# God Says Only 1 Mahler Piece Will Surivive!



## Klassic (Dec 19, 2015)

{_God comes down and talks to Adam in order to set things straight with mankind_}

*God:* I'm sorry Adam, but I'm going to have to get rid of Mahler's music.

*Adam* [_looking terrified_]*:* Why God?! Wtf!

*God:* Because it's a threat to my glory. I can't have Mahler getting more praise than me, it's just not right. But I'll tell you what, you can preserve one of his works for mankind, but it can only be one. Choose wisely.

*Adam* [_throwing arms wildly in air_]*:* But God, [_Adam mumbling to self: '***** this isn't fair'_], wait! Come back! God, wait!!!

{_God ascends to heaven, Adam has 9 minutes and 39 seconds to decide._}

Which piece would you choose if you were Adam?


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## Dedalus (Jun 27, 2014)

Wow, God Certainly is a jealous little brat isn't he! Maybe if he tried being a little more glorious and a little less petulant he wouldn't have to worry about Mahler's music challenging his glory.

Ugh, that aside, I get the point. I can only keep one Mahler piece. I'll pick Mahler's 2nd because it's my favorite, and it's in my opinion the most glorious, so the one God would most have to worry about, even if it's the only one left.


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## dsphipps100 (Jan 10, 2016)

The 7th, simply because it's my personal favorite.

But then I would ask, will the other symphonies still be available in hell?


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## Harold in Columbia (Jan 10, 2016)

_The Song of the Earth_, easy.


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## clavichorder (May 2, 2011)

The 2nd I guess. But really, I have no need for Mahler, greatly preferring Nielsen and Sibelius to his overrated histrionic teutonic/Jewish style. More originality and concision in those two Scandinavians. And Bruckner suits me better too, having more sincerity and depth though less polish and color.


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## Adam Weber (Apr 9, 2015)

Sixth Symphony. 

I guess. 

I dunno. 

Don't make me do this.


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## hpowders (Dec 23, 2013)

I would keep the most profound adagio that Mahler wrote-that of his Tenth Symphony. I wouldn't want to live without it.


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## Weston (Jul 11, 2008)

To contemplate the horrifying choices thrust upon us by these iconoclastic threads, even for a moment, is more than I care to bare. I need to celebrate the arts, relish them, revel in them, rejoice in them, and share the experience.


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## SalieriIsInnocent (Feb 28, 2008)

I won't choose. That's the same as the "what item would you grab if your house was on fire?" question.


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## Manxfeeder (Oct 19, 2010)

I'd choose the 3rd. That's the one that taught me about the love of God. No, it really did.


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## StlukesguildOhio (Dec 25, 2006)

I'd be torn between the 2nd and _Das Lied von der Erde_. Might have to flip a coin.


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## StlukesguildOhio (Dec 25, 2006)

I wanna hear Mahlerian's take on this question.


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## EarthBoundRules (Sep 25, 2011)

My favourite, the 9th.


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## isorhythm (Jan 2, 2015)

Ninth Symphony, but _Das Lied_ is a close second choice.


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## Klassic (Dec 19, 2015)

This really is a hard question. Mahler might be the hardest composer to do this with... I mean in the case of Beethoven no brainier, Op.91 "Wellington's Victory." In the case of Mozart no problem, Symphony No.39. We all know this, these are easy and obvious choices for preservation, but in the case of Mahler how can we decide?


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## OldFashionedGirl (Jul 21, 2013)

The 2nd Symphony.


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## Boldertism (May 21, 2015)

It's like choosing which single sense to keep. In the case of Mahler, though I'd long for the rest, I'd have to pick Symphony No. 2.



> I mean in the case of Beethoven no brainier, Op.91 "Wellington's Victory." In the case of Mozart no problem, Symphony No.39


 Are you saying Mozart's 39th Symphony (which I consider _almost_ equal to the Jupiter) is corny and dumb like Wellinton's Victory?


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## Pugg (Aug 8, 2014)

dsphipps100 said:


> The 7th, simply because it's my personal favorite.
> 
> But then I would ask, will the other symphonies still be available in hell?


​


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## Woodduck (Mar 17, 2014)

The song "Ich bin der Welt abhanden gekommen."






Everything I love about Mahler in seven perfect minutes.


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## Haydn man (Jan 25, 2014)

Well I think it will be Mahler 5
But if God is so jealous of old Gustav, then there won't be much Mozart in heaven either


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## Kevin Pearson (Aug 14, 2009)

Your god is too small and petty to be a God, however, I would keep the 4th because it's my personal favorite. 

Kevin


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## violadude (May 2, 2011)

Dedalus said:


> Wow, God Certainly is a jealous little brat isn't he! Maybe if he tried being a little more glorious and a little less petulant he wouldn't have to worry about Mahler's music challenging his glory.


In all fairness though, it's the same sort of attitude God displays in the Tower of Babel story. At least if we're talking about the Abrahamic God.

Other culture's gods usually have at least one petulant one in the mix as well. So I say it's a fair hypothetical.


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## MagneticGhost (Apr 7, 2013)

The Resurrection - without even having to think about it. 

I'd cry buckets on the loss of 3,6 and the 10
adagio though.


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## Art Rock (Nov 28, 2009)

Seven of Mahler's compositions I rate as among the very, very best (less than 100 works) that classical music has to offer to me, more than any other composer. I'd be devastated to lose the other six (Symphonies 2,4,6,9, Kindertotenlieder, Rueckertlieder), but I'd save Das Lied von der Erde.


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## FLighT (Mar 7, 2013)

Without all of Mahler mankind will cease to exist, so, preserve for who?


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## Ilarion (May 22, 2015)

Weston said:


> To contemplate the horrifying choices thrust upon us by these iconoclastic threads, even for a moment, is more than I care to bare. I need to celebrate the arts, relish them, revel in them, rejoice in them, and share the experience.


Truer words have yet to be uttered on this forum - Thank you dear Weston:tiphat::tiphat:


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## aleazk (Sep 30, 2011)

The one in A minor...

No... no the 6th Symphony, but this one!


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## Animal the Drummer (Nov 14, 2015)

The early piano quartet movement, because it's the only piece of Mahler's music I've ever managed to enjoy.


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## Fugue Meister (Jul 5, 2014)

I'd probably cheat and mix and match movements from all to create a the best of all (for me), even though the structural unity would suffer. In addition to this, I'd select five movements for the maximum amount of Mahler.


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## Stavrogin (Apr 20, 2014)

I'd pick the 9th.

Also waiting for Mahlerian here


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## drnlaw (Jan 27, 2016)

The 2nd. 

I’m fairly new here, so I don’t know all the unwritten rules. But I’m going to take this opportunity to relate a story involving the Mahler Second, and if it’s inappropriate to include such stuff, please feel free to let me know. I always want to be a good citizen.

By the time I was 15 or 16 years old, I was solidly hooked on Mahler and Bruckner, and my favorite even at that tender age was the Second, the first Solti Chicago version, which to this day remains my favorite.

Shortly after high school, I joined the Navy, and was stationed at the submarine base at New London, Connecticut. I had a buddy, a fellow Mahler lover, who worked in the base chaplain’s office, and because at the time we were both relatively low ranking enlisted pukes who had to live in the barracks, he had a stereo set up in the chaplain’s office, and we would often spend evenings there listening to music.

We also had a mutual friend, female, with whom our relationship was purely platonic, who would sometimes join us. Our custom was, when listening to the Mahler Second, to turn out all the lights at the beginning of the choral section, and simply lie back on the carpeted floor to be washed by the music. It happened one night that the three of us were there pretty late, and about the time we turned out the lights for the Mahler, the shore patrol happened to have his eye on the building, wondering who was there that late at night, and why the lights had been turned out but no one had come out of the building. So after a few minutes he banged on the door, demanding to be let in, and there we were, two guys and a girl scrambling to find the light switch, claiming (truthfully) that we were simply there to enjoy the intensely spiritual experience of listening to the Mahler Second with the lights out. Quite inexplicably, he didn’t seem to believe us. We finally had to get the head chaplain (who, thankfully, knew all three of us pretty well) out of bed to assure the shore patrol that we were there by consent.

So even though the Mahler Second almost resulted in me spending a few hours in the brig, it to this day remains my single favorite piece of symphonic classical music (and vies with the Beethoven Missa Solemnis as the greatest piece of music ever written – IMHO).


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## arpeggio (Oct 4, 2012)

They are all worth saving even the _Eighth_.


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## drnlaw (Jan 27, 2016)

Fugue Meister said:


> I'd probably cheat and mix and match movements from all to create a the best of all (for me), even though the structural unity would suffer. In addition to this, I'd select five movements for the maximum amount of Mahler.


Doesn't the 3rd have 6? So you should be able to mix and match six movements. If I were doing this, I'd make sure they were long movements, for maximum Mahler.


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## DeepR (Apr 13, 2012)

I would save some separate movements instead (such as the finale of the 2nd and 8th and adagietto of the 5th). To some it may be sacrilege but I have no problem with separating movements and enjoying them as sort of standalone pieces.


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## drnlaw (Jan 27, 2016)

arpeggio said:


> They are all worth saving even the _Eighth_.


EVEN the Eighth?

Bite your tongue!


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## hpowders (Dec 23, 2013)

Curious though:

Was God speaking English? If so, could you pinpoint the regional accent?

Was God's voice male, female or something unique, never heard before?

Just asking.


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## Mahlerian (Nov 27, 2012)

clavichorder said:


> The 2nd I guess. But really, I have no need for Mahler, greatly preferring Nielsen and Sibelius to *his overrated histrionic teutonic/Jewish style*. More originality and concision in those two Scandinavians. And Bruckner suits me better too, having more sincerity and depth though less polish and color.


Who is this describing? What do people even mean when they throw in dumb words like histrionic in relation to Mahler? His music is full of contrasts, grotesquerie, and so forth, sure, but that doesn't mean it merits such superficial reactions.

Anyway, as much as I'd hate to lose everything else he ever composed, I'd keep the Sixth.


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## clavichorder (May 2, 2011)

It is my opinion, that is all. I don't dislike Mahler, but feel him extremely overrated on talkclassical.


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## Chronochromie (May 17, 2014)

If I picked the 7th most Mahler fans would kill me so I'd choose Das Lied instead.


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## drnlaw (Jan 27, 2016)

Chronochromie said:


> If I picked the 7th most Mahler fans would kill me so I'd choose Das Lied instead.


I wouldn't kill you, but I must confess - of ALL Mahler's music, I find the Seventh the most difficult to warm up to. Levine/CSO has allowed me to ALMOST appreciate it. I don't think I've even heard anything done more recently than that, so maybe somewhere . . .

I usually appreciate Rattle - maybe I'll listen to his on YouTube to see what I think of it.


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## Mahlerian (Nov 27, 2012)

clavichorder said:


> It is my opinion, that is all. I don't dislike Mahler, but feel him extremely overrated on talkclassical.


I asked, though, what you meant by saying "his histrionic Teutonic/Jewish style." It is nothing like a neutral description, and it has little to do with the way I perceive his music.


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## Chronochromie (May 17, 2014)

drnlaw said:


> Wouldn't kill you, but I must confess - of ALL Mahler's music, I find the Seventh the most difficult to warm up to. Levine has allowed me to ALMOST appreciate it.


You should try Gielen's recording if you haven't already.


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## drnlaw (Jan 27, 2016)

Chronochromie said:


> You should try Gielen's recording if you haven't already.


I haven't, but I will. Thank you.


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## clavichorder (May 2, 2011)

It was my impulsive intent to be a bit inflammatory(I was also drunk..) He can take a little put down given his popularity and respected status. In an ideal world we would all just listen to great music and not bother with sizing composers up according to who is more unfairly popular or respected and who isn't. But I percieve other composers the equal of Mahler, who I also happen to prefer, being constantly overshadowed and it does irk me, influencing my decision to not listen to him as often. I also tend not to favor what I consider the most obvious forms of musical maximalism, no matter how well done. With the exception of Schumann, Brahms, and Bruckner, I tend to not feel as strong an inclination for post Beethoven germanic masters. I feel like they often took an almost self consciously straight path down the natural evolution of music, and to me that is less interesting than someone like Brahms who seems to look back far and leap ahead all the same, and have a more melancholic musical disposition, or someone like Berlioz who was simply himself and bold by nature, who I greatly prefer to Wagner.


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## Mahlerian (Nov 27, 2012)

clavichorder said:


> It was my impulsive intent to be a bit inflammatory(I was also drunk..) He can take a little put down given his popularity and respected status. In an ideal world we would all just listen to great music and not bother with sizing composers up according to who is more unfairly popular or respected and who isn't. But I percieve other composers the equal of Mahler, who I also happen to prefer, being constantly overshadowed and it does irk me, influencing my decision to not listen to him as often. I also tend not to favor what I consider the most obvious forms of musical maximalism, no matter how well done.


None of this, of course, has any bearing on the quality of his works.

I love Sibelius's symphonies as well. Not as much as Mahler's, but then they are very different in character and try different things, so it's unsurprising that some will prefer one and some the other.


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## Barbebleu (May 17, 2015)

arpeggio said:


> They are all worth saving even the _Eighth_.


Particularly the 8th as far as I'm concerned closely followed by Das Lied, then Kindertotenlieder.


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## Haydn man (Jan 25, 2014)

I have changed my mind on this.
I would tell this God that I am not doing his dirty work for him so, let him destroy what he wants. After all I reckon if he is so jealous of Mahler, it is unlikely he will agree to let you keep the one you choose.


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## Dedalus (Jun 27, 2014)

violadude said:


> *In all fairness though, it's the same sort of attitude God displays in the Tower of Babel story. At least if we're talking about the Abrahamic God.*
> 
> Other culture's gods usually have at least one petulant one in the mix as well. So I say it's a fair hypothetical.


That's actually what I think is funniest about this hypothetical. The fact that it's really not so farfetched of or out of character for the Abrahamic God. Also. How does Adam know about Mahler? Also. Didn't God create Mahler? Doesn't he see the future? Could he have stopped it before it happened? Does omnipotence include music composition? Ok. ok. ok. I'll stop. I'm thinking way too deeply into this hypothetical.

Still 2nd symphony for the win, though.


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## drnlaw (Jan 27, 2016)

Dedalus said:


> That's actually what I think is funniest about this hypothetical. The fact that it's really not so farfetched of or out of character for the Abrahamic God. Also. How does Adam know about Mahler? Also. Didn't God create Mahler? Doesn't he see the future? Could he have stopped it before it happened? Does omnipotence include music composition? Ok. ok. ok. I'll stop. I'm thinking way too deeply into this hypothetical.
> 
> Still 2nd symphony for the win, though.


Do we need a talkclassicaltheology subgroup?


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## Adam Weber (Apr 9, 2015)

drnlaw said:


> Do we need a talkclassicaltheology subgroup?


Seeing how heated things get when we're just talking about music, I'm gonna go out on a limb and say we probably shouldn't bring religion into it also.


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## Becca (Feb 5, 2015)

The 10th *IF* God will resurrect Mahler long enough for him to finish it


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## Huilunsoittaja (Apr 6, 2010)

If Mahler was worth anything, a single piece would be enough to overshadow God still. Clearly God's bluffing. :tiphat:


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## science (Oct 14, 2010)

Mahler says God only gets to keep one commandment.


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## MarkW (Feb 16, 2015)

Coin flip: Sixth or Das Lied . . . I'd let God surprise me.


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## Guest (Feb 18, 2016)

Probably Mahler 3, but that and Des Knaben Wunderhorn are the only ones I've seen live so far sooooo maybe I'm biased.


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## dsphipps100 (Jan 10, 2016)

(accidental post)
#b#b#b#b#b#b#b#b#b


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## Petwhac (Jun 9, 2010)

Mahler says you can only keep one god. 
I choose Quetzalcoatl.


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## manyene (Feb 7, 2015)

*Fortunately* we live in a world where we don't have to make this sort of choice. Long may it remain so.


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## science (Oct 14, 2010)

dsphipps100 said:


> (accidental post)
> b# b# b# b# b# b# b# b#


I'm saying C major until I see that key signature.


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## Pugg (Aug 8, 2014)

manyene said:


> *Fortunately* we live in a world where we don't have to make this sort of choice. Long may it remain so.


​


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## Dedalus (Jun 27, 2014)

drnlaw said:


> Do we need a talkclassicaltheology subgroup?


Also if God created Mahler wouldn't everything he did be a reflection of his own greatness? I mean.... If you create something that creates something good, isn't the original creator most responsible for the chain of events? If God can make Mahler, or Mozart, or what have you, obviously those things are attributed to him, I mean, that's just simple logic. I don't even believe in God, but come on, this hypothetical rubs me the wrong way in like 20 different ways. What does god even need glory for? What is he gonna do with it? He has everything he wants, what is glory to him? Like what he just wants to feel popular... among the creatures he himself created? Come on. If God exists, he is WAY grander than that.

(Least I would hope so)


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## dsphipps100 (Jan 10, 2016)

science said:


> dsphipps100 said:
> 
> 
> > (accidental post)
> ...


I was just doing a really bad job of trying to be cute with the (ahem) "accidental" (pun definitely intended) post, when my mouse was a little more responsive that I wanted it to be. The lower-case bs were supposed to be flats, so it would look like a series of "accidentals". Again, pun definitely intended, but no key signature intended....


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## SiegendesLicht (Mar 4, 2012)

Dedalus said:


> Also if God created Mahler wouldn't everything he did be a reflection of his own greatness? I mean.... If you create something that creates something good, isn't the original creator most responsible for the chain of events? If God can make Mahler, or Mozart, or what have you, obviously those things are attributed to him, I mean, that's just simple logic.


Somehow it is so that when men do something great or wonderful, it is God who gets the glory. But when men do something horrible, it is men's own choice and responsibility...

Actually, the OP's proposition is not far-fetched at all. There are fundamentalists sects in both Christianity and Islam (I don't know about Judaism) who would ban _all_ music if they could. They would not even let you choose one.


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## hpowders (Dec 23, 2013)

I would choose Kindertotenlieder in the Janet Baker/Israel Philharmonic/Leonard Bernstein performance.

One of the most devastating, moving performances of anything I know.

But then again, there is the performance of the Mahler Symphony No. 10 Adagio with Leonard Bernstein conducting the NY Philharmonic. Also devastating and for me the finest music Mahler ever composed.

A tough choice.

However, "humanity" deserves neither!


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## Xaltotun (Sep 3, 2010)

The 7th is my favourite but I do get an instinctive feeling that I should actually choose the 2nd. That's what I'd do. In a way it's the freshest, most creative, most enthusiastic, drunk with joy of its own explosive creative power.


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## Wandering (Feb 27, 2012)

I wonder if Adam had all sorts of hotheaded revenge fantasies whirling around in his head, like burying God alive and telling him to "Schoeck on it!"


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## Polyphemus (Nov 2, 2011)

If God existed he would probably send Gustav a 'thank you' note.


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## Klassic (Dec 19, 2015)

Dedalus said:


> Also if God created Mahler wouldn't everything he did be a reflection of his own greatness?


Nope, because God gave man free will so He could claim He is not responsible. He only comes in to override the will when He feels it threatens His view of Himself. Hence, Mahler's free will has to be stopped lest it usurp God's glory.


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## 20centrfuge (Apr 13, 2007)

I am not a Mahlerian, but I like 5


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## imoustapha (Feb 21, 2016)

Das Lied Von der Erde - No doubt


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## Nevum (Nov 28, 2013)

Symphony number 1. For sure. And this post reminds me why I am agnostic


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## dsphipps100 (Jan 10, 2016)

Nevum said:


> Symphony number 1.


Shoulda known anybody with a Mendelssohn avatar would pick # 1.....


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## Pugg (Aug 8, 2014)

Nevum said:


> Symphony number 1. For sure. And this post reminds me why I am agnostic


Like the answer :lol:


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## Richard8655 (Feb 19, 2016)

Toss up between 5 and 9.


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## Totenfeier (Mar 11, 2016)

You want to experience _God_, pick any of the other symphonies; you want to experience _Man_, got to be Das Lied.


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