# Sardonic Skeptic Banned -- Another Suspense Song



## teknoaxe

This was originally a 45 second clip for a friend of mine, who ultimately got banned on youtube. He's alright, he created a new account and he's got more subscribers than ever. But last weekend I thought I would extend the clip into a full song and this is the result.

I get real bombastic here, so if you like bombastic, this is your track.


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## Aramis

Very cheap bombasticism, sounds like computer game soundtrack (WarCraft III comes to mind) or movie thing, definitely nothing like huge orchestral classical music of late romanticism or anything like this.


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## teknoaxe

Aramis said:


> Very cheap bombasticism, sounds like computer game soundtrack (WarCraft III comes to mind) or movie thing, definitely nothing like huge orchestral classical music of late romanticism or anything like this.


You do know that video games are at the forefront of modern orchestral music nowadays, right? So I'll take that one as a very big compliment.


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## Aramis

> You do know that video games are at the forefront of modern orchestral music nowadays, right?


Of *poor* orchestral music. I don't want to be offensive, I hear that you intentionally compose such music - perhaps you are not talentless, maybe you just waste your skills for some reason.


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## teknoaxe

Aramis said:


> Of *poor* orchestral music. I don't want to be offensive, I hear that you intentionally compose such music - perhaps you are not talentless, maybe you just waste your skills for some reason.


I don't think John Debney or Russell Shaw count as poor in their composition skills. Really, if you're discounting those guys because they don't compose like people did 150 years ago, then you're kind of missing out on some great music.


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## Aramis

> I don't think John Debney or Russell Shaw count as poor in their composition skills. Really, if you're discounting those guys because they don't compose like people did 150 years ago, then you're kind of missing out on some great music.


It is not matter of composing like people did 150 years ago, it is matter of composing at the same level as still great and famous people did 150, 250 or 300 years ago.


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## teknoaxe

Aramis said:


> It is not matter of composing like people did 150 years ago, it is matter of composing at the same level as still great and famous people did 150, 250 or 300 years ago.


Mmmhmmm. Maybe you should be a little more specific on exactly how music isn't composed on the same level as it was back then. Is it technical brilliance you're looking for? Maybe I am a Neanderthal, but technical brilliance means nothing to me if the song sucks.

But I will give you one point in that I am pushing the soundfonts that I'm using to their limits. There are some better instruments out there for my style of composing and as soon as I can afford them, then prepare for your mind to be blown apart.


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## Argus

The start reminds me of the start of this song:


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## teknoaxe

Argus said:


> The start reminds me of the start of this song:


That's fair enough. My original goal of the piece was to try to harness the brass section with staccato notes and also to give the main percussive elements over to an instrument other than the snare.


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## Rasa

It's all been written before, and better.


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## Earthling

teknoaxe said:


> I don't think John Debney or Russell Shaw count as poor in their composition skills. Really, if you're discounting those guys because they don't compose like people did 150 years ago, then you're kind of missing out on some great music.


Actually, harmonically and rhythmically this piece is more _behind _the times, not ahead-- If you want to play that game. Listening to yet another re-hashed third rate copy of Holst's "Mars, the Bringer of War" and Orff's "O Fortuna" is a dead horse that really deserves to be buried.

I'm just saying that it is a very limited view of what orchestral music is capable of expressing. There's so much more to classical-- including modern and contemporary compositions-- than Clint Mansell melodramatic silliness.

Sorry, I just woke up and apparently I'm cranky.


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## teknoaxe

Earthling said:


> Actually, harmonically and rhythmically this piece is more _behind _the times, not ahead-- If you want to play that game. Listening to yet another re-hashed third rate copy of Holst's "Mars, the Bringer of War" and Orff's "O Fortuna" is a dead horse that really deserves to be buried.


Well, as I said, I wrote this thing for a friend. The 45 second intro was literally written in three hours because I needed to put the video up quick to get the word out about his new channel. When I picked it back up last Saturday to finish it, I just wanted the rest to be consistent with the intro.

I didn't specifically mention myself as up to date with Debney or Russell, but Aramas here likened my stuff to video game music, which I took as a compliment. That's where the whole "modern vs. romantic" debate came from.



> I'm just saying that it is a very limited view of what orchestral music is capable of expressing. There's so much more to classical-- including modern and contemporary compositions-- than Clint Mansell melodramatic silliness.


Well, give me some time. I'm an electrical engineer by trade and I'm composing with VSampler and some rather cheap Sonivox soundfonts. And this is only one of 8 pieces I've composed so far since February, which has contained a variety of moods and expressions. This one is just bombastic. I have ideas for two more: one is a more light and comical piece about a cat and a fish. The other one is going to be two movements: the creepy aura of a woman in zombie infested london followed by a frantic zombie chase on a train. ;D Awesome.


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## Earthling

teknoaxe said:


> I didn't specifically mention myself as up to date with Debney or Russell, but Aramas here likened my stuff to video game music, which I took as a compliment. That's where the whole "modern vs. romantic" debate came from.


This was intended more as a general comment about ALL that music that crops up in movie and TV soundtracks and trailers, commercials, video games, etc. Whether its John Williams or Hans Zimmer outright copping Holst, or Clint Mansell et al doing their ridiculous Carl Orff ripoff, it all ends up sounding the same-- and it is hardly "modern." Its not original, it isn't new, it isn't even "modern"-- anyone on this forum could easily point to music written 50, 100, 150 years ago more technically advanced and "modern."

My point is, if anyone wants to write good, original music, there are many better composers to emulate and study-- and they aren't on TV or on a video game.

And Clint Mansell should be throttled.


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## teknoaxe

Earthling said:


> This was intended more as a general comment about ALL that music that crops up in movie and TV soundtracks and trailers, commercials, video games, etc. Whether its John Williams or Hans Zimmer outright copping Holst, or Clint Mansell et al doing their ridiculous Carl Orff ripoff, it all ends up sounding the same-- and it is hardly "modern." Its not original, it isn't new, it isn't even "modern"-- anyone on this forum could easily point to music written 50, 100, 150 years ago more technically advanced and "modern."
> 
> My point is, if anyone wants to write good, original music, there are many better composers to emulate and study-- and they aren't on TV or on a video game.
> 
> And Clint Mansell should be throttled.


So, I've thought a lot about what you've said and you know, maybe you're right. I haven't heard the tip of the iceberg in terms of composers, although I've heard some amazing songs myself that don't rip off Carl or however you call it. I do have a special place in my heart for Smetana's "Moldau" and "The William Tell Overture", which is the first song I ever liked ever in my life. The lone ranger, you know.

But, amidst all your griping about people ripping off this style, you have to wonder why that is. I'll bet you that it's not because the these composers aren't original, but that in many cases, this style of music is simply the most efficient way of telling the musical side to a story, whether it's a movie or video game. The motif of a character, like say Luke Skywalker, to give the most obvious example, resonates with the audience of a film just as much as Mark Hammill.

In video games, I challenge you to listen to the dual harps on "Marcus Memorial" for Fable II and not be caught up by the delicacy of the piece. Or listen to the absolute chaos of Debney's Final Battle piece for "Lair", for which the game actually sucked, but the soundtrack won numerous awards for, and not actually imagine some grand conflict unfold in front of you. Listen to the Celtic overtones and the rawness of "The Age of Conan" and not be left breathless by the choir in "The Hymn for Conan".

And I'd like to stress that I've only played one of the three games that I've listed above. I simply research the others because I want to hear good music. And the good music comes from games nowadays.

No, sir. There may be great pieces with great technical prowess, but I believe you are lost in the technical side of it all and too concerned with the idea that people nowadays simply rip off previous artists. Isn't that the mark of the greatest composer? The greatest composer steals? Did Handel not take "Twinkle Little Star" for his own? ....hmmmm


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