# Hard Music



## schuberkovich (Apr 7, 2013)

Hello,

After hearing many times how Beethoven's SQ no.14 op.131 is one of the greatest pieces of music ever, I decided to listen to it all the way through with the score, performed by Quartetto Italiano.

At the beginning, I could tell something great was going on - the opening fugue is something you can tell is genius.
I really enjoyed the playful 2nd movement.
However, throughout the remaining movements, I honestly didn't feel anything. I was even feeling bored  and when I saw presto come up, I got really excited - but I found it to be incredibly repetitive (5th movement) - and I didn't feel anything once more until the end.

I also felt like it could have been more compact and "went on" a bit.

I feel like a very uncultured person who can't appreciate good music - while listening, I felt mainly confused and bored.  

What should I do? Is this a normal response for a first listen? Should I try again? Or am I just not musical enough to get it? 

Thanks


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## Crudblud (Dec 29, 2011)

At some point you will have to learn to let yourself have opinions, whether they match up with general consensus or not, though first impressions should always be tempered with further listens, I think.


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## ptr (Jan 22, 2013)

Try doing this with recordings from 10-20 different string quartets and at the end my might well be able to patch together one suitable version of the Op 131 and if You cant try another quartet!
This kind of possible variety is what makes this repertoire great!

/ptr


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## drpraetorus (Aug 9, 2012)

Some "great" music takes a bit of getting used to before the great takes hold in you. Some never will. Give it time but don't worry if you never like it as much as other pieces.


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## Ukko (Jun 4, 2010)

schuberkovich said:


> Hello,
> 
> After hearing many times how Beethoven's SQ no.14 op.131 is one of the greatest pieces of music ever, I decided to listen to it all the way through with the score, performed by Quartetto Italiano.
> 
> ...


Looks like you have too much unmodified 'feel expectation' going on there. 131 is Beethoven's version of a Zappa-esque smorgasbord. There are more movements than usual because he is offering examples of familiar fare that turn out not to be familiar. If you have digested 132 and 130/133, 131 might feel just right; another step in the journey.

Alternatively... there umpteen alternative possibilities, including the one that says your impressions are right on. Go with _Crudblud_.


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## GGluek (Dec 11, 2011)

Yes, by all means, listen to it again -- many time, in different performances, at regular intervals. You will appreciate different things about it each time -- and they will be the things that appeal to _you_, not someone else. Never be afraid to have your own opinion -- and be aware that it may change over time (it was 30 years before the Goldberg Variations did anything more for me than they they did for Goldberg (i.e. put me to sleep).)

One thing to listen for, which has always brought pleasure to my listenings to Op. 131, is Beethoven's use of comic relief -- which is as well developed as that in Shakespeare tragedies. From the variations movement on there are 4 or 5 places where Beethoven invites you to break into a broad smile -- if not laugh out loud. I love him for that.


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## KenOC (Mar 7, 2011)

schuberkovich said:


> What should I do? Is this a normal response for a first listen? Should I try again?


Don't feel bad. The Viennese musical public, one of the most sophisticated that there ever was, had a great deal of trouble with the late quartets. I think that even today, most people approaching these quartets for the first time have some problems.

They don't give up their secrets easily. Give yourself time. I'd start with the Op. 127 and get used to that first. If you come to like it, then listen to the others. Just my $0.02!


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## Mahlerian (Nov 27, 2012)

Don't feel bad. Most of us aren't Beethoven and can't think as quickly in musical terms as Beethoven could, so don't feel that you're stupid or incapable of enjoying something when it leaves you cold. Maybe it just doesn't appeal to you. Leave it aside for a while, and after listening to other things, come back to it and see if your perception has changed.


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## schuberkovich (Apr 7, 2013)

Thanks for all the responses, I feel much better. I will definitely give op.131 another try sometime in the future - but right now I feel like listening to a Mozart Piano Concerto 
Thanks again!

On another note, does anyone know why I can't access my profile. If I try, I'm met with:

schuberkovich, you do not have permission to access this page. This could be due to one of several reasons:
Your user account may not have sufficient privileges to access this page. Are you trying to edit someone else's post, access administrative features or some other privileged system?
If you are trying to post, the administrator may have disabled your account, or it may be awaiting activation.


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## ptr (Jan 22, 2013)

schuberkovich said:


> On another note, does anyone know why I can't access my profile. If I try, I'm met with:


You have to post more then *ten* times to be allowed access to Your control panel, if you read the FAQ, it is all there (Troll prevention)!

/ptr


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## GGluek (Dec 11, 2011)

Better answer
In some ways the “difficulty” of the late Beethoven quartets has been oversold. What sets them apart is not so much their profundity – although individual movements do plumb expressive depths that were and are unique – but their inventiveness. Individually and as a set, there is barely a movement in them that doesn’t expand the boundaries of what had been considered possible for the type of movement it was – and many of these – even whole quartets – are delightfully accessible to most anyone. Therefore, they need to be enjoyed this way, not in the expectation of some pre-conceived level of difficulty.


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## schuberkovich (Apr 7, 2013)

I forgot to update this - might as well now. I took some of the advice and began properly listening to it as music to enjoy, not expecting some supreme revelation, and not obsessively studying to score. After a few more listens I began to appreciate the later movements more and the quartet's sense of continuity. And now, after a lot of listening, I can truly see how incredible a work it is. True, I don't think the other parts of the quartet are as good as the opening fugue movement, with its shifting harmonies like wisps of interacting silk  but I really think the other movements are great, and I can now see why people think it's so good.

It's interesting - instead of having a big initial impact, it's growing on me _exponentially_. 
Which way should I go now - down to 13, or up to 15?


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## GGluek (Dec 11, 2011)

First, just a personal gripe: _No one _(except record companies) refers to Beethoven quartets by their numbers (many of us don't even "know" their numbers). Quartet No. 13, or Quartet No. 15 are not like the symphonies, and when you talk about them like that, a lot of people have to go through mental gymnastics to figure out what you are talking about. Beethoven quartets are more commonly known by their Opus Nos. -- and the Late Quartets, by Opus Nos. and/or keys. Both Opus 131 and c-sharp minor quartet are more widely understood than whatever its number is. 

For your question -- Opus 130 has more surface appeal and variety -- and gives you the option of concluding it with either the massive Fugue (also published separately as Opus 133) or the slight alternative dance movement he composed as a replacement (and is his last completed movement in any genre). Two totally different effects. Opus 132 is more melancholy (minor key and all) but has it's own set of brilliant moments. Flip a coin.


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## brianvds (May 1, 2013)

schuberkovich said:


> It's interesting - instead of having a big initial impact, it's growing on me _exponentially_.
> Which way should I go now - down to 13, or up to 15?


You are now ready to move on to Bartok's quartets...


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## chrisco97 (May 22, 2013)

schuberkovich said:


> I forgot to update this - might as well now. I took some of the advice and began properly listening to it as music to enjoy, not expecting some supreme revelation, and not obsessively studying to score. After a few more listens I began to appreciate the later movements more and the quartet's sense of continuity. And now, after a lot of listening, I can truly see how incredible a work it is. True, I don't think the other parts of the quartet are as good as the opening fugue movement, with its shifting harmonies like wisps of interacting silk  but I really think the other movements are great, and I can now see why people think it's so good.
> 
> It's interesting - instead of having a big initial impact, it's growing on me _exponentially_. Which way should I go now - down to 13, or up to 15?


Same for me and the *Grosse Fuge*. I all but hated it upon first listen (aside from the epic opening, haha), but after another listen or two, it became one of my favourite pieces in all of classical music. Glad to hear it worked out for you. 

Speaking of the Fuge, listen to 13 if you have not yet.


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