# Zigmoud Freud and Karl Jung favorite classical composers, a post women will hate lol



## deprofundis (Apr 25, 2014)

Hmm let's face it , intellectual woman even the more open mind are against these two Psychanalists..
My sister who seem somehow to be intelligent yet she only knowledge, Than she said to me once in french it'S funnier i will translate later on, Your Freud you like is a cocaine addict and a sexist just like Jung , she was frustrated against me...

Than an old man at a book store told me woman dosen like psychanalysis and think it'S B.S, what do you guys think at TC, can you be Freudian whiteout being sexist are both are inseparable hmm?

Know gurls here at talk classical please behave and be nice just kidding and dont take it personnal please this post was done in realistic humour...
:tiphat:


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## Klassik (Mar 14, 2017)

deprofundis said:


> Than an old man at a book store told me woman dosen like psychanalysis and think it'S B.S, what do you guys think at TC, can you be Freudian whiteout being sexist are both are inseparable hmm?


Freud's theories have no scientific basis and thus are nonsense as psychological theories. They're certainly interesting, so I guess that's why they remain popular, but it's about as useful as getting psychological knowledge from a Magic 8 ball. The best stuff coming out of Vienna during Freud's days was classical music (even if it was Schoenberg), not psychology theory. In other words, don't run off blaming mother for everything...unless she actually deserves it! And don't tell your girlfriend that, according to Freud, she's really upset because she really wants a ding dong and/or her dad


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## deprofundis (Apr 25, 2014)

don't run off blaming mother for everything...unless she actually deserves it! And don't tell your girlfriend that, according to Freud, she's really upset because she really wants a ding dong and/or her dad, i agree Klassik


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## Bettina (Sep 29, 2016)

I'm a woman, and a feminist - and I love Freud! Sure, a few of his ideas (the you-know-what envy) are sexist and I don't agree with that aspect of his work. But most of his ideas are not sexist at all. I love his theories about how the unconscious mind works, and his insights into dream symbolism and interpretation. He was a brilliant philosopher. It's unfortunate that he's usually depicted, at least in pop culture, as a cigar-obsessed freak!


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## Klassik (Mar 14, 2017)

Bettina said:


> I love his theories about how the unconscious mind works, and his insights into dream symbolism and interpretation. He was a brilliant philosopher. It's unfortunate that he's usually depicted, at least in pop culture, as a cigar-obsessed freak!


Philosopher is probably the right word to describe Freud. A brilliant or mediocre one can be debated, but I would never call him a scientist who has any useful insights into psychology or psychiatry. He did give us some interesting things to discuss though. Perhaps we can come up with a list of the most poophole retentive and expulsive composers. We can debate whether conductors who use batons are really wanting to waive their ding dongs (or the ding dongs they wished they had in the case of women conductors) at the orchestra/crowd. Is Gergiev's toothpick a statement about his manhood?


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## KenOC (Mar 7, 2011)

Klassik said:


> Is Gergiev's toothpick a statement about his manhood?


"Sometimes a toothpick is only a toothpick." --Siggypoo


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## Manxfeeder (Oct 19, 2010)

Say what you will, Freud did get to the root of Mahler's problems with intimacy with his wife. I think. Anyway, it seemed to cure his problem.


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## Bettina (Sep 29, 2016)

Klassik said:


> Philosopher is probably the right word to describe Freud. A brilliant or mediocre one can be debated, but I would never call him a scientist who has any useful insights into psychology or psychiatry. He did give us some interesting things to discuss though. Perhaps we can come up with a list of the most poophole retentive and expulsive composers. We can debate whether conductors who use batons are really wanting to waive their ding dongs (or the ding dongs they wished they had in the case of women conductors) at the orchestra/crowd. Is Gergiev's toothpick a statement about his manhood?


Yes, I definitely do consider Freud a philosopher, even though that was not necessarily how he viewed himself. His work strikes me as being very much in the tradition of continental philosophers such as Rousseau, Kierkegaard, Schopenhauer, Nietzsche...thinkers who offer their opinions about the human condition, often expressed in highly figurative language.


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## hpowders (Dec 23, 2013)

Klassik said:


> Freud's theories have no scientific basis and thus are nonsense as psychological theories. They're certainly interesting, so I guess that's why they remain popular, but it's about as useful as getting psychological knowledge from a Magic 8 ball. The best stuff coming out of Vienna during Freud's days was classical music (even if it was Schoenberg), not psychology theory. In other words, don't run off blaming mother for everything...unless she actually deserves it! And don't tell your girlfriend that, according to Freud, she's really upset because she really wants a ding dong and/or her dad


So how do you explain Freudian Slips? Just a phallic-y?


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## Captainnumber36 (Jan 19, 2017)

As a therapist myself, I enjoy Freud's Psychoanalysis in bringing to the conscious mind the sub-conscious thoughts that drive one's behavior. I also am a fan of exploring child hood events that have caused current behavior!

I mix this with Cognitive Behavioral Therapy in that I attempt to conduct behavior modifications in the insights we discover through Psychoanalysis.

Freud was certainly an innovative thinker, but much like Ayn Rand, did not conduct science to test his hypotheses. But still, out of the box thoughts are certainly valuable in stimulating research ideas!


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## TurnaboutVox (Sep 22, 2013)

I will reply to this later - I am actually a trained (Freudian, if you like) Psychoanalytic psychotherapist, and apply that model to psychiatric work.


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## Mandryka (Feb 22, 2013)

deprofundis said:


> Hmm let's face it , intellectual woman even the more open mind are against these two Psychanalists..
> My sister who seem somehow to be intelligent yet she only knowledge, Than she said to me once in french it'S funnier i will translate later on, Your Freud you like is a cocaine addict and a sexist just like Jung , she was frustrated against me...
> 
> Than an old man at a book store told me woman dosen like psychanalysis and think it'S B.S, what do you guys think at TC, can you be Freudian whiteout being sexist are both are inseparable hmm?
> ...


Why is it funnier in French?

I have a problem with Jung, understanding him. I'm very suspicious by nature of magic and mysticism, I just don't have the God gene. When I was a kid I loved Jung's autobiography!

I have a friend who has being doing Freudian analysis as a patient for about 12 years, he says it's hard, very hard, and it hasn't made him happier, but it has helped him in some way, I'm not sure I understand really.


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## Lenny (Jul 19, 2016)

I'm more a Jung guy myself. His theories about collective uncouscious rock, and are of a proper size to my taste. Freud seemed to be schoolboy compared to Jung, who thought himself as a lion-headed aryan god (according to Richard Noll's book The Aryan Christ: The Secret Life of Carl Jung).


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## Xaltotun (Sep 3, 2010)

I'm a great friend of Freud, he's one of my favourite writers. Maybe the most brilliant mind of the 20th century. Jung is all right as well, but I do prefer Freud.


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## Lenny (Jul 19, 2016)

Xaltotun said:


> I'm a great friend of Freud, he's one of my favourite writers. Maybe the most brilliant mind of the 20th century. Jung is all right as well, but I do prefer Freud.


Do you also prefer Mahler over Brucker? Or Mahler over Wagner?


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## Xaltotun (Sep 3, 2010)

Lenny said:


> Do you also prefer Mahler over Brucker? Or Mahler over Wagner?


I prefer both Bruckner and Wagner over Mahler, but I think get what you're implying - a conflicted, dualistic attitude or a unified monistic wholeness? Hmm. Maybe I prefer one in music and the other in literature/psychology? Have to give this some thought.


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## Lenny (Jul 19, 2016)

Xaltotun said:


> I prefer both Bruckner and Wagner over Mahler, but I think get what you're implying - a conflicted, dualistic attitude or a unified monistic wholeness? Hmm. Maybe I prefer one in music and the other in literature/psychology? Have to give this some thought.


Looks like I cannot now build a theory over this set of data!

(Sorry for the ot... I'm just feeling a bit far out while waiting for tomorrow's Bruckner #8)


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## Huilunsoittaja (Apr 6, 2010)

I learned about Female Hysteria in a class about Dostoevsky, which was comparing Freud's view of Hysteria to Dostoevsky's view of the psyche (which was definitely different). Freud supposedly thought Dostoevsky was a nut, and wasn't quite sure what was his problem. Some childhood issues of course, maybe that incident with the beating of a horse. 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Female_hysteria

I dunno.... the symptoms of hysteria were really strange, like the fact you could draw on the skin... I don't think anyone has been able to explain that. But the whole Victorian stereotype of women being non-sexual may have played a part in this supposed suppressed state. I won't dismiss the possibility of it being a real condition, because we don't know exactly how life was for Victorian women, we can only imagine today what kinds of mental illness they were prone to. The reason Freud was so respected was the fact he seemed to have cured a number of cases with his system of thought.


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## Bettina (Sep 29, 2016)

Huilunsoittaja said:


> I learned about Female Hysteria in a class about Dostoevsky, which was comparing Freud's view of Hysteria to Dostoevsky's view of the psyche (which was definitely different). Freud supposedly thought Dostoevsky was a nut, and wasn't quite sure what was his problem. Some childhood issues of course, maybe that incident with the beating of a horse.
> 
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Female_hysteria
> 
> I dunno.... the symptoms of hysteria were really strange, like the fact you could draw on the skin... I don't think anyone has been able to explain that. But the whole Victorian stereotype of women being non-sexual may have played a part in this supposed suppressed state. *I won't dismiss the possibility of it being a real condition, because we don't know exactly how life was for Victorian women, we can only imagine today what kinds of mental illness they were prone to.* The reason Freud was so respected was the fact he seemed to have cured a number of cases with his system of thought.


Yes, exactly! Some of Freud's work is quite culturally specific, such as his ideas about hysteria. That type of thing doesn't translate well into today's society. When I read Freud, I always try to separate his "Victorian-era" ideas from the ideas that have more universal applicability. However, the effort required to extract his "universal" ideas can be maddening and frustrating (or maybe I'm just upset because I don't have a you-know-what!!) :lol:


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## Klassik (Mar 14, 2017)

Huilunsoittaja said:


> I dunno.... the symptoms of hysteria were really strange, like the fact you could draw on the skin... I don't think anyone has been able to explain that. But the whole Victorian stereotype of women being non-sexual may have played a part in this supposed suppressed state. I won't dismiss the possibility of it being a real condition, because we don't know exactly how life was for Victorian women, we can only imagine today what kinds of mental illness they were prone to. The reason Freud was so respected was the fact he seemed to have cured a number of cases with his system of thought.


With Freud at least, he built his theory up based on the women who came in for treatment. Obviously women needing "professional" psychological help does not make for a representative sample of women and might lead to biased conclusions. The scientific method is all important in psychology/psychiatry. Unfortunately, the psychology field sometimes struggles to get people to understand the murky science of things instead of admittedly very interesting pop psychology and armchair psychiatry that Freud helped fuel.


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## hpowders (Dec 23, 2013)

deprofundis said:


> Hmm let's face it , intellectual woman even the more open mind are against these two Psychanalists..
> My sister who seem somehow to be intelligent yet she only knowledge, Than she said to me once in french it'S funnier i will translate later on, Your Freud you like is a cocaine addict and a sexist just like Jung , she was frustrated against me...
> 
> Than an old man at a book store told me woman dosen like psychanalysis and think it'S B.S, what do you guys think at TC, can you be Freudian whiteout being sexist are both are inseparable hmm?
> ...


Nothing like some good humor/humour I always say. At least you didn't skirt the issue. You can't be accused of posting Freud....I mean fraud.


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## Magnum Miserium (Aug 15, 2016)

deprofundis said:


> Hmm let's face it , intellectual woman even the more open mind are against these two Psychanalists..
> My sister who seem somehow to be intelligent yet she only knowledge, Than she said to me once in french it'S funnier i will translate later on, Your Freud you like is a cocaine addict and a sexist just like Jung , she was frustrated against me...
> 
> Than an old man at a book store told me woman dosen like psychanalysis and think it'S B.S, what do you guys think at TC, can you be Freudian whiteout being sexist are both are inseparable hmm?
> ...


Men are trash



Klassik said:


> Freud's theories have no scientific basis and thus are nonsense as psychological theories. They're certainly interesting, so I guess that's why they remain popular, but it's about as useful as getting psychological knowledge from a Magic 8 ball. The best stuff coming out of Vienna during Freud's days was classical music (even if it was Schoenberg), not psychology theory. In other words, don't run off blaming mother for everything...unless she actually deserves it! And don't tell your girlfriend that, according to Freud, she's really upset because she really wants a ding dong and/or her dad


Psychologists (and even more so amateur explicators of contemporary psychlogy) vis a vis Freud is the ultimate Oedipus complex


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