# Contemporary & Avant-garde Classical Your Recommendations Please



## Blue Hour (Jan 2, 2012)

Dear Reader,

First of all I apologise if have posted this in the wrong section. I think this is my first thread and I was unsure where best to post it.

I have recently started seeing someone who fortunately for me likes classical music. However her taste is quite different from mine. She is very involved with the local contemporary and avant-garde scene.

I like contemporary classical to a point, I like somethings and not others and I am certainly no expert.

She is an artist and doesn't own CDs or a CD player as she says there isn't enough room in her apartment (which is nonsense).

So I have decided to buy her an iPod with a speaker dock so we can listen to music at her place as well as mine.

However execpt for the obvious things like Ligeti and Penderecki both of whom I like myself I have no idea what to put her iPod as we have not been seeing each other long enough for me to figure out her tastes. *I would ask her but I'd like it to be a surprise*.

If you would be so kind to recommend composers, works or recordings I'd be forever in your debt.

Thank very much for your time.

Kind Regards,

Blue

ps.

I forgot to mention she doesn't like Philip Glass.


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## Guest (May 15, 2014)

Dear Blue,

There are already a gazillion recommendation threads.

Put on her iPod whatever you want, even Glass.

And word of advice, don't try to figure out her tastes.


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## Whistler Fred (Feb 6, 2014)

Without knowing about what is going on at her contemporary and avant-garde scene, it might be a little hard to respond. But, rushing in where angels fear to tread... 

If she does visual art, the first person I would suggest is Morton Feldman. He was good friends with several painters and his music often is inspired by visual art. A recently released CD including Rothko Chapel, For Frank O'Hara and The King of Denmark might be a good place to start.

If Ligeti and Penderecki are mutual favorites, I surmise that a fascination with sound as sound may be a factor, in which case I would suggest Per Nørgård, and particularly "Voyage into the Golden Screen." Although the music of Iannis Xenakis is based on stocastic principles, the sound world he creates, particularly in his earlier works, is not unlike Penderecki. Check out his "Pithoprakta" for a good example.

Most of the avant-garde I'm familiar with is from the 1960-80's. Something more recent that may be worth investigating would be Bang on a Can, who made several recordings of music written for (and by) them. It's a kind of "everything but the kitchen sink" ensemble, using electic guitars and an eclectic approach that takes in jazz, rock, minimalism and much more besides. I find much of their music to be interesting and even fun.

I'll let my wise peers take it from here.


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## Crudblud (Dec 29, 2011)

It's more than a little presumptuous on my part, but here are some pieces post-1950 that I know and love. Performers in brackets.

Elliott Carter - _Triple Duo _[The Fires of London]
Claude Vivier - _Zipangu_ [Yuri Turkovsky/I Musici de Montréal][SUP]1[/SUP] 
Edgard Varèse - _Ecuatorial_ [Riccardo Chailly/Concertgebouw Orch][SUP]2[/SUP]
Karlheinz Stockhausen - _Der Jahreslauf_ [Stockhausen][SUP]3[/SUP]
Olivier Messiaen - _Sept Haïkaï_ [Pierre Boulez/Cleveland Orch/Joela Jones]
Pascal Dusapin - _Time Zones _[Arditti SQ]
Bernd Alois Zimmermann - _Trumpet __Concerto_ [Reinhold Friedrich]
Charles Wuorinen - _Horn Trio_ [Group for Contemporary Music]
André Jolivet - _Suite en concert pour flûte et percussion_ [Jean-Pierre Rampal]
Unsuk Chin - _Double Concerto _[Ensemble InterContemporain]
Luciano Berio - _Laborintus II_ [Berio/Ensemble Musique Vivant]
Klaus Huber - _Ein Hauch von Unzeit VIII_ [Alexis Descharmes]

[SUP]1[/SUP] - I find this recording has more "punch" and immediacy than the Leeuw/ASKO recording, despite being slightly slower overall.

[SUP]2[/SUP] - Boulez/NYPO also has a fine recording available alongside _Déserts_ and _Hyperprism_, plus Carter's _Symphony of Three Orchestras_.

[SUP]3[/SUP] - This is an alternate concert version of the _Jahreslauf _featured as the first act of _Dienstag aus Licht_. It is shorter than the opera version by about 10 minutes.


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## PetrB (Feb 28, 2012)

There is a world-wide held delusion that one or many completely / deeply shared interests are a major component which forms a good basis for an interpersonal relationship, and it is hogwash.

"We like _all the same things._" Yeah, right. You'll get bored with each other within one year 

While the thought to purchase a gift and load the iPod up with music more to her taste is thoughtful, it is also in my book a 'negative,' i.e. you are in a way _pushing_ to find music you like to listen to together.

I'm sure there are plenty of other things you like to do together where each party's personal taste overlaps more.

I would not 'second guess' her musical tastes. She might not even want any reproducing player equipment in her flat: I would really feel that one out _first_, and then if you want, do the more truly generous thing -- _without its having any hook of 'trying to bind' by shared activity_ -- purchase her a playing system and a gift certificate to purchase whatever recordings she cares to have.

I would abandon pushing 'listening together' to what you both can like, and just wait and see what music she likes that you _might like,_ and vice versa.


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## SimonNZ (Jul 12, 2012)

PetrB said:


> There is a world-wide held delusion that one or many completely / deeply shared interests are a major component which forms a good basis for an interpersonal relationship, and it is hogwash.
> 
> "We like _all the same things._" Yeah, right. You'll get bored with each other within one year
> .


This is something I'd be interested in seeing discussed at some length on a different thread, specifically wrt classical music. So many members here seem to tell of being ordered by their spouses to turn that rubbish off when they get home that it just stuns and baffles me how they stand the lack of curiosity or the desire to share some degree of the pleasure or experience.

-

But strongly agree with the rest of PetrB's post.


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## PetrB (Feb 28, 2012)

SimonNZ said:


> This is something I'd be interested in seeing discussed at some length on a different thread, specifically wrt classical music. So many members here seem to tell of being ordered by their spouses to turn that rubbish off when they get home that it just stuns and baffles me how they stand the lack of curiosity or the desire to share some degree of the pleasure or experience.
> 
> But strongly agree with the rest of PetrB's post.


What you propose is I think an interesting topic for another thread. I think those stories _"turn that off!" / or / "Not while I'm around!"_ stories come from musicophiles who are not musicians, or their partners would have "known what they were signing up for" and had less, if any complaints about the music in the house. LOL.

I've heard many an artist / musician friend say that "Artists should live only with other artists." While I don't think that a universal truth, there is still a lot of truth to it


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## ArtMusic (Jan 5, 2013)

Blue Hour said:


> Dear Reader,
> 
> First of all I apologise if have posted this in the wrong section. I think this is my first thread and I was unsure where best to post it.
> 
> ...


Just a friendly advice however, do be careful with the sounds of some composers, such as Xenakis with the earphone on, it can easily be physically harmful.


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## SimonNZ (Jul 12, 2012)

Oh, Art...you'd actually gone some time not doing this, appearing to have mellowed and be less dogmatic, hell, I'd even started "likeing" some of your posts. It saddens me, truly, to see the relapse of the last few days.


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## Blue Hour (Jan 2, 2012)

Thank you all so much for taking the time to reply I appreciate it.



PetrB said:


> There is a world-wide held delusion that one or many completely / deeply shared interests are a major component which forms a good basis for an interpersonal relationship, and it is hogwash.
> 
> "We like _all the same things._" Yeah, right. You'll get bored with each other within one year
> 
> ...


In reply to what you said in the above comment I agree with some of it. However I don't feel I'm pushing anything or trying to hard to find things in common. I like the fact her taste is different from mine it's quite exciting. It's a chance for me to discover new music and perhaps introduce her to new things as well. Of course we are not going to agree on everything but that's life.

However you do raise some valid points which I will consider so thank you and thanks again to everyone who has posted so far.


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## PetrB (Feb 28, 2012)

ArtMusic said:


> Just a friendly advice however, do be careful with the sounds of some composers, such as Xenakis with the earphone on, it can easily be physically harmful.


Earphones, at a certain volume, and with sustained use, can be harmful to your hearing. (Doh!)

It is possible to do such damage by listening at unwise volume levels to: Bach, Beethoven, Mozart, The Rolling Stones, Leo Kottke, Opera, Messiaen, Yanni, The Magic Garden, Pete Seeger, Odetta, Frank Sinatra, The Concert Suite to Star Wars, a Hans Zimmer Film Score -- in short, all music, pop or non-pop, tonal or non-tonal -- played too loud (doh!), and also played too loud while listening with earphones. (Doh!)


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## PetrB (Feb 28, 2012)

Blue Hour said:


> Thank you all so much for taking the time to reply I appreciate it.
> 
> In reply to what you said in the above comment I agree with some of it. However I don't feel I'm pushing anything or trying to hard to find things in common. I like the fact her taste is different from mine it's quite exciting. It's a chance for me to discover new music and perhaps introduce her to new things as well. Of course we are not going to agree on everything but that's life.
> 
> However you do raise some valid points which I will consider so thank you and thanks again to everyone who has posted so far.


Avant garde is so often a misused term I suppose that needs some 'checking,' too.

Lucia Dlugoszewski's _Fire Fragile Flight_ 




is from ca 1976, and as 'alternate' (and beautiful) as it is, by definition "avant garde" must be relatively current, i.e. usually from within the last five years as well as being outside the more commonly explored arenas of contemporary music of the time. Ergo, no matter how avant garde something written in 1976 _was,_ the only truly avant garde music must be very current. (I.e. usually something no more than ca. five years old.)

These more current works...
Beat Furrer ~ _Piano concerto_




Georg Friedrich Haas ~ _In Vain_




are not 'experimental' or 'avant-garde' but are merely contemporary, i.e. front and center main stage on the contemporary scene.

With all the common misuse of the term, for best recommendations more specifically pertaining to your girl friend's taste and interests, what are some of the 'avant garde' pieces, or composers, or ensemble improvs, etc. that she is into?


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## Couac Addict (Oct 16, 2013)

Do nothing and tell her its Cage's 4'33" on repeat.


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## ptr (Jan 22, 2013)

Hey Blue, I'm guessing that the society that the object of desire is involved with has some kind of concert programme?

Why not check if it is available on-line and harvest a few prolific names from their past seasons and see what discs are available with their music, this would give You a common ground to start discussing the music from and it will give You an opportunity to learn from Her experience and grow in Your musical interests!

/ptr


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## Prodromides (Mar 18, 2012)

Blue Hour said:


> ...and thanks again to everyone who has posted so far.


Are you continuing to intake recommendations, Blue Hour? ...
Or have you gotten enough?


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