# short discussion about mahler



## vamos (Oct 9, 2009)

I've listened to the ninth symphony, and some of the fifth and fourth. I find certain melodies and moments in his music to be absolutely beyond words. However, his music goes into passages which are long and sometimes that start to feel a bit forced. I was wondering how to better listen to and approach this music so that I can "see the light."


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## Dim7 (Apr 24, 2009)

Have you tried focusing on one movement at a time, relistening that instead of the whole symphony? The ninth is probably one of his more "difficult" works also. Symphonies 1,4,5,6 are probably easier to digest.


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## Aramis (Mar 1, 2009)

Dim7 said:


> Have you tried focusing on one movement at a time, relistening that instead of the whole symphony?


That's how I did it. I can assure that it works.


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## vamos (Oct 9, 2009)

that is how i do it. it's working, slowly, with the ninth. i really prefer his melodic moments to his bombastic ones, though it is starting to seem that they need each other for the full effect. i was wondering if you guys knew what his most melodic pieces were - the ones with the least overwhelming loudness and more serenity and beauty. there are moments in the first 5 minutes or so of the ninth that make me tear up immediately if i listen intently - it's some of the most powerful, if not the most powerful music i have ever heard. it's as if i'm seeing my family and the past years of my life flash before my eyes. i believe i read something that suggested mahler intended this effect.

i hope to find other moments like those in his work. so far the sixth seems to be much more violent, but i will give it time.


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## Dim7 (Apr 24, 2009)

Isn't listening to his slow movements the obvious thing to do? The ninth is a peculiar symphony because it has a slow first movement and a slow finale. The finale doesn't have any crushing loud moments if I recall correctly while the first movement definately has. 
Adagietto from the fifth is a very popular movement btw, you should check that probably. I personally like the slow movement, andante moderato from the sixth symphony more - it's either the second or the third movement depending on the recording. 
The fourth symphony is definately the least bombastic symphony of Mahler, it's almost un-Mahlerian (though there's that chamber-music-like treatment of instruments that's typical of Mahler). The first three movements of his first symphony are perhaps similar in style but the finale is a typical stormy, pompous Mahler movement. Though even in the more intense and harsher movements there are lyrical moments of beauty, that's typical of Mahler too. Like in the first movement of the sixth there's that so-called "Alma theme."


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## World Violist (May 31, 2007)

Actually, I first made my acquaintance to Mahler through possibly the most "difficult" movement he ever wrote: the finale of the sixth symphony. However, David Hurwitz's book on Mahler's symphonies had a particularly good introductory article on it, so I actually loved it at first listen.

I would definitely, for a whole symphony, recommend the first symphony, and not the fourth, the reason being that the fourth I never felt was one of Mahler's best efforts. Besides, I've always felt that, with Mahler, starting at the very beginning is a good thing unlike with most other composers. There is a progression through the symphonies without the sacrifice in quality that you see in most other composers' symphonies.


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## Dim7 (Apr 24, 2009)

Fourth is relatively easy to digest and isn't that bad, however I would also recommend the first rather than the fourth as a introductory piece of Mahler because the first gives more accurate impression of Mahler's general style.


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## Lukecash12 (Sep 21, 2009)

Who knows, maybe you could switch between Kogan playing Paganini and the Mahler Symphonies so you can keep up the energy needed to devote yourself to gaining perspective of a new composer.


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## World Violist (May 31, 2007)

Lukecash12 said:


> Who knows, maybe you could switch between Kogan playing Paganini and the Mahler Symphonies so you can keep up the energy needed to devote yourself to gaining perspective of a new composer.


Only problem is that the Paganini caprices don't have any sort of inner meaning like the Mahler symphonies... and the concerti and other pieces I don't know enough to say.

Anyway, I think the best thing to do is just sit down and listen. It isn't going to kill you.


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## scytheavatar (Aug 27, 2009)

Mahler's symphonies are draggy and bombastic at parts. But that's his music, that's his style and why so many people like his symphonies so much. If you are looking for "melodic moments" only, I recommend you to stick to Beethoven, Mozart, Tchaikovsky etc and tackle Mahler only when you are ready. 

Having said that, what conductor are you listening to? The choice of conductor is a very important factor, some like Bernstein and Chailly make what are draggy and bombastic Mahler moments even more draggy and bombastic. While others, Kubelik and Abbado in particular, are the best for bringing out the lyrical Mahler.


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## Tapkaara (Apr 18, 2006)

This so-called "short" discussion of Mahler, it seems, is getting awfully long. Just saying...


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## Lukecash12 (Sep 21, 2009)

This isn't exactly the short discussion site. It seems like we like to put in our two cents, even if it doesn't change or help much (I'm guilty of that). Maybe we like to hear ourselves type?


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