# What are people's thoughts on Mozart's Piano concerto 12?



## Queequeg (Feb 12, 2014)

I seem to never see it much in discussions on Mozart's best piano concertos, but the whole piece is just sublime and beautiful, especially the 3rd movement. It doesn't really "wow" me as much as concerto 25 though (my personal favorite), maybe that's why? It's a wonderful piece, but with his composition skill, he just has 'better' ones out there.


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## hpowders (Dec 23, 2013)

One of my favorites of Mozart's earlier solo keyboard concertos. A complete delight!

Unlike you though, it is the first movement that delights me the most.

You are right. A great Mozart keyboard concerto!


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## Pugg (Aug 8, 2014)

It's good but not that good, that's the answer, the 9th for example is much more delightful.


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## pcnog11 (Nov 14, 2016)

Queequeg said:


> I seem to never see it much in discussions on Mozart's best piano concertos, but the whole piece is just sublime and beautiful, especially the 3rd movement. It doesn't really "wow" me as much as concerto 25 though (my personal favorite), maybe that's why? It's a wonderful piece, but with his composition skill, he just has 'better' ones out there.


Concerto no. 25 is one of my favorites too. Mozart was writing it like a symphony to start off with. The image of the opening is like waking up in a huge 18th century mansion in the morning with sunlight shining through the windows in May and you can see the beautiful gardens where the piano represents different types flowers. You can almost smell the flowers. Elegant, powerful and absolutely enticing.

Concerto no. 26 is another good one. I like how the piano develop the first movement. Only Mozart can make this happen. The second movement is a simple child-like tune but it become intricate in Mozart's hands, very details and much intrigued as you listen to the soloist. The piano line is a tread that sew all the instrument together to become a masterpiece. I think it is one of the most underrated piece of Mozart's work.

I can go on and on about Mozart piano concertos.......however, I want to listen to others on what they think.


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## pcnog11 (Nov 14, 2016)

Queequeg said:


> I seem to never see it much in discussions on Mozart's best piano concertos, but the whole piece is just sublime and beautiful, especially the 3rd movement. It doesn't really "wow" me as much as concerto 25 though (my personal favorite), maybe that's why? It's a wonderful piece, but with his composition skill, he just has 'better' ones out there.


I should also add, concerto no. 12 is another great piece. I like this interpretation from Ashkenazy:






The rondo in the 3rd movement is so alive. There are quite a few parallels you can draw from no. 12 and no. 26. Wonderful music! Cheers!


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## Triplets (Sep 4, 2014)

All his PCs are great, even the maligned early ones. I have not listened to this one in some time and will correct that henceforth


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## Guest (Dec 1, 2016)

PCs 11, 12, and 13 were written soon after Mozart came to Vienna. They were deliberately written for the masses and to the taste of the Viennese public. They are not too difficult and not to easy to play either. Mozart offered manuscripts of them to the public in a paid subscription. Also, they were written so they could either be played with an orchestra, or "a quattro" - that is for piano and string quartet. It is interesting to hear the in that format, as a kind of piano quintet. No. 12 (K414) was the first of the three written and probably the best of the three as well. But to my taste they are not as good as some earlier concertos - especially 5, 9, and 10 - and all the late concertos from 17 onward.


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## Pugg (Aug 8, 2014)

Triplets said:


> All his PCs are great, even the maligned early ones. I have not listened to this one in some time and will correct that henceforth


That's the spirit .....................


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## Janspe (Nov 10, 2012)

Inspired by this thread, I revisited the piece through my favourite Mozart concerto set - Mitsuko Uchida & the English Chamber Orchestra, led by Jeffrey Tate. It is indeed a charming piece, very sunny and a joy to listen to. I haven't heard it too often, though - the next concerto (C major, K.415) has always been more close to my heart. But it is certainly a worthy piece that I should listen to more often. I admit, I'm also very partial to the later concertos - they just contain such irresistibly lush woodwind writing! But to be fair, I like every single one of the 21 (original!) piano concertos of Mozart - there isn't a single weak work among them. I should just listen to them _all_ more evenly.

I also recommend that Ashkenazy performance posted earlier on this thread, it's a fine performance - even if the squeaking chair causes some difficulties...


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## Guest (Dec 1, 2016)

Janspe said:


> Inspired by this thread, I revisited the piece through my favourite Mozart concerto set - Mitsuko Uchida & the English Chamber Orchestra, led by Jeffrey Tate. It is indeed a charming piece, very sunny and a joy to listen to. I haven't heard it too often, though - the next concerto (C major, K.415) has always been more close to my heart. But it is certainly a worthy piece that I should listen to more often. I admit, I'm also very partial to the later concertos - they just contain such irresistibly lush woodwind writing! But to be fair, I like every single one of the 21 (original!) piano concertos of Mozart - there isn't a single weak work among them. I should just listen to them _all_ more evenly.
> 
> I also recommend that Ashkenazy performance posted earlier on this thread, it's a fine performance - even if the squeaking chair causes some difficulties...


Uchida is also my favorite full set, at least on modern piano. When you say 21 original you must be leaving out the Nos. 7 and 10. They are for multiple pianos. No. 7 is not that good but I absolutely LOVE No. 10. That's K365. I think it sounds best on fortepiano which is not as loud and does not sustain as long.


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## Janspe (Nov 10, 2012)

Jerome said:


> When you say 21 original you must be leaving out the Nos. 7 and 10. They are for multiple pianos. No. 7 is not that good but I absolutely LOVE No. 10. That's K365. I think it sounds best on fortepiano which is not as loud and does not sustain as long.


Oh yeah, I meant 21 original concertos for _solo_ piano. The double and triple concertos are fine works indeed - too bad Uchida never recorded them...


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## Animal the Drummer (Nov 14, 2015)

pcnog11 said:


> I should also add, concerto no. 12 is another great piece. I like this interpretation from Ashkenazy:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Despite liking Ashkenazy as a rule I'm not generally a big fan of his Mozart, which tends to be somewhat over-personalised for my taste. He does strike a nice balance in this particular concerto though.

As far as the music itself is concerned, I like it a lot but by Mozart's standards I wouldn't term it "great". For my money that epithet belongs to most of the concertos from no.20 onwards but not to those earlier in the canon, though there are numerous earlier ones (e.g.no.12) that are very fine.


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## pcnog11 (Nov 14, 2016)

Does anyone like his piano concerto no. 2. The slow movement is so simple, elegant, peaceful yet technically challenging. Mozart strike a fine balance in his early age. It rarely performed, could be a missed gem.

Check it out with Murray Perahia.


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## Mal (Jan 1, 2016)

Pugg said:


> It's good but not that good, that's the answer, the 9th for example is much more delightful.


The 9th is the most delightful thing on Earth. But I think 12 is up there with 1, 4, 5, 10, 11,13, 15, 17, 21-27 - all great delights.

I have Perahia's set and am very happy with it.


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## Mal (Jan 1, 2016)

pcnog11 said:


> Does anyone like his piano concerto no. 2. The slow movement is so simple, elegant, peaceful yet technically challenging. Mozart strike a fine balance in his early age. It rarely performed, could be a missed gem.


It is nice, but the Perahia booklet says that 1-4 were not original works, they were drawn from other composers. So you should be mostly praising Herr Schobert here! With No.5 we encounter original Mozart for the first time, age 17, and wonderful it is...


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## Alydon (May 16, 2012)

It is interesting that No.12 (forgiving No.9) seems for many musicians and listeners alike to be the 'real' start of Mozart's piano concerto output, and those before mere practice pieces. I for one have always been attracted to No.12 after being given an ancient EP of the piece as a teenager with Benjamin Britten playing the solo part and directing, and this now mercifully available on CD has always been my favourite performance of this enchanting work.


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## Mal (Jan 1, 2016)

I must seek out Benjamin Britten playing 12, I really like his recording of symphonies 25, 29, 38, and 40 with the ECO.


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## PlaySalieri (Jun 3, 2012)

I heard no 12 for the first time in 20 years just a few days ago. The first movement is enchanting though has one or two cliche formulaic touches that diminish it. The main theme reminds me of some of the others - notably no 19.

I place it with a group that include 11,14,16, 18 - not among his best but better than any other composer from that era.


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