# Favorite Country For Music?



## Bartók (Dec 10, 2009)

What country produced your favorite music? I would have to choose France, with Hungary being my second favorite.

_Edit: there was meant to be a poll, but apparently polls can only be added within 10 minutes of posting the thread. So this is what the poll would of been:_

*Austria* (Berg, Bruckner, Haydn, Mahler, Mozart, Schoenberg, Schubert, etc.)

*Czech Republic* (Dvorak, Janacek, Martinu, Smetana, ect.)

*France* (Berlioz, Debussy, Dutilleux, Faure, Messiaen, Poulenc, Saint-Saens, Varese, etc.)

*Germany* (Bach, Handel, Mendelssohn, Schumman, Stockhausen, Strauss, Wagner, etc.)

*Hungary* (Bartok, Kodaly, Ligeti, Liszt, etc.)

*Italy* (Berio, Corelli, Montiverdi, Puccini, Respighi, Rossini, Scarlatti, Verdi, Vivaldi, etc.)

*Russia* (Borodin, Mussorgsky, Prokofiev, Rachmaninoff, Rimsky-Korsakov, Scriabin, Schnittke, Shostakovich, Stravinsky, Tchaikovsky, etc.)

*United Kingdom* (Bax, Britten, Delius, Elgar, Holst, Purcell, Tallis, Vaughan Williams, etc.)

*United States of America* (Adams, Bernstein, Cage, Carter, Copland, Glass, Hovhaness, Ives, Reich, etc.)

*Other*


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## Jaime77 (Jun 29, 2009)

I would also choose France


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## Weston (Jul 11, 2008)

Probably Germany or Austria for me with England running a close second. Or would that be Russia in second place? Oddly I don't care much for American music at all. Otherwise I enjoy all music of the western world.


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## Bartók (Dec 10, 2009)

Weston said:


> Oddly I don't care much for American music at all.


I am also not too much of a fan of American music. Much of it seems to be very complex (Ives, Carter, Cage, Babbitt) or minimalism. I do not listen to a lot of either type.


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## Johnny (Mar 7, 2010)

I don't know. Either some European country, or America. Doesn't really narrow it down much I suppose.

TRVE NORWEGIAN BLACK METAL!


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## Rondo (Jul 11, 2007)

Germany/Austria leading, with Hungary and Russia not very far behind.


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## Sid James (Feb 7, 2009)

At the moment, France followed by the rest. I've recently began to get into American composers. The only country listed whose music/composers I'm not hugely into is Italy, but maybe I'm simply not familiar enough with them? In any case, opera is not my forte, so that cancels out more than half the guys on offer.

I'd add some more to the list, including regions like Latin America:

*Latin America *- Chavez, Revueltas, Villa-Lobos, Ginastera, Piazzolla, etc.

*Japan *- Takemitsu, Ifukube & others (please help us out, Tapkaara)

& my own *Australia* has some significant composers - Sculthorpe, Vine, Meale, Dean, Koehne, Kats-Chernin, Edwards, Conyngham, Sutherland, etc.

& why not even* India *- Shankar & others (World Violist would know more than I)


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## Polednice (Sep 13, 2009)

If I were to choose a country in line with one of my few all-time favourite composers, I'd have to go for Germany or the Czech Rep. However, as much as I idolise such giants, I don't think my favouritism warrants making their _country_ my favourite as well. To me, Germany's 'style' is defined precisely by the fact that it seems to lack one compared to other countries, and the music of the Czech Rep. - wonderful as it is - is slightly too provincial for me to single it out. Rather, for consistency of the kind of emotion, scope and drama that I enjoy most, I would without hesitation choose Russia above all others.

[Although not quite related to favourites or countries, I do have quite a soft spot for Scandinavian music too...]


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## StlukesguildOhio (Dec 25, 2006)

Germany/Austria (and considering the history and the fact that a unified Germany... or Italy for that matter... is not even a reality until the late 19th century I think one might do better looking at language than any modern national borders): Bach, Mozart, Beethoven, Handel, Haydn, Wagner, Richard Strauss, Schubert, Schumann, Bruchner, Brahms, Mahler, Zemlinsky... and on and on it goes. No one else is even close.

Italy would be second with Scarlatti, Corelli, Monteverdi, Giovanni Pierluigi da Palestrina, Giovanni Battista Pergolesi, Carlo Gesualdo, Allegri, Vivaldi, Boccherini, Donizetti, Puccini, Leoncavallo, Rossini, Verdi, etc...

France would be third with Faure, Ravel, Debussy, Berlioz, Bizet, Massenet, Koechlin, Joseph Canteloube, Leonin, Perotin, Charles Tournemire, Maurice Duruflé, Marcel Dupré, Henri Duparc, Paul Dukas, Léo Delibes, Reynaldo Hahn, etc...

After that? Probably Russia followed by Britain, the US, and then Poland, Hungary, etc...


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## nefigah (Aug 23, 2008)

Germany(/Austria) by a mile!

EDIT: A kilometer?


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## StlukesguildOhio (Dec 25, 2006)

Yes. My collection of Bach alone outnumbers many other countries.


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## Conor71 (Feb 19, 2009)

Finland (Sibelius, Rautavaara), Germany (Bach, Beethoven, Mozart, Strauss, etc.) and Russia (Tchaikovsky, Shostakovich, Rimsky-Korsakov, Mussorgsky, etc.) are my favourites - I would probably chose Germany though for the number of composers I like hailing from there.


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## Argus (Oct 16, 2009)

It's very close between Britain and America with Germany just a bit further behind.

If I could choose the Austro-Hungarian Empire and you combined all the composers from those lands, it would be a more difficult decision. Better yet, the Holy Roman Empire.


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## Fsharpmajor (Dec 14, 2008)

I have the most music by Russian composers, but the greatest number of composers I have is American.
I would disagree that all American music is either minimalism or very complex; there's Copland, Barber, Hovhaness, Chadwick, Daugherty, Dorman, just to name a few. Whether they're to your taste or not is another matter, of course.

Having said that, though, I would opt for Russia.


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## emiellucifuge (May 26, 2009)

Russia or more specifically the Soviet union.


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## SPR (Nov 12, 2008)

Bach, Mozart, Haydn, Handel, Wagner, etc....

any chance we can just sort of _blur_ the lines between Austria and Germany? I mean.. they all speak German, right?

(...grasping at straws...)


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## Grosse Fugue (Mar 3, 2010)

A an opera lover I have to say Italy for both Rossini and Opera itself.
Germany/Austria would be my second choice.


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## TresPicos (Mar 21, 2009)

Bartók said:


> What country produced your favorite music? I would have to choose France, with Hungary being my second favorite.
> 
> *France* (Berlioz, Debussy, Dutilleux, Faure, Messiaen, Poulenc, Saint-Saens, Varese, etc.)


Yes, it would have to be France. Debussy, Ravel, Dutilleux, Satie, Fauré, Duruflé, Poulenc, Ibert, Bizet, Dukas, (Honegger), Roussel, Francaix...


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## mamascarlatti (Sep 23, 2009)

As I mainly listen to opera I'd have to take Italy first - Monteverdi, Verdi, Puccini, Donizetti, Rossini, but also D.Scarlatti (with a nod to Spain), Corelli, 

Then Germany/Austria - Wagner, Mozart, Handel, Gluck, Bach, Schubert, Beethoven

Then probably France - Rameau, Lully (who of course was Italian), Charpentier, Bizet, Massenet

Then Russia.


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## HarpsichordConcerto (Jan 1, 2010)

emiellucifuge said:


> Russia or more specifically the Soviet union.


More specifically, the _former_ Soviet Union. 

As for me: Germany, Austria, Italy, England are the big standouts.


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## Aramis (Mar 1, 2009)

How wrong you are, all. Germany, Italy, France? Ha <spits on the ground with contempt>

The most prominent classical music country is Israel (Palestine?).

Mendelssohn, Mahler, Alkan, Copland, Gershwin, Anton Rubinstein, Morton Feldman, Otto Klemperer, von Zemlinsky, Moscheles, Nyman, Previn, Ullmann, I'm loosing my breath! 

Anyway, behold the mighty Jews.


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## Weston (Jul 11, 2008)

Aramis said:


> The most prominent classical music country is Israel (Palestine?).
> 
> Mendelssohn, Mahler, Alkan, Copland, Gershwin, Anton Rubinstein, Morton Feldman, Otto Klemperer, von Zemlinsky, Moscheles, Nyman, Previn, Ullmann, I'm loosing my breath!


That's a little like saying William Grant Still is an African composer.

However heritage does play an important role. Was Hovhaness and American composer, or Armenian? Or Scottish? It's all very confusing and goes to show the futility of categorizing the arts. Something within us compels us to try anyway.


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## Aramis (Mar 1, 2009)

Then what plays important role? Citzenship? If a German would say "I'm proud to be German bacause there was a lot of great German composers and performers", what would he mean? That he consider himself somehow *related* to those artists, just like he is related to his mother, father, brother or uncle. Ethnically.

If we don't consider this important then nothing is important in this subject and we shouldn't be even discussing it.


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## Sid James (Feb 7, 2009)

I suppose Aramis does have a point - it's difficult to categorise some composers by nation because some of them tended to move around a bit. Look at Handel, (to me) his _Fireworks_ & _Water_ musics sound very English, yet the man was born in what is now Germany. & closer to our own times there were composers like Leo Ornstein who was born in Russia but moved with his parents early on to the USA. & I don't even have to mention people like Martinu & Stravinsky, who both moved to France from their respective countries, & ended up in the USA. It's all a bit confusing as to how you categorise them, as these composers developed a unique sound that was as much related to their adopted countries as to their places of birth...


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## Grosse Fugue (Mar 3, 2010)

Andre said:


> I suppose Aramis does have a point - it's difficult to categorise some composers by nation because some of them tended to move around a bit. Look at Handel, (to me) his _Fireworks_ & _Water_ musics sound very English, yet the man was born in what is now Germany. & closer to our own times there were composers like Leo Ornstein who was born in Russia but moved with his parents early on to the USA. & I don't even have to mention people like Martinu & Stravinsky, who both moved to France from their respective countries, & ended up in the USA. It's all a bit confusing as to how you categorise them, as these composers developed a unique sound that was as much related to their adopted countries as to their places of birth...


Very true. Even thought those Handel pieces were written for a German King of England I never know whether to call he a German or English composer. I guess both.


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## StlukesguildOhio (Dec 25, 2006)

The most prominent classical music country is Israel (Palestine?).

Mendelssohn, Mahler, Alkan, Copland, Gershwin, Anton Rubinstein, Morton Feldman, Otto Klemperer, von Zemlinsky, Moscheles, Nyman, Previn, Ullmann, I'm loosing my breath!

Sorry... but that makes absolutely no sense. Because Mahler was Jewish he should be counted as Isreali regardless of his national and cultural heritage? So where does that leave Bach? I mean he's Christian... and the roots of Christianity go back to the Middle-East and the Jews. And Handel might be English because he worked in Britain..?? So then Stravinsky was American, Chopin was French, Vivaldi was Austrian, and Domenico Scarlatti was Spanish?? It would seem to me that an artist's culture is defined by the culture in which he or she was raised and educated.


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## Chi_townPhilly (Apr 21, 2007)

Ah, memories...


SPR said:


> etc....any chance we can just sort of _blur_ the lines between Austria and Germany? I mean.. they all speak German, right?


If we did so, we wouldn't be first to blur the lines--

However: it's my experience that Austrians, generally speaking, resent being co-mingled with Germans re: national consideration. Of course, one take take the contradistinction too far, as America's current head-of-government did when he made reference to "speak[ing] Austrian."

As one can see from my entries in the above-linked thread, I don't think I _need_ to resort to an alternate conception of nationality in order to rate- 1) *Germany* 2) *Austria*. (Maybe I can say that the Czech Republic is my 'pound-for-pound' champ.)


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## Aramis (Mar 1, 2009)

StlukesguildOhio said:


> Sorry... but that makes absolutely no sense. Because Mahler was Jewish he should be counted as Isreali regardless of his national and cultural heritage? So where does that leave Bach? I mean he's Christian... and the roots of Christianity go back to the Middle-East and the Jews. And Handel might be English because he worked in Britain..?? So then Stravinsky was American, Chopin was French, Vivaldi was Austrian, and Domenico Scarlatti was Spanish?? It would seem to me that an artist's culture is defined by the culture in which he or she was raised and educated.


Don't compare Jews and Christians, the latter is religion. Jews are nation, some say they are not and there is no such thing as Jews, but these are just minor theories.


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## SPR (Nov 12, 2008)

Aramis said:


> Don't compare Jews and Christians, the latter is religion. Jews are nation, some say they are not and there is no such thing as Jews, but these are just minor theories.


Lets not get off topic. The topic is 'favorite country'.


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## Argus (Oct 16, 2009)

Aramis said:


> Don't compare Jews and Christians, the latter is religion. Jews are nation, some say they are not and there is no such thing as Jews, but these are just minor theories.


Religion and race have nothing to do with the subject of this thread. This is about natonality, which is mainly a geographical factor. Not all Jews are Israeli and not all Israeli's are Jews which defies your original point for starters. Just like not all Sikhs are Indian or Shintoists Japanese. Also, who says there is no such thing as Jews?

I agree it is pretty pointless subject, as what does it matter what nationality a composer is, but sometimes it's interesting to make pointless relationships into competitions.


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## Toccata (Jun 13, 2009)

Aramis said:


> How wrong you are, all. Germany, Italy, France? Ha <spits on the ground with contempt>
> 
> The most prominent classical music country is Israel (Palestine?).
> 
> ...


I can't wait until "Saul" gets wind of this.


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## StlukesguildOhio (Dec 25, 2006)

Religion and race have nothing to do with the subject of this thread. This is about natonality, which is mainly a geographical factor. Not all Jews are Israeli and not all Israeli's are Jews which defies your original point for starters. Just like not all Sikhs are Indian or Shintoists Japanese. Also, who says there is no such thing as Jews?

Seriously... its more likely that a Jew is not-Israeli than that he or she is. There are nearly as many Jews in the United States alone as there are in the whole of Israel... and as Argus says, not all Israelis are Jewish any more than all Italians are Catholic or all Iranians are Muslim. The notion that "Jews" are not a religion but a nation is absurd and something most Jews I know... including my art studio partner... would laugh at. I suspect that in most instances you would discover that a Russian Jew, Israeli Jew, and American Jew would have far less in common than an American Jew, and American Catholic, and American Protestant, and an American Muslim. Indeed... one of the restaurants that I frequent near my studio with my Jewish friend is in a predominantly Black neighborhood, owned by Palestinians... and we are all able to converse freely and without any hostilities... because we share a common American culture.

My studio partner is American, first and foremost, because he has been educated in America and his experiences have been profoundly impacted by his experience of American culture... just as Mahler's were undoubtedly impacted by his experiences of Austrian/German culture... especially of Vienna. We can all split hairs over the vaieties of experience of living in one culture or one nation but of a minority race or religion or nationality (A black American, an German Lutheran in Catholic Spain, and Italian in Algiers) and ultimately it is meaningless... except that ultimately the nationality of culture under which one is raised and educated is the one which marks one the most profoundly. There is far more to be found in Mendelssohn or Mahler that is rooted in their German?Austrian culture than in their Jewish identity.

The differences in cultures is something to be cherished... especially in an increasingly corporate standardized concept of culture. Italian opera is quite different than Russian or German opera and German painting is marked by common elements different from French painting. "Different" not "better". Bach, Beethoven, Mozart, Wagner, Brahms are individuals of great achievements within a given culture... but German/Austrian music as a whole is not inherently better than French or Russian or English.


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## Il Seraglio (Sep 14, 2009)

Austria and Germany are neck and neck for me. Austria for Mozart, Haydn, Schubert, Hummel, Mahler and Bruckner and Germany for Buxtehude, Bach, Handel, Gluck, Beethoven, Wagner and Schumann.

Maybe France would figure in there somewhere seen as I _really_ like most French music I hear I just need to hear more of it. Some of my favourites are Leonin, Perotin, des Prez, Rameau, Berlioz, Ravel, Messiaen and more recently Dutilleux (thanks some guy and StlukesguildOhio for the recommendation). I know that looks like a long list, but I have heard very little of each, save Berlioz.


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## Sid James (Feb 7, 2009)

Il Seraglio said:


> ...Germany for Buxtehude...


Let's not forget that he also had Danish ancestry...


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## Johnny (Mar 7, 2010)

Everyone is African if you go back far enough. Not really a country, but who knows what they called it in those days!

If you're not going to use either present day geographical boundaries, or ones from the times of the composers in question, the entire question becomes a farce.


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## TresPicos (Mar 21, 2009)

StlukesguildOhio said:


> Seriously... its more likely that a Jew is not-Israeli than that he or she is. There are nearly as many Jews in the United States alone as there are in the whole of Israel... and as Argus says, not all Israelis are Jewish any more than all Italians are Catholic or all Iranians are Muslim. The notion that "Jews" are not a religion but a nation is absurd and something most Jews I know... including my art studio partner... would laugh at. I suspect that in most instances you would discover that a Russian Jew, Israeli Jew, and American Jew would have far less in common than an American Jew, and American Catholic, and American Protestant, and an American Muslim. Indeed... one of the restaurants that I frequent near my studio with my Jewish friend is in a predominantly Black neighborhood, owned by Palestinians... and we are all able to converse freely and without any hostilities... because we share a common American culture.
> 
> My studio partner is American, first and foremost, because he has been educated in America and his experiences have been profoundly impacted by his experience of American culture... just as Mahler's were undoubtedly impacted by his experiences of Austrian/German culture... especially of Vienna. We can all split hairs over the vaieties of experience of living in one culture or one nation but of a minority race or religion or nationality (A black American, an German Lutheran in Catholic Spain, and Italian in Algiers) and ultimately it is meaningless... except that ultimately the nationality of culture under which one is raised and educated is the one which marks one the most profoundly. There is far more to be found in Mendelssohn or Mahler that is rooted in their German?Austrian culture than in their Jewish identity.


Couldn't agree more.


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## Josef Anton Bruckner (Mar 22, 2010)

Germany, Austria, Russia


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## Ivan_cro (Mar 19, 2010)

Russia, then piece of Germany and Italy, and last but not least, France.
And where should I put Chopin? Poland or France?

And of course Croatia!


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