# Beethoven on Period Instruments - Have any Recommendations?



## TrueMiracle

Hello everybody. I'm starting to really get into recordings of Beethoven on period instruments. I've always loved Beethoven, but have never really had an interest for recordings on period instruments until now. 

I'm currently leaning toward Immerseel's box set of the Symphonies and Overtures. Also looking at Zehetmair and Bruggen - Violin Concerto and Immerseel and Seiler - Violin Sonatas.

I'd be really interested to see if anybody has any recommendations on the Piano Concertos, Piano Sonatas, Piano Trios, etc... Also if you have opinions on the above recordings please do share.


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## ComposerOfAvantGarde

There's this:










And I believe Gardiner also conducted the piano concertos. Brautigam has an amazing set on BIS of the piano sonatas which you should look into.


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## nightscape

And Beethoven's totally waving at you. Can't beat that.


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## KenOC

Beethoven on period instruments: Recommended:

Symphonies, Gardiner and the ORR.
Diabelli Variations, Andreas Staier, fortepiano.
Opus 18 Quartets, Smithson Quartet.
Cello Sonatas, Bylsma and Immerseel.
Violin Sonatas, Seiler and Immerseel.

These are ones I have and like.


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## Mandryka

TrueMiracle said:


> I'd be really interested to see if anybody has any recommendations on the Piano Concertos, Piano Sonatas, Piano Trios, etc... Also if you have opinions on the above recordings please do share.


Try sonatas by Paul Badura Skoda on Astrée, Peter Serkin, Tom Beghin, Alexei Lubimov. I don't know the concertos so well, but I can say I liked concertos by Schoonderwoerd and Lubin. I don't know the trios at all, apart from the Ghost Trio, I think you should try to hear the one with Queras and Staier.

By the way, the Zehetmair Violin Concerto is the only recording of it I can stomach.


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## TrueMiracle

Hey everybody, wanted to give an update. As of now I have gone with the following:

_Beethoven: Missa Solemnis_ - Philippe Herreweghe conducting the Orchestre des Champs Elysées
_Beethoven: Complete Works for Violin and Orchestra_ - Patricia Kopatchinskaja on Violin, Philippe Herreweghe conducting the Orchestre des Champs Elysées

And arriving in the mail soon:
_Beethoven: Symphonies and Overtures_ - Jos van Immerseel conducting the Anima Eterna

Still want to do more research before getting a set of the Piano Concertos, and I've been looking but can't seem to find a complete set of the string quartets on period instruments. Does anybody know of a set out there?


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## Mandryka

TrueMiracle said:


> I've been looking but can't seem to find a complete set of the string quartets on period instruments. Does anybody know of a set out there?


There isn't one.

As far as the concertos go, you may want to look on the web to see if you can find Alexei Lubimov playing the 3rd.


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## Ukko

Late sonatas - Peter Serkin.


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## Guest

Brautigam's recordings of the sonatas on BIS are excellent for period instruments. He is wonderful in this repertoire.

Staier's recording of the Diabelli Variations on the fortepiano for Harmonia Mundi is also one I highly recommend.

Gardiner, in addition to excellent recordings of the symphonies, also has great recordings of both the Mass in C and the Missa Solemnis - every collection needs the Missa Solemnis.

As I recall, there is a recording on Sony by Immerseel and Bylsma and a third, whose name I don't remember, performing the Ghost and Archduke piano trios on period instruments.


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## Triplets

Krivine's Symphony cycle has been praised to the skies by some. It is quite expensive, but I have it saved as a favorite on Spotify. Hogwood's Symphony cycle with the AAM has been my HIPP go to for 20 years or so. It may be out of the catalog at the moment but easily available on Amazon used (and given the recent death of Hogwood, probably up for reissue shortly).
I second the Brautingham Sonatas, of which I have a couple of versions. The Jewel case covers aare God awful, but the music making is superb


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## KenOC

DrMike said:


> ...Gardiner, in addition to excellent recordings of the symphonies, also has great recordings of both the Mass in C and the Missa Solemnis - every collection needs the Missa Solemnis.
> 
> As I recall, there is a recording on Sony by Immerseel and Bylsma and a third, whose name I don't remember, performing the Ghost and Archduke piano trios on period instruments.


Gardiner's new Missa Solemnis is the best available recording IMO. The Violin Sonatas by Seiler and Immerseel are available in full, not just the two mentioned.


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## Mandryka

KenOC said:


> *Gardiner's new Missa Solemnis is the best available recording IMO.* The Violin Sonatas by Seiler and Immerseel are available in full, not just the two mentioned.


Why? (I haven't heard it.)


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## TrueMiracle

Thanks for the feedback everybody! :tiphat: I will be going with Brautigam for the Piano Sonatas. The recording quality on the BIS set sounds amazing. I'm also going with KenOC's recommendation of the Cello Sonatas performed by Immerseel (Fortepiano) and Anner Bylsma (Violincello).

Herreweghe's recording of the Missa Solemnis on Harmonia Mundi is very good. I may get the Gardiner set as an alternative.

Still listening to different samples of the Piano Concertos before committing to an initial purchase.


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## DiesIraeCX

TrueMiracle said:


> Thanks for the feedback everybody! :tiphat: I will be going with Brautigam for the Piano Sonatas. The recording quality on the BIS set sounds amazing. I'm also going with KenOC's recommendation of the Cello Sonatas performed by Immerseel (Fortepiano) and Anner Bylsma (Violincello).
> 
> Herreweghe's recording of the Missa Solemnis on Harmonia Mundi is very good. I may get the Gardiner set as an alternative.
> 
> Still listening to different samples of the Piano Concertos before committing to an initial purchase.


Great to hear, I can attest to the quality of both Brautigam's piano sonatas on fortepiano (it really is ear-opening if you've only heard them on a modern piano. It's great to have both options!) as well as Gardiner's _Missa Solemnis_.


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## TrueMiracle

Is anybody familiar with the recording off the Vivarte label of all five Piano Concertos, all five Cello Sonatas, and the Violin Concerto? They have it for a really good bargain price on Amazon (USA). Definitely considering getting this one.


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## Raefus Authenticus

Hi, TrueMiracle.

Here are some suggestions for you, based on my current collection:

SYMPHONIES:

Complete sets: 
The Hanover Band (Goodman and Hugget) 
The Academy of Ancient Music (Hogwood) 
The London Classical Players (Norrington) 
Orchestra Of the Eighteenth Century - First set 1985 to 1992 recordings (Bruggen) 
Orchestre Revolutionnaire et Romantique (Gardiner) 
Anima Eterna (Immerseel) 
La Chambre Philharmonique (Krivine) 
Orchestra of The 18th Century - Second set 2011 recordings (Bruggen) 
Tafelmusik - Nos. 1 to 8 only (Weil) *nos.7&8 release includes both CD and DVD video of the performances.

Other recordings: 
No.1 - Ensemble Philidor (Talpain) *includes Mehul's No.1 
No.3 - Collegium Aureum (no conductor named) 
No.3 - Le Concert des Nations (Savall) 
No.4 - Tafelmusik (Weil) *includes Mendelssohn's No.4 
Nos.4&5 - Philharmonia Baroque (McGegan) 
No.5 - Anima Eterna (Immerseel) *this is a DVD entitled 'Beethoven's Fifth. A Rediscovery. Concert and Documentary'. It is a reconstruction of the original orchestra size, as well as the type of room (low ceiling) that the symphony was premiered in. 
Nos.4&7 - Orchestra of the Age of Enlightenment (Jurowski) *this is a DVD entitled 'Beethoven Symphonies Nos. 4&7 - Coriolan Overture'. 
Nos.5&7 - Orchestre Revolutionnaire et Romantique (Gardiner) - 2011 recording 
No.7 - Collegium Aureum (Maier) 
No.9 - La Chapelle Royale, Collegium Vocale, Orchestre des Champs Elysees (Herreweghe) 
No.9 - Philharmonia Baroque Orchestra (McGuigan) 
No.9 - UC Baerkeley Chamber Chorus, Pacific Mozart Ensemble, American Bach Choir, American Bach Soloists (Thomas) 
No.9 - Orchestra of the Age of enlightenment (Mackerras) 
No.9 - Chorus Musicus Koln, Das Neue Orchester (Sperring) *includes Consecration of the House overture and Kyrie, Credo and Agnus Dei from Missa Solemnis, which is an exact recreation of the 7th May 1824 concert that Beethoven conducted to premier the 9th Symphony.

***I currently own all of the above, and would be grateful to anyone who lets me know of any other period instrument recordings.***

Also, there is a performance of Nos.3 and 8 by the Philharmonia Baroque Orchestra under McGuigan, but I am unsure if it was ever released on CD.

As for other Beethoven music on period instruments, I can recommend the following:

PIANO CONCERTOS NOS.1 - 5:

Steven Lubin, fortepiano, with The Academy of Ancient Music (Hogwood)
Melvyn Tan, fortepiano, with The London Classical Players (Norrington) 
Jos van Immerseel, fortepiano, with Tafelmusik (Weil) *also includes the Violin Concerto with Vera Beths playing a 1727 Strativarius.

'CELLO SONATAS and VARIATIONS FOR FORTEPIANO AND 'CELLO: 
Melvyn Tan, fortepiano, and Anthony Pleeth, 'cello *2 CDs.

OVERTURES:

Beethoven Overtures: Coriolan, The Ruins of Athens, King Stephen, Leonore No.2, Fidelio, Egmont, The Creatures of Prometheus, The Consecration of the House - The Hanover Band (Goodman and Hugget)

As for the Symphonies, my favourite complete sets are:

The Londons Classical Players (despite the less than ideally spacious sound) 
The Hanover Band (most realistic sound of all) 
The Academy of Ancient Music (wonderfully raw and sinewy instruments) 
The first Orchestra of the 18th Century set (delicious woodwind, and polished sound)

Other recordings I particularly like are: 
No.1 with Ensemble Philidore 
No.3 with Le Concert des Nations (Jordi Savall should record the complete set based on this fantastic No.3) 
No.9 with the American Bach Soloists (the first movement is similarly as raw and thrilling as The Academy of Ancient Music's performance)

So, as you can see, you have a lot of choices with the Symphonies. I would recommend choosing a box set (you've chosen Immerseel's), then buying some alternative versions.

You could have:

Nos.1-9 with Anima Eterna, and alternative performances of 1 (Ensemble Philidore), 3 (Le Concert des Nations), 5 & 7 (Orchestre Revolutionnaire et Romantique, 2011 recordings), and 9 (American Bach Soloists)… Just a suggestion.

I hope you enjoy your period instrument Beethoven adventures!


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## TrueMiracle

Raefus Authenticus said:


> Hi, TrueMiracle.
> 
> Here are some suggestions for you, based on my current collection:
> 
> SYMPHONIES:
> 
> Complete sets:
> The Hanover Band (Goodman and Hugget)
> The Academy of Ancient Music (Hogwood)
> The London Classical Players (Norrington)
> Orchestra Of the Eighteenth Century - First set 1985 to 1992 recordings (Bruggen)
> Orchestre Revolutionnaire et Romantique (Gardiner)
> Anima Eterna (Immerseel)
> La Chambre Philharmonique (Krivine)
> Orchestra of The 18th Century - Second set 2011 recordings (Bruggen)
> Tafelmusik - Nos. 1 to 8 only (Weil) *nos.7&8 release includes both CD and DVD video of the performances.
> 
> Other recordings:
> No.1 - Ensemble Philidor (Talpain) *includes Mehul's No.1
> No.3 - Collegium Aureum (no conductor named)
> No.3 - Le Concert des Nations (Savall)
> No.4 - Tafelmusik (Weil) *includes Mendelssohn's No.4
> Nos.4&5 - Philharmonia Baroque (McGegan)
> No.5 - Anima Eterna (Immerseel) *this is a DVD entitled 'Beethoven's Fifth. A Rediscovery. Concert and Documentary'. It is a reconstruction of the original orchestra size, as well as the type of room (low ceiling) that the symphony was premiered in.
> Nos.4&7 - Orchestra of the Age of Enlightenment (Jurowski) *this is a DVD entitled 'Beethoven Symphonies Nos. 4&7 - Coriolan Overture'.
> Nos.5&7 - Orchestre Revolutionnaire et Romantique (Gardiner) - 2011 recording
> No.7 - Collegium Aureum (Maier)
> No.9 - La Chapelle Royale, Collegium Vocale, Orchestre des Champs Elysees (Herreweghe)
> No.9 - Philharmonia Baroque Orchestra (McGuigan)
> No.9 - UC Baerkeley Chamber Chorus, Pacific Mozart Ensemble, American Bach Choir, American Bach Soloists (Thomas)
> No.9 - Orchestra of the Age of enlightenment (Mackerras)
> No.9 - Chorus Musicus Koln, Das Neue Orchester (Sperring) *includes Consecration of the House overture and Kyrie, Credo and Agnus Dei from Missa Solemnis, which is an exact recreation of the 7th May 1824 concert that Beethoven conducted to premier the 9th Symphony.
> 
> ***I currently own all of the above, and would be grateful to anyone who lets me know of any other period instrument recordings.***
> 
> Also, there is a performance of Nos.3 and 8 by the Philharmonia Baroque Orchestra under McGuigan, but I am unsure if it was ever released on CD.
> 
> As for other Beethoven music on period instruments, I can recommend the following:
> 
> PIANO CONCERTOS NOS.1 - 5:
> 
> Steven Lubin, fortepiano, with The Academy of Ancient Music (Hogwood)
> Melvyn Tan, fortepiano, with The London Classical Players (Norrington)
> Jos van Immerseel, fortepiano, with Tafelmusik (Weil) *also includes the Violin Concerto with Vera Beths playing a 1727 Strativarius.
> 
> 'CELLO SONATAS and VARIATIONS FOR FORTEPIANO AND 'CELLO:
> Melvyn Tan, fortepiano, and Anthony Pleeth, 'cello *2 CDs.
> 
> OVERTURES:
> 
> Beethoven Overtures: Coriolan, The Ruins of Athens, King Stephen, Leonore No.2, Fidelio, Egmont, The Creatures of Prometheus, The Consecration of the House - The Hanover Band (Goodman and Hugget)
> 
> As for the Symphonies, my favourite complete sets are:
> 
> The Londons Classical Players (despite the less than ideally special sound)
> The Hanover Band (most realistic sound of all)
> The Academy of Ancient Music (wonderfully raw and sinewy instruments)
> The first Orchestra of the 18th Century set (delicious woodwind, and polished sound)
> Other recordings I particularly like are:
> No.1 with Ensemble Philidore
> No.3 with Le Concert des Nations (Jordi Savall should record the complete set based on this fantastic No.3)
> No.9 with the American Bach Soloists (the first movement is similarly as raw and thrilling as The Academy of Ancient Music's performance)
> 
> So, as you can see, you have a lot of choices with the Symphonies. I would recommend choosing a box set (you've chosen Immerseel's), then buying some alternative versions.
> 
> You could have:
> 
> Nos.1-9 with Anima Eterna, and alternative performances of 1 (Ensemble Philidore), 3 (Le Concert des Nations), 5 & 7 (Orchestre Revolutionnaire et Romantique, 2011 recordings), and 9 (American Bach Soloists)… Just a suggestion.
> 
> I hope you enjoy your period instrument Beethoven adventures!


Thank you so much for the wealth of recommendations! I will definitely jump into as many of these as I can. Do you happen to know if any period instrument orchestra has recorded Beethoven's only oratorio, "Christ on the Mount of Olives, Op. 85?"


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## Mandryka

Raefus Authenticus said:


> Hi, TrueMiracle.
> 
> Here are some suggestions for you, based on my current collection:
> 
> SYMPHONIES:
> 
> Complete sets:
> The Hanover Band (Goodman and Hugget)
> The Academy of Ancient Music (Hogwood)
> The London Classical Players (Norrington)
> Orchestra Of the Eighteenth Century - First set 1985 to 1992 recordings (Bruggen)
> Orchestre Revolutionnaire et Romantique (Gardiner)
> Anima Eterna (Immerseel)
> La Chambre Philharmonique (Krivine)
> Orchestra of The 18th Century - Second set 2011 recordings (Bruggen)
> Tafelmusik - Nos. 1 to 8 only (Weil) *nos.7&8 release includes both CD and DVD video of the performances.
> 
> Other recordings:
> No.1 - Ensemble Philidor (Talpain) *includes Mehul's No.1
> No.3 - Collegium Aureum (no conductor named)
> No.3 - Le Concert des Nations (Savall)
> No.4 - Tafelmusik (Weil) *includes Mendelssohn's No.4
> Nos.4&5 - Philharmonia Baroque (McGegan)
> No.5 - Anima Eterna (Immerseel) *this is a DVD entitled 'Beethoven's Fifth. A Rediscovery. Concert and Documentary'. It is a reconstruction of the original orchestra size, as well as the type of room (low ceiling) that the symphony was premiered in.
> Nos.4&7 - Orchestra of the Age of Enlightenment (Jurowski) *this is a DVD entitled 'Beethoven Symphonies Nos. 4&7 - Coriolan Overture'.
> Nos.5&7 - Orchestre Revolutionnaire et Romantique (Gardiner) - 2011 recording
> No.7 - Collegium Aureum (Maier)
> No.9 - La Chapelle Royale, Collegium Vocale, Orchestre des Champs Elysees (Herreweghe)
> No.9 - Philharmonia Baroque Orchestra (McGuigan)
> No.9 - UC Baerkeley Chamber Chorus, Pacific Mozart Ensemble, American Bach Choir, American Bach Soloists (Thomas)
> No.9 - Orchestra of the Age of enlightenment (Mackerras)
> No.9 - Chorus Musicus Koln, Das Neue Orchester (Sperring) *includes Consecration of the House overture and Kyrie, Credo and Agnus Dei from Missa Solemnis, which is an exact recreation of the 7th May 1824 concert that Beethoven conducted to premier the 9th Symphony.
> 
> ***I currently own all of the above, and would be grateful to anyone who lets me know of any other period instrument recordings.***
> 
> Also, there is a performance of Nos.3 and 8 by the Philharmonia Baroque Orchestra under McGuigan, but I am unsure if it was ever released on CD.
> 
> As for other Beethoven music on period instruments, I can recommend the following:
> 
> PIANO CONCERTOS NOS.1 - 5:
> 
> Steven Lubin, fortepiano, with The Academy of Ancient Music (Hogwood)
> Melvyn Tan, fortepiano, with The London Classical Players (Norrington)
> Jos van Immerseel, fortepiano, with Tafelmusik (Weil) *also includes the Violin Concerto with Vera Beths playing a 1727 Strativarius.
> 
> 'CELLO SONATAS and VARIATIONS FOR FORTEPIANO AND 'CELLO:
> Melvyn Tan, fortepiano, and Anthony Pleeth, 'cello *2 CDs.
> 
> OVERTURES:
> 
> Beethoven Overtures: Coriolan, The Ruins of Athens, King Stephen, Leonore No.2, Fidelio, Egmont, The Creatures of Prometheus, The Consecration of the House - The Hanover Band (Goodman and Hugget)
> 
> As for the Symphonies, my favourite complete sets are:
> 
> The Londons Classical Players (despite the less than ideally special sound)
> The Hanover Band (most realistic sound of all)
> The Academy of Ancient Music (wonderfully raw and sinewy instruments)
> The first Orchestra of the 18th Century set (delicious woodwind, and polished sound)
> Other recordings I particularly like are:
> No.1 with Ensemble Philidore
> No.3 with Le Concert des Nations (Jordi Savall should record the complete set based on this fantastic No.3)
> No.9 with the American Bach Soloists (the first movement is similarly as raw and thrilling as The Academy of Ancient Music's performance)
> 
> So, as you can see, you have a lot of choices with the Symphonies. I would recommend choosing a box set (you've chosen Immerseel's), then buying some alternative versions.
> 
> You could have:
> 
> Nos.1-9 with Anima Eterna, and alternative performances of 1 (Ensemble Philidore), 3 (Le Concert des Nations), 5 & 7 (Orchestre Revolutionnaire et Romantique, 2011 recordings), and 9 (American Bach Soloists)… Just a suggestion.
> 
> I hope you enjoy your period instrument Beethoven adventures!


There is a good live cycle from Brueggen in Paris on symphonyshare. Another 3 to think about hearing is Ensemble 28 and Grossmann. 
What did you think of Schoonderwoerd's concertos?


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## Raefus Authenticus

TrueMiracle said:


> Thank you so much for the wealth of recommendations! I will definitely jump into as many of these as I can. Do you happen to know if any period instrument orchestra has recorded Beethoven's only oratorio, "Christ on the Mount of Olives, Op. 85?"


You're welcome!

There is a recording of Christ on the Mount of Olives performed by Das Neue Orchester, directed by Christoph Spering. I think it's out of print, so you would need to buy it on Amazon. I haven't heard it yet; I'm waiting to receive it in the mail any day now.


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## Raefus Authenticus

Mandryka said:


> There is a good live cycle from Brueggen in Paris on symphonyshare. Another 3 to think about hearing is Ensemble 28 and Grossmann.
> What did you think of Schoonderwoerd's concertos?


Thanks so much for the Ensemble 28/Grossman tip off!

I haven't heard Schoonderwoerd's Beethoven piano concerti. That's with Ensemble Cristofori?


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## Raefus Authenticus

TrueMiracle said:


> Thank you so much for the wealth of recommendations! I will definitely jump into as many of these as I can. Do you happen to know if any period instrument orchestra has recorded Beethoven's only oratorio, "Christ on the Mount of Olives, Op. 85?"


*I should have included the new release of Beethoven's Symphonies Nos.2 and 8, performed by Orchestre Revolutionnaire et Romantique under Gardiner.


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## Renaissance Man

I love the Hogwood Symphony Cycle: energetic and vibrant where required, contemplative and introspective where suited.


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## gardibolt

Plus Hogwood takes all the repeats as indicated by Beethoven.


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## SixFootScowl

I don't think this one was mentioned yet.


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## Kreisler jr

I can think of a select number of period instruments Beethoven recordings that I prefer to (almost all on) modern instruments:

Violin concerto with Zehetmair/Brüggen

Piano trios with the Castle Trio (esp. op.1, op.11 and the WoO 38/39)

Scottish/Irish songs anthology with Daneman, Agnew, Harvey (singers) and Moccia, Hantai, Verzier (trio)


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## JTS

TrueMiracle said:


> Is anybody familiar with the recording off the Vivarte label of all five Piano Concertos, all five Cello Sonatas, and the Violin Concerto? They have it for a really good bargain price on Amazon (USA). Definitely considering getting this one.


I have heard them and they are not that good IMO, for the violin concerto see Kop's version withHerreweghe


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## SixFootScowl

This just arrived today. Listening now. Absolutley wonderful!


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## SixFootScowl

This is a beautifully packaged set in a clamshell case. No cheesy jewel cases. Disks in color matched cardboard slip covers. Each disk lists the piano concertos on it and the back of the slip covers have the full track listing. Disks color coded to the sleeves. The 68-page book is all in English and has 2 articles, Beethoven's Piano Sonatas and Personal Reflections on the Hammerklavier Sonata, as well as 2 brief discussions: The Pianos of Beethoven and The Badura-Skoda Collection (of the sonatas), photos of the pianos, track listings, The clarity is remarkable and I feel like I can hear the individual strings vs. a more blended sound from a modern piano. This set really makes the sonatas come alive for me.


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