# Best Iago?



## guythegreg (Jun 15, 2012)

I don't have a choice myself, I'm just thinking I haven't heard a really good one.


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## Bellinilover (Jul 24, 2013)

I was torn between Leiferkus and Milnes but voted for Milnes. Let me explain. To me, Leiferkus had a perfect voice for the CHARACTER of Iago -- a cold, heartless voice, poison as sound. On the other hand, he didn't sound like a "Verdi baritone" to me. Specifically, this meant that (for example) in "Era la notte" he couldn't or wouldn't use much mezza-voce, with the result that the piece lacked insinuation and nuance. By contrast, Milnes had quite a "pleasant"-sounding voice but was able to sound villainous by means of ennunciation and inflection; his "Era la notte" was much more varied in dynamics and thus actually sounded the way it should. And in the Credo he wasn't underpowered as was Leiferkus. Milnes was a less subtle Iago but I think a more vocally appropriate one. What I liked most about Leiferkus's Iago was that he didn't make any attempt to be amiable, even in the "public" scenes. Rather, he was a man who was always brutally honest -- the operative word being "brutally."

Edited to add: Just so you know, Leiferkus is on the Covent Garden DVD with Domingo and Te Kanawa; Milnes is on the RCA recording with Domingo and a "Live from the Met" telecast which was on Youtube last time I checked.


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## DavidA (Dec 14, 2012)

No contest. Indisputably Gobbi.


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## sharik (Jan 23, 2013)

Leiferkus and Morris for me!


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## Revenant (Aug 27, 2013)

I was torn between Gobbi and Ruffo, but that Ruffo deep snarl clinched it for me.


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## MAuer (Feb 6, 2011)

Here's another vote for Milnes, though I also like Diaz in the Maazel recording.


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## schigolch (Jun 26, 2011)

Iago is a role written for a great "fraseggiatore", a solid voice, easy top notes, a good vocal actor to express the powerful drama... A difficult role. Many times, it has been the victim of abuse by some baritones that used vocal and acting tricks to engage the audience, a kind of 'Look, look at me!. I'm very bad. A very bad guy', instead of singing the score, that is full of coldness, of elegance, of detachment. Exaggerating a little (but just a little) bit, Iago could be sung almost entirely in mezzavoce, with just a pair of outbursts.

Difficult choice... I think I would select Valdengo, that is the more convincing for me, with his legato, his diction, his Verdian accent (even with some rather unpleasant nasal touches, here and there).


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## JCarmel (Feb 3, 2013)

Guiseppe Valdengo in my favourite recording of Otello


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## moody (Nov 5, 2011)

Martinelli was in a class of his own as Otello and his Iago was Lawrence Tibbett. Martinelli almost unbearably eloquent,Tibbett so firm in tone, so alive in utterance. Their performance with Elisabeth Rethberg as Desdemona (!!!) may be heard in "off-the-air" recordings from the Met in the late 1930s.
Martinelli and Tibbett recorded an Otello selection with the love duet featuring Helen Jepson. The recording is bad and dry,RCA did some bad deeds in the recording world---and always to very good artists.
Ruffo was special and Apollo Granforte always lived up to his name.
In more modern times Valdengo certainly gave the performance of his life for Toscanini and Gobbi finds more colour and variations than most.


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## Pip (Aug 16, 2013)

I also think that Valdengo was superb for Toscanini, but Tibbett was possibly even better.
However , I saw Gobbi sing it and that is the clincher. Once seen, never forgotten. No matter who else sang the role.
I believe Tibbett was also of this calibre, but I can't judge on second hand evidence.


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## Bellinilover (Jul 24, 2013)

Pip wrote:

*I believe Tibbett was also of this calibre, but I can't judge on second hand evidence.*

Tibbett is a favorite of mine, and I've heard great things about his Iago. Fortunately, one doesn't have to judge it on second-hand evidence, as there exists a recording of a live Met broadcast from the 1930's, currently available on the Naxos label.


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## moody (Nov 5, 2011)

Bellinilover said:


> Pip wrote:
> 
> *I believe Tibbett was also of this calibre, but I can't judge on second hand evidence.*
> 
> Tibbett is a favorite of mine, and I've heard great things about his Iago. Fortunately, one doesn't have to judge it on second-hand evidence, as there exists a recording of a live Met broadcast from the 1930's, currently available on the Naxos label.


As I said in the post above.


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## Pip (Aug 16, 2013)

Bellinilover said:


> Pip wrote:
> 
> *I believe Tibbett was also of this calibre, but I can't judge on second hand evidence.*
> 
> Tibbett is a favorite of mine, and I've heard great things about his Iago. Fortunately, one doesn't have to judge it on second-hand evidence, as there exists a recording of a live Met broadcast from the 1930's, currently available on the Naxos label.


You misunderstand - second hand evidence is hearing it only on a recorded medium.
First hand is having seen him singing it in person.
I saw Gobbi - I have just about every recording live and commercial that Tibbett ever made, but apart from that and three of his Hollywood movies which I have, I did not see him sing Iago, so based on that evidence, I have to give the academy award for the greatest baritone singing/actor - actor/singer I have ever seen to Tito Gobbi.(by a large margin)


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## moody (Nov 5, 2011)

Pip said:


> You misunderstand - second hand evidence is hearing it only on a recorded medium.
> First hand is having seen him singing it in person.
> I saw Gobbi - I have just about every recording live and commercial that Tibbett ever made, but apart from that and three of his Hollywood movies which I have, I did not see him sing Iago, so based on that evidence, I have to give the academy award for the greatest baritone singing/actor - actor/singer I have ever seen to Tito Gobbi.(by a large margin)


The only trouble with this is that the question did not specify that you had to have seen the singer. But also Caruso couldn't have been the best tenor because nobody alive has seen him.


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## Pip (Aug 16, 2013)

moody said:


> The only trouble with this is that the question did not specify that you had to have seen the singer. But also Caruso couldn't have been the best tenor because nobody alive has seen him.


That is not the point I was trying to make!
I saw Gobbi and fortunately or not, it influenced me so much that every other person I have seen OR heard or seen AND heard since, has come up short against him.
That is all I was trying to say.


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## Bellinilover (Jul 24, 2013)

*Moody:* You did indeed refer to the Tibbett live recording in your post. I was in a hurry and must have overlooked it.

*Pip:* I know just what you mean about some singer or other having, for us, the definitive interpretation of an aria or role. Finding these kinds of performances is one of the joys of loving opera but also one of the frustrations, as it tends to make us less objective. For example, the other day I was listening to the classic Solti AIDA recording and reflecting that, as beautifully as Robert Merrill sings and as well as he characterizes as Amonasro, no one will ever, for me, equal the first Amonasro I ever heard: Mark Delevan on a Met broadcast. Of course, it would be ridiculous of me to suggest that Delevan is a better singer than Merrill or even a better Amonasro. It's just that I feel his voice had a presence and an incisiveness that Merrill's doesn't quite have; possibly it's a bigger voice. I just know that today, twelve years later, I can still hear the sound of Delevan's voice in that role in my head.


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## guythegreg (Jun 15, 2012)

Bellinilover said:


> I was torn between Leiferkus and Milnes but voted for Milnes. Let me explain. To me, Leiferkus had a perfect voice for the CHARACTER of Iago -- a cold, heartless voice, poison as sound. On the other hand, he didn't sound like a "Verdi baritone" to me. Specifically, this meant that (for example) in "Era la notte" he couldn't or wouldn't use much mezza-voce, with the result that the piece lacked insinuation and nuance. By contrast, Milnes had quite a "pleasant"-sounding voice but was able to sound villainous by means of ennunciation and inflection; his "Era la notte" was much more varied in dynamics and thus actually sounded the way it should. And in the Credo he wasn't underpowered as was Leiferkus. Milnes was a less subtle Iago but I think a more vocally appropriate one. What I liked most about Leiferkus's Iago was that he didn't make any attempt to be amiable, even in the "public" scenes. Rather, he was a man who was always brutally honest -- the operative word being "brutally."


Very thoughtful, as always! Thanks. Yeah, I know some people like the brutality of Leiferkus, others thought it made the character unbelievable ... myself, I haven't heard it yet. We'll see.


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## guythegreg (Jun 15, 2012)

schigolch said:


> Iago is a role written for a great "fraseggiatore", a solid voice, easy top notes, a good vocal actor to express the powerful drama... A difficult role. Many times, it has been the victim of abuse by some baritones that used vocal and acting tricks to engage the audience, a kind of 'Look, look at me!. I'm very bad. A very bad guy', instead of singing the score, that is full of coldness, of elegance, of detachment. Exaggerating a little (but just a little) bit, Iago could be sung almost entirely in mezzavoce, with just a pair of outbursts.
> 
> Difficult choice... I think I would select Valdengo, that is the more convincing for me, with his legato, his diction, his Verdian accent (even with some rather unpleasant nasal touches, here and there).


I'll definitely listen to Valdengo - he's so many people's favorite!


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## guythegreg (Jun 15, 2012)

MAuer said:


> Here's another vote for Milnes, though I also like Diaz in the Maazel recording.


The more I think about Milnes, the more I believe there's something about the man - I don't mean something personally, but something about his image - that leads people to discount his singing. I'm starting to think that as time goes on his reputation will only improve. It can't improve very far, of course, since he's already considered one of the best ...!


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## Bellinilover (Jul 24, 2013)

guythegreg said:


> The more I think about Milnes, the more I believe there's something about the man - I don't mean something personally, but something about his image - that leads people to discount his singing. I'm starting to think that as time goes on his reputation will only improve. It can't improve very far, of course, since he's already considered one of the best ...!


I think that people tend to have in their minds a sort of exaggerated "picture" of what he sounds like. That tends to happen when people rely too much on their memories and stop going back to the actual recordings and making direct comparisons with other singers of the same type. I know that I have sometimes, with other singers, been guilty of relying too much on my memory.

Just last night I was listening to a CD I have of Milnes live recital excerpts; one of the selections is an Elizabethan-style song called "Yarmouth Fair." Milnes sings it with a light touch, utterly charming expression, and a tone that is resonant and even from top to bottom -- and it was recorded in 1984, a couple of years after his "vocal crisis." Regarding his recorded Iago, some might recall it as a stereotypical villain but (as I've said in another post elsewhere) if one goes through the role bit by bit and makes comparisons, it is a very detailed portrayal. It's not as coherent as a whole as Gobbi's, and it's not the _most_ subtle Iago imaginable -- but it is subtle in the sense that it contains many "little" details. For example, in "Era la notte" there's that sort of sneer he does on the word "Moro" -- it's as though his Iago knows that's just what will enrage Otello the most. I also like some of the physical things he does in the telecast: the hand gesture, like the cuckhold's horns but more vulgar, that he makes when he sings about Otello wanting to see Desdemona and Cassio embracing.


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## guythegreg (Jun 15, 2012)

Bellinilover said:


> I think that people tend to have in their minds a sort of exaggerated "picture" of what he sounds like. That tends to happen when people rely too much on their memories and stop going back to the actual recordings and making direct comparisons with other singers of the same type. I know that I have sometimes, with other singers, been guilty of relying too much on my memory.
> 
> Just last night I was listening to a CD I have of Milnes live recital excerpts; one of the selections is an Elizabethan-style song called "Yarmouth Fair." Milnes sings it with a light touch, utterly charming expression, and a tone that is resonant and even from top to bottom -- and it was recorded in 1984, a couple of years after his "vocal crisis." Regarding his recorded Iago, some might recall it as a stereotypical villain but (as I've said in another post elsewhere) if one goes through the role bit by bit and makes comparisons, it is a very detailed portrayal. It's not as coherent as a whole as Gobbi's, and it's not the _most_ subtle Iago imaginable -- but it is subtle in the sense that it contains many "little" details. For example, in "Era la notte" there's that sort of sneer he does on the word "Moro" -- it's as though his Iago knows that's just what will enrage Otello the most. I also like some of the physical things he does in the telecast: the hand gesture, like the cuckhold's horns but more vulgar, that he makes when he sings about Otello wanting to see Desdemona and Cassio embracing.


It's clear that when you examine Milnes' performances carefully, he really stands out. He knew from top to bottom what a good opera singer should be.


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## Bellinilover (Jul 24, 2013)

guythegreg said:


> It's clear that when you examine Milnes' performances carefully, he really stands out. He knew from top to bottom what a good opera singer should be.


I agree with you, but then I've been a fan for the past fifteen years. And, regarding what you said before about the general opinion of Milnes improving, I think it's notable that my admiration for him rests almost entirely on audio recordings (with a few DVD performances thrown in), as his career was for the most part before my time. So he's not just one of those "you had to be there" singers. I'm not claiming that he was objectively the greatest Iago. And I acknowledge that his style is not for everyone. But then, you could say that for just about any opera singer; I mean, I've yet to hear of one singer whom everyone in the world likes.


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## Yashin (Jul 22, 2011)

My favourite recording of Otello is the Giuseppe Giacomini cd conducted by Alain Lombard. He is accompanied by Margaret Price as Desdemona and Matteo Manugeurra as Iago. Manuguerra is therefore my favourite Iago!

If you have not heard this cd....its brilliant!


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## guythegreg (Jun 15, 2012)

Bellinilover said:


> I agree with you, but then I've been a fan for the past fifteen years. And, regarding what you said before about the general opinion of Milnes improving, I think it's notable that my admiration for him rests almost entirely on audio recordings (with a few DVD performances thrown in), as his career was for the most part before my time. So he's not just one of those "you had to be there" singers. I'm not claiming that he was objectively the greatest Iago. And I acknowledge that his style is not for everyone. But then, you could say that for just about any opera singer; I mean, I've yet to hear of one singer whom everyone in the world likes.


I know what you mean. Even with Domingo, there are times when I sit and wonder what it is about his singing that's so attractive ... I love his Nemorino, but his Una Furtiva Lagrima is far from the best, and his portamento is dull, and his intonation is occasionally a bit off; in fact on the same recording you can compare maybe the best portamento (Cotrubas) with really lackluster work in that department on Domingo's part. He and Bergonzi both seem to me to frequently sacrifice intonation to effort. And maybe they're right. Maybe it's the effort I really enjoy the most. I don't know.


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## guythegreg (Jun 15, 2012)

Yashin said:


> My favourite recording of Otello is the Giuseppe Giacomini cd conducted by Alain Lombard. He is accompanied by Margaret Price as Desdemona and Matteo Manugeurra as Iago. Manuguerra is therefore my favourite Iago!
> 
> If you have not heard this cd....its brilliant!


Most of the Amazon reviews seem to agree with you ... notable however is one reviewer who says this regarding Manuguerra: "Vocally, he is almost a copy of Tito Gobbi, a baritone of medium quality with a voice of limited volume and passable technique." (He didn't like Giacomini, either.) :lol: Sounds like a must buy to me.


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