# Quick need for Fidelio recommendation please



## Bernamej (Feb 24, 2014)

Hello,
First time I post something, and sorry for the low effort but, I’ve never yet heard Fidelio, despite loving opera (Baroque, Bel Canto, French, Italian, but most of all Wagner and post wagnerian).
I hope somebody can recommend me a good CD of Fidelio. Please if you can think of something with good sound.
Thank you !


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## Op.123 (Mar 25, 2013)

Maazel with Nilsson and McCracken


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## Rogerx (Apr 27, 2018)

Seek post from our fellow member SixFootScowl he has about 11 I believe.


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## Art Rock (Nov 28, 2009)

The collective judgement of the TC opera gang:



Figleaf said:


> #33: Beethoven, Fidelio
> 
> CD: *Klemperer*
> 
> ...


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## MAS (Apr 15, 2015)

There's this survey of some of the available recordings by critic Ralph Moore, if you'd care to read it.
Though not comprehensive, it covers recordings from 1941 - 2020.

http://www.musicweb-international.com/classrev/2021/Aug/Beethoven-Fidelio-survey.htm


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## Bernamej (Feb 24, 2014)

Thanks I just ordered it.


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## Bernamej (Feb 24, 2014)

Damn I should have read this before ordering too fast...haha thanks


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## ScottK (Dec 23, 2021)

In Fidelio I think first of conductor and Florestan. I'm sure there are conductors to rival Klemperer but I have trouble imagining someone superior. He has weight, beauty and drama. And I cannot conceive of a better Florestan than the young Vickers. Throw in Ludwig and a strong cast, I doubt you'll be disappointed!


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## Bernamej (Feb 24, 2014)

Basically I ordered the Klemperer studio stereo recording and the Maazel one.


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## ScottK (Dec 23, 2021)

Bernamej said:


> Basically I ordered the Klemperer studio stereo recording and the Maazel one.


I'll love hearing your take! The only thing I know from the Maazel is McCracken's rendition of Florestan's aria and I think its the best thing I ever heard him do. Enjoy!


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## wkasimer (Jun 5, 2017)

The Klemperer recording is the one that I’d consider essential. I’m not a big fan of Nilsson on recordings, but IIRC, the sonics on the Maazel are fabulous, and Tom Krause is a superb Pizarro.


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## Rogerx (Apr 27, 2018)

Bernamej said:


> Basically I ordered the Klemperer studio stereo recording and the Maazel one.


If you ever want a DVD , the Bernstein: it's just magic. :angel:


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## Seattleoperafan (Mar 24, 2013)

Ludwig is my favorite Leonora. It is one of my favorite operas to hear live.


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## Tsaraslondon (Nov 7, 2013)

You probably can't go wrong with the Klemperer. However, when I first bought the opera on LP, I went for the Karajan, mostly because I had seen Helga Dernesch as Leonore the first time I saw the opera, and she had impressed me enormously. I was not disappointed and I think it's the best thinh she ever did on disc.

However, when it came to getting the opera on CD, I bowed to popular opinion and went for the Klemperer. All I can say is that I was rather disappointed. I didn't find the performance anywhere near as dramatic as Karajan's and, though I like Ludwig in other repertoire, I found her Leonore less exciting and less moving than that of Dernesch, who at this stage in her career sings with gleaming radiance and no hint of strain. Vickers is on both recordings of course and the rest of Karajan's cast could hardly be bettered, down to José Van Dam in the small but important role of Don Fernando.

Eventually I replaced the Klemperer with the Karajan and it remains my favourite.


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## SixFootScowl (Oct 17, 2011)

Bernamej said:


> Damn I should have read this before ordering too fast...haha thanks


Not to worry. You need several or more sets.



Rogerx said:


> Seek post from our fellow member SixFootScowl he has about 11 I believe.


I just counted 27 commercial CD sets in my collection, plus some Leonores (all 5 or 6 of them) and some from Opera Depot. Also 10 on DVD not counting two I got rid of (rashly perhaps) because I did not like them so much.

Funny thing. I burned out and haven't listened much in recent years.

Bernstein DVD is one of the best for a traditional Fidelio.

For CD really like Abbado with Jonas Kaufmann, and both sets with Behrens (Bohm and Solti). Bernstein's Fidelio on CD is good, but the DVD soundtrack being live is much better IMO. but really most of them are pretty good.

And then I like the Barenboim set with Domingo and Meier, no dialogue other than the talk embeded during the grave digging scene. Get all four overtures with it too.


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## Bernamej (Feb 24, 2014)

Thanks again to all of you. I’m currently still listening to the Klemperer and will expand soon.
For the sonics and price I’m a bit curious about the Rattle one.


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## SixFootScowl (Oct 17, 2011)

Bernamej said:


> Thanks again to all of you. I'm currently still listening to the Klemperer and will expand soon.
> For the sonics and price I'm a bit curious about the Rattle one.


Klemperer is quite a wonderful performance. There are better sets than Rattle out there. Check out the Mackerras set here:
https://www.allmusic.com/album/beethoven-fidelio-op72-mw0001805591?1644644975920

You might like to browse this page which reviews some great Fidelio recordings:
http://musicweb-international.com/classrev/2021/Aug/Beethoven-Fidelio-survey.htm

I am glad you started this thread because it is pulling me back to Fidelio. What a wonderful opera and it was my very first opera. My first Fidelio on CD was the NAXOS set (Halasz) which is included in the reviews. My first opera DVD was the Bernstein Fidelio.


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## marlow (11 mo ago)

I can never see why Klemperer gets the praise it does as the performance is undramatic and too slow. I got his live performance in the hope it was better but not much improvement and worse sonics. If you want a dramatic performance then Karajan 1997 is great and you get Vickers too. OK Denersch isn’t quite Ludwig but she is good and the rest of the cast is at least par. 
Friscay and Bernstein also have things to say about this. There is also a rumbustious version live from Karajan with Ludwig from Vienna. White hot!


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## Op.123 (Mar 25, 2013)

Op.123 said:


> Maazel with Nilsson and McCracken


Oh and also Walter 1941 with Flagstad on Pristine - absolutely amazing!


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## Olias (Nov 18, 2010)

My blog has a page on Fidelio including a PDF walkthrough for every scene:

http://somethingclassical.blogspot.com/p/fidelio.html


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## Kreisler jr (Apr 21, 2021)

marlow said:


> I can never see why Klemperer gets the praise it does as the performance is undramatic and too slow. I got his live performance in the hope it was better but not much improvement and worse sonics. If you want a dramatic performance then Karajan 1997 is great and you get Vickers too. OK Denersch isn't quite Ludwig but she is good and the rest of the cast is at least par.
> Friscay and Bernstein also have things to say about this. There is also a rumbustious version live from Karajan with Ludwig from Vienna. White hot!


Klemperer lacks a bit of dramatic sweep at times but I think that this has been exaggerated and I think it overall largely deserves its reputation. The cast is very strong overall and the weighty approach works IMO very well for some key scenes that are not fast/dramatic anyway like the canon, prisoner's chorus and finale of the first, Florestan's scene and almost oratorio-like finale of the 2nd act.
Fricsay's main problem is the sonics that make it appear very small scale (I have no problems with the smallish, lyrical Haefliger as Florestan).
I have Karajan and Bernstein but don't know them well enough to comment; certainly worth checking out.

@Olias: Nice work, but you should call Leonore by her real name throughout, I think. The character's name is usually given as Leonore despite the alias. And there are some misspellings of Florestan with an i instead an e.
As for Marzelline and Jacquino, I am sure Rocco will give his blessing but I am not really sure if Marzelline really wants to...


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## Tsaraslondon (Nov 7, 2013)

marlow said:


> I can never see why Klemperer gets the praise it does as the performance is undramatic and too slow. I got his live performance in the hope it was better but not much improvement and worse sonics. If you want a dramatic performance then Karajan 1997 is great and you get Vickers too. OK Denersch isn't quite Ludwig but she is good and the rest of the cast is at least par.
> Friscay and Bernstein also have things to say about this. There is also a rumbustious version live from Karajan with Ludwig from Vienna. White hot!


My impressions are no doubt coloured by the fact that I saw Dernesch as Leonore when she sang the role with Scottish Opera. I will never forget her entrance into the canon in Act I, which pierced the gloom of the jailhouse like a shaft of sunlight. Nor the gleaming radiance of her singing throughout. I think her Leonore on the Karajan recording is the best thing she ever did for the gramophone, surpassing even her fine Elisabeth on the Solti *Tannhäuser* and I think she is at least the equal of Ludwig. My slightly biased opinion places her even higher.

In any case, like you, I find the Karajan performance much more incisively dramatic.


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## SixFootScowl (Oct 17, 2011)

As great as the older performances are, I generally avoid them because the sound is not as good as more recent performances.

Today I listened to Mackerras and Abbado's Fidelios, and definitely prefer the Abbado.
'
'One awesome (IMO) historic recording is this one from January 1978. There is a LOT of emotion in this one. Very realistic and exciting performance. *Here is an image of the back of the CD set* with the cast. I highly recommend this one.


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## Itullian (Aug 27, 2011)

My recommendation would be the EMI Karajan.
The most exciting imho.

i like Bernstein's dvd video.


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## SixFootScowl (Oct 17, 2011)

Itullian said:


> My recommendation would be the EMI Karajan.
> The most exciting imho.
> 
> i like Bernstein's dvd video.


I have it! Will give it a listen tomorrow.


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## Itullian (Aug 27, 2011)

SixFootScowl said:


> I have it! Will give it a listen tomorrow.


One of Herby's finest recordings imho.


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## marlow (11 mo ago)

Janowitz is an interesting leonora on Bernstein’s recording.


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## SixFootScowl (Oct 17, 2011)

marlow said:


> Janowitz is an interesting leonora on Bernstein's recording.


And there is *a Karajan recording where she sings Marzelline*.


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## SixFootScowl (Oct 17, 2011)

Itullian said:


> One of Herby's finest recordings imho.


Listened today. Yes, an excellent performance! I do also like the Bohm Behrens set. I like a lot of the Fidelio sets, really.


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## marlow (11 mo ago)

SixFootScowl said:


> And there is *a Karajan recording where she sings Marzelline*.


It's an interesting recording which I have in another incarnation on another label. A very rumbustious performance but there is a huge dispute as to whether the tenor is actually Jon Vickers as advertised. Interesting in the review on Amazon his son insists it is not him. Other reviews dispute that it is Vickers. So somewhat of a mystery about this recording


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## SixFootScowl (Oct 17, 2011)

So here is my bottom line. For video the Bernstein Fidelio is my favorite.

For CD my favorite is the *Solti set with Behrens* (also there is an alternate release with not so nice of cover art). I like this better than the Bernstein CD set which is studio and IMO not as good as the Bernstein DVD sound track.


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## Op.123 (Mar 25, 2013)

-posted earlier in thread, sorry-


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