# 1957 Knappertsbuch Parsifal



## expat (Mar 17, 2013)

I just received this as a gift yesterday and wanted to hear what the board says about this record. 

This will be my first exposure to Parsifal (apart from the prelude) after listening to the Ring, Tannhaeuser and Lohengrin for the last two years. 

Thanks much.


----------



## bigshot (Nov 22, 2011)

It's just about as good as Parsifal gets.


----------



## Revenant (Aug 27, 2013)

You see, this is what I mean... I had the 1951 Kna Parsifal and recently got the 1962. And now I find that there's a third Kna. Does it ever end for me?


----------



## Don Fatale (Aug 31, 2009)

Revenant said:


> You see, this is what I mean... I had the 1951 Kna Parsifal and recently got the 1962. And now I find that there's a third Kna. Does it ever end for me?


Like many of us whose shelves are laden with Wagner recordings, I'm sure you'll come up with a good reason why this is needed.


----------



## Pip (Aug 16, 2013)

Revenant said:


> You see, this is what I mean... I had the 1951 Kna Parsifal and recently got the 1962. And now I find that there's a third Kna. Does it ever end for me?


I'm afraid that it is much worse - (or better?)
Kna's Parsifal broadcasts have been issued on CD (official or otherwise) from the following years

1951 Decca commercially issued
1952 Melodram
1953 -He did not conduct it that year (Clemens Krauss - also great)
1954 Melodram
1955 This one has never been issued in any form
1956 Walhall
1957 Walhall
1958 Walhall
1959 Walhall
1960 Myto
1961 Myto with Hotter as Gurnemanz - second broadcast that year with Weber as Gurnemanz
1962 Philips commercially recorded
1963 Melodram Hotter Windgassen
1964 Orfeo commercially issued Hotter Vickers

Apart from 1955 (of which I have only two scruffy sounding Acts on tape) all the rest are in excellent sound quality.
The 52 is significantly quicker than the '51 
The 1954 is very interesting with Greindl as Gurnemanz and Hotter as Amfortas
1956 brings in Fischer-Dieskau as Amfortas and Vinay as Parsifal
1957 has Greindl London and Vinay
1958 has the most unusual Bayreuth cast Hines(g) Wächter(a) Beirer(p) Crespin(k) repeated in 1959

They are all good - I know them all 
The best sound is 1962 (Philips - stereo)
The best performance is 1964 - Kna was very ill by this time and had all but retired. Wieland persuded him to come and conduct it, one more time, and it is uncanny listening to this because it is as if Knappertsbusch knew that this would be his
"zum letzten mal". Hotter and Vickers never sang better in their lives than in this performance. In 1965 he was terminally ill and Cluytens took the performances - Kna died that October.
It does not really matter which of his performances one has - they are all great - I was lucky to see the Wieland production before it was retired in 1973 with Jochum conducting. He was probably the nearest thing to Knappertsbusch one could get.

I shall play his 1964 Act 3 tomorrow in his memory


----------



## Marschallin Blair (Jan 23, 2014)

expat said:


> I just received this as a gift yesterday and wanted to hear what the board says about this record.
> 
> This will be my first exposure to Parsifal (apart from the prelude) after listening to the Ring, Tannhaeuser and Lohengrin for the last two years.
> 
> Thanks much.


---
Uncanny you post this.

I ordered the '62 Knappertsbusch about two weeks ago-- not having heard any of Knappy's incarnations of the opera.

However, here's what a tony and informed operatic friend of mine in the Forum had to say about the three Knappertsbusch Parsifals:

So, as you've gathered, I think Kna's '62 P is great. There are lots of good Ps, as compared to, say, Tristans, which, let's face it, is unperformable. I heard the Karajan P years ago and liked it better than his Ring, which responds less well to caressing. I didn't care for the voices of the Parsifal, the Kundry or the Klingsor, though, so I've never acquired it. There are 4 or 5 Knas now, all from Bayreuth, with varying casts, and so far I've heard only the first, from '51, and the second (to be released), the '62. The '51 has very strong performances by Windgassen (sounding young and leathery, as opposed to old and leathery), Modl (sounding German-expressionistic and weirdly squeezed as she always did), Weber (black-toned and noble), London (perfect) and Uhde (greatest Klingsor ever, a scary raving psychotic). The sound is so-so monaural. Most interesting is that Kna's tempi are quite slow, but he knows how to keep them alive (unlike James Levine, who seems to be watching paint dry). Fine recording, all in all, but I prefer the '62 for the Parsifal and Kundry, the warm sound that catches the Bayreuth ambience, and Kna's tempi, which feel ideal and prove that a little faster doesn't mean less profound. Jess Thomas is very fine here, as in his Lohengrin; Irene Dalis has a firm, full, earthy mezzo that can be demonic, sensual or maternal as needed; Hans Hotter is in the lower, firmer part of his voice and is so noble and compassionate you wish he were your grandfather; George London repeats his powerful Amfortas; and Gustav Neidlinger as Klingsor is second only to Hermann Uhde. We even get Gundula Janowitz as the first flower maiden, so sweet and fragrant you wonder why Parsifal bothers with that old crone Kundry (yes, yes, she knows his name. O Mama!). I've heard a few other Ps, but there's a spell over this one, a real sense of the sacred. Kna makes it all sing so naturally you're never aware of him doing it; in fact you quite forget that this is a performance of something. I think Wagner wanted just that to happen. Damn the old sorcerer! (I should warn you about the bronchial counterpoint at the beginning of the prelude. I wish they'd substituted a rehearsal tape. After that you're never aware of the audience).


----------



## Marschallin Blair (Jan 23, 2014)

Revenant said:


> You see, this is what I mean... I had the 1951 Kna Parsifal and recently got the 1962. And now I find that there's a third Kna. Does it ever end for me?


It's the 'Unending Quest,' for you; for all of us. . . we few, we 'happy few,' we, band of brothers.

Ha. Ha. Ha. Ha.


----------



## Marschallin Blair (Jan 23, 2014)

bigshot said:


> It's just about as good as Parsifal gets.


We'll see. I have the Karajan, and the '62 Knappertsbusch is in the mail.

The Karajan's pretty Lancelot-unhorsed. . . but then the Knappertsbusch has Janowitz as a flower maiden; which, for me, is worth the whole price of the opera just to hear.


----------



## perempe (Feb 27, 2014)

tomorrow i'll see the 2014 Pinchas Steinberg Parsifal with Alexander Marco Buhrmester and Matti Salminen.


----------



## Revenant (Aug 27, 2013)

Alexander said:


> Like many of us whose shelves are laden with Wagner recordings, I'm sure you'll come up with a good reason why this is needed.


Oh yes I will. It's an addiction. Someone once asked W. C. Fields why he carried whiskey in his golf cart when he was out on the links. He replied "In case I see a snake. Which I also carry."


----------



## Marschallin Blair (Jan 23, 2014)

Alexander said:


> Like many of us whose shelves are laden with Wagner recordings, I'm sure you'll come up with a good reason why this is needed.











"Less than all cannot satisfy man."

- William Blake


----------



## Itullian (Aug 27, 2011)

Marschallin Blair said:


> View attachment 39751
> 
> 
> "Less than all cannot satisfy man."
> ...


I have Solti's and Knappy's 62. And Boulez.
I'll be satisfied when I have the Kubelik and Knappy's '64.


----------



## Pip (Aug 16, 2013)

I am also a great admirer of the live Karajan performance from Vienna in 1961








The conducting is wonderful and the singing is great. I am also a great admirer of Karajan's idea (he also produced this performance) of using two different singers as Kundry.
He used Elizabeth Höngen (a venerable and mature stalwart of the Staatsoper company) for Acts 1 & 3 and for the first scene of Act 2 as an elderly kundry, and then Klingsor suddenly changes her from an old crone into the voluptuous Christa Ludwig.(whose looks and voice in 1961 were just so) A brilliant stroke, that was vilified by the critics at the time.(I have never understood why). I've often wished that some other producer would try it again, especially now as video recording of productions offer the possibility of so much more, instead of the garbage that most new productions seem to offer.


----------



## Revenant (Aug 27, 2013)

Pip said:


> I am also a great admirer of the live Karajan performance from Vienna in 1961
> View attachment 39770
> 
> 
> ...


Pip, given your encyclopedically inclusive grasp of recorded Parsifal versions, what may I ask are the very top ones in your estimation? Or is that an impossibly hard question given the 'embarassment of riches?'


----------



## DavidA (Dec 14, 2012)

Pip said:


> I am also a great admirer of the live Karajan performance from Vienna in 1961
> View attachment 39770
> 
> 
> ...


It is worth pointing out that the recording of this performance is less than first class. But the two Kundrys produce exquisite ear candy.


----------



## expat (Mar 17, 2013)

Thanks all. Looks like I am in for a treat.


----------



## Pip (Aug 16, 2013)

Revenant said:


> Pip, given your encyclopedically inclusive grasp of recorded Parsifal versions, what may I ask are the very top ones in your estimation? Or is that an impossibly hard question given the 'embarassment of riches?'


Sorry it took so long to get back on this - It is the old "desert island" disc quandry.....well....one to listen to only?
Assuming that I had decent quality reproduction equipment or an ipad with a lifetime battery, I would take the 1962 Bayreuth with me as my first choice, because i could wallow in the sound. My second choice would be the Kubelik Bavarian Radio CDs and the third would be......................a different choice every day.
I am not a particular fan of any of the commercial recordings. They all have good things in them particularly Karajan and Solti but not for repeated listening. 
I have lived with the Bayreuth/Philips recording since it was issued in the 60s, so I will take that one.
My ideal casts would include Hotter or Sotin - Vickers or Kaufmann , London or Fischer-Dieskau, and Christa Ludwig or Amy Shuard.
No need to ask who would conduct. orchestra? the Vienna Philharmonic at Bayreuth - just a dream


----------



## Revenant (Aug 27, 2013)

Thanks, Pip. I knew it had to be a hard choice. I have the 1962. Also a DVD of the early 80s Bayreuth production with Jerusalem. Those and the 1951 Kna will do me for the present.


----------

