# First Round:Chi il bel sogno di Doretta. Caballe and Price



## Seattleoperafan (Mar 24, 2013)

You might as well skip my soprano high notes contest as it is too silly and unsophisticated for all of you. Sorry. I love this aria. Very different from Abscheulicher.


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## MAS (Apr 15, 2015)

Caballe, who seems to be practicing magic with those hand gestures, indulges in her gorgeous _pianissimi _while forgoing the text, though she makes vague sounds as if she’s not.

Price sings on the words and gets the most out of her gorgeous _pianissimi._which at this point of her career were unbeatable. This was before Caballe.

Heard live, both singers would knock your socks off with their radiant sounds. But, face it, they both are primarily vocal singers and this is an aria to show off your gorgeous voice.


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## Tsaraslondon (Nov 7, 2013)

As MAS has just said, this is an aria that will always be effective as long as the soprano has a lovely voice, which both singers here do. Interpretively it requires very little and vocally, it mostly requires an ability to float some top noes. I doubt it would have suited Callas at all, for instance, although, surprisingly perhaps one of my favourite versions is by Renata Scotto.

Caballé's arm gestures are distracting and I'd recommend just listening to her. That said, her diction is vague and I found the end a little too forceful. She sings a much better version on the Puccini recital she recorded in 1970 for EMI, with Mackerras conducting. If that had been the version chosen, I'd have had more problems choosing a favourite, but as it is, Price, in gorgeous early voice, wins this one for me. 

I don't know who else you've chosen, but there are loads of good versions to choose from. I've enjoyed versions byTe Kanawa, who made the aria a huge popular success when her version was chosen for the movie _A Room With A View_, Gheorghiu, Moffo, Fleming, Scotto and Cotrubas.


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## MAS (Apr 15, 2015)

I think Renee Fleming has a version, but I find her singing the musical equivalent to “vapid.”


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## vivalagentenuova (Jun 11, 2019)

Put Dorothy Kirsten's version in the next round!


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## Woodduck (Mar 17, 2014)

I never cared for Leontyne Price until I heard her early work as an exquisite lyric soprano, which she is here. Caballe makes this into something more portentous-sounding than it actually is, as she does with a lot of things, including "O mio babbino caro." With the hand gestures she could be Cassandra lamenting the impending fall of Troy.

The Price is right.


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## Georgieva (7 mo ago)

Voted for Caballe. Too many personal sentiments.


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## MAS (Apr 15, 2015)

Georgieva said:


> Voted for Caballe. Too many personal sentiments.


I have great memories of Caballe; her hushed _“Casta Diva” _in the first recital LP for RCA, her Paris concert with Carreras where she bowled me over with her “_Depuis le jour,” _the voice so radiant; her last Act of *Roberto Devereux *in San Francisco in which I could swear she sung everything _pianissimo _(she was reportedly very sick); that *Norma *at Les Choregies d’Orange; a stupendous *Semiramide *with Marilyn Horne, also in San Francisco; a fabulous *Turandot *with Pavarotti and Leona Mitchell’s Liu, again in San Francisco. Not to mention numerous live recordings that astonish.


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## Seattleoperafan (Mar 24, 2013)

MAS said:


> I have great memories of Caballe; her hushed _“Casta Diva” _in the first recital LP for RCA, her Paris concert with Carreras where she bowled me over with her “_Depuis le jour,” _the voice so radiant; her last Act of *Roberto Devereux *in San Francisco in which I could swear she sung everything _pianissimo _(she was reportedly very sick); that *Norma *at Les Choregies d’Orange; a stupendous *Semiramide *with Marilyn Horne, also in San Francisco; a fabulous *Turandot *with Pavarotti and Leona Mitchell’s Liu, again in San Francisco. Not to mention numerous live recordings that astonish.


I would hate you if I didn't like you so much  She and Horne were a very good team. She was best early on in my opinion.


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## MAS (Apr 15, 2015)

Seattleoperafan said:


> I would hate you if I didn't like you so much  She and Horne were a very good team. She was best early on in my opinion.


😂 Horne was very good late in her career, but technically. Very practiced. Vocally, she had a nice soprano-ish sound early but I never truly liked her butch sound with the strong chest. But what a great voice for “pants” roles, only lacking a certain sweetness. At times she could almost float the high voice, too. But there was always the feeling that spontaneity was lacking.


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## Op.123 (Mar 25, 2013)

I can't choose, Caballe is not at her best here but Price's voice has always sounded a little thin to me, especially on top. For me, the most georgeous rendition of this aria is from Virginia Zeani.


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## Woodduck (Mar 17, 2014)

Zeani is marvelous. She's more passionate than most, and she made me look up the text:


_Who could Doretta's beautiful dream
ever guess?
Her mystery how come it's never
how come it's never ending

Alas! One day a student
kisses her on the lips
and it was such a kss
revelation:
It was passion!

Crazy love!
Crazy intoxication!
Who could this subtle caress
of such flaming a kiss
ever describe;

Ah! my dream!

Ah! my life!

Who cares about riches
if it finally flourishes
happiness!
Oh golden dream
to be able to love like this!_


Zeani gets it, and now so do I.


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## Woodduck (Mar 17, 2014)

MAS said:


> 😂 Horne was very good late in her career, but technically. Very practiced. Vocally, she had a nice soprano-ish sound early but I never truly liked *her butch sound with the strong chest.* But what a great voice for “pants” roles, only lacking a certain sweetness. At times she could almost float the high voice, too. But there was always the feeling that spontaneity was lacking.


I've never found the right adjective to describe Horne's tone quality. You've nailed it. I can see her now in helmet and breastplate.


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## Seattleoperafan (Mar 24, 2013)

Woodduck said:


> Zeani is marvelous. She's more passionate than most, and she made me look up the text:
> 
> 
> _Who could Doretta's beautiful dream
> ...


I hope you guys have not worn out your Zeani praise as she is a contestant.


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## ColdGenius (9 mo ago)

Montserrat! 🥰


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## Tsaraslondon (Nov 7, 2013)

Woodduck said:


> Zeani is marvelous. She's more passionate than most, and she made me look up the text:
> 
> 
> _Who could Doretta's beautiful dream
> ...


Context is also important, for the words of the aria, at the time she sings them, have little to do with the plot. The scene is a cocktail party being held by Magda, at which the poet Prunier plays and sings his latest song about Doretta, who rejected a king as her suitor because of the value she placed on true love. He does not know how to finish the song, so Magda takes over and provides the second verse: she recounts how Doretta falls in love with a student. At this point, Magda hasn't even met Ruggero and is in under the protection of Rambaldo. Though the high lying phrases perhaps serve as an indication of a certain yearning in the character of Magda, she is not at this point thinking of anyone specific. I like Zeani's version but it somehow sounds almost too passionate, when I also want to recognise that in fact this is just someone getting up and singing a song at a party. 

I suppose what I'm saying is that a slightly more detached interpretation is just as valid.


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## Woodduck (Mar 17, 2014)

Tsaraslondon said:


> Context is also important, for the words of the aria, at the time she sings them, have little to do with the plot. The scene is a cocktail party being held by Magda, at which the poet Prunier plays and sings his latest song about Doretta, who rejected a king as her suitor because of the value she placed on true love. He does not know how to finish the song, so Magda takes over and provides the second verse: she recounts how Doretta falls in love with a student. At this point, Magda hasn't even met Ruggero and is in under the protection of Rambaldo. Though the high lying phrases perhaps serve as an indication of a certain yearning in the character of Magda, she is not at this point thinking of anyone specific. I like Zeani's version but it somehow sounds almost too passionate, when I also want to recognise that in fact this is just someone getting up and singing a song at a party.
> 
> I suppose what I'm saying is that a slightly more detached interpretation is just as valid.


Good point. My sense of the opera's plot is sketchy, as I've listened to it only a few times over many years. I do like Zeani's characteristic urgency. I recall that she was also wonderfully fervent in "O mio babbino caro." She was never content to make pretty noises, as many sopranos seem to be in both of these Puccini chestnuts.


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## Becca (Feb 5, 2015)

Here is a wild-card shown in context... Ainhoa Arteta


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## nina foresti (Mar 11, 2014)

As I was skimming down to post my choice, I ran by the face of one of my top 5 favorite sopranos, Virginia Zeani, and I wondered if John had decided to add her to the mix as well and so I listened to her too until I realized someone else had put this rendition up there.
So, playing fair, I have to vote for second best after Zeani blew me away.
Now I am a lover of those incredibly superb pianissimos that Caballe has made a business out of, despite some annoyed fans who think she overdoes it, and because of her gorgeous, ethereal ending I almost voted for her, but Price was the one that caused some goosebumps and although she's no Zeani she did a beautiful job and gets my vote.
(now to go up and see that I am once again out in left field.)


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## Seattleoperafan (Mar 24, 2013)

nina foresti said:


> As I was skimming down to post my choice, I ran by the face of one of my top 5 favorite sopranos, Virginia Zeani, and I wondered if John had decided to add her to the mix as well and so I listened to her too until I realized someone else had put this rendition up there.
> So, playing fair, I have to vote for second best after Zeani blew me away.
> Now I am a lover of those incredibly superb pianissimos that Caballe has made a business out of, despite some annoyed fans who think she overdoes it, and because of her gorgeous, ethereal ending I almost voted for her, but Price was the one that caused some goosebumps and although she's no Zeani she did a beautiful job and gets my vote.
> (now to go up and see that I am once again out in left field.)


Zeani is on the list.


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