# THE Best



## Guest (Dec 21, 2012)

Okay, I have been collecting classical music for several years now. I have not heard absolutely everything out there, but enough to know what I like, and what I don't like. I have explored various recordings, made up my mind on HIP vs. modern, and everything else in between. Now, I want the best.

By the best, I mean the best. I am interested in collecting the consensus "best" recordings out there. This means a combination of important, influential, can't live without it works paired with what might be considered by a plurality to be the top recorded performance of that work. 

For example, while there will be dissenters, there is a fairly strong consensus that the Carlos Kleiber/Wiener Philharmoniker recording of Beethoven's 5th symphony on DG is THE recording of that work.

I'm looking for things similar to that - a definitive collection, against which others can be judged. I don't care if it is SACD or mono, recorded in 1940 or 2012. I would prefer to keep it to the Baroque, Classical, and Romantic periods.

So, let the arguments - and recommendations - begin.


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## bigshot (Nov 22, 2011)

I was thinking the other day about recordings that were in their own league. I'm still thinking, but here are a few I thought of...

Toscanini: Beethoven's 3rd
Anda: Mozart Piano Concerto 17 & 21
Munch: Ravel's Daphnis et Chloe
Schnabel: Beethoven's Diabelli Variations
Talich/Czech PO: Dvorak Slovanic Dances and Smetna's Ma Vlast
Stravinsky: Rite of Spring Dorati (either version)
Chopin Nocturnes Rubinstein
Wagner: Act 1 of Die Walkure Walter/VPO Melchior Lehmann
Puccini: La Boheme Karajan
Offenbach: Gaetie Parisienne Fiedler
Ives: Central Park in the Dark Bernstein
Rimsky Korsakov Antar Symphony Bakels / Malaysian PO
Mussorgsky: Night on Bald Mountain Stokowski

There are lots of works where there are several really good recordings. But I limited my thinking to examples where one performance outshines the rest.


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## joen_cph (Jan 17, 2010)

A decision by the majority can of course be a guiding principle, but if the task was to select 4-5 recordings of the works, representing various performance styles in a suitable way, the project would be easier ... People are too individual in their taste and background here to agree on pretty much anything - and about recordings in particular. You´ll find those very fond of "objective" and sonically clear, very modern recordings; others, who prefer the HIP-style; those who prefer individually coloured interpretations, often in elder recordings; and those where a performer´s name or even a label is the magic word - being it Karajan, Brendel, Gould, Gardiner, Perahia, Emerson Quartet, Richter, DG, ECM or who/whatever.

However I can think of some examples where recordings acclaimed by a - usually - substantial majority, provided that people know them, also correspond to my own preferred ones

Liszt: Piano Concertos 1+2 / Richter,Kondrashin
Tchaikovsky: Symphonies 4,5,6 / Mravinsky,Leningrad O / DG stereo
Nielsen: Symphony 5 / Bernstein,NYPO

Supplementary recordings are indeed very nice to have in these examples too, however. And it is frankly speaking doubtful that others here would agree on my choices as regards most other works. On the list above, I´d agree that Sacre / Dorati is really very good, but I´d have to compare at least with the very old Ormandy / Philadelphia SO once again.


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## PetrB (Feb 28, 2012)

Mozart: Piano Quartets; Budapest String Quartet; George Szell, piano... ("legendary")

Any Dinu Lipatti Chopin recordings.

Bartok: Music for Stringed Instruments, Percussion and Celesta
Chicago Symphony Orchestra; Fritz Reiner
Berlin Radio Symphony Orchestra; Ferenc Fricsay

Ravel's four major masterpieces:
Daphnis et Chloe; Boston Symphony: Charles Munch_ (Seconding / Confirming bigshot's rec.)_ 
L'enfant et les sortileges; DGG -- Loren Maazel, Orchestre de la R.T.F.
Piano Concerti in G, in D: Samson François; Orchestre de la Société des Concerts du Conservatoire, Andre Cluytens

Mahler ~ Das Lied von der Erde / Mildred Miller, Ernst Haefliger, N.Y.Phil; Bruno Walter (Sony Classical)

Morton Feldman ~ Piano and String Quartet / Aki Takahashi, Kronos Quartet

Messiaen ~ Trois Petites Liturgies de la Presence Divine / N.Y. Phil: Leonard Bernstein

Carl Nielsen ~ Symphony No. 5 / New York Philharmonic; Leonard Bernstein. _(Seconding / Confirming joen_cph's rec.)_

Samuel Barber:
Violin Concerto ~ Isaac Stern; New York Philharmonic, Leonard Bernstein
Piano Concerto ~ John Browning; Cleveland Symphony Orchestra, George Szell
Knoxville, Summer of 1915 ~ Leontyne Price; N.Y.Phil, Thomas Schippers

John Adams:
Harmonium: San Francisco Symphony Chorus; San Francisco Symphony; John Adams
Chamber Symphony; Grand Pianola Music; London Sinfonietta, John Adams 
Fearful Symmetries; Orchestre National de Montpellier, René Bosc

Stravinsky ~ Le Rossignol
William Murphy; Stanley Kolk; Elaine Bonazzi; Herbert Beattie; Kenneth Smith; Loren Driscoll;
*Reri Grist*; Marina Picassi; Donald Gramm; Carl Kaiser
Orchestra/Ensemble: Washington D.C. Opera Society Orchestra, Washington D.C. Opera Society Chorus: Igor Stravinsky (This is one of those 'definitive' recordings, of which there are many in the Columbia (now Sony) Stravinsky 'cover' collection... which is not alltogether what it purports to be....
[ a number of the 'best' original composer conducted recordings from the Columbia series produced in the 1960's being ditched for earlier recordings, the Petruchka the earliest version with a Hollywood Orchestra, instead of the wonderful revised version Stravinsky conducted in that series during the 60's (thereby avoiding royalty fees on the music itself, tsk, tsk.) and a dreadful Les Noces, sung in English with an 'all star' composer conductor four piano ensemble. I may write those handful up in another post.]


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## Chi_townPhilly (Apr 21, 2007)

DrMike said:


> I am interested in collecting the consensus "best" recordings out there.


So it's consensus you want?

If that's the goal, what I would do is- gather up a _Penguin_ Guide, the _Gramophone_ Guide, Third Ear, 1001 Classical Recordings You Must Hear Before You Die, Bill Parker's 'Building a Classical Music Library*' and BBC's (more simply titled) 'Building a Library,' (this last you can check out on-line)- then run the numbers. Might cut down on the arguments.

That being said, that doesn't mean there aren't times when I don't disagree with "consensus." For example, I _still_ can't figure out why Karajan's Bruckner is so highly rated. *But*- I don't think you're interested in my idiosyncratic dissensions; at least not within the confines of this particular thread. So... name a piece- I'll let you know the inputs from the source materials listed above.

[*by the way, Parker's book is really underrated]


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## Ukko (Jun 4, 2010)

I don't agree with hardly anything put up as The best so far; so I do believe I'll pass.


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## PetrB (Feb 28, 2012)

Chi_townPhilly said:


> So it's consensus you want?
> 
> If that's the goal, what I would do is- gather up a _Penguin_ Guide, the _Gramophone_ Guide, Third Ear, 1001 Classical Recordings You Must Hear Before You Die, Bill Parker's 'Building a Classical Music Library*' and BBC's (more simply titled) 'Building a Library,'
> [*by the way, Parker's book is really underrated]


There is an inevitable built-in 'nationlist' bias to almost all of these guides - as neutral as the editor may try to make them, the 'home boy / girl' product may be put forward before another equal or better recording. 
Too, they are not much interested in publishing a guide to budget re-releases, out of print gems, or more currently, what is available, rare or not, on vinyl 

without looking, it might be entirely possible the Penguin guide would inadvertently push for a recording of Berlioz' Les Nuits d'été with Janet Baker; London Symphony Orchestra; John Barbirolli, or another with Heather Harper, British band; conductor 
vs. the recording with Regine Crespin; L'Orchestre de la Suisse Romande; Ernest Ansermet.

Owning none, I can imagine each rather 'incredible' in their own way. Perhaps individuals might follow suit, being most aware of the 'home boy / girl' release over others, but individuals are not so consciously or unconsciously trying to sell records, or 'Buy British / Buy American.'

Without speaking for the author of the OP, I imagine some of those considerations were in place when the OP posted the question.


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## PetrB (Feb 28, 2012)

Hilltroll72 said:


> I don't agree with hardly anything put up as The best so far; so I do believe I'll pass.


Aw, go for it, be an expert! It's just a dressed up poll, a bit more highly qualified than the rest. And we all know in these polls we are all 'experts' ;-)


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## Ukko (Jun 4, 2010)

PetrB said:


> Aw, go for it, be an expert! It's just a dressed up poll, a bit more highly qualified than the rest. And we all know in these polls we are all 'experts' ;-)


The thing is, you see, I _*am*_ expert. I'm saving that knowledge to pass on to my progeny.


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## PetrB (Feb 28, 2012)

Hilltroll72 said:


> The thing is, you see, I _*am*_ expert. I'm saving that knowledge to pass on to my progeny.


That is like the infamous / notorious 'family recipe,' only 'written down' in Mom or Grandmom's head. 
What if they get hit by a truck?

Small and selfish, that's what it is 

Besides, if there are other 'consensii' then it messes with everyone's minds, and the stats!


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## moody (Nov 5, 2011)

Hilltroll72 said:


> The thing is, you see, I _*am*_ expert. I'm saving that knowledge to pass on to my progeny.


You have progeny ?


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## moody (Nov 5, 2011)

For a start, consensus or no consensus I don't consider Kleiber's Beethoven 5th to be THE recording of the work.
Secondly, we had a monstrous thread from BPS in August : "Challenge Question: Your 100 Favorite Classical Albums".
I had to do mine in three helpings---I'm sure you could get your statistics from there, I'm really disinclined to do it all over again.


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## joen_cph (Jan 17, 2010)

Had overlooked that thread ( http://www.talkclassical.com/20850-challenge-question-your-100-a-7.html )
which is interesting, thanks.


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## Ukko (Jun 4, 2010)

moody said:


> You have progeny ?


Not yet, but I'm only 75.


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## bigshot (Nov 22, 2011)

I guess I didn't really follow the instructions. I didn't list THE BEST, I listed unique and individual standouts. If I had to list the best, I would need to list more than one performance of each work to cover all of the angles. It's easier to pick standouts.


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## Head_case (Feb 5, 2010)

moody said:


> You have progeny ?


Of coz:










Can't say I've ever liked the senselessness of the consensus. I suppose that's partly due to developing too specialised a taste in classical music. Whoever gets my classical music collection will probably be thinking "GRIEF. How on earth am I supposed to get rid of all these caterwauling string quartets?!"


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## techniquest (Aug 3, 2012)

Not everyone's favourite of course because it is all subjective, but the Solti recording of The Ring cycle on Decca must rate as one of the best ever made.


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