# Mozart's 'Jupiter' Symphony, 3rd Movement, Menuetto. How fast?



## David Phillips (Jun 26, 2017)

The Menuetto is marked Allegretto i.e. 'fairly quick' but most conductors take this to mean fairly slow. Even Sir Thomas Beecham, who was no slouch when it came to tempo, in his recording takes this movement at a dreadful plod. I think it should sound mercurial with scampering strings and perky woodwind. Both Fricsay and Marriner get up a good head of steam and Mackerras, here, is getting there:






Fricsay, Marriner and Mackerras are exceptions, most conductors trudge along in this movement. Are they right?


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## chromatic owl (Jan 4, 2017)

Given that the minuet is supposed to be an elegant dance the tempo in this recording seems very quick, not just 'fairly'. So I suppose if the conductor relates 'allegretto' to the tempo of a minuet you get a rather moderate to slow tempo.


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## Animal the Drummer (Nov 14, 2015)

Perhaps this is a reflection of what one's become used to in recent years, but Mackerras' tempo doesn't seem exceptionally quick to me (though, if Fricsay and Marriner take it more quickly still, that might come across as a bit OTT, to me at least). The minuet is certainly a dance form, but to me that's a starting-point rather than an inflexible rule for what a symphonic minuet should sound like.


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## Botschaft (Aug 4, 2017)

No, they are wrong. Mackerras gets it right in the previous symphony too:








chromatic owl said:


> Given that the minuet is supposed to be an elegant dance the tempo in this recording seems very quick, not just 'fairly'. So I suppose if the conductor relates 'allegretto' to the tempo of a minuet you get a rather moderate to slow tempo.


No one is supposed to dance to this, though, and allegretto is still allegretto whether you dance to it or not.


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## AClockworkOrange (May 24, 2012)

Improbus said:


> No, they are wrong. Mackerras gets it right in the previous symphony too:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


What performance is this taken from Improbus?

Is it one of Mackerras' recordings? If so, which?

Thanks :tiphat:


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## Botschaft (Aug 4, 2017)

AClockworkOrange said:


> What performance is this taken from Improbus?
> 
> Is it one of Mackerras' recordings? If so, which?
> 
> Thanks :tiphat:


It's Mackerras/Prague Chamber Orchestra.


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## Pugg (Aug 8, 2014)

^^^







This box set is reasonable priced nowadays.


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