# 9/11 "Threat"



## Couchie (Dec 9, 2010)

Do you think anything will happen?


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## Kopachris (May 31, 2010)

I haven't heard anything about this (yes, I live under a rock). Could someone please explain?


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## regressivetransphobe (May 16, 2011)

The terrorists(tm) really have won if we ask ourselves that every year.


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## violadude (May 2, 2011)

I think more than anything, a lot of "anti-islamic" things will happen rather than terrorist attacks...


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## Krummhorn (Feb 18, 2007)

Imho, it's a 'media' thing to make more money. People these days are so gullible that stories like this will sell like hotcakes. 

Now that it's been mentioned by one outlet, all the others now have to throw their views of the same story ad nauseum. 

Any threat of terrorism, imo, is a daily thing, not just for 9/11 anniversaries. But we need not be paranoid about it so much, as we could all wind up in the Tokyo Giggling Academy in short order.


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## Meaghan (Jul 31, 2010)

violadude said:


> I think more than anything, a lot of "anti-islamic" things will happen rather than terrorist attacks...


^Yes, I also think this is more likely.


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## Meaghan (Jul 31, 2010)

In my college town, they are marking the anniversary with an interfaith (Christian/Jewish/Muslim) service at a local church, which I think is a very nice thing, and I intend to go even though I'm not religious. From what I've gathered about the event, it seems to be centered around themes of tolerance, peace, and healing. And my school's chamber choir is singing at it. The last movement of Chichester Psalms, among other things.


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## regressivetransphobe (May 16, 2011)

Meaghan said:


> it seems to be centered around themes of tolerance, peace, and healing.


File under "things religious folks are better at talking about than practicing".


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## violadude (May 2, 2011)

regressivetransphobe said:


> File under "things religious folks are better at talking about than practicing".


Well in any religion, you're likely to run into some good people and some bad people (for lack of better terms) but I've met religious people who are generally good at this sort of thing.


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## Meaghan (Jul 31, 2010)

regressivetransphobe said:


> File under "things religious folks are better at talking about than practicing".


Mmm, I'd say that varies a lot from one religious person (/community) to another. The noisy ones are generally better at talking about these things than practicing them. But the religious groups at this school, at least, do a lot of service of the non-preachy variety and are composed mostly of lovely people. I agree that "religious folks" are pretty far from having the monopolies on charity/morality some of them claim.


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## violadude (May 2, 2011)

Meaghan said:


> Mmm, I'd say that varies a lot from one religious person (/community) to another. The noisy ones are generally better at talking about these things than practicing them. But the religious groups at this school, at least, do a lot of service of the non-preachy variety and are composed mostly of lovely people. I agree that that "religious folks" are pretty far from having the monopolies on charity/morality some of them claim.


I agree, speaking as someone who grew up Christian (and still consider myself one, though struggling heavily with it), all this stuff about religious people being more loving in reality seems like ** to me. There was a hymn I remember singing when I still went to church that had the lyrics "and they'll know we are Christians by our love." Even when I was much stronger in my faith than I am now, these words always bothered me because from my experience I had never felt that any of my peers at church were any more loving than people I met outside of church who weren't Christian. In fact, a lot of times the opposite was true...


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## Almaviva (Aug 13, 2010)

This thread is veering off-topic.
I don't think the OP started it to debate whether or not religious people are more loving/charitable than atheists.

Coming back to topic, all I heard is that there was a relatively credible threat of car-bombing but considered to be in early stage of preparation - more like wishful thinking - therefore it wasn't something very likely to happen this 9-11. Have you heard anything different?


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## regressivetransphobe (May 16, 2011)

I will literally bet anyone here money there will be no bombing or substantial terror act in the US on the 11th.

Not literally. But I would if it was allowed.


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## World Violist (May 31, 2007)

Why do the "news" media continue to do this crap when they know they're always wrong? Americans should just stop watching and force them to actually be responsible, adult people giving real news.

In any case, if something does happen, so it goes. If nothing happens, great. We won't know until tomorrow (or, more precisely, Monday).


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## Ravellian (Aug 17, 2009)

Of course the terrorists won't be stupid enough to do anything on 9/11, that'll be the day we're all expecting it.


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## Weston (Jul 11, 2008)

World Violist said:


> Why do the "news" media continue to do this crap when they know they're always wrong? Americans should just stop watching and force them to actually be responsible, adult people giving real news.


At least one American has stopped watching. I did read a headline on the CNN website about three days ago that mentioned a possible threat. That was the extent of the notice I took of the matter. I am skeptical that we would have the kind of intelligence (I mean that in the spying sense of the word not the IQ sense) to detect every primitive terrorist plan. I mean, do we have plants inside all the terrorist meetings? If so, I'd think they would have been taken out long before now. I think the terrorists themselves leak this stuff to get us all riled up. It is best to spit on their lame threats by going on with our lives. They can ruin some peoples lives, yes. But education and reason will always ultimately succeed over ignorance, superstition, and brainwashing.


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## sabrina (Apr 26, 2011)

*A Brave New World*
I think this is hysteria. I really agree to the idea that terrorists have won if we keep on worrying . Living with a constant idea of threat is like post stress disorder. Part of the story is simply media generated and its constant struggle for more money, no matter how they get it. Nobody talks about the whatever reasons these horrible things happened.
This looks more like an autoimmune disease. I am so sorry for all the people who died in the 9/11 attacks. That looked more like Pearl Harbor.
Unfortunately, terrorist attacks will come and go. It's stupid human nature. Think about the Norway attack, and a few inside jobs/attacks within US, done by its citizens. 
We should learn to be more tolerant, and to love our enemies. It's not easy.


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## regressivetransphobe (May 16, 2011)

On the 11th, if you're American, please realize a civilian in Pakistan has a higher chance of being killed by a US military drone strike than you have of being affected in any way by a terror attack.


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## Almaviva (Aug 13, 2010)

Well, the media just reported it. I read about it today, and it was a real piece of intelligence coming from Pakistan. It's been confirmed by Hillary Clinton. We did receive the intelligence. Whether or not it was bogus and only meant to drive fear into our hearts, or genuine and meant to help us beef-up surveillance and protect ourselves, I think it *is* the legitimate duty of the media to report on what even our highest officials have acknowledged.

I hope nothing happens, which would mean that either the source was trying to to infuse terror into us, or was just plain mistaken, or the threat was too primitive and didn't result in anything real.

But the media is not making this up, so I don't think the media is to blame.


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## Almaviva (Aug 13, 2010)

regressivetransphobe said:


> On the 11th, if you're American, please realize a civilian in Pakistan has a higher chance of being killed by a US military drone strike than you have of being affected in any way by a terror attack.


 Statistically speaking, yes. But to say that there is no threat and no possibility whatsoever of some Americans dying from an attack is a stretch. Now, if by affected in any way you include indirect effects, of course we've been profoundly affected by the 9-11 attack in various ways - blow to the economy, costly recovery for the city of NY, human lives wasted, changes in air travel, costly wars, etc.


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## Almaviva (Aug 13, 2010)

I got these details from AP news:

"The tip that touched off the most recent investigation came from a CIA informant who has proved reliable in the past, according to U.S. officials. They said the informant approached intelligence officials overseas to say that the men were ordered by new al-Qaida leader Ayman al-Zawahri to mark the 10th anniversary of the Sept. 11 by doing harm on U.S. soil.He took over as the group's leader after the U.S. killed Osama bin Laden during a raid in May at his compound in Pakistan.
The informant said the would-be attackers were of Arab descent and might speak Arabic as well as English. Counterterrorism officials were looking for certain names associated with the threat, but it was unclear whether the names were real or fake.
Some intelligence officials have raised doubts about the threat, given the short turnaround time. Someone who recently arrived in the United States would have just days to plan and obtain materials for a car bomb attack, a difficult feat even with a long lead time."


Apparently as far as intelligence agencies know, nobody matching the description has entered the country lately, so hopefully this is just another one of multiple groundless tips that we receive.


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## starthrower (Dec 11, 2010)

Whatever happens, happens. I don't know about Canada, but my government is occupying two foreign countries and killing innocent civilians, so we should expect these things.


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## Almaviva (Aug 13, 2010)

starthrower said:


> Whatever happens, happens. I don't know about Canada, but my government is occupying two foreign countries and killing innocent civilians, so we should expect these things.


 The terrorists have killed and continue to kill innocent civilians too (here, in Europe, and in those two countries and others around the world), so it's all relative.


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## Couchie (Dec 9, 2010)

I really started this thread in the spirt of somebody who has watched every season of 24 (even after it became physically painful into the later seasons) than as a fear-stricken citizen. Sounds like no big deal at this point though.


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## starthrower (Dec 11, 2010)

Almaviva said:


> The terrorists have killed and continue to kill innocent civilians too (here, in Europe, and in those two countries and others around the world), so it's all relative.


That's right. I'm sure those "we" label terrorists see us in the same light. But ultimately, both sides have chosen the tactics of failure.


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## Huilunsoittaja (Apr 6, 2010)

I would be sad if something happened, but not surprised. We can never completely remove terrorism from our planet, it's impossible.

By the way, I'm going to a concert tomorrow night that serves as commemoration for 9/11. I'll be hearing the Mozart Requiem, and some other works.


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## violadude (May 2, 2011)

Huilunsoittaja said:


> I would be sad if something happened, but not surprised. We can never completely remove terrorism from our planet, it's impossible.
> 
> By the way, I'm going to a concert tomorrow night that serves as commemoration for 9/11. I'll be hearing the Mozart Requiem, and some other works.


Yes, as noble as the concept of world peace is, it will never happen.


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## Meaghan (Jul 31, 2010)

Huilunsoittaja said:


> By the way, I'm going to a concert tomorrow night that serves as commemoration for 9/11. I'll be hearing the Mozart Requiem, and some other works.


I am going to one as well. (Well, sort of a church service/concert) You should report back on yours, and I will on mine!


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## Almaviva (Aug 13, 2010)

Hm... I thought I had recognized your high school football field... and in my metropolitan area there is exactly such a concert - I'm also in the Mid-Atlantic region, so, I guess we may be neighbors.


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## Sid James (Feb 7, 2009)

Speaking of concerts commemorating the twin towers tragedy, there was a concert here of Karl Jenkins'_ The Armed Man - A Mass for Peace _on the eve of the anniversary. I was tied up with other things so I couldn't go. Some of the takings at the box office were donated to the charitable organisation Medicens Sans Frontieres, a worthy cause in terms of dealing with the problems faced by many people of the world currently living in war zones...


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## Amfibius (Jul 19, 2006)

I don't know what you Americans are afraid of. You are more likely to die at the hands of another American than from a terror attack. The homicide rate in the USA is 5.0 per 100,000 head of population per annum - 12,500 homicides per year. That is four 9/11's every year. The highest homicide rate in the developed world. If al-Qaeda wanted to kill lots of Americans, all they need to do is send the NRA a large donation - your gun nutters will take care of the rest. 

I suppose you should be using the occasion to think about how many preventable deaths you have a year instead of worrying about a bunch of crazy terrorists who are mostly toothless these days anyway. They have killed more of their own kind than Americans, or Brits, or Australians. Their own people are turning against them. They have lost, and we have won.

I am not trying to make light of the terrible tragedy that was 9/11. But there are MANY MORE tragedies that happen every day which you guys seem remarkably unperturbed about. If the homicide rate was that high in Australia, we would be doing something about it.


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## regressivetransphobe (May 16, 2011)

Amfibius said:


> But there are MANY MORE tragedies that happen every day which you guys seem remarkably unperturbed about.





> you guys


Here's your mistake. I'm an American and I've been making light of 9/11 for 10 years, while emphasizing greater tragedies.

Ain't gonna stop now just because plastic flags are selling more for one day.


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## Almaviva (Aug 13, 2010)

Amfibius said:


> I don't know what you Americans are afraid of. You are more likely to die at the hands of another American than from a terror attack. The homicide rate in the USA is 5.0 per 100,000 head of population per annum - 12,500 homicides per year. That is four 9/11's every year. The highest homicide rate in the developed world. If al-Qaeda wanted to kill lots of Americans, all they need to do is send the NRA a large donation - your gun nutters will take care of the rest.
> 
> I suppose you should be using the occasion to think about how many preventable deaths you have a year instead of worrying about a bunch of crazy terrorists who are mostly toothless these days anyway. They have killed more of their own kind than Americans, or Brits, or Australians. Their own people are turning against them. They have lost, and we have won.
> 
> I am not trying to make light of the terrible tragedy that was 9/11. But there are MANY MORE tragedies that happen every day which you guys seem remarkably unperturbed about. If the homicide rate was that high in Australia, we would be doing something about it.


Who says we are afraid?
And when you say they have lost and we have won, well, I believe we Americans have played a big part in this victory, no?
Not to forget your generalization. Not all Americans support the NRA, and many of us are for strict gun controls.


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## Almaviva (Aug 13, 2010)

regressivetransphobe said:


> Here's your mistake. I'm an American and *I've been making light of 9/11* for 10 years, while emphasizing greater tragedies.
> 
> Ain't gonna stop now just because plastic flags are selling more for one day.


See, I have trouble relating to this attitude because there's nothing light about it. I donated professional time to help the families of the victims and saw first hand the pain and suffering. I think you might feel differently if one of your loved ones were among the 3,000 victims.


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## sabrina (Apr 26, 2011)

This is a day of remembrance, for all those who died during 9/11 attack. Not only Americans celebrate it. Whole Europe joined this remembrance. 
It is understandable, but amazing, the fact that many people in Afghanistan, and many other places, have no idea anything happened in those days. They live their simple life, and with no media around, so how could they know? Are they interested? Maybe there are many people celebrating the attackers. There is too much hate and ignorance in this world. What a sad day!


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## graaf (Dec 12, 2009)

There's a cult movie in Serbia that people still use quotes from as punchlines in everyday situations. The movie is Balkan Spy, and the paranoid protagonist accuses an innocent man for spying and calls his brother to help him in dealing with "the spy". Needless to say, they beat him to get "the info" out of him, and by the end of the movie they are trying to persuade him to "give in to the police", and which is more, _they_ will forgive _him_ that _they_ had to beat _him_.

I thought it is possible only in a movie to see that beater is forgiving the beaten one. That is until I saw Americans forgiving "the terrorists" (ie brown Muslim people) for killing hundreds of thousands of them (both before and after 9/11). And truth is again stranger than fiction...

And then people think I'm downsizing the horror of people dying in the WTC, jumping to their death from a building in fire. I'm not, I'm just saying that US media rehashes 9/11 ad infinitum (ratings=money), establishment is set to exploit it forever, and no one looks even in the 12k homicides in US, let alone hundreds of thousands dying by American hand out of US.

I do admit that the reason all of that irritates me is not because I'm some kind of saint (which I'm not), but simply because I can't afford the luxury of forgiving my enemies for beating the **** out of them, but can only try to forgive them for beating the **** out of me, which is something I'm reluctant to do.

And it's all just human nature after all, every nation bullies around whenever it can, and history shows that every nation that could do it - did it. Let's just hope world becomes multi-polar, not much we can do anyway.


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## mamascarlatti (Sep 23, 2009)

See this is where I also agree with Graaf, without trying to disrespect the people who died in 9/11. 

Maybe because I am in contact with Iraqis in everyday life, I think specifically of the possibly 90,000 civilian deaths in Iraq (lower end of the estimates) since the invasion by the US and UK. When are they going to be commemorated with a minute's silence?

As one refugee said to me a few years ago: "Under Saddam we knew who to be scared of and how to deal with it. Since he has gone, we are scared of everybody all the time".


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## Sid James (Feb 7, 2009)

There are also people who've become sick from asbestos inhalatation (eg. cancer-causing substances in the air long after the collapse of the twin towers). Esp. firefighters who were not wearing protective breathing gear (I'd guess there was little time for them to think of themselves, they had to respond quickly). I heard a guy on talkback radio here yesterday & he said that these people applying for compensation in the USA court system are having a hard time getting the payouts they obviously deserve. If this is true, if the system is not supporting or paying them back for the risks they took, this is quite appalling. & it goes against the grain of basic values which the USA I thought stood for, or at least aspires to stand for?*

At my end, here Down Under, the 9/11 anniversary was not over-exposed in the media, I think there was some coverage, but not saturation (as far as I could tell). It was talked about on air, but did not dominate the other news of the day/s. I think people here are more worried about other things, like for eg. how financial mismanagement for decades in the USA has impacted on the global economy (eg. the sub-prime mortgage spill). This is what friends & colleagues are talking about more here in relation to the USA, rather than what happened with the terrorist attacks...

* Here in Australia, it also took more than a decade for those fighting for compensation from asbestos mining companies - eg. James Hardie - to be held accountable for exposing workers to the deadly asbestos decades ago, this should be referred to as a precedent in the USA courts...


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## Huilunsoittaja (Apr 6, 2010)

Meaghan said:


> I am going to one as well. (Well, sort of a church service/concert) You should report back on yours, and I will on mine!


It was a great concert! Mozart's Requiem, and 2 Ives works: Symphony no. 2 III, and String Quartet no. 1 Slow mvmt. The program was ordered so that the Requiem was split up with spoken poems and letters, and the Ives works also interspersed. There was no clapping or anything at the end, which was odd since those players completely deserved applause. But, I guess they want to preserve the serious tone.


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## Almaviva (Aug 13, 2010)

Sid James said:


> I heard a guy on talkback radio here yesterday & he said that these people applying for compensation in the USA court system are having a hard time getting the payouts they obviously deserve. If this is true, if the system is not supporting or paying them back for the risks they took, this is quite appalling. & it goes against the grain of basic values which the USA I thought stood for, or at least aspires to stand for?*


Don't believe in everything you hear in talk radio.
There were funds established for 9-11 victims and families got millions of dollars, kids of the victims got their education paid for through college, etc.
The grain of truth in what you heard in talk radio probably comes from some con artists who tried to take advantage of the system and pretend that they were also 9-11 victims.
The true victims (or their families/children) got compensated all right.


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## Almaviva (Aug 13, 2010)

mamascarlatti said:


> See this is where I also agree with Graaf, without trying to disrespect the people who died in 9/11.
> 
> Maybe because I am in contact with Iraqis in everyday life, I think specifically of the possibly 90,000 civilian deaths in Iraq (lower end of the estimates) since the invasion by the US and UK. When are they going to be commemorated with a minute's silence?
> 
> As one refugee said to me a few years ago: "Under Saddam we knew who to be scared of and how to deal with it. Since he has gone, we are scared of everybody all the time".


Many Americans were and are against the war in Iraq.
I didn't vote for that guy.


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## Almaviva (Aug 13, 2010)

graaf said:


> I'm not, I'm just saying that US media rehashes 9/11 ad infinitum (ratings=money), establishment is set to exploit it forever,


I don't agree with this at all. It is an important date for us, and is coverage that we want to see. It's not a big conspiracy from the media. Yes, we do try to honor our dead. Most civilized nations do.


> and no one looks even in the 12k homicides in US


Why is it that some posters have been insisting on this lately? We do have a police and a justice system, you know? We do try to curb these homicides, and in many cases with success (incidence is dropping in many cities). Why are you guys under the impression that we don't try to solve this problem?


> let alone hundreds of thousands dying by American hand out of US


It happens in wars. I don't like wars. But many other countries have engaged in wars. They're the rule rather than the exception, in mankind's history.



> And it's all just human nature after all, every nation bullies around whenever it can, and history shows that every nation that could do it - did it. Let's just hope world becomes multi-polar, not much we can do anyway.


With this part, I agree.


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## Sid James (Feb 7, 2009)

Almaviva said:


> Don't believe in everything you hear in talk radio.
> There were funds established for 9-11 victims and families got millions of dollars, kids of the victims got their education paid for through college, etc.
> The grain of truth in what you heard in talk radio probably comes from some con artists who tried to take advantage of the system and pretend that they were also 9-11 victims.
> The true victims (or their families/children) got compensated all right.


Okay, I know there was compensation & it's said to be quite generous by any standard. But was it mainly compensating families of those who died or did it include those who've survived & living with cancer due to asbestos exposure? (esp. the firefighters, I just checked online, many of their cases are/have gone through the courts, but I'm not sure of the outcome/s of these). I am connecting how bloody hard it was for our own victims of asbestos poisoning - who had worked in the mines before wearing protective gear was introduced - to get compensation in the Australian courts. People like the late Bernie Banton fought tooth and nail to get compensation for these people, and he himself died of asbestos induced lung cancer only a week after the result came in favour of the workers. He'd been fighting this in the courts for like a decade or more. It's probably complex, I'm not sure if firefighters are covered for things like contracting a fatal disease from inhaling asbestos (eg. are they being held responsible as individuals for not wearing the mandated protective gear in these hazardous situations?)...


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## Almaviva (Aug 13, 2010)

Sid James said:


> Okay, I know there was compensation & it's said to be quite generous by any standard. But was it mainly compensating families of those who died or did it include those who've survived & living with cancer due to asbestos exposure? (esp. the firefighters, I just checked online, many of their cases are/have gone through the courts, but I'm not sure of the outcome/s of these). I am connecting how bloody hard it was for our own victims of asbestos poisoning - who had worked in the mines before wearing protective gear was introduced - to get compensation in the Australian courts. People like the late Bernie Banton fought tooth and nail to get compensation for these people, and he himself died of asbestos induced lung cancer only a week after the result came in favour of the workers. He'd been fighting this in the courts for like a decade or more. It's probably complex, I'm not sure if firefighters are covered for things like contracting a fatal disease from inhaling asbestos (eg. are they being held responsible as individuals for not wearing the mandated protective gear in these hazardous situations?)...


I don't know. I'd expect that people who successfully prove a connection will get compensated. But given human nature, you know that when something like this happens, there are always pretenders who try to take advantage of the system. That's exactly what the courts are for. You can't be granting millions to just anybody who cries out lout "I'm sick because of 9-11." Some cases are real and deserve compensation; others aren't and deserve to be prosecuted for fraud. Of course the people who have their claims denied (I believe, most of the time for good reason) will be fast to cry foul and go to talk radios, etc. Next they'll be trying a book deal.

But regarding the people who really deserve compensation, I believe that the system has been rather generous to them, and willing to accept their claims.


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## Sid James (Feb 7, 2009)

^^Ok, fair enough, I'll have to look into this & do proper research online when I get the chance. 

As I said re the asbestos compensation claims here in Australia, it was a class action, eg. a combination of actions by former workers in asbestos mines. It was won by the workers around 2004 after about a 10 year battle with the company James Hardie in the courts. I'd be interested if the firefighters and others working on the ground during the twin towers attack have launched a class action of some sort, or are they making their claims individually. 

I'll have to dig deeper to find out, the caller that talked about this on talkback yesterday only mentioned this in passing, he said that it was not easy or straightforward (in a less than fair/reasonable way, eg. being made more difficult than necessary) for these people to be compensated, but didn't go into detail...


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## Ralfy (Jul 19, 2010)

Related:


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