# William Schuman



## Bruce Morrison

I'm currently getting to know William Schuman's 3rd Symphony (the DG recording conducted by Bernstein) and I must say it's a striking work, especially the opening passacaglia and the beautiful third movement. Not so sure about the second movement yet, but I'll keep trying.

Are there any Schuman admirers here and can you recommend which of his other symphonies are particularly worth investigating?


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## Delicious Manager

I am a great admirer of William Schuman. ALL the symphonies are worthy exploring. Some are a little tougher than others to get to know (eg No 4 requires repeated listening). The 5th Symphony (_Symphony for Strings_) is, in my opinion, one of the best works written for strings in the 20th century. The Violin Concerto is also worth getting to know (although it's perhaps a little overlong) and the _New England Triptych_ is great fun.

Also try other American symphonists:

Paul Creston
David Diamond
Howard Hanson


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## Rangstrom

The Naxos box set of all his symphonies is a real bargain and the performances are all top rate.


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## Huilunsoittaja

The New England Triptych is a pretty good orchestral work. I have the Naxos version, conducted by Jose Serebrier.


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## Ukko

Huilunsoittaja said:


> The New England Triptych is a pretty good orchestral work. I have the Naxos version, conducted by Jose Serebrier.


Hah. That's the only William Schuman work I can recommend. I have it on an American Recording Society LP, performers mysterious. The ARS recorded a lot of music composed by Americans. The label introduced me to Quincy Porter, whose music I enjoy without understanding why, and to Victor Herbert's 2nd cello concerto (Greenhouse the soloist), a work that should be performed more often - though not by Yo Yo Ma.


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## violadude

Hilltroll72 said:


> Hah. That's the only William Schuman work I can recommend. I have it on an American Recording Society LP, performers mysterious. The ARS recorded a lot of music composed by Americans. The label introduced me to Quincy Porter, whose music I enjoy without understanding why, and to Victor Herbert's 2nd cello concerto (Greenhouse the soloist), a work that should be performed more often - though not by Yo Yo Ma.


what have you heard by Porter?


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## clavichorder

I agree with the string symphony, its a very concise work as well, so great for an introduction into his music. The third symphony is interesting as well, as is The New England Triptych.


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## Ukko

violadude said:


> what have you heard by Porter?


Right now, I can only name the viola concerto. And it fits my 'enjoy without knowing why' statement. Not a single phrase or theme that 'shivers me timbers', but it draws me in, and when it's over I stay in for awhile. That effect, for me, is similar to what sometimes happens when I listen to Fauré.

To cast a less exalted light on the subject, the subject effect also occurs sometimes with New Age music.


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## Laudemont

I must say, I have ignored Schuman because the only work of his I knew, one of his symphonies (forget which one), seemed just too strident for my tastes. However, during my student days in Boston (early 1970s) I recorded some of the Boston Symphony live stereo broadcasts on 7-1/2 ips reel-to-reel tape, and one concert included a performance of Schuman's violin concerto with Paul Zukovsky (Michael Tilson Thomas conducting). Lately I have been going through these tapes -- still good after all these years -- to convert them to CDs. When I came to the Schuman work I realized that I could develop a better appreciation for this twentieth-century composer. To my mind Schuman can't be compared with contemporaries like Hanson or Piston, whom I have long enjoyed, but creates a quite different sound that is taking me a while to get used to.


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## clavichorder

Laudemont said:


> To my mind Schuman can't be compared with contemporaries like Hanson or Piston, whom I have long enjoyed, but creates a quite different sound that is taking me a while to get used to.


I'm the other way around, I prefer Schuman to Hanson or Piston.


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## clavichorder

What are the latest thoughts on Schuman? I was obsessed with him for a while, but I have to be in just the right mood to listen to him, he's sometimes distressing to me, but he has terrific things going on at the same time.


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## arpeggio

*William Schuman on I'VE GOT A SECRET.*

William Schuman on I'VE GOT A SECRET.


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## arpeggio

*Schuman's Second Symphony*

William Schuman completed his second symphony in 1937. It was performed a couple of times, once for a radio broadcast, and then withdrawn. It hasn't been performed since.

I just discovered a recording of the radio broadcast is available on Youtube:


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## starthrower

clavichorder said:


> What are the latest thoughts on Schuman? I was obsessed with him for a while, but I have to be in just the right mood to listen to him, he's sometimes distressing to me, but he has terrific things going on at the same time.


The two Naxos CDs I have including nos. 4&9,and 7&10 always sound great whenever I put them on. I have a Bernstein disc of 3, 5, and 8 that I don't get into as much.


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## PetrB

I think his Symphony No. 6 is (perhaps) his finest





and there are these pieces, a bit less known:
Schuman composed some fine choral music, all of which I know are his
_Carols of Death_.
worth a search around, there was an LP with these, which had also on it Samuel Barber's _Reincarnations_

Concerto for piano and small orchestra (1943)













Night Journey (choreographic poem for fifteen instruments (1947)





He composed a fine 'Cello Concerto ~ Song of Orpheus

a later (1988) one-act opera which I have not yet listened to
A Question of Taste





I recall reading through this small scale set of piano pieces with some pleasure:
Three Piece Set (1943)


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## hpowders

Bruce Morrison said:


> I'm currently getting to know William Schuman's 3rd Symphony (the DG recording conducted by Bernstein) and I must say it's a striking work, especially the opening passacaglia and the beautiful third movement. Not so sure about the second movement yet, but I'll keep trying.
> 
> Are there any Schuman admirers here and can you recommend which of his other symphonies are particularly2011 worth investigating?


Sure. Check out his 4th, 8th, and 10th symphonies. After you familiarize yourself with them, then you are ready for his two greatest and deepest symphonies, the 6th and the 9th.

Edit: didn't see the OP was asking about Schuman in 2011! I was a mere child at the time.


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## PetrB

clavichorder said:


> What are the latest thoughts on Schuman? I was obsessed with him for a while, but I have to be in just the right mood to listen to him, he's sometimes distressing to me, but he has terrific things going on at the same time.


With Shostakovich sitting in a general popularity as one past tense 'modern' composer whom the public now seems to regularly enjoy, the fact that Schuman is equally as strong 'a symphonist' (my opinion, and then I think 'stronger') is not going to bring him any greater popularity for a while... the harmonic vein he mined, and the works themselves are both far more "modern" as well as that greater in their harmonic density, and that I think means they will either wait for a long time or forever for a wider general audience to embrace them. They also lack that extra-musical biographical pathos which is so attached to most of Shostakovich.

His works may sit where they do now, recognized amongst musicians and some listeners as pretty damned strong music, conservative in form, fairly dense in harmonic vocabulary, and very well made, but known by a relatively small audience.

Schuman sounds very much from its time, but so do Beethoven, Shostakovich and hosts of others


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## regenmusic




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## hpowders

_I also can recommend Schuman's splendid 12 Piano Sonatas._

Edit: As violadude noticed, the composer who wrote those splendid sonatas should have been Persichetti, not Schuman.

However, the Schuman Violin Concerto is a worthy work well worth pursuing, so I am recommending it.


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## violadude

hpowders said:


> I also can recommend Schuman's splendid 12 Piano Sonatas.


Are you thinking of Persichetti again?


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## leroy

Funny I just discovered Schuman today, his sonata "voyage". what are the other ones, or where are they available ? I haven't found much information on them, when you do searches you usually end up with mis-spelled "Schumann"


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## hpowders

violadude said:


> Are you thinking of Persichetti again?


Ouch! Too much rum cake. Okay I will revise it to the Violin Concerto!!


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## hpowders

leroy said:


> Funny I just discovered Schuman today, his sonata "voyage". what are the other ones, or where are they available ? I haven't found much information on them, when you do searches you usually end up with mis-spelled "Schumann"


Try symphonies 3,4,6,7,8 and 10. Naxos/Gerard Schwarz.

Yeah, the mis-spelling thing happens to me all the time.


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## Albert7

Schuman... definitely one of the underrated guys.  Bernstein did promote him at least.


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## leroy

Here's Schuman's "Voyage" sonata I mentioned, not sure how many recordings there are of it, but this is Beveridge Webster on LP


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## hpowders

Albert7 said:


> Schuman... definitely one of the underrated guys.  Bernstein did promote him at least.


Not as much as he could have. He kept recording Beethoven, Brahms and Mahler, over and over while Schuman rotted in the wind.


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## Avey

So totally enthralled with the _cantabile intensamente_ from his Seventh Symphony.


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## Rudy

Not familiar with his works (yet), but he had written a few works for concert band as well as these others mentioned above. We'd played "George Washington Bridge" in high school. This is one I like playing better than hearing, but it could also be the interpretation--the version I found a recording of is rather strict, almost "martial" in quality if that makes sense. Our conductor's interpretation was IMHO more expressive and free-flowing.


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## Vaneyes

hpowders said:


> Try symphonies 3,4,6,7,8 and 10. Naxos/Gerard Schwarz.
> 
> Yeah, the mis-spelling thing happens to me all the time.


As with starthrower, I only had LB Sony Schuman Symphony experience, which I wasn't overwhelmed by. Thusly culled. I'll audition the Seattle/Schwarz. :tiphat:


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## Triplets

clavichorder said:


> I'm the other way around, I prefer Schuman to Hanson or Piston.


I would rank them as Piston, Schuman, Hanson


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## EDaddy

I especially like this version of his 4th. If you like Bernstein's take on The Rhenish, I suspect you might like this one.


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## arpeggio

Sorry. Wrong Schuman. This thread is about the American Composer William Schuman not Robert Schumann.


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## clavichorder

Interesting to hear recommendations of the 4th. I ought to revisit it.

Edit, _Schumann's 4th_... there appears to be a lot of confusion in this thread regarding names...


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## Birdsong88

Schuman is definitely a composer I need to explore further. I know Naxos has recorded a good number of his works, so I will probably start with those. Besides his symphonic works what else of his worth checking out?


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## elgar's ghost

Birdsong88 said:


> Schuman is definitely a composer I need to explore further. I know Naxos has recorded a good number of his works, so I will probably start with those. Besides his symphonic works what else of his worth checking out?


I'd say the Violin Concerto is as good a place as any. Naxos's recording with Serebrier and Quint is good value especially as it also includes the New England Triptych and his orchestration of Ives's Variations on 'America'.


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## Avey

elgars ghost said:


> Naxos's recording with Serebrier and Quint is good value especially as it also includes the New England Triptych and his orchestration of Ives's Variations on 'America'.


+1.

Plus, I would say Symphony *FOUR* and *SEVEN* are excellent places to start. I know his third is his most renown -- and justifiably so -- but I think the fourth and seventh symphonies are exceptional. Very intriguing material throughout.


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## starthrower

Avey said:


> +1.
> 
> Plus, I would say Symphony *FOUR* and *SEVEN* are excellent places to start. I know his third is his most renown -- and justifiably so -- but I think the fourth and seventh symphonies are exceptional. Very intriguing material throughout.


Those are my favorites. But I like all of them. No. 4 has a beautiful opening clarinet melody.


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## starthrower

EDaddy said:


> I especially like this version of his 4th. If you like Bernstein's take on The Rhenish, I suspect you might like this one.
> 
> View attachment 70228


Yup! Wrong composer. Try this one.


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## Johnnie Burgess

He wrote some great symphonies.


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