# Qu'est ce c'est



## Svelte Silhouette (Nov 7, 2013)

I am not sure what 'Classical' music is really ...

I know that the 'Classical' period is 1750-1820 but almost anything writ from approx. 1000 AD (for us Westerners) up to this very minute could count BUT based on what I just don't know. 

The Beatles have stood the test of time and one survivor has had a few forays on 'Classical' labels such as his 'Liverpool Oratorio' but whether this latter work or any of the band material he co-wrote much for can be considered merititious enough to be considered 'Classical' or even Classic is, I guess, a matter of opinion.

Another thread mentions Yes's 'Tales from Topographic Oceans' which is an 80+ minute work with 4 discrete sections (or, maybe albeit not labelled as such, movements) BUT no orchestra. Deep Purple wrote a 'Concerto for Group and Orchestra which covers off the lack of Orchestra bit in the former recording BUT maybe this is confusing 'Classical' with a form rather than a genre.

Mozart wrote a lot of nice dance ditties as did one of those Strauss chappies and I'm sure a lot of folks danced to that Telemann bloke BUT these are 'Classical' where Britney's 'Oops I did it again' mightn't be though maybe, just maybe, 'Come together' might be in which case that'd make the imho classic Abbey Road a Classical album particularly if Mike Nyman, whom I met once a long time go in a galaxy far far away (hence my informality), can write music for a movie and then make 'The Piano Concerto' out of it ... on top of all that said composer is younger than any Beatle or Rolling Stone and pretty much contemporary with composers within any Progressive rock band such as either of the other two cited.

Many rock bands write, or wrote, magnum opuses or very lengthy tracks such as Genesis (whose Live expansions are only rivalled by Deep Purple's 'Space Truckin' or Led Zeppelin's 'Dazed and Confused' from 'The Song remains the same'), Pink Floyd, Led Zeppelin or even themed albums with definitive start and end points such as the Kinks' Soap Opera.

So ... quite a few Rock bands have recorded with Orchestra's, named their recordings 'Concerto' or whatever, used 'Movements' either directly in name or indirectly, used themes rather than simply wrote a few nice 'dance tunes', survived the test of time and in some instances been 'covered' by other artistes.

OK, rock bands aren't highbrow though there is much pomp and circumstance in some of their recordings BUT some might say this is just the over-inflated wind pumped out by some with over-inflated egos and that neatly brings us back to that Oratorio ... 

Can anyone help me out with 'What is Classical music'?


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## Aramis (Mar 1, 2009)

> Mozart wrote a lot of nice dance ditties as did one of those Strauss chappies and I'm sure a lot of folks danced to that Telemann bloke BUT these are 'Classical' where Britney's 'Oops I did it again' mightn't be...


So for you, the major criterium is whetever somebody has danced to the music? You won't get far in sorting things out while thinking this way.

I have danced to Mahler's 9th and never when listening to Led Zeppelin's debut album. _Babe I'm Gonna Leave You_ is classical music, Mahler's 9th is pop dance.


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## Guest (Nov 7, 2013)

In a way, I'm the worst person to respond to this request.

But in a way, I'm at least a good person to respond to this request.

First, a little history. The term "classical music" was coined, in Germany, in 1810. It made its way to England by around 1825. This means that all that music written from approximately 1000 AD to approximately 1820 AD was written without any of its creators knowing that they were writing "classical music."

Second, a personal opinion (along with a little personal history). I used to think that classical music was terrifically important and that "classical music" was qualitatively superior to any other kind and that it was important to define "classical music" very carefully and consistently so as to preserve its pre-eminence. Listening to twentieth century music, especially to things from the experimental tradition in the US such as indeterminacy, Fluxus, and various concept musics, has led me to question item number three. That and knowing a lot of living composers who do not think of themselves as "classical" composers, just as composers. (Very much like the composers of the so-called "classical" era and before, eh? The retrofitted composers.)

I think music is terrifically important. I think music is something to listen to. I think it expresses only itself, though any listener at any time can feel all sorts of things, can respond in all sorts of ways to this thing that is only expressing itself. I think that thing is important all on its own, that it needs no stories, no programs, no historical or philosophical associations to make it important. It just is important. Hard as that is to express in language. Rhythm, sound, timbre--these things do something that no other art can even attempt to do, though poetry can come the closest. (Language being a type of music.)

"Superior" is a huge distraction from what is important, listening and experiencing.

So my conclusion, for myself, is that it doesn't matter whether the term "classical music" is used or not. It has certainly become less useful for any of my purposes, though I could still probably categorize any particular piece or style as classical or not classical. I just wouldn't think it a terribly important distinction to make.

If you do, then what I have just said is probably not going to be very useful to you. If you do not, then what I have just said is superfluous.

Only if you are undecided (or perhaps interested in multiple possibilities), will what I have just said be of any use.

Enjoy!


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