# Shostakovich:Traditional composer?



## marius (Jan 26, 2010)

Greetings everyone. I've been researching the great composers and i am currently learning about the Russian masters. I would very much like to know people's opinion, if they have one, on a question i have read in a magazine on music recently. Is Shostakovich's chamber music traditional? Does he conform to tradition?? In fact, what is the tradition of chamber music? is their one?


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## Fsharpmajor (Dec 14, 2008)

I am not an expert, but as I understand it he mainly conforms to tradition in his chamber music, at least in terms of tonality. More so than some of the other composers of his day; except that in one or the other of his late quartets he uses tone rows. He certainly knew about Schoenberg et al.

If I am wrong, though, feel free to shoot me down.


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## Aramis (Mar 1, 2009)

Listening to some of his sonatas you could think that this music was written about 100 years before his birth. String quatrets from 8th on seem rather modernistic to me. Piano trios at the other hand, were not popular in modern period and he wrote more than one. His music was in some ways a traditional one, but he himself definitively was not a traditionalist by all means.


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## bplary (Sep 13, 2009)

I most definitely would not categorize Shostakovich as a traditional composer, he oftentimes will push the limits of tonality in form in his works. Very unique, not traditional.


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## marius (Jan 26, 2010)

Thankyou for your input, I'm getting the impression that like most things, it is a rather disputed area. From reading some literature i've got the strong impression that he did try to stretch his music but also that he was under a lot of pressure to stay within the certain limits of a certain somebody and his party. Maybe he wasn't a true traditionalist but he did allude to other composers' music in his compostitions on occasions, so i suppose that could be a dissent from tradition by using the traditional composers? I'm not sure if that is gobbledeegook!!! I will try to compare Shostakovich with some earlier chamber masters. Maybe begin with Haydn.


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## Guest (Jan 26, 2010)

Pushing the limits of tonality is what all the greater tonal composers have done since the move from modality. Tonality is a pushing the limits kind of thing.

So in a sense, pushing the limits of tonality is a traditional thing.

But otherwise, when was Shostakovich pushing these limits? And what limits was he pushing? To push 1910 limits in 1950 or 60 (or even 1930 or 40 for that matter) hardly qualifies as even pushing the limits, does it? (If you have a centuries old tradition of pushing limits, then what constitutes the border is going to be constantly changing.)

So I wouldn't put it as being a contrast between being unique and being traditional. Shostakovich was in all ways traditional, writing tonal music at all that late in the century, but he was also a very talented composer, and a strong individual, so of course he's going to write music that's unique, i.e., that sounds like nobody else but Shostakovich. But the same goes for Wagner and Schumann and Berlioz, too, just to name three. (And even a relatively minor composer like Bizet sounds like nobody else but Bizet. Unique.)


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## marius (Jan 26, 2010)

thats a very good argument. The change and new boundaries was the tradition but every great artist must also be unique or he wouldn't exist.


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## Scott Good (Jun 8, 2009)

depending on what parameters.

he was tonal, but did, to varying degrees, use modern techniques to define the function. techniques that certainly composers 100 years before were not using.

one in particular that has always fascinated me is the idea of non-octave transposing modes. that is, creating a mode in which there is no octave equivalence.

so, a mode could begin strongly in Gmin - G A Bb C D Eb F G but then continue, Ab Bb Cb Dd Eb Fb and on. (the piano quintet uses something like this)

this was also a technique that Messiaen used as well - arguably to much further ends. but that is another story.

but the kind of tonality created by shostakovitch in his music comes partially from a seeking for new contexts to have tonality, rather than just using what was there (diatonic octave equivalent scales) and making it more chromatic, and this is a modernist attitude. there is a sound to his music that is designed by using this and other techniques.

in terms of chamber music. formally he does use very traditional models. this can also be found in his symphonies...for the most part. but, this can also be found in Schoenberg as well. sonata form, binary, ternary, etc.

pretty much what some guy is saying with a tiny bit of theory detail.


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