# Does using classical music for background cause injustice to the piece?



## Albert7 (Nov 16, 2014)

I noticed lately that I have been listening a lot to classical music for my commute via public transit around SLC (I don't like to drive).

However I notice that a lot of people use classical music as background music for shopping, working, or just another activity.

I was wondering whether it is "morally" wrong to do that... that classical music commands full attention while listening to it or should it be all right to have it for background sometimes.

I know that I could be more attentive to classical music 

Any opinions on this issue?


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## Sloe (May 9, 2014)

I can´t just sit down listen to music I need to do something else at the same time.


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## Kibbles Croquettes (Dec 2, 2014)

As I said in the youtube-thread, I have almost all the time some background ambience on. Usually this means classical music. I do sometimes have this vision of a dead composer, say Haydn for example, looking down from the otherworld and disapproving my usage of his music that way. I'm glad I don't really believe in afterlife. And even if there was an afterlife, I don't think it would be good idea for composers to peek at what people are doing while listening to their music. If Bach would have seen to what kind of activities his music has been used as a background music... I don't think he would be taking another peek in hundreds of years.

Well, the point of all this is that I can't stand quietness. At least when I'm alone at home: for me to be able to feel like I'm at _home_, I need some music/radio/television to be in the background. And obviously I don't think it's disrespectful, although at times my superego gives me visions of dead composers being angry at me. I'm sorry, Schubert, I'm so sorry, please don't hurt me!


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## Manxfeeder (Oct 19, 2010)

In a perfect world, I'd listen to every piece attentively with a notated score in my hand. It's not, so I can't. I do the best I can do.


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## science (Oct 14, 2010)

Everything is ok. The music is for you, not you for the music. 

However, a lot of music - especially music with structures like sonata form or fugues - is much more interesting when listened to closely than when half-ignored. 

(Also, some music is probably much more interesting when you've analyzed the score - some of the art is hidden from the listener - but I have so little personal experience with this that I'd better defer to the experts here.)


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## hpowders (Dec 23, 2013)

I went to a restaurant once in Jones Beach, NY and they were playing the first movement of Mozart's Jupiter Symphony softly through their speakers.

I was quite happy. It added a touch of class to the establishment. Wish more restaurants would do that.


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## KenOC (Mar 7, 2011)

hpowders said:


> I went to a restaurant once in Jones Beach, NY and they were playing the first movement of Mozart's Jupiter Symphony softly through their speakers.
> 
> I was quite happy. It added a touch of class to the establishment. Wish more restaurants would do that.


There was a study done of this in England a couple of years ago. If soft classical music is played, diners tend to order the more expensive dishes and to drink more. The drinks are the high-margin items of course.


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## Andolink (Oct 29, 2012)

Personally, I'm averse to the idea of music being used rather than listened to.


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## Balthazar (Aug 30, 2014)

Of course it's ok! My local grocery store plays classical all the time, and I often find myself lingering longer than necessary when a particularly nice piece is playing. I am so thankful they play classical rather than pop or muzak.

Music is meant to entertain, not to be worshipped.


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## Kibbles Croquettes (Dec 2, 2014)

Balthazar said:


> Of course it's ok! My local grocery store plays classical all the time, and I often find myself lingering longer than necessary when a particularly nice piece is playing. Music is meant to entertain, not to be worshipped.


Well, then again classical music is used also in the opposite way: I have heard that it is used to deter young people from hanging around malls.


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## PetrB (Feb 28, 2012)

There is a quote from the _Arabian Nights_, the content of which I here lay down accurately, though not verbatim:
*For some, music is medicine, for some it is a fan, and for others it is food.
___Medicine: to alter or further enhance the listener's mood(s).
___Fan: a pleasant-sounding disturbance of the air, thought of about as much as one would think of the breeze from a fan.
___Food: essential nutrition to sustain health and life -- this may very well include 'what you know is good for you' as a criterion above and beyond what you simply like or find tasty or pleasant*

Ergo: responses to the OP are entirely dependent upon the individual and how they both perceive music and 'what they use it for.'

Me, I am a musician, that involvement and training commencing in very early childhood.

Around the house, I will put on a recording and use it more as ambiance, i.e. its nice to have it in the air of the room while doing other things, _but, whatever I put on is something with which I am already deeply familiar._

Otherwise and elsewhere, music -- of any sort, really -- has such a strength of pulling my entire attention and concentration that I truly resent the piped-in music in restaurants, shops, etc. because to me it is an inevitable distraction, and I am near to wholly unable to "turn it off" or ignore it.

If I were commuting and the driving / train / piloting the plane are wholly up to someone else, I could happily listen to music. If I am the driver, well, you do not want me driving anything if I am also listening to music. I suppose the one exception to that is a long-distance haul where it is say, on an interstate and traffic is extremely light, or next to or actually nonexistent. I can not drive a manual shift vehicle, especially, if any music is playing -- inevitably I over or under-ride a gear, because apart from feel, I depend so much upon the sound to tell me what is up.

Because that is my disposition, I somewhat marvel (not much, I 'get it') at people who can tolerate it in restaurants, and other public places where the choice of what is played is not up to me. I do think anyone driving their car in anything amounting to moderate traffic is about as much danger to their self as well as others if they are listening to music, nearly as disturbing as knowing people are reading or sending text messages from their phones while driving.

As to your thought about 'slighting the piece,' that is less the point, i.e. the piece stays the same no matter how you are listening to it, but I would rather say the listener is short-changing their self. The fact there are but a few declared music lovers who actually "just sit and listen," whether at home, or plunk themselves down in a seat in a symphony hall, which is all about attentive listening, is a mere fact. I think TC has far less of those than average, that many here do 'just listen' and nothing else. More power, and fuller pleasure, to 'em


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## PetrB (Feb 28, 2012)

Sloe said:


> I can´t just sit down listen to music I need to do something else at the same time.


So much for attending any straight-ahead classical music concerts or recitals, then?


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## EdwardBast (Nov 25, 2013)

Being aware of music playing without attending to it is hearing, not listening. Some find such experiences beneficial, soothing or enjoyable. Doesn't harm anyone. Also, in my experience, doesn't readily lead to comprehension or appreciation. All depends on what one hopes to get out of the experience, I suppose. Not a moral issue but a practical one for me.

Edit: PetrB's long post came up while I was writing. I would add: "Yeah, what he said!"


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## aajj (Dec 28, 2014)

Music serves a wide variety of purposes. Most people use television for background noise but I prefer music. However, if someone uses great music _exclusively _for background it's a shame for what they are missing. Great music deserves and demands attention.

I still get a thrill when I am driving and come across a loved piece of music on the radio. Usually makes the ride an enjoyable one, which is not always easy considering the way some people behave on the road.


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## Woodduck (Mar 17, 2014)

Familiar music is good background. My memory fills in what I miss while doing other things. If I use unfamiliar music as background I quickly realize I'm missing stuff I should be hearing. Unfortunately I can't always just drop everything and listen when something new comes on the radio. More and more I limit the choice to actually listening or enjoying silence.

Two stores I shop at often play classical music. It gives me the pleasant illusion of living in a civilized world filled with sensitive, intelligent, cultivated people (a little fantasy keeps one sane). It's also just nice not feeling that I need to shop and run to avoid horrors assaulting my brain; there are establishments I'd rather avoid altogether because of the @#$% they play. My ultimate preference is to shop in silence, but there's no returning to Eden.


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## GGluek (Dec 11, 2011)

Depends on how good a listener you are.


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## Bulldog (Nov 21, 2013)

albertfallickwang said:


> I noticed lately that I have been listening a lot to classical music for my commute via public transit around SLC (I don't like to drive).
> 
> However I notice that a lot of people use classical music as background music for shopping, working, or just another activity.
> 
> ...


As I often say, there are no "shoulds" when it comes to music. Concerning myself, I never listen to classical music while doing other things (except while driving).


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## SixFootScowl (Oct 17, 2011)

If I could not listen to classical music (or any music) as background music, it would eliminate about 95 percent of my listening.

I love having my earbud in when I am in stores because then I am usually oblivious to the junk music the store is playing--unless it is too loud.


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## Dave Whitmore (Oct 3, 2014)

Woodduck said:


> Familiar music is good background. My memory fills in what I miss while doing other things. If I use unfamiliar music as background I quickly realize I'm missing stuff I should be hearing. Unfortunately I can't always just drop everything and listen when something new comes on the radio. More and more I limit the choice to actually listening or enjoying silence.
> 
> Two stores I shop at often play classical music. It gives me the pleasant illusion of living in a civilized world filled with sensitive, intelligent, cultivated people (a little fantasy keeps one sane). It's also just nice not feeling that I need to shop and run to avoid horrors assaulting my brain; there are establishments I'd rather avoid altogether because of the @#$% they play. My ultimate preference is to shop in silence, but there's no returning to Eden.


I know what you mean. My tolerance for "popular" music has plummeted since I really got into classical. The only time I hear non classical now is if I'm in a store or in a car with the wife. She drives so it's her choice of music. The only time she will listen to classical is in bed before going to sleep. She finds it relaxing. She especially enjoys when I play Tchaikovsky, Beethoven or Mozart. But in the car it's her choice. I just tend to tune it out now.


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## Dave Whitmore (Oct 3, 2014)

I often listen to music while browsing on this forum. If a piece of music really catches my attention I'll stop and just listen. If it's a piece I've heard before (and I do have a series of "go to" pieces of music I tend to listen to often) then I'm more likely to browse. I do try to pay more attention when it's something new.


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## brotagonist (Jul 11, 2013)

Morally wrong? 

I see no problem with using music as accompaniment to doing something else. That is one of it's functions, I believe—to serve as an entertainment. BUT, you would not be doing justice to your full capacity to enjoy, if this were the only way you listen, as you cannot honestly claim to have genuinely heard the music with your full attention (the same as you can't honestly claim to be paying attention to your driving, when you are talking on the phone when behind the wheel of your car).


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## brotagonist (Jul 11, 2013)

Woodduck said:


> My ultimate preference is to shop in silence, but there's no returning to Eden.


You could go to Germany  They have such strict laws about paying royalties to performers for public performance of music, that few stores, restaurants or cafés can afford to pay, so you truly do shop/dine in silence. I found it very weird


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## Kibbles Croquettes (Dec 2, 2014)

Background music in shops reminds me of a study in which people's perceptions of the background music in a shop were studied. I don't remember the actual percentages (they were statistically significant, though, if that means anything to anyone), but it was mildly interesting that when there wasn't any background music people recognized it more often than that there was background music. Background music, therefore, seems to be something that isn't necessarily paid attention to, but nevertheless it should be there, because if it weren't, it's absence would be noticed.

Then, of course, there are people like Woodduck who would prefer to do their shopping in silence. Or relative silence: obviously if there isn't any background music, all kinds of background _noises_ become more salient. Was it John Cage who was flabbergasted when he got to visit an anechoic chamber and realized that there isn't such thing as silence? Well, this all reminds me of a poem that I cited in the "Random thoughts" -thread a while a go. It was about how our ears are an alarm system that cannot be turned off and how existentially terrifying it is.


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## SixFootScowl (Oct 17, 2011)

Dave Whitmore said:


> The only time I hear non classical now is if I'm in a store or in a car with the wife. She drives so it's her choice of music. The only time she will listen to classical is in bed before going to sleep. She finds it relaxing. She especially enjoys when I play Tchaikovsky, Beethoven or Mozart. But in the car it's her choice. I just tend to tune it out now.


My wife never listens to music in the car--or anywhere else. I am blessed. I can keep background classical in one ear while we are driving.


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## Woodduck (Mar 17, 2014)

Kibbles Croquettes said:


> Background music in shops reminds me of a study in which people's perceptions of the background music in a shop were studied. I don't remember the actual percentages (they were statistically significant, though, if that means anything to anyone), but it was mildly interesting that when there wasn't any background music people recognized it more often than that there was background music. Background music, therefore, seems to be something that isn't necessarily paid attention to, but nevertheless it should be there, because if it weren't, it's absence would be noticed.
> 
> Then, of course, there are people like Woodduck who would prefer to do their shopping in silence. Or relative silence: *obviously if there isn't any background music, all kinds of background noises become more salient.* Was it John Cage who was flabbergasted when he got to visit an anechoic chamber and realized that there isn't such thing as silence? Well, this all reminds me of a poem that I cited in the "Random thoughts" -thread a while a go. It was about how our ears are an alarm system that cannot be turned off and how existentially terrifying it is.


Alas. Nowadays if it isn't bad music it's someone carrying on a private telephone conversation while squeezing the avocados. Which is worse? Lucky us, we're often spared that difficult choice. We get both at once.


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## pianississimo (Nov 24, 2014)

The temptation is to say Yes - unless it's Strauss, but that's beneath me...
Bus stations in my region have taken to playing "light classics" over the tannoy. http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/magazine/4154711.stm

That's ironically annoying to me as I can often hear it over a quieter symphony that I'm listening to on my ipod.
The results are that there is less trouble in bus stations and the part I like best is that when the researchers asked the youths what they thought about it they said they enjoyed listening to the music. You never know. Perhaps one in 20 or so will seek out some more of this bus station music and discover something more interesting and life-enhancing than vandalism.

edit - I do like this comment from the link above...
On the one hand, I'm in favour of anything that can be done to reduce anti-social behaviour. On the other, speaking as a classical musician, I am rather saddened to see some of humanity's greatest artistic achievements being demoted to the rank of piped "yob repellant". Couldn't they use something else equally "uncool" as well? Like skiffle, or Welsh folk music?
Gareth, Harpenden, Herts.

 Welsh folk music...


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## KenOC (Mar 7, 2011)

pianississimo said:


> Welsh folk music...


...is known to attract miscreants of all stripes and incite them to violent and unseemly acts. In my town, it's illegal to play Welsh folk music except over headphones, and then in your own home. :lol:


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## Albert7 (Nov 16, 2014)

I know that I wouldn't ever try to play Wagner as background music. Too much going on there without focusing on the work at hand.


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## Guest (Dec 30, 2014)

PetrB said:


> So much for attending any straight-ahead classical music concerts or recitals, then?


Do they let you take your ironing board with you?


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## Giordano (Aug 10, 2014)

One way to become familiar with music that is new to you is to play it "in the background." Good music will get to you anyway even if you are not paying full attention. That is exactly why music is so "powerful" and "mysterious."

I find that I can "concentrate" on music while doing physical labor. The concentration is not intellectual or emotional; there is no word for it in human language -- the best way of describing it is that I am "fully conscious of the music" while also fully conscious of what my body is doing. 

So, in other words, background & foreground are not as clearly delineated as we think.


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## science (Oct 14, 2010)

MacLeod said:


> Do they let you take your ironing board with you?


This took me a while. I was thinking, "Why does PetrB need an ironing board? Does it mean he's so ironic? Or did he 'burn' the poster he was responding to?"

Eventually, however, I figured it out.


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## SiegendesLicht (Mar 4, 2012)

When I listen to classical music, it is usually the music that is in the foreground, and in the background is whatever else I am doing. So, I only combine it with activities that do not require much concentration - housework, hiking, surfing the internet, sometimes light reading. Things that take my full attention I'd rather do in silence. When I am on public transport or walking in the city, I usually listen to non-classical music, as the background noise level is too high for CM.



brotagonist said:


> You could go to Germany  They have such strict laws about paying royalties to performers for public performance of music, that few stores, restaurants or cafés can afford to pay, so you truly do shop/dine in silence. I found it very weird


I think it's great that your private aural space does not have to be invaded with stuff you most likely will find ugly.

Personally I find one thing about pretty much all restaurants/eating places in Minsk that is very irritating: very few of them make any attempt to match the music they play to the general theme of the place. Out of three German restaurants only one plays music that is actually German. The others play generic MTV crap. The same crap you can hear in a Mexican restaurant, a sushi place, an Irish pub and McDonalds. Come on, is it that difficult?


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## ArtMusic (Jan 5, 2013)

Lots of pieces were written as party music. But I think it's stupid to cast a moral judgement on someone else if (s)he listens to classical music as background. So what, nothing wrong with that.


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## Guest (Dec 30, 2014)

science said:


> This took me a while. I was thinking, "Why does PetrB need an ironing board? Does it mean he's so ironic? Or did he 'burn' the poster he was responding to?"
> 
> Eventually, however, I figured it out.


Actually, it's my wife who says that she has to be doing something else - like ironing - while watching TV or listening to music, but I thought I'd borrow the idea...

I do both - have it as background, and listen attentively while doing little else but breathing!


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## dgee (Sep 26, 2013)

I'll happily listen to anything as background to light tasks or as part of daily routine (travel, housework etc) - can be a good way to re-hear old favourites or test new stuff for ear-catching interest. Detailed listening is different - and, for me, score-based where possible


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## sharik (Jan 23, 2013)

albertfallickwang said:


> Does using classical music for background cause injustice to the piece?


yes of course it does.


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## EdwardBast (Nov 25, 2013)

dgee said:


> I'll happily listen to anything as background to light tasks or as part of daily routine (travel, housework etc) - can be a good way to re-hear old favourites *or test new stuff for ear-catching interest*. Detailed listening is different - and, for me, score-based where possible


Yes. I screen new (to me, not historically) music this way and if I find myself really listening, I make a note to really listen later.


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## Guest (Dec 30, 2014)

sharik said:


> yes of course it does.


I wouldn't use 'justice/injustice' in the same sentence as 'music' - it's not a dimension I'd recognise except in a metaphorical sense. Music is to be listened to, or not, as the listener determines. The composer _might _wish for her work to be listened to in certain prescribed circumstances, but she cannot dictate.


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## Skilmarilion (Apr 6, 2013)

dgee said:


> I'll happily listen to anything as background to light tasks or as part of daily routine (travel, housework etc) - can be a good way to re-hear old favourites *or test new stuff for ear-catching interest.*


I do this from time to time, although I'm quite sure that it's not the most effective nor efficient way of discovering rep.

It obviously depends on what one is listening to -- there are works from baroque / classical periods that can be put on in the background without a lot of 'injustice' occurring imo.

With most of the rep however, there is nothing quite like attentive listening, and in same cases I can't imagine how much satisfaction and/or intake there really is having a Mahler symphony / Beethoven late quartet / Prokofiev piano concerto etc. etc. simply on in the background.


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## Albert7 (Nov 16, 2014)

That is one of the main reasons why I like to take public transit here in SLC so that I can focus on the music and not worry about too much distractions.


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## bigshot (Nov 22, 2011)

I think the more you can interface with music the better. You shouldn't *only* listen to classical music backgrounded, but there's nothing wrong with doing that as opposed to not listening to music at all.


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## Albert7 (Nov 16, 2014)

bigshot said:


> I think the more you can interface with music the better. You shouldn't *only* listen to classical music backgrounded, but there's nothing wrong with doing that as opposed to not listening to music at all.


That is definitely true there


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## Sloe (May 9, 2014)

PetrB said:


> So much for attending any straight-ahead classical music concerts or recitals, then?


I am a restless person.
But it was nice listening to Bruckner's fourth symphony while working.


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## Guest (Dec 30, 2014)

I definitely find music in general to be overly ubiquitous. It's like the world is flooded with it. What about special times to listen? What about silence?


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## BillT (Nov 3, 2013)

Kibbles Croquettes said:


> Well, the point of all this is that I can't stand quietness. At least when I'm alone at home: for me to be able to feel like I'm at _home_, I need some music/radio/television to be in the background.


Oh, man, I am *SO* on the opposite side of that comment! I love quietness; I sometimes think of putting music on when, say, I am doing my yoga, but sometimes I prefer the quietness. Even when my neighbor's dog is barking. Isn't the best part of a piece of music the quietness at the end?

As far as TV on when no one is listening -- I can't even summon words to say how much I dislike that. (Which reminds me -- I am going to start a restaurant chain with the theme "No TV here". I feel like I cannot even get a meal without hearing the "news". Ugh. )

Please don't take any of this personally to you. But maybe we should not marry. 

- Bill


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## BillT (Nov 3, 2013)

brotagonist said:


> You could go to Germany  They have such strict laws about paying royalties to performers for public performance of music, that few stores, restaurants or cafés can afford to pay, so you truly do shop/dine in silence. I found it very weird


Damn! I'm moving to Germany! I'd CERTAINLY rather hear nothing than the crap they usually play.


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## mtmailey (Oct 21, 2011)

There is no injustice to me one may hear it then buy it later to here the whole work.Having such music can also gain more fans of classical music.Putting music like & hip hop/rap is not a great idea you know.


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## PetrB (Feb 28, 2012)

brotagonist said:


> You could go to Germany  They have such strict laws about paying royalties to performers for public performance of music, that few stores, restaurants or cafés can afford to pay, so you truly do shop/dine in silence. I found it very weird


Holland has similar laws, which include the playing of a public radio station in a place of business, and there are anonymous spot-checkers in civilian gear who drop in to check... talk about an odd sort of employ 

Another thing in place in Holland I really appreciated -- whether that place of business is using the radio, or playing recordings owned and selected by the management, many a bar and restaurant sound system has a legally required limiter, which constantly levels the peak of loudness at a level which can not be exceeded. This due to the fact that so many businesses are on the ground floor of an otherwise residential building, and to also consider the adjacent neighbors as well!

By American sensibilities, it is all rather Big Brotherish, but I do think if you are going to turn on that radio station as the music in the place of business which is all about making profit, that you should pony up.


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## michaels (Oct 3, 2014)

I'd say life without background music in the city with all the other noise is a loss. Keep listening background or intensely engaged!

I would also say there's different music for me that I work well to (e.g. Bach keyboard keeps my focus directed and forward moving) and others that engage me when I'm doing focused listening. I prefer Opera with the libretto... keeps me from wandering and into the human element of the stories that are amplified by the music.


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## michaels (Oct 3, 2014)

PetrB said:


> Holland has similar laws, which include the playing of a public radio station in a place of business, and there are anonymous spot-checkers in civilian gear who drop in to check... talk about an odd sort of employ
> ...
> By American sensibilities, it is all rather Big Brotherish, but I do think if you are going to turn on that radio station as the music in the place of business which is all about making profit, that you should pony up.


Actually places of business have to pay royalties as well. There's a monthly fee and people do go around and check and will sue you if you don't play ball:
http://www.ascap.com/licensing/types/restaurant-bar-grill-tavern.aspx


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## DonAlfonso (Oct 4, 2014)

Some years ago I was driving while Ravel's Bolero was playing on the radio. I wasn't actively listening as it's far from my favourite piece but I noticed after a while that as the tempo of the music increased my speed was also increasing.


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## Kibbles Croquettes (Dec 2, 2014)

BillT said:


> Oh, man, I am *SO* on the opposite side of that comment! I love quietness; I sometimes think of putting music on when, say, I am doing my yoga, but sometimes I prefer the quietness. Even when my neighbor's dog is barking. Isn't the best part of a piece of music the quietness at the end?
> 
> As far as TV on when no one is listening -- I can't even summon words to say how much I dislike that. (Which reminds me -- I am going to start a restaurant chain with the theme "No TV here". I feel like I cannot even get a meal without hearing the "news". Ugh. )
> 
> ...


Of course I won't take it personally. Everyone's got their own preferences.

Silence just isn't for me. Even if I think about the worst case scenario which would be that I have been playing a gig at a bar, three sets of rock'n'roll, been there for the whole night listening to loud music and drunkards - to the point when I feel like my head is going to crack - but when I finally get home, I'll straight away put on some classical music - silence would be terrifying.


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## Kibbles Croquettes (Dec 2, 2014)

Seppo Heikinheimo - a music critic - listed his reasons for his suicide in the end of his (obviously last) book "Mätämunan muistelmat". One of them was that he couldn't anymore attend baseball games since loud and noisy music was being played at them.


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## aajj (Dec 28, 2014)

Kibbles Croquettes said:


> Seppo Heikinheimo - a music critic - listed his reasons for his suicide in the end of his (obviously last) book "Mätämunan muistelmat". One of them was that he couldn't anymore attend baseball games since loud and noisy music was being played at them.


This is a sad story but I can personally relate. Not to the suicide part but the loudness of music at baseball games. I remember when ballparks used nothing other than an organ at reasonable volume. Nowadays they seem to think they have to keep fans awake by blasting obnoxious pop music into everyone's ears.

I almost never hear background classical music in stores or restaurants. I would have no objection to even something "light," compared to the usual musak-type fluff that I do my best to tune out. During this time of year it's non-stop holiday or seasonal music. I enjoy "Winter Wonderland" but after the 10th time, including schmaltzy "easy listening" renditions, it's enough. Maybe this is why people shop online more and more!

On the other hand, I made a rare appearance at a mall recently and a live string quartet was on the scene, happily mixed in a bit of Mozart with holiday music.


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## BillT (Nov 3, 2013)

Kibbles Croquettes said:


> Seppo Heikinheimo - a music critic - listed his reasons for his suicide in the end of his (obviously last) book "Mätämunan muistelmat". One of them was that he couldn't anymore attend baseball games since loud and noisy music was being played at them.


I am in nearly the same boat. I have reduced my BB game attendance considerably. The money I have saved is mostly going to my music-listening activities. but I am not at the point of suicide. Yet?


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## BillT (Nov 3, 2013)

aajj said:


> This is a sad story but I can personally relate. Not to the suicide part but the loudness of music at baseball games. I remember when ballparks used nothing other than an organ at reasonable volume. Nowadays they seem to think they have to keep fans awake by blasting obnoxious pop music into everyone's ears.


Really, it's to the point where is mostly impossible (or at least very difficult) to talk. I used to love to go to games with a friend, have a beer, and shoot the breeze. No more. They seem to think everyone must always be "entertained". I am sure they have done appropriate focus groups, and that it brings them more attendance and more money.

When I think about these things, it actually does increase my readiness to die when my time comes.

- Bill


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## PetrB (Feb 28, 2012)

BillT said:


> Really, it's to the point where is mostly impossible (or at least very difficult) to talk. I used to love to go to games with a friend, have a beer, and shoot the breeze. No more. They seem to think everyone must always be "entertained". I am sure they have done appropriate focus groups, and that it brings them more attendance and more money.
> 
> When I think about these things, it actually does increase my readiness to die when my time comes.
> 
> - Bill


Current sound levels at sports events, those spectacle circus-type affairs like Cirque du Soleil, etc. are at such a number of decibels, unrelieved for the duration of the event, that they are certainly causing a bit of permanent hearing damage (loss) for anyone attending just one event. 
(One reason for the overkill music in these show venues is to cloak the already very loud noises from the stage machinery. But, whether it is white noise to distract you from city sounds, it is still adding to the overall decibel count!)

If your ears are ringing, people, some slight permanent damage has already been done!
Pay for that? Well, no, thanks.


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## pianississimo (Nov 24, 2014)

Music at rugby (league) matches tends to be reserved for pre-match. That's not too bad. Sometimes you get a blast or two when a try has been scored but it's rarely loud enough so you can't talk to people near you.
I couldn't go to a game which had loud pop music all the time. Baseball matches sound hellish!

Music in restaurants tends not to be too loud. If I'm on my own I put my ipod on and drown it out. 
Clothes shops have the loudest (and worst) music and it's forced me to stay out of a lot of shops that I'd otherwise use.

Interesting story,
Pianist Leif Ove Andsnes said that he was staying in a hotel some years ago and the elevator music was Beethoven piano concertos. Every time he used the elevator he would hear a little random bit of the concerto.
He said it caused him to re-visit Beethoven and study the concertos again. these led onto his wonderful series of Beethoven Journey concerto disks and a series of concerts of all the concertos.
I think this illustrates two points. One, Mr Andsnes obviously stays in a better class of hotel than me; and two, listening just a little bit to so-called background music can have a cumulative affect. It can worm it's way into your mind and make you want to explore further.


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## omega (Mar 13, 2014)

My school has the opening of Vivaldi's _Spring_ as a bell (how original...). It is a piece that has suffered a lot of injustice... But it's so sticky (and so badly played) that I've lost the pleasure of listening to _the Spring_.


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## DeepR (Apr 13, 2012)

It's a grave injustice! 
No, of course not. It's still better than bad music used as background music. And it may actually get someone interested in classical music.


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## ahammel (Oct 10, 2012)

For me, playing music in the background while I'm working means that I don't really work and I don't really listen. I can get some good listening done while I'm doing stuff that's not too taxing either physically or mentally, though.

I usually listen to Schoenberg when I'm cleaning the bathroom, instance.


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## scratchgolf (Nov 15, 2013)

Since injustice is 100% from the perspective of the recipient, I think I'm ok here. I personally get more out of 10 casual listenings than 1 focused listening. I may not be paying complete attention but a sort of familiarity develops from casual listenings. They are quite often followed up by enjoyable focused listening of the same work. At least in my experience.


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## aajj (Dec 28, 2014)

hpowders said:


> I went to a restaurant once in Jones Beach, NY and they were playing the first movement of Mozart's Jupiter Symphony softly through their speakers.
> 
> I was quite happy. It added a touch of class to the establishment. Wish more restaurants would do that.


I grew up in NY, often went to Jones Beach, but only heard pop music at the snack bars. That's what i get for not indulging in fine restaurants.


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## hpowders (Dec 23, 2013)

aajj said:


> I grew up in NY, often went to Jones Beach, but only heard pop music at the snack bars. That's what i get for not indulging in fine restaurants.


It wasn't a snack bar. it was a nice sit down restaurant. I remember I had lobster bisque and steak.

Well anyway, you could achieve the same effect by cooking a nice meal at home and playing the first movement of the Jupiter Symphony softly through your home system.

Add one of those white noise machines too and set it to "ocean waves"!


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