# Best Brahms first symphony you ever heard? (recording)



## Itullian

mine just might be Eschenbachs Houston version. or Barbirollis emi.

hmmmmmmmmm E!!!!!!!!!!!!:tiphat:


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## Moscow-Mahler

Has anyone heard the recording of the First by Michael Gielen? Some people praise it, I have not heard it yet?


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## Polednice

I'm personally not a great fan of the 1st.


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## Vaneyes

I'm attracted to the added strength in HvK's 1964 reading.


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## Webernite

I quite like Gardiner's.


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## Polednice

Webernite said:


> I quite like Gardiner's.


In that case, you do not like Brahms's music as it is supposed to be!


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## Itullian

how about Norrington's?


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## Webernite

Polednice said:


> In that case, you do not like Brahms's music as it is supposed to be!


You don't even like the _symphony itself_ and you're telling me off for my choice of recordings.


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## Webernite

Never really liked Norrington. He tends to make everything sound grey.


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## Polednice

Webernite said:


> You don't even like the _symphony itself_ and you're telling me off for my choice of recordings.


I may not be a fan of everything Brahms wrote, but I'm still possessed by his soul.


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## Ukko

Polednice said:


> I'm personally not a great fan of the 1st.


Nor I. There is too much Beethoven in it, not enough Brahms.


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## Itullian

phooey on youeee


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## Moscow-Mahler

I hope that Vanska will record Brahms, instead of re-recording Sibelius and Beethoven Piano Concerti. *Minnesota* has a great sound that reminds me Cleveland Orchestra of Dohnanyi's era.


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## Webernite

Polednice said:


> I may not be a fan of everything Brahms wrote, but I'm still possessed by his soul.


Don't you even like the 4th movement?


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## Polednice

Webernite said:


> Don't you even like the 4th movement?


I prefer the 1st movement. I find the final movement has some really wonderful moments, but it is not as profoundly coherent as many other Brahms pieces - it's more meandering.


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## beethovenian

I like gardiner's too and the rest of his Brahms series! I like it how he goes really fast in the ending of the 1st symphony.:devil:
Guess I am public enemy in the brahms department in Polenice's eyes now.


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## Webernite

Polednice said:


> I prefer the 1st movement. I find the final movement has some really wonderful moments, but it is not as profoundly coherent as many other Brahms pieces - it's more meandering.


But it doesn't sound meandering in the Gardiner recording.


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## Il_Penseroso

No one has conducted Brahms like Jochum, I think :


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## Kansenji

*Marin Alsop Made Me Feel Sick.*

I do love Brahms' 1st Symphony dearly, though I must embarrassingly admit that the second & third movements usually leave me yawning; they strike me as just "something" to fill in the gap between the two magnificent outer movements. I have had/got dozens of versions of Symphony No.1 & must admit that sound quality is now not very important to me, whereas the differences in interpretations are.

*Eugen Jochum* does reign supreme in this symphony; his 1953 B.P.O. recording is revelatory & his 1976 L.P.O. recording is just as good, but with better sound (_no longer available_ as a single CD.-it urgently needs re-mastering & re-release!). Both recordings dramatically accelerate at about 90 seconds before the end & convincingly so too. In fact, it seems that this speed-up was "normal practice" until the mid 1950s. *Wilhelm Furtwängler* used to do the same in his numerous performances, also in the following recordings: V.P.O. (1947), Concertgebouw Orchestra (1950), N.D.R.S.O. (1951), & B.P.O. (1952). If you want to try just _one_ of Furtwängler's, I suggest the 1952 Berlin Philharmonic recording, it seems the most coherent & its sound quality is the best of the bunch too.

*Hans Schmidt-Isserstedt*'s 1967 recording with the NDSRO (part of a cheap 4-symphony box set called "Brahms From Hamburg"- £9 on Amazon) is a beautifully crafted interpretation.

Unfortunately, I find most recent releases of this symphony to be uninspiring & *Marin Alsop*'s L.P.O. recording actually left me feeling quite nauseous & was quickly disposed of (literally, _thrown in the refuse bin!_ I didn't want anyone else to be as disappointed as I was).

Though I don't _own_ the following, more recent recording, I have _listened_ to much of it & it is my "hot favourite" for a recent recording: *Michael Gielen & The S.W.R.S.O. of Baden-Baden*, to buy asap (£15.07 on Amazon).


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## billeames

I love Ozawa BSO DG Japan. Jochum DG excellent with lesser sound. Kurt Sanderling RCA Dresden also great.
I am open to other ideas on who is best. Bill


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## Itullian

Vaneyes said:


> I'm attracted to the added strength in HvK's 1964 reading.


My favorite too.


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## Guest

Vaneyes said:


> I'm attracted to the added strength in HvK's 1964 reading.


Agreed.

Has anyone heard the new one from Gergiev? I've read mixed reviews.


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## billeames

Hello,

I want to give some of what I like about Brahms first. Such a wonderful symphony!

I may post this another place also. I am more fussy about Brahms 1 than any other symphony. I like accentuation of the last note of a phrase. Well done by Ozawa BSO, not well by some others. I like the power and thick sound of Giulini (LAPO, Philharmonia, BRSO on Profil). I like the sculpted sound of Abbado VPO 1973 (not on CD). But not the slower paced Abbado BPO version as much. I prefer sound that is 1960's or newer. The coda must be absolutely full throttle. Ozawa, Levine, Jochum BPO, Beinum Concertgebouw do this. If I remember correctly, Giulini too but pacing can be slow (through all of the symphony). Bernstein VPO has some indulgance but otherwise very good. On my earlier set of speakers Kurt Sanderlindg sounded boring on Spendor SP1, but great on Wilson Sasha's because of more lower frequencies coming through. But there are many positives to the older Spendors--sounds OK on bad recordings. The system has an influence on the outcome, that's partly why reviewers have a hard job. 

Perhaps I am looking for the perfect 1st, but I have fun listening to most all of them.

Bill


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## bigshot

A system with as flat a response throughout the full range of human hearing will present any recording at its best.


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## realdealblues

Brahms Symphony #1 is still probably my favorite Brahms Symphony.

Munch/Boston is hard too beat and is about as perfect as it gets for me.

Wand/NDR is top shelf.

Kempe/Munich is another that's pretty high up for me.

Sanderling/Dresden is top notch.

Jochum/Berlin or London as already mentioned is very well done.

Klemperer/Philharmonia will always hold a special place for me.

Szell/Cleveland is one that I don't think gets much attention but still really enjoy hearing.

Toscanini/NBC is another that I also feel is something special.

I don't know that I could pick one favorite, but the above are all pretty high up for me.


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## Bill H.

Kansenji said:


> *Wilhelm Furtwängler* used to do the same in his numerous performances, also in the following recordings: V.P.O. (1947), Concertgebouw Orchestra (1950), N.D.R.S.O. (1951), & B.P.O. (1952). If you want to try just _one_ of Furtwängler's, I suggest the 1952 Berlin Philharmonic recording, it seems the most coherent & its sound quality is the best of the bunch too.
> 
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> I'm most familiar with Furtwängler's '51 Hamburg (NDRSO) performance, will have to check out the '52 with the BSO, as well as the earlier Jochum.
> 
> BTW there is a recording of a live performance with Berlin, in January 1945, but just the finale has survived intact. This was, I believe, the famous performance where WF supposedly had to hightail it out of Germany later that night, just before he was to be arrested by the Gestapo (but there are differing accounts of whether this was really that performance, or it was a later one in Vienna that month before he fled). The performance is hearable on youtube, and it may be the most intense finale I've ever run across so far.


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## Brahmsian Colors

My favorites: Klemperer's late 50s account with the Philharmonia. A performance of sustained grandeur. Though not as weighty as Klemperer's 1st, Van Beinum's stereo Concertgebouw reading from 1958 is beautifully played and balanced. Bruno Walter's Columbia Symphony performance alternates underlying tension and poetry. His earlier mono N.Y. Philharmonic conception is also top notch.


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## Animal the Drummer

Karajan's rich, dark, craggy 1964 recording for me, with the Berlin Phil playing at white heat.


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## Pugg

Animal the Drummer said:


> Karajan's rich, dark, craggy 1964 recording for me, with the Berlin Phil playing at white heat.


My favourite too.


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## Manxfeeder

Pugg said:


> My favourite too.


Shuffling through my CD stack. Rats; I have the one from the '70s. Oh, well, I do have Jochum (1977) and Klemperer. Jochum is my current favorite, but when it comes to Brahms, I tend to take the route of the honeybee and flit from flower to flower.


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## Mal

i didn't like Szell or Jochum last time I tried them. I didn't like one of Karajan's, but maybe one of the other four will do it for me; thanks for the recommendation Vaneyes. For the moment, its between Walter and Klemperer for me.

Third Ear ("he diminishes the spirit of Brahms") kind of put me off Norrington  Brahms without warmth and richness seounds like coffee without cream. But, who knows, I might listen to it after I've listened to a few dozen others... several times...


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## shadowdancer

I would like to add another great recording:
Toscanini & Philharmonia Orchestra
1952


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## 77dRW

Furtwangler conducts Brahms, with BPO in 1952. So far the best I've heard.


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## Brahmsian Colors

I previously listed Klemperer, Van Beinum and Walter as my favorites, but there are three others I would say are very finely played: Krips/Vienna Philharmonic and Ormandy/Philadelphia Orchestra, both from the late 1950s in stereo, and Jochum/London Philharmonic (1977).


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## David Phillips

Munch/Boston for me too - the timps at the beginning are really LOUD!


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## Merl

It's not my favourite Brahms symphony (the 3rd is) but of the versions I listen to these are those I rate the most highly (at the moment):

Munch
Szell
Wand
Levine (Chicago)
Jurowski
Jochum


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## Brahmsianhorn

The 60s Karajan, Abbado and Kempe are all very good, but the only one that has ever really knocked my socks off is Furtwangler's 1951 performance in Hamburg. It's the only one that for me has the requisite intensity. Good sound, too.


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## Heck148

Solti/CSO...really great, heard them do it live in Carnegie Hall..

Wand/CSO is really good as well - closing passages are quite phenomenal....

Toscanini/NBC - a couple of good versions available...this was an AT specialty.


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## AfterHours

Though there are several top notch candidates, James Levine/Vienna Philharmonic might be unbeatable.

Spotify as follows: https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/615UBLEg2NL.jpg

Available on Youtube too, separated by movement.


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## Fpanny

Eschenbach and Bernstein/VPO


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## premont

Brahmsian Colors said:


> I previously listed Klemperer, Van Beinum and Walter as my favorites..


Precisely my favorites along with Boult.

BTW van Beinum died acutely from heart attack during a performance of this symphony.


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## CnC Bartok

I've got quite a few Brahms cycles, and have been dipping into them over the past few weeks, something resembling a Brahms binge, but not quite as Bacchanalian as it could be. It's interesting to see positive comments about Gielen's Brahms. I enjoyed it very much first time around - a cycle under the radar - and am glad to see I am not the only one. I didn't think much of his Bruckner though, very hit and miss.....

However, with this symphony, I keep going back to Otto Klemperer and the Philharmonia. It has (for me) the right blend of grandeur, lyricism, rhythm/bounce, and is short on aggressiveness, close to perfect as far as I am concerned.

On this one, Jochum and Belohlavek not far behind.....


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## Merl

CnC Bartok said:


> On this one, Jochum and Belohlavek not far behind.....


I like that Belohlavek cycle too, CnC. Its quite a traditional set but it's got power aplenty and is very well played. It got very mixed reviews upon release.


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## CnC Bartok

Merl said:


> I like that Belohlavek cycle too, CnC. Its quite a traditional set but it's got power aplenty and is very well played. It got very mixed reviews upon release.


Agreed. I also think Belohlavek brings out some of the lyrical beauty of Brahms. I haven't seen any Western reviews, but I bet they say it's a bit bland? If so utter nonsense!


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## Highwayman

Klempy is my champion for Brahms in general but I also find Böhm quite impeccable with the first especially.


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## Gothos

This is the first one that I heard.I haven't gotten around to any other
recordings yet.


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## Marc

premont said:


> Precisely my favorites along with Boult.
> 
> BTW van Beinum died acutely from heart attack during a performance of this symphony.


During a rehearsal... to be more precise: wilst Haakon Stotijn was playing the beautiful oboe solo of the 2nd movement.
Some time earlier, after a performance, Van Beinum had said to him: "Haakon, next time when you play that solo as beautiful as you did this evening, I won't survive it."

On topic: I could not name just one. I like Van Beinum, Klemperer, Jochum, Böhm, Solti and Mackerras. But to be honest, the 1st is probably my least favourite Brahms symphony (apologies)... despite that beautiful oboe solo.


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## Allegro Con Brio

Gothos said:


> View attachment 145628
> 
> 
> This is the first one that I heard.I haven't gotten around to any other
> recordings yet.


Wow, you probably heard the most idiosyncratic and controversial one! Must admit that I'm not a big fan of it; there is a point where stretching of tempi becomes artificial and overinflated rather than a natural ebb and flow, and I think Lenny crosses that line here. For example, he slows down to an almost complete halt for the big brass chorale at the very end which just kills the momentum.

My favorite 1sts are Jochum (either one is just fine with me; opulent Romantic playing), the stereo Böhm (some big-time heft and epic drama going on there), Klemperer (stolid and monumental like the Matterhorn), and of course the vintage Furtwängler and Toscanini. Surprisingly, I think the "lighter" versions like Zehetmair and Zinman are worth listening to even if they don't top the classic approaches in my opinion; I think there is some benefit from hearing translucent textures where the rip-roaring horns, lyrical strings, and inner wind lines can all be clearly heard if you're looking for a dissection of the score.


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## Merl

Allegro Con Brio said:


> Wow, you probably heard the most idiosyncratic and controversial one! Must admit that I'm not a big fan of it; there is a point where stretching of tempi becomes artificial and overinflated rather than a natural ebb and flow, and I think Lenny crosses that line here. For example, he slows down to an almost complete halt for the big brass chorale at the very end which just kills the momentum.


I'm with you, ACB. I find Bernstein's VPO Brahms 1st unbearable however it's brilliant compared to his quite horrible 3rd. Bernstein + Brahms = carcrash


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## Geoff48

When I started listening to classical music seriously as a pre teenager Brahms was a blind spot. Okay I liked the Haydn variations and a few Hungarian dances but the symphonies and concertos left me cold, they seemed very heavy with dull orchestration and not very melodic. Then the violin concerto was played at a Saturday night evening concert, can’t remember who was playing, and I enjoyed it. So I borrowed a copy of the 1st symphony from the Record Library. I actually was impressed, both with the very dramatic opening and also the slow movement and that magnificent theme in the final movement. Soon thereafter I bought an LP on the EMI MFP label. The conductor was Rudolph Kempe with the Berlin Philharmonic. As I discovered later Kempe was a great conductor who could always be relied upon to give a good performance of whatever he played.
As I grew older I began to appreciate Brahms more. The 1st piano concerto I discovered through the L shaped room with Leslie Caron, the 2nd Symphony with Bohm on Heliodor. He was never my favourite composer overall but I no longer shied away from him. I even respected the 4th Symphony although that took some time. And I have plenty of his music now in my collection.


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## TwoFlutesOneTrumpet

My current favourites:

Dohnanyi and Cleveland.
Solti and CSO.
Levine and CSO.


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## Brahmsianhorn

If you can handle a little idiosyncrasy, the Bernstein/VPO 1st is one of the most powerful, angst-ridden around. It depends how much you value drama. For this symphony, what Bernstein brings is something that I find essential in the work.

I am not a fan of his 3rd, however. No flow. Too heavy.

His 2nd is very good. Very sumptuous.

The 4th suffers again from the same problems of idiosyncrasy in the finale, though there are other moments making it worth at least a listen.


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## Itullian

I love Bernsteins VPO.
i think they are powerful and emotional.


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## hoodjem

Chailly or Klemperer.


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## Rmathuln

billeames said:


> Hello,
> 
> I want to give some of what I like about Brahms first. Such a wonderful symphony!
> 
> I may post this another place also. I am more fussy about Brahms 1 than any other symphony. I like accentuation of the last note of a phrase. Well done by Ozawa BSO, not well by some others. I like the power and thick sound of Giulini (LAPO, Philharmonia, BRSO on Profil). I like the sculpted sound of Abbado VPO 1973 (not on CD). But not the slower paced Abbado BPO version as much. I prefer sound that is 1960's or newer. The coda must be absolutely full throttle. Ozawa, Levine, Jochum BPO, Beinum Concertgebouw do this. If I remember correctly, Giulini too but pacing can be slow (through all of the symphony). Bernstein VPO has some indulgance but otherwise very good. On my earlier set of speakers Kurt Sanderlindg sounded boring on Spendor SP1, but great on Wilson Sasha's because of more lower frequencies coming through. But there are many positives to the older Spendors--sounds OK on bad recordings. The system has an influence on the outcome, that's partly why reviewers have a hard job.
> 
> Perhaps I am looking for the perfect 1st, but I have fun listening to most all of them.
> 
> Bill


Abbado/VPO is/was available on CD from Tower Records Japan










*https://tower.jp/item/2880518/

UPC 4988005655240
*

Essentially a reproduction of 1970s LP set DG 2720 061-32

Was widely available in USA in a subscription set from the International Preview Society


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## Brahmsian Colors

It had been years since I last heard this performance of the Brahms 1 from 1959 with Eugene Ormandy and the Philadelphia Orchestra on the Columbia lp label. Returning to it for a re-listen simply reaffirmed my conviction of its superb quality. Along with Van Beinum/Amsterdam Concertgebouw (1958 stereo version) and Klemperer/Philharmonia, it sits at the top of my list of Brahms First favorites.


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## bavlf

Animal the Drummer said:


> Karajan's rich, dark, craggy 1964 recording for me, with the Berlin Phil playing at white heat.


+1 

DG, the Originals


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## Ned Low

Though there are many great Brahms' 1st, i've been impressed by Furtwangler's interpretation of this monumental work( especially the strings).


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## HenryPenfold

The most searingly intense performance of this symphony I've ever heard.

Live performance in London 1988.


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## Oldhoosierdude

None other will do for me.


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## david johnson

I keep the Klemperer and Jochum around. I used to have HvK lp and liked it. When I was a young teen, the radio aired a Toscanini show on Sunday evenings that used his NBC Brahms 1 as the theme music.


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