# SS 02.11.13 - Mahler #6 "Tragic"



## realdealblues (Mar 3, 2010)

A continuation of the Saturday Symphonies Tradition:

*Gustav Mahler (1860 - 1911)*

Symphony #6 in A Minor "Tragic" 

1. Allegro energico, ma non troppo. Heftig aber markig
2. Andante moderato
3. Scherzo: Wuchtig
4. Finale: Sostenuto - Allegro moderato - Allegro energico
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Post what recording you are going to listen to giving details of Orchestra / Conductor / Chorus / Soloists etc - Enjoy!


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## realdealblues (Mar 3, 2010)

This Saturday I'm going to listen to:

View attachment 27626


George Szell & The Cleveland Orchestra

I don't think I've ever listened to this recording. I've had it for years, but I have no memory of having listened to it. I know I've read it was spliced together from two separate radio performances but I honestly can't remember having listened to this CD. So again, rather than one of my favorites, I'm going to try something new.


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## Celloman (Sep 30, 2006)

BTW, this is my favorite Mahler symphony. (It's also Mahlerian's favorite, but don't tell him I said that!)

I will listen to Thomas Sanderling and the St. Petersburg Philharmonic.


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## Mahlerian (Nov 27, 2012)

It is my favorite!

I'm going for Abbado/Berlin Philharmonic.

For anyone interested, I have written an introduction, plus analyses of the First and Second movements.


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## Pip (Aug 16, 2013)

I will also choose Abbado, but I will watch this


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## Guest (Nov 1, 2013)

Guess I'm going Boulez, cuz that's what I have


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## joen_cph (Jan 17, 2010)

Concerning extreme tempi, the manic Scherchen/Leipzig 



 and also Kondrashin are unusually fast in the 1st movement, whereas Barbirolli is very broad and extremely slow.

I´ve also got Karajan, Tennstedt and Bernstein/DG.

Will choose Scherchen, and then Kondrashin to soften the impression a bit.


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## Avey (Mar 5, 2013)

Someone tell me what version to listen to


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## Mahlerian (Nov 27, 2012)

Avey said:


> Someone tell me what version to listen to


Tennstedt/London Philharmonic!


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## maestro267 (Jul 25, 2009)

Sadly, I won't be able to participate this week. I'm away all day tomorrow. Have fun, though!


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## realdealblues (Mar 3, 2010)

maestro267 said:


> Sadly, I won't be able to participate this week. I'm away all day tomorrow. Have fun, though!


Even though it's the Saturday Symphony, it's not required that you actually listen on Saturday, lots of people listen on Sunday


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## LancsMan (Oct 28, 2013)

The Mahler 6th is special to me. In the arrogance of youth I held that Brahms was the only composer worth listening to after Beethoven and Schubert. Then I heard someone else's recording of Sibelius's 2cnd and on the strength of this thought I should perhaps investigate music post Brahms. I'm not sure why but I went out and bought the Karajan recording of Mahler's 6th and was bowled over by it! Mahler's 9th is my favourite Mahler symphony but Mahler's 6th is a very close second. 

Is the Mahler 6th his most 'classical' symphony?


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## Mahlerian (Nov 27, 2012)

LancsMan said:


> Is the Mahler 6th his most 'classical' symphony?


Yes and no. In outward form (four movements, sonata form complete with exposition repeat), it is, but in terms of content, of the details in the movements, it stretches the limits of the form beyond what anyone would have conceived. The finale in particular is a complicated, untamed beast that begins in the "wrong" key.


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## senza sordino (Oct 20, 2013)

My cd is Berstein with the NY Phil. I have left this cd sitting on the shelf for a few years forgotten. I am looking forward to re listening to this.


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## Mika (Jul 24, 2009)

Activated Berlin Philharmonic digital concert hall a week ago. So it will be Berlin phil and Simon Rattle today


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## elgar's ghost (Aug 8, 2010)

Mahlerian said:


> Tennstedt/London Philharmonic!


Is that the live recording where the bloke bellows 'BRAVO!' with indecent haste? A great performance, all the same - I haven't heard Tennstedt's studio one.


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## AClockworkOrange (May 24, 2012)

It's going to have to be a Sunday Symphony for me 

I'll be going with my Mahler default - Tennstedt & the London Philharmonic, in this case with the live recording.

If I get time, I hope to watch the Bernstein Wiener Philharmoniker DVD in the evening but I'll have to wait and see.


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## chalkpie (Oct 5, 2011)

I love both the scherzo and andante, but I prefer the andante 2nd and the scherzo 3rd. The one-two punch of the 1st movement/scherzo makes me fatigued for some reason, and I get itchy and break out in a rash. I still think GM is "missing" a short movement that was never written in there!


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## Guest (Nov 3, 2013)

Excellent symphony, and my current favorite recording is Eschenbach with the Philadelphia Orchestra on Ondine. I bought the album specifically because I wanted a recording of the one movement Piano Quartet in A minor, but fell in love with the recording of the symphony.


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## Mahlerian (Nov 27, 2012)

chalkpie said:


> I love both the scherzo and andante, but I prefer the andante 2nd and the scherzo 3rd. *The one-two punch of the 1st movement/scherzo makes me fatigued for some reason*, and I get itchy and break out in a rash. I still think GM is "missing" a short movement that was never written in there!


The themes are very similar to each other, and the key sequences of the movements are related as well. I always think of the Scherzo as basically the first movement revisited, but with all of the "heroic/pastoral" elements removed.


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## senza sordino (Oct 20, 2013)

I am listening to it right now, Bernstein conducts the NY Phil. I got a score from the library to follow along. I can really get into all the parts, but I only managed to follow for two movements, too much work. I'd rather just listen. Quite nice, though not my favourite Mahler. You can just make out the cowbell in the first movement. Needs more cowbell!


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## realdealblues (Mar 3, 2010)

I listened to George Szell and the Cleveland Orchestra on Saturday.

First off, this was the first full Mahler symphony I heard many many years ago so I have a soft spot for it. It's hard for me to pick a favorite but this one will always be my "sentimental" favorite. It really has everything in it.

As for the recording, other than the occasional crowd noise I thought it was a very good recording. I liked Szell's tempos throughout. The Clevelanders sounded good as usual. I was also happy to hear the 3 hammer blows stand out. On many recordings they are hard to hear, but I had no issue telling them when they came in this recording. Overall, very enjoyable. It would have been interesting to hear what a studio Mahler Cycle from Szell would have been like.


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## maestro267 (Jul 25, 2009)

Personally I prefer Andante 2nd, Scherzo 3rd. The first movement ends triumphantly, then the Andante carries on the "positive" (though more tranquil and calm) mood, while the scherzo lays the groundwork for the epic finale.


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## Celloman (Sep 30, 2006)

maestro267 said:


> Personally I prefer Andante 2nd, Scherzo 3rd. The first movement ends triumphantly, then the Andante carries on the "positive" (though more tranquil and calm) mood, while the scherzo lays the groundwork for the epic finale.


I agree. I have the live recording with Jansons and the LSO, and that is what they do. The mysterious coda of the Scherzo movement does seem to set up the final movement quite nicely.


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## senza sordino (Oct 20, 2013)

I had another listen this afternoon. It's starting to grow on me, and that final movement is epic. I need to try to follow with the score the final two movements. I'll listen to it a couple more times this week to get to know it better. Like I said earlier, I bought the cd some years ago, but shelved it and forgot it. I've dusted it off will keep it in regular rotation from now on.


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## Mahlerian (Nov 27, 2012)

Analyses of the remaining movements are finished!

Andante
Finale


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## DeepR (Apr 13, 2012)

Without reading anything about it, I'm trying to get into this symphony (the fourth Mahler symphony I'm listening to, after 1, 2 and 8), but I can't get past the first movement. It seems so... insincere? Maybe it's intended to have elements of humor and absurdity. So far I'm not connecting to the music. I hear how well it's made though.


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## Mahlerian (Nov 27, 2012)

DeepR said:


> Without reading anything about it, I'm trying to get into this symphony (the fourth Mahler symphony I'm listening to, after 1, 2 and 8), but I can't get past the first movement. It seems so... insincere? Maybe it's intended to have elements of humor and absurdity. So far I'm not connecting to the music. I hear how well it's made though.


What about it seems insincere?

I don't know about humor or absurdity, but Mahler's music certainly has elements of the grotesque, and the first movement of the Sixth is no exception.


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## Couac Addict (Oct 16, 2013)

My preferred recording is Boulez/Vienna.
What? Boulez and Mahler? On this rare occasion, yes. Whilst Boulez is a bit of a robot, it works to the advantage of the 6th. 
He also injects some emotion for once. Often overlooked because Boulez isn't suited for Mahler - the 6th is the exception.


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## dgee (Sep 26, 2013)

My preferred recording is Bernstein/Vienna.
What? Bernstein and Mahler? Bernstein off Broadway?? On this rare occasion, yes. Whilst Bernstein is a tasteless ham, it works to the advantage of the 6th.
He also injects some accuracy and sensitivity to the nuance in the score for once. Often overlooked because Bernstein isn't suited to the concert hall - the 6th is the exception.

Sigh - if only ;-)


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## Vaneyes (May 11, 2010)

dgee said:


> My preferred recording is Bernstein/Vienna.
> What? Bernstein and Mahler? Bernstein off Broadway?? On this rare occasion, yes. Whilst Bernstein is *a tasteless ham*, it works to the advantage of the 6th.
> He also injects some accuracy and sensitivity to the nuance in the score for once. Often overlooked because Bernstein *isn't suited to the concert hall *- the 6th is the exception.
> 
> Sigh - if only ;-)


Puzzled by those bold statements. Moving on...

I think LB's DG M6 is too expansive. His Sony seems better suited. Both recs. take the opening too fast. My preferences, Philharmonia/Barbirolli and VPO/Boulez IMO. :tiphat:


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