# Bruckner’s 7th Symphony in E major



## Waehnen (Oct 31, 2021)

I have learnt to adore the 7th Symphony by Bruckner. First of all it is in E major which is one of my favourite keys. For some reason the key is not too common in symphonies whereas the E minor key is in frequent use.

The themes are of high profile. The sound is noble. I love the ostinatos. I love the contrasts between movements. It is obvious the composer is expressing a lot.

It would seem at this time this is my Bruckner symphony of choice.

How do you rate the 7th and how would you compare it to other Bruckner symphonies?


----------



## Heck148 (Oct 27, 2016)

Bruckner Sym #7 is one of the greatest of all symphonies....i think it is Bruckner's best effort in this genre, and for me it certainly makes the list of greatest symphonies ever written....the Adagio mvt II is one of the greatest symphonic slow movements in a class with such movements as Mahler 3/VI and 9/IV, and various Beethoven creations...
Great scherzo as well, makes a wonderful contrast with the powerful Adagio...
Powerful work, when done right, a very moving experience.


----------



## Merl (Jul 28, 2016)

It's one of my favourite Bruckner symphonies. I do love those Wagner tubas in the 2nd movement and agree with Heck that when done right it sounds wonderful. I saw Stan the Man do it in Manchester with the Halle just before the Free Trade Hall shut and it was, indeed, a very moving experience. Whenever I hear the 7th I think of that gig, tbh.


----------



## Art Rock (Nov 28, 2009)

Bruckner is a top 10 composer for me, and I would rate the 7th as his fourth greatest work (after 9, 8, and 4). This is what I wrote many years ago:

One of his four most popular symphonies, and one of the best received in the composer's life time. The opening movement of 23 minutes is spellbinding and beautiful, and the following 23 minutes adagio offers some of the greatest melodic lines Bruckner ever composed. It is ironic that, had the composer been unable to finish the symphony after these two movements, I would probably have ranked it as one of the best ever, on par with Schubert's two movement unfinished 8th. As is, the scherzo is not bad, but still a bit of a let down after those marvelous first two movements, and the same holds for the finale.


----------



## Kreisler jr (Apr 21, 2021)

It's my favorite Bruckner, partly because the scherzo and finale are of more modest scale and don't threaten to break under their own weight as in some other works.


----------



## RobertJTh (Sep 19, 2021)

Waehnen said:


> How do you rate the 7th and how would you compare it to other Bruckner symphonies?


Well, let's compare it to my favorite Bruckner symphony, the 6th.

1st movement: both equally splendid, but very different.
2st movement: the two greatest adagio movements by Bruckner - and I'm tempted to say: by anyone. Slight preference for the adagio of the 6th, because it contains the most beautiful melody... ever.
3st movement: 6th wins by a landslide. Bruckner's greatest scherzo, and one of his most complex, modern and idiosyncratic movements at the same time. In comparison, the scherzo of the 7th sounds like a throwback to the more "primitive" Bruckner, of the first 3 symphonies.
4th movement: the finale of the 6th is much more in line with the proportions of the other movements and of the work as a whole. Musically, quality wise, they're equal.

So, for me that comes down to two draws and two wins for the 6th. But I know, as a devoted Brucknerian, I have some pretty iconoclastic views. For instance, I consider the "major key tetralogy" (4-7) Bruckner's best works, and 8 and 9 more like an over-ripe afterglow. And issuing, promoting and recording the early versions of Bruckner's symphonies is one of the worst posthumous crimes against a composer ever committed.


----------



## Waehnen (Oct 31, 2021)

RobertJTh said:


> Well, let's compare it to my favorite Bruckner symphony, the 6th.
> 
> 1st movement: both equally splendid, but very different.
> 2st movement: the two greatest adagio movements by Bruckner - and I'm tempted to say: by anyone. Slight preference for the adagio of the 6th, because it contains the most beautiful melody... ever.
> ...


Thank you, Robert! Just saying that the 6th is atm my 2nd favourite Bruckner Symphony. We kinda experience Bruckner in a similar way, it seems. I also LOOOVEEEE A-major key.


----------



## Kreisler jr (Apr 21, 2021)

To prefer the 6th seems a minority view. 
I think the 7th "wins" in all movements, except for the scherzo as the one from the 6th is my second favorite Bruckner scherzo after 9. They are narrow wins in the first two movements but a very clear win in the finale which is IMO the weak point of the 6th.


----------



## Azol (Jan 25, 2015)

The timpani pedal point at the end of the first movement that goes on for several minutes is pure genius. So much depends on the way conductor balances it against the orchestra during the crescendo/diminuendo passages - never overpowering, always applying sonic pressure much like a pedal point from a great pipe organ. And the tremolo in the strings is very important - you can fiddle with timpani part later in the studio but you cannot hide a substandard string tone, exposed in such a way. Abbado/Lucerne do it just perfectly. Celi/Munchen as well (especially string playing is gorgeous, although his broad tempi are less effective in B7 than, say, in B4, B6 or B8). Chailly/RSO Berlin is great.
Listen to this with good headphones or (preferably) on big audio system, will knock your socks off!


----------



## Kreisler jr (Apr 21, 2021)

The beginning of the first movement is by far the most beautiful of any Bruckner symphony.

(To be more precise, I mean the most beautiful beginning, there might be a few passages in slow movements equally beautiful.)


----------



## ansfelden (Jan 11, 2022)

It is one of my favourites too, the first movement is probably one of his very best.

As for the most beautiful movement (or part of a movement) of a Bruckner symphony, that would be the ending of his fourth - it could go on and on forever.


----------



## marlow (11 mo ago)

Really lovely symphony. The best from Anton IMO


----------



## SONNET CLV (May 31, 2014)

The Seventh? My favorite Bruckner symphony.


----------



## Philidor (11 mo ago)

Waehnen said:


> How do you rate the 7th and how would you compare it to other Bruckner symphonies?


Bruckner is one of my favorite composers for symphonies.

The sevenths ... we can read everywhere that the 7th is the first of the three late symphonies.

I appreciate this symphony very much, but especially for its first two movements which belong to the best Bruckner ever wrote. From my point of view it is a pity that the two other movements do not keep his level entirely.

Among Bruckner's symphonies, my ranking (starting at the top) is 8 - 9 - 5 and then 4 or 7, depending wheter I am looking at the symphony as a whole or to the showcases in #7.


----------



## ORigel (May 7, 2020)

It has become, overall, my _least_ favorite of the late Bruckner symphonies (nos. 7, 8, & 9). Which are all among my favorite symphonies (above them are Beethoven 9 and Schubert 9; on par with them are some Mahler symphonies which have grown on me).

I think the Eighth is Bruckner's overall best symphony. It certainly has Bruckner's best finale. As for the Ninth, I cannot get enough of the first movement. And while the Fifth is not even in my top 20 symphonies, it has my current favorite Bruckner slow movement.

My favorite movement of the Seventh is the Scherzo. The weakest movement in my opinion is the finale. My favorite passages from the symphony are in the first movement (including the coda).


----------



## ORigel (May 7, 2020)

Kreisler jr said:


> To prefer the 6th seems a minority view.
> I think the 7th "wins" in all movements, except for the scherzo as the one from the 6th is my second favorite Bruckner scherzo after 9. They are narrow wins in the first two movements but a very clear win in the finale which is IMO the weak point of the 6th.


I cannot remember the Sixth, except for the first movement and scherzo.


----------



## Kreisler jr (Apr 21, 2021)

I am generally not too fond of Bruckner's scherzi. The quip with elephants trying to dance is too often true... The exception is the 9th when it seems to become tanks not even bothering with dancing and the 6th which is more lyrical in the Mendelsohn/Weber "elfin" way. (Still rather robust elves...)
The 7th's scherzo is not as extraordinary as these two but good enough and a great contrast in a piece that is overall more lyrical and melodic than any other (with #6 close behind).

As for the finale, I think it is a stroke of genius in its comparable lightness and superior to the other overambitious, overlong Bruckner finales. I don't really like them very much, but even apart from that I think it's a brilliant change in a composer who too often clung too closely to a rather restricted toolbox.


----------



## Waehnen (Oct 31, 2021)

Just wondering if it is widely noticed that the most dramatic chord sequence of the Adagio is actually from Liszt’s Liebestraum no. 3?


----------



## dko22 (Jun 22, 2021)

Kreisler jr said:


> To prefer the 6th seems a minority view.
> I think the 7th "wins" in all movements, except for the scherzo as the one from the 6th is my second favorite Bruckner scherzo after 9. They are narrow wins in the first two movements but a very clear win in the finale which is IMO the weak point of the 6th.


I'm happy to be in a minority. Until not so very long ago, I regarded the 7th as being more "safe" and less strikingly original than a few others, especially no.6. Nevertheless, I think 6 still wins in every movement for the twists and turns at every juncture and the slow movement has probably Bruckner's greatest tune. Initially brought up on Haitink, I did think the finale was a bit more lightweight but top recordings like Jochum, Tintner or Celi make it seem to fit well into the overall scheme of things. One of my top three symphonies by any composer.


----------



## RobertJTh (Sep 19, 2021)

dko22 said:


> I'm happy to be in a minority. Until not so very long ago, I regarded the 7th as being more "safe" and less strikingly original than a few others, especially no.6. Nevertheless, I think 6 still wins in every movement for the twists and turns at every juncture and the slow movement has probably Bruckner's greatest tune. Initially brought up on Haitink, I did think the finale was a bit more lightweight but top recordings like Jochum, Tintner or Celi make it seem to fit well into the overall scheme of things. One of my top three symphonies by any composer.


I couldn't agree more. My favorite 6 is Sawallisch's, btw, closely followed by Keilberth (BPO), Klemperer and maybe Stein (VPO).


----------



## haziz (Sep 15, 2017)

Waehnen said:


> How do you rate the 7th ........?




Very poorly ...


----------



## GraemeG (Jun 30, 2009)

8, 6, 4 are the masterpieces for me. Then 9. For some reason 7 has never really grabbed me. Slow movement's kind of pretty (although the cymbal does sound odd to me) but isn't a patch on the 6th, as observed above. I've heard them all in concert bar 1 & 2, and my live experiences tend to mimic my recorded listening.

I was at the Linz Brucknerfest in 1989. Celi and the MP were playing the 7th out at St Florian. It was sold out. I debated whether I should go anyway and try to scrounge a returned ticket. Were it in the middle of town I would have tried, obviously. I decided it was too hard. Kind-of regretted it since.


----------



## tbazar (Jan 14, 2017)

I have a love/hate with Bruckner...gotta be in the mood to tackle him. Yet, the 7th is one of my favorites. Ormandy with Philly is top notch.


----------

