# Opera discussion class help



## Musicforawhile (Oct 10, 2014)

I might be holding an informal opera discussion class and I just wondered if anyone has any ideas for topics. The level would range from people who are new to opera to professional classical musicians.

The topic choices I have thought of so far are:

*Arias and intense emotions/ moods* e.g. 
anger: Der Holle rache,
despair: Dido's Lament, E lucevan le stelle
worry: L'ho perduta
hope: Un bel di vidremo, Una furtiva lagrima
feeling carefree: Largo al factotum
passion: Ch'il bel sogno di doretta
vengeful: Svegliatevi nel core
manipulative, coaxing: O mio babbino caro
playful: Una voce poco fa
belligerent: Ho jo to ho...I am not sure about this one

*Popularised arias and their meaning and context* e.g,
Nessun dorma
Sull'aria
La Donna e mobile
O mio babbino caro
Voi che sapete
The flower duet

*Complex relationships, forbidden relationships, adultery* e.g.
Elektra
Antigone
Marriage of Figaro

*Madness* e.g.
Mad scene from Lucia di Lammermoor
Purcell's mad songs

*Dreamlike and mysterious music* e.g.
Pelleas et Melisande by Debussy..*don't have much more for this topic, so any suggestions would be really helpful*

Can anyone think of any other general discussion topics?


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## tdc (Jan 17, 2011)

How Opera began starting with Monteverdi and then discuss its development through the musical eras (stylistic changes, important composers etc) up to the present day.


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## Bruce (Jan 2, 2013)

When I was just beginning to listen to opera, I found the most difficult stumbling block to overcome was the relationship between the singing and the orchestral music. In fact, it still seems to me that in some operas, the vocal line could be just about anything--it doesn't seem to blend well with the orchestral accompaniment. So, an idea might be to explain how the orchestra provides a necessary harmonic support for the vocal line.


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## Headphone Hermit (Jan 8, 2014)

"What you like and why" might be a useful starting point - then you can continue in future sessions with other topics as they arise naturally


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## Musicforawhile (Oct 10, 2014)

Thanks so much for the suggestions.


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## MAuer (Feb 6, 2011)

How about opera's treatment of historical figures -- how these individuals are portrayed in opera as compared to historical reality? (I.e., the actual character of Don Carlos as opposed to Schiller's/Verdi's version; the fact that -- contrary to Donizetti -- there was never a confrontation between Mary Stuart and her cousin Elizabeth I; etc.)


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## Woodduck (Mar 17, 2014)

Brunnhilde's "hojotoho!" isn't belligerent at all. It's just what excited Valkyries do to keep track of one another amid the clouds and thunder and lightning. If you want belligerence in Wagner, listen to Alberich and Mime spitting furiously at each other in act 2 of Siegfried.


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## Headphone Hermit (Jan 8, 2014)

MAuer said:


> How about opera's treatment of historical figures -- how these individuals are portrayed in opera as compared to historical reality? (I.e., the actual character of Don Carlos as opposed to Schiller's/Verdi's version; the fact that -- contrary to Donizetti -- there was never a confrontation between Mary Stuart and her cousin Elizabeth I; etc.)


Does it matter? When I want a history lesson, I go to an academic text, when I want entartainment, I go to Callas


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## Musicforawhile (Oct 10, 2014)

Woodduck said:


> Brunnhilde's "hojotoho!" isn't belligerent at all. It's just what excited Valkyries do to keep track of one another amid the clouds and thunder and lightning. If you want belligerence in Wagner, listen to Alberich and Mime spitting furiously at each other in act 2 of Siegfried.


Yep, I agree, wasn't sure what the right word be to describe it. I was thinking 'trimuphant.' What word(s) would you suggest as the general mood for Brunhilde's aria? 'Excited,' 'exhilarated,' 'impassioned?'


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## Don Fatale (Aug 31, 2009)

Opera is far too big a subject to do with broad strokes. You need to focus on something where you can find an engaging tale. Something you're passionate about. Or even a specific composer. (I did a talk on Wagner recently and even with a single composer I only looked at a specific aspect.



MAuer said:


> How about opera's treatment of historical figures -- how these individuals are portrayed in opera as compared to historical reality? (I.e., the actual character of Don Carlos as opposed to Schiller's/Verdi's version; the fact that -- contrary to Donizetti -- there was never a confrontation between Mary Stuart and her cousin Elizabeth I; etc.)


Having watched the DVD where Grace Bumbry sing Eboli with a historically informed eye-patch throughout, yes, Don Carlo is a good example here.

(It's amazing how much I've learned about history and Shakespeare's plays from operas.)


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## Marschallin Blair (Jan 23, 2014)

Woodduck said:


> Brunnhilde's "hojotoho!" isn't belligerent at all. It's just what excited Valkyries do to keep track of one another amid the clouds and thunder and lightning. If you want belligerence in Wagner, listen to Alberich and Mime spitting furiously at each other in act 2 of Siegfried.


It's also to let the V.C. know that you're coming.


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## Headphone Hermit (Jan 8, 2014)

Musicforawhile said:


> Yep, I agree, wasn't sure what the right word be to describe it. I was thinking 'trimuphant.' What word(s) would you suggest as the general mood for Brunhilde's aria? 'Excited,' 'exhilarated,' 'impassioned?'


There you go! There is topic #1 - play the aria, thoughtshower adjectives to describe it and discuss personal responses to what they have heard.

Then cake and biscuits and agree the time and date of the next meeting

Sorted!


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## Woodduck (Mar 17, 2014)

Musicforawhile said:


> Yep, I agree, wasn't sure what the right word be to describe it. I was thinking 'trimuphant.' What word(s) would you suggest as the general mood for Brunhilde's aria? 'Excited,' 'exhilarated,' 'impassioned?'


It's just a tomboy whoopin' it up for Daddy. I might go with "exuberant."


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## MAuer (Feb 6, 2011)

Headphone Hermit said:


> Does it matter? When I want a history lesson, I go to an academic text, when I want entartainment, I go to Callas


Perhaps it may not "matter," but I find it interesting to know about the actual individuals as contrasted with the way they are portrayed onstage. But then, I also find history interesting and not something restricted to the realm of academia.


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## Musicforawhile (Oct 10, 2014)

Bruce said:


> When I was just beginning to listen to opera, I found the most difficult stumbling block to overcome was the relationship between the singing and the orchestral music. In fact, it still seems to me that in some operas, the vocal line could be just about anything--it doesn't seem to blend well with the orchestral accompaniment. So, an idea might be to explain how the orchestra provides a necessary harmonic support for the vocal line.


Bruce, could you give me an example of an aria which you feel doesn't fit with the orchestral accompaniment?


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## Musicforawhile (Oct 10, 2014)

Headphone Hermit said:


> There you go! There is topic #1 - play the aria, thoughtshower adjectives to describe it and discuss personal responses to what they have heard.
> 
> Then cake and biscuits and agree the time and date of the next meeting
> 
> Sorted!


If only it were that easy.


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