# Round One: Ah Non Giunge. Damrau, Netrebko, Gutierrrez



## Seattleoperafan (Mar 24, 2013)

PLEASE, WE ARE ONLY JUDGING THE CABELLETA SO NOTE THE START TIMES.
Start Diana at the 6 min mark please




*Diana Damrau - Ah non credea, Ah non giunge (2016) 10:25 min




Sep 18, 2008 soprano Anna Netrebko - ah, non giunge (sonnambula)- Bbc PROMS 2007 *
For Gutierrez start at 14:16




Teatro Lirico di Cagliari / October 14, 2008


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## Seattleoperafan (Mar 24, 2013)

Most of you won't know Gutierrez but she was a very very popular performer in Seattle. She had such a lovely voice and was so charming onstage.


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## Becca (Feb 5, 2015)

Seattleoperafan said:


> Most of you won't know Gutierrez but she was a very very popular performer in Seattle. She had such a lovely voice and was so charming onstage.


For those who have seen the YouTube video of Massenet's _Cendrillon_ from Covent Garden, Gutierrez sang the fairy godmother.


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## Woodduck (Mar 17, 2014)

Damrau's basic vocal timbre is very attractive, and she sings "Ah! Non credea" most expressively, but the slow waver which her vibrato has become undermines her effort, especially toward the end, where she more or less loses the musical line. In the following cabaletta the vibrato becomes intolerable, but the worst is yet to come in the unbelievably grotesque glissando - or whatever it is - she emits in place of that treacherous two-octave descending scale. From that point on she seems to have lost her mind and sounds like a drunken crazy lady. When it was all over I went back to see what on earth she was doing while singing, and I can report that "on earth" is probably not the right location for her gyrations. The audience ate it up.

Netrebko, who gives us "Ah, non giunge" only, is not a singer we should, if we have our wits intact, long to hear in this music. She is distinctly unsubtle, and her runs are variable. But - guess what? - she doesn't sound like a drunken crazy lady, and in that infamous fourteen-note drop from high Eb she sings all the notes. Every one of them. Of course there's never any question of Amina intruding on the Anna show.

Gutierrez's loose treatment of recitative is not encouraging. I know Amina is just waking up, and I freely admit that my recitative is nothing special either when I haven't had my coffee, but after five tedious minutes I wondered if we were ever going to get to the aria. We finally did, and it was neither terrible nor remarkable. But who is that amateurish pipsqueak of a tenor who thoroughly merits Birgit Nilsson's marvelous question to a master class student, "Dear, do you take lessons?" Gutierrez's "Ah, non giunge" is the most tasteful of the three heard here, though far from perfect, and there are some differences from the melody we're used to. 

No one sings this treacherous music flawlessly, except possibly Sutherland on her best day. Gutierrez, at least, is actually performing Bellini, so she gets the palm.


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## MAS (Apr 15, 2015)

This seems to be late Damrau, as her voice is tremulous in the _cavatina _especially in the sustained notes. In the _cabaletta, _she sometime uses a “wah” sound to jump from note to note, and again sustained ones are a trifle unsteady. Otherwise, she has the requisite agility and sounds appropriately joyous. The last note is,again, unsteady. 


A young Netrebko starts with the _cabaletta _and her familiar inexact and slurred divisions are as present as her charisma. She has a backup chorus and a public for whom she can do no wrong. 

Eglise Gutierrez made a name for herself by singing mostly _bel canto _operas. She does not seem like she’s sleepwalking during the _cavatina, _or sound somnolent, but she sings beautifully and accurately. The _cabaletta _is sung easily with all the high notes one could wish, and beautifully done. I’ll vote for her.


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## Seattleoperafan (Mar 24, 2013)

Woodduck said:


> Damrau's basic vocal timbre is very attractive, and she sings "Ah! Non credea" most expressively, but the slow waver which her vibrato has become undermines her effort, especially toward the end, where she more or less loses the musical line. In the following cabaletta the vibrato becomes intolerable, but the worst is yet to come in the unbelievably grotesque glissando - or whatever it is - she emits in place of that treacherous two-octave descending scale. From that point on she seems to have lost her mind and sounds like a drunken crazy lady. When it was all over I went back to see what on earth she was doing while singing, and I can report that "on earth" is probably not the right location for her gyrations. The audience ate it up.
> 
> Netrebko, who gives us "Ah, non giunge" only, is not a singer we should, if we have our wits intact, long to hear in this music. She is distinctly unsubtle, and her runs are variable. But - guess what? - she doesn't sound like a drunken crazy lady, and in that infamous fourteen-note drop from high Eb she sings all the notes. Every one of them. Of course there's never any question of Amina intruding on the Anna show.
> 
> ...


If we could have this critique read aloud by an actor I would choose Dame Maggie Smith reading as if it were her character in Downton Abby saying the lines  In every way you are a big hit with me but I wanted us only to consider the cabaletta and I put the times to start as all attempts to cue up video to a time have failed of late. I wonder how best I could note that.


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## Seattleoperafan (Mar 24, 2013)

MAS said:


> This seems to be late Damrau, as her voice is tremulous in the _cavatina _especially in the sustained notes. In the _cabaletta, _she sometime uses a “wah” sound to jump from note to note, and again sustained ones are a trifle unsteady. Otherwise, she has the requisite agility and sounds appropriately joyous. The last note is,again, unsteady.
> 
> 
> A young Netrebko starts with the _cabaletta _and her familiar inexact and slurred divisions are as present as her charisma. She has a backup chorus and a public for whom she can do no wrong.
> ...


My fault. I wanted all versions to be live performance video to be similar and this was the only live version by Damrau. I only listened enough to make sure the sound was okay. I am not familiar enough with her career to know of her voice's deterioration.


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## Woodduck (Mar 17, 2014)

Seattleoperafan said:


> If we could have this critique read aloud by an actor I would choose Dame Maggie Smith reading as if it were her character in Downton Abby saying the lines  In every way you are a big hit with me but I wanted us only to consider the cabaletta and I put the times to start as all attempts to cue up video to a time have failed of late. I wonder how best I could note that.


Me, ah knows nuthin' 'bout cuein' 'n' suchlahk. Ah's jus' a humble opry luvva.


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## Tsaraslondon (Nov 7, 2013)

As King Charles III said recently when being visited by our now ex Prime Minister, "Dear, oh dear. Anyway..."

Poor Bellini. I didn't like any of these, though Gutierrez caused me the least offence, so I suppose I'll vote for her. The less said about Damrau and Netrebko the better.


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## Woodduck (Mar 17, 2014)

Tsaraslondon said:


> The less said about Damrau and Netrebko the better.


If only you'd told me that before I started listening...


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## Tsaraslondon (Nov 7, 2013)

Woodduck said:


> If only you'd told me that before I started listening...


I enjoyed your critques. I was referring to myself and adhering to the prinicple. "If you can't say anything nice, then don't say anything at all."


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## Seattleoperafan (Mar 24, 2013)

Woodduck said:


> If only you'd told me that before I started listening...


Sometimes each of you are your most entertaining when shredding bad performances so I think it behooves me to let some pop up from time to time. Don't worry, we have some good versions coming up of this aria.


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## Woodduck (Mar 17, 2014)

Seattleoperafan said:


> Sometimes each of you are your most entertaining when shredding bad performances so I think it behooves me to let some pop up from time to time. Don't worry, we have some good versions coming up of this aria.


Yes, I adhere to the maxim, "if you can't say something nice, say something else to keep you up till 2 AM."


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## Aerobat (Dec 31, 2018)

Hmmm. I was prepared to be truly horrified by Anna. All I'll say is that this wasn't Anna at her worst, and I actually preferred her to Damrau. She has an undeniable charisma and presence that wins her a huge fan base, let down sadly by her slurring and generally sloppy voice. 

Gutierrez by default for me.


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## Op.123 (Mar 25, 2013)

These range from fairly offensive to the musical equivalent of viscious hate speech. I can't vote.


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## Tsaraslondon (Nov 7, 2013)

Incidentally the Netrebko clip is taken from when she sang at the _Last Night of the Proms. _I recall she also sang _Meine Lippen sie küssen so heiß_ from *Guditta*_, _during whcih she tossed red roses into the audience, somewhat as, apparently, Florence Foster Jenkins was apt to do when she sang _Clavelitos. _I thought it all a bit over the top and the next day, when I met my friend, the late opera producer, Elijah Moshinsky, we briefly discussed her appearance. "Dreadfully vulgar, don't you think?" was his verdict. The audience, of course, lapped it up.


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## Seattleoperafan (Mar 24, 2013)

Tsaraslondon said:


> Incidentally the Netrebko clip is taken from when she sang at the _Last Night of the Proms. _I recall she also sang _Meine Lippen sie küssen so heiß_ from *Guditta*_, _during whcih she tossed red roses into the audience, somewhat as, apparently, Florence Foster Jenkins was apt to do when she sang _Clavelitos. _I thought it all a bit over the top and the next day, when I met my friend, the late opera producer, Elijah Moshinsky, we briefly discussed her appearance. "Dreadfully vulgar, don't you think?" was his verdict. The audience, of course, lapped it up.


I have rarely if ever included Netrebko in a contest but vitriol can be fun to read. She is the state of the opera world today although I am attending a highly lauded Tristan this weekend that has got me rather excited. My fingers are crossed.


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## Shaughnessy (Dec 31, 2020)

My usual contest voting methodology is to -

1) Have an initial cursory listening session of each of the selections.

2) Carefully read what Woodduck, Tsaraslondon, The Conte, and MAS have written in regards to each.

3) Have a second, more deeply focused listening session in which I try to incorporate what I've read by them with what I'm actually hearing.

4) After careful thought and consideration, I then vote for the one "quello con il paio di tette più grandi"


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## ALT (Mar 1, 2021)

More on the state of the opera world today. Talk about over the top plus dreadfully vulgar.


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## Aerobat (Dec 31, 2018)

Seattleoperafan said:


> I have rarely if ever included Netrebko in a contest but vitriol can be fun to read. She is the state of the opera world today although I am attending a highly lauded Tristan this weekend that has got me rather excited. My fingers are crossed.


As I've alluded to before - she's the state of the opera world due to a large amount of hype, but nowhere near as much ability. There are far better singers out there today. I'd describe her as an "A" lister on hype and marketing, but a "B" lister in terms of ability. Oropesa, Grigorian, Sierra, & Rebeka all outshine her vocally.


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## nina foresti (Mar 11, 2014)

I don't know what others have to say yet but I can tell you that as fine a performance as Damrau gave, for me she was just too embellishment happy. 
As for Gutierrez, she had no guts and gumption to her very pretty voice.
But for me Her Nebs knocked the Philly's homerun out of the ball park.
(BTW: ou est Dessay et Sutherland?)


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## MAS (Apr 15, 2015)

Aerobat said:


> As I've alluded to before - she's the state of the opera world due to a large amount of hype, but nowhere near as much ability. There are far better singers out there today. I'd describe her as an "A" lister on hype and marketing, but a "B" lister in terms of ability. Oropesa, Grigorian, Sierra, & Rebeka all outshine her vocally.


Yes, but do any outshine her _musically? _It should be easy to do…


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## Seattleoperafan (Mar 24, 2013)

MAS said:


> Yes, but do any outshine her _musically? _It should be easy to do…


I have to post her occasionally so everyone can kvetch.


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## ewilkros (8 mo ago)

nina foresti said:


> (BTW: ou est Dessay et Sutherland?)


--ou sont les neiges d'antan?


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## BBSVK (10 mo ago)

None of these cabalettas reach my platonic ideal of the aria.

Diana Damrau - I don"t like her voice here, it sounds somehow fake joyful or even sinister. There was a moment when the voice does not flow like a liquid, as if the structure changed, but not in a pleasant way, plus a sharp aspiration. But I like the speed.

Netrebko - does not attempt to be that joyful, by the voice. Better than overdoing it and sounding fake. I like the speed. The microphone or something in the recording apparatus doesn't handle her top notes well, but it is not her fault.

Eglise Gutierrez - I love love this opera performance ! It is my imprint version for La Sonnambula as a whole. I heard a bit of cantabile while searching for cabaletta and remembered how great she is and that I should listen to this again. But the cabaletta is way too slow. It is about conducting, too, but I believe it is adjusted to the singer here.

I voted for Netrebko because:
1. Her CD Sempre libera was my imprint version for the cabaletta
2. I am tired of all the hate she is getting in my peergroups


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## Seattleoperafan (Mar 24, 2013)

BBSVK said:


> None of these cabalettas reach my platonic ideal of the aria.
> 
> Diana Damrau - I don"t like her voice here, it sounds somehow fake joyful or even sinister. There was a moment when the voice does not flow like a liquid, as if the structure changed, but not in a pleasant way, plus a sharp aspiration. But I like the speed.
> 
> ...


Your critiques are always fun to read and sometimes come from a different perspective from the rest of us... keep them up.


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## BBSVK (10 mo ago)

Seattleoperafan said:


> Your critiques are always fun to read and sometimes come from a different perspective from the rest of us... keep them up.


Thanks. I try not to read what others write before I write myself. Only sometimes I see the critiques or voting results by accident.

But Netrebko has 3 voices here for now ;-)


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## IgorS (Jan 7, 2018)

It was painful to listen to, but to my surprise, Netrebko was a little bit less horrible than the other two.


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## Woodduck (Mar 17, 2014)

IgorS said:


> It was painful to listen to, but to my surprise, Netrebko was a little bit less horrible than the other two.


Sounds like an average day in my life.


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## ColdGenius (9 mo ago)

Well, I voted earlier, but write a little lately, when all the participants are omitted from the final. 
All the ladies are different, everyone is bad in her own way (but also good in some sense). Gutierrez is the most "safe" here, she is in a production you could show your mother and sounds not bad, maybe even vividly in a theater, but without any shine, especially when you know who and how has sung it previously. The rest two I heard live. Netrebko is on the top of her beauty (Shaughnessy woul prevent me from lying) and her voice is beautiful too, though in a wrong repertoire. Damrau is as usually is. I know, she can't help acting as in a silent movie, but with singing, and leaves far behind Boris Christoff at sobs, laughs and coughs within the aria. But there is something in her voice that I like and forgive her some things.


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