# Romeo Contesst: Franz/ Scaramberg/ Thills/ Kaufmann



## JanacekTheGreat (Feb 26, 2021)

_"Ah, leve-toi, soleil"_ from Gounod's Roméo et Juliette. Which ones are your favorite? Multiple options are allowed now.

*Emile Scaramberg (1863 - 1938)*






*Paul Franz (1876-1950)*






*Georges Thill (1897 - 1984)*






*Jonas Kaufmann (1969 - )*






P/S: Yes, I admit it: Kaufmann is included as a clickbait. I am willing to change my opinions about his singing. I may even do a Lohengrin contest with the same singers, in case there are opinions that he is at disadvantage here.


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## nina foresti (Mar 11, 2014)

I must add my favorite one. You might want to start at 4:24





I voted above for Thill. He had the sweetest voice of the lot and to me this aria needs a sweet sound more than a powerful voice.


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## Woodduck (Mar 17, 2014)

JanacekTheGreat said:


> P/S: Yes, I admit it: Kaufmann is included as a clickbait. I am willing to change my opinions about his singing. I may even do a Lohengrin contest with the same singers, in case there are opinions that he is at disadvantage here.


We knew that. 

It's been a long time since I last heard Emile Scaramberg. Surely he was one of the greatest tenors of his or any age, and his ease and brilliance, not to mention his uninhibited, Caruso-esque fervor, are stunning. Actually a choice between the three great French tenors, all from those happy days before the species died out, isn't easy, but factoring in the age of the recording and the piano accompaniment makes Scaramberg seem all the more impressive. I'm happy to give him the blue ribbon.

I feel no need to discuss Kaufmann, save to remind us all that he's one of our leading tenors. Kleenex, anyone?


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## MAS (Apr 15, 2015)

nina foresti said:


> I must add my favorite one. You might want to start at 4:24


Plus, he was absolutely adorable!


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## MAS (Apr 15, 2015)

I just love Georges Thill, who sings immaculately. 

Also I like Scaremberg, who seems to have everything possible in a tenor.

Kaufman sounds like a baritone trying it out.


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## Seattleoperafan (Mar 24, 2013)

Thanks for doing a tenor contest.


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## JanacekTheGreat (Feb 26, 2021)

Woodduck said:


> We knew that.
> 
> It's been a long time since I last heard Emile Scaramberg. Surely he was one of the greatest tenors of his or any age, and his ease and brilliance, not to mention his uninhibited, Caruso-esque fervor, are stunning. *Actually a choice between the three great French tenors, all from those happy days before the species died out, isn't easy*, but factoring in the age of the recording and the piano accompaniment makes Scaramberg seem all the more impressive. I'm happy to give him the blue ribbon.
> 
> I feel no need to discuss Kaufmann, save to remind us all that he's one of our leading tenors. Kleenex, anyone?


Very well-put as always.

I was tempted to pick Alagna's sweet example but decided to use Kaufmann instead. The reason is that like Kaufmann, the three French gentlemen also sang Wagner regularly in their career (Sigmund, Lohengrin, Tannhäuser), and even Siegfried (Franz). Just notice how free and fervent their sounds are compared to Kaufmann's throaty, fake, darkened voice.


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## Woodduck (Mar 17, 2014)

JanacekTheGreat said:


> Very well-put as always.
> 
> I was tempted to pick Alagna's sweet example but decided to use Kaufmann instead. The reason is that like Kaufmann, the three French gentlemen also sang Wagner regularly in their career (Sigmund, Lohengrin, Tannhäuser), and even Siegfried (Franz). Just notice how free and fervent their sounds are compared to Kaufmann's throaty, fake, darkened voice.


Alagna's is very nice without being quite equal to the old guys in sheer vocal freedom. Has there been a more recent French tenor worth talking about?


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## nina foresti (Mar 11, 2014)

Woodduck said:


> Alagna's is very nice without being quite equal to the old guys in sheer vocal freedom. Has there been a more recent French tenor worth talking about?


Yes. Benjamin Bernheim. Not big on the power but typical French delivery which I think is very appealing.


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## Woodduck (Mar 17, 2014)

nina foresti said:


> Yes. Benjamin Bernheim. Not big on the power but typical French delivery which I think is very appealing.


Sorry to say, he doesn't impress me greatly. It sounds like a small voice that half-disappears when he brings down the volume. Like many immature singers - immature in technique, not in age - he allows the phonation of words to create lapses in the vocal energy and tonal fulness that sustain a strong musical line. This sacrifice of tonal body and continuity of line to words is intended to pass for "sensitive interpretation," and although it signals to the audience that the singer knows he's telling us about something, it leaves holes in the vocal presentation. The voice has to be there, firm and resonant, no matter what the volume level; articulation of vowels and consonants should never get in the way, but must float on top of an unbroken tonal stream. I hope he's still studying and listening to singers like Thill and other old-timers who produced a consistent stream of golden tone regardless of dynamic level, coloration, or dramatic accent.


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## BachIsBest (Feb 17, 2018)

I voted for Emile Scaramberg. I found Thill vocally beautiful, but a little emotionally uninspired. Franz was excellent, but his interpretation didn't reach the delirious euphoria that Scaramber built up (with only a piano accompaniment no less). I must admit that I don't think I've heard Scaramberg before, but after listening here, perhaps I should go on a youtube search for his work. The spontaneity he achieves is equal (at least here) to the very best (e.g. Caruso, Schipa, etc.) and, as with virtually all pre-war singers, the legato line is to die for.


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## wkasimer (Jun 5, 2017)

I ranked them as

1 Thill
2 Scaremberg
3 Franz
>
>
>
4 Kaufmann

I'm a huge fan of Paul Franz, but despite exceptional vocalism, his delivery here is rather matter-of-fact. Scaremberg was a terrific singer - I only rank him second to Thill because he's a little too emphatic for my taste. Thill's vocalism is on par with Franz's, and there's more passion to his delivery.

A couple of more modern favorites -

I always seem to forget about Raoul Jobin, but he was a fine singer of the French repertoire during the 40's.






And then there's Alain Vanzo, whose version of this I actually prefer to Thill's - just listen to how he caresses that final note:






And I can never resist posting about one of my favorite tenors, Leonid Sobinov:


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## JanacekTheGreat (Feb 26, 2021)

BachIsBest said:


> I voted for Emile Scaramberg. I found Thill vocally beautiful, but a little emotionally uninspired. Franz was excellent, but his interpretation didn't reach the delirious euphoria that Scaramber built up (with only a piano accompaniment no less). I must admit that I don't think I've heard Scaramberg before, but after listening here, perhaps I should go on a youtube search for his work. The spontaneity he achieves is equal (at least here) to the very best (e.g. Caruso, Schipa, etc.) and, as with virtually all pre-war singers, the legato line is to die for.


Speaking of delirious euphoria, please be sure to check out his "_Ah fuyez douce image_", and "_Prince du Rhin_".


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## Woodduck (Mar 17, 2014)

wkasimer said:


> I ranked them as
> 
> 1 Thill
> 2 Scaremberg
> ...


Jobin, a singer I don't know well at all, is wonderful here. Vanzo is a singer I've never been able to care for despite his impeccable style; the voice just seems a bit nondescript and unthrilling to me, rather as Alfredo Kraus's does. It's a pity all those great old Russians insisted on recording everything in Russian, an ungainly language that compromises music written in other languages and creates a barrier I have to listen _through_ rather than _to_. Sobinov does know how to soften it and make it sound as musical as it can, but still the aria emerges as a rather different experience that isn't quite Gounod.


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## BachIsBest (Feb 17, 2018)

I perused the youtube, and Emile Scaramberg belongs right with the best; it's too bad that his voice went in 1907. I mean, listen to some of this stuff. What modern tenor can match the vocal freedom and expressiveness of his "Pourquoi me reveiller?"





Where's the tenor that can maintain this sort of awe-inspiring legato line in "Amor ti vieta"?





Finally, who now can so convince you of Jose's frenzied, sickening, passion, and yet still touch it with a brushstroke of true tender love? And with only piano accompaniment?





Just think, in the ten years before WW1 one could have listened to Lauri-Volpi, Emile Scaramberg, Enrico Caruso, Beniamino Gigli, Tito Schipa, Lauritz Melchoir, and that's just the tenors! In the past ten years, one could have listened to, well, some other guys probably. I don't know exactly who to talk to, but I feel there's got to be the possibility of getting a refund on these sorts of things.


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## JanacekTheGreat (Feb 26, 2021)

BachIsBest said:


> Just think, in the ten years before WW1 one could have listened to Lauri-Volpi, Emile Scaramberg, Enrico Caruso, Beniamino Gigli, Tito Schipa, Lauritz Melchoir, and that's just the tenors! In the past ten years, one could have listened to, well, some other guys probably. I don't know exactly who to talk to, but I feel there's got to be the possibility of getting a refund on these sorts of things.


My opera-aficionados peers accuse me that I love historical recordings because I only imagine "things" while listening to these scratchy sounds. Well, these wonderful Scaramberg clips easily disprove that: you don't have to imagine anything when the beauty and artistry spontaneously leap out. Ironically, it's the Kaufmann clip that forces me to imagine what this music might have sounded like in modern sound if it had been handled properly.


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## Woodduck (Mar 17, 2014)

BachIsBest said:


> Just think, in the ten years before WW1 one could have listened to Lauri-Volpi, Emile Scaramberg, Enrico Caruso, Beniamino Gigli, Tito Schipa, Lauritz Melchoir, and that's just the tenors! In the past ten years, one could have listened to, well, some other guys probably. I don't know exactly who to talk to, but I feel there's got to be the possibility of getting a refund on these sorts of things.


Melchior began singing as a baritone before WW I but made his career as a tenor after the war. But there were other fine tenors singing Wagner in the decade before the war, notably Johannes Sembach, Charles Dalmores and Jacques Urlus. I'm still discovering singers from that era whose muffled, scratchy old recordings, often made when the singers were nearing the ends of their careers, put modern singers in the shade.


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## BachIsBest (Feb 17, 2018)

Woodduck said:


> Melchior began singing as a baritone before WW I but made his career as a tenor after the war. But there were other fine tenors singing Wagner in the decade before the war, notably Johannes Sembach, Charles Dalmores and Jacques Urlus. I'm still discovering singers from that era whose muffled, scratchy old recordings, often made when the singers were nearing the ends of their careers, put modern singers in the shade.


Ah, I didn't know that about Melchoir, only that he started singing just before WWI broke out. Anyhow, my list was not supposed to be exhaustive, there were probably about dozen tenors then who could realistically claim to be better than any tenor we have today!


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## wkasimer (Jun 5, 2017)

BachIsBest said:


> there were probably about dozen tenors then who could realistically claim to be better than any tenor we have today!


There may have been a dozen in Paris alone.


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## Revitalized Classics (Oct 31, 2018)

Scaramberg, for me.

He's one of those artists who makes everyone else sound half-asleep.


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## Woodduck (Mar 17, 2014)

BachIsBest said:


> Ah, I didn't know that about Melchoir, only that he started singing just before WWI broke out. Anyhow, my list was not supposed to be exhaustive, there were probably about dozen tenors then who could realistically claim to be better than any tenor we have today!


I believe there were _more_ than a dozen. The world was swarming with amazing singers.

As a baby boomer (1949) I've long been acutely and sadly aware that I was born into a world that was vanishing rapidly. For a few innocent years I could indulge the belief that what I was hearing on my great-grandfather's 78 rpm records - Caruso, Galli-Curci, Pinza, etc. - was normal and eternal, but it didn't take many years of living in the world to realize that I was cherishing the culture of a past that would never return. Opera and the trained voice are still here - they're too important to disappear - but nowadays what we see in the opera house is apt to be more interesting than what we hear.


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## Revitalized Classics (Oct 31, 2018)

Personally, one of my favourites is Dmitri Smirnov. He was in great voice for his Russian version in 1909





He re-recorded the aria in French in 1921, not the best transfer but it improves after a bad start and worth a listen


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## Woodduck (Mar 17, 2014)

Revitalized Classics said:


> Personally, one of my favourites is Dmitri Smirnov. He was in great voice for his Russian version in 1909
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Amazing singing. I'm glad we get to hear him in French. Of all the old-school Russian tenors, I think Smirnov may be the greatest. That he's also the earliest is surely suggestive of something.


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## JanacekTheGreat (Feb 26, 2021)

Woodduck said:


> Amazing singing. I'm glad we get to hear him in French. Of all the old-school Russian tenors, I think Smirnov may be the greatest. That he's also the earliest is surely suggestive of something.


I also prefer Smirnov to other brilliant lyric tenors of the era, including the more popular Sobinov.


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## BachIsBest (Feb 17, 2018)

Woodduck said:


> I believe there were _more_ than a dozen. The world was swarming with amazing singers.


It's hard to say, as we don't have too many recordings from that era, but very possible indeed. What I wouldn't give for a time machine (actually, from a science perspective, going back in time isn't prohibited by any known law, although changing the past is, so I'm holding out hope).



Woodduck said:


> As a baby boomer (1949) I've long been acutely and sadly aware that I was born into a world that was vanishing rapidly. For a few innocent years I could indulge the belief that what I was hearing on my great-grandfather's 78 rpm records - Caruso, Galli-Curci, Pinza, etc. - was normal and eternal, but it didn't take many years of living in the world to realize that I was cherishing the culture of a past that would never return. Opera and the trained voice are still here - they're too important to disappear - but nowadays what we see in the opera house is apt to be more interesting than what we hear.


As someone in their twenties, I grew up thinking opera was sort of like what singers of the national anthems at sports events sounded like or whatever was done in _Jesus Christ Superstar_ (or as my mother told me: "Opera is when men sing really really low and women sing really really high"). Even when I started listening to classical music, I mostly disliked solo singing save for the vibrato-less Baroque hipsters, but I now realise I was just listening to the wrong singers. I sometimes wonder how many people would really love opera, if they committed to a serious introduction to it.


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## Woodduck (Mar 17, 2014)

BachIsBest said:


> As someone in their twenties, I grew up thinking opera was sort of like what singers of the national anthems at sports events sounded like or whatever was done in _Jesus Christ Superstar_ (or as my mother told me: "Opera is when men sing really really low and women sing really really high"). Even when I started listening to classical music, I mostly disliked solo singing save for the vibrato-less Baroque hipsters, but *I now realise I was just listening to the wrong singers. I sometimes wonder how many people would really love opera, if they committed to a serious introduction to it.*


I think many more people would love opera if they had a proper introduction to it, but there must be considerable differences of opinion as to what a proper introduction is. Surely it is not this:


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## MAS (Apr 15, 2015)

Woodduck said:


> I think many more people would love opera if they had a proper introduction to it, but there must be considerable differences of opinion as to what a proper introduction is. Surely it is not this:


Ugh! This is to what _Great Performances _has devolved? I was decrying the dearth of operatic programming on PBS, but let us instead mourn the dearth of decent opera singing in general.


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## JanacekTheGreat (Feb 26, 2021)

Woodduck said:


> I think many more people would love opera if they had a proper introduction to it, but there must be considerable differences of opinion as to what a proper introduction is. Surely it is not this:


OMG, the quartet at the end! Sounds like 4 random dudes/gals in the bar were in the mood for some impromptu.


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## JanacekTheGreat (Feb 26, 2021)

MAS said:


> Ugh! This is to what _Great Performances _has devolved? I was decrying the dearth of operatic programming on PBS, but let us instead mourn the dearth of decent opera singing in general.


Great Performances = _Whatever _performed by _whomever _we (record labels and major opera houses) tell you are superstars.


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## BachIsBest (Feb 17, 2018)

JanacekTheGreat said:


> Great Performances = _Whatever _performed by _whomever _we (record labels and major opera houses) tell you are superstars.


I think these singers are the best of the well-established Wagnerian opera singers that were available. I doubt the record labels and major opera houses are somehow conspiring against good singing.


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## Tsaraslondon (Nov 7, 2013)

I voted for Scaramberg, but it wasn't an easy choice and on another day I might easily have voted for Thill or Franz. Kaufmann was a non-starter and actually the young Alagna was a good deal better than him.

Just as a by the by, I was in the audience for one of Alagana's Romeos at Covent Garden, from which the above video was taken, and it was a thrilling evening in the house. There was a palpable feel of excitement the night I was there. Sadly I don't think he ever quite became the artist he could have and should have been. Modern times, I suppose. I remember watching a TV programme about him shortly after this and it was quite disgusting to see the marketing people discussing him as if he was simply a commodity, which, I suppose, is all artists are these days.


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## JanacekTheGreat (Feb 26, 2021)

Tsaraslondon said:


> I voted for Scaramberg, but it wasn't an easy choice and on another day I might easily have voted for Thill or Franz. Kaufmann was a non-starter and actually the young Alagna was a good deal better than him.
> 
> Just as a by the by, I was in the audience for one of Alagana's Romeos at Covent Garden, from which the above video was taken, and it was a thrilling evening in the house. There was a palpable feel of excitement the night I was there. Sadly I don't think he ever quite became the artist he could have and should have been. Modern times, I suppose. I remember watching a TV programme about him shortly after this and it was quite disgusting to see the marketing people discussing him as if he was simply a commodity, which, I suppose, is all artists are these days.


Alagna was an opera heartthrob until he was urged to sing Manrico, Samson, Radames, Enee, and Otello. What a shame.


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## MAS (Apr 15, 2015)

JanacekTheGreat said:


> Alagna was an opera heartthrob until he was urged to sing Manrico, Samson, Radames, Enee, and Otello. What a shame.


That's the fate of almost all lyric tenors - they'll always want to sing the big roles. One could probably count in one hand the tenors who have not gone that route. Alfredo Kraus comes to mind, perhaps Alain Vanzo?


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## Woodduck (Mar 17, 2014)

MAS said:


> That's the fate of almost all lyric tenors - they'll always want to sing the big roles. One could probably count in one hand the tenors who have not gone that route. Alfredo Kraus comes to mind, perhaps Alain Vanzo?


Not only tenors, of course. Nearly every small-voiced singer aspires to power and high drama. Some, like Bjorling, carry it off by dint of their technical soundness and savoir-faire. Others, like Sills, manage it for a while through both technique and sheer dramatic intensity, while realizing that it will shorten their careers. As long as they have the self-awareness to understand their limitations and are willing to stop before offending their art and their audiences, I can be sympathetic to their aspirations. Alas, Anna dear, your time has passed...


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## Tsaraslondon (Nov 7, 2013)

Woodduck said:


> Not only tenors, of course. Nearly every small-voiced singer aspires to power and high drama. Some, like Bjorling, carry it off by dint of sheer technical soundness and savoir-faire. Others, like Sills, manage it for a while through both technique and sheer dramatic intensity, while realizing that it will shorten their careers. As long as they have the self-awareness to understand their limitations and are willing to stop before offending their art and their audiences, I can be sympathetic to their aspirations. Alas, Anna dear, your time has passed...


And Sills, as far as I'm aware, was never foolhardy enough to try Aida or Lady Macbeth.


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## Woodduck (Mar 17, 2014)

Tsaraslondon said:


> And Sills, as far as I'm aware, was never foolhardy enough to try Aida or Lady Macbeth.


She went as far as Norma late in her career, but I think she only did it a few times, and I doubt she had any illusions about being a Callas or a Ponselle.


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## MAS (Apr 15, 2015)

Tsaraslondon said:


> And Sills, as far as I'm aware, was never foolhardy enough to try Aida or Lady Macbeth.


Sills did sing an *Aida* in New Jersey, but early in her career and never again as far as I know. There's a recording.


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## MAS (Apr 15, 2015)

Woodduck said:


> She went as far as Norma late in her career, but I think she only did it a few times, and I doubt she had any illusions about being a Callas or a Ponselle.


Sills disparaged the libretto of *Norma*, saying it was ridiculous or some such thing. I don't think the performances (with Sarah Caldwell's Boston Company) were a success. We know the role is far too heavy for Sills's voice, and perhaps she waited too long to sing it. I think there is a studio recording, with Verrett as Adalgisa?


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## Tsaraslondon (Nov 7, 2013)

MAS said:


> Sills disparaged the libretto of *Norma*, saying it was ridiculous or some such thing. I don't think the performances (with Sarah Caldwell's Boston Company) were a success. We know the role is far too heavy for Sills's voice, and perhaps she waited too long to sing it. I think there is a studio recording, with Verrett as Adalgisa?


Not exactly recommendable. The voice character is all wrong as her voice is much to shallow. The role was never right for her. Mind you, I never thought the Tudor Queens were right for her either, but she did have a considerable success in them.


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## Woodduck (Mar 17, 2014)

MAS said:


> Sills disparaged the libretto of *Norma*, saying it was ridiculous or some such thing. I don't think the performances (with Sarah Caldwell's Boston Company) were a success. We know the role is far too heavy for Sills's voice, and perhaps she waited too long to sing it. I think there is a studio recording, with Verrett as Adalgisa?


I'd forgotten about the recording. Here it is on Amazon:

https://www.amazon.com/Vincenzo-Bel...rds=norma+sills&qid=1639172616&s=music&sr=1-1


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## Seattleoperafan (Mar 24, 2013)

Woodduck said:


> Not only tenors, of course. Nearly every small-voiced singer aspires to power and high drama. Some, like Bjorling, carry it off by dint of their technical soundness and savoir-faire. Others, like Sills, manage it for a while through both technique and sheer dramatic intensity, while realizing that it will shorten their careers. As long as they have the self-awareness to understand their limitations and are willing to stop before offending their art and their audiences, I can be sympathetic to their aspirations. Alas, Anna dear, your time has passed...


Do you know of any lyric voices that had such good projection they could sing heavier parts by virtue their excellent resonance technique? Cheryl Studer perhaps? Bjorling possibly fell under this category.


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## nina foresti (Mar 11, 2014)

Seattleoperafan said:


> Do you know of any lyric voices that had such good projection they could sing heavier parts by virtue their excellent resonance technique? Cheryl Studer perhaps? Bjorling possibly fell under this category.


Magda Oliveroooo


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## Woodduck (Mar 17, 2014)

Seattleoperafan said:


> Do you know of any lyric voices that had such good projection they could sing heavier parts by virtue their excellent resonance technique? Cheryl Studer perhaps? Bjorling possibly fell under this category.


I know nearly all singers only from recordings and by reputation. Recordings can be deceptive, and the only way to judge a voice's projection is to hear it live. Bjorling's voice was said not to be large, but so clear and focused that he could succeed in parts as heavy as Radames and Manrico. He never sang Calaf in the house but his recording is so good you'd wonder why not, and I wouldn't be surprised to learn that he would have ventured it had he lived longer. I gather from that biographical video posted by Christabel that he was a little nervous recording it with Nilsson, but the difference in their vocal power isn't too apparent, perhaps thanks to the miracles of engineering ("miracles" Nilsson complained about, which you can understand when you set that recording beside one of her live recordings with Corelli).

Sometimes you really can tell, even from a recording, that a singer's voice would be too small to take on a role in the theater. I'm thinking of Maragaret Price's Isolde, a lovely performance that's clearly mic-dependent (which bothers me but not some other people). Still, it was a beautifully focused voice that would probably have been perfectly audible, even if underpowered against a huge orchestra. I think that, in general, a well-produced voice will project well, and if singers can avoid the temptation to oversing thay can get away with occasionally taking on parts a little too big for them.


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## JanacekTheGreat (Feb 26, 2021)

^^Another example is Bidu Sayao, one of the beloved sopranos of TC.

This performance has been discussed many times in recent threads. The voice is a bit light for this music, and she doesn't need to hide the fact (i.e darkens it artificially). But it is a very well-coordinated voice, and well-projected too. The result is a stunning performance, much better than Sutherland et al., IMO.






I don't like Rossini in general, but performances like this prove that his opera can be very exciting. Rather than 3 hours with constant ooo-ooo-ooo vocalization from Sutherland.


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## Woodduck (Mar 17, 2014)

JanacekTheGreat said:


> ^^Another example is Bidu Sayao, one of the beloved sopranos of TC.
> 
> This performance has been discussed many times in recent threads. The voice is a bit light for this music, and she doesn't need to hide the fact (i.e darkens it artificially). But it is a very well-coordinated voice, and well-projected too. The result is a stunning performance, much better than Sutherland et al., IMO.


it's a dazzling recording. Apparently the coloratura surprised some of her contemporaries. She was smart enough, though, to avoid roles calling for great power. I think Violetta in _La Traviata_ is about the heaviest part she undertook.


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## Revitalized Classics (Oct 31, 2018)

Seattleoperafan said:


> Do you know of any lyric voices that had such good projection they could sing heavier parts by virtue their excellent resonance technique? Cheryl Studer perhaps? Bjorling possibly fell under this category.


Pavarotti would fit that definition, for me.

It may be that his recordings are not fully representative, as Woodduck points out: I never hear him live.

Even assuming a degree of fakery, the way that Pavarotti was able to sound pretty great as Calaf in the _Turandot_ recording with Mehta defies every expectation you might have of a famous Tonio in _La Fille du Regiment_, which he was singing around the same time.

Possibly the best indication of how his voice projected is that he sang Manrico in _Il Trovatore_ at San Francisco _before_ his final run as Arturo in _I Puritani_ at the Met. Even if he was just intelligible in those big spaces - and records suggest he was more than that - it demanded a daring combination of declamation, flexibility, vocal range and endurance.


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## Seattleoperafan (Mar 24, 2013)

Revitalized Classics said:


> Pavarotti would fit that definition, for me.
> 
> It may be that his recordings are not fully representative, as Woodduck points out: I never hear him live.
> 
> ...


Of course technique is involved, but I suspect he is one of those singers like Nilsson , Caruso and Sutherland who had a face and neck maximized for the projection of sound with large bone structure and large sinus cavity areas in their face. Pav had no neck and the sound just flew out of his throat.


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## MAS (Apr 15, 2015)

Woodduck said:


> it's a dazzling recording. Apparently the coloratura surprised some of her contemporaries. She was smart enough, though, to avoid roles calling for great power. I think Violetta in _La Traviata_ is about the heaviest part she undertook.


Apparently, this was in the nature of a challenge. One of the other sopranos on the Metropolitan Opera's roster said Sayao couldn't do coloratura. Being no shrinking violet, she decided to "show them," and inserted the aria during the Lesson Scene of *Il barbiere di Siviglia*. It is certainly over decorated, but she does show them!


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## MAS (Apr 15, 2015)

Seattleoperafan said:


> Of course technique is involved, but I suspect he is one of those singers like Nilsson , Caruso and Sutherland who had a face and neck maximized for the projection of sound with large bone structure and large sinus cavity areas in their face. Pav had no neck and the sound just flew out of his throat.


One could hear him very well in most of the things Pavarotti sang at the San Francisco Opera. The War Memorial Opera House has some dead spots but I never heard anyone complain about him being inaudible.


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## Tsaraslondon (Nov 7, 2013)

JanacekTheGreat said:


> ^^Another example is Bidu Sayao, one of the beloved sopranos of TC.
> 
> This performance has been discussed many times in recent threads. The voice is a bit light for this music, and she doesn't need to hide the fact (i.e darkens it artificially). But it is a very well-coordinated voice, and well-projected too. The result is a stunning performance, much better than Sutherland et al., IMO.
> 
> ...


I agree with you that this is very impressive, but I don't agree that it is much better than Sutherland, or at least in her recording on _The Art of the Prima Donna_, which was recorded in 1960, when she still sang words. I'm no Sutherland fan, by the way, but credit where it's due and this is one of her most stunning recordings. Sutherland also has a vocal grandeur, which is more suited to the role. Sayão can't quite disguise the fact that her instrument is too light.

Here's the 1960 Sutherland performance.


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