# 16 Levels (of Complexity) of Piano Composition



## Phil loves classical (Feb 8, 2017)

I thought this was an entertaining video. Shows the techniques (some more modern) done to a familiar tune. Great for ear training.


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## Mandryka (Feb 22, 2013)

Which "real" composers have turned melodies upside down?



Phil loves classical said:


> (some more modern)


I haven't listen to all of it, but the most modern I've heard is klangfarbenmelodie, which may have antecedents in French early baroque lute music anyway and anyway was Webern was exploring exploring it about a hundred years ago. Have I missed something more modern than that?


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## mikeh375 (Sep 7, 2017)

Mandryka said:


> Which "real" composers have turned melodies upside down? .....


The one that came to mind straight away is Rachmaninoff in the Paganini Variations. OK it's not modern as such, but the Famous D flat major variation is a mirror of the Paganini theme, at least to start with. 20' 20" in on this Stephen Hough performance.


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## Mandryka (Feb 22, 2013)

There are fugues in early music where the "mirror" is placed before or after the theme, as it were. I didn't know there were examples where the mirror is placed above or below the theme. I'm not sure what I'm hearing in that Rachmaninov.


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## Phil loves classical (Feb 8, 2017)

The Rachmaninov also came to my mind first, it's probably the most famous inverted theme. It's an inversion of the famous one by Paganini, slowed way down to a ballad. This one also comes to mind by Bartok.






an inversion of (or the other way around)


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## EdwardBast (Nov 25, 2013)

Bartok did it all of the time. Listen to the fugue in the first movement of the Concerto for Orchestra, whose imitative entrances are followed immediately by a counter exposition in which they are inverted. Invertible themes were a central element of his style. The Second Piano Concerto is full of such writing.

Not to mention the most obvious example, _The Art of Fugue_.

The genius of Rachmaninoff is that his transformations are so perfectly natural and melodic that one might never guess they're there.

The fugues in Beethoven's late have this kind of writing. The one in Op. 110 has a counter-exposition by inversion like the Bartok cited above.


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## mikeh375 (Sep 7, 2017)

Mandryka said:


> There are fugues in early music where the "mirror" is placed before or after the theme, as it were. I didn't know there were examples where the mirror is placed above or below the theme. I'm not sure what I'm hearing in that Rachmaninov.


Perhaps this will help. Rach on the top stave, Paganini on the bottom stave.

View attachment paganinirach.pdf


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## violadude (May 2, 2011)

I love her channel. She has a great series of videos where she breaks down the style of various piano composers and attempts to imitate their style, very successfully to my ears.


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## Phil loves classical (Feb 8, 2017)

^ Interesting series. I feel the Schumann was the most convincing of these.


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## Captainnumber36 (Jan 19, 2017)

I've seen the video in the OP before, it's very interesting. I should listen to it more to expand my harmonic vocabulary for my own compositions.


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