# World Cup 2014



## Guest

I thoroughly enjoyed the dismantling of Spain last night. It was great to see a promising match deliver excitement and entertainment, sometimes missing when we have high expectations about clashes between leading countries.

As one of the commentators said, we got the Final we should have had in 2010. I was particularly pleased that Spain's exceedingly dull style was found so extravagantly wanting.

And if anyone thinks that running in high temperatures is not possible, they should watch Robben in full flow! Cameroon might have fared better against Mexico if they could have extended themselves and occasionally broken into something more than a leisurely stroll!


----------



## jurianbai

For World Cup 2014 my classic favorite is Italy. I also wanted Japan and South Korea to go further ever. Of course I am not surprise if Brazil going to win this , perhaps easily.

Match review:
Brazil - Croatia 3-1. At first half both team looks fighting equally, but then Brazil dominated the game. The penalty didn't seem really necessery though.

Mexico - Cameroon 1-0 - I didn't watch this, maybe Cameroon not really the tiger as in '90s anymore.

Spain - Netherland 1-5. Netherland surprisingly control the play easily. Considering Spain got some multi talents on them this either something wrong with the strategy or Netherland is really solid as a team. Robben is really hard, the game itself should ended up with more goals, for both sides, as many obvious opportunity was missed. Spain missed goals were even bad.

Chile - Australia 3-1. Not really an enjoyable game, both team lose ball a lot of time. Chile slightly wins the ball possession.

Looking forward for England vs Italy on Sunday morning (my time...).


----------



## elgar's ghost

The Dutch were superb - I reckon if any team plays with caution against the likes of Spain and Brazil then 9 times out of 10 they'll walk out of the tunnel a goal down already. Instead the Netherlands took Spain on and ripped them apart even after going a goal down. 

Can't see what all the fuss is about Brazil these days - every pundit talks in cliches about 'samba magic', 'South American flair' and the like but the truth is that Brazil haven't played in their own distinctive, all-out attacking style since the World Cup of 1986 - nearly all of their international players are now based in Europe and their overall game is more defensive-oriented as a result and has been since the competition in 1990. They have toughened up at the back but it has also made them more predictable. Because they have home advantage this time very few teams will try and go toe to toe with them. I expect them to be able to sleepwalk out of the group stages.

If England stay true to World Cup form and make a complete pig's breakfast of it then I'll be rooting for the Dutch.


----------



## TxllxT

New (for me) in the collection of crazy Dutch outfits: Russian military caps turned orange


----------



## Vaneyes

England...the horror, the horror, the horror.

The Telegraph has solutions.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/fo...nds-crucial-World-Cup-clash-with-Uruguay.html


----------



## Headphone Hermit

Oh, those crazy Dutch!









no, not the attractive Dutch woman, but the guy with carrots on his hat. What's that all about? :lol:


----------



## Guest

Germany _v._ Portugal this evening (CET). That'll be one to watch. Must get some beer in!


----------



## Kieran

elgars ghost said:


> Can't see what all the fuss is about Brazil these days - every pundit talks in cliches about 'samba magic', 'South American flair' and the like but the truth is that Brazil haven't played in their own distinctive, all-out attacking style since the World Cup of 1986 - nearly all of their international players are now based in Europe and their overall game is more defensive-oriented as a result and has been since the competition in 1990. They have toughened up at the back but it has also made them more predictable. Because they have home advantage this time very few teams will try and go toe to toe with them. I expect them to be able to sleepwalk out of the group stages.


Exactly.

If Brazil had been able to win the World Cup with the great Socrates and Zico in their team, who knows what football would look like now, but they gave up on individual expression back in the 80's and adopted the European reliance on systems and organisation and they haven't been so interesting or "beautiful" since.

The Dutch have been the most impressive team so far - which probably means they'll fail to qualify from their group! :lol:


----------



## Marc

Kieran said:


> Exactly.
> 
> If Brazil had been able to win the World Cup with the great Socrates and Zico in their team, who knows what football would look like now, but they gave up on individual expression back in the 80's and adopted the European reliance on systems and organisation and they haven't been so interesting or "beautiful" since.
> 
> The Dutch have been the most impressive team so far - which probably means they'll fail to qualify from their group! :lol:


I'm Dutch, and I'm afraid that I know what you mean. 

Still, if Van Persie, Robben and Sneijder (and Van Gaal ) stay fit and in good form ... then the rest of the (rather unexperienced) team might stay confident and inspired, too.


----------



## Kieran

I was only kidding, Marc, I think the Dutch will progress, you have a great manager and some great players. Traditionally, the Dutch fall out with each other at big tournaments but hopefully that won't happen...


----------



## hpowders

Germany looks like the best team at the World Cup. Thomas Müller looks like the best player at the World Cup. So what else is new?


----------



## Levanda

I want Russia to win world cup. I hope so.


----------



## Vaneyes

hpowders said:


> Germany looks like the best team at the World Cup. Thomas Müller looks like the best player at the World Cup. So what else is new?


I've got today's game pvr'd. I'll fast>>>forward to the "headbutt".


----------



## Kieran

Vaneyes said:


> I've got today's game pvr'd. I'll fast>>>forward to the "headbutt".


Yeah, the Germans are very physical, but they also know how to roll about the floor like a grieving widow...


----------



## sabrina

OMG! Socrates (RIP), Zico, Falcao, Eder what a dream team! I love Brazil and I would like them to win, but they need to upgrade their game...


----------



## SiegendesLicht

TalkingHead said:


> Germany _v._ Portugal this evening (CET). That'll be one to watch. Must get some beer in!


Now, personally I am of the opinion that national pride should be based on more substantial things than football victories, but 4:0 was still kind of nice...


----------



## Headphone Hermit

Kieran said:


> I was only kidding, Marc, I think the Dutch will progress, you have a great manager and some great players. Traditionally, the Dutch fall out with each other at big tournaments but hopefully that won't happen...


I hope van Gaal wins the World Cup (thrashing Germany in the finals) and then he realises he has nothing else to achieve in football, unexpectedly resigns as Man U manager before he even starts (and Man U appoint Roy Keane as manager - who then ruins everything, leading them to be relegated to the Conference in four seasons), and learns how to manage a cricket team, leading England to a run of success lasting years. I hope!!!!


----------



## Headphone Hermit

hpowders said:


> Germany looks like the best team at the World Cup.


Yes, correct assessment (despite the fantasy world of my previous post!)


----------



## Vaneyes

Mexico upsets the Team of Samba today. Just kidding.


----------



## elgar's ghost

Disgraceful behaviour by Muller but as usual it will go unpunished. FIFA had a chance to put things right years ago after Rivaldo's infamous face-clutching and going down like a sack of cement when the ball had gently hit him in the leg when he stood near the corner spot. As can be expected, the spineless weasels at FIFA did nothing and they never will as all they are concerned about is bean-counting. As far as I'm concerned, blatant play-acting should be dealt with as harshly as a dangerous foul and although saying this does me no credit I secretly hope someone gets a bit of sly one in on Muller in a future match.


----------



## Vaneyes

Who's kidding? Ole! Mexico wins 0 - 0. ToS's Julio Cesar had a workout in the closing minutes. Well done, Amigos!


----------



## hpowders

Viva Müller and Germany! They put on quite an entertaining show for those who appreciate great football. :tiphat:

Viva Italy for their beautiful win against the typically overrated, spoiled and pampered Englanders! Poor boys; driving away in their Ferraris and Rolls Royces.

Viva USA for beating a team, Ghana, that was clearly better than they were!


----------



## Guest

Mexican goalie performed brilliantly against disappointing Brazil. So much for the overrated samba.


----------



## Headphone Hermit

Is there another team (apart from Belgium) in this year's finals that sings their national anthem in two languages?


----------



## Piwikiwi

Headphone Hermit said:


> Is there another team (apart from Belgium) in this year's finals that sings their national anthem in two languages?


Poor german speaking Belgians are veing left out


----------



## elgar's ghost

Headphone Hermit said:


> Is there another team (apart from Belgium) in this year's finals that sings their national anthem in two languages?


Perhaps the Swiss sing theirs in at least three?


----------



## Headphone Hermit

elgars ghost said:


> Perhaps the Swiss sing theirs in at least three?


Good call! That calls for a .... beer! :tiphat:


----------



## Vaneyes

Spain continues their slide into oblivion, trailing Chile 2 nil.:devil:


----------



## hpowders

Viva Chile for playing a very nice game in defeating and eliminating a sloppy, seemingly unmotivated Spanish team.

Absolutamente glorioso!!! :cheers:


----------



## Vaneyes

Didn't watch Netherlands (3) & Australia (2). What's up with that? Netherlands come out flat after that "BIG" win 'gainst Spain?


----------



## hpowders

Vaneyes said:


> Didn't watch Netherlands (3) & Australia (2). What's up with that? Netherlands come out flat after that "BIG" win 'gainst Spain?


I was busy writing my memoirs. Missed it too. Having trouble getting to sentence three; page one.


----------



## Vaneyes

BREAKING NEWS: Ronaldo may be out (knee injury), and Ms. Shayk called on to nurse. Developing.


----------



## hpowders

I want to look just like that! Not Irina. Who cares about her?

Like Ronaldo and that fancy schmancy expensive leather jacket!


----------



## Vaneyes

hpowders said:


> I want to look just like that! Not Irina. Who cares about her?
> 
> Like Ronaldo and that fancy schmancy expensive leather jacket!


Either one would probably be twice as lucky.


----------



## Vaneyes

Okay, lets combine all our positive energy and will* England* a victory today.:devil:


----------



## hpowders

I want plastic surgery to look just like Ronaldo (not that it would take much). Then Irina and I can keep posting back and forth here, happily ever after! :cheers:


----------



## hpowders

Even though Colombia beat Ivory Coast, 2-1, a loud "VIVA!" must be given to Ivory Coast for scoring the most exciting, virtuosic goal of the tournament.




(Completely Dispassionate & Mercifully Pithy World Cup Evaluations)


----------



## Headphone Hermit

hpowders said:


> I want plastic surgery to look just like Ronaldo (*not that it would take much*).


I see your novel is progressing well


----------



## Headphone Hermit

34 seconds left for England to score 2. 

Back to Blighty, Chaps!

Whistle gone - they think it is all over .... it IS now!


----------



## hpowders

A very loud VIVA!!! to Luis Suárez and the magnificent Uruguay goal keeper for outplaying a favored England, disappointing the latter's fans....again.



(Completely Dispassionate & Mercifully Pithy World Cup Evaluations)


----------



## Vaneyes

Well, we tried, and I thank all who participated.

In a nasal whiny voice, "I still think England would beat Spain."

"Girly boys." -- Awnold


----------



## clara s

Headphone Hermit said:


> 34 seconds left for England to score 2.
> 
> Back to Blighty, Chaps!
> 
> Whistle gone - they think it is all over .... it IS now!


sorry Hermit

I wanted you to win, but the round God had other plans


----------



## hpowders

Headphone Hermit said:


> I see your novel is progressing well


Truth can be stranger than fiction.

(Completely Dispassionate & Mercifully Pithy World Cup Evaluations)


----------



## Headphone Hermit

clara s said:


> sorry Hermit
> 
> I wanted you to win, but the round God had other plans


No worries - I'd rather see Suarez scoring freely and us win the league next year


----------



## clara s

Headphone Hermit said:


> No worries - I'd rather see Suarez scoring freely and us win the league next year
> 
> View attachment 44820


wow

don't tell me you are Liverpool


----------



## Headphone Hermit

can't you see me in here?









:lol:


----------



## hpowders

Nobody there will ever be mistaken for Ronaldo.


----------



## hpowders

VIVA Greece!! After losing their captain to a red card, instead of being disheartened, Greece took it up a notch and played the best defensive game of the World Cup so far. Japan kept pouring it on; Greece kept turning them back.

A score of 0-0 doesn't reveal the great defense Greece displayed.



(Completely Dispassionate and Usually Pithy World Cup Evaluations)


----------



## Wood

So why do England players so often fail to reproduce club form when representing Her Britannic Majesty?


----------



## Matsps

Wood said:


> So why do England players so often fail to reproduce club form when representing Her Britannic Majesty?


Do England really have that many players who showed exceptional club form this season?


----------



## Headphone Hermit

Matsps said:


> Do England really have that many players who showed exceptional club form this season?


Oooh! Ouch!!!

Suggesting there is a possibility that we don't have many (erm .... more than a few) quality players is a touch severe (albeit entirely accurate!)


----------



## hpowders

Viva Costa Rica for beating a shockingly listless, unmotivated and lazy looking Italy.





(Completely Dispassionate World Cup Evaluations)


----------



## Guest

I'm glad I don't have to fret about the possibility of Italy beating Uruguay and England bagging 5 against Costa Rica!


----------



## Kieran

England went out with barely a whimper. So many of their players were out of their depth, including Gerrard. They need to change their football culture - but they've needed to do that since 1970. 

Great to see Costa Rica play so well, leaving us with a much anticipated battle between the two nations who shared the first four World Cups and have deliberately avoided each other ever since - except when they didn't.

Uruguay to summon the Spirit of 1950 and go through!


----------



## hpowders

Viva France as the Flying Frenchman easily put away a weak Swiss team in an effervescent, magnificent display of football virtuosity. The exact opposite of the Italians, today!

I would have to say the evidence is pointing towards Germany and France as the two best teams in the World Cup, in my opinion.




(Completely Dispassionate World Cup Evaluations)


----------



## Kieran

I thought the French were about to surrender there, when the Swiss pulled back two goals, but then they realised that Switzerland are neutral... :lol:


----------



## hpowders

With Italy's taking a dive in today's match, England's going home.

Would Italy purposely play dead just to get rid of England? Hmmmm....


----------



## GreenMamba

Well, England might hang around to play their last match.

Costa Rica are going through, but haven't clinched the top spot.


----------



## Matsps

hpowders said:


> I would have to say the evidence is pointing towards Germany and France as the two best teams in the World Cup, in my opinion.


You weren't impressed with The Netherlands so far? How about Columbia with their two wins? And do not forget about Argentina and Belgium, who both have really strong squads. I'm mostly just wondering why you picked France over any of these teams really?


----------



## Kieran

hpowders said:


> With Italy's taking a dive in today's match, England's going home.
> 
> Would Italy purposely play dead just to get rid of England? Hmmmm....


Nah! Why would they do that? It's not like England are Germany or Spain. This is probably the weakest England team I've seen in years...


----------



## elgar's ghost

Headphone Hermit said:


> Oooh! Ouch!!!
> 
> Suggesting there is a possibility that we don't have many (erm .... more than a few) quality players is a touch severe (albeit entirely accurate!)


It hardly helps the international team's cause when most of the top English clubs have only a smattering of Englishmen playing for them in the first place. Champion club Manchester City have only six English players in a first team squad of 26 (and of those, only two can be considered first-team regulars) - could you imagine the likes of Bayern Munich, Juventus and Real Madrid having such a disparity? As no current England players ply their trade abroad this reflects an alarming lack of strength in depth.


----------



## Guest

elgars ghost said:


> It hardly helps the international team's cause when most of the top English clubs have only a smattering of Englishmen playing for them in the first place. Champion club Manchester City have only six English players in a first team squad of 26 (and of those, only two can be considered first-team regulars) - could you imagine the likes of Bayern Munich, Juventus and Real Madrid having such a disparity? As no current England players ply their trade abroad this reflects an alarming lack of strength in depth.


Alternatively, all those Englishmen currently playing in English clubs benefit from playing alongside some highly skilled international footballers (though some are flattered by the company).


----------



## hpowders

Viva Argentina and Messi! He broke Iran's hearts with a beautiful goal in stoppage time to recover Argentina's honor, even though Iran outplayed Argentina through most of the match.


----------



## Headphone Hermit

MacLeod said:


> Alternatively, all those Englishmen currently playing in English clubs benefit from playing alongside some highly skilled international footballers (though some are flattered by the company).


Well, they DID benefit - they qualified for the finals. I'm happy that we have a world-class striker who almost got us over the line to win our first title for donkeys years, but it IS the case that we don't have a large pool of good players to draw from when picking a national team. I doubt that this is because of the large number of foreign players and I doubt that restricting the numbers of foreign players would lead to an improvement in the quality of english players

WOW! Ghana just taken the lead against Germany!!!!!


----------



## Headphone Hermit

Muntari and Gyan are out-playing the Germans ..... I don't remember either being much good in the cold and damp of an English football season


----------



## Guest

Headphone Hermit said:


> Muntari and Gyan are out-playing the Germans ..... I don't remember either being much good in the cold and damp of an English football season


I remember Muntari doing a pretty good job at Pompey!


----------



## hpowders

Viva Ghana for surprisingly tying Germany, 2-2!


----------



## hpowders

Viva Nigeria as they stop some late bombs by Bosnia and win 1-0, sending Bosnia home.


----------



## Vaneyes

Kieran said:


> Nah! Why would they do that? It's not like England are Germany or Spain. This is probably the weakest England team I've seen in years...


And maybe the weakest World Cup?


----------



## Vaneyes

Wayne Rooney--"Absolutely devastated to be out of the World Cup. Going into each game we had great belief in ourselves but unfortunately it hasn't worked out. Sorry to all the fans that travelled and at home that we haven't done better...gutted!"

Little Joao, age 6, saw it coming.


----------



## Kieran

MacLeod said:


> I remember Muntari doing a pretty good job at Pompey!


Held out until a volcano erupted, is what I read...


----------



## jurianbai

Go go South Korea!


----------



## TurnaboutVox

Here's a reminder of what you've been missing...if only the World's Greatest Football Team (TM) had been in Brazil! (This is from Argentina in 1978, in case you're wondering, and a good introduction to 'disillusionment')


----------



## Wood

TurnaboutVox said:


> Here's a reminder of what you've been missing...if only the World's Greatest Football Team (TM) had been in Brazil! (This is from Argentina in 1978, in case you're wondering, and a good introduction to 'disillusionment')


Scotland in dreamland.






One of those unforgettable world cup goals.

It is disappointing that the UK doesn't put out a team with all of its best players. One can only imagine how much better in the WC we'd have done without this unnecessary provincialism.


----------



## hpowders

Matsps said:


> You weren't impressed with The Netherlands so far? How about Columbia with their two wins? And do not forget about Argentina and Belgium, who both have really strong squads. I'm mostly just wondering why you picked France over any of these teams really?


Yes. The Dutch are fine too. Less impressed with Germany after the shocking 2-2 tie with Ghana.

Argentina, strong? Did you see yesterday's game. Most unimpressive.

I pick France to win the World Cup.

France reminds me of the Montreal Canadiens back in the 1960's-they never stop coming, absolutely flying, and they never stop scoring.


----------



## Wood

I enjoy the world cup by imbibing a drink from the countries playing the current match I'm watching. Didn't think too much of the Beck's last night.

Looking forward to Holland v Chile. Advocaat and Carmenere anybody?


----------



## clara s

hpowders said:


> Yes. The Dutch are fine too. Less impressed with Germany after the shocking 2-2 tie with Ghana.
> 
> Argentina, strong? Did you see yesterday's game. Most unimpressive.
> 
> I pick France to win the World Cup.
> 
> France reminds me of the Montreal Canadiens back in the 1960's-they never stop coming, absolutely flying, and they never stop scoring.


I read somewhere in the internet, that a "magician" predicted that Argentina will win the cup hahaha

now Paul the octapus is gone, the magicians came in the front line


----------



## Headphone Hermit

MacLeod said:


> I remember Muntari doing a pretty good job at Pompey!


correct! "Pretty good job" rather than outplaying world-class players

Currently bored by Belgium-Russia - yawn


----------



## hpowders

Viva Russia for staying with the highly favored Belgians for 87 minutes in their 0-1 loss.

Fans of Belgium could not have been too happy with their team's performance today against a weak Russian team.


----------



## hpowders

clara s said:


> I read somewhere in the internet, that a "magician" predicted that Argentina will win the cup hahaha
> 
> now Paul the octapus is gone, the magicians came in the front line


Paul was amazingly accurate!

For Argentina to win it all, they better pray for a miracle after beating a very weak Iran only 1-0.


----------



## hpowders

Headphone Hermit said:


> correct! "Pretty good job" rather than outplaying world-class players
> 
> Currently bored by Belgium-Russia - yawn


Yes. An extremely dull match. There is only one way for the other two matches to go after this disappointing sleeper.


----------



## aleazk

hpowders said:


> Paul was amazingly accurate!
> 
> For Argentina to win it all, they better pray for a miracle after beating a very weak Iran only 1-0.


In Argentina there's a saying: "vende humo" ("smoke seller"). It's applied to people that overestimate things and try to convince you of that. We have very good players and possibly the best (Messi). But that's not guarantee of anything, since all these players are normally scattered through Europe most of the time and very rarely they play together. Messi by himself or any of the other good players by themselves are not going to win a World Cup.


----------



## Vaneyes

Blame Maradona, too, for this smelly WC.:lol:

http://www.espnfc.us/fifa-world-cup...-says-argentine-football-federation-president


----------



## Vaneyes

jurianbai said:


> Go go South Korea!


Maybe Canada could've done something in this WC.

"Stella! Stella!"


----------



## hpowders

Algeria-South Korea:

All Algeria, first half. South Korea looked impotent, amateurish.

Second half, a different match. One of the most entertaining halves of the World Cup. Thrilling!

Viva both South Korea and Algeria for the terrific second half entertainment, although it was obvious, Algeria had the better team and won 4-2.


----------



## hpowders

aleazk said:


> In Argentina there's a saying: "vende humo" ("smoke seller"). It's applied to people that overestimate things and try to convince you of that. We have very good players and possibly the best (Messi). But that's not guarantee of anything, since all these players are normally scattered through Europe most of the time and very rarely they play together. Messi by himself or any of the other good players by themselves are not going to win a World Cup.


No argument from me about Messi. If it wasn't for Messi, Argentina's last match would have been embarrassingly messy!


----------



## hpowders

Next: USA-Portugal.

Hope it's a good match with no major mistakes.


----------



## Vaneyes

hpowders said:


> Next: USA-Portugal.
> 
> Hope it's a good match with no major mistakes.


The only major mistakes would be not seeing Ms. Shayk watching her mano.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...ited-States-make-history-defeat-Portugal.html

http://www.theguardian.com/football/2014/jun/22/world-cup-2014-portugal-cristiano-ronaldo-start-usa


----------



## hpowders

Vaneyes said:


> The only major mistakes would be not seeing Ms. Shayk watching her mano.
> 
> http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...ited-States-make-history-defeat-Portugal.html
> 
> http://www.theguardian.com/football/2014/jun/22/world-cup-2014-portugal-cristiano-ronaldo-start-usa


Her eyes will probably be buried in her smartphone, but she will say, "Yes! Of course I watched it!! By the way, there's this beautiful full length leather Italian coat..."


----------



## hpowders

Defensive mistake by the US cost a goal, just a few minutes in. Sloppy!


----------



## TurnaboutVox

Wood said:


> It is disappointing that the UK doesn't put out a team with all of its best players. One can only imagine how much better in the WC we'd have done without this unnecessary provincialism.


Scotland isn't a province of the UK, though...



Wood said:


> I enjoy the world cup by imbibing a drink from the countries playing the current match I'm watching. Didn't think too much of the Beck's last night.
> 
> Looking forward to Holland v Chile. Advocaat and Carmenere anybody?


Not in the same glass, no!


----------



## jurianbai

ouuch... wake up and see S Korea going to go home for sure, same fate with Japan....

USA keeper works hard, looking forward for second half vs Portugal.


----------



## Vaneyes

GOAL! GOAL! GOAL!


----------



## Vaneyes




----------



## Vaneyes




----------



## Vaneyes

Buzzer beater! Buzzer beater! Buzzer beater!


----------



## hpowders

About time they get rid of stoppage time. Take football out of the dark ages and do what is done in ice hockey: stop the clock when they need to and play two 45 minute periods without stoppage time.

How about that spectacular first USA goal by Jones and Ronaldo saving his best for last, a magnificent cross to set up the equalizing Portugal goal. 

Anyhow Viva Portugal and the USA for providing the most exciting match of the tournament, as far as I'm concerned. A thrilling 2-2 tie.


----------



## GreenMamba

You can't blame that last goal on stoppage time. Anyway, there' an unwritten (?) rule that you let a team finish an attack in progress, which doesn't happen in other sports. I think that's a good way to do it.


----------



## hpowders

When a player is injured and a stretcher is brought out and play is stopped, why not stop the clock? When a goal is scored, stop the clock. When a team has the lead near the end of the match, and a player goes down to stall, stop the clock.
That way there's no guessing at the end about how much time to add.


----------



## Guest

As (gleefully) told to me by an Italian at a barbecue yesterday :

Q: What's the difference between the England team and a tea bag?
A: A tea bag stays longer in the cup.

Ouch.


----------



## Kieran

hpowders said:


> When a player is injured and a stretcher is brought out and play is stopped, why not stop the clock? When a goal is scored, stop the clock. When a team has the lead near the end of the match, and a player goes down to stall, stop the clock.
> That way there's no guessing at the end about how much time to add.


Exactly. In rugby, the timekeeper is in the stand. The ref doesn't need the job. Stop the clock every time play stops and have a proper accounting of time. And maybe this too: don't let them know how much time is left...


----------



## hpowders

When I first watched European football, I found stoppage time absolutely incredible! How the heck could anyone determine such a thing with any degree of accuracy?

I'm not saying the US team would have beaten Portugal, but I would sure feel better about the tie, if the clock was simply stopped with each delay of the game, rather than a goal being scored at the very end of 5 minutes of inaccurate stoppage time.


----------



## Wood

TurnaboutVox said:


> Scotland isn't a province of the UK, though...


We'll find out on SEP 18. 

I'm not hopeful.

Re a UK team, if the English were serious about the WC, they would override the objections of the Celtic regions and insist on a national team. The provincialism I cannot comprehend is that of the English.


----------



## Wood

hpowders said:


> When I first watched European football, I found stoppage time absolutely incredible! How the heck could anyone determine such a thing with any degree of accuracy?
> 
> I'm not saying the US team would have beaten Portugal, but I would sure feel better about the tie, if the clock was simply stopped with each delay of the game, rather than a goal being scored at the very end of 5 minutes of inaccurate stoppage time.


In the good old days, the referee would press the teet on his stopwatch every time there was a hold up for substitutions, time-wasting etc. The commentator would announce when the 45 minutes were up, with just the remaining time for stoppages (unknown to himself, the players and the viewers).

Finally, the referee would blow for time. It seemed to work well. I don't know why they changed it.


----------



## TxllxT

Still my craziest favourite. News from today: President Putin had his telly switched off on sunday.


----------



## Wood

I wanted to support the Dutch but their outrageous diving today made me switch off during the 2nd half.

Very disappointing, I hope they are knocked out soon.


----------



## Kieran

Is it just me, or is this a really lousy Brazil team? I mean, long ball play - against Cameroon?


----------



## Vaneyes

I like the way it is. Let the clock run. Stop, start, stop, start, is harder on the players. Also, the game would quickly proceed to 3 plus hours.

North American professional team sports are on their way to ruin with all the stoppages of play. Challenges make me furious. My viewing time has decreased dramatically...which my wife doesn't mind too much.


----------



## Vaneyes

Mexico captain says, "We can beat anybody." Next up, Netherlands.


----------



## Guest

Wood said:


> I wanted to support the Dutch but their outrageous diving today made me switch off during the 2nd half.
> 
> Very disappointing, I hope they are knocked out soon.


Seconded! [Down with the Cloggies! Booh!]


----------



## Piwikiwi

TalkingHead said:


> Seconded! [Down with the Cloggies! Booh!]











So much jealousy I love it


----------



## GreenMamba

Er, did Luis Suarez just bite a guy?


----------



## kv466

You know what's funny, Van, I've been a die hard fan of Holland since my first Cup in '82 but after seeing this Mexican team I wouldn't be surprised. Also, USA can totally defeat Germany. I can't believe Beasley didn't foul Ronaldo having so much experience; we should have won that game.


----------



## hpowders

Viva Uruguay for eliminating Italy. The Italians did it to themselves, losing two key players.

Luis Suárez almost bit off more than he could chew there for a moment.

Time to get rid of the disgraceful fudge factor called "added time". Supposed to be 5 minutes at the end of this match; lasted almost 6. Uruguay's coach was begging the referee to blow the whistle already! Match over!


----------



## kv466

hpowders said:


> Viva Uruguay for eliminating Italy. The Italians did it to themselves, losing two key players.
> 
> Luis Suárez almost bit off more than he could chew there for a moment.
> 
> Time to get rid of the disgraceful fudge factor called "added time". Supposed to be 5 minutes at the end of this match; lasted almost 6. Uruguay's coach was begging the referee to blow the whistle already! Match over!


Mientras me que da gusto ver a otro equipo de los nuestros avanzar, los Uruguayos han demostrado ser demasiadamente sucios y ese salvaje canibal debe ser eliminado inmediatamente!!


----------



## Kieran

They'd wanna bang Suarez into a cage and feed him raw meat, the feller's a loon...


----------



## Guest

Biting is something I have to tell my young children not to do. The fact that a grown man has repeatedly done this is ridiculous in the absurd.

I am enjoying the World Cup, but I am reminded every 4 years of the things that frustrate me so about soccer. These are all a bunch of drama queens - flopping on the ground, clutching their faces in agony if someone so much as breathes on them heavily. You would think they were dying a horrible death, only to pop up 5 seconds later if they don't get a call, as if nothing had happened. I suspect a lot of this can be to run out the clock.

And I still think the offsides penalty is a flawed one.


----------



## Matsps

DrMike said:


> And I still think the offsides penalty is a flawed one.


The game doesn't play as nicely without the offside rule. It just means you can leave a striker up near the opposition goal and play long balls to him all the time. Pretty boring.


----------



## Headphone Hermit

DrMike said:


> Biting is something I have to tell my young children not to do. The fact that a grown man has repeatedly done this is ridiculous in the absurd.


Yes, very sad. I agree with Ian Wright's comments on ITV after the game - I feel sorry for the guy in that he clearly has very serious issues that he needs to get treatment for. IW got a fair amount of flak for saying this (and so will I, probably) but the guy needs help and treatment (as well as a lengthy ban)


----------



## hpowders

Greece up by 1-0 over Ivory Coast. If result holds, Greece advances.


----------



## hpowders

kv466 said:


> Mientras me que da gusto ver a otro equipo de los nuestros avanzar, los Uruguayos han demostrado ser demasiadamente sucios y ese salvaje canibal debe ser eliminado inmediatamente!!


 Luis Suárez should be banned from professional football. Three times a biter!!!

A great player, but unfortunately a dirty player; very, very, dirty!!

He embarrassed the fine effort by Uruguay. This will be a stain talked about forever!

El partido debe ser investigado y Luis Suárez debería ser prohibido!


----------



## hpowders

Kieran said:


> They'd wanna bang Suarez into a cage and feed him raw meat, the feller's a loon...


He will be banned, or as they say in Germany, bahned!

If you do the noble thing and ban yourself, then you have reached the summited:

You are autobahned.


----------



## hpowders

Greece-Ivory Coast.

The most exciting match of the tournament so far!

Viva Greece! They played their hearts out with the inspired defense they've shown throughout the tournament, but all of a sudden their offense found religion, missing two goals at the crossbar and winning the game in thrilling fashion by penalty kick.

Congratulations, Greece for beating Ivory Coast 2-1 and advancing!!!

A terrific match!!!


----------



## jurianbai

I hate World cup 2014.


----------



## Guest

I hate matches decided by a penalty kick. I realize that a penalty kick isn't a guaranteed goal, but it is pretty damn close. Lousy way to do it.


----------



## Vaneyes

Drama queens? You haven't seen my wife's hairstylist. Amateurs all, in comparison.


----------



## GreenMamba

DrMike said:


> I hate matches decided by a penalty kick. I realize that a penalty kick isn't a guaranteed goal, but it is pretty damn close. Lousy way to do it.


You mean the Greece game or the tiebreak penalty that might occur in the knockout stage?

I have no issues with the Greece penalty. It's unfortunate, but you can't let defenders hack their opponents. Otherwise, no one would ever score.


----------



## Guest

hpowders said:


> He will be banned, or as we say in Germany, bahned!


Doesn't seem quite fitting. There should be a more serious punishment for so flagrant and malicious a thing. I think they should disqualify the team. Obviously whatever the current level of punishment is for such actions isn't enough to encourage this guy not to bite (sad that it even needs to be said that you should not bite someone). But put the pressure on the whole team - keep this guy under control, or it could get you disqualified.

I think, at the bare minimum, Italy deserves one more penalty kick for the bite.

But it wouldn't be the first thing I find absurd about FIFA.


----------



## Guest

Vaneyes said:


> Drama queens? You haven't seen my wife's hairstylist. Amateurs all, in comparison.


Not unless she spends more time rolling on the floor, holding her face, than she spends styling your wife's hair.

So is the flopping and rolling around part of practice, or are they just supposed to work on their acting skills in their spare time?


----------



## hpowders

jurianbai said:


> *I hate World cup 2014.[*/QUOTE]
> 
> So why are you posting here? Why don't you post something in "atonal music"?


----------



## hpowders

DrMike said:


> Doesn't seem quite fitting. There should be a more serious punishment for so flagrant and malicious a thing. I think they should disqualify the team. Obviously whatever the current level of punishment is for such actions isn't enough to encourage this guy not to bite (sad that it even needs to be said that you should not bite someone). But put the pressure on the whole team - keep this guy under control, or it could get you disqualified.
> 
> I think, at the bare minimum, Italy deserves one more penalty kick for the bite.
> 
> But it wouldn't be the first thing I find absurd about FIFA.


Enjoyed your vital, biting prose.


----------



## hpowders

Let's not think that Greece won easily with the penalty kick. Imagine. You are an underdog team. Nobody expects you to advance and all of a sudden the pressure of an entire country rests on your leg's accuracy, one chance to advance.
Where I come from, that's extraordinary pressure and many a penalty kick has been missed because of it.

So kudos to the great Greek player who took the shot, hit it true, right into the net, so an entire country could be out dancing and singing tonight!!!

I* say BRAVO and PARTY HARD, GREECE!!*

*VERY WELL DONE. LADS!!!*


----------



## jurianbai

hpowders said:


> So why are you posting here? Why don't you post something in "atonal music"?


lol... all my mainstream favorites are gone...


----------



## hpowders

jurianbai said:


> lol... all my mainstream favorites are gone...


It's either Schönberg or World Cup for you!

I thought so. Welcome to the World Cup thread. :lol:


----------



## Guest

GreenMamba said:


> You mean the Greece game or the tiebreak penalty that might occur in the knockout stage?
> 
> I have no issues with the Greece penalty. It's unfortunate, but you can't let defenders hack their opponents. Otherwise, no one would ever score.


No hacking. Not a pen IMO.


----------



## Kieran

This is the World Cup of the unexpected. The team that's delighted me most is Costa Rica - no bother to them to qualify from their group, knocking out two European heavyweight teams in the process. Now they face Greece, who I'm glad are having a run. 

European teams are finding the South Americans difficult to handle. There's been a few upsets - but I don't think it's a great World Cup yet because we haven't seen any actually great team, in my opinion. We'll see how the Dutch and Germans progress, and if Brazil improve, but so far, I think the standard has been less interesting than the activity itself...


----------



## hpowders

Yes. Unexpected is good. Who wants to see the same teams dominate?


----------



## hpowders

By the way, the referee should be banned along with Suárez. Not seeing the bite is one thing, but he refused to even look at the victim's shoulder for bite marks!

FIFA will be under the microscope. Will they do the right thing and ban this guy for at least two years or will he get special treatment because he is a superstar?


----------



## Guest

I don't know how strict FIFA is. But for something like this, and him being a repeat offender, they should give him a punishment with some teeth. Pun intended. Maybe they could force him to play with a mask over his face like Hannibal Lecter in Silence of the Lambs, as well as expel him from the rest of the World Cup.


----------



## Guest

hpowders said:


> Yes. Unexpected is good. Who wants to see the same teams dominate?


Well, if you did a bracket and put some money on it, then unexpected tends to screw you over.


----------



## Vaneyes

Sorry, I've gotta come down on the side of opposing cannibalism.


----------



## Vaneyes

hpowders said:


> By the way, the referee should be banned along with Suárez. Not seeing the bite is one thing, but he refused to even look at the victim's shoulder for bite marks!
> 
> FIFA will be under the microscope. Will they do the right thing and ban this guy for at least two years or will he get special treatment because he is a superstar?


I can only suppose that FIFA and the ref are insistent that the footballer's wife, partner, or gf did that to him.


----------



## elgar's ghost

I suppose as Luis Suarez has teeth to rival Bugs Bunny then he probably thinks he may as well use them.

But seriously...what an objectionable little turd he is at times.


----------



## hpowders

Vaneyes said:


> I can only suppose that FIFA and the ref are insistent that the footballer's wife, partner, or gf did that to him.


They really need to make rules with some teeth in them.


----------



## hpowders

DrMike said:


> I don't know how strict FIFA is. But for something like this, and him being a repeat offender, they should give him a punishment with some teeth. Pun intended. Maybe they could force him to play with a mask over his face like Hannibal Lecter in Silence of the Lambs, as well as expel him from the rest of the World Cup.
> 
> View attachment 45250


Expelling from the rest of the World Cup isn't that much. He needs to be suspended for 2 years without pay from Liverpool. That should help clean up his act.


----------



## hpowders

DrMike said:


> Well, if you did a bracket and put some money on it, then unexpected tends to screw you over.


Well, it's always nice to see an underdog make the final 16, like Greece did. England, out. Italy, out. Spain, out. I'm sure most people expected all of them to make the final 16.

In a few days it starts getting very interesting. Can't wait!


----------



## Headphone Hermit

hpowders said:


> Expelling from the rest of the World Cup isn't that much. He needs to be suspended for 2 years without pay from Liverpool. That should help clean up his act.


He wasn't playing for Liverpool - why should we be punished as well?


----------



## Vaneyes

A reenactment of WW2 tomorrow.


----------



## Vaneyes

Headphone Hermit said:


> He wasn't playing for Liverpool - why should we be punished as well?


Okay, Liverpool can play him without paying him.


----------



## Headphone Hermit

Does that mean that tomorrow they will turn up after it has started - sorry, couldn't resist!


----------



## Vaneyes

Headphone Hermit said:


> Does that mean that tomorrow they will turn up after it has started - sorry, couldn't resist!


I think it had something to do with fighting in two theatres.


----------



## hpowders

Headphone Hermit said:


> He wasn't playing for Liverpool - why should we be punished as well?


How else is one supposed to hurt him?


----------



## Guest

Headphone Hermit said:


> He wasn't playing for Liverpool - why should we be punished as well?


For having a biter on your team.


----------



## Vaneyes

hpowders said:


> How else is one supposed to hurt him?


"Break his knees, for starters."


----------



## hpowders

Gee, I wonder who's living in Liverpool? "Can't buy me love!!"


----------



## hpowders

Vaneyes said:


> "Break his knees, for starters."


Nah! 10 minutes in the agua caliente and he's as good as new.


----------



## hpowders

Hit him where it hurts!!

Hey Luis!! No Liverpool for you!! No soup either!!


----------



## Headphone Hermit

DrMike said:


> For having a biter on your team.


there are alternatives available









:lol:


----------



## Vaneyes

Headphone Hermit said:


> there are alternatives available
> 
> View attachment 45293
> 
> 
> :lol:


Hannibal mask is a safer bet...but it's moot. He'll be sittin' for a while.


----------



## hpowders

Headphone Hermit said:


> *there are alternatives available
> *
> View attachment 45293
> 
> 
> :lol:


Sure. Rabies shots for all Liverpool opponents.


----------



## hpowders

Headphone Hermit said:


> there are alternatives available
> 
> View attachment 45293
> 
> 
> :lol:


Would you trust this man doting upon your doter? Your one and only doter?


----------



## hpowders

Vaneyes said:


> Hannibal mask is a safer bet...but it's moot. He'll be sittin' for a while.


If he doesn't, the fix is in.


----------



## Vaneyes

hpowders said:


> If he doesn't, the fix is in.


I know if I had a dog, it would want to bite that footballer.


----------



## hpowders

Let's see how long it takes for "justice". FIFA is under pressure to do something, so I expect a verdict by Friday, if not sooner.


----------



## hpowders

The Ref should be fined or suspended too. He wouldn't even look at the fresh bite marks.

Perhaps, he was just "squeamish".


----------



## aleazk

Uruguay's Mujica says he "didn't see any bite"... of course, in his well famous austerity he only followed the game on the radio, he doesn't have a tv!


----------



## Guest

BBC Breakfast's "sports" bulletin spent so long on Suarez, they forgot to tell us the actual results of the night's matches!

Of course, whilst biting is unacceptable, I wonder if we make a disproportionate fuss, given that after every match, players come of the pitch with worse injuries than Chiellini suffered?


----------



## Wood

MacLeod said:


> BBC Breakfast's "sports" bulletin spent so long on Suarez, they forgot to tell us the actual results of the night's matches!
> 
> Of course, whilst biting is unacceptable, I wonder if we make a disproportionate fuss, given that after every match, players come of the pitch with worse injuries than Chiellini suffered?


Reminds me of Jack Charlton in his pundit days responding to a player who had spat at another. He was beside himself with rage, said it was the worse thing a player could do, and if it had have happened to him, he'd have given the perp a beating.


----------



## Kieran

Suarez should find out his fate today. What a pity the Italian didn't shrug in the Italian way, just at the crucual moment, and knock the cannibals teeth out. They could be held in a clear plastic evidence bag, tagged, and brought out when required for the judge to weigh them. Hopefully the next time he tries it, this is what he gets. Better than a six month ban, I reckons...


----------



## elgar's ghost

hpowders said:


> Well, it's always nice to see an underdog make the final 16, like Greece did. England, out. Italy, out. Spain, out. I'm sure most people expected all of them to make the final 16


Absolutely correct apart from the England bit.


----------



## Kieran

If England had made the last 16, they'd be as big an underdog as Greece. England's football, at international level, has been an unfathomable mystery for almost fifty years. I remember when their clubs ruled Europe - and the national team foundered. Now, their club teams rely on foreign stars, and the international team is worse than Costa Rica.

It's not a situation I see changing much over the next fifty years, unless some inspiration is found somewhere...


----------



## Vaneyes

"Biter" out of harm's way for 4 months.

http://www.espnfc.com/fifa-world-cup/story/1913701/luis-suarez-banned-for-four-months


----------



## hpowders

Vaneyes said:


> "Biter" out of harm's way for 4 months.
> 
> http://www.espnfc.com/fifa-world-cup/story/1913701/luis-suarez-banned-for-four-months


If that's true, the fix is in. A simple slap on the wrist.


----------



## hpowders

USA holding their own against Germany, despite one clown of a referee, who looks like an extra player for Germany, from his inept missed calls and by blocking out an American player near the German goal.


----------



## Headphone Hermit

hpowders said:


> USA holding their own against Germany, despite one clown of a referee, who looks like an extra player for Germany, from his inept missed calls and by blocking out an American player near the German goal.


always good to see a dispassionate report


----------



## Wood

Vaneyes said:


> "Biter" out of harm's way for 4 months.
> 
> http://www.espnfc.com/fifa-world-cup/story/1913701/luis-suarez-banned-for-four-months


'FIFA have taken the bite out of Uruguay's attack.'


----------



## Headphone Hermit

BTW - wonder why Podolski, Boateng and Oezil weren't singing along to the German national anthem (although Klinsmann was singing the American one - or at least having a go at doing so!) :devil:


----------



## hpowders

Terrific goal by Thomas Müller. Germany 1-0.


----------



## hpowders

Headphone Hermit said:


> always good to see a dispassionate report


Always glad to oblige. However the ref could be better.

I always get a _kick_ out of your posts.


----------



## hpowders

Headphone Hermit said:


> BTW - wonder why Podolski, Boateng and Oezil weren't singing along to the German national anthem (although *Klinsmann* was singing the American one - or at least having a go at doing so!) :devil:


The American National Anthem should be changed to "Walk like a Mann; Talk like a Mann, mein Sohn..."


----------



## SiegendesLicht

Headphone Hermit said:


> BTW - wonder why Podolski, Boateng and Oezil weren't singing along to the German national anthem (although Klinsmann was singing the American one - or at least having a go at doing so!) :devil:


Maybe they are such bad singers they did not want to disrupt the chorus of native Germans.


----------



## hpowders

SiegendesLicht said:


> Maybe they are such bad singers they did not want to disrupt the chorus of native Germans.


Autsch!! :lol:


----------



## Headphone Hermit

hpowders said:


> Always glad to oblige. However the ref could be better.
> 
> I always get a _kick_ out of your posts.


aye, but they lack the _bite_ of Suarez' contributions :lol:


----------



## hpowders

Headphone Hermit said:


> aye, but they lack the _bite_ of Suarez' contributions :lol:


The last time I experienced the equivalent of Luis Suárez' bite, it was from some Sir Walter Raleigh pipe tobacco.


----------



## Headphone Hermit

Americans have done really well - a few seconds to go ..... they deserve to go through to the next stage


----------



## hpowders

Thanks to Ronaldo, the USA advances. The Portugal-Ghana game was fantastic. As dull as Germany-USA was, the other game was just the opposite. Ronaldo was sensational, flying down the field so many times.


----------



## SiegendesLicht

Well, the hopes of hearing a certain Joseph Haydn tune at the final game have just grown somewhat.


----------



## hpowders

Perhaps, but it's a long way to Tipperary.


----------



## hpowders

Headphone Hermit said:


> Americans have done really well - a few seconds to go ..... they deserve to go through to the next stage


I consider this comment to be on-side.


----------



## jurianbai

Ghana's goalkeeper should granted USA green card soon... 

Portugal...


----------



## hpowders

Portugal peaked too late.


----------



## TurnaboutVox

Yes, hp, congratulations on the USA not getting too badly beaten by the Deutschlanders...


----------



## Headphone Hermit

TurnaboutVox said:


> Yes, hp, congratulations on the USA not getting too badly beaten by the Deutschlanders...


Aye! If only we could aspire to the day when 'not getting too badly beaten' is greeted with congratulations


----------



## TurnaboutVox

As a Scot I'll take 'not getting too badly beaten' every time, with an ironic cheer and a pint of 'heavy'!


----------



## hpowders

TurnaboutVox said:


> Yes, hp, congratulations on the USA not getting too badly beaten by the Deutschlanders...


Germany had nothing to play for.


----------



## hpowders

TurnaboutVox said:


> Yes, hp, congratulations on the USA not getting too badly beaten by the Deutschlanders...


And YOUR team is ummmm.....where???? :lol::lol:


----------



## Vaneyes

Am I wrong to think that the '14 WC champeen will come from the winner of Argentina vs Switzerland (July 1)?

http://www.espnfc.us/fifa-world-cup/4/scores?season=2014


----------



## hpowders

If Portugal played their earlier matches like they did today, they would be serious contenders to take it all. But alas, not!


----------



## hpowders

Vaneyes said:


> Am I wrong to think that the '14 WC champeen will come from the winner of Argentina vs Switzerland (July 1)?
> 
> http://www.espnfc.us/fifa-world-cup/4/scores?season=2014


Probably. I'm going with France. They are going with a new goalie, Alfred Dreyfus.


----------



## Vaneyes

hpowders said:


> Probably. I'm going with France. Their going with a new goalie, Alfred Dreyfus.


Okay, we're now getting more conviction in this thread.


----------



## hpowders

Vaneyes said:


> Okay, we're now getting more conviction in this thread.


There's a rumor going around that goalie Dreyfus insists on dining on swordfish fillet before every match he plays.


----------



## TurnaboutVox

hpowders said:


> And YOUR team is ummmm.....where???? :lol::lol:


Scotland? Why, they're in Scotland, of course. To the right of Canada, a bit.


----------



## hpowders

Hard to get through Friday without any World Cup matches.


----------



## Guest

Brazil vs Chile today - should be a good one. Gotta to pop out to get the beer and pizzas in.


----------



## Headphone Hermit

hpowders said:


> Hard to get through Friday without any World Cup matches.


Agreed!

Tour de France starts next week - I might need two televisions in the living room for a while. Mrs Hermit will LOVE it!


----------



## hpowders

Can't wait for this weekend's matches.

You know where to find me: at the intersection of television street and couch lane.


----------



## GreenMamba

All South America today. Strange how that happens.


----------



## hpowders

Regarding Brazil-Chile:

First half was refreshingly clean with hardly a stoppage for fouls.

Second half just the opposite. Sloppy. The stars were the goalkeepers.


----------



## Vaneyes

Near its end, Team of Salsa Armada is firing everything at the heroic Chilean goalkeeper. Chile has better wine, so Go Chile!


----------



## TurnaboutVox

I wondered what American (and other) TC'ers thought of this from today's Guardian. I could hardly help noticing how interested some of our north American members seem to be in the football World Cup. And of course the US team has done so well thus far...



> 'The growing popularity of soccer in the States is a sign of moral decay, according to the right-wing columnist Ann Coulter. She claims the World Cup is being pushed by the same people who want north Americans to like Hilary Clinton. The rising appeal, she says, is due to an influx of Hispanics resulting from Teddy Kennedy's immigration law. "I promise you, no American whose great grandfather was born here is watching soccer. One can only hope that, in addition to learning English, these new Americans will drop their soccer fetish with time" proclaims [Coulter].'


----------



## Vaneyes

hpowders said:


> There's a rumor going around that goalie Dreyfus insists on dining on swordfish fillet before every match he plays.


Just the facts, please. :lol:


----------



## Vaneyes

TurnaboutVox said:


> I wondered what American (and other) TC'ers thought of this from today's Guardian. I could hardly help noticing how *interested some of our North American members* seem to be in the football World Cup. And of course the US team has done so well thus far...


Some of us are just trying to be neighborly.


----------



## hpowders

Ann Coulter needs to take a laxative; a good strong laxative. Everything's a conspiracy theory.
I like soccer. Nobody told me to watch it or like it. I'm born in the USA and can think for myself, thank you very much!

Ann Coulter needs to chill out, relax and stop being so angry at everything she doesn't like. I believe the word is "tolerance". And perhaps cut her hair. She's no longer an 18 year old teeny bopper.


----------



## Vaneyes

hpowders said:


> Hard to get through Friday without any World Cup matches.


Golf, rumor, pvr, take precedence for me.


----------



## hpowders

Chile-Brazil: Extra time. You can see the tension out there. So much pressure on Brazil.


----------



## Guest

Ramires does a Rooney...Brazil distinctly uninspiring...more sanddance than samba!


----------



## Vaneyes

*"Goalpost, goalpost, goalpost!*"


----------



## hpowders

What a mesmerizing shootout. High drama! A shame to see Chile exit like that. They played their hearts out in this tournament. A couple of inches lower for Chile on the great shot in the last minute of extra time, and it would have been a different story.


----------



## Kieran

Yeah, a pity for Chile. I think it's a poor Brazil team, but they were marginally better tonight - and got lucky...


----------



## EricABQ

In about an hour I'll be rooting on my neighbors to the south. When the World Cup rolls around I always find myself pulling for Mexico, and maybe today is the day they pull off a big upset.


----------



## hpowders

Looking forward to a lot of goals scored by Netherlands today!


----------



## jurianbai

Netherland is overwhelmed! Not going to be easy match!


----------



## Kieran

Yeah, looks like a day for beach there - not football. They took a cooling break, and all. The Dutch look sluggish. Mexico have been sharp. The shadow lengthens across the pitch - but too slowly for The Netherlands?


----------



## hpowders

GOAL, MEXICO!!! A big-time goal at a big-time moment!!!!*

But the curse continues......


----------



## EricABQ

It feels like a Dutch goal is inevitable unless Mexico can hold possession better. Seems like this entire half has been played in front of Mexico's goal.


----------



## Vaneyes

Viva tacos, burritos, enchiladas, chile relleno, tostadas! 81:53.

Edit: Eric wins the Mexico football.


----------



## Guest

Stunning strike from Sneijder!


----------



## EricABQ

What a letdown.


----------



## hpowders

Mexico's still living the curse. Up 1-0 late in the match. Losing the game 1-2 to the Netherlands.


----------



## Guest

Not the most obvious of penalties, but given the obvious ones not given earlier, some degree of justice is served.


----------



## Vaneyes

Fresh crow with a side of refried beans is being prepared for Hernandez.:lol:


----------



## hpowders

Will Mexico EVER advance from the round of 16????????


----------



## GreenMamba

I'm just bothered that I was Robben who drew the penalty, and he of course made a meal of it.


----------



## Piwikiwi

Fudge yes!!!!!!!


----------



## Guest

I can't bear his diving either, but given that defences have no scruples about covert fouling (how often is shirt-pulling and back-nudging completely ignored) its hardly surprising that canny attackers try to take charge of when the fouling will be to their advantage.


----------



## EricABQ

I post this in solidarity with my fellow North Americans:


----------



## TxllxT




----------



## Wood

TxllxT said:


>


That is so funny, but why is Belgium shown below Poland, and where is that great Dutch colony Indonesia?


----------



## TxllxT

Wood said:


> That is so funny, but why is Belgium shown below Poland, and where is that great Dutch colony Indonesia?


Belgium = Spare-Dutch (the Flemish) / Spare-French (the Walloons)
Indonesia = V.O.C. (Dutch East India Company, the world's 1st multinational)


----------



## SiegendesLicht

Am I the only one who is watching Germany-Algeria? 

The commentators that accompany the broadcast, are both unashamedly pro-German.


----------



## GreenMamba

Both matches today were good, both ended as expected.

I watch on Univision while at work. They didn't sound pro-German (I don't habla Espanol) but they were having fun with Schweinsteiger.


----------



## hpowders

Who are the worst choral singers in human history?

Any team at the World Cup singing their national anthem.

Not for the squeamish!!!


----------



## Vaneyes

*Biter* says he won't bite again. Should we believe him? 

http://www.espnfc.us/uruguay/story/...ts-biteapologises-to-italys-giorgio-chiellini


----------



## SiegendesLicht

GreenMamba said:


> Both matches today were good, both ended as expected.
> 
> I watch on Univision while at work. They didn't sound pro-German (I don't habla Espanol) but they were having fun with Schweinsteiger.


The commentators were not the same ones you listened to.


----------



## Headphone Hermit

hpowders said:


> Who are the worst choral singers in human history?
> 
> Any team at the World Cup singing their national anthem.
> 
> Not for the squeamish!!!


I thought the Chilean team and fans belted out their anthem in a stirring manner, even though Fifa have put a time limit of the length of anthems

http://www.buzzfeed.com/mrloganrhoades/chile-fans-finish-singing-their-national-anthem-after-fifa-c

Still can't beat the French for having the best national anthem (criteria = any anthem arranged by Berlioz automatically gets 1st place :lol


----------



## hpowders

Headphone Hermit said:


> I thought the Chilean team and fans belted out their anthem in a stirring manner, even though Fifa have put a time limit of the length of anthems
> 
> http://www.buzzfeed.com/mrloganrhoades/chile-fans-finish-singing-their-national-anthem-after-fifa-c
> 
> Still can't beat the French for having the best national anthem (criteria = any anthem arranged by Berlioz automatically gets 1st place :lol


If you concentrate just on the teams themselves, like I said, not for the squeamish.

Some of them sing like they are about to attend their own funerals and perhaps they were right.


----------



## Headphone Hermit

hpowders said:


> If you concentrate just on the teams themselves, like I said, not for the squeamish.
> 
> Some of them sing like they are about to attend their own funerals and perhaps they were right.


hang on ..... I can just sense this 'evidence' being used to justify the classical music = intelligence argument :devil: If only footballers were intelligent enough to like proper music, then they would sing more enthusiastically :lol:


----------



## Vaneyes

Argentina/Switzerland. I repeat, the '14 WC king likely comes from this game. As long as biters and FIFA don't get in the way.


----------



## Vaneyes

"Malbec for everyone!"


----------



## hpowders

Okay Switzerland you had your chance. Now get back there and fix my Rolex Submariner.


----------



## hpowders

Headphone Hermit said:


> hang on ..... I can just sense this 'evidence' being used to justify the classical music = intelligence argument :devil: If only footballers were intelligent enough to like proper music, then they would sing more enthusiastically :lol:


Maybe. Quien sabe?


----------



## hpowders

Viva Argentina! Viva las Pampas!!!


----------



## EricABQ

I must be a convert to the sport............I took an hour of vacation time to come home early and watch the game.

USA! USA! USA!

Waffles suck!!*



*actually, I love waffles.


----------



## hpowders

Go USA!


----------



## Headphone Hermit

hpowders said:


> Who are the worst choral singers in human history?
> 
> Any team at the World Cup singing their national anthem.
> 
> Not for the squeamish!!!


PLEASE FORGIVE ME - I guess you are blissfully unaware of the phenomenon (now, thankfully, extinct) of the World Cup Team Song .... a plague from the 1970s and 1980s of which one of the most noxious was this one 



 .... We're On Our Way!

Not for the squeamish!


----------



## jurianbai

Hey tonight games were highly entertaining. Go Klinsmann, lol, he is the only one I known from both teams.


----------



## EricABQ

Another scoreless first half.

That usually favors the favorite it seems.


----------



## Vaneyes

Headphone Hermit said:


> PLEASE FORGIVE ME - I guess you are blissfully unaware of the phenomenon (now, thankfully, extinct) of the World Cup Team Song .... a plague from the 1970s and 1980s of which one of the most noxious was this one
> 
> 
> 
> .... We're On Our Way!
> 
> Not for the squeamish!


Can't help but think the inspiring "Ain't No Stoppin' Us Now" would be a good candidate, with slight lyric modification.


----------



## Vaneyes

EricABQ said:


> Another scoreless first half.
> 
> That usually favors the favorite it seems.


"Who's the favorite in this Uncle Sam & Waffle game?"


----------



## hpowders

Vaneyes said:


> "Who's the favorite in this Uncle Sam & Waffle game?"


Belgium in this match.

Looking more and more like Bratwurst mit sauerkraut at the end of the road.


----------



## EricABQ

So far in the 2nd half too much time is being spent in the US side of the field. They are bound to give up a goal if that keeps up.


----------



## Vaneyes

Both teams shall continue to deliberate...reminiscent of Monty Python's philosopher football match.


----------



## EricABQ

How much can we ask of Tim Howard?


----------



## hpowders

More than he's got.


----------



## EricABQ

Howard is the hardest working man in sports today.


----------



## Vaneyes

"Well done. Waffles for everyone!"


----------



## Vaneyes

Mercy ending, please.


----------



## EricABQ

Belgium was clearly the better team today. Howard single handedly kept the US in the game for as long as he could.


----------



## hpowders

2-1. It ain't over yet!


----------



## Vaneyes

Uh, hold the phone.


----------



## hpowders

No. It's over. The USA woke up in extra time. Too little. Too late. I'll be watching for their plane.


----------



## hpowders

Now that my team is out of the World Cup, I need something to fill up the time.

Is classical music any good? As good as Madonna or Taylor Swift or Barry Manilow?


----------



## EricABQ

It was fun getting behind team USA. good run, but they just didn't have the firepower to get it done. 

Now I guess I will root for Costa Rica since they are geographically closest to me.


----------



## hpowders

Looks more and more like Germany-Argentina.

Magnums of wine were invented for just such a moment.

hpowders: forget.....forget....forget.....


----------



## clara s

toccata and fugue will do nicely

its the proper music on the way home 

many europeans, we know the feeling hahaha


----------



## clara s

hpowders said:


> Looks more and more like Germany-Argentina.
> 
> Magnums of wine were invented for just such a moment.
> 
> hpowders: forget.....forget....forget.....


do not forget...

the magician has predicted... Argentina


----------



## hpowders

clara s said:


> toccata and fugue will do nicely
> 
> its the proper music on the way home
> 
> many europeans, we know the feeling hahaha


Yeah, thanks. Couldn't make it to the final 8. I will set my alarm clock for 4 years from now.


----------



## hpowders

clara s said:


> do not forget...
> 
> the magician has predicted... Argentina


Messi is looking awesome! I wouldn't doubt it!


----------



## clara s

hpowders said:


> Yeah, thanks. Couldn't make it to the final 8. I will set my alarm clock for 4 years from now.


why 4 years sleep? will you miss the pre-qualification games?

they are fun hahaha


----------



## hpowders

clara s said:


> why 4 years sleep? will you miss the pre-qualification games?
> 
> they are fun hahaha


World Cup? What World Cup? One bottle gone....


----------



## EricABQ

hpowders said:


> Looks more and more like Germany-Argentina.
> 
> Magnums of wine were invented for just such a moment.
> 
> hpowders: forget.....forget....forget.....


I don't know about that.

If I had to bet money, I may go against both of those teams in the next round.


----------



## clara s

one of the best world cups of all seasons, the commentators say 

and USA-Belgium quite a match

well, time to sleep


----------



## hpowders

EricABQ said:


> I don't know about that.
> 
> If I had to bet money, I may go against both of those teams in the next round.


You think France will beat Germany?


----------



## Bulldog

hpowders said:


> Now that my team is out of the World Cup, I need something to fill up the time.


There's always tennis where "extra minutes" don't apply. Regardless, I'm disappointed in the U.S. performance - not aggressive enough.


----------



## Vaneyes

hpowders said:


> Now that my team is out of the World Cup, I need something to fill up the time.
> 
> Is classical music any good? As good as Madonna or Taylor Swift or Barry Manilow?


You can try Michael Bolton's arias.


----------



## hpowders

Vaneyes said:


> You can try Michael Bolton's arias.


His grandfather officer Joe Bolton used to have a Three Stooges TV program back in the 1960's, or so I am told by historians of ancient American history.


----------



## EricABQ

hpowders said:


> You think France will beat Germany?


Truthfully, I have no idea. But, I'm assuming that France will be the underdog so I'd take my chances on the bigger payoff.


----------



## Vaneyes

hpowders said:


> You think France will beat Germany?


Germany's been pretty good in WWII replays.


----------



## Vaneyes

hpowders said:


> His grandfather officer Joe Bolton used to have a Three Stooges TV program back in the 1960's, or so I am told by historians of ancient American history.


R.I.P. Joe.


----------



## hpowders

Vaneyes said:


> R.I.P. Joe.


Those were the days!!! Classical music and the Three Stooges make hpowders one happy dude. I have "others" when I want to hear Nessun Dorma. Paging Franco Corelli!Jussi Björling!!!


----------



## Vaneyes

For those interested, some USA!USA! goalkeeper Howard background info. My hat's off to his heroic play.:tiphat:

http://www.cnn.com/2014/07/01/sport/football/tim-howard-spotlight/index.html?hpt=hp_t1


----------



## aleazk

Buenos Aires' central avenue during yesterday's game...










lol, people is really obsessed with this game around here.


----------



## PabloElFlamenco

Ok, I'm not in the habit of discussing football/soccer, and highly incompetent. But I am Belgian, and have lived in, and respect, the USA. During the week, lodging in the Netherlands, I don't have TV, and I didn't feel like walking to town for a public café with TV for an event which ended close to 1 AM (work in the morning...), so for the first time in my life I spent some 3 hours listening to football/soccer on the radio. Belgian (Flemish) radio. My bare feet firmly planted on the wooden floor and, between my feet, my mobile phone awaiting my press of the button for SMS'ing the word "Tjak" to my son, in Belgium. I had to wait a loooong time. And then we started SMS'ing, back and forth. At one point, we switched from Flemish to English. Late in the second prolongation, I sent "we must attack". My son's reply "Are you listening to US radio?" Nooooooo... I replied. I was very, very afraid of the American team: I know that in matters of tenacity, nothing resembles a German more than an American. I'm very happy that our team (Belgium, just to be sure) won the match. They deserved to win it. And now we face Argentina. WWW: we will win (¡dicho con mucho respeto, más, cariño por los Argentinos!)
Pablo (El muy Flamenco) :devil::devil::devil:


----------



## Guest

I have decided to place all of my life's savings on Costa Rica. !!! Arriba, arriba, Costa Rica !!!


----------



## Piwikiwi

TalkingHead said:


> I have decided to place all of my life's savings on Costa Rica. !!! Arriba, arriba, Costa Rica !!!


Prepare yourself for more disappointment!


----------



## TxllxT

Let's face the reality


----------



## hpowders

The USA had their chances. How about that beautiful set play in extra time off the free kick where Dempsey pealed off, took the ball and brought it right in front of the keeper (!!!!), only to shoot it right at him! Should have tied the score there, no doubt about it. A sad day for the US.


----------



## hpowders

PabloElFlamenco said:


> Ok, I'm not in the habit of discussing football/soccer, and highly incompetent. But I am Belgian, and have lived in, and respect, the USA. During the week, lodging in the Netherlands, I don't have TV, and I didn't feel like walking to town for a public café with TV for an event which ended close to 1 AM (work in the morning...), so for the first time in my life I spent some 3 hours listening to football/soccer on the radio. Belgian (Flemish) radio. My bare feet firmly planted on the wooden floor and, between my feet, my mobile phone awaiting my press of the button for SMS'ing the word "Tjak" to my son, in Belgium. I had to wait a loooong time. And then we started SMS'ing, back and forth. At one point, we switched from Flemish to English. Late in the second prolongation, I sent "we must attack". My son's reply "Are you listening to US radio?" Nooooooo... I replied. I was very, very afraid of the American team: I know that in matters of tenacity, nothing resembles a German more than an American. I'm very happy that our team (Belgium, just to be sure) won the match. They deserved to win it. And now we face Argentina. WWW: we will win (¡dicho con mucho respeto, más, cariño por los Argentinos!)
> Pablo (El muy Flamenco) :devil::devil::devil:


Belgium deserve to move on. They played great and looked better than the US team.

I'm sad because I'm an American, but the better team won yesterday.


----------



## hpowders

TxllxT said:


> Let's face the reality


I must go there one day. Awesome!


----------



## hpowders

TalkingHead said:


> I have decided to place all of my life's savings on Costa Rica. !!! Arriba, arriba, Costa Rica !!!


That's fine. Just leave 10 euros under the pillow for rent, food and gas.


----------



## TxllxT

A classic video with something you never saw before: German Humor


----------



## Guest

hpowders said:


> The USA had their chances. How about that beautiful set play in extra time off the free kick where Dempsey pealed off, took the ball and brought it right in front of the keeper (!!!!), only to shoot it right at him! Should have tied the score there, no doubt about it. A sad day for the US.


Sad that we didn't win, to be sure, but not really a sad day for the US. Would we have been ecstatic had we won? Not really, but we would be really, really happy. But the US just doesn't care about soccer as much as some other countries, where it is the dominant sport. In the US, so many other sports are vastly more popular than soccer. We cared here because it was us against another country - it was more about national pride than a love of soccer. The game is still boring to most of us. Having to wait nearly 2 hours before someone actually scores a point? Sorry, but from this American spectator, soccer is the trench warfare of sports. Roughly equally matched teams, fighting over the same small patch of no-man's land in the middle for most of the battle, and then one lucky sneak past the defenders for a modest accomplishment. We Americans, in general (I realize there are some legitimate American soccer fans who love it and snootily look down on those of us who call it soccer rather than football) look at that and think it is pointless. That is why we even like hockey more - essentially soccer on ice with skates and a puck instead of a ball - because more happens, it is more physical, and you get to break up the monotony with power plays and fights.


----------



## GreenMamba

DrMike said:


> That is why we even like hockey more - essentially soccer on ice with skates and a puck instead of a ball - because more happens, it is more physical, and you get to break up the monotony with power plays and fights.


We don't really really like hockey that much. Possibly you are a hockey fan overrating the popularity of your sport.

If it's all about action, then why do Americans like baseball so much? (note: I actually am a baseball fan).


----------



## Guest

I don't like hockey. The only time I watch it is when I am at my father-in-law's, who does like it.

There is action in baseball - certainly more than in soccer. There is also skill. And it is a profoundly American sport. And baseball is also not the top sport in the nation anymore. I personally am bored with baseball. I prefer football and basketball.


----------



## Couac Addict

DrMike said:


> The game is still boring to most of us. Having to wait nearly 2 hours before someone actually scores a point? Sorry, but from this American spectator, soccer is the trench warfare of sports. Roughly equally matched teams, fighting over the same small patch of no-man's land in the middle for most of the battle, and then one lucky sneak past the defenders for a modest accomplishment.


You are aware that in most leagues, on average, there's an shot at goal every 2-3mins.


----------



## hpowders

DrMike said:


> Sad that we didn't win, to be sure, but not really a sad day for the US. Would we have been ecstatic had we won? Not really, but we would be really, really happy. But the US just doesn't care about soccer as much as some other countries, where it is the dominant sport. In the US, so many other sports are vastly more popular than soccer. We cared here because it was us against another country - it was more about national pride than a love of soccer. The game is still boring to most of us. Having to wait nearly 2 hours before someone actually scores a point? Sorry, but from this American spectator, soccer is the trench warfare of sports. Roughly equally matched teams, fighting over the same small patch of no-man's land in the middle for most of the battle, and then one lucky sneak past the defenders for a modest accomplishment. We Americans, in general (I realize there are some legitimate American soccer fans who love it and snootily look down on those of us who call it soccer rather than football) look at that and think it is pointless. That is why we even like hockey more - essentially soccer on ice with skates and a puck instead of a ball - because more happens, it is more physical, and you get to break up the monotony with power plays and fights.


I just keep replaying in my mind that wonderful set play off the free kick, near the end of the match which gave Dempsey the ball right in front of the net, all alone, and he couldn't finish it.


----------



## Wood

DrMike said:


> Sad that we didn't win, to be sure, but not really a sad day for the US. Would we have been ecstatic had we won? Not really, but we would be really, really happy. But the US just doesn't care about soccer as much as some other countries, where it is the dominant sport. In the US, so many other sports are vastly more popular than soccer. We cared here because it was us against another country - it was more about national pride than a love of soccer. The game is still boring to most of us. *Having to wait nearly 2 hours before someone actually scores a point? * Sorry, but from this American spectator, soccer is the trench warfare of sports. Roughly equally matched teams, fighting over the same small patch of no-man's land in the middle for most of the battle, and then one lucky sneak past the defenders for a modest accomplishment. We Americans, in general (I realize there are some legitimate American soccer fans who love it and snootily look down on those of us who call it soccer rather than football) look at that and think it is pointless. That is why we even like hockey more - essentially soccer on ice with skates and a puck instead of a ball - because more happens, it is more physical, and you get to break up the monotony with power plays and fights.


I detest the Americanisation of football in terms of the modern use of extra time and penalties to decide a drawn match. The beauty of British sports is that sometimes there is no winner, honour is shared. In cricket, also bastardised in recent decades, matches can last five days without finishing and yet the match can be both subtly fascinating and action packed with heroic performances.

To decide the best football team in the world by penalty shootouts is to play a sport which isn't football.

DrMike, you might not be interested in the Eton Wall Game, played annually, which is reputed to have ended 0-0 on all but one occasion in the last 100 years!


----------



## GreenMamba

DrMike said:


> I don't like hockey. The only time I watch it is when I am at my father-in-law's, who does like it.
> 
> There is action in baseball - certainly more than in soccer. There is also skill. And it is a profoundly American sport. And baseball is also not the top sport in the nation anymore. I personally am bored with baseball. I prefer football and basketball.


Well, I prefer football (the NFL) too. But baseball is very, very popular still, and really doesn't have a lot of action. The ball is certainly in play a lot more in soccer.

If you think baseball has more action than soccer, it's because you are used to it. My guess is you don't notice anything in soccer but the goals and near goals, much the way a non-football fan wouldn't consider anything as action but the touchdowns spread across 3+ hours (while fans scream at the TV when there's a sack). A non-baseball fan must find the average at bat to be excruciating.

One way to look at it: all sports are, objectively speaking, dull. It's only your decision to involve yourself that makes them watchable.


----------



## Guest

Couac Addict said:


> You are aware that in most leagues, on average, there's an shot at goal every 2-3mins.


How many end up being goals? Or how many are shots on target, not just on goal? You can kick it fifty feet in the air above the goal and call that a shot at goal.


----------



## SiegendesLicht

DrMike said:


> I don't like hockey. The only time I watch it is when I am at my father-in-law's, who does like it.
> 
> There is action in baseball - certainly more than in soccer. There is also skill. And it is a profoundly American sport. And baseball is also not the top sport in the nation anymore. I personally am bored with baseball. I prefer football and basketball.


During my stay in the US I really tried to like baseball, but it always seemed to me incredibly static - people just standing on the spot and throwing the ball from it, compared to footballers who run around the field, attack and counterattack all the time.


----------



## Guest

Wood said:


> I detest the Americanisation of football in terms of the modern use of extra time and penalties to decide a drawn match. The beauty of British sports is that sometimes there is no winner, honour is shared. In cricket, also bastardised in recent decades, matches can last five days without finishing and yet the match can be both subtly fascinating and action packed with heroic performances.
> 
> To decide the best football team in the world by penalty shootouts is to play a sport which isn't football.
> 
> DrMike, you might not be interested in the Eton Wall Game, played annually, which is reputed to have ended 0-0 on all but one occasion in the last 100 years!


I agree about disliking 120 minutes of playing then being decided by penalty kicks.

And while it is fine during a normal season in a league to have draws, what else do you do in something like the World Cup? They allow draws in the first round, but after that, where it is single elimination, how else do you decide it? You can't leave it a draw. Both teams can't advance.

The honor in a game comes from sportsmanlike conduct and admiring the athleticism of the athletes. It isn't in the winning or losing. But if you can come away with no winners or losers, what is the point? What if every game in a season were a draw? Do we declare everybody a winner? Are we worried about wounding pride by somebody having to lose? What is the point? When you compete, the object is to win, not to draw.

I think I would have lost interest in the Eton Wall Game a long time ago. Pardon the crudeness of my metaphor, but that sounds about as appealing having a gorgeous wife and being impotent. Sure, you may have some fun, but in the end you are just going to be disappointed.


----------



## Guest

GreenMamba said:


> Well, I prefer football (the NFL) too. But baseball is very, very popular still, and really doesn't have a lot of action. The ball is certainly in play a lot more in soccer.
> 
> If you think baseball has more action than soccer, it's because you are used to it. My guess is you don't notice anything in soccer but the goals and near goals, much the way a non-football fan wouldn't consider anything as action but the touchdowns spread across 3+ hours (while fans scream at the TV when there's a sack). A non-baseball fan must find the average at bat to be excruciating.
> 
> One way to look at it: all sports are, objectively speaking, dull. It's only your decision to involve yourself that makes them watchable.


And that very well may be. And so I get back to my original statement. There was excitement for a time from Americans over their playing in the World Cup, but less excitement for the game, and more excitement for national pride. We do like to compete against other countries. And part of our psyche would love to beat the rest of the world at their own game - the rest of the world does tend to look down on us regarding soccer, and we would love to rub their faces in it. But ultimately, we don't care that much. Now that we are no longer in it, we'll go back to watching re-runs and who knows what else over World Cup soccer. We honestly don't care too much about a competition where the potential winner could be Costa Rica, or the Netherlands, or Belgium.


----------



## Matsps

An idea to replace penalties: 

If a game remains drawn at 120 mins, both goalkeepers are sent off the pitch and no other player is allowed to use their hands in the box. Play continues from a drop ball in the centre circle until someone scores.


----------



## hpowders

SiegendesLicht said:


> During my stay in the US I really tried to like baseball, but it always seemed to me incredibly static - people just standing on the spot and throwing the ball from it, compared to footballers who run around the field, attack and counterattack all the time.


 Amazing how certain stereotypes take hold, whether it's concerning European football or classical music.
So many American news pundits proudly and with "macho" asserting over the last several weeks how they would never watch the World Cup; soooo boring, as if baseball isn't. Of course they don't know what they are talking about. Such artistry, stamina and coordination. It's incredible how terrific those World Cup athletes are!

Damn stereotypes. I just want to scream!!!


----------



## Guest

SiegendesLicht said:


> During my stay in the US I really tried to like baseball, but it always seemed to me incredibly static - people just standing on the spot and throwing the ball from it, compared to footballers who run around the field, attack and counterattack all the time.


Even so, if some of the mindset went into the rules of baseball like they have been applied to soccer, I could imagine some changes that would make it even less exciting. I could imagine stealing bases banned, similar to the logic behind the offsides penalty. Or maybe doing away with homeruns.

I won't argue that baseball is not static. Of all the professional team sports, I think baseball has some of the least fit players. And it is not for everyone, but it has really started to generate a lot of international interest. And there are some incredible skills in the sport that aren't found elsewhere - like being able to hit a small orb with a bat very close to the same diameter while it is hurtling towards you at speeds close to 100 miles per hour. I don't care for baseball, but even I stand in awe of that ability.


----------



## Wood

DrMike said:


> And while it is fine during a normal season in a league to have draws, what else do you do in something like the World Cup? They allow draws in the first round, but after that, where it is single elimination, how else do you decide it? You can't leave it a draw. Both teams can't advance.


The traditional method is to have replays. It does have implications for scheduling but is certainly doable. I rather fancy that the drama of the penalty shootout increases advertising revenue and that takes precedence over the purity of the sport.



> The honor in a game comes from sportsmanlike conduct and admiring the athleticism of the athletes. It isn't in the winning or losing.


Yes, that is true. But in a league system, a draw isn't a dead rubber. A weak team playing away to a strong team will have a huge disadvantage, so holding out for a draw provides a kind of victory & vv for the superior team.



> But if you can come away with no winners or losers, what is the point? What if every game in a season were a draw? Do we declare everybody a winner? Are we worried about wounding pride by somebody having to lose? What is the point? When you compete, the object is to win, not to draw.


No, I'm not coming from the PC angle that everyone should be winners. Having a draw provides a third dimension to the potential outcome of a match. It is a middle ground between the elation of victory and despair of defeat. There is literally a point to a draw. It is half (or illogically a third) as good as a win. Also, in a league match there is no more closure to a game that finishes with a winner / loser than one with a draw. It is in both cases the same, just one more step advancing through the season.



> I think I would have lost interest in the Eton Wall Game a long time ago. Pardon the crudeness of my metaphor, but that sounds about as appealing having a gorgeous wife and being impotent. Sure, you may have some fun, but in the end you are just going to be disappointed.


You're not alone. It is supposed to be the most boring spectator sport in history, even for the schoolboys sitting above the game on the wall.

On the other hand, for the players, it is a game requiring great skill, strength and athleticism, which has presumably been the main force in it surviving since the 18th century.


----------



## Vaneyes

Cavedweller, Viagra (or Cialis) can come to the rescue for the impotent man with a gorgeous wife.


----------



## Guest

DrMike said:


> The game is still boring to most of us. Having to wait nearly 2 hours before someone actually scores a point?


Perhaps your lack of interest stems from your lack of knowledge? I've not yet found the motivation to get into baseball or American football, but I'm not about to pronounce how boring it must be to watch if no one gets a home point in baseball or scores a pitch goal in American football.


----------



## hpowders

Looking forward to France-Germany. Unfortunately, I must tape it since I will be "out to lunch".


----------



## Guest

MacLeod said:


> Perhaps your lack of interest stems from your lack of knowledge? I've not yet found the motivation to get into baseball or American football, but I'm not about to pronounce how boring it must be to watch if no one gets a home point in baseball or scores a pitch goal in American football.


No, I said it was boring to most of us. I don't have scientific evidence to support such a claim, but the fact that it generates so little interest most of the time can be offered up as anecdotal evidence. We generally are fairly willing to watch things we find exciting. I am fully aware that other countries find soccer more exciting than ours, and that others (with some exceptions) see no excitement in baseball or American football.

My original comment referred specifically to general impressions of soccer by Americans. For example - you are not likely to ever find any soccer riots here in the States. We realize that the vast majority of the planet likes soccer much more than we do. And it doesn't really rankle us that much. I doubt the average American could even name more than 5 American soccer players.

1. Mia Hamm
2. The female player who took her top off when the American women won several years back.
3. Some guy that had crazy red hair - Lallas, maybe?
4. Our really good goalie - Howard, I think?
5. I think there was another guy named Dempsey.

That is it. Some might name Beckham, because he came and played in LA, but he's a Brit.

How many sports get a lot of attention over there in the UK? Cricket, rugby, soccer? Any others? Most countries seem to have enough excitement for 3, maybe 4 sports. Do any care for more?

In the U.S., we have football - and some would say that college and professional are two different sports in and of themselves - and basketball, and baseball. Hockey gets decent attention. Soccer just doesn't rank that high.


----------



## SiegendesLicht

hpowders said:


> Looking forward to France-Germany. Unfortunately, I must tape it since I will be "out to lunch".


France will win this time. None of the teams that I have ever rooted for, has ever made it beyond the quarterfinals.


----------



## hpowders

SiegendesLicht said:


> France will win this time. None of the teams that I have ever rooted for, has ever made it beyond the quarterfinals.


I actually picked France to win it all during this thread's adolescence, but that was after their first match. They haven't impressed me since. Germany on the other hand look like they have a date with destiny-Messi and Argentina.


----------



## Guest

So who will it be tonight, France or Germany?
I think the answer lies in a quick comparison of their respective national anthems:

1) Germany : 



2) France : 




You be the judge!


----------



## PabloElFlamenco

hpowders said:


> I actually picked France to win it all during this thread's adolescence, but that was after their first match. They haven't impressed me since. Germany on the other hand look like they have a date with destiny-Messi and Argentina.


I beg you, much esteemed Sir, to forget it! :devil::devil::devil:


----------



## hpowders

PabloElFlamenco said:


> I beg you, much esteemed Sir, to forget it! :devil::devil::devil:


Forget what? France? They looked good in their first match, but nothing special since.


----------



## hpowders

Germany win again. No surprise.


----------



## SiegendesLicht

SiegendesLicht said:


> France will win this time. None of the teams that I have ever rooted for, has ever made it beyond the quarterfinals.


Well, I am glad to have been proved wrong!


----------



## hpowders

Yeah. What a shock. France looked like they were playing a consolation game, rather than fighting to win a spot in the semis at the World Cup.


----------



## hpowders

Dumb move by Silva, deliberately running into the Colombian goal keeper.
The second goal was a fabulous shot.
James Rodríguez penalty kick, no problem.
Too little, too late. Brazil advance as expected.


----------



## Kieran

Brazil have been horrible in this World Cup. Lousy, long ball, dirty, hoofing industrial football. Without a ref, there'd be riots and bedlam on the streets. Germany weren't much better. 

The semi final will be great! :tiphat:


----------



## EricABQ

A couple pieces of news came out of the Brazil v. Colombia game.

1. Neymar apparently broke a vertebrae in his back and will miss the rest of the tournament.

2. There are some seriously big and scary insects in Brazil:


----------



## Vaneyes

So, after weeks if not years of teeth-gnashing, pretty much the expected teams are in crunchtime.

FWIW the sfs are usually the best games in the NFL process.

Back to footaball. Argentina all the way.


----------



## Vaneyes

hpowders said:


> Yeah. What a shock. France looked like they were playing a consolation game, rather than fighting to win a spot in the semis at the World Cup.


Lovers (of good food & wine, which is okay), not fighters.


----------



## Vaneyes

hpowders said:


> Looking forward to France-Germany. Unfortunately, I must tape it since I will be *"out to lunch"*.


We understand.


----------



## Guest

Two hugely disappointing games. France didn't seem to care (or were they too hot to?) and the refereeing in the Brazil v Colombia match was diabolical - nearly as bad as the football which offered one or two moments of showmanship and much kick and rush, latin-style.

I have a horrible feeling that today's games aren't going to deliver either...


----------



## ArtMusic

Some how I just think Brazil will end up winning the FIFA anyway. Just a gut feeling, nothing more, nothing less.


----------



## Wood

Vaneyes said:


> Lovers (of good food & wine, which is okay), not fighters.


Or as Lance put it, 'Cheese-eating surrender monkeys'.


----------



## hpowders

Vaneyes said:


> We understand.


I canceled my lunch date to watch it. Mistake. Pure dullsville.

Once again, Germany overran France without a fight.

The French people deserve to have a serious case of the sacré bleus today after that match!


----------



## Kieran

hpowders said:


> Once again, Germany overran France without a fight.


Yeah, it was _1870 and all that_ once again.

The French still haven't figgered out how to stop the Germans having their wicked way with them...


----------



## hpowders

Looking forward to a couple of fine matches today.

However, I also thought the Titanic would float...so I could be wrong!


----------



## Guest

At this point, I want Germany to win, because I picked them to win the whole thing in my office pool, but I somehow can't stir myself to care much about the Netherlands, Costa Rica, Belgium, or Argentina. For my pool, I need Argentina to win today, then for them to advance to the finals. I need Germany to defeat Brazil and advance to the finals. And then I need Germany to beat Argentina. So I just check in at the end of the matches for the final scores.


----------



## hpowders

Germany-Brazil. Should be the match of the tournament.

But don't take anything I say too seriously. I love atonal music.


----------



## Kieran

hpowders said:


> But don't take anything I say too seriously. I love atonal music.


Thanks for the heads up! :tiphat:


----------



## hpowders

All phones are off the hook. Time for Argentina-Belgium.

Rooting for Argentina as revenge for Belgium's victory over the USA.

I've already canceled my Belgian Chocolate of the Month subscription.
Just as well, for with the summer heat, it melts too easily and becomes quite messi.


----------



## Guest

hpowders said:


> All phones are off the hook. Time for Argentina-Belgium.
> 
> Rooting for Argentina as revenge for Belgium's victory over the USA.
> 
> I've already canceled my Belgium Chocolate of the Month subscription.
> Just as well, with the summer heat, it melts quite easily and becomes too messi.


ho ho ho ho hum


----------



## Guest

Kieran said:


> Yeah, it was _1870 and all that_ once again.
> 
> The French still haven't figgered out how to stop the Germans having their wicked way with them...


Reminds me of the old joke:

Q) Why are French roads lined with trees?

A) So the Germans can walk in the shade.

:lol:


----------



## clara s

hpowders said:


> All phones are off the hook. Time for Argentina-Belgium.
> 
> Rooting for Argentina as revenge for Belgium's victory over the USA.
> 
> I've already canceled my Belgian Chocolate of the Month subscription.
> Just as well, for with the summer heat, it melts too easily and becomes quite messi.


now you cancelled your belgian chocolates,

you can order a parrilla rib eye steak, to support Messi hahaha

he is doing not bad


----------



## clara s

DrMike said:


> At this point, I want Germany to win, because I picked them to win the whole thing in my office pool, but I somehow can't stir myself to care much about the Netherlands, Costa Rica, Belgium, or Argentina. For my pool, I need Argentina to win today, then for them to advance to the finals. I need Germany to defeat Brazil and advance to the finals. And then I need Germany to beat Argentina. So I just check in at the end of the matches for the final scores.


Dr Mike

Argentina will win the cup

can you change your pool pick?


----------



## hpowders

An absolute pleasure watching Argentina's crisp accurate passing and Messi, in particular, a virtuosic wonder of controlling the ball.

Belgium looked a bit disorganized and couldn't mount a sustained offensive attack except at the exciting end.

Very happy with the result!!


----------



## hpowders

clara s said:


> now you cancelled your belgian chocolates,
> 
> you can order a parrilla rib eye steak, to support Messi hahaha
> 
> he is doing not bad


Yes. Straight from la Pampa.


----------



## TxllxT

In about an hour...


----------



## Piwikiwi

Swamp Germans for the win!


----------



## Headphone Hermit

DrMike said:


> How many sports get a lot of attention over there in the UK? Cricket, rugby, soccer? Any others? Most countries seem to have enough excitement for 3, maybe 4 sports. Do any care for more?


Sport is very popular in the UK - there are large fan bases for: Football, rugby league, rugby union (yes - two different sports!), tennis (especially last two weeks!), cycling (estimated 2-4 million people to line the roads to watch the Tour in the first three days), F1, golf, horse racing, cricket, snooker, darts .... and others. Sky have four main sports channels (plus a fifth about to start), two channels of Eurosport, two of BT Sport ..... Mrs Hermit despairs!

I'm surpirsed if only 3 or 4 sports are truly popular over the pond


----------



## Headphone Hermit

hpowders said:


> All phones are off the hook. Time for Argentina-Belgium.
> 
> Rooting for Argentina as revenge for Belgium's victory over the USA.
> 
> I've already canceled my Belgian Chocolate of the Month subscription.
> Just as well, for with the summer heat, it melts too easily and *becomes quite messi*.


Suarez got banned for nine matches. That terrible pun deserves at least a sound thrashing!


----------



## Headphone Hermit

The Dutch need to get into gear or they could lose this

A bit of 'Dutch Courage' needed - Advocaat is in the cupboard (where it will stay!)


----------



## Vaneyes

Costa Rica vs England 0 - 0

Costa Rica vs Netherlands 0 - 0


----------



## Vaneyes

Costa Rica's Chinese fire-drill is working.


----------



## Headphone Hermit

Costa Rica - well-organised; play as a team; know what they CAN do ... and do it; know what they CAN'T do ... and work out how to cover it up; don't pretend to be better than they are .... and have a large chunk of luck


----------



## Vaneyes

Headphone Hermit said:


> Costa Rica - well-organised; play as a team; know what they CAN do ... and do it; know what they CAN'T do ... and work out how to cover it up; don't pretend to be better than they are .... *and have a large chunk of luck*


"I agree with that."


----------



## EricABQ

What a classless jackass Krul is with the taunting.


----------



## hpowders

High drama in the Costa Rica-Netherlands match decided by penalty kicks.

The Dutch did everything but put it in the net thanks to Costa Rica's terrific defensive effort featuring their new star defensive player, Cross Bar.

However two very weak Costa Rican penalty kicks allowed the Dutch to advance to the semis.


----------



## GreenMamba

The Dutch deserved to win. Not a great match, but some late excitement.

Now we have a classic semifinal. Aside from Italy and, more recently, Spain, you could argue that these are the Big Four sides. Netherlands have never won it all, but have always been in the hunt.

ADD: a gutsy decision to switch keepers late.


----------



## Headphone Hermit

I'm looking forward to a new name on the trophy


----------



## EricABQ

Between Arjen's diving and Krul's buffoonery, Netherlands is a hard team to root for.


----------



## Vaneyes

EricABQ said:


> Between Arjen's diving and Krul's buffoonery, Netherlands is a hard team to root for.


Especially when they play Argentina.


----------



## EricABQ

Vaneyes said:


> Especially when they play Argentina.


I'll be drinking some Malbec on Wednesday in support of my neighbors to the very, very south.


----------



## hpowders

Netherlands has as much chance of beating Argentina as I have of being CEO of TC.

Wait a minute....the phone's ringing.


----------



## Guest

EricABQ said:


> Between Arjen's diving and Krul's buffoonery, Netherlands is a hard team to root for.


However, it was noticeable that Robben behaved himself last night. They controlled the game for most of the time and compared to the Brazil/Colombia tie, it was really quite gentlemanly.


----------



## Kieran

I missed the scoreless drama of the Dutch match, but I was hoping Robben wouldn't trip during the penalty shoot out. That would have created a bureaucratic quagmire if the ref gave him _two _penalties to kick.

Brazil v Germany?

Well, I'm repeating myself, but this is a lousy Brazil team, made even more horrible by the exclusion of Neymar (who showed signs that he was contributing less of any use in each successive match), but made more successful by the usefulness of the Twelfth Man, and Germany didn't have to try hard to invade France. I mean, to beat France.

Holland v Messi.

I'm going with Leo to get them in the final, and the final will be:

Messi v The Referee - with the hosts taking the title... :tiphat:


----------



## Piwikiwi

EricABQ said:


> I'll be drinking some Malbec on Wednesday in support of my neighbors to the very, very south.


I'll be drinking some heineken in an orange falklands whool jumper:devil:


----------



## SiegendesLicht

I am hoping for a Germany vs. Netherlands finale, but most likely it will be Brazil vs. Argentina.


----------



## Headphone Hermit

SiegendesLicht said:


> I am hoping for a Germany vs. Netherlands finale, but most likely it will be Brazil vs. Argentina.


oh yes, the Deutch versus the Dutch - bring it on!


----------



## TxllxT

Slowly preparing ourselves for the finals


----------



## hpowders

Kieran said:


> I missed the scoreless drama of the Dutch match, but I was hoping Robben wouldn't trip during the penalty shoot out. That would have created a bureaucratic quagmire if the ref gave him _two _penalties to kick.
> 
> Brazil v Germany?
> 
> Well, I'm repeating myself, but this is a lousy Brazil team, made even more horrible by the exclusion of Neymar (who showed signs that he was contributing less of any use in each successive match), but made more successful by the usefulness of the Twelfth Man, and Germany didn't have to try hard to invade France. I mean, to beat France.
> 
> Holland v Messi.
> 
> I'm going with Leo to get them in the final, and the final will be:
> 
> Messi v The Referee - with the hosts taking the title... :tiphat:


I've never seen a bald Robben before. Of course, I will add it to my collection.


----------



## senza sordino

World Cup hair battle
http://www.cbc.ca/sports/soccer/brazil2014/world-cup-hair-battle-the-contenders-1.2697643


----------



## Morimur

Was rooting for Costa Rica (being born in Central America) but the Dutch did an excellent job. I am sure team Costa Rica gained a lot of respect though; they've nothing to be ashamed of.


----------



## hpowders

Of course. Any team making it to the quarter finals of the World Cup should be respected. Excellent defensive effort by Costa Rica against the Dutch.


----------



## Jos

hpowders said:


> Excellent defensive effort by Costa Rica against the Dutch.


A bit too defensive imo. The 16 mtr. area was pretty crowded constantly. Two great shots that hit the goalposts hard. That is a talent too....

What's next ? Please, not the Germans again, please...

Cheers,
Jos


----------



## Kieran

Have we seen any bona fide "great" matches so far?

And any team we'll remember in 20 years?


----------



## hpowders

I'd say Greece-Costa Rica was a great match.

Twenty years? I probably won't even remember my name in twenty years.


----------



## Guest

Kieran said:


> And any team we'll remember in 20 years?


Of course! England's, for not getting out of the group stage!


----------



## Guest

Probably what this World Cup will be remembered most for is the Uruguayan biting the Italian - or, as he would have you believe it, stumbling teeth-first into the shoulder of the Italian, completely by accident.


----------



## Kieran

MacLeod said:


> Of course! England's, for not getting out of the group stage!


That could be very easily confused with any other major tournament they enter...


----------



## hpowders

Anyhow, tomorrow's match should be a memorable one, Germany-Brazil.
You think there's any pressure on Brazil?


----------



## Guest

I now know why the English team did so badly. In the good old days top players enjoyed a few smokes whilst training:


----------



## Kieran

hpowders said:


> Anyhow, tomorrow's match should be a memorable one, Germany-Brazil.
> You think there's any pressure on Brazil?


Exactly. They've been under tremendous pressure. I wasn't over-impressed with Germany against France, but they're still looking better than the hosts. And Brazil got physical with Colombia, especially in the first half, but they won't have huge success with that against the Germans. Muller is playing well. It's going to be a fascinating one...


----------



## hpowders

Kieran said:


> Exactly. They've been under tremendous pressure. I wasn't over-impressed with Germany against France, but they're still looking better than the hosts. And Brazil got physical with Colombia, especially in the first half, but they won't have huge success with that against the Germans. Muller is playing well. It's going to be a fascinating one...


Get the fire brigades ready if Brazil loses. A hot country will be getting hotter....much, much hotter.

They may have to play the championship match in Venezuela.


----------



## Guest

Read this great line - soccer is a lot like old age: one falls down a lot and seldom scores.


----------



## TxllxT

Is it true that the game of soccer / football is one of the main causes of having defused the European problem of nationalism (ending up repeatedly with starting a war), offering a gentle British solution to it: still anyone is allowed to be extremely (nationalistically) proud, but :tiphat: : no blood is being spilled.


----------



## clara s

TxllxT said:


> Is it true that the game of soccer / football is one of the main causes of having defused the European problem of nationalism (ending up repeatedly with starting a war), offering a gentle British solution to it: still anyone is allowed to be extremely (nationalistically) proud, but :tiphat: : no blood is being spilled.


very nice solution that could be...
but are you sure that no blood is being spilled? hahaha


----------



## Vaneyes

Brazil's worst nightmare.

http://www.dailystar.com.lb/Sports/...to-argentina-seizes-brazil.ashx#axzz36pW9zESn


----------



## Guest

Kieran said:


> Have we seen any bona fide "great" matches so far?
> 
> And any team we'll remember in 20 years?


I thought the game where the Netherlands totally destroyed Spain on Day 2 was a really great game. The Van Persie header was a thing of beauty, but the fireworks kept coming the whole second half. What a smack-down!

If the Dutch team do win this tournament, they'll be remembered.


----------



## hpowders

That was so long ago, I completely forgot. Spain is soooo yesterday's news.

The Dutch have as much chance to win the World Cup as I do of becoming the next Pope.


----------



## SiegendesLicht

Just the other day I watched a movie called "Goodbye, Lenin", set in 1990 Germany. The Berlin wall fell, Germans received their eastern half back... and won the World Cup. They must have received such a strong psychological kick from these events that gave them just the amount of strength needed to beat Argentina in the final. Except that I don't see anything that might give them another kick to win this one.


----------



## hpowders

Argentina is looking very good. The bad news for the other teams is they are peaking, looking better and better with each match. Can't say that for any of the other teams still left.


----------



## Matsps

Tonight - Germany win 2 - 1. Tomorrow - Argentina win 2 - 0.

Brazil are missing Neymar (scorer of 4 goals) and Silva, their captain, is banned, so it falls to David Luiz (probably) to score their goals and I'm not sure what other leaders they have out there. Germany on the other hand, just are always always always a threat. 

Argentina and The Netherlands are the only teams to have won all games. I'm favouring the winner of that match (probably Argentina) to win the tournament.


----------



## Kieran

Matsps said:


> Brazil are missing Neymar (scorer of 4 goals) and Silva, their captain, is banned, so it falls to David Luiz (probably) to score their goals and I'm not sure what other leaders they have out there.


...................................


----------



## Headphone Hermit

TxllxT said:


> Is it true that the game of soccer / football is one of the main causes of having defused the European problem of nationalism (ending up repeatedly with starting a war), offering a gentle British solution to it: still anyone is allowed to be extremely (nationalistically) proud, but :tiphat: : no blood is being spilled.


.... or simply that in football there is a chance that the Dutch CAN beat Germany???


----------



## Guest

Headphone Hermit said:


> .... or simply that in football there is a chance that the Dutch CAN beat Germany???


That's because in war there is no such thing as the offsides penalty, and you aren't restricted as to how many men you can have on the field, and the red and yellow cards only come afterwards, and only for the team that loses.


----------



## hpowders

SiegendesLicht said:


> Just the other day I watched a movie called "Goodbye, Lenin", set in 1990 Germany. The Berlin wall fell, Germans received their eastern half back... and won the World Cup. They must have received such a strong psychological kick from these events that gave them just the amount of strength needed to beat Argentina in the final. Except that I don't see anything that might give them another kick to win this one.


Happy belated birthday, by the way!! :tiphat:


----------



## SiegendesLicht

hpowders said:


> Happy belated birthday, by the way!! :tiphat:


Thank you! If they make it past Brazilians tonight, I might just celebrate on Sunday in a German restaurant with lots of beer, friends and the final on a big screen. If not... friends and beer will be present in any case.


----------



## hpowders

SiegendesLicht said:


> Thank you! If they make it past Brazilians tonight, I might just celebrate on Sunday in a German restaurant with lots of beer, friends and the final on a big screen. If not... friends and beer will be present in any case.


So much pressure on Brazil. That can only help Germany as the Brazilians may take very risky aggressive chances, setting up Germany for breakaways going the other way and excellent scoring opportunities.


----------



## Guest

I'm just hoping for victories within the first 90 minutes.


----------



## hpowders

I'd hate to see any of the semi-final matches (consolation, excepted) lost by penalty kick shootouts. It's a disgusting way to determine the winner of a match of such importance.

Instead, at the semi-final level and beyond, after no winner has been determined by 30 minutes of extended time, the complete match should be re-played two days hence and the remaining matches should be re-scheduled around it.


----------



## Guest

Why not just play sudden death? First goal wins? Yes, it might drag out some time, but at least it would be determined by two teams, not just one player at a time versus the goalie.


----------



## hpowders

DrMike said:


> Why not just play sudden death? First goal wins? Yes, it might drag out some time, but at least it would be determined by two teams, not just one player at a time versus the goalie.


Because they might all drop dead from exhaustion? Just a guess.

They've already run up and down the pitch for 120+ minutes in high heat and humidity.

Killing them should not be an option.


----------



## samurai

I'm hoping for Germany vs. The Netherlands in the finals; never a big soccer fan, I have really gotten into these matches, in no small measure due to the enthusiasm of my brother-in-law, who happens to be of Italian extraction.


----------



## samurai

I'm hoping for Germany vs. The Netherlands in the finals; never a big soccer fan, I have really gotten into these matches, in no small measure due to the enthusiasm of my brother-in-law, who happens to be of Italian extraction. I still don't fully understand how "offsides" is determined, though. In spite of this lack on my part, I have really enjoyed watching these matches, and the high caliber of play and endurance evinced by these marvelous athletes.


----------



## Guest

hpowders said:


> Because they might all drop dead from exhaustion? Just a guess.
> 
> They've already run up and down the pitch for 120+ minutes in high heat and humidity.
> 
> Killing them should not be an option.


So do away with the two 15-minute extra times, and just send it into sudden death after the 90 minutes. And maybe allow more substitutions, so your players don't get so exhausted.


----------



## samurai

I'm hoping for Germany vs. The Netherlands in the finals; never a big soccer fan, I have really gotten into these matches, in no small measure due to the enthusiasm of my brother-in-law, who happens to be of Italian extraction. I still don't fully understand how "offsides" is determined, though. In spite of this lack on my part, I have really enjoyed watching these matches, and the high caliber of play and endurance evinced by these marvelous athletes.
Duplicate post. Sorry!


----------



## mirepoix

samurai said:


> I'm hoping for Germany vs. The Netherlands in the finals; never a big soccer fan, I have really gotten into these matches, in no small measure due to the enthusiasm of my brother-in-law, who happens to be of Italian extraction. I still don't fully understand how "offsides" is determined, though.
> Duplicate post. Sorry!


_
"You're in a shoe shop, second in the queue for the till. Behind the shop assistant on the till is a pair of shoes which you have seen and which you must have.

The female shopper in front of you has seen them also and is eyeing them with desire. Both of you have forgotten your purses.

It would be rude to push in front of the first woman if you had no money to pay for the shoes.

The shop assistant remains at the till waiting.

Your friend is trying on another pair of shoes at the back of the shop and sees your dilemma.

She prepares to throw her purse to you.

If she does so, you can catch the purse, then walk round the other shopper and buy the shoes!

At a pinch she could throw the purse ahead of the other shopper and "whilst it is in flight" you could nip around the other shopper, catch the purse and buy the shoes!

BUT, you must always remember that until the purse has "actually been thrown", it would be plain wrong for you to be in front of the other shopper and you would be OFFSIDE!"_

?


----------



## samurai

mirepoix said:


> _
> "You're in a shoe shop, second in the queue for the till. Behind the shop assistant on the till is a pair of shoes which you have seen and which you must have.
> 
> The female shopper in front of you has seen them also and is eyeing them with desire. Both of you have forgotten your purses.
> 
> It would be rude to push in front of the first woman if you had no money to pay for the shoes.
> 
> The shop assistant remains at the till waiting.
> 
> Your friend is trying on another pair of shoes at the back of the shop and sees your dilemma.
> 
> She prepares to throw her purse to you.
> 
> If she does so, you can catch the purse, then walk round the other shopper and buy the shoes!
> 
> At a pinch she could throw the purse ahead of the other shopper and "whilst it is in flight" you could nip around the other shopper, catch the purse and buy the shoes!
> 
> BUT, you must always remember that until the purse has "actually been thrown", it would be plain wrong for you to be in front of the other shopper and you would be OFFSIDE!"_
> 
> ?


@mirepoix, Thanks for that 411; so am I correct in my understanding that the ball must always be "in flight" and ahead of the player for him to be "onside"?. 
p.s., In my case it would be more appropriate--me being male and all--if the object being thrown to me by my friend was a wallet rather than a purse, but your point is taken.


----------



## Wood

samurai said:


> @mirepoix, Thanks for that 411; so am I correct in my understanding that the ball must always be "in flight" and ahead of the player for him to be "onside"?.
> p.s., In my case it would be more appropriate--me being male and all--if the object being thrown to me by my friend was a wallet rather than a purse, but your point is taken.


http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/rules_and_equipment/4993924.stm


----------



## Wood

Once you have the offside rule sorted, you may wish to understand cricket, as explained on numerous teatowels in the 1970s:



> *Cricket: As explained to a foreigner...*
> 
> You have two sides, one out in the field and one in. Each man that's in the side that's in goes out, and when he's out he comes in and the next man goes in until he's out. When they are all out, the side that's out comes in and the side thats been in goes out and tries to get those coming in, out. Sometimes you get men still in and not out.When a man goes out to go in, the men who are out try to get him out, and when he is out he goes in and the next man in goes out and goes in. There are two men called umpires who stay all out all the time and they decide when the men who are in are out.
> When both sides have been in and all the men have out, and both sides have been out twice after all the men have been in, including those who are not out, that is the end of the game!


----------



## mirepoix

I know you're a dude, dude - I simply forgot to edit what I'd pasted.

_"...correct in my understanding that the ball must always be "in flight" and ahead of the player for him to be "onside"?_

Not always, no.

You're the attacker. I'm your teammate.

If you start off either behind or level with the defender who is between you and the goal ('checkout') and I then play the ball forward to you, then you're onside.

But if you had moved in front of that defender and only _then_ I played the ball forward to you, then you're offside.

It's basically all about when the ball is played forward and if you're behind/level with the defender when it's played forward.
Behind/level - onside
In front - offside


----------



## mirepoix

Wood said:


> Once you have the offside rule sorted, you may wish to understand cricket, as explained on numerous teatowels in the 1970s:


Which never mentioned the meaning of "...and he's gone off for _repairs_."


----------



## Guest

samurai said:


> I'm hoping for Germany vs. The Netherlands in the finals; never a big soccer fan, I have really gotten into these matches, in no small measure due to the enthusiasm of my brother-in-law, who happens to be of Italian extraction. I still don't fully understand how "offsides" is determined, though. In spite of this lack on my part, I have really enjoyed watching these matches, and the high caliber of play and endurance evinced by these marvelous athletes.
> Duplicate post. Sorry!


Consider it this way:
In American football, if you send a receiver downfield, and he outruns the defenders and then makes the reception, the rules of soccer would call that offsides. In soccer, you are not allowed to be closer to the goal than the defenders if the ball is passed to you. Many teams take advantage of this. If they know the ball will be passed to you, all they have to do is pull all their defenders away, and then you get called offsides. I don't much care for the rule. But soccer fans seem to like it. They think it would do something horrible, like lead to more scoring.


----------



## Guest

Wood said:


> Once you have the offside rule sorted, you may wish to understand cricket, as explained on numerous teatowels in the 1970s:


I realize this is meant to be absurd, but it never ceases to amaze me that any country that enjoys cricket would ever think of calling American sports like Football and Baseball too confusing.


----------



## samurai

DrMike said:


> Consider it this way:
> In American football, if you send a receiver downfield, and he outruns the defenders and then makes the reception, the rules of soccer would call that offsides. In soccer, you are not allowed to be closer to the goal than the defenders if the ball is passed to you. Many teams take advantage of this. If they know the ball will be passed to you, all they have to do is pull all their defenders away, and then you get called offsides. I don't much care for the rule. But soccer fans seem to like it. They think it would do something horrible, like lead to more scoring.


Thanks, Dr. Mike. In your context, I am now much clearer on what constitutes "offside".


----------



## Wood

DrMike said:


> I realize this is meant to be absurd, but it never ceases to amaze me that any country that enjoys cricket would ever think of calling American sports like Football and Baseball too confusing.


I call baseball 'rounders'  but can appreciate and enjoy (American) Football for its tactics, like rugby. It would be better without all the helmets and padding though.


----------



## Wood

DrMike said:


> . But soccer fans seem to like it. They think it would do something horrible, like lead to more scoring.


Being a 'goalhanger' is just not British old bean.


----------



## GreenMamba

Keep in mind that the offsides rule doesn't actually refer to "the defender," it refers to two players, one of whom is almost always the keeper. Occasionally this detail matters.



DrMike said:


> Consider it this way:
> In American football, if you send a receiver downfield, and he outruns the defenders and then makes the reception, the rules of soccer would call that offsides.


Not if the ball was passed before he ran past the defenders.



DrMike said:


> I don't much care for the rule. But soccer fans seem to like it. They think it would do something horrible, like lead to more scoring.


Like more cherry-picking. That's the concern. The game would degenerate into forwards parking in front of the enemy net, with defenders hanging around, both awaiting long balls. No more pretty goals.

Changing a rule of a sport profoundly alters the way in which it is played.

I appreciate that some people don't like soccer, but pretending that the fans are willfully horrified of scoring is silly. They know the sport.


----------



## mirepoix

Wood said:


> Being a 'goalhanger' is just not British old bean.


Or a "poaching b*****d". (Although that never did the likes of Gerd Muller any harm...)


----------



## Guest

Wood said:


> I call baseball 'rounders'  but can appreciate and enjoy (American) Football for its tactics, like rugby. It would be better without all the helmets and padding though.


Football is well regulated warfare, pure and simple. You don't want to send the players in without helmets and padding - too many injuries.

I like rugby - one of the few sports I was able to figure out fairly well just by watching.


----------



## Guest

GreenMamba said:


> Keep in mind that the offsides rule doesn't actually refer to "the defender," it refers to two players, one of whom is almost always the keeper. Occasionally this detail matters.
> 
> Not if the ball was passed before he ran past the defenders.
> 
> Like more cherry-picking. That's the concern. The game would degenerate into forwards parking in front of the enemy net, with defenders hanging around, both awaiting long balls. No more pretty goals.
> 
> Changing a rule of a sport profoundly alters the way in which it is played.
> 
> I appreciate that some people don't like soccer, but pretending that the fans are willfully horrified of scoring is silly. They know the sport.


Yes, that might be a concern, that forwards would just park in front of the enemy net and wait for a long ball. But there is also a tradeoff - they have less people defending their goal. I know soccer fans like the offsides rule. I just don't care for it - but then I am not a soccer fan, so my opinion doesn't count for much. And it wouldn't make sense in most American sports.


----------



## Headphone Hermit

Headphone Hermit said:


> .... or simply that in football there is a chance that the Dutch CAN beat Germany???


Ooops! I take that back - Germany 3 - Brazil 0

argh! Fourth German goal just gone in - complete shock!


----------



## hpowders

Brazil is indeed being taken to the cleaners by Germany.

With 25 minutes gone in the first half, at 4-0, this match is essentially over. A laugher!!!

Should be some emotion shown by the Brazilian populace tonight. Call out the fire brigades!!!


----------



## SiegendesLicht

Deutschland!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


----------



## Headphone Hermit

Wood said:


> I call baseball 'rounders'  but can appreciate and enjoy (American) Football for its tactics, like rugby. It would be better without all the helmets and padding though.


We CAN understand baseball and American football. YOU struggle with football (can't even call it the correct name) and cricket.

Draw whatever conclusion you wish :devil:


----------



## GreenMamba

5-0! Oh, Brazil.


----------



## SiegendesLicht

I think this is the best game I have ever seen.


----------



## Headphone Hermit

Five nil - it could be a cricket score tonight!!!!


----------



## Headphone Hermit

SiegendesLicht said:


> I think this is the best game I have ever seen.


nah! Everton 0 - Liverpool 5 (Ian Rush scores 4) was better 

best game this century was Man U 0 - Liverpool 3 this season


----------



## hpowders

SiegendesLicht said:


> I think this is the best game I have ever seen.


It's your birthday gift!


----------



## hpowders

I taped the match. Glad I did, because I still can't believe the complete destruction and collapse of Brazil.

Guess what the Brazilians will be doing tonight. The violence will cost their economy plenty!


----------



## TxllxT

A real _Schweinsteiger_ indeed. Tomorrow we'll see the Dutch roasting Argentinian beef.


----------



## GreenMamba

hpowders said:


> I taped the match. Glad I did, because I still can't believe the complete destruction and collapse of Brazil.


The good news is you only have to watch about 8 minutes of it to get the gist.


----------



## Dustin

This match is shocking. I don't watch much soccer and when I do, I have rarely seen a goal scored live, they are always on replays. To see 5 in about 20 minutes is pretty unreal and kind of cool.


----------



## Headphone Hermit

GreenMamba said:


> The good news is you only have to watch about 8 minutes of it to get the gist.


they kept it pithy!


----------



## hpowders

GreenMamba said:


> The good news is you only have to watch about 8 minutes of it to get the gist.


Would be something if the tape is a much closer match!


----------



## hpowders

Headphone Hermit said:


> they kept it pithy!


My kind of match; short, sweet; pithiness at its glorious best.

Now I am free to watch the daily soaps. Let's see, what channel is "As The Stomach Churns" on again?


----------



## TxllxT




----------



## Piwikiwi

This is fantastic,


----------



## SiegendesLicht

The German goalkeeper is a hero.


----------



## Xaltotun

I've seen technically better football games but this is shocking, visceral, horrifying!

I can take the repeats in Beethoven symphonies but this is too much!


----------



## samurai

Six nil and counting. Ouch! :scold:


----------



## SiegendesLicht

6:0 Germany winning!!!

But the thing Germans do best of all, is still music.


----------



## shangoyal

SiegendesLicht said:


> 6:0 Germany winning!!!
> 
> But the thing Germans do best of all, is still music.


So much authority in this statement, especially with the light saber.


----------



## samurai

SiegendesLicht said:


> The German goalkeeper is a hero.


The whole squad is simply terrific! :cheers:


----------



## SiegendesLicht

7:0!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


----------



## GreenMamba

Seben! 

The Germans should be saving these for Sunday.


----------



## hpowders

7-0 as we speak. What an embarrassment in front of the home crowd. Hope the coach is wearing a bulletproof vest. I'm glad I'm not there. After the match, Brazil will be a very high risk place to find oneself.


----------



## Headphone Hermit

SiegendesLicht said:


> 7:0!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


and an astonishingly good one it was too!


----------



## hpowders

These are more goals than I've seen in the last 3 World Cups combined.


----------



## EricABQ

The Broncos know how the Brazilians feel.


----------



## Xaltotun

SiegendesLicht said:


> 6:0 Germany winning!!!
> 
> But the thing Germans do best of all, is still music.


Well sure, but also philosophy! And they're not too shabby in literature, visual arts, architecture, or the natural sciences, either


----------



## samurai

I am wondering--as the score has just ballooned to *7 nil*--if the Brazilians ever considered pulling their goalkeeper after the first two or three goals. He--like the rest of this squad--look totally "shell-shocked" and as if they don't even belong on the same pitch with the Germans. And if they didn't consider this move, then why not?  After all--if I recall correctly--this is precisely what the Netherlands coach did against Costa Rica in the penalty phase of that match--and I believe that this tactical move proved to be a brilliant stroke which won the match for them.


----------



## Xaltotun

1-7 eh? It's like looking at a slaughtered animal that still has seizures.


----------



## samurai

Well, I guess the fat lady has finally sung! "Turn out the lights, the party's over," as "Dandy" Don Meredith used to croon/croak on Monday Night Football with Cosell and Gifford; now I'm really dating myself with that allusion.  Anyone else on here old enough to remember that? Please, anybody.  :wave:


----------



## hpowders

So, we will all meet in North Korea for the next World Cup?


----------



## TxllxT




----------



## hpowders

Something tells me the volatile Brazilian fans will forget all about that statue tonight.


----------



## SiegendesLicht

My man just said he can hear people celebrating all over Hamburg.


----------



## clara s

congratulations to all gentlemen celebrating... but

"the opera ain't over till the fat lady sings"


----------



## Bulldog

samurai said:


> Well, I guess the fat lady has finally sung! "Turn out the lights, the party's over," as "Dandy" Don Meredith used to croon/croak on Monday Night Football with Cosell and Gifford; now I'm really dating myself with that allusion.  Anyone else on here old enough to remember that? Please, anybody.  :wave:


I remember it very well. They were an excellent trio of broadcasters.

As for Brazil, the lights are certainly out for this team. Reminds me a little of the Denver Broncos.


----------



## hpowders

clara s said:


> congratulations to all gentlemen celebrating... but
> 
> "the opera ain't over till the fat lady sings"


I'll go with Argentina. My father used to say, save some of those runs, points, goals for the next match. He was usually right.


----------



## Kieran

That was like turning up for the Rio carnival and all the babes were fat. Shocking. 

Garrincha, Tostao, Gerson, Zico, Socrates. All the genius of Brazilian football, snuffed out. They've become a third world football nation...


----------



## mirepoix

Kieran said:


> That was like turning up for the Rio carnival and all the babes were fat. Shocking.
> 
> Garrincha, Tostao, Gerson, Zico, Socrates. All the genius of Brazilian football, snuffed out. They've become a third world football nation...


The last great line-up I can remember them having was in 1982 - Zico, Socrates, Serginho, Falcao, Eder, Junior, Dirceu etc. More than thirty years ago.


----------



## mirepoix

Kieran said:


> That was like turning up for the Rio carnival and all the babes were fat. Shocking.
> 
> Garrincha, Tostao, Gerson, Zico, Socrates. All the genius of Brazilian football, snuffed out. They've become a third world football nation...


The last great line-up I can remember them having was in 1982 - Zico, Socrates, Serginho, Falcao, Eder, Junior, Dirceu etc. More than thirty years ago. 
e: and a full back named Leandro(?) who would walk into the current team.


----------



## jurianbai

Wake up at 4am and see something strange.. 0-5 at the moment. I lucky still saw three more goals. The things is, who going to added more misery for Brazil in the 3rd place bout later...


----------



## Matsps

lol I actually went to a pub to watch this game and called 7-1 when I was chatting to the landlord about it pre-match (I thought it would be a routing with Brazil missing key players)!!!* 

*I should probably point out I've only predicted one other score correctly all world cup though... LOL


----------



## Guest

If the Netherlands wins tomorrow, and Germany wins the final, I win my office pool!!!!! One other person picked Germany to win, but they picked the final to be Germany vs. Argentina, so I need the Netherlands to win to make it even. Then thanks to Germany's 7 goals today, a tie would mean I win, because Germany's total goal count will be closer to my prediction (20).


----------



## EricABQ

What's the difference between war and soccer?

In soccer, the Germans can hold a big lead.


----------



## Kieran

mirepoix said:


> The last great line-up I can remember them having was in 1982 - Zico, Socrates, Serginho, Falcao, Eder, Junior, Dirceu etc. More than thirty years ago.


You and me, both. The great Socrates died in 2011. Imagine how he'd have felt watching this useless team?

I think they need to look very hard at things, because apart from their lousy unBrazilian way of playing, they're not producing great footballers like they used to.

This is for you, and everybody else who remembers this great team:


----------



## mirepoix

^^^That was good stuff and brought back a lot of memories.
When the game is played like that it's so simple; one touch whenever possible, and release and immediately move into space to make yourself available again. And they had players in every position who could do that. 

I don't believe they'll ever get it back. Things have moved on and that style of play is as obsolete as the old formation of playing with five forwards. Safety first. What a pity. But I enjoyed watching that video. Thanks for posting it.


----------



## Kieran

You're welcome!

I think a problem is that a lot of Brazilians ply their trade in Europe, where systems and organisation reigns, at the expense of individual expression. The South American style of playing was seen by Colombia, at a lower level, but if Brazil can stop exporting their best players and go back to their footballing principles - while also producing great players - a mix of improvisation and organisation might be possible.

But hoofing long balls out of defence? That's agricultural football...


----------



## Guest

Good grief, was there all this hullabaloo back in the day when Germany's leading striker Louis "Boot-boy" Beethoven eliminated Portuguese virtuoso Ronaldo Dedos da Manteiga* from the competition in the semi-final of the 1802 Broadwood European Cup?

Read all about it here: http://www.theguardian.com/football...many-front-pages#/?picture=441624696&index=11

*Translation required


----------



## mirepoix

Kieran said:


> You're welcome!
> 
> I think a problem is that a lot of Brazilians ply their trade in Europe, where systems and organisation reigns, at the expense of individual expression. The South American style of playing was seen by Colombia, at a lower level, but if Brazil can stop exporting their best players and go back to their footballing principles - while also producing great players - a mix of improvisation and organisation might be possible.
> 
> But hoofing long balls out of defence? That's agricultural football...


You hit the nail on the head there when you say that the players are expected to fit into the system, no matter what that might be. If you look at the eventual destination of some of the 82 squad you'll see they went to play in Italy - http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/1982_FIFA_World_Cup_squads#Brazil - and while many had a fine career the football played in Serie A isn't the most exciting, or at least attack minded.

Anyway, Germany are looking good (obviously!) and the majority of that squad - guys like Ozil and Khedira - are vastly more experienced than in 2010, and then you've such as Hummels who came through the under 21 squad and the Euros with a few others. I think they'll be hard to beat. Having said that, I wonder how they'll cope against a more physical approach when the pressure is on.


----------



## Matsps

I don't think the Germany performance against Brazil really made them any more of a threat than they were to start with. Brazil's defending was truly awful and their attack lackluster. Argentina or The Netherlands will offer a far more substantial threat going forward and a considerably better organized defence and midfield.


----------



## mirepoix

Matsps said:


> I don't think the Germany performance against Brazil really made them any more of a threat than they were to start with. Brazil's defending was truly awful and their attack lackluster. Argentina or The Netherlands will offer a far more substantial threat going forward and a considerably better organized defence and midfield.


The German keeper was being praised for a number of good saves - but did you notice how many of them were required as a result of their defence being so square?


----------



## sabrina

I think the value of Brazilian players is from good to exceptional, but they lacked any form of coordination, especially in the defence area. When their captain played, he was always shouting and was trying to suggest positions especially in the defence. I think his absence was much worse than that of that amazing Neymar. The Brazilian defence looked like a student amateur team, with a chaotic moving, and the incoming goals sealed the sad truth.
I still love Brazil football, and I am sure they will eventually come back with some great play. I only don't know when that will happen.


----------



## hpowders

Looking for Argentina to move on today.


----------



## Piwikiwi

hpowders said:


> Looking for Argentina to move on today.


To move one to a match against Brasil


----------



## TxllxT

hpowders said:


> Looking for Argentina to move on today.


They will anyhow move on: to the 3rd, 2nd or 1st place, with Brazil sitting like a dead duck on the 4th. My guess for them is the 3rd.


----------



## Guest

I'm hoping for an all European final.

The biggest thing that the Brazilian loss told me was that the whole team is 2 men. Take them away, and you have, at best, a second rate team. That is a pretty shallow team that can be so destroyed by the loss of 2 players, even if they are the stars.

I think Brazil will ultimately settle in at 4th place, after they lose to Argentina. The question is whether Germany can beat the Netherlands.


----------



## SiegendesLicht

Germans are beating Brazilians and unmasking American moles in their defense ministry...Who knows, maybe something bigger and better than a few scored goals will grow out of this. Maybe these people are recovering a bit of their pride after all...


----------



## elgar's ghost

I could never have predicted a scoreline like that, but I always had a sneaking feeling that any team that was both well-organised and confident in their own abilities had what it took to beat Brazil in their own backyard - for so long too many good teams have had a debilitating inferiority complex when facing the most over-hyped national side of the last 12-15 years.


----------



## hpowders

Piwikiwi said:


> To move one to a match against Brasil


Doubtful. The better team will win.


----------



## Piwikiwi

hpowders said:


> Doubtful. The better team will win.


We will see. Don't have a clue to be honest


----------



## hpowders

So many variables are involved with who will win a big match like this.

Mistakes, injuries, cards.

Nobody can predict what will happen. We can only sit by and watch.

One thing I know, no matter who wins today, I will get no money, no fame, no photo in Football's Most Handsome Players;

I'm rooting for Argentina. If they lose, I won't jump out my bedroom window. Besides, it's on the first floor.


----------



## hpowders

Piwikiwi said:


> We will see. Don't have a clue to be honest


Neither do I. One of us will be wrong. If I'm right, I will continue posting on this thread.
If I'm wrong....it won't be the first time.


----------



## hpowders

I am very impressed by the high level of sportsmanship exhibited in international football.
Nothing like it in any typical sporting events in the USA.


----------



## Kieran

De Jong is playing, presumably to Kung fu kick Messi into the middle of next season...


----------



## Guest

hpowders said:


> I am very impressed by the high level of sportsmanship exhibited in international football.
> Nothing like it in any typical sporting events in the USA.


Now that's not really a fair comparison, is it? You are comparing international to national. Tell me, if we were to compare it at the national level, how would things stand? British soccer hooligans are quite well known. As I have learned, the Uruguayan suspended for biting has a history of that, and not only at the international level. I believe he has bitten two others in the past?

At the international level, Americans are very sportsmanlike. At the national level, maybe there are differences. However, I can think of other instances, at the international level, where some really questionable action is displayed. Two world cups ago, I seem to remember a particularly notorious head-butting.

There have been multiple red cards in this World Cup - you could say that was unsportsmanlike. It isn't too often that people get ejected from games in American sports.


----------



## EricABQ

SiegendesLicht said:


> Germans are beating Brazilians and unmasking American moles in their defense ministry...Who knows, maybe something bigger and better than a few scored goals will grow out of this. Maybe these people are recovering a bit of their pride after all...


Yes, it's always a good thing for the world when the Germans get overly high on themselves.


----------



## senza sordino

EricABQ said:


> What's the difference between war and soccer?
> 
> In soccer, the Germans can hold a big lead.


We let the Germans win.


----------



## hpowders

Pretty even first half.


----------



## sabrina

Go Argentina!!! I have NO favourites in this game, but though I love Europe, I'd rather go with the Latin nation! And, I'd like Argentina to win the cup...as the Germans had enough glory beating poor Brazil


----------



## Wood

This is a good game for Dr Mike. No goals after an hour and little goalmouth action, and yet as fascinating and absorbing a match as a neutral is likely to see.


----------



## hpowders

Superlative defensive efforts by both teams in regular time. 

This is shaping up to be a real heartbreaker for one of these teams.


----------



## clara s

hpowders said:


> Superlative defensive efforts by both teams in regular time.
> 
> This is shaping up to be a real heartbreaker for one of these teams.


not bad game

not bad at all

I like both of them

may the best (and the luckiest) win


----------



## sabrina

For me it looks that both teams are too afraid not to get a goal, which is evidently true. But both are too defensive for my taste. I know they are both very good, still it's so boring. Hopefully one will score before the shoot outs


----------



## hpowders

Felicitaciones, Argentina! Usted preservado la dignidad del continente sudamericano, al menos por ahora!

Viva Argentina! Yes!! Yes!!


----------



## hpowders

hpowders said:


> Looking for Argentina to move on today.


Ummmm......yes!


----------



## hpowders

clara s said:


> not bad game
> 
> not bad at all
> 
> I like both of them
> 
> may the best (and the luckiest) win


The best one did win. Viva Argentina!!


----------



## clara s

hpowders said:


> The best one did win. Viva Argentina!!


Viva hahaha

has the fat lady already sung?

I do not think so


----------



## hpowders

Looking forward to a great championship match-great offense encounters great defense.


----------



## hpowders

clara s said:


> Viva hahaha
> 
> has the fat lady already sung?
> 
> I do not think so


Yes. That is true, but I think it's good for Latin America, not to have an all European championship match, although admittedly, from Brazil's standpoint, having Argentina there, is just as humiliating as losing big to Germany in the semis.


----------



## hpowders

clara s said:


> Viva hahaha
> 
> has the fat lady already sung?
> 
> I do not think so


Al menos por ahora.

Great offense meets great defense. Shaping up to be a great final match.


----------



## aleazk

wow, amazing Romero!


----------



## hpowders

Let's face it. With Argentina winning tonight to make the championship match, this is Brazil's worst nightmare. Last night was bad. This was just as bad.


----------



## sabrina

I know from my huge European experience that neighbours could be the worst enemies. I hardly understand that. I picked up Argentina just because there was no Brazil, to root for. I can't imagine how bad that can be. I wonder what team is preferable to win from the Brazilians point of view. I would have thought Argentina, as they speak similar languages...but only God knows the real answer. I can't imagine them rooting for Germany...


----------



## Kieran

I wonder if the winners get to keep the trophy: it'll be their third since the Jules Rimet trophy was claimed by the Brazilians in 1970...


----------



## EricABQ

With the Argentina win today I have clinched my $50 bet with my friend.

That is good, because Germany was also a team I had on my side of the bet, and now I will not be in the unfortunate situation of having to root for Germany in the final.


----------



## senza sordino

I have not missed a final in 32 years. I know I didn't watch the final of 1978. But since 1982 I haven't missed a final. I remember being late after lunch for school because I was watching World Cup Games in 1982. 

Now with Germany and Argentina, neither of which I can chear for, this could be missed.


----------



## Guest

So that is what passes for exciting? That was boring. I was listening to EUROPEAN announcers of the game talk about how poor a game it was. So few shots on goal. My prediction is Germany will wipe the floor with Argentina. Having only a good defense makes it harder for your opponent to score, true. It doesn't mean you have a better chance of scoring.

As I said before - soccer is to sports what trench warfare is to military strategy.


----------



## Guest

hpowders said:


> Let's face it. With Argentina winning tonight to make the championship match, this is Brazil's worst nightmare. Last night was bad. This was just as bad.


How so? I would have thought losing to Germany 7-1 and being knocked out of the chance to play in the finals would be their worst nightmare (aside from being knocked out in the first round).

Tonight was bad - boringly bad. Last night was exciting - as much as soccer can be exciting.


----------



## Guest

I'm still cheering for Germany. Argentina's win knocked me out of contention for the first prize in my office pool, but if Germany wins, I can still win 2nd place and get $20.


----------



## hpowders

DrMike said:


> How so? I would have thought losing to Germany 7-1 and being knocked out of the chance to play in the finals would be their worst nightmare (aside from being knocked out in the first round).
> 
> Tonight was bad - boringly bad. Last night was exciting - as much as soccer can be exciting.


There is intense rivalry among the South American nations. There is no love lost between Brazil and Argentina.

It is total humiliation for Brazil to see Argentina playing in a game they want to be in so badly.


----------



## hpowders

The final game should be a good one. Argentina does not have the porous defense that Brazil had.

Even so, Germany has been awesome and I will be shocked if Argentina beats them.

Yes. I have to go with Germany.


----------



## Guest

I'm not really up on how the different South American countries feel about each other. I guess that comes from not watching much soccer.

Still, though, I imagine it is agony enough watching ANYBODY but yourself compete in the finals when it is being held in your own country - that and getting the sh** kicked out of you on your home turf by the Germans.


----------



## hpowders

Yes. It will be a day Brazil will never forget. I just played a tape of the first half of yesterday's match and it was hard to watch.

A lot of Brazilians were crying. They really take their football super-seriously.


----------



## Vaneyes

Great game. Good sportsmanship.

Viva Argentina!


----------



## GreenMamba

DrMike said:


> So that is what passes for exciting? That was boring. I was listening to EUROPEAN announcers of the game talk about how poor a game it was. So few shots on goal. My prediction is Germany will wipe the floor with Argentina. Having only a good defense makes it harder for your opponent to score, true. It doesn't mean you have a better chance of scoring.
> 
> As I said before - soccer is to sports what trench warfare is to military strategy.


The Super Bowl was boring this year. It happens.


----------



## Piwikiwi

hpowders said:


> Ummmm......yes!


Awww, ah well now I can support my girlfriend's country of origin. GO GERMANY.


----------



## SiegendesLicht

I had to miss last night's game, otherwise I would not have gotten out of bed today. The table in front of the big screen at the German restaurant has been booked, friends have been invited and a grand finale on Sunday is being erwartet... I mean awaited... I am not even a real football fan (I only ever watch World Cups and European Cups), but hey, this is fun!


----------



## Guest

Same for me, SiegendsLicht, I'm not a regular football fan. I must tell you however that I'm supporting Argentina in the final. 
!! Arriba, arriba, Argentina !!


----------



## PabloElFlamenco

Living in the Netherlands, I decided against walking out to a café to be able to see NL-ARG, mostly due to the "22:00" starting hour of the game. I'm happy I listened to it on the radio, and went to bed after 90 minutes of playing time. I heard the result at breakfast. All Netherlands' fault: they should have scored. Period.
Now (lo siento mucho, amigos Argentinos) it's all Deutschland for me, alles bestes jungs.
PabloElBelga


----------



## TxllxT

Brazil population 202,828,000
Germany population 80,716,000
Argentina population 42,669,500
The Netherlands population 16,858,500

Well, the Dutch almost got there  . Compared with the population stats and World Cup history they continue to keep up  a nice record.


----------



## hpowders

"Almost" doesn't cut it. History is brimming with the failures known as "almosts".

It's time for Argentina-Germany. There is nobody else.

Argentina has a great defense, but even so, how can anyone stop the German scoring machine?

Germany looks like one of the greatest national teams of all time.


----------



## Kieran

I'm hoping Argentina win, but if the Germans score first, I don't see how they can. Messi can rubber stamp his place among the very very very elite who ever played, by having a decisive impact in the final, and really, this is what Argentina need, but I think the Germans will crowd him out quite effectively. It'll be tight, but Germany should win this, unfortunately...


----------



## mirepoix

I'd like to see Argentina win, although I believe this German team is stronger than their team of four years ago.
But when it comes down to it I don't care and would be happy to see a final minus dramatics/sinking the boot in, and with a surplus of one touch football and goals.


----------



## hpowders

I would like Argentina to win too, since the drought for them has gone on much too long.

But I am also a realist and even though Argentina has a great defense, the German scoring machine is from another planet.


----------



## hpowders

Piwikiwi said:


> Awww, ah well now I can support my girlfriend's country of origin. GO GERMANY.


Yeah. That's a tough pick!! :lol::lol:


----------



## hpowders

Can you imagine the terrific game Argentina will have played if they take Germany to penalty kicks to determine the champion?


----------



## mirepoix

hpowders said:


> I would like Argentina to win too, since the drought for them has gone on much too long.
> 
> But I am also a realist and even though Argentina has a great defense, the German scoring machine is from another planet.


Yes, I don't believe Argentina can do it. Although as I said, I'd like them to. They'd need the majority of their squad on top form and for the Germans to under perform.
Then again, depending on how you view the law of averages, the world cup has never been won in South America by a European team...


----------



## hpowders

mirepoix said:


> Yes, I don't believe Argentina can do it. Although as I said, I'd like them to. They'd need the majority of their squad on top form and for the Germans to under perform.
> Then again, depending on how you view the law of averages, the world cup has never been won in South America by a European team...


Well then Brazil has one business day to file a "Succession From The South American Union" form so if Germany wins, the claim will be null and void.


----------



## Piwikiwi

hpowders said:


> I would like Argentina to win too, since the drought for them has gone on much too long.
> 
> But I am also a realist and even though Argentina has a great defense, the German scoring machine is from another planet.


But it took penalties to win from the Netherlands and it's obvious that Germany is a LOT stronger than the Netherlands. Disclaimer:I don't know much about football.


----------



## SiegendesLicht

Today the driver who usually takes me and my coworkers to work, came sporting a German flag fluttering out of his window. Another one I saw behind the windshield of one of the company's big trucks that passed us on the road, going on his usual tour of the autobahns. The enthusiasm is rising...


----------



## Kieran

SiegendesLicht said:


> Today the driver who usually takes me and my coworkers to work, came sporting a German flag fluttering out of his window. Another one I saw behind the windshield of one of the company's big trucks that passed us on the road, going on his usual tour of the autobahns. The enthusiasm is rising...


*Today* the enthusiasm is rising? *Today?*

You're in the final! The tournament has been going on all month! What were you like before today? :devil:

Tell Angela that you're all taking the weekend off and get out there and make some noise! :trp:ut:

Here's an article which helped me appreciate the scale of the German achievement, a project that was started ten years ago and may come to fruition on Sunday...


----------



## SiegendesLicht

Kieran, I am in Belarus still! 

I can imagine though what the mood in Germany is like after that victory, and to what hights it is yet going to rise on Sunday. There will be a lot of noise made, either way, if they win or if they lose. But it is nice to see some of that Germanophile sentiment in Belarus too. My friends, who partly also share that sentiment, and I are going to be drinking beer, eating meat, speaking German and rooting for Germany on Sunday. And I am taking Monday off! :cheers::clap::trp:


----------



## Kieran

Good stuff, Sieg! I imagine the mood in Germany is becoming something loud and cheerful and it'll be a great weekend all over. I hope you enjoy the game and I think the Germans will win, although this time I'm rooting for Messi, and a dose of individual brilliance.

But I think that the German side is the only one that might be a great team in the World Cup. I found their ability to restructure and regroup over the last ten years or so to be remarkable, and maybe Klinsmann deserves a lot of credit, I don't know. Brazil should look at that, and not despair...


----------



## Cnote11

I'm just happy the Netherlands didn't make it to the finals... here is to hoping Brazil manages to pull it out today, but it honestly looks like it'll be another bloodbath...


----------



## Piwikiwi

Ha suck it Brasil!


----------



## hpowders

First there was embarrassment by Germany. Then there was embarrassment by the Dutch. Then there was not even a bronze medal.

There is only one thing left to complete the Brazilian nation's worst nightmare and that is if Argentina wins the World Cup.


----------



## tdc

hpowders said:


> There is only one thing left to complete the Brazilian nation's worst nightmare and that is if Argentina wins the World Cup.


Actually, I think most of them would rather see Argentina win, largely because they feel Messi deserves to win a world cup. This is what Neymar said anyway.


----------



## SiegendesLicht

Wow! The Dutch winning 3:0! Another great game!


----------



## hpowders

tdc said:


> Actually, I think most of them would rather see Argentina win, largely because they feel Messi deserves to win a world cup. This is what Neymar said anyway.


Argentina and Brazil are hated rivals. It's like the Blue against the Gray in the American Civil War.


----------



## tdc

hpowders said:


> Argentina and Brazil are hated rivals. It's like the Blue against the Gray in the American Civil War.


You've got a point, but somehow I don't think seeing the team that recently humiliated them 7-1 in front of their fans hoist the world cup is going to make this scenario any less nightmarish for Brazil. I think the nightmare is already complete for this team and its back to the drawing board for Brazil. Time to focus on team defense a little here guys.


----------



## hpowders

tdc said:


> You've got a point, but somehow I don't think seeing the team that recently humiliated them 7-1 in front of their fans hoist the world cup is going to make this scenario any less nightmarish for Brazil. I think the nightmare is already complete for this team and its back to the drawing board for Brazil. Time to focus on team defense a little here guys.


Well that's true too. Brazil seems to be in a "no win" situation concerning the final match. If they were smart, they would put on Beethoven's Pastoral Symphony, take a deep breath, relax and forget this World Cup madness.

There are more important things in life.


----------



## Norse

The match was marred by some weird calls by the referee(s). The early penalty should have been a red card instead, the second goal was actually an offside, and Brazil should have gotten a penalty kick in the second half, instead they got a yellow card for diving. Correct calls probably wouldn't have saved Brazil (especially with 10 vs 11), but maybe it could have been more of a nail-biter..


----------



## SiegendesLicht

hpowders said:


> There are more important things in life.


Exactly! If Germans take a thrashing from Argentina tomorrow, not a note of Wagner or Beethoven or any other of the great Teutonic masters will sound any less beautiful for that. And that is the most important thing, no?


----------



## hpowders

SiegendesLicht said:


> Exactly! If Germans take a thrashing from Argentina tomorrow, not a note of Wagner or Beethoven or any other of the great Teutonic masters will sound any less beautiful for that. And that is the most important thing, no?


Yes. That's true, but from what I have observed so far, Germany should go on to complete the job. They have been the most impressive of the 32 participants and deserve to win. I've never seen any National Team play this well. They look like they have been playing together for years.


----------



## Piwikiwi

Norse said:


> The match was marred by some weird calls by the referee(s). The early penalty should have been a red card instead, the second goal was actually an offside, and Brazil should have gotten a penalty kick in the second half, instead they got a yellow card for diving. Correct calls probably wouldn't have saved Brazil (especially with 10 vs 11), but maybe it could have been more of a nail-biter..


I agree that was a terrible referee but I'm still gladctgat we won^^


----------



## Guest

SiegendesLicht said:


> Exactly! If Germans take a thrashing from Argentina tomorrow, not a note of Wagner or Beethoven or any other of the great Teutonic masters will sound any less beautiful for that. And that is the most important thing, no?


Absolutely. In fact, I'd like to see Argentina thrash Germany to the soundtrack of Beethoven's 9th (Finale) blaring out in the background.


----------



## Kieran

I think Messi needs to have a great game tonight, if we're going to continuously stretch things and compare him with Diego. I wouldn't be able to listen to comparisons with Pele and Maradona if what we've seen so far is the best Messi has, at the highest level...


----------



## TxllxT




----------



## hpowders

Even though I wrote that Germany is the best of the 32 teams and deserve to win, I'm still rooting for Argentina. It's been a long time for them. It would be one heck of a match if they could win today. For this to happen, Messi needs to have a great game, otherwise things could get messy.


----------



## hpowders

Piwikiwi said:


> I agree that was a terrible referee but I'm still gladctgat we won^^


Bronze is better than nothing. Being #3 out 32 teams isn't too bad.


----------



## hpowders

TalkingHead said:


> Absolutely. In fact, I'd like to see Argentina thrash Germany to the soundtrack of Beethoven's 9th (Finale) blaring out in the background.


Karajan or Furtwängler? The choreographer needs to know 8 hours before the match. An Amazon drone should get it there on time.


----------



## TxllxT

TalkingHead said:


> Absolutely. In fact, I'd like to see Argentina thrash Germany to the soundtrack of Beethoven's 9th (Finale) blaring out in the background.





hpowders said:


> Karajan or Furtwängler? The choreographer needs to know 8 hours before the match. An Amazon drone should get it there on time.


Good question: Who did the most blaring Finale ever of Beethoven's 9th? My guess: Yevgeny Mravinsky. But of course all should remain Teutonic


----------



## clara s

hpowders said:


> Karajan or Furtwängler? The choreographer needs to know 8 hours before the match. An Amazon drone should get it there on time.


what are you talking about?

Daniel Barenboim of course, as being Argentine-born hahaha

a Buenos Aires boy


----------



## EricABQ

I'll go on record with a pick of Germany 2 - 0. I haven't seen enough offense out of Argentina to think they can pull off the upset. 

I hope I'm wrong.


----------



## SiegendesLicht

I hope you are right.


----------



## hpowders

clara s said:


> what are you talking about?
> 
> Daniel Barenboim of course, as being Argentine-born hahaha
> 
> a Buenos Aires boy


Yes but he claims to be an Israeli.

Once I was sitting a few seats away from him at a concert at Carnegie Hall in New York City. I would have asked him about the Argentinian thing if I knew about it at that time. (He was listening to his old buddy Pinchas Zuckerman perform).

Maybe if Argentina wins today, Barenboim will renounce his Israeli citizenship and reclaim his long lost love for Argentina.

Whatever happens, don't cry for Barenboim, Argentina.


----------



## hpowders

TxllxT said:


> Good question: Who did the most blaring Finale ever of Beethoven's 9th? My guess: Yevgeny Mravinsky. But of course all should remain Teutonic


Toscanini is on reserve waiting to come in and substitute for Karajan if the heat gets to him. Imagine Toscanini in a FIFA shirt.


----------



## Headphone Hermit

TxllxT said:


>


Dear God, let your *hand* help US this time :lol:


----------



## Headphone Hermit

hpowders said:


> Toscanini is on reserve waiting to come in and substitute for Karajan if the heat gets to him. Imagine Toscanini in a FIFA shirt.


'twud have to be a big 'un :lol:

And he'd have his shorts pulled up to his armpits too!


----------



## hpowders

Second yellow card on Germany should have been a red. Very dirty play; almost made a bass-baritone Argentine player into a soprano.


----------



## hpowders

Headphone Hermit said:


> 'twud have to be a big 'un :lol:
> 
> And he'd have his shorts pulled up to his armpits too!


And he'd be yelling like crazy from the sideline!!


----------



## senza sordino

I'm sorry, all this scoreless football is my fault. This is only my second full game I've watched. I watched Argentina play Netherlands to another scoreless game, the semifinal. I watched some of yesterday's game, but I tuned in after Netherlands had already scored twice and I didn't see the third goal. 

I've now watched over 250 minutes of football and yet to see a goal.


----------



## hpowders

Terrific defensive match, but to win the World Cup one must score goals. Messi was horrible when they needed him the most.

Glad it didn't come down to penalty kicks. That would be a horrible way to determine the World Cup winner.

Anyhow, congratulations to Germany. The two best teams fought hard for the Cup and the best team won.


----------



## TxllxT




----------



## sabrina

Congrats to Germany! After a boring semifinal, one big piece of boring final...Good God 120 min for 1 goal!


----------



## hpowders

^^^It was a terrific, hard fought defensive match; one of the best I've seen. It's not all about goal-scoring.

Do you realize what kind of tremendous defense Argentina had to play to keep Germany off the board until almost the end of extended time?


----------



## hpowders

Oh well....now its back to boring baseball in the US. It's either that or watching my living room walls' paint dry.

I think I'll take the walls!!!


----------



## aleazk

Both teams played very well. Terrific defense from Argentina, but the attack was missing or was imprecise, really puzzling, considering that the team was known for its attack players rather than the defense. And, of course, no attack means no goals. That's what happened.


----------



## Winterreisender

Ugh... there was a public viewing about 50m from my house. I can still hear fireworks and obnoxious screaming. Probably won't be getting much sleep tonight. 

On the flip side, at least I now know how it feels to live in a world cup winning country, lol...


----------



## Badinerie

Great match. Argentina could so easily have come out on top but Germany played by the book and kept slamming them with it. Beautiful goal. Messi played well and was a constant threat. Shame he cocked up at the end but no shame on his performance.
Watching German team climb the stairs now for the Cup presentation.


----------



## TxllxT

For the 1st time in history a European team wins the World Cup in South America.


----------



## HaydnBearstheClock

Congrats to Germany! They deserved the world cup title. An extremely well-rounded team.


----------



## SiegendesLicht

I am just back from that German restaurant where I have drunk beer and rooted for Germany.

It was a good night.

And it was a great game.

And the score is all that matters.

Here's to victory...


----------



## EricABQ

Screw Germany. 

But at least I won $50.


----------



## Piwikiwi

hpowders said:


> Oh well....now its back to boring baseball in the US. It's either that or watching my living room walls' paint dry.
> 
> I think I'll take the walls!!!


Watching paint dry is surprisingly interesting.


----------



## Fugue Meister

Man those German's can really toss that soccer ball.


----------



## Headphone Hermit

Winterreisender said:


> at least I now know how it feels to live in a world cup winning country, lol...


Unlikely ever to happen when you're residing in Birmingham


----------



## Guest

A good game, with a great goal and just reward for the team that worked harder on an attacking gameplan.

Now, if England keep all but one of their current team and go again in 2018, can they repeat the same feat as Germany? :lol:


----------



## Kieran

It was a good final, a lot of players rose to the occasion brilliantly, particularly Mascherano and Schweinsteiger. The Argies left their shooting boots in the dressing room. Messi had more space than against the Dutch, but he didn't make a decisive use of it. Ozil was anonymous and it's a miracle he stayed on the pitch so long. Very entertaining final, won by a great goal.

I think it was a World Cup that had more entertainment than great players, or great teams. The level in the knockout stages was a bit bogey. Brazil just sacked Big Phil. Now they should sack the players too. And start again - the way Germany did, about ten years ago. That was the strangest this of the World Cup for me - the absolute lack of any style in Brazilian football. They picked a bad year to host this tournament...


----------



## ArtMusic

My grandma suggested Germany would win. She was right. I was wrong.


----------



## EricABQ

Well, soccer was fun for the last month. 

Really caught fire in the US. A lot of that had to do with the favorable time zone. We shall see if is as popular next time with 4am start times. 

Now, looking ahead to August we have the FIBA Basketball World Cup. Not quite as big of a deal, but should be a good tournament. It is being held in Spain, and Spain is very good, so they will be a real test for the US.


----------



## hpowders

ArtMusic said:


> My grandma suggested Germany would win. She was right. I was wrong.


Sadly, one can't choose one's family.


----------



## hpowders

Telling it like it was at the World Cup, Ian Darke, ESPN announcer, "The reviews of Lionel Messi were not going to be very kind" after this World Cup.

Dumbest sour grapes statement at the World Cup, Aldo Malizia, Brazilian fan. "The Pope may be Argentine, but God is Brazilian."

How dumb can you get??? :lol:


----------



## Guest

With Germany's win, I took 2nd place in my office pool, thanks to that goal by someone whose name I don't know. Time to go back to ignoring soccer for at least another 4 years.


----------



## Guest

hpowders said:


> ^^^It was a terrific, hard fought defensive match; one of the best I've seen. It's not all about goal-scoring.
> 
> Do you realize what kind of tremendous defense Argentina had to play to keep Germany off the board until almost the end of extended time?


The point of EVERY sport is to win. And if all you do is defense, you don't win. Defend all you want, but nobody wins until somebody has a little bit more offense than the other. Think about it - nobody ever said, "That was such a wonderfully long, drawn out war. What incredible defenses. It's not about scoring points against the other side."

Again - that is why soccer just doesn't have the appeal to Americans. It focuses overwhelmingly on defense, almost to the detriment of offense. It is so foreign to American sports, in games where we talk about fast breaks, getting behind the defense, etc. Not that there is no place for defense in American sports, but we really don't have a sport that focuses on defense quite to the extent that soccer does. We don't like wars of attrition. It merely tends to wear out both sides and leaves everybody feeling incomplete, even when there is eventually a winner.


----------



## Guest

hpowders said:


> Oh well....now its back to boring baseball in the US. *It's either that or watching my living room walls' paint dry.*
> 
> I think I'll take the walls!!!


I thought the World Cup was over.


----------



## Kieran

DrMike said:


> The point of EVERY sport is to win. And if all you do is defense, you don't win. Defend all you want, but nobody wins until somebody has a little bit more offense than the other. Think about it - nobody ever said, "That was such a wonderfully long, drawn out war. What incredible defenses. It's not about scoring points against the other side."
> 
> Again - that is why soccer just doesn't have the appeal to Americans. It focuses overwhelmingly on defense, almost to the detriment of offense. It is so foreign to American sports, in games where we talk about fast breaks, getting behind the defense, etc. Not that there is no place for defense in American sports, but we really don't have a sport that focuses on defense quite to the extent that soccer does. We don't like wars of attrition. It merely tends to wear out both sides and leaves everybody feeling incomplete, even when there is eventually a winner.


There's definitely a cultural reason why Americans don't take to football. I think you like fast action, fast scoring - and soccer is more about anticipation, and sometimes even, nothingness. Goals become precious in football, this is why defence is so important. Brazil's defence was like children in a playground - had they more discipline and common-sense, they might have kept the scores in their last two matches respectable.

You can't have a great side without having a strong defence. It's been shown throughout football history that teams which neglect the defence have doomed themselves to fail. An organised and rigorous defence is the first thing, because when you don't have the ball, you need to know how to get it back.

After this, some creativity in midfield and potency in attack - but even here, these players should be the first lines of defence. In other words, when Ronaldo loses the ball outside the opponents penalty area, his first task is to try retrieve it, and not to sulk and buff his chest with suntan oil and preen himself for the cameras. Defence isn't just for the defenders, it starts with everybody as soon as the ball is lost.

I think football will catch on in the States, when you stop look for high scoring games. I'm not a huge football fan myself, I'm more into tennis, but I enjoy football and of course, it can be dull as ditchwater sometimes, and they flop about like salmon on a river as soon as they're nudged, but it has its own way of expressing the human spirit at play...


----------



## Guest

Of course you have to have defense. You can't have all one and none of the other. But you have to strike the right balance. And, arguably, having a great offense compensates for not having the best defense. Your defense doesn't have to be as good if you are constantly putting the pressure on the other team's defense. Think about it - what is the weakest position on the field? The goalkeeper. He has a large goal that he has to defend. He is given greater latitude to defend it - he can use his hands, he is given greater protection from things like tackles, etc., by the rules. But if a midfielder misses a play, it is less consequential as when the goalkeeper misses. So you keep the pressure on the goalkeeper. You have some defense of your own as well, but it is not as consequential if the ball only rarely makes it down to your end. So in that sense, a good offense can compensate for deficiencies in the defense. In the case of Brazil, it wasn't only that they lacked a good defence - they lacked just about everything. It's not like it was a high-scoring game all around. Brazil could neither defend nor score.

American sports do like things tipped more towards offense. We recognize the need for a good defense, and train for it. In the case of American football, each team has an entire squad that specialized in defense. But even in other sports where you have to play, simultaneously, offense and defense, just as you do with soccer, there is still a slightly larger emphasis put on being aggressive and going on the offensive. When teams are forced back on the defensive, they are not viewed as being in a strong position to win the game, rather they are letting the other team set the pace.


----------



## hpowders

DrMike said:


> I thought the World Cup was over.


Heh! Heh! Yes indeed-ee. It finally is! Next stop Russia in 4 years.


----------



## Kieran

DrMike said:


> So you keep the pressure on the goalkeeper. You have some defense of your own as well, but it is not as consequential if the ball only rarely makes it down to your end. So in that sense, a good offense can compensate for deficiencies in the defense.


How do you think the opposition prepare to meet your good offense? With solid defence! :lol:

History shows that sides who play with main regard for attacking, the philosophy being "if they score 3, we'll score 4!" don't succeed at high levels. But I do agree, a great side also needs good attack, to keep the pressure off the defence. This Argentina side lacked the gap between the two, maybe: the midfield. They were good at defensive duties, but not so creative when it came to keeping the Germans in their own half...


----------



## elgar's ghost

Congratulations to Germany - worthy winners. OK, the final wasn't a purist's dream but with two teams as well-organised as those two and with what was at stake perhaps it was never likely to be an end-to-end humdinger. However, it certainly knocked spots off the previous final that was contested between them in 1990 - a real turgid and spiteful affair, as I recall.


----------



## mirepoix

Well, I missed the final and only now got to see the goal - he did a great job of killing the momentum just enough to drop and then finish delightfully. Congrats to the Germans, commiserations to the Argentinians.


----------



## sospiro

No footie to look forward to on the tellybox. Withdrawal symptoms.


----------



## Guest

Don't worry - as hpowders mentioned, you can go spread some paint on the wall and watch it dry. Apparently it is equally exciting.

:devil:


----------



## hpowders

^^^I said watching paint dry is as exciting as watching baseball. No reference there to soccer.

The World Cup I found very exciting. In soccer, one has to appreciate the tremendous agility and passing skills-controlling and shooting the ball with both feet, being able to bend the ball from left to right and right to left and being able to shoot the ball at the goal and make the ball drop.

There's a lot of skill involved in soccer and if you find it boring, I'm sure there must be a modern art museum within the city where you live to palpitate your heart a bit.


----------



## Wood

sospiro said:


> No footie to look forward to on the tellybox. Withdrawal symptoms.


Don't worry, Match of the Day will be back in a month and in the meantime there is the Tour de France and the Commonwealth Games.

It is another fine summer of TV sport, with the only blot being the lack of live Test cricket again this year.


----------



## Guest

hpowders said:


> ^^^I said watching paint dry is as exciting as watching baseball. No reference there to soccer.
> 
> The World Cup I found very exciting. In soccer, one has to appreciate the tremendous agility and passing skills-controlling and shooting the ball with both feet, being able to bend the ball from left to right and right to left and being able to shoot the ball at the goal and make the ball drop.
> 
> There's a lot of skill involved in soccer and if you find it boring, I'm sure there must be a modern art museum within the city where you live to palpitate your heart a bit.


Well I won't deny that I also find baseball boring, but if it is skill that you appreciate, then I don't know why baseball is your target for derision. What of the skill of a pitcher being able to throw a small, simple ball in so many different ways - sliders, slowballs, fastballs, curveballs, having it break high or low or left or right, while still propelling it at speeds that are illegal for cars and into a target zone so small - much smaller than a soccer goal. Then there is the skill required to hit such a ball hurling at you at such fast speeds and curving or whatever else the pitcher has been able to make it do, all while using a stick not much different in diameter from that ball. And then there is the skill and presence of mind required to make a double or triple play - knowing exactly who to throw the ball to as the ball is coming to you. Throwing across you body while you are off balance, or even in the air, and getting it across the field in time to tag out the runner. Sliding into a plate, contorting your body so as to tag the plate while avoiding the person holding the ball trying to tag you.

Most sports require great skill and agility and athleticism from those who would play well. There is no denying the skill involved in playing soccer. But form alone is not what makes a game exciting. What about the skill of being able to throw a basketball into a hoop? Or of a perfectly executed pass and reception in football?

So one can find skill in just about every sport. But it takes more than that to bring excitement, else you would be equally enthralled by baseball.


----------



## sospiro

Wood said:


> Don't worry, Match of the Day will be back in a month and in the meantime there is the Tour de France and the Commonwealth Games.


True. True. And only 1 year, 10 months, 3 weeks and 6 days until the start of Euro 2016.





Wood said:


> It is another fine summer of TV sport, with the only blot being the lack of live Test cricket again this year.


Such a shame.


----------



## mirepoix

I remember the test match coverage from years ago... 'Jonners' and 'Aggers' and 'Blowers' and all the ex public schoolboy patter. It was a delight on a sunny afternoon to sit and listen to their commentary punctuated by such as _"...and we've just been sent a wonderful cake baked by the wife of one of our listeners, Col. Smyth-Plunger, and oh, there goes a number 28 bus from behind the pavilion end..."_


----------



## Wood

mirepoix said:


> I remember the test match coverage from years ago... 'Jonners' and 'Aggers' and 'Blowers' and all the ex public schoolboy patter. It was a delight on a sunny afternoon to sit and listen to their commentary punctuated by such as _"...and we've just been sent a wonderful cake baked by the wife of one of our listeners, Col. Smyth-Plunger, and oh, there goes a number 28 bus from behind the pavilion end..."_


I remember when Aggers was playing, his seat being held by the wino connoisseur and poet John Arlott.

That was the period of 'The batsman is Holding, the bowler's....' etc etc


----------



## mirepoix

^^^ yep, I remember it well and it seems a world away.
And also, not forgetting:


----------



## sospiro

mirepoix said:


> I remember the test match coverage from years ago... 'Jonners' and 'Aggers' and 'Blowers' and all the ex public schoolboy patter. It was a delight on a sunny afternoon to sit and listen to their commentary punctuated by such as _"...and we've just been sent a wonderful cake baked by the wife of one of our listeners, Col. Smyth-Plunger, and oh, there goes a number 28 bus from behind the pavilion end..."_


Do you remember the legover?


----------



## SiegendesLicht

Some great pictures of celebrating Germans and dejected Argentinians here . Wish I was there to join in the fun. And no violence whatsoever, no broken windows or burned cars. That is how a civilized nation celebrates.

Last night was fun, and the _Paulaner_ was good. And today at work everyone made a point of congratulating me, as if I had something to do with this victory. I even forgot I only had four hours of sleep last night...


----------



## sospiro

SiegendesLicht said:


> Some great pictures of celebrating Germans and dejected Argentinians here . Wish I was there to join in the fun. And no violence whatsoever, no broken windows or burned cars. That is how a civilized nation celebrates.
> 
> Last night was fun, and the _Paulaner_ was good. And today at work everyone made a point of congratulating me, as if I had something to do with this victory. I even forgot I only had four hours of sleep last night...


Germany is a superb team. I wouldn't mind trying to see one of their matches in Euro 2016.


----------



## hpowders

Someone should do a sociological study as to why fans take sporting events so seriously. It's not like they have a vested interest in the winning team-no money, no fame, no TV or magazine interviews.

I like watching, but I do not cry if my team loses, I do not set fire to cars and riot in the streets. Why on earth do people react this way?

If the fans ever wise up and ask themselves "why are we getting so emotional about an event that doesn't directly affect us?" watch inflated athletes' salaries plummet and ticket sales and TV revenue stall.

Of course these are the same deep thinkers who regard hip-hop and vulgar Rap lyrics as the greatest music in the world.

In other words, hpowders is dreaming.


----------



## Headphone Hermit

Wood said:


> It is another fine summer of TV sport, with the only blot being the lack of live Test cricket again this year.


confession: I sold out years ago and subscribed to satellite channels to watch the Tour de France live .... and test cricket too, if I wish


----------



## SiegendesLicht

hpowders said:


> Someone should do a sociological study as to why fans take sporting events so seriously. It's not like they have a vested interest in the winning team-no money, no fame, no TV or magazine interviews.


It's some sort of a mixture of thrill - whether your team scores or not and good old national pride.

Personally, I would love to see all those Germans who gathered in front of the Brandenburg Gate in Berlin to watch the game last night, crowd into opera houses and get high on their own _Hochkultur_. But that is not happening, so we might as well celebrate a football victory.


----------



## hpowders

SiegendesLicht said:


> It's some sort of a mixture of thrill - whether your team scores or not and good old national pride.
> 
> Personally, I would love to see all those Germans who gathered in front of the Brandenburg Gate in Berlin to watch the game last night, crowd into opera houses and get high on their own _Hochkultur_. But that is not happening, so we might as well celebrate a football victory.


The national pride angle I fully comprehend, but many fans are emotional to a degree that is way, way out of proportion to the importance of the event. Winning a big sporting event won't put food on the rabid fans' tables, get them a job and if they already have a job, give them a raise. The only ones who benefit from winning are the players and coaches.

As consolation, losing a big sporting event will not take food away from the horribly depressed fans' tables, eliminate their jobs and lower their paychecks. The only ones who might get screwed are the players and coaches.

Fan reaction to big sporting events is the same in the US.


----------



## Headphone Hermit

sospiro said:


> Do you remember the legover?


Great stuff, indeed ..... but Bumble is also wonderful 




apologies for the dreadful images, but 'someone's knicked my lawnmower' is one of my favourites!


----------



## Headphone Hermit

Sorry - rubbish written. Binned. 

will lie down in darkened room soon


----------



## sospiro

Headphone Hermit said:


> confession: I sold out years ago and subscribed to satellite channels to watch the Tour de France live .... and test cricket too, if I wish


TdF is on terrestrial and every stage is live on ITV4. Now I just wish I could see live cricket. (My place is a Sky-free zone)


----------



## Couac Addict

Well, another World Cup over...well done Bayern München


----------



## Vaneyes

Congrats to Germany. Another great game. Argentina did well to "hold them" off as long as they did.:tiphat:


----------



## hpowders

These great World Cup photos indicate I really should attend the next one.


----------

