# Yannick Nézet-Séguin’s brand new Beethoven symphonies cycle with the Chamber Orchestra of Europe



## EvaBaron (Jan 3, 2022)

Hi, DG recently released a new Beethoven cycle. It’s apparently also the first cycle to be based on the recently concluded new complete edition of the composer’s works. I have only had time to listen to the first symphony and it’s one of the best I’ve ever heard, only beaten IMO by Chailly and the Gewandhaus Orchester. Looking forward to listening to the rest. So my question is how do you rate this cycle if you’ve heard it? And otherwise I’m happy if some people now know there’s a new one because of this post and that they might consider listening to it


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## Merl (Jul 28, 2016)

Surprisingly for me I've yet to hear it but I have sampled the 7th and 8th and was impressed by what I heard but I believe these are the strongest of the set so I'll reserve judgement till I hear the lot.


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## prlj (10 mo ago)

I started by listening to the 8th last night. I am blown away by the sheer presence of the winds/brass. Almost overwhelmingly so, in a good way. There's a tight, ferocious energy to it. I'm eager to dive into the whole set. I may go in order, with scores in hand, over the next few days.


Okay - editing to add this: I have the final movement of the 5th on right now - the energy here is outstanding. Love the presence of the winds and timpani...this is wonderful.


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## Rogerx (Apr 27, 2018)

I have the set, only CD so far, disc two is coming up, no regrets so far. 
Freshness would be my word


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## prlj (10 mo ago)

Okay...so after the 5th, I jumped to the 9th. Uhmmm....that might have been one of the most anemic 9ths I've heard in a while. :/ I don't understand why. Everything else I've heard so far is bold, fresh and exciting. This was...limp. Even the first soloist entrance - seemed like he jumped in in an effort to pick things up and get things moving along.


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## mbhaub (Dec 2, 2016)

I have not heard this new set but am curious about it. The last thing I need is another Beethoven cycle, but what the heck. That the 9th is "anemic" doesn't come as a surprise. It's the result of using the Chamber Orchestra of Europe. There are several sets using chamber ensembles where the 9th is the let down. Paavo Jarvi and Mackerras come to mind. Harnoncourt, with the same orchestra, to some extent, but it's not as noticeable. Can't have everything!


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## Enthusiast (Mar 5, 2016)

All I have heard is a part of the 9th (broadcast on the radio). I didn't find what I heard anaemic. I might almost say "exciting" and certainly enough for me to want to hear a bit more from the set. But I'm not in any hurry. I have so many Beethoven symphony sets that are exceptional that many of those that I used to like are now surplus to my needs. So I'm not in a hurry.


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## wkasimer (Jun 5, 2017)

mbhaub said:


> That the 9th is "anemic" doesn't come as a surprise. It's the result of using the Chamber Orchestra of Europe. There are several sets using chamber ensembles where the 9th is the let down. Paavo Jarvi and Mackerras come to mind.


Mackerras used the Philharmonia for the 9th. The rest of the set is with the Scottish Chamber Orchestra.


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## Kiki (Aug 15, 2018)

I have listened to #5, #6, #8 and sampled a few others so far. Some initial observations -

Little vibrato and quick decay are apparent in many places; while timpani and some winds sound like period instruments, so perhaps he used a mixed modern/period band (?) like Harnoncourt did with the same orchestra.

The range of tempo choices is wide. I found some tempo choices here moderately fast and some others really slow.

His signature beautiful/sensual sound is also apparent at a lot of places; which sounds interesting with little vibrato and (probably) period winds. He certainly did not leave his pussycat at home, and I probably need more time to get used to his vision for the sonics here.

I have no idea what the new edition of the score is about. It seems that the major difference is the contrabassoon parts in #9, plus the usual uncluttering claims elsewhere. I have not listened to this #9 and it probably will not happen soon. Anybody knows enough details about the new edition to arouse some interest?


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## Merl (Jul 28, 2016)

Listening to small pieces one thing stands out, the dominance of the brass and timpani. I love the timpani sound and it really cuts through the mix. Strings are rather suppressed - this is certainly not Karajanesque! It's not what I'm used to but it's an interesting approach. Speeds seem to be all over the place. The 6th was not zippy in the slightest (11:52 is not quick for a first movement), whilst the 5th is quick in the 1st movement then slows drastically in the 2nd and 3rd movements, which are wayyy slower than metronome  The 9th didn't impress at all from an initial skip-thru, sounding really flat and sluggish in the first movement especially. The 7th sounds the best of the bits I've heard but until I sit and listen to the lot I'm reluctant to comment too much. I suspect, as a gut reaction, this is going to be one of those frustrating sets for me.

Edit: Hmm, listening to this set in comparison with Mackerras RLPO I'm not blown away. The Mackerras is way more urgent, lively and quicker across the board. That Funeral march in the Eroica is quite turgid. Sampling symphonies 1-3 I'm less than convinced and the claims, by one critic, that this set adheres to Beethoven's metronome markings (try Scherchen please) seems laughable. In fact, Mackerras is quicker or equivalent in many movenents Disappointingly Nez opts for a rather Haydnesque approach to the first two symphonies (take a listen to Stan the Man and de Vriend to hear how these should be done, Nezzy-S) and that thunderstorm in #6 sounds more like a small snow-flurry. Although 7 and 8 sound decent I'm afraid this is not impressing and I'm rarely wrong from even from an initial skip-listen. I can think of one other critic who will hate this. Lol.


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## NVK (Nov 1, 2014)

This is one of the best sets I’ve heard recently. In my opinion the 9th is also a strong performance.


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## Rogerx (Apr 27, 2018)

NVK said:


> This is one of the best sets I’ve heard recently. In my opinion the 9th is also a strong performance.


I agree with you, it's a decent set and will find it's place in music history .
Welcome to the forum by the way .


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## mbhaub (Dec 2, 2016)

Well guess what Santa brought? This new DG set. Not being a fan of either the NFL or NBA I spent Christmas afternoon and evening with Beethoven and the COE. Having heard the entire cycle I will say I was mostly impressed and very pleasantly surprised and at times thrilled. The clarity of sound was astonishing; I mean I could actually hear things like the 2nd bassoon parts that usually get buried. There were some odd things: the first fermata in the 5th was sure given short shrift, the second longer. Was YNS pointing out the one extra bar difference in the score? Was there something the editors at Henle learned? Don't know. But it was noticeable. The lack of vibrato was glaringly obvious in 6, 7 and 9. Annoyingly so. I wish they had warmed the sound up a bit by using at least a little. But otherwise I really enjoyed the set. The quick pacing (in general) left no draggy or dull spots. The shortened scherzo of the 9th was a blessing. Over the years as we've had more and more of these small orchestra Beethoven sets I've become convinced that this is the way Beethoven should be done. The Big Band versions of the 20th C are a thing of the past. Szell, Toscanini, Walter, Klemperer, Bernstein, Schmidt-Isserstedt, Leinsdorf, Karajan,,,no more for me; it's chamber Beethoven from now on.


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## Knorf (Jan 16, 2020)

I'm extremely curious about this cycle (I can't help myself), so I appreciate all of these thoughtful remarks! Thanks, everyone. 

I, too, am much more drawn to smaller orchestra Beethoven nowadays, but I'll never give up the likes of Karajan, Bernstein, Szell, Jansons, etc.


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