# Happy composers club?



## kiwipolish (May 2, 2008)

It is a well known fact that the greatest masterpieces have been composed as a result of distress and unhappiness. Almost all great composers had (big) problems of some kind: Beethoven was getting deaf, Mahler was tormented, Mozart was discontent, etc. Not to mention that almost all great composers were poor or facing day-to-day material problems.

Until now, I knew of only one exception to that rule: Mendelssohn. Son of wealthy bankers, he had no material problems. His attachment to his sister, and her premature loss did eventually kill him; but the inspiration in his music is all happiness. In the most troubled romantic times, he wrote an overture named "Calm Sea and Happy Voyage"  ... that says it all!

A few days ago, I found a CD with piano works of French / German Louis Theodore Gouvy (1819-1898) - piano music for four hands by Yaara Tal & Andreas Groethuysen (Sony). What a gem! This is very highly inspired music! Having researched a bit more about that hitherto unknown composer, I learnt that he wrote 9 symphonies (none of which have ever been recorded???) and and plenty of other works. Gouvy, like Mendelssohn, had no material problems, and lead a worry-free life, sponsored by his wealthy family.

So, the club of happy composers has only 2 members?


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## opus67 (Jan 30, 2007)

No other member, if any, comes to mind right now, but thanks for the lead on Gouvy. I'll have to check his music.


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## confuoco (Feb 8, 2008)

Aaron Copland? Maybe also Haydn and Händel.


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## Bach (Jun 2, 2008)

Bach? His inspiration was God - I believe he was content enough..


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## Yagan Kiely (Feb 6, 2008)

> Mozart was discontent, etc. Not to mention that almost all great composers were poor or facing day-to-day material problems.


Mozart's was rarely (if ever) remotely poor. And he wasn't discontent more than any person. Everyone is discontent at some points in there life.



> Bach? His inspiration was God - I believe he was content enough..


He _believe_ his inspiration was God.


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## Guest (Jun 5, 2008)

It is an oft _repeated_ fact, but facts are either true or false. This one happens to be false.

Many people are miserable, as Yagan has already said, Mozart et cetera no more or less than anyone else. The idea that the wellspring of true inspiration is suffering is a pernicious one, methinks. Composers are people who are sometimes sad and sometimes happy, just like all the rest of us. All the ones I know, even when they're complaining about this or that lack of money or audience, seem pretty happy for the most part.

And their works are perfectly fine.


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## kiwipolish (May 2, 2008)

Valid points have been made here.

I agree that Bach's music does reflect some kind of happiness. Yet: 10 of his children and his first wife died. He wrote cantatas like "Christ lag in Todesbanden" ("Christ lay in death's bonds"), "Wir müssen durch viel Trübsal" ("We suffer through much affliction"), aria "Ich freue mich auf meinen Tod" ("I look forward to death"). So happiness... yes... but rather sad happiness... and, of course breathtakingly beautiful because of that.

Haydn's music is all joy and happy mischief indeed. But Haydn's father was a wheelwright and Joseph had to work hard to make a living. He was a servant to the Esterhazys; not born wealthy himself.

I must admit I know less about Aaron Copland but, although his parents were doing well, they were new immigrants; so he was certainly brought up in more unstable conditions than Mendelssohn and Gouvy.

*What made me start this thread is the analogy between Mendelssohn and Gouvy. I suppose that their relatively worry-free lives, sponsored by their established wealthy families, lead them to write a very peculiar type of music. Having myself had a displaced, broken and rather poor family, I find that their music has a form of serenity which I crave for.*


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## confuoco (Feb 8, 2008)

kiwipolish said:


> *What made me start this thread is the analogy between Mendelssohn and Gouvy. I suppose that their relatively worry-free lives, sponsored by their established wealthy families, lead them to write a very peculiar type of music. Having myself had a displaced, broken and rather poor family, I find that their music has a form of serenity which I crave for.*


But I thought that we are talking about "happy composers club" and not "wealthy composers club". I saw some videos with Copland and he seemed to be mellow and satisfied man. He can compose, he wasn't poor and he had his audience admiring him. On the other hand, everbody has his own problems as Mendelssohn sure had.

Finally, Chopin in Paris wasn't poor anyway...and I wouldn't qualify him as happy composer.


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## marie (May 20, 2008)

Interesting discussion. Thank you for starting the thread!

I suppose that Mozart was feeling good when he composed happy music and that he was feeling down when he wrote sad/angry music. I find it somewhat difficult to imagine that you could compose happy music when you cannot really feel that way. I don't know…... You could perhaps fake your feeling to some extent. But when you put your soul into your music, I would think that your true Self emerges.


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## Yagan Kiely (Feb 6, 2008)

[q] I find it somewhat difficult to imagine that you could compose happy music when you cannot really feel that way.[/q]He wrote Eine Kleine shortly after one of his parents died. And Sturm und Drang was getting popular in that era, so there is no need for emotional interference.


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## BuddhaBandit (Dec 31, 2007)

This is a tough question because of the almost Lockean distinction between composer's wealth, music, etc. ("secondary qualities") and his state of mind ("primary qualities"). With that said, the only composers I can think of that were "truly happy" are modern composers, as it's easier to observe their happiness directly (through interviews, performances, etc). I would cite John Cage as a prime example (he was known for his laugh) and, and I think, Aaron Copland as a lesser example.


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## Yagan Kiely (Feb 6, 2008)

Well, you have to take into account that in Modern times your "image" is important, it is a brand and a logo. You can't trust what people do as there personality, nor what there friends say.


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## BuddhaBandit (Dec 31, 2007)

I think one's image, especially for high-profile musicians, has always been important. Just look at the court life of 18th century Vienna...


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## marie (May 20, 2008)

I think that I should make a distinction between having a happy mood (temporal emotions) and being a happy person. While the former could be affected by the external environment and stressors, the latter is more to do with the internal personal trait.

After I learned from another poster that Mozart composed his Eine Kleine shortly after one of his parents died, I have been thinking what made him to compose such a heavenly comfortable music. 

Renoir kept painting happy pictures whatever his external circumstances were. I feel that Renoir would have been a person who had an internal happiness. 

We often discover sublime beauty even when we are facing a very stressful situation. When I am absorbed in that beauty, I am not thinking about the stress. As long as I feel connected with that beauty, I feel internally happy. But if I am too stressed out, perhaps I wouldn't be able to discover that beauty in the first place.


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## kiwipolish (May 2, 2008)

confuoco said:


> But I thought that we are talking about "happy composers club" and not "wealthy composers club".





kiwipolish said:


> I find that their music has a form of serenity which I crave for.


I suppose the key word here is *serenity*. Being born in an established family that sponsors you, you are likely to be serene. Then, the difficulty is to be also *inspired* in that situation.

The musical term _serenade_ has the same root as serenity... yet how many composers have been as serene and inspired as Mendelssohn and Gouvy?

I found another one: Fanny Mendelssohn-Hensel, Felix's sister. Just listened to her delightful "Das Jahr". Not many recordings of her works are available, but it's worth looking for her piano works.

I reserve the right to wait another 100 years until I can qualify John Cage's works as "inspired". Anyway, he might have been happy, but - judging from his biography - was not born in a family as comfortable as Mendelssohn and Gouvy.


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## Yagan Kiely (Feb 6, 2008)

[q]I think one's image, especially for high-profile musicians, has always been important. Just look at the court life of 18th century Vienna...[/q]But in Modern times more so.


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## confuoco (Feb 8, 2008)

kiwipolish said:


> I suppose the key word here is *serenity*.


If it is, I definitely suggest Aaron Copland to happy composers club . Do you know for example Appalachian Spring? It is substantiation of serenity . And not only this his work.


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## shsherm (Jan 24, 2008)

Health problems were common in the 19th century and nobody was immune from them. Many of the great composers of that era died relatively young. As Elliot Carter enters his 100th year I don't know anything about his state of happiness but would guess he is at least somewhat satisfied. Leonard Bernstein always seemed pretty happy to me. Many great composers experienced misery but by no means all of them did.


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## marie (May 20, 2008)

kiwipolish said:


> I suppose the key word here is *serenity*.


I believe that the composer whose music could give listeners a sense of serenity would have that quality him/herself. To me, some (though not all) of the works of Mozart, Beethoven, and Bach give me a deep sense of serenity. So I personally think that these composers perhaps had serenity when they composed such music (even if not always).


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