# Antonio Vivaldi: Correct music naming rule



## AKazak (May 1, 2012)

Greetings, dear community!

While adding an Essential Vivaldi CD set to home digital library I found few different approaches to name music items:


Concerto in F, Op. 8, No. 3, RV 293 "L'Autunno" (Autumn): I. Allegro
Concerto in G minor, RV 439 "La Notte", for alto recorder, violin I & II, bassoon, basso continuo: I. Largo
Concerto in G minor, RV 105, for alto recorder, oboe, violin, bassoon, basso continuo: I. Allegro
Trio in G minor, RV 85, for violin, lute and basso (msc I-Tn, Foa; "per Sua Eccellenza Conte Wrtby"): I. Andante molto
Sonata in C, RV 48, for flute and basso continuo: I. [Preludio]


As you can see even in a single song collection there are different naming approaches used.
Therefore I'm curious about an unified naming convention which I can use to rename all 209 music titles.

Thank you in advance for the detailed reply or references.


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## tgtr0660 (Jan 29, 2010)

We can start by not calling them 'songs'


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## humanbean (Mar 5, 2011)

Yes, unfortunately there is a hundred different ways to name a classical track, yet no universal standard. Surprisingly, there isn't even a good index of classical works on the web yet. I'd once considered creating a wiki-style directory for ALL classical works, including a standardized scheme that would be helpful for obsessive taggers like myself. I even got quite far in programming the backend, but never finished it. I might take that up again if there is enough interest.

But for now, I would suggest checking out the Classical Style Guide on Musicbrainz, or take the tags off of Allmusic, which uses it's own standards for naming tracks. The latter is very helpful if you don't have the time to figure out the CSG for every track.


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## neoshredder (Nov 7, 2011)

Vivaldi is the beginning and the end. But yeah this looks like spam.


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## Jeremy Marchant (Mar 11, 2010)

neoshredder said:


> ... But yeah this looks like spam.


A bit harsh.

Distinguish between the whole work and individudal movements of it.
So *Concerto in G minor, RV 439, "La Notte"* is the widely accepted title of work. The RV number uniquely identifes it, so the key signature and nickname are actually irrelevent, but people generally don't remember RV numbers.

"for alto recorder, violin I & II, bassoon, basso continuo" does not constitute any part of the title but it is some interesting information about the piece of music (the "violin I & II" is a bit precious: "two violins" would do).

"I. Largo" is the number and tempo marking of a particular movement of the concerto.

Mostof the other items broadly conform to this structure


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## AKazak (May 1, 2012)

tgtr0660 said:


> We can start by not calling them 'songs'


I appologize for this. The works, classical tracks or masterpieces 



neoshredder said:


> Vivaldi is the beginning and the end. But yeah this looks like spam.


Yes. Not at all!



Jeremy Marchant said:


> Distinguish between the whole work and individudal movements of it.
> So *Concerto in G minor, RV 439, "La Notte"* is the widely accepted title of work. The RV number uniquely identifes it, so the key signature and nickname are actually irrelevent, but people generally don't remember RV numbers.
> 
> "for alto recorder, violin I & II, bassoon, basso continuo" does not constitute any part of the title but it is some interesting information about the piece of music (the "violin I & II" is a bit precious: "two violins" would do).
> ...


Thank you. Now I see. Could you advice me few links on complete list of tempo markings with explanations please?


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## mamascarlatti (Sep 23, 2009)

AKazak said:


> Thank you. Now I see. Could you advice me few links on complete list of tempo markings with explanations please?


Wiki is your friend:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tempo


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## neoshredder (Nov 7, 2011)

So it's not spam. My bad. Many times I see a first post with a link, I think spam.


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## Kopachris (May 31, 2010)

humanbean said:


> Yes, unfortunately there is a hundred different ways to name a classical track, yet no universal standard. Surprisingly, there isn't even a good index of classical works on the web yet. I'd once considered creating a wiki-style directory for ALL classical works, including a standardized scheme that would be helpful for obsessive taggers like myself. I even got quite far in programming the backend, but never finished it. I might take that up again if there is enough interest.
> 
> But for now, I would suggest checking out the Classical Style Guide on Musicbrainz, or take the tags off of Allmusic, which uses it's own standards for naming tracks. The latter is very helpful if you don't have the time to figure out the CSG for every track.


What would have been wrong with simply using MediaWiki? Use categories for "tagging," e.g. the article on _Fuer Elise_ would be in categories "Beethoven, Ludwig van," "Bagatelle," "Solo piano," "A minor," "Rondo form," and maybe a few others depending on how detailed you want to get. Put a template on each piece's page with some basic info about it (who, when, what, where) and a standardized file name. No need to reinvent the wheel.

Come to think of it, this could be extended to popular music as well by including lyrics (with citations, of course, which other lyrics sites lack).

(Yes, I did just ignore the whole point of the thread. Sorry.)

EDIT: but what should we call it? I was thinking "Lyrica" until I did a Google search and found that it's the brand name for the drug pregabalin and is also the name of a for-hire music ensemble.

EDIT2: On further thought, the idea seems ambitious, but rubbish. May as well just ignore this whole post.


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## AKazak (May 1, 2012)

By the way, what is the correct way of writing?

"B*-*flat" or "B flat"
"A*-*minor" or "A minor"


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## quack (Oct 13, 2011)

Hyphen before sharp or flat: "B-flat", "G-sharp minor"
No hyphen before major or minor "C major", "A minor"


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## Jeremy Marchant (Mar 11, 2010)

quack said:


> Hyphen before sharp or flat: "B-flat", "G-sharp minor"


Nah, that is a local rule (to be polite).

"A minor" is the conventional way of writing a key signature in English and American (no doubt Australian too). Likewise "A flat".
The hyphen creeps in from German orthography, where it _is _correct to write, say, "D-Dur" [D major]


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## Very Senior Member (Jul 16, 2009)

The following is a useful site for identifying/naming Vivaldi's works. I use the RV nomenclature as it's by far the most widely used. As may be seen, it gives a cross reference where possible to other naming systems. http://www.classical.net/music/composer/works/vivaldi/index.html


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## GraemeG (Jun 30, 2009)

There used to be a convention that capitals were major, and lower case minor.
Brahms: Symphony No. 1 in c minor
Beethoven: Symphony No. 1 in C major, and hence; Symphony No. 1 in C
cheers,
GG


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## Jeremy Marchant (Mar 11, 2010)

GraemeG said:


> There used to be a convention that capitals were major, and lower case minor.


Not in English/American. That is a translation from the German and French.


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