# Any Elgar afficianados out there?



## violadude (May 2, 2011)

I was listening to an Elgar piece called "The Music Makers" the other day and I noticed that some parts of this piece have very clear direct quotes from the "Enigma Variations", especially from the main theme and the nimrod variations. So I was wondering if anyone else has noticed this? and which one was written or conceived first?


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## aleazk (Sep 30, 2011)

I can tell you that @ComposerOfAvantGarde is big, but a big, Elgar fan. You will see (he has told me that he even has "erotic dreams" with Elgar and his music). :devil::angel::tiphat:

Personally, the only piece of him that I know well is the famous cello concerto. I like it, but I'm not a big fan of that piece. I like some parts that are very "solemn", very british.


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## violadude (May 2, 2011)

aleazk said:


> I can tell you that @ComposerOfAvantGarde is big, but a big, Elgar fan. You will see (he has told me that he even has "erotic dreams" with Elgar and his music). :devil::angel::tiphat:
> 
> Personally, the only piece of him that I know well is the famous cello concerto. I like it, but I'm not a big fan of that piece. I like some parts that are very "solemn", very british.


oh I know very well COAG love of Elgar haha.


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## moody (Nov 5, 2011)

The Enigma Variations were premiered in 1899. The Music Makers in 1912. I hope you are a fan, as far as the Variations are concerned I am quite convinced that this is one of the most extraordinary works ever written.


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## violadude (May 2, 2011)

moody said:


> The Enigma Variations were premiered in 1899. The Music Makers in 1912. I hope you are a fan, as far as the Variations are concerned I am quite convinced that this is one of the most extraordinary works ever written.


I do like that work very much! It was one of the last pieces I played with my highschool youth symphony. It is bloody hard! >.<


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## moody (Nov 5, 2011)

I wonder if you might like The Starlight Express have you come across that yet?


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## violadude (May 2, 2011)

moody said:


> I wonder if you might like The Starlight Express have you come across that yet?


Yes I have listened to that one. I didn't think much of it my first listen through. I'll have to listen to it again though.


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## moody (Nov 5, 2011)

OK, here are two more: Coronation Ode written for Edward the Seventh's coronation in 1902, this is where the famous "Land of Hope and Glory" comes from used in the most popular Pomp and Circumstance march.
The Spirit of England based on the war poems of Lawrence Binyon and using a soprano and chorus. This was the last of Elgar's great choral work and appeared after WW 1. 
Just to clarify, the Pomp and Circumstance March No.1 came out before the Ode but the words were added for that work.


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## Ukko (Jun 4, 2010)

Hah. I have discovered that I like his 2nd Symphony - if I skip the slow movement.


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## Polednice (Sep 13, 2009)

Is there anything Polednice would like? He has not found anything so far.


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## violadude (May 2, 2011)

Polednice said:


> Is there anything Polednice would like? He has not found anything so far.


What have you heard?


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## Polednice (Sep 13, 2009)

violadude said:


> What have you heard?


Enigma Variations, Cello Concerto, and some string serenade thingy. It was all so boring I didn't try anything else.


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## violadude (May 2, 2011)

Polednice said:


> Enigma Variations, Cello Concerto, and some string serenade thingy. It was all so boring I didn't try anything else.


Hmm try his string quartet or introduction and allegro for strings.


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## moody (Nov 5, 2011)

Hilltroll72 said:


> Hah. I have discovered that I like his 2nd Symphony - if I skip the slow movement.


Bet you don't eat your crusts either.


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## moody (Nov 5, 2011)

violadude said:


> Hmm try his string quartet or introduction and allegro for strings.


You know he only likes Rachmaninoff I believe!


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## Polednice (Sep 13, 2009)

violadude said:


> Hmm try his string quartet or introduction and allegro for strings.


I listened to the introduction and allegro as well - it was on the same CD. I'll try the string quartet.


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## Ukko (Jun 4, 2010)

moody said:


> Bet you don't eat your crusts either.


I eat my crusts, but that slow movement is more like porridge... which I don't eat - hot or cold, fresh or 9 days old.


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## Polednice (Sep 13, 2009)

moody said:


> You know he only likes Rachmaninoff I believe!


Ugh! Can't stand Tacky Rachy.


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## moody (Nov 5, 2011)

Polednice said:


> Ugh! Can't stand Tacky Rachy.


I knew that if you remember from our first meeting. Have you tried Elgar's violin concerto? But if you dont like him, you don't, there are plenty more composers in the sea. Unlike a lot of people in this place I believe in love at first hearing, I still dislike most composer I didn't like when i was fifteen--with a few exceptions.


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## Delicious Manager (Jul 16, 2008)

violadude said:


> I was listening to an Elgar piece called "The Music Makers" the other day and I noticed that some parts of this piece have very clear direct quotes from the "Enigma Variations", especially from the main theme and the nimrod variations. So I was wondering if anyone else has noticed this? and which one was written or conceived first?


I have most of Elgar's music (I'm a middle-aged Brit, so I'm duty-bound!). _The Music Makers_ is strewn with Elgar self-quotations. As well as _Nimrod_, which you have already spotted, there are quotes from Elgar's _The Dream of Gerontius_, the opening of his _Sea Pictures_, the First and Second Symphonies and the Violin Concerto. He also quotes Thomas Arne's _Rule, Britannia_ and the French national anthem _La Marseillaise_.


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## starthrower (Dec 11, 2010)

Check out this vintage performance conducted by a young and dashing Daniel Barenboim.


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## Taneyev (Jan 19, 2009)

I'm and Elgar's "aficionado" (that's the word) but only on his concert and chamber works. Not interested on his symphonics nor other stuff. IMO his violin and cello concerti are supreme pieces on the gender, and all his chamber are really great.


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## elgar's ghost (Aug 8, 2010)

Polednice said:


> Enigma Variations, Cello Concerto, and some string serenade thingy. It was all so boring I didn't try anything else.


I may be clutching at straws here but give his 'Cockaigne' and 'In The South' overtures a whirl.


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## clavichorder (May 2, 2011)

moody said:


> Unlike a lot of people in this place I believe in love at first hearing, I still dislike most composer I didn't like when i was fifteen--with a few exceptions.


Are you serious? If I was like I was at 15, I'd be listening to classic rock and Vivaldi concertos. Also, you don't mean that pieces that you don't love on first impression, you continue not to care much about do you? Because one of the most eye opening phenomena of my listening experience is that I've learned that certain pieces grow on you, and styles. Otherwise I'd hate the Beethoven symphonies, 7 sounded ridiculous to me at first. Appassionata sounded pretentious. Only dark and streamlined baroque and Mozart was really interesting to me.

Now, on the topic, I like Elgar's 2nd symphony, first movement. I really haven't digested the whole piece though. I enjoyed the challenge of its thickness. I'm not at the point where I'm just crazy about it though.


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## HarpsichordConcerto (Jan 1, 2010)

One of his better works, _The Dream of Gerontius _


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## violadude (May 2, 2011)

Well I kind of got the question answered that I needed the Elgar expert for...soo.....you guys can keep talking about Elgar if you'd like I suppose.


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## clavichorder (May 2, 2011)

violadude said:


> Well I kind of got the question answered that I needed the Elgar expert for...soo.....you guys can keep talking about Elgar if you'd like I suppose.


Nice! A thread that resolves.


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## moody (Nov 5, 2011)

clavichorder said:


> Are you serious? If I was like I was at 15, I'd be listening to classic rock and Vivaldi concertos. Also, you don't mean that pieces that you don't love on first impression, you continue not to care much about do you? Because one of the most eye opening phenomena of my listening experience is that I've learned that certain pieces grow on you, and styles. Otherwise I'd hate the Beethoven symphonies, 7 sounded ridiculous to me at first. Appassionata sounded pretentious. Only dark and streamlined baroque and Mozart was really interesting to me.
> 
> Now, on the topic, I like Elgar's 2nd symphony, first movement. I really haven't digested the whole piece though. I enjoyed the challenge of its thickness. I'm not at the point where I'm just crazy about it though.


You are right that I broadened as I went along,but quite seriously I was crazy about the Appassionata when I was ten. But I don't think I've changed that much over the years, I just seem to know a lot across the board.I was lucky in that I met many people who got me places that are not easy to get into. If this sounds rambling it's probably because it is 02.20 hours here.


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## clavichorder (May 2, 2011)

moody said:


> You are right that I broadened as I went along,but quite seriously I was crazy about the Appassionata when I was ten. But I don't think I've changed that much over the years, I just seem to know a lot across the board.I was lucky in that I met many people who got me places that are not easy to get into. If this sounds rambling it's probably because it is 02.20 hours here.


I hope I wasn't rude, I may have been to quick to write all that without imagining what my tone might have been like. Anyway, its just quite different from my experience. I still don't know what I'll end up liking the most.


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## moody (Nov 5, 2011)

clavichorder said:


> I hope I wasn't rude, I may have been to quick to write all that without imagining what my tone might have been like. Anyway, its just quite different from my experience. I still don't know what I'll end up liking the most.


I think you are probably incapable of being rude--pity there aren't more like you around here.


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## crmoorhead (Apr 6, 2011)

I am very much enjoying The Dream of Gerontius ATM. The slow orchestral intro is excellent and I like choral works in general. It is probably my favourite work by Elgar that I have heard so far. The Music Makers is also in the set, but I haven't listened to it much yet.


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## presto (Jun 17, 2011)

Absolutely love Elgar, the two Symphonies in particular are utter masterpieces.
In recent years a reconstruction of the 3rd Symphony has been made by Anthony Payne from fragments and sketches left by Elgar after his death.
If anyone loves Elgar and doesn’t know this work it’s a remarkable achievement, it sounds totally convincing as if Elgar wrote the whole thing from scratch.


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## sahibagupta (Aug 16, 2011)

Hi

ELGAR Pageant of Empire. The Pipes of Pan. The River. Sea Pictures. GURNEY Lights Out. HURD Shore Leave • Roderick Williams (bar); Martin Yates, cond; BBC Concert O • DUTTON EPOCH 7243 (76:15)This absolution will authority appropriate address to Elgar aficionados. Only two of the advance accept been recorded afore in the anatomy we acquisition them here, namely the two absolute songs “The River” and “The Pipes of Pan,” both orchestrated by the composer. The far better-known Sea Pictures is accessible in abundant accomplished performances, conspicuously those with Janet Baker and Maureen Forrester, but this is their aboriginal time on disc with a baritone replacing average or contralto in an agreeable setting. (Baritone Konrad Jarnont for one has recorded the Sea Pictures with piano.) 
Thanks


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