# Spotify VS Classics Online HD



## Kevin Pearson (Aug 14, 2009)

I'm mostly writing to warn others on here about my experience with Classics Online HD service. I subscribed around a month back and enjoy the service and the sound quality can be really fabulous but the more I listen the more glitches I find in their rips. Having clicks and even empty space is really annoying and ruins the listening experience. They claim they can't duplicate my problems and yet I have given them all the info they need. They recommend that I update my version and yet I am using their latest version. The problems can be replicated in the same exact spots every time and I am convinced that these are ripping issues and glitches caused probably by multitasking while ripping the CD. You cannot do that while ripping and ensure no glitches. I know because I used to trade a lot of live music and even having fast processors you cannot do other things while ripping or burning. I thought their sale off was a good value but now I want my money back. 

My experience with Spotify on the other hand has been nothing but positive. Never have had any glitches or drops. I was willing to pay a higher price to have CD and HD quality but not when almost every other album I listen to has issues.

So, if you are, or have been thinking of, getting Classics Online DON'T!!


Kevin


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## GioCar (Oct 30, 2013)

Kevin, How do you listen to their tracks? Have you tried to change your DAC?
I have exactly the same problem (clicks, glitches) with Qobuz (A European HD streaming service, similar to Classics Online HD) only if coupled with a specific DAC, just that DAC. I don't know why.
This made me crazy until I discovered that with another DAC all worked fine. It took me time to discover that, since that DAC (the one having problems with Qobuz) actually is fine with all the rest of my music sources...


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## Becca (Feb 5, 2015)

I have encountered problems with Spotify, specifically blank tracks or tracks which don't belong to the piece being played.


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## Kevin Pearson (Aug 14, 2009)

GioCar said:


> Kevin, How do you listen to their tracks? Have you tried to change your DAC?
> I have exactly the same problem (clicks, glitches) with Qobuz (A European HD streaming service, similar to Classics Online HD) only if coupled with a specific DAC, just that DAC. I don't know why.
> This made me crazy until I discovered that with another DAC all worked fine. It took me time to discover that, since that DAC (the one having problems with Qobuz) actually is fine with all the rest of my music sources...


The sound is streamed from their program, through my PC using the HDMI and not the internal sound card. The HDMI is coming into my Onkyo receiver to amplify. I have no other issues with this outside of Classics Online. I can play CDs on the desktop, which I don't, stream Neflix, YouTube, Spotify etc. without any glitches whatsoever. What's annoying with Classics Online is that it's not every album and it's also not limited to just HD quality or just CD quality. When I hear a glitch I can actually back up the stream and hear the same glitch in the same location every time and yet they say they can't duplicate it. When the albums play without problems I love the sound quality but any glitches just ruin the whole experience for me. Any other suggestions?

Kevin


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## GioCar (Oct 30, 2013)

Okay, so you are using the DAC inside your Onkyo, but if you use instead your PC sound card (which has is own DAC) do you still hear glitches? Of course the sound quality will be worse, but if it's a problem of compatibility of Classics Online with your Onkyo's DAC, you should notice the difference - in terms of no glitches.


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## Kevin Pearson (Aug 14, 2009)

OK so I used the internal sound card and the same results in the exact same spots. I can only assume that it is the rips of the CDs themselves.


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## Doulton (Nov 12, 2015)

I have had difficulties with both of them but far fewer with Spotify. I finally cancelled by subscription to Classics Online HD because it too often failed to launch or stopped abruptly. Spotify is not perfect and has a less congenial home page, but it has been much more reliable and the occasional pop, crackle, and blank moment correct themselves relatively quickly. 
I have subscribed to Spotify. I really want Classics Online HD to become reliable; I am just not certain what went wrong. I rarely have any difficulty with live-streaming of Public Radio stations--but of course one has to rely on potluck.


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## GioCar (Oct 30, 2013)

Kevin Pearson said:


> OK so I used the internal sound card and the same results in the exact same spots. I can only assume that it is the rips of the CDs themselves.


Yes, your assumption seems correct then...


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## jegreenwood (Dec 25, 2015)

Anyone else use Tidal?


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## sweetviolin (Jun 21, 2015)

Classics Online HD has no Linux support(!), and streaming on the phone is no option when not connected to WiFi, since one cannot set the Kbps low enough. 500Kbps++ I cannot afford.

I heard no glitches though using my Asus Essence STX connected to Creative Gigaworks T40.


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## ArtMusic (Jan 5, 2013)

Noted, and thank you very much for this thread.


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## jbeemon (Dec 6, 2015)

Hello all, I ran across this thread while searching for others who are having trouble with ClassicsOnlineHD. While I do not usually post to many forums, I want to relate some of my COL-HD troubles and some of the fixes I have found. I was one of the first to subscribe to COL-HD and was very pleased with the service. My internet speed is slow compared to most people - just 6mbits/sec, so I am at the very low end of what is acceptable for streaming CD resolution and Hi-Res, such as COL-HD. I had a few problems connected to my internet speed, but things went bad when COL-HD implemented "Adaptive Bitrate."

Most of my sound problems revolved around which drivers I used. I too output through HDMI to my Marantz 7701 Pre/Pro. Various Windows drivers can be found under "Settings". COL-HD defaults to WDM-KS drivers. These drivers would cause random pops and clicks in the music, it sounded like listening to a lightly scratched LP. However my pops and clicks were random, and are related to buffering in the WDM-KS driver. I began to use the WASAPI driver and my clicks and pops went away. Then COL-HD implemented "Adaptive Bitrate." Using adaptive bitrate, an internal cache is implemented at no more than 320 kbits/sec. The music will start playing from the low bit rate cache and then switch to live play. You can see this in the notice just above the album art where it tells you the sampling and bit rate. This swap from cache play to live play was terrible with the music skipping forward or back, like the two streams were not synced. It got better with several updates, but then one of the updates caused the program to play everything in 44.1/16 unless you used the WDM-KS driver. I confirmed this with the information display on the Marantz. Of course the clicks and pops came back with hi-res tracks using the WDM-KS driver. I complained to COL-HD about this, and an update fixed that issue. I also discovered if you disabled "adaptive bitrate" you would get constant live play, but then music would stop midway of the track. Manually clicking the next track would resume play. Again I complained to COL-HD and a new update resolved that problem. Now the music only stops in between tracks, requiring a manual click forward or backwards to start the next track. All the time it is hung, it continues to download to the program. Then the most recent update undid all the good they had done. We are back to square one, with only WDM-KS driver providing real hi-res sound, but with pops and clicks, adaptive bit rate skipping, etc.

No more complaining to COL-HD for me. I have pretty much given up on them. I have a one year subscription, but will probably not renew, unless COL-HD can get their act together. I am using Tidal with NO problems. Tidal has most of the music COL-HD has with some exceptions. It's hard to find though on Tidal. COL-HD has by far the best search function. I use Spotify occasionally, and the used interface is probably the best.

Thank you for starting this thread. It's good to know that I am not the only one having these problems.

Jim


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## Blancrocher (Jul 6, 2013)

jegreenwood said:


> Anyone else use Tidal?


I used to--I abandoned it because I decided the selection was too small for the price (though the sound quality was great). It may well have grown significantly in recent months, though.


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## Kevin Pearson (Aug 14, 2009)

Jim,

Thanks for your post and joining TC just to comment about this issue and to know I'm not crazy. Your post gave me the idea though to update my sound drivers and they did need updating. So, I will continue to listen and see if I still hear glitches. Plus I did not know that I could turn off adaptive bitrate. Since I have a pretty decent high speed internet (50/50) it might actually make a difference. I also turned off automatic sampling rate switching. I hope these two things will make a difference as I really do like COD when it's working right. I also tried to clear the cache and see if that helps. I'll go back and listen to some pieces I know have had problems.

Kevin


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## jegreenwood (Dec 25, 2015)

Blancrocher said:


> I used to--I abandoned it because I decided the selection was too small for the price (though the sound quality was great). It may well have grown significantly in recent months, though.


May I suggest you take another look.

Edit - just tried a random test - entered "Monteverdi Poppea" in the Spotify and Tidal search engines. Both returned 8 albums (overlapping for the most part).

Of course both search engines leave much to be desired.


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## jbeemon (Dec 6, 2015)

I like the search features of COL. There is a "general search" in which you can look for almost anything from a general listing of various works having to do with a general theme such as "string quartets" to specific works by a composer. In the "advanced search" you can filter results down to a specific "period" or specific "label" etc. Tidal, on the other hand, requires you to know the exact spelling of a composers name, exact spelling of a work, or you get "0" results. Miss one letter of a name and zilch. However Tidal will have almost all of the same albums as COL-HD, just harder to get too. This turned me off when I first tried Tidal and I cancelled the subscription for a long time. Then I went back to Tidal after starting all the problems with COL-HD. That's when I discovered the real depth of their classical music section.

As an experiment, COL-HD had a new listing at the bottom of it's start page of little known ballets. There are eight albums listed from Adams to Ginastera to Lord Berners to Glazunov, and Tidal had all eight as well. Just had to search for them by specific name. Jim


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## Blancrocher (Jul 6, 2013)

jegreenwood said:


> May I suggest you take another look.
> 
> Edit - just tried a random test - entered "Monteverdi Poppea" in the Spotify and Tidal search engines. Both returned 8 albums (overlapping for the most part).
> 
> Of course both search engines leave much to be desired.


Unfortunately they don't allow you to search their catalog without signing up. It's too bad, since I'd be interested to see to what extent their collection has expanded. During the period of my subscription it wasn't even comparable to Spotify's. That was a deal-breaker, since I continue to foolishly prefer collecting cds and so primarily use streaming sites for sampling potential purchases.


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## jbeemon (Dec 6, 2015)

Kevin,

Thank you for your reply. I would be careful turning off the automatic sampling rate switching. When it was first added, I turned it off and all of a sudden my 96/24 tracks were playing at 44.1/16. ???? Turning it back on solved that problem. I haven't touched it since. I think it had to do with my playback settings under Windows sound setup. If you turn off automatic sampling, the program defaults to whatever you have set up as the default sampling rate in Windows. Turn it on and the COL programs controls the sampling/bitrate. However, (there's always a 'however') for this to work you should go into the Windows playback settings, double click your chosen output, go to the advanced tab and make sure you check both boxes under Exclusive Mode: "Allow applications to take exclusive control of this device," and, "Give exclusive mode applications priority." With this turned on COL will control sample rate/bit rate as long as your have automatic sampling turned on.

Clearing the cache sometimes helped, but sometimes made no difference, go figure. I envy you your 50/50 internet speed. I have 6 down and almost nothing up, and it's not likely going to change anytime in my remaining lifetime. However (?), living 'way' out in the country at the end of a dead end road has it's advantages.


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## jegreenwood (Dec 25, 2015)

Blancrocher said:


> Unfortunately they don't allow you to search their catalog without signing up. It's too bad, since I'd be interested to see to what extent their collection has expanded. During the period of my subscription it wasn't even comparable to Spotify's. That was a deal-breaker, since I continue to foolishly prefer collecting cds and so primarily use streaming sites for sampling potential purchases.


If you can recall one or two particular titles that were missing before, I can try to find them.

Edit - tried two more spot checks on Tidal: "Ashkenazy Beethoven" and "Karajan Brahms." Both returned more than 20 albums (although they include multiple releases of the same recordings).


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## hreichgott (Dec 31, 2012)

I'm quite happy with Spotify for "plan A" use, and CDs or itunes for "plan B".
Spotify has enough of what I want to be worth the subscription fee. Sound quality is always great and the few technical issues (silences in the middle of a track, or wrong track title) have occurred less than 10 times over several years of frequent use, and have a clear bug-report process.


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