# Schubert or Beethoven Keyboard Works?



## vtpoet (Jan 17, 2019)

You know... because it's the fashionable question right now. :devil: Not just the sonatas, but the whole enchilada (including works for four hands).


----------



## lnjng (Dec 24, 2021)

While Schubert may have composed more works for piano than Beethoven, I think most of Beethoven’s pieces is itself better. Each of the 32 piano sonatas are worth listening/playing, as well as his variations and piano trios.

Note that I may have some bias towards Beethoven, as I have personally played more Beethoven than Schubert.


----------



## hammeredklavier (Feb 18, 2018)

vtpoet said:


> You know... because it's the fashionable question right now. :devil: Not just the sonatas, but the whole enchilada (including works for four hands).


You know... I'm going to give a very generic answer cause it's always fashionable to be generic on TC:
With four hand works - Schubert.
Without four hand works - Beethoven.


----------



## vtpoet (Jan 17, 2019)

Yeah, it's the four hand works that cause me to hesitate maybe a little.


----------



## BrahmsWasAGreatMelodist (Jan 13, 2019)

hammeredklavier said:


> You know... I'm going to give a very generic answer cause it's always fashionable to be generic on TC:
> With four hand works - Schubert.
> Without four hand works - Beethoven.


I thought you hated Schubert.


----------



## Holden4th (Jul 14, 2017)

Beethoven hands down. For a start, he had a far better grasp of musical structure than Schubert did and this is evident in the piano sonatas of both. There is a lot of music in Schubert's sonatas that simply goes nowhere, just around in circles. Sometimes this includes whole movements. Beethoven, on the other hand had an excellent view of musical structure and every note is a vital part of the composition.If you removed it this would improve the work by making it tauter and with more direction. Interestingly, my favourite Schubert piano work is for four hands - the D940 Fantasie.


----------



## TwoFlutesOneTrumpet (Aug 31, 2011)

How is this supposed to be even close? Beethoven by a light year.


----------



## vtpoet (Jan 17, 2019)

TwoFlutesOneTrumpet said:


> How is this supposed to be even close? Beethoven by a light year.


Maybe it's not, but Schubert wrote much more than piano sonatas and Beethoven wrote nothing that competes with Schubert's works for four hands. But... Beethoven's piano sonatas are hard to beat.


----------



## Neo Romanza (May 7, 2013)

Neither, but truth be told, I'm much more into Beethoven's music than Schubert's (even though he did write some great pieces).


----------



## Rogerx (Apr 27, 2018)

Unanswerable question, depends on mood day by day, they both wrote great music.


----------



## CarlHaydn284 (Jul 12, 2020)

This is extremely easy to answer. Compare the first 5 Schubert sonatas to the first 5 by Beethoven. Beethoven quite easily wins.


----------



## Highwayman (Jul 16, 2018)

If the OP included only the sonatas I`d have agreed that Beethoven would win this. _But_ other than _Diabelli_ and perhaps a couple more sets of variations B. didn`t have much going on whereas Schubert has the _Wanderer Fantasy_, _Fantasy in F minor_, _Impromptus_, _Moments Musicaux_ and some other things like _Drei Klavierstücke_. So, all things combined I think it`s safe for me to call it a tie.


----------



## Mandryka (Feb 22, 2013)

vtpoet said:


> You know... because it's the fashionable question right now. :devil: Not just the sonatas, but the whole enchilada (including works for four hands).


Don,and smmc smmc mcm score,m sxmsn x


----------



## Holden4th (Jul 14, 2017)

Highwayman said:


> If the OP included only the sonatas I`d have agreed that Beethoven would win this. _But_ other than _Diabelli_ and perhaps a couple more sets of variations B. didn`t have much going on whereas Schubert has the _Wanderer Fantasy_, _Fantasy in F minor_, _Impromptus_, _Moments Musicaux_ and some other things like _Drei Klavierstücke_. So, all things combined I think it`s safe for me to call it a tie.


The variations had a lot going on. You also have the G minor fantasy and the Andante Favori as examples of LvBs ability to write music outside of sonata form. The F minor Fantasie is four hands so it doesn't count.

One area where Schubert beats LvB hands down is melody and nowhere is this more evident than in the lieder and the chamber works. He occasionally replicated this in his piano works and the best example is the slow movement of D960 which I absolutely love.


----------



## Kreisler jr (Apr 21, 2021)

The Schubert 4 hands music is underrated but there are only a few great works among them, in fact the only really great piece might be the f minor fantasy, with the Grand Duo D 812 and that A minor/major piece as follow up. They are not really tipping the scales for me and although I like also the late Schubert sonatas and shorter pieces, it's overall no contest.

The Diabellis alone would for me balance all non-sonatas from Schubert (such as Wandererfantasie, Impromptus etc.), and there are a few other great variation sets and the late bagatelles that are important works.

The only keyboard oeuvre I'd accept as equal to Beethoven's is Bach's (and I'd still prefer Beethoven). 

But Schubert probably wrote the best piano works of any composer who was not also a good to great pianist (Haydn and Schoenberg might be next in this category).


----------



## vtpoet (Jan 17, 2019)

Highwayman said:


> If the OP included only the sonatas I`d have agreed that Beethoven would win this. _But_ other than _Diabelli_ and perhaps a couple more sets of variations B. didn`t have much going on whereas Schubert has the _Wanderer Fantasy_, _Fantasy in F minor_, _Impromptus_, _Moments Musicaux_ and some other things like _Drei Klavierstücke_. So, all things combined I think it`s safe for me to call it a tie.


That's where my own estimation comes down. The choice isn't so clear to me as to others.


----------

