# Orchestrated piano works



## maestro267

Lately I've been looking into different orchestrations of Mussorgsky's Pictures at an Exhibition, other than the famous Ravel one. I bought a recording recently where each movement was orchestrated by a different composer.

I wonder if anyone has attempted to orchestrate a complete Beethoven piano sonata. Or any other sonata for that matter. I know the purists may shudder at it, but they don't have to listen if they don't want to. It's just fascinating to see what colours the orchestrator comes up with, especially if they use larger forces.


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## PetrB

F.Y.I. With a very small handful of exceptions, the majority of Ravel's own orchestral works are orchestrations of his original piano pieces.


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## schuberkovich

You might be interested in Rubbra's orchestration of Brahms's Handel Variations:


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## Mahlerian

Theo Verbey's orchestration of Berg's Piano Sonata (in one movement) sounds like a precursor to Berg's own Three Orchestral Pieces.






Stravinsky very inventively orchestrated his set of easy piano pieces "Les Cinq Doigts" for small ensemble.


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## ptr

When I took Composition/Music Theory at university, about all of the second year was spent on orchestration exercises like; take the sonata of X and orchestrate the first movement imitating the style and zeitgeist of "Composer Z", the second like "Y" and the finale like "X". Very educational, gives quite good insight into each epoch built its musical Lego!

I was mostly a useless hack at this, but the Finale MIDI playback of my orchestration of the aforementioned Webern Piano Sonata in the style of the middle Mozart brought down a few hearty laughs from the auditorium... 

/ptr


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## Aggelos

maestro267 said:


> Lately I've been looking into different orchestrations of Mussorgsky's Pictures at an Exhibition, other than the famous Ravel one. I bought a recording recently where each movement was orchestrated by a different composer.


two nice threads

http://www.talkclassical.com/4813-pictures-exhibition-ravel-vs.html
http://www.talkclassical.com/8661-orchestral-transcriptions-orchestrations.html


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## PetrB

One stellar lesson in how to orchestrate from relatively simple piano music is Mahler's orchestration of his _Kindertoten Lieder,_ (as well as the other later orchestrated songs which were originally for voice and piano.)

These are such ingenious and effective transliterations that they often end up cited in textbooks on orchestration.

The more pianistic the piece, i.e. dependent upon how the piano behaves, pedaling and the aggregate harmonics beyond the written notes, the more difficult the challenge to orchestrate such pieces. Famously, Ravel did not orchestrate the _Toccata_ from his _Le Tombeau de Couperin,_ (someone did, much later, do a 'decent' job, yet that is not wholly effective, imo.) I also have yet to hear a wholly effective orchestration of Debussy's _Clair de lune_ from his _Suite Bergamasque._ Ditto for _any_ Chopin piano piece! 

Schoenberg did such an effective orchestration of Brahms' _Piano quartet No. 1_ that he felt comfortable dubbing it _"Brahms' Fifth"_ (symphony.) It has later been called "an orchestral powerhouse to rival _Pictures at an Exhibition._"


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## Orfeo

-Glazunov's "Chopiniana" (his rather Russian orchestration of various Chopin's piano pieces.
-Alexander Borodin's "Petite" Suite (orchestrated by Glazunov).
-Myaskovsky's "Links" from his earlier piano pieces.


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## maestro267

Interesting stuff so far. Thanks! I forgot about the Brahms/Schoenberg Quartet. I'll have to give that a listen at some point.


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## Norse

Prokofiev's _Visions Fugitives_ has been arranged for full orchestra by Susskind and for string orchestra by Barshai. The latter has been recorded several times and isn't hard to find (eg Spotify). It would have been interesting to hear Susskind's version, but I'm not finding any recordings of it..

Also, Respighi orchestrated five of Rachmaninov's _Etudes-Tableaux_:


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## Aggelos

Mussorgsky's other "Pictures" opus as orchestrated by Walter Goehr...





The 'Pictures from the Crimea' are three of Mussorgsky's piano pieces as orchestrated by Walter Goehr. The third of them, the "Capriccio" heard here, is one of two 'Reminiscences' of a visit that Mussorgsky made to the Crimea region of Southern Russia in 1879. In this colourful recording, Geoffrey Simon conducts the Philharmonia Orchestra.
http://www.musicweb-international.com/classrev/2001/June01/Mussorgsky_Pictures.htm


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## sdtom

I think most works begin with the piano.
Tom


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## mtmailey

Most composers sketch out works on piano then make it into a full orchestra works.Like Schubert symphony 10 was a piano version before it was made in a full symphony.


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## QuietGuy

San Francisco Symphony/MTT

Ives' Concord Sonata as Concord Symphony


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## violadude

sdtom said:


> I think most works begin with the piano.
> Tom


Ya but that's different from transposing an existing piece, written for the piano, into an orchestral piece. When a composer writes a piano score for a piece they are intending to orchestrate they're not at all worried about whether it's pianistic or even possible to play on the piano.

The only purpose of writing the piece on a piano score first is so you can see the layout of everything (harmony and form and whatnot) on a neat and easy to read scale before you start all the orchestration and transposing (and not all composers start with a piano score or find it helpful to start with one).

But piano scores that act as precursors to orchestra pieces aren't actually meant to be played on piano too.


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## mikey




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## SalieriIsInnocent

At one time I knew who orchestrated this, but years make you forget





Stokowski was quite good at orchestrating works

I still prefer the piano all day to this





One of my favorite orchestrations by Stokowski





Stokowski's orchestrations of Pictures at an Exhibition are really good, though I still love Ravel's more.


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## Aggelos

Leopold Stokowski's orchestration of Debussy's piano prelude 'La Cathedrale Engloutie' is here played by the Philharmonia Orchestra conducted by Geoffrey Simon (Cala Records). It evokes an ancient legend in which the submerged Cathedral of Ys rises slowly out of the sea, its bells ringing and priests chanting, and then sinks slowly back again into the watery depths.
http://www.musicweb-international.com/classrev/2000/oct00/debussyengulfed.htm





Buxtehude's "Sarabande and Courante," dating from the 1600s and originally written for keyboard, was arranged by Leopold Stokowski for a solo electrical Ondes Martenot and Orchestra. This extraordinary version is played here by Cynthia Millar with the BBC Philharmonic conducted by Matthias Bamert.





Stokowski's colourful edition of 8 movements from Handel's "Water Music" was recorded by the BBC Philharmonic under Matthias Bamert. We hear 5 numbers (Allegro; Bourree; Hornpipe; Andante; and a final Allegro). The superb oboe solo in the 'Andante' is played by Christopher Blake.





The 'Dead March' from Handel's "Saul" is heard here in a dramatic orchestration by Leopold Stokowski, played by the BBC Philharmonic under Matthias Bamert.
http://www.musicweb-international.com/classrev/2002/Jan02/Symphbaroq.htm





Borodin's "Requeim" started out as one of several little piano pieces (others were composed by Rimsky-Korsakov, Cui and Liadov) based on the repeating 'ostinato' children's theme 'Chopsticks' (or 'Tati-Tati' as it is known in Russia). Borodin added the opening words of the Requiem into his piano score ("Requiem aeternum dona eis, Domine, et lux perpetua luceat eis") to be sung by a male chorus. Many years later, Leopold Stokowski arranged this piano piece for a huge orchestra and it received its first recording under Geoffrey Simon's baton in 1992.
http://www.musicweb-international.com/classrev/2001/June01/BorodinRequiem.htm





Debussy's "La Soiree dans Grenade" (or "La Noche en Granada"), originally for piano, is played in Stokowski's colourful orchestration by the Philharmonia Orchestra under Geoffrey Simon.
http://www.musicweb-international.com/classrev/2000/oct00/Debussynight.htm


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## DeepR

PetrB said:


> F.Y.I. With a very small handful of exceptions, the majority of Ravel's own orchestral works are orchestrations of his original piano pieces.


One of his piano pieces that Ravel himself didn't orchestrate:






I don't know if this is a good orchestration from a technical point of view but I totally love it (more so than the original piano piece).


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## joen_cph

Some more not mentioned hitherto:

Arnold Schönberg/Maegaard:"Variations o a Recitative", for organ

Carl Nielsen/Abrahamsen:"3 Piano Pieces" (for chamber ensemble)

Vitezlav Novak/Novak:"Pan", Symphonic Poem

Eugen Suchon/Suchon:"Baladic Suite"

Scriabin/Nemtin:"Nuances", suite of orchestrated piano pieces 

Schumann/Glazunov etc.:"Carnaval"

Liszt/Weiner:"Sonata for Piano"

Liszt/Lambert:"Dante Sonata"

Tchaikovsky/Gauk:"The Seasons", 12 Pieces


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## Piwikiwi

PetrB said:


> F.Y.I. With a very small handful of exceptions, the majority of Ravel's own orchestral works are orchestrations of his original piano pieces.


Which is a bit of a bummer, I prefer his original orchestral music to his transciptions


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## maestro267

The Hammerklavier was one of the sonatas I was thinking of when it came to ones that might be orchestrated.


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## violadude

maestro267 said:


> The Hammerklavier was one of the sonatas I was thinking of when it came to ones that might be orchestrated.


That piece probably wouldn't translate well to orchestra.


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## Orfeo

violadude said:


> The only purpose of writing the piece on a piano score first is so you can see the layout of everything (harmony and form and whatnot) on a neat and easy to read scale before you start all the orchestration and transposing (and not all composers start with a piano score or find it helpful to start with one).


A metemorphosis (or what Vernon Handley would call, a composing).


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## Guest

Boulez - Notations


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## Aggelos

Mozart's 'Rondo alla Turca,' from his Piano Sonata No. 11 in A, was orchestrated by Leopold Stokowski under the title "Turkish March." It is played here by the BBC Philharmonic under Matthias Bamert and comes from their Chandos CD "Stokowski Encores."





Shostakovich's "United Nations March" (from the MGM war-time musical 'Thousands Cheer') is heard here in the orchestration by Leopold Stokowski (pictured on the left, after a concert in Moscow in 1958). The BBC Philharmonic plays it under Matthias Bamert, a one-time assistant conductor to Stokowski. It comes from a Chandos CD entitled "Stokowski Encores."





Frederick Fennell and the Eastman-Rochester Pops Orchestra play Rachmaninoff's Prelude in G minor (originally for piano) as orchestrated by the English composer Edmund Rubbra, from a 1959 LP called "Popovers."





Lucien Cailliet (1897-1985) was a composer / wind player who spent many years with the Philadelphia Orchestra as both clarinetist and house arranger. His orchestrations of three Rachmaninoff piano preludes were recorded in 1950 by Eugene Ormandy and have been reissued on the Pristine label: (a) Prelude in C# minor; (b) Prelude in G major; (c) Prelude in G minor.









Sir Henry Wood's transcription of Debussy's famous piano prelude dates from 1919 when he first introduced it at one of the Proms Concerts which still bear his name today. His scoring requires a large orchestra that includes a gong, tubular and mushroom bells, two harps and organ. Wood made his version as a memorial tribute to Debussy who had died the previous year. (From a 'Lyrita' CD on which Nicholas Braithwaite conducts the London Philharmonic.)





Sir Henry Wood was an inveterate transcriber of piano works and his orchestration of Rachmaninov's most famous Prelude dates from 1913. The splendid recording heard here was made by the London Philharmonic conducted by Nicholas Braithwaite.





Sir Henry Wood's version of 'Pictures at an Exhibition' dates from 1915. It was only the second orchestration of Mussorgsky's piano set, the first being that by Mikhail Tushmalov, a pupil of Rimsky-Korsakov. Like the Tushmalov version, Wood's is not complete, since he omits all but the first of the 'Promenades' and makes considerable changes and abridgements to the music throughout. However, when the Ravel version appeared a few years later, Wood's disappeared from view while Ravel's became the pre-eminent transcription of the work, still retaining its place today at the head of over 30 orchestrations by other composers and conductors.
For a Proms concert in 2010 at London's Royal Albert Hall, Sir Henry Wood's arrangement was given a rare revival by the BBC National Orchestra of Wales under its Associate Guest Conductor, Francois-Xavier Roth. Gordon Jacob once described Wood's orchestration as "superior in picturesqueness to Ravel's" with its astonishing array of orchestral effects. On the other hand, as the announcer says at the end, it is very "over the top." No wonder the Proms audience went wild!





Sir Adrian Boult and the London Philharmonic play Jeremiah Clarke's "Prince of Denmark's March" (a keyboard piece formerly known as Purcell's "Trumpet Voluntary") in Sir Henry Wood's splendidly gargantuan orchestration.





Bach's Toccata and Fugue in D minor was performed at the First Night of the 2004 Proms in two parts: the Toccata was played on the Albert Hall organ by Martin Neary, while the Fugue was given in Sir Henry Wood's orchestration. The BBC Symphony was conducted by its then Chief Conductor, Leonard Slatkin.





The "Funeral March" ('Marche Funebre') from Chopin's Piano Sonata No. 2 has been orchestrated by several musicians, including Elgar and Stokowski. Sir Henry Wood introduced his own version during the 1895 Proms. It was last heard at the Proms in 1943 under Basil Cameron's direction.





This Gavotte comes from the Sonata No. 6 in E major for Solo Violin. It was transcribed for full string orchestra by Sir Henry Wood and recorded in the 1950s by George Weldon and the London Symphony Orchestra on a Columbia LP.





Sir Henry Wood, founder of the Proms in London, conducts his Symphony Orchestra in his own arrangement of this traditional Russian folksong. From a 78rpm disc made in 1930.





Sir Henry Wood's "Suite No. 6" was devised as a kind of successor to J. S. Bach's own Orchestral Suites. Its six movements come from a variety of sources and the first of them is the Prelude in C sharp minor from Book 1 of the Well-Tempered Clavier. Wood's scoring is fleet and gossamer and rather suggestive of Mendelssohn. This track comes from Leonard Slatkin's Chandos CD of Bach arrangements made by assorted conductors.





Sir Henry Wood's 'Suite No. 6' is a set of six Bach transcriptions, arranged from various sources, that includes this heartfelt 'Lament.' It is the 'Adagio' from Bach's 'Capriccio on the Departure of His Most Beloved Brother' in Bb major, BWV 992. In this recording, the BBC Symphony is conducted by Leonard Slatkin.





Sir Henry Wood orchestrated six short pieces by Bach and combined them into what he called "Suite No. 6 for Full Orchestra." This was a kind of follow-up to Bach's own Orchestral Suites and also a "Suite No. 5 for Strings" that Wood had created out of the composer's organ sonatas. The Finale of the "Suite No. 6" is the 'Prelude' from the Partita No. 3 for Solo Violin. It was played at the 2010 BBC Proms by the Royal Philharmonic under Andrew Litton in a concert devoted entirely to Bach Transcriptions..

http://www.musicweb-international.com/classrev/2007/Aug07/Henry_Wood_SRCD216.htm
http://www.musicweb-international.com/classrev/2007/Sept07/Wood_SRCD216.htm
http://www.musicweb-international.com/classrev/2004/Aug04/Bach_conductors.htm





Bach's Toccata and Fugue in D minor has been orchestrated many times, with Leopold Stokowski's version being the most famous and Sir Henry Wood's the most over-the-top. At the other extreme from both of those is the one made by Alois Melichar, an Austrian composer / conductor who made many recordings for Polydor in the 1930s. His light-weight arrangement of Bach's organ masterwork was recorded in 1939 with the Berlin Philharmonic and is heard here in a transfer by Mark Obert-Thorn for the Biddulph label.
http://www.musicweb-international.com/classrev/2001/Jan01/Bach_Transcriptions.htm





The programme opens with the famous D minor Toccata and Fugue, orchestrated by Stanislav Skrowaczewski in the early 1960s, when he was music director at Minneapolis. In a sense the rhetorical stance of this music does not transfer so readily to an orchestral delivery as some other Bach pieces do.





This version of Bach's famous Toccata and Fugue in D minor starts off with the organ, played by Leslie Pearson, but when the orchestra comes in the arrangement owes quite a lot to Stokowski's transcription. It was made and conducted by Tutti Camarata (1913-2005) who began his musical career as a jazz trumpeter in New York. After World War II he became a composer and record producer. During the 1960s and '70s he arranged and conducted a number of Decca/London popular classical LPs in 'Phase 4 Stereo' with the Kingsway Symphony Orchestra, so called because it was an 'ad hoc' band of top London musicians which recorded in the famous Kingsway Hall.

http://www.musicweb-international.com/classrev/2002/feb02/Stokowski_encores.htm


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## waldvogel

Franz Liszt orchestrated Schubert's _Wanderer Fantasy_. I have it on this CD box set, but with Brendel playing the _Impromptus_, _Moments Musicaux_, _Grand Duo_, and the real _Wanderer Fantasy_ on three CD's, I haven't listened to it too much. In fact, I tend to stop the CD a few seconds after saying "what the hell is this?"


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## Fabulin

6:48-end, featuring the cadenza from Alkan's Concerto for Solo Piano, orchestrated by Karl Klindworth (1902)





7:02 really brings a smile to one's face


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## MusicSybarite

maestro267 said:


> The Hammerklavier was one of the sonatas I was thinking of when it came to ones that might be orchestrated.


Weingartner orchestrated it. The only recording of it is just horrible, though.


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## CnC Bartok

MusicSybarite said:


> Weingartner orchestrated it. The only recording of it is just horrible, though.


Indeed. I've got that on the Naxos series of Weingartner's Beethoven recordings. Awful sound (obviously) and really not an interesting enough transcription for me to wish for a more modern recording.

There's a relatively new Mussorgsky Pictures, orchestrated by Peter Breiner, on Naxos. Slightly wacky, but worth a listen. I have to be honest and say I really like the orchestration Vladimir Ashkenazy did....


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## SONNET CLV

Among treasured discs in my collection are the symphonies and the piano sonatas of Viktor Ullmann (1898-1944), who wrote his late pieces while incarcerated by the Nazis at Theresienstadt. It was in Theresienstadt where Ullmann composed the opera "Der Kaiser von Atlantis" Op. 49, based on a text by fellow inmate, painter and poet Peter Kien. The Emperor portrayed in the opera, a bellicose leader with no regard to the life of his subjects, is in fact a very thinly disguised Adolf Hitler. Death goes on strike with disastrous consequences, agreeing to go back to work only after the emperor agrees to be his first victim. The opera actually went into rehearsal, but it was never staged. Camp authorities realized the meaning of the production, cancelling the premiere days before it was supposed to happen. Viktor Ullmann was transferred to Auschwitz, where he perished in the gas chambers within two days of arrival.

Read more: http://www.musicweb-international.com/classrev/2003/July03/Ullmann2.htm#ixzz6jZSaIm4X















Piano Sonatas 5 and 7 had many indications of orchestration ideas, which suggest that they started out as symphonies. Ullmann premiered the sonatas at Theresienstadt.

Symphony No. 1, "On My Youth" (1943)
Reconstructed by Bernhard Wulff from the short score of the fifth piano sonata

Symphony No. 2 in D Major (1944)
Reconstructed by Bernhard Wulff from the short score of the seventh piano sonata

Before being sent to the death camp, he was able to entrust all of his scores to a friend in the camp. They were miraculously preserved, so, in fact, all we have of Viktor Ullmann's works is his Theresienstadt output, while most of what he wrote before is now lost.


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## Merl

I knew a bit about Ullman from his only surviving string quartet (no. 3), which is a very good one, but I've never listened to his other music. It always amazes me how people can still create music even when the conditions are so hostile towards creativity. His is a fascinating story but what's truly amazing is that his lost work is all the stuff he created prior to going into the concentration camp. What a shame we have been denied that.


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## MarkW

Many years ago, when I worked for a college arts center, the Director and I stood outside a rehearsal room, listening to a visiting wind octet run through what we presumed was a reduction of a piece we knew like the back of our hand but couldn't identify for the life of us. It turned out to be an expansion of Beethoven'a Pathetique Sonata!!


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## SONNET CLV

MarkW said:


> Many years ago, when I worked for a college arts center, the Director and I stood outside a rehearsal room, listening to a visiting wind octet run through what we presumed was a reduction of a piece we knew like the back of our hand but couldn't identify for the life of us. It turned out to be an expansion of Beethoven'a Pathetique Sonata!!


What! You mean, someone tampered with a Beethoven piano sonata and turned it into a wind octet!!!? That's pathetic!


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