# Ravel-Daphnis et Chloe



## starthrower

I heard this piece on the radio last night. I was very impressed! I have no clue as to the definitive recordings? How about some suggestions, please and thank you!


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## itywltmt

I am biased, but my favourite recording was made in the early 1980's by Charles Dutoit and the Montreal Symphony. It was re-issued on the Decca LEGENDS series.

To some, the best ever recording was by Charles Munch and the Boston SO, available on Public Domain Classic:
http://public-domain-archive.com/classic/download.php?lang=eng&album_no=667

Ernest Ansermet and l'Orchestre de la Suisse Romande is another excellent choice.


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## bumtz

I have only one recording of this (terrific) piece - Orchestre de Paris with Jean Martinon conducting, from '74 on EMI. It's excellent (both performance and the sound), and is available as a part of super-cheap 3-CD set of Ravel's Orchestral works: http://www.amazon.co.uk/Orchestral-...4EYI/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1315054832&sr=8-1


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## joen_cph

As regards the Suites 1+2, there is a not so well-known recording by *Celibidache and the Munich PO*, it was s on the Originals label (not the DG series with that name), fine sound and splendid. 
DG issued another Suite no.2 with Celi and the Stuttgart RSO.

As regards Suite no.2, there is also an excellent one with* Stokowski/LondonSO.

*Both are of the highest order.

(I also own Ozawa (his Ravel set is good), Jordan, Skrowaczewski, early mono Ormandy and one Baudo; Cluytens is also considered a classic, but I don´t have that).

For the complete ballet, I don´t have a real favourite. Chailly/CtGebouw and Dutoit/Montreal are nice though (I have Ansermet, Mata, Martinon, Dutoit and Chailly)


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## Manxfeeder

Another vote for Dutoit, also Martinon.


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## starthrower

Thanks for the suggestions! I'm not familiar with Martinon, but I'll take your word for it.Wow! Those EMI 3 disc sets are a great deal! I have the Lutoslawski set, plus a number of their 2-CD sets by Berg, Dutilleux, Bartok, etc.

I suppose if I decided on the Dutoit 4-CD set on Decca, I'd have all the Ravel I'll ever need. Thanks again!


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## theclassicalguy

I can't believe no one mentioned Pierre Monteux! I was always under the impression that his recording with the London Symphony was THE definitive recording. It's hard to argue he knew the piece well since he was the conductor at the world premier. The recording I have has _Daphnis et Chloe_, _Rapsodie Espagnole _and_ Pavane pour une Infante Defunte_. All three are excellent, but I've rarely if ever heard a recording of Daphnis that had more fire; the chorus really gets worked up in places and the orchestral playing is exquisite. But don't take my word for it:

http://www.amazon.com/Ravel-Daphnis...EGZA/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1315788531&sr=8-1

If you're having a hard time deciding, and if this is an important decision for you, request copies from your local library and compare them. I've done this only a few times, but it made all the difference and I felt I got what I really wanted.


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## starthrower

There is a great library system in my town with a huge classical library. I have the Dutoit recording on the way to my local branch.


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## Ukko

I haven't heard a recording of the suites I didn't like. The complete ballet on the other hand... I have only heard Maazel/Cleveland, and it drags.


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## Il_Penseroso

Monteux and London Symphony Orchestra ! I assure you this is the best Daphnis et Chloé ever recorded !


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## theclassicalguy

The Monteux is the complete ballet, by the way.


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## starthrower

bumtz said:


> I have only one recording of this (terrific) piece - Orchestre de Paris with Jean Martinon conducting, from '74 on EMI. It's excellent (both performance and the sound), and is available as a part of super-cheap 3-CD set of Ravel's Orchestral works: http://www.amazon.co.uk/Orchestral-...4EYI/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1315054832&sr=8-1


I ended up purchasing this EMI set. Thanks again for the suggestion, as I was not aware of Martinon. Three CDs of great music here and yes, super cheap!


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## Manxfeeder

starthrower said:


> I ended up purchasing this EMI set.


I hope you like it. As a matter of fact, I'm putting on the disc now.


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## starthrower

I've been listening to disc two. I particularly like Le Tombeau de Couperin. It's going to take some time to familiarize myself with all of these works.


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## BrianPK

starthrower said:


> I've been listening to disc two. I particularly like Le Tombeau de Couperin. It's going to take some time to familiarize myself with all of these works.


 What's the sound quality like? Is the orchestra closely miked i.e. is there a good sense of involvement or does the orchestra sound far away? I'll forgive anything in a recording once I feel involved with the music and not feel as if I'm straining to hear from back in row z. I've been promising myself some Ravel for a while.


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## starthrower

I wasn't conscious of myself straining, but to be honest I wasn't listening that closely from a technical point of view.
I was just focusing on the music. I haven't even listened to the entire set yet. Some other folks here have owned 
this set for a longer time, so maybe they can help. So far it sounds good to me. The EMI set was recorded in 1974.


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## BrianPK

Thanks for the reply,starthrower. I'll check it out


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## starthrower

I love the EMI and Decca/London multi -disc reissue sets. I think I'm going to get the Poulenc Keyboard set on Decca next.


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## chalkpie

Big BUMP. I"m back in a Ravel binge and this piece may be his ultimate masterpiece, but that really isn't true. I'm digging the Boulez and Martinon recordings right now. SO good.


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## JB Henson

I have the Martinon lying around somewhere on a quad lp. Not sure if I'd call it better than the "Classic" 1955 Munch but it's certainly clearer.


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## Heck148

for complete Daphnis - 

Bernstein/NYPO
Monteux/LSO
Abbado/LSO is good, too

the recent Haitink/CSO on Resound is a good one also...
I do have Munch/BSO...it's good, not my fave...


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## bigshot

I'll second the Monteux. But I think it's important to get more Ravel than just the two suites. I really like the Dutoit Ravel box set.


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## flamencosketches

chalkpie said:


> Big BUMP. I"m back in a Ravel binge and this piece may be his ultimate masterpiece, but that really isn't true. I'm digging the Boulez and Martinon recordings right now. SO good.


What is his "ultimate masterpiece", then?

I love Ravel but have not heard this piece.


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## Rmathuln

Heck148 said:


> for complete Daphnis -
> 
> Bernstein/NYPO
> Monteux/LSO
> Abbado/LSO is good, too
> 
> the recent Haitink/CSO on Resound is a good one also...
> I do have Munch/BSO...it's good, not my fave...


One thing I recall about the Abbado - the first CD release had a plethora of indexes in addition to tracking - following the action description in the booklet was miles beyond any other. Was hands down the best use of Indexes I ever saw.
More releases documented and indexed like that may have helped preserve the index feature, but alas it is way too late for that now.


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## Kiki

Rmathuln said:


> One thing I recall about the Abbado - the first CD release had a plethora of indexes in addition to tracking - following the action description in the booklet was miles beyond any other. Was hands down the best use of Indexes I ever saw.
> More releases documented and indexed like that may have helped preserve the index feature, but alas it is way too late for that now.


What big labels USED TO do is quite amazing....










Unfortunately I no longer have a CD player so I don't "see" those index points anymore.

Daphnis et Chloé is probably Ravel's most epic and large-scale work. Certainly one of my favourites!


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## Heck148

bigshot said:


> I'll second the Monteux. But I think it's important to get more Ravel than just the two suites. I really like the Dutoit Ravel box set.


for sure...the works of Ravel are really quite wonderful....Rapsodie Espagnole, La Valse, Alborado del Gracioso, Pavane for Dead Princess are just a few of his awesome works....


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## chalkpie

flamencosketches said:


> What is his "ultimate masterpiece", then?
> 
> I love Ravel but have not heard this piece.


Ravel's "masterpieces" may be different pieces to some listeners. In my humble opinion, the absolute greatest Ravel works will include (in no specific order):

Le Tombeau de Couperin (both versions...take your pick)
Daphnis et Chloe
Pavane pour....(both versions)
Ma Mere L'oye (all versions)
Miroirs (all versions)
Rapsodie Espagnole
Gaspard de la Nuit
Valses Nobles...(both versions)
Both Piano Concertos
Introduction and Allegro
Piano Trio in A
Trois poèmes de Mallarmé
Sherherazade, M.41

My point is that I truly love these works pretty much on equal par, so as amazing as Daphnis is, I just don't see it as being more superior than say Le Tombeau or Gaspard (for example).


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## chalkpie

Is Daphnis Suite No. 2 essentially just Part III to the full Daphnis? I usually just listen to the complete ballet but on a Ravel compilation it popped up and seemed to be just the third part to my ears. Are there are any differences and/or edits?


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## Brahmsianhorn

Am I really the first on this thread to recommend Karajan for Suite No. 2? Still a favorite of mine. A luxury for the ears if not the last word in detail.

Otherwise, Monteux and Munch.

And if you want something truly historical and uniquely idiomatic, try the premiere recording by Piero Coppola. I believe it is just Suite No. 2


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## flamencosketches

chalkpie said:


> Ravel's "masterpieces" may be different pieces to some listeners. In my humble opinion, the absolute greatest Ravel works will include (in no specific order):
> 
> Le Tombeau de Couperin (both versions...take your pick)
> Daphnis et Chloe
> Pavane pour....(both versions)
> Ma Mere L'oye (all versions)
> Miroirs (all versions)
> Rapsodie Espagnole
> Gaspard de la Nuit
> Valses Nobles...(both versions)
> Both Piano Concertos
> Introduction and Allegro
> Piano Trio in A
> Trois poèmes de Mallarmé
> Sherherazade, M.41
> 
> My point is that I truly love these works pretty much on equal par, so as amazing as Daphnis is, I just don't see it as being more superior than say Le Tombeau or Gaspard (for example).


I agree that Le Tombeau, Gaspard, and the Piano Concertos are all way up there as far as his greatest works. I need to spend more time with Daphnis, still.


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## Guest

Kiki said:


> What big labels USED TO do is quite amazing....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Unfortunately I no longer have a CD player so I don't "see" those index points anymore.
> 
> Daphnis et Chloé is probably Ravel's most epic and large-scale work. Certainly one of my favourites!


None of the CD players I ever owned showed index points. And besides, what use are index points if you have to listen to Abbado? All you need is a CD player with a good _eject_ button.


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## Kiki

Baron Scarpia said:


> None of the CD players I ever owned showed index points. And besides, what use are index points if you have to listen to Abbado? All you need is a CD player with a good _eject_ button.


This is heartbreaking.  This is a Ravel CD from Abbado, so it is quite OK I'd say.  If it were a Beethoven CD, then I suspect one might not even need a CD Player to start with.


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## Guest

bumtz said:


> I have only one recording of this (terrific) piece - Orchestre de Paris with Jean Martinon conducting, from '74 on EMI. It's excellent (both performance* and the sound*), and is available as a part of super-cheap 3-CD set of Ravel's Orchestral works: http://www.amazon.co.uk/Orchestral-...4EYI/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1315054832&sr=8-1


That comment astonishes me, since I record the sound in that set of recordings as positively awful.

Dutoit and Ansermet would be my choices.


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## chalkpie

Baron Scarpia said:


> That comment astonishes me, since I record the sound in that set of recordings as positively awful.


Awful sound? Not even close to my ears - granted this is a 1974 analog recording. What exactly about this recording is sonically awful?


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## Guest

I have only one recording of this work - the Münch/Boston recording. I have listened to it a few times but have to admit that Ravel has yet to truly move me. I suppose I should give this work another shot.


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## jegreenwood

DrMike said:


> I have only one recording of this work - the Münch/Boston recording. I have listened to it a few times but have to admit that Ravel has yet to truly move me. I suppose I should give this work another shot.


Daphnis and Chloe didn't work for me at first. I got into Ravel through the piano trio, string quartet, piano concerto in G, Introduction and Allegro and the shorter pieces conducted by Paray on Mercury label.


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## Guest

chalkpie said:


> Awful sound? Not even close to my ears - granted this is a 1974 analog recording. What exactly about this recording is sonically awful?


I have no problem with analog recordings, some of my favorite recordings are old Mercury Living Presence from the 50's and Philips from the 60's. That series of Martinon recording has always struck me a thin, brittle, lacking a satisfying sound-stage. I only know them from the first CD release from EMI, maybe there is more on the tapes than made it to that early CD master.


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## Heck148

DrMike said:


> I have only one recording of this work - the Münch/Boston recording. I have listened to it a few times but have to admit that Ravel has yet to truly move me. I suppose I should give this work another shot.


Try Bernstein/NYPO or Monteux/LSO for complete version...


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## DavidA

Pierre Monteux gave the premiere and this was one of John Culshaw's demonstration recordings. Decca only gave permission for the recording if the whole ballet could be fitted on to one LP and in those early days of LP cutting it was touch and go but Decca made it and this historic performance stands.
For more up to date sound we have Dutoit but I was disappointed there is no tracking on the CD I have.
Chailly is pretty good too


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## chalkpie

DavidA said:


> Chailly is pretty good too


Thx, will check this out.


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