid of Modern, but about two months ago I started to explore it thoroughly and today love it.


I find this phenomenon fascinating. We all know exposure to music can change our views and enjoyment. I am probably where you were a couple of months ago - just starting to explore with some purpose rather than simple listening to random works (which almost invariably I disliked).

Do you think that simple exposure got you "over the hump"? Or did you explore in specific ways that allowed you to sample the "correct" works - works that might appeal more to you than a random modern piece?


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## Weston (Jul 11, 2008)

I used to loathe Mozart. Thought him saccharine and superficial, and never understood people's placing him on such a pedastel when for me Haydn was the deeper musician. Now I have come to understand it was early Mozart I didn't like. In the TC Top 100 keyboard concertos thread, some of Mozart's latter piano concertos outranked even Beethoven's in my estimation. And that's saying something. 

For opera and the entire classical style of singing I had to imagine it was some kind of theremin making the noise rather than a human. Silly as it sounds that got me over the hurdle of classical vocal soloists.

I don't believe I will ever change my mind about country music or rap however. I would rather take a shower in molten glass than listen to those things.

Most of my taste changes come slowly over a period of years. It's more of an evolution than a change of mind. For example I am slowly warming to more modern pieces.


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## Argus (Oct 16, 2009)

haydnfan said:


> I used to dislike Carter, now he is one of my favorite composers.


Sorry to hear about that, I wish you a speedy recovery.


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## haydnfan (Apr 13, 2011)

Haha! lol Reminds me yesterday I was listening to Queyras/Tharaud Schubert album thinking it was all Schubert... they start playing Webern... I don't it and I'm like "holy cow! Schubert had a heavily dissonant avant garde side?"


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## Huilunsoittaja (Apr 6, 2010)

Well, recently not much, except now I have more substantiation for hating Stravinsky, I've learned more things about him. And his anti-Russian music continues to annoy me. Yeah, it's not his dissonance, its his mentality that annoys me.

Would you believe there was a time I was awfully suspicious of Prokofiev? Yes! Couple years ago I was really suspicious of his music, thinking that because he was an Enfante Terrible, he was a Serialist or something like that. I was dead wrong, except for the Enfante Terrible part.

I think that all the time now, I'm gradually getting an acquired taste for dissonance. I'm glad for it, because now I can listen to stuff I don't even like at all, but still be able to listen to it without freaking out. It's the beginning of becoming more tolerant, and eventually appreciative.


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## Pieck (Jan 12, 2011)

mmsbls said:


> I find this phenomenon fascinating. We all know exposure to music can change our views and enjoyment. I am probably where you were a couple of months ago - just starting to explore with some purpose rather than simple listening to random works (which almost invariably I disliked).
> 
> Do you think that simple exposure got you "over the hump"? Or did you explore in specific ways that allowed you to sample the "correct" works - works that might appeal more to you than a random modern piece?


Not randomally at all. I started with le Sacre du Printemps, Bartok's Concerto, Shostakovich 8th SQ, Janacek 2nd SQ, Debussy and Ravel SQ (by modern I mean anything post Post-Romanticism), and stuff like these.
I used as a source of recommendations the TC's lists.
I listened to more than all above, like Bartok and Berg VCs, Schoenberg and Webern STrios, etc. and now Bartok SQs as can be seen in the Current Listening\purchases threads.
But what amaze me above all, is how fast I got used to the dissonaces.
When I first heard Debussy's Cello Sonata few months ago, I was like "WTF??!!#" and that's not even so dissonant. Today I love it of course. and with the atonality Im also getting along pretty good now.
Now I can enjoy dissonance on first hearing , like with Bartok SQs.
I think it's all matter of attitude. I approached it very open minded. The most problematic issue is coming with prejudices like my mother planted in me, e.g, you cant really enjoy modern, etc.


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## Manxfeeder (Oct 19, 2010)

I'm surprised that I like to listen to much of Schoenberg's music. That just happened, I think, over the last year. And when I was in my 20s I couldn't stand Tchaikovsky, but somehow now he makes sense.


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## mmsbls (Mar 6, 2011)

Manxfeeder said:


> I'm surprised that I like to listen to much of Schoenberg's music. That just happened, I think, over the last year. And when I was in my 20s I couldn't stand Tchaikovsky, but somehow now he makes sense.


Did you do anything specific to like Schoenberg more? Did you listen to his works many times? Did you listen to certain works? Did you listen to many other modern works? Or did it really feel as though it happened without doing anything specific?


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## Webernite (Sep 4, 2010)

My experiences are similar Pieck's. If you listen to a certain amount of Schoenberg/Carter/Bartok/etc., it's not so much that you learn to live with the dissonance: what happens is that the works literally begin to _sound_ less dissonant to your ears. You perceive things as consonances which you had previously perceived as dissonances. I think this is quite a common experience, but it does take some effort.


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## suhwahaksaeng (Apr 17, 2011)

_Poeme Electronique_ by Edgar Varese used to put me in a trance.
But after the rock musicians copied his tape-splicing idea and ran it into the ground, it no longer has that effect on me.

The first time I heard Siegfried's funeral march, I didn't think much of it.
But now that I identified all the motifs in the piece, I can't listen to it dry-eyed.


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## Romantic Geek (Dec 25, 2009)

I've been warming up to some modernist works by Ornstein and Antheil. Still doesn't mean I like Schoenberg! Still don't like Mozart. I definitely have a greater appreciation for CPE Bach though.


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## StlukesguildOhio (Dec 25, 2006)

I think that the biggest recent change I've made has been in my opinion of French Baroque music. I used to think that the French music of the period was effete and lightweight in comparison to Bach, Handel, and the rest of the Italians and Germans (and even the English... Purcell). As I've made a concerted effort over the last year and a half in exploring the Baroque in greater depth I found that the French music of the period is quite marvelous: Rameau, Lully, Charpentier, Couperin, and so much more.


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## Conor71 (Feb 19, 2009)

It took me a while to warm to Bruckner - I really like him now though! .


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## Couchie (Dec 9, 2010)

I really can't listen to much of Chopin or Rachmaninoff anymore without wanting to tear my hair out. They're 2 of only a few composers I have approaching the complete works of, and I think I wore them out in my younger days. I've since learned to pace myself more and balance my current-listening portfolio with many different composers, rather than months-long binges of somebody. Sorry guys!


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## nickgray (Sep 28, 2008)

Mozart. After hearing interpretations by Mackerras and Jacobs I suddenly realized why Mozart is held is such high esteem. I also realized how important period performance practice are (mainly proper tempi and small orchestras), because Mozart sounds absolutely ridiculous and horrible when performed by a large orchestra in a romantic manner.

Modern/contemporary/avant-garde stuff. I still despise pieces like Helicopter Quartet, but overall I kinda grew accustomed to this weird modern music. Oh, and as a result I now like early Schnittke as well. I loved his late stuff before, but his early music was too avantgarde-ish for me. Not anymore, fortunately.


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## Manxfeeder (Oct 19, 2010)

mmsbls said:


> Did you do anything specific to like Schoenberg more? Did you listen to his works many times? Did you listen to certain works? Did you listen to many other modern works? Or did it really feel as though it happened without doing anything specific?


Yeah, it just happened. I never thought he was worth much attention (sounding to me more like Brahms played with all wrong notes) until I met a lawyer who said he liked Schoenberg, and the weird idea of a Schoenbergian lawyer tweaked me into wanting to check into his music. I started with Gurrelieder, then Verklarte Nacht, then Pelleas. I think the big moment came when I discovered a piece I heard once 30 years ago and never forgot but didn't know its name was actually Farben from the Five Pieces for Orchestra. That hooked me into exploring further, into the Variations for Orchestra and Moses und Aron and then others.

I don't always understand what he's doing, but so far his music has been clicking with me regardless.


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## anshuman (Jul 6, 2010)

As a fan of classical music I try to listen to a work again and again when I am unable to get attracted to it at the first listening.These days I am trying to develop a taste for Delius' music. I got hooked to his music through On hearing the First Cuckoo in Spring and La Calinda. Now i have come to appreciate works like Brigg Fair and he Violin Sonata.I dont know whether this the right way of developing musical appreciation. I think that i have lost a degree of sponteneity in my love of music.


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## Comistra (Feb 27, 2010)

My thoughts on Schönberg (at least Verklärte Nacht) are turning, to some degree. Often I have my music player set to randomly select one work out of my entire collection, picking a new one whenever the current one finishes. In the past, when VN started playing, I'd ask myself, _What is this garbage?_, look to see, then skip to the next work. Last time it came up, I instead said to myself, _This is rather interesting_, and was surprised to find it was VN. I couldn't take the whole piece, but it appears to be endearing itself to me, ever so slowly.

For the other way around, I'm cooling off on Brahms' symphonies. I used to really like them, but now I find them tiresome. I don't think it's from overplaying, since I never actually listened to them too much; but for whatever reason, they've become.. I don't know, too Romantic? I suppose that's an odd comment from somebody who likes Dvořák so much, but there you are.


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## science (Oct 14, 2010)

I can't think of any work of music that I like less than I used to.

Things that I did not initially appreciate, and later did include Brahms' piano quartets, Janacek's Glagolitic Mass, Bartok's piano concertos, for that matter perhaps everything I've ever heard by Bartok, Debussy's La Mer, John Eliot Gardiner (though I'm still not a big fan). I might be coming around on R. Strauss now too.


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## kmisho (Oct 22, 2009)

mmsbls said:


> I find this phenomenon fascinating. We all know exposure to music can change our views and enjoyment. I am probably where you were a couple of months ago - just starting to explore with some purpose rather than simple listening to random works (which almost invariably I disliked).
> 
> Do you think that simple exposure got you "over the hump"? Or did you explore in specific ways that allowed you to sample the "correct" works - works that might appeal more to you than a random modern piece?


If I may chime in. I think simple exposure is probably enough. I actually remember when I first began to like "modern" harmonies. I was listening to Stravinsky's Symphony in C. It still had all of that "wrong note" feeling to me, but it suddenly sounded right. It sounded self-consistent and no longer seemed just plain ugly. I had liked some "ugly" works before this, like Stravinsky's Rite of Spring, but that one seemed different because I think ugliness was part of the intention. The discord was part of the intent. But the symphony in C does not intend to be discordant. It simply speaks a different language of tonality than Beethoven or Mozart for instance. And after a certain amount of exposure it suddenly made sense to me. I keep saying suddenly, and it was pretty sudden. One day I didn't get it, the next day I did.


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## Argus (Oct 16, 2009)

Most classical written before about 1800 I find less appealing. It bores me more and more. I can still enjoy a few select pieces by Bach or Handel or whoever, but for the most part it all sounds so vanilla. Pre- renaissance is out of the equation.

Classical written between 1800 and 1950 has become more polarised. I still really like the stuff I used to really like, if not more, but the stuff I was lukewarm towards I am now dead cold to. Quite a lot of it sounds either overly sentimental or plain twee.

Classical post 1950 has become my preferred area of exploration. There's so much variety and so many composers unhyped and under-appreciated it makes discovery more interesting. This excludes serialism which I still find to be highly tedious.


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## Barking Spiderz (Feb 1, 2011)

Though I've only been into CM for a year or so, initially I was open to a wide range of stuff from Monteverdi to Stravinsky. Now my CM listenign habois5have narrowed and consolidated. There are firm faves who can do little wrong in my ears - Dvorak, Smetana, Rimsky, LvB, Rossini overtures, Bizet, Debussy, Tchaikovsky and Borodin - but after being open minded I've since developed a strong dislike of the late Austro-German Romantics / early modern and the 20th century Russians. If any Baroque and Classical pre late Haydn Paris symphoines and Mozart's 36th symph comes on the radio I dive for the off button. As for opera I dont think anything'll make me like it.


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## RErnesto (Apr 14, 2011)

Huilunsoittaja said:


> Well, recently not much, except now I have more substantiation for hating Stravinsky, I've learned more things about him. And his anti-Russian music continues to annoy me. Yeah, it's not his dissonance, its his mentality that annoys me..


anti-Russian though or more anti-Communist? Seems odd considering he was Russian and subscribed to the Russian Orthodox church.


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## Sid James (Feb 7, 2009)

Well, going back 20 years, I used to think chamber & solo piano music was the "poor cousin" of orchestral music, but now I'm much more into them than orchestral music. The same thing has happened (to a degree) with art song and choral music (be it accompanied or a Capella). I'm now much more into a variety of genres. I have also discovered electroacoustic music in the last couple of years, and I like it a lot. Gone are the days when virtually the only thing I'd listen to was orchestral music. The only thing that I'm not hugely into is opera, but occasionally I like to get out ones I like such as _Carmen_ or _Wozzeck_ & give them a listen. Otherwise I've mainly hovered around chamber for the past 3-6 months or so, and this was unthinkable 20 or even 10 years ago (although I did begin to attend concerts by the Australian Chamber Orchestra in the '90's, but a lot of what they do is play the larger ensemble works)...


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## Huilunsoittaja (Apr 6, 2010)

RErnesto said:


> anti-Russian though or more anti-Communist? Seems odd considering he was Russian and subscribed to the Russian Orthodox church.


Probably both. But I'm disturbed how he completely rejected his Russian roots. He actually refused to be called at Russian Composer, and preferred to be considered a French Composer. I think with as high influence as he had, I don't think he had to worry about being called Communist, he was a strong capitalist. So, I'll give him what he wanted: I will not love him as a Russian composer (except for Firebird and a few other things). I'll only love him after I love his Un-Russian side.


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## Andreas (Apr 27, 2012)

There are a number of composer I did not like, or failed to fully appreciate, at first. One of them is Debussy. Initially, I considered him a petty piano composer who relished colours and sonorities rather than executing proper musical arguments. I have since come to admire his work, however. The is a certain dryness, an emotional detachment, that balances off the playful harmonies. Also, there's a kind of frivolous arrogance about his works. This is actually quite appealing to me because it signifies confidence and independence, which contradicts, in a way, the seemingly flattering and pleasing style of his works.


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## arpeggio (Oct 4, 2012)

*Atonal/Avant-garde*

Interesting thread. Surprised that there has been so little activity in it.

During the first fifty years of my life I did not get Atonal/Avant-garde music with the exception of Berg. I liked 20th century music but I gravitated toward the more conservative tonal composers: Hindemith, Barber, Copland, Shostakovitch, Britten, _etc._ I was listening to some Xenakis the other day and I thought, "Hey this stuff is pretty good."

Don't ask me why? I really do not know.

Now that I get the modernistic stuff, it gets me into all sorts of trouble.

Ironically all of the anti-modernistic rhetoric has had the opposite effect on me. It makes appreciate this stuff even more.


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## mstar (Aug 14, 2013)

Changed my mind about liszt for the worse. I really did expect more variation from work to work.... 
Change my mind about Rach for the better all the time (i.e. almost every time I listen to a new work). 
Changing my mind constantly about piano works by Brahms.


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## Flamme (Dec 30, 2012)

Huilunsoittaja said:


> Probably both. But I'm disturbed how he completely rejected his Russian roots. He actually refused to be called at Russian Composer, and preferred to be considered a French Composer. I think with as high influence as he had, I don't think he had to worry about being called Communist, he was a strong capitalist. So, I'll give him what he wanted: I will not love him as a Russian composer (except for Firebird and a few other things). I'll only love him after I love his Un-Russian side.


Well his country was a mess in many things still as like when he gave such statements its not just him but milions of russians who fled it afer the revolution and millions of other slav refugees from countries ''infected'' by communism, he just didnt believe situation will EVER change on beter


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## Flamme (Dec 30, 2012)

About Gershwin, thought he was a ''leight weight'' pop composer, but its much more that meets the eye...Or Ear for this matter


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## moody (Nov 5, 2011)

mstar said:


> Changed my mind about liszt for the worse. I really did expect more variation from work to work....
> Change my mind about Rach for the better all the time (i.e. almost every time I listen to a new work).
> Changing my mind constantly about piano works by Brahms.


I don't know what Liszt you've been listening to but there's a huge variation between his many works.


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## Piwikiwi (Apr 1, 2011)

Huilunsoittaja said:


> Probably both. But I'm disturbed how he completely rejected his Russian roots. He actually refused to be called at Russian Composer, and preferred to be considered a French Composer. I think with as high influence as he had, I don't think he had to worry about being called Communist, he was a strong capitalist. So, I'll give him what he wanted: I will not love him as a Russian composer (except for Firebird and a few other things). I'll only love him after I love his Un-Russian side.


I don't want to sound rude but that must be the most hilarious reason for not liking someone's music I've ever heard.


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## Cosmos (Jun 28, 2013)

I used to like Liszt, but he's fallen to the wayside :/ I guess it's because I first loved him for his awesomely difficult piano pieces. But after a bit, I got over that, and once you ignore the technique aspect to Liszt's music, there's not much left. I think he's a God awful orchestrater and that makes it hard to enjoy his Dante and Faust symphonies. The piano sonata will always remain a favorite of mine, IMO it's one of the best sonatas ever written

I used to dislike Shostakovich. I tried getting into his music, and it sounded so wrong. Now I have no idea what I was thinking back then, because he's rapidly becoming one of my favorites.

I used to like Alkan, but his music is kinda meh after repeated listenings. 

Finally, I used to hate Brahms. Now he's just ok, but nothing special for me.


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## mstar (Aug 14, 2013)

Cosmos said:


> I used to like Liszt, but he's fallen to the wayside :/ I guess it's because I first loved him for his awesomely difficult piano pieces. But after a bit, I got over that, and once you ignore the technique aspect to Liszt's music, there's not much left. I think he's a God awful orchestrater and that makes it hard to enjoy his Dante and Faust symphonies. The piano sonata will always remain a favorite of mine, IMO it's one of the best sonatas ever written.


True. Sat down at the piano and tried a bit at the techniques used. What lacks is _musical quality in same-composer style-differentiation...._


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## hpowders (Dec 23, 2013)

I used to love Aaron Copland's music, but except for Appalachian Spring as performed by the NY Philharmonic under Leonard Bernstein, find his music sounding dated. Doesn't wear well for me anymore.


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## mmsbls (Mar 6, 2011)

I originally started this thread awhile ago, and much has changed for me. There are many composers and works that I decidedly disliked then but quite enjoy now. I'm not sure there were any works by Stravinsky that I liked, but now I love many. Of composers who mystified me back then, I quite enjoy some works by Boulez, Stockhausen, Messiean, Lutoslawski, Berg, and others. 

Perhaps the most significant change has been how I view certain modern music. Back then some works sounded awful, vulgar, even absurd. I couldn't understand how anyone could possibly enjoy them, and, quite frankly, some barely sounded like music to me. Now, although I may not like some works, most no longer sound awful or absurd - they merely sound different. I may find interesting parts to them and often hear at least something that's fun and even enjoyable. I've mentioned elsewhere how the transformation seems almost magical, but continued listening and exploration really does seem to open up many new possibilities in music.


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## Tristan (Jan 5, 2013)

Brahms - originally used to find his music boring, and I was only interested in his 1st symphony. My how that has changed.

chamber music in general - I was really not interested in much chamber music, especially string quartets, which I used to consider especially dull. That has changed quite a bit too!


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## hpowders (Dec 23, 2013)

Berg-couldn't "get" most of it until I heard Arthur Grumiaux's recording of the violin concerto. An absolutely fantastic, moving work!


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## Fried fifer (Dec 14, 2013)

Italian romantic period music, thought it was boring self absorbed crap. Now ive seen Falstaff live, and can definitely say Falstaff is a masterpiece. And I have not listened to enough other work to judge Italian romantic work but I am open to it, so there is that.


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